Great Western Coffee Shop

It's December - and time for our Advent Quiz 2019.  Bigger and better this year ... I'm going to give you two pictures and three questions each day.  Tell me:

1. Where the old or hetitage picture was taken?
2. In what year was it taken?
3. Where the modern / current picture was taken?

Each day ... answer as many or as few of the elements as you like ... but please give others a chance too - if you identify someting one day, please leave the next day's questions for someone else.

Big, huge, enormous thanks to various members who have provided me with pictures and permission to use them. I'll tell you who they are at some point - not necessarily straight away as we run the quiz, as in some cases their identities would be clues as to the location.

First day coming up shortly .. enjoy!

Saturday, 1st December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

1.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_01.jpg)
1.2 - And in which year?

1.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_01.jpg)
1.4 Care to guess when it was taken?

1.1 Westbury

1.3 Chippenham (after it got dark)

1.4 2018, the other day while waiting after a missed connection?

Yes, it is ... this is the junction that will be  relaid (infuriatingly, without even passive provision for retracing the 4th platform) over Christmas; needs doing - various speed restrictions on it at present


Also correct.  "When" wasn't really asking time of day - though you're correct "after dark".  It was about 8 p.m. last night; seeing a 150/1 turn up these days feels like GWR were really scraping the barrel to provide the train.  I would much rather they scrape the barrel rather than not try, mind you!


As I wrote ... you posted. Yes, exactly.  Long wait on Chippenham Station. As it got colder, the gate line staff went off duty leaving the station unmanned, and asked me to leave the warmth of the waiting room so they could lock it up.   Ironic situation that the waiting room is closed at the colder time of day and when the gaps between trains are longer, isn't it?

I know, me being slightly naughty stating the obvious. My lame sense of humour.  :)

According to the station sign on the platform, anyway  :)

1972-ish?

Don't think you're far out. I have managed to leave my crib sheet at home ... seated in a waiting room on another station again now ... I'll be able to confirm the date overnight. 

I had a good chuckle and it's the sort of thing I would have written.    Should have answers with a smiley to let you know I found it funny  :D ;D :-* :-[

Why ? missed another connection due to another late running service  >:( ::)  >:(

Earlier than when goods brake vans were dispensed with and maybe at a time when unfitted fright might have still have been a common sight on the BR network aka the disappearing freight north towards Trowbridge.  :P

No - there are still BIG gaps in services back home to Melksham.   This morning I did have another failed connection due to a 9 minute holdup with a 60 minute delay resulting (into a bus!).  This afternoon was known in advance.

"According to the station sign on the platform, anyway."

That's cheating . . . :o

Checked back - 1970.  And many thanks to SandTEngineer for the use of this picture, and others which will be sprinkled through up to Christmas.  Some very interesting pictures indeed coming up ...

Sunday, 2nd December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

2.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_02.jpg)
2.2 - And in which year?

2.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_02.jpg)
2.4 Care to guess when it was taken?

2.3 - Pilning?

Yep ... any thoughts as to when?

That fence looks like the Midland to me. Somewhere on the Settle and Carlisle?

My understanding from the picture provider is that you are incredibly close!

The north end of Garsdale station?

I am embarrassed.  I made a note of where I though this was / email from the member who has let me use the picture, but I think I may have got mixed up ... so I'm give you a definite "it could be" just for the moment.   I'm having problems placin it at the location I noted down.

Garsdale .. whenever I come across Garsdale I find myself clicking to the story of Graham Nuttall and Ruswarp (http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/content/articles/2009/04/17/ruswarp_feature.shtml) and shedding a tear or five.

Has to be 2017 or, more likely, 2018?

How about "yesterday"  ;D - nothing like an up to date quiz!

Clarified by a Red Squirrel (thank you for the picture). Settle and Carlisle, yes.   Garsdale, no.  You could give me two more points of the compass in a correct answer.

As it happens I saw my first ever red squirrel on that trip - at Garsdale Station! Tried to get a picture (now that would have been good!) but the little varmint was too quick for me.

I know where it is by the signalling and track layout, but I won't spoil the fun for everybody ;D

Kirkby Stephen signal box end .

I think it must be Langwarthby, judging by the "points of the compass" clue. As to date, it re-opened in 1986, so some time after then?

Or ... Kirkby Stephen West. south end

Many thanks for that, have often wondered when that bridge last saw a paintbrush, or maintenance of any kind - now I know !

The bridge has weight limits on it these days - with a series concern that one day it might be damaged when a heavy that shouldn't goes over it.  With the West Wilts Trading Estate to the north and the roads to ports (Southampton, Portsmouth, Poole) to the south it's very tempting to lorry drivers who's licenses aren't on the Swansea database for an easy penalty.   The D1 bus wriggles around through Slag Lane (no, not where your find the slags - the name has a different origin) ... and the lorries get sent all the way up to North Bradley.

Slag Lane - Throw back to the days of Westbury Iron Works I presume

Monday 3rd December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

3.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_03.jpg)
3.2 - And in which year?

3.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_03.jpg)

3.1 Black Dog Halt on the former Chippenham to Calne line ?

That would be so much "me" but, no, it isn't.

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/b/black_dog_halt/

So my guess of 3.1 was wrong so I'll go for 3.3 as Salisbury.

And that's correct ...

The train is 1F30 - the 17:23 Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central - pictured at 18:45 on 9th October 2018 (so running about 5 late). I was surprised to see a 150/1 turn up - especially in its own. Busy but enough capacity at that time of the evening for my run up to Westbury.

Bump ... is it really that hard?

I guess it is ... hundreds of little stations must have looked like that, most (including this one) gone.  To help, here is a picture taken a short distance up the trackbed earlier this month.

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/tbed03.jpg)

Cross Hands halt ?

So, so close .. next halt up that trackbed. (yes, my very recent picture is very close to Cross Hands)

New Passage Halt

If you look REALLY hard at the name board you can just make it out. I am going to guess 1961

That's about the date I was given ... and perhaps I should have done a bit more vandalising of that name board. Easy when you know, of course!

Tuesday 4th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

1.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_04.jpg)
1.2 - And in which year?

1.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_04.jpg)

Quick late night/early morning punt on 3: Oldfield Park?

G'night.

Its a, cut down, well the rear two coaches, Hastings line DEMU but the leading coach is not by reason of the profile of that vehicle against the rear two. I'll put it as somewhere between Guildford and Redhill on the South Downs (Reading to Gatwick) line when services on that line continued from Redhill to Tonbridge.

Spot on


I cannot fault your logic or conclusions.

From the landscape I would put it near to or east of Redhill.

Gomshall ?

Yes indeed.

In those days, the Reading to Redhill service continued on (via its reversal at Redhill) to Tonbridge rather than to Gatwick.  An unelectrified line in a sea of third rail, these lines were served by a fleet of around half a dozen "Tadpoles" - spare 6 car Hastings line demus with narrow bodies were split in two, the resultant halves trimmed back by a further carriage, and a wide bodied driving trailer from an electric set added.  Odd looking things and from memory what a long time they took from Tonbridge to Reading, calling (I felt) at every blade of grass along the way.

The Redhill to Tonbridge section started life under the South Eastern Railway as the first main line to the Kent coast / channel ports.  Map from 1840.
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/kentrail1840.jpg)
(Public domain map / WikiPedia)

When the Sevenoaks cutoff opened in 1868, the section dropped to being a secondary line - a relief line if there were problems on the new Knockholt - Sevenoaks - Hildenborough.  A merger/partnership of the South Eastern Railway with the London Chatham and Dover in 1899 gave the (combined) operator other routes to the ports, and the line dropped further off the radar - taking a step back onto the radar in 1993 when it was electrified, through services from London to replace the Tonbridge - Reading service, and a diversionary route for Channel Tunnel (Eurostar) services from Waterloo to Paris and Brussels.

The Redhill to Reading section was also built by South Eastern and opened in 1849, with a view to increasing their reach - very much a single tentacle of a line from their Kentish heartline around to the West of London, avoiding London.  In many way forward thinking ... it's always surprised me that the reversal at Redhill was and still is required.  Gomshall station - on the quiz - is one of those under the flank of the North Downs, clearly seen in the picture.

Except of course, like so many secondary lines, it wasn't built by the SER itself but by a line-specific company - a Victorian kind of "special-purpose vehicle" - the Reading, Guildford and Reigate Railway Company. It's true that the SER shared directors with the RGRR, and agreed early on to lease and run it; but they also proposed their own bill for part of the route, as did LBSCR, LSWR, plus several new companies. Most of the route was outside SER territory, and involved dealing with the other established (if only for a few years) railways, and while SER's backing was important they were very keen on someone - anyone - else putting up the capital, for which a local identity was essential.

As to why trains have always reversed at Redhill, until not so long ago they ran into Charing Cross - so you'd need to change there instead. That was so not only under the separate companies, but survived nationalisation for a while (into the 50s at least). After that, what would you do instead, for what was now a very minor route? A flat junction, missing Redhill, and unworkable except for so few trains it's not worth it?  A (hugely expensive) flyover, also skipping Redhill? Add a link to one of the lines to enter from the north, despite the terrain, the presence by now of Redhill, and the Quarry Lines?

Interesting to see Tunbridge on the map, but not its southerly neighbour Royel Tinbrodge Wulls...

The South Eastern ownership is the reason for the disparity in mileage markers coming towards Reading. The line from Wokingham not being measured from either Waterloo or Paddington but presumably from Charing Cross.

Do you only have images of 150/1s??? Given there's only 2 out there now, you appear to be riding them very frequently.

Closet 150/1 spotter perhaps?!  :o

Indeed - though in fact by the 50s trains from Reading ran to Victoria or London Bridge instead! Not a sensible commute, obviously, taking over 2¹/₂ hours.

Ond, jost tis ounce, ist nit on famis gramme tipo...

Nor any kind of typo - from Wikipedia:

I do have some pictures of 150-002 somewhere  ;D ;D

In semi-seriousness, I did wonder how long it would be for someone to comment ... there's an intentional thread running through the "recent" pictures at the moment.   Not sure how long it will last.

Is Reading to Victoria / London Bridge / Charing Cross via Reigate still a valid routing option?  I suspect not ...

So do I...

(http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/swisvb.jpg)

Was it going to/from Severn Beach? If so what was it doing at Swindon...?!

Well it wasn't going to pick up any passengers at Swindon - it was on the middle road.  It was the 13th Dec 2013 at 8.30am - but I can't remember any of the other details now.  I remember taking the picture for a possible quiz - but like so many good intentions it didn't happen.

Wasn't it based at Reading in those days? Possibly heading back to Reading depot

Now you mention it. Red marker lights indicating that’s the rear of the train so heading east.  You could be right!

Wednesday 5th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

Eagerly awaiting todays offering.

5.1 Where?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_05.jpg)

5.2 When (that picture)

5.3 Where?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_05.jpg)

5.3 Exeter St. Thomas ?

5.1 Holt
5.2 Beaven’s outing 1905
Source ‘Holt Junction magazine’ - my gran used to live there!

Yes ...


... and yes

From Bradford-on-Avon Museum (http://www.bradfordonavonmuseum.co.uk/tanning)


Today - from http://www.glovefactorystudios.com/about/


A thought to include a request for a re-opened station on the site of Holt Junction for the village neighbourhood plan was rejected when the authors of the plan looked into the feasabiity and concluded that it would only be practical if the area between the railway and the village were to be filled with houses - it wasn't a direction they wanted to go. However, there may be a future case for a station at or near Bradford Junction / Staverton / for Holt.

Holt Junction - a nostalgic conundrum. Many years ago, after visiting my Gran in Bath I was travelling home via Westbury. I have a very clear recollection that I changed trains at Holt - and backtracked to Westbury. I often wonder whether this was a normal connection or whether I had got on the wrong train at Bath Spa. A question that has bothered me for 60 years.

There was a limited through semi-fast service from Bristol and Bath via Bradford-on-Avon, Holt, Devizes, Hunergford and Newbury to Reading and London, and bearing in mind the relative infrequency of trains on all lines, I suspect that Bath to Westbury at certain times of day would involve a change off that train onto a Swindon or Chippenham to Westbury (or a Patney / Devizes to Westbury train) at Holt.

To add ... looking at a Summer 1963 timetable for an example ... Monday to Friday

15:37 Bath to Westbury, direct train, arrives 16:34

16:24 Bath to Melksham train - change at Holt Junction 16:57 to 17:15, arrive Westbury 17:31

16:58 Bath to Westbury, direct train, arrive 17:38

I think the Bristol to London via Devizes service had ceased a couple of years earlier, but I only have a limited timetable collection.

Having missed the opportunity to "get" the Tadpole at Gomshall yesterday, I think the "in which year" question has not been attempted - so having "hit the side netting" with Garsdale, I'll have a go at this..

Is it early 1981? The reasons for this guess - by then most Tadpoles had been disbanded, and they were about to phased out on the North Downs, so more likely that a railway buff would want to photograph one. It was also a cold winter and late spring - could be a sprinkling of snow on the North Downs behind?

Close but not quote bull's eye.

From my original post ...


And I will post that again as a reminder tomorrow morning.   People seem to be keen to play "where's the 150/1" ...

150 002 was at Parkway this morning - in filthy weather. No picture, though.

Thursday 6th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

Please remember ...
But please feel free to message me ... I will be around until 07:45 the from just after lunch today

6.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_06.jpg)
6.2 - And in which year?

6.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_06.jpg)

6.3 Hayle.

The sign pointing to 'North Quay' was a big clue!

Indeed ... minimal image manipulation on this quiz

Hayle is a fascinating place to visit with the walk down to .. the North Quay ... these days. Lisa, I and the dogs holidayed beyond there a year or two back, and I enjoyed the walk from the station, along the quay and beyond to the Towans. But it is much in need of TLC and purpose .. which developers hope to bring ...

https://www.corinthianland.co.uk/projects/hayle-harbour-cornwall


... and the Town Council feel are excessive - from Cornwall Live (https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/cornwall-news/claims-hayle-north-quay-250-2146196)

6.1 Eggesford ?

I completely agree with the Town Mayor. Ive been down to Hayle a fair bit in recent years, and frankly, im not focusing on the buildings when i walk down there - Im focusing on the wonderful overall harbour landscape, which (once you are past the ASDA) does not feel overly intruded upon by building footprint.

This will certainly be intruded upon by this proposal though. You only have to look at examples like Exmouth seafront to see how fine the line is between "TLC and purpose" and throwing the baby out with the bathwater in the name of soulless modernity, sweeping aside long-established and much loved features such as the Model Railway in the process. The proposed Hayle development, in my view, is way out of proportion, and firmly in the latter camp.

Yes, it is

6.1 Eggesford original signalbox was undermined (as was the Down platform) by a flood in the adjacent river, and the signalbox structure was severely damaged to the extent it needed to be removed.  This occurred on 21 November 1967.  As shown in the photograph a new signalbox was constructed to the then standard WR design (known in the trade as a 'PLYWOOD WONDER') and opened on 28 September 1969.  This signalbox itself was closed on 01 December 1987 and the crossing loop subsequently controlled by Crediton signalbox as it is today.

Thank you ... and as provider of the picture (thank you) there is a huge authority in what you write, and I'm embarrassed that I've got the date crib sheet on another computer that's not with me ....

1.1 Westbury North signalbox (known later just as Westbury signalbox) was abolished on 11 May 1984 when the new Westbury Panel opened (actually opened on 14 May 1984).  The two bracket signals shown are known as GWR '1942 bracket type' as the design used was the first use of a fully steel signal.  This design had the bracket posts to one side of the main post and this caused the signal to require a substantial foundation.  When BR(WR) took over post 1948 the design was reconfigured so the main post was between any higher posts avoiding a turning moment on the main post, and thus requiring a simpler foundation and bracket.  The signals on the right have mechanical route indicators consisting of a number of slides with text on them to display the necessary route indication.  These were displayed when the main signal arm was cleared to proceed.

There were originally three signalboxes at Westbury; Westbury North, Westbury Middle and Westbury South.  Westbury (North) shown in the photograph and Westbury South were the largest of the three and both housed a lever frame consisting of 99 levers each.

In the absence of anyone else trying - 1980?

Just a year out ... dated April 1979

Friday 7th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

7.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_07.jpg)
7.2 - And in which year?

7.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_07.jpg)

7.2 - By way of almost completely failing to answer the question: My GWR engine identification skills would embarrass my dad, but I'm guessing the engine on the left is Modified Hall No.6974 Bryngwyn Hall (withdrawn in May 1965); the King is less easy to identify, but given that they were all gone by the end of 1962 that puts an upper limit on the date.

Is 7.3 Cam & Dursley?

7.3 Ashchurch for Tewkesbury.

Yes - Ashchurch for Tewkesbury - Cam and Dursley was on the right line - just not the right station!

For 7.1 I will go for Castle Cary. The layout looks right. The semaphore signal gantry initially gave me doubts but I believe the down starter at Castle Cary originally did have three routes before later having the right hand side removed.

As for the year, I have no idea!

Yes - it *is* Castle Cary ... I will let the year discussion roll on ...

Nothing much to do with the date, but is the King hauling the Cornish Riviera Express?

The Hall is presumably on a Weymouth service. The left hand route going to the siding was removed when the siding was extended back behind the down platform, which was done in Sept 1963.

6974 was new in 1947 and allocated to Old Oak Common & Southall until early 1964. Warships took over the Cornish Riviera Express from around 1958.

This would suggest a date between 1947 and 1958

7.1 CASTLE CARY
There were four signalboxes at Castle Cary.  The first opened in 1880 and closed on 11 April 1905.  The second opened on 11 April 1905 contained 55 levers.  This signalbox was destroyed by a bomb dropped by a lone Messerschmidt 110 during the second world war, on 03 September 1942, and closed as a consequence.  The third signalbox was a temporary wooden replacement opened on 05 September 1942 and contained 22 levers, opened just two days after the previous signalbox was bombed, and was closed on 27 October 1942.  The third and final signalbox was opened on 27 October 1942 and contained 85 levers and was closed on 01 February 1985, the area being controlled by Westbury Panel Box.  The final signalbox can just be seen in the Advent Quiz photograph, enveloped in steam and smoke from the approaching train, behind the righthand signal post.  This style of signalbox (which was a very basic box type structure with a flat roof) was known as the GWR ARP Type, and was developed prior to the second world war.

In the Advent Quiz photograph the bracket signal is of the 1942 type and the three arms left to right applied to the DOWN GOODS; DOWN WEYMOUTH and DOWN TAUNTON.

Here is my photograph of the same location taken in 1970 but slightly to the right of the quiz one.  The signal is known as a ‘Backing Signal’ and the arm is fully red without a white stripe and contains two holes to indicate its function.  The route indicator below is the same as those referenced earlier in the Westbury North quiz photograph and shows four indications: DOWN GOODS LOOP; DOWN WEYMOUTH; DOWN TAUNTON and GOODS SHED.

(http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/4.jpg)
(C)2018 SandTEngineer

I don't know if there are many of these left but a similar route indicator still exists at the northern end of Platform 2 at Worcester Shrub Hill (showing routes to Birmingham or Hereford).

I think the Worcester one is the last surviving one on the NR network.  There are a few scattered around the preserved railway lines.

The one that was at Yeovil Pen Mill is now to be seen at the Yeovil Railway Centre.  The routes were Weymouth and Branch(Taunton)

Having looked at some examples of GWR number plates, the typography of 1s and 7s suggests that must be 6914 - Langton Hall. That's marginally easier to reconcile with the name plate as shown, though half the letters of the name still seem to have fallen off. Otherwise it fits as well, being at Weymouth from 1959.

I agree, it is 6914. Poor Dad, he'll be turning in his grave! I have found another photo of the loco in question - well actually I got the photo researchers at TransWilts to find it for me, but I think this confirms what you say:

(http://www.lostheritage.org.uk/graphics/houses/lh_lincolnshire_langtonhall_fs.jpg)

Image courtesy of Lost Heritage (http://www.lostheritage.org.uk/houses/lh_lincolnshire_langtonhall_info_gallery.html)

Saturday, 8th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

8.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_08.jpg)
8.2 - And in which year?

8.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_08.jpg)

Is 8.1 Thingley Junction?

As to 8.2, that is a WD 2-8-0. 1957?

8.3 Athenry?

It is Thingley Junction - and I believe you're not far out in date.   In those days, it was a double junction and you can see how the train coming up from Trowbridge is having to rise and fall to cross the main line towards Bath, canted and curved at that point.  Putting such a double junction back while maintaining line speed would be hard today, but there is room for a layout such as at Bathampton ... and indeed (as last night's lack of capacity and resultant cancellations showed) a good case for doing something.

Goodness - yes.   Taken this June. Nearest I could get to a 150/1 in Ireland.

And reduced to monochrome so as to remove the clue of its livery?

Strange photograph of a locomotive...….

8.1 Gloucester where the Midland line from Eastgate ran parallel to the GWR line as far as Standish Junction where the GWR had running powers over the Midland line as far as Yate South Junction. The service fotted could be an all stops Midland/BR(M) service to Bristol Temple Meads via Mangotsfield.

Yes

Further reading latest posts I'm miles away but I did get an 'O' level in Geography.

Odd things, Geography "O" levels.   I gave up Geography two years before O level and have been pretty darned lost ever since  ;D

That's cos it's a modified hall, maybe?

Though doing that to what's obviously a recent picture just adds a distinct odour of rat ...

It's amazing how a photograph dropped outside for a few days can yellow and fade

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/oldhenry.jpg)

If we were living in a world designed by Douglas Adams, the telephone number of Langton Hall would be 6914...

Some of us in the moderation team increasingly feel like we do  ;D

Sunday 9th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

9.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_09.jpg)
9.2 - And in which year?

9.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_09.jpg)

9.3  Borth

9.1: Maidenhead arriving off the Marlow branch about 1973

Both correct .. thanks to S&TEngineer for use of the Maidenhead picture. He writes "Photograph taken in 1973.  Maidenhead station looking West. Taken during the 100-year centenary celebrations of the opening of the Marlow branch."

Is thot Borth Spor? Chonged since I wos lost there...

 ;D ;D

The place you're thinking of is Bath Spa - named and pronounce according to the Queen's English.   It's only the toffs of North East Somerset with their Eton and Oxford educations who might mis-pronounce it as they plot for higher office to make themselves even toffier.

It was the signal box that looked familiar so reaching for my Mitchell and Smith's "Slough to Newbury", I found on pl. 33 a photo of the 'box dated December 1972. The signal - Down Bay Starter - had a subsidiary arm and route indicator in 1972.  By the time of S+TE's excellent picture was taken, the route from the bay to the goods yard had been recovered and the signalling simplified to the single arm shown.  The 'box closed 21^st October 1974 hence my 'lucky' stab at 1973.

.........shouldn't that be tawffier ?

9.1 MAIDENHEAD
Yes, taken during the 100-year celebration of the MARLOW BRANCH on 15 July 1973.  It was a very wet day!  More details here: https://www.mmpa.org.uk/gallery/gallery29/index.html

Monday 10th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

10.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_10.jpg)
10.2 - And in which year?

10.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_10.jpg)

10.1 Melksham (the new Taunton in quizes) Not long before closure in 1966

Yes it is ... and look how much has changed!  The lengthening of the platform in the summer took away the last remnants of the old station that we in (re) use - platform surface and edging stones.

Tuesday 11th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

11.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_11.jpg)
11.2 - And in which year?

11.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_11.jpg)

11.1 Newbury

Correct ... and noting freight wagons in a number of these old photos ... how times change

11.3 ECML with East Midland train for Grimsby Town
Newark?

I think 11.3 is Lincoln

Brook Lea is right, I could not decide between the two. However there is an identical shot here.
https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-an-east-midlands-trains-train-waiting-by-the-platform-at-lincoln-railway-54422882.html

It was the LNER signs that confused me but there is one return service a day to London and hence the carriage location signs.

11.3 is indeed Lincoln ... train has just arrived from Newark (where it departed from a very much barer platform) and as I recall terminated at Lincoln. Some of the onward services in Lincolnshire are pretty sparse - down to a Melkshamesque level.

Lincoln Central as I still call it.

Yes, though it is (gulp!) over 30 years since St Marks closed.

Trains to and from Lincoln cannot access the main down platform at Newark Northgate, so one wouldn't see a 153 with the station buildings - which are in any case slightly different in GN style from the Lincoln ones. Newark is much more like High Barnet - which always confuses me when I'm on the upper reaches of the Northern Line.

Wednesday 12th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

12.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_12.jpg)
12.2 - And in which year?

12.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_12.jpg)

12.1 Somewhere on Ivo Peters' beloved SDJR before 1966 - RIP

12.3 - Okehampton

Yesterday's - indeed - Masbury summit on the Somerset and Dorset, and Okehampton

Thursday13th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

13.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_13.jpg)
13.2 - And in which year?

13.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_13.jpg)

13.1  Corris on the Corris Railway

13.3 Freshford?

13.3 reminds me of Bedwyn, and I wonder whether the ‘heritage’ photo for today might actually be the more recent than the ‘modern’ one?

It probably reminds you of Bedwyn because it is Bedwyn  ;D ;D

Both pictures are some 3 to 5 years old ... and I need to look back to see which is older!

I thought that Bedwyn picture might be very much more difficult ... well done indeed for spotting it!

Friday, 14th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

14.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_14.jpg)
14.2 - And in which year?

14.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_14.jpg)

Wow. Really hit me. Stunning image.  Thank you to the donor.

14.3 Southampton Central. I also can have a good guess at 14.1 & 14.2 and I am sure that others will get them easily

14.1 Salisbury?.

It is indeed Southampton Central - the Fawley Forsester last summer showing how there'w a railway line that a passenger train can run on from Southampton to Tottom, Marchwood, Hythe and Fawley.  Probably one of the most strikingly obvious cases for re-introduction of a regular service ...


Sorry, it ain't!

14.1 Cardiff
14.2 1963

14.1 is Taunton shed. I agree that it is an excellent photograph.

I concur. Taunton in 14.1.

The Great Western Hotel (soon to reopen as a hotel) in the background on the other side of Station Road.

What! Shock-Horror! :o Taunton as the answer to a Coffeeshop quiz question.  That's never happened before surely. :D

Saturday, 15th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

15.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_15.jpg)
15.2 - And in which year?

15.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_15.jpg)

15.3 Severn Beach.

I have to say that I was impressed that Graham posted this question at about 3.20 in the morning (can't be entirely sure). The only excuse that I have for replying so quickly is that I am somewhere in the South Pacific, and decided to check my emails before going for dinner!

15.1 Bristol Temple Meads.
15.3 Severn Beach.

Both correct.

I am usually up for a few minutes in the middle of the night as Billy our greyhound needs to be let out to check the garden is still there.   But you are not usually in the South Pacific are you?   Sounds like you might be on a cruise ...

I noticed on a poster about timetable changes at Swindon last night that Severn Beach goes up to hourly on a Sunday from 31st March 2019.  Is this just for the summer, or all year?  Something new, or was it hourly last summer?

I think Oxman should be disqualified for answering the advent question the day before it was asked.  ;D

15.2: April 27th 2012.

Yep, I am on a cruise, but at the moment I am 9.5 hours behind UK time! So I appeal against disqualification!

9.5 Hours because in a few hours we arrive in Nuka Hiva in French Polynesia, which, being French, has to be 30 minutes different!

In a few days time, we shall cross the Date Line, and then I will be ahead of you, and you can disqualify me if you like, but I don't think I shall care too much!!!!

Around 6pm!

17:49 and 30 seconds  ;D ;D

I could be that specific because I was there that day too. It was the day grahame and I won the pub quiz in Bonapartes.

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/irregulars.jpg)

(http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/ocbri.jpg)

Sunday 16th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

16.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_16.jpg)
16.2 - And in which year?

16.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_16.jpg)

16.3 Bridgewater

No, definitely not Bridgewater.

It might be Bridgwater.  :D

The loco 7820 Dinmore Manor in preserved and spent most of its working life allocated to various sheds in the midlands apart from a short stint at Laira.

The picture shows it double heading what looks like a Castle or a King.

At first glance I thought the picture was Taunton with the lift on the current platform 5 and the stairs from the subway behind the staff member portrayed but the perceived distance to the platform ramp is too short for Taunton unless the photo was taken using a telephoto lens.

My guess therefore would be Shrewsbury arriving with an express to Birkenhead.

Definitely not Shrewsbury as that had centre lines between the platforms.  Looks to be a rasonably large station so perhaps Wolverhampton Low Level

I though Wolverhampton LL had centre lines as well.

16.1 Plymouth.

Oh heck I've got muddled ... I had that as old bay platforms at Swindon but I am really doubting that.   Must get back to the other computer and re-research it ... sorry folks.

Certain its the country end of Platform No.7 at Plymouth.  You can see the end of the new panel box to the left of the engine.

Thanks ... I have pictures of Santa spinning in front of my eyes this evening (why (http://www.mrug.org.uk/bandit.html)) and got confused.

I'm certain 16.1 is Plymouth too. The canopy ironwork is still the same today.

(http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/5908637_44f2b45f_zpsvzrkz4k3.jpg)

You're lucky. I am temporarily dyslexic, and have Satan spinning in front of mine. I would go with Bridgwater for 16.3 though - the hoist where the fizzy-bang magic moonbeam fuel leftover flasks are loaded for the long trip north.

Monday, 17th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

17.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_17.jpg)
17.2 - And in which year?

17.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_17.jpg)

17.1 Pontarfynach on the Vale of Rheidol Railway (aka Devils Bridge)

I can see the resemblance, but - sorry - no.

17.1 Portland, it is the incline from a quarry by the Verne down to join the Portland Railway
17.2 1960?

17.3 Basingstoke.

Location write, date way out ... but then this is a scene that's hardly changed


Correct

Not answering (been answered anyway) but I really like that photo.

this was the site in 2016

I've looked back ... 1st September 2012 at 18:24 was when I took it.

What is that weird object on the platform level with the front of the train?

I took it to be a species of refreshment trolley (for use on platforms).

Either that or an unsuccessful prototype Dalek.

Agreed.  I've seen those in other WR photographs of that era (late 1950s/early 1960s).

I can remember seeing platform vending trolleys at Temple Meads selling refreshments through the carriage windows, you know, those little sliding things that have caution notices on them, 'to avoid draughts do not open beyond arrows' and of course the carriage door windows. It was not unusual to see up to four of these trolleys 'servicing' a single train at TM on a Summer Saturday particularly the named trains from/to the north, 'The Cornishman' and 'The Devonian'.

Tuesday 18th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

18.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_18.jpg)
18.2 - And in which year?

18.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_18.jpg)

18.1 Patchway
18.2 This year. (2018)

18.3 I would guess Scotland somewhere being on a single line which was once double tracked rail section of line showing a Scotrail Class 158 unit and not on the Borders Railway cos platform surface too worn.

The vending trolley sold some snacks but also a large range of papers and magazines. The picture was taken on a Sunday afternoon, and the trolley was actually unmanned. The guy behind (military?) just happened to be there looking as if he was the vendor. I too was struck with the similarity between the canopy in the Plymouth photo and that shown - perhaps it was a standard GWR design.
On a Sunday afternoon there was a single through train between Swindon and Weymouth and the empty stock is seen arriving. (by the way, I was only just 13 at the time, and Plymouth was beyond the boundary of where I was allowed to roam unaccompanied).

Correct ... the picture is from within the last few months.


Also correct ... though "Scotland" is a little bit less specific than I was hoping for in the answer  ;D ;D

I should have guessed - I saw that train departing Paddington from my office window!

And you can see ongoing works for the footings for the new footbridge - so maybe October

Well as no one else has had a stab at 18.3 and knowing Grahame visited Wick I wonder if he threw into todays mixture a piccy of Scotlands remotest station.

Is 18.3 Altnabraec ?

Spot on!   I spent several days in Wick ... on one took at trip out to Altnabraec and back, changing trains onto the same train at Georgemas and getting off at Altnabraec, catching the train it passed at Forsinard back into Wick.

Wednesday 19th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

19.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_19.jpg)
19.2 - And in which year?

19.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_19.jpg)

19.3 
Liskeard

19.1 Aberystwyth - Vale of Rheidol Railway

Both correct.

Why does that run round loop at Aberystwyth "fly" so far from the platform line?

19.2 2011?

So people in the train can see it, rather than have it block the view?

And because since it replaced a set of standard gauge lines there was plenty of space. 

Thursday 20th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

20.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_20.jpg)
20.2 - And in which year?

20.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_20.jpg)

20.1 Worcester Shrub Hill

20.3 I would guess you were either going to or returning from one of your many jaunts to foreign exotic cliimes when you took this one Grahame.

Definitely - you can almost see my house.

Year? Before the current foul-up of the signalling. 1968?

20.3 I can only think of it being Gatwick Airport.

20.1 - correct, Worcester Shrub Hill.

20.3 - correct, Gatwick Airport .. but NOT on a frequent trip to exotic foreign climes .. I rarely fly anywhere these days! Guessing without going back through my library that it was on my way back from Aalborg in Denmark which though pleasant enough is not really exotic!!

Bump...

I felt that bump.   Wait - that's 'cos I'm on the bus in Bath.  Will check when I get home.

23rd My 2012 ... 11:20 in the morning!

Tsk!

It was the platform number that gave it away for me, or to be more precise, the yellow number on a black background.

Friday 21st December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

21.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_21.jpg)
21.2 - And in which year?

21.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_21.jpg)

21.1 is Calne with the DMU just departing towards Chippenham.

21.3 Standing alongside a Cross Country Voyager  ;D

Yes it is and , my goodness that was quick.

Calne was at the end of a branch from Chippenham. What has struck me as I've looked at it over the years is just how quickly it appears to have gone from a pretty significant freight operation and good passenger timetable (but I don't know how busy the trains were) to closure.   Different times - but perhaps a warning if we end up in other different times - of how fast things can turn around.

Others here may well have fuller information and knowledge of the Calne branch and other Wiltshire lines which closed around 50 years ago.

Calne was a casualty of Beeching.

Adrian Vaughan in his 'Signalling Reflections' covers the Calne branch in quite some detail. The biggest freight customer was Harris's Pork Pies who shipped all of their products by rail until a prolonged and damaging rail strike in the late 1950s - you can see their vans in the goods yard. This saw a transfer to road haulage to the detriment of rail.  There were also two large RAF stations served by Calne which subsequently closed chopping a lot of the passenger traffic.

OK. I'll be more precise.

21.3 Standing alongside a Cross Country Voyager at a station with at least one derelict platform face on a curve and its not Taunton cos that stations unused platform face is straight  ;)

You are correct as far as you go but I would like you to go as far as mentioning specific station. Clearly, your description eliminates stations all the way from Sugar Loaf to Waterloo from Exeter St. Thomas to Dingwall, but still leaves plenty of choice.

I well remember motoring to and from home and Slough before the M4 days when I was on a sandwich course at Slough College sponsored by ICI Paints Division in the town passing RAF Yatesbury on the A4 which was a Radio / Radar Training Establishment.

Yes, Harris's, famous for their pork pies but also for their sausages and bacon. When Marks and Spencers moved into the food business almost all off their offerings were marketed under the St. Micheal brand. Harris's products were some of the finest products available in the field and so much wanted by M & S to be on their shelves but Harris's would only allow this on the condition that they (Harris's) could be accredited on the packaging with wording such as 'Produced and Packed for Marks and Spencers by Harris's of Calne'/

But I am abiding by the rules as I have already correctly guessed a couple including Altnabraec when all seemed lost. In todays case I honestly haven't a clue at the moment but I'll eliminate another station that XC serves with a derelict platform. Newton Abbot but that stations derelict platform face is straight too and at the wrong end of the piccy.  :)

It is worth remembering that Cross Country have been serving some stations they wouldn't normally serve during recent engineering work diversions. But I have no idea if that is applicable in this case.

20.2 As nobody has guessed correctly I will.  1970.  I know that coz I was there (its my photograph) ;D

21.3 Hazarding a guess with Newquay

Correct

Saturday, 22nd December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

22.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_22.jpg)
21.2 - And in which year?

22.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_22.jpg)
22.4 Care to guess when it was taken?

22.2 Herras fencing and shipping container in the background suggests very recently

22.1-2 Porthmadoc 2016

Portmadoc or Porthmadog, yes.  Not far out in the year, but I note my camera's geo location was turned off so I have nothing showing up when I look for picture in the Portmadoc area ... 2016 sound close, though.

I have a photo somewhere - still looking - of Lyd steaming through Minffordd station around that time. Was very surprised to discover a L&B engine when I was expecting a Fairlie !

22.3 Kyle of Lochalsh

22.4 Summer 2018?

Correct indeed.   A couple of further pictures ...

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_22a.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_22b.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_22c.jpg)

Crikey, they can't even get our bus stop indicators to tell you correctly what the next bus is 30 seconds before its due..... :P

Looks like a good service until your realise that's all the buses that leave for the next five hours!

Yes, but I expect all those remote places need/justify only one service a day.....

Sunday 23rd December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

23.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_23.jpg)
23.2 - And in which year?

23.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_23.jpg)

23.3 Looe

I have ... noted, I think it may have been on another thread, commend about how darned early on the day these advent quizzes have been posted, and how that's lead to the lark picking up the worms before the owls are even awake.  Noted, but for the one last day I've decided not to break the pattern.     Rumour has it that tomorrow is a specialty of some sort - and one where people don't even catch trains - so we'll see what if anything that brings and at what time of day ...

Monday 24th December 2018 - the Coffee Shop Advent Quiz.

24.1 - Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmq18_24.jpg)
24.2 - And in which year?

24.3 Where was this picture taken?
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_24.jpg)
24.4 Care to guess when it was taken?

First time I have ever been referred to as a lark!

Where I am right now, I would definitely be the night owl.

Anyway, I have a hunch about 24.1, but will leave it for when the British owls wake up.

Goodnight! 

G'night ... enjoy the South Pacific!

24.1  I got a hunch the place begins with 'I'.

IBM?  Inverness?

I agree I think it begins with and 'I' as well

Neither

Inverkeithing? Ilford?


Niver Iver   ;D

Surely you're meaning either Imperial Wharf or Ingatestone .... ;D

Not them as well.

24.1 Ilfracombe

Nobody has tried 23.1 yet. Is it somewhere in the Northern Heights?

Yes, it is.


I don't think so ... I need to scroll back to remind myself, but I don't think "northern" could be much wronger ...

Well I did give you a clue with the I-spy beginning with I.

:)

Wherever it is, thanks for doing the quiz. I - and I am sure many others - have enjoyed it greatly.

23.1 Montpelier, Bristol.

Ilfracombe ... is one of the closures in the few years up to about 1975 that I feel least comfortable with, together with the lines through from Yeoford to Bere Alston, from Oxford via Milton Keynes and Bedford to Cambridge, and from Taunton to Minehead.  Having visited Barnstaple for a railway conference a couple of years back, the massive amount of work needed to get it back even from Barnstaple Junction to Barnstaple Town probably makes it one of those least likely to be put back.

...and the seegar goes to that man!

A number of the later closures (Penrith-Keswick is another that comes to mind) were perfectly viable services that were axed for no other reason than that it was possible to 'replace' them with a bus service - something ontologists would refer to as a 'category error'.

It has been a real pleasure putting these pictures together.  There are around 10 sources which I will correlate; many thanks to them all - an especial mention to SandTEngineer for quantity and variety of historic pictures.  Every single one of those pictures really appreciated by me ... been great fun for me too.   I've been delighted at some of the conversations stimulated, and I'm looking forward to taking so many more pictures next year!

Linking to another thread, I hope 1X01 brings you what  you're looking for tonight, and I share with you some more details of that train, courtesy of Chiltern Railways

The heights of North Bristol... :)

By the way, Grahame - I do not recall ever have seen an answer to 10.3. My immediate thoughts were on the S&C. If the answer hasn't been disclosed can you let us know, please?

Loved the quiz. Thankyou

Many thanks for yet another excellent quiz Grahame.

With reference to 24.1, I will always remember the station announcer at Exeter St Davids and his pronunciation of Ilfracombe. This probably doesn't convey it that well but it was phonetically...........

Ill-fra-com-bee   

spoken very quickly, but with most emphasis on the final syllable (as in the honey variety)

1.1 Westbury; 1.3 Chippenham; 2.1 Kirkby Stephen West; 2.3 Pilning; 3.1 New Passage Halt; 3.3 Salisbury; 4.1 Gomshall; 4.3 Oldfield Park; 5.1 Holt; 5.3 Exeter St Thomas; 6.1 Eggesford; 6.3 Hayle; 7.1 Castle Cary; 7.3 Ashchurch; 8.1 Thingley Junction; 8.3 Athenry; 9.1 Maidenhead; 9.3 Borth; 10.1 Melksham; 10.3 STILL TO BE GUESSED; 11.1 Newbury; 11.3 Lincoln; 12.1 Masbury; 12.3 Okehampton; 13.1 Corris; 13.3 Bedwyn; 14.1 Taunton; 14.3 Southampton Central; 15.1 Bristol Temple Meads; 15.3 Severn Beach; 16.1 Plymouth; 16.3 Bridgwater; 17.1 Portland; 17.3 Basingstoke; 18.1 Patchway; 18.3 Altnabraec; 19.1 Aberystwyth; 19.3 Liskeard; 20.1 Worcester Foregate Street; 20.3 Gatwick Airport; 21.1 Calne; 21.3 Newquay; 22.1 Porthmadog; 22.3 Kyle of Lochalsh; 23.1 Montpelier; 23.3 Looe; 24.1 Ilfracombe; 24.3 STILL TO BE GUESSED.



Two to go and a Christmas Eve bonus for the owls ... coming home for Christmas


Santa has the answers on a slip of paper in his bag, and will be leaving that slip at Melksham with me just before he heads off to Tonfanau.  I will add them when the children dogs wake us if no-one has before.

10.3
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_10.jpg)

24.3
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmr18_24.jpg)

25.1
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xms18_25.jpg)

25.3
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/xmt18_25.jpg)

25.3 is Taunton, I mean Melksham

So is 25.1!

25.1 Is that 92220 Evening Star? If so it's between 1960 and 1965.

That would fit with the date I was thinking of (not that it was actually asked for) - 1963, on the grounds that a high proportion of the days with snow lying from the date in the 50s when some of the track around the goods shed was lifted to 1966 were in 1963.

mmm.  Think that might just be over-exposure (of the print that is)..... :P

17th October 1964 according to my source - so, yes, over-exposure.  Overall picture quality is not great (!) though the content is fascinating

Snow was recorded in October 1964,  if  the 18th was the perhaps the 8th or 28th, looking at the sheds in the background quite possibly IS snow.

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/binaries/content/assets/mohippo/pdf/j/k/oct1964.pdf

Is it me, or have the nameplates already been plundered? They should be on the smoke deflector, shouldn't they?

10.3 is Llandrindod

24.3 is Leeds

Billy and Gypsy both wanted to check the garden ... is it really morning already?    Happy Christmas everyone!

Looking at those "before and after" shots of Melksham, those single-storey buildings on the right of the 9F have survived - albeit looking in need of some TLC. Also in the far distance two of the industrial buildings appear still to be there beyond the housing.

What was the industry?

From the Wiltshire Times (https://www.wiltshiretimes.co.uk/news/745707.then-now-spencers-gate-melksham/) - a 2006 archive


I recall walking around the old docks in Dublin and seeing a lift bridge with a maker's plate "Spencers, Melksham" ...

A picture from the archive and a map from the second world war.   My wife has become something of an expert on Spencer's having catalogues much of their archive for the Swindon and Wiltshire history centre ...

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/spencerkit.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/spencermap.jpg)

Wow! Thanks for posting, Graham.