Great Western Coffee Shop

According to the BBC, at 8am today Flybe announced that it is to begin direct flights between Exeter and London City Airport.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-27122754

In an interview on the 'Today' programme this morning, Simon Calder of the Independent was quoting prices as low as ^23 single and flight times considerably shorter than the train.  As yet I can't find a written source for details, but no doubt this will emerge over the coming days.

I wonder what the equivalent 'Anytime air fare' will be?   The one that allows you to walk into London City airport without booking and still allows travel on the next random flight?

Paul

Just picked up on this.

I did wonder if Exeter was a mistake, and they (BBC) meant Newquay? However, I had always wondered why they didn't operate Exeter - London, as I imagine a lot of customers would drive up from Cornwall and North & West Devon, in the same way they do for Tivvy Parkway.

Missed the 'Today' programme, but I'm intrigued to know why they spoke to Simon Calder rather than, say for example, someone from Flybe? That'll be the same Simon Calder who 'mischieviously'* claimed that the bus service laid on whilst Dawlish was repaired was quicker than the train...

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=13782.0

* according to bobm

Red Squirrel:  I'm guessing they spoke to Calder because he was nearest the phone when they needed someone within the hour. He is the first port of call, it seems, on all travel matters for the Beeb.  I think you can catch 'Today' on iPlayer.  It was near the end of the programme.

No, Umberleigh, it's definitely Exeter.

These new routes are now in the on-line booking engine, with this text (at http://www.flybe.com/london-city/ (http://www.flybe.com/london-city/)):
What that quoted minimum fare means in reality is as unclear as it always is - on a quick look I can see some return legs at ^23.99, but no outward ones as low as ^34.99.

From looking at the flybe booking engine flight times will be 1h20m Exeter-London, 1h15m London-Exeter. That compares favourably with the train you look at the times Exeter St Davids-London Paddington, where you are looking at 2hr10m minimum but if you compare doorstep-workplace I can't imagine the flight will compare so favourably. Perhaps flying might work out slightly quicker if you're going to Canary Wharf.

While the pricing looks good, a realistic day return is 08:00 arrival in London City (fine), the 2 returns are 16:40 (probably too early?) or 20:30 (probably too late?).

Its a step in the right direction and London City is an excellent airport with short check in times....I remember when Air SouthWest were still flying from City into Plymouth I could leave my office in Southwark and be back at Roborough within 2 hours .

If the powers that be have any sense, something will be done about Plymouth Airport, it should never have been allowed to close in the first place, as was starkly brought into relief during the recent rail chaos.

It'll certainly be a very strong option to Exeter for those who valued the peace & quiet of 1st class travel on the train which is shortly to be curtailed by the reduction of 1st class accommodation.....may make FGW up their game, they could do with some competition!

Now in the Exeter Express & Echo:


http://www.exeterexpressandecho.co.uk/Exeter-business-council-leaders-welcome-new-Flybe/story-20999585-detail/story.html

Personally, I think it's good for FGW to have competition on this route. There is an argument that the 1st class offering is poor compared with, say Virgin Trains, and it should also prevent any reduction in the quality of what is already offered.

Whilst it's true that there isn't much difference City centre to City centre, most business travellers drive into Exeter from outside anyway. At the end of the day, Flybe can only offer a fraction of the seats that FGW can, but it does provide an alternative when the line is flooded.

Incidentally, if Flybe win the Newquay four year, subsidised contract, will this service start and terminate at Newquay as per the old Plymouth -Newquay- Gatwick service?

I have to admit I also wondered if a reduction in First Class quality at peak times with peak fares would have an effect on the decisions regarding travel of business people going to the City.

It will for this customer. I am not happy with the changes to First Class, as I consider having a bit of space to myself as part of the premium I pay. If I can no longer do this, then I may as well get there in half the time, and for possibly half the price.

Minimum check in at Exeter airport is 30 mins before departure for domestic, plus the extra time to potentially travel out to the airport, stagecoach buses take 25 mins from City centre to airport. So add probably an hour to flight times if you have to commute out from near the city, and the flight time is not competitive unless savings are made by London City being better located than paddington at the other end.

From The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/flybe-starts-autumn-fares-war-on-domestic-travel--that-could-make-planes-cheaper-than-trains-9277271.html):

I will give the Exeter-London City service 12 months before either major schedule changes, more than likely withdrawal of the mid-afternoon flights, or even complete cessation.
It is, I think, a long established transport planning principle (please don't ask me to quote sources) that for domestic travel train generally wins over 'plane on distances up to around 250 miles.
Exeter Airport is, as has been mentioned previously, not particularly easy to get to except by car, with a minimum day parking rate of ^15.30, or taxi which when I made the journey several years ago attracted a flat fare of ^20 from anywhere within the Exeter city administrative area. The Flybe opening offer day return price is ^85 near as makes no difference. Whatever else you make think about them, FGW are not stupid and I have no doubt that with this much advance notice they will be able to organise a very competitive fare option.
I, too, remain unconvinced that many business travellers from this neck of the woods will want or need to end up in the middle of a largely finance-based commercial centre. Because of that I don't entirely accept the supposed time advantages of flying this route when many potential users will actually need to get to central London.
(This may very well be a slightly clouded view; I have only ever flown four sectors with Flybe - two were more or less on time, the others incurred delays of 7 and 5 hours!)

This ALWAYS comes up! LCY is superbly located for the City (as the name suggests!) and has very good links to the rest of London - as to the bus to the airport/checkin issue, unless you live right next door to Exeter St Davids/Paddington there is always going to be time spent getting to your starting point whether your journey is by train or plane, and I doubt anyone would aim to get to the station 30 seconds before departure, personally if I'm on a long train journey I'd be at the station a good 20 mins before departure to get newspapers, food & drink supplies etc so I really don't think it's an issue.

The cost of parking at Exeter airport, is more expensive than Gatwick and The poor public transport links will deter many, if you live outside of Exeter and you have to take train to Exeter anyway, you may as well stay on the train, as getting from the train to the airport is so slow, and poor bus times. The first bus isn't until 8am and last one is about 6pm.
I see all these factors deterring people using the service

.
And as it always comes up, we already know that every service from the west-country to London has ceased due to low passenger numbers, easyjet, air southwest, Ryanair, BA,the list goes on, and flybe were pulling out until Cornwall council arranged them a subsidy due to losses. Why will this service be any different?

Would there be any rail services but for the subsidy?

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2009/nov/04/firstgroup-taxpayer-subsidy

Flybe will have lower costs due to being much larger than Air South West. Flybe were still committed to a Newquay - London Southend summer service, akin to the FGW summer direct trains. No surprise that the year-round Gatwick service suffered, look at FGWs winter timetable from Newquay...

Ever stood outside Exeter St David's for a while and seen how many passengers get dropped off/picked up by friends and family? So not just reliant on parking, buses or taxis.

It's a generally accepted fact that the journey beyond Exeter to Penzance is slower than driving, hence why so many drive up to Tivvy Parkway. So let's not assume all Exeter/Tivvy passengers started their journey locally.

Also the service will attract those who currently pay FGWs eye watering 1st Class fares, so a few quid extra on parking will hardly hurt.

Finally, a trip on the DLR is a nicer proposition than the Tube at rush hour.

FGW need some serious competition to keep them on their toes: remember when they removed complimentary items from the trolley? So mean-spirited. There are still persistent rumours that the trolley service will be withdrawn, as will all buffet services beyond Plymouth.