Great Western Coffee Shop

Consultation Question 2

a) Do you agree or disagree with the proposals outlined above for splitting the Great Western franchise into smaller franchises?
– Agree
– Disagree
– No opinion
b) Why?

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Explanatory text

The following map illustrates one possible option for a two-way split, comprising:
●● One franchise, coloured blue on the map below, concentrating on the intercity markets between London and Bristol, South Wales and the Cotswolds, outer suburban and branch line services in the Thames Valley, airport services and potentially future services using the proposed western rail link to Heathrow;
●● Another franchise, coloured red on the map below, providing long-distance services between London, Wiltshire, Somerset, Devon and Cornwall (including the Sleeper), together with regional and local services across the central and south-western parts of the franchise area, including potential future services to Portishead and other elements of the ‘MetroWest’ scheme. This could include the services between Paddington, Newbury and Bedwyn, as although they may be a good fit with other Thames Valley services, there could be potential for the Newbury and Bedwyn services to be integrated within the longer-distance intercity services that operate along the same route.



See http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=19037 for the background to this topic

So is no West of England Services via Bristol a proposal of this consultation or has the decision already been made?
Also the same for no Direct trains from WSM to Paddington?

There is some reference in question 8 - see http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=19045

Noting also on the map a whole load of other elements - some of which I suspect are due to a simplified diagram. But still potential for comment.

- No Carmarthen or Pembroke Dock
- No through London to Worcester via Ashchurch service
- No local services between Newton Abbott and Plymouth
- No TransWilts services continuing south of Westbury (indeed only SWR and CDF-PMH services to Warminster)

What GWR thinks of the proposal to split the franchise. Unsurprisingly not too keen in the idea:

http://www.bathchronicle.co.uk/news/bath-news/gwr-dismisses-proposed-break-up-849624

For what it’s worth I don’t see it happening. Maybe a bit of tinkering around the edges of the GWR network  with some lines going to other franchises.

Here's the GWR comment:


Note though that an option requires an alternative.   Is the alternative "no change" as I don't see anything else laid down in the document explicitly as what could happen if the option is not taken.   Searching the document, the only place I find "Carmarthen" or "Pembroke" is on the current franchise map ... no other questions / alternatives there ...

The consultation document itself reads to me as finding more faults with the idea on balance than arguments in favour.

a; Disagree

b; I don't have much thought process on this one, and won't bother outlining the pros v cons as this has already been done in the consultation document, but I am against the idea. Possibly as discussed in question 3 some 'fat' could be trimmed off the current area, Greenford, Brighton etc, but personally I would like to see the core of the franchise remain as it is.

I am thoroughly opposed to this. This is just another politicians' fad.

There's a reason this was nearly all one company even before 1923.  It works best as a network.  I cannot see better services from swindon to the South West resulting from this - quite the opposite.  It will reduce flexibility when things go wrong and will constrain innovation when things go right. 

Splitting it up before 2006 did not work - that's why they put it all together - so why should splitting it up again work any better now?

They have removed much of the LTV trains to TfL.  What more do they need to tinker with now!

Another potential reason is the problem when there need to be diversions.  If the franchises are split will there be less opportunities to maintain route knowledge for diversions.  I suppose it is linked to shared traction knowledge - depending on whether the 800/801 and 802s need separate training for traction knowledge.

If the franchises are split and there are no West of England Services via Bristol, how will the 'Red' Drivers maintain the route knowledge for diversions? 

Ditto How will 'Blue' drivers maintain the route knowledge for diversions the other way?

Resilience drops within a smaller franchise ... but then resilience is traded off against cost in the planning. 

At the time the railway was expected to be running with all-electric class 801 units from London to Bristol and to Swansea, they would have been scuppered with a closure just about anywhere along their main line leaving only the extended services (Carmarthen, Weston-super-mare able to take an alternative line.  And with the sea wall breach at Dawlish fading from the memory (are there any DfT ministers who were there at the time still at the DfT??) and not so high on the agenda, we see that resilience beyond running (say) 98% of the time perhaps isn't an investment priority.

It would be possible to send one train a day via a different route - as done at Foxhall curve, Ogmore Valley, and a few others.  At one time in the not too distant past,a regular relief train from London to the West Country used to run via Chippenham and Westbury, and I'm sure there are other examples ... and it would be possible to divert a train with a second driver from another company who know the road, but perhaps not the traction.  At short notice that would be impractical, but then at a cost of £££££ does the franchise specifier need to have such backup resources and systems in place to save just ££ of hassle on the occasional unplanned day?

According to Philip Haigh of rail on twitter, the franchise is not going to be split.
Apparently there was no support for the proposal in the consultation.

Good news - excellent when confirmed [personal view, but clearly the majority one]

Also suggests the power of consultation inputs, and an example of how they can be a significant element in decisions.

Whilst its great news, it also goes to show just how out of touch the government and Department for Transport are with issues related to the railway...

Confirmed by Chris Grayling at the end of his session with the Transport Select Committee.

https://goo.gl/2FTNnx (https://goo.gl/2FTNnx)

Fast forward to 15:42:45 - also contains brief discussion on Cross Country franchise.
(Reference is Time of Day rather than 15 minutes into the video)

The BBC Spotlight piece referred to by member woody in Across the West is available here (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/BBC%20Spotlight%2024%20Jul%2018.mp4).

Contains a short clip of the Secretary of State's "announcement" and some of the background.

Also very interesting that the Secretary of State has "absolutely no intention of reducing services to the South West" under the Cross Country Franchise.  So that's good news for Paignton, Bath and Newquay, right?

An almost universally unpopular idea.  Which makes the fact the DfT didn’t opt for it somewhat surprising.

Having listened to the full recording of the Commons Transport Committee, I felt that one interpretation was that there would be an increased service to the South West BUT I am not sure he specified Cross Country was operating it.
It could be that GWR would provide the service connecting out of the Cross Country trains.

The 2015 GWR franchise refers to the Devon and Cornwall GWR mainline service being 2 tph except in those early and late hours where certain extended services eg to/from Penzance would remain operated by XC.  In other words the overall service offer was a combined effort.

Then the very latest XC consultation (which is still ongoing) was proposing removal of  those off pattern XC services but they’d have been replaced by the local TOC, in the case of Penzance:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/714761/cross-country-passenger-rail-franchise-public-consultation.pdf

In the south they were proposing cutting back from Bournemouth to Southampton as SWR were adding more trains to Bournemouth.  Hopefully that’s been binned as well.

Swindon Advertiser - first with the news..... http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/16402303.railway-franchise-will-remain-intact/ (http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/16402303.railway-franchise-will-remain-intact/)