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All across the Great Western territory => Across the West => Topic started by: plymothian on June 07, 2022, 05:38:03 pm



Title: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on June 07, 2022, 05:38:03 pm
All RMT members at GWR have been instructed not to book on for any shifts that commence between:

 

•              0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Tuesday 21st  June 2022

•              0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Thursday 23rd  June 2022

•              0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Saturday 25th  June 2022


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 07, 2022, 05:52:53 pm
Bang goes Glastonbury!

On the RMT website (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/members-updates/defend-jobs-pay-and-conditions--great-western-railway070622/?preview=true)

Quote
Our Ref: BR2/10/1

7th June 2022

RMT CALLS STRIKE ACTION

Dear Colleague,

DEFEND JOBS, PAY AND CONDITIONS – GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY

Firstly, I would like to congratulate you and your colleagues for achieving this monumental vote for industrial action, which has sent a clear message to the company that we demand job security, a decent and substantial pay reward and for our terms and conditions to be protected.

During the global pandemic the rail industry were keen to promote you and your colleagues as key workers. To use your hard work in their propaganda, and their praise of a continued service, despite the horrific situation that not only the country, but the whole world was experiencing.

You and your colleagues continued to work during the pandemic, ensuring the railways moved to allow key workers, such as yourself to continue working. During this period the railway has continued to make substantial profits, despite the rail industry being at an all time low for passenger numbers and ticket sales. However, now that it is time to reward the people who kept the railway moving and kept the profits coming in for Great Western Railway, management have gone silent and the company no longer has any money to guarantee your jobs security or reward your hard work with a substantial pay increase.

In my previous correspondence I outlined that I would be raising the issue at an industrywide level. I have since been in discussions with the Rail Industry Recovery Group with the aim of creating a framework and structure for negotiations and discussions on all the issues at the heart of this dispute.

However, during these discussions no firm commitments have been obtained from Network Rail or any Train Operating Company on Job Security, nor has any pay proposal been put forward by any company. During discussions on this issue all the companies have indicated that they wish to pursue their full agenda of “workforce reform” and cuts through a transition process.

Considering the lack of tangible progress through these discussions the Union’s National Executive Committee has considered this matter further. The NEC believe that Great Western Railway are not taking the situation seriously and that we must now take industrial action. The NEC has decided to instruct all members of all grades, in all locations, to take 3 periods of 24-hour strike action.

Therefore, ALL Great Western Railway members are instructed to not to book on for any shifts that commence between:

0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Tuesday 21st June 2022
0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Thursday 23rd June 2022
0001 Hours and 2359 Hours on Saturday 25th June 2022

I urge you all to stand shoulder to shoulder during the days of industrial action. All members, branches, regions, representatives, and officers are instructed to continue to make active preparations for the industrial action set out and to prepare for effective picketing regimes during this phase of action. Further information will be distributed to members on picketing locations and members should speak with their local representatives or branches.

The company has been advised that, as always, the Union is readily available for meaningful negotiations with the employer on this issue and we urge the company to make tangible and definite proposals at the earliest opportunity.

You and your colleagues deserve better and now we must take a stand to demand better.

HARD WORK DESERVES FAIR PAY
SUPPORT THE ACTION
UNITY IS STRENGTH

Yours sincerely

Michael Lynch
General Secretary


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 07, 2022, 06:31:41 pm
Bang goes even more public sympathy (to be fair, there was very little to lose)



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on June 07, 2022, 06:44:51 pm
Same dates announced for all TOCs in dispute and Network Rail.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 07, 2022, 07:21:36 pm
I don’t think the government have any intention of resolving this dispute and are prepared to let them strike hurting both the rail industry and it’s workers and in the end the cuts will still go through.

The fact that the a great proportion of the workforce are now geared to WFH following Covid means strike action is less effective than it was a few years ago.

I also suspect that the RMT took a look at the events calendar to see what events could be disrupted by strike action.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: nickswift99 on June 07, 2022, 07:52:35 pm
Are you suggesting that Royal Ascot and Henley Regatta were deliberately avoided?  ;)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 07, 2022, 08:51:52 pm
Are you suggesting that Royal Ascot and Henley Regatta were deliberately avoided?  ;)

RMT leadership have likely all got tickets and hospitality arranged for Ascot & Henley, so wouldn't want to risk missing them!

(The dates of Wimbledon have probably been avoided for the same reason!)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on June 07, 2022, 10:01:01 pm
I don’t think the government have any intention of resolving this dispute and are prepared to let them strike hurting both the rail industry and it’s workers and in the end the cuts will still go through.

Johnson needs something to make him popular again.  Crushing the left wing militant rail unions will do just that.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 09, 2022, 01:21:07 pm
From Mark Hopwood at GWR and Mike Gallop at Network Rail

Quote
You may have seen that the RMT (Rail, Maritime and Transport Trade Union) have today announced that they have asked members to take strike action on Tuesday 21 June, Thursday 23 June and Saturday 25 June.   The dates are the same across all Train Operators providing services for the Department for Transport (DfT) and Network Rail, and they coincide with strikes on the London Underground (21 June) as well as Glastonbury Festival in the South West between Wednesday 22 June and Sunday 26 June.
 
We thought it might be helpful to share with you both the Rail Delivery Group release  https://media.raildeliverygroup.com/news/rmt-urged-to-call-off-strikes-and-stay-at-the-table
and Network Rail’s national release with comments from Andrew Haines, Network Rail Chief Executive https://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/talks-continue-in-rail-dispute
 
We are now working on the impacts and GWR will issue a further update next week with more details about train services.   We anticipate most rail services will be affected and we will be advising customers to consider their plans and to check before they travel. Any train services that we do operate are likely to be extremely busy.  Anything you can do to help spread that message would be much appreciated. 
 
While strike days have been announced we are committed to keep talking with Trades Union colleagues to work together for a sustainable railway for our future. We’re doing everything we can to avoid strike action on the railway. There are a few weeks until the first strike is planned. We will use this time to keep talking to our unions and, through compromise and common sense on both sides, we hope to find a solution and avoid the damage that strike action would cause all involved.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 09, 2022, 02:16:06 pm
ASLEF have accepted 5% from Scotrail (They're going to put it to their members this time)

BBC News - ScotRail agrees 5% pay deal with train drivers union
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-61737750

From the Union

"The offer on pay has been increased to 5% and we have received improved offers on pay for rest day working, Sunday working allowances, driving instructor allowances, maternity pay and an extension of no compulsory redundancies to five years. There has also been an improved proposal around the non consolidated revenue scheme.”

“The Joint Working Party will also be looking at Sundays being part of the working week subject to negotiations by December 2027 as per the Aslef charter.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: NickB on June 09, 2022, 02:41:50 pm
Will tfl services (Crossrail) be impacted by the strike in the latter part of the week or should those services be running after the 21st?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 09, 2022, 02:50:38 pm
Will tfl services (Crossrail) be impacted by the strike in the latter part of the week or should those services be running after the 21st?

They should be - but whether they'll be impacted by the RMT signallers is another matter....


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 11, 2022, 08:28:48 am
Interesting view from Tony Lodge yesterday......

Later this month, Britain’s biggest rail union will deliver a hammer blow to the railways’ finances, future growth prospects and probably its own members’ jobs. By announcing three staggered strike days, they have designed the walkout to inflict the maximum possible disruption over the longest possible time to try to force ministers to bow to pay demands. The damage that this will inflict to future passenger confidence, perceived reliability and market share will be huge.

So why are the rail unions leading their members into what could be the most damaging series of national rail strikes for a generation? What is the basis for kicking a sector that remains in intensive care following the pandemic; a decision that can only lead to more people abandoning the train, choosing the car or doing more work from home? There are historic lessons here that every rail worker should heed and consider when reading the next RMT diktat.

The similarities with Arthur Scargill’s disastrous year-long miner’s strike in 1984-5 and the railways today are clear. By the early 1980s the coal industry in Britain was overproducing by almost 20 per cent; its markets were shrinking and a deep recession had further reduced customer demand. As a result, tens of millions of tons of coal were piled up at power stations and pits kept producing coal they couldn’t sell, with huge taxpayer subsidy. Scargill wasn’t interested in helping deliver a viable sector where supply met demand and, instead, argued it was up to ministers to keep loss-making pits going.

The strike ultimately led to the collapse of the coal industry as customers looked at more reliable suppliers and alternative fuels. Between 1985 and 2015, 170 collieries closed and more than 170,000 miners lost their jobs.

The parallel for rail workers is important, as the sector is in its weakest state since the end of the Second World War – especially after Britain’s railways were hit by the pandemic. Boris Johnson’s order to work from home resulted in a 77 per cent drop in rail use which particularly decimated the once highly lucrative five-day peak home counties commuter market. The income from this alone covered a large slice of the railways’ cost base and limited the need for more taxpayer support.

More than £16 billion of taxpayers’ cash has since been spent to keep the network running, despite the numbers commuting at peak times on weekdays standing at just 20 per cent of pre-pandemic levels.

Another £4.5 billion has been handed to Transport for London to keep the Underground running, but the traditional flows of peak-time passengers aren’t returning to the capital and the knock-on is clear. This month’s strike will further hurt TfL’s perilous finances just as it unveils the new £18 billion Elizabeth Line.

The unions are ignoring the existential threat faced by the railways. Hybrid working means passengers have choices that didn’t exist before, and prolonged strikes will inevitably drive more away. But rather than working with planners to try to win passengers back, the unions look hell-bent on fatally undermining future growth, which can only mean fewer trains and jobs.

Rail and coal were once inter-reliant. Train workers should recall what happened to their one-time compatriots whose union prioritised a politically motivated strike over any real ambition to address a radically changing market where customers have new and cheaper choices.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 11, 2022, 09:44:54 am
ANOTHER comparison with the disastrous miners strike.
I cant see the railways being closed down to the extent that the coal mines were closed. But I do expect some cutbacks, and more calls for automation.
ATO, at least on the underground.
Fewer manned ticket offices.
More use of non union subcontractors for maintenance etc.
A slow down in reopening schemes "whilst we evaluate the impact of the pay award"


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: didcotdean on June 11, 2022, 10:26:59 am
It may start moving the conversation in areas that railway unions and those working in it would find uncomfortable. For example this letter from independent pensions expert John Ralfe in The Times today:
Quote
In quoting headline pay, unions ignore the annual value of the generous defined benefit pensions — deferred salary — and a huge part of overall pay for rail staff. Not only are rail pensions guaranteed they still have a retirement age of 60 and unlimited annual inflation increases. After a member's own contributions, the annual cost to rail companies — and ultimately taxpayers — is more than 50 per cent of salary. Meanwhile, even the most generous private sector defined contribution pensions have employer contributions of 15 per cent of salary, and most are much lower.

The answer to any pay squeeze for rail staff is simple: reduce the generosity of future pensions by closing the defined benefit scheme and moving to defined contributions, and then use some of the savings to increase pay.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 11, 2022, 06:59:29 pm
Sadly for the travelling public these strikes will only end up with increased fares and less services in the long run.  As for many of the NR staff in Maintenance that are taking strike action they will more than likely end leaving NR and work for many of the contractors who are offering substantially higher salaries than NR and on better terms


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 11, 2022, 07:57:11 pm
It may start moving the conversation in areas that railway unions and those working in it would find uncomfortable. For example this letter from independent pensions expert John Ralfe in The Times today:
Quote
In quoting headline pay, unions ignore the annual value of the generous defined benefit pensions — deferred salary — and a huge part of overall pay for rail staff. Not only are rail pensions guaranteed they still have a retirement age of 60 and unlimited annual inflation increases. After a member's own contributions, the annual cost to rail companies — and ultimately taxpayers — is more than 50 per cent of salary. Meanwhile, even the most generous private sector defined contribution pensions have employer contributions of 15 per cent of salary, and most are much lower.

The answer to any pay squeeze for rail staff is simple: reduce the generosity of future pensions by closing the defined benefit scheme and moving to defined contributions, and then use some of the savings to increase pay.

Seriously?

I genuinely didn't even realise those sort of "gold plated" pensions still existed......certainly not able to be taken at 60!

That's 7 years before retirement age for most others!

I can imagine the reaction of Bruvver Lynch et al though if moves were made to bring these pensions into line with those the rest of us have to look forward to, without the benefit of being financed and the risk borne by the taxpayer.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 11, 2022, 08:44:45 pm
It may start moving the conversation in areas that railway unions and those working in it would find uncomfortable. For example this letter from independent pensions expert John Ralfe in The Times today:
Quote
In quoting headline pay, unions ignore the annual value of the generous defined benefit pensions — deferred salary — and a huge part of overall pay for rail staff. Not only are rail pensions guaranteed they still have a retirement age of 60 and unlimited annual inflation increases. After a member's own contributions, the annual cost to rail companies — and ultimately taxpayers — is more than 50 per cent of salary. Meanwhile, even the most generous private sector defined contribution pensions have employer contributions of 15 per cent of salary, and most are much lower.

The answer to any pay squeeze for rail staff is simple: reduce the generosity of future pensions by closing the defined benefit scheme and moving to defined contributions, and then use some of the savings to increase pay.

Seriously?

The Rail Pension Scheme (RPS) which has its origins from BR Pension Fund still exists, it is currently protected in the 1993 Act "the indefensible right" this was brought about by Robert Maxwell and the fraudulent activates that happened to Mirror Group pension fund that was discovered when he fell off of his Yachet.  Some rail pension scheme benefits are lost if someone moves rail employer, I have moved mine 3 times since 1998.

Of all of the Nationalised industries pension schemes the RPS was the only one that was not "robbed" by the treasury during the privatisation process, the miners, power industry, teaches all had their funds raide; the Unions are concerned that the Government will raid the RPS during the formation of GBR .........................

The RPS is no longer a true final salary scheme, the contribution % by the employee are quite high but it's matched by the employer.

I genuinely didn't even realise those sort of "gold plated" pensions still existed......certainly not able to be taken at 60!

That's 7 years before retirement age for most others!

I can imagine the reaction of Bruvver Lynch et al though if moves were made to bring these pensions into line with those the rest of us have to look forward to, without the benefit of being financed and the risk borne by the taxpayer.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on June 11, 2022, 09:34:04 pm
I genuinely didn't even realise those sort of "gold plated" pensions still existed......certainly not able to be taken at 60!

That's 7 years before retirement age for most others!

I can imagine the reaction of Bruvver Lynch et al though if moves were made to bring these pensions into line with those the rest of us have to look forward to, without the benefit of being financed and the risk borne by the taxpayer.

Such 'gold plated' pensions were not just public sector.  Once upon a time many private sector employers offered such pensions.  They were encouraged by government to make up for the fact that the UK had and still has one of the lowest state pension payments anywhere in Europe.


When UK governments started to look at surpluses in pension funds in the 1980's they decided these were a tax dodge so Norman Lamont introduced new rules which meant that employers with what government saw as excessive surpluses were required to either improve benefits or take contribution holidays.  Twenty years on and investment returns were not as good employers started to have problems and needed to put more money it to fund deficits.  Much blame was placed on Gordon Brown as chancellor, but the damage was done much earlier.

As a trustee of one such fund that took a contribution holiday were were advised that were it not for that government interference that forced us to take a contribution holiday the fund would not have the massive deficit. 

In a different fund where I am a member the private company could not support the deficit and I am left with a much reduced pension because it has gone into the pension protection fund. 

So government failed to fund pensions then sabotaged the system that made up for this. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 11, 2022, 09:41:54 pm
What happens to union members who were due to start work at say 20-00 on the evening before a strike day.
Are they expected to turn up as usual and walk out at midnight ?
Or not to turn up at all.

Likewise, what about those due to start work at say 22-00 on a strike day ? Delay starting work until midnight ?

Or to take the extreme case, what about a worker booked for an 8 hour shift, of which 7.5 hours fall into the 24 hour strike period, and 30 minutes into the following or preceeding non strike day.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 11, 2022, 10:00:46 pm
I genuinely didn't even realise those sort of "gold plated" pensions still existed......certainly not able to be taken at 60!

That's 7 years before retirement age for most others!

I can imagine the reaction of Bruvver Lynch et al though if moves were made to bring these pensions into line with those the rest of us have to look forward to, without the benefit of being financed and the risk borne by the taxpayer.

Such 'gold plated' pensions were not just public sector.  Once upon a time many private sector employers offered such pensions.  They were encouraged by government to make up for the fact that the UK had and still has one of the lowest state pension payments anywhere in Europe.


When UK governments started to look at surpluses in pension funds in the 1980's they decided these were a tax dodge so Norman Lamont introduced new rules which meant that employers with what government saw as excessive surpluses were required to either improve benefits or take contribution holidays.  Twenty years on and investment returns were not as good employers started to have problems and needed to put more money it to fund deficits.  Much blame was placed on Gordon Brown as chancellor, but the damage was done much earlier.

As a trustee of one such fund that took a contribution holiday were were advised that were it not for that government interference that forced us to take a contribution holiday the fund would not have the massive deficit. 

In a different fund where I am a member the private company could not support the deficit and I am left with a much reduced pension because it has gone into the pension protection fund. 

So government failed to fund pensions then sabotaged the system that made up for this. 

Without wishing to go too far off topic, I think you'll find it was Nigel Lawson, not Norman Lamont but yes certainly Brown landed a killer blow......this explains it rather well.......

https://theconversation.com/britains-great-pension-robbery-why-the-defined-benefits-gold-standard-is-a-luxury-of-the-past-100844


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: trainbuff on June 12, 2022, 12:38:14 am
It may start moving the conversation in areas that railway unions and those working in it would find uncomfortable. For example this letter from independent pensions expert John Ralfe in The Times today:
Quote
In quoting headline pay, unions ignore the annual value of the generous defined benefit pensions — deferred salary — and a huge part of overall pay for rail staff. Not only are rail pensions guaranteed they still have a retirement age of 60 and unlimited annual inflation increases. After a member's own contributions, the annual cost to rail companies — and ultimately taxpayers — is more than 50 per cent of salary. Meanwhile, even the most generous private sector defined contribution pensions have employer contributions of 15 per cent of salary, and most are much lower.

The answer to any pay squeeze for rail staff is simple: reduce the generosity of future pensions by closing the defined benefit scheme and moving to defined contributions, and then use some of the savings to increase pay.

Seriously?

I genuinely didn't even realise those sort of "gold plated" pensions still existed......certainly not able to be taken at 60!

That's 7 years before retirement age for most others!

I can imagine the reaction of Bruvver Lynch et al though if moves were made to bring these pensions into line with those the rest of us have to look forward to, without the benefit of being financed and the risk borne by the taxpayer.

For non BR staff it is currently 62. Bear in mind the shift pattern that workers do. Wrecks the body. Many have blood pressure and type 2 diabetes. How does a body cope with finishing late, at say 1am on a Sunday morning, having a 'day off' and booking on at 3am on the Monday morning? Not all the time but does happen, more frequently then it should. Imagine doing that for 40+ years.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: trainbuff on June 12, 2022, 12:40:31 am
What happens to union members who were due to start work at say 20-00 on the evening before a strike day.
Are they expected to turn up as usual and walk out at midnight ?
Or not to turn up at all.

Likewise, what about those due to start work at say 22-00 on a strike day ? Delay starting work until midnight ?

Or to take the extreme case, what about a worker booked for an 8 hour shift, of which 7.5 hours fall into the 24 hour strike period, and 30 minutes into the following or preceeding non strike day.

They are still expected to work their shift


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 12, 2022, 12:59:40 am
What happens to union members who were due to start work at say 20-00 on the evening before a strike day.
Are they expected to turn up as usual and walk out at midnight ?
Or not to turn up at all.

Likewise, what about those due to start work at say 22-00 on a strike day ? Delay starting work until midnight ?

Or to take the extreme case, what about a worker booked for an 8 hour shift, of which 7.5 hours fall into the 24 hour strike period, and 30 minutes into the following or preceeding non strike day.

For a 20:00 start the day before, they book on as normal and should be available to complete their shift. As the original post states you are only ‘instructed’ by the RMT to not book on for shifts commencing 00:01-23:59 on strike days.

So for a 22:00 book on on a strike day they would not book on and therefore not be available for the whole shift.

Those basic principles also apply for the ‘extreme example’ you gave.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 12, 2022, 01:39:44 am
Thanks for the info in the previous two posts.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 12, 2022, 03:13:33 am

For non BR staff it is currently 62. Bear in mind the shift pattern that workers do. Wrecks the body. Many have blood pressure and type 2 diabetes. How does a body cope with finishing late, at say 1am on a Sunday morning, having a 'day off' and booking on at 3am on the Monday morning? Not all the time but does happen, more frequently then it should. Imagine doing that for 40+ years.

I have long felt that the present shift pattern for railway work is a powerful disincentive to recruitment and retention of staff, and it does indeed have health consequences.

A far better policy in my view would be largely fixed working hours. Some of these hours would be anti social, but in my view fixed anti social shifts are preferable to continual changes.
Regularly starting work at say 03-00 and working until say 11-00 would in my view be preferable to the present arrangements. Overtime working by mutual agreement could consist of EITHER working 6 such shifts in a week rather than 5 shifts, or alternatively starting at say 01-00 instead of at 03-00.

I know of someone who left the railway and now works in a power station. The PERMANENT night shifts rather than an endlessly changing shift pattern was the main reason for the change.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Henry on June 12, 2022, 06:26:52 am

For non BR staff it is currently 62. Bear in mind the shift pattern that workers do. Wrecks the body. Many have blood pressure and type 2 diabetes. How does a body cope with finishing late, at say 1am on a Sunday morning, having a 'day off' and booking on at 3am on the Monday morning? Not all the time but does happen, more frequently then it should. Imagine doing that for 40+ years.

I have long felt that the present shift pattern for railway work is a powerful disincentive to recruitment and retention of staff, and it does indeed have health consequences.

A far better policy in my view would be largely fixed working hours. Some of these hours would be anti social, but in my view fixed anti social shifts are preferable to continual changes.
Regularly starting work at say 03-00 and working until say 11-00 would in my view be preferable to the present arrangements. Overtime working by mutual agreement could consist of EITHER working 6 such shifts in a week rather than 5 shifts, or alternatively starting at say 01-00 instead of at 03-00.

I know of someone who left the railway and now works in a power station. The PERMANENT night shifts rather than an endlessly changing shift pattern was the main reason for the change.
I seem to remember as a Conductor employed by BR, we did work such shifts. Then their was a dispute over a flexible rostering agreement, if I remember correctly.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: GWR 158 on June 12, 2022, 07:24:59 am
Do GWR provide rail replacment buses on strike days?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 12, 2022, 07:35:04 am
Do GWR provide rail replacment buses on strike days?

From GWR website:
www.gwr.com/strike

Quote
We are not able to provide bus replacement services.

A useful page with lots of information and answers to questions which I’m sure will be continually updated as and when GWR have further information.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 12, 2022, 07:43:56 am
Do GWR provide rail replacment buses on strike days?

There are not enough busses or drivers to cover the service, and the TOC's are not obliged to provide a replacement as it is something outside of their control and they will have given sufficient notice to their customers.

If they did attempt to provide a bus service the TOC would get slated in the media for long queues, slow and late running services best to just for them to point the finger of blame on the Unions


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on June 12, 2022, 07:23:46 pm
GWR have announced on their website that the Night Riviera sleeper service is cancelled for the whole week between 20th and 24th June.  However they will run on Sunday 19th into the 20th.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: onthecushions on June 12, 2022, 07:42:48 pm
Gordon Brown's £5Bn/year pension fund raid at the start of New Labour, when capitalised at 4%, was equivalent to the c£130Bn hole in the pension funds. It would have been better to tax the pensions paid out from the investments' returns rather than reduce the invested capital.

IIRC many private pensions pre-2000 were based on 1/60ths over 30 years, often non-contributory. Public sector pensions were based on 1/80ths over 40 years, with 6% employee's contribution, employers paying 12%. As most public sector workers had far less than 40 years service, average pensions were often not large. The gold plating was therefore not very thick, relatively.

The fallacy in the Unions' claim is that inflation will blip, over the next year, falling away after. As an example gas wholesale prices peaked about 550p/therm and have now fallen back to c150p/therm. Once the other markets have settled, similar reductions will follow.

I do sympathise with those many industrious skilled members of the railway industry who have put up with much abuse since privatisation but they will weaken their position and industry by disruption.

OTC


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 12, 2022, 08:21:46 pm
GWR have announced on their website that the Night Riviera sleeper service is cancelled for the whole week between 20th and 24th June.  However they will run on Sunday 19th into the 20th.

In todays Observer article (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/jun/12/rail-strikes-glastonbury-travel-trouble-small-shows-fear-devastating-impact?utm_term=62a58ef52383437e3015ebbe764553e2&utm_campaign=GuardianTodayUK&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&CMP=GTUK_email), this paragraph about GWR & Glastonbury

Quote
Rail strikes spell travel trouble for Glastonbury – and small events fear ‘catastrophe’

.....GWR, the train company serving Castle Cary, the station closest to Glastonbury, has said it hopes to maintain timetabled trains from London Paddington throughout the festival. But it said other parts of its network were likely to be “more affected” by the strike action and that customers “may need to consider alternative ways to travel to a station serving Castle Cary”.....

So it seems available resources may be being concentrated on the PAD - Castle Cary service over other services.

The fallacy in the Unions' claim is that inflation will blip, over the next year, falling away after. As an example gas wholesale prices peaked about 550p/therm and have now fallen back to c150p/therm. Once the other markets have settled, similar reductions will follow.

Totally agree - a one-off bonus for the year to counter this inflationary 'blip' would make a more sensible ask than an 11.1% pay hike that increases wages from here on, regardless of how inflation falls over the next years


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 13, 2022, 05:13:08 am
So it seems available resources may be being concentrated on the PAD - Castle Cary service over other services.

Standard practice isn't it?  I recall Paddington to Cheltenham Spa services being reduced to a Swindon - Cheltenham Spa shuttle, and the Paddington to Cardiff being culled, leaving an hourly Paddington so Swansea service to pick up displaced passengers in previous "normal" years.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: froome on June 13, 2022, 06:31:45 am
What will happen with Bristol to Weymouth services, which also serve Castle Cary? They always have huge demand from Glastonbury users as well, and if Paddington to the West Country services are reduced, there will be additional pressure from other passengers wanting to transfer onto them instead and then change at Castle Cary.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 13, 2022, 06:58:49 am
What will happen with Bristol to Weymouth services, which also serve Castle Cary? They always have huge demand from Glastonbury users as well, and if Paddington to the West Country services are reduced, there will be additional pressure from other passengers wanting to transfer onto them instead and then change at Castle Cary.

I think it's safe to say that any trains that do run within striking distance of Glastonbury will be packed beyond belief and certainly beyond safety.

I wonder if there will be the usual boarding control at Paddington? Will there be any staff available to supervise it? What happens at Reading?

This sort of uncertainty and chaos of course is exactly what the RMT are counting on - hence the choice of dates.

For the sake of safety, it may be worth GWR simply saying that people shouldn't count on any trains running to Castle Cary and that they should make other arrangements.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 13, 2022, 07:19:22 am
Glastonbury already has a massive traffic problem during festival week. Without trains running to bring festival goers it would be even worse. I’m sure we will learn this week what GWR’s plans are. They’ve known for a while strikes were coming and would likely affect Glastonbury week.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 13, 2022, 07:36:36 am
Glastonbury already has a massive traffic problem during festival week. Without trains running to bring festival goers it would be even worse. I’m sure we will learn this week what GWR’s plans are. They’ve known for a while strikes were coming and would likely affect Glastonbury week.

That will make interesting reading, especially as (presumably?) much of it will be beyond GWR's control?

If enough of (for example) the signallers strike, could any sort of meaningful service run?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 13, 2022, 08:45:58 am
What will happen with Bristol to Weymouth services, which also serve Castle Cary? They always have huge demand from Glastonbury users as well, and if Paddington to the West Country services are reduced, there will be additional pressure from other passengers wanting to transfer onto them instead and then change at Castle Cary.

I think it's safe to say that any trains that do run within striking distance of Glastonbury will be packed beyond belief and certainly beyond safety.

I wonder if there will be the usual boarding control at Paddington? Will there be any staff available to supervise it? What happens at Reading?

This sort of uncertainty and chaos of course is exactly what the RMT are counting on - hence the choice of dates.

For the sake of safety, it may be worth GWR simply saying that people shouldn't count on any trains running to Castle Cary and that they should make other arrangements.

Boarding controls at Paddington or elsewhere is the sort of thing for which non union agency staff COULD be used in future. Not for THIS strike presumably, but in future perhaps.
The work is more like crowd control at say a major sporting fixture, than "railway work"


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 13, 2022, 09:33:57 am
I’m fairly sure temporary agency staff are routinely used for such things every year.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 13, 2022, 10:22:01 am
Interesting figures quoted by the Telegraph via MSN online (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/rail-workers-inundate-voluntary-redundancy-scheme-despite-strikes-over-job-cuts/ar-AAYnudI?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=befb15978b7a4a918bd8892c34860353)

Quote
Rail workers inundate voluntary redundancy scheme – despite strikes over job cuts

A voluntary redundancy scheme for rail workers has been inundated with more than 5,000 applications, casting doubt over union bosses’ reasons for launching the most aggressive strike action in a generation.

Rail managers invited requests for voluntary redundancy last autumn as part of efforts to reduce the burden on taxpayers caused by the pandemic.

Figures seen by The Telegraph show that train operators received 2,949 applications to quit. A further 2,159 applied for the scheme at Network Rail, the state-backed owner of tracks and stations.

Though the number of voluntary redundancies sought by managers is closely guarded, it is understood that applications outstripped places by roughly two to one at Network Rail.

Meanwhile, train operators confirmed that “we had more people express an interest in the scheme than we were initially able to accept”.

Union chiefs insisted voluntary redundancy programmes had only been offered to management grade personnel at Network Rail.

Nevertheless, the number of applications, released under freedom of information laws, calls into question claims by “militant” trade union chiefs that rail leaders are imposing unwanted job cuts to reduce costs.

The figures also suggest that the organisation leading the dispute - the Rail, Maritime and Transport workers union (RMT) - is now facing an existential crisis as members scramble to quit Britain's rail sector.

Andrew Haines, chief executive of Network Rail said: “We know there is huge latent demand within Network Rail for people to leave and move on - it’s mainly an age profile thing - and it could be unlocked by the trades unions.

“Without flexibility from them, we won't be able to make the savings that will permit us to open a voluntary severance scheme for their members. We hope they'll settle down to some meaningful negotiations that could make any suggestion of compulsory redundancies, null and void.”

Between 40,000 and 50,000 RMT members will walkout on June 21, 23 and 25, disrupting Glastonbury Festival, the Headingley test match, and  those making their way to Armed Forces Day celebrations on June 25.

Strike action by Network Rail signal workers – the first such action in more than three decades – will cripple the train network and bring services to a near-standstill. 

The industrial action will cost the Exchequer £100m in loss fare revenue and deliver an estimated £450m hit to the UK economy.

Grant Shapps, the Transport Secretary said this weekend that agency staff may be used to break “Marxist” union strikes - but will not prevent significant disruption later this month.

Strike action on the railways intensified last week as train drivers union Aslef also launched strikes in June and July on Hull Trains, Greater Anglia and the Croydon Tramline.

A third union, the TSSA, is balloting for a walkout that could cripple the network completely in July as Birmingham prepares to host the Commonwealth Games.

Grant Shapps, the Transport Secretary, is under orders from the Treasury to reduce the burden of running the railways on taxpayers after more than £16bn was spent keeping services running during the pandemic.

A spokesman for the Department for Transport said: “The industry is looking at several ways of making the railway sustainable for the long term – staffing costs is just one area of this.

“We once again want to urge the unions to come to talks with the rail industry so we can work together to build a better, more modern, passenger-focused, railway.”

A spokesman for the Rail Delivery Group, which represents train operators: “The rail industry launched a voluntary exit scheme, the first of its kind, last year, in recognition that some colleagues wanted to use the skills and expertise they have built in our industry elsewhere.

“We had more people express an interest in the scheme than we were initially able to accept.”

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "The only voluntary severance programme so far has been among managers and the total job losses among them up to this point has been over 2,500.

“There has been no voluntary severance exercise among RMT members.

“RMT is continuing dialogue with Network Rail on their ideas for cost savings but we remain opposed to job cuts, we will defend our conditions and we want a pay rise."


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: GBM on June 14, 2022, 11:19:42 am
Whilst having my hair cut this morning, my barber(ess) said one of her clients is a GWR driver, and they've accepted a pay rise, so won't be on strike, but.
Trains won't have a conductor/guard or catering body on, just the driver; station dispatch being done by station staff and the driver.
I would have thought that 'down west' trains couldn't leave without a second body on board, and drivers would refuse to take a train out without one?
She also said trains wouldn't be cleaned, but drivers have been asked to sign on earlier and do a basic pick up litter run before commencing their duties. 
I would have thought that too would have been refused?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 14, 2022, 11:27:12 am
Utter nonsense.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 14, 2022, 11:30:59 am
It certainly sounds rather improbable.
Esp the bit about litter picking ! That is easily done by a minimum wage, non union, agency worker rather than by increasing the expensive hours worked by a driver.

One person operation sounds almost as unlikely.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 14, 2022, 12:02:28 pm
Now the TSSA is balloting at Network Rail stations in the capital - first action slated for July 25 if positive vote gained. Paddington included - would mean no IETs beyond Reading & probably Slough for stoppers?

From My London, via MSN (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/london-rail-strikes-euston-victoria-and-london-bridge-stations-among-those-targeted-with-fresh-ballot-that-could-see-industrial-action-all-summer/ar-AAYrez8?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=8f38e357ec574ffc8cfb08537c6bd56e)

Quote
Rail workers union TSSA has announced that its members will vote on strike action to take place towards the end of July affecting most major London rail stations including London Bridge, Charing Cross and Euston. On Tuesday (June 14) the union said members would be balloted on action that could see services at London's biggest termini, including Kings Cross, Liverpool Street, Paddington, Victoria and Waterloo, severely disrupted all summer.

The dispute is over pay and conditions as the union claims its members working at Network Rail, the public body which looks after railway infrastructure in England, have not had a pay increase for at least two years. It is also calling for a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies.

This industrial action, which would see over 6,000 staff across the country walk out, would take place from July 25 at the earliest, exactly one month after larger action by the RMT, which will see 50,000 staff walk out over three days across the railway network in England, including a co-ordinated Tube strike on June 21. Should the TSSA members vote to strike, it would mean disruption for rail travel in the capital for the entire summer, as this vote can allow the union to prolong the industrial action if the dispute over pay and conditions is not resolved after the initial strike.

In London, this action would affect nearly all National Rail services because the majority of them start and terminate at the termini stations where staff would walk out. Even if the government's proposed legislation is approved to allow agency staff to replace the staff on the picket lines, disruption would still continue because agency staff would be unable to fill the highly technical roles which are critical to running the railway, such as signalling, operations control and heavy maintenance.

TSSA General Secretary Manuel Cortes said: "We could be seeing a summer of discontent across our railways if Network Rail don't see sense and come to the table to face the concerns of their staff. Network Rail staff are asking for basic fair treatment: not to be sacked from their jobs; a fair pay rise in the face of a cost-of-living crisis; and no race to the bottom on terms and conditions. Fat cat bosses have so far refused these completely reasonable requests, leaving us with no option other than to ballot for industrial action, something which is always a last resort."

The TSSA union is also in dispute with three rail operators which operate in and out of London: Avanti West Coast, East Midlands Railway and London Northwestern Railway, which means strikes could also take place on these services too.

The ballot (vote on whether to strike) opens on June 20 and closes on July 11, with strike action taking place as soon as July 25 if a 'yes' vote wins. Some Network Rail office staff who are TSSA members at Blackfriars, Stratford and Waterloo are also being balloted.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 14, 2022, 01:52:31 pm
And the BBCs (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61795673) take on this new threat...

Quote
Thousands more railway workers will vote on whether to go on strikes which threaten travel chaos this summer.

The Transport Salaried Staffs Association (TSSA) plans to ballot more than 6,000 staff at Network Rail (NR).

It is part of a dispute over pay, conditions and job security. Other rail unions will strike next week in what is the biggest walkout in three decades.

A Department for Transport spokesman said strikes should be a last resort and urged TSSA to reconsider.

Network Rail said: "Now is not for time for the TSSA to be jumping on the RMT strike bandwagon."

Members of the Rail, Maritime and Transport (RMT) union at NR and 13 train operators will go on strike for three days from 21 June.

The RMT and Unite are also holding a one-day strike on the London Underground on the same day as the first rail strike, in a separate row over jobs and pay.

Travel misery

Train strikes, cancelled flights and record-breaking petrol prices have thrown getaway plans into disarray and threaten a summer of travel misery.

The TSSA has previously announced strike ballots among its members at four rail companies - Avanti West Coast, CrossCountry, East Midlands and West Midlands Trains.

Meanwhile, members of the drivers union Aslef are also striking later this month at Hull Trains, Greater Anglia and Croydon Tramlink.

TSSA members at NR work in operational, control, management and safety critical roles on rail services across Britain.

They are being asked to cast two votes - one on strike action and another on action short of a strike. The ballot opens on 20 June and closes on 11 July.

In the event of a yes vote, strike action could be held from 25 July.

'Summer of discontent'

The TSSA is demanding a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies for 2022, no unagreed changes to terms and conditions, and a pay increase which reflects the rising cost of living.

It said NR staff last had a pay rise between two and three years ago, although it varies between grades, and also worked throughout the coronavirus pandemic as key workers.

TSSA general secretary Manuel Cortes said: "We could be seeing a summer of discontent across our railways if Network Rail don't see sense and come to the table to face the concerns of their staff."

He added Network Rail only responded to the union's requests for pay talks, made before Christmas, when it moved the issue to dispute in April.

'No-strings pay offer'

But a spokesman for Network Rail said positive pay talks were in full swing with a 'no-strings' pay offer of 2.5% on the table with the potential for more if targets were hit.

A Department for Transport spokesman said it was "hugely disappointing and premature that the TSSA is balloting for industrial action when talks have only just begun".

He added: "Train travel for millions more people is now a choice, not a necessity. Strikes stop our customers choosing rail, and they might never return.

He urged the TSSA to reconsider and go to industry talks in a bid to find a solution for workers, passengers and taxpayers.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on June 14, 2022, 06:12:46 pm
I am sorry but I nearly fell off my perch when I read this

Quote
But a spokesman for Network Rail said positive pay talks were in full swing with a 'no-strings' pay offer of 2.5% on the table with the potential for more if targets were hit.

Inflation at least 10% offer 2.5%!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ray951 on June 15, 2022, 11:23:34 am
Maps now available of where trains will run on strike day and the day's in between
https://www.gwr.com/strike (https://www.gwr.com/strike)

I doesn't look to me like timetables, at least those linked to from that page, have been updated yet.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 15, 2022, 11:52:49 am
Hmmm....that page does tell you that they haven't, and when they will be available!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 15, 2022, 12:59:46 pm
Update from GWR ... I am dashing between meetings and will come back and fill this in further / move post if necessary

Quote
We promised to update you further on the impact of the RMT strike action, and you may well have seen the national update at 1030 this morning by Network Rail and the Rail Delivery Group.
 
Network Rail has been working hard to cover signal boxes to keep as many routes open as possible on the strike days (Tuesday 21 June, Thursday 23 June and Saturday 25 June). 
 
This is not possible in all areas and there are some routes where rail services will not operate, in other areas a limited service will run, but will start later and finish much earlier.   There will also be a reduced service on the days between and after the strike, Wednesday 22 June, Friday 24 June and Sunday 26 June. 
 
Our dedicated web page www.gwr.com/strike now has an overview of the timetable for each region and clear maps showing where services are operational.  This is a dedicated web page which we will keep updated throughout the week.   In addition, Network Rail are now entering timetable changes into the national timetable database, and detailed changes to weekday services will be available in online journey planners from Friday 17 June, and for weekend services from Saturday 18 June.
 
We are recommending that even where services are possible customers should only travel if absolutely necessary, services will be busy, and there will not be any replacement road transport.   It is also important to note that there could be further changes, even on the day, particularly if cover cannot be maintained for signal boxes, where routes will need to stop operating.
 
We understand the impact that these changes will have on customer journeys, and we know it will mean making alternative plans for many.  We will therefore be doing all we can to alert customers to the changes, so they have time to plan. Any help you can give us with that would be very gratefully received.
 
Please signpost anyone to the webpage for more information -  www.gwr.com/strike - and do email us if you need any clarification, have any questions or any queries.
 
This is going to be a very difficult week for our customers, we will do all we can to help, but the impact will be significant.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ray951 on June 15, 2022, 01:01:32 pm
Hmmm....that page does tell you that they haven't, and when they will be available!
So what I said was correct  ;) of course you are correct as well  ;)

Of course I could say it is poor design, and it probably is, but it was also user error (I didn't scroll down to bottom of the page).
A rhetorical question, but why provide a link to timetables if the timetables aren't available?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 15, 2022, 01:26:22 pm
Where’s the link to specifically timetables? There’s that page you did link fo that gives the overall view, but nowhere does ot say it’s specifically timetables. Indeed, the accomoanying blurb only mentions that timetables *wil be* (i.e. not yet) uploaded to journeyplanners. Then that link tells you when each days timetable will be available.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 15, 2022, 01:47:33 pm
Other TOCs have published actual timetables to view but GWR never does that, and hasn't for a very long time, instead directing everyone to journeyplanner.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on June 15, 2022, 03:34:06 pm
Network Rail have produced this map (https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/Map-showing-open-lines-during-strike-days-June-2022.jpg) showing the lines they will be able to open, presumably using the few non-striking staff capable of working as signallers.
(https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/Map-showing-open-lines-during-strike-days-June-2022.jpg)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 15, 2022, 03:55:16 pm
From The Telegraph (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/don-t-travel-by-train-on-strike-days-commuters-urged/ar-AAYsPJX?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=05bca5fd286940c988dd6823663d7d7f) via MSN

Quote
Commuters will be told not to travel by train next week as the entire network is set to be crippled by the largest strike in more than 30 years.

In a major announcement on Wednesday, train operating companies are expected to urge people to avoid all travel on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday as services will be drastically reduced.

Network Rail is set to lay out a new schedule, with services cut by 80 per cent, and to announce that all journeys will have to be completed by 6.30pm.

Southeastern, one of Britain’s biggest rail operators, has already written to passengers asking them to avoid travelling on strike days because most of its routes and stations will be closed, while c2c rail will advise passengers to “only travel if necessary”.

Bosses at South Western Railway were still having “live conversations” about their plans on Tuesday night, but will most likely ask passengers to avoid travelling. Other operators are expected to make similar announcements.

It will force schools and hospitals to urgently assess how they can continue to operate, with the risk of a return to online lessons and the cancellation of non-emergency medical appointments.

Industry sources said on Tuesday night that train companies were coming under substantial pressure from ministers to avoid putting out “do not travel” notices because Grant Shapps, the transport minister, “doesn’t want to give in to the unions”.

They are being urged to keep services running wherever possible. However, sources said: “We will have to tell them not to travel because if we have people turning up as normal to stations expecting to get on a train we will have a major problem.”

‘Completely unsafe to run any trains during strike’

Union sources said that the entire network would have to be shut down during the strike for safety reasons. They described suggestions of even a 20 per cent service as “optimistic” and said that it was “completely unsafe to run any trains” because of the sheer number of safety critical staff going on strike. 

It comes as thousands more railway workers are to be balloted for strikes which could hit in July.

The Transport Salaried Staffs Association (TSSA) has served notice to ballot more than 6,000 staff at Network Rail in a dispute over pay, conditions and job security. In the event of a yes vote, strike action could be held from July 25.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 15, 2022, 04:06:58 pm
And now The BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61808898)

Quote
Passengers have been advised not to travel on trains unless necessary during strikes next week, with only a fifth of services due to run.

Network Rail said about half of all rail lines will be closed when thousands of workers walk out across Britain on 21, 23 and 25 June.

The services that run will start and finish earlier, from 07:30 to 18:30.

There will be no trains at all in many places including north from Glasgow or Edinburgh and to Penzance in Cornwall.

Network Rail, which owns and maintains the country's railways, said there would also be no passenger services to locations including Bournemouth in Dorset, Swansea in south Wales, Holyhead in north Wales, Chester in Cheshire and Blackpool in Lancashire.

Open lines include the West Coast Main Line from London to Scotland via locations such as Birmingham and Manchester.

However, with trains running for shorter hours on strike days, final departures will be much earlier than usual. For example, the last train from Manchester to London will leave at 14:47 and the last from Norwich to London at 16:00, with the last train from London to Edinburgh at 15:00.

Rural and district lines will be most affected by the action.

The timetable from 20 June to 26 June is still being finalised, but the number of services is expected to be around 4,500 compared with 20,000 normally, Network Rail said.

Disruption is also expected to carry over into non-strike days during the week, when only about 60% of services are expected to run.

This is due to not enough staff being on shift overnight to get services ready for the following day.

Several train operators including Southeastern, TransPennine and Avanti West Coast have urged passengers to only travel by rail if necessary, while Northern has asked people "not to travel" on trains between Tuesday and Sunday.

Several large events could be affected by the strikes, ranging from Glastonbury Festival, which runs from 22 to 26 June, to a cricket Test match between England and New Zealand taking place from 23 to 27 June.

Pensioner Linda is supposed to be travelling by train from Great Yarmouth to London for a Rolling Stones concert on 25 June.

She paid £100 per ticket, and there are four people due to go. However, she is not sure if there is any way for her to get there now.

"If I was to book a coach, it would cost a lot more - plus increase the travel time; two-and-a-half hours on the train becomes five to six hours on a coach," she told the BBC. "And there's no way we'd get to the concert in time."

She is still hoping she will be able to travel - the train company issued her a notification that an emergency timetable would be released on Friday.

More than 40,000 RMT union members from Network Rail and 13 train firms plan to walk out. The industrial action, which has been described as the "biggest rail strike in modern history", involves union members which include railway staff such as guards and signalling operators.

RMT announced the strike action last week after talks over pay and redundancies fell through.

On the first day of the planned strike on 21 June, London Underground RMT workers plan to walk out in a separate dispute over pensions and job losses.

Andrew Haines, Network Rail chief executive, said talks with the union had "not progressed as far as I had hoped" and so preparations had begun for a strike.

He called the action "needless" and said it would have a "damaging impact".

"Make no mistake, the level of service we will be able to offer will be significantly compromised and passengers need to take that into account and to plan ahead and only travel if it's really necessary to do so," he said.

The strikes may be less disruptive for commuters, with more people now able to work from home since the pandemic.

But the Rail Delivery Group, which represents train operators, said "millions of people", including those who cannot work remotely, students sitting exams and others travelling for summer events, would still be affected.
_____________________________________________________

Analysis by Katy Austin

The mood music right now is that not enough progress has been made in negotiations to stop next week's walkouts.

Assuming they go ahead, there will be disruption across the whole week.

The involvement of Network Rail signalling staff means the number of trains that can run is particularly limited.

On strike days, the signallers' replacements can only cover 12 hours, hence services will start late and finish early - where they run at all.

Busy, key routes have been prioritised, meaning vast swathes of the country will be left with no services at all.

Network Rail says next week's action will cost up to £150m in lost revenue and aborted work.
_______________________________________________________________________

The RMT union has claimed Network Rail plans to cut up to 2,500 jobs as part of a £2bn reduction in spending, with the proposed job cuts including workers who maintain tracks, signals and overhead lines.

It also said train operators had been subject to pay freezes and changes to their terms and conditions.

On Tuesday, RMT called for a meeting with the transport secretary and chancellor, saying it had become clear that the Treasury was "calling the shots and not allowing rail employers to reach a negotiated settlement".

But a deal is "unlikely at the moment", said RMT's Eddie Dempsey, who accused the government of "relishing the thought of having a dispute to distract from some other issues".

Downing Street has previously branded the action selfish and said the union's move was "thoroughly irresponsible".

The rail industry is under pressure to save money due to the financial impact of the coronavirus pandemic and Network Rail has said it wants to modernise working practices.

It estimated between 1,500 and 2,000 fewer staff would be needed, but insists this could be achieved through voluntary means.

As part of a separate strike, Aslef, a union representing train drivers, has announced walkouts at three companies in rows over pay on 26 June at Hull Trains, at Greater Anglia on 23 June, and on Croydon Tramlink on 28, 29 June and 13 and 14 July.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 15, 2022, 06:06:48 pm
Network Rail have produced this map (https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/Map-showing-open-lines-during-strike-days-June-2022.jpg) showing the lines they will be able to open, presumably using the few non-striking staff capable of working as signallers.

I have mirrored the map at
http://www.wellho.net/pix/Map-showing-open-lines-during-strike-days-June-2022.jpg
in case Network Rail take it down at some point in the future


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 15, 2022, 06:12:45 pm
Various TOCs that do in-house servicing, rather than contracting out will obviously also have maintenance issues across the strike days, meaning stock unable to be used on the shoulder, non-strike days too as safety checks, refuelling of diesel units etc won't have been done - so are only offering service on shoulder days the same as strike days.

WMR & Chiltern at least two TOCs affected in this way. I'm unsure about GWR.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 16, 2022, 06:30:04 am

I know of someone who left the railway and now works in a power station. The PERMANENT night shifts rather than an endlessly changing shift pattern was the main reason for the change.

A bit more detail re this particular case.
The man in question USED to work at Hither Green railway depot, south east London. Various positions but all maintenance related and all requiring ever changing shift patterns.

They NOW work at the Isle of Grain power station, on permanent night shifts. The wages are a bit less but this is considered a price worth paying for stability.
They do not speak well of the railway as an employer, despite attractive sounding wages. At the power station they feel a "valued and useful member of the team" Whereas on the railway they felt that "management were always trying trying to catch you out in the hope of starting a disciplinary case"

They also state that co-workers at the power station are in general happier at work than railway staff were.

One particular difference is in uniform/overalls/workwear. On the railway they were required to wear "multiple layers of thick, hot, heavy polyester" and that the detailed requirements kept changing.
At the power station, simple overalls are provided and worn and LAUNDERED BY THE EMPLOYER.

They recently suffered a minor industrial accident, the enquiry into which was brief and simple and not a blame game.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 16, 2022, 06:33:16 am
Network Rail have produced this map showing the lines they will be able to open, presumably using the few non-striking staff capable of working as signallers.

Also, a reliance on managers who hold relevant competencies for Signalling, Electrical Control Rooms and in a limited way dealing with critical faults. these managers can only be rostered 37 hours in a week (basically 3 12 shifts) unless the individual agrees to longer, however there is a reluctance to grant time off in lieu or pay for additional shifts  

This cover could come to an end if the TSSA ballot call for industrial action.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on June 16, 2022, 11:05:33 am
If you look at the map you will see the TransWilts line is show as open on strike days but Melksham Station as closed.   That is because IETs will be used to run the service and they still can't stop there.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: oxviem on June 16, 2022, 11:08:45 am
Given that GWR are saying "check journey planners" is there any way to determine when the journey planners are showing the proposed emergency timetable?

I'm not sure if I'm seeing the "real" one for the 21st and it's quite confusing.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on June 16, 2022, 11:21:20 am
Given that GWR are saying "check journey planners" is there any way to determine when the journey planners are showing the proposed emergency timetable?

I'm not sure if I'm seeing the "real" one for the 21st and it's quite confusing.

GWR's site now has a page of more detailed plans (https://www.gwr.com/strike), including the dates for publishing the timetables to journey planners.

Strike/non-day    Date                          Publication
Non-strike day    Monday 20 June       Thursday 16 June
 Strike day         Tuesday 21 June      Thursday 16 June
 Non-strike day    Wednesday 22 June   Friday 17 June
 Strike day         Thursday 23 June       Thursday 16 June
 Non-strike day     Friday 24 June          Friday 17 June
 Strike day          Saturday 25 June      Tuesday 21 June
 Non-strike day     Sunday 26 June      Tuesday 21 June


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 16, 2022, 11:21:49 am
Given that GWR are saying "check journey planners" is there any way to determine when the journey planners are showing the proposed emergency timetable?

I'm not sure if I'm seeing the "real" one for the 21st and it's quite confusing.
I'm using RTT to see when services have been updated and so far this is still to happen. Every other TOC has posted actual revised timetables on their websites but as usual not GWR!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 16, 2022, 11:47:25 am
If you look at the map you will see the TransWilts line is show as open on strike days but Melksham Station as closed.   That is because IETs will be used to run the service and they still can't stop there.

Great!   Can we do a "Dilton Marsh" and stick our hand out to stop the train, please??   Only 25,000 people in our hamlet!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: oxviem on June 16, 2022, 02:50:39 pm

GWR's site now has a page of more detailed plans (https://www.gwr.com/strike), including the dates for publishing the timetables to journey planners.

Strike/non-day    Date                          Publication
Non-strike day    Monday 20 June       Thursday 16 June
 Strike day         Tuesday 21 June      Thursday 16 June

Agreed but when on the 16th - I look now and I'm still not convinced it's the emergency timetable so to the less informed they may make judgements based on this information. Sorry I sound exasperated and I do accept the challenges in providing the information but in my mind wrong information (ie what is currently in journey planners) is worse than none.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 16, 2022, 07:03:58 pm
Agreed but when on the 16th - I look now and I'm still not convinced it's the emergency timetable so to the less informed they may make judgements based on this information. Sorry I sound exasperated and I do accept the challenges in providing the information but in my mind wrong information (ie what is currently in journey planners) is worse than none.
Now put back until the 17th. Quite why GWR is taking longer than other TOCs to issue revised timetables I don’t know.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 17, 2022, 06:51:53 am
GWR Revised strike day timetables for the 21st and 23rd are now available to view in the Journey planner/train timetable viewer of your choice.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 17, 2022, 10:09:36 am
.........is anyone planning on rolling the dice and trying to travel by train next week?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on June 17, 2022, 10:18:40 am
As always with these things there are winners and losers.   If the scheduled timetable runs as planned there are more through trains to the West of England from Swindon than usual.  As it happens I will already be in Cornwall so it won't benefit me!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 17, 2022, 10:57:47 am
As always with these things there are winners and losers.   If the scheduled timetable runs as planned there are more through trains to the West of England from Swindon than usual.  As it happens I will already be in Cornwall so it won't benefit me!

The good news is that there will be more trains through Melksham than usual.  The bad news is than none of them will be stopping ... and to add icing to that cake (or insult to injury), there is no rail replacement bus service and no arrangement for train tickets to be accepted on service buses either.

Sometimes the feeling is "tails you loose, heads you don't win".   When SWR took off the services from Bradford-on-Avon to Waterloo, they gave the excuse that there was little commuter or school traffic on them (mostly leisure and personal/business use).    Now GWR are canning our trains - much used by commuters and with school traffic on them too in favour of leisure trains for such things as Glastonbury, and longer distance traffic which is predominantly personal business use.   Why can't First companies be consistent??


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: hoover50 on June 17, 2022, 01:09:19 pm
GWR Revised strike day timetables for the 21st and 23rd are now available to view in the Journey planner/train timetable viewer of your choice.

Does anyone know where I can find PDFs of the strike day timetables?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 17, 2022, 01:27:11 pm
As always with these things there are winners and losers.   If the scheduled timetable runs as planned there are more through trains to the West of England from Swindon than usual.  As it happens I will already be in Cornwall so it won't benefit me!

The good news is that there will be more trains through Melksham than usual.  The bad news is than none of them will be stopping ... and to add icing to that cake (or insult to injury), there is no rail replacement bus service and no arrangement for train tickets to be accepted on service buses either.

Sometimes the feeling is "tails you loose, heads you don't win".   When SWR took off the services from Bradford-on-Avon to Waterloo, they gave the excuse that there was little commuter or school traffic on them (mostly leisure and personal/business use).    Now GWR are canning our trains - much used by commuters and with school traffic on them too in favour of leisure trains for such things as Glastonbury, and longer distance traffic which is predominantly personal business use.   Why can't First companies be consistent??

These are exceptional circumstances Graham, people are being advised not to travel and if memory serves special arrangements have always been made for events such as Glastonbury - it is of course an unfortunate coincidence (I'm sure!) that the RMT have decided to strike in the coming week when there are so many events taking place which traditionally stretch the railway to the limit - perhaps you could enquire of Mr Lynch and his colleagues as to why this week was chosen? (any explanation other than to cause the maximum possible disruption and inconvenience would be enlightening!)

Whilst some commuters will no doubt be adversely affected, the large number now able to work from home in addition to those who already work a hybrid pattern since the pandemic will greatly mitigate that impact.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on June 17, 2022, 01:28:06 pm
Why can't First companies be consistent??

Why does the RMT have to strike forcing these decisions?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Mark A on June 17, 2022, 01:31:08 pm
Possibly. To Swindon on the first train from Bath Spa at 7:43ish and back in the evening, lots of trains back via Swindon on Wednesday evening for some reason.

*Looks at events calendar in Somerset*

*Colour drains from face*

Mark


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 17, 2022, 01:45:17 pm
GWR Revised strike day timetables for the 21st and 23rd are now available to view in the Journey planner/train timetable viewer of your choice.

Does anyone know where I can find PDFs of the strike day timetables?
Sadly GWR don’t believe in producing timetables at times of disruption, engineering work or industrial action and haven’t done so for many years despite at one time being one of the best TOCs for doing so. We are always told to consult journey planners for times of trains.

Every TOC website that I’ve visited that’s affected by next week’s strike action have published revised timetables. Why can’t GWR?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: the void on June 17, 2022, 02:22:36 pm
GWR Revised strike day timetables for the 21st and 23rd are now available to view in the Journey planner/train timetable viewer of your choice.

Does anyone know where I can find PDFs of the strike day timetables?
Sadly GWR don’t believe in producing timetables at times of disruption, engineering work or industrial action and haven’t done so for many years despite at one time being one of the best TOCs for doing so. We are always told to consult journey planners for times of trains.

Every TOC website that I’ve visited that’s affected by next week’s strike action have published revised timetables. Why can’t GWR?

TOCs can plan what services they would like to run next week, but none of them can actually guarantee they will be able to deliver the revised timetable. If no signalers turn up, there won't be any services running! So what is the point of publishing a revised timetable that may ultimately be completely inaccurate. Is it not better to wait until the day and see what happens? The advice across the whole industry is to avoid travelling if possible.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 17, 2022, 03:21:07 pm
These are exceptional circumstances Graham, ....

I understand that.  Just as we have had "exceptional circumstances" nearly every year since the published timetable increased in December 2013.  If it's not Box Tunnel closed, it's staff shortage. And if it's not a reduced Covid timetable it's the Berks and Hants closed. Or perhaps it's the signal cables were cut or the staff going on strike or Westbury station being shut so they can relay it.  All of those rather longer than just a day or two. 

I sometimes feel that an "exceptional circumstance" would a summer with running all day throughout.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 17, 2022, 03:34:11 pm
These are exceptional circumstances Graham, ....

I understand that.  Just as we have had "exceptional circumstances" nearly every year since the published timetable increased in December 2013.  If it's not Box Tunnel closed, it's staff shortage. And if it's not a reduced Covid timetable it's the Berks and Hants closed. Or perhaps it's the signal cables were cut or the staff going on strike or Westbury station being shut so they can relay it.  All of those rather longer than just a day or two. 

I sometimes feel that an "exceptional circumstance" would be a summer with running all day throughout.

Not forgetting the apparently surprising need to train staff on the new trains, or the need for extra staff on a 10 car IET, Easter arriving without warning, or new trains getting drowned at Dawlish, and of course seasonal weather which no one could have foreseen.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 17, 2022, 04:32:07 pm
These are exceptional circumstances Graham, ....

I understand that.  Just as we have had "exceptional circumstances" nearly every year since the published timetable increased in December 2013.  If it's not Box Tunnel closed, it's staff shortage. And if it's not a reduced Covid timetable it's the Berks and Hants closed. Or perhaps it's the signal cables were cut or the staff going on strike or Westbury station being shut so they can relay it.  All of those rather longer than just a day or two. 

I sometimes feel that an "exceptional circumstance" would be a summer with running all day throughout.

Not forgetting the apparently surprising need to train staff on the new trains, or the need for extra staff on a 10 car IET, Easter arriving without warning, or new trains getting drowned at Dawlish, and of course seasonal weather which no one could have foreseen.

Not forgotten, but I'm being specific about Melksham Station's service.  We've had a couple of HSTs call, but never an IET even though they run through often enough.   I WILL half-give you the weather one, with GWR not running any trains for multiple days when the bad weather meant they could run trains, even long after other lines had re-opened - but a winter not a summer issue.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 18, 2022, 09:01:05 am
Well, that's it then - Gentlemen (and ladies) of the railway, load your weapons, and take aim at your feet.............

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/rail-and-tube-strikes-will-go-ahead-next-week/?fbclid=IwAR0EXNC4oMsH1rP31ljdA1CSJDYXQbohcieDafup6wxTk8YRhvO4igGDGkk


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on June 18, 2022, 09:30:30 am
RMT's statement  (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-statement/)today reads:
Quote
In the past few weeks, discussions have been taking place at senior level with Network Rail, Train Operators and London Underground.

Despite the best efforts of our negotiators no viable settlements to the disputes have been created.

It has to be re-stated that the source of these disputes is the decision by the Tory Government to cut £4bn of funding from our transport systems - £2bn from national rail and £2bn from Transport for London.

As a result of this transport austerity imposed by the Government, the employing companies have taken decisions to:

    Savage the Railway Pension Scheme and the TFL scheme, cutting benefits, making staff work longer, and poorer in retirement, while paying increased contributions.
    Thousands of job cuts across the rail networks.
    Attacking terms, conditions and working practices in a form of internal fire and re-hire.
    Cutting real pay for most of our members through lengthy pay freezes and below RPI inflation pay proposals.

In the face of this massive attack on our people the RMT cannot be passive.

So today, having heard the reports on the discussions that have been taking place we are confirming that the strike action scheduled to take place on 21st, 23rd and 25th June will go ahead.

We want a transport system that operates for the benefit of the people, for the needs of society and our environment – not for private profit.

We call on our members to stand firm, support the action, mount the pickets and demonstrate their willingness to fight for workplace justice.

Every worker in Britain deserves a pay rise that reflects the cost-of-living crises. All working people should have the benefit of good negotiated terms, conditions, working practices and occupational pensions that will ensure their living standards in retirement.

We call on the entire labour movement and the working people to rally to the support of the RMT and our members in this struggle.

The RMT will support every group of workers who organise and fight for these aims and we call for joint campaigning and coordinated action to achieve a better deal for workers and a fairer society.

RMT remains available for discussions that will settle this dispute and ensure our transport system can operate without disruption.

Or, as summarised on the site of the International Committee of the Fourth International (ICFI):
Quote
UK: RMT officials offer surrender to Tories on eve of national rail strikes, as Corbyn and McDonnell give their blessing
Chris Marsden
15 hours ago

Rail, Maritime and Transport union (RMT) General Secretary Mick Lynch appealed for direct talks with the Conservative government June 15, in a begging letter to Transport Secretary Grant Shapps. Had Shapps accepted, there is no doubt that next week’s planned strikes would have been called off as the RMT negotiated a rotten betrayal...



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 18, 2022, 10:30:08 am
RMT's statement  (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-statement/)today reads:
Quote
Or, as summarised on the site of the International Committee of the Fourth International (ICFI):
Quote
UK: RMT officials offer surrender to Tories on eve of national rail strikes, as Corbyn and McDonnell give their blessing
Chris Marsden
15 hours ago

Rail, Maritime and Transport union (RMT) General Secretary Mick Lynch appealed for direct talks with the Conservative government June 15, in a begging letter to Transport Secretary Grant Shapps. Had Shapps accepted, there is no doubt that next week’s planned strikes would have been called off as the RMT negotiated a rotten betrayal...



That's classic, brilliant! I can almost hear the Internationale playing in the background!

(Typing must be tricky whilst singing it and raising one hand in a clenched fist!)  :D


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on June 18, 2022, 02:20:58 pm

Paul Waugh iNews is reporting that the reasons the negotiations broke down is because the train companies have been instructed by DfT not to properly negotiate. 

https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370 (https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370)

In other words this strike is not caused by RMT, but by Grant Shapps. Judging by the rhetoric presumably so that they can blame it on the Labour Party to make it sound like a Corbyn and McDonald still run the party.  They are trying to re-run the battles of the 1960's and 70's.  Obviously coincidental that there are two byelections this week. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 18, 2022, 04:10:45 pm

Paul Waugh iNews is reporting that the reasons the negotiations broke down is because the train companies have been instructed by DfT not to properly negotiate. 

https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370 (https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370)

In other words this strike is not caused by RMT, but by Grant Shapps. Judging by the rhetoric presumably so that they can blame it on the Labour Party to make it sound like a Corbyn and McDonald still run the party.  They are trying to re-run the battles of the 1960's and 70's.  Obviously coincidental that there are two byelections this week. 

The article is behind a paywall but it's all he said/she said now, hard to know who to believe.

I suspect the chance to have two by-elections in the same week as the strike along with Glastonbury, the Headingley Test match and GCSE & A Level exams to disrupt was too good an opportunity for the RMT to miss and another reason why they chose these dates.

I think the Tories will struggle to pin it on Labour given the Opposition Leadership's at best ambiguous attitude towards the RMT's actions, I am sure they will try but let's face it, Lynch etc and Starmer are hardly fellow travellers, in any sense next week!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 18, 2022, 04:28:13 pm

Paul Waugh iNews is reporting that the reasons the negotiations broke down is because the train companies have been instructed by DfT not to properly negotiate. 

https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370 (https://inews.co.uk/news/train-strike-chaos-continue-ministers-rail-firms-rmt-1693370)

In other words this strike is not caused by RMT, but by Grant Shapps. Judging by the rhetoric presumably so that they can blame it on the Labour Party to make it sound like a Corbyn and McDonald still run the party.  They are trying to re-run the battles of the 1960's and 70's.  Obviously coincidental that there are two byelections this week. 

The article is behind a paywall but it's all he said/she said now, hard to know who to believe.

I suspect the chance to have two by-elections in the same week as the strike along with Glastonbury, the Headingley Test match and GCSE & A Level exams to disrupt was too good an opportunity for the RMT to miss and another reason why they chose these dates.

I think the Tories will struggle to pin it on Labour given the Opposition Leadership's at best ambiguous attitude towards the RMT's actions, I am sure they will try but let's face it, Lynch etc and Starmer are hardly fellow travellers, in any sense next week!

It does not matter which week is chosen, there will always be events happening. At the end of June is Wimbledon and Henley for example.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Robin Summerhill on June 18, 2022, 05:43:53 pm


It does not matter which week is chosen, there will always be events happening. At the end of June is Wimbledon and Henley for example.

Quite. And indeed the Tories could actually get political mileage out of an "evil unions" stance at the by-elections


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Henry on June 18, 2022, 07:05:00 pm

  I notice ASLEF have also voted for Industrial Action, which seems to be
  totally ignored by the media. Which, unlike the RMT, does involve a majority of
  train driver's. So who is going to drive the trains ?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on June 18, 2022, 07:18:39 pm

  I notice ASLEF have also voted for Industrial Action, which seems to be
  totally ignored by the media. Which, unlike the RMT, does involve a majority of
  train driver's. So who is going to drive the trains ?

ASLEF are voting TOC by TOC, and so far results and resulting strike dates have only been announced for Greater Anglia and Hull trains. This was last Thursday's statement (https://aslef.org.uk/publications/britains-train-drivers-union-announces-strike-action):
Quote
ASLEF, the train drivers’ trade union, today [Thursday] announced strike action over pay:

[/i] Drivers at Greater Anglia will strike between 00:01 and 23:59 Thursday 23 June 2022.

[ii] Drivers at Hull Trains will strike between 00:01 and 23:59 on Sunday 26 June.

[iii] And tram drivers in south London will strike for a fair pay deal from 00:01 on Tuesday 28 June until 23:59 on Wednesday 29 June and from 00:01 on Wednesday 13 July until 23:59 on Thursday 14 July.

Finn Brennan, ASLEF’s organiser on the Underground, said: ‘More than six months after the end of our last pay settlement and with the RPI rate of inflation running at over 11%, there has still been no offer from the company to resolve this dispute. Every day our members are seeing the price of their necessities, from fuel to food go up, while the real value of wages has fallen dramatically. Tram drivers, like other workers in public transport do a difficult and demanding job with round the clock shifts seven days a week. They deserve fair pay and are determined to fight for it.’

He added: ‘ASLEF members on Croydon Tramlink returned an incredible 99.2% Yes vote to strike on a turnout of over 86 %. It is a result that any union would be proud of and demonstrates just how strongly our members feel about managements failure to make an acceptable pay offer. The ball is now in management’s court. They can either make a fair offer or face the prospect of hard hitting and drawn-out strike action. I hope they will choose the sensible option our members are ready and prepared to act if they do not.’

Mick Whelan, general secretary of ASLEF, the train drivers’ union, says that figures published this week by the DfT that reveal that passenger numbers on Britain’s railways are nearly back to normal – back to pre-pandemic levels – underlines why there is no need for rail workers to be asked, effectively, to take a pay cut.

Mick said: ‘The latest Department for Transport statistics show that passenger numbers reached the milestone of 90% of pre-covid levels on Thursday 19 May – and went up to 92% over the next three days. That’s great news – not just for the railways, but for Britain.

‘But this blows the argument that “there is no money” right out of the water. There is, now the railway is returning to normal, because passengers are back and services are packed again.

‘Many of our members have not had a pay rise since 2019. We will fight to maintain the pay, terms & conditions, and the pensions of our members. We are not naïve. The train companies are doing very well out of Britain’s railways – with handsome profits, dividends for shareholders, and big salaries for managers – and we are not going to work longer, for less. We want a pay rise, for train drivers, who kept people and goods moving during the pandemic, in line with the cost of living, so that we are not, in real terms, worse off.’

 
Note to editors:

ASLEF has called ballots for industrial action over pay at Arriva Rail London; Chiltern; Croydon Tramlink; Greater Anglia; Great Western; Hull Trains; LNER; Northern Trains; ScotRail; Southeastern; TransPennine Express; and West Midlands Trains.

We have successfully concluded pay deals with DB Cargo; Eurostar; Freightliner Heavy Haul; Freightliner Intermodal; GB Railfreight; Merseyrail; MTR Elizabeth line; and PRE Metro Operations.

And we also have multi-year deals with other companies, which were previously agreed, already in place.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Henry on June 18, 2022, 08:28:37 pm

 Yes, sorry stand corrected.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on June 18, 2022, 10:34:00 pm
I think the Tories will struggle to pin it on Labour given the Opposition Leadership's at best ambiguous attitude towards the RMT's actions, I am sure they will try but let's face it, Lynch etc and Starmer are hardly fellow travellers, in any sense next week!

You may be right, but they are certainly trying. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on June 18, 2022, 10:40:27 pm
For completeness, these are the timescales of TSSA's relevant ballots. Other railway employers (https://www.tssa.org.uk/find-your-company?letter=N) can be found via the TSSA website:

Quote
TSSA has served notice to ballot almost five hundred workers at Great Western Railway (GWR) for strike action and action short of strike in a dispute over pay, conditions and job security.

The union is demanding a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies for 2022, no unagreed changes to terms and conditions, and a pay increase which reflects the rising cost of living.

Ballots open: 24 June 2022
Ballots close: 12 July 2022
The earliest that industrial action could be taken is 26 July 2022.

These ballot follows hot on the heels of similar announcements in Network Rail, Cross Country, East Midlands Railway, West Midlands Trains, and Avanti West Coast, Northern, LNER and C2C in an escalating dispute across the railway.
Quote
Rail union TSSA has served notice to ballot over 6,000 staff at Network Rail for strike action and action short of strike in a dispute over pay, conditions and job security.

The ballot comes as part of an escalating dispute with Network Rail and the wider rail industry, which could result in widespread disruption across Britain’s rail network. TSSA’s members work in operational, control, management and safety critical roles on rail services across Britain.

TSSA is demanding a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies for 2022, no unagreed changes to terms and conditions, and a pay increase which reflects the rising cost of living. Network Rail staff last had a pay rise between two and three years ago (it varies between grades) and also worked throughout the coronavirus pandemic as key workers.

Members are being asked to cast two votes: one on strike action, another on action short of strike. The timetable for the ballot is:
Ballot opens: 20 June 2022
Ballot closes: 11 July 2022
In the event of a yes vote, strike action could take place as early as 25 July 2022


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Birdie100 on June 19, 2022, 09:33:45 pm
Apologies if this has been covered before but how will the mechanics of the strike work in practice, particularly with respect to the signallers? I assume tomorrow (Monday) will run as normal, but ordinarily I’d assume the signallers would handover shifts overnight. I’d have thought every last train out on the network must be able to return before the last signallers clocks off? Presumably the ‘shutdown’ late tomorrow will not be dissimilar to winding down for the Christmas/ Boxing Day holiday? The very few signallers not striking then run the skeleton service left, with I’d have thought minimum staffing eg at least 2 present in the case they need a break?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 20, 2022, 12:22:55 am
Signalling managers will cover most of the TVSC and boxes that are planned to remain open during the strike.

RMT members booking on before 23:59 in the eve of a strike day will be expected to do so and remain until the end of their shift, so with many night shifts starting at the traditional time of 10pm or thereabouts, getting trains to final destinations shouldn’t be an issue on Monday night.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 20, 2022, 06:17:31 pm
Interestingly, most TOCS *are* closing down early, to be back in their stabling no later than midnight.

Also to note, that Hull Trains have settled with the union & their ASLEF strike has been called off after succcessful negotiations. I wonder what their deal was?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 20, 2022, 09:32:49 pm
Interestingly, most TOCS *are* closing down early, to be back in their stabling no later than midnight.

Are you referring to tonight’s end of service that was being discussed or later on in the week?

A quick check of GWR, SWR, and Chiltern shows (I think) all their trains that terminate between midnight and gone 2am currently running normally tonight.  The 00:32 Paddington to Oxford is one such example.  There are however some ‘signaller taken ill’ cancellations a little earlier on affecting some service through Reading.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 21, 2022, 06:58:54 am
And so the first strike day.  As I write prior to 07:00, nothing running.  Ironically, no reported short term changes on JourneyCheck for once - no cancellations, no short runs, no trains shorter than usual or running without normal toilet or catering facilities.   Simply no trains ...


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 21, 2022, 07:12:18 am
And so the first strike day.  As I write prior to 07:00, nothing running.  Ironically, no reported short term changes on JourneyCheck for once - no cancellations, no short runs, no trains shorter than usual or running without normal toilet or catering facilities.   Simply no trains ...

For the contingency to be 'reliable' 12 hours is the maximum that can be covered, the staff and managers who are working are still governed by Network Rails policy, which is based on legislation with its origins from The 'Hidden Report'

Quote
Guidance on the Management of Door-to-Door Work & Travel Time. These
are set out below:
No-one shall work more than 13 consecutive turns of duty in any 14-day period.
No more than 12 hours to be worked per turn of duty/shift.
A minimum rest period of 12 hours between shifts including any travelling time. This may be reduced to 8 hours at
the weekly shift changeover, in the case of staff working a shift pattern which rotates or alternates on a weekly basis.
 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Marlburian on June 21, 2022, 11:15:37 am
Popped into Tilehurst Station at 0715 this morning on my way to the Big Shop. I was surprised to see that the screen offered a good range of services. Had "they" bothered to change it, I thought. A couple turned up with suitcases; optimists, I thought.

Just checked on Realtime trains, and there seems to have been reasonable service both ways since 0756 this morning. The 0122 also ran.

Might have to revise my revised plans for tomorrow, when I was resigned to not being able to get to Twyford by train for an environmental task close to the station. (Usually my tasks out that way involve a 20-minute walk from the station to Ruscombe.)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Hafren on June 21, 2022, 12:04:16 pm
I had a look at RTT earlier to see how things were going. Something that grabbed my attention was the train formations; there's a 2 car on the remnants of the CDF-PMH route, and several 5 cars on intercity routes. A bit irritating when the operators are generally advising people to expect busy trains, on a day when the stock utilisation rate is well below the usual, but it's understandable that positioning stock for an optimal service start may be difficult today (and I've no idea what actual loadings have been like today). I hope the 5 car appearances on journeys serving Castle Cary don't persist later this week! Contrast with SWR; a look at Waterloo shows almost exclusively maximum length 10/12 car trains.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 21, 2022, 12:08:36 pm
Possibly something to do with the leasing arrangement with Hitachi & how much notice needs giving in order for them to turn out trains of different lengths to 'usual'?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2022, 12:17:27 pm
Might have to revise my revised plans for tomorrow, when I was resigned to not being able to get to Twyford by train for an environmental task close to the station. (Usually my tasks out that way involve a 20-minute walk from the station to Ruscombe.)

An hour or so sat at Twyford during the day today and you could be forgiven for not being aware a strike is on.  Sixteen trains an hour serving or passing through the station.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 21, 2022, 12:36:19 pm
Possibly something to do with the leasing arrangement with Hitachi & how much notice needs giving in order for them to turn out trains of different lengths to 'usual'?

If so, then hitachi should be told firmly where to go.
Their new trains have been a miserable failure in general availability, and they should therefore be bending over backwards to be as helpful as possible, and NOT putting up more obstacles.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Phantom on June 21, 2022, 12:41:15 pm
Does anyone know what potential dates strikes could be held after this week?
I am going to London on the 30th (from WsM) and was looking to sort other days out by train soon too


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: nickswift99 on June 21, 2022, 12:51:09 pm
Unions are required to give 14 days notice of action, so you can safely assume that there will be no further strike action after this week until at least the 6th July.

Of course, the unions currently in dispute may well also be taking actions short of striking which may make services less reliable.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Hafren on June 21, 2022, 12:54:16 pm
Possibly something to do with the leasing arrangement with Hitachi & how much notice needs giving in order for them to turn out trains of different lengths to 'usual'?

That wouldn't be a surprise. I've had similar issues during engineering works, when the on-train announcement was that the use of a (full) 5 car set on the 'far' side of the blockade was because of something or other to do with the contract with Hitachi. (There would have been a full fleet from the previous night so it wouldn't have been a case of too few sets being that side of the blockade.)

I wondered if Maliphant and Fratton (re CDF-WSB route) being off-limits would be a factor, although with fewer trains running the remaining depots would be turning out fewer sets than usual anyway.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 21, 2022, 02:10:19 pm
Is it just strike notice that has to have 14 days notice or any action short of a strike as well? Or can the latter just begin whenever the union decides?

Also, just be a wee bit aware that new strike dates could be announced before these have completed, say on Friday….but yes, 14 days clear notice required for any more strikes, which of course can start & end at sny time within the 24 hours. A favourite used to be 1359 one day to 1358 the next day, which screwed two full days for one lost shift


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2022, 02:52:33 pm
I believe ‘Action short of a strike’ can be instigated and run whenever and for however long.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 21, 2022, 04:14:24 pm
Never a good day for this to happen, but today of all days.......


Alterations to services between London Paddington and Reading

Due to a person hit by a train between London Paddington and Reading all lines are closed.
Train services running to and from these stations may be delayed or revised. Windsor & Eton Central will not be served. Disruption is expected until 17:30 21/06.
Customer Advice
Owing to the emergency services dealing with an incident train services between London Paddington and Reading, together with the line between Slough and Windsor & Eton Central are currently suspended.

Owing to the Industrial Action taking place today, resulting in special services being operated over parts the National Rail network, with some routes devoid of any service, it is very much regretted that alternative travel options are extremely limited.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2022, 04:40:45 pm
Never a good day for this to happen, but today of all days.......

Two of the four lines reopened at Slough where the incident took place as you posted that message.  The reduced number of trains and passengers should mean that the area can cope with only half the line capacity available, though it looks as if Slough station will remain shut and the Windsor branch suspended for a while longer. 

You could argue that it is as near as you can get to a 'good' day for it to happen.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 21, 2022, 04:54:10 pm
Never a good day for this to happen, but today of all days.......

Two of the four lines reopened at Slough where the incident took place as you posted that message.  The reduced number of trains and passengers should mean that the area can cope with only half the line capacity available, though it looks as if Slough station will remain shut and the Windsor branch suspended for a while longer. 

You could argue that it is as near as you can get to a 'good' day for it to happen.

Updated message

Due to a person hit by a train between London Paddington and Reading some lines are closed.
Train services running to and from these stations may be delayed by up to 60 minutes or revised. Windsor & Eton Central and Slough will not be served. Disruption is expected until 19:30 21/06.

Customer Advice
The emergency services are dealing with an incident and have been able to release two of the four tracks in the affected area for train services between London Paddington and Reading to resume operation. However, Slough and Windsor & Eton Central stations will not currently be served


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2022, 04:56:59 pm
Windsor branch suspended for the rest of the truncated days service.  Delays to services not directly affected at the time only 5-10 or so minutes as they go past on the relief lines.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 21, 2022, 06:02:54 pm
I believe ‘Action short of a strike’ can be instigated and run whenever and for however long.

Also known as working to rule.  Staff just do their contracted hours which for most Network Rail is 35 hours and would also have a big impact on the current contingency cover provided by managers and technical grades



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Bob_Blakey on June 21, 2022, 06:22:30 pm
Out on the bike between Exeter and Dawlish / Rewe. 'Castles' very much in evidence with a few IET9's - RTT indicates that the former were running PLY<>BRI hourly with the latter doing PLY<>PAD roughly every 2 hours. The Red Cow Level Crossing - north end of EXD for anybody not already aware - keepers were absent so the pedestrian gates had been padlocked shut. There was a small RMT picket opposite the north end of the TMD. Whilst waiting for the barriers to open I did clock a few unsuccessful attempts by the RMT crew to hand explanatory leaflets to queuing vehicle drivers.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 21, 2022, 06:42:07 pm
More talks now planned for tomorrow...


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on June 21, 2022, 07:49:28 pm
It is clear that some trains did run but that the disruption was significant.

Does anyone know if the disruption was as "good" as the RMT expected ? If the disruption was "better" than expected than that seems likely to encourage more strikes.

If however the strike was less effective than was hoped, then that might discourage more strikes.

The RMT will no doubt declare the strike a great success, and "the railway" will no doubt claim that they ran more services than expected, and hope to do even better in future strikes.

Are there any more independent views ?










Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 21, 2022, 08:19:29 pm
Windsor branch suspended for the rest of the truncated days service.  Delays to services not directly affected at the time only 5-10 or so minutes as they go past on the relief lines.

We can only hope that Her Majesty didn't fancy a night out in Slough tonight.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2022, 08:28:11 pm
Bang goes even more public sympathy (to be fair, there was very little to lose)

A YouGov poll just released does indeed show more of the public 'oppose' the strikes than are 'for' them...but not by very much at all - a difference of just 8% in fact:

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/rail-tubes-strikes-london-underground-oppose-support-new-poll-b1007535.html


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Oxonhutch on June 21, 2022, 09:39:32 pm
We can only hope that Her Majesty didn't fancy a night out in Slough tonight.

I can only hope for Her Majesty that a night on the Slough tiles is never on her agenda.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on June 21, 2022, 09:43:27 pm
From what I’ve seen over the past few days, particularly today, Mick Lynch is definitely winning the media war making some big name MSM journos look rather foolish with their at times bizarre lines of questioning.

Grant Shapps on the other hand looked flustered and irritated in the two interviews I saw this morning with the PM later in the day asking the cabinet to support Grant.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 21, 2022, 10:03:51 pm
It is clear that some trains did run but that the disruption was significant.

Does anyone know if the disruption was as "good" as the RMT expected ? If the disruption was "better" than expected than that seems likely to encourage more strikes.

If however the strike was less effective than was hoped, then that might discourage more strikes.

The RMT will no doubt declare the strike a great success, and "the railway" will no doubt claim that they ran more services than expected, and hope to do even better in future strikes.

Are there any more independent views ?

Well - Transport Focus visited stations closed, open with just a single service, and open with rather more.  I don't know if you would consider these a success, but these are blindingly obvious findings:

Quote
At Cannon Street in London, which is closed, it was eerily quiet

Quote
An early-morning visit to Brighton revealed a much quieter station than normal and plenty of staff on hand for those passengers who were travelling.

Quote
Another colleague who visited Fleet station for us reported that it looked like most people had stayed away and reverted to working from home.






Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: nickswift99 on June 21, 2022, 10:13:58 pm
We can only hope that Her Majesty didn't fancy a night out in Slough tonight.

I can only hope for Her Majesty that a night on the Slough tiles is never on her agenda.

I'm fairly certain that the emergency marmalade sandwich would need deploying should she find herself stranded.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 22, 2022, 07:02:31 am
Following further on "how effective was the strike?"

From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61883770)

Quote
One new factor in this rail strike was that many commuters are now set up to work from home if they need to.

So, although some bosses will no doubt have found it frustrating, it means the impact isn't as serious for some workers as it might have been in the past.

Frank Bird, a senior network planner at Highways England, said in the post-pandemic world people had come up with a much better Plan B when they can't get into work, and for many that means working from home rather than driving.

Long article, much more detail


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 22, 2022, 07:06:34 am
I have renamed this topic from "RMT strike days announced" to "RMT strike days, June 2022" to reflect the strikes (at least the first one) actually taking place and the information about them all being within this topic.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 22, 2022, 07:30:00 am
The Mummy returns!

Good to see the old boy getting out and about on the picket line - still wearing the 1984 baseball cap too!

I'm sure the RMT are hoping it isn't an omen!

 :)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: 1st fan on June 22, 2022, 02:14:05 pm
I had a look at RTT earlier to see how things were going. Something that grabbed my attention was the train formations; there's a 2 car on the remnants of the CDF-PMH route, and several 5 cars on intercity routes. A bit irritating when the operators are generally advising people to expect busy trains, on a day when the stock utilisation rate is well below the usual, but it's understandable that positioning stock for an optimal service start may be difficult today (and I've no idea what actual loadings have been like today). I hope the 5 car appearances on journeys serving Castle Cary don't persist later this week! Contrast with SWR; a look at Waterloo shows almost exclusively maximum length 10/12 car trains.

I spoke to an ex colleague who now lives in an area where GWR don’t have service during strike days. He’s more than a little upset that the advice is don’t travel, he doesn’t have a train service to travel on and needs one to get to work*. However GWR are able to run several trains a day to “allow people to go to a music festival that doesn’t have any music playing for days”.

*If he’s a no show at his job he doesn’t get paid. Doesn’t believe that GWR have got their priorities straight as a result.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 22, 2022, 02:42:29 pm
I had a look at RTT earlier to see how things were going. Something that grabbed my attention was the train formations; there's a 2 car on the remnants of the CDF-PMH route, and several 5 cars on intercity routes. A bit irritating when the operators are generally advising people to expect busy trains, on a day when the stock utilisation rate is well below the usual, but it's understandable that positioning stock for an optimal service start may be difficult today (and I've no idea what actual loadings have been like today). I hope the 5 car appearances on journeys serving Castle Cary don't persist later this week! Contrast with SWR; a look at Waterloo shows almost exclusively maximum length 10/12 car trains.

I spoke to an ex colleague who now lives in an area where GWR don’t have service during strike days. He’s more than a little upset that the advice is don’t travel, he doesn’t have a train service to travel on and needs one to get to work*. However GWR are able to run several trains a day to “allow people to go to a music festival that doesn’t have any music playing for days”.

*If he’s a no show at his job he doesn’t get paid. Doesn’t believe that GWR have got their priorities straight as a result.

It may be that GWR had no choice in the lack of services to your exColleague. As  I understand it, most of the places lacking GWR trains was the lack of Network Rail staff to keep the lines open.  The only exception was Melksham where the line was open - 4 trains each way on strike day - but they didn't stop them!



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: didcotdean on June 22, 2022, 03:16:08 pm
Bang goes even more public sympathy (to be fair, there was very little to lose)

A YouGov poll just released does indeed show more of the public 'oppose' the strikes than are 'for' them...but not by very much at all - a difference of just 8% in fact:

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/rail-tubes-strikes-london-underground-oppose-support-new-poll-b1007535.html
As with any opinion poll, the results depend on the exact wording of the question, and possibly what is asked leading up to the question. A poll taken around the same time by a different pollster (ComRes) indicates 58% of people think the rail strikes are justified. Still finely balanced though.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 22, 2022, 03:39:33 pm
Yes I agree. 

Some of yesterday’s media interviews with Mick Lynch verged on the ridiculous IMHO and made it ridiculously easy for him. 

I’m no fan, but by and large was fairly impressed with how he handled the media.  More so than Shapps anyway.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: 1st fan on June 22, 2022, 05:45:19 pm
I had a look at RTT earlier to see how things were going. Something that grabbed my attention was the train formations; there's a 2 car on the remnants of the CDF-PMH route, and several 5 cars on intercity routes. A bit irritating when the operators are generally advising people to expect busy trains, on a day when the stock utilisation rate is well below the usual, but it's understandable that positioning stock for an optimal service start may be difficult today (and I've no idea what actual loadings have been like today). I hope the 5 car appearances on journeys serving Castle Cary don't persist later this week! Contrast with SWR; a look at Waterloo shows almost exclusively maximum length 10/12 car trains.

I spoke to an ex colleague who now lives in an area where GWR don’t have service during strike days. He’s more than a little upset that the advice is don’t travel, he doesn’t have a train service to travel on and needs one to get to work*. However GWR are able to run several trains a day to “allow people to go to a music festival that doesn’t have any music playing for days”.

*If he’s a no show at his job he doesn’t get paid. Doesn’t believe that GWR have got their priorities straight as a result.

It may be that GWR had no choice in the lack of services to your exColleague. As  I understand it, most of the places lacking GWR trains was the lack of Network Rail staff to keep the lines open.  The only exception was Melksham where the line was open - 4 trains each way on strike day - but they didn't stop them!



I know that, you know that, but try telling him that.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: CyclingSid on June 23, 2022, 06:58:14 am
Be careful what comparisons you use?
https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA (https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 23, 2022, 08:26:16 am
Paddington looking very quiet this morning, I doubt the same can be said for the roads heading to Glastonbury!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on June 23, 2022, 08:44:51 am
Be careful what comparisons you use?
https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA (https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA)

This os a better one!

https://twitter.com/rmtunion/status/1539645558016851969?s=21&t=gJiIRBM-UEGqsbMMw-_BWQ


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 23, 2022, 11:08:38 am
Be careful what comparisons you use?
https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA (https://twitter.com/SueSuezep/status/1539203545529991172?cxt=HHwWiICyhYferNwqAAAA)

Certainly the MP's approach needs to be modernised, they have after all chosen not to vacate the Palace of Westminster to allow the quickest and most cost effective means of renovating the building instead they have chosen to keep to their old working practices of tea rooms and bars.   Don't get me started on the stalled devolution process and house of Lords, there should be a parliament for England with the house of Lords being the Federal Governance of the UK ............... but then its only the Railways that have out dated Victoria working practices  ;D


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 23, 2022, 12:56:31 pm
Meanwhile the GWR ASLEF ballots have been issued, with votes to be returned no later than 11th July.  Should 'action short of a strike' or 'strike action' be voted for then it would be likely to commence in about a month from now.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Henry on June 23, 2022, 01:17:41 pm

 Speculation on the BBC news, airport staff balloted for strike action.
 Expected yes vote, talking about industrial action on or about 23 July.
 No doubt that should the RMT not reach an aggrement, would they also have this date in
 mind for any future action ?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 23, 2022, 06:32:33 pm

 Speculation on the BBC news, airport staff balloted for strike action.
 Expected yes vote, talking about industrial action on or about 23 July.
 No doubt that should the RMT not reach an aggrement, would they also have this date in
 mind for any future action ?

Trains, planes, thank God for automobiles!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61906236


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Oxonhutch on June 23, 2022, 10:45:26 pm
Waiting to see if the strike will affect my railway on Saturday when I am Fat Controller. I could ask my management for a 100% pay rise right now, and they would agree on the spot.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: CyclingSid on June 24, 2022, 06:52:54 am
100% of not a lot?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 25, 2022, 07:40:41 am
Blimey. Didn't realise the Railways suits salaries were quite that high!

I wonder how Hopwoods et al compare?

They must have a good Trade Union, I doubt Sundays are part of their working week either!!!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on June 25, 2022, 08:17:15 am
Blimey. Didn't realise the Railways suits salaries were quite that high!

I wonder how Hopwoods et al compare?

They must have a good Trade Union, I doubt Sundays are part of their working week either!!!

I'm not sure whether this has been mentioned before, but I have been shown an email which contains the following paragraph relating to GWR directors....

Quote
Meanwhile in the Accounting years 2020 to 2021 all of the Directors pay increased by £126,000 (or more than 18%!) from £685,000 in 2020 to £811,000 in 2021, all while staff received a pay freeze and real terms pay cut! It looks like only 4 directors were paid direct by GWR (the others were paid by Group) and we know that one left in June 2021 and the highest paid director dropped their pay by £10,000 to £282,000 (or this could have been as a result of a Director leaving perhaps?) so on average the Directors who received a pay rise received an average pay increase of somewhere between £34,000-45,333 each! More than many staff receive in a full year!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 25, 2022, 08:41:31 am
Blimey. Didn't realise the Railways suits salaries were quite that high!

I wonder how Hopwoods et al compare?

They must have a good Trade Union, I doubt Sundays are part of their working week either!!!

I'm not sure whether this has been mentioned before, but I have been shown an email which contains the following paragraph relating to GWR directors....

Quote
Meanwhile in the Accounting years 2020 to 2021 all of the Directors pay increased by £126,000 (or more than 18%!) from £685,000 in 2020 to £811,000 in 2021, all while staff received a pay freeze and real terms pay cut! It looks like only 4 directors were paid direct by GWR (the others were paid by Group) and we know that one left in June 2021 and the highest paid director dropped their pay by £10,000 to £282,000 (or this could have been as a result of a Director leaving perhaps?) so on average the Directors who received a pay rise received an average pay increase of somewhere between £34,000-45,333 each! More than many staff receive in a full year!

Nice work if you can get it!

It's not uncommon for those running formerly nationalised industries/Utilities to be filling their boots in this way it would seem.

I've long thought that there should be a direct link between customer satisfaction levels and executive salaries in these circumstances - might concentrate a few minds and provide some focus!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 25, 2022, 08:51:48 am
I've long thought that there should be a direct link between customer satisfaction levels and executive salaries in these circumstances - might concentrate a few minds and provide some focus!

With so much control of the railways now with the Department for Transport, should there also be a link between the salaries of the civil servants concerned and customer satisfaction levels?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 25, 2022, 09:05:46 am
Blimey. Didn't realise the Railways suits salaries were quite that high!

I wonder how Hopwoods et al compare?

They must have a good Trade Union, I doubt Sundays are part of their working week either!!!

This is part of the grievance the Unions have, the Executives get a rise in pay yet the ones on the frontline even working long hours still have to make use of food banks!!!

The government continually refer to the median wage on the railways as £45,000 or the salaries of train drivers however the vast majority of rail workers are more on a starting salary around £22,000 a year. With experience, this could go up to around £23,700 a year. they can earn extra through shift allowance and overtime.  

The average for NR skilled maintenance technicians is £33,000, these are the people who fix the signals, track, power supplies, OLE ie the people who make the infrastructure safe for trains to travel over every day

One final note MP's who at the end of the day are 'public sector workers' have given themselves a £2,212 pay rise


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 25, 2022, 09:08:47 am
I've long thought that there should be a direct link between customer satisfaction levels and executive salaries in these circumstances - might concentrate a few minds and provide some focus!

With so much control of the railways now with the Department for Transport, should there also be a link between the salaries of the civil servants concerned and customer satisfaction levels?

They should be on the same contract terms as a premier league manage ............. i.e. if the performance fails they get sacked


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on June 25, 2022, 09:38:54 am
I've long thought that there should be a direct link between customer satisfaction levels and executive salaries in these circumstances - might concentrate a few minds and provide some focus!

With so much control of the railways now with the Department for Transport, should there also be a link between the salaries of the civil servants concerned and customer satisfaction levels?

We must recognise that the performance of senior civil servants may often be difficult measure as there needs to be a way to discern the effects of their actions from the quality of instructions they get from minsters. 

Was it the work of a civil servant or a Special Advisor (SPAD - no not a signal passed at danger) ? For example the imperial units 'consultation' falls so far short of civil service standards that I am almost certain that it was written by a Special Advisor and published on the instructions of the minster.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Mark A on June 25, 2022, 12:13:07 pm
The minister of state for transport played fast and loose with a stats calculation and even showed their workings. The likes of 'Full Fact' took this apart:

https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/

Mark


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on June 25, 2022, 12:22:11 pm
The minister of state for transport played fast and loose with a stats calculation and even showed their workings. The likes of 'Full Fact' took this apart:

https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/

Mark

Link does not work


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Mark A on June 25, 2022, 12:35:24 pm
Oops, ta, forgot that directly pasting links isn't good. Here you are.

https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/ (https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on June 25, 2022, 12:41:58 pm
Oops, ta, forgot that directly pasting links isn't good. Here you are.

https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/ (https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/)

Still doesn't work.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on June 25, 2022, 12:54:32 pm
Oops, ta, forgot that directly pasting links isn't good. Here you are.

https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/ (https://fullfact.org/economy/RMT-strike-salary/)

Still doesn't work.

Looks like the original is designed to work only when you navigate to it from the site indexes and not as a landing page.

Mirror for Coffee Shop members at http://www.passenger.chat/RMT-strike-salary.pdf


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 01, 2022, 07:32:21 pm
From the BBC News website (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62009982)

Quote
Rail strikes: No rush to call for more action, says union

A rail workers' union has said it is "not in any rush" to call for further strikes in July, following last week's walkouts which caused significant disruption across the UK.

Eddie Dempsey, senior assistant general secretary at the RMT, said the union did not "take these steps lightly".

Mr Dempsey, who is also leading talks with Network Rail, said it had been an intense week of discussions.

The two sides are trying to reach an agreement to prevent further strikes.

Thousands of members of the RMT who work for Network Rail and 13 train companies walked out on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday last week as part of a dispute over job cuts, pay and conditions.

Half of the rail network was closed on strike days, while the knock-on impact meant services were also disrupted on the following days.

The union has warned more strike action could follow.

However, when asked on the BBC's Today programme whether there could be further strikes in July, Mr Dempsey said: "We've told people we're not in any rush.

"I think we've made a pretty emphatic point with the strike action we put on. We don't take these steps lightly. We're in no rush to run into the boardroom and name further action."

The RMT and Network Rail are initially trying to reach an agreement on job security, before discussing pay and conditions.

Mr Dempsey said the discussions this week had been "fairly intense".

"We're progressing in terms of discussions. There are some fundamental issues of difficulty between us still, and that's why we're seeking feedback, but we haven't gotten onto the question of pay yet," Mr Dempsey said.

"That's going to be a really important issue, and whether or not there can be an offer that satisfies our people, we will have to wait and see."

Talks 'constructive'

It came as the lead negotiator for Network Rail, Tim Shoveller, said he was "cautiously optimistic" that an agreement would be reached with the RMT union to prevent further strikes.

Speaking to the Today programme, Mr Shoveller said talks since last week's walkouts had been "constructive".

On 20 June, the day before the first rail strike, Network Rail gave the RMT a letter inviting them to a formal consultation meeting on 1 July about introducing reforms to working practices which would involve job losses.

A spokesperson told the BBC this week that although the letter had not been withdrawn, all sides had agreed to temporarily set it aside to enable talks to continue, and it would only come into play if talks stalled.

Mr Shoveller confirmed to the BBC that the meeting originally planned for this morning to formally start that process would no longer take place.

He said there was "no need" for it, as the best way to find a conclusion was through negotiation. He added that "the letter remains in place, but at the moment that is not preventing us from having the conversations we need to have".

Mr Shoveller described this as a "pragmatic position" after "pragmatic conversations" with the RMT this week, and there was no need to start that formal consultation for the moment.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on July 04, 2022, 04:49:30 pm
I have now heard of ANOTHER case of ex railway workers leaving the railway for alternative work.

Two young men, previously employed on p-way maintenance in Scotland. They considered that "the railway" were a bad employer who treated staff very badly. Harsh weather is to be expected and not the employers fault, but unsuitable and uncomfortable workwear IS the employers fault. And the lack of welfare facilities is also the fault of the employers.

They now work for the local utility company, primarily on overhead line maintenance and repair, so still exposed to similar bad weather. But better clothed and equipped for the conditions. The employer provides a choice of workwear, with the only strict rule that it must be fire retardant. Employees own clothing worn under the issued workwear must be in natural fibres in case of fire. 100% cotton long underwear is favored in moderately cold weather, with similar garments in 100% wool for more severe conditions.
The mobile "welfare unit" is much better than anything provided by the railway. It is a light truck fitted with cooking facilities, an effective heater, and storage.

They actually ENJOYED storm Arwen !
"loadsa overtime"
" interesting challenges"
"great fun"
" The manager took us all to the pub afterwards"


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on July 04, 2022, 08:28:37 pm
I have now heard of ANOTHER case of ex railway workers leaving the railway for alternative work.

Two young men, previously employed on p-way maintenance in Scotland. They considered that "the railway" were a bad employer who treated staff very badly. Harsh weather is to be expected and not the employers fault, but unsuitable and uncomfortable workwear IS the employers fault. And the lack of welfare facilities is also the fault of the employers.

They now work for the local utility company, primarily on overhead line maintenance and repair, so still exposed to similar bad weather. But better clothed and equipped for the conditions. The employer provides a choice of workwear, with the only strict rule that it must be fire retardant. Employees own clothing worn under the issued workwear must be in natural fibres in case of fire. 100% cotton long underwear is favored in moderately cold weather, with similar garments in 100% wool for more severe conditions.
The mobile "welfare unit" is much better than anything provided by the railway. It is a light truck fitted with cooking facilities, an effective heater, and storage.

They actually ENJOYED storm Arwen !
"loadsa overtime"
" interesting challenges"
"great fun"
" The manager took us all to the pub afterwards"

Given that there is a shortage of workers and money is tight this is what employers will have to do to ensure they have enough staff.  Provide good working conditions (as good as is possible given the nature of the work) and treat them well. On pay it is more difficult, but if people cannot survive of the wages offered they will walk. If someone still needs to claim benefits after working a full time then the employer is having a laugh at both the employee and the taxpayer's expense. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on July 04, 2022, 09:18:33 pm
In the case above, the move from the railway to the power company was not due to better wages, the pay is "about the same"
Railway management were considered "unhelpful" and "looking for a fight" and generally disliked. Any complaints about unsuitable clothing or boots, and lack of welfare facilities was blamed upon the bad weather.

The utility company by contrast issued better workwear, waterproof boots, and provided various forms of mobile welfare unit.
They even subsidise the purchase of long underwear for outdoor work. "There is no such thing as bad weather, only unsuitable clothing"

One manager, not equipped for outdoor work, did cook a hot meal for the team. Another manager give an extra half day off work and paid for food and drink in the pub.


After any major incident such as storm Arwen, a "recovery day" is declared. This is NOT an extra day off, it is a working day but confined to the depot. The day is spent carefully examining work vehicles for any defects or damages acquired during extreme use. Minor repairs are performed or the vehicle sent away for any major repairs. Company tools and equipment are examined in detail and any deficiencies dealt with. Personal tool kits are likewise inspected and replacements supplied if needed.
Supplies of spares and consumables in work vehicles are then checked and replenished as needed.
Workwear is inspected and laundered or replaced as needed.
Finally depot stocks of spares and consumables are carefully checked for both quantity and condition.

This avoids future incidents like "Alfie, bring me three fuses, type XXYY"  Oh dear we only have one left, I think we used loads in the flood at AABB.




Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on July 05, 2022, 06:23:33 am
I have now heard of ANOTHER case of ex railway workers leaving the railway for alternative work.

Two young men, previously employed on p-way maintenance in Scotland. They considered that "the railway" were a bad employer who treated staff very badly. Harsh weather is to be expected and not the employers fault, but unsuitable and uncomfortable workwear IS the employers fault. And the lack of welfare facilities is also the fault of the employers.

They now work for the local utility company, primarily on overhead line maintenance and repair, so still exposed to similar bad weather. But better clothed and equipped for the conditions. The employer provides a choice of workwear, with the only strict rule that it must be fire retardant. Employees own clothing worn under the issued workwear must be in natural fibres in case of fire. 100% cotton long underwear is favored in moderately cold weather, with similar garments in 100% wool for more severe conditions.
The mobile "welfare unit" is much better than anything provided by the railway. It is a light truck fitted with cooking facilities, an effective heater, and storage.

They actually ENJOYED storm Arwen !
"loadsa overtime"
" interesting challenges"
"great fun"
" The manager took us all to the pub afterwards"

In the case above, the move from the railway to the power company was not due to better wages, the pay is "about the same"
Railway management were considered "unhelpful" and "looking for a fight" and generally disliked. Any complaints about unsuitable clothing or boots, and lack of welfare facilities was blamed upon the bad weather.

The utility company by contrast issued better workwear, waterproof boots, and provided various forms of mobile welfare unit.
They even subsidise the purchase of long underwear for outdoor work. "There is no such thing as bad weather, only unsuitable clothing"

One manager, not equipped for outdoor work, did cook a hot meal for the team. Another manager give an extra half day off work and paid for food and drink in the pub.


After any major incident such as storm Arwen, a "recovery day" is declared. This is NOT an extra day off, it is a working day but confined to the depot. The day is spent carefully examining work vehicles for any defects or damages acquired during extreme use. Minor repairs are performed or the vehicle sent away for any major repairs. Company tools and equipment are examined in detail and any deficiencies dealt with. Personal tool kits are likewise inspected and replacements supplied if needed.
Supplies of spares and consumables in work vehicles are then checked and replenished as needed.
Workwear is inspected and laundered or replaced as needed.
Finally depot stocks of spares and consumables are carefully checked for both quantity and condition.

This avoids future incidents like "Alfie, bring me three fuses, type XXYY"  Oh dear we only have one left, I think we used loads in the flood at AABB.

With regards PPE (clothing) yes the basic issue is not always what is required for certain rolls; however, the PPE catalogue has a very wide range of PPE to suite all weather conditions.   The only teams mandated to wear arc flash PPE are Distribution staff who work in high Voltage substations.

Welfare facilities are recognised in the railway industry as a challenge, a lot of work has been done in recent years to improve things.  There is an internal phone app that gives detail of the nearest welfare to where you are including any information like lock combination numbers.  Welfare vans are available in each delivery unit and a local manager can order more from hire companies.  For longer duration work port-a-potties are provided along the worksite with larger facilities at signing on points.

Like any large employer there are going to be good, bad or indifferent management


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on July 05, 2022, 07:00:07 am
The utility workers to whom I referred are required in general to wear arc flash resistant clothing, in hot weather this may be removed if not working near live equipment.

Employees own clothing MUST BE of 100% natural fibres in case of arc flash accidents. broadgage suggested a supplier of 100% cotton long underwear, most sold in the UK contains polyester or other fake stuff.

The welfare vans are well equipped. Self heating tinned food is very much appreciated for quick hot snacks in bad weather.

The main problem is toilet facilities. Portable toilets of the Turdis type are available but in stormy weather tend to blow away. At least one was destroyed and another one never seen again. "Probably in Norway by now"


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 13, 2022, 07:43:33 pm
Need to update the header subjectnow. New RMT strike day announced for July 27.

From BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62154070)

Quote
Rail strike: New walkout to take place on 27 July

Railway workers are to stage a one-day strike on 27 July as part of an ongoing dispute over pay, jobs and conditions, the RMT union says.

It comes after thousands of train operator and Network Rail workers walked out during national strike action in June.

The strikes caused disruption for millions of commuters.

Earlier this week, Network Rail made workers a fresh pay offer it said was worth more than 5%.

But the offer depended on workers accepting "modernising reforms".

RMT leaders rejected the new offer describing it as "paltry".

It also said it would consult other unions with mandates for strike action in the coming days.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.

"The train operating companies remain stubborn and are refusing to make any new offer which deals with job security and pay," he added.

"Strike action is the only course open to us to make both the rail industry and government understand that this dispute will continue for as long as it takes, until we get a negotiated settlement."

Last month Britain's rail network was brought close to a standstill as tens of thousands of rail workers walked out in what unions said was the biggest rail strike in 30 years.

The RMT held three strikes over the course of a week, severely disrupting services across the country.

The union, whose members include everyone from guards and signallers to catering staff and cleaners, is looking for a pay rise of at least 7%.

It also wants a written guarantee from Network Rail that no compulsory redundancies will be made as part of planned reforms.

So far the government has rejected the union's demands to negotiate with it directly.

In June, Transport Secretary Grant Shapps accused the RMT of "damaging people's lives".

And the RMT's version (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-calls-24-hours-strike-action/)

Quote
13 July 2022

RMT Press Office:

RMT calls 24 hours strike action after rejecting "paltry" Network Rail offer.

Railway workers will once again take strike action over job security, pay and working conditions on Wednesday July 27.

The 24-hour stoppage comes after Network Rail made an offer of 4pc in the first year followed by a possible 4pc in the second year, conditional on RMT members accepting all attacks on their terms and conditions.

RMT has yet to receive a pay offer or guarantees over job losses from the train operating companies (TOCs).

Network Rail members will strike from 2am on Wednesday July 27 for 24 hours. And members on the TOCs will take action from 00.01 until 23:59 on the 27 July.

We will also be consulting other unions that have delivered mandates for strike action in the coming days.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.

"We have made progress on compulsory redundancies. But Network Rail are still seeking to make our members poorer when we have won in some cases double what they are offering, with other rail operators.

"The train operating companies remain stubborn and are refusing to make any new offer which deals with job security and pay.

"Strike action is the only course open to us to make both the rail industry and government understand that this dispute will continue for as long as it takes, until we get a negotiated settlement.

"The public who will be inconvenienced by our strike action need to understand that it is the government's shackling of Network Rail and the TOCs that means the rail network will be shut down for 24 hours.

"We remain open for further talks."

I understand the offer was 5% with strings attached.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on July 13, 2022, 08:32:43 pm
Title updated. (When does Autumn start?)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 13, 2022, 08:46:36 pm
September, I think


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on July 13, 2022, 10:53:21 pm
Title updated. (When does Autumn start?)

September, I think

Astronomically    - 21st September;
Meteorologically  - 1st September.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 14, 2022, 05:51:33 am
Need to update the header subjectnow. New RMT strike day announced for July 27.

From BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62154070)

Quote
Rail strike: New walkout to take place on 27 July

Railway workers are to stage a one-day strike on 27 July as part of an ongoing dispute over pay, jobs and conditions, the RMT union says.

It comes after thousands of train operator and Network Rail workers walked out during national strike action in June.

The strikes caused disruption for millions of commuters.

Earlier this week, Network Rail made workers a fresh pay offer it said was worth more than 5%.

But the offer depended on workers accepting "modernising reforms".

RMT leaders rejected the new offer describing it as "paltry".

It also said it would consult other unions with mandates for strike action in the coming days.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.

"The train operating companies remain stubborn and are refusing to make any new offer which deals with job security and pay," he added.

"Strike action is the only course open to us to make both the rail industry and government understand that this dispute will continue for as long as it takes, until we get a negotiated settlement."

Last month Britain's rail network was brought close to a standstill as tens of thousands of rail workers walked out in what unions said was the biggest rail strike in 30 years.

The RMT held three strikes over the course of a week, severely disrupting services across the country.

The union, whose members include everyone from guards and signallers to catering staff and cleaners, is looking for a pay rise of at least 7%.

It also wants a written guarantee from Network Rail that no compulsory redundancies will be made as part of planned reforms.

So far the government has rejected the union's demands to negotiate with it directly.

In June, Transport Secretary Grant Shapps accused the RMT of "damaging people's lives".

And the RMT's version (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-calls-24-hours-strike-action/)

Quote
13 July 2022

RMT Press Office:

RMT calls 24 hours strike action after rejecting "paltry" Network Rail offer.

Railway workers will once again take strike action over job security, pay and working conditions on Wednesday July 27.

The 24-hour stoppage comes after Network Rail made an offer of 4pc in the first year followed by a possible 4pc in the second year, conditional on RMT members accepting all attacks on their terms and conditions.

RMT has yet to receive a pay offer or guarantees over job losses from the train operating companies (TOCs).

Network Rail members will strike from 2am on Wednesday July 27 for 24 hours. And members on the TOCs will take action from 00.01 until 23:59 on the 27 July.

We will also be consulting other unions that have delivered mandates for strike action in the coming days.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.

"We have made progress on compulsory redundancies. But Network Rail are still seeking to make our members poorer when we have won in some cases double what they are offering, with other rail operators.

"The train operating companies remain stubborn and are refusing to make any new offer which deals with job security and pay.

"Strike action is the only course open to us to make both the rail industry and government understand that this dispute will continue for as long as it takes, until we get a negotiated settlement.

"The public who will be inconvenienced by our strike action need to understand that it is the government's shackling of Network Rail and the TOCs that means the rail network will be shut down for 24 hours.

"We remain open for further talks."

I understand the offer was 5% with strings attached.

The "strings" being modernisation. Not something the RMT are keen on.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on July 14, 2022, 10:46:59 pm
The RMT will instruct all grades at NR and TOCs in dispute to walk out on 18th and 20th August.

ASLEF will strike on 30th July.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 19, 2022, 01:40:02 pm
From The Telegraph, via MSN -

 (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/take-it-or-leave-it-network-rail-tells-striking-workers/ar-AAZHoxM?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=8f5a12209f864c6cb73bc6aa0eb56d2c)
Quote
Take it or leave it, Network Rail tells striking workers

Network Rail has insisted it will not improve its pay deal for staff in an ultimatum that raises the spectre of strike action lasting throughout the summer and into the autumn.

Andrew Haines, chief executive of the state-backed owner of tracks and stations, has today told staff that there are "no significantly better deals".

In an internal email to staff, seen by The Telegraph, Mr Haines said that last week’s pay offer of an average of 5pc is the best Network Rail can offer.

“Anyone who truly believes that there can be a pay offer that meets or exceeds the highest levels of inflation for a generation, is not being realistic,” he said.

The Rail, Maritime and Transport workers union (RMT), the protagonist of the industrial action to date, rejected the Network Rail deal and announced a fresh wave of walkouts on July 27, and August 18 and 20.

Drivers union Aslef will also strike on July 30.

Mr Haines continued: “I have to level with you; there are no significantly better deals out there for us right now. I am sorry, I know that’s not what you want to hear with inflation as high as it is. But it is true.

“Commuters and business travellers show no signs of returning to their pre-pandemic travel habits. And that’s what forms the backbone of the railway’s fares income.

“In fact, it’s worse than that. If talks break down now, our financial situation gets worse. The cost of strike action has already exceeded £100m - as well as causing misery for millions of passengers and harming the reputation of our railway. Each of those pounds lost is a pound we can no longer give to you through a pay offer.

“I don’t say this as a threat, it's simply the reality we face.” 

The RMT has previously warned that it has a mandate to bombard commuters with waves of strikes until Christmas.

Asked if last month if passengers should expect a "long fight", Mr Lynch told the i newspaper: “That may have to be the way that is, I hope that’s not the case, but there doesn’t seem to be much evidence at the moment that it’s going to go any other way."

Last week’s Network Rail “final offer” included a 5pc pay rise, heavily discounted train travel for family members and cash bonuses of up to £900. The state-owned company also ruled out compulsory redundancies for the next two years.

Mick Lynch, general secretary of RMT said: “The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members, and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.”

Train operators are yet to offer similar terms.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on July 19, 2022, 04:25:13 pm
From The Telegraph, via MSN -

 (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/take-it-or-leave-it-network-rail-tells-striking-workers/ar-AAZHoxM?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=8f5a12209f864c6cb73bc6aa0eb56d2c)
Quote
Take it or leave it, Network Rail tells striking workers

Network Rail has insisted it will not improve its pay deal for staff in an ultimatum that raises the spectre of strike action lasting throughout the summer and into the autumn.

Andrew Haines, chief executive of the state-backed owner of tracks and stations, has today told staff that there are "no significantly better deals".

In an internal email to staff, seen by The Telegraph, Mr Haines said that last week’s pay offer of an average of 5pc is the best Network Rail can offer.

“Anyone who truly believes that there can be a pay offer that meets or exceeds the highest levels of inflation for a generation, is not being realistic,” he said.

The Rail, Maritime and Transport workers union (RMT), the protagonist of the industrial action to date, rejected the Network Rail deal and announced a fresh wave of walkouts on July 27, and August 18 and 20.

Drivers union Aslef will also strike on July 30.

Mr Haines continued: “I have to level with you; there are no significantly better deals out there for us right now. I am sorry, I know that’s not what you want to hear with inflation as high as it is. But it is true.

“Commuters and business travellers show no signs of returning to their pre-pandemic travel habits. And that’s what forms the backbone of the railway’s fares income.

“In fact, it’s worse than that. If talks break down now, our financial situation gets worse. The cost of strike action has already exceeded £100m - as well as causing misery for millions of passengers and harming the reputation of our railway. Each of those pounds lost is a pound we can no longer give to you through a pay offer.

“I don’t say this as a threat, it's simply the reality we face.” 

The RMT has previously warned that it has a mandate to bombard commuters with waves of strikes until Christmas.

Asked if last month if passengers should expect a "long fight", Mr Lynch told the i newspaper: “That may have to be the way that is, I hope that’s not the case, but there doesn’t seem to be much evidence at the moment that it’s going to go any other way."

Last week’s Network Rail “final offer” included a 5pc pay rise, heavily discounted train travel for family members and cash bonuses of up to £900. The state-owned company also ruled out compulsory redundancies for the next two years.

Mick Lynch, general secretary of RMT said: “The offer from Network Rail represents a real terms pay cut for our members, and the paltry sum is conditional on RMT members agreeing to drastic changes in their working lives.”

Train operators are yet to offer similar terms.



Except the pay raise offered is not technically an average of a 5%


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on July 19, 2022, 05:39:27 pm
Except the pay raise offered is not technically an average of a 5%

What's the technicality?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: onthecushions on July 19, 2022, 08:59:17 pm

Interestingly the quoted  "good" employer was a (privatised but regulated) utility company or its sub; the "bad" employer was dear Network Rail or its subs, property of HMG.

OTC


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on July 20, 2022, 06:26:26 pm
Except the pay raise offered is not technically an average of a 5%

What's the technicality?

Because the 5% is the headline, it is not a straight 5% now, it is something like 3% now and 2% next year with the strings of "modernisation of maintenance" attached which the Union believe will result in redundancies and de-skilling which in the Unions view will impact of public safety.   The offer of staff leisure discount travel is something the Unions in NR have been seeking for years and do not want to see it as part of pay.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Phantom on July 21, 2022, 10:56:57 am
I know there is a GWR strike planned for the 30th
In the past it was mentioned services early the next day could be impacted

Does anyone know when a finalised timetable for the 31st will be released - or will it be the usual timetable?

The reason I ask I am taking sister and her family to Wembley on the 08:58 train from Weston on the 31st


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: trainbuff on July 21, 2022, 10:33:39 pm
There is strike action planned for the 30th July but I will point out it is not RMT but rather the Drivers Union ASLEF. Only RMT drivers will be working and there are not many of them


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 22, 2022, 07:58:12 am
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on July 22, 2022, 10:01:21 am
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on July 22, 2022, 10:05:58 am
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later

If I were management and my staff went on strike, I would ban overtime as a means for staff to recoup loss of wages - even if my company lost out because of it.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 22, 2022, 10:11:20 am
That is a card that the DfT could choose to play at some point.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: old original on July 22, 2022, 10:54:00 am
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later

If I were management and my staff went on strike, I would ban overtime as a means for staff to recoup loss of wages - even if my company lost out because of it.



..so no Sunday service at all


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on July 22, 2022, 02:00:27 pm
From GWR - echoing the different groups striking on different days.

Quote
Services on strike days will be extremely limited, and on Saturday 30th July there will be no GWR services on most of the network. Where trains are able to run we are expecting them to be very busy, and the last services will be much earlier than normal. There will also be disruption on Thursday 28th July and Sunday 31st July.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Marlburian on July 22, 2022, 03:24:14 pm
My Polish friend is flying back to London on Sunday, so I checked on the trains from Stansted and discovered there was a replacement bus service to Waltham Cross, where she could then get a train. Turns out to be "planned engineering works". She was going to book a seat on National Express, then looked again at her air ticket and saw it was for Luton.The trains there to London look OK.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 22, 2022, 04:43:31 pm
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later

Sales of charcoal, sausages and burgers are forecast to spike!  :)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 22, 2022, 06:29:14 pm
Gotta keep morale up on the picket line somehow!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Henry on July 22, 2022, 07:31:55 pm

 Rail Strikes to go ahead next Wednesday.
 RMT could not agree to ticket office closures and driver only operation.
 (there's a surprise).
 Can not see any settlement soon.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: trainbuff on July 22, 2022, 10:38:12 pm
That is a card that the DfT could choose to play at some point.

Which does indeed show that the DfT can settle the strike rather than Network Rail and the TOC's. They cant have it both ways but it is the DfT that holds the purse strings


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on July 23, 2022, 07:03:15 am
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later

If I were management and my staff went on strike, I would ban overtime as a means for staff to recoup loss of wages - even if my company lost out because of it.

And the trainset will come to a grinding halt, there would be a proliferation of ESR's, switches and crossings clipped out of use, many other faults that are repaired out of hours that would not get done.

NR are reliant on overtime in Signal boxes, Electrical Control Rooms, Maintenance.  The management grades also have a pay claim at the moment there is good will by those grades to continue to work hours extra hours outside their contracted hours like they have done for years but it would not take much for them to work to rule.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 23, 2022, 07:11:37 am

 Rail Strikes to go ahead next Wednesday.
 RMT could not agree to ticket office closures and driver only operation.
 (there's a surprise).
 Can not see any settlement soon.

I think that's "would not" rather than "could not"!  :)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: GBM on July 23, 2022, 07:14:33 am
As a passenger I would not be happy on a DOO train from Penzance to Paddington.
Need at least a guard, and assistance from catering trolley crew always welcome.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 23, 2022, 07:27:49 am
As a passenger I would not be happy on a DOO train from Penzance to Paddington.
Need at least a guard, and assistance from catering trolley crew always welcome.

Yes agreed on longer distance routes, but the Luddite attitude to maintaining all the ticket offices is surely untenable.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on July 23, 2022, 07:56:42 am
Isn't ticket office staffing somewhat outside the RMT's remit? I thought the majority of those staff, who are union members, belong to the TSSA.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on July 23, 2022, 12:06:15 pm
Isn't ticket office staffing somewhat outside the RMT's remit? I thought the majority of those staff, who are union members, belong to the TSSA.

RMT does have members among station staff, and have been conducting specific campaigns against reductions in staffed hours of stations and ticket offices at Scotrail and LNER. There is a category of member for this - Supervisory Clerical and Other Salaried Grades  - though not, I think, separate representation. No doubt the distribution is down to history - like there being RMT drivers in some places. Presumably there will be some fraternal competition for members with TSSA, along the lines of "there are not so many of us but we're more militant than them".


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on July 23, 2022, 12:23:47 pm
RMT put out a press statement today (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-launches-bid-to-save-britains-railway-ticket-offices/) about their "save Britain's railway ticket offices" campaign.
Quote
23 July 2022

RMT Press Office:

RAIL UNION RMT will attempt to stop the closure of all ticket offices on the railway network with a mass campaign across the country.

Almost 1,000 ticket offices are set to close with the loss of thousands of jobs and creating accessibility problems for different types of travellers.

These include the elderly, people with disabilities and foreign visitors who may not have English as their first language.

Elderly and disabled people, and people on low incomes are less likely to have access to the internet and are excluded by the push towards online and electronic ticketing

Without ticket offices and on station support, huge swathes of passengers could be excluded from the railways altogether.

The planned closure of ticket offices is part of a wider industry attack on jobs and services.

Yet in stark contrast, the private rail industry is taking in excess of £500m in profits annually and many rail bosses have £1 million+ pay packets.

The industry is carrying out a consultation in August and is scheduled to start the process of closing offices from October.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "Ticket offices are a vital service on our railways and profit hungry train operating companies simply do not care about the detrimental impact it will have on vulnerable passengers and staff safety.

"We have no problem with genuine modernisation and adapting the way the modern railways work.

"But we will not allow thousands of members to meekly join Britain's dole queues or to accept a version of fire and rehire on inferior terms and conditions.

"We will fight this every step of the way with our national rail strike, and the public can help greatly by putting pressure on their local MP, telling the politicians they must oppose the closures."

Cat Hobbs, We Own It Director, said: “Passengers want ticket offices on our railway, they want a human being they can turn to for help, not just a machine.

“We all need them - from children on their first solo trip, to elderly passengers who don’t have a smartphone to buy a ticket.

“You can’t have Great British Railways if people can’t even ask for the information and support that they need. It is vital that the government scraps the disastrous plan to close nearly 1000 ticket offices - that’s why we’re coming together with the RMT Union in this fight for the very future of our railway.

“Instead of abandoning passengers with a second class service, this government should be making it easy for people to take the train.”

Notes:

The petition - https://www.megaphone.org.uk/petitions/cut-their-profits-not-our-ticket-offices

We are holding a day of action on ticket offices on Tuesday 23rd August 2022 at stations around the country.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 25, 2022, 06:01:42 pm
This has got just over 7,000 signatures - how many ticket staff are there?!!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 25, 2022, 06:07:07 pm
From GWR - echoing the different groups striking on different days.

Quote
Services on strike days will be extremely limited, and on Saturday 30th July there will be no GWR services on most of the network. Where trains are able to run we are expecting them to be very busy, and the last services will be much earlier than normal. There will also be disruption on Thursday 28th July and Sunday 31st July.

On GWR's strike webpage (https://www.gwr.com/strike?utm_source=Nevertransacted&utm_medium=email&utm_term=find_out_more&utm_content=EB1199346&utm_campaign=GWR_RMT_JUL22) for Saturday & Sunday...

Quote
Saturday 30 July
The Aslef strike among GWR train drivers on Saturday 30 July will have an even greater impact, and most parts of the GWR network will have no train service.

An extremely limited service will only operate on the routes below. Services will start later and finish much earlier than normal.
Bristol Temple Meads-London Paddington
Bristol Temple Meads-Cardiff Central
Reading to Oxford
Reading to Basingstoke
No other GWR services will run.

Sunday 31 July
Disruption is likely please check before you travel.

Online timetables should be correct on -

For Saturday, tomorrow 26th
For Sunday, Wednesday 27th

The journeyplanners are already updated for last trains tomorrow, Wednesday & early trains on Thursday.
NOTE - no sleepers on Tuesday night, Wednesday night, Friday night nor Sunday night


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 26, 2022, 07:36:46 am
Mick Lynch - "We have no problem with genuine modernisation and adapting the way the modern railways work".

OK Mick.

The rail industry actively encourages online ticket purchase and  as far back as 2017 40% of customers were stating that they purchased their tickets always or most frequently online rather than at a ticket counter - this figure is only going to go one way.

.........but insisting that ticket offices are maintained at their current level on pain of National strike action is having "no problem with genuine modernisation".



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 26, 2022, 08:44:03 am
But always require an extra payment for it. One example. To move from a hole punch ticket check to using a QR code reader. Bit like using a scanner rather than a photocopier in an office. But who got additional payment?

And the TSSA have joined the RMT in striking at 7 TOCs, including GWR,  on August 18 & 20.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 26, 2022, 10:54:16 am
But always require an extra payment for it. One example. To move from a hole punch ticket check to using a QR code reader. Bit like using a scanner rather than a photocopier in an office. But who got additional payment?

And the TSSA have joined the RMT in striking at 7 TOCs, including GWR,  on August 18 & 20.

Seriously? A pay rise was demanded for "clipping" a ticket in a different way?

Beyond parody.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 26, 2022, 11:18:55 am
Yep, seriously!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Sleepy on July 26, 2022, 11:22:51 pm
Yes, if the ASLEF strike goes ahead, the service is likely to be extremely limited for the affected operators…far more do than the RMT action.

Given the ASLEF strike is on a Saturday, Sunday could go one of two ways….
Either they’ll all volunteer to work to recoup their losses OR they could decide to have a weekend off.  If I was a betting man, I’d favour the later

If I were management and my staff went on strike, I would ban overtime as a means for staff to recoup loss of wages - even if my company lost out because of it.

If overtime was banned the service would be in chaos on non-strike days, most TOC are seriously short of drivers following limited/no training during Covid.
Grant Scapps made such a comment at the start of the strikes - would imagine RDG were horrified and straight on the phone to DfT !!!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on July 27, 2022, 06:45:41 am
Not got off to a good start for anyone travelling to or from Plymouth today with all services starting and terminating at Exeter due to no contingency signallers.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: RichardB on July 27, 2022, 09:38:41 am
Not got off to a good start for anyone travelling to or from Plymouth today with all services starting and terminating at Exeter due to no contingency signallers.

This was expected.  There was an e-mail to stakeholders from GWR yesterday. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on July 27, 2022, 10:57:25 am
Mick Lynch - "We have no problem with genuine modernisation and adapting the way the modern railways work".

OK Mick.

The rail industry actively encourages online ticket purchase and  as far back as 2017 40% of customers were stating that they purchased their tickets always or most frequently online rather than at a ticket counter - this figure is only going to go one way.

.........but insisting that ticket offices are maintained at their current level on pain of National strike action is having "no problem with genuine modernisation".



You would be surprised at the number of customers at ticket offices wanting to change their online or TVM purchases because they purchased the wrong ticket or the ticket they wanted was not offered to them.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on July 27, 2022, 11:37:27 am
Not got off to a good start for anyone travelling to or from Plymouth today with all services starting and terminating at Exeter due to no contingency signallers.

This was expected.  There was an e-mail to stakeholders from GWR yesterday. 

I wonder why they are turning them at Exeter and not running at least some to Newton Abbot or even Totnes. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on July 27, 2022, 12:10:44 pm
It's an ill wind ... Q: What can you do on a strike day more easily than a normal one? A: drag an IET with a seized axle from Reading to North Pole very slowly. Very, very, very, slowly.

8Z20 was planned (presumably for overnight, but with no strike) to take 6 hours 20 minutes for what is only 35 miles. That did allow for a stop in every loop, and at Maidenhead. That's the only one it's so far reached, and its stop there was less than allowed (presumably to check the wheel skates were surviving).

It was due to pass Slough after 121 minutes, but was 101 minutes down by then! Fortunately it doesn't matter too much today: even the Elizabeth Line trains can swap to the Main line in some places. I see it's now sneaked into the siding at Langley for its next little rest.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 27, 2022, 01:31:21 pm
Not got off to a good start for anyone travelling to or from Plymouth today with all services starting and terminating at Exeter due to no contingency signallers.

This was expected.  There was an e-mail to stakeholders from GWR yesterday. 

How far west does the Exeter box cover? That may answer your query

I wonder why they are turning them at Exeter and not running at least some to Newton Abbot or even Totnes. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on July 27, 2022, 01:36:37 pm
How far west does the Exeter box cover? That may answer your query

Exeter's first signal on the Up is the entrance to Totnes loop and the last on the Down the first after the loop at the station.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 27, 2022, 01:44:12 pm
It's an ill wind ... Q: What can you do on a strike day more easily than a normal one? A: drag an IET with a seized axle from Reading to North Pole very slowly. Very, very, very, slowly.

At 5mph I expect.  As you say, such moves are normally carried out in the dead of night, but the 'dead of day' today is nearly as good!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 27, 2022, 01:45:39 pm
How far west does the Exeter box cover? That may answer your query

Exeter's first signal on the Up is the entrance to Totnes loop and the last on the Down the first after the loop at the station.

How many work stations in Exeter box? Maybe that they can’t cover every one ir can inly cover just the one for EXD and north thereof?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on July 27, 2022, 05:20:02 pm
And now ASLEF have announced another for Saturday 13 August. Detail in the appropriate thread.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on July 27, 2022, 05:25:12 pm
It's an ill wind ... Q: What can you do on a strike day more easily than a normal one? A: drag an IET with a seized axle from Reading to North Pole very slowly. Very, very, very, slowly.

At 5mph I expect.  As you say, such moves are normally carried out in the dead of night, but the 'dead of day' today is nearly as good!

In average speed, well under 5 mph! It just got in, having taken over 9 hours.

The planned path involved crossing to Line 3 at Ladbroke Grove, then to Line 1 to enter Royal Oak Sidings to reverse. In the end it reversed in Line 3, saving nearly an hour. I'm guessing there was a loco each end, rather than running round and un/coupling in Line 3, even today.

It's notable how much of the journey can be done in loops and sidings, even if it skipped the "No 1 Loop" at Hanwell/West Ealing (Plassers).


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on July 27, 2022, 05:43:21 pm
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62325842

Quote
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has sacked his junior shadow transport minister who joined striking rail workers on a picket line.

Ilford South MP Sam Tarry attended the protest at London's Euston station despite Sir Keir saying his frontbench MPs should stay away.

Speaking to reporters, Mr Tarry said "any Labour MP" would have "absolute solidarity with striking workers".

Labour said he had been fired for making unauthorised media appearances.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 27, 2022, 06:35:42 pm
It's notable how much of the journey can be done in loops and sidings, even if it skipped the "No 1 Loop" at Hanwell/West Ealing (Plassers).

Yeah, the only really long gap is between Reading and Maidenhead.  There used to be a goods loop at Ruscombe, east of Twyford, but it was taken out in the mid-2000s as it was too short to be of much use (though it would have been potentially of use today).


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on July 27, 2022, 07:35:32 pm
Not got off to a good start for anyone travelling to or from Plymouth today with all services starting and terminating at Exeter due to no contingency signallers.

This was expected.  There was an e-mail to stakeholders from GWR yesterday. 

I wonder why they are turning them at Exeter and not running at least some to Newton Abbot or even Totnes. 

I suspect it will come down to the number of contingent signallers that have been signed off for the area and any signallers that turned up for work.   Contingent signallers and Electrical Control Room Operators still have to be signed off as competent for the area, this means them taking time out of their normal duties to undertake training and assessments.  I don't know what the requirement for contingent signallers is but the contingent Electrical Control Room Operator is 2 or 3 days every six months.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on July 28, 2022, 12:40:14 pm
Pleased to see Castle Cary, Westbury and Pewsey stops being added to some of the fast SW services as the semi fasts aren't running today which had left these three stations with a couple of trains in each direction to and from London today.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 28, 2022, 01:57:06 pm
All cancelled due to "short notice changes to the timetable (I'm guessing strike related?

16:36 London Paddington to Plymouth due 20:13

17:36 London Paddington to Plymouth due 21:25

18:36 London Paddington to Plymouth due 22:09

Could get cosy later, especially factoring in those who took the advice not to travel yesterday.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Ollie on July 28, 2022, 10:25:28 pm
It's an ill wind ... Q: What can you do on a strike day more easily than a normal one? A: drag an IET with a seized axle from Reading to North Pole very slowly. Very, very, very, slowly.

At 5mph I expect.  As you say, such moves are normally carried out in the dead of night, but the 'dead of day' today is nearly as good!

In average speed, well under 5 mph! It just got in, having taken over 9 hours.

The planned path involved crossing to Line 3 at Ladbroke Grove, then to Line 1 to enter Royal Oak Sidings to reverse. In the end it reversed in Line 3, saving nearly an hour. I'm guessing there was a loco each end, rather than running round and un/coupling in Line 3, even today.

It's notable how much of the journey can be done in loops and sidings, even if it skipped the "No 1 Loop" at Hanwell/West Ealing (Plassers).
No loco required, it ran under its own power.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: REVUpminster on July 29, 2022, 07:06:47 pm
There's a tour train Saturday from Kettering due into Paignton and Kingswear that's expected to run as it's only the drivers on strike.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on August 17, 2022, 08:41:44 am
Isn't ticket office staffing somewhat outside the RMT's remit? I thought the majority of those staff, who are union members, belong to the TSSA.

RMT does have members among station staff, and have been conducting specific campaigns against reductions in staffed hours of stations and ticket offices at Scotrail and LNER. There is a category of member for this - Supervisory Clerical and Other Salaried Grades  - though not, I think, separate representation. No doubt the distribution is down to history - like there being RMT drivers in some places. Presumably there will be some fraternal competition for members with TSSA, along the lines of "there are not so many of us but we're more militant than them".

Came back from a few days in Plymouth yesterday afternoon - got to the station very early as a monsoon was forecast and the delights of Cornwall St in the rain are somewhat limited.

As I had 40 minutes or so to kill, I thought I'd see how much business the ticket office did - well, the answer was not much - I saw all of 3 customers approach the windows (4 of which were open), whilst others clearly had already obtained their tickets via other means or used the TVMs.

Fully expect a number of "Yeah buts" in reply, however it's telling given that this is one of the largest ticket offices in the South West.

Photo taken about 1445.

(Journey itself was pretty good - train was on time and very quiet, I was the only customer in coach L until Taunton and the TM gave me a beer!)  :)



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on August 18, 2022, 04:51:27 pm
Had to make a trip to get my glasses fixed this morning - can't drive without them so took a chance on the train - Elizabeth Line running fine mid morning and pretty quiet, small group of RMT pickets outside Slough station with a rather bedraggled RMT banner tied to a lamppost, very good natured, arseing about in the sunshine rather than bothering anyone.

I notice Bruvver Lynch is now threatening that the strike action could go on "indefinitely" but I wonder if it is really having much of an impact other than inconvenience?

There's certainly no sense of London (for example) being "held to ransom" or grinding to a halt like the old days when the ability to do that gave the RMT much more leverage.

Certainly from West and East the Elizabeth Line is providing an alternative in key corridors (albeit slower), far fewer people are travelling to work these days (or at least are not obliged to thanks to home/hybrid working) and it's peak holiday season. The odd day here and there makes little difference - apart from the likes of key workers such as nurses of course.

This leaves leisure travellers to upset for many of whom rail travel is an option rather than a necessity, and as the holiday period comes to an end, this will naturally reduce anyway.

All of which makes me wonder - are the Rail Companies and the Government going to tough this one out?

Chap from Network Rail impressed on the BBC this morning and reiterated that the offer of 8% over two years and no compulsory redundancies has been made but the RMT refused to put it to their members.

I guess the question is, will Mick have the cojones to go for an "all out" or more protracted strike if there is no further movement, and/or we remain at "minor inconvenience" level?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on August 18, 2022, 05:40:51 pm
Chap from Network Rail impressed on the BBC this morning and reiterated that the offer of 8% over two years and no compulsory redundancies has been made but the RMT refused to put it to their members.

I would be very interested in seeing the small print of that "offer" before I made a judgement.  For example I have seen some information that one offer (not sure which company so not necessarily NR) reduced the payment terms for Sunday and rest day working so that though the headline looked good it was in fact a pay cut!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 18, 2022, 06:00:17 pm
If Sundays became part of the working week, I'd sort of expect that to be paid at the daily rate going forward, rather than at overtime rate, yes. Not everyone does Sundays/obliged to do Sundays, so an overall salary increase to make up for any 'loss' may not be appropriate.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: old original on August 18, 2022, 09:41:11 pm
Bear in mind the chap from Network Rail had a £50k pay rise in April from £540k to over £590k
I don't expect he'll be sweating over "heat or eat" this winter


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on August 18, 2022, 10:30:59 pm
Bear in mind the chap from Network Rail had a £50k pay rise in April from £540k to over £590k
I don't expect he'll be sweating over "heat or eat" this winter

Yes, Andrew Haines will get by this winter, and he's had a pay rise this year when his employees haven't (yet), but it's important that the figures quoted are accurate.

6.5%. £557,000 to £593,000 including BiK. £36,000 increase. Less than the 8% the RMT is turning down 'on behalf' of their members. Arguably its an annual net increase of 0% as he took a four month 20% pay cut in 2020/2021. Meaning he earnt nearly the same in 2021/2022 as he did in 2019/2020. You could say that's a two year pay freeze - just like his employees.

Of course, the media will only report the headline salary and/or round up figures. Ive seen £600,000 mentioned and increase this year of £50,000. Both wrong.

He's also earning 22% less than his predecessor Mark Carne who earned £759,000 in his last full year as CEO. Go back to Ian Coucher in 2010 and he was earning £1.4m!

Is Andrew Haines worth £593,000 as CEO? I've no idea. He presided over revenue of £9.5bn in 2021/2022. It's very likely that a private sector Chief Exec of a company earning nearly £10bn would be paid considerably more.

Network Rail 2021/2022 remuneration report:
https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Directors-remuneration-committee-report-2022.pdf


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on August 19, 2022, 06:42:04 am
If Sundays became part of the working week, I'd sort of expect that to be paid at the daily rate going forward, rather than at overtime rate, yes. Not everyone does Sundays/obliged to do Sundays, so an overall salary increase to make up for any 'loss' may not be appropriate.

Yes that would be the case, however the rail industry relies on overtime being worked.  Therefore, if there is a 7 day roster instead of a 5 or 6 day roster as is the current practice, rest day working will be inevitable which will have enhanced rate of pay to induce people to give up their day off.

It is also worth noting Rail workers legally have to have a 12 hours rest between shifts a max working shift of 14 hours including travelling time form their place of rest and where they book on; also Rail workers can only work 13 shifts and then are required to have a day off.  If you wish to understand why please read the Anthon Hidden QC report into the events leading up to 8:10 a.m. on the morning of Monday, 12 December 1988, at Clapham


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on August 19, 2022, 08:04:54 am
It is also worth noting Rail workers legally have to have a 12 hours rest between shifts a max working shift of 14 hours including travelling time form their place of rest and where they book on; also Rail workers can only work 13 shifts and then are required to have a day off.  If you wish to understand why please read the Anthon Hidden QC report into the events leading up to 8:10 a.m. on the morning of Monday, 12 December 1988, at Clapham

Hidden was never elevated to statutory status.  His recommendations were adopted but are not actually legal.  Sunsequently we hoty The Railways and Other Guided Transport Systems (Safety) Regulations 2006 (18 years later!) specifically section

25.—(1) Every controller of safety critical work shall have in place arrangements to ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable, that a safety critical worker under his management, supervision or control does not carry out safety critical work in circumstances where he is so fatigued or where he would be liable to become so fatigued that his health or safety or the health or safety of other persons on a transport system could be significantly affected.

Note that no times are actually given because such were covered by the Working Time Regulations 1998 (10 years later).  This is why government spokes persons are able to attack the railway's 'Victorian working practices' and 'loss of productive time'.

It is perfectly "fine" to break Hidden and in several accidents in recent years have the RAIB have noted that where fatigue has been a factor, there is collective industrial memory fade since 1988.

The unions are arguing that the biggest memory fade is coming from the government.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: the void on August 19, 2022, 08:13:35 am
If Sundays became part of the working week, I'd sort of expect that to be paid at the daily rate going forward, rather than at overtime rate, yes. Not everyone does Sundays/obliged to do Sundays, so an overall salary increase to make up for any 'loss' may not be appropriate.

From Industrial Action FAQs issued this week by Richard Rowland:


"Sunday working

We want to make Sunday services more attractive for customers. The aim is to ensure coverage by establishing a commitment by colleagues to working on some – not all - Sundays. This will mean that cover for shifts is guaranteed, and train companies can plan more robust, reliable train services.

Enhanced overtime pay protected and opt-out options for current staff that want them and opportunities for additional earning opportunities will be maintained. These arrangements already exist in some places on the network, so this is about turning a patchwork of agreements into something more aligned across the industry.

More reliable Sunday services will help meet the growing demand from customers for leisure travel – Sunday is the one day of the week that is consistently seeing more customers travelling than they did pre-pandemic across the industry. Vital to the long term growth of the industry."

So no plans to remove enhanced pay for working on Sunday, just the ability to roster staff to work on Sundays, rather than having to rely on volunteers.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 19, 2022, 08:28:41 am
I wonder what sort number if Sundays are thought to be required? But yes, a reasonable suggestion


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ellendune on August 19, 2022, 09:27:56 am
Enhanced overtime pay protected and opt-out options for current staff that want them and opportunities for additional earning opportunities will be maintained. These arrangements already exist in some places on the network, so this is about turning a patchwork of agreements into something more aligned across the industry.

Good.  I am aware that this is not one dispute but many.  Are they all seeking similar changes or is each one bespoke?  The claim I saw did not abolish enhanced pay on Sundays, but reduced it. So I still remain cautious about small print. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 19, 2022, 10:47:02 am
GWR drivers already have a commitment to work Sundays.

HSS drivers don’t have that commitment.

I’m not sure wether it’s a commitment to work rostered Sundays or a commitment to work so many Sundays in a year.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 19, 2022, 10:50:50 am
That may well be why GWR are suggesting

Quote
We want to make Sunday services more attractive for customers. The aim is to ensure coverage by establishing a commitment by colleagues to working on some – not all - Sundays.

To bring HSS in line with those that have a commitment. What is that commitment in terms of the number of Sundays?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 19, 2022, 11:13:20 am
No trains to BRI during tomorrow's strike - a change to previous strikes

Quote
Dear Chris
 
A very quick update and reminder on the RMT and TSSA strikes. 
 
We were able to operate our contingency timetable yesterday (Thursday 18 August) without any additional changes, albeit that in some areas we were not able to run any services at all.  There is a Transport for London strike today, but the majority of GWR rail services are running normally.
 
As we mentioned previously there is a further rail strike tomorrow Saturday (20 August). This will mean a heavily reduced timetable with no services in many areas, including Bristol Temple Meads where contingency signallers are not available this Saturday. This is different to previous strike days.
 
Our message to customers remains to only travel if absolutely necessary, and to make alternative arrangements if they can.  If there are services operating, we want customers to double check timetables before setting out – including return journeys as services will be finishing much early than usual.
 
The strike will also impact some services on Sunday (21 August).  Details are on our dedicated strike page on www.gwr.com/strike
 
No further rail strike dates have been announced by either RMT, ASLEF or TSSA.  They would need to give at least two weeks notice and we will keep you fully updated.
 
As always if you have any questions for us, please do get in contact, we are happy to help.
 
Jane and Toby
 

Jane Jones
Head of Public Affairs, Great Western Railway
 
Toby Elliott
Head of Communications, Network Rail Western


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2022, 11:51:37 am
That may well be why GWR are suggesting

Quote
We want to make Sunday services more attractive for customers. The aim is to ensure coverage by establishing a commitment by colleagues to working on some – not all - Sundays.

To bring HSS in line with those that have a commitment. What is that commitment in terms of the number of Sundays?

Currently around 1 in 3 Sundays for the GWR drivers with the ‘committed Sunday’ agreement. 

I’d have thought any new agreement would be at the most at similar level to Saturdays which is 2 in 3, though possibly something like 1 in 2 or even 2 in 5 would be enough for what is likely to operate on Sunday’s.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 19, 2022, 11:57:05 am
That may well be why GWR are suggesting

Quote
We want to make Sunday services more attractive for customers. The aim is to ensure coverage by establishing a commitment by colleagues to working on some – not all - Sundays.

To bring HSS in line with those that have a commitment. What is that commitment in terms of the number of Sundays?

I don’t know what the commitment is in terms of the number of Sundays.

There’s little point in trying to bring HSS in line with GWR drivers purely because there are now so few HSS drivers and the number will only continue to dwindle.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2022, 12:23:23 pm
There’s little point in trying to bring HSS in line with GWR drivers purely because there are now so few HSS drivers and the number will only continue to dwindle.

I think there’s still over 400 HSS drivers, so still plenty.  As you say, numbers are diminishing, but still many years of shortages if just left to natural wastage.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 19, 2022, 01:17:59 pm
There’s little point in trying to bring HSS in line with GWR drivers purely because there are now so few HSS drivers and the number will only continue to dwindle.

I think there’s still over 400 HSS drivers, so still plenty.  As you say, numbers are diminishing, but still many years of shortages if just left to natural wastage.

But put into perspective, there’s nearly 250 GWR drivers at Exeter alone.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2022, 02:26:39 pm
Exeter GWR has around 150 I think you’ll find


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2022, 06:10:17 pm
Exeter GWR has around 150 I think you’ll find

Just to give an idea of driver numbers at each depot:

Bristol - HSS 66   GWR 118
Bristol Parkway - HSS 41  GWR 6
Cardiff - GWR 15
Exeter - HSS 43   GWR 150
Fratton - GWR 34
Gloucester - GWR 60
Oxford - GWR 83
Paddington - HSS 78   GWR 73   
Par - GWR 33
Penzance - HSS 30   GWR 47
Plymouth - HSS 55   GWR 30
Reading - GWR 220
Swansea - HSS 65   GWR 5
Westbury - GWR 65
Worcester - HSS 25   GWR 14

Totals:  HSS 403    GWR 953

So, 30% HSS and 70% GWR - a little more biased towards GWR than I was expecting, but they can have a disproportionate affect on the longer distance routes that seem to struggle the most on Sundays.  You can't cover much of a Paddington<>Penzance service with crews from the GWR exclusive deports of Oxford, Reading, Fratton or Gloucester for example.

In terms of how quickly HSS drivers will move to GWR or retire remains to be seen.  I guess if I do this calculation same time next year, we'll get an idea as to how quickly numbers are shifting?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on August 19, 2022, 09:12:40 pm
Exeter GWR has around 150 I think you’ll find

Just to give an idea of driver numbers at each depot:

Bristol - HSS 66   GWR 118
Bristol Parkway - HSS 41  GWR 6
Cardiff - GWR 15
Exeter - HSS 43   GWR 150
Fratton - GWR 34
Gloucester - GWR 60
Oxford - GWR 83
Paddington - HSS 78   GWR 73   
Par - GWR 33
Penzance - HSS 30   GWR 47
Plymouth - HSS 55   GWR 30
Reading - GWR 220
Swansea - HSS 65   GWR 5
Westbury - GWR 65
Worcester - HSS 25   GWR 14

Totals:  HSS 403    GWR 953

So, 30% HSS and 70% GWR - a little more biased towards GWR than I was expecting, but they can have a disproportionate affect on the longer distance routes that seem to struggle the most on Sundays.  You can't cover much of a Paddington<>Penzance service with crews from the GWR exclusive deports of Oxford, Reading, Fratton or Gloucester for example.

In terms of how quickly HSS drivers will move to GWR or retire remains to be seen.  I guess if I do this calculation same time next year, we'll get an idea as to how quickly numbers are shifting?


I do seem to recall a few years back certain correspondents were telling us that there were a lot of new recruits going through driver training who had Sundays as part of the working week and so this problem would naturally disappear.........what has happened to them?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on August 20, 2022, 06:35:20 am
Exeter GWR has around 150 I think you’ll find

Just to give an idea of driver numbers at each depot:

Bristol - HSS 66   GWR 118
Bristol Parkway - HSS 41  GWR 6
Cardiff - GWR 15
Exeter - HSS 43   GWR 150
Fratton - GWR 34
Gloucester - GWR 60
Oxford - GWR 83
Paddington - HSS 78   GWR 73   
Par - GWR 33
Penzance - HSS 30   GWR 47
Plymouth - HSS 55   GWR 30
Reading - GWR 220
Swansea - HSS 65   GWR 5
Westbury - GWR 65
Worcester - HSS 25   GWR 14

Totals:  HSS 403    GWR 953

So, 30% HSS and 70% GWR - a little more biased towards GWR than I was expecting, but they can have a disproportionate affect on the longer distance routes that seem to struggle the most on Sundays.  You can't cover much of a Paddington<>Penzance service with crews from the GWR exclusive deports of Oxford, Reading, Fratton or Gloucester for example.

In terms of how quickly HSS drivers will move to GWR or retire remains to be seen.  I guess if I do this calculation same time next year, we'll get an idea as to how quickly numbers are shifting?


Although I suspect the retirement / transfer rate is not a linear one.

Network Rail has a similar issue with a large number of maintenance staff on old RT IMC (Railtrack Infrastructure Maintenance Companies) AMec, Balfour Beaty, Amey GTRM / Carillion.  One of the conditions of the pay offer by NR is to use one contract for people to be moved onto it on promotion or voluntarily, the contract that is being proposed is one of the former RT IMC contracts it just so happens it's the one with worst conditions


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 20, 2022, 09:12:33 am
I do seem to recall a few years back certain correspondents were telling us that there were a lot of new recruits going through driver training who had Sundays as part of the working week and so this problem would naturally disappear.........what has happened to them?

Are you asking what’s happened to the trainees, or the correspondents?  ;)

All new trainees since 2017 (IIRC) have been GWR grade, meaning Sundays are ‘committed overtime’ which is different to being part of the working week as explained before.

I remember Broadgage suggesting that would solve the Sunday problem and myself being very cautious about how long it would take to make a tangible difference, and stick by that statement.

Lots of trainees have passed out, not helped by COVID of course, but look at Worcester for example which was 30 HSS and 0 LTV two years ago and it’s now 25/14. 

Many more are still going through training, but that 403 HSS figure won’t disappear overnight…hence me suggesting I take a look this time next year to see how it has changed.

A settlement from the industrial dispute might render that irrelevant in terms of Sunday working, but I personally doubt it.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 21, 2022, 09:09:19 am
The 403 HSS drivers will only reduce through natural wastage, very few will opt to transfer over to the GWR grade. 

When you look at it though, across the entire business, you’ll never currently need more than 175 to 200 HSS drivers on a Sunday and with the next recruit drive for drivers to be launched next year you’ll have a pool of more GWR drivers to cover HSS Sunday work on overtime.
To get Sundays in the working week would require substantially more drivers which is why companies and the DfT prefer the commitment to work instead.  Sunday’s to HSS drivers who work them are worth, in the region of £8,000 a year. There’s very little business sense in offering a pay rise of £5,000+ to HSS drivers to include Sunday’s.  IndustryInsider may be able to confirm as I’m not sure, but any pay rise to HSS drivers has to be given to GWR drivers as well?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2022, 10:25:25 am
The 403 HSS drivers will only reduce through natural wastage, very few will opt to transfer over to the GWR grade. 

Indeed, no more than a handful have so far across the business AIUI.

In time there might be a tipping point reached where the number of HSS drivers will diminish such that the company could starve them of the more attractive shifts and routes and that means the end will happen quite quickly, but I can see that being at least five, maybe ten years into the future.

IndustryInsider may be able to confirm as I’m not sure, but any pay rise to HSS drivers has to be given to GWR drivers as well?

Yes, AIUI.  Parity on pay for HSS, LTV and West drivers was achieved in early 2020 after several yearly stages (with LTV and West combining to become GWR), and I don't think HSS can then leap ahead again.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on August 22, 2022, 10:49:21 am
In time there might be a tipping point reached where the number of HSS drivers will diminish such that the company could starve them of the more attractive shifts and routes and that means the end will happen quite quickly, but I can see that being at least five, maybe ten years into the future.

... by which time GBR will have brought in ... what? The original Williams-Shapps plan was keen on industry-wide career and training structures, but very woolly about what operators' contracts would contain and how it would get there. I've not seen anything clearer yet, but no doubt the unions are taking a close interest in this subject.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2022, 11:02:29 am
Exactly.  Far too far in advance to know for sure.  I don’t expect the summer Sunday situation to improve much for at least three years though sadly.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on August 22, 2022, 11:46:15 am
Exactly.  Far too far in advance to know for sure.  I don’t expect the summer Sunday situation to improve much for at least three years though sadly.
Which begs the question why won't GWR produce a realistic summer Sunday timetable that can be achieved instead of having to cancel services every Sunday?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2022, 11:56:27 am
Good question.

Because that would be admitting defeat?  Or in breach of their contract?  Or the DfT won’t allow them?  Or because they have a more optimistic view than I have? 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on August 22, 2022, 12:42:19 pm
Exactly.  Far too far in advance to know for sure.  I don’t expect the summer Sunday situation to improve much for at least three years though sadly.

Frankly an appalling prospect, and bodes ill for the future of a railway which will rely increasingly on leisure travel to sustain viability on many routes.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2022, 01:44:47 pm
Exactly.  Far too far in advance to know for sure.  I don’t expect the summer Sunday situation to improve much for at least three years though sadly.

Frankly an appalling prospect, and bodes ill for the future of a railway which will rely increasingly on leisure travel to sustain viability on many routes.

I agree.  Make sure you take every opportunity to put that point of view across to the DfT/GWR.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 22, 2022, 04:12:19 pm
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62634795 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62634795)


With Citi forecasting inflation to hit over 18% next year I think the chances of settling this dispute is diminishing very quickly.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 22, 2022, 04:14:35 pm
That's next year's settlement (if it does get that high)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 22, 2022, 04:19:16 pm
That's next year's settlement (if it does get that high)

I did say next year!  But when the likes of Network Rail are offering multi-year pay deals (the current being being 8% over two or three years) shows this is some way off being settled. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2022, 04:34:57 pm
I’ve always been wary of multi-year settlements, and in the current climate I don’t see any point in them at all.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on August 22, 2022, 04:42:46 pm
I’ve always been wary of multi-year settlements, and in the current climate I don’t see any point in them at all.

Absolutely. Sort a one year deal out based on the months RPI we usually use (Feb or March) and then start discussing a framework for next year. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on August 22, 2022, 05:40:52 pm
There have been multi-year deals - TFL have just finished one. It was based I believe on RPI%+0.25%


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on August 22, 2022, 06:19:54 pm
There have been multi-year deals - TFL have just finished one. It was based I believe on RPI%+0.25%

While inflation was below 2% employers were content with these types of deals over multiple years, if the NR were to offer the RMT RPI plus 0.25%  I suspect the RMT would be more inclined to accept it as the pay award part of the talks; threat of redundancies is a different and very difficult circle to square


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Marlburian on October 05, 2022, 12:12:17 pm
My Polish friend is flying back to London on Sunday, so I checked on the trains from Stansted and discovered there was a replacement bus service to Waltham Cross, where she could then get a train. Turns out to be "planned engineering works". She was going to book a seat on National Express, then looked again at her air ticket and saw it was for Luton.The trains there to London look OK.

And I've previously posted about her travelling from Waterloo to Reading, then back to Paddington. She's back in London over the next few days and is very nonchalant about the various strikes. She reckons that today she'll catch a National Express bus from Stansted to London, where's she staying in Queensway, close to Paddington, so convenient for a Reading train. Only there's a very limited service. Now she's talking of travelling from Waterloo: "it was such a great journey last time - very much enjoyed it - train was great too".

Over the years, the only advantage of taking the Waterloo train rather than a Paddington one, was a change of scenery.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Ollie on October 15, 2022, 02:02:43 am
Not related to the pay dispute, however is an RMT strike, so...

RMT has instructed all its members employed as Crossing Keepers, Electrical Control Room Operators, Shift Signaller Managers and Signallers at Didcot Thames Valley Signalling Centre to not book on for any shifts that commence between:

00:01 to 23:59 hours on Saturday 5th November 2022
00:01 to 23:59 hours on Monday 7th November 2022

This dispute is in relation to the dismissal of a signaller.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: infoman on October 15, 2022, 04:02:40 am
May I ask what the dismissal was for?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on October 15, 2022, 07:45:35 am
Not related to the pay dispute, however is an RMT strike, so...

RMT has instructed all its members employed as Crossing Keepers, Electrical Control Room Operators, Shift Signaller Managers and Signallers at Didcot Thames Valley Signalling Centre to not book on for any shifts that commence between:

00:01 to 23:59 hours on Saturday 5th November 2022
00:01 to 23:59 hours on Monday 7th November 2022

This dispute is in relation to the dismissal of a signaller.


In practical terms, what will that mean for services between Reading- Plymouth/Penzance on those dates?

I have a journey which I need to make as a mercy mission on the 7th, I had considered making it by train but it sounds like I may need to consider my options.

Thanks for any advice


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Ollie on October 15, 2022, 01:36:00 pm
May I ask what the dismissal was for?

I've not been able to find that part yet. If I do, I shall update.

 

In practical terms, what will that mean for services between Reading- Plymouth/Penzance on those dates?

I have a journey which I need to make as a mercy mission on the 7th, I had considered making it by train but it sounds like I may need to consider my options.

Thanks for any advice

Probably a bit early to say, RMT gave the dates yesterday, so it'll be for Network Rail to now work out what desks in TVSC they think they can cover and for how long.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on October 18, 2022, 06:24:46 pm
RMT just announced strikes on 3/5/7 November


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on October 18, 2022, 07:16:33 pm
RMT just announced strikes on 3/5/7 November

A friend who is a RMT member has just received this...

Quote
18 October 2022
 
To: Branches, Regional Councils & Regional Offices
 
NETWORK RAIL MEMBERS TO TAKE FRESH STRIKE ACTION
 
Dear colleague
 
DEFEND JOBS, PAY & CONDITIONS – NETWORK RAIL
 
Talks between your union and Network Rail have resulted in management causing confusion and disarray after doing a U-Turn on a new pay offer and through a vindictive style of negotiations and threats to impose new working arrangements on RMT members.
 
Some managers are advising us formally that they are seeking to reach a negotiated settlement to this dispute while other managers are issuing threatening correspondence which do nothing to reach a settlement and instead set out the company’s clear intention to steamroller through their so-called “modernising” agenda without agreement.
 
This disingenuous method of negotiations cannot be tolerated any longer. Your union’s National Executive Committee has therefore today taken the decision to hold a further series of strikes.
 
All Network Rail members in the Maintenance function are instructed not to book on for any duties which commence between:
 
02:00 hours on Thursday 3rd November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Friday 4th November 2022
02:00 hours on Saturday 5th November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Sunday 6th November 2022
02:00 hours on Monday 7th November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Tuesday 8th November 2022
 
In addition, those in the Maintenance function are instructed not to work any overtime or rest days between:
 
02:00 hours on Wednesday 2nd November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Thursday 3rd November 2022
02:00 hours on Friday 4th November 2022 and 01:59 hours Saturday 5th November 2022
02:00 hours on Sunday 6th November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Monday 7th November 2022
02:00 hours on Tuesday 8th November 2022 and 01:59 hours on Wednesday 9th November 2022
 
All Network Rail members in the Operations function are instructed not to book on for any duties which commence between:
 
00:01 and 23:59 Hours on Thursday 3rd November 2022
00:01 and 23:59 Hours on Saturday 5th November 2022
00:01 and 23:59 Hours on Monday 7th November 2022
 
The company has left us no choice but to take this action following the Joint Pay Council of both Ops and Maintenance last Friday which was adjourned at the request of the Management Side to facilitate a full response to the positions put forward by your representatives.
One important position was that RMT formally requested confirmation that the company would not seek to impose any changes to members’ terms and conditions of employment or working practices which are material to the proposals being discussed.
This was in line with the stated company commitment to seek a negotiated settlement, therefore we requested that the company defer commencing local consultation on matters subject to these discussions and also defer the opening of voluntary severance for the same reasons.
 
Immediately following this meeting - and prior to us reconvening negotiations – I received correspondence from a manager who was not in attendance at the discussions confirming the company will move to impose matters supposedly still in the discussion and on which the Chair of Joint Council stated the company is actively seeking our agreement.
 
This correspondence also refers to members’ contractual terms and conditions of employment as “working practices” – despite our negotiating team advising that any move to impose changes to these would result in both an immediate industrial response and a legal challenge.
 
When clarification was sought from the Chair of the Joint Council we were advised:
 
“I want to confirm our commitment given at joint pay council on Friday that we wish to continue looking for a negotiated settlement to the dispute….”
 
Network Rail’s management is clearly divided and in disarray. It commits to negotiations and imposition at the same time. It offers to discuss an improved pay offer while reviving a rejected offer. We have no choice therefore but to respond industrially.
 
I have absolutely no doubt that RMT members at Network Rail will respond to this industrial action instruction in the same united, dignified and solid way they have responded to all strike calls up to now.
 
We simply cannot allow management to continue negotiating in such a chaotic manner, but we can assure members that this union is willing to talk and negotiate properly and formally.
 
STRIKE FOR PAY JUSTICE!
DEFEND YOUR TERMS AND CONDITIONS!
 
Yours sincerely

Michael Lynch
General Secretary


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on October 18, 2022, 07:31:50 pm
The strike day on the 3rd includes the London Underground & Overground


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: old original on October 19, 2022, 05:01:56 pm
I believe it's just been announced the RMT staff at the TOCs are also out on the 3rd & 5th


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on October 19, 2022, 05:06:55 pm
From the RMT website (https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-launch-strikes-on-train-operating-companies-in-national/)


Quote
19 October 2022

RMT Press Office:

Rail union RMT will take strike action on 14 train operating companies on November 3 and 5 after no new offer on pay jobs and working conditions.

Strike action will coincide with RMT members on Network Rail, London Underground and Overground who are also walking out.

Despite repeated negotiations, the Rail Delivery Group has failed to offer RMT members any offer on pay, jobs and conditions.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "Throughout this whole dispute, the Rail Delivery Group has been completely unreasonable by not offering our members any deal on pay, conditions and job security.

"Some of our members on the train operating companies are some of the lowest paid on the railways.

"This stands in stark contrast to rail operating company bosses making millions of pounds in profit.

"We remain open to meaningful talks, but we are steadfast in our industrial campaign to see a negotiated settlement for all our members in this dispute."

I thought that there were 15 TOCs that the RMT had strike action ballot approval - has one expired?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on October 20, 2022, 05:21:49 pm
It appears that TSSA are taking 'Action Short of a Strike' on the days RMT are striking.....

Quote
Given the lack of movement in negotiations within the Train Operating Companies. TSSA is announcing additional action short of strike for all our members in Great Western Railways (GWR).

Our reps met this week and decided to escalate our Action Short of Strike (ASOS) by adding an additional type of ASOS to the list than we have previously employed. We are announcing this today given the anti-trade union legislation that requires us to give 14 days’ notice of any industrial action.

We have therefore written to the company today to give notice that we are calling members to participate in:
 
•   Ban on on-call activities including ban on covering vacant on-call lines
This will take place over the following times and dates:

From 00:01 on Thursday 3rd November 2022 to 23:59 on Thursday 3rd November 2022

From 00:01 on Saturday 5th November 2022 to 23:59 on Saturday 5th November 2022

During the period of dispute TSSA members can legitimately refuse to:
 
•   Carry out on call duties whether their own or vacant colleagues during the times and dates above which coincide with the strike action planned by our Sister unions.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on October 21, 2022, 07:15:15 am
This letter is on the Network Rail website https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/Letter-to-Mick-Lynch-letter-dated-19-October-2022.pdf

Quote
19th October 2022
Dear Mick
After days of constructive negotiations with your team, I was genuinely surprised to see your press release last night stating that Network Rail had performed a ‘U-turn’ on our pay offer.  Nothing could be further from the truth. People were concerned to know if the current offer had been withdrawn and we simply confirmed it was still on the table. We remain open to additional ideas that would make us more productive and generate additional funding for pay.
On one issue our offer has changed already – for the better. Recognising colleagues’ genuine fears about job security we are now offering an even stronger jobs guarantee. This is our commitment to no compulsory redundancy for general grades colleagues until 31 January 2025. Indeed, I would hope to extend our jobs guarantee beyond this if we can work together to modernise the railway.

That is our offer so far: a jobs guarantee, a pay rise and discounted travel as follows: -
• 4%increase in base pay backdated to 1 January 2022, including shift pay and overtime.
• 4%increase in base pay from 1 January 2023.
• £250 increase in base salary backdated to January 2021 for colleagues whose annual base salary in 2021 was less than £24,000 per year.
• Increased pay range scales in line with the 4% award for 2022 and 2023.
We are also offering a 75% discount on leisure travel for our staff, their partner, and any dependents. As well as removing the cap on season ticket subsidies so those who can catch the train to work can have a 75% discount on any season ticket.
 
This comprehensively responds to the elements in your dispute. In the current climate of significant economic uncertainty and looming public spending cuts I think that’s a fair package.
And I think many of our colleagues think so too, which is why we are disappointed you’ve never put it to a referendum. So we need to get round the table to sort out any specific issues urgently because delay makes the financial challenge even greater.  We do want agreement to our proposals to change working practices in Maintenance and Works
Delivery, in particular, to fund this deal - as we have no additional income to pay for rises otherwise. These changes would make us more effective, safe and efficient. This means introducing individual rostering, joint response teams, co-operative working and overlapping skills becoming mandatory. We have always been transparent that Maintenance would reduce by approximately 1,850 colleagues over the next 12 -18 months, which we will achieve through a voluntary redundancy scheme for Maintenance and Works Delivery. This scheme will open for expressions of interest on 24 October.  As you know, national consultation on our proposals to change working practices in Maintenance concluded on 11 October. We offered, in good faith, to delay the start of local consultation at Route level until December to provide additional time for more talks with the Trade Unions. We are disappointed about your decision yesterday to announce strikes on November 3, 5 and 7, which effectively gives us a matter of days to reach agreement.
 
I must level with you that the financial impact of further strikes such as those you have now announced will make it harder to fund even the existing pay offer. Strikes risk driving away passengers and freight customer for good and cost the industry money we can ill afford in these times.
Given the public nature of your claims last night I am making this letter public and sharing it with colleagues.  We have invited you and your team to intensive talks next week after TUC Congress.
I look forward to getting a resolution in time for Christmas.

Yours sincerely,
Tim Shoveller
Managing director
North West and Centra



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on October 21, 2022, 09:02:17 am
It's good to see a factual, calm and measured response from NR to the endless stream of froth mouthed rhetoric emanating from Lynch and the RMT.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 21, 2022, 08:00:53 pm
Sensible timing from NR’s perspective as they know the RMT membership is about to be re-balloted.

Let’s hope the various disputes can indeed be resolved by the end of the year.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on October 25, 2022, 03:45:35 pm
It appears that TSSA are taking 'Action Short of a Strike' on the days RMT are striking.....

Quote
Given the lack of movement in negotiations within the Train Operating Companies. TSSA is announcing additional action short of strike for all our members in Great Western Railways (GWR).

Our reps met this week and decided to escalate our Action Short of Strike (ASOS) by adding an additional type of ASOS to the list than we have previously employed. We are announcing this today given the anti-trade union legislation that requires us to give 14 days’ notice of any industrial action.

We have therefore written to the company today to give notice that we are calling members to participate in:
 
•   Ban on on-call activities including ban on covering vacant on-call lines
This will take place over the following times and dates:

From 00:01 on Thursday 3rd November 2022 to 23:59 on Thursday 3rd November 2022

From 00:01 on Saturday 5th November 2022 to 23:59 on Saturday 5th November 2022

During the period of dispute TSSA members can legitimately refuse to:
 
•   Carry out on call duties whether their own or vacant colleagues during the times and dates above which coincide with the strike action planned by our Sister unions.

Update - now strike action on these days at Network Rail too.
From The Grauniad (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/24/rail-union-announces-week-of-industrial-action-across-uk?utm_term=635792d4da2c571153a0e4bb6d7e3336&utm_campaign=BusinessToday&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&CMP=bustoday_email)

Quote
UK rail union announces week of industrial action
Members at South Western Rail, Southeastern, West Midlands Trains, Northern and Great Western will strike starting from 3 November

A rail union has announced nearly a week of industrial action, including strikes in November in their ongoing dispute over pay, job security and conditions.

Thousands of members of the Transport Salaried Staffs’ Association at Network Rail will strike on Thursday 3 November, Saturday 5 November and Monday 7 November, while members at individual train companies will take strike action and action short of strike on 3, 7 and 8 November.

Members at five rail operators – South Western Rail, Southeastern, West Midlands Trains, Northern and Great Western – will take action short of strike action for the whole of November, and those at a sixth company, TransPennine Express, will join them from 7 November.

Members involved in the action include staff in ticket offices, stations, control rooms, and other support roles across Britain.

The TSSA is seeking a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies, a pay rise that offsets the cost of living crisis, and no unagreed changes to terms and conditions.

Its general secretary, Manuel Cortes, said: “Our members never take industrial action lightly. We would far rather find a fair negotiated solution to this now long-running dispute, but we simply have no choice.

“A huge number of rail workers in our union, many of whom are our longstanding members, had never been directly involved in an industrial dispute before this year.

“Across our railways, our members recently stepped up to the plate yet again and went above and beyond to meet unprecedented demand during the period of public mourning to provide additional services and keep the public safe, much like they did during the pandemic. They prove their worth time and time again and yet they are still undervalued.

“When this dust has settled over Rishi Sunak’s coronation, I hope that whoever he appoints as the new secretary of state for transport will see sense, unlike Grant Shapps, and use their powers to mandate a fair pay rise, reasonable terms and conditions and end this dispute.

“It’s time for train operators to be allowed to meet us round the table and negotiate a fair solution.”

A Department for Transport spokesperson said: “This is incredibly disappointing. Through no fault of their own, people up and down the country will once again have their day to day lives disrupted and be unable to attend work, school or vital doctor’s appointments.

“Our railway is in desperate need of modernisation, but all more strikes will do is take it back to the dark ages and push passengers further away. We urge union bosses to reconsider this divisive action and instead work with employers, not against them, to agree a new way forward.”



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on October 25, 2022, 04:52:58 pm
So the TSSA is basically saying they want guarantees of no change ever, irrespective of the wider environment (some might say the real world) + a double digit payrise.

I think they'll have a few challenges managing expectations going forward.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on October 25, 2022, 09:52:42 pm
RMT call off strike on Thursday 3 November, 5th and 7th to go ahead as planned.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on October 25, 2022, 10:03:38 pm
RMT call off strike on Thursday 3 November, 5th and 7th to go ahead as planned.
On the 9th instead.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 25, 2022, 10:16:39 pm
So the TSSA is basically saying they want guarantees of no change ever, irrespective of the wider environment (some might say the real world) + a double digit payrise.

Guarantees of no unagreed changes.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on October 25, 2022, 11:28:14 pm
5th now NR & TOCs, 7th & 9th is NR only.

Tube & Overground now moved to 10th


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on October 26, 2022, 06:39:04 am
5th now NR & TOCs, 7th & 9th is NR only.
I imagine the affect of action will be the same on the 7th and 9th will be the same as the 5th as TOCs aren’t able to run many services with NR staff on strike?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on October 26, 2022, 01:27:07 pm
The 7th & 9th will like previous RMT strikes - no service on many lines & Those that run will be on one shift - so 0730 - 1830

The 5th will all depend on the number of drivers each TOC has in the RMT rather than ASLEF.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on October 26, 2022, 10:03:16 pm
9th now confirmed as a full RMT strike.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 04, 2022, 03:45:49 pm
Train strikes suspended

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63510380


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 04, 2022, 04:52:08 pm
Train strikes suspended

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63510380


Story has been updated several times ...now reads

Quote
A series of strikes by railway workers planned for 5, 7 and 9 November has been suspended, the RMT union has said.

But Network Rail warned that the late notice meant services on Saturday would remain "extremely limited", and trains on Monday are likely to be affected.

The RMT, which represents rail workers, said it would now enter "a period of intensive negotiations" with Network Rail and the rail companies.

The strike had been called in a dispute over pay and conditions.

They involved staff at Network Rail, which employs signalling workers across England, Scotland and Wales.

As a result, the action had been expected to have a major impact across the network, with only a fifth of services due to run.
RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said the threat of strike action "has made the rail employers see sense".

"We have always wanted to secure a negotiated settlement and that is what we will continue to push for in this next phase of intensive talks.

"Our priority is our members, and we are working towards securing a deal on job security, a decent pay rise and good working conditions."

He added that there had been "the promise of an offer" on pay from the rail operating companies.

Mr Lynch also warned that if the union felt the need to take strike action during the next six months, it would still do so.

Tim Shoveller, Network Rail's chief negotiator, welcomed the suspension of the strike but said: "The very late notice means that services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited," adding that services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted.

He said Network Rail "look forward to getting back round the table with all our trades unions early next week to see if the progress made this week can be built on, and a resolution found."

Network Rail continues to advise passengers to check before they travel, and to only travel by rail if absolutely necessary on Saturday and Monday.

Mark Harper, the UK's new transport secretary, said that the suspension of the strike action was "a positive development for passengers up and down the country".

But he cautioned that the very late notice means "there will still be significant disruption across the network tomorrow and into Monday".

He added that calling off the latest strikes has given negotiations between unions and employers a "better chance of success".


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 04, 2022, 05:38:30 pm
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: broadgage on November 05, 2022, 12:56:24 am
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???

I expect that some of those who were due to strike have already made arrangements to go away for a few days. Some may already have left the country and can not return in time to start work.
I expect a lot of sudden sickness on the days during which strike action was expected.

Might also be a shortage of trains. The very limited service that was expected might have been considered as a good opportunity to catch up on maintenance.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 05, 2022, 08:25:33 am
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???

I expect that some of those who were due to strike have already made arrangements to go away for a few days. Some may already have left the country and can not return in time to start work.
I expect a lot of sudden sickness on the days during which strike action was expected.

Might also be a shortage of trains. The very limited service that was expected might have been considered as a good opportunity to catch up on maintenance.

In every organisation I've ever worked for, once strike dates were announced it was not possible to book annual leave for the same date, so assuming the railways work the same way, unless those to whom you allude had magical powers of foresight and had booked said days off already, they will be expected to report for work or be AWOL, and early November is hardly peak holiday time, being after half term and before Christmas.

No doubt there will be sickies, but I would imagine most likely a lot of people sitting around doing nothing for a few days whilst customers struggle on - good luck to anyone travelling to and from Cardiff today for the rugby - you would have thought at the very least some arrangements could have been made to service that event.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Fourbee on November 05, 2022, 08:44:32 am
Might be (even more of) a problem booking Rail Replacement Buses on routes where they weren't going to be provided.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 05, 2022, 09:09:29 am
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???

Due to the lateness of the announcement contacting all of the staff is not practical, within Network Rail some turns at the weekend would normally covered by overtime which means no one will have been rostered to cover the turns.  On-call staff will have left their vans at depots so there will be a time lag for them to report in and collect them.

There is a limit to the contingent cover provided during the strikes and there is a limit to the level of service that is safe to run with the contingent cover


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 05, 2022, 09:28:08 am
I know every part of the rail network is different, but Southeastern have manage to come up with a pretty decent service today:

https://www.southeasternrailway.co.uk/travel-information/live-travel-information/service-disruption?uq=638032366163950000#INCC634C816107542CF811A7FDF1BF3D75C

Quote
The RMT and TSSA unions have announced that the strike action planned for Saturday 5, Monday 7 and Wednesday 9 November has been suspended.

Given the late notice suspension it has not been possible to restore our full timetable and therefore we will only be able to operate a limited service on the routes detailed below. Trains will start later and finish much earlier than the usual Saturday timetable so please check your journey before travelling by using our journey planner.

High speed (London St Pancras <> Ashford)
High speed (London St Pancras <> Ramsgate via Faversham)
London Victoria <> Ramsgate via Rochester
London Victoria <> Orpington via Herne Hill
London Victoria <> Ashford International via Maidstone East
London Bridge <> Dartford via Woolwich
London Bridge <> Dartford via Bexleyheath   
London Bridge <> Dartford via Sidcup      
London Bridge <> Orpington / Sevenoaks   
London Charing Cross <> Hastings            
London Charing Cross <> Ramsgate via Dover   
London Charing Cross <> Ramsgate via Canterbury West
 

There will be no service on the following routes:

Medway Valley Line (Tonbridge / Paddock Wood <> Strood via Maidstone West)
Sheerness Line (Sittingbourne <> Sheerness)
Hayes Line (Lewisham <> Hayes)
Bromley North Line (Grove Park <> Bromley North)



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 05, 2022, 01:59:54 pm
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???

Due to the lateness of the announcement contacting all of the staff is not practical, within Network Rail some turns at the weekend would normally covered by overtime which means no one will have been rostered to cover the turns.  On-call staff will have left their vans at depots so there will be a time lag for them to report in and collect them.

There is a limit to the contingent cover provided during the strikes and there is a limit to the level of service that is safe to run with the contingent cover

Can possibly, just possibly with a huge amount of latitude accept some of that as an excuse for today (although needing to contact all staff? Do they live in a bubble without exposure to news?)...but Monday? Three days later?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 05, 2022, 05:43:15 pm
Looks like TfW have managed to continue to run valley line trains throughout the evening to help get Welsh rugby fans back home.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 05, 2022, 05:43:41 pm
......presumably this means that all those due to strike will report for duty, so I'm puzzled as to why "services for tomorrow cannot be reinstated and will remain extremely limited", and that "services on Monday are also likely to be disrupted"???

Due to the lateness of the announcement contacting all of the staff is not practical, within Network Rail some turns at the weekend would normally covered by overtime which means no one will have been rostered to cover the turns.  On-call staff will have left their vans at depots so there will be a time lag for them to report in and collect them.

There is a limit to the contingent cover provided during the strikes and there is a limit to the level of service that is safe to run with the contingent cover

Can possibly, just possibly with a huge amount of latitude accept some of that as an excuse for today (although needing to contact all staff? Do they live in a bubble without exposure to news?)...but Monday? Three days later?

I will be how the rosters have been planned out.  The staff roster planning and train diagrams over the industrial action period would have been set in place over a week ago, the train diagrams are easier to alter than people, the people would have been assigned their shifts to work changing people work patterns at short notice is not easy especially when there's lots of people involved.

There will be efforts put inplace to get staff rosters chnaged, but it is better to say Monday may not be a full service and over deliver than promise a normal service and under deliver


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Richard Fairhurst on November 06, 2022, 07:10:22 pm
RTT is suggesting that many services have been reinstated tomorrow on the Cotswold Line, at least:

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/gb-nr:CBY/2022-11-07/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

A cursory check suggests that several other lines have had some service reinstated (e.g. South Cotswolds, TransWilts), but that it's pretty skeletal on a few (e.g. North Downs, Banbury stoppers).


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on November 06, 2022, 07:48:12 pm
There will be efforts put inplace to get staff rosters chnaged, but it is better to say Monday may not be a full service and over deliver than promise a normal service and under deliver

I can see it might take 24 hours notice for a simpler metro-style service, and 48 hours for long-distance routes where trains and crews have longer cycle times. And if there's a residue of disruption on Monday morning ... well, we know the railway is a big complicated cumbersome and inflexible beast. But GWR's current advice looks unimpressive by any measure:
Quote
Planned industrial action on Monday 7 & Wednesday 9 November has been cancelled. Unfortunately, with less than 12 hours notice before the strikes were due to start, it is too late to restore normal timetables on Monday 7 & Tuesday 8 November. Our advice remains to only travel by rail if absolutely necessary.
-
Train services will still be severely disrupted and some parts of the GWR network will have no service at all. Where trains are running, an extremely limited service will operate.
-
Where trains are able to run, they are expected to be extremely busy and we are not able to provide bus replacement services.
-
Customers are advised to find alternative ways to travel on Monday 7 November. Only travel by train if absolutely necessary. A reduced timetable will be in operation and many routes will have no services at all.
-
We are working hard to restore the normal timetable from Wednesday 9 November. However, customers planning to travel on either Tuesday 8 or Wednesday 9 November are advised to check their entire journey before travelling.

That's 12 hours notice, but before a strike start four days earlier!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: old original on November 07, 2022, 08:32:52 am
Hourly on the Falmouth & St Ives also hourly shuttle Penzance to Newton Abbot....  better than nothing


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Richard Fairhurst on November 07, 2022, 09:18:28 am
Bit confusing this morning - the departure boards were saying that several up trains would run on the Cotswold Line, but in fact nothing has run so far. Looks like the first one will be the 08.56 from Great Malvern which RTT is showing as being on its way.

Next question is whether anything will run this evening...


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 07, 2022, 10:12:32 am
Bit confusing this morning - the departure boards were saying that several up trains would run on the Cotswold Line, but in fact nothing has run so far. Looks like the first one will be the 08.56 from Great Malvern which RTT is showing as being on its way.

Basically it's a mess - data all over the place ...

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/bambam247.jpg)

BBC headline - "Train passengers told to check before travelling on Monday" - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63522511


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Hafren on November 07, 2022, 10:15:15 am
I wonder how all this works with compensation. I planned to work from home because of the strike, and claim the lost day's use of season ticket as instructed. Strike was cancelled but potentially too late for service on Monday. Trains reappeared in RTT late last night, but I decided it was too late to change plans, and stuck with plan to work from home. Perhaps still claimable as we were told to expect disruption, but automatic systems might not approve it.

Checking SWA, there were some problems e.g. delays and non-reports, and not the 'full' service running, but not too bad.

Bit confusing this morning - the departure boards were saying that several up trains would run on the Cotswold Line, but in fact nothing has run so far. Looks like the first one will be the 08.56 from Great Malvern which RTT is showing as being on its way.

Next question is whether anything will run this evening...

Shows the need to under-promise and over-deliver in this situation. As is often the case, understandable that problems arose, but not great that a reinstatement was advertised and then couldn't be delivered.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: the void on November 07, 2022, 10:55:10 am
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/rail-rmt-strike-suspension-cancellation-b2218879.html

Suggestion that this might be a new RMT tactic. Announce a strike, but call it off at the very last minute, knowing it's too late to reinstate services. All the disruption with no loss of pay for members.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: nickswift99 on November 07, 2022, 01:43:07 pm
I wonder how all this works with compensation. I planned to work from home because of the strike, and claim the lost day's use of season ticket as instructed. Strike was cancelled but potentially too late for service on Monday. Trains reappeared in RTT late last night, but I decided it was too late to change plans, and stuck with plan to work from home. Perhaps still claimable as we were told to expect disruption, but automatic systems might not approve it.

Checking SWA, there were some problems e.g. delays and non-reports, and not the 'full' service running, but not too bad.

Bit confusing this morning - the departure boards were saying that several up trains would run on the Cotswold Line, but in fact nothing has run so far. Looks like the first one will be the 08.56 from Great Malvern which RTT is showing as being on its way.

Next question is whether anything will run this evening...

Shows the need to under-promise and over-deliver in this situation. As is often the case, understandable that problems arose, but not great that a reinstatement was advertised and then couldn't be delivered.

The advice on GWR's website for today and tomorrow (Tuesday) remains to avoid travel. On that basis I've not travelled and submitted a claim for today. The language used on their website is the same as previous strike days for which I received compensation.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 07, 2022, 02:34:36 pm
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/rail-rmt-strike-suspension-cancellation-b2218879.html

Suggestion that this might be a new RMT tactic. Announce a strike, but call it off at the very last minute, knowing it's too late to reinstate services. All the disruption with no loss of pay for members.

Only the staff that would have normally been rostered as part of their normal turns of duty.

I doubt that a Union would use calling off of a strike at short notice as a tactic they would use in the dispute, it would be the quickest route for them to end up in Court, also if used too often the employers could be issuing warnings to staff for failing to turn up for duty a very quick way to tee off your members.  The Unions must have felt fairly confident that progress had been made in the talks with the employers to call of the industrial action 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on November 07, 2022, 03:45:58 pm
Bit confusing this morning - the departure boards were saying that several up trains would run on the Cotswold Line, but in fact nothing has run so far. Looks like the first one will be the 08.56 from Great Malvern which RTT is showing as being on its way.

Basically it's a mess - data all over the place ...

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/bambam247.jpg)

BBC headline - "Train passengers told to check before travelling on Monday" - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63522511

It is not brilliant - but there isn't a simple answer.  Leave things as they were so the earlier messages remain, and are clear, but be criticised for doing nothing or try to add services back as resources are available.

It isn't a problem unique to GWR.  There was some confusion between differing websites about some SWR services this morning.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 07, 2022, 05:04:29 pm
It is not brilliant - but there isn't a simple answer.  Leave things as they were so the earlier messages remain, and are clear, but be criticised for doing nothing or try to add services back as resources are available.

It isn't a problem unique to GWR.  There was some confusion between differing websites about some SWR services this morning.

I know - I chose to leave it as was on the Coffee Shop and not attempt a "special". 

Much more of concern was the printed notice still on display (on a mobile stand that could have been wheeled away thought about it!) telling people - lunchtime Saturday - about the strikes that day and on Monday and Wednesday.  Out of date and misleading - better to take it away that provide wrong information or even (the circumstances) a handwritten or printed A4 sheet on top saying "being updated".   Great admiration for certain tube stations where a good old fashioned whiteboard ...


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 07, 2022, 07:11:00 pm
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/rail-rmt-strike-suspension-cancellation-b2218879.html

Suggestion that this might be a new RMT tactic. Announce a strike, but call it off at the very last minute, knowing it's too late to reinstate services. All the disruption with no loss of pay for members.

Only the staff that would have normally been rostered as part of their normal turns of duty.

I doubt that a Union would use calling off of a strike at short notice as a tactic they would use in the dispute, it would be the quickest route for them to end up in Court, also if used too often the employers could be issuing warnings to staff for failing to turn up for duty a very quick way to tee off your members.  The Unions must have felt fairly confident that progress had been made in the talks with the employers to call of the industrial action 

Well....the proof of this will surely be in the pudding as we'll shortly find out if there is indeed an offer made.

The delay in restoring services is down to rosters of crew & trains, which may be in the wrong place - no trains Saturday, very few movements Sunday with early finish on some routes still going in as planned for the Monday strike plus possible maintenance calls with Hitachi. Staff rosters have to be notified to all staff well in advance (once they've been worked out, meaning weekend working by staff who may not have been available at no notice, being firework weekend) - at least 72 hours and possibly longer. If you are rostered for a 0330 start, you don't want to find out the night before.....

But Wednesday really ought to be a full service frankly


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: bobm on November 07, 2022, 07:20:47 pm
If you are rostered for a 0330 start, you don't want to find out the night before.....

…..when you are on your second pint in the pub”

To paraphrase a rail friend of mine. 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 07, 2022, 08:15:47 pm
Having said all that, all depots should have a 'Master Roster' which I believe is set to roster everyone for a standard timetable, including rest days. Holidays will have been banned during the strike week too, I understand, so the quickest & easiest way of restoring at least somewhat of a normal service would for the roster management team to implement that, and then set to work rostering anything else out of the standard pattern.

This I believe is how C2C & Greater Anglia got almost their full timetable up & running today, with SouthEastern not far behind. Why others couldn't/wouldn't do that, I don't know.

Of course, there may have been stock issues too, but at least something of a reasonable offer might have been possible.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 08, 2022, 04:36:56 am
From GWR and NR last night at 18:30 - circular I'm sure but headed "dear Graham"

Quote
Following Friday’s late notice postponement of strike action by the RMT, TSSA and Unite unions, our teams have been working hard to reinstate services and we ran more services than originally planned today. A reduced timetable with services starting later than usual will remain in place for tomorrow (Tuesday 8th).
 
Our normal timetable will resume from Wednesday 9th November (previously planned to be a strike day).
 
Services for tomorrow and Wednesday are already in online journey planners. Customers should check before they travel in case there are any short-notice changes using www.gwr.com/check. 
 
Customers with tickets for the proposed strike days who have now chosen to change their travel plans will be entitled to a full refund, or use their existing ticket on services up to and including Friday 11th November. Full information can be found at www.gwr.com/strike. 
 
If there is anything we can do to help, please get in touch.

Sanity has returned to our disruption map

First train (Melksham) showing at the 07:53 to Swindon, so the 05:33, 06:36 and 07:21 remain "cancelled" as far as the passenger is concerned, although they probably won't show up in the failure stats making those stats look better than they really are.   First southbound train 09:10.
 


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: a-driver on November 08, 2022, 05:20:34 am
Holidays will have been banned during the strike week too, I understand

Holidays are definitely not banned. We’d be out the door again if that happened!!!!!!
Companies do not hold what union an employee is a member of so crew will be rostered as a normal day on strike days.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 08, 2022, 05:49:09 am
AIUI any annual leave remains valid that was booked and agreed before a strike day is called, but no additional applications are entertained after a strike is called.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 08, 2022, 07:06:40 am
AIUI any annual leave remains valid that was booked and agreed before a strike day is called, but no additional applications are entertained after a strike is called.

Yes that's been my experience throughout my career.

Message from GWR Twitter this morning remains

Services continue to be affected following the suspension of planned industrial action

There is currently a reduced level of service operating on many parts of the network

Find alternative ways to travel if possible

http://gwr.com/strike


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Richard Fairhurst on November 08, 2022, 08:58:16 am
The 04.49 from Hereford to Paddington was reinstated late last night. I spotted it in time to save Mrs F the protracted journey on the charming but rather slow bus from Charlbury into Oxford this morning. Can't imagine it was busy, though, unless there were many other people watching RTT in the small hours.

Otherwise no service before 09.00 here.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 08, 2022, 09:40:32 am
Many of the peak 9/10-car IET arrivals at Paddington crammed with 800+ passengers.

The ‘try not to travel’ message is very necessary but not necessarily being followed!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 08, 2022, 11:42:40 am
From The Telegraph, via MSN (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/rmt-blamed-for-monday-rail-chaos-after-sitting-on-potential-pay-deal/ar-AA13Qa97?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=abde1d7c6b494561b8354a728cabad87)

Quote
RMT blamed for Monday rail chaos after ‘sitting on’ potential pay deal

The trade union leading industrial action on the railways sat on a potential deal for a week that would have avoided travel chaos for millions of commuters on Monday, the Telegraph has learnt.

The Rail, Maritime and Transport workers union (RMT) waited until Friday afternoon to call off three days of strike action starting on Saturday, leaving no time to reset train timetables.

As a result, millions of commuters were dismayed to find just one in five train services were running on Monday across some of the UK's busiest lines despite the planned strike action being cancelled.

The last-minute cancellation came despite a verbal offer made a week beforehand. Network Rail is understood to have offered an olive branch to union leaders during the week commencing Oct 24.

It included an offer to drop plans to ram through changes to maintenance staff working conditions – a core plank of the dispute – without the RMT’s support.

The TSSA and Unite unions chose to call off their industrial action on the following Tuesday, Nov 1, in response.

It is understood that had the RMT moved in step with its sister unions, a full rail service would have been operated on Monday. Disruption on Saturday would also have been mitigated.

Mick Lynch, RMT general secretary, however, waited until last Thursday, Nov 3, to request that the offer from Network Rail was put in writing. Assurances were delivered on Friday, which prompted Mr Lynch to call off the strikes.

The RMT insisted that it decided to abandon a week-long campaign of strike action only once it had received written confirmation from Network Rail on Nov 4.

A spokesman for the union said: "For the first time the train operators via [trade body] the RDG committed in their letter on Friday to finally make a full written offer on the issues in dispute following a period of intensive negotiations with the train operating companies.

"Our NEC then decided at the earliest opportunity that same day to suspend scheduled strike action."

Rail industry sources hit back, with one saying that Network Rail’s position had not changed over the course of the week.

“TSSA and Unite didn't feel the need to wait for a clarification letter, the reason being everything was crystal clear,” they added.

Thameslink, Southern, Great Northern, Northern, South Western, South Eastern and ScotRail ran only around one in five of their normal services on Monday as a result of the last minute cancellation of industrial action.

Others, such as Greater Anglia and Merseyrail, were able to return to a full normal timetable.

Rail chiefs spent much of the weekend in talks with union leaders to try and avert travel chaos bleeding into this week.

Although they were unable to restore a full service, it is thought that roughly 40pc of normal trains were in operation across the country. Most companies offer drivers a "seven-day rostering agreement" that means timetables must be agreed a week in advance.

Services on Wednesday, originally down as a strike day, will return to a full schedule, sources said, after train operators struck a deal with drivers union Aslef to increase flexibility on rostering.

A train operator source said: "Bosses are spitting feathers at the fact that the RMT has got the moral high ground, whilst their members are getting paid for sitting at home."

A spokesman for Network Rail said: “Finding a resolution to this long running dispute is all that matters and right now all parties involved are fully engaged in that goal. With a fair wind, and building on progress of the last week, we hope that talks over the next two weeks can find that elusive win-win.”

They are correct in that the TSSA & Unite cancelled their strikes as stated above.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 09, 2022, 06:11:23 am
Another two strike days coming up on the 19th and 21st of November. RMT striking over the dismissal of a signaller at Thames Valley Signalling Centre.

Awaiting to see what disruption that will cause. All GWR are saying at the moment:
https://www.gwr.com/strike

Quote
In a separate, local, dispute with Network Rail, RMT members at the Thames Valley Signal Centre (TVSC) have announced their intention to take industrial action on Saturday 19 and Monday 21 November.

On these days train services will be disrupted on many parts of the GWR network. Trains on the days following the industrial action may also be disrupted.

A reduced service will operate between 07:30 and 18:30 on most parts of the GWR network, and the last trains will be earlier than usual.

In the areas affected, where we are able to run services, they are expected to be busy and we are not able to provide bus replacement services.

Online journey planners will be updated with the latest timetable information as soon as possible.

Must confess to having a bit more interest in this one as I’m meant to be traveling home from London on Saturday the 19th  :(


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 10, 2022, 01:58:05 pm
Train drivers belonging to ASLEF to strike on Saturday 26th of November.

edit: spelling


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 10, 2022, 02:06:18 pm
From the ASLEF website (https://aslef.org.uk/publications/aslef-announces-another-day-strike-action)

Quote
rain drivers who are members of ASLEF – the train drivers’ union – will walk out at 12 train operating companies on Saturday 26 November in a dispute over pay.

ASLEF negotiators have been engaged in talks with the industry but there has, so far, been no offer on pay.

Mick Whelan, general secretary, commented:

“We regret that passengers will be inconvenienced for another day. We don’t want to be taking this action. Withdrawing our labour is always a last resort for a trade union.

“We have come to the table, as we always will, in good faith but while the industry continues to make no offer – due to the dodgy deal they signed with the DfT – we have no choice but to take strike action again.

“They want drivers to take a real terms pay cut. With inflation now well into double figures, train drivers who kept Britain moving through the pandemic are now being expected to work just as hard this year as last year but for less. Most of these drivers have not had an increase in salary since 2019.

“We want the companies – which are making huge profits – to make a proper pay offer so that our members can keep up with the cost of living.”

ASLEF members at 12 companies – Avanti West Coast; Chiltern Railways; CrossCountry; East Midlands Railway; Great Western Railway; Greater Anglia; London North Eastern Railway; London Overground; Northern Trains; Southeastern; Transpennine Express, and West Midlands Trains   - will strike on 26 November.

We have already walked out for 24 hours on Saturday 30 July; Saturday 13 August; Saturday 1 October, and Wednesday 5 October at those companies which have, so far, refused to do the right thing.

This year we have successfully concluded pay deals with fourteen companies: Colas Infrastructure Monitoring; DB Cargo; Direct Rail Services; Eurostar; Freightliner Heavy Haul; Freightliner Intermodal; GB Railfreight; Grand Central; Merseyrail; MTR Elizabeth line; Nexus; PRE Metro Operations; ScotRail, and Transport for Wales. We have put an offer from the company to our members from Hull Trains and First Tram Operations.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 10, 2022, 02:33:10 pm
South West Trains unaffected?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 10, 2022, 02:36:38 pm
They were being re-balloted - maybe only action short of a strike was agreed?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Fourbee on November 12, 2022, 09:49:12 am
South West Trains unaffected?
SWR drivers had a pay deal a while back, not sure how long is left on it.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on November 12, 2022, 02:48:54 pm
South West Trains unaffected?

With the dire performance during 'normal' times we in SWR land are grateful for every small mercy.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 12, 2022, 06:36:34 pm
On the RDG website (https://media.raildeliverygroup.com/news/update-on-the-rmt-negotiations)

Quote
Update on the RMT negotiations

A spokesperson for the Railway Delivery Group, said

“We have held a series of constructive discussions with the RMT leadership this week and we have agreed to continue these discussions next week. Our priority remains to reach a fair deal which both rewards our people with a pay rise, and delivers the reforms needed to secure a sustainable future for the industry and those working within it.”

The result of the RMT re-ballot on the 15th (Tuesday) will be needed to be positive before they set any further strike dates, assuming they see out next week's talks.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 13, 2022, 10:03:39 am
South West Trains unaffected?
SWR drivers had a pay deal a while back, not sure how long is left on it.

Thanks - useful to know.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: rogerw on November 14, 2022, 02:08:14 pm
I have to travel from Bristol to London and back, for a trip on the British Pullman, on 26th November. When are we likely to know what service, if any, GWR will be offering


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 14, 2022, 02:11:05 pm
A few days before. Don’t expext anything before 0730 and all services to complete by 1830


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 14, 2022, 05:08:38 pm
Four days away from the industrial action taking place at TVSC on the 19th and we’re none the wiser as to what is going to be running on this coming Saturday.

edit spelling


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 14, 2022, 06:49:40 pm
Four days away from the industrial action taking place at TVSC on the 19th and we’re none the wiser as to what is going to be running on this coming Saturday.
Finally, some information: www.gwr.com/strike page has been updated. Still have to wait till Wednesday for a timetable mind.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 14, 2022, 09:56:44 pm
Four days away from the industrial action taking place at TVSC on the 19th and we’re none the wiser as to what is going to be running on this coming Saturday.

edit spelling

from GWR:

Quote
Dear Graham
 
We said we would keep you updated with planned industrial action that will affect train services. Unfortunately, we have two sets of dates to make you aware of.
 
On both Saturday 19th and Monday 21st November, RMT members at Network Rail’s signalling centre near Didcot Parkway will be on strike. This is regarding a local disciplinary matter and unrelated to the other strikes that have taken place this year.
 
As this is a crucial part of the network controlling all signalling between London Paddington, the Cotswolds, south Wales, west and south west of England, we will only be able to run a reduced number of services and those in the affected area will start much later and finish much earlier than usual. The train schedule is currently being confirmed and will be in online systems later this week. As with previous strikes, there will be a knock-on impact for the days after strikes, on Sunday 20th and Tuesday 22nd November. For further information please see www.gwr.com/strike. 
 
As this isn’t a national strike the level of awareness isn’t high, and will affect many passengers including heading to the rugby at the Principality Stadium in Cardiff and Twickenham Stadium in London. We’d be grateful if you could share this information through your networks.
 
We have also received notice that the ASLEF union (train drivers) will be on strike on Saturday 26th November. As with previous ASLEF action, this will severely limit train services and we expect to only be able to operate a very limited service between Bristol and London, Reading and Oxford, and Reading and Basingstoke. Exact details of the train schedule will be confirmed next week.
 
We will write to you again later this week when the train schedule for Saturday, Sunday, Monday and Tuesday as well as Saturday 26th has been confirmed.
 
Many thanks,
 
Toby and Jane
 
Toby Elliott, Head of Communications, Network Rail Western
 
Jane Jones, Head of Public Affairs, Great Western Railway


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 14, 2022, 10:56:50 pm
Melksham & North Cotswolds bott being served I note this weekend


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 15, 2022, 11:00:52 am
Melksham & North Cotswolds bott being served I note this weekend

Good to see.  Anything beyond Wolvercote Junction isn't controlled by the TVSC and that's the same once you get just onto the Melsksham Single at 96m 30c - but that might not have stopped them from giving up anyway!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: rogerw on November 20, 2022, 11:22:38 am
Services for 26th November, such as they are, now on journey planners. Limited hourly service BRI - PAD (0730 to1930). Booked myself a ticket and seat reservation. Interestingly services are not stopping at Bath Spa in either direction. Also hourly Reading to Oxford and Basingstoke.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: WSW Frome on November 20, 2022, 11:40:31 am
Assuming the trains are routed through Bath, then GWR may be avoiding the extra crush caused by the Christmas Market in Bath which I believe starts this Thursday.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: rogerw on November 20, 2022, 11:52:44 am
Probably the explanation as calling at Chippenham.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 20, 2022, 05:26:25 pm
Assuming the trains are routed through Bath, then GWR may be avoiding the extra crush caused by the Christmas Market in Bath which I believe starts this Thursday.
www.gwr.com/strike confirms trains not stopping at Bath Spa. Sensible move on this occasion as it would cause all sorts of trouble with overcrowding on what limited service is running. The Bath Christmas market causes all sorts of problems at Bath Spa when a full timetable is in operation!

Quote
A very limited service will run only on the following routes between:

London Paddington and Bristol Temple Meads (these trains will not stop at Bath Spa)
Reading and Oxford
Reading and Basingstoke


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Timmer on November 21, 2022, 05:40:57 pm
It’s not looking good:

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/train-companies-cancel-negotiations-and-make-no-offer-in/

Quote

TRAIN COMPANIES CANCEL NEGOTIATIONS AND MAKE NO OFFER IN NATIONAL RAIL DISPUTE

RMT Press Office:

The Rail Delivery Group, which represents the Train Operating Companies (TOCs), has today without any credible explanation refused to make their promised written proposals in the six-month dispute over jobs, terms and conditions and pay.

Similarly, Network Rail has also refused to make any proposals promised at the conclusion of intensive talks last week. RMT suspended strike action on the basis that they would make new proposals by November 17 and it has failed to table anything new.

This will mean that despite having shown good faith in attending a fortnight of discussions with both halves of the industry, the union has no new proposals to consider or put to its members.

RMT’s National Executive Committee will meet tomorrow morning (Tuesday 22nd November 2022) to consider the matter and it is highly likely that further phases of industrial action will be set down.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said:

“After a fortnight of talks, the TOCs had committed to making a firm offer in writing for the first time today.  They cancelled the meeting at an hour’s notice, and we can sense the hand of the Tory government in this as we believe that they are not allowing an offer to be made.

“This is on top of Network Rail failing to make a new proposal at the end of last week.

“Our members have shown their commitment to the dispute and to winning workplace justice in the re-ballot results last week and their union is equally determined to see this dispute through until we get a deal our members can support.

“Tomorrow morning our National Executive Committee will be meeting to consider this. We have been patient and have shown good faith which has not been returned. 

“Therefore, I will be recommending that we set out further phases of sustained industrial action in support of our members.

“While we will remain available for meaningful negotiations it is now obvious that the other side is unwilling or unable to progress matters appropriately, so our action will be reinstated,” he said.

I think we’re going to need a new thread soon.  :(


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: froome on November 21, 2022, 05:49:59 pm
 >:( >:( >:(


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 21, 2022, 06:07:57 pm
It’s not looking good:

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/train-companies-cancel-negotiations-and-make-no-offer-in/

Quote

TRAIN COMPANIES CANCEL NEGOTIATIONS AND MAKE NO OFFER IN NATIONAL RAIL DISPUTE

RMT Press Office:

The Rail Delivery Group, which represents the Train Operating Companies (TOCs), has today without any credible explanation refused to make their promised written proposals in the six-month dispute over jobs, terms and conditions and pay.

Similarly, Network Rail has also refused to make any proposals promised at the conclusion of intensive talks last week. RMT suspended strike action on the basis that they would make new proposals by November 17 and it has failed to table anything new.

This will mean that despite having shown good faith in attending a fortnight of discussions with both halves of the industry, the union has no new proposals to consider or put to its members.

RMT’s National Executive Committee will meet tomorrow morning (Tuesday 22nd November 2022) to consider the matter and it is highly likely that further phases of industrial action will be set down.

RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said:

“After a fortnight of talks, the TOCs had committed to making a firm offer in writing for the first time today.  They cancelled the meeting at an hour’s notice, and we can sense the hand of the Tory government in this as we believe that they are not allowing an offer to be made.

“This is on top of Network Rail failing to make a new proposal at the end of last week.

“Our members have shown their commitment to the dispute and to winning workplace justice in the re-ballot results last week and their union is equally determined to see this dispute through until we get a deal our members can support.

“Tomorrow morning our National Executive Committee will be meeting to consider this. We have been patient and have shown good faith which has not been returned. 

“Therefore, I will be recommending that we set out further phases of sustained industrial action in support of our members.

“While we will remain available for meaningful negotiations it is now obvious that the other side is unwilling or unable to progress matters appropriately, so our action will be reinstated,” he said.

I think we’re going to need a new thread soon.  :(

More like rope  ::)

It's fine for the RMT to express their disappointment regarding RD and NR withdrawing from negotiations the RMT made no effort to recommend what was on offer.

I suspect the Government will still proceed with it hasty legislation


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: PhilWakely on November 21, 2022, 06:45:23 pm
It's fine for the RMT to express their disappointment regarding RD and NR withdrawing from negotiations the RMT made no effort to recommend what was on offer.

I suspect the Government will still proceed with it hasty legislation

Unless I have mis-read your comment, I think the clue is in the title of the press release as to why the Union has not recommended anything
Quote
TRAIN COMPANIES CANCEL NEGOTIATIONS AND MAKE NO OFFER IN NATIONAL RAIL DISPUTE

I do agree with your final comment though - legislation will be rushed through imminently


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on November 21, 2022, 07:34:48 pm
As I suspected, RMT's isn't the only version of what happened. This is from RDG (https://media.raildeliverygroup.com/news/rail-delivery-group-responds-to-the-latest-rmt-statement):
Quote
The Rail Delivery Group has responded to today's (21 November 2022) statement from the RMT.

A spokesperson for the Rail Delivery Group, said:

“We have made real progress over the last fortnight and for the first time in months we can see the outline of a credible deal.

"Any strikes will only cause further misery for customers and struggling businesses in the run up to Christmas and beyond. The RMT leadership should now remove any uncertainty around Christmas and commit to protecting everyone’s first festive period post Covid from any strike disruption. 

"The alternative is a bleak winter of industrial action, making it harder to find workable solutions to bring about the much-needed changes that will help secure the railway’s future and unlock the funds for a pay offer. Revenues are still 20% down on 2019 level and this dispute has brought the industry’s post-pandemic recovery to a shuddering halt – with strikes since June resulting in lost revenue of £250-£300m.

"We urge the RMT leadership to stay at the negotiating table so we can build on that progress and end a dispute that is harming passengers and businesses, the industry, and their members.”

TSSA say they are prepared to keep talking.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on November 22, 2022, 03:55:51 pm
RMT have announced four 48hr strikes in December and January.

13-14 and 16-17 December.
3-4 and 6-7 January.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/22/more-uk-rail-strikes-to-disrupt-travel-in-december-and-january




Edit note: I've renamed this topic to include all rail unions - a one stop shop for all rail union strike posts, information and debate. Also changed 'summer' to '2022/2023' to reflect the ongoing industrial action.

JayMac


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 22, 2022, 04:31:03 pm
It's reached the point where trains need to be in the right place for a prompt start up on the day after any strike....otherwise it'll be a late start up on the day in-between (yes, I realise that this is what the RMT intend, hence my comment!)


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: plymothian on November 22, 2022, 04:36:56 pm
Also an overtime ban Sunday 18 December - 2 January inclusive.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: JayMac on November 22, 2022, 04:43:26 pm
Not forgetting the ASLEF strike this Saturday, 26th November, affecting twelve TOCs, including GWR.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 22, 2022, 04:57:39 pm
Busier motorways, more lost customers and less revenue for the railways.

I see ASLEF's strike on Saturday now affects "only" 11 train companies. Not sure who's dropped out.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Surrey 455 on November 22, 2022, 07:56:23 pm
Busier motorways, more lost customers and less revenue for the railways.

I see ASLEF's strike on Saturday now affects "only" 11 train companies. Not sure who's dropped out.

London Overground.

From BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61634959)
Quote
What about the strike on Saturday?
Saturday's strike, called by the Aslef union over pay, involves train drivers working for:

Avanti West Coast - no services on the day
Chiltern Railways - no services
CrossCountry - no services
East Midlands Railway - no services
Great Western Railway - an "extremely limited" service
Greater Anglia - "heavily reduced" service
London North Eastern Railway - "limited" service
Northern Trains - no services
Southeastern - no services
Transpennine Express - "very limited" service
West Midlands Trains - no services
There may also be disruption on the days before and after the strike day.

Strike action at London Overground - which had been expected on Saturday - has been suspended while union members consider a new pay offer.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 23, 2022, 05:35:21 am
Edit note: I've renamed this topic to include all rail unions - a one stop shop for all rail union strike posts, information and debate. Also changed 'summer' to '2022/2023' to reflect the ongoing industrial action.

Thanks for that.   Ruefully, I found myself hoping the "2023" is enough and did a Google search for the longest strike.  Somewhat tangentially, it came up with a "School Strike" that lasted from 1914 to 1939 where the fired teachers took almost all of their pupils with them and set up an independent school.    I can't see a direct parallel, but it set me wondering if others (such as Go-op and the Unions) might set up their own open access train operations, but then you would still have the government owning the infrastructure.   It's a very different matter getting a new alternative school building to getting a new alternative railway infrastructure, though of course that solution WAS used in Victorian times!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Jamsdad on November 23, 2022, 02:03:49 pm
Well I was planning to get he train form Liskeard to Paddington on 14 December, and because I do need to make this journey, have managed to get a ticket for the National Express Coach . It s not a very appealing alternative.  I have to leave Liskeard at 0755 and dont get in  to London until 1530.( 7.5 hours)  No refreshments, but I do believe they a have a toilet!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 23, 2022, 02:09:27 pm
From My London, via MSN (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/london-underground-major-stations-including-heathrow-and-king-s-cross-st-pancras-to-be-hit-by-extra-strike-this-week/ar-AA14rXEq?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=53ba2b4434fd4a64afedfa6440462192)

London Underground: Major stations including Heathrow and King's Cross St Pancras to be hit by extra strike this week

Quote
RMT union members who work at several key London Underground stations will take strike action this Friday (November 25) in a continued dispute over the non-backfilling of up to 600 positions which the union claims will compromise passenger and staff safety. The walkout is a culmination of a week-long overtime ban which started on Sunday (November 20).

Station staff at Victoria, Euston, Green Park, King's Cross St Pancras, Heathrow Terminals 2,3, Heathrow Terminal 4, Heathrow Terminal 5, Hatton Cross and Hounslow West will take part in the action, as well as staff in the London Underground 's special requirements team, which provides support across the network subject to demand (such as for major events).

Transport for London (TfL) is advising passengers using these stations to check journeys before travelling, although the stations should remain open for most of the day. It only expects stations to have to close if available staff drop below the minimum levels at the start or end of the day. If this happens, Tube trains won't stop at the above stations.

As the strike only relates to London Underground station staff, National Rail (including London Overground and Elizabeth line) and Heathrow Express staff will operate as normal so non-Tube services will still be able to stop at affected stations. Euston Square Tube station will be open as normal, which is a five minute walk away from Euston.

continues....



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 23, 2022, 05:48:49 pm
Rumour has it the blocker to the deal if the DfT.  The DfT will not agree to the offer NR want to put the TU's


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 23, 2022, 06:23:16 pm
I think that is probably correct. What would make it more interesting is what that offer might be.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 24, 2022, 06:41:30 am
I think that is probably correct. What would make it more interesting is what that offer might be.

The rumour is that it is something NR Board strongly believe the TU's would sign up to.

In the meantime, MP's have been given a £2200 a year pay rise and can claim expenses for Christmas parties


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 24, 2022, 07:25:53 pm
From Guardian's via MSN rolling news feed (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/mick-lynch-says-rmt-no-closer-to-calling-off-rail-strikes-as-transport-minister-states-there-is-deal-to-be-done-uk-politics-live/ar-AA14uMEh?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=2142fa95849c4ccebe274cb091a4a930) this afternoon

Quote
14:30
Here is a full summary of what Mick Lynch, the RMT general secretary, said when he spoke to journalists after his meeting with Mark Harper, the transport secretary.

Lynch said the meeting with Mark Harper was “positive”. He said:

I would say it was a positive meeting in the sense that we’ve got rid of the bellicose nonsense that we used to have from Grant Shapps and his cohort, in his era, and we are now starting to get a dialogue.

But he said the RMT was no closer to calling off the strikes scheduled for December and January. He said that would not happen until a reasonable offer was on the table. He said:


If we call off the strikes, we’ll never get a settlement. We did that two weeks ago. We’ve changed our dates in response to public opinion. When the Queen passed, when we had the poppy day, we’ve done other things. We have not had a strike for seven weeks, and nothing has happened. So anyone that’s been involved in industrial relations knows that there has got to leverage and pressure at the table from both sides. That will create the compromises and the resolutions that we’re all looking for.

If I take these [strike] actions off without any outcome, my members won’t forgive me for doing that. And we know that the pressure will be off all the parties.

He said Harper had committed to giving the RMT a letter setting out a process towards a resolution of the rail dispute.

He said he wanted Harper to give the rail industry a fresh mandate to negotiate an end to the dispute. He said that although the RMT has been in talks with the Rail Delivery Group, which represents rail companies, it did not seem to have proper authority to negotiate. The individual companies were also saying they could not negotiate either, he said. He said he asked Harper to clarify who had authority to negotiate, and to set up a liaison group involving ministers. He went on:

[Harper] has got a legal responsibility for industrial relations, and the responsibility to set their mandate, ie what they can say, what they can offer, and what they can negotiate on at that table. So I’m hoping he’s going to do that, hopefully today … He needs to clarify in writing where he stands and where the industry stands when they are transacting with us in those discussions.

He said he did not expect Harper to be at the negotiating table with him. But he did expect ministers to be “engaged in the process”.

He claimed the current negotiating situation was “surreal” because the employers did not have a mandate to negotiate a resolution. He said the Rail Delivery Group had told the RMT it was not able to engage in collective bargaining. And the individual rail companies said they could not engage in collective bargaining either, he said. He went on:

So this is a completely strange and surreal situation. I’m responsible for my union, and I stand in front of you and take whatever you want to throw at me. Nobody from the employers is prepared to stand in front of me and take the responsibility for settling this dispute. That’s what we need. We need somebody of authority, which has to start with the secretary of state and the rail minister, who I want to work with positively, to take responsibility for settling this dispute.

He said Harper had denied that the Department for Transport was the “blockage” preventing a solution to the dispute. Lynch said someone seemed to be blocking a solution, but he said it was not clearly exactly who it was.

He said he had urged Harper to speed up negotiations. The talks have been running for six months already, he said. “And we have had not one document put across the table. That has to change,” he said.

He said jobs, and terms and conditions, were more important to his members than pay levels. He said:

My members are telling me you’ve got to secure me my job, and you’ve got to get me a set of terms and conditions that are acceptable, and then we can talk about what we’re getting paid. If you haven’t got a job, you don’t get a pay rise anyway.

He said the train operators were “only interested in profit”. He said:

They made profit throughout Covid and they made profit throughout these disputes, where they have been indemnified for every day of strike action. This lot in the Department of Transport have been paying all their costs while all the businesses in London and across this country have been suffering losses, while the train operators have had all of their revenue protected by this government.

He said plans to cut 50% of maintenance inspections on the railway were not acceptable.

He said he would urge passengers disrupted by the rail strikes to contact Tory MPs and urge them to “get these ministers to get us a settlement”.

14:37
Mark Harper, the transport secretary, has said his meeting with Mick Lynch, the RMT general secretary, was productive. In a clip for broadcasters, he adopted a consensual tone, stressing the “shared” objectives of both sides, but did not offer commitments on substance. He said:


[Lynch] and I both agreed that this was a productive meeting. It was the first one that that we’ve had. I think it struck the right tone.

I think there was a shared agreement in the meeting. We both want to have a thriving railway that is sustainable for the future, that serves passengers, that serves the country and also provides good, well-paid jobs for the people that he represents. I think there’s a lot of shared agreement there.

But we need to have the two sides, the trade unions and the employers, sit down, agree on the detail, so that we can bring this dispute to an end. I think that’s where we both have a shared interest.

15:05
The Department for Transport has now sent out a news release with a statement from Mark Harper about his meeting with Mick Lynch, the RMT general secretary. It mostly echoes what he told the BBC (see 2.32pm), but it includes a line saying he thinks “there is a deal to be done”. He says:


We have common ground - we both want the dispute to end and we both want a thriving railway which delivers for passengers and workers alike. To achieve this though, we need to work together, across the entire industry to ensure our railway industry thrives.

There is a deal to be done, and I believe we will get there – I want to facilitate the RMT and the employers to reach an agreement and end the dispute for the benefit of the travelling public.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 25, 2022, 05:50:15 am
From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63746412)

Quote
Train strikes: Minister hopes Christmas walkouts can be stopped

[snip]

But Mr Harper has now agreed to help both sides come back to the table and will write to RMT boss Mick Lynch setting out the terms under which talks can take place.

Mr Harper said there was a "shared agreement" that the dispute had gone on for too long, but would not commit to offering more government money to help resolve the dispute.

Instead he maintained that industry reform was needed to deliver the savings which would enable a "reasonable pay rise" for staff.

[snip]

So as I read it, they're having talks about talks, and whilst they share an agreement that the dispute has gone on too long (!!) the government - quoted with Mr Harper as a spokesman - maintains that there are unchanged (?) pre-requisites for a solution on their side.

Pity the poor passenger, and the long term future of the rail industry and those who work there - but let's hope and encourage works towards a solution - that there may be opportunities in discussions to move forward.



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Electric train on November 25, 2022, 06:26:08 am
From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63746412)

Quote
Train strikes: Minister hopes Christmas walkouts can be stopped

[snip]

But Mr Harper has now agreed to help both sides come back to the table and will write to RMT boss Mick Lynch setting out the terms under which talks can take place.

Mr Harper said there was a "shared agreement" that the dispute had gone on for too long, but would not commit to offering more government money to help resolve the dispute.

Instead he maintained that industry reform was needed to deliver the savings which would enable a "reasonable pay rise" for staff.

[snip]

So as I read it, they're having talks about talks, and whilst they share an agreement that the dispute has gone on too long (!!) the government - quoted with Mr Harper as a spokesman - maintains that there are unchanged (?) pre-requisites for a solution on their side.

Pity the poor passenger, and the long term future of the rail industry and those who work there - but let's hope and encourage works towards a solution - that there may be opportunities in discussions to move forward.



Not quite the days of Harrold Wilson's "Beer and Sandwich" meetings at No 10 with the TU's


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 25, 2022, 05:25:58 pm
And the view from The Canary (https://www.thecanary.co/trending/2022/11/25/mick-lynch-has-been-rinsing-tv-reporters-as-the-rmt-prepares-to-go-to-war-with-bosses/)

Quote
Rail, Transport and Maritime union (RMT) general secretary Mick Lynch is back on the war path. The straight-talking trade union leader did another round of the TV studios ahead of planned strikes. The results were predictable: posh, smug TV presenters left gaping.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 25, 2022, 05:34:56 pm
And from The Caterer (https://www.thecaterer.com/news/rail-strike-hospitality-cost)

Quote
The next wave of rail strikes over the festive period could cost the hospitality industry an estimated £1.5b a day, UKHospitality has warned.

The trade body said businesses had already seen large-scale cancellations with operators facing their third Christmas in a row with disrupted trading.

It warned the damage caused by eight days of 48-hour strikes in December and January could be of a similar scale to that caused by the Omicron Covid-19 variant on bookings last year.

And from the The Night Time Industries Association (https://completemusicupdate.com/article/pre-christmas-rail-strikes-will-be-catastrophic-for-night-time-economy-says-ntia/)

Quote
The Night Time Industries Association has stressed how damaging the latest rail strikes in the UK will be for bars, clubs, venues and other night-time businesses, coming as they do in the middle of the key Christmas party season.

Indeed, NTIA boss Michael Kill says next month’s strike action will be “catastrophic” for bars, clubs and music venues, fearing that the strikes could result in a big drop in the number of people having nights out in December, certainly on the strike days, and maybe more generally.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: trainbuff on November 25, 2022, 10:22:20 pm
Might it not be the case that it is cheaper to settle? Or are the Government worried that other workers such as nurses will take it as a green light for their pay claims?


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on November 26, 2022, 12:11:09 am
From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-63742751):
Quote
ScotRail strike off as RMT staff accept pay offer

Staff at ScotRail have accepted an increased pay offer, averting a planned series of strikes.

The RMT had planned to strike next Saturday followed by regular walk-outs on Fridays and Saturdays up to Christmas.

Members were voting on a 5% rise plus an extra £750.

ScotRail said this means wages will rise by 7.5% for staff such as conductors and ticket examiners with an 8.5% increase for lower-paid workers.

Announcing the result of the ballot, the RMT said 67.7% of members who voted opted to accept the offer which the union had recommended.

However the deal is separate to the ongoing pay dispute and industrial action being taken by Network Rail staff who are members of the RMT.

The strikes were temporarily suspended on 10 November after ScotRail made the improved pay offer.

As part of the improved deal, minimum flat rate pay has been increased to £10.50 per hour and a no compulsory redundancies guarantee has also been increased from five to six years.

The current agreement on rest day working has been extended until 31 October 2023.

I guess that sets a marker, if not exactly a going rate.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 26, 2022, 05:11:15 pm
it's a funny old world ...

Quote
14:30 Bristol Temple Meads to London Paddington due 16:07 has run as scheduled.

Additional Information

We're sorry for any changes this brings to your travel plans today.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: ChrisB on November 26, 2022, 06:19:05 pm
The 1030 was standing in the aisles, as was the connecting RDG-OXF from Dicot. Seems as though the strikes aren’t putting people off travelling


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: BBM on November 26, 2022, 07:49:34 pm
I was at PAD tonight and I saw the 1732 departure for Bristol TM which likewise was rammed full with staff preventing further passengers from attempting to join it.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Richard Fairhurst on November 26, 2022, 08:15:38 pm
I cycled past Combe station earlier and the display was apologising that there would be no services from this station today due to strike action.

Those pesky strikers, depriving Combe of its 0tph Saturday service.


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: rogerw on November 26, 2022, 08:44:00 pm
My journeys to and from London today were fairly uneventful. 0730 BRI - PAD full and standing from Swindon. The trolley managed to get as far as coach G where I was before running into the jam, thanks to the TM moving people down the train. The 1732 Pad - BRI was full but no standing passengers in coach C. Depsite there being no other trains it still managed to lose 17 minutes on its journey, none of it station overtime. My trip on the British Pullman was superb


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: grahame on November 27, 2022, 09:03:16 am
I was at PAD tonight and I saw the 1732 departure for Bristol TM which likewise was rammed full with staff preventing further passengers from attempting to join it.

Real Time Trains reported all trains that ran were 9 or 10 carriages; thankful for small mercies!


Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: Mark A on November 27, 2022, 12:09:29 pm
Now, when will Bath Spa's train service have been 100% powered by steam as might have been the case yesterday?

Here's an, er... 'technically flawed'... video clip of the return trip of said steam loco, passing that footbridge in Sydney Gardens.

Note to self, if you're simultaneously recording a video, turning 80 degrees and walking back six paces, you're lucky if the second half of the video didn't record only sky and tree branches.

In the early evening gloom, an impressive and alarming amount of light from the firebox, greatly helped by being carried and reflected by the steam and smoke it found in its path. Alarming as the flicker indicates a small light source, but the spread of light helped by the steam made it appear as though something far more sinister was afoot - it was briefly like witnessing an electricity substation transformer short-circult and fire, but yellow light rather than blue.

Mark

https://twitter.com/markannand/status/1596579393479970816



Title: Re: Rail unions strike action 2022/2023
Post by: stuving on November 29, 2022, 09:51:14 am
Mark's been writing to his new pen-pal Mick (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/letter-from-the-secretary-of-state-for-transport-to-the-general-secretary-of-the-rmt).
Quote
                                                                            28 November 2022
Dear Mr Lynch,

Thank you for meeting me last week; it was constructive and positive.

We both agree the industrial dispute on the railways has gone on too long. It’s bad for your members, losing out on pay and overtime, bad for businesses who depend on trains to bring them goods and customers and bad for people across our country who depend on the railways. Worse, disruption pushes more and more people away from using the railways, some of whom will never come back. We both want a long-term sustainable railway that provides both great service and rewarding jobs. Every day’s industrial action makes that harder to deliver.

There is a way forwards to meet everyone’s needs. By modernising working practices, we can deliver the savings that lower post-Covid passenger numbers require, restore financial sustainability and not place an unfair burden on taxpayers. My role is to facilitate and support – not negotiate. Negotiations will continue between trade unions and employers, but I can see scope for agreement.
Let me set out how I think we can help support that. Better information sharing between the Rail Minister, trade unions and those leading the negotiations on behalf of the employers can speed up this process. We will soon convene a further meeting to help advance, with the good faith of all parties, settlement discussions and progress in this dispute.

I want to work with you and employers in good faith to help resolve these long-standing issues, and help the employers and you reach a resolution that is fair to all. I would hope this will lead to progress that will allow you to call off industrial action.

Yours sincerely,
Rt Hon Mark Harper MP
SECRETARY OF STATE FOR TRANSPORT



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