Great Western Coffee Shop

All across the Great Western territory => Active travel: Cyclists and walkers, including how the railways deal with them => Topic started by: CyclingSid on October 04, 2022, 10:04:07



Title: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: CyclingSid on October 04, 2022, 10:04:07
It is possible if there is the will and the market

https://www.scotrail.co.uk/scotrail-highland-explorer (https://www.scotrail.co.uk/scotrail-highland-explorer)

"Working in partnership with Transport Scotland" presumably means some level of subsidy (in addition to normal rail subsidy?). It will be interesting to see how long the service survives.


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: broadgage on October 04, 2022, 13:49:33
I suspect that other TOCs are watching this with concern, lest it be demanded elsewhere. For years most TOCs have been making carriage of cycles more complex and limited in numbers. Often called "improvements" See here for example http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=24068.0 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=24068.0)

I can remember when almost every train had a guards van/luggage van and cycles and other bulky items were carried therein without problems, even on local services. And on HSTs bulky items were, at busy holiday times, conveyed in the power cars IN ADDITION to the normal luggage area. "Obviously" no similar provision can be made these days.

There might well be a strictly unofficial view that Scotrail have "let the side down" by providing decent cycle accommodation.

Whatever next ! surfboards to popular surfing resorts ?



Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 04, 2022, 15:48:13
It is possible if there is the will and the market

https://www.scotrail.co.uk/scotrail-highland-explorer (https://www.scotrail.co.uk/scotrail-highland-explorer)

"Working in partnership with Transport Scotland" presumably means some level of subsidy (in addition to normal rail subsidy?). It will be interesting to see how long the service survives.

An interesting development.  Will it be extended to other suitable routes?  Are there any suitable routes within the GWR area?


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: stuving on October 04, 2022, 15:54:35
I think you can take it as read it's not being paid for out of revenue. If you remember this (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=25994.msg318247#msg318247), we have figures for the line from 2019/20:
revenue per service: £871 - twice any other rural line, and not far from half an intercity one
cost to run per service: £1585
total subsidy per year: £4.92M


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: broadgage on October 04, 2022, 23:01:49
I think you can take it as read it's not being paid for out of revenue. If you remember this (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=25994.msg318247#msg318247), we have figures for the line from 2019/20:
revenue per service: £871 - twice any other rural line, and not far from half an intercity one
cost to run per service: £1585
total subsidy per year: £4.92M

Yes, almost certainly not directly economic, but TPTB have decided, correctly in my view, that the drain on the public purse is worth paying in order to encourage tourism, and encourage greener transport options.

Unlike the Westcountry where provision for cyclists is generally poor, luggage space very limited, and surfboards prohibited.


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: CyclingSid on October 05, 2022, 06:52:06
Scotland is the only area, that I am aware of, that has done an economic evaluation of the benefits of cycle tourism.


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: broadgage on October 05, 2022, 17:33:55
Scotland is the only area, that I am aware of, that has done an economic evaluation of the benefits of cycle tourism.

Whilst this is primarily to encourage cycle tourism, presumably there is some benefit to local residents also. Thinking of those who live within cycling distance of a station, but too far to walk.
Could make train and cycle more attractive for travel to work, rather than driving.

Elsewhere in these forums I referred to a proposal to convert some class 455 DC EMUs to battery power for use on West Country branch lines. Part of the proposal was to convert part of one vehicle to 2+0 seating to accommodate bulky luggage, baby carriages, AND CYCLES.


Title: Re: Bikes on trains - it is possiple
Post by: eightonedee on October 05, 2022, 17:43:09
Isn't there a practical problem here?

The Scottish provision is only possible because there are a few redundant single coach diesel units around, compatible with their current trains, and available for conversion for this use.

Any more widespread adoption would eat into the already limited diesel passenger fleet.

From my recent trips to West Scotland, I'd say definitely this is for visitors, not residents. Understandably in the light of the terrain and weather not many locals are seen on pedal cycles.   



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