Great Western Coffee Shop

How do your travel plans (by train) look for this summer?

I will give you my "starter for 5" as a sample ...
 
I will be travelling LESS by train this summer because
* I cannot trust to planning because of service unreliability
* We are very busy indeed locally and it's hard to find time
* I am no longer travelling on business (to give IT courses)

I will be travelling MORE by train this summer because
* We have guests staying with us and will be showing them around

On balance - less train travel.  And note more bus travel than in past years and no air travel at all until (perhaps) very limited flights in the autumn

Less than previously for me.

Unreliability, especially at weekends
Likelihood of strikes disrupting plans
Much less travel on business

I voted for less because my job has changed and I do less external meetings. Also the landscape has changed and those that I do are almost always on-line. 

I will probably use trains a bit less than my pre-2019 level this summer. The threat of strikes and other disruption does make it hard to plan ahead, which makes me reluctant to take advantage of cheaper advance fares. In turn this makes me less likely to take longer, more expensive journeys.

I've "planned" quite a few days out by rail this year and have been using the rail option fairly frequently for my visits to Devon.  Whether strikes/weather/reliability etc allow for all the railway journeys is another matter but I want to give my "Advanced Middle Age" Railcard a good workout.

Next week I’m travelling to sheffield for the womens euros semi final. I’ve tried to do the cheapest travel options and killing a couple of birds with one stone on way home as something the daughter wants to visit in London.

Monday 25th
fly Newquay to Manchester with EasyJet, £18.99 for me and £9.99 for 1 child.
Train Manchester to Sheffield, advanced singles totalling about £6 for 1 adult 1 child. Booked through Avantis website  as my bank had a 5% cash back offer on Avanti.

Wednesday 27th
National express Sheffield to London £11 (I also booked a cheap rail advance of around £26, which I’ve applied for refund due to strike day) I bought the express ticket before strike dates were announced as a back up as it was known strikes were going to happen just not when!

Thursday 28th
London to Gatwick by unknown method, haven’t made this plan yet.
Gatwick to Newquay, eastern airways £40.99.

I priced the full itinerary by rail and there was legs with no cheap advances so total rail fare would have been  almost £600!

22nd august Trip  to explore Thames valley returning 23rd august using my first group staff offer  for first class day rovers. .

I plan less train travel this Summer than previously, for several reasons.

Strikes, on dates not yet announced prevent any long term plans.
Dislike of IETs, often too short, uncomfortable.
General unreliability, seems worse than previously.

Probably more trips on the WSR as that is immune to strikes and IETs.

My planned flight to Biarritz next month has been cancelled by easyJet, although I am telling everyone I pulled the plug on principle. This was originally intended as somewhere in Spain in July 2020, and has been rehashed several times. Cancellation has solved a number of logistical issues. All money for accommodation and flights has been refunded, and I might go somewhere nice by rail in UK, although I have just got back from Paris.

I have given up travelling by train until the railway becomes reliable and you can plan ahead. All seems a disaster area at the moment with strikes and cancellations.

I hope the Brammall Lane stewards confiscate that stone as we cannot have violence at the football!  ;)

I largely agree, I have not COMPLETELY  stopped travelling by train, but have greatly reduced rail use.
Cracked trains, short trains, strikes, and infrastructure failures.
I refer here not to the recent extreme heat, but to the endless disruptions in only moderately adverse weather during which roads and airlines operate as normal.

It is getting to the point of "We apologise for the delay, which is due to the wrong type of snow/sun/wind/staff/heat/bank holiday"

Not to mention killing TWO innocent birdies, the veggies will be after you.

I expect to be doing my usual Saturday cycling trips, subject to availability of trains.

It will then be the autumn and the decision of do we renew the railcard.

It's interesting, perhaps telling that even in a forum for those with a particular interest in rail travel, over 50% so far (albeit of a smallish sample) are planning on travelling less by train this summer.

I wouldn’t blame anyone for making less journeys by train this year - strikes and staff shortages are clearly going to cause problems. 

Same goes for people taking less flights, less ferries and less road trips, as all are likely to be affected.  I read of delays at Dover today, planned motorway go-slows (not to mention fuel costs) and we all know what a state the airlines are in currently.

Staying at home is looking increasingly attractive ! perhaps with the odd local day out by heritage railway. Or by horse drawn cart.

Railways not doing very well for reasons already noted.

Airlines and airports seem to be in a long term state of chaos, mainly lack of staff but airport infrastructure failures are also a problem.

Motorways overcrowded and hit by protests of two different sorts. One lot calling for restrictions on and a reduction in fuel used, and the other lot calling for cheaper fuel in order that people can use more of it.

Ferries have just about recovered from the P and O debacle, but are now hit by major delays at Dover.

What next ?
Extreme Autumn or winter weather.
Fuel shortages.
Terrorist attacks on transport infrastructure or fuel supply.
A new pandemic.
A new war.
Civil disorder/large scale rioting.

Are the airlines in the state the media portray? Or easy targets?
Tui the worst portrayed by the media released that less than 0.5% of their flights were cancelled or delayed in June. How does this compare to rail TOCs? Those 0.5% are getting all the media, whereas the 99.5% without issue isn’t newsworthy

By what metric is a flight classed as ‘delayed’?

Always the prophet of doom?  

It's a relief that we (individual, country, world) seemingly bounce back from most of these things, all be it with updated / altered metric to take account of the new.

I'm also noting that (at the time of writing) half the votes are saying "I will use trains less", with the remaining half of the votes spread all across all the other options put together.

Two things crop up time and again from members posts
* Travelling less because of service reliability concerns (a whole load of factors)
* Travelling less because of the drop off of face to face business in favour of online meetings and remote working

We are a small sample and we cannot extend our result to the nation - we are characterised by being regular users and knoweldgable speakers for public transport in the first place, which is not typical of a random sample of the population.

One thing is for sure, the whole forum could take a break from travelling and many trains will still be packed, cancellations or not!

It’s proportionate to distance travelled.

Flight distance   How long the delay has to be
Less than 1,500km   2 hours
Between 1,500km and 3,500km   3 hours
More than 3,500km   4 hours

Thanks…no wonder such a ‘good’ figure has been announced then!  :o

But, yes, the media do hype it…just as they always do with railways I guess?

Yes I am rather a prophet of doom.
Many of my doomerish predictions have come true or are clearly underway. Not just railway related but also regarding climate change/extreme weather, and energy prices.

The media is making out everyone is being stranded all over the place but the stats don’t support it being that bad. They’ve found the few hundred people who’ve had issue and exaggerated it. Could find a similar number of affected rail passengers too!

As I believe I saw yesterday on journeycheck. Can't remember the times, but one midday Paddington to Penzance full and standing at Paddington & it's opposite number Penzance to Paddington, full and standing (at Plymouth?)

I think it's patchy - take a look at this (click on to get it bigger):
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/weekmess.jpg) (http://www.wellho.net/pix/weekmess.jpg)
It's looking at Swindon to Westbury and Westbury to Weymouth services over the last week.

Now, yes, the hot weather caused problems on some days.  As strikes would cause problems on other days, staff shortages on others, diversions and failures on others so the pattern is not unusual.

* These lines are far more prone to cancellations and serious delays than others

* When something does go wrong, the wait for the next train is significant - not just "there will be another along in 30 minutes"

* For a day trip to work, all four trains needed must run

* Connections need to work too - no good a train being 15 minutes late when a connecting train leaves as scheduled from Westbury

I always travel with a backup plan ... and I like to pride myself on knowing things well enough to make decisions on my agenda changes on the fly.

The first night of our May holiday in Cyprus, booked via Tui, was spent in the Marriott Hotel in Bristol. Although our intended aircraft was on the tarmac at Bristol at the time it should have left, we ended up on a different type from a different  airline, flown from Portugal empty to Bristol, then back empty to Lisbon from Paphos. I was most upset, although the compensation put a smile back on my face. Tui's handling of the matter at the airport was pretty poor - inaccurate information posted on the boards, no staff around, and when someone did venture out of the bunker, they knew less than I already knew from various aviation websites. There were other cancellations, as well as overbooking, but that wasn't June, and they may have got their act together and massaged the stats a bit by then.


I can't argue with the first sentence.  ;D

There are a few of your prescient offerings that haven't come to pass yet, but the beauty of being a prophet of doom is that if someone says it hasn't happened, you can always say "Not yet".

An article in i newspaper
https://inews.co.uk/news/how-railways-are-driving-a-new-british-seaside-boom-1735085 (https://inews.co.uk/news/how-railways-are-driving-a-new-british-seaside-boom-1735085)
on the increase in summer leisure traffic on the railways
St Ives up 45%
Newquay up 33%
Bournemouth 50%

No figures from Southern but estimate of 20% increase on Saturdays.

No figures for Cross-Country, the Reading - Bournemouth yesterday was a 4-car cattle truck.

 Recently 'semi-retired' and now in the possesion of a bus pass.
  Journey times obviously take longer but the stops are more convenient
  for my final destination.
  Obviously can only travel 'off-peak', but sometimes feel the need to give up my seat to
  fare paying passenger's.
  Surprised to find buses no longer run by Devon General.
 
 

When comparing with pre-pandemic you also need to look at:
1. How frequent is the XC service south from Reading now?
2. How frequent was that service three years ago?
3. How many carriages was the nearest equivalent service three years ago?

That's good news for the railways but they need to up their game if they wish to sustain it - yesterday saw one of the very few direct Newquay services cancelled and today, for those who have had a weekend away.......

13:30 Newquay to London Paddington due 18:24

13:30 Newquay to London Paddington due 18:24 will be terminated at Plymouth.
It will no longer call at Totnes, Newton Abbot, Exeter St Davids, Tiverton Parkway, Taunton, Reading and London Paddington.

This is due to a shortage of train crew.

Ditto ... but I have modified your text

1. Some journeys don't take longer - home to Bath is quicker by bus than by train - especially if I look at frequency of daytime weekday services and have to be in Bath for an appointment and don't want to hang around waiting because the train is infrequent and inconveniently timed.

2. I have added "source and" - the bus stop is literally outside our home, whereas the train station is a 20 minute walk, no buses call there and no free parking at the station any longer so if driving I may as well "railhead" at Chippenham, Trowbridge or Westbury and save myself a change, and on return save myself a potentially long wait.

3. Even though I have a senior bus card, I can use the bus at any time - I just have to pay as I do with the train. Locally at present, there's an arrangement for this to be at a child's fare

In addition, buses from Melksham to neighbouring towns are far more reliable that trains at present.  Heading to Bristol?  Far better to railhead at Bath where, even if some trains to Bristol are cancelled, there will be another one along within the half hour than end up hanging around at a station with no train for ages.   Heading toward Brighton?  If there's any doubt about the train, far better to get the bus to Trowbridge where the train runs direct at least as far as Cosham.

Putting that into a context ...

It's due to arrive into Plymouth at 15:01.   

There is a London departure at 14:56 (I wonder if it will be held?) calling at most of the same stations (not Totnes or Tiverton Parkway) and additionally at Bridgwater, Bristol Temple Meads, Bath Spa, Chippenham and Swindon.  The 14:56 is 9 carriages and leaves from the adjacent track (so it does mean a need to use the subway). It's scheduled into London just 12 minutes after the cancelled train, though I suspect it would be running 10 to 15 minutes late because of the "hold".

A service at 15:47 serves all the stations the cancelled train was due to call at as far as Taunton, and some others too.

The following London departure is 16:15 and that does serve Totnes and Tiverton Parkway.

Anyone who travels from the South West towards London on a Sunday afternoon will know how busy those trains are (even on the rare occasions when they all run) - so with the best will in the world, your context doesn't provide much comfort stacked up against 2 trainloads cramming onto one train, and I don't need our esteemed fellow forum member's crystal ball to know that it won't be a pleasant experience.

Also add to point 3, some local authorities have removed time restrictions for concession pass holders to be used for free. Others have relaxed their timings.

Cornwall is one example within the GWR area where no time Restrictions exist for using concession passes and they can be used 24/7

Also Cornwall has the cheap/cheaper bus fare initiative.
https://www.cornwall.gov.uk/council-news/transport-streets-and-waste/great-value-bus-travel-is-coming-to-cornwall-as-council-leads-the-way-with-pioneering-trial/
Residents will pay significantly less to travel by bus from next week under a new pilot scheme led by Cornwall Council to encourage more people to travel by bus.

The reduced bus fares pilot scheme is a first for a local authority and follows a successful bid by the Council for £23.5m funded by UK Government.

It will mean adult bus passengers will, on average, pay one-third less for their fares when new summer timetables are introduced on Sunday, April 10.  ...........(continues)....

If you look at the 2019 Summer Saturday timetable there was one service an hour to Bournemouth but also one as far as Southampton on the other half of the hour. These would have been both single units, ie 4 or 5 carriages.

Presently there is only one service every two hours to Bournemouth. Most comprise a doubled unit of 9/10 coaches but certain ones are only 4/5.

This is a significant reduction of capacity south of Reading.

Looks like an even more sensible solution found ... the train from Newquay terminated at Plymouth and appears to have continued on as a delayed London via Bristol service. Putting the overcrowding issues to one side, sensible, very sensible.

£5 an adult for a day on any bus with any company in the whole of Cornwall and £10 for a family. Real bargain. £5 is almost half a gallon of petrol!!

I had a feeling that would happen. Control at Swindon are often creative when they can be in trying to minimise disruption for passengers when services are either cancelled or are running short.

I never did follow up when this poll closed - sorry ...

I plan to travel by train less than normal this summer   - 51.7%
I plan to travel by train about the same as normal this summer   - 27.6%
I don't yet know how it will turn out   - 10.3%
I plan to travel by train more than normal this summer   - 6.9%
I don't know how to define normal   - 3.4%
I never travel by train anyway   - 0%

I find that pretty depressing. In a summer when we might have expected the UK to be re-opening, the majority of us still plan to travel by train "less than normal".  And that's not a small majority either - it's more than half the votes cast.  I wonder why - new poll at http://www.passenger.chat/26633

For longer distance trains my plans over the summer have not changed much (strikes withstanding). Where my travelling habits have changed is use of the train for “local” journeys in and around Reading/TV.

And not because of the ticket prices - which I think are competitive given the current price of fuel.

I am put off using the train because of the cost of using APCOA managed station car parks. An off-peak day ticket has *doubled* in the last two years at my local station. It now costs more to park the car at the station than it does to buys a peak return ticket into Reading !

This associated price rises does not get the press it deserves.

How can this type of pricing behaviour promote the use of trains. When people talk about being ‘priced off’ using the railways - the *entire* associated costs needs to be factored in. It’s not just about the tickets.

Oh ! And my local once full by 8:30 station car park is now, at most, 1/3 full by midday.
Indicative measure of the issues facing the rail companies.