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All across the Great Western territory => Active travel: Cyclists and walkers, including how the railways deal with them => Topic started by: grahame on September 14, 2021, 07:01:23 am



Title: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: grahame on September 14, 2021, 07:01:23 am
From The Argus (https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/19577663.train-disruption-cyclists-attending-london-brighton/)

Quote
Restrictions will be in place on train services ahead of the London to Brighton Bike Ride, Southern Rail has said.

In a statement on Twitter, the rail company confirmed that bicycles will not be permitted on Southern or Thameslink trains from the start of service on Sunday (September 19) until midday.

However, restrictions will remain in place between Gatwick Airport and Brighton for the duration of the day.

Passengers were also warned that those travelling with bikes on Saturday (September 18) and Monday (September 20) may face delays, as train services can only hold a certain number of bicycles.

Both Thameslink and Southern advised customers to check their cycle policies ahead of travelling.



Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: TaplowGreen on September 14, 2021, 07:29:51 am
From The Argus (https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/19577663.train-disruption-cyclists-attending-london-brighton/)

Quote
Restrictions will be in place on train services ahead of the London to Brighton Bike Ride, Southern Rail has said.

In a statement on Twitter, the rail company confirmed that bicycles will not be permitted on Southern or Thameslink trains from the start of service on Sunday (September 19) until midday.

However, restrictions will remain in place between Gatwick Airport and Brighton for the duration of the day.

Passengers were also warned that those travelling with bikes on Saturday (September 18) and Monday (September 20) may face delays, as train services can only hold a certain number of bicycles.

Both Thameslink and Southern advised customers to check their cycle policies ahead of travelling.


Beyond parody - rather like extra trains for Boardmasters - no surfboards allowed!  ::)


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: grahame on September 14, 2021, 08:12:24 am
Beyond parody - rather like extra trains for Boardmasters - no surfboards allowed!  ::)

Hear, hear!

I am headed for the Great Global Greyhound Walk (https://www.facebook.com/groups/324040254294277) on Sunday.  The event I am attending is near Chippenham Station.  Will I be allowed to take them by train, or would I be wise to drive?

We could also try ...
... no heavy luggage to Southampton Central on days that cruises start
... no travel from England to Cardiff on days that Wales are playing England at the Millennium Stadium
... no anoraks to be warn to Warminster on Imber Bus day


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: ChrisB on September 14, 2021, 10:24:46 am
I’m sure suitable rolling stock, deisel hauled, could be available should the organisers wish to organise it….and charge to cover the cost.

It’s unrealistic to design passenger rolling stock in order to cope with the demand on one weekend a year.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: broadgage on September 14, 2021, 01:40:29 pm
Back in the good old days, a newspaper van or similar vehicle would have been added to the train, with space for DOZENS of cycles, or luggage for connecting with cruise ships.

In the case of an EMU, adding an extra and non powered vehicle to the train presumably reduced performance but I do not recall this being significant. And going further back, there existed "motor luggage vans"  a powered vehicle for adding to DC EMUS these increased performance as the extra power was more than in proportion to the extra weight.

There was even a battery version, that could haul the WHOLE TRAIN very slowly and for a limited distance in docks and similar places were conductor rail was not installed.

Cant expect that sort of thing these days though.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: grahame on September 14, 2021, 01:53:57 pm
Cant expect that sort of thing these days though.

No, but I suspect that a 710/2 or 710/3 could carry a lot more cycles than the normal 2 or 3 of most trains, and would enjoy a trip to the seaside of its normal rather boring suburban beat at the weekend when its commuter line was less that crowded.  Might even be available on Friday afternoon, as that's now more POETS day than even.

Of course, this sort of thing was pretty awkward with competing franchises, but what's stopping this sort of co-operation between lines and operators now that it's pretty much down to management contracts  ;D .


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: ChrisB on September 14, 2021, 02:31:21 pm
But you need to be avle to carry *all* or nothing….managing say, 75%, isn’t any use to the owners of the remaining 25%!

They used to use the loco-hauled newspaper trains/mail trains, then the guards vans during the Red Star parcel days. Nowadays, there would be a stack of HSE rules that require that many cycles to all be secured, and likely away from passengers too. Not enough tip-up seating, and for obe weekend a year, why should passengers have to use tip-up seating that is usually the most uncomfortable seating there is?

No, the organisers need to put in place some suitable diesel hauled stock with volunteers at either end to load/unload & recnnect cycle with owners. Doable, but would need a lot of organising & plenty of volunteers.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: broadgage on September 14, 2021, 02:44:07 pm
Or we need some proper trains with generous luggage space, to be deployed as needed for events like
Boardmasters.
Glastonbury.
Connecting with cruise ships.
Cycling events.
Beginnings/ends of university terms.

Probably loco hauled.

A fleet of perhaps a dozen trains for use when ever needed, a lot more than one weekend a year. Also a handy reserve for exceptional passenger flows even without unusual volumes of luggage.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: ChrisB on September 14, 2021, 02:57:31 pm
I’m sure that stick probably already exists amongst the charter/heritage organisations already.

Just needs some organisation by those likely to require it.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 14, 2021, 04:16:33 pm
Managing 75% is still good if you have an effective reservation system. You're only left with a quarter who have to make other arrangements, and not everyone will want to take a train back anyway


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: ChrisB on September 14, 2021, 04:24:26 pm
Indeed, but the organisers, not the rail industry, needs to organise it and hire it!


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 14, 2021, 05:02:23 pm
In practice, that often does happen with similar events (I don't know about this one specifically). But it's buses and trailers they hire, not trains.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: ChrisB on September 14, 2021, 06:22:55 pm
Yep, they’re cheaper.

But this ride has always left it to the rail industry to cope and need calling out on it.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: TaplowGreen on September 14, 2021, 08:36:08 pm
Yep, they’re cheaper.

But this ride has always left it to the rail industry to cope and need calling out on it.

Chris.....go on.....you know you want to....it's on the tip of your tongue......."Ooooooooos gonna pay for it?"  ;)


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: froome on September 14, 2021, 09:39:50 pm
The last time I rode the London to Brighton ride, probably more than 35 years ago now, I took a week off work and spent 2 days cycling to London from Bristol, did the ride and then spent 2 days riding back from Brighton. A lovely week.

I had ridden it a couple of times before that and think on those occasions there were buses arranged from Brighton back to London to take the bikes, with the riders taking the train and getting their bikes back in London.

I stopped doing the ride because I didn't enjoy having such large numbers of people riding very close, to the point that it felt pretty dangerous, and did see a few accidents were one bike clipped the wheel of another.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: Surrey 455 on September 15, 2021, 12:21:05 am
I have been to Brighton on one or two occasions when the bike ride took place although I did not know about it until I got there. I remember seeing lots of vans on Madeira Drive being packed with bikes for the journey back.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: CyclingSid on September 15, 2021, 06:50:14 am
Quote
In a statement on Twitter, the rail company confirmed that bicycles will not be permitted on Southern or Thameslink trains from the start of service on Sunday (September 19) until midday.
Nothing new, has been the situation for many years. The event has obviously survived despite the inconvenience.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: broadgage on September 15, 2021, 08:30:04 am
Indeed, but the organisers, not the rail industry, needs to organise it and hire it!

Not sure about that, is it really the job of event organisers to to arrange for RAILWAY rolling stock provision ?

Are organisers of events at the proposed Bristol arena expected to hire trains for events ?
Are the FA expected to hire trains for cup finals ?
Or the West country tourist trade to "organise and hire" trains for their customers.

IMHO, it is up to "the railway" to provide within reason for the needs of their fare payers, this includes both regular commuters and leisure travel including special events.
I know that the mantra is "there is no spare rolling stock, and we cant justify buying or leasing extra stock for once a year events"

Once a year events are in total numerous enough that extra rolling stock IS JUSTIFIED not for any one event, but in total.
Easter weekend, the pre Christmas and post Christmas rush, other bank holidays, airshows, cup finals, rugby internationals, boardmasters, Glastonbury, Reading festival, beginnings and ends of university terms, connecting with cruise ships, and other  events, if considered in total DO justify a reserve of rolling stock.
Loco hauled, and of generous length Perhaps 2 first class and 8 standard class coaches as the standard MINIMUM formation, with a small number of luggage vans, catering vehicles, or extra seated coaches that may be added according to the nature of the event.


Title: Re: London to Brighton Bike Ride, and not using the train to get your bike there
Post by: paul7755 on September 15, 2021, 03:08:52 pm
How come this story gets re-run every year?  8) Typically there’s 15,000 bikes involved. Back when they brought out the grottiest Mk 1 rolling stock with the seat cushions removed, there was nothing like the present day numbers.

Expecting the railway to deal with the modern London to Brighton numbers is ridiculous IMHO, and the event organisers have been fully aware of this for donkey’s years…

Paul



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