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Short notice but I have just discovered this programme scheduled for tonight at 9pm on BBC TWO.


Quote from Digiguide

They should be used to that, having both worked at the BBC....pot calling kettle

Maybe Ian Fletcher will be the next head of Network Rail?  ;D

Actually "The Apprentice" was produced by Fremantle Media, not the BBC.

Watch the programme tonight and make an objective judgement, I have no doubt that many people on here will find any criticism very hard to accept, but these are two people with very wide experience in Business and have opinions which many will value and respect.

The counter argument that the railway industry is currently efficient is one which I would be interested in being made and listening to.

Yes well no so that's all good going forward !!!.

Found the whole premise of the programme to be so depressingly negative. The first positive comment came in at 46 minutes into the whole programme.   I enjoyed the Pacer being outpaced by a British Leyland Ribble RELL replesdent in rousingly rapturous red..... and saw Margaret Mountford smile for the first time ever! Plenty of questions and observations but few answers.What answers there were, bordered on the pathetic. Yes, the Todmorden Curve lies completed but empty, but NR have buggered up the signalling,the TOC claims there isn't a spare train or carriage, and just to square the circle the drivers cannot be trained as there are no signals. If there was a case for someone to knock heads together, surely this was it. All we needed to compound the misery  was a spoonful of Sugar to help the acerbic medicinal taste of the programme go down the wrong way !

Real time trains and also ticket sales / journey planners showing an hourly service from mid May, so they've got a train from somewhere  ;D

"Chuffed........wiv regret.......you're fired!"  ;D

I only caught the last 30 minutes, but I thought the piece around Chiltern and the new line into Oxford was fairly positive!

Learnt a bit about railways in Northern Ireland as well.

The NR boss seemed to me to have a somewhat laissez-faire attitude to the massive cost over-runs around electrification.

I rather enjoyed it (I like Nick Hewer as a presenter anyway) and felt it was reasonably balanced given the time available versus the scale of the subject. However, there were a few major questions asked and then left hanging: for example, should companies/shareholders take profits from a publicly subsidized organization? The feeling was 'no' but no real solutions or further suggestions were offered.

I was quite pleased with the program, it highlighted alot of the complexities of the current structure of the railways that we (mostly) know about but the general public probably don't. Of particular interest to me was the bit about Northern Ireland railways, which I don't know much about, and the praise which was given to the SWT-NR deep alliance. In particular Northern Ireland was said to have experienced a doubling of passenger numbers, just like the part-privatised railway over here, which perhaps negates the claims that the growth we've had was a concequence of privatisation. As for the SWT comments, it shows that vertical integration helps the railway. Together, these two points have strengthened by view that the breaking up and privatisation of British Rail was a mistake. Sure the trains were old, dirty and late, but in that regard nothing has changed. The negatives about today's service are the same as they were in BR days, just the fragmentation and profiteering* means we are paying more for it. I am however also mindful that some of the damage was probably due to the re-organisation itself rather than the new privatised structure, so although losing BR was a big mistake I am starting to wonder whether I should remain in favour of renationalisation. Perhaps John Major's government 'killed the golden goose' and we cannot now return to a financially efficient railway? I suppose if you did it slowly it might work out ok, but I doubt we could expect a quick return to efficiency.

Perhaps of particular importance was the bit near the end when Margaret got only a written statement out of DfT, and her comments that the system is effectively nationalised anyway and the DfT is using the TOCs to create a smokescreen and mask accountablity. This perhaps is the ultimate 'smoke and mirrors', the DfT is actually running the show in many respects but any critisism is reflected at the TOCs who in turn blame Network Rail, DfT and perhaps the ROSCOs. The DfT apparently has so far managed to avoid critisism for its illogical and wasteful Intercity rolling stock plans, for example.

I was a tad disapointed by questions left hanging, such as the reasons behind the train that's always late (my guess when I heard that at the start of the program was that there must be some odd timetable anomally, but apparently not?) but overall I felt it was rather good. Is it part of a series or a one-off?

* It was a shame that the didn't give a figure for ROSCO profits. They stated that the TOCs have small margins, single-digit-percentage profits and suggested the ROSCOs made more, but they didn't put a figure on how much more.

Errr, I wasn't referring to that programme. Both have worked for the BBC in other programmes

I agree with Rhydgaled I thought it was balanced and empathetic towards customers, and the background info on the ROSCOs was interesting too - I was pleased that the NR big cheese was interviewed although he didn't really have much of an answer to the massive overspend on electrification, not surprising that Nick picked up on that!

Would perhaps have been interesting to get more views of staff on the frontline?

Highlighting the absurdities of issues such as the Todmorden curve was also interesting.

It certainly didn't come across as a "witch hunt" though which I guess a lot of the Rail people in this forum feared?

I thought they were an ideal pair to present the show - savvy about Business, but willing to listen too.

I didn't get to see it, but here's a review from the Telegraph:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/tv-and-radio-reviews/11572314/Nick-and-Margaret-the-Trouble-with-Our-Trains-BBC-Two-review.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/tv-and-radio-reviews/11572314/Nick-and-Margaret-the-Trouble-with-Our-Trains-BBC-Two-review.html)

iPlayer is your friend...  ;)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05sz83j/nick-and-margaret-the-trouble-with-our-trains (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05sz83j/nick-and-margaret-the-trouble-with-our-trains)

For Margaret Mountford I can find just one show she's been a presenter of with a BBC production credit. Other shows she's appeared alongside Nick Hewer in have been produced by Silver River Productions.

That's as offensive as referring to Clun Castle as a BR 4073 class...

North west electrification is finally releasing some dmu's, though the majority are having to be retained for stock juggling to compensate for the loss of TPE Class 170s to Chiltern, rather than used to alleviate overcrowding.

Now I've seen it, I understand - that was a Leyland National, sir: the very thing bus operators were forced to buy when the good old Bristol RELL ceased production. Chiz.

Todmorden curve opens ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-32754835