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Journey by Journey => Thames Valley Branches => Topic started by: autotank on March 25, 2009, 12:59:50



Title: Reading Green Park
Post by: autotank on March 25, 2009, 12:59:50
This has been cleared by the ORR: http://www.transportbriefing.co.uk/story.php?id=5741

Seems like a very odd way of financing a station - I am very unconvinced about these PPP's. Surely all stations should be owned by NR and not some outside company? I imagine the passenger will end up paying through the nose as usual!

Will it be of much use to those attending the Reading FC ground?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 25, 2009, 15:00:39
I agree that it's a strange way to finance and operate a station, but that seems to be the way we're heading. Why the extra few pennies to turn it into a 6-car platform can't be found though I don't know.

It could be a very useful station for the Madjeski Stadium as I will be less than a mile away from it. Green Park is already quite a big complex and set to expand further on land nearer to the site of this new station, so it will also prove very popular for people going to work there from Basingstoke and Reading.

It's also very close to the M4, so perhaps there is a 'Reading Parkway' potential that could also be exploited? It's a shame that land on the other side of the tracks is very low-lying and full of lakes as that would have given the site even more potential.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightf48544 on March 25, 2009, 16:42:39
Web site says.

"The two-platform station design will accommodate five car train sets, with space for future extensions, connected by a footbridge with disabled access lifts. Work on site is expected to begin by the end of this month."

As industry insider says why not go for 6 * 23m to start. It shouldn't cost too much more.

How close is it to Southcote junction?

Is there room for a Basingstoke train to be stopped in the platform and let another train onto the line and clear Southcote otherwise it could cause delays to Berks and Hants trains.

PPP basically means that whoever rents the station (Netwrokrail?) will pay considerably more to lease the station over many years than had they built it  themselves and paid interest on borrowed capital.




Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Electric train on March 25, 2009, 18:13:10
I think this new station has a lot to do with planning permission for Green Park, Reading Borough has added things like this in other business parks.

Its a good deal for NR they get an increase in train usage hence track access charges without the grief of looking after the station as the landlord.

The new station should be well clear of Southcott Jcn as I think the new station will be quite close to the M4


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on July 10, 2009, 22:51:49
Has anyone seen any signs of activity on the site yet? Ages since I was up that stretch of line unfortunately. 

"Station construction works are scheduled to commence early 2009 and the station should be open by early 2010."
According to this:

http://www.greenparkvillage.co.uk/station.html (http://www.greenparkvillage.co.uk/station.html)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Phil on July 11, 2009, 10:16:10
No, I went up and down that line last Thursday and there wasn't any indication of activity.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on June 28, 2010, 22:30:02
No, I went up and down that line last Thursday and there wasn't any indication of activity.

And to confirm that almost a year on, and after the supposed opening date, there's still no sign of any construction work taking place.  Does anybody know what the hold-up is?  Has the scheme been quietly dropped?  The Green Park website only makes mention to a February 2008 press release giving final approval: http://www.greenpark.co.uk/cms/pdfs/GP_NEWS_FEB08.pdf (http://www.greenpark.co.uk/cms/pdfs/GP_NEWS_FEB08.pdf)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 18, 2010, 13:46:31
Does anybody know what the hold-up is? 

Nobody?  ???


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on August 18, 2010, 14:44:26
I wasn't going to bother pointing it out, but could there have been a recession?  ???

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 18, 2010, 15:11:48
I think there was, yes.  ::)  Shouldn't that lead to an official announcement of a delay or cancellation though?

The latest news I could find comes from the excellent Reading Chronicle: http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/reading/articles/2009/11/01/42644-station-developers-ecobacktrack-/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/reading/articles/2009/11/01/42644-station-developers-ecobacktrack-/) - which talks of a change in specification last November (i.e. post recession), but still states that the work should now have started and be largely completed ready for a November opening this year.  That clearly isn't going to happen.  I'm a little surprised that there's not more public interest in what is a rare opening of a new station in England.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on August 18, 2010, 17:13:06
I think there's a different media interest when 'the railway' announces an opening proposal.  This seems to be firmly associated with the overall development in the area - and I don't think it's something NR or FGW have publicised much?

So does that lead to less potential for 'railway bashing' by the local media, because as far as folk in Reading are concerned it's just part of yet another out of town development, and there's a sort of complacency because they are going on to their own agenda and timescales?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 27, 2011, 09:27:16
At last, some news on this project, but sadly it's not good news!

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2102282_green_park_station_plan_hits_the_buffers (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2102282_green_park_station_plan_hits_the_buffers)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 04, 2013, 12:10:25
A bit of positive news regarding Reading Green Park station:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-25198432 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-25198432)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: JayMac on December 04, 2013, 14:50:38
Positive news indeed. But, that station name...

Makes me all misty eyed for another 'Green Park' that will never again see a train.

(http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_3001_zps08579727.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bobm on December 04, 2013, 14:55:51
I can assure you Green Park in Reading looks nothing like that....

There was also talk of opening a station at Suttons Industrial Park to the east of Reading but I think that has died a death.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Timmer on December 04, 2013, 17:04:16
Makes me all misty eyed for another 'Green Park' that will never again see a train.
Makes me sad everytime I walk through it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 04, 2013, 19:41:27
There was also talk of opening a station at Suttons Industrial Park to the east of Reading but I think that has died a death.

I've always wondered why I've not seen a station at Woodley suggested: i.e. at the west end of "Suttons' Seeds", or a bit further out. True, being in Sonning cutting adds to the cost, especially if you need to provide the Crossrail standard of 4 platforms, but ten years or more ago that wouldn't have been needed.

That would be closer to the spacing out from Reading of the first station on other lines - Earley, Tilehurst, and the proposed Green Park (ignoring Reading West) are all just under 3 miles. What should determine the spacing of stations like this?

I guess that, apart from operational matters, the main issue is how big a catchment a station can serve. Is there a standard figure for how far people will walk from work or home?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on July 08, 2014, 14:48:45
This proposal seems to have come back to life again. See

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2014/07/08/101760-plans-for-green-park-station-serving-reading-fcs-madejski-stadium-on-track-after-government-pledges-32m-for-transport-projects-across-reading/

All I can say is that it will be a long walk to the stadium. As the crow flies the shortest distance is about 3/4 mile.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on July 08, 2014, 16:31:30
There seems (nationally) to be a strange idea that you can justify a station opening (or re-openings) by its proximity to a football stadium.  Whereas in the reality, although a stadium would be of some marginal interest to the business case, it will never be a prime justification, as headline writers seem to think...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on November 21, 2014, 18:52:32
Well, once more Network rail are right about a project they put in their plans - funding this has now been signed off, according to the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-30128617)
Quote
20 November 2014 Last updated at 20:06
Green Park train station funding approved for Reading

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/79155000/jpg/_79155055_79147410.jpg)
The new station at Green Park is near the Madejski Stadium, a new housing development and a business park

Funding for a new train station in Reading has been approved as part of a multimillion-pound spend on improving transport networks across Berkshire.

The ^6.4m Green Park station will be built on the Reading to Basingstoke line near the Madejski Stadium, with construction planned in October 2016.

It is part of a ^21.4m batch of schemes agreed by the Berkshire Local Transport Body, and funded by the government.

Newbury, Bracknell and Slough councils have had road upgrades approved.

Plans for the station include a bus interchange, park and ride, a short stay car park and taxi drop-off.

Reading Borough's transport chief Tony Page, who also chairs the Berkshire Local Transport Body, said: "It will be instrumental in unlocking the much needed housing and other facilities that are encompassed in the Green Park Village development."

Newbury is to get a direct link between the Hambridge Road industrial area and the A339 - costing ^2.34m, and a new ^1.9m junction to improve access to London Road Industrial Estate, a regeneration site.

Slough will receive a total of ^7.1m to improve the A332 Windsor Road as well as a scheme to improve traffic flow on the A355 between the M4, Slough Trading Estate and the M40.

Bracknell is to build a ^3.5m Warfield link road to facilitate plans for a 2,200-home development in the area.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Jason on March 20, 2015, 15:32:12
The long-awaited Green Park railway station is back on the agenda after plans were submitted to Reading Borough Council...
http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/green-park-train-station-plans-8865748 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/green-park-train-station-plans-8865748)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on March 20, 2015, 20:00:35
Any chance of one of these at Bath?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 25, 2015, 20:07:51
From GetReading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/first-great-western-suggest-green-8911892):

Quote
First Great Western suggest Green Park station won't be open until late 2018

There is confusion as to when the ^8 million development will be ready for public use

(http://i4.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article4132542.ece/alternates/s615/C_67_article_2080208_body_articleblock_0_bodyimage.jpg)
Planners are due to discuss the future of the Green Park railway station tonight

There is much speculation surrounding the completion of the planned Green Park railway station.

Original plans submitted to Reading Borough Council by agents Peter Brett Associates estimate completion by the end of 2017, if all goes well.

Councillor Tony Page, Deputy Leader of the Council and Lead Councillor for Strategic Environment, Planning and Transport confirmed this.

However James Davis, Media Relations Manager for First Great Western believes the ^8 million station will not be ready until December 2018, in time for the electrification of the railway line.

This is a separate project aiming to bring out a fleet of new electric trains across the Thames Valley and South Wales, replacing some of the old diesel engines.

Tony Page said First Great Western were being "pessimistic in their expectations.

"They're erring on the side of caution here," he said.

The 25,600 sq m station would be unmanned and would be part-funded by the Local Enterprise Partnership, receiving a grant of ^6.4 million.

Reading Borough Council would cover the remaining ^1.6 million.

Proposals for the station date back to 2007, with the original Green Park business park.

After being dropped in 2011, the project was resurrected in December 2013 when the council announced it would re-submit plans for the station.

In July 2014 it was announced the station would feature in a ^17 million Government investment in road and rail projects.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on March 25, 2015, 20:47:20
Confusion? In a railway project? Whatever next!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on March 28, 2015, 23:01:42
I would expect that the station opens with the electric service to Basingstoke. The reason is that the current 30 minute interval service can be maintained by 2 units with a journey time of 25 minutes. Lengthening the end-to-end journey time by 3 or 4 minutes will mean there is insufficient turnround time at each end of the journey for a reliable service to be run.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 29, 2015, 09:19:12
I agree with ReadingAbbeys comment, especially with the 150s the turnaround time is tight enough as it is, the stop at Green Park would be to much for 2 units. However if the turbos are being cascaded by then perhaps 3 units could be used until the line has been fully electrified.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on March 29, 2015, 11:50:26
I would expect that the station opens with the electric service to Basingstoke.

But when will that be? Remember this bit of electrification was an afterthought, is not due to complete GRIP 3 until December 2015, and all later milestone dates are TBA.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on March 29, 2015, 17:19:16

But when will that be? Remember this bit of electrification was an afterthought, is not due to complete GRIP 3 until December 2015, and all later milestone dates are TBA.

Sorreee...! I should have made it clear that I was commenting on the difference in completion dates of the electrification given by Tony Page of the RBC (December 2017) and James Davis of fGW who quoted December 2018.

I quite believe the official documents only give TBA - but these documents are written for civil servants by civil servants and none of them will want to be definite if they don't have to be and the approved documents are not to hand. The operator needs to have something more concrete for their planning so I expect they are basing their working on some reasonable assumptions. The RBC politicians, on the other hand, want to have something in their hands so that they can later berate the railways so they pluck a number out of the air or, to be charitable, a date quoted in an earlier iteration of the planning... :o


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Jason on April 29, 2015, 09:40:07
Updated plans have been submitted as the original consents have expired as reported in
http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/green-park-station-expired-plan-9139923 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/green-park-station-expired-plan-9139923)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 10, 2015, 00:34:00
From Railnews (http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/2015/05/08-goahead-for-station-at-reading.html):

Quote
Go-ahead for station at Reading Green Park

(http://www.railnews.co.uk/img/medium/news02102.jpg)

Planning permission has been granted for a new park-and-ride station in the southern outskirts of Reading, eight years after plans for the station were first unveiled.

The ^6.4 million station ^ part funded by the Berkshire Local Transport Body and nearby property developers ^ will include a multi-storey car park and bus interchange, and be served by First Great Western trains on the Reading-Basingstoke line.

Plans now also include provision for the planned electrification of the Basingstoke line as part of the North-South Spine project.

The new station will serve a fast-growing high-tech and residential area on the south side of Reading, near Junction 11 of the M4.  Tesco already has a substantial distribution centre nearby, employing around 1,000 people, and Huawei, the Chinese telecoms giants, has recently relocated to Green Park.

The Berkshire Local Transport Body says the Reading-Basingstoke corridor provides access to over 50,000 jobs in central Reading and 10,000 jobs and 1,500 homes in South Reading. There is also planned growth of 7,500 jobs and 1,500 more homes along the corridor, and another 2,500 homes near M4 junction 11.

First Great Western said the station is expected to be completed by December 2018.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on July 23, 2016, 15:46:34
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-36857446):

Quote
Reading Green Park railway station cost increases by £3m

    22 July 2016
    From the section Berkshire

The cost of a new railway station planned for Reading has risen by almost 50%.

Berkshire Local Transport Body (BLTB) awarded an additional £3m to the initial £6.4m contract for Green Park Station on Thursday.

The station will be built on the Reading to Basingstoke line near Madejski Stadium to improve transport networks across Berkshire.

Reading Borough Council said the funds would help "cater for more passengers".

Funds would go towards the provision of additional waiting shelters and ticketing facilities for passengers.

Tony Page, planning and transport councillor at the authority, said: "We need to future-proof for a much greater use by passengers than originally anticipated due to the growth in housing, leisure and conference facilities...over the next few years."

An assessment of forecast passenger demand for the station was undertaken in 2013 by Great Western Railway and Network Rail.

However, BLTP said recent reviews suggested "a significant increase in the forecast passenger demand for the station in comparison to the calculations undertaken in 2013".

Construction work on the station is set to begin in October 2016.

It is part of a £21.4m batch of schemes agreed by the Berkshire Local Transport Body and funded by the government.

Other schemes include road improvements in Newbury, Slough and Bracknell.

Now, what's missing from that (as it was from the shorter news item run on South Today on Thursday)? Oh yes, what trains might call there and from when.

While it's not in the thread above, the Hendy version of delivery dates gives:
Quote
Milestone Description Date Status
GRIP 3 AIP completionSingle option selection and AIP completionJune 2018Regulated Output
GRIP 4 completionSingle option scope definedAssumed CP6Indicative
GRIP 6 startStart on siteAssumed CP6Indicative
EIS Infrastructure authorised  Infrastructure authorised for passenger useAssumed CP6   Indicative
Output deliveredFirst timetabled public use of the infrastructure  Assumed CP6n/a

So if anyone is still counting on electric trains for this service, there's no rush to build the station.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on July 23, 2016, 18:18:44
Having travelled a lot between Reading and Southampton recently I've noticed some houses being built at Green Park edging slowly towards the railway line so I would have thought passenger demand will be increasing fairly shortly.

Quote
Oh yes, what trains might call there and from when
With turbos being released from the main line, as I have said before I don't see any reason for not having three turbos shuttling up and down, would be far better for turnaround times as at the moment recovery times throughout the day are practically nonexistent.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on July 23, 2016, 19:53:41
Having travelled a lot between Reading and Southampton recently I've noticed some houses being built at Green Park edging slowly towards the railway line so I would have thought passenger demand will be increasing fairly shortly.

Let's hope they have a train service to meet that demand rather than one that starts after they've all bought their second cars!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Noggin on July 24, 2016, 22:05:22
Well I suppose that it's good news if they are building it properly rather than a minimalistic effort that will have to be upgraded at great expense.

IIRC, the issue with the Reading to Basingstoke line is that you can just squeeze in the current service pattern, but an additional stop at Green Park would be too much. I believe that the faster acceleration of EMUs would resolve the issue, otherwise other stations would have to lose some of their services (assuming that a complete recast of the timetable is out of the question).

I'm inclined to think that with Hendy in charge, GWML electrification will be run like Crossrail - i.e. strictly no increases in scope, extras only get done once the main project has been delivered.     


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 26, 2017, 20:31:46
This has popped up in GetReading:
Quote
Network Rail attempt to get Green Park Station project back on track
There are concerns that no trains will stop at the station when it opens in 2018 as the electrification of the line has been delayed*

ByNathan Hyde    11:37, 26 FEB 2017
(http://i1.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article9251709.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/green-park-stationJPG.jpg)
Artist's impression of Green Park Station

Reading passengers may be able to catch a train at Green Park Station when it opens in December 2018, even though the railway line will not be electrified.

Plans for the eagerly-awaited station suffered a huge blow in 2015 when Network Rail announced that work to electrify the line it sits on would not begin before 2019.

There were concerns that no trains would be able to call at the station when it opened.

The two diesel trains which operate on the branch line are not able to achieve the necessary acceleration in the short distance between Green Park and Reading Station.

However, Network Rail has revealed it could make alterations to ensure that diesel trains can stop at the station, until the electrification is completed.

"We’re working with Reading Borough Council and the Department for Transport to put arrangements in so that the station can be served by diesel trains before the line is electrified," said a Network Rails spokesman.

He also confirmed that the station is still expected to open in December 2018.

Reading FC are keeping a close eye on the multi-million pound project as the station will offer another mode of transport for fans and people travelling to and from Royal Elm Park.
Royal Elm Park

The installation of an electrified line between Basingstoke and Reading has been delayed until what Network Rail call CP6, which is sometime between 2019 to 2024.

The announcement was made in the Hendy Report, published by Network Rail chairman Sir Peter Hendy after he was tasked with looking at a massive overspend on the electrification of railway lines across the UK.

Reading Borough Council has secured £13.7 million of funding for the project, from the Local Growth Fund and private sector contributions.

Plans for the railway station were approved by the council's planning committee in April 2015.
(*I'm not sure what that's doing there.)

Now, I wonder what's that all about? I mean, particularly, ""We’re working with Reading Borough Council and the Department for Transport to put arrangements in so that the station can be served by diesel trains before the line is electrified," said a Network Rails spokesman."


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 26, 2017, 21:45:00
Realistically it's either an extra unit to maintain the 30-minute frequency, or a one of the other three intermediate stops being removed.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Jason on August 01, 2017, 11:52:28
Green Park Station given major funding boost by Government

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15440149.__2_3m_pledged_to_create_new_train_station/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15440149.__2_3m_pledged_to_create_new_train_station/)
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-station-boost-for-passengers-thanks-to-16-million-government-investment (https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-station-boost-for-passengers-thanks-to-16-million-government-investment)

Still no mention of hard timescales for trains actually being able to stop there.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Jason on September 19, 2017, 13:42:14
Green Park station milestone reached as project edges closer
[ http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/green-park-station-milestone-reached-13637531 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/green-park-station-milestone-reached-13637531) ]

The station is set to be a transport hub for South Reading
Plans for Green Park railway station will reach a key milestone when spending on the project and a developer to lead the design are agreed.

Reading Borough Council bosses are expected to approve the scheme and spending for the new station at its policy committee on Monday, September 25.

Councillors are also expected to appoint developers Balfour Beatty.
Read More

    Green Park Station plans given green light by government

Councillor Tony Page, lead member for strategic environment, planning and transport, said: "The spend approval for Green Park Station is an important landmark for this council-led scheme and we hope to be in a position to announce when work on the ground will start at some point over the winter."

The station will be on the Reading to Basingstoke train line, and services will run every 30 minutes north to Reading and south to Basingstoke throughout the day.

The council is in discussions with the Department for Transport, Network Rail and Great Western Railway to agree a timetable for the delivery of the station.

Green Park station will cost an estimated £16 million and will feature two platforms, disabled access, a car park, bus stops, a taxi rank and cycle parking.
Artist's impression of Green Park Station

Football fans are expected to be major beneficiaries of the new station on matchdays, due to the proximity of the station to the Madejski Stadium.

It is hoped the new transport link will also help alleviate queues on the busy A33.

Cllr Page said: "Reading Green Park Station will be a key part of the town’s future transport infrastructure as more homes, businesses and leisure developments are planned for the area.

"It will also be welcomed by football and rugby fans heading to Madejski Stadium.
Read More
Green Park station

    Government approve station plans
    Fears over station electrification
    Plan for flats nearby
    Royal Elm Park approved

"Quick and easy rail access to south Reading will also help keep traffic off busy roads like the A33, which is an obvious benefit to everyone."

The move comes after the Department for Transport announced it would put £2.3 million into the scheme.

Other funding will come from area development contributions (£4.6 million) and £9.15 million from the the Local Enterprise Partnership.

When the Department for Transport approved the cash in July it stated the new station would be complete by March 2020.

The station will be just one part of major works going on at Green Park, which include the expansion of Green Park Business Park, the Green Park Village residential development and the Royal Elm Park mixed-use development.

Planning permission for the station was granted in 2015.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: ChrisB on September 19, 2017, 14:15:18
Presumably another turbo will be required to provide this service? The trip will take more than 30 minutes once a stop here is served?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on September 20, 2017, 08:16:50
There was a previous article in the Reading paper about electrification, which is possibly the only way they would be able to keep to the current schedule. As for reducing road traffic, I can't see that happening unless there are some peak time trains direct to Paddington, and in the light of the recent changes to the Henley service I can't imagine that happening.
Plans for Grazeley Garden Village also suggest that there should be a station there, with the idea of "moving" Mortimer station (which I would imagine wouldn't be well received by the current users).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 20, 2017, 09:32:23
Can't see electrification happening in time for the proposed opening date, but given that is likely to slip given its already slipped many times and experience of similar stations being delayed, who knows which will be ready first!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: aifo on September 22, 2017, 11:38:04
There's more details in the agenda for the RBC Policy Committee, Item 10:
http://www.reading.gov.uk/article/10578/Policy-Committee-25-SEP-2017 (http://www.reading.gov.uk/article/10578/Policy-Committee-25-SEP-2017)
Quote
An indicative programme for delivery of the station by May 2019 has been agreed with the DfT, Network Rail and GWR, based on the requirement for the station to be included within the specification for the Great Western Franchise. There is also a requirement for an additional diesel train to be supplied for the Reading-Basingstoke line as part of this franchise to enable Green Park Station to be served prior to delivery of electrification of the line (which will enable the station to be served with the existing provision of two trains on the line) which has been agreed with the DfT.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 22, 2017, 11:44:38
An additional train would also mean much longer turnaround times at either end, which is less efficient but should improve timekeeping.  One less Turbo for the west though?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on September 22, 2017, 21:48:18
There's more details in the agenda for the RBC Policy Committee, Item 10:

http://www.reading.gov.uk/article/10578/Policy-Committee-25-SEP-2017 (http://www.reading.gov.uk/article/10578/Policy-Committee-25-SEP-2017)


Thanks for posting that information, aifo - and a warm welcome to the Coffee Shop forum.  :)



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 27, 2017, 10:13:36
Funding approved by RBC, unsurprising as they don't have to fund any of it.
http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/green-park-station-funding-approved-13674198 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/green-park-station-funding-approved-13674198)

Quote
which is now expected to be completed by May 2019
Now, where's that pig flying emoticon?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: ChrisB on October 01, 2017, 11:36:14
An additional train would also mean much longer turnaround times at either end, which is less efficient but should improve timekeeping.  One less Turbo for the west though?

Or the retention of a 150 once released from the West?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 01, 2017, 16:18:35
Possible, though I would think the Turbo option would be likelier as that means crew knowledge would be much simplified.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 17, 2019, 13:54:21
Quote
Funding approved by RBC, unsurprising as they don't have to fund any of it.
http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/green-park-station-funding-approved-13674198

Quote
which is now expected to be completed by May 2019
Now, where's that pig flying emoticon?

It looks like your scepticism was justified-

This is what the site looked like earlier today-











Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: jamestheredengine on February 17, 2019, 16:10:08
I'm not surprised that the station site still looks like that. What surprises me is the jump to using extra rolling stock, rather than inter-working with the Newbury local service, which already seems not to have very tidy turnarounds.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on February 17, 2019, 16:25:02
I'm not surprised that the station site still looks like that. What surprises me is the jump to using extra rolling stock, rather than inter-working with the Newbury local service, which already seems not to have very tidy turnarounds.

But the Newbury local service is electric ...


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 17, 2019, 16:32:21
After the last new date (summer 2019 in place of 2020), things have got delayed again, by guess who? Wokingham Borough Planning (http://publicaccess.wokingham.gov.uk/AniteIM.WebSearch/(S(lxusee5532hrj1yrr1n3ugr5))/Results.aspx?grdResultsP=1), that's who. As the applicants' agents (Peter Brett Associates) explain:
Quote
An application for the construction of a railway station, multi-modal interchange and multi-storey car park was granted full planning permission by Reading Borough Council (Ref: 141944) and West Berkshire Council (Ref: 14/03289/COMIND) in Spring 2015. As a result of subsequent detailed design work and engineering constraints (such as the existing Foudry Brook culvert and high voltage cables), it is necessary for the approved platforms to be relocated further south and for the platforms to be extended to 165m to accommodate 6 carriage trains. This, in turn, requires relocation of the approved footbridge and a change to the location of the approved ditch diversion. These proposed amendments fall outside of the previously approved application boundary and therefore a new full application is hereby submitted.

There is a tiny wedge of wayward Wokingham in the immediate foreground of eightonedee's picture (from Kirtons Farm Road bridge). It only goes as far as the equipment cabinet and half as far again, but the platforms in their new positions come right up to the bridge. The rest of the station is in West Berkshire, except for just the front wall and road access (including a 4-storey car park) that are in Reading. So a new planning application was made to WBC last May ... and there it still rests, listed officially as recommendation made and awaiting the start of a consultation phase.

Having refused Reading's application to build their bus bridge (East Reading MRT), on the grounds that it would ruin the riverside environment (which looks suspiciously like a scruffy bit of ex-industrial canal bank), I wonder what objections WBC will come up with this time?






Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 17, 2019, 17:12:21
Quote
Having refused Reading's application to build their bus bridge (East Reading MRT), on the grounds that it would ruin the riverside environment (which looks suspiciously like a scruffy bit of ex-industrial canal bank), I wonder what objections WBC will come up with this time?

To be fair, Stuving, there was a lot of opposition (especially from "Green" groups) to the MRT. While I agree that it looks about the least attractive part of the Thames through Berkshire, there are a lot of people in east Reading/Newtown area who seem very attached to this their nearest bit of riverside greenery.

The same cannot however be said about Green Park Station. It has no effect on the amenity of any Wokingham residents at all so I cannot understand what WBC's problem is. I am also surprised that Councillor Page (who is not backward at coming forward!) has not been lambasting WBC in the local press about their delay in processing this application.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 17, 2019, 18:50:59
That very odd boundary, in case you were wondering, dates way back to when it divided the parishes of Shinfield and Burghfield. At that stage both parishes extended well to the north, with a somewhat wiggly boundary (probably following a tiny stream) but nothing unusual. It was also a Workhouse Union boundary, and that became the basis for sanitary districts and then (following 1894) rural districts (Wokingham and Bradfield). But in 1887, when the RDCs were created, Reading Borough was extended (and promoted to County Borough) and took over part of Shinfield and Wokingham Union to the east of the railway. That cut off this little snippet of Wokingham.

Now historically parishes didn't bother to follow even county boundaries, nor to join detached parts by narrow contiguating strips. This time they chose to do both of those things, hence the north half of Kirtons Farm Road from the bridge eastwards is in Wokingham. The bridge is one-way with traffic lights, which at 300 m are quite far apart, and four of the signal posts are in West Berkshire, one in Reading, and the cable between them can't avoid going through Wokingham.

I'm sure it all made sense at the time ... to someone ...


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 17, 2019, 19:42:39
Did you spot this bit? "...for the platforms to be extended to 165m to accommodate 6 carriage trains"? Is that just "while we're at it let's cater for future growth"? That's hardly the usual style, not for NR nor any other funders. So is there a cunning plan hiding out of sight somewhere - or maybe it's "let's put 165 m in the planning application, but only build 3-car for now"!

When electrification was still on, Mortimer and Bramley were going to get stretched from 3-car to 4-car platform lengths. That bit of the plan is now just sitting there sulking and dreaming optimistically of CP6, unless anyone has heard any newer news.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on February 18, 2019, 14:19:55
The other thing that struck me about the site of Reading Green Park, it would seem to be fairly close to having the National Grid lines overhead.

For those interested in the many and varied quirks of Berkshire boundaries might want to get sight of a copy of "An Historical Atlas of Berkshire". Also to show that the Local Government Boundary Commission for England has a sense of humour, see some of the proposals before they ended up with six unitary authorities.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 18, 2019, 14:25:39
Did you spot this bit? "...for the platforms to be extended to 165m to accommodate 6 carriage trains"? Is that just "while we're at it let's cater for future growth"? That's hardly the usual style, not for NR nor any other funders. So is there a cunning plan hiding out of sight somewhere - or maybe it's "let's put 165 m in the planning application, but only build 3-car for now"!

To be able to operate match day specials for Reading F.C.?  Either 6-car Turbos, or 8-car 769s?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 18, 2019, 18:34:02
Did you spot this bit? "...for the platforms to be extended to 165m to accommodate 6 carriage trains"? Is that just "while we're at it let's cater for future growth"? That's hardly the usual style, not for NR nor any other funders. So is there a cunning plan hiding out of sight somewhere - or maybe it's "let's put 165 m in the planning application, but only build 3-car for now"!

To be able to operate match day specials for Reading F.C.?  Either 6-car Turbos, or 8-car 769s?

I thought not, as that would not have changed since 2015. However, the stock will change - now that the station design is for diesel rather than for electric. The earlier design was for 5-car (presumably 140 m), and it may be that one of the implications non-electrification is having to cope with only 3-car units.

I thought I'd just have a quick look at the new application - in whichever LPD it belongs to - and failed. It seems all three sets of planners think it's primarily someone else's, and haven't posted most of the documents. But I did find that it probably isn't Wokingham that's being difficult, but the other WBC (West Berks).

From various short summaries, it's clear the redesign has moved the platforms some 35 m southwards so as not to span Foudry Brook, and a bit less again to reach 6-car length. The old design stopped just short of Wokingham, so the move alone pushes into their patch and the extension is all theirs. So Wokingham got a full application, never having had one before, and so did Reading though with no visible documents; and both are just waiting.

West Berks only got a quickie non-material change application, presumably on the grounds (you don't get to explain why) that the only significant change is removing things to somewhere else. They have refused this, on the grounds that moving a planned building is material. I guess they should now get a full application, basically to explain why a full application wasn't needed. This of course is familiar territory for planning, where you can get a planning pseudo-consent (for permitted development) that says you don't need planning consent...

What is really odd though, is that Wokingham's site outline map shows an access route via West Berks,  while theirs doesn't and it wasn't in the first (approved) application to them. Isn't that a material change?

For completeness, and in case you want to look at the pretty pictures, the numbers are (the postcode is RG2 6GP, but so is a lot of Green Park, and no help if it was not entered):

Reading: (http://planning.reading.gov.uk/fastweb_PL/search.asp?Results=none&ApplicationNumber=&AddressPrefix=Land+West+Of+Longwater+Avenue&Postcode=RG2+6GP&CaseOfficer=&ParishName=&AreaTeam=&WardMember=&Consultant=&DateReceivedStart=&DateReceivedEnd=&DateDecidedStart=&DateDecidedEnd=&Locality=&AgentName=&ApplicantName=&ShowDecided=&Decision_Made=&DecisionDescription=&Sort1=FullAddressPrefix&Sort2=DateReceived+DESC&Submit=Search) 141944 full, 171011, 171064, 171258 conditions, 150254, 171205 minor, 181123 new one but no details

West Berk (https://publicaccess.westberks.gov.uk/online-applications/)s: 14/03289/COMIND full, 18/00034/NONMAT new one - refused

Wokingham (https://planning.wokingham.gov.uk/FastWebPL/search.asp?Results=none&ApplicationNumber=%09181514&AddressPrefix=&Postcode=&KeywordSearch=&Submit=Search): 181514 only one, full


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 18, 2019, 20:13:13
As someone who has to deal with planning authorities all the time in my professional life, I normally have considerable sympathy with those whose plans get stuck in the mire of the planning system. However as this story unfolds I am beginning to question the way this has been dealt with.

Someone really should have settled the final design of this before going for planning in what is clearly a sensitive location, due to its unusual position in relation to the boundary between three different planning authorities. Perhaps this is why Tony Page has not been sounding off in the press - someone needs to explain

1  having got full permission - why have they gone back to change it?

2  If the change is essential  - why have they not made a new full application to West Berks in the nearly one year that has passed since West Berks decided that it was not a non-material change? That decision was made on 8 March 2018!

3  Why were the new applications to RBC and Wokingham made three and a half and two and a half months respectively after the West Berks application had already been determined? And why is the RBC application also undetermined?

You can view the documents on West Berks's planning website - the only thing missing is the covering letter accompanying the form and plan - which simply shows the old and new boundaries of the site.

Sorry - I've just had a "lightbulb moment!"

Just realised the answer to 2 above lies in the catchily named Town and Country Planning (General Permitted Development) Order 2015, Schedule 2 part 8 paragraph A2 - No planning permission is required for railway related development comprising alteration of a building or bridge unless
Quote
the external design or appearance would be materially affected
. This would probably override West Berks's guidance which requires a full application for moving any building. My guess is that someone pointed this out to West Berks after receiving the decision notice (which does not mention the permitted development rights), hence no further application! Someone should though have had a dialogue with the planning authority to flush this out first. This principle should also apply to the RBC element - and possibly Wokingham's too, as I do not think that a minor permitted change to a previously approved scheme would need a separate consent simply because it strays across a local government boundary, so it does not explain either the Wokingham application, nor the latest RBC one. What's going on here?

Something is odd here - there is a story to be told!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 18, 2019, 21:47:57
Sorry - there's another answer I can give - the access is development that does not require permission - it is noted on one of the plans lodged with Wokingham to this effect (see-http://publicaccess.wokingham.gov.uk/NorthgatePublicDocs/00419682.pdf)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 18, 2019, 23:53:56
Sorry - there's another answer I can give - the access is development that does not require permission - it is noted on one of the plans lodged with Wokingham to this effect (see-http://publicaccess.wokingham.gov.uk/NorthgatePublicDocs/00419682.pdf)

There is a lot more in the Planning Statement (http://publicaccess.wokingham.gov.uk/AniteIM.WebSearch/(S(cspit355pwpglzexcxa3g0at))/Download.aspx?ID=419674) (bottom of page 2 of the document list), which also refers to a full application to West Berks (that didn't some up in my search, nor as a related application, but is 18/01451/COMIND). It refers to the haul road:
Quote
3.3.5 The access road would be constructed to provide access to the compound to facilitate construction and therefore falls under Part 2 Class B of the GPDO 2015 which permits:
“The formation, laying out and construction of a means of access to a highway which is not a trunk road or a classified road, where that access is required in connection with development permitted by any Class in this Schedule (other than by Class A of this Part).”
3.3.6 The development of the access road for use during construction can therefore proceed under permitted development rights. This was confirmed in writing by West Berkshire Council during pre-application discussions in November 2017.

I'm not familiar with GPDO 2015, but while that might apply to planning per se (i.e. to what is permanently built), surely controls still apply to construction phase aspects and all the environmental issues? There is also a construction management plan, from Balfour Beatty, which doesn't inspire confidence (even if it is only "outline"). It says its preferred traffic route is solely from the A33 at Mereoak and via Kirtons Farm Road over the railway bridge:
Quote
It is assumed there is no constraint on Heavy Commercial Vehicles using the rail bridge carriageway as they will be accessing premises along that stretch of road.
There is a 7.5t weight limit on the bridge. Now, that isn't the bridge's fault - it was rebuilt by Network rail in 2015 to "full strength", whatever that is, and the old limit of 3t was raised only to 7.5t after the local residents (all six of them) said they didn't want their peace and quiet disturbed. Now that might be negotiable for this project - but you'd think they would have found out about it first.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on February 19, 2019, 00:15:28
Poking about in that new West Berks application's documents, there's an extension of the time limit for determination to 15/2/19. That was caused by arguments between all of them and the EA about flood risk, and whether the station is "essential transport infrastructure" and so can't just be put somewhere else.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 20, 2019, 00:02:50
Apologies all - having re-read the relevant paragraph of the GPDO, reproduced below, I missed a crucial element (shown in bold)-

Quote
Permitted development
A.  Development by railway undertakers on their operational land, required in connection with the movement of traffic by rail.

Development not permitted
A.1  Development is not permitted by Class A if it consists of or includes—

(a)the construction of a railway;
(b)the construction or erection of a hotel, railway station or bridge; or
(c)the construction or erection otherwise than wholly within a railway station of—
(i)an office, residential or educational building, or a building used for an industrial process, or
(ii)a car park, shop, restaurant, garage, petrol filling station or other building or structure provided under transport legislation.
Interpretation of Class A
A.2  For the purposes of Class A, references to the construction or erection of any building or structure include references to the reconstruction or alteration of a building or structure where its design or external appearance would be materially affected.


RBC is not a railway undertaker, so has to apply for planning permission.

Thanks Stuving for ferreting out the apparently missing West Berks application. Their website does indeed have all the relevant documentation and correspondence, and their closing date matches Wokingham's closing date for consultation. The "smoking gun" has been found!

The flood risk issue is very much a live one in the vicinity. The nearby major electricity and gas infrastructure facitilities had to be sandbagged by the armed forces twice in the winters of 2012/3 and 2013/4 to avoid large parts of Reading losing power from these installations being being flooded. The EA is currently reviewing its flood modelling in the area and this has caused delay in other planning applications including one that is at an appeal that has been adjourned twice since it started in September. The issue about piling putting the aquifer at risk is also understandable - the area east of the line was for many years "Smallmead Dump" - a refuse landfill for Reading.  It is a little surprising that it seems to be more difficult this time around, but the EA would no doubt claim (with some justification) that they have to deal with these matters with limited resources while continuing to discharge their day to day land drainage and flood defence responsibilities.

Let's hope we're near resolution of these issues - but my guess would be 2020 for opening at the earliest, not 2019.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on April 15, 2019, 21:45:05
Some good news - both West Berks and Wokingham Councils finally granted approval for the amended scheme on 28 March after a number of extensions to allow for EA input!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 24, 2019, 11:40:53
Looks like they have started.

Going by yesterday the undergrowth/jungle on the Up side has been attacked,


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 24, 2019, 11:46:24
Looks like they have started.

Going by yesterday the undergrowth/jungle on the Up side has been attacked,

Only ten years late, but hey-ho, a start is a start!  Unless that's just clearance for a ground survey of course!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: mjones on April 24, 2019, 12:19:54
They will be looking for newts and dormice.  It won't take long to find them, then they can stop work for another few years.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 24, 2019, 12:22:07
To be fair, it's only the Great Crested Dormouse that's a problem, other mice are fine.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on May 13, 2019, 22:24:43
I took a slight detour when walking around Green Park yesterday to look at the site of the Green Park station from the Kirtons Farm Road bridge to see if there has been any developments.

The answer is yes and no.

Yes, the ground work for the access road, parking, drop-off point etc. coming along.
No, nothing that will enable trains to stop.

I took some pictures and will try to share them tomorrow


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on May 14, 2019, 05:40:47
I took a slight detour when walking around Green Park yesterday to look at the site of the Green Park station from the Kirtons Farm Road bridge to see if there has been any developments.

The answer is yes and no.

Yes, the ground work for the access road, parking, drop-off point etc. coming along.
No, nothing that will enable trains to stop.

I took some pictures and will try to share them tomorrow

Sounds like good news; I would expect that the access road is needed first for site access, with platforms coming later.  It certainly worked like that for platform extensions that have happened within my observation in the last couple of years such as Melksham and Freshford.

Your first post!    Welcome to the forum - yes, please do add pictures and keep us updated; although there are a lot of members, we're thinly spread and it's really useful getting the Reading (and Green Park) view.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 14, 2019, 09:37:08
Thanks for the information, bradbrka - and welcome to the forum as contributor.

Sounds like good news; I would expect that the access road is needed first for site access, with platforms coming later.  It certainly worked like that for platform extensions that have happened within my observation in the last couple of years such as Melksham and Freshford.

There are two things that might be called an "access road". The road layout for the interchange, to the east of the railway, is the one thing that could start right after the planners' "bang". It's an extension of the housing site, and parts of it have been used as construction compound and parking. The other is the "haul road" in from the west (Cottage Lane). That has to be built before anything much else on the Up side stationwise.

There are also a few underground preliminaries that may not show a lot - slightly shifting a 33kV cable to the east of the line and an S&T route to the west. The big overhead cables (132kV) are staying, as are the buried 33kV ones and watercourses just outside the northern end of the station site - they are the reason it was extended to the south and so invaded Wokingham.

edit: recount volts


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on May 14, 2019, 15:07:14
The sunshine and the previous persuaded me to get the bike out and go down and have a look.

Waiting at the traffic lights to go over the bridge was almost squashed by a large dumper. Over the bridge there were some cones and on the corner of the road to the power station. Round the corner a large excavator making a start at digging out the "verge" on the railway (west) side. Presumably the start of the "haul road" that stuving mentioned.

Is there going to be any passenger vehicle access on that side when it is completed?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on May 14, 2019, 15:39:40
That's a good question, as the road in Green Park and the lane over the railway remain isolated from each other to prevent through traffic. It would make sense to have some access to at least drop people off on that side. There is the possibility that parking could occur on Kirton's Farm Road i guess.
This is the housing development happening right next to the station
https://www.berkeleygroup.co.uk/developments/berkshire/reading/bankside-gardens


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 14, 2019, 16:10:54
£515k for a 2-bed flat on the outskirts of Reading! Blimey!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 14, 2019, 18:34:16
That's a good question, as the road in Green Park and the lane over the railway remain isolated from each other to prevent through traffic. It would make sense to have some access to at least drop people off on that side. There is the possibility that parking could occur on Kirton's Farm Road i guess.

The only access will be via the interchange, and there will be no direct access to the Up platform apart from over the footbridge - not even for properly authorised newts. I presume the present works access in from Kirtons Farm Road will be reopened as part of Cycle Route 23 (currently diverted down Longwater Road), for pedestrians and bikes but not cars.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on May 15, 2019, 10:32:51
£515k for a 2-bed flat on the outskirts of Reading! Blimey!
Quite! There are a fair few people who are under the impression that crossrail is a brand new fast line to london fully underground all the way into the Thames Valley. Many estate agents appear to be selling it as such, and as a result housing prices reflect this.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/reading-named-the-best-place-for-first-time-buyers-in-the-uk-2019-89xtwqvlh

Hmm.
Not sure this is true for many from here in the first place.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 15, 2019, 10:40:27
Quite! There are a fair few people who are under the impression that crossrail is a brand new fast line to london fully underground all the way into the Thames Valley. Many estate agents appear to be selling it as such, and as a result housing prices reflect this.

Berkeley and their copywriting weasels have taken care to not say that - not quite:
Quote
    A vibrant new destination for Reading
    Uber-stylish waterfront apartments
    Concierge, co-working studio, residents' gym and cinema room
    Extensive landscaped gardens and parkland
    New train station to Reading and Crossrail in 6 minutes
    Reading to London Paddington in 26 minutes

I find their weasels' prose rather funny - I mean, what style to you associate with Uber? Would you like to live in (rather than just near) a "vibrant destination"? Some of the internal descriptions are even better ... I guess it is just possible I'm not in their target demographic.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on May 15, 2019, 18:48:38
I'm quite surprised that it being in Reading is even mentioned. Some developments just point out the journey time on the earliest train to london and that's it! It's as if there are no trains going anywhere else from here. Why wouldn't you let people know how long it takes to other places of potential work or leisure, Oxford, Basingstoke, Bath, the south coast, direct trains to three airports etc. Why not broaden the range of people your attempting to sell to? Or are london workers the only ones willing to pay that much to live in Reading? What a daft world.

Anyhow I'm still quite excited that a new station is opening in my town and the possibility of getting the train to watch the biccy men avoid relegation in the future.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: onthecushions on May 15, 2019, 18:56:18

Estate agents once told me that they advertise "living at Reading" rather than "living in Reading"!

A Deo et Regina,

OTC


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on May 16, 2019, 16:37:36

Estate agents once told me that they advertise "living at Reading" rather than "living in Reading"!

A Deo et Regina,

OTC
Sic Transit Gloria Swanson.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on May 29, 2019, 22:32:56
I took a slight detour when walking around Green Park yesterday to look at the site of the Green Park station from the Kirtons Farm Road bridge to see if there has been any developments.

The answer is yes and no.

Yes, the ground work for the access road, parking, drop-off point etc. coming along.
No, nothing that will enable trains to stop.

I took some pictures and will try to share them tomorrow

The pictures I took didn't come out to well so I went back this weekend to have another try.

The 3 views from Kirtons Farm Lane bridge are below, all looking north towards Reading.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on May 30, 2019, 21:51:58
Hmm - not much work on the station itself yet..........


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on June 07, 2019, 13:10:00
Now pushed back to summer 2020, allegedly

https://www.reading.co.uk/green-park-railway-station-application-submitted/


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 07, 2019, 18:59:10
I do find the name Reading Green Park a little strange as it's not as if you could quickly get to the town centre. Reading West is valid but it's not Reading Tilehurst or Reading Earley. If it was a parkway type station like Bristol Parkway then perhaps the name would be valid. I only learnt recently that Parkway is the name of the M32 into Bristol and I guess that the term meaning car parking was simply adopted for other locations.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on June 07, 2019, 19:11:58
I have previously suggested "Mad Stad"........


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on June 07, 2019, 21:23:01
I do find the name Reading Green Park a little strange as it's not as if you could quickly get to the town centre. Reading West is valid but it's not Reading Tilehurst or Reading Earley. If it was a parkway type station like Bristol Parkway then perhaps the name would be valid. I only learnt recently that Parkway is the name of the M32 into Bristol and I guess that the term meaning car parking was simply adopted for other locations.

It would be even stranger if it was just "Green Park". No, not that one - nor the other one either. It's the one near ... well, Reading, as there it isn't really near to a place with a name other than that. And it's not that close to the stadium.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 08, 2019, 14:28:18
I can't see people getting confused with which Green Park it is, and after all is the name of the place, albeit a made up one. I think it would be potentially more misleading if people left the train here expecting to change to another train or find the town centre. Perhaps if Reading (general) station had a second name it might be more appropriate to prefix with the town's name. Perhaps it's time to revive General.
 
There is the traditional railway method of adding the county name in brackets similar to Bramley (Hants) two stops down, or use the arrangement like the Southern oddity of London Road (Guildford).

I have certainly seen people leave trains at Reading West expecting to change trains but at least the town centre is in sight for those who alighted there to reach the town centre.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on June 08, 2019, 18:04:26
There have already been incorrect links from Reading Green Park to the Green Park in London. I don't know how the development came to be called Green Park. The one slightly north is Kennet Island which is vaguely understandable, not an island but within sight of the Kennet. Certainly better than the concept of Didcot on Thames.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 08, 2019, 18:55:23
You would have to be pretty naive with maps to confuse this one with a tube station and park in london but I guess people following technology rather than common sense leads to these problems and others must just find it difficult. When I drove buses to Loddon Bridge park and ride from the town centre I encountered a handful of people expecting to go to london in the 3 years I was on it, some seemed fairly well educated types too.

There appears to be a lot of naming places for the benefit of search engines. The annoyingly vague Thames Valley Park in east Reading began the trend before the internet came along. It has been joined by Thames Valley Science Park south of the town now to add further confusion. A names such as Reading Gate, Reading Gateway, Reading No.1 and Reading International Business Park hardly inspire. Reading Borough Council seem to prefer brand new buzz type names for suburbs and areas rather than the historical reference points. Smallmead or Pingewood would be more appropriate names for this Green Park station and the development but I guess they don't inspire the global thinking types.
How about Green Park Village for the station? That's the name of the housing area next to it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: didcotdean on June 08, 2019, 20:38:07
How about Green Park Village for the station? That's the name of the housing area next to it.
There is the precedent of Bicester Village :)

Great Western Park in Didcot/Harwell is another example of a somewhat misleading development name. Used to be widely advertised as five minutes from Didcot Parkway - well it might be on the southern flank to the station by car or bus but is more than a mile across and much more remote and difficult to walk or cycle from than this suggests. The developers wanted the main road through it to be called Great Western Way (or possibly Avenue) but this was refused as there is already a Great Western Drive in Didcot.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 08, 2019, 21:43:08
Isn't the pub called The Station or something?

I think Green Park's name was perhaps trying to pull at environmental strings upon it's naming. Green it is in colour with plenty of trees, but it has clearly been built for the motor car. Several different bus routes have to serve separate areas of it because of layout. and some of the bus stops don't even have pavement running to them. A previous transport manager at Reading Transport in the early 2000's told me he once went to seminar that had a talk on planning for public transport in housing and work areas. They put up a map on a screen to demonstrate an example of poor planning for bus routes and, although not labelled, he immediately recognised it as Green Park, and that was in it's early days!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on June 08, 2019, 22:08:35
I think Green Park's name was perhaps trying to pull at environmental strings upon it's naming. Green it is in colour with plenty of trees, but it has clearly been built for the motor car. Several different bus routes have to serve separate areas of it because of layout. and some of the bus stops don't even have pavement running to them. A previous transport manager at Reading Transport in the early 2000's told me he once went to seminar that had a talk on planning for public transport in housing and work areas. They put up a map on a screen to demonstrate an example of poor planning for bus routes and, although not labelled, he immediately recognised it as Green Park, and that was in it's early days!

There's that big whirly thing too.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: GBM on June 09, 2019, 09:58:19

.... or use the arrangement like the Southern oddity of London Road (Guildford).

There is a London Road, which is the next stop to Brighton, on the Brighton to Lewes Southern line


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on June 09, 2019, 18:41:29
Quote
Reading Borough Council seem to prefer brand new buzz type names for suburbs and areas rather than the historical reference points.

Not just Reading to be fair. Remember the "Thames Gateway"? I have also been involved professionally with "Gateways" elsewhere - the term was very much in vogue 10 years ago. Sadly marketing folk like names like these  - there was a time when everyone had to have "Science" or "Technology" in the name of a business park, while "Green" and "Eco" have been more popular recently, and "Garden" is currently favoured. So let's (not) have "Reading Green Technology Gateway Garden Park"!!

As my Mad Stad idea has fallen flat, I'm for Smallmead or Pingewood, or for the unadventurous "South Reading" (or South Reading for Green Park and Madejski Stadium)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: ellendune on June 09, 2019, 20:17:40
Quote
Reading Borough Council seem to prefer brand new buzz type names for suburbs and areas rather than the historical reference points.

Not just Reading to be fair. Remember the "Thames Gateway"? I have also been involved professionally with "Gateways" elsewhere - the term was very much in vogue 10 years ago. Sadly marketing folk like names like these  - there was a time when everyone had to have "Science" or "Technology" in the name of a business park, while "Green" and "Eco" have been more popular recently, and "Garden" is currently favoured. So let's (not) have "Reading Green Technology Gateway Garden Park"!!

As my Mad Stad idea has fallen flat, I'm for Smallmead or Pingewood, or for the unadventurous "South Reading" (or South Reading for Green Park and Madejski Stadium)

Glad you said South Reading as Reading South has been used before!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 09, 2019, 21:22:54
Only oddly it wasn't south it was southern. South of General perhaps.
Were those stations on the Great Central main line with Central in the title closer to the middle of the towns than there counterparts? Or was it stating the rail line it was on? Parkway means car parking but the name appeared from Bristol Parkway which is named after a road. Different rail companies had different ideas about naming, and that still seems to be the case even with a national network.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on June 10, 2019, 06:59:12
And possibly yet to come, Grazeley Garden Village, proposal currently somewhere in central government probably stuck behind a Brexit logjam.

They want a new station on the Reading - Basingstoke line, or if all else fails move Mortimer station ( a somewhat inflammatory proposal methinks). Details can be found if you rummage on the Wokingham BC website.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on June 10, 2019, 09:32:12
Only oddly it wasn't south it was southern.

Not odd - it had been Reading Southern from 1923 when the company name changed from South Eastern, but that wasn't part of the official name. Its owners called it "Reading", as did GWR theirs, and as happened quite generally. People added the company name so they could tell them apart.

On nationalisation, the companies disappeared, but something now had to be included in the station name so BR could distinguish them. Apparently, at Reading they went for General and South, changing back (in a sense) to Southern in 1961 - no doubt because South suggests something in the south of the town ... though probably not as far out as Green Park.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on June 10, 2019, 10:52:02
Only oddly it wasn't south it was southern.

Not odd - it had been Reading Southern from 1923 when the company name changed from South Eastern, but that wasn't part of the official name. Its owners called it "Reading", as did GWR theirs, and as happened quite generally. People added the company name so they could tell them apart.

To this day, you have "Wigan North Western" from London North Western Railway - that's the company that operated it until the end of 1922.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on June 10, 2019, 12:05:41
Reading Great Western? Nice ring to it

When I was young I was always fascinated by the intriguing station names when I visited General and heard announcements (I applied for the announcers job in the early 90's an announced the Hereford train across the station as part of the interview).
Magical sounding places like Worcester Shrub Hill, Worcester Foregate Street, Birmingham New Street,Liverpool Lime Street, Manchester Piccadilly even Dorking Depedene. Bristol Temple Meads was the most exciting name, the pictures created in a young mind. All Reading ever got was General in brackets and by the time I came along this was dropped as well. It still appeared on some signs when I was young and was what my dad referred to the station as.

Cheers


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on June 11, 2019, 11:16:43
I’m a bit confused now...   ???

What was the planning application for that was reported (by eightonedee in post 62) to have been approved in March?  I thought that and the previously discussed applications had already been for a “station”?

From Reading planning site:
“190858
Site Address:   Green Park Station
Description:   Construction of a building comprising ticket hall, public conveniences, staff facilities and ancillary retail provision to serve the proposed Green Park railway station development, including associated signage...”

So is this definitely just a building?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on June 11, 2019, 12:38:26
Yes, I believe this 'new' application was for the station building rather than the actual station


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on June 11, 2019, 15:01:13
Yes, I believe this 'new' application was for the station building rather than the actual station

The last complete planning approval in 2015 was for the interchange, multi-storey car park, and an unmanned station. That has now lapsed, the station had to be moved south and extended south, and the the station is now include booking office other passenger and staff facilities. The shift over the borough boundary meant Wokingham had to be involved too, and that station application covered a redesign of the interchange too, but omitted the building itself.

I think they wanted to avoid involving Wokingham in this one for the station building, on the grounds it could only add difficulties. Oddly, the new application says "the location of the proposed station building was shown indicatively on the approved drawings for the original applications", but all I can see is some cycle parking and ticket machines.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on June 11, 2019, 19:55:01

There's that big whirly thing too.

That's the one that generated £100,000 worth of electricity, and £130,000 worth of subsidies in 2011.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 11, 2019, 17:37:52
Went by the site Reading Green Park (RGP?) last Saturday. Have definitely got access and cleared a "platform length" next to the track on the Up side.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 06, 2019, 09:31:44
I note that from December provisional Green Park (RGP (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RGP/2019/12/18/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt)) timings have been included in readiness




Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on August 06, 2019, 10:04:26
I note that from December provisional Green Park (RGP (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RGP/2019/12/18/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt)) timings have been included in readiness

That looks minor, but involves a big operational change - a third unit throughout the day on the Reading-Basingstoke shuttle.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 06, 2019, 10:07:15
Which should improve timekeeping significantly as there will be substantial layover times.  Providing the crew can be found!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 06, 2019, 10:43:37
Appears to be an increase in the peak time frequency as well utilising a 4th unit


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on August 06, 2019, 12:50:50
Well they are going to have to pull their finger out if there is going to be station.
I was down on the bridge overlooking the site last week. They have cleared, some weeks ago, some of the undergrowth where the Up platform would be. There appeared to be somebody in the bushes doing some wiring/cabling.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 06, 2019, 13:29:45
As with Worcestershire Parkway the timings will be in the system for as and when the station opens and in the meantime there will be a little sitting about waiting time at Mortimer, Reading West or Southcote Junction.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 13, 2019, 17:40:51
Progress has been, shall we say, non-existent as evident by this picture from today

(https://i.ibb.co/S6515JJ/20190813-081146.jpg) (https://ibb.co/NFtkt77)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on September 15, 2019, 20:21:49

Another month passes, and little sign of on-site works, but the haul road is now in-


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 05, 2019, 19:23:17
The haul road is definitely tarmaced!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 05, 2019, 20:54:39
Haul Road picture now added to previous post! ::)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 06, 2019, 09:39:04
Timings for Reading Green Park now included in the schedules:

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RGP/2019/12/16/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

Though I’d be surprised if it’s ready for trains to stop during the validity of the December 2019 timetable.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Adelante_CCT on October 07, 2019, 15:19:31
Timings for Reading Green Park now included in the schedules:

As they were in August...

I note that from December provisional Green Park (RGP (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RGP/2019/12/18/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt)) timings have been included in readiness


Do keep up II  ;D


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 07, 2019, 18:17:16
 :P


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on December 30, 2019, 07:21:54
Had a look at progress (?) at Reading Green Park yesterday. There is now a tarmaced surface parallel to where the Up platform would be. The current weather highlights a large ditch/drainage channel between the tarmac and the rail tracks. The dry bit next to the tracks appears not to be wide enough for a platform. Interesting to see what they do; place the platform (on piles) over the ditch or re-arrange the drainage which could be interesting in an area with a high water table and liable to flooding.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 30, 2019, 20:03:16
Had a look at progress (?) at Reading Green Park yesterday. There is now a tarmaced surface parallel to where the Up platform would be. The current weather highlights a large ditch/drainage channel between the tarmac and the rail tracks. The dry bit next to the tracks appears not to be wide enough for a platform. Interesting to see what they do; place the platform (on piles) over the ditch or re-arrange the drainage which could be interesting in an area with a high water table and liable to flooding.

According to the plans...there is enough room for the platform, but not for the footbridge. So part of the drainage ditch will be diverted a bit to the west to go round that. However, the whole ditch will be lined, presumably to protect the foundations of the platform, and that might narrow it a bit from its current width.

I think the platforms are shown as a bit over 3 m wide, but it's hard to say since the drawings submitted to planing are undimensioned. I find this odd - indeed, baffling.

Now, when I first had to do with technical drawing, our drawing sheets had scale bars printed along the edge. They could be used to set off dividers or compasses, or to read off dimensions from dividers - all very traditional. That would still work on a scale print, whereas using a ruler was only easy on an original or full-scale copy, and only possible on a scale print if the (usually reduction) factor was known. But scale prints were very rare, since the photographic processes need to do them were difficult and expensive. Most copies were taken by contact (diazo prints), so were always full scale.

Now, full-scale paper prints are very rare, and most drawing and looking is done on screens. But to read dimensions you need to have the drawing on a professional drawing system of the right kind. Anything printed off (even on imaginary paper) is scaled by an unknown factor, at least by the time it gets onto your screen. But this is exactly what scale bars were for - so why have they now completely disappeared?

If what planning gets are just the PDFs we can see, they are not really plans at all - they are undimensioned, so no more than sketches. Why is that allowed?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: onthecushions on December 30, 2019, 20:20:37

March 25 2020 will mark 11 full years of posts under this heading, competing closely with the Tavistock extension for procrastination.

This area of "Green Park" is developed on an extremely low density and doesn't look able to support an unstaffed halt let alone that proposed.

In view of the flood plain siting and the near loss of the nearby electricity sub-station to Davey Jones, I think the station would be better run by the RNLI.

The clue is in the road's name - Longwater.

OTC


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on December 30, 2019, 20:36:09
To answer Stuving (as a non-architect but who sees lots of plans at work) the drawings are produced so that if they are printing without reduction on a specified standard paper size they will be to scale. The scale (and usually the page size at which they should be printed) normally appears in the title block, conventionally in the bottom left of the drawing.

These days drawings are often produced as part of a system known as BIM, an integrated IT system for capturing all the information about a project which those who I believe now much more than I do is revolutionising the construction process, at least at the scale of single buildings.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: BBM on December 30, 2019, 21:38:11
March 25 2020 will mark 11 full years of posts under this heading, competing closely with the Tavistock extension for procrastination.

The equivalent thread on the Hob Nob Reading FC fan forum has been going for even longer:

https://hobnob.royals.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=61077 (https://hobnob.royals.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=61077)

The first post there (dated 05/05/2007) says:

Quote
Anybody who travels on the Reading to Basingstoke line seen any signs of work starting.The GP website says it will be ready for 2008.Surely this means that work must have started on site?

I'm fed up of using the station shuttle.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: SandTEngineer on December 30, 2019, 21:43:10
To answer Stuving (as a non-architect but who sees lots of plans at work) the drawings are produced so that if they are printing without reduction on a specified standard paper size they will be to scale. The scale (and usually the page size at which they should be printed) normally appears in the title block, conventionally in the bottom left of the drawing.

These days drawings are often produced as part of a system known as BIM, an integrated IT system for capturing all the information about a project which those who I believe now much more than I do is revolutionising the construction process, at least at the scale of single buildings.

I've seen BIM used (although I thought it was BIMS) whilst at ATKINS and it seems to be a very good system, but needs a very good plotter/printer to work properly.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 30, 2019, 22:41:57
To answer Stuving (as a non-architect but who sees lots of plans at work) the drawings are produced so that if they are printing without reduction on a specified standard paper size they will be to scale. The scale (and usually the page size at which they should be printed) normally appears in the title block, conventionally in the bottom left of the drawing.

These days drawings are often produced as part of a system known as BIM, an integrated IT system for capturing all the information about a project which those who I believe now much more than I do is revolutionising the construction process, at least at the scale of single buildings.

Exactly. Just the point I was making. The drawing I was looking at had a box at the bottom right corner saying "A1 scale  1:500", so if I had an A1 print from its originating system, correctly formatted for the printer, I could take dimensions off it. If I had it on screen on its originating CAD/CAE system the software could do that for me. But with a print on some other size of paper, which in turn is viewed on a PC screen, I'd need to find the A1 sheet corner marks, measure them and some other dimensions off the screen, and do some sums to get anywhere. And those corner marks are not always printed - note that the drawing scale is in terms of the full sheet size, not the drawing frame.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: ellendune on December 30, 2019, 23:08:40
Exactly. Just the point I was making. The drawing I was looking at had a box at the bottom right corner saying "A1 scale  1:500", so if I had an A1 print from its originating system, correctly formatted for the printer, I could take dimensions off it. If I had it on screen on its originating CAD/CAE system the software could do that for me. But with a print on some other size of paper, which in turn is viewed on a PC screen, I'd need to find the A1 sheet corner marks, measure them and some other dimensions off the screen, and do some sums to get anywhere. And those corner marks are not always printed - note that the drawing scale is in terms of the full sheet size, not the drawing frame.

Scaling of a drawing!
In my career there has always been a specific instruction not to scale dimensions from the drawing as that leads to error.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 30, 2019, 23:15:19
Exactly. Just the point I was making. The drawing I was looking at had a box at the bottom right corner saying "A1 scale  1:500", so if I had an A1 print from its originating system, correctly formatted for the printer, I could take dimensions off it. If I had it on screen on its originating CAD/CAE system the software could do that for me. But with a print on some other size of paper, which in turn is viewed on a PC screen, I'd need to find the A1 sheet corner marks, measure them and some other dimensions off the screen, and do some sums to get anywhere. And those corner marks are not always printed - note that the drawing scale is in terms of the full sheet size, not the drawing frame.

Scaling of a drawing!
In my career there has always been a specific instruction not to scale dimensions from the drawing as that leads to error.

In your career, yes. But otherwise? I wasn't thinking of going down to the site and doing a bit of freelance building. I just wanted to read the drawing as a drawing rether than look at it as a sketch and say "I wonder how wide that platform is going to be - if I had a drawing it would tell me, accurately enough".


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: lordgoata on December 31, 2019, 14:43:58
I've seen BIM used (although I thought it was BIMS) whilst at ATKINS and it seems to be a very good system, but needs a very good plotter/printer to work properly.

BIM = Building Information Modeling. I guess S could = System? :-) I've always known it as BIM.

Best use I saw was combined with A/R = when the device was waved around infront of the wall, you could see all the utilties behind it on the screen, very impressive - I think it was on a documentary about Crossrail stations actually.

I know we get a lot of requests for BIM data at work - anything from cable trays/racking through to valve and actuator data, but I've never really seen how that resulting data is used.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on January 13, 2020, 21:36:55
Meanwhile, back at Green Park, this was the situation yesterday (Sunday).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on March 15, 2020, 08:11:42
More visible progress on the Up side of Reading Green Park yesterday (14/3)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on March 16, 2020, 17:23:17
I passed the site today and plenty of activity on both sides of the line. It's starting to get exciting. I can still see Kirton's Farm Road/Berry Lane becoming unofficial parking for this Station, and wonder whether they will have to consider pavements along those roads.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 19, 2020, 15:18:10
My daily exercise has taken me down to Green Park. There is now a line piles along the Up side. To my untutored eye it would suggest the line of the rear pf the platform.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on May 12, 2020, 15:14:23
Sitrep - 12/05/20

The Smallmead bridge end there are now three rows of piles on the Up side. Two rows in the middle a gap and two rows the far end. In the middle there is an array of piles suggesting a building or similar. On the Down side some cones and a theodolite/total station.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 12, 2020, 19:43:58
There's been more planning stuff going on since last reported - and it's not finished yet. This is the site history (only since 2018):
Quote
Construction of a building comprising ticket hall, public conveniences, staff facilities and ancillary retail provision to serve the proposed Green Park Railway station development including associated signage.
Ref. No: 19/01468/FUL | Status: Approved

Out of district consultation: Construction of a building comprising ticket hall, public conveniences, staff facilities and ancillary retail provision to serve the proposed Green Park Railway station development including associated signage.
Ref. No: 19/01506/OOD | Status: No Comment

Application for approval of details reserved by conditions 3 - Materials, 6 - Remediation Strategy (partial discharge), 7 - SuDS, 9 - Piling, 10 - Floor Levels, 13 - Site clearance outside breeding season, 14 -Compensatory flood plain storage and 15 - Ditch diversion method statement, of planning permission reference 18/01451/COMIND.
Ref. No: 19/02327/COND1 | Status: Part Approved, Part Refused

Application for approval of details reserved by condition (14) Compensatory flood plain storage of approved 18/01451/COMIND - Relocation and extension to the approved railway platforms together with the relocation of approved railway footbridge and relocation of the approved ditch diversion works at land east of Cottage Lane, Reading.
Ref. No: 20/00244/COND2 | Status: Refused

Application for approval of details reserved by Conditions (6) Remediation strategy and (9) Piling of approved 18/01451/COMIND - Relocation and extension to the approved railway platforms together with the relocation of approved railway footbridge and relocation of the approved ditch diversion works at land east of Cottage Lane, Reading.
Ref. No: 20/00879/COND3 | Status: Pending Consideration

Approval of details reserved by Conditions (3) Ecology, (5) Piling, (6) Remediation Strategy, (7) SuDS, (8) Drainage Plans and (9) Materials of Approved Application 19/01468/FUL
Ref. No: 20/00896/COND1 | Status: Pending Consideration

There should indeed be several rows of piles, of at least two kinds, for the platform and the (ca. 40 m long) shelter behind it. Behind that, the diverted ditch should have been the first thing built. There is also the footbridge towards the north end of the shelter which will needs its own piles.

Oddly, the plans still show a shelter on the down side too, not the station building which was proposed later.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Phil on August 03, 2020, 15:36:26
What's the latest on this, good people? I was due to go to a conference in April this year which Reading Green Park would have been dead handy to get to, but by the time I uncrossed my fingers that the station would be ready in time for me to use it, the conference itself got banjaxed for obvious reasons. The conference is however hopefully going ahead NEXT April - but will the station be open by then? Has work recommenced yet?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on August 03, 2020, 19:38:39
I have been by in the last few weeks. Piling appears to be finished, and there appears to be no signs of life on the Network Rail side of the fence. On the Down side the developers (?) appear to have completed the turning circle and drop off, and some car parking (if I interpret the tarmac correctly).

Certainly don't get the impression that anybody is busting a gut to finish it. Does the next stage require a possession?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 04, 2020, 22:41:50
It should be open by next spring I’d have thought.  I wouldn’t expect there to be any great need for it at the moment, with conferences not happening, hardly anyone staying in the hotels, empty offices and a football ground not allowing spectators.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bobm on August 10, 2020, 17:58:15
Latest views of the station site today.

(http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgreen1.jpg)

(http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgreen2.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on August 10, 2020, 18:46:33
Well, I can see why it's going to be delayed. They've done all the planting but those piles won't grow in this weather, and unless they water them they will just wither and die.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on September 20, 2020, 13:15:55
First visit to the site for 6 months today. Some progress made - but the buddleia is growing faster...


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bobm on September 20, 2020, 13:31:15
I had to cut a few bits back to get my photos!  Probably encouraged it to sprout more!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on September 20, 2020, 18:13:15
Presumably those rebar panels will form an accurate height flat slab above each set of piles, and then some prefabricated standard platform sections will arrive and be craned into place?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 20, 2020, 18:35:00
Presumably those rebar panels will form an accurate height flat slab above each set of piles, and then some prefabricated standard platform sections will arrive and be craned into place?

And probably quite quickly.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 08, 2020, 07:00:19
Had a look this week.

Piles on the Up side all appear to have concrete "plinths" (platform bases?) around them. The one nearest the bridge/Mortimer has two courses of blocks on it.

Not quite the same progress on the Down side. Still appears to be some earth moving going on at the Reading end, not sure whether that is related to the station or the adjacent building.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 14, 2020, 18:31:04
Well, there's one thing Coronavirus does deliver - the instant excuse! - see - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-54526010.

So it's unlikely that we'll see much progress over the winter.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 15, 2020, 06:46:44
Will Tony Page still be lead for transport and planning when it opens? His seat is up for re-election next May.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on October 15, 2020, 10:29:21
I do hope so. He means well but a fair few projects aren?t really thought through enough. Closing Station hill to buses without no alternative terminus and waiting area for buses has done nothing but stifle public transport, especially north of the river.  The MRT plans leave a lot to be desired by avoiding populated areas and simply aiming transport at those who arrive by car rather than moving the population around the urban area.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on October 15, 2020, 15:20:02
Will there be escalators at Green Park, as suggested here  (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/delays-opening-readings-green-park-19107853)by the Get Reading news website?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on October 15, 2020, 15:36:25
Will there be escalators at Green Park, as suggested here  (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/delays-opening-readings-green-park-19107853)by the Get Reading news website?
I doubt it. That is a stock photo of a london underground escalator from a news website that employs journalists who probably think that Reading is in London, or that the Green Park discussed is the one in London
Seriously, does nobody notice the green countryside between Reading and London anymore?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on October 15, 2020, 16:14:29
My tongue was in my cheek when I asked! It's the same news website that from time to time lists "Reading's most expensive Street" or "Reading's most sought-after road" and then cites Shiplake or Wargrave.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyN on October 15, 2020, 16:55:35
The picture with the esculators is an artists impression of the Reading underground line 1 platforms when they open in 2050


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on October 15, 2020, 17:06:28
My tongue was in my cheek when I asked! It's the same news website that from time lists "Reading's most expensive Street" or "Reading's most sought-after road" and then cites Shiplake or Wargrave.
Then, depending on the type of news will write about Caversham like it?s a separate market town 10 miles away.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 15, 2020, 17:36:57
Will there be escalators at Green Park, as suggested here  (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/delays-opening-readings-green-park-19107853)by the Get Reading news website?
I doubt it. That is a stock photo of a london underground escalator from a news website that employs journalists who probably think that Reading is in London, or that the Green Park discussed is the one in London
Seriously, does nobody notice the green countryside between Reading and London anymore?

Why do you think it was chosen to illustrate "railway station", let alone "Reading Green Park railway station"? The caption suggests it was to illustrate "Covid-19". So you might ask what the aforesaid "journalists" imagine the construction labour force to be like ...


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on November 18, 2020, 13:41:07
According to BBC South Today today, the (best-case) finish date for construction of Green Park station is now late summer 2021.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on December 01, 2020, 15:11:19
Just done a circuit by Reading Green Park. Have got to the stage where they have something looking like platforms, the Basingstoke end. Generous clearance when a container train went through. How do they compare in width with passenger stock? To chilly to wait for a passenger train.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 01, 2020, 15:55:08
Just done a circuit by Reading Green Park. Have got to the stage where they have something looking like platforms, the Basingstoke end. Generous clearance when a container train went through. How do they compare in width with passenger stock? To chilly to wait for a passenger train.

Presumably each still needs its surface finished - overhanging copers plus asphalt - as well as a back fence and some canopy. I doubt there will be any solid back wall to the canopy to give shelter from the wind, though.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on December 02, 2020, 21:15:50
I?d expect a couple of those fairly standard looking bus shelter things, rather than canopies?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on December 02, 2020, 22:00:51
I?d expect a couple of those fairly standard looking bus shelter things, rather than canopies?

Paul

Canopies is what was in the planning application - remember this is being built by Reading Borough Council, not Network Rail.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on December 03, 2020, 12:04:08
I?d expect a couple of those fairly standard looking bus shelter things, rather than canopies?

Paul

Canopies is what was in the planning application - remember this is being built by Reading Borough Council, not Network Rail.
Oh right, not necessarily the usual stuff then.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on February 06, 2021, 15:50:41
Sitrep. Just done one of my circuits. It is now possible to stand behind the yellow line at the Reading end of the down plaform.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 21, 2021, 14:15:54
Hoping this works - a photo from Green Park this morning, taken when passing on lockdown-permitted business


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: MVR S&T on February 21, 2021, 21:23:45
onder if it will be ready for the great unlocking in May?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 21, 2021, 22:11:00
onder if it will be ready for the great unlocking in May?

I would think it unlikely looking at how advanced the work is.  It seems there are many hurdles to leap over even when construction is complete in order for a new station to be certified as ready for opening, so even if physically complete there's a good chance that will delay the opening. 


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on March 15, 2021, 07:23:11
The yellow line now extends half the length of the down platform.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on June 06, 2021, 14:32:26
When I drive from the A33 to the Burghfield Road I normally chose the road south of the M4 but last Sunday for the first time in two years or more I took the northern route past the station site. And today I walked a very muddy Cottage Lane from the canal that brought me out on the same road, close to the access for construction traffic.

Last Sunday I was startled by how close the industrial (or is it office) development had spread southward. And today I reflected that it could be quite a hike for some workers from the station - though I gather there has been talk of a cycle-hire scheme (and perhaps one for e-scooters???)

I understand that the final phase of the development includes a four-storey car park with 200 spaces. Presumably this will be within the Green Park site? Will there be access for vehicles from the northern route, making the station useful for park & riders?

The lakeside hotel to the south west of the station might also prove useful to station users.



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Hal on June 24, 2021, 09:52:36
https://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/politics/19394002.covid-brexit-cause-green-park-station-opening-delays/

Reading Chronicle reports that Green Park won't open till 2022. RBC blames Brexit and Covid for the delay.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Lee on June 24, 2021, 10:57:14
https://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/politics/19394002.covid-brexit-cause-green-park-station-opening-delays/

Reading Chronicle reports that Green Park won't open till 2022. RBC blames Brexit and Covid for the delay.

"Lee wont be over to the UK to annoy you all till 2022 - He blames Brexit and Covid for the delay"


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on June 24, 2021, 12:00:59
Quote
RBC‡(resolve)

Impossible, as most Reading Borough Council tax payers will tell you!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on June 25, 2021, 08:13:21
More specific from Berkshire Live (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/opening-new-reading-train-station-20890690)

Quote
A long anticipated new train station in Reading has hit further delays.

The opening of the Green Park Station has been pushed back by up to six months, after the combination of the coronavirus pandemic and Brexit compounded leading to delays to the project.

Transport bosses in Reading had hoped the station would be open by the end of 2021, but have revised that date, despite construction work continuing throughout the pandemic.

The station, which is near the Madejski Stadium, is now expected to be open to passengers sometime between April to June 2022, a Network Rail spokesman said.

Before the pandemic, the station had been scheduled to open in late 2020 but last October, Reading Borough Council's transport chief said it would be delayed until late summer 2021 “at the earliest” due to the pandemic.

It seems to be sliding at the same speed that time's passing.  Always just a month or two short of a year away?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on June 25, 2021, 10:06:11
Another local news article (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/opening-new-reading-train-station-20890690)

Posted only to query the photograph. Surely not Green Park? And no evidence of anything connected to railways.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on June 25, 2021, 10:34:14
Another local news article (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/opening-new-reading-train-station-20890690)

Posted only to query the photograph. Surely not Green Park? And no evidence of anything connected to railways.

Those are the houses on the east side of the "lake", so the picture is taken from close to the railway. The foreground might be the "transport hub" area in front of the station, or more likely the road leading into it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on June 25, 2021, 11:18:11
This link to the developer's website should help identify the viewpoint-

https://www.berkeleygroup.co.uk/developments/berkshire/reading/green-park-village;

So the race is still on - Green Park station opening, class 769s in regular service or Crossrail finished?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on June 25, 2021, 11:44:02
My apologies to Berkshire Live!  I hadn't realised that houses like that had been built so far south on the site.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on June 25, 2021, 15:24:41
Have just been down to Green Park station for the first time in a couple of months.

The yellow line now extends the full-length of the down platform, and the Reading-end third of the up platform. Steel work has been erected for what I take to be the station building on the down side, and for the stairs/lift on both sides. Some people working, but hardly the hive of activity of the developer's site.

The excavator in the newspaper photo was working on the station site when I was there.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 25, 2021, 09:26:16
Went down to Reading Green Park station yesterday.

The Up platform now has the yellow line along two thirds of the platform, but no other obvious differences from the previous report.

The Down platform appears to have completed the main steel work for the station building. Also looks as though the steel work is complete on the stairs/lift structure. Because of the angle of view from the road bridge it looks as though the Up platform stairs/lift structure will be close to the overhead grid lines, all an optical illusion I am sure.

On a slightly different but related topic. NCN23 (Reading to Basingstoke) has been restored to its original route from what is now Longwater Avenue along what used to be Smallmead Road to Kirtons Farm Road just before the slope up to the bridge over the railway. Nicely done, tarmac surface some temporary barriers on the south side along a drainage ditch, presumably some landscaping and tidying up to be done. Will be a convenient route to the completed station. Failed to check if the temporary route through Green Park maintenance site is still open.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on August 03, 2021, 12:51:55
Went down to Reading Green Park station yesterday.

The Up platform has the yellow line completed. It also looks as though the steel work is complete on the stairs/lift structure on the Up platform, together with the stairs. The bridge link is in place, so they presumably had a possession at some stage. The Down platform stairs were horizontal waiting to be installed.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 11, 2021, 07:04:10
More progress, slowly.

Fencing at the back of the platforms complete, platform lighting standards installed, blockwork (as in building blocks) started on station building. Not sure what the purpose of the path that has been created behind the platform fencing on the Up platform is for.

The big question: three holes have recently been cut and filled in the pavement of the road overbridge to the south of the station. Any ideas as to what for, as I can't see underneath. Future-proofing for OLE?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on October 11, 2021, 09:34:36
Trains are shown on RTT as stopping, but "Service stop unadvertised". That doesn't change on 13 December.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on October 11, 2021, 09:45:33
Not sure about the 3 filled holes but it could be related to the upcoming 16 week road closure detailed below.

Works Descriptions
Description
Balfour Beatty Road Closure AG

Location
200 mtrs either side of Railway bridge and on bridge deck RG2 6AT

Carriageway and construction of new footway


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Lee on October 11, 2021, 09:49:45
More progress, slowly.

Fencing at the back of the platforms complete, platform lighting standards installed, blockwork (as in building blocks) started on station building. Not sure what the purpose of the path that has been created behind the platform fencing on the Up platform is for.

I suspect it is to keep us guessing long enough as to what it is for that another 6 months will have flown by in RGPs plucky attempt to break the Guinness World Record for longest time taken to open a railway station.

Although quite how they expect to beat Porkway Partway's glorious ongoing endeavours is beyond me, and that's before North Filton Platform@Brabazon Sponsored by Viking River Cruises enters the fray.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 12, 2021, 07:10:08
Quote
Works Descriptions
Description
Balfour Beatty Road Closure AG

Location
200 mtrs either side of Railway bridge and on bridge deck RG2 6AT

Carriageway and construction of new footway

One.network suggests the closure is 25 Oct 2021 - 11 Feb 2022 from Wokingham BC with road closure and diversion. Despite having a No Entry symbol “No delays are likely” from West Berkshire Council. Nice to know that our local councils are fulfilling their duty of cooperation!

Thanks bradbrka, would be grateful for source and any more detail

Sid


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on October 12, 2021, 08:53:51
Quote
Works Descriptions
Description
Balfour Beatty Road Closure AG

Location
200 mtrs either side of Railway bridge and on bridge deck RG2 6AT

Carriageway and construction of new footway

One.network suggests the closure is 25 Oct 2021 - 11 Feb 2022 from Wokingham BC with road closure and diversion. Despite having a No Entry symbol “No delays are likely” from West Berkshire Council. Nice to know that our local councils are fulfilling their duty of cooperation!

Thanks bradbrka, would be grateful for source and any more detail

Sid

I found the advance notice signs as I walked past at the weekend so did some digging (not the holes on the bridge).

It's from the same source. The two councils have each added entries in slightly different places, the West Berks entry is on the bridge (the one with more detail behind it), the Wokingham one is on the approach at the point the road will be closed on the east side.

Probably a result of the road being on both sides of the council boundaries.



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 12, 2021, 09:30:34
It's from the same source. The two councils have each added entries in slightly different places, the West Berks entry is on the bridge (the one with more detail behind it), the Wokingham one is on the approach at the point the road will be closed on the east side.

Probably a result of the road being on both sides of the council boundaries.

If you look closely, the West Berks data entry is for the closure of the bridge only, and the Wokingham one is just for part of the diversion around that. Their description of the route even says that once you have gone along Pingewood Road South for 0.1 km "destination is on the left". That "destination" must be the borough boundary, and West Berks have not posted the rest of the route on their side.

There are a number of odd things about that. One of them is why Wokingham think that it's not allowed for them to advise a diversion through another LTA area. Why not? They should at least notify them, and if need be collaborate on the routing, but the route makes sense as a whole or not at all. Of course it's even odder for West Berks to promulgate a road closure with no diversion at all. Yes it will be obvious to the locals, who are most of the users of that road, but still.

Before that there is the the well-known fact that the northern side of that bridge is in Wokingham Borough. Now it is only one side, and if you go too far east or west you find yourself in West Berks or Reading. But you'd have thought the rules, followed as a matter of routine, would require both WBCs to do the formalities. Looking through the local paper back to 16th September, I can't find a published TRO notice from Wokingham BC.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 12, 2021, 17:55:36
Looking at the mapping data, the boundary mapped at 1:10,000 runs along the north side of the road. So the recent holes in the bridge are in Wokingham, but probably done by Network Rail?

The road has been a mess for a long time. The traffic lights don't work sensibly, warned by a yellow sign saying cyclists might be met in the middle of the road. The next road bridge south has proper sensors cctv/microwave and works very well.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 12, 2021, 18:23:01
Looking at the mapping data, the boundary mapped at 1:10,000 runs along the north side of the road. So the recent holes in the bridge are in Wokingham, but probably done by Network Rail?

Moved, has it? The parish boundary on which the West Berks/Wokingham boundary is based ran along the centre of the roadway, from 160 m east of the railway centreline to 100 m to the west. The modern boundary does the same, and for the eastern 100 m of that length there is another parish boundary, now the one between Wokingham and Reading, along the same road and defined as the traditional four feet from the (northern) hedge at the roots. Now the little bit of Wokingham (then of Shinfield parish) might be a true exclave, with a single boundary between West Berks and Reading along the road to its east. But that's not what the old maps show - there is a narrow strip of the Borough/parish connecting it to the main part, between the road's centreline and the "4 ft. RH" line to its north.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 13, 2021, 11:53:21
Not the best of maps, I am sure they could have the boundary line slightly thinner.

https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/election-maps/gb/?x=469596&y=170091&z=13&bnd1=UTA&bnd2=&labels=off (https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/election-maps/gb/?x=469596&y=170091&z=13&bnd1=UTA&bnd2=&labels=off)

As in the Boundary Line data I was looking at, it appears to run along the north side of the road.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 13, 2021, 12:57:34
Not the best of maps, I am sure they could have the boundary line slightly thinner.

https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/election-maps/gb/?x=469596&y=170091&z=13&bnd1=UTA&bnd2=&labels=off (https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/election-maps/gb/?x=469596&y=170091&z=13&bnd1=UTA&bnd2=&labels=off)

As in the Boundary Line data I was looking at, it appears to run along the north side of the road.

I guess it's fit for the purpose of defining boundaries. After all, the population (voting or other) of roadways is small - one of the reasons for drawing boundaries along them. But most old boundaries are still exactly where they were when they only crossed fields, and do now bisect houses and other buildings. The Reading/Wokingham boundary through the Whitknights campus and the housing to the south is a case in point. Why are they never tidied up just a little bit?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 13, 2021, 14:39:34
Quote
Why are they never tidied up just a little bit?

They are Stuving, but normally in a haphazard way, generally when there's an urban area spreading into an adjoining (different) county - for example Caversham became part of Reading Borough in (I think) the 1920s, and further bits have transferred since, such as Caversham Park Village, all transferred out of Oxfordshire. This is why you encounter a "Mapledurham" sign on the Woodcote Road before you leave Reading Borough. Someone at the Boundary Commission also decided more recently (1980s or 1990s I think) that Berkshire's boundary with Oxfordshire along the Thames should move to the middle of the river (except for some inexplicable reason a bit here in Streatley), and lucky Berkshire (our strictly I guess Slough Borough) was awarded all the land covered by Junction 4B of the M4 which used to be shared with neighbouring authorities.

It must be a great job at the Boundary Commission, spending your life looking at large scale OS maps pondering what minor local government boundary change you might recommend next!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 13, 2021, 14:57:58
Quote
Why are they never tidied up just a little bit?

They are Stuving, but normally in a haphazard way, generally when there's an urban area spreading into an adjoining (different) county - for example Caversham became part of Reading Borough in (I think) the 1920s, and further bits have transferred since, such as Caversham Park Village, all transferred out of Oxfordshire.
Ah, but I meant "a little bit" to be taken literally. Even its biggest detractors would not say that about Caversham. And where a significant amount a population is transferred, isn't it often done by the wardful? That leaves the boundary following a line drawn centuries ago for other purposes.

I suspect this really about the difficulty Emglish lawyers have always had in defining land boundaries in absolute terms. They always refer to something already there, even if it is something easy to dig up or demolish. An existing boundary offers the same illusory safety, combined with being able to say "it may be wrong, but it wasn't my mistake". So while it looks sensible to move an administrative boundary to between houses or along new property boundaries or features, no-one is volunteering to do it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on October 13, 2021, 15:20:09
I know this example is regularly trotted out for comparison, but in my defence I have to say that I first came across it in reality when I lived in Belgium and my wife and I went out for a drive one Sunday.

Search a large scale map for Baarle-Nassau or Baarle-Hertzog on the Belgium-Dutch border just north of Turnhout in Belgium, for example <https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Baarle-Nassau,+Netherlands/@51.4367821,4.8532009,12z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x47c6a5342570ab1d:0x808696d1e9939744!8m2!3d51.4451366!4d4.9295231>

There the exclaves have exclaves...!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 13, 2021, 22:34:39
Quote
I suspect this really about the difficulty Emglish lawyers have always had in defining land boundaries in absolute terms. They always refer to something already there, even if it is something easy to dig up or demolish. An existing boundary offers the same illusory safety, combined with being able to say "it may be wrong, but it wasn't my mistake". So while it looks sensible to move an administrative boundary to between houses or along new property boundaries or features, no-one is volunteering to do it.

Speaking as an English lawyer (and a property lawyer to boot), this is nothing to do with this. The problem we have with boundaries is a combination of the poor quality of old deed plans, the fact that title boundaries are now normally defined by reference to OS data at 1/1250 or 1/2500 (the thickness of line alone being 0.5m in the real world) where some of the underlying surevy data has been carried across many editions of the OS without detailed survey, recognised by what is known as the General Boundaries Rule, and the darker side of human nature, with a small proportion of humanity that either maliciously moves boundaries or suspects their neighbours wrongly of doing so.

The real problem is that features that are often used to mark boundaries like river and stream courses tend to move over time, and then thoughtless people do things like building roads and railways over them, resulting in the obliteration or diversion of the feature that used to be a clear parish boundary - which I expect is exactly what has happened at Kirton's Farm Road/Smallmead Bridge/the site of Green Park Station.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on October 14, 2021, 07:04:55
As I am sure eightonedee can tell us there is a vast amount of publications and case law on property boundaries. There is precious little on administrative boundaries, the last I can remember is by Booth (Public  Boundaries  and  Ordnance  Survey  1840-1980) which is forty years old.

David Andrews' article in Sheetlines https://www.charlesclosesociety.org/files/Issue103page31.pdf (https://www.charlesclosesociety.org/files/Issue103page31.pdf) suggests that there might not have been anything more recent from Ordnance Survey than An Illustrated Guide to Boundary Making, Ordnance Survey, 1986 (not seen).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Reading General on October 14, 2021, 08:47:04
Quote
Why are they never tidied up just a little bit?

They are Stuving, but normally in a haphazard way, generally when there's an urban area spreading into an adjoining (different) county - for example Caversham became part of Reading Borough in (I think) the 1920s, and further bits have transferred since, such as Caversham Park Village, all transferred out of Oxfordshire. This is why you encounter a "Mapledurham" sign on the Woodcote Road before you leave Reading Borough.
1974 was the last time the boundary was moved up in Caversham Heights I think, from where that sign is to the current one on Upper Woodcote Road. You may also notice that street lamps are not on the upper stretch either.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 17, 2021, 14:30:17
Meanwhile, back at the place where three unitary authority boundaries meet, this is what it looked like this morning-


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on October 22, 2021, 23:45:59
Went down to Reading Green Park station yesterday.

The Up platform has the yellow line completed. It also looks as though the steel work is complete on the stairs/lift structure on the Up platform, together with the stairs. The bridge link is in place, so they presumably had a possession at some stage. The Down platform stairs were horizontal waiting to be installed.

There was a longish media release on progress from RBC (https://media.reading.gov.uk/news/green-park-station-takes-shape) back in August, covering the craning of the bits of bridge, plus this aerial picture:
(https://cdn.prgloo.com/media/8db3623abf844639af80116717d6d26f?width=580&height=580)
This also has a date - June 2022 - which somehow sounds unambitious and likely to be missed at the same time. There is also now a project page (https://www.reading.gov.uk/transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/) with some documents on it, though nothing so useful as a link to the update.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on November 07, 2021, 15:39:43
Have just been down to Reading Green Park. Possibly the last chance to take a view of the station for 16 weeks, while a footpath is built up the road and over the bridge (better not to kill your passengers before they get to the station?).

Difficult to see much change from the bridge, but get the impression that they have installed some roofing panels on the station roof. Also appears to be some new tyre tracks from the station car park/dropping off point to the side of the road embankment. Presumably in preparation for the road works.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on November 14, 2021, 13:03:55
Being in the vicinity again this morning and (ahem!) not put off by the "No Unauthorised Persons" board that seemed to be the extent of the security on Searles Farm Lane, the temporary security barriers not extending across the road, I thought I would see if the road closure had stimulated an acceleration of the glacial rate of progress on this job.

Judge for yourselves.......


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on November 15, 2021, 06:56:33
Quote
glacial rate of progress

The road works are being carried out by the same contractors as are building the station. Did wonder if the 16 week closure was something that other contractors would do in two weeks. Or maybe the road works will overrun to 2022.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on November 21, 2021, 15:52:58
The progress in a week appears to be that they have flailed the hedges both sides of the road (which would probably take a competent agricultural contractor about an hour). The Green Park Village side of the works has been secured.

I have not seen any drawings of what is proposed. But if they intend to put a footpath next to the road I would think they are going to have to widen the embankment and take the hedges/trees out one side, not sure flailing first would help that. Although I must admit that you can see the kerbs both sides, probably for the first time in a decade or more.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on December 19, 2021, 21:04:57
I was in the vicinity again this morning, and thought I might walk up to Smallmead Bridge to get another photograph to show progress.

However Balfour Beatty clearly had other ideas - are they getting sensitive to people seeing how quickly the project is proceeding?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on December 20, 2021, 07:00:21
As far as I can make out, it isn't.

Been up during the week and there has been no sight or sound of work. Agreeably there used to be some of the large bore corrugated plastic tubing, used for cabling etc, visible by the bridge which was vanished in the last week.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightf48544 on January 05, 2022, 15:42:03
Browsing Open train times and Realtime trains around Reading area the other day I found a West of England train stopped at Southcote o let abasingotke Reading stopper in front. Finding  the stopper's  schedule on Real Time trains I was surprised to see it had a minutes stop at Green Park

Just like the famous signal in the Battle of the River Plate "Anticipation"

You can now search Real Time Time trains for Reading Green Park ~(RGP)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on January 05, 2022, 15:59:04

Just like the famous signal in the Battle of the River Plate "Anticipation"


I have that film recorded to watch again. This will be the first time I have seen the film since taking this picture

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51801510321_74d46fe7fc_c.jpg)

and I shall look out for it in its original position.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on January 05, 2022, 19:10:13
Browsing Open train times and Realtime trains around Reading area the other day I found a West of England train stopped at Southcote o let abasingotke Reading stopper in front. Finding  the stopper's  schedule on Real Time trains I was surprised to see it had a minutes stop at Green Park

Just like the famous signal in the Battle of the River Plate "Anticipation"

You can now search Real Time Time trains for Reading Green Park ~(RGP)
I think unadvertised calls at Reading Green Park have been showing in the RTT data since last summer. Looking back through the thread I see TonyK mentioned it in October.   It  might not have been in the stations drop down list though.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on January 06, 2022, 09:59:43
Browsing Open train times and Realtime trains around Reading area the other day I found a West of England train stopped at Southcote o let abasingotke Reading stopper in front. Finding  the stopper's  schedule on Real Time trains I was surprised to see it had a minutes stop at Green Park

Just like the famous signal in the Battle of the River Plate "Anticipation"

You can now search Real Time Time trains for Reading Green Park ~(RGP)
I think unadvertised calls at Reading Green Park have been showing in the RTT data since last summer. Looking back through the thread I see TonyK mentioned it in October.   It  might not have been in the stations drop down list though.

Paul

If you mean the drop down list in RTT, it is there, and appears on typing rea. The mnemonic is RGP. RTT shows a one-minute stop - is this actually happening as a test?

I watched the film last night, prompted by eightf's post above. The range finder wasn't obvious, except in one long shot. Now for Green Park - the anticipation must be high.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on January 06, 2022, 10:26:01
Browsing Open train times and Realtime trains around Reading area the other day I found a West of England train stopped at Southcote o let abasingotke Reading stopper in front. Finding  the stopper's  schedule on Real Time trains I was surprised to see it had a minutes stop at Green Park

Just like the famous signal in the Battle of the River Plate "Anticipation"

You can now search Real Time Time trains for Reading Green Park ~(RGP)
I think unadvertised calls at Reading Green Park have been showing in the RTT data since last summer. Looking back through the thread I see TonyK mentioned it in October.   It  might not have been in the stations drop down list though.

Paul

If you mean the drop down list in RTT, it is there, and appears on typing rea. The mnemonic is RGP. RTT shows a one-minute stop - is this actually happening as a test?

What I was trying to say was that at some time in the past it may have been appearing as a timing point on the line before it became selectable as a station.  I think I first saw it a while ago looking at the times for the proposed 3 tph stopper, but I agree it works exactly as you’d expect now.

Don’t know though if trains ever do test stops.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Oxonhutch on January 06, 2022, 13:30:54
The range finder wasn't obvious, except in one long shot.

From wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_River_Plate#Legacy) re the 1956 film:

Quote
Admiral Graf Spee (two turrets) was portrayed by the U.S. heavy cruiser USS Salem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Salem_(CA-139)) (three turrets).

So a different (or no) range finder.



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on January 06, 2022, 15:50:51
The range finder wasn't obvious, except in one long shot.

From wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_River_Plate) re the 1956 film:

Quote
Admiral Graf Spee (two turrets) was portrayed by the U.S. heavy cruiser USS Salem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Salem_(CA-139)) (three turrets).

So a different (or no) range finder.



USS Salem was listed in the opening credits, but there was one shot where I wondered if film of the real thing had been used in a long shot. It will be on again next Christmas, so I'll watch out. ;D
There is still a lot of the Graf Spee stuck in the middle of the Plate. Our ship had to go back out to sea from Montevideo then turn back to get to Buenos Aires without hitting it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: johnneyw on January 06, 2022, 18:49:29
The range finder wasn't obvious, except in one long shot.

From wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_River_Plate) re the 1956 film:

Quote
Admiral Graf Spee (two turrets) was portrayed by the U.S. heavy cruiser USS Salem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Salem_(CA-139)) (three turrets).

So a different (or no) range finder.



USS Salem was listed in the opening credits, but there was one shot where I wondered if film of the real thing had been used in a long shot. It will be on again next Christmas, so I'll watch out. ;D
There is still a lot of the Graf Spee stuck in the middle of the Plate. Our ship had to go back out to sea from Montevideo then turn back to get to Buenos Aires without hitting it.

I'm sure that I've got a Pressburger Powell box set somewhere, I'll have to see if The Battle of River Plate is amongst them.
I've read that attempts were made to raise the Graf Spee and restore it about 15 years ago as it was a shipping hazard.  Not sure how that went.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradshaw on January 06, 2022, 19:15:11
My father was an RAF technician who served on the Ajax from 1935 to her return from the Plate. We still have his collection of various contemporary images.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: RichT54 on January 07, 2022, 14:00:52
I haven't seen this (very short) video posted here before, shot while travelling through the station back in September 2021:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FrdlRL9fq8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FrdlRL9fq8)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on January 07, 2022, 18:52:23
The ghost of Jethro is probably working on a variation of his famous routine - "Trains don't stop Green Park yet"


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on January 07, 2022, 22:28:25
When were services supposed to start serving Reading Park?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on January 07, 2022, 22:37:26
When were services supposed to start serving Reading Park?

Supposed? When and by whom? And how - aren't we talking crystal balls here?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on January 08, 2022, 04:05:14
When were services supposed to start serving Reading Park?

Supposed? When and by whom? And how - aren't we talking crystal balls here?

From WikiWand (https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Reading_Green_Park_railway_station#/Suspension)

Quote
Plans were announced in July 2007 and approved by the Office of Rail Regulation in March 2009. Building was originally expected to begin in early 2009, and be completed in early 2010. However ...


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on January 08, 2022, 07:47:00
Thankyou Graham.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on January 29, 2022, 17:52:18
Being in the vicinity this morning, and using local knowledge gained in more than 40 years' birding at the nearby gravel pits ;), I was able to "circumvent" Balfour Beatty's "security" to bring you this progress report picture.

It is beginning to look like it might not be far away from being finished!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on January 30, 2022, 09:16:50
Thank you eightonedee. Went by yesterday, but can't really get detail on a Down Cross Country. Still intrigued as to what they are supposed to be doing to the road. Get the impression there is a "ramp" up to the road by the bridge?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 30, 2022, 10:41:02
What is the large building by the station going to be?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on January 30, 2022, 11:09:50
What is the large building by the station going to be?

The area of Green Park Village on the station side of the "lake" is called Bankside Gardens. That big block and the similar one behind it are identified as affordable housing.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on January 30, 2022, 20:30:28
Quote
Thank you eightonedee. Went by yesterday, but can't really get detail on a Down Cross Country. Still intrigued as to what they are supposed to be doing to the road. Get the impression there is a "ramp" up to the road by the bridge?

It looks like there will be a pedestrian access to Kirton's Farm Road, the one going over the Smallmead road bridge. It is a bit difficult to work out why it has been necessary to close the road for so long. There's a pavement being constructed over the bridge to connect to this ramp, but bearing in mind that this is a light-controlled single carriageway bridge, I would have though that there would have been sufficient working room to allow the bridge to continue in use, or at least only to close during working hours weekdays with the works safely behind construction fencing during the rest of the day and weekends.   


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on January 30, 2022, 22:06:50
Quote
Thank you eightonedee. Went by yesterday, but can't really get detail on a Down Cross Country. Still intrigued as to what they are supposed to be doing to the road. Get the impression there is a "ramp" up to the road by the bridge?

It looks like there will be a pedestrian access to Kirton's Farm Road, the one going over the Smallmead road bridge. It is a bit difficult to work out why it has been necessary to close the road for so long. There's a pavement being constructed over the bridge to connect to this ramp, but bearing in mind that this is a light-controlled single carriageway bridge, I would have though that there would have been sufficient working room to allow the bridge to continue in use, or at least only to close during working hours weekdays with the works safely behind construction fencing during the rest of the day and weekends.   

Presumably that is to provide step-free access to the Up platform. If the only access is via the footbridge and lifts, then if a lift is out of use the only step-free route goes via another station to swap sides. I would guess there's a strong preference for a better alternative - even a long and inconvenient path is better than using another station. Mind you, I can't find it mentioned in "Design standards for accessible railway stations: a code of practice by the Department for Transport and Transport Scotland" or "Station design principles for Network Rail".


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 25, 2022, 16:05:12
Some nice drone footage of the station, with supporting aerial photographs:

https://media.reading.gov.uk/news/breathtaking-aerial-footage-shows-latest-progress-on-green-park-station

Nice to see it finally nearing completion and the station building is much more beefier than I was expecting.  Looks like it'll tie in nicely with the completion of the other developments by the station.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on February 25, 2022, 18:16:42
Some nice drone footage of the station, with supporting aerial photographs:

https://media.reading.gov.uk/news/breathtaking-aerial-footage-shows-latest-progress-on-green-park-station

Nice to see it finally nearing completion and the station building is much more beefier than I was expecting.  Looks like it'll tie in nicely with the completion of the other developments by the station.
We generally seem to be getting far better construction quality with many of these new stations, at least compared to some of the rubbish that was normal in the 80s


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on February 26, 2022, 14:55:20
I was at Smallmead bridge again this morning - approaching via the route referred to in my last post, although the gate (moveable section of Herras fencing) was open.

When I arrived at the top of the bridge I was hailed by a jovial orange and yellow clad Balfour Beatty operative in a foreign accent. I explain I was just getting a photo (see below), and we fell into conversation.

He explained that he was Portuguese, born in Angola in the last days of colonial rule, his family returning "home" after periods in Mozambique and Venezuela in 1980. He came to the UK many years ago due to the lack of opportunity in Portugal and had worked for BB for many years. He was hoping to settle permanently, the problem being the cost of accommodation, so he was contemplating a move to South Wales.

When I queried the slowness of the project he was clear what the problem was. He said that his managers were angry and frustrated at the continual problem in obtaining the requisite permissions for works, then dealing with the continual cancellation of planned work by "the railways". He said that there was a problem with stress in his team, and his boss was suffering from depression.

Nonetheless, he expressed pride in the project, and his role in it, and in the contribution it would make to the local community. He regretted that he would not be there at the time the station would finally be open.

Here's a view through the Herras fencing today - the access from Searles Farm Lane that goes over the bridge will not be step free - there's now a newly constructed concrete staircase up to the bridge - or is this just a work access? 


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 26, 2022, 15:07:53
Lovely to hear about the background, ambitions and thoughts of what you and I just think of as another member of the 'orange army'.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: RichT54 on February 26, 2022, 16:37:07
The tops of the lift shafts make them look a bit like church towers, or parts of a castle.

Is this a one-off, or are there other stations with a similar style?



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on February 26, 2022, 21:37:07
Here's a view through the Herras fencing today - the access from Searles Farm Lane that goes over the bridge will not be step free - there's now a newly constructed concrete staircase up to the bridge - or is this just a work access? 
There’s a few still photos on the Reading council Flickr site showing the south end, I’d put my money on the two flights of steps, one each side, being emergency escape routes, either that or it’s one “up and down” escape route from the up platform… 

The link to the stills is immediately underneath the video image on the webpage posted by II yesterday:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/readingnewsimages/sets/72177720296874330/

Google Streetview does show an existing NR maintenance access gate at bridge level, but it was apparently behind the crash barrier when photographed.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on March 01, 2022, 14:53:09
Well the fences are down so I suppose the job is finished. At least the barrier on the bridge is done with Kee Klamps, which were originally made in Reading.

You might get the idea that I am not impressed. Silly me, I assumed they would have taken the opportunity to improve the road when it was closed for 16 weeks. The road is pretty much a death trap for cyclists. The road sensors have not been tuned to detect cyclists, your only "protection" is a sign which says "CAUTION CYCLISTS IN ROAD AHEAD". When I was there a Bentley came over the bridge at probably 30mph, would have been unsighted if I was coming up the hill, similarly I would have been unsighted of him. The only response in those situations is to leap for the hedge.

The next bridge south over the railway, on Pingewood Road South is very well protected by sensors and you can cycle over quite safely. Not sure why they couldn't have upgraded Kirtons Farm Lane the same, or even announced they had plans to when the budget was available.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: nickswift99 on March 02, 2022, 13:18:07
The Reading Post, one of the local newspapers has published an article and some photos of the station.

The article can be found at https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/gallery/readings-green-park-station-taking-23261322 (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/gallery/readings-green-park-station-taking-23261322)

Quote
New images and aerial footage show Reading's new £20m train station taking shape - and on track to open this summer.

Long-anticipated Green Park Station was due to open by the end of 2021 but the date was pushed back due to the Covid pandemic. Reading Borough Council says construction work, which began in spring 2019, is progressing well.

It has released stunning panoramic photos taken at sunset, showing the station as it nears completion. Drone footage of the site commissioned by the council from www.jsaerial.co.uk has also been shared.

The new station now has two 150m platforms, a new station building and a new overbridge, providing fully accessible access to both platforms via stairs and lifts.

Outside, there is a new bus interchange and cycle parking facilities along with two car parks, including 12 blue badge spaces and drop off areas

Over the coming weeks, work will continue on site to complete the final finishes to the station. This will include toilet facilities, accessible baby change, ticket vending machines and signs.

Green Park Station will sit on the Reading to Basingstoke line and will be served by a half-hourly service north to Reading and south to Basingstoke through the day. It will have two platforms with disabled access and a "multi-modal interchange" with a surface level car park, bus stops, taxi rank and cycle parking.

Construction work is being led by Reading Borough Council, with Green Park Station expected to be open for public use this summer. The council says that when complete, the new station will help to alleviate queues on the A33 by offering an "alternative sustainable mode of travel".

It said the station will significantly improve accessibility to the south Reading area, where large-scale development is taking place. Projects in the area include the expansion of Green Park Business Park and Green Park Village.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on March 20, 2022, 21:34:13
And with what I anticipate will be my last visit before it opens, here's what it looked like this morning.

Let's hope Reading avoid relegation so I can use it for a match or two in the Championship next season.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on April 07, 2022, 12:57:50
I can't work out, from those pictures, what the tactile/visual edge markings are going to be exactly. Because they may look a bit different from usual. I found this letter (https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1042196/the-railways-interoperability-regulations-2011-non-compliance-at-reading-green-park-station-for-the-danger-area-requirements-in-th-prm-ntsn.pdf) from the "Deputy Director, Rail Industry Standards and Capability, Department for Transport" to Reading Borough Council on "non-compliance at Reading Green Park for the danger area requirements in the PRM NTSN". Exciting stuff, as you can imagine.

This is all about the danger area near the platform edgebeing a lot wider than usual - 1500 mm, or about twice as wide. Since the risk here is aerodynamic effects of passing trains, I would guess that it's about intermodal trains passing at their current line speed (i.e. isn't going to be reduced for this new station). While these are not as fast as passenger trains, they are as fast as goods trains get and the containers are big and unevenly spaced. This is a quote from some specialists*:
Quote
Some trains are designed to be, or are naturally more aerodynamic than others. The shape of the train (exterior) impacts the gust generated and the lateral extension of the wake caused by the movement of the train. Freight trains, like the one in the video, present a greater aerodynamic risk when passing than passenger trains for this reason. The greatest risk comes from goods carrying exposed cargo, such as road vehicles, or from container trains with large spaces between containers due to inconsistency in the train profile.

And what happens in other stations, like Mortimer and Bramley? It looks as it the danger area is marked at a bit less than 1 metre, as usual. Maybe the locals there wear lead boots?

(* leedeo engineering, which appears to be a Spanish bit of RAMS Engineering Services).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 08, 2022, 06:58:39
Quote
Maybe the locals there wear lead boots?

Very effective when somebody suggested that Mortimer station should be moved.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 17, 2022, 07:55:14
Passing through yesterday all the glass doors to the platform and the road side entrance appear to be in place.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on April 17, 2022, 08:58:30
Is there a date for the station to be opened yet?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on July 01, 2022, 06:53:31
"New Reading Green station hopes to open 'as soon as possible'" (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/new-reading-green-station-hopes-24362765)

Typical local website journalism:

"The new station on the Reading to Basingstoke line was expected to open to passengers this summer."

"The long-anticipated Green Park Station is on track to open by summer 2022."



Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on July 01, 2022, 08:20:14
...........so when exactly is it going to be open?   ???


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on July 01, 2022, 09:38:43
...........so when exactly is it going to be open?   ???

Since it "hopes to open 'as soon as possible'", maybe you should ask it?

And where is that a picture of? Not Reading Green Park station, that's for sure.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 01, 2022, 15:18:57
When I went by earlier in the week they were doing some "landscaping", well planting at any rate. The plants might die before it opens?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on July 01, 2022, 19:52:38
And where is that a picture of? Not Reading Green Park station, that's for sure.

getreading have now found a picture of the station! Quite recent, too, by the look of it.

The first one was actually of the new Rivermead (leisure centre) being built next to the old one, with the Caversham Road Premier Inn (actually in Richfield Avenue) behind it.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on July 05, 2022, 13:07:05
To open by "end of the year": https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/ (https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on July 05, 2022, 13:15:38
To open by "end of the year": https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/ (https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/)

Quote
To date, the council has delivered:

    2,150m of platforms;

Wow! All those extra platforms - at least 14 in all - just by a single dodgy keystroke!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on July 05, 2022, 13:28:52
The contractor ought to try and see if he can get paid for all that extra platform construction, no wonder it’s taking so long to do the final surfacing…. >:(


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on July 05, 2022, 17:32:34
To open by "end of the year": https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/ (https://www.reading.gov.uk/vehicles-roads-and-transport/transport-schemes-and-projects/reading-green-park-station/)

BBC:  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-62048949

Quote
A new railway station, delayed due to the pandemic, is set to open by the end of the year.

Reading's Green Park Station on the Reading to Basingstoke line had been expected to open in late 2020.

Building work on the two-platform station, near Reading FC's Madejski Stadium, will finish in July.

It will then go through a period of testing before the station will be up and running for passengers, Reading Borough Council said.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 06, 2022, 06:52:20
Quote
near Reading FC‡'s Madejski Stadium

Will be a nice job for Thames Valley Police sheparding the fans through Green Park Village and the Business Park to the Stadium. Bet the residents will soon be complaining about that.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on July 08, 2022, 13:38:51
Quote
Building work on the two-platform station, near Reading FC‡'s Madejski Stadium, will finish in July.

It will then go through a period of testing before the station will be up and running for passengers, Reading Borough Council said.

Does any forum member know what such testing involves, why such a period is needed, and how long such period ought to be? It seems odd that they cannot be more specific.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 08, 2022, 13:51:38
It should be a lot quicker, but as we saw for Worcestershire Parkway and Kenilworth it takes forever….mostly for the paperwork to be signed off it seems rather than the actual testing.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 15, 2022, 10:24:13
It looks like substantial sections of the platforms have been dug up for some reason.  Perhaps part of the ongoing delays?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on July 16, 2022, 08:45:12
It looks like substantial sections of the platforms have been dug up for some reason.  Perhaps part of the ongoing delays?

Walked past the station yesterday evening. It appears they are repositioning the tactile paving further away from the platform edge as discussed  in post 230. The paving on the south bound platform looks to have been done.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 16, 2022, 09:45:54
Ah, thanks…I’d missed post #230.

If it is as a result of the turbulence from passing intermodal trains it’s a good example of why safety standards for new stations increase costs.  Especially given the proximity of the station to Southcote Junction with its 45 or 50mph permitted speeds meaning those trains won’t be going anywhere near their 75mph maximum speed.  Probably 60mph at the most through the station.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on July 16, 2022, 16:30:49
Ah, thanks…I’d missed post #230.

If it is as a result of the turbulence from passing intermodal trains it’s a good example of why safety standards for new stations increase costs.  Especially given the proximity of the station to Southcote Junction with its 45 or 50mph permitted speeds meaning those trains won’t be going anywhere near their 75mph maximum speed.  Probably 60mph at the most through the station.
Well, if someone’s recently worked out that the tactiles should be behind the yellow line rather than just in front of it, as has been usual for years, then a heck of a lot of other platforms will need modifying…

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 21, 2022, 16:32:20
Signs of progress

Just been by Green Park station. Platforms still dug up.

But NR icon on a pole at the front of the station and "Reading Green Park" name boards on the platforms.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on July 26, 2022, 09:15:15
Passed over the bridge at Green park again yesterday evening. There are now 2 rows of tactile paving on the southbound platform, one by the platform edge stones, the other further back. Not easy to see but appear to be different patterns. I tried to get a photo but with all the temporary fencing proved too difficult.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on September 11, 2022, 17:22:54
When I last posted a picture back in March, I foolishly predicted that it would be the last time before the station opened. I was back there today, and this is what I saw. There are indeed two lines of tactile paving down each platform and it looks like (at least on the east side) either some making good behind the outer (furthest from the track) edge or perhaps a linear drainage grid to cover a gully.

To my untrained eye it does look almost ready to go. Does anyone know if the period for testing mentioned previously has passed and the testing completed?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on September 11, 2022, 17:33:30
Well, there's a coincidence. I was composing the first post in this thread since July and so were you. Today I was driving back to Tilehurst "though the gravel pits", as I used to call the route in my cycling days and intended to cross the railway by means of the bridge by Green Park Station. Only the road was closed. Looking back through this thread, I couldn't see any reason for the closure. Perhaps there are works taking place on the bridge itself??


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on September 11, 2022, 22:09:01
The road closure was for a triathlon event (I hasten to add I was not participating!). I travelled to and from the site on foot.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on September 12, 2022, 07:27:34
It was busy down at the Green Park bridge yesterday, as I also had a check on the progress (?).

Are they going to remove one strip of tactile paving? I can forsee confusion otherwise. Can't understand the emergency exits, from the bridge it looks like you have a long ramp followed by steps, not exactly wheelchair friendly. It might all look sensible from another angle.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Electric train on September 12, 2022, 17:39:54


Are they going to remove one strip of tactile paving? I can forsee confusion otherwise. Can't understand the emergency exits, from the bridge it looks like you have a long ramp followed by steps, not exactly wheelchair friendly. It might all look sensible from another angle.


In the emergency planning a phrase "position of relative safety" is used this allows for all people of differing mobility to get away from danger, this does not mean they can self-evacuate completely.  These "position of relative safety" will be known to the RIO and agreed with the local Fire and Rescue and will be in the station evacuation plan


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on October 09, 2022, 18:44:46
Another month passes, and once again I am in the vicinity, so I had another look to see what (if anything) has changed. Here's another view from the Smallmead road bridge - perhaps we can run a monthly "spot the progess" competition?

There's still two rows of tactile paving on each platform, but is that some new tarmac between them? The other change is a little more signage and some puzzling signage/gate hanging.

On the east side stairway up to the bridge there's now some emergency exit signage, with a panic bar. But.... the panic bar is on the outer side of the gates, so anyone seeking an emergency exit from the station cannot reach it. What's more, on the one at the top (second picture if this post goes to plan!) there does not seem to be a mortice for the catch in the non-hanging gatepost. It's currently chained close! Have they hung the gate the wrong way around?

It's a shame that these are gated emergency accesses only. While there may not be many of them, the residents of Searle's Farm Lane and roads off it face quite a long detour to reach the station, as do those going fishing or birdwatching at the nearby gravel pits.  


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bradbrka on October 09, 2022, 20:16:04
I believe the east side stairway is not an exit route but is to allow those who are taken via the west side stairs to safety in the carpark, as that's where it leads to. This would explain the push bar on the bridge side of the gate.

The other change that can't be seen clearly from your photo is that the carpark and access roads are now fully completed including all the white and yellow lining.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Electric train on October 10, 2022, 07:14:16
Another month passes, and once again I am in the vicinity, so I had another look to see what (if anything) has changed. Here's another view from the Smallmead road bridge - perhaps we can run a monthly "spot the progess" competition?

There's still two rows of tactile paving on each platform, but is that some new tarmac between them? The other change is a little more signage and some puzzling signage/gate hanging.

On the east side stairway up to the bridge there's now some emergency exit signage, with a panic bar. But.... the panic bar is on the outer side of the gates, so anyone seeking an emergency exit from the station cannot reach it. What's more, on the one at the top (second picture if this post goes to plan!) there does not seem to be a mortice for the catch in the non-hanging gatepost. It's currently chained close! Have they hung the gate the wrong way around?

It's a shame that these are gated emergency accesses only. While there may not be many of them, the residents of Searle's Farm Lane and roads off it face quite a long detour to reach the station, as do those going fishing or birdwatching at the nearby gravel pits.  

I have been involved in the past with EXP (emergency evacuation plan) for Thameslink core, there will have been an EVP developed for Green Park at an early stage of the design, this will have had blue light services involvement, Local Authority, NR Ops and TOC involvement.

There will be a walk through as part of the hand over process where any errors in the build or indeed the EVP should be picked up and then corrected


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on November 10, 2022, 07:31:05
Aerial views - and a video (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/gallery/look-around-readings-new-green-25475171) (which I can never got to load on this particular website).

"The station ... is scheduled to open in spring 2023. It was originally due to open this summer but the project has been delayed by material shortages and 'unforeseen power supply issues'. It will now need to go through a 'commissioning and safety validation' process before the station can welcome its first trains and serve passengers."


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on November 10, 2022, 12:47:18
Thanks Marlburian

I also tried unsuccessfully to get the video to load from Get Reading.

This link might work instead - https://media.reading.gov.uk/news/breath-taking-aerial-footage-shows-entirety-of-new-reading-green-park-station.

Am I the only one who finds the delay in finally opening the station surprising? When construction of this project started we had Theresa May as PM, no-one knew what Covid meant and there was peace in Europe. What will the world be like when we can finally use it?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Witham Bobby on November 10, 2022, 13:36:43

Am I the only one who finds the delay in finally opening the station surprising? When construction of this project started we had Theresa May as PM, no-one knew what Covid meant and there was peace in Europe. What will the world be like when we can finally use it?

Who knew that a station building project to lead to such strife and grief in the world?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TonyK on November 10, 2022, 16:44:56

Am I the only one who finds the delay in finally opening the station surprising? When construction of this project started we had Theresa May as PM, no-one knew what Covid meant and there was peace in Europe. What will the world be like when we can finally use it?

I reckon efforts to reopen the Portishead line go back at least as far as Jim Callaghan, predating Channel 4 by a few years.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on November 10, 2022, 19:59:47

Am I the only one who finds the delay in finally opening the station surprising? When construction of this project started we had Theresa May as PM, no-one knew what Covid meant and there was peace in Europe. What will the world be like when we can finally use it?

I reckon efforts to reopen the Portishead line go back at least as far as Jim Callaghan, predating Channel 4 by a few years.

Nothing new in delay after a station building are completed - Bradford-on-Avon station was built in 1850 but the first train did not run until 1857.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on November 10, 2022, 21:19:50
Nothing new in delay after a station building are completed - Bradford-on-Avon station was built in 1850 but the first train did not run until 1857.
I think those builders might have moved on to Crossrail…  ;D

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on November 11, 2022, 07:07:35
My other half was an architect where there was initial design concept done for Reading Green Park at least 20 years ago.

It also doesn't help that the station etc straddles three local authorities, none of whom are particularly good at internal communication let alone between each other.

It will be very interesting to see what its usage figures are five years after opening, will probably be the most expensive station per passenger.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on January 04, 2023, 14:22:07
Not sure it is progress, but I managed to cycle up to the front entrance of Reading Green Park station. The person in the security hut was deep in their mobile/book.

Didn't hang about. Couple of people working on the down platform, one out the front loading a vehicle.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Noggin on January 04, 2023, 21:23:28
My other half was an architect where there was initial design concept done for Reading Green Park at least 20 years ago.

Didn't Reading BC still have cash in escrow until recently which would have been the developer's contribution to a Reading Thames Valley Park railway station?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on February 12, 2023, 06:09:29
Went down to RGP last week and it appears that all contractors signage has been removed. Does this mean that the end game is in sight (with a good telescope!).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on February 12, 2023, 07:31:17
Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Electric train on February 12, 2023, 08:09:52
Went down to RGP last week and it appears that all contractors signage has been removed. Does this mean that the end game is in sight (with a good telescope!).

It's a good sign that the site has been handed over to Network Rail (the landlord), and the ORR have no concerns and have signed it off or will be in the near future for passenger train use.

It may even have been handed over to the ToC (tenant), I assume GWR, by Network Rail.

When it will appear in the time table, could be as soon as May the next major timetable change


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on April 01, 2023, 22:51:25
Went down to RGP last week and it appears that all contractors signage has been removed. Does this mean that the end game is in sight (with a good telescope!).

It's a good sign that the site has been handed over to Network Rail (the landlord), and the ORR have no concerns and have signed it off or will be in the near future for passenger train use.

It may even have been handed over to the ToC (tenant), I assume GWR, by Network Rail.

When it will appear in the time table, could be as soon as May the next major timetable change

Any news on this?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on April 01, 2023, 23:25:35
Thanks TG for jogging my memory - I did take a picture when I was passing on 12 March, which I hope will be the last of the series of "here's what it looks like" before it is actually open!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on April 02, 2023, 19:29:50
Thanks TG for jogging my memory - I did take a picture when I was passing on 12 March, which I hope will be the last of the series of "here's what it looks like" before it is actually open!

Do you know when it opens?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on April 02, 2023, 22:25:54
Sorry TG - I have no more information beyond that posted earlier in this thread.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 02, 2023, 22:55:50
Do you know when it opens?

I expect there will be a press release when a definite date is set.

Internally we were recently told that all three new stations (Portway P&R and Marsh Barton being the other two), were ‘progressing’ towards an opening date.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on April 03, 2023, 04:25:40
Do you know when it opens?

I expect there will be a press release when a definite date is set.

Internally we were recently told that all three new stations (Portway P&R and Marsh Barton being the other two), were ‘progressing’ towards an opening date.

Thanks, reassuringly vague!  :)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 03, 2023, 06:54:51
Ah, but the Tesco Express opposite the station entrance is open!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on April 03, 2023, 06:58:46
Ah, but the Tesco Express opposite the station entrance is open!

Every little helps.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 03, 2023, 11:09:07
Worth remembering that snagging works and red tape seem to add about 6-12 months on top of any completion date for a new station.

Construction of the residential properties by the station seemed to stall for ages as well, so it’s good to see they’re also nearing completion.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: johnneyw on April 03, 2023, 11:14:41
Do you know when it opens?

I expect there will be a press release when a definite date is set.

Internally we were recently told that all three new stations (Portway P&R and Marsh Barton being the other two), were ‘progressing’ towards an opening date.

The latest on Portway P&R was a "summer" opening date.   I don't recall the press release clarifying which summer they meant though.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on April 03, 2023, 12:44:15
The latest on Portway P&R was a "summer" opening date.

Do the Met Office do a long-range station opening forecast?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on April 04, 2023, 14:59:42
Just been down to RGP, still barriers across the entrance road. Following the path round to Tesco, there were  four cars/vans outside the station entrance, and two people on the Down platform one with a clip board (nothing like reliable technology).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on May 04, 2023, 22:03:45
I have just checked the timetable from 21 May to see what it says about Green Park opening.

Unhelpfully it says "During the currency of this timetable Reading Green Park (between Reading West and Mortimer) is expected to open"!

Might not even be by 9 December....

By way of contrast, I have recently saw one of Jago Hazzard's wonderful You Tube videos on Arnos Grove station - from drawing board to open for use in less than 6 months in the 1930s. Apparently it was not quite finished when it did.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 04, 2023, 22:57:22
By way of contrast, I have recently saw one of Jago Hazzard's wonderful You Tube videos on Arnos Grove station - from drawing board to open for use in less than 6 months in the 1930s. Apparently it was not quite finished when it did.

It can still be done.  Workington North was far quicker than that!  ;)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Marlburian on May 09, 2023, 18:16:38
I had to visit Green Park today and lamented that the station had yet to open, so I travelled by bus. Just as well, because steady rain started as I was about to leave at the end of my appointment.  I scurried the 130 metres to the bus shelter, getting there just as the rain became a downpour, but still with wet legs. I was some 15 minutes' walk from the station so would have got drenched.

Earlier I'd walked to the station in pleasant, warm sunshine.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 12, 2023, 22:35:02
Rumour has it that opening day will be announced on Monday as Saturday 27th May.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 15, 2023, 10:56:46
Rumour has it that opening day will be announced on Monday as Saturday 27th May.

Confirmation from GWR (https://news.gwr.com/news/reading-green-park-station-opening-date-confirmed):
Quote
Reading Green Park station opening date confirmed

Becoming the first new station in Reading in over 100 years, Reading Green Park Station is set to open on Saturday 27 May 2023.

Reading Green Park Station – the first station to open in Reading since Reading West in July 1906 and the first of three new Great Western Railway (GWR) stations opening this year along with Portway Park & Ride in Bristol and Marsh Barton in Exeter.

It will provide improved sustainable travel options for local residents and businesses in the Green Park area, as well as fans attending events at the Select Car Leasing Stadium, home of Reading Football Club.

The station, built by Reading Borough Council, Network Rail and GWR, features:

    Two 150m platforms;
    A new fully accessible station building;
    A fully accessible overbridge, providing access to both platforms, via stairs and lifts;
    A bus interchange, taxi rank and cycle parking facilities;
    Two car parks, including 12 blue badge spaces and drop-off parking and long-stay parking for commuters.

The station sits on the Reading to Basingstoke line, with half-hourly services running north to Reading and south to Basingstoke through the day.

The delivery of the station has been made possible by the Council leading alongside the rail industry to secure the approvals, funding and planning permission for the station, as well as managing the construction of the station.

Readers can take a virtual tour of the new facilities here: https://youtu.be/HhaHbppRHT8  and view aerial footage of the entire site here: https://youtu.be/e-33IcK8_2g
[continues, Pollyannaishly.]


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 15, 2023, 11:21:08
Quote
Readers can take a virtual tour of the new facilities here: https://youtu.be/HhaHbppRHT8  and view aerial footage of the entire site here: https://youtu.be/e-33IcK8_2g

Looking at that tour, a couple of reactions:
  • Big, innit?
  • I see the branding message about Rail Alphabet 2 has got through for the station signage but not the name boards, which look like Glypha. Presumably they were provided by GWR, as they have their logo on - perhaps they were bought years ago, for an earlier opening date?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Witham Bobby on May 15, 2023, 12:04:32
Am I missing something? Or, won't those fences make boarding and alighting a bit difficult?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Mark A on May 15, 2023, 12:11:34
Possibly known in the trade as 'Ascot fences'. Reference to the single-facing of platform 1 rather than racecourse jumps.

Mark


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 15, 2023, 12:16:44
Am I missing something? Or, won't those fences make boarding and alighting a bit difficult?

Yes, up to 26th May. Until then they are needed to stop video camera operators falling onto the track.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Mark A on May 15, 2023, 16:46:29
It's annoying, the (temporary) Green Park fences are more attractive than the permanent installation at Ascot's former platform edge.

Mark


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 15, 2023, 17:34:46
It's annoying, the (temporary) Green Park fences are more attractive than the permanent installation at Ascot's former platform edge.

Mark

They were able to build the attachments into the platforms from the start, which I'm sure helps. Justified no doubt by the knowledge the station would hang around mostly built but unopened for ages.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 25, 2023, 10:11:21
From the BBC today (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-65698714):
Quote
Reading's new Green Park Station to receive first passengers

(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/0799/production/_129854910_readinggreenpark.jpg.webp)
Image source, GWR

A new £20m railway station will welcome its first guests later before it formally opens this weekend.

Reading Green Park station, south-west of the Berkshire town, is close to sites being developed for businesses and more than 1,100 new homes.

It will be served by half-hourly trains between Reading and Basingstoke in Hampshire.

Local politicians and rail bosses will view the station before it opens to the public on Saturday.

The facility, built by Reading Borough Council, Network Rail and Great Western Railway (GWR), was originally due to open in 2020.

Councillor Tony Page, in charge of transport for the borough, said it would be an option for football fans heading to the Reading FC stadium.

Joanna Grew, a Network Rail director, said the station would also reduce traffic on the A33.

It is the town's first new railway station since the opening of Reading West in 1906.

We never did find out why the approval to use two safety markings, one tactile and one visible, has led to three of them, did we?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: BBM on May 25, 2023, 10:19:42
Modern Railways has just tweeted a photo from the opening event:
https://twitter.com/Modern_Railways/status/1661662652454559744 (https://twitter.com/Modern_Railways/status/1661662652454559744)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: The Tall Controller on May 25, 2023, 12:19:04
The tactile paving closest to the edge of the platform is standard edging warning slabs. The grooved tactile paving in the middle of the platform acts as a 'guided walkway' for those using white canes. The grooves rotate 90 degrees at turning points. I believe this is to be standard at all new stations


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: paul7575 on May 25, 2023, 18:35:04
The tactile paving closest to the edge of the platform is standard edging warning slabs. The grooved tactile paving in the middle of the platform acts as a 'guided walkway' for those using white canes. The grooves rotate 90 degrees at turning points. I believe this is to be standard at all new stations
As I understand it Marsh Barton also has the way finding tactiles leading on or off the platform.

So has Portway (park & ride), I just noticed it in the recent photo quiz thread.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: ChrisB on May 25, 2023, 18:42:45
Pain in the arse when using a wheelchair.....no one's thought of those!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: stuving on May 25, 2023, 19:41:44
Pain in the arse when using a wheelchair.....no one's thought of those!

Presumably that depends on where you are and which way you are going relative to the tactiles. The relevant provisions are in the NTSN: Persons with Reduced Mobility (PRM):
Quote
4.2.1.4.   Floor surfaces
(1)   All floor coverings, ground surfaces and stair tread surfaces shall be slip resistant.
(2)   Within the station buildings there shall be no irregularities in excess of 0,5 cm at any given point in floor walking surface areas, except for thresholds, drainage channels and tactile walking surface indicators

The provisions about danger area marking that the exemption was granted for say:
Quote
4.2.1.12.   Platform width and edge of platform
(6)   The boundary of the danger area, furthest from the rail side edge of the platform, shall have a visual marking and tactile walking surface indicators.
(7)   The visual marking shall be a contrasting, slip resistant, warning line with a minimum width of 10 cm.
(8)   Tactile walking surface indicators can be one of the two types:
      -   an attention pattern indicating a hazard at the boundary of the danger area
      -   a guiding pattern indicating a path of travel at the safe side of the platform

As I read that one it's not saying the wayfinding tactiles are required. There are, however, a lot of complicated bits about obstacle-free routes that may, taken together, require one along a platform (though so far I think that's slipped past not-quite-specified).

The NTSNs are based on the TSIs, rather than previous UK rail standards. They were put together mainly by RSSB, but this one appears to have been written by consultants (specifically someone from Ricardo with previous experience at the EC and ORR. RSSB are providing guidance about impmenting bits of them even in upgrade works where it's not a requirement, in which case these NTSNs might result on more compliance with the TSIs than would have happened otherwise (i.e. without Brexit).

This is the page with the NTSNs in it  (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/railway-interoperability-national-technical-specification-notices-ntsns)(filed under Brexit, not DfT).


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: Bmblbzzz on May 25, 2023, 19:57:01
Those wayfinding groove tactiles look extremely similar to the warning grooved tactiles used for cycle-on-the-pavement lanes, but the other way round. In that situation, the cycle lane grooves run parallel to direction to travel (which is annoying to downright dangerous for cyclists, depending on factors such as tyre width – I'm not sure how they affect wheelchairs) and the pedestrian side run perpendicular to travel.

Possibly these grooves are actually different, in a way that is detectable by a cane user – but there are at least two types used for cycle lanes and it seems inevitable that, unless this type is only available to NR, they will be misplaced.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: BBM on May 27, 2023, 10:17:09
Transport YouTuber JenOnTheMove has posted a video of this morning's public opening and the first train:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9I6E7os8GRA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9I6E7os8GRA)

At 1:31 in the video I spotted another YouTuber called Bryn Buck (aka Roadsign Reporter) who has posted a short video of the first train on his channel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuCQ8asY5GM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuCQ8asY5GM)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 27, 2023, 10:31:05
Brilliant news that it’s now open.

Rather less brilliant that it’s taken 14 years from the first ‘cleared for opening’ post on this thread!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 27, 2023, 14:52:09
Brilliant news that it’s now open.

Rather less brilliant that it’s taken 14 years from the first ‘cleared for opening’ post on this thread!

It is good news to see it's open at last - and be fair - that's only 1 year longer than it took to construct the whole of Crossrail - albeit that was delayed too!!!  :)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: bobm on May 28, 2023, 10:42:35
(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpsign.jpg)

Took a trip to see Reading Green Park finally open yesterday.  I wasn't there for the first service but, taking advantage of the brighter mornings, I was there soon after

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpdep3.jpg)

As you would expect the screens both on the platform and onboard have been updated to include the new station.  The audio announcements have also been revised.  The same onboard voice has been used to say "Reading Green Park" however it has been recorded at a much lower level to give the effect that she is whispering the name.  The platform announcements don't have that problem.

Arriving at Reading Green Park there were a number who were also there to see the station in operation for the first time.  The station is sited on a long straight piece of track between Southcote Junction and Mortimer - such that you can see an arriving train from quite a distance.

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgp1.jpg)

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgparr.jpg)

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpgv.jpg)

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpgv2.jpg)

As you'd expect from a modern station it has lifts between the two platforms which are summoned remotely when the station is unstaffed.  There is a gateline and self service ticket machines both inside and by the night gate.  With perhaps a look to the future there is no ticket office but a "retail desk" where presumably tickets could be sold from a mobile machine.

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpfront.jpg)

The front of the station has a bus turning circle.  The posters suggest Reading Buses Greenwave 50 service calls there but I haven't found any evidence that the company has adjusted its timetables yet.

My visit was slightly extended after one of the units running the Reading - Basingstoke service developed a fault

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpdep2.jpg)

However it was rather relaxing hearing the birds singing in the morning sunshine - and the odd plane banking in the skies as they queued to land at Heathrow.

Earlier in this thread we have discussed the various types of tactile paving.   As mentioned it changes as you reach places where routes diverge.

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgptact.jpg)

Trains heading to Basingstoke stop in the middle of the platform but those going to Reading stop at the very end of the platform beyond the covered area.  I assume this is because of the signal just past the platform.

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpsig.jpg)

The station will serve the nearby business parks and Reading Football Club.  The opening day saw Reading playing Chelsea in the Women's Super League.  I haven't seen what the attendance was - Reading's average crowd is just below 2,000 - but with Chelsea in town that may have been greater yesterday.  I wonder how many used rhe train?

(https://mbob.co.uk/rforum/rgpftb.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: infoman on May 28, 2023, 13:46:17
Shame that Championship league clubs won't get the chance to use the station in season 2023/24,

unless Reading draw a Championship club in one of the Cup competitions.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: TaplowGreen on May 28, 2023, 16:39:51
Shame that Championship league clubs won't get the chance to use the station in season 2023/24,

unless Reading draw a Championship club in one of the Cup competitions.

I was indeed looking forward to watching the mighty Plymouth Argyle there however we passed Reading on the way up as they came down!


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: BBM on May 29, 2023, 17:20:43
Geoff Marshall has just uploaded a video about the station:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4Q3JrdMdGs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4Q3JrdMdGs)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on July 03, 2023, 07:13:24
Are GWR ashamed of their new station? They have added Reading Green Park to their on train announcements, but have got the sound balance so far out that you can hardly hear Reading Green Park.

Coming back about 18:00 on Saturday five people got on.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 03, 2023, 08:57:44
Are GWR ashamed of their new station? They have added Reading Green Park to their on train announcements, but have got the sound balance so far out that you can hardly hear Reading Green Park.

At least they’ve managed to record it with a female voice unlike  Worcestershire Parkway.  :D


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: eightonedee on December 09, 2023, 23:49:35
I wondered whether to post here or in the thread on Gloucestershire's proposed cricket ground move!
Having watched the progress on construction for an extended time, I used the station (at last) for the first time today.

It was my first visit in a very long time to the "Select Car Leasing Stadium", which shall always be the Mad Stad for us, to see Reading play. The club has being doing badly off and on the field for a while, as anyone who takes a passing interest in the game will know. An old school friend and I decided it was time to show some support, and I thought I would try the new station as a way of getting there - a very reasonable £3-55 return from Goring and Streatley now I have a senior railcard.

On the way out everything went smoothly. Sadly the Turbo out from Reading had been vandalised with paint (or tagged as foolish people who should know better call it), as had an Electrostar in the depot and most of the ex-Viva Rail Marston Vale stock that has replaced the 769s in the area reserved for rebuilt oddities. GWR thoughtfully put on 3 car units. I went early to meet up for a pre-match drink, but there were already a number of supporters on the train.

One thing that struck me was the absence of signage on the convenient direct pedestrian route form the station to the stadium. Perhaps it was understandable as it pre-dated the station, but I would have thought that both destinations would have been added.

On the way back things were not quite so good. The middle coach of the Reading-bound train had been locked out of use as someone had been sick over one of the seats, and it was held awaiting a fast train at Southcote Junction, so I missed the connection to Goring I hoped to get. Memories of commuting days - I got down to the platform just as doors closed..... Never mind, I used the half hour to do some supplemental Christmas shopping at Hotel Chocolat - one of the highlights of the "new" Reading Station!

There were about 100 who got on the train back to Reading, possibly a few more. On the opposite platform there were rather fewer, but still possibly 70-80 waiting for the next Basingstoke-bound train. I guess there may have been more later, as quite a few supporters have a post match drink at the stadium hotel bar. The long queues to leave the car-park are an incentive to stay for one. I'd guess the crowd was about 10,000.

A thought for those commercially minded folk at GWR - perhaps sell tickets with a discount via the football club, and invest in a few signs between the station and the stadium? There looks to be a possible source of revenue that could be better exploited here.

Oh - and the station was as others have already described. The only negative point was the presence of wet-floor warning signs on the footbridge indicating possible a roof problem there. And the reception desk affair near the entrance is no more "getting the staff closer to passengers" than had it been an enclosed ticket office. It's somewhere for staff you walk past when you enter the building.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: grahame on December 10, 2023, 03:28:25
I wondered whether to post here or in the thread on Gloucestershire's proposed cricket ground move!
Having watched the progress on construction for an extended time, I used the station (at last) for the first time today.

A fascinating report, thank you so much.  But I am going to pick you up on the tail of it:
Quote
The only negative point was the presence of wet-floor warning signs on the footbridge indicating possible a roof problem there. And the reception desk affair near the entrance is no more "getting the staff closer to passengers" than had it been an enclosed ticket office. It's somewhere for staff you walk past when you enter the building.

Fair enough on the wet floors.  But, yet, a fixed desk in public might actually work for human ticket issuing in future. Why do we put ticket office staff behind a screen?  To provide security for the cash they handle and the stock of tickets which also have value. With fewer cash transactions, and tickets printed dynamically, how much of a rethink can we make?


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on December 11, 2023, 07:04:45
Quote
One thing that struck me was the absence of signage on the convenient direct pedestrian route form the station to the stadium.

I believe that the road to Green Park station is a Restricted Local Access Street (presumably unadopted) the council, Reading Buses and GWR are limited to what they can do on/with it in terms of signage etc.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: BBM on December 12, 2023, 15:51:16
Reading Buses has announced that from January 2nd route 9 ('buzz 9') will be extended from Whitley Wood to Green Park Station via Imperial Way and will run Mondays to Saturdays:

https://www.reading-buses.co.uk/timetable-changes-tuesday-2-january (https://www.reading-buses.co.uk/timetable-changes-tuesday-2-january)


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: CyclingSid on December 21, 2023, 07:07:26
And now on the Beeb https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c802d1e9g7wo (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c802d1e9g7wo)

The buses are going to be hourly, but the trains are half hourly. Do they even meet the alternate trains, or is this another could do better of inter-modal travel.


Title: Re: Reading Green Park
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 21, 2023, 07:39:09
Do they even meet the alternate trains, or is this another could do better of inter-modal travel.

Typically there will be 10-12 minute connections into and out of the buses to and from trains in both directions, so just about perfect.



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