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Journey by Journey => London to the West => Topic started by: WSW Frome on September 07, 2017, 05:39:30 PM



Title: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: WSW Frome on September 07, 2017, 05:39:30 PM
Has anyone seen a draft timetable for the West Country IEP services to commence, I believe, in Dec18/Jan19? I am especially interested in the semi-fast services to EXD, including calls at WSB.


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: ChrisB on September 07, 2017, 06:13:22 PM
Several, but owing to the negotiations over muzzled/unmuzzled bimodes, another iteration is underway. In other words, there are no currently proposed timetables


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: bobm on September 07, 2017, 06:21:36 PM
The versions I have seen have been on condition they are not circulated further, partly due no doubt to the reasons mentioned by ChrisB above.  Frustrating but not uncommon in these days of commercial sensitivity.


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: WSW Frome on September 08, 2017, 03:24:01 PM
Is anyone able to comment on the general pattern proposed?

Such as hourly - Paddington, Reading, Newbury, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton, Tiverton PW, Exeter SD. Plus perhaps Pewsey and/or Frome calls every two hours. Differences may apply in the peaks with additional Berks and Hants calls??

All speculation on my part based on speculation I have previously read - but it might be useful to know where we are heading! West or East perhaps!


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 08, 2017, 03:39:53 PM
Is anyone able to comment on the general pattern proposed?

Such as hourly - Paddington, Reading, Newbury, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton, Tiverton PW, Exeter SD. Plus perhaps Pewsey and/or Frome calls every two hours. Differences may apply in the peaks with additional Berks and Hants calls??

All speculation on my part based on speculation I have previously read - but it might be useful to know where we are heading! West or East perhaps!

Hourly Paddington - Reading - Taunton - Tiverton - Exeter - Newton Abbott - etc (to and via Plymouth)

Every 2 hours Paddington - Reading - Theale - Newbury - Stations to Pewsey - Westbury - Castle Cary - Taunton - Exeter (some extensions, Paignton and / or Plymouth)

Also Paddington - Reading - key stations via Newbury to Bedwyn to make services to Bedwyn hourly overall.


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: WSW Frome on September 11, 2017, 05:48:53 PM
No doubt still many iterations to go before a final plan emerges.

However, no surprise that I am disappointed to see no mention so far of Frome calls in the semi-fasts. The planning of this major change could represent a golden opportunity to put Frome more firmly back on the inter-city map. So I do hope the powers that be have not simply dismissed the idea as impractical, but will give the matter further thought so that at least "some" semis do call throughout the day.

I had pondered that the ideal calls could be in the quiet hour when the Weymouth's do not typically run. However, this is confounded by the (probable) requirement for a reasonable connection in to and out of the Weymouth services at Westbury mainly to serve Bruton (and Frome!). This is another example of the many compromises that appear in timetable planning.

There has not been much comment around Frome about this pending change (early days) but I do expect that louder voices will appear for Frome calls once the framework becomes more widely known. High powers that be please note the latent demand. 

 


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: ChrisB on September 11, 2017, 06:30:44 PM
Need to get request in fast - with reasoned argument preferably evidenced. They are SO behind that material changes won't be welcomed/even possible once they are settled....so get talking now!


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 11, 2017, 06:48:42 PM
There has not been much comment around Frome about this pending change (early days) but I do expect that louder voices will appear for Frome calls once the framework becomes more widely known. High powers that be please note the latent demand.

There is scope for significant input for 2019 during this Autumn.  Not sure where to start.

Frome is a Heart of Wessex CRP station and they have been polled for inputs, as have Wiltshire Council, on both the principles of timetable design at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=18459.0 and a separate sheet of flows (direct and connections) that the community wants to protect / nurture. The nature of the beast looks like the timetable planners will be putting the the main artery services at clock face (perhaps not quite so regular as you might expect, though) and then seeing how the secondary main lines and then the rest can fit round them.  Suggest you talk with Heart of Wessex, or if you're on the station CRP team of theirs, bring it up.

Frome also is treated as an honorary member of the West Wilts Rail User Group.  Are you on their committee?  Do you know any committee members?  Regular meetings tend to be single talks of interest, so it's unlikely on historic form that that'll hold a special meeting / discuss it at  public meeting - but you could ask.  In any case, they have a meeting (19:00 tomorrow evening, Civic Hall, Warminster)

Frome is not a TransWilts Station ... except that we do have a through service to / from Swindon each day, a number of commuters between Frome and Melksham / Chippenham / Swindon, special "via Melksham" fares, and economically it has far closer ties with Wiltshire and Trowbridge than with Somerset and Taunton.  So the TransWilts team feel a "duty of care" for our mutual good, and that's extended to some crosswork behind the scenes.

WSW Frome - are you a member of a group that's a TWSW member?  There will be a thread there on the 2018/19 timetable, and also the pre-consultation and consultation as to what goes into the next greater western franchise.   You should also be involving your local passenger transport authority - Somerset County Council - and ensuring they know your views.

I'm aware "Frome Rail Users" on Facebook - are you linked with that - and know the FAVbug bus group / co-ordination might be rather useful if not already under way.

With my TWSW hat on, I feel fairly well informed on the jigsaw pieces for the 2018 timetable (potentially some big changes), 2019 timetable (other big changes for sure) and for the timetable in the next franchise.   Happy to talk them through with you before or after tomorrow's WWRUG meeting if you're there / introduce yourself (if I don't already know the face behind the name here!) or to talk them through at another date.   At present it's like planning for a wedding - knowing who has to be there, who you would like there in addition, and having to work out the seating - but not publishing early ideas because elements will upset people, and they'll change anyway.





Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: WSW Frome on September 12, 2017, 09:11:57 AM
Thanks Grahame - I plan to be in Warminster tonight so we (and others?) can chat after the meeting.


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 12, 2017, 09:35:26 AM
Thanks Grahame - I plan to be in Warminster tonight so we (and others?) can chat after the meeting.

I won't be in a rush to get back home as the last train from Warminster that connects to Melksham is at 19:01. On past form, we'll be kicked out of the Civic Centre at the end of the meeting, but there are a couple of places that serve excellent soft drinks (as well as alcohol) on the main street, where much effective post-meeting business has been conducted on prior occasions!


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Kernow Otter on September 12, 2017, 10:14:38 AM
Would love to see a 3x daily PAD to PNZ service (5+5 IEP) targeting Devon and Cornwall passengers travelling to and from London.  In an ideal world this would run fast to EXD before splitting, with the front unit running fast again to PLY then all stations to PNZ, and the rear unit stopping all stations to PLY.  This pattern would reverse for the Up service.

Yes this does not serve those trying to get to the intermediate stations between EXD and PAD, but would be a service for the residents of Devon and Cornwall and not commuters or those further up the line who already have more choice of services to and from the capital.



Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: ChrisB on September 12, 2017, 11:56:30 AM
Isn't the suggestion for the fast PLY/PNZ services to do exactly that?


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 12, 2017, 12:19:44 PM
Isn't the suggestion for the fast PLY/PNZ services to do exactly that?

Not exactly ... but recognisably close in stopping pattern.   Extra stops east of Devon in the hourly service are only at Taunton and Reading.  And not just 3 a day but hourly. 


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 12, 2017, 12:47:03 PM
Quote
Not exactly ... but recognisably close in stopping pattern.   Extra stops east of Devon in the hourly service are only at Taunton and Reading.  And not just 3 a day but hourly. 

Aren't the hourly 'fast' ones also stopping at Tiverton, with the two-hourly semi-fasts from Paddington to Exeter missing out Tiverton?


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 12, 2017, 02:25:04 PM
Quote
Not exactly ... but recognisably close in stopping pattern.   Extra stops east of Devon in the hourly service are only at Taunton and Reading.  And not just 3 a day but hourly. 

Aren't the hourly 'fast' ones also stopping at Tiverton, with the two-hourly semi-fasts from Paddington to Exeter missing out Tiverton?

Yes.  I said "East of Devon" and the previous correspondence was talking about giving Devon and Cornwall fast services to London.  Tiverton is in Devon.


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 12, 2017, 06:59:24 PM
Good point, although I had it in my head the part about running fast to Exeter, and was considering Tiverton as
Quote
the intermediate stations between EXD and PAD


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Kernow Otter on September 12, 2017, 09:20:18 PM
How could I forget Tiverton !

So, fast Paddington to Taunton.  Split Taunton with front unit then fast to PLY for all stations to PNZ, with the rear unit all stations to PLY.

I wonder what the journey time would be ?


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: ChrisB on September 12, 2017, 09:34:14 PM
Can't see that - major flow EXD-PLY will sant to travel on the faster service


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Zo on September 13, 2017, 08:38:28 PM
Every 2 hours Paddington - Reading - Theale - Newbury - Stations to Pewsey - Westbury - Castle Cary - Taunton - Exeter (some extensions, Paignton and / or Plymouth)

Also Paddington - Reading - key stations via Newbury to Bedwyn to make services to Bedwyn hourly overall.

Is that definite rather than the semi-fast just calling at Newbury, Pewsey, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton and Exeter with an hourly Bedwyn service continuing to run as now?


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: grahame on September 13, 2017, 09:22:36 PM
Every 2 hours Paddington - Reading - Theale - Newbury - Stations to Pewsey - Westbury - Castle Cary - Taunton - Exeter (some extensions, Paignton and / or Plymouth)

Also Paddington - Reading - key stations via Newbury to Bedwyn to make services to Bedwyn hourly overall.

Is that definite rather than the semi-fast just calling at Newbury, Pewsey, Westbury, Castle Cary, Taunton and Exeter with an hourly Bedwyn service continuing to run as now?

Not sure of structure east of Pewsey; Bedwyn should get hourly - may be hourly turn back, or alternate turn backs;


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: WSW Frome on November 14, 2017, 04:58:13 PM
Recently I have started an awareness exercise in Frome concerning the new IET/IEP timetables and the opportunities this may present to improve services at Frome. Two of the local newspapers have recently published my letter and the text is shown below.

Many of us are aware that there are operational issues linked with Frome calls. Not least of these is that the current plans (apparently) require the down semi-fasts to arrive in Taunton just ahead of the fast service, for connectional purposes (and presumably equivalent for up services). However, the issue should be given a reasonable consideration and response. The MP for Somerton and Frome is an active rail campaigner and supports these suggestions. We will meet later in November to discuss further.

Future Train Services at Frome
Readers may be aware that the (now partial) Great Western Railway electrification scheme will be completed in 2018. The timetables will be completely revised in late 2018 and this will affect the Frome/Westbury areas.  The draft timetables are in advanced planning but not yet in the public domain.
Information from various sources show the proposed GWR service patterns as they affect this region are:
1.   Every hour- fast service London to/from the West Country, calling at Reading and Taunton.
2.   (Generally) Every two hours - semi-fast service London to/from Exeter, calling at Newbury, Pewsey, Westbury, Castle Cary and Taunton.
The morning and evening commuter services between Frome and London are retained but the afternoon service will likely disappear. Under these plans Frome will generally be served by connections at Westbury in/out of Heart of Wessex trains similar to the current arrangements.
These major timetable revisions accompanying the introduction of new rolling stock represent an opportunity to try to put Frome more firmly back on the inter-city map, with improved direct services to London and importantly, greater connectivity within Somerset to Taunton.
We must ask anyone with lobbying influence to strongly recommend that some of the semi-fast services call at Frome. It must be noted that there are time penalties and other technical issues associated with calling at Frome so that practicalities may just prevail but it is definitely worth a serious ask. Wider thinking might consider the use of skip-stop working for certain services or an extension of some services which will otherwise terminate at Bedwyn, Wilts.
Separately, South Western Railway have recently published (for comment) their draft timetable for December 2018. The services to/from Frome are slightly enhanced and include an early morning service to London Waterloo and a late afternoon return.
It is not clear if there will be any public consultation on the GWR timetables but I plan to circulate this information more widely and anyone interested should try to influence a positive outcome.



Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: ChrisB on November 14, 2017, 06:29:07 PM
2. You forgot Tiverton Parkway.

Also, I'm not not sure skip stopping on a service every 2 hours would be welcomed at stations due to be served every two hours. Skip stopping would mean a service once in a 4-hour period


Title: Re: Draft IEP Timetables Dec18/Jan19
Post by: Adelante_CCT on November 14, 2017, 07:33:09 PM
Quote
2. You forgot Tiverton Parkway.

I thought Tiverton was being served by the hourly fasts, and not by the two hourly semi-fasts.