Great Western Coffee Shop

From Design Build Network: (http://www.designbuild-network.com/news/news72017.html)

Formally known in the 1920's to 50's as Bishops Bridge Road station, great when the world turns full circle (unlike the circle line)

Ah that's interesting to hear.  Thanks.

If the Hammersmith (and Circle Line from next week) station is to close during the works then it's not going to be much fun travelling Eastbound along the Circle line from Paddington - one stop change please!

Boppy.

I'd be tempted to walk to Edgeware Road

Or get a 27 or 205 bus which drops you right by Edgware Road Circle Line station.

Had a little snippet of infor this week regards Crossrail, to reduce the cost the design of some of the stations at the eastern end of the core may be  reduced in grandeur also the core to Abby Wood is likely to retain its existing 3rd rail electrification rather than be converted to 25kv OHLE

A bit of a shame that the H&C station is being demolished, as I thought it was the world's oldest Underground station.

The current platform 15 / 16 date from the 1920's or 30's  the original underground station I believe is the one in Parade St

Sorry, but how can the line to Abbey Wood retain its existing third rail? Except for a short single track length in the docks which used to be a part of the NLL, it is all brand new alignment. It doesn't even join up with the existing Kent lines until it gets to Abbey Wood station.  I also believe that on any new construction, OHLE will be cheaper than third rail.

Paul

Wouldn't it mean the Crossrail trains would have to be dual voltage? Can't see that happening just to save a modest amount of re-electrification.

Thinking about this dual voltage could make sense if Crossrail service is extended beyond Abbey Wood - the alignment needed for four tracking is safeguarded, but a cheapo version could use the existing two tracks beyond Abbey Wood.  Perhaps that's where the idea comes from?

Paul

I suppose it is not surprising cost cutting is starting*. Although it is annoying, it is VITAL that we get the central tunnels built to relieve the Tube; if that means less work at the extremities, so be it!

*and remember that the Tories have yet to commit to Xrail!

I agree with Btline's views. We don't need cathedral like structures in the suburbs - just fit for purpose stations that can handle the volumes comfortably.

I don't think there has ever been any suggestion of 'cathedral like' Crossrail stations in the suburbs. Between Paddington and Whitechapel they are all new underground stations, built to allow the necessary capacity, and all double ended (ie 2 entrances) except Whitechapel. So they'll need to deal with 10 car mainline trains - stations about the size of the Jubilee extension will be needed.

Elsewhere on the GWML and GEML though, nearly all are existing suburban stations which will have platforms lengthened to allow 10 car trains. Woolwich Arsenal will be new, apparently in a basement, and Customs House will be 90% new, but I can't see either being cathedral like...

Paul

The info cames out of the NR Crossrail team the savings would come from the reduction in tunnel size, however I do suspect this is accountants talking without fully realising the consequences.

They may downsize the scheme from 12 car to 10 car as well.

It would be less future proofing, but the current proposed 10 car service will still increase London's rail capacity by 10%. It's just good planning to allow the trains' capacity to be increased by 20%.

Don't you just love the "bean counters"?

There's three artist impressions of what the new northern entrance will look like at:

http://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/daily-news/in-pictures-weston-williamsons-paddington-station/5211750.article (http://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/daily-news/in-pictures-weston-williamsons-paddington-station/5211750.article)

Everything from the Span 4 refurbishment, to Crossrail, electrification, and the continuing Paddington Central area developments are falling into place quite nicely.

Interesting pictures. Anyone know what they are referring to when they mention the 'existing H&C concourse'? Is there another entrance that is out of use somewhere, because I thought the only access was steps from the internal footbridge, ie behind the new barrier line.

I haven't heard of any plans to alter the current H&C platforms, is there any room to do anything with them? Although I did see a letter in one of the rail mags suggesting that maybe they could have separate up and down platforms, by taking over the mainline P14. Obviously pie in the sky if NR/FGW need that capacity though...

Paul

They may be referring to the existing access to 13/14 and 15/16 which along with the top of the old taxi down ramp to plat 8 is a large area, the whole area adjacent to plat 16 has the remains of the down ramps from Bishop Bridge to the Red Star area also the old down ramp into the old Goods yard along with what used to be the Goods Yard canteen (The Drum, damn good bacon buttes when I used to use it as maintenance electrician at Padd Stn) There is also a set of stairs toward the western end of 13/14 and 15/16 which are labeled emergency exit at the top of these used to be a ticket office and exit on the Bishops Bridge

http://idocs.westminster.gov.uk:8080/WAM/showCaseFileDocs.do?appNumber=09/09265/LBC (http://idocs.westminster.gov.uk:8080/WAM/showCaseFileDocs.do?appNumber=09/09265/LBC)

"Jump to the diagram on page 31 of the Design Statement for a good 3D
diagram of the whole scheme, and there are some good plans and cross
sections earlier on."

Acknowledgements to 'Mr Thant', posting in uk.transport.london

Edit: This link provides a better quality pdf of the design statement linked above

http://idocs.westminster.gov.uk:8080/WAM/showCaseFileDocs.do?appNumber=09/09263/XR7PS&CFID=1593358&CFTOKEN=14577946 (http://idocs.westminster.gov.uk:8080/WAM/showCaseFileDocs.do?appNumber=09/09263/XR7PS&CFID=1593358&CFTOKEN=14577946)

Paul

Let's hope that the stations are big enough for the trains and their customers rather than architects' egos. Canary Wharf style stations don't help make the case for railway investment. Perhaps they could also have cleanliness inbuilt, unlike the newer bits (1991) of Reading General which are a filthy disgrace, having never been deep cleaned since new. The proposals also show a nice clear concourse without the excessive coffee shops, vendors and allied pedlars that clutter up post-privatisation stations.

The trains could in my view better be 2x5x23m cars rather than 3x4x20m cars and should have 125mph/200kph capability for semi-fast work, now that CrossRail will reach Swansea..... (a Mars bar for the first sighting).

I can't see how dc instead of ac could work. HMRI doesn't allow new live rail schemes. Smaller tunnels (5m diameter instead of 6m) would need a modified/new borer with time loss.

If revision is on the cards, then perhaps the route should include St Pancras I rather than hi fi alley.

OTC

Any pictures than these

http://www.crossrail.co.uk/library#asset/4966

http://www.crossrail.co.uk/library#asset/4965

Guy

The current Crossrail plans are for '5x20m units' running in pairs, with the underground station tunnels 'as tunnelled length' capable of  coping with  pairs of 6x20m units, but not fully fitted out. It is this 40m expansion capacity that 'btline' is suggesting won't be provided on Crossrail, if I understand his post correctly. [This was also the policy on the TW Metro underground stations - they are all 'dug out' for 6 car trains, but these have never happened, so there is approx 40m of unfinished platform at all the underground stations, behind false walls.]  Using 5x23m rather than 5x20m might be impossible at this stage dependent on tunnel curvatures and the resulting gauging issues?

However I suspect that whatever the current Crossrail spec calls for it would be daft not to use a follow on order of whatever Thameslink agree on, or a very similar spec.  Using full length trains rather than pairs of units gains the wasted space used up by the intermediate cabs.

Paul

If you are wondering about better pictures of Crossrail station layouts, I'd recommend this page from New Civil Engineer magazine - the Crossrail website must be one of the worst around for finding useful info, IMO...

http://www.nce.co.uk/major-projects/crossrail/delivering-crossrail-major-project-report/5208323.article (http://www.nce.co.uk/major-projects/crossrail/delivering-crossrail-major-project-report/5208323.article)

Down the middle of the page you'll see links for each Crossrail station, including Paddington.

Paul

Thanks, Paul - that New Civil Engineer site is a good resource for news on Crossrail and HS2.

Thanks

This is a good web site

Guy