Great Western Coffee Shop

Forgive the self-indulgence here but I was wondering if any of the many knowledgeable posters on this site have any recollection of a serious discussion regarding the reinstatement of passenger services on the Fowey branch. Although hardly a major revenue earner in its heyday, this branch is intact for all but the last half a mile and does see occasional excursions. Could a people-mover and a park & ride for the summer months break even? Fowey ain't St Ives but I always feel that this freight-only line isn't playing the role it could do in local transport.

 
 

One of the First Great Western regional managers explained to me once that even a pack 2 coach train running up and down a branch all day would not break even, although it's possible to do very well, thank you, on a 125 operation.    Reasons included things like:

Lower pence per mile fares on the branch
Fewer miles per hour on the branch
A longer proportion of time spend loading / unloading / turning around
Fewer passengers per crew member
More fuel needed per passenger on the shorter train
More stations served in a given time, so relatively more Network Rail station charges
Shorter distance traffic tend to be more peak-time biased

That's not a full answer to the question, but gives you a flavour of just how uneven the playing field would be for you.

The line doesn't actually go into Fowey it's self anymore, it stops short, also a lot of mods would need to be done at Carne point where the line runs through the unloading point for the CDA hoppers, would probably be a busy branch though if the station at Golant was also reopened.

Thanks for these answers grahame & vacman. It seems such a shame that at least a summer weekends service isn't tried out on this line, though it would of course have to be extended back to Fowey first. Anyone know of any charters/railtours planned over the branch this summer?
 

What about a commuter service for Pymouth starting at "Fowey Parkway" station?

There's nowhere to build a parkway station as the line runs at the bottom of a steep valley with a cliff one side and a river the other!

I'm sure oooooo has a few photos, meanwhile - I found this: http://britishrailphotosbymichaelmcnicholas.fotopic.net/p48969319.html

And the famous golant 'shot' http://ronwestwater.fotopic.net/p40043327.html

Nice  :D

Now to upset just 1 or 2 but I've been in Carne Point China Clay transfer sidings at Fowey Docks and whilst China Clay is running to from Fowey Docks reinstating passenger trains to Fowey is a NON starter.

However it might be Possible and cost about the same to Reinstate a Passenger line from Fowey to St. Blazey.

However when the French company Imerys (Misery is an Anagram) Close All their Cornish China Clay Works down then Fowey can have a Passenger service back.
Not a good move by English China Clays (ECC) to sell out to Imerys who IIRC also own and operate the cheap Brazilian china clay works.

When the China Clay does go, Would make real sense for a regular Plymouth-Lostwithiel-Fowey-St.blazey-Newquay service running over both restored lines into Fowey.

A big shame!

From the look of those photos, the line looks very picturesque and would draw leisure travellers!

Now if I was an FGW PR person, I'd kill to have a photo like that with a DMU featured in my publicity material.

Not related to Fowey but on the south west freight branch side the last ever clay by rail left Marsh Mills today rendering the short branch from Tavistock junction disused. Also this week the last Bitumen wagons where tripped to Cattewater, this terminal also now without traffic.....

Very sad news for rail freight in the South West.

Are there not any new rail freight opportunities in Devon and Cornwall? I know about the freight concentration depot near Exeter Airport, but there must be other possibilities with the sheer volume of freight on our roads.

Taunton Fairwater yard had massivly expanded its freight movements, but in the far south west things are pretty stagnant and I can't see much of a future for the line to Meldon!

Yes, but Fairwater Yard is only temporary, will be all done with in a couple years time...

I recently discovered that in the mid 90s for a brief period there was a Summer Sunday service on the route of a limited number of trains a day funded (and initiated) by local government. However, it came to grief following hikes in the charges levied. 

Problem being that the haul road form Par Docks to Fowey is built on the trackbed of the route from St Blazey to Fowey.

Youre right about it being a bad idea to sell ECC to Imerys as all they were after is the Technology,.

Perhaps their headquarters could be moved to Newark.  ;)

 :o

Meldon branch seems in quite good health under new ownership by a US freight company who want to expand operations and are very supportive of the passenger operations

Tavistock Jnc has been earmarked for a future possible road/rail freight interchange:

http://www.plymouth.gov.uk/homepage/environmentandplanning/planning/planningpolicy/reportofthejointstudiesarea.htm

I've passed through Lostwithiel a couple of times over the last few days and was wondering what the status is of all the sidings there (on both sides of the crossing). They look rather 'mothballed'.
 

 

The sidings known as the clay yard at Lostwithiel is used very little as most clay trains are too big to fit in the yard and have to use the up or down goods loops.
The yard will only accomodate up to 16 wagons for a loco to be able to run round it.
When the last train from Parkandillick used to stable in there overnight it had to be split into two sidings to fit it all in, this train now runs into Fowey at night instead of first thing in the morning.

If this article is to be believed, it seems that Cornwall Council are negotiating with Imerys to "open up" the Fowey branch line. If, as the article states, a plan to convert the down sidings at Lostwithiel into a car park goes ahead, there will be no bay platform for any branch line train to use, however. 

http://www.cornishguardian.co.uk/cornwall-council-backs-reviving-lostwithiel-fowey-branch-line/story-29435992-detail/story.html

I did wonder how long this article would take to surface !  As the Town Councillor quoted in the article, I can confirm that in conjunction with the Town Forum, Lostwithiel Town Council is pleased to be working with Cornwall Council and others, in a long term bid to improve facilities and service levels at our station.  Among these aspirations are the reopening of the branch line to Fowey to passenger traffic, however we are very aware that there a significant number of hurdles to cross before that can happen.

We hope that more short term aims are to increase the number of services that stop at Lostwithiel, throughout the day, including a later departure of the last trains of the day from Truro and Plymouth to allow people throughout Cornwall to be able to enjoy a full evening out in either city, and be able to travel to and from by train.  Certainly we are confident that the partial resignalling project and eventual stock cascades will help deliver the number of stopping trains.

We are also keen to reinstate the 'up' stop of the Night Riviera at Lostwithiel, and in response to significant public response we are keen to reinstate a footbridge at the station.

While some might consider this to be a big ask for what some consider to be a small station, I suppose the ethos is that if you don't ask you don't get, and we remain keen to point out that we have a population of circa 3000 people living within walking distance of the station.  The final draft of the Cornwall Council sponsored questionnaire has been approved, and while owing to costs it will no longer be a door to door survey, a telephone survey is expected to be done in early autumn.

This is an exciting opportunity for Lostwithiel Station, which has significant local support, and it is very refreshing to be working 'with' a local authority rather than against them !

A friend I was talking to missed her down train recently, she said she'd arrived 10 mins before her train was due, just as the barriers were coming down for an up freight train. The barriers didn't go up again until after her down train had passed.

Exactly why there is a need to reinstate a footbridge.

With the frequency of trains likely to increase following the resignalling project, the level crossing will operate more frequently than now which will cause significant disruption to the train travelling public, and general circulation of road traffic and pedestrians in the town.

One of the possible stumbling blocks in reinstating a footbridge is weather any such bridge has to be DDA compliant with ramps or lifts, as formal designated ramped access is available at each platform end adjacent to the level crossing.  A DDA footbridge such as the one recently installed at St Austell is likely to be prohibitively expensive, where as a replica bridge such as that at Menheniot might be justified.

Does anyone have any experience or knowledge in this area?

The very best of luck to you in your campaign to improve services at Lostwithiel and reinstate a footbridge. The scenic Lostwithiel-Fowey branch line is a real unexploited treasure and in addition to providing a service between the two towns for the locals, and reducing traffic on country roads, it could generate considerable tourist revenue for both. The Okehampton summer Sunday services are possibly a good model to aspire to. In the meantime, let's hope that those siding(s) nearest the bay platform are left intact...

Please accept my apologies for missing that one - I'm usually fairly prompt in picking up such items of local news, and posting them here on the Coffee Shop forum.  :-[

Good luck with your campaign for those improvements!  ;)

I don't, but maybe ask GWR/Network Rail how they managed the new bridge at Kingham, which has no ramps. I think it has passive provision for lifts to be added at a later date.

(As a town councillor here in Charlbury, I sorely wish I'd been on the council at the time the monstrosity of a ramped bridge was put in here. Plenty of simple things that could have been done to make it look less hideous. :( )

No experience but aware of another case. Surely you read The Scunthorpe Telegraph (http://www.scunthorpetelegraph.co.uk/row-erupts-disabled-access-station-bridge/story-25978267-detail/story.html)  ;D ;D

The equality act 2010 requires a facility to allow the disabled person to cross to use facilities at the other platform. Lostwithiels level crossing surely provides this?

I like the quote that "the feedback we get from customers is they would use the station if there was access".

I think something else (http://www.brtimes.com/#!board?stn=BGG&date=20160831) would help attract passengers to the station...

(To be fair, there are a few trains on Saturdays (http://www.brtimes.com/#!board?stn=BGG&date=20160903).)

I'd have thought that if Camborne, with its level crossing and footbridge without lifts, is compliant, then the same reasoning should apply to Lostwithiel.  

And with that premis, then Truro as well?  But they have the benefit of having their original footbridges, and are not having to put a replacement, and hence new bridge back in.  Rumours persist that the original footbridge survives in preservation but further details escape me.