Great Western Coffee Shop

This has appeared on other forums so thought I would post it in case anyone hasnt read it yet.

http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/single-view/view/south-west-trains-plans-suburban-train-order.html


Edited by Brucey to fix a broken link

Thanks anthony215. That link didn't work for me though

I've edited the link in anthony215's original post.  Appears it got truncated at some point.

Are we aware yet whether these are to replace the 455 units or for use in addition?

All additional, going by various magazine articles, and what has been announced already by SWT.

In the case of the 455s, they aren't going anywhere.  They've only just announced they are to be given new AC traction equipment, that will only be cost effective if the 90 odd units are being kept for the medium term.   The numbers in the new order are about what you need to increase all the remaining inner suburban 8 car services to ten car, the Reading line from 8 to 10 car, and all remaining long distance services from 8 to 12 car. 

Although the 456s (48 vehicles) were widely reported as directly augmenting the 455 fleet, as can be seen from SWT's 2012 press release they only provide a minimal increase in capacity in the main line side inner suburban area, they are in fact also being deployed so as to allow cascades of 450/458 to increase the length of long distance EMU services from places like Alton, Haslemere, Portsmouth and Southampton, and strengthen DMU services via Salisbury.  Apparently it turns out the likeliest place to see 456s when they first come into use with SWT will be on Guildford to Ascot shuttles, releasing a few 450s and 458s for use elsewhere...

Paul

The retractioning of the class 455 fleet will allow units to go longer between routine maintenance. It is this retractioning project, which will free up just enough capacity at Wimbledon Park to accommodate the maintenance of these new trains without a new depot needing to be built.

Wonder if Siemens will find the spare manufacturing capacity to bid  ;D

As I understand things, the current intention is for them to be used, together with the refurbished 458/5 units, to deliver the "ten-car railway" plans on the Windsor lines for which may platforms have recently been extended. Do bear in mind that although strengthening of trains to ten cars on the main suburban side is planned, it will take somewhat longer because it will require significant remodelling work at Waterloo, where platforms 1 - 4 can only handle 8 x 455 each.

Discussions elsewhere a few months ago suggested that very few if any of the 456s will operate on the Windsor side.  8 or 9 will apparently be used on Guildford - Ascot shuttles, and most of the rest will work on the main suburban side (ie through Wimbledon), but not generally in 4+4+2 formations with 455s, as was expected.  SWT insiders reckon a number will work paired up as half of an 8 car (4+2+2) formation, and that this then releases 455s to run additional peak trains, for example they plan to have a couple of extra services running in to Waterloo from Raynes Park.

The other point of course is that there's a continuing 455 overhaul programme for DDA mods, and a separate programme for retractioning, that also affect the number of units that are available for a two or three year period.

What I mean is that the 24 units (say 20 or 21 diagrammed daily) won't generally augment pairs of 455s up to 10 car, which was the popular assumption. SWT's announcement that the 456s were arriving listed only the following changes that can be considered 'suburban', most of the enhancements listed were to mainline longer distance services, presumably via cascaded 458s or 450s:


AIUI the 10 car Windsor side, (Windsor and Hounslow loop etc), is well within the capacity of the full 458/5 fleet, basically they are using 36 merged units to operate the routes that were previously covered by the 29 HC 450/5 conversions.  Another relevant issue is that the 455/456 fleet cannot be used on the Windsor side 10 car routes where SDO is  going to be used (ie minor stations beyond Staines towards Windsor) so their normal operating area has to be on routes where all platforms are extended - and that poses the difficulty that you have pointed out already that they cannot run into Waterloo P1-4.  It seems the limited number of main suburban 10 car trains will use P5 and P6. 

Paul