Great Western Coffee Shop

Sideshoots - associated subjects => Railway and Related History => Topic started by: WSW Frome on January 12, 2021, 04:48:26 pm



Title: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: WSW Frome on January 12, 2021, 04:48:26 pm
Instead of a quiz I would like to test the memories of the grey-hair brigade. Now more appropriate to post this in the ?History? section since it is just that.

I have been reminiscing recently on my then adventurous trips from Weymouth to ride on the Somerset and Dorset on the last two operational Saturday afternoon/evenings in February/March 1966. I do remember quite a lot about those trips, and I do have some (dubious quality) photos when I can locate them. I also have timetables from those years (kept because of the major changes) to identify the services used.

I recall very little about the Yeovil to Templecombe (and return) journeys which I used to access the S & D for both North and South journeys. I believe the two services involved were as below and that the rationalised timetable was not yet in force:
14.20 Exeter SD to Waterloo
19.55 Salisbury to Yeovil Town

So the queries are:
1.   Were all/most Salisbury ? Exeter services diesel hauled at this time? (I guess yes, probably with Warship haulage.)
2.   Were the local/shorter distance services diesel (or steam) loco hauled or were dmu?s ever employed at this time?
3.   For through services to Yeovil Town were these still operated at this time, or a connecting service provided instead?
4.   In general, for through services to Yeovil Town, was an additional loco provided for the reversal, or did the train engine run round at Yeovil Junction?

It will be interesting to see if anyone can remember these sorts of details after just 54 years!


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: PhilWakely on January 12, 2021, 04:57:17 pm
Instead of a quiz I would like to test the memories of the grey-hair brigade. Now more appropriate to post this in the ?History? section since it is just that.

I have been reminiscing recently on my then adventurous trips from Weymouth to ride on the Somerset and Dorset on the last two operational Saturday afternoon/evenings in February/March 1966. I do remember quite a lot about those trips, and I do have some (dubious quality) photos when I can locate them. I also have timetables from those years (kept because of the major changes) to identify the services used.

I recall very little about the Yeovil to Templecombe (and return) journeys which I used to access the S & D for both North and South journeys. I believe the two services involved were as below and that the rationalised timetable was not yet in force:
14.20 Exeter SD to Waterloo
19.55 Salisbury to Yeovil Town

So the queries are:
1.   Were all/most Salisbury ? Exeter services diesel hauled at this time? (I guess yes, probably with Warship haulage.)
2.   Were the local/shorter distance services diesel (or steam) loco hauled or were dmu?s ever employed at this time?
3.   For through services to Yeovil Town were these still operated at this time, or a connecting service provided instead?
4.   In general, for through services to Yeovil Town, was an additional loco provided for the reversal, or did the train engine run round at Yeovil Junction?

It will be interesting to see if anyone can remember these sorts of details after just 54 years!


1. IIRC Warships were in charge of Waterloo to Exeter services by 1966. There were a few steam hauled, but I think these were all railtours.
2. I recall several school trips from Pinhoe to Exeter, Seaton Junction and Axminster in early 1966 and these were all DMU hauled. Not sure about the 'other end of the Mule'.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: rogerw on January 12, 2021, 05:14:04 pm
All steam was banned from the Western Region from 1 January 1966 although the S&D remained steam worked until the end. As everything west of Salisbury was WR diesels reigned supreme. Waterloo to Exeter services were loco hauled by warships. All other services were DMUs.  Local services did not last long and the line was singled summer 1967.  I think that there may have still been some steam workings east of Salisbury until the end of Southern steam in July 1967.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: grahame on January 12, 2021, 09:40:25 pm
For March 1967 to May 1968 ...

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/1968_wr_t2.jpg)

I can recall catching the Brighton to Exeter service at around about that time - class 33 (Type 3 Compton Diesel) with a rake of Mk1 coaches.   Soon thereafter, it was reduced to a Saturday only service, and was operated by a Hastings diesel unit from St Leonards depot, which had a number of Monday to Friday only diagrams.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: RichardB on January 13, 2021, 12:05:44 pm
Interesting to see the commuter service from Yeovil Pen Mill to Exeter and back in the 67-68 timetable.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 13, 2021, 12:24:43 pm
For March 1967 to May 1968 ...

Another example of how awful the frequency of services used to be.  Mind you, it was the good old days with decent catering on nearly every train, and plenty of scope for those wanting to arrive Salisbury at just gone 3am.  ;)


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: bradshaw on January 13, 2021, 02:57:23 pm
I was living in Crewkerne at this time, before going to college. A survey at Yeovil Junction on 29th August 1964 revealed 116 train journeys seen of which 110 were steam. The others were 4 diesel locomotives, Warships on Waterloo -Exeter services and 2 DMUs on Yeovil-Exeter services. The Yeovil Town branch service was run by 6430. There were still brought services to Ilfracombe, Padstow, Torrington as well as the Brighton Plymouth.


In September I had moved to do a college course at Paisley, Scotland returning at Christmas

Forwarding to Christmas Eve 1964 at Salisbury the Waterloo-Exeters were all Warships, occasionally changing to steam thence to Waterloo. The Exeter/Yeovil - Salisburys were DMU.
The Cardiff - Portsmouths were Hymek to Salisbury and steam to Portsmouth.
The Brighton Plymouth was West Country to Salisbury then Hymek
The Waterloo Salisbury were steam.

I think that the change to diesel working on the Waterloo/Exeter service happened at the start of the winter timetable.

Meanwhile, in Scotland I was able to experience the runs of the A4s on the Glasgow Aberdeen service!


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: Clan Line on January 13, 2021, 06:37:27 pm
...... plenty of scope for those wanting to arrive Salisbury at just gone 3am.  ;)

....or like me, wanting to depart Salisbury (along with half the RN) at "just gone 3am !!"

My distinct recollections were that in the early part of '67 the 3am train was most definitely steam hauled (usually a VERY dirty W/C) and kept good time - Keyham at sometime after 7am..
Later in the year the "return" service (1818 ex ESD ??) was diesel hauled, but with the line having being singled, the time keeping, which prior to that wasn't bad, became absolutely appalling.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: broadgage on January 13, 2021, 07:54:46 pm
For March 1967 to May 1968 ...

Another example of how awful the frequency of services used to be.  Mind you, it was the good old days with decent catering on nearly every train, and plenty of scope for those wanting to arrive Salisbury at just gone 3am.  ;)

Restaurants on several trains a day, and buffets on many.
Restaurants removed many years ago.
Buffets survived until the downgrade from loco hauled to 3 car DMU operation.
Then a rather half hearted trolley service, which survived until recently.
No now catering whatsoever.
50 years of progress.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: eightonedee on January 13, 2021, 07:59:12 pm
Quote
(usually a VERY dirty W/C)

Sadly, I think from what I recall as an 11 year old train spotter, there were no other liveries, and you had to refer to your Ian Allen to find out what its name was. (I can still recall that Sir Eustace Missenden and Bere Alston were the last two I saw in "real" service, both on the Pines Express into Reading, neither carrying a nameplate)


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: Jamsdad on January 13, 2021, 08:36:15 pm
Fond memories from that time of the restaurant car service. I can still remember gammon and pineapple for  lunch going up  the incline to Honiton en route to Salisbury!


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: PhilWakely on January 13, 2021, 08:51:14 pm
Quote
(usually a VERY dirty W/C)

Sadly, I don't think from what I recall as an 11 year old train spotter, there were no other liveries, and you had to refer to your Ian Allen to find out what its name was. (I can still recall that Sir Eustace Missenden and Bere Alston were the last two I saw in "real" service, both on the Pines Express into Reading, neither carrying a nameplate)

The last WC I saw in active service (i.e not on railtour duties) was 34108 'Wincanton'. I couldn't say precisely when, except that it was running tender-first through a closed Pinhoe station towards Salisbury. It was bereft of nameplate and very filthy. I can recall this as if it were yesterday, but google is making me doubt the memory as I have seen pictures of an immaculate 'Wincanton', complete with nameplate, at Weymouth at the head of one of the 'Farewell to Southern Steam' specials in June '67.

My Facebook cover photo shows a 7-year-old me with my mum and sister at Pinhoe station, admiring unrebuilt BB 34080 on an all-stations, Exeter Central to Yeovil Town (so I am led to believe) service in the Spring of '64. A picture I did not know existed until the middle of last year.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: REVUpminster on January 13, 2021, 10:15:43 pm
In the loft I have a Graham Farish N gauge Class 158 Alpha train.
I think this ran from Paignton and went via Salisbury  to somewhere along the south coast. I wonder if it was a later extension of the Exeter-Brighton service?


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: grahame on January 14, 2021, 08:39:46 am
In the loft I have a Graham Farish N gauge Class 158 Alpha train.
I think this ran from Paignton and went via Salisbury  to somewhere along the south coast. I wonder if it was a later extension of the Exeter-Brighton service?

Alpha Line was primarily the replacement of the irregular loco plus coaches services on the Wales and West network with hourly DMU trains designed for their regional (as opposed to local or suburban) use.   The main service was Portsmouth - Cardiff and (I need to check) Cardiff via Hereford, Shrewsbury and Crewe to Manchester.    Class 158 trains; perhaps a different thread for the rise of Alphaline and what has happened from then on?

In competition with GWR and Wales and West, South West Trains ran some Waterloo - Salisbury - Exeter trains on to Paington, Plymouth and Penzance.   Those were not Alpha Line branded though they were class 158/159 operated, and I'm not aware of (but there may well have been) and through services from south east of Salisbury (i.e. via Southampton) to south west of Exeter (i.e. via Newton Abbot)


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: rogerw on January 14, 2021, 08:56:56 am
There was, for a time, a Portsmouth to Penzance service operated by a class 158. Not sure if was introduced by Wales and West or Wessex. It ran via Westbury and Taunton.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: REVUpminster on January 14, 2021, 11:27:08 pm
In the loft I have a Graham Farish N gauge Class 158 Alpha train.
I think this ran from Paignton and went via Salisbury  to somewhere along the south coast. I wonder if it was a later extension of the Exeter-Brighton service?

Alpha Line was primarily the replacement of the irregular loco plus coaches services on the Wales and West network with hourly DMU trains designed for their regional (as opposed to local or suburban) use.   The main service was Portsmouth - Cardiff and (I need to check) Cardiff via Hereford, Shrewsbury and Crewe to Manchester.    Class 158 trains; perhaps a different thread for the rise of Alphaline and what has happened from then on?

In competition with GWR and Wales and West, South West Trains ran some Waterloo - Salisbury - Exeter trains on to Paington, Plymouth and Penzance.   Those were not Alpha Line branded though they were class 158/159 operated, and I'm not aware of (but there may well have been) and through services from south east of Salisbury (i.e. via Southampton) to south west of Exeter (i.e. via Newton Abbot)

I certainly travelled on the Waterloo to Plymouth/Paignton. A 159 of nine coaches (3 units) left Waterloo, dropped three coaches at Salisbury, split at Exeter St David's with three coaches going to Plymouth and Paignton respectively. One Saturday because of engineering works the train was diverted via Southampton and was so late it terminated at Newton Abbot.


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: Clan Line on January 15, 2021, 10:12:13 am
One other recollection of using this route. It was long before the advent of Railcards, but there was a special "port to port" ticket between Portsmouth & Plymouth for military personnel................... if I remember correctly it cost 2 guineas !


Title: Re: Salisbury ? Exeter Services in Early 1966
Post by: Jamsdad on January 15, 2021, 11:23:04 am
Yes I remember that . I think it was Wessex.



This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net