Great Western Coffee Shop

From The BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-58674934)


Whilst Coronavirus has not helped (to put it mildly!), I can't help wondering if there would be less of a problem having enough bus and lorry drivers had we not seen so many return to mainland Europe.  I note that the BBC lists this as a possible cause, but it appears that Mr Shapps did not.  I wonder why the difference  :D

I can't comment on HGV drivers over here in Brittany because it's not something I regularly deal with. I can however confirm that we have enough bus and train drivers to run our local/regional public transport system effectively with.

Isn't it a tacit admission that there are other issues causing the driver shortage when one says, "made worse"?

Probably so!

As regards tankers, I knew a couple of drivers who only stuck with the job because of the pay. It is not easy driving around Britain's roads with a large bomb behind you. Although accidents are mercifully extremely rare, I can see that the offer of a pay rise to drive around with nothing more dangerous than chicken nuggets may prove tempting. I think we will see a fair bit of swapping around before enough new drivers come on stream to make it all better.

There's also a severe shortage in many countries on the continent, including Germany, Poland, and the Czech Republic. Here for instance is a piece about the ongoing problems they are having in Germany:
https://www.transportlogistic.de/de/messe/industry-insights/lkw-fahrermangel/

The elephant in the room as I see it is the Blairite 50% of kids going to university, so that they can be indebted and unemployed as they slowly waste their 20s coming to the conclusion that the graduate jobs they were sold are a myth. We'd do better to reverse that quota – there are parts of the country where far too many kids are going to university, when they should be learning to do proper jobs that serve their communities: LEAs in the Thames Valley in particular should be penalised for producing inadequate numbers of people going on to practical and technical jobs.

But here is the rub, that would mean reversing the failure of the 1980's that of closing all the Collages of Further Education, technical Collages and reverting some Universities to Polytechnics. and the YUPPIEisation of the 1980's .................

The problem does go back across decades and different colour political rosettes

There has been a shortage or HGV drivers for many years.  I remember being told in 1999 that a builders merchant would do anything to get more HGV drivers for local deliveries.  The current issues have only exacerbated the problem.

There is absolutely no reason, other than the cost, why someone with a PhD can't also hold a HGV licence. Rowan Atkinson springs to mind, but I was surprised to learn that Dame Kelly Holmes can also drive a Class 1 vehicle. In her case, she learned in the army, and I would bet that a fair few HGV trained vets demob every year and go into something other than lorry driving.

(Not the animal doctor vets, although who knows?)

jamestheredengine, electric train, I beg to differ.

Having been a governor of an FE college I agree that insufficient resources have been put into technical and vocational courses, but many of the jobs that are not being filled are either unskilled or (like HGV driving) the training is outside the college system.

Even amongst professions where long university courses are needed there are shortages  - farm animal vets, for example. The problem is that people are not prepared to take jobs where hours are long or unsocial, or where work conditions are uncomfortable.

Having had quite a bit of work done at home in recent months it is interesting to speak to the tradesmen we have used, some being ones we have used for over ten years. They are all getting older, and only one has someone from the next generation following them into "the trade" (his daughter). The others complain about the lack of apprentices, or have given up training because those they have taken on have not stayed the course.

HGV (and bus) driving is demanding work, with unsocial hours, often having to stay away from home using facilities that do not seem to have improved much in recent decades (unlike mainstream hotel accommodation).

Ironically, the Telegraph had a picture of a meeting of the Brexiteer Conservative MPs who scuppered Theresa May's Brexit deal who call themselves the Brexit Spartans. I don't think they have much of an idea about spartan working conditions from the nonsense they spout about getting back to using UK labour for the jobs that were filled by EU migrants (although in the interest of balance I don't see any other party has any better ideas either). The irony is increased by the uncomfortable truth that the move that was meant to reduce bureaucracy and barriers to trade has heralded a whole new set of controls and interefered with the free movement of labour in our corner of the globe.   

Interview on BBC R4 this morning just after 7 with a tanker driver who described the poor working conditions - sleeping in the cab - poor services  - unsocial hours.  He said the next generation don't want a job where you are away from home all week.  Why would you do it if you had a choice?

I have read other descriptions that also mentioned dirty facilities and expensive poor quality food at services.  This was contrasted with much better facilities on the continent provided by local authorities. Also pressure to achieve timed delivery slots and complete work within permitted driving hours. 

If clients want their goods delivered then I suggest that current market conditions are right to force them to remove unreasonable restrictions like narrowly timed delivery slots. Government should also fund the creation of better rest facilities for HGV drivers at reasonable cost.   Perhaps the facilities at the Houses of Parliament should be downgraded to those of the average truckstop!

It should be perfectly possible to reconfigure our supply chains to reduce the need for the unsocial hours and to take some of the pressure off drivers.  Yes this will cost money, but we have an unsustainable obsession with cheap goods paid for by the poor working conditions of others.  It is part of our unequal society. 

Motorway service stations have improved hugely in recent years in terms of quality but have always been a rip-off in terms of price.

The driver shortage issue seems to be most acute in the UK however it's also a problem across Europe and has been growing for some time - especially in France and Germany.

Obviously the consequence of reconfiguring supply chains to reduce the need for unsocial hours means more HGVs on the road during the day - not sure how palatable that would be.

Having spoken to friends in Plymouth recently you'll find many bus drivers and taxi drivers are now driving delivery vans for the supermarkets and companies servicing Amazon etc - this market has exploded during lockdown and looks likely to continue, entirely possible that HGV drivers are doing same?

Compare and contrast a Greggs at a motorway services with a stop at a Relais Routiers (https://www.relais-routiers.com/) truck stop in France.

Exactly. I mean how could French rustic cuisine hope to compete with a steak bake & sausage roll?

I wonder how keen EU truckers will be to work in the UK up to Christmas this year? Bearing in mind that last Christmas thousands of them were stuck for days on the M2 and at Manston Airfield until Boxing Day.

Of course if even 10% of road freight was transferred to rail, that would somewhat ease truck driver shortages.

And as for working conditions, it cant be that hard to provide properly equipped truck stops. Nothing elaborate is needed, secure parking, preferably with mains electricity hook ups. Basic but clean and reliable toilets and showers. And a few motel type rooms for those without sleeper cabs. Refuse bins and recycling bins. Outdoor seating. A small shop.
It would IMHO be reasonable for the state to provide the land for free, but with the facilities built and run by private operators who could charge for use.

To be fair, I'll put in a good word for Greggs.  On the days when I go into the office I seldom manage to resist their morning offer of coffee & bacon roll for £2.30 and I've always enjoyed with what I've had.  No gourmet food but edible, tasty and good value.

Yes, I was wondering if the RDG's words describing the "we mean green" campaign (or some successor to that) might evolve to claim coping with fewer drivers as a big selling point of rail freight. You know, those are the words no-one bothered to read as they were too busy arguing about imaginary issues of logo use or abuse.

I have seen TV news reports of two recent "ferroutage" roperations in France, in which needing fewer drivers for long journeys was given as an advantage. However, that could be just a journalist's or marketeer's invention, and might not be what attracts operators to use it at all.

One was about the two existing routes from Perpignan to Calais and Luxembourg, using the system that backs trailers onto wagons at an angle - the top of the wagon pivots with the trailer on it. They were claiming remarkably quick turn-round times, of well under an hour.

Then there is the recent news of the restarting of the "primeurs" train from Perpignan to Rungis market, suspended by SNCF last year. The reason given was that the refrigerated wagons needed to be replaced, but the declining usage of the train could not justify the capital cost. The state has provided some kind of revenue guarantee, and tendered for an operator last year, and the renewed service has just started.

Since loading wagons is transshipment it is likely to attract smaller producers who only have part loads anyway; those who can fill a lorry would need to be very close not to find it easier to drive all the way. But various things, of which the lack of willing drivers is one, might alter that. It also appears that this new service will carry containers, though it's not clear how from this report in EuroFruit (http://www.fruitnet.com/eurofruit/article/186331/rungis-backs-return-of-primeurs-train):

In addition, I've just hit upon another rail freight operator with a Perpignan-Calais link using a different loading system (and terminals) for the trailers. This is CargoBeamer, (https://www.cargobeamer.com/what-we-do.html) who have terminal at Ashford too, and looks like an independent commercial enterprise (but may not be). Why, you may ask, don't their trains go a lot further up-country? Lack of government bribes, I suspect.

Stop press: this Ashford-Perpignan route only started last week, and (unsurprisingly) involves Eurotunnel as a partner. From RailFreight:

Someone needs a geography lesson.

There are advanced plans for Dollands Moor International Freight Yard to accommodate RoRo for HGV trailers, ie no HGV tractor (cab) unit and driver required to travel through the tunnel.

Brexit and then Covid have slowed in the implementation of this scheme.

So, today we've got a Govt. Minister saying the reserve tanker fleet is being utilised, with civilian drivers. Where exactly are the drivers being magic-ed up from?  Doesn't Mr Kwarteng know there's a driver shortage?

BBC News - Petrol supply: Reserve fuel tankers on the road to help boost deliveries
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58729653

There are an estimated 54,000 licenses sitting with DVLA awaiting processing.

That's potentially a lot more vehicles on the road if the Civil service could get their act together.

Industrial action ingoing at the DVLC

FTFY.  :P

I found them unbelievably efficient recently. Sold my car recently. Notified DVLA online. Got my car tax refund cheque in 5 working days.

It's not just the French doing it - Tesco are also finding every little extra train helps. From the StokeonTrentLive:

I think it depends in the degree of automation required.  Mrs XP has just renewed her driving licence and it came back in a week.  I need an eye test and applied last September.  2 weeks ago I received the documentation to book the eye test; I have been without a licence and driving on the strength of a letter from the DVLA for over 12 months and I do not lnow how long they will be after I have had the eye test.

Wouldn't spectacles be better?

(https://i.ibb.co/xhYsrQ8/FB-IMG-1633038391852.jpg)

It's been a while since I last had coke.

Just say no. <sniff>

Me and tobacco, my final addiction apart from a sufficiency of port, said farewell on Sunday 12 May 1991. My last blast was a small cigar in the Cock of the North, Henleaze, also known as the Kebab and Calculator, and now more sedately as the Westbury Tavern so as not to upset anybody. Me and Class A were never really an item - they made me feel far too good, so I went no further. The chemical stockpile they call my breakfast turns my wee orange, which is as close to recreational as I am likely to get. Breaks the ice at parties.

Such is life.

From the Daily Mail (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-10507751/Miss-England-beauty-queen-ditches-pageant-life-train-trucker.html) - a solution to the lorry driver shortage which seems news about 30 years out of date in fact and sentiment.  Enjoy.

Lovely. Let's see what a diet of fry-ups and Yorkie bars does - or is that out of date too? For the record, my former chimney sweep was a Miss England contestant, not that you would have known behind the overalls and gas mask.

Is this driver shortage still a thing? I don't recall hearing about any fix for it, though lack of news isn't conclusive evidence either way.

But here's another announcement about ferroutage that can be used as an exercise in "spot the deliberatecareless error". It's from XPO (https://europenews.xpo.com/en/2882/xpo-and-schneider-electric-launch--rail-road-freight-solution-uk-france/), about their new trucking arrangements for Schneider Electric:


XPO is American, but its European operation is run from Lyon (where Mions and Vénissieux are). So is their knowledge of geography really that bad? Probably not, as the French version (which must have been the original) suggests:


I fear the subtleties of the French language have defeated whichever machine or person was given the task of translating that into English. The French uses ou, meaning "or", not où (where). When you look closer at the English text, that use of "where" sounds wrong anyway, and "from where" (which would have been d'où) is better but still not quite right.

So XPO have flogged a system that has the potential of going by rail to near Telford, but just now they can't go all the way so will transship to road trailers near Lille. Delta 3 at Dourges, by the way, is a trimodal transshipment depot - it's got a bit of canal too, and container handlers that can reach over it.