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All across the Great Western territory => The Wider Picture - related rail and other transport issues => Topic started by: TaplowGreen on May 15, 2015, 12:23:05



Title: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 15, 2015, 12:23:05
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32748029

...........it just gets better and better!  :(


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 15, 2015, 12:32:10
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32748029

...........it just gets better and better!  :(


Quote
Network Rail workers are to stage a 24-hour strike from 5pm on bank holiday Monday in a row over pay.
The UK-wide action will see signallers, maintenance staff and station workers, walk out from 25 May on the busy holiday weekend.

General feedback on the page isn't sympathetic to the strikers or rail industry - 4 separate quotes here of the latest comments as I read the page

Quote
A full-time track maintenance engineer can earn up to ^75K and gets at least 28 days holiday. That's currently on offer in Basingstoke. Most people in the private sector start on 22 days holiday. maybe rising to 25 after 5 years and 28 after 10 but get nowhere near that sort of money. Yes, there are jobs paying considerably less, but there are in the private sector.

Only 5% of workers commute by train. The other 95% of taxpayers who subsidise rail travel can rarely use it due to ever ongoing maintenance. Go on strike. Lose your pay. Not many people will really notice or bother.

my trains are late too and from work more than once a week due to signal failures. I think its and outrage that these people can strike when the railways they look after are in such a state.

Agenda driven smoke and mirrors from you yet again, do you agree that the Conservatives got a higher proportion of votes, seats and percentage than any other individual Party. One thing is certain if Labour had won, even come second in a hung parliament and formed coalition, there would not be a peep out of you and your ridiculous logic. The moss is drying underneath your home, hurry back.





Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 15, 2015, 13:42:06
We'll see if it happens.  I reckon well over 50% of national rail strikes called get cancelled when late agreement is reached.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 15, 2015, 14:37:59
Have there been any ballots for a national strike in the last decade or so? The last time there was an actual national strike in the rail industry was 1994 I believe.

The Government's response:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/transport-secretary-responds-to-rail-strike-action


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 15, 2015, 14:43:24
any idea what impact the strike would have if it goes ahead?  Will it likely be no trains at all, or will it be severe delays?



Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 15, 2015, 14:54:35
No trains, surely? Signalmen would be out


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Fourbee on May 15, 2015, 15:29:31
The TSSA ballot outcome is due later today. I expect that would have a bearing on the overall service provision on those 2 days.

I'd assume on the Monday, services could still run in the morning, but many would need to be wound down earlier than 5pm.

No mention of ASLEF members being balloted?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Fourbee on May 15, 2015, 15:30:57
Also noticed on twitter that thetrainline are offering "full refunds". I wonder if that includes their booking fee.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: insider on May 15, 2015, 16:42:50
The TSSA ballot outcome is due later today. I expect that would have a bearing on the overall service provision on those 2 days.

I'd assume on the Monday, services could still run in the morning, but many would need to be wound down earlier than 5pm.

No mention of ASLEF members being balloted?

ASLEF is a drivers union and TOC's drivers are not affected.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 15, 2015, 16:56:06
The TSSA ballot outcome is due later today. I expect that would have a bearing on the overall service provision on those 2 days.

I'd assume on the Monday, services could still run in the morning, but many would need to be wound down earlier than 5pm.

No mention of ASLEF members being balloted?

that is useful.

I really would like to be in London on 26th to attend an event with Sir David Attenborough and Prof Alice Roberts (respectively a hero and crush of mine), and wondered if I should be booking a coach today.

- amended.  I have booked a ^8 national Express fare just in case.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 15, 2015, 18:08:20
The NR members of RMT are the signallers. If they're out, it doesn't matter what the TSSA (or the drivers unions, for that matter) vote. There wouldn't be any trains if no signallers


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: John R on May 15, 2015, 18:17:03
There wouldn't be any trains if no signallers

 A surprising number of trains ran during the last national signallers strike, and with the centralisation of boxes in the intervening years I would imagine even more so would run this time around.  If I recall on each successive day more and more ran as BR got increasingly confident about who would turn up, and the level of service that could be run.  Managers were used to man the key centres - it will be interesting to see whether the privatised railway has remembered to keep them trained to do so. That could be a stumbling block.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: eightf48544 on May 16, 2015, 09:18:22
No mention of ASLEF members being balloted?

ASLEF don't need to call a National Strike to be effective. With the break up of the railway drivers are now tied  to one TOC, its specific traction and routes. Gone are teh days of local sheds with spare links of drivers and fireman.

Therefore, they can play one TOC off against another by threating local disrution. The affected TOC would be unable to call on drivers from other comapanies because there wouldn't be enough spare to cover, they wouldn't know the traction or the routes. Gone are the days of local sheds with spare links of drivers and fireman.

The government didnn't see that coming they thought by breaking up the railways they'd dimish ASLEF in particualr power.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Rapidash on May 16, 2015, 18:45:13
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays, but Stagecoach do and as such, the buses run a sunday service. The number of X46 runs on that day can be counted on a blind butchers hand.

I don't hold anyone to blame for it, though. People are angry, and will lawfully express it, one way or another.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Ollie on May 16, 2015, 22:44:03
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays,

I don't get what you mean by this comment?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 16, 2015, 22:46:44
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays, but Stagecoach do and as such, the buses run a sunday service. The number of X46 runs on that day can be counted on a blind butchers hand.

I don't hold anyone to blame for it, though. People are angry, and will lawfully express it, one way or another.

.......and the timing, just after a Tory election victory, is an amazing coincidence!  ;)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Rapidash on May 17, 2015, 08:12:16
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays,

I don't get what you mean by this comment?

They run the standard weekday service, rather than a sunday service. I assume the rest of the network is like that ;)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 17, 2015, 09:44:22
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays, but Stagecoach do and as such, the buses run a sunday service. The number of X46 runs on that day can be counted on a blind butchers hand.

I don't hold anyone to blame for it, though. People are angry, and will lawfully express it, one way or another.

.......and the timing, just after a Tory election victory, is an amazing coincidence!  ;)

Coincidence is exactly what it is. The ballot for industrial action was called by the RMT in April before they, or anyone, knew what colour the next Parliament was going to be.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 17, 2015, 16:42:00
The ballot for industrial action was called by the RMT in April before they, or anyone, knew what colour the next Parliament was going to be.

...even the pollsters!  ;D


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 17, 2015, 17:00:05
My main peeve with this, is that FGW don't believe in bank holidays, but Stagecoach do and as such, the buses run a sunday service. The number of X46 runs on that day can be counted on a blind butchers hand.

I don't hold anyone to blame for it, though. People are angry, and will lawfully express it, one way or another.

.......and the timing, just after a Tory election victory, is an amazing coincidence!  ;)

Coincidence is exactly what it is. The ballot for industrial action was called by the RMT in April before they, or anyone, knew what colour the next Parliament was going to be.

.....fair point.....I should have said just after the election of a new Government......you can guarantee the Unions will have a go, whatever the colour......they've already started the process of choosing the new Labour leader on both sides of the border!!! ;)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 19, 2015, 18:35:09
Arriva Trains Wales are first out of the blocks with their contingency plan:

http://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/IndustrialAction/

Interesting to note from that, FGW are planning on running hourly services in both directions on Tuesday 26th between Cardiff and London, and Bristol TM and London.

That suggests FGW have drawn up a contingency plan for public consumption, just not yet published it.



EDIT: Just had a reply from @FGW. They are just finalising their plans


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: John R on May 19, 2015, 18:45:17

Interesting to note from that, FGW are planning on running hourly services in both directions on Tuesday 26th between Cardiff and London, and Bristol TM and London.


It's somewhat ambiguous. It could refer to a separate hourly service between Cardiff and Bristol TM, which would be "in area" for ATW.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: BRIChris on May 19, 2015, 19:47:29
I am going to potentially be caught right up in this strike. A few friends and I have planned a bike ride across North Devon over this weekend which involves a journey by train from Exeter to Bristol on the Monday evening - we had planned to get back to Bristol at about 8pm.

While changing travel plans by train isn't normally too bad, we obviously have the added caveat that we all have bikes! I have been sensible and booked us all bike spaces on an earlier train getting back to Bristol a few hours before the strike is due to start, but I am wondering/pensive/cautious as to how early the effects of the strike may start to set in, and whether in such unusual circumstances, whether the reservations will be upheld.

FGW and XC have not at the time of writing published anything that I can find to do with contingency plans for the strike... so it's a bit of a waiting game at the moment to see if I'll have to make a contingency plan for our contingency plan! :o

They run the standard weekday service, rather than a sunday service. I assume the rest of the network is like that ;)

Could someone please correct me if I'm wrong (and I may be about to learn another new thing on here!) but is it so trains are in the correct places for the next day's service? As I always thought a Sunday evening service winds down so that trains are in the same place on a Sunday night as they would be on a Monday night for the next weekday? Or have I just made this up?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 19, 2015, 20:20:03
I understand that TOCs will publish a timetable once they lnow it's going ahead, which I would guess will be Friday - however manyvare saying they'll publish more details during tomorrow...?

Chiltern published at thecweekend, so they were firstcout if the blocks


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: a-driver on May 19, 2015, 21:48:03
I suppose also, a lot more thought and planning will go into a timetable for the larger operators covering many signalling centre areas than say the likes of C2C and a TOC can't really begin to plan a timetable until NR confirm their exact staffing levels during the strike.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: tomL on May 19, 2015, 22:36:08
A notice has gone out on the open rail data community warning system maintainers to expect a large flow of schedule updates and modifications over the next few days.

Should be interesting to see what comes of it all!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 10:49:27
RMT Notice to members

Quote
Our Ref: HSR/4/2Head Office Circular: NP/091/15

20th May 2015

The Secretary

ALL BRANCHES

ALL REGIONAL COUNCILS

 

Dear Colleague

NETWORK RAIL DISPUTE ^ SERIOUS AND IMMINENT DANGER

Members of the RMT working for Network Rail will be engaging in industrial action as follows:

To take 24 hours of industrial action by not booking on for duty on any shift from 1700 hours on 25/05/2015 until 1659 hours on 26/05/2015.

To take industrial action by not working any overtime or additional hours or any extended shifts and by not undertaking any call-outs for 48 hours between 0001 hours on 25/05/2015 and 2359 hours on 26/05/2015.

During these periods we believe Network Rail will attempt to run a railway service by using managers to cover safety critical roles and in particular to cover Electrical Control Rooms, signal boxes and signalling centres and train dispatch with managers who we fear may not be fully competent to carry out the safety critical tasks that are so important in protecting staff, passengers and the general public.

These cover arrangements will clearly impact on the operational safety of staff working outside of Network Rail but working on the railway infrastructure. Roles that may be affected in this way by the dispute include, but may not be limited to, train drivers, guards, infrastructure workers, other on-board staff and train dispatch staff.

Under the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations 1999 (MHSW), Regulation 8(1) employers have a duty to establish procedures to be followed in the event of serious and imminent danger to persons at work such procedures are sometimes known as Worksafe Procedures.

A guide to your rights in this regard are contained in the following RMT publication:

http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/publications/serious-and-imminent-dangers/ (http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/publications/serious-and-imminent-dangers/)

Should you, as an individual, feel that as part of your duties you are placing yourself in serious or imminent danger during the dispute you should comply with your company^s policy as required by the MHSW. Attached to this circular is a pro-forma should you wish to record your concerns in writing to your management.

Please bring the contents of this circular to the attention of all relevant members.

Yours sincerely
 Mick Cash

General Secretary     

http://www.rmt.org.uk/healthandsafety


To^ Line Manager

From^

Workplace^.

INDUSTRIAL ACTION BY RMT MEMBERS EMPLOYED BY NETWORK RAIL IN MAINTENANCE AND OPERATIONS GRADES

I am genuinely concerned for the safety of myself and others due to my belief that I may be placed at risk of serious and imminent danger by Network Rail^s use of unqualified staff who do not possess the necessary competencies to cover safety critical duties. I believe that you have a duty to provide me with a safe system of work and I would ask that you ensure that the arrangements you have in place adequately protect my safety.

I would therefore request that I am allocated alternative duties for which I am trained and licensed for until such time as the procedures contained in the company^s procedure to protect against serious and imminent danger have been carried out and I believe that my safety is adequately protected.


Signed^..

Date^

and NRE current advice

Quote
Members of the RMT and TSSA Unions that work for track and infrastructure operator Network Rail have announced that they are planning to take industrial action on Bank Holiday Monday 25 May and Tuesday 26 May. However, further talks between Network Rail and the Trades Unions are currently taking place, which may still lead to resolution of the dispute.

Should the industrial action go ahead there is likely to be severe disruption to rail services on Monday 25 and Tuesday 26 May, although this is likely to vary considerably by route, so you are strongly advised to check with the relevant train company before travelling.

More information on the timetables that will operate on the 25 and 26 May will be available on this page of the National Rail Enquiries website from the afternoon of Thursday 21 May onwards. Please note, that as the planned industrial action will affect routes differently (because of differing rail signaling systems, for instance), it is likely that more information will be available on some routes than others. Full timetables for the 25 and 26 May are currently expected to be available from Saturday 23 May onwards. [my emphasis]

We appreciate that many customers will have their travel plans disrupted by the planned industrial action, so train companies have agreed to put in place special ticketing arrangements to make it easier for you to complete your journey, should the industrial action go ahead. Please see details below:

If the industrial action goes ahead and you already have a valid Anytime, Off-Peak or Super Off-Peak ticket valid for travel on either the Monday 25 or Tuesday 26 May you will be able to use your ticket for travel on Sunday 24 May or Wednesday 27 May, subject to any travel restrictions that would normally apply to your ticket on those days.

If you have an Advance ticket for travel on Monday 25 or Tuesday 26 May, you will also be able to travel on either Sunday 24 May or Wednesday 27 May. However, if you travel on either of these two, alternative days, you must use the same train service that you would have used on the 25 or 26 May, or the services immediately before or after this service.

Some train companies will be putting in place additional local ticketing arrangements, so please check with the train company you^ll be using before travelling.

If you already have a ticket valid for travel on any of the days potentially affected by the planned industrial action and no longer wish to travel, the retailer that sold you your ticket will provide you with a full refund. Alternatively you can exchange it for another ticket (once you^ve paid any difference in price). If you want to obtain a refund or exchange your ticket please ask the retailer from whom you purchased your ticket.

If you have a Season Ticket you will be entitled to compensation. As these arrangements vary by train company, please check with your train company on the compensation you will be entitled to.

To get the latest travel and other information, go to www.nationalrail.co.uk, download the NRE app, follow us on Twitter @nationalrailenq or using the hashtag #IndustrialAction or speak to your train operator.

Now, season compensation. With flexible working, and some of us working on Monday, I wonder whether the TOCs will offer two days compensation?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 20, 2015, 11:23:50
And what about those with multi day Rover Tickets?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Ollie on May 20, 2015, 12:06:42
Subject to agreement from Network Rail, we aim to operate the following:

London Thames Valley

^        Paddington ^ Didcot, calling at Slough Maidenhead (Peak only) and Reading: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Didcot, calling at Ealing Broadway, Southall Hayes and Harlington, West Drayton, Iver, Langley, Slough, Maidenhead, Twyford, Reading, Tilehurst, Pangbourne, Goring and Streatley, Cholsey and Didcot Parkway: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Reading non-stop to operate during peak time only: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Reading, calling at Acton Mainline, Ealing Broadway, West Ealing, Hanwell, Southall, Hayes and Harlington, West Drayton, Slough, Burnham, Taplow, Maidenhead, Twyford and Reading: Every 30 mins

^        Branch line services to Bourne End/Marlow and Windsor to run every 20/30 mins

Bristol

^        Paddington ^ Bristol Temple Meads, calling at Reading Didcot, Swindon, Chippenham, Bath and Bristol, extended to Weston-Super-Mare and Taunton during peak: Hourly

^        Swindon ^ Bristol, calling at Chippenham, Bath Spa, Oldfield Park, Keynsham, Bristol Temple Meads: Hourly

^        Bristol Parkway ^ Weston-Super-Mare, calling at Filton, Stapleton Road, Lawrence Hill, Bristol Temple Meads, Bedminster, Parson St, Nailsea and Backwell, Yatton, Worle, Weston Milton and Weston-Super-Mare: Hourly

South Wales

^        Paddington ^ Swansea on Monday and Cardiff on Tuesday, calling at Reading, Didcot Parkway, Swindon, Bristol Parkway, Newport and Cardiff: Hourly

^        Cardiff ^ Taunton, calling at Newport, Severn Tunnel Juncton, Patchway, Filton Abbey Wood, Bristol Temple Meads, Nailsea, Yatton, Worle, Weston-Super-Mare, Highbridge, Bridgwater and Taunton: Hourly

Devon and Cornwall

^        Paddington ^ Plymouth, calling at Reading, Bristol Parkway, Bristol Temple Meads, Taunton, Tiverton, Exeter, Dawlish, Teignmouth, Newton Abbot, Totnes, Ivybridge (select trains only) and Plymouth: Hourly

^        Exeter ^ Newton Abbot, stopping service: Hourly
^        Sleeper services will not be able to operate on Sunday, Monday or Tuesday.


Unfortunately, Network Rail has confirmed that they do not expect to be able to allow access to the following areas of the First Great Western network, and no trains will run after 0001 Monday 25 May and Tuesday 26 May. Service start up on Wednesday will also be affected:

^        North Cotswolds line, from Oxford and calling at Worcester and Hereford, or services between Didcot and Oxford

^        Beyond Plymouth to Penzance and on Devon and Cornwall branch line services
^        Reading to Gatwick Airport/Reading to Basingstoke
^        Between Swindon and Gloucester/Cheltenham
^        Between Bath Spa and Portsmouth Harbour
^        Between Reading and Taunton
^        On the Henley-on-Thames and Greenford Branch lines
^        On Severn Beach branch line


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 20, 2015, 12:12:20
Subject to agreement from Network Rail, we aim to operate the following:

[snip]

Unfortunately, Network Rail has confirmed that they do not expect to be able to allow access to the following areas of the First Great Western network, and no trains will run after 0001 Monday 25 May and Tuesday 26 May. Service start up on Wednesday will also be affected:

[snip]


Thanks for those lists, Ollie.

Can't see "Swindon to Westbury" nor "Westbury to Weymouth" in either list.  Can you tell me how they stand, and will there be alternative road replacement services?  Thanks!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 12:14:13
Unfortunately, Network Rail has confirmed that they do not expect to be able to allow access to the following areas of the First Great Western network, and no trains will run after 0001 Monday 25 May and Tuesday 26 May. Service start up on Wednesday will also be affected:

^        North Cotswolds line, from Oxford and calling at Worcester and Hereford, or services between Didcot and Oxford

^        Beyond Plymouth to Penzance and on Devon and Cornwall branch line services
^        Reading to Gatwick Airport/Reading to Basingstoke
^        Between Swindon and Gloucester/Cheltenham
^        Between Bath Spa and Portsmouth Harbour
^        Between Reading and Taunton
^        On the Henley-on-Thames and Greenford Branch lines
^        On Severn Beach branch line

I realise that there is an overtime ban, but as the strike isn't to start until 1700 Monday, that's taking the proverbial isn't it?

There won't be any road replacement, there never is.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Ollie on May 20, 2015, 12:23:12
Thanks for those lists, Ollie.

Can't see "Swindon to Westbury" nor "Westbury to Weymouth" in either list.  Can you tell me how they stand, and will there be alternative road replacement services?  Thanks!

I believe there will be no service on those routes, but I've asked for confirmation.

There won't be road transport available.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 12:26:05
The full ptress release -

Quote
National rail strike: RMT and TSSA planned industrial action

Services expected to be significantly affected from 0001 Monday 25 to Tuesday 26 May and in the morning of Wednesday 27 May



RMT and TSSA trade union members employed by Network Rail have voted in favour of taking industrial action, which could affect rail services from 0001 Monday 25 May throughout Monday and Tuesday 26 May and will impact services on the morning of Wednesday 27 May.

We have been talking to Network Rail about the planned strike and the impact on First Great Western services. Should action go ahead is it likely to have a significant impact on our ability to run our train services throughout this period. Trains that are able to run are expected to be busy.

Full refunds will be available for customers who have already bought tickets during the industrial action period and choose not to travel, and Season Ticket holders will be compensated for any days affected.

Those with tickets for travel on Monday and Tuesday will also be able to use their ticket to travel on Sunday 24 May or Wednesday 27 May, subject to any travel restrictions that would normally apply to your ticket.

If you have an Advance Purchase ticket for Monday or Tuesday you will also able to travel on Sunday or Wednesday using the same service or one immediately before or after the booked time.

During Monday and Tuesday it is expected that services will operate at a reduced service frequency between 0730 and approximately 1830; please check timetables on the day for details of your last service.

Subject to agreement from Network Rail, we aim to operate the following:

London Thames Valley

^        Paddington ^ Didcot, calling at Slough Maidenhead (Peak only) and Reading: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Didcot, calling at Ealing Broadway, Southall Hayes and Harlington, West Drayton, Iver, Langley, Slough, Maidenhead, Twyford, Reading, Tilehurst, Pangbourne, Goring and Streatley, Cholsey and Didcot Parkway: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Reading non-stop to operate during peak time only: Every 30 mins

^        Paddington ^ Reading, calling at Acton Mainline, Ealing Broadway, West Ealing, Hanwell, Southall, Hayes and Harlington, West Drayton, Slough, Burnham, Taplow, Maidenhead, Twyford and Reading: Every 30 mins

^        Branch line services to Bourne End/Marlow and Windsor to run every 20/30 mins

Bristol

^        Paddington ^ Bristol Temple Meads, calling at Reading Didcot, Swindon, Chippenham, Bath and Bristol, extended to Weston-Super-Mare and Taunton during peak: Hourly

^        Swindon ^ Bristol, calling at Chippenham, Bath Spa, Oldfield Park, Keynsham, Bristol Temple Meads: Hourly

^        Bristol Parkway ^ Weston-Super-Mare, calling at Filton, Stapleton Road, Lawrence Hill, Bristol Temple Meads, Bedminster, Parson St, Nailsea and Backwell, Yatton, Worle, Weston Milton and Weston-Super-Mare: Hourly

South Wales

^        Paddington ^ Swansea on Monday and Cardiff on Tuesday, calling at Reading, Didcot Parkway, Swindon, Bristol Parkway, Newport and Cardiff: Hourly

^        Cardiff ^ Taunton, calling at Newport, Severn Tunnel Juncton, Patchway, Filton Abbey Wood, Bristol Temple Meads, Nailsea, Yatton, Worle, Weston-Super-Mare, Highbridge, Bridgwater and Taunton: Hourly

Devon and Cornwall

^        Paddington ^ Plymouth, calling at Reading, Bristol Parkway, Bristol Temple Meads, Taunton, Tiverton, Exeter, Dawlish, Teignmouth, Newton Abbot, Totnes, Ivybridge (select trains only) and Plymouth: Hourly

^        Exeter ^ Newton Abbot, stopping service: Hourly

^        Sleeper services will not be able to operate on Sunday, Monday or Tuesday.


Unfortunately, Network Rail has confirmed that they do not expect to be able to allow access to the following areas of the First Great Western network, and no trains will run after 0001 Monday 25 May and Tuesday 26 May. Service start up on Wednesday will also be affected:

^        North Cotswolds line, from Oxford and calling at Worcester and Hereford, or services between Didcot and Oxford

^        Beyond Plymouth to Penzance and on Devon and Cornwall branch line services


^        Reading to Gatwick Airport/Reading to Basingstoke


^        Between Swindon and Gloucester/Cheltenham


^        Between Bath Spa and Portsmouth Harbour


^        Between Reading and Taunton


^        On the Henley-on-Thames and Greenford Branch lines


^        On Severn Beach branch line


Please note that it is unlikely that we will be able to honour seat reservations on these days, but should you choose to alter your travel plans we can change the reservation without penalty.

For the very latest information please continue to check this page or National Rail Enquiries at www.nationalrail.co.uk.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 12:27:55
The way I read that is that seasons will be compensated for Monday/Tuesday (and possibly Wednesday if the AM seriously disrupted).

The Rover will probably get extra days if you want them or a full refund if choosing not to travel.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Ollie on May 20, 2015, 12:32:02
Thanks for those lists, Ollie.

Can't see "Swindon to Westbury" nor "Westbury to Weymouth" in either list.  Can you tell me how they stand, and will there be alternative road replacement services?  Thanks!

I believe there will be no service on those routes, but I've asked for confirmation.

There won't be road transport available.

Confirmed - no service.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 20, 2015, 12:33:24
Even if the strike does go ahead, at least we won't be the only ones:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32810896 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32810896)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: broadgage on May 20, 2015, 12:53:42
With the limited service available, I hope that ALL the trains that do run will be of the maximum permitted length. In view of the number of services that cant be run, there should be no shortage of stock.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 13:30:26
All the turbo stock at Oxford will be trapped....


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 20, 2015, 13:51:42
All the turbo stock at Oxford will be trapped....

Even so, there should be plenty of units available to ensure full length turbo trains of 6-cars on all of the special services planned - perhaps even longer (8/9 car) on some services, i.e. the Paddington to Reading non-stop ones if they are to be Turbo operated?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 20, 2015, 14:15:12
Thanks for those lists, Ollie.

Can't see "Swindon to Westbury" nor "Westbury to Weymouth" in either list.  Can you tell me how they stand, and will there be alternative road replacement services?  Thanks!

I believe there will be no service on those routes, but I've asked for confirmation.

There won't be road transport available.

Confirmed - no service.

Thanks for that ... and for double checking.   We can at least make sure the message gets around (hopefully without turning off traffic if the service runs - does anyone have an educated guess as to whether the action will go ahead?)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 14:18:03
Totally up to the Politicos I guess - now NR is Government-owned.

Either they'll tell NR to settle, or they won't. The union is up for a fight though, so definitely Government choice.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 20, 2015, 14:48:46
Do I understand correctly that the Strike is from 1700 on Monday to 1700 on Tuesday, but that it looks like some trains will be running on my line (Bristol-Bath-Paddington) on Tuesday morning when the strike is supposedly happening, but that late Tuesday evening after the strike is over there will not be any trains?

 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ray951 on May 20, 2015, 14:54:24
Totally up to the Politicos I guess - now NR is Government-owned.

Either they'll tell NR to settle, or they won't. The union is up for a fight though, so definitely Government choice.

If you think this is true then it will go-ahead as
a) It will give the Govt an excuse/reason (take your pick) to introduce the new strike laws promised in their manifesto
b) the amount offered to NR staff, assuming RPI is greater than 1%, is more than has been offered to other Public Sector employees and they wouldn't want that. (Note RPI is currently 0.9%).
c) The ever increasing NR debt is going to have to be addressed and higher pay awards are only going to add to that, so the Govt will want to try and keep that in check using pay awards as has happened with the rest of the Public Sector.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 14:57:28
Yep, that's the way I see it too.

Question (poss for another thread) - If RPI also goes negative in July, will the price of seasons next January drop? Tories promised no 'rise' in prices - taken to mean RPI% each year, rather than a freeze in prices.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 20, 2015, 15:28:15
Do I understand correctly that the Strike is from 1700 on Monday to 1700 on Tuesday, but that it looks like some trains will be running on my line (Bristol-Bath-Paddington) on Tuesday morning when the strike is supposedly happening, but that late Tuesday evening after the strike is over there will not be any trains?

The union's directive is telling people not to start a shift in those times - so on Tuesday evening they'll still be on strike.    Looks like the operating plans are to concentrate available resources into the daytime.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: didcotdean on May 20, 2015, 15:55:14
Question (poss for another thread) - If RPI also goes negative in July, will the price of seasons next January drop? Tories promised no 'rise' in prices - taken to mean RPI% each year, rather than a freeze in prices.

RPI was negative through much of 2009. The result was that the rise applied in 2010 was 0.7%, but the regime then was RPI+1% I think. RPI is unlikely to go negative this year on current projections.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 20, 2015, 16:43:59
Do I understand correctly that the Strike is from 1700 on Monday to 1700 on Tuesday, but that it looks like some trains will be running on my line (Bristol-Bath-Paddington) on Tuesday morning when the strike is supposedly happening, but that late Tuesday evening after the strike is over there will not be any trains?

The union's directive is telling people not to start a shift in those times - so on Tuesday evening they'll still be on strike.    Looks like the operating plans are to concentrate available resources into the daytime.

That kind of makes sense, and I didn't expect everything to snap back into place at 5pm on Tuesday, but I would have expected some services leaving Paddington later that evening.  IMHO the TOCs and media have done a pretty poor job at communicating what might happen.  All the news outlets have reported 1700 to 1700 as if that would be the period effected.



Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Timmer on May 20, 2015, 16:52:34
Virgin West Coast are running NO services on both Monday and Tuesday. They are copping a lot of flack on social media for 'turning a 24 hour strike into a 48 hour strike'. Yes most of us here understand the logistics of services not being able to run before and after a rail strike, but most of the general public won't understand...and why should they? They just want to see services run.

There is also the added complication of getting the Preston North End (who are sponsored by Virgin Trains) fans back home after the play off match against Swindon at Wembley. Because of engineering work, last train to Preston leaves just before 8pm.

Thanks to Sky and the FA, the game has been moved from the usual k/o of 3pm to 5.30pm so a lot of fans bought a weekend package of accommodation with train home on Monday. If the strike goes ahead = no train home. Makes the challenge for the Swindon Town fans travelling by train look simple.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 16:56:15
That kind of makes sense, and I didn't expect everything to snap back into place at 5pm on Tuesday, but I would have expected some services leaving Paddington later that evening.  IMHO the TOCs and media have done a pretty poor job at communicating what might happen.  All the news outlets have reported 1700 to 1700 as if that would be the period effected.

If they tried that, an awful lot of people would be wanting to travel - probably more than available capacity - sorry, I agree better to put people off unless they can be sure of running a reasonable level of service. Otherwise pax turn up & don't /can't travel, and you know what our media would make of that.

They can't win in this situation.

But I am somewhat surprised they think start up on Wednesday might be disrupted. Surely they can make as many ECS moves as necessary to get stock in the right places if services aren't being run late into the evening? I think I'd like an explanation of that from FGW. No other TOC has mentioned potential start up problems for Wednesday


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Timmer on May 20, 2015, 17:00:36
In my view this has already been a victory for the unions as its causing the TOCs, Network Rail and the travelling public a lot of hassle into making revised plans that may not be needed. Three days now and we've heard nothing. They say no news is good news, but when it comes to talks at ACAS that saying means nothing as they could talk for five days only for the talks to break down with the strike going ahead. Let hope this doesn't happen.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 20, 2015, 17:12:53
But I am somewhat surprised they think start up on Wednesday might be disrupted. Surely they can make as many ECS moves as necessary to get stock in the right places if services aren't being run late into the evening? I think I'd like an explanation of that from FGW. No other TOC has mentioned potential start up problems for Wednesday

I would guess that if they are running some services on Mon & Tues, then it might very well not be possible to diagram in the right moves overnight to get absolutely everything in the right places for normal service on Wednesday morning and keep everyone within their legal hours.

In my view this has already been a victory for the unions as its causing the TOCs, Network Rail and the travelling public a lot of hassle into making revised plans that may not be needed. Three days now and we've heard nothing. They say no news is good news, but when it comes to talks at ACAS that saying means nothing as they could talk for five days only for the talks to break down with the strike going ahead. Let hope this doesn't happen.

I think it's more likely a shot in the foot to be honest, my impression is the travelling public is getting tired of enduring these strikes and it's likely to be a nice populist move for the government to further reduce the influence of the unions.


I notice Southern (ASLEF) drivers have also voted to strike now, they must be being paid a pittance if they feel an above inflation pay rise is insufficient  ???:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-32810994 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-32810994)



Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Timmer on May 20, 2015, 17:27:07
A victory for the unions from the point of view of the aim of a strike is to cause as much disruption as possible to further their cause in negotiations. It's causing disruption now to those who have to travel next Monday and Tuesday who are having to change plans or maybe not change plans.

It's never going to win favour with the public, who as you say are fed up strikes on the railways on top of all the disruption caused by over running engineering work, a system falling apart because it can't cope with demand, the high cost of fares and in some cases tired worn out rolling stock.

Another victory for the unions will be the complete shut down on the West Coast line as that will be the headline story in the propaganda war in the media next week not the fact that FGW were able to run some trains on the Western Region.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Timmer on May 20, 2015, 19:58:10
NO services on SWT Tuesday with services running down during the afternoon on Monday ceasing by late afternoon.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 20, 2015, 20:33:52
I have to wonder, if there is a last minute resolution of the dispute such that the action is called off whether it will be possible to unravel all these plans and run the normal service.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: a-driver on May 20, 2015, 20:37:43
I have to wonder, if there is a last minute resolution of the dispute such that the action is called off whether it will be possible to unravel all these plans and run the normal service.

We've been rostered to work as if it's a normal day so as long as the trains are in the right place there shouldn't be any reason why we couldn't.

I notice Southern (ASLEF) drivers have also voted to strike now, they must be being paid a pittance if they feel an above inflation pay rise is insufficient  ???:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-32810994 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-32810994)

The issue isn't always the actual pay rise but the strings that normally come attached to it, the changes to terms and conditions etc


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: dviner on May 20, 2015, 21:01:32
A victory for the unions from the point of view of the aim of a strike is to cause as much disruption as possible to further their cause in negotiations. It's causing disruption now to those who have to travel next Monday and Tuesday who are having to change plans or maybe not change plans.

It's never going to win favour with the public, who as you say are fed up strikes on the railways on top of all the disruption caused by over running engineering work, a system falling apart because it can't cope with demand, the high cost of fares and in some cases tired worn out rolling stock.

Another victory for the unions will be the complete shut down on the West Coast line as that will be the headline story in the propaganda war in the media next week not the fact that FGW were able to run some trains on the Western Region.

A victory for the union is the strike being called off because a settlement has been made.









Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2015, 21:09:47
Chiltern have updated their website. Trains running on all routes exceot Princes Risborough/Aylesbury, but limited north of Bicester to one shift of signaller. Better on mileage covered by the Marylebone box, but no trains between 1700/1900 while signallers change shifts


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: old original on May 21, 2015, 07:02:30
A half term/bank holiday monday in cornwall -no trains and a sunday bus service - ooh fun!!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 21, 2015, 13:34:43
Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT/UNITE as the TSSA have now reached agreement.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 21, 2015, 13:56:58

If they tried that, an awful lot of people would be wanting to travel

Sorry. but the argument that lots of people want to travel so we are going to respond by not carrying any of them strikes me as a rather lazy response.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 21, 2015, 14:01:26
Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT/UNITE as the TSSA have now reached agreement.

Good.  I am generally to the left politically, but I have no time for UNITE and their leader Len Mccluskey. It is to a large extent UNITE's fault that we have 5 more years of Tory government because it was UNITE that foisted the unelected Ed Milliband onto the Labour Party.   


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 21, 2015, 14:12:02
I thought it was just RMT & TSSA in dispute - when did UNITE join in (and where on the network do their members work?)

Sorry, I think TSSA settled as they knew they were about to lose the Appeal Court case this afternoon.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 21, 2015, 14:45:13
According to their website

Quote
Unite has dedicated to supporting our members whether they work on track, in cleaning grades, maintenance depots, engineering workshops, office administration, managers, rail professional grades or in the rolling stock manufacturing and supply chain companies.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 21, 2015, 14:47:01
BBC now saying the RMT have called off their strike.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 21, 2015, 14:53:18
BBC now saying the RMT have called off their strike.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32832191

Quote
Rail unions have called off a national bank holiday strike after reaching agreement with Network Rail.
Members of the RMT and TSSA unions had been due to walk out for 24 hours from 17:00 BST on Monday in a row over pay.
The RMT said the union's executive had decided to suspend the strike, after the TSSA earlier called off its action.
Many train services had been cancelled for Monday and Tuesday.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 21, 2015, 14:59:11
"Suspended" according to the RMT


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 21, 2015, 15:23:02
"Suspended" according to the RMT

Yep, that's what the BBC says too.   It makes sense, in that they'll want to take time to consider the next steps in a situation that's clearly just changed for them, and so they're acting in a way that doesn't close any doors if they decide that (after all) they should strike within the current vote / mandate in favour of action.

Striking typically isn't very popular with staff who loose pay when they're not working, so I'm not surprised that it's no longer happening next week.  It's had the effect of concentrating minds on the matters of concern, and it's done so after the general election, at a time that the concentrating of minds won't impact negatively on the Labour party's representation in parliament (thus chance of government). 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 21, 2015, 15:55:27
FGW confirming they plan to run a normal service next week.

Quote
National rail strikes called off

We welcome the agreement reached between Network Rail and the RMT and TSSA unions. This will come as a huge relief to millions of our customers choosing to travel over the Bank Holiday weekend and to the communities that we serve. We expect to run services as normal.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 21, 2015, 16:35:26
millions?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 21, 2015, 16:52:42
millions?

No mention of where the quote originated, could be Network Rail, who also say in the publication "Delivering a better railway for a better Britain, our plans for 2014-2019":

Quote
Every day 4m people use the network

So I reckon millions is ok for NR, but might be something of an exaggeration if FGW were using that term!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 21, 2015, 16:55:11
which they were, according to bobm above


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 21, 2015, 17:17:43
Either way, good news that the action next week has been suspended, and I wouldn't mind betting that's the last we'll hear of this particular dispute.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 21, 2015, 20:51:08
Either way, good news that the action next week has been suspended, and I wouldn't mind betting that's the last we'll hear of this particular dispute.

I agree this will probably fade into the background now.

Although this spring/summer strike season seems to be well underway now, with an announcement today that ASLEF members at London Underground are unhappy about the forthcoming 24 hour service provision and plan to walk out in protest:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-32833436 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-32833436)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: dviner on May 21, 2015, 21:07:20
Striking typically isn't very popular with staff who loose pay when they're not working, so I'm not surprised that it's no longer happening next week.  It's had the effect of concentrating minds on the matters of concern, and it's done so after the general election, at a time that the concentrating of minds won't impact negatively on the Labour party's representation in parliament (thus chance of government). 

If you're going to call a strike you do it at the time that it would have the most impact - tube strikes are during the weekend, because they would cause disruption to the commuters; postal strikes are during the run-up to Christmas, as that's their busy time; coal strikes used to be during the winter (year-long ones excepted). So, why call a strike for a Bank Holiday?

Nothing to do with the General Election, nothing to do with causing disruption to holiday makers or football supporters going to Wembley.

No, it's because it's the last long weekend that Network Rail had before the end of August to carry out serious engineering works.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 22, 2015, 08:52:24
From another forum comes (unconfirmed) details of the revised offer from Network Rail:

Quote
There's a picture doing the rounds on Facebook that basically says the offer is:

1% consolidated backdated to 1 January 2015 (with a minimum increase for part timers)
1.4% consolidated on 1 January 2016

No compulsory redundancies before 31 December 2016

Company and unions to hold discussions regarding "comprehensive job security package" with final details 6 Months

Discussions to be held regarding enhanced productivity within 3 Months. If successful a further 0.7% from January 2016

It should be noted that the offer has to be accepted by the unions' membership. If not, then industrial action may continue.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 22, 2015, 09:32:59
Quote
No compulsory redundancies before 31 December 2016

No change to that part of the offer - which I reckon'll be the sticking point


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 22, 2015, 16:48:55
I really find it hard to understand how any business in the real world, especially in the state that Network Rail is, can be expected to make an undertaking like that.....of course I guess that the Unions will count on the taxpayer picking up the tab.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ray951 on May 22, 2015, 18:29:11
I really find it hard to understand how any business in the real world, especially in the state that Network Rail is, can be expected to make an undertaking like that.....of course I guess that the Unions will count on the taxpayer picking up the tab.
Because it is a meaningless statement, instead of compulsory redundancies people will just be 'volunteered'.
I worked for a bank, many years ago, that was heavily unionised that had the same agreement and lots of people were still made redundant. Of course there will be handful who object but they will be in the minority and everybody else will just take the cash and run.
Also it is very unlikely that Network Rail will go bankrupt so quite easy for NR to guarantee this. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ellendune on May 22, 2015, 19:21:46
I really find it hard to understand how any business in the real world, especially in the state that Network Rail is, can be expected to make an undertaking like that.....of course I guess that the Unions will count on the taxpayer picking up the tab.

A business can make such a statement in good conscience without significant risk if:
a) They have a high staff turnover anyway;
b) They are already having difficulty recruiting or retaining staff;
c) The age profile of its staff leads them to expect more retirements than any possible redundancies (or those nearing retirement who would gladly volunteer if they were given a decent offer);
d) They rely heavily on outside contractors for work that they could bring in house.

What are the big business risks that might cause NR suddenly and unforeseeably to need to loose a lot of staff?

Now there are always risks in business, but many businesses are finding they have cases a) & b) at the moment, particularly for skilled staff and those who work unsocial hours. That must cover the vast majority of NR staff. 

Also December 2016 is not that far off.  A business like NR should be able to see that far ahead. 

The main risk of redundancies in NR going forward must be signallers as the old boxes are transferred to the new signalling centres. However they already know which ones are going to close by December 2016 and in our patch most of those should be in commuting distance of Didcot or Cardiff so they would want to redeploy most of them.

Going forward with a bit of careful workforce planning they may be able to extend that time. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 22, 2015, 19:35:51
I think the RMT is looking for a no redundancy commitment for the full length of the agreement - all four years of it, not just 1 and a half


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ellendune on May 22, 2015, 19:49:02
I think the RMT is looking for a no redundancy commitment for the full length of the agreement - all four years of it, not just 1 and a half
I know.  With a bit of work they might find they are able to give one.  After all they know their investment plans for the next 4 years and the likely impact of that on their workforce.  There might need to be some negotiation on redeployment etc. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 23, 2015, 08:44:42
FGW are still going to honour the earlier arrangements for tickets on the planned strike days

Quote
If you have a ticket for the 25th or 26th May, you can still travel on Sunday or Wednesday.

^ If you have an Anytime, Off-peak and Super-off Peak ticket, normal time restrictions will still apply on Tuesday and Wednesday.
^If you have an Advance Purchase tickets, you can still travel on alternative days - but should try to make sure this is around the same time as your original booking.
^Full refunds with no admin fee will still be available for unused tickets valid for 25th and 26th May.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 23, 2015, 09:10:22
Sensibly handled by FGW, and I assume the other operators are doing the same?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: bobm on May 23, 2015, 09:13:09
That is from their website, I haven't checked other operators.  FGW are also accepting tickets dated yesterday today following the incident at Twyford.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 23, 2015, 09:37:09
I really find it hard to understand how any business in the real world, especially in the state that Network Rail is, can be expected to make an undertaking like that.....of course I guess that the Unions will count on the taxpayer picking up the tab.



What are the big business risks that might cause NR suddenly and unforeseeably to need to loose a lot of staff?


 

........how about a ^1 billion overspend on a Capex project?

How many Businesses in that position would be able to offer a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies?

It's the sort of ridiculous sense of entitlement irrespective of performance that enabled powerful trade unions to destroy our competitiveness and knacker the economy in the 1960s & 1970s, the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ellendune on May 23, 2015, 09:45:40
What are the big business risks that might cause NR suddenly and unforeseeably to need to loose a lot of staff?
........how about a ^1 billion overspend on a Capex project?

That is more likely to affect future Capex than Opex which might delay future investment and therefore lead to retention of staff.  Except perhaps those running the Investment programme - but the majority of those involved in investment are consultants. 

NR is not in a position to cut day to day operational without reducing the number of trains, unless it is as a result of investment, either to reduce the need for maintenance or reduce the number of staff needed to operate the railway.  After all part of the problems with the reliability of today's railway is the shortage of skilled staff. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 23, 2015, 14:24:24
the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

How about teachers, firefighters, ambulance crews, pilots, air traffic controllers?  Are you saying they have no 'power' anymore?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 23, 2015, 14:33:22
Teachers....a few days off for the kids & parents a touch annoyed, but no power, no


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 23, 2015, 14:58:00
I suppose parents a touch annoyed (having to arrange child care/take time off work etc.) is much the same as commuters a touch annoyed depending on whether you are directly affected by any action.

I wonder how each would compare in terms of impact on the economy?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 23, 2015, 15:05:41
I think you've just made my point.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 23, 2015, 15:22:27
Quite possibly.  :)  How about the other example industries I gave?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ellendune on May 23, 2015, 15:43:17
the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

Are you saying that you believe London is the only place of any importance ?

or

That the English UK Government and Parliament seem to believe this, so there's not a lot we can do about it? 

I think a lot of people in the UK are getting pretty sick of this Londonist view of the UK and you might discover that out here in "the provinces" real people might think a bit differently to their national politicians. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 23, 2015, 15:47:55
Quite possibly.  :)  How about the other example industries I gave?

I'll leave the OP to answer your point in full.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 23, 2015, 16:03:46
the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

Are you saying that you believe London is the only place of any importance ?

or

That the English UK Government and Parliament seem to believe this, so there's not a lot we can do about it? 

I think a lot of people in the UK are getting pretty sick of this Londonist view of the UK and you might discover that out here in "the provinces" real people might think a bit differently to their national politicians. 

No, I am saying that the rail unions have the ability to bring London to a halt, by preventing  over 1 million people getting to work by their usual means......I don't underestimate the effect it has elsewhere too, and as someone who is from "the provinces" I don't underestimate the effect a daily 3rd rate rail system has elsewhere either......it's simply that it has more cost,effect and profile in London than anywhere else, unless you'd like to tell me about another major UK city where 80% of the workforce use surface rail and/or the Underground daily?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 23, 2015, 17:27:32
Quite possibly.  :)  How about the other example industries I gave?

I'll leave the OP to answer your point in full.

Fair enough.  Let's hope he does, because whilst the union movement's ability to cause the havoc it did in the 70s/80s has no doubt been diminished (and I have a fair amount of sympathy for the views he expressed on that period), I'm not at all sure that the railway industry is the only 'meat eating' dinosaur that's left.

Anyway, the strike has been called off with a reasonable amount of notice so let's hope the long period since the last national rail strike continues for many more years.  In fact the amount of strike action on the national rail network that had any significant impact in recent times in very small.  It's really only the London Unserground that has caused any real strife since the turn of the century.



Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: broadgage on May 23, 2015, 18:48:39
the rail unions are pretty much the only TU that have any power left (mainly because they can bring London to a halt), their days are numbered.

How about teachers, firefighters, ambulance crews, pilots, air traffic controllers?  Are you saying they have no 'power' anymore?

Teachers seem to strike fairly regularly, and apart from parents having to make other child care arrangements, no one much cares.
Firefighters have struck several times recently, with surprisingly little effect.
Ambulance crews striking could be serious.
Airline pilots strike from time to time, but the dispute usually only affects one airline, so customers simply use another.
Air traffic controllers famously struck in the USA some years ago, and were sacked. permanently !


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 24, 2015, 13:30:14
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Broadgage.  Pretty reasonable ones they are too.  A shame that the OP doesn't appear to want to bother to add his.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 24, 2015, 20:18:45
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Broadgage.  Pretty reasonable ones they are too.  A shame that the OP doesn't appear to want to bother to add his.

If you mean me (feel free to use my name if you do!), I agree with Broadgage's analysis, he puts it far more succinctly than I could!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 24, 2015, 20:28:53
My thanks to all who have posted here, and in such polite terms, even where their personal opinions clearly differ.  :)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 24, 2015, 20:47:28
My thanks to all who have posted here, and in such polite terms, even where their personal opinions clearly differ.  :)

Hear Hear! (or should that be "Hell, Yeah"?)  :)


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 24, 2015, 20:59:58
Thanks, TaplowGreen  :)

May I ask, in what particular service industry are you involved, where summary dismissal is an option?

I only ask because, in my own previous employment area (financial services), it can apparently occur: See http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-01-07/man-sacked-from-stockbrokers-over-i-hit-a-cyclist-tweet/

Chris from Nailsea.  :-X


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Cynthia on May 25, 2015, 08:42:46
Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT/UNITE as the TSSA have now reached agreement.

Good.  I am generally to the left politically, but I have no time for UNITE and their leader Len Mccluskey. It is to a large extent UNITE's fault that we have 5 more years of Tory government because it was UNITE that foisted the unelected Ed Milliband onto the Labour Party.   

Moving away from the thread subject somewhat, but, Tim, I'm rather confused by your comment about Ed Miliband being foisted onto the Labour Party.  If you're generally 'left', that shouldn't have worried you too much?  Who would you have chosen as leader then?  And perhaps more to the point now, who should be chosen to replace him?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 25, 2015, 08:50:06
Thanks, TaplowGreen  :)

May I ask, in what particular service industry are you involved, where summary dismissal is an option?

I only ask because, in my own previous employment area (financial services), it can apparently occur: See http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-01-07/man-sacked-from-stockbrokers-over-i-hit-a-cyclist-tweet/

Chris from Nailsea.  :-X

Chris - I have worked in a number of service industries/sectors, both private and public sector mainly in the R & M area.....in each of these, I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal - obviously lower down the scale there are oral/written/final written warnings.

Poor behaviour is generally tolerated far more in the public/quasi public sector in my experience.

I note that this incident made it onto the front page of the Sunday Telegraph yesterday along with an apology from FGW.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-32857408


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ellendune on May 25, 2015, 09:46:10
... I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal

Gross misconduct is usually only for things like intoxication (whether from drink or drugs), fighting or other physical abuse, indecent behaviour, theft, dishonesty, sabotage, serious breaches of health and safety rules, discrimination, harassment and gross insubordination. 


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 25, 2015, 10:10:07
... I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal

Gross misconduct is usually only for things like intoxication (whether from drink or drugs), fighting or other physical abuse, indecent behaviour, theft, dishonesty, sabotage, serious breaches of health and safety rules, discrimination, harassment and gross insubordination. 



I have - once - had to follow the "Gross Misconduct" line with an (became-ex) employee which involved four of the things you list. Thoroughly unpleasant for all concerned, and even then it was done with the thought "was this just an exceptional circumstance that's unlikely to happen again".   In the same circumstance, I would do the same again - but I would still ask myself the same question, and take a more measured approach if I felt there was any prospect of that being practical.

Coming back later to clarify my comment ... - I was answering Ellendune's comment on gross misconduct, and I have seen nothing what so ever to indicate any of those grounds in the matter under discussion.   I suppose my point was to suggest that the story as reported doesn't indicate to me anything along these lines, and to illustrate the stark difference between what's reported and such a case.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 25, 2015, 10:11:38
... I have known a number of cases of gross misconduct (which I would argue is the category in the case under discussion constitutes) resulting in dismissal

Gross misconduct is usually only for things like intoxication (whether from drink or drugs), fighting or other physical abuse, indecent behaviour, theft, dishonesty, sabotage, serious breaches of health and safety rules, discrimination, harassment and gross insubordination. 


Yep - that's pretty much a cut and paste from lawdonut.com which I use at work too - but you also need the context of the next sentence that these are examples of gross misconduct, not a conclusive list  - you also need to consider the definition which points to behaviour which destroys the employee/employer relationship.

http://www.lawdonut.co.uk/law/employment-law/discipline-and-grievance/gross-misconduct-faqs#1

Clearly this is an emotive subject (....which for some reason seems to have jumped from another thread) - clearly we're not going to agree - I'm going to step back and await the outcome of FGW's investigation and the action they choose to take.....enjoy the Bank Holiday!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 25, 2015, 10:14:39
you won't find out.

Disciplinary Procedures are confidential - and rightly too.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 25, 2015, 10:18:09
I note that this incident made it onto the front page of the Sunday Telegraph yesterday along with an apology from FGW.

Whilst not wishing to condone what was a pretty stupid announcement, I can't help but think a front page story on a national newspaper, even if it was one of the couple of smaller stories they usually put at the bottom, is a slightly hysterical overreaction.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Electric train on May 25, 2015, 11:45:53
Perhaps a though should go to the individual who made the announcement, for us who travel on the trains regularly we occasionally get our services disrupted and very rarely directly impacted by a suicide / "person on the line;" for staff who spend their whole working day traveling on trains that occasionally can be come frequently and that rarely can become often.  This can obviously put a lot of stress on these on train staff who get the brunt of comments from disgruntled, get their own end of shift extended.

I hope the enquiry into this incident initially goes along the lines of was this due to stress on the part of the employee?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 25, 2015, 13:39:17
you won't find out.

Disciplinary Procedures are confidential - and rightly too.

We may find out if it becomes a union issue.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 25, 2015, 21:05:22
Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT/UNITE as the TSSA have now reached agreement.

Good.  I am generally to the left politically, but I have no time for UNITE and their leader Len Mccluskey. It is to a large extent UNITE's fault that we have 5 more years of Tory government because it was UNITE that foisted the unelected Ed Milliband onto the Labour Party.   

Moving away from the thread subject somewhat, but, Tim, I'm rather confused by your comment about Ed Miliband being foisted onto the Labour Party.  If you're generally 'left', that shouldn't have worried you too much?  Who would you have chosen as leader then?  And perhaps more to the point now, who should be chosen to replace him?

I am generally of the left in that I prefer a Labour or LibDem government to a Conservative one.  I am not of the left in that I want the labour party leader to be from the left wing of the party. 

I want the Labour party to be lead by a person who occupies the central grounds and is therefore electable. 

Ed Balls would have been my choice, but he of course is not standing.   I don't know who I would pick from the current field, but it needs to be someone electable rather than the choice of a left-wing fraction of a union.   


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 26, 2015, 08:45:20
Looking more and more likely an agreement will be reached with RMT/UNITE as the TSSA have now reached agreement.

Good.  I am generally to the left politically, but I have no time for UNITE and their leader Len Mccluskey. It is to a large extent UNITE's fault that we have 5 more years of Tory government because it was UNITE that foisted the unelected Ed Milliband onto the Labour Party.   

Moving away from the thread subject somewhat, but, Tim, I'm rather confused by your comment about Ed Miliband being foisted onto the Labour Party.  If you're generally 'left', that shouldn't have worried you too much?  Who would you have chosen as leader then?  And perhaps more to the point now, who should be chosen to replace him?

I am generally of the left in that I prefer a Labour or LibDem government to a Conservative one.  I am not of the left in that I want the labour party leader to be from the left wing of the party. 

I want the Labour party to be lead by a person who occupies the central grounds and is therefore electable. 

Ed Balls would have been my choice, but he of course is not standing.   I don't know who I would pick from the current field, but it needs to be someone electable rather than the choice of a left-wing fraction of a union.   

The name "Tony Blair" springs to mind! (Doubt they could afford him these days!)  :D


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Tim on May 26, 2015, 09:58:43

The name "Tony Blair" springs to mind! (Doubt they could afford him these days!)  :D

That name had crossed my mind too.  Trouble with Tony was he had a highly flawed character in other ways, but a Labour party that is supportive of business and aspiration but which doesn't show neglect to those at the bottom of the heap either,  is one that I think could properly be described as "Blairite" if such a term didn't carry such toxic connotations.  And one that could be elected. 



Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 28, 2015, 15:25:14
RMT strike back on. 24 hours from 17:00 4th June and 48 hours from 17:00 9th June

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32920794 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32920794) :

Quote
RMT union members at Network Rail are to go on strike next month after rejecting a pay offer.

They will hold a 24-hour strike from 17:00 BST on 4 June and a 48-hour strike from 17:00 BST on 9 June.

Staff had been due to walk out last week in the row over pay, but the union's executive suspended the action when Network Rail offered a new deal.

Union reps met on Thursday to discuss the offer but it was rejected, leading to the announcement of fresh strikes.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 28, 2015, 15:48:37
RMT strike back on. 24 hours from 17:00 4th June and 48 hours from 17:00 9th June

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32920794 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32920794) :

Quote
RMT union members at Network Rail are to go on strike next month after rejecting a pay offer.

They will hold a 24-hour strike from 17:00 BST on 4 June and a 48-hour strike from 17:00 BST on 9 June.

Staff had been due to walk out last week in the row over pay, but the union's executive suspended the action when Network Rail offered a new deal.

Union reps met on Thursday to discuss the offer but it was rejected, leading to the announcement of fresh strikes.


Oh joy!  >:(


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 28, 2015, 16:12:40
The rejected offer

Quote
The new offer was for two years, with a 1% rise this year and a rise of about 1.4% next year. There would be no compulsory redundancies for the duration of the agreement.

That's about what I'll get if I'm lucky, without the no-redundancy guarantee.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 28, 2015, 16:16:31
The rejected offer

Quote
The new offer was for two years, with a 1% rise this year and a rise of about 1.4% next year. There would be no compulsory redundancies for the duration of the agreement.

That's about what I'll get if I'm lucky, without the no-redundancy guarantee.

I've had my day rate cut twice in the last 6 months on a take it or leave it basis. The network rail offer seems quite generous to me!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 28, 2015, 16:20:34
As before, I won't be in the slightest bit surprised if these don't happen.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: chrisr_75 on May 28, 2015, 17:06:56
As before, I won't be in the slightest bit surprised if these don't happen.

I agree, the dates seem to be chosen to cause maximum disruption/pre-strike managerial worry (mid-week 48 hour walkout?!), typical RMT bully boy tactics. About time they wound their necks in a bit and woke up to the fact that the workforce has, in general, never had it so good. It's not 1860 anymore, Mr Cash!


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 28, 2015, 17:26:50
that "48 hour one" will, if arrangements for the one cancelled were anything to go by, will be Tuesday, Wednesday & Thursday - so 3 days effectively.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 28, 2015, 17:53:24
In view of the ongoing dispute I've retitled the thread.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 28, 2015, 22:59:03
The RMT's press release (http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-confirms-new-strike-dates-in-network-rail-dispute/) today:

Quote
The largest rail union, RMT, today confirmed that members will be taking 24 hours of strike action from 5pm Thursday 4th June through to 4.59pm on Friday 5th June in the current dispute over pay and jobs at Network Rail with a further 48 hours of action from 5pm On Tuesday 9th June to 4.59pm on Thursday 11th June. In addition there will be action short of a strike from 00.01 Saturday 6th June to 23.59 on Friday 12th June.

The RMT executive decision is:

We note that a meeting with our Area Council Representatives has been held and as part of a rolling campaign we instruct our members to take Industrial action as follows:

^ Not to book on for any shifts that start between 17:00 Thursday 4th June 2015 until 16:59 Friday 5th June 2015
^ Not to book on for any shifts that start between 17:00 Tuesday 9th June 2015 until 16:59 Thursday 11th June 2015.

Additionally,
To take action short of strike by not working any overtime or additional hours or any extended shifts and by not undertaking any call-outs duties from 0001 hours on Saturday 06 June 2015 and 2359 hours on Friday 12th June 2015

NR members voted in a ballot by 80% for strike action on a 60% turn out and by 92% for action short of strike action.

RMT has rejected the latest NR pay proposals as falling well short of what is required to maintain the living standards and the working conditions for nearly 16,000 staff across NR operations and maintenance.‎ RMT is in no doubt that a decent pay settlement for NR staff is entirely affordable.

The union has pointed out that:

^ Network Rail can clearly afford to make a pay offer that maintains the standards of living of its workforce
^ The company generated ^1 billion of profits in the most recent financial year due to the effort and commitment of its staff
^ Network Rail has is paying out ^60 million in bonuses with top managers able to hit a bonus level up to 50% of their actual income.
^ It has been estimated that each one day of strike action will result in compensation payments of ^30 million to the private train companies
^ Each additional 1% on the pay offer means an additional ^7.5 million in real costs to the company ^ meaning that the dispute could be settled for a fraction of the nearly ^100 million soaked up in bonuses and compensation.
^ The union has been negotiating on the current pay round since last October ^ with the award being delayed from the anniversary date of the 1st January the current offer of 1% for 2105 is paltry in comparison to the real rate of inflation of 2.1% when negotiations opened towards the end of last year.

RMT General Secretary Mick Cash said:
^Our representatives have today rejected the pay package offered by Network Rail and in the absence of any further movement from the company that has left us with no option but to move to a rolling programme of industrial action which will begin next Thursday.

"We have a massive mandate for action which shows the anger of safety-critical staff across the rail network at attacks on their standards of living and the blunt truth is that this dispute could be settled for a fraction of the money being handed out in senior manager bonuses and to the train operators for not running services. That is a ludicrous situation which should never have been allowed to have arisen.

^With no shortage of cash in the bonus pot and to compensate the private train companies it is no wonder that our members take the view that 1% is wholly inadequate and fails to recognise the massive pressures staff are working under to keep services running safely at a time when the company is generating profits of ^1 billion. It is our members battling to keep Britain moving around the clock, often in appalling conditions, and they deserve a fair share from Network Rail for their incredible efforts.

^Our rail staff deserve a fair reward for the high-pressure, safety-critical work that they undertake day and night and the last thing that we need is a demoralised, burnt-out workforce living in fear for their livelihoods and their futures and the message has come back loud and clear that that is exactly how they feel about the current offer from Network Rail.

^RMT remains available for talks and we hope that the company will appreciate the anger amongst staff at the current offer on pay and conditions from Network Rail and that they will agree to our call to come back to the table with an improved package. We expect rock solid support for this action and will be taking a new campaign to the public under the banner "OUR JOBS - YOUR SAFETY" as we build support for the fight to stop this attack on a workforce ‎whose core role is to deliver a safe railway to the British people."

Network Rail's response (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/rail-dispute-continues-as-union-leadership-fails-to-carry-agreed-offer):

Quote
Rail dispute continues as union leadership fails to carry agreed offer

Thursday 28 May 2015

National

Once again the RMT leadership have failed to get their members to accept a pay offer from Network Rail that they had agreed to in discussions with ACAS.

Mark Carne, Chief Executive said:

^Our people know that there are ways to improve the way work is done.  I have always said that if we work together to realise these benefits there is the possibility to increase pay.  We are therefore ready to get around the table with whoever the RMT consider can speak on behalf of their members.  It is clearly unacceptable for the RMT to massively disrupt the travelling public with strike action when we are ready to continue talks.^

Network Rail will now restart its contingency planning with the train operators, but if a national rail strike goes ahead, rail services will be severely affected.

NOTES TO EDITORS

The terms of the latest rejected offer were;

1. Network Rail will pay all staff in the bargaining groups a 1% consolidated increase on their base salary backdated to 1 January 2015 (with a guaranteed minimum increase of ^250 consolidated per annum- pro-rata for part-time staff);

2. Network Rail will pay all staff in the bargaining groups a 1.4% consolidated increase, on 1 January 2016;

3. Separately, the unions and Network Rail have committed to continue working with ACAS to discuss and agree smarter, better ways of working. If these are agreed, Network Rail has committed to paying up to 0.7% consolidated on basic salary from 1 January 2016;

4. Network Rail will guarantee that there will be no compulsory redundancies across all members of bargaining groups until 31 December 2016; and

5. Network Rail will enter in to discussion with the unions to agree a comprehensive job security package for the future.
 

NB. Bargaining groups are - operations and customer services in bands 5-8 and equivalent, maintenance bands 5-8 and equivalent and controller grades this includes all signalling and supervisory grades, ECRO^s (1-8), Controllers (1-4), all maintenance grade staff, all operational grades


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 28, 2015, 23:51:02
I rather think Comrade Crow would be proud of you, Brother Cash.  :P


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on May 29, 2015, 00:13:51
Comrade Crow is busy sorting out some collective bargaining in a higher place.

The angels are working to rule after a disagreement with St Peter.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 29, 2015, 06:18:11
Comrade Crow is busy sorting out some collective bargaining in a higher place.

The angels are working to rule after a disagreement with St Peter.

.....do Oyster cards open heavenly gates?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: grahame on May 29, 2015, 07:02:47
Quote
It has been estimated that each one day of strike action will result in compensation payments of ^30 million to the private train companies

Each additional 1% on the pay offer means an additional ^7.5 million in real costs to the company

Interesting figures / estimates.  Some questions that spring to my mind:

What does each day of strikes cost members in lost income?
What does each day of strikes cost passengers in terms of lost income, other arrangemnts to be made and paid for?
What does each day of strike action cost TOCs in terms of lost income?
What is the knock on effect of each day of strike action in terms of passengers making future choices that involve different transport choices?
What is the knock on effect of each day of strike action in terms of effecting the environment for long term investments in the railways and a jobs in the railways?
And what is the effect in each of these areas of a threatened strike which is suspended / called off late in the day?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: ChrisB on May 29, 2015, 09:46:07
TOCs get compensated by NR for their broken contract of not being able to run the agreed timetable, but not for the additional work needed to rearrange working....so effectively lots of lost hours productivity


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 29, 2015, 10:52:07
Quote
It has been estimated that each one day of strike action will result in compensation payments of ^30 million to the private train companies

Each additional 1% on the pay offer means an additional ^7.5 million in real costs to the company

Interesting figures / estimates.  Some questions that spring to my mind:

What does each day of strikes cost members in lost income?
What does each day of strikes cost passengers in terms of lost income, other arrangemnts to be made and paid for?
What does each day of strike action cost TOCs in terms of lost income?
What is the knock on effect of each day of strike action in terms of passengers making future choices that involve different transport choices?
What is the knock on effect of each day of strike action in terms of effecting the environment for long term investments in the railways and a jobs in the railways?
And what is the effect in each of these areas of a threatened strike which is suspended / called off late in the day?

..........and the overall cost to the UK economy?


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: Ollie on June 01, 2015, 12:32:27
RMT have suspended strike so they can talk to their Network Rail reps about new offer: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32956876


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: JayMac on June 01, 2015, 13:24:20
That BBC news item in full:

Quote
Planned rail strikes by workers from the RMT union have been suspended after talks over a pay deal, the arbitration service Acas has said.

The 24-hour strike by Network Rail workers was to have taken place from 17:00 BST on Thursday, followed by a 48-hour walk-out next week.

Acas said four days of talks helped "formulate" revised proposals for the RMT and other unions to consider.

The RMT has 16,000 members at Network Rail in operations and maintenance.

RMT general secretary Mick Cash said the union would consult on the details of the revised package.

Members of the TSSA and Unite unions will also be consulted.

Network Rail chief executive Mark Carne said: "I am very pleased that the industrial action has been suspended. With Acas's help, we have had very constructive talks with the unions over the weekend and I hope they will be able to agree this deal."

A planned strike starting on the 25 May bank holiday was suspended by the RMT and TSSA after Network Rail tabled a revised pay offer to workers. The offer was not accepted by RMT members.

Network Rail originally offered a four-year deal of a single ^500 payment followed by three years of rises in line with RPI inflation.

The original revised offer was for two years, with a 1% rise this year, and a rise of about 1.4% next year. It was also established that there would be no compulsory redundancies for the duration of the agreement.


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: SandTEngineer on June 06, 2015, 14:05:44
The revised offer has been tabled: http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/rmt-to-hold-referendum-on-latest-pay-offer-with-a-recommendation-to-accept


Title: Re: Network Rail industrial action 2015.
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 06, 2015, 16:40:17
Let's hope good sense prevails and they accept it.



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