Great Western Coffee Shop

Recently I was studying the timetable posters at Frome Station. There are, as I can see only two displayed, one outside and one on the platform. These show the BRI/WSB-WEY (and v/v) service but only the trains that make the full journey. None of the FRO starters or terminators are shown (anywhere on the station). This poster is Version 15.12LORC3 BRI-WEY. There is now a separate poster for the SW Trains services.

Clearly Mr Average who turns up at the station without any research is going to be short-changed and misinformed. I believe these posters (or their equivalent) are also displayed at points North to BRI so similar issues apply there. Maybe this will get fixed for the May timetables but my suspicion is that this omission was present in earlier versions. The poster has plenty of space to include all the extras - even at the same font size.

So could Ollie or Mr Timetable Expert think about correcting this for the future? The Frome extras need to be included in the main tables and probably with ultimate destinations shown as footnotes. Curiosities like the 15.20FO WSB-EXD and also the 15.55 FRO-PAD should also not be forgotten.   

I guess the 14:04 to Swindon isn't shown?

Something for you to take up with the Heart of Wessex CRP, I suspect.     With a TransWilts train running to Frome, and the TransWilts corridor bus (the X34), I've taken more notice of Frome of late, and it rather sounds / looks as if a re-evaluation of timetable information for the town (bus and train) would be worthwhile.    Administratively, Frome is in Somerset, but economically it is much more closely linked to Wiltshire and its county town of Trowbridge, with well over a dozen direct public transport services a day than Taunton with 1 direct train a day.

P.S.  I'm told that posters at stations are a lot less looked at than they were a few years ago.  Which means that information in the town / online should be looked at too.  I'm sure the rail journey planner has it right except in very rare cases ... but that only accounts for a proportion of travellers, and those are the ones who have already decided to take the train.

I am surprised that Frome gets this Line of Route (LOR) poster. We already produce a different LOR which shows the full FRO service (Inc 1520 WSB-EXD and 1555 FRO-PAD) and I would have thought that would be used.

I shall investigate and see if not having the latter on display is an error with us.

FYI the Summer edition of the BRI-WEY  LOR will be pretty much the same as the previous summer version with the exception of the new YVP-WEY SWT services on Saturdays.

I remember discussing this timetable problem with Graham some time ago (when we were delivering the TransWilts publicity in Melksham) and I wrote emails to FGW and to the Frome Town Council lady (I don't remember her name, it was the person Graham was speaking to at the Cheese and Grain meeting about SWT's plans). Nothing has happened. I also blame (in some part) the lack of information provided at Frome for the poor passenger numbers when First ran the 234 bus from the station, the bus information on the platform and the bus stop itself still stated that it was for rail replacement services only.

Frome is a very interesting town with an interesting public transport setup.  Although a Somerset town, it links much more closely in business and economic terms to Wiltshire and to BaNES than it does to Somerset County - just compare bus and train links from Frome to Trowbridge (county town of Wiltshire), Bath ('county town' of BaNES) and Taunton (county town of Somerset) and you'll see how the commercial and the administrative elements look in different directions.  And that puts it at an interesting boundary as far as transport groups with a community element are concerned.    Frome is also similar in population to Melksham, and shares other transport issues and concerns too such as a station away from the centre, some significant holes in service, bus services to / from Bath run by competing companies looking to abstract passengers from each other, and buses to and from Trowbridge which end much too early.

The station is a Heart of Wessex Community Rail Partnership designated one, so very much their lead as indeed (across the border in Wiltshire) are Westbury, Trowbridge, Bradford-on-Avon and Avoncliff.  A single service each day extends from Frome up the TransWilts to Melksham, Chippenham and Swindon which leads us to be a little involved as a minority player, a position that's boosted by passenger flows between Frome, Chippenham and Swindon to the extent that we include Frome in our line timetable.   On the wider public transport side, our 'bus people' and their 'bus people' also work together sharing knowledge and ideas - after all, we're dealing with the same bus and train companies and issues.

To add to my original post.

The new timetable issued in May has produced no change in the timetable posters displayed at Frome. There are three BRI/WSB to WEY posters displayed around the station area. None of the Frome extras are shown. There is a separate SWT poster for their services.

The full CDF-PMH/WEY poster does display the Frome extras, so logically both posters should appear in Frome as they do at WSB and elsewhere.

However, for future issues it would be sensible to include all such services in the BRI-WEY poster including the SWT services through Frome. Whilst the YPM-WEY Summer Saturday SWT services are included, the weekday SWT services through Frome are not. LOGICAL or what?

 

The 14:04 Frome to Swindon is one of Frome's "phantom" services, unannounced on any of the timetable posters though it does come up of the LED display in the period leading up to its departure.   I was there (to catch that train) on 20th May - so that's after the May timetable change.    Poster space at stations is limited, and a full Cardiff - Portsmouth set takes up two panels. Frome has an extensive set of extra services not shown on existing boards, as fill-in services to help patch timetable gaps head off in a variety of different directions.  From Monday to Friday, I think the following are all missing:
 06:05 Paddington
 06:45 Cardiff
 14:04 Swindon
 14:59 Warminster
 15:31 Exeter (Fridays)
 15:55 Paddington
 20:15 Westbury
 21:02 Westbury
and there's no easy current panel switch that would include all of those while leaving space for everything that's already shown on the current posters too.

The matter has been raised with GWR and the Heart of Wessex CRP, agreement reached between them that something which addresses the issues could (and will) be provided to coincide with the next annual timetable change.  I'm afraid it's not just a switching around of current posters that exist, so it won't happen next week. or even next month.

In the meantime  ;) ... Frome to Swindon via Chippenham services on Monday to Friday:
06:05 - 07:40 (change at Westbury and Bath Spa)
06:45 - 07:48 (change at Westbury) (1)
07:03 - 08:19 (change at Westbury) (1)
08:02 - 09:40 (change at Bath Spa)
10:15 - 11:40 (change at Bath Spa)
12:42 - 14:10 (change at Bath Spa)
14:04 - 15:03 (through train) (2)
14:41 - 16:10 (change at Bath Spa)
14:59 - 16:40 (change at Westbury and Bath Spa)
15:56 - 17:06 (change at Westbury) (2)
16:29 - 18:10 (change at Bath Spa)
17:24 - 18:40 (change at Westbury and Bath Spa)
19:06 - 20:21 (change at Westbury) (2)
19:56 - 21:10 (change at Westbury and Bath Spa)
21:11 - 22:31 (change at Westbury and Bath Spa)
21:38 - 23:14 (change at Bath Spa)

Single fare 14.20 except
(1) - single fare 8.30; also serves Melksham
(2) - single fare 7.10; also serves Melksham

Slower journeys at lower fares.  Connections with a single change at Westbury can also be made off the 08:02, 10:15 and 17:24 services from Frome at a single fare of 7.10, but these service arrive in Swindon 43 to 56 minutes later than the services via Bath Spa due to a long wait (very poor connection) at Westbury.

For a New Year Update - the December 2016 BRI-WEY timetable poster sheets now include the SWT services passing through Frome but none of the Frome "extras." (or as Graham prefers - the Frome phantom trains).

Slowly, slowly one increment at a time. However, it is amazing how long it can take for something "quite" simple.

Grrrrr!    Thanks for the update. Some good steps forward on a couple of "Greater Wessex" poster issues, but I'm afraid this one isn't unique in being slightly disappointing as to how long it takes and / or what can (and can't) be done within legal and franchise frameworks.

If you are referring to Frome station specifically, then this poster is up in error as we arranged for Frome to receive an A-Z poster incorporating all departures from Frome. This was agreed by the TransWilts and Heart of Wessex CRPs.

I shall chase up this week and ensure tell correct posters are on display. Can you confirm that you are referring to Frome?

I am delighted to see that an A-Z departure poster has recently appeared in one of the poster displays on the platform at Frome Station. This is a significant improvement in information provision, since it now shows all train departures from Frome, and displays a good range of destinations (including some which involve connecting services).

... almost as if by magic!

Thanks, Rob T  ;) :D ;D

Good to hear all is resolved and the Frome Phantom trains have finally been put to rest!  :) 

I thought I had better do a thorough tour of Frome Station today to double check the complete picture. As reported above one alphabetical destination poster is indeed displayed on the platform. It includes most/all of the typical destinations (direct and connections) and the only error I could spot was omission of the late (21.58) SW service to WSB/SAL. It even includes the services to Melksham International! This presentation gives a much clearer presentation of the services available at Frome. Congratulations for this success to all concerned.

Elsewhere there are three standard BRI/WEY posters displayed around the station area as previously. As I recall there is no timetable poster displayed within the booking hall. It remains a mystery to me why the Frome "extras" cannot be included in the BRI/WEY poster (for completeness) even if they need to be in a separate box or as footnotes. To me there is adequate space available for inclusion in the main tables, without the need to use a small font.   

The Bristol to Weymouth timetable poster does what it says on the tin so to speak.

Its aimed at customers using stations between CLC and WEY that have no other services. We do have another timetable poster that does show all services between WSB and FRO but this could not be displayed at Frome due to poster space restrictions, hence why we now have an A-Z there.

With thanks for your explanation, Rob T, but is there any possibility that just one additional poster case could be installed at Frome station, for that general purpose?  ::)

I only ask because, considering the staff costs incurred by Great Western Railway in designing such a poster, only to find that it cannot be displayed at Frome, does seem to be somewhat perverse.  :o

Never mind the cost and expertise, think what the passenger and potential passenger would find useful.   Having the right display of posters at a station for the travelling public, and for the interested local resident who pops by for a look, remains a critical marketing tool.   Some posters need to be displayed for the mass of users, and others to inform newcomers and to answer important but occasional questions ... whilst all the time considering franchise, legal and Rail Delivery Group stipulations , available "real estate" at the station, the update cycle for design and installation of signs, and the need for the local station management team to be engaged in the process too.  Adding another sign board ain't necessarily the answer; you don't want to drown vital data in an ocean of other stuff, and at places like Frome you're likely to need (?) things like listed building planning permission.   Finally, you need to look at sign board location - where staffing is limited, are the signs going to be shut away ... is there a light source so they can be read in the dark ... will people find the sign board they need?

"Heart of Wessex" CRP is the (lead) CRP on Frome, and I know they've been well involved in the considerable improvement that the A to Z there makes.    The GWR poster team has done Frome (and Melksham) proud with A to Zs - I'm delighted from afar at Frome, concerned at Melksham as to what's it's replaced, where we have three panels (of 8) of questionable need / duplicated content and no line of TransWilts sheet.  We know it exists as it's on display at Chippenham.

Unfortunately the excellent A-Z departure poster at Frome station appears to have disappeared. I suspect it may be hidden under this poster concerning the SWR industrial action, which affects a handful of weekday trains at Frome. Fortunately GWR's Famous Five marketing poster is still on display.  ::) (sorry the pic is rather large)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/qfRORIZqUD6sq9c0XW9cjb9bzNv5MENnw4k_AQ4MVl1Mia0Nz7kcqVcgMzuyBi9_XRSxHSPrVAkhLEXdi-Bt3exkPAvaOucNEXL_E3_lyB7tEDAhCZifVRCyqg5KaOz6ziZEDDbNkh0=w2400)