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Title: HS4Air Post by: SandTEngineer on March 07, 2018, 17:42:26 ::) :P
https://www.globalrailwayreview.com/news/67132/hs4air-proposal-south-east-england/ Apologies. There is a map in that article but I still haven't got the knack of copying those over to here (Note to self: Must speak to CfN :P) Quote HS4Air: A new railway proposal revealed for South East England A new railway route has been proposed by London firm Expedition, creating a high-speed railway version of the M25, connecting both Gatwick and Heathrow airports… An HS4Air proposal has been revealed for South East England Expedition, a London-based engineering consultancy firm, have revealed their proposal for a new high-speed railway called HS4Air (High-Speed for Air). The new railway would connect the existing HS1 with the planned HS2, linking both Gatwick and Heathrow airports. Also included would be a connection to the Great Western Main Line railway (GWML). Along this planned route, passengers would be able to travel to either airport from cities such as Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and Cardiff without the need to change trains; reducing road congestion, air pollution and travel times. Journey duration from Sussex and Kent to the Midlands and the West would also be reduced by up to one hour. Moreover, HS4Air would bring direct international train services, from the Midlands and the North to Europe via the Channel Tunnel. The high-speed rail service to the city centre of Paris, from both Birmingham and Manchester, would be faster in comparison to flying. Director of Expedition, Alistair Lenczner, Leader of the HS4Air proposal, said: “HS4Air has been developed to allow rail and aviation infrastructure projects in South East England that are currently unconnected to become joined-up. This will offer greatly enhanced benefits for users and provide better value for the investments currently being made in the UK’s strategic infrastructure.” With HS4Air, South East England’s transport network would become more environmentally-friendly with reduced carbon emissions and less air pollution. The region would experience stimulated economic growth across the nation as a result from the stronger transport links between cities. The nation’s distribution networks could also benefit from HS4Air by running cables and pipes alongside the railway. “In a way HS4Air can be regarded as a high-speed railway version of the M25 around London, except that it allows much faster journey times with no congestion and with far less impact on the environment,” continued Alistair. The proposal illustrates the route to be approximately 140km-long between the connections with HS1 at Ashford and HS2 near Denham. Twenty per cent of the line would be tunnelled to avoid impacting the landscape and 40 per cent would re-use the existing straight railway running between Tonbridge and Ashford which would require simple upgrading to operate high-speed trains. “The proposed HS4Air project is an example of integrated strategic planning that spans across multiple infrastructure sectors that are too often planned within separate ‘silos’,” said Alistair. “Such integrated planning allows projects to achieve better results in terms of their land-use efficiency and investment value.” Using the cost estimates from HS2 Phase 1, HS4Air has been estimated to cost approximately £10 billion and is expected to provide a similar transport network integration that already exists in France, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium and Switzerland. Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 07, 2018, 18:57:21 Like this?
(https://www.globalrailwayreview.com/wp-content/uploads/HS4Air-map.jpg) :) Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: eXPassenger on March 07, 2018, 20:17:19 Interesting idea. I see the following potential markets, each of which has different benefits:
I would be a lot happier with this type of press release if it gave forecast order of magnitude figures for passengers and the likely fare structure. Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: stuving on March 07, 2018, 22:48:07 I think that a few years back it was in the news that DfT were looking into the idea of a high-speed railway line alongside the M25/M23 to join the two airports. I don't remember seeing any more than that, and certainly nothing official, but it did remind me that I thought that was a good idea when the M25 was being built. It would give about 20 minutes for that journey, with the idea it could even be done airside so the two airports could be operated as one for interchange/hub purposes.
Following on from that, there is a convenient straight line already going from Redhill towards Ashford to repurpose - and replace by some nearby alternative if the locals want. That would have offered a choice of short route into a London Eurostar terminal from along the M25. And of course it could have linked onward from Heathrow into whatever the railways would become from then on (which was none too clear at the time). This latest proposal doesn't put the line alongside a motorway, which may be a disadvantage. Putting the two together is common elsewhere (especially in France) - mainly because if you've ruined one linear neighbourhood for living in already, a bit more ruining isn't such a big deal. It works even better when the road is being built (as in my original M25 idea). Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: ChrisB on March 08, 2018, 10:39:00 Al;so seen this referred to as HS4M25 :-)
Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: devonexpress on May 10, 2018, 07:52:26 Sorry to be so negative, but its another silly idea that won't happen! Just as the link between Windsor & Eton Central & Eton Riverside will never happen.
Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: stuving on July 20, 2018, 16:18:33 This idea was in the Times today. I did wonder why, as it isn't new news, but it does contain the added snippet that "the plans will be submitted to the Department for Transport before the end of the month". It also adds some new company names. It was originally dreamed up by Alistair Lenczner of Expedition Engineering, and now Weston Williamson + Partners (architects) and Turley (planning) have jumped into their sandpit.
WW+P have done some words of their own, and a sketchy picture (https://www.westonwilliamson.com/news-and-events/hs4air-will-create-new-transport-hubs) (which I can't find in downloadable form): Quote A new image has been revealed for HS4Air, the proposal for a new high-speed railway around London that passes via both Gatwick and Heathrow Airports. The proposal will be submitted to the Department for Transport in response to a call for ideas within the rail sector. The proposal will also have an important role for stimulating much-needed new housing developments in the South East over the coming decades. HS4Air has been developed by London-based Expedition Engineering together with architects Weston Williamson + Partners (WW+P) and planning and development consultants Turley. The proposed new railway, estimated to cost £10bn, is proposed to connect HS1 at Ashford to HS2 North West of London via Heathrow and Gatwick airports with a spur connection to the Great Western Main Line. Dubbed the “M25 for high-speed trains”, HS4Air would allow train journey times to be slashed from the UK’s two most important airports together with their hinterlands in South East England to the Midlands, North England and South Wales. HS4Air will reduce journey times as follows: Ashford to Gatwick: 25 minutes (typically 1 hour 50 mins today) Manchester to Heathrow: 1 hour 10 mins (typically 3 hours 20 mins today) Heathrow to Gatwick: 15 minutes Cardiff to Heathrow: 1 hour 40 mins (typically 2 hours 50 mins today) Birmingham to Paris: 3 hours (typically 3 hours 50 minutes by air) Four new stations along HS4Air at Ashford, Tonbridge, Gatwick and Heathrow will provide important new points of new transport connectivity to the rest of the UK beyond London. Both Heathrow and Gatwick airports will become multi-modal regional transport hubs with many passengers using these stations even if they are not catching a plane. The new connectivity created by the proposed high-speed line and the transport hubs along it are expected to act as a boost for regional economies from South East England to northern England. HS4Air will remove London as the historic barrier for railway connectivity between UK regions North and West of London and continental Europe. By providing a fast “bypass” rail route around London, fast direct passenger and freight trains from the Midlands and North England to Europe can be made. City centre to city centre journey times from both Birmingham and Manchester to Paris will be faster using HS4Air than travelling by air. As a result, HS4Air will become a catalyst for economic activity between the UK regions and Europe. By taking the people and freight out of London that does not need or want to pass through the congested metropolis, HS4Air is expected to release capacity on the London rail network back for use by the intra-London market. I see no mention of any partner with money - so keep breathing.! PS. the three original pictures are in this pdf (https://expedition.uk.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/HS4Air-Images-1.pdf). Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: ellendune on July 20, 2018, 16:24:00 This is rather telling
Quote By taking the people and freight out of London that does not need or want to pass through the congested metropolis, HS4Air is expected to release capacity on the London rail network back for use by the intra-London market. They are proposing a mixed traffic high speed line. Either that is two pairs of tracks for the different speeds of the two traffics or it is going to have very restricted capacity. I hope they can demonstrate how this will work in practice, but I suspect it is because they don't have the first clue how to run a railway. Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: SandTEngineer on July 20, 2018, 17:55:31 I note that nothing Southwest of Bristol gets a lookin again...... :P
Title: Re: HS4Air Post by: ellendune on July 20, 2018, 18:14:52 I note that nothing Southwest of Bristol gets a lookin again...... :P That's not really saying it as it is. What you mean in nothing South west of Staines gets a lookin again... Ok so it shows some through services, but they never happened on HS1 so why now? This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net |