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All across the Great Western territory => The Wider Picture - related rail and other transport issues => Topic started by: Chris from Nailsea on November 05, 2014, 20:09:56



Title: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 05, 2014, 20:09:56
From The Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/epic/fgp/11211177/FirstGroup-We-wont-be-forced-into-any-desperate-rail-bids.html):

Quote
FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids

Transport company dispells any suggestion it will have to raise more cash if it fails to win the East Coast Main Line rail bidding competition

(http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/03065/tim1_3065316a.jpg)
Tim O'Toole, FirstGroup's chief executive, has faced a tumultuous time since the company's ^615m deeply discounted rights issue last year

FirstGroup's chief executive, Tim O^Toole, has insisted the transport company won^t be forced into making any ^desperate^ bids for UK rail contracts, despite coming away empty-handed from four franchise competitions so far this year.

All eyes are on the bidding competition for the prestigious East Coast Main Line, the winner of which is due to be announced by the Department for Transport this month.

Some analysts have suggested FirstGroup^s balance sheet will be put under ^further stress^ if it fails to win the contract to operate London-to-Scotland East Coast services, having already lost out on so many rail bids this year.

FirstGroup was passed over for a new contract to run ScotRail services north of the Border which was awarded to Abellio, the UK arm of the Dutch state railway.

It also lost out to Go-Ahead Group and Keolis in the battle for the giant ^Thameslink Southern Great Northern^ commuter franchise in London and the South of England, while it will no longer run Caledonian Sleeper services from April.

FirstGroup had also been short-listed in the competition for the Essex Thameside franchise but National Express has retained control of the services between London and the Essex Coast.

Mr O^Toole, who led FirstGroup^s ^615m rights issue last year, insisted that the transport heavyweight would not have to raise additional cash, even if it is unsuccessful in the East Coast franchise competition.

FirstGroup is not going to depart from a ^disciplined approach^ to rail bids, he argued. ^That^s always the concern isn^t it? That we will get desperate and put in some uneconomic bid just so we can say: 'Oh, well, look we won one.^ I^m saying, look, we are in the business of restoring shareholder values so we can^t go there.^

FirstGroup was accused in 2012 of putting in a bid for the West Coast Main Line franchise that would have resulted in ^almost certain bankruptcy^ when it was named the preferred bidder for the contract over Sir Richard Branson^s Virgin Trains - an accusation Mr O^Toole has always flatly denied. The West Coast competition was subsequently scrapped in the face of a legal challenge by Virgin.

Despite reassuring over FirstGroup^s disciplined approach to rail bids, Mr O^Toole appeared to question his rivals^ approach to franchise competitions, saying the contracts awarded so far this year were at ^economic levels that were unacceptable to us^.

FirstGroup, which last year suspended its dividend and has been under pressure from activist investor Sandell Asset Management, insisted that its turnaround plan is ^on track^ as it posted a 10.9pc fall in first-half revenues to ^2.9bn.

The bus and rail operator, which is seeking to turnaround its UK bus and American yellow school bus units, blamed one-off factors for the slide, such as the end of revenue support for its First Great Western and First Capital Connect rail franchises.

The group also said revenues from a year earlier included income from several UK bus operations that have since been sold or closed. Excluding these factors, it said revenue increased by 3.9pc. Pre-tax profit rose to ^9.9m in the six months to September 30 from an ^8m loss at the same point a year ago.

In a nod to Sandell, which has been pushing for a strategy change, FirstGroup^s outgoing chairman John McFarlane said the company^s board had reviewed strategic alternatives ^but nothing compelling has become evident^.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 05, 2014, 21:30:39
The rumours and talking up coming from the city and one or two market analysts is that the Stagecoach (90%)/Virgin (10%) bid is the front runner for the Inter City East Coast franchise. Announcement on the winner is expected on or around the 19th November.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/marketforceslive/2014/oct/29/stagecoach-slips-despite-positive-update-ahead-of-east-coast-decision

The early rumours/talking up that circulated in the business press prior to the awards of the Thameslink, Southern & Great Northern and the Essex Thameside franchises prove to be correct.

As an aside the domain virgineastcoast.co.uk was registered by Stagecoach on 23rd October... but then, firsteastcoast.co.uk was also updated on 24th September...


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 25, 2014, 17:00:02
Announcement on the ICEC franchise is still pending. This weeks rumours are that Eurostar/Keolis are now the front runners.

http://www.railtechnologymagazine.com/Rail-News/eurostar-and-keolis-favoured-to-win-east-coast-franchise

After this rumour surfaced in the weekend national press both Stagecoach and First Group's share price took a tumble when markets opened Monday morning.

Maybe if another week passes before an announcement from the DfT, First Group will be rumoured as front runners.  :P

Having failed to win any franchises since the process was restarted I bet First Group are glad the DfT decided to postpone the Greater Western franchise competition, despite First Group exercising the contract break clause in 2011. They've managed to keep operating Greater Western, and at much more favourable financial terms under a management contract as opposed to the premium payments required had they they taken the 3 year extension. Good news for First Group's shareholders. Bad news for taxpayers.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: ChrisB on November 25, 2014, 17:05:47
Blame the Government at the time that gave FGW that franchise, rather than suggest the operator is at fault.

All they did was action an option written into their franchise. Admit it, you'd have done the same!


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 25, 2014, 17:12:46
I can't have done the same. I'm not a company involved in rail transport. First Group did what made financial sense for them. Sadly that was at the expense of taxpayers. Absolutely nothing wrong in that. Priorities are: safety; shareholders; government; passengers.

Were I the minister though, I'd've not scrapped the franchise process and rewarded an operator who walked away. Or, if it just wasn't possible to have a franchise competition it should have been DOR rather than a management contract.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: ChrisB on November 25, 2014, 17:16:13
So you can put yourself in olace of the Minister, but not the CEO OF firstGroup?! Huh?

You gaven't the facts to make that decision an informed decision....


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 25, 2014, 17:22:29
Yep. I'm an individual, not a board of directors.

I also have no connection to First Great Western beyond being a passenger. Free to praise. Free to be critical. Free to defend.

I trust the ellipses+1 means some facts are forthcoming.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: ChrisB on November 25, 2014, 17:33:10
Indeed. So is the CEO OF first Group....

Don't understand your elipses+1 comment.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: Red Squirrel on November 25, 2014, 21:33:21
Yep. I'm an individual, not a board of directors.

I also have no connection to First Great Western beyond being a passenger. Free to praise. Free to be critical. Free to defend.

I trust the ellipses+1 means some facts are forthcoming.

According to some authorities, an ellipsis at the end of a sentence should have four dots (others disagree - see http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=1737920). Perhaps ChrisB is adhering to that convention...



Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: eightf48544 on November 26, 2014, 10:56:20
I'd be surprised if any TOC will bid for the new GW franchise if Roger Ford's estimates of the leasing costs he's postualted for the IEP in Modern Railways are any where near accurate.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: TonyK on November 26, 2014, 21:31:05
DLR, or whatever it is called


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 27, 2014, 03:07:17
The Scotsman calls ICEC for Eurostar/Keolis.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/faster-journeys-for-new-east-coast-rail-franchise-1-3616950

Announcement expected later this morning.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: John R on November 27, 2014, 07:07:02
But then again, it might not be the French after all  ;)


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: Brucey on November 27, 2014, 07:09:00
BBC News are reporting the Virgin/Stagecoach bid as won the ICEC franchise.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: stuving on November 27, 2014, 09:14:19
Here's the DfT announcement (https://www.gov.uk/government/news/more-seats-more-services-and-new-trains-for-east-coast-passengers) of the Virgin/Stagecoach ("Inter City Railways") award:
Quote
East Coast franchise awarded to Inter City Railways, a consortium of Stagecoach and Virgin.

Rail journeys between London and Edinburgh will be transformed by more seats, more services and new trains after the government announced its intention to award the new East Coast franchise to Inter City Railways, a consortium of Stagecoach and Virgin, today (27 November 2014).

The new deal will include a host of extra benefits for passengers:

23 new services from London to key destinations, with 75 more station calls a day
plans for new direct links to Huddersfield, Sunderland, Middlesbrough, Dewsbury and Thornaby
proposals for more trains to London from Bradford, Edinburgh, Harrogate, Leeds, Lincoln, Newcastle, Shipley, Stirling, and York
3,100 extra seats for the morning peak time by 2020
across the entire train fleet there will be 12,200 additional seats ^ a 50% increase
65 state of the art Intercity Express trains brought into passenger service from 2018, totalling 500 new carriages
journey times from London to Leeds reduced by 14 minutes, and from London to Edinburgh by 13 minutes
a ^140 million investment package to improve trains and stations.
...


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: ellendune on November 27, 2014, 09:19:18
What caught my eye in the DfT announcement was a commitment to reduce long distance anytime fares on ECML by 10%!


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: stuving on November 27, 2014, 09:29:12
The first puzzle - what this new bunch is called? Is it "Inter City Railways", as in the DfT statement? Or "inter city-railways" (as printed as their address in their brochure)?

I can't find any web presence, but surely they have got their towel on something.

Also, note this:
Quote
Inter City Railways is 90% owned by Stagecoach, but trains will be branded 'Virgin Trains East Coast', Stagecoach said.

So maybe it's "Stagecoach".


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: Super Guard on November 27, 2014, 09:50:54
FG shares dropped initially, and now up 1%.. go figure!


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 27, 2014, 10:32:54
So, like TSGN, the early rumours were correct.  ;)

Hmm... this year it has been anyone but First Group when it comes to rail franchises. Lost ScotRail, lost First Capital Connect, failed in bids for TSGN, Essex Thameside, and now unsuccessful in their bid for ICEC.

Still at least they've got Greater Western for the foreseeable future, eventually for near double the actual length of time of the original franchise award in 2006.

Shouldn't be too long now before we get an announcement of the specific financial details from the DfT and First Group on how they've colluded to keep Greater Western in First Group's hands until 2018/19 with a direct award.

No doubt there will be mention again of, 'Greatest investment since Brunel' but I suspect there will be very little money on the table from First Group. Greater Western will continue to be good value for FG's shareholders, but poor value for the taxpayer.

First Group's statement from CEO Tim O'Toole regarding the Intercity East Coast Franchise Competition:

Quote
FirstGroup notes the announcement today by the Department for Transport (^DfT^) concerning the new InterCity East Coast franchise.

Commenting, Tim O^Toole, FirstGroup^s Chief Executive, said:

^Our bid for the East Coast franchise was ambitious yet realistic. Had it been selected, it would have created a world class railway for passengers and value for taxpayers with a balanced level of risk and returns for shareholders.

^As one of the UK's most experienced operators, we remain committed to the rail market but we are dissatisfied not to have secured any of the franchises that have come up for tender in this first round.

^Whilst we will retain a disciplined approach to bidding, we will continue to examine and assess the feedback from this and previous rail bids to help shape our approach to future competitions.

^We are shortlisted to run the next TransPennine Express franchise, and are negotiating with the DfT to extend our current operation of that route to February 2016. We are also negotiating with the DfT for a direct award to operate First Great Western, our largest franchise, through to at least March 2019.

^There are 12 franchise competitions still to take place and we remain focused on reaching our desired position in rail by the end of the process, which is to achieve earnings on a par with the previous franchising cycle at an acceptable level of risk and return.^
http://www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2014/27-11-14.aspx


It seems that First Group are hoping for jam tomorrow. However, now might be a good time to buy shares in First Group PLC. If they do bounce back with further franchise wins in the coming years it could be a canny investment.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: ChrisB on November 27, 2014, 10:40:10
That may explain the rise in share price after an initial drop....BNE piled into FirstGroup :-)

Virgin East Coast - likely to appear on the Virgin website, no?....somewhat surprised thatthis combo has now got both East & West Coast...

RMT flailing....franchise worth ^3.3billion to taxpayer, while DOR only paid ^1billion since takeover. Assuming Stagecoach cough everything up, taxpayer gets 3 times what DOR have paid over.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: eightf48544 on November 27, 2014, 10:53:39
The bids for the new GW franchise from 2019 are going to be very interesting.

Particularly as it is rumoured (Roger Ford for one) that the leasing costs of the IEP's will  be considerably higher than for an HST thus will require a massive increase in passengers to cover.

And that's without a possible increase in Track Access charges to pay for electrification and resignalling.

Plus the winner is likely to lose the revenue from TV stations to Crossrail.

A bit of poisoned challis


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: JayMac on November 27, 2014, 10:57:03
A bit of poisoned challis

Must have been something he drank.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fb/John_Challis.jpg/220px-John_Challis.jpg)
 ;D


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: stuving on November 27, 2014, 12:01:46
What caught my eye in the DfT announcement was a commitment to reduce long distance anytime fares on ECML by 10%!

The wording of that promise is:
Quote
Inter City Railways has also given a commitment to reduce all long-distance standard anytime fares by 10%.

In the corresponding statement to parliament (https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/rail-franchising-27-november-2014), that becomes:
Quote
Stagecoach/Virgin plans to reduce some of the most expensive standard class fares on the franchise by up to 10% from May next year.

Nibbled by weasels in transit? Or is that the real version?


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: Richard Fairhurst on November 27, 2014, 12:11:10
London-Glasgow anytime return via WCML, priced by Virgin Trains: ^352.

London-Glasgow anytime return via ECML, priced by East Coast: ^304.

Mr Branson, why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: grahame on November 27, 2014, 12:44:41
London-Glasgow anytime return via WCML, priced by Virgin Trains: ^352.

London-Glasgow anytime return via ECML, priced by East Coast: ^304.

Mr Branson, why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?

An interesting point and thought on what's been bid.  Trains on the East Coast line are, though, older that those on the West Coast, and perhaps the ECML fare in this case is a competitive one.  At 38p and 44p per mile, indeed, these fares both appear to be better value than something line a London to Bristol anytime return.


Title: Re: FirstGroup: We won't be forced into any 'desperate' rail bids
Post by: TonyK on November 27, 2014, 16:36:39

It seems that First Group are hoping for jam tomorrow. However, now might be a good time to buy shares in First Group PLC. If they do bounce back with further franchise wins in the coming years it could be a canny investment.
^1.09 at the moment, 52 week high is ^1.459. Might have a flutter.



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