Great Western Coffee Shop

Controversial Wales Online (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2012/02/20/concern-as-west-wales-loses-out-to-cornwall-over-train-service-91466-30362975/) article, particularly the claim by Prof Stuart Cole of the Wales Transport Research Centre that there is no justification for HSTs to run west of Plymouth "apart from maybe summer specials".

TRANSPORT experts say West Wales is missing out on better rail links with London because managers are more interested in Cornwall.
Read More http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2012/02/20/concern-as-west-wales-loses-out-to-cornwall-over-train-service-91466-30362975/#ixzz1muiOEq3b
Here is a contraversial quote from said article "Prof Stuart Cole, of the Wales Transport Research Centre, said: ^You shouldn^t have 125s running what is essentially a local service to Penzance.^There are smaller units which would be suitable. West of Plymouth, there isn^t a justification for 125s apart from maybe summer specials."

Oh dear Prof Stuart Cole clearly does not travel between Plymouth and Penzance.Apart from the fact that Devon and Cornwall are by far the most popular holiday destination in Britain-Cornish commuters alone can sometimes make HSTs full and standing between Plymouth and Penzance at peak times let alone the 2 car 150s used to supplement them.While I have every sympathy with West Wales situation robbing Peter to pay Paul is definately not the answer.That is an issue for the new Great Western Franchise specification and the generously funded welsh Assembly Government to address.



Edit note: Thanks for posting this, woody. I've just merged it with another topic which Lee was starting at almost exactly the same time! Chris.  :)

What is Prof. Cole thinking? I've never been to Penzance, so maybe a 150 from Plymouth would be suitable, but his comment ^There are smaller units which would be suitable" is daft. Smaller units may be suitable, but there aren't any (if they were enough spare 150s, wouldn't it be better to use them to add a 2-hourly service between Swansea and Milford Haven, to bring the Milford Haven service up to hourly, rather than replacing IC125s with the 150s?)

I'd like to see the Carmarthen daily service extended to Milford Haven, and the tourist summer service run every day during the summer rather than just Saturdays (to Pembroke Dock, why would tourists be interested in a service to Haverfordwest?) I would have thought a summer tourist service to Fishguard Harbour would make more sence than one to Haverfordwest (unless the unit has to be elsewhere by a certain time, I would say everything going to HVF should extend to Milford Haven), and what's wrong with short platforms? The Pembroke Dock branch doesn't have IC125 length platforms either, yet the service still works.

This is kind of a stupid thing to say as services in South Wales are somewhat similair to those in the far South West of England which is hst's which are designed for express services are stopping at too many stations that they were not designed to do so. Hst's should not be used as stopping services between Plymouth and Penzance or Cardiff and Swansea for that matter. More suitable stock should provide these services such as multiple units with sufficient capcity so the hst's stop at the larger stations only. This is what the professor should be looking at, not saying services should be withdrawn or altered to benefit his chosen area.

In an ideal world, extra units would call at all stops to Plymouth to Penzance, and the HSTs would stop at just a couple of places, slashing journey times to Penzance.

Which couple of places did you have in mind, Btline?

Lets face it, the Welsh Assembly wanted an all Wales franchise which is always going to reduce the amount of services in the area that are operated by an outside TOC, Cornwall is a far more popular holiday destination than west Wales and the holiday makers that visit Cornwall are mostly people from the London area. And basically this person should do some research before posting such crap and he will see that most trains from Penzance to Pad are usually full by the time they get to Plymouth anyway, and thats all year round!

Someone once posted a good calling pattern on here. I can't remember the exact pattern, but one was Truro.

You could probably come up with a convincing argument not to run an Intercity type service beyond Cardiff if you tried hard enough. Sounds like the prof has done the usual trick of deciding his solution and then come up with a load of drivel to support it.

They have a Welsh Assembly to fight Wales's corner, who have Cornwall got? No-one...

As for using smaller units in Cornwall remind me how many perfectly serviceable units were removed from the FGW West services in the West of England and got sent to Wales? Eight 150/2 wasn't it?

I expect the prof has been sent a picture of four empty seats taken through a side window from the platform of an HST standing at Hayle and based his entire research on that.

I've been on a 125 leaving Penzance, luckily with reserved seats, to see people standing before we left the station, with more getting on, and few off, at Camborne, Redruth, and Truro. It's very heavily used. Speed wise, 125s are wasted, as the line speed is too slow, but come on Professor! It's a long way to Plymouth in a 150.

These sort of comments really annoy me & there's a clear example of someone talking about a part of the country they clearly know nothing about! I've been on packed hst's many times between plymouth & penzance, not to mention 150's aren't nice to be sat on for long journeys & it's along way from ply to pnz.

Weren't they [loaned Arriva Trains Wales units?

I would say there is a demand for more Long distance, both XC and FGW services to Penzance.