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Title: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on March 25, 2023, 01:25:54 From The Metro (https://metro.co.uk/2023/03/24/tfl-plans-to-spend-4000000-renaming-each-london-overground-line-18500479/)
Quote The orange spaghetti string that is the London Overground could soon all lines have individual names as part of a £4,000,000 plan by TfL. Transport for London has announced a plan to individually name all six of the London Overground lines to make wayfinding less of a chore. Right now, crisscrossing orange double lines cover the Tube map, with many of the lines having interchanges between them. So the transit body has set aside four million of its £13,000,000 in City Hall funding to explore renaming the lines, its budget published this month says. Sadly ... Quote Usually, it’s up to TfL and City Hall to come up with tube line names and may consult with local authorities and advocacy group London TravelWatch. This means it’s unlikely the public will have much of a say in what the six routes should be renamed to – so maybe don’t expect a Barking McBarking Face line just yet. Oh COME ON - let's come up with some good names. I can find a few names coined unofficially that have become official ... including some very close to home. Suggestions, please! Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on March 25, 2023, 01:45:47 Here are the lines involved ... as I read it ...
1. Euston to Watford Junction "DC Lines" 2. Richmond and Clapham Junction to Stratford (routes join at Willesden Junction) "North London Line"? 3. Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside "Gobl Line"? 4. Highbury and Islington via Thames Tunnel to Clapham Junction / West Croydon / New Cross / Crystal Palace "East London Line"? 5. Liverpool Street to Enfield Town / Cheshunt / Chingford "Jazz service"? 6. Romford to Upminster "The Waif" Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on March 25, 2023, 10:33:31 From the precedent of Victoria and Elizabeth ... after famous people ...
Churchill Charles Darwin Beeching Stevenson Trevithick Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: ChrisB on March 25, 2023, 11:00:00 Here are the lines involved ... as I read it ... 1. Euston to Watford Junction "DC Lines" 2. Richmond and Clapham Junction to Stratford (routes join at Willesden Junction) "North London Line"? 3. Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside "Gobl Line"? 4. Highbury and Islington via Thames Tunnel to Clapham Junction / West Croydon / New Cross / Crystal Palace "East London Line"? 5. Liverpool Street to Enfield Town / Cheshunt / Chingford "Jazz service"? 6. Romford to Upminster "The Waif" Agree with bringing bank 1-4 as they served well - fully descriptive. However 3 was actually called "Goblin Line" Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Bmblbzzz on March 25, 2023, 11:20:01 I can't remember now if it was here or elseweb that confusion was caused by someone referring to "the overground" – or possibly even "the Overground". So giving them names might be useful, though it's also useful to distinguish between underground (or Underground) and overground (or Overground) lines.
Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Surrey 455 on March 25, 2023, 12:05:06 My preference is quite boring really - numbers. Other cities use Line 1, Line 2 etc. German cities have U & S numbered routes.
Though the Overground will probably end up with named lines that some will detest and others cheer. Incidentally I also read that even if the lines are renamed / numbered they will still keep the orange lines on the map, so won't be any easier to distinguish between them. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: johnneyw on March 25, 2023, 16:01:32 Numbers, instead of names will help distinguish Overground from Underground networks. Perhaps an "O" prefix followed by a number and with hopefully no possibility of confusion with the O2 arena.
Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Electric train on March 25, 2023, 18:36:11 Here are the lines involved ... as I read it ... 1. Euston to Watford Junction "DC Lines" 2. Richmond and Clapham Junction to Stratford (routes join at Willesden Junction) "North London Line"? 3. Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside "Gobl Line"? 4. Highbury and Islington via Thames Tunnel to Clapham Junction / West Croydon / New Cross / Crystal Palace "East London Line"? 5. Liverpool Street to Enfield Town / Cheshunt / Chingford "Jazz service"? 6. Romford to Upminster "The Waif" But how would these cover the fact that many of the services extend beyond those older names, for eample the East London line extends to West Croydon and Clapham Junction? I think TfL could be looking for non geographic similar in idea to the Elizabeth Line Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on March 25, 2023, 19:39:24 But how would these cover the fact that many of the services extend beyond those older names, for eample the East London line extends to West Croydon and Clapham Junction? Perhaps you don't? The "Northern Line" already includes the southern most station on the Underground. "North London Line" and "East London Line" work well for those two in that they pass to the north and the east; slight concern at "North London Line" and "Northern Line" getting confused? Quote I think TfL could be looking for non geographic similar in idea to the Elizabeth Line I suspect so. Name them after formidable women - Florence (Nightingale) Line, Emmeline (Pankhurst) Line, Mary (Seacole) Line, Bodicea Line, Margaret (Thatcher) Line and Theresa (May) Line. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Bmblbzzz on March 26, 2023, 14:44:34 As for colours – this will have to be very carefully thought out to keep them distinct. Probably some lines will have to be a combination of colours (eg red outline with blue infill). It's still going to get messy at different scales. And as a colourblind friend says, "Will it work in greyscale?"
Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: TaplowGreen on March 26, 2023, 15:03:13 From the precedent of Victoria and Elizabeth ... after famous people ... Churchill Charles Darwin Beeching Stevenson Trevithick Not enough diversity there I'm afraid, all old white men! Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on March 26, 2023, 18:42:23 From the precedent of Victoria and Elizabeth ... after famous people ... Churchill Charles Darwin Beeching Stevenson Trevithick Not enough diversity there I'm afraid, all old white men! See my alternative suggestion up-thread. Nightingale, Seacole, Pankhurst, etc Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: CyclingSid on March 27, 2023, 07:11:56 As for colours – this will have to be very carefully thought out to keep them distinct. Probably some lines will have to be a combination of colours (eg red outline with blue infill). It's still going to get messy at different scales. And as a colourblind friend says, "Will it work in greyscale?" I have problems differentiating the existing range of colours, so they are going to have to vary texture (dashed, filled, etc) as well for some of us to have a chance. Quite challenging with the pocket Tube map. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Witham Bobby on March 28, 2023, 13:34:49 But how would these cover the fact that many of the services extend beyond those older names, for eample the East London line extends to West Croydon and Clapham Junction? Perhaps you don't? The "Northern Line" already includes the southern most station on the Underground. "North London Line" and "East London Line" work well for those two in that they pass to the north and the east; slight concern at "North London Line" and "Northern Line" getting confused? Quote I think TfL could be looking for non geographic similar in idea to the Elizabeth Line I suspect so. Name them after formidable women - Florence (Nightingale) Line, Emmeline (Pankhurst) Line, Mary (Seacole) Line, Bodicea Line, Margaret (Thatcher) Line and Theresa (May) Line. I have a feeling Mayor Khan isn't going to allow a line to be named after Margaret Thatcher. Just a hunch. Could be wrong Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: ellendune on March 28, 2023, 18:55:40 Name them after formidable women - Florence (Nightingale) Line, Emmeline (Pankhurst) Line, Mary (Seacole) Line, Bodicea Line, Margaret (Thatcher) Line and Theresa (May) Line. The overground is actually more than one line so could have more than one name - though problem with more colours (but Paris seems to manage). Perhaps the name Boadicea could be given to the line heading more in an East Anglian Direction? Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: JayMac on March 29, 2023, 17:46:12 Here's YouTuber Jago Hazzard's take on the matter.
https://youtu.be/gKBkb3H3Abk Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: JayMac on July 01, 2023, 15:14:44 From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-66067924):
Quote Six London Overground lines will be named by the end of next year, Transport for London (TfL) says. Routes to be named include Euston to Watford Junction, Romford to Upminster and Gospel Oak to Barking, already affectionately dubbed the Goblin line. TfL believes the move will increase confidence and offer clearer service disruption information. London Overground, with its orange roundel, will remain as the umbrella brand, according to transport bosses. TfL says it will consult local groups and transport historians and "is working with the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm to establish broad themes we'll use to guide the community engagement". It added: "The approach is centred around hearing from the many different communities that live close to the London Overground and how we can represent them through the line names." Mayor of London Sadiq Khan said: "Naming the lines will not only help educate visitors about our amazing city and incredible history but will also make it easier for people who live, work or visit London to more easily navigate the city." Possibly coincidence but two recent videos from Geoff Marshall and Jago Hazzard both suggested it was time that TfL named the Overground lines. Suggestions? Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Surrey 455 on July 01, 2023, 17:26:08 This topic has come up recently at
http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=27318.0 Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: JayMac on July 01, 2023, 18:05:56 This topic has come up recently at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=27318.0 Aha. Missed that. Despite my contribution to the earlier thread. Now merged. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: stuving on February 15, 2024, 09:15:57 New names now announced. From TfL (https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/london-overground/the-new-look-london-overground?intcmp=75267):
Quote London Overground’s new look We'll introduce new names and line colours across the London Overground network by the end of 2024. Each of the 6 routes that make up the London Overground will be given its own colour. Lioness (currently known as Watford Junction to Euston) - yellow Mildmay (currently known as Richmond and Clapham Junction to Stratford) - blue Windrush (currently known as Highbury & Islington to New Cross, Clapham Junction, Crystal Palace and West Croydon) - red Weaver (currently known as Liverpool Street to Enfield Town, Cheshunt and Chingford) - maroon Suffragette (currently known as Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside) - green Liberty (currently known as Romford to Upminster) - grey And there's a map of just the Overground lines (https://tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/london-overground-map-autumn-2024.pdf): (https://tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/images/london-overground-map-with-new-names2-700x800.png) The full tube map (https://tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/tube-map-with-the-new-lo-names.pdf)'s a bit too big to show in a post. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: grahame on February 15, 2024, 10:07:32 Colours make sense; names explained at https://madeby.tfl.gov.uk/2024/02/15/overground_line_names/?intcmp=75213 - not sure they are what I would have chosen but you're not going to please everyone (and I know I can be difficult to please ;D )
Edit - full map mirrored for members at http://www.passenger.chat/mirror/tube-map-with-the-new-lo-names.pdf Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: stuving on February 15, 2024, 11:38:21 All new names sound and feel odd, because they lack the association with the thing they now name, which will build up later. I'm sure Bakerloo felt a bit silly too at first. It appears in a headline on the opening day; I'm sure sub-editors liked it as they had always struggled to get the full names of railways to fit in. It then appears as "Baker-loo" and then "Bakerloo" (with the quotes) within days. And people soon got used to it, partly because it just works as a name.
These new Overground names do seem to have an air of woke virtue-signalling about them. Of course elsewhere in Europe this kind of rather political naming of things has been more common. And remember that the last line named by TfL was the Elizabeth Line - an example of a much older custom: deferential virtue-signalling. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Noggin on February 15, 2024, 13:09:02 It's a nice gesture, however operationally it's got got the potential for a lot of confusion, particularly for tourists and the elderly. Anchoring them in geography would arguably have been much better from a usability perspective.
It's also got the potential to attract a huge amount of ridicule both domestically and internationally. Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: ChrisB on February 15, 2024, 14:09:29 There are now TWO green lines passing through Barking....confusion? I reckon. Badly planned.
Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: TaplowGreen on February 15, 2024, 15:17:57 It's a nice gesture, however operationally it's got got the potential for a lot of confusion, particularly for tourists and the elderly. Anchoring them in geography would arguably have been much better from a usability perspective. It's also got the potential to attract a huge amount of ridicule both domestically and internationally. Agreed, geography would be better, although if "Windrush" passed through Tower Hamlets it could usefully be used as a pointer to the curryhouses of Brick Lane? Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: Electric train on February 15, 2024, 17:03:15 Maybe we should adopt the German method of a letter and numbers eg S1 U1
The London Overground would be O1, O2, O3 etc, ;D Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: ChrisB on February 15, 2024, 17:06:11 Just as well it wouldn't be "Take the O2 to get to the O2" then....
Title: Re: Giving each overground line a separate name and colour Post by: TonyK on February 15, 2024, 20:33:01 There are now TWO green lines passing through Barking....confusion? I reckon. Badly planned. Barking mad. Quote London Overground’s new look We'll introduce new names and line colours across the London Overground network by the end of 2024. Each of the 6 routes that make up the London Overground will be given its own colour. Lioness (currently known as Watford Junction to Euston) - yellow Mildmay (currently known as Richmond and Clapham Junction to Stratford) - blue Windrush (currently known as Highbury & Islington to New Cross, Clapham Junction, Crystal Palace and West Croydon) - red Weaver (currently known as Liverpool Street to Enfield Town, Cheshunt and Chingford) - maroon Suffragette (currently known as Gospel Oak to Barking Riverside) - green Liberty (currently known as Romford to Upminster) - grey I can see unofficial nicknames creeping in if things don't go quite to plan. Liomess, Weaver train hopefully, and the Diabolical Liberty Line spring to mind, but hopefully all will go well forever and there'll be no need for that. This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net |