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All across the Great Western territory => Across the West => Topic started by: Chris from Nailsea on March 13, 2010, 22:16:08



Title: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 13, 2010, 22:16:08
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/berkshire/8565864.stm):

Quote
A public meeting is to be held over a multi-million pound plan to transform Reading railway station.
The borough council proposes an upgrade of the southern entrance and outside travel interchange concourse, including bus, taxi and drop-off areas.
It comes as Network Rail plans a ^500m revamp of rail lines into the town, including five new platforms and a train depot.
Residents and businesses are being urged to attend and give their views.
The council says the Network Rail upgrade will significantly increase passenger numbers and should allow more trains to run through Reading, reduce delays on the western route and ease overcrowding at the station.
Another planned regeneration project at nearby Station Hill, including skyscrapers housing offices, restaurants and flats, would also increase numbers.
During the meeting, council planners will outline their plans, followed by a question and answer session.
Their Reading Station Area Framework covers an area from the River Thames to the north, Friar Street to the south, Caversham Road to the west and Forbury Road to the east.
There will also be an opportunity to see the Network Rail and Station Hill plans.
A council spokesperson said: "The council wants its residents to get involved now so they can help to inform any possible future development and have some input into future plans. Exhibitions have already taken place at Caversham Library and the Civic Centre."
The meeting will be held on 22 March from 1830 GMT in the Victoria Hall at the town hall.


Title: Reading Station Bridge Widening - work looks to have begun
Post by: Boppy on March 19, 2010, 12:14:06
I've noticed the barricading and single lane closure of the road under the East Side Reading Railway Bridge.

With all the area to the North of the tracks to the East also cordoned off (the car parks have been closed along Napier road it looks like) is this the beginning of the bridge widening?

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station Bridge Widening - work looks to have begun
Post by: willc on March 25, 2010, 22:35:58
DafT has today announced a package of road alterations around the station. Press release below.

A ^16 million road improvement scheme which will allow for major upgrades to Reading station has taken an important step forward, Transport Minister Sadiq Khan announced today.

The scheme - which will increase capacity on roads and junctions around the station -has received conditional approval, meaning work could start later this year. The Minister also reconfirmed that the Department will invest ^15 million in the project, subject to Reading ensuring that appropriate procurement, governance and project management mechanisms are in place.  Reading Borough Council will meet the remainder of the cost.

The work will allow new rail bridges to be constructed as part of the wider ^425 million programme of works to rebuild Reading station and significantly improve train services. It will also improve traffic flow around the station.
Sadiq Khan said:

^I am delighted to confirm that this vital scheme - which we are prepared to invest ^15 million towards - has taken an important step forward.

"The improvement project will not only ease congestion on local roads - but also allow new rail bridges to be constructed as part of the wider ^425 million programme of works to rebuild Reading station.

"This will deliver major improvements to the performance and capacity of one of the most critical rail hubs in Britain."

Following a review of the scheme by Reading Borough Council, the proposed road improvements involve:

^ works to modify the existing roundabout at Portman Road/Oxford Road including a bus lane on the approach to the junction;
^ southern and northern stations access works around the junction of station Hill/Vastern Road/Caversham Road; and
^ signalisation of the junction at Richfield Avenue/Caversham Road.

The improvements will allow new rail bridges to be built over Cow Lane Road to accommodate the provision of additional track to the west of the station.  The junction improvements are needed to provide a strategic road route for HGVs and other non-local traffic and improve management of the road network.


Title: Re: Reading Station Bridge Widening - work looks to have begun
Post by: paul7575 on March 26, 2010, 10:46:33
This is double announcing as far as I can see. There was an announcement that work on the actual railway bridges had started quite a few weeks ago.  Didn't we discuss exactly what they meant by 'widening', ie was it with respect to the roads or the tracks?

What they'll have done is included it again just to pad out whatever new work is being discussed...   ::)

Paul


Title: Re: Views wanted on Reading railway station plans
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 10, 2010, 18:13:39
From the Network Rail press release (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/NETWORK-RAIL-SHOWCASES-VISION-FOR-THE-FUTURE-OF-READING-STATION-1437/SearchCategoryID-7.aspx):

Quote
NETWORK RAIL SHOWCASES VISION FOR THE FUTURE OF READING STATION

Network Rail today published artist^s impressions of how Reading station will look, following their multimillion pound investment to modernise the station.

The images have been released in advance of a public exhibition on Network Rail^s plans for Reading^s railway, to be held in Reading Town Hall from Thursday 20 to Saturday 22 May.

Tony Walker, Network Rail^s scheme sponsor for the Reading project said: ^Reading^s residents and commuters were really positive about our plans for the station when we consulted them a couple of years ago. I^m keen to give people an update on our scheme and get their views before we start construction in earnest.

^The work we^re doing in Reading is one of the biggest pieces of railway investment anywhere in the country right now. I urge everyone who lives in Reading or uses the station to come along to the Town Hall and find out about the benefits and how they^re affected by our plans.^

Network Rail, in conjunction with Reading Borough Council, plans to enlarge and modernise Reading station, building two new entrances connected by a brand new footbridge, relieving congestion for Reading^s commuters. New lifts and escalators will make it easier to get about the station, and five extra platforms will provide more space for trains.

The improvements to the station are just one part of Network Rail^s ambitious plans for Reading^s railway, which involve the construction of a viaduct to untangle the tracks to the west of the station, boosting capacity and cutting delays.

Owing to close working partnerships between Network Rail, First Great Western, and other train operating companies, the vast majority of the work to rebuild Reading station and the surrounding railway will be undertaken without affecting train services. However there will be times when passengers using Reading station will be affected. The first of these will be this Christmas (2010), when the station will close for a number of days while the first phase of work is completed.

Network Rail engineers and project managers will be on hand at the Town Hall exhibition to answer questions about the future for Reading^s railway, and the benefits for the travelling public. Further details on trains next Christmas and alternative travel arrangements will also be available.


Title: Re: Views wanted on Reading railway station plans
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 19, 2010, 20:55:11
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/berkshire/8691613.stm):

Quote
Reading station revamp exhibition opens

Reading commuters are to get a glimpse of how their new railway station will look after a ^400m revamp when an exhibition opens in the town centre.
The station is due to be remodelled by 2013 to include five more platforms and an additional entrance west of the Three Guineas Pub.
The display is due to open at Reading Town Hall at 1000 BST on Thursday.
Network Rail engineers and project managers will be on hand to answer questions about the scheme.
Network Rail has released a new image of how the southern entrance of station will look when it is rebuilt.
The entrance is one of two new access points planned for the station and will be served by a footbridge, lifts and escalators.
Tony Walker, who is working on the project, said: "Reading's residents and commuters were really positive about our plans for the station when we consulted them a couple of years ago. I'm keen to give people an update on our scheme and get their views before we start construction in earnest. The work we're doing in Reading is one of the biggest pieces of railway investment anywhere in the country right now. I urge everyone who lives in Reading or uses the station to come along to the town hall and find out about the benefits and how they're affected by our plans."
The Reading exhibition will be held in the Waterhouse Chamber, Reading Town Hall from Thursday to Saturday and at Reading Station on Thursday from 1700 to 2000 BST.


Title: Re: Views wanted on Reading railway station plans
Post by: Boppy on May 21, 2010, 11:25:02
Hi,

I saw this "exhibition" outside Reading station yesterday.

What I was expecting of something described as such is maybe a scale model?  But all it was was a large banner showing pretty much the same images and artists impressions that have already been shown in the pdfs associated with the project on Network Rail and Reading Borough Council's web sites.  All the publicity about it had built it up a lot so I felt a bit let down - oh well!

Also - the plan used on the banner and in the leaflets handed out is a bit confusing - it has an exaggerated vertical scale to show the extra platforms and tracks but the track layout isn't true - it's just an approximation.  We had what looked to be 3 tracks heading out west, 1 track heading out south (past Reading West) & just 2 tracks for the GWML to Paddington!  But at least there were the correct (i.e. 2) tracks heading off to Wokingham.   :D

On the plus side there were plenty of people to talk to about the plans.

Can't wait for the project to be done - all the days of trains queueing outside Reading into Platform 4 may finally come to an end!?   :)

Boppy.


Title: Re: Views wanted on Reading railway station plans
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on June 11, 2010, 20:51:11
From getreading.co.uk (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2072653_reading_station_plans_still_on_say_network_rail):

Quote
Reading Station plans still on say Network Rail

Network Rail has rubbished claims made on BBC Berkshire Radio this morning that plans to redevelop Reading Station have been scrapped.

Work is already under way on the scheme to improve the station as part of a multi-million pound development and rail bosses have said rumours the plans were being scrapped by the Government were not accurate.

Russell Spink, Network Rail spokesman, said: ""The upgrade of Reading's railway is funded as part of our current funding settlement, which runs until 2014, and this settlement is not under review. The project is already under way; our engineers are already working at Caversham and Vastern Road bridges and on Napier Road. We recognise that we're operating in a tough economic environment and we are looking carefully at all of our projects to make sure we work efficiently and deliver value for money. However to suggest that the entire Reading project is suspended is simply not correct."

A Department for Transport (DfT) statement made yesterday said that all transport schemes were under review until they had been given the go-ahead by the new Government.

This includes the Cow Lane bridges aspect of the road network to be completed by Reading Borough Council that will be reviewed in the autumn but not the town centre area development that includes Station Hill, due to start later this month.

Mr Spink added: "We have the cash to carry out our projects which are unaffected by the announcement. The DfT^s announcement applies to local government transport schemes only. It^s important to make clear that Network Rail^s work at Cow Lane is part of our Reading project and is not affected by any cuts or reviews. The DfT money which is now under review was for the council to improve the roads nearby to get them ready for the extra traffic that will probably be using them when we widen the bridges".


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on June 12, 2010, 00:03:00
Let's hope Networkrail is right and there is funding for teh whole scheme, other wise it's in danger of becoming another Leeds rebuild in teh 50s/60s which kept getting started and stopped.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on June 18, 2010, 21:12:53
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/berkshire/10340577.stm):

Quote
Traffic concerns over bridge widening leads to footpath

A temporary footpath is being installed under a bridge which is being widened for the ^400m revamp of Reading railway station.

The pedestrian crossing at Vastern Road, which runs under the bridge, was removed so the roadworks could begin.

It was replaced with a diversion leading pedestrians around the Vastern Road roundabout but it is understood some people are walking into the road.

The council said pedestrian and motorist safety are a priority.

Richard Willis, Reading's lead councillor for transport and strategic planning, said: "I am pleased that improvements are to be made and hope that pedestrians and cyclists will find the new footpath safer to use."

Network Rail's improvements include five new platforms, an elevated railway and a new station entrance.

Vastern Road railway bridge is being widened to make way for new and longer train platforms, a spokeswoman said.

A row of pedestrian barriers will also be put in place along the east side of Vastern Road to protect pedestrians from traffic underneath the bridge.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on June 18, 2010, 23:50:59
Money being wasted just because some people can't be bothered to walk a little bit further..


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: John R on June 19, 2010, 10:20:18
And people wonder why projects over-run.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on July 08, 2010, 21:36:35
Work on the new bridge to the Waterloo platforms is clearly progressing now, and I'm curious as to what it will actually look like when finished. I am assuming that the new bridge will be double track and will serve both the current platform 4b and the new platform to be built next to 4b? Then I assume the 4a platform will be extended across the existing bridge, presumably with the platform deck straddling both existing and new bridges to serve both 4a and 4b? I'm curious as to where the new bridge and track will join the existing line, as there is quite a steep descent from the other side of the bridge.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on July 08, 2010, 22:36:13
All very good questions, and I don't know all the answers. I do know that there will be a third platform to the south of the existing platforms, that they wll all be extended (I think I was told 12 car) and that there will be a double track approach in place of the existing single lead. How they will make the gradients work is indeed an interesting question!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 09, 2010, 18:54:24
How they will make the gradients work is indeed an interesting question!

I took a look a while ago and reckoned on there being just enough room for 12-car platforms (if the buffers remain where they are now) before the gradient starts.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on July 12, 2010, 06:08:01
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/berkshire/10550464.stm):

Quote
Reading station to close over Christmas due to revamp

Festive rail passengers around Reading are to be hit with delays as the first part of a ^400m revamp starts.

Network Rail said it was the best time to carry out the work which will see the station partially shut from late on Christmas Eve until 4 January.

A bus replacement service will operate but some rail services will be allowed to run at busy times.

The station will be remodelled by 2013 to include five more platforms and two additional entrances.

Network Rail said: "We're working closely with First Great Western and other train operating companies to minimise the impact of this work on your journeys. There will be a frequent, efficient, replacement bus timetable, and plenty of staff on hand to help you on your journey."


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on July 12, 2010, 06:23:06
Going to be some interesting diversions on long distance services whilst this work takes place with West of England services diverted via Salisbury to Waterloo and Bristol/South Wales services operating via Banbury before heading down to Paddington.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: 6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01 on July 12, 2010, 10:23:14
will this be via yeovil or taunton


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on July 12, 2010, 11:03:58
I'd imagine that the up West of England services will run ususal route as far as Westbury, reverse then via Salisbury to Waterloo.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on July 12, 2010, 19:30:50
I'd imagine that the up West of England services will run ususal route as far as Westbury, reverse then via Salisbury to Waterloo.
Think thats the plan. That way a near normal service can operate on the Waterloo-Exeter line and Tiverton, Taunton, Castle Cary and Westbury still get a direct service to London.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on July 15, 2010, 15:02:14
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/berkshire/hi/people_and_places/newsid_8800000/8800604.stm):

Quote
Network Rail explain work over Christmas in Reading

Christmas seems a while away, especially in the middle of summer. But Network Rail has announced there will be significant works on the tracks in Reading over the festive period. The works are part of the first phase of ^400m worth of planned rail developments in the town.

But how will train-users be affected?

"We've got two really important jobs to do over Christmas," David Wilson from Network Rail said. "We will modernise the signalling for the whole of the Reading area. That's a huge job, which we've started already and will complete at Christmas. We've also got to replace a railway bridge over Caversham Road, to make way for new track and platforms for the station above. So they are two massive jobs. It's the sort of job you can only do by taking possession of the railway and unfortunately impacting on passenger services for a period."

Service disruption

There will be no train services on Christmas and Boxing Day, and work will continue into the New Year, David explained. "Obviously on Christmas Day and Boxing Day there wouldn't normally be services anyway, that's why we are doing the work then. But then there are two further Bank Holidays after Christmas Day and Boxing Day because it falls on a weekend this year. So we will be working through those Bank Holidays and the next two days as well. A large amount of our work will be done by the 30th of December. Whilst that work is going on there will be bus services to take people to where they want to go. We will re-open the station on New Year's Eve because we are aware a lot of people will want to travel then, and then we will be doing some work on the New Year's weekend but some trains will be running."

Snow danger

There is a danger that bad weather might cause further disruption to the services. David explained that there is a contingency plan for that. "We are planning very carefully. Everyone saw what happened in Reading last Christmas. We are well aware of the impact of bad weather and making really good contingency plans, just in case we get snow or wind. We will be ready."

Reading Station will get the revamp by 2013 and work is currently underway on Caversham and Vastern Road bridges and on Napier Road.

"We are lucky with the Reading project," David said. "Our funding has been agreed. We've got that in the bag from the Government. Obviously, like any large construction projects at the moment, we are aware of the tough financial circumstances we are operating in and we're looking at the project to see how we can deliver it as efficiently as possible. But the Reading project is definitely going ahead."

Bottle neck

Mike Greedy from Passenger Focus, an independent watchdog, explained how the group is backing the plan.

"I think this is the only way of going about it. Reading is a national bottle neck for passengers. All of us using Reading find a severe disruption because of limitations on the infrastructure there. So this has got to be good news for passengers. We're satisfied they are doing this at the best time of year to cause the least disruption. We've been working very closely with Network Rail and First Great Western to make sure they have the best contingency plans because this must be re-opened for the start of business again on the 4th of January. Everyone is well aware of that and we're fairly confident they have the right plans in place to do this."



Winter 2010 services are as follows:

Christmas Day and Boxing Day - No services scheduled.

27 December to 30 December, 2010
- All train lines through Reading will be closed.

First Great Western will put on alternative transport for local services to, from and through Reading.

New Year's Eve - All routes will be open. A Bank Holiday service will operate including additional trains from London.

New Year's Day through to 3 January, 2011
- Long distance train services will run to and from London via diversionary routes. All other routes will be open, with a Bank Holiday service in operation.

Monday, 4 January - Normal scheduled trains services are expected to run.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 15, 2010, 16:27:13
Does that seem to imply that diverted long distance services will only run over New Year weekend?

I.E. on the 27th -30th it'll be local bustitution only as they expect only minimal work travel during the intermediate week?  I'm not criticising, btw, I think they have discovered there is a major reduction in travel during that week in recent years, with a lot of businesses closing for the duration.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on July 16, 2010, 00:10:50
Does that seem to imply that diverted long distance services will only run over New Year weekend?

I.E. on the 27th -30th it'll be local bustitution only as they expect only minimal work travel during the intermediate week?  I'm not criticising, btw, I think they have discovered there is a major reduction in travel during that week in recent years, with a lot of businesses closing for the duration.

Paul

It's not as clear as it should be but bear in mind this is a BBC Berkshire report, aimed at people living in and around Reading, for whom all FGW services for most of the period affected will be bus-shaped, so what the diverted trains are up to is neither here not there for them.

The FGW website has a dedicated page giving details of what's going to happen http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=4888 and there are already posters up at stations warning people there will be work at Reading over Christmas and New Year.

Just hope the email update service is better organised than the one for the Cotswold Line work - if anything has been sent out by FGW since last summer, I haven't received it.


Title: Reading Blockade - Xmas 2010
Post by: A V Lowe on July 25, 2010, 11:30:42
Just looked at the FGW website - reading this about Reading you might imagine that the FGW blockade was only affecting the GW Main Line.  There is mention of just Didcot and Twyford.  Nothing about the SWT/North Downs route which could presumably continue to operate as I suspect Reading is an end-on junction at the interface between power boxes and a relatively simple connection to commission.

No mention either of the Newbury and Basingstoke routes and whether the XC services will still run via Didcot and the West curve to Basingstoke.  Presumably this is currently at T minus 26 stage of fine tuning the plans and filling in the details, preparing for the T minus 12 download to the National Timetable.

Almost worth inviting a contribution towards the Evergreen 3 Bicester-Oxford project as a diversionary route for the future albeit unlikely to deliver much in time for the substantially greater work taking place at Reading.  I also wonder if the West Curve connection to Basingstoke remains open, whether a '1-week' Workington North platform detail could save a substantial number of replacement coaches from Didcot , and put something at (or near) the proposed Green Park site.     


Title: Re: Reading Blockade - Xmas 2010
Post by: Electric train on July 25, 2010, 11:49:58
I believe that Reading will be blocked to all trains http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/7585.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/7585.aspx) not sure how this will affect cross-country trains but as the works over Christmas is the relocation of signaling from Reading Box to Didcot this will affect the whole of the immediate Reading area interlocking.



Title: Re: Reading Blockade - Xmas 2010
Post by: eightf48544 on July 25, 2010, 12:46:40
As far as I know all routes around Reading (including West Curve and Winnersh) are out over Xmas.

The only sevice diversions I've heard about are some HSTs taking the Foxhall curve at Didcot and reversing at Banbury for Padd. I still need the Foxhall curve.

Whether XC would run via Salisbury and Bristol. But it would mean a lot of route learing unless they can hire in FGW pilotmen.


Title: Re: Reading Blockade - Xmas 2010
Post by: A V Lowe on July 25, 2010, 14:48:42
I gather that WC will run from Waterloo and Cotswolds via Banbury may get more detail soon.  That still doesn't answer SWT and North Downs.


Title: Re: Reading Blockade - Xmas 2010
Post by: Oxman on July 25, 2010, 14:51:57
Cross Country will stop/start at Didcot and Basingstoke. Coaches between Didcot and Reading, Reading and Basingstoke, and Didcot and Winchester (quicker and easier than Basingstoke).

SWT and North Downs will stop/start at Wokingham, coaches Reading - Wokingham.

Kennet Valley will stop/start Theale, coaches Theale and Reading.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: inspector_blakey on July 25, 2010, 17:18:11
We've inadvertently ended up with two thread running on the work happening at Reading over Christmas. To keep all the info on thsi subject in one place, I've moved the original thread from the "London to Reading" board to "Across the West", since this will have a significant impact on FGW's high-speed and LTV operations. And I've merged in the thread started by A V Lowe. Hope that's reasonably clear to everyone!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 25, 2010, 23:30:40
It's a little small, but here's a schematic diagram of the bus/train plans for Reading this Xmas:

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4098/4828616862_49fbb83192_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Mookiemoo on July 25, 2010, 23:33:13
Worcester doesnt get 1TPH now - let alone then!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 26, 2010, 12:13:20
No FGW into Waterloo then.   :o

That was never any more than rumour anyway.  It hasn't ever been mentioned in the NR 'rules of the route' for the period of the blockade. 

I suppose there's still a possibility that Exeter - Waterloo services get strengthened to maximum length?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on July 26, 2010, 12:32:21
FGW will be serving Waterloo during the blockade. But only with West of England services.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 26, 2010, 13:20:02
FGW will be serving Waterloo during the blockade. But only with West of England services.

Is that map wrong already then? It clearly shows the 1 tph WoE via Didcot and Banbury, and a Taunton - Theale.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 26, 2010, 13:41:45
It first surfaced about 6 months ago, so may well have been updated or changed since then.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 26, 2010, 13:49:39
Or that map has superceded the one Ollie refers to?....

I prefer to think the mapo on thwe previous page is old - that they realised that 1tph to cover both WoE AND Bristol was just not do-able in terms of capacity and went away to re-think....

I understand that both Wales & Bristol services come via Banbury (well, one actually reverses at BAN, the other with reverse in a turn-back to be constructed at Aynho Junction, hence the crossover mentioned in another thread...) and down the Chiltern to PAD...

The WoE services to go via Waterloo.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on July 26, 2010, 18:11:44
I prefer to think the map on the previous page is old - that they realised that 1tph to cover both WoE AND Bristol was just not do-able in terms of capacity and went away to re-think....
Asking for trouble combining Bristol with WoE IMHO so good job they are thinking again.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on July 26, 2010, 20:32:37
As I understand it:

Hourly services between:

Padd - Bristol, via Banbury (not for passenger use), Oxford (pick up/set down) and Foxhall, not calling Didcot.
Padd - Swansea, as above.
West Country - Exeter - Taunton - Westbury - Salisbury - Waterloo
North Cots - Didcot (ok, maybe not every hour)
Cheltenham - Didcot
Bristol - Bath - Westbury - Newbury - Theale.

Should be fun!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 26, 2010, 20:41:35
So, those from Cheltenham have to change @ Swindon to pick up the Bristol / Swanseas in order to get to London?

And North Cotswolds pick up the same trains @ Oxford, I guess?

With no direct London services for Didcot?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on July 26, 2010, 21:09:30
Correct


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on July 26, 2010, 21:12:34
I have several maps similar to the one posted. With varying service levels based on the date during the blockade.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on July 26, 2010, 22:38:35
May well be able to manage an hourly Cotswold service for the duration, as presumably it will be Turbos anyway and fewer will be needed in the Thames Valley with no Oxford semi-fasts to cover.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 27, 2010, 19:53:05
Meanwhile, there's still absolutely no sign of any physical works at Banbury connected with this turnback provision for platforms 1 and 2.  Only five months to go, so I would expect things to start happening imminently, or it'll be a rush job!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 27, 2010, 21:45:19
Should be do-able in a weekend.....

The turn-back at Aynho Junction will take longer, I reckon - there's some major line closures in early November - Friday 5th for the weekend. I reckon that'll be it....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 28, 2010, 02:41:09
Should be do-able in a weekend.....

The turn-back at Aynho Junction will take longer, I reckon - there's some major line closures in early November - Friday 5th for the weekend. I reckon that'll be it....

I'd have expected to see bases for signals appearing and other preliminary work before the actual commissioning soon though.  As for Aynho, is the turn-back going to be a separate siding off of the main line?  If not, there's already a position light signal on the Down Main, so I presume that's simply going to be changed to a main aspect signal?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 28, 2010, 09:01:16
As for Aynho, is the turn-back going to be a separate siding off of the main line? 

As I understood it from our local NR Manager, yes.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 28, 2010, 10:29:53
OK, thanks Chris.  That will indeed be a bigger job then - though hopefully mostly non-disruptive.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 28, 2010, 20:41:27
I have my doubts about this being a siding, the network change proposal of Jan 2010 describes the work as:

"Upgrade of Existing Signals to Main Signals to Provide a Turn Back Capability".

In their response to the proposal, DB Schenker wrote:

"Whilst understanding the usefulness of the proposed facilities as a way of providing through access between the Didcot and Paddington areas during periods when direct routes via Reading are unavailable, DB Schenker has some concerns over the use of the crossover at Aynho Junction on account of the periods during which the drivers will be changing ends on the Down Line and northbound paths for other traffic will be unavailable. DB Schenker wishes to see evidence of robust timetable planning which maintains the availability of paths for other traffic using the route."

So as I said, that doesn't sound like a siding, of course things could have changed since then.  Unfortunately NR only rarely publish the drawings that go with their Network Change proposals...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 29, 2010, 09:34:08
You're right - that sounds like a turn-back on the down line, utilising the crossover that Chiltern are putting in under EG3. :o

This will also require trackside running boards as the driver changes ends *outside* of the HST...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 29, 2010, 11:25:05
Ah, OK - I did think a siding was a bit extravagant!  There is already a crossing there (albeit a slower speed one than the Evergreen 3 project will provide), so, for this Xmas at least, I expect that will be utilised and a simple upgrade of the position light signal to a main aspect signal.  Trains having reversed there could then access the Chiltern Line via that crossing.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on July 29, 2010, 12:03:30
Isn't the current one in the wrong direction (up to down?)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: anthony215 on July 29, 2010, 17:06:54
Any idea what stock is to work this service:

Bristol - Bath - Westbury - Newbury - Theale

I know it may be possible for a class 165/166 to be used since they used to run Bristol to Oxford


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: grahame on July 29, 2010, 17:19:39
Any idea what stock is to work this service:

Bristol - Bath - Westbury - Newbury - Theale

I know it may be possible for a class 165/166 to be used since they used to run Bristol to Oxford

It would need to be 125 / 142 / 143 / 150 / 153 / 158

165 / 166 not cleared between Bath and Westbury


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 29, 2010, 18:25:33
Isn't the current one in the wrong direction (up to down?)

No, it's from the down to the up as you face towards London, so to reverse a train would run beyond the signal (that's being upgraded from a position light), the driver would change ends, and then move via the crossing to the Up Main (then either Up Main, the Up Loop, or the Up Chiltern Line).  There's a farm overbridge directly over where the signal is located.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on July 29, 2010, 18:35:35
Bristol - Theale will be HSTs, with a temporary platform built at Theale to accomodate.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on July 29, 2010, 19:08:24
253/4 can work the chiltern line


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: qwerty on July 30, 2010, 16:03:10
This will also require trackside running boards as the driver changes ends *outside* of the HST...

Safe walking Route. Any place where Drivers change end outside the train will be risk assessed and approved as part of the project. The safe walking route can be the cess if it is level and no adjacent running line.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 30, 2010, 17:15:10
Might it not be quicker and safer to 'double man' the trains between Oxford and wherever?

It's only for a few days after all, with a much reduced number of services, AIUI.  Apparently this was the solution agreed with Virgin when they were diverting their double and triple Voyagers via the Chilterns which had a couple of reversals into Euston...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Tim on July 30, 2010, 17:27:22
This will also require trackside running boards as the driver changes ends *outside* of the HST...

Safe walking Route. Any place where Drivers change end outside the train will be risk assessed and approved as part of the project. The safe walking route can be the cess if it is level and no adjacent running line.



Can't the driver change ends inside the train?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on July 30, 2010, 17:34:52
Driver still has to do a lamp check at each end though.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on July 30, 2010, 17:45:35
This will also require trackside running boards as the driver changes ends *outside* of the HST...

Safe walking Route. Any place where Drivers change end outside the train will be risk assessed and approved as part of the project. The safe walking route can be the cess if it is level and no adjacent running line.



Can't the driver change ends inside the train?
oooo too much like hard work scrabbling through a packed and standing train


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on July 30, 2010, 21:11:19
oooo too much like hard work scrabbling through a packed and standing train
Or perhaps it's quicker, than walking through the train when it has passengers on it..
As said driver will need to get off anyway to check lights at each end..


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 31, 2010, 01:05:32
If it was a Turbo (2 or 3-car) they'd probably change ends without leaving the train ('proving' lights in the cab confirm what the head/tail lights are showing).  Although it is possible to change ends on a HST without leaving the train, you'd have to be pretty desperate to want to do so, as squeezing through the engine room of two cabs with engines blaring away would not be pleasant on either the heat or noise front!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: woody on July 31, 2010, 09:57:18
FGW will be serving Waterloo during the blockade. But only with West of England services.
Read on another forum that quote "A notice has gone up that the guards will be starting route learning soon."
Can anyone confirm or deny?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on August 02, 2010, 11:30:39
The reversals at Aynho will have to wait, I suspect!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: onthecushions on August 26, 2010, 18:55:50

Slight deviation.

Alighting at Reading last night off the 1922 to Hereford, in the midst of a downpour, many customers had to leap through sheets of water overflowing from the unmaintained platform canopy gutters. No pensioners fortunately (except me!). Thoughtfully, the gutters contrived to overflow at just the 23 m car lengths needed and the train drew up so that the doors were precisely sited under the respective Niagaras.

Risking prosecution (you may be accused of swearing etc), I suggested to platform staff, including a supervisor that this was a safety issue as customers could not step down safely and water was flowing freely down both sides of the open doors into the electric locking mechanism...

I was told that it was a Network Rail station and that nothing would be done as it was all to be rebuilt. It wasn't a safety issue of course, until someone was injured....

If all NR and FGW's horses and men can't economically attach a gutter to a bargeboard at the right fall and keep the downpipe clear, then we are wasting our time thinking of new stations, electrification etc.

Isn't Reading General is a FGW site?

OTC


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on August 26, 2010, 19:42:20
Reading station is leased from NR by FGW. NR are responsible for maintenance of the canopies.

Its unlikely that the gutter is the problem. In common with many other stations the drains are just not adequate in a torrential downpoor - rain water backs up, and overflows from the gutters. You probably noticed that the back of platform 4 becomes a lake as water floods out of the drainpipes and the drain is unable to cope.

We can only hope that the rebuild starts some way underground, with adequate drainage!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 27, 2010, 01:10:42
In common with many other stations the drains are just not adequate in a torrential downpoor - rain water backs up, and overflows from the gutters.

And not just stations - the drainage on many public buildings/surfaces can't cope with some of the heaviest bursts of rain like some of the stuff that was coming down from the heavens last night.  Like with the safety hazards that heavy snowfall cause - I'm thinking back to the fact that some pavements were icy hazards for well over a week last winter - I think you just have to shrug your shoulders and accept that certain conditions will inevitably cause your own safety to be compromised slightly on occasions.  Look on the bright side, at least you weren't trying to pitch a tent at Reading festival!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ReWind on August 27, 2010, 09:11:47
A bit like platform 7 at Bristol TM then.  ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: SDS on August 28, 2010, 00:54:11
You should see PAD when it rains.
plat 3 london end under the massively huge roof, it leaks badly.
plat 1 country end it is a downpour.
plat 6/7 are fine, but thats cos hex get what they want.
plat 8/9 is a running river
10 is fine
11 turns into a river, right where the pax run for trains.
13/14 being rebuilt by crossrail.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on August 28, 2010, 10:07:07
You should see PAD when it rains.
plat 3 london end under the massively huge roof, it leaks badly.
plat 1 country end it is a downpour.
plat 6/7 are fine, but thats cos hex get what they want.
plat 8/9 is a running river
10 is fine
11 turns into a river, right where the pax run for trains.
13/14 being rebuilt by crossrail.

The roof at Padd deals with heavy rain quite well given the age of it's drainage, part of the problem is and always has been is the way the Victorians built the drains, the pipes away from the down pipes (the down pipes are internal to the columns) are too small and have bends that silt up quickly.  When I first worked at Padd in the late 70's the District Civil Engineer had a team of men who spent quite a lot of their year cleaning out the roof gutters and gullies
To modify the drainage would mean virtually digging the whole station up this one reason way 6 & 7 is dryer because the drains were renewed when the HEX (now disused) baggage tunnel was built


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: smokey on August 28, 2010, 10:40:42
Reading station is leased from NR by FGW. NR are responsible for maintenance of the canopies.

Its unlikely that the gutter is the problem. In common with many other stations the drains are just not adequate in a torrential downpoor - rain water backs up, and overflows from the gutters. You probably noticed that the back of platform 4 becomes a lake as water floods out of the drainpipes and the drain is unable to cope.

We can only hope that the rebuild starts some way underground, with adequate drainage!

On today's Railway whilst NR own the Stations maintenance, painting etc is done by FGW or it's contractors up to I believe 2.5 m high then NR take over Except for lighting and Guttering which is a FGW problem, but as there is no FGW maintenance programm to keep guttering clean problems occur.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on August 28, 2010, 12:00:20
But if you point out there are problems with blocked gutters to them, they usually do something about. I emailed FGW customer services about water pouring through the platform 2 canopy at Oxford in several places early this year or late last year and the next time I was there when there was a torrential downpour (only a week or two later) it was clear someone had been up top and cleared the gutters and fallpipes.

Paddington is entirely NR's responsibility as a major station. Presumably matters at the platforms under under span four will be improved by the current restoration work and removal of the crash deck.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: onthecushions on August 29, 2010, 22:45:01

It's one thing for customers to get wet when it rains.

It's quite another to make them pass through a vertical sheet of water caused by neglect.

Just removing the canopy gutters would reduce the problem, as water would not then be chanelled from a wide area onto the carriage doorways.

Today's Engineers seem lost if something can't be done by Autocad, Microsoft Project, or FEA.

Well done at Paddington for trying, though

Drying nicely,

OTC



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 30, 2010, 11:08:57
Presumably matters at the platforms under under span four will be improved by the current restoration work and removal of the crash deck.

At the moment there's not really a roof over span 4 to speak of whilst it's being renovated.  Temporary plastic and metal sheeting is stopping the worst of the water getting through, but there are a few spots which are really bad when it rains, and the contractors have their staff constantly clearing water off of the platforms when it has rained heavily.  This time next year the place will be transformed though and hopefully it'll be nice and dry because those nice shiny tiled slabs on the floor and water don't mix too well.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on August 30, 2010, 15:22:56
Presumably matters at the platforms under under span four will be improved by the current restoration work and removal of the crash deck.
This time next year the place will be transformed though and hopefully it'll be nice and dry because those nice shiny tiled slabs on the floor and water don't mix too well.

Them nice shiny slabs are French Limestone, very expensive, when the station was being refurbed for the HEX project the Architects did not like Yorkstone great grip but no shine you see, it does look better than the 1980's BR aberration of Terrazzo


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 30, 2010, 15:41:26
Yes it has a very attractive finish and a few of the newly tiled areas that have been uncovered show a perfect match with the older ones.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on September 15, 2010, 22:23:08
Found a letter on NR's website all about the diversions over Christmas/New Year:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/reading%20programme/fgw%20vehicle%20change%20proposal%20reading%20diversions%2027%2008%2010.pdf (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/reading%20programme/fgw%20vehicle%20change%20proposal%20reading%20diversions%2027%2008%2010.pdf)

Indicates amongst other things that all diversionary routes will be pretty generously timed.

Hope this is of interest to someone...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on September 16, 2010, 06:22:57
Very interesting, thanks for posting this Paul. There hasn't been much info released about the Reading closure to date so this is useful.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on September 16, 2010, 10:06:42
There won't be, until both the timetable and bus arrangements are complete, sometime next month.

The Customer Panel are likely to be briefed towards the middle of October & I'll of course report back once that's happened.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on September 27, 2010, 01:17:21
Journey planners now have times live for the week between Christmas and New Year, so you can get an idea of services during the Reading closure.

Two trains per hour between Oxford and London via the Chiltern Line, timings are for 1hr 58 towards London and 1hr 45 the other way, so with all Chiltern and W&S's services as well, it will be pretty busy between Banbury and Ruislip.

One train per hour between the West Country and Waterloo, with 3hrs 26mins allowed for Taunton to Waterloo and 3hrs 3mins the other way.

Not clear whether the timing differences are down to pathing issues on the diversion routes, or whether our old friend Mr Padding has reared his head as well.

NB On further study, should qualify that by saying some times for that week are in the FGW journey planner - but not on National Rail yet - and while FGW's site will give the two sample journeys given above, it refuses to offer any suggestions for Moreton-in-Marsh to London at present, so looks like not all timings are sorted out for connecting routes yet.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on September 27, 2010, 09:32:44
M-i-M to LOndon will be a change at Oxford into one of the Chiltern diversion trains.

THe Chiltern TT is being reduced to 2 tph between London & Banbury to make room for the HSTs.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on September 27, 2010, 10:31:12
M-i-M to LOndon will be a change at Oxford into one of the Chiltern diversion trains.

Chris, I'm aware of the need to change if doing MIM-PAD over that period but just noted that no details of it were in the system yet, in case anyone else was looking for a journey that week that didn't involve using the diverted direct trains, which, based on a few quick searches last night, appeared to be all that had been uploaded to the website so far. Eg searching for MIM-WOS that week came up blank too.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on September 27, 2010, 10:35:25
You might be, others may not be....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on September 27, 2010, 14:51:40
One train per hour between the West Country and Waterloo, with 3hrs 26mins allowed for Taunton to Waterloo and 3hrs 3mins the other way.

There was only 10 mins difference between Westbury and Waterloo when I checked earlier, so that 23 min suggests there's a wait somewhere west of, or more likely at Westbury.   Presumably they'll have to fit in around other services there anyway but I expect the 10 min up/down difference will be the normal extra time to enter Waterloo.  Note that the TAA I linked to earlier suggests they are using 158/9 timings in the SW area, ie 90 mph.

Paul

Edited, because as written earlier it seemed like a contradiction...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on September 27, 2010, 18:33:14
You might be, others may not be....

Sorry to labour the point. What I was trying to get across was that what I initially posted suggested that all the timetable was uploaded, as I had only tried the Oxford and Taunton journeys at that point. I amended the post later to point out that information for other journeys wasn't there yet - and still isn't - in case someone was looking for a journey, got no answer from the FGW site and thought I was talking nonsense about the timetable being online. Hope that's clear.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on September 27, 2010, 20:31:34
No problem, willc - thanks for your clarification.  :)

(I'm sure nobody here would have thought you could ever talk nonsense on the subject, though.)  ;) :D ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: anthony215 on October 02, 2010, 17:42:19
A timetable for the  Penzance - Plymouth - Westbury - London Waterloo servie has been posted up on uk railforums:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=505152#post505152

More details on that thread


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 02, 2010, 19:47:49
Note:  That link does not work for those of us who are not members of RailUK forums.  ::)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 02, 2010, 20:09:11
And the timetable shown on said link is in no way an official release.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: anthony215 on October 02, 2010, 21:46:45
Note:  That link does not work for those of us who are not members of RailUK forums.  ::)

Oops sorry, I forgot about that. As for the timetable, I thought it was a bit strange,


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 02, 2010, 23:23:21
And the timetable shown on said link is in no way an official release.

It's probably a direct crib from the journey planners, (he did the same a week or two back for the XC Southampton extensions); so about as accurate as anything could be at the moment, pending any last minute revisions to the TSDB. 

I think they're unlikely to chnage much now...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 04, 2010, 09:58:29
It's attached to this post for anyone that wants to see it...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: XPT on October 04, 2010, 18:26:11
A timetable for the  Penzance - Plymouth - Westbury - London Waterloo servie has been posted up on uk railforums:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=505152#post505152

More details on that thread

The timings of these services are a little different to the timings that are back on the FGW site.  The services out of London Waterloo depart at xx:26, with the first service departing at 1026.

The timings for the services to and from Bristol and South Wales are back online on FGW too.

Just a couple of weeks now before cheap advance tickets on these services are bookable.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 04, 2010, 20:15:16
BUT....those timings twixt WAterloo & Basingstoke! Around 90 minutes!??


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 04, 2010, 20:22:30
Despite the timings, (which may not be finalised) it's still a darn site better than a rail replacement bus.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 04, 2010, 20:26:10
SWT do it generally in 45-50 minutes....ok, I realise the HSTs are going the long way round, but nevertheless, 90 minutes? Just hpw long will they sit at Basingstoke?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 04, 2010, 21:15:11
I did mention in an earlier post that up trains had 10 mins of extra time over down trains between BAS and WAT, and we also know they are timed as 158/159s; it is already known that they're taking the long way round via Staines, and as far as Barnes Jn they'll be pathed in amongst other SWT services, either via Feltham or Hounslow.

Comparing that with SWT's timings whenever they make the same diversion (which is happening again this weekend by chance) would confirm they are using the usual diversionary timings.  The SWT website explains that this weekend mainline services will run in their normal times west of Woking, but depart from Waterloo half an hour earlier, (and vice versa).  Interestingly, to make this happen the Windsor service gets thinned out to make room - I haven't heard of that happening during the Reading blockade.

Here's the DMU diversion timings for example:

http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/uploads/101024woe.pdf (http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/uploads/101024woe.pdf)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on October 04, 2010, 21:15:49
They are also due to stop at Clapham Junction, though hopefully not for 40 minutes or there would be gridlock!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 04, 2010, 23:40:08
Without the working book it is difficult to judge I assumme the HSTs are sloted in between the stoppers and semi fasts. Ideally in the slot before both.

Be interesting to see the graph between Virgina Water and Feltham Junction which is the bottle neck. I imagine they'll be running on yellows most of the way.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on October 05, 2010, 07:35:51
A timetable for the  Penzance - Plymouth - Westbury - London Waterloo servie has been posted up on uk railforums:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=505152#post505152

More details on that thread

The timings of these services are a little different to the timings that are back on the FGW site.  The services out of London Waterloo depart at xx:26, with the first service departing at 1026.

The timings for the services to and from Bristol and South Wales are back online on FGW too.

Just a couple of weeks now before cheap advance tickets on these services are bookable.

It would appear that the xx26 timings are the bank holiday times (27th and 28th), and those xx33 timings are the normal weekday timings.

SWT do it generally in 45-50 minutes....ok, I realise the HSTs are going the long way round, but nevertheless, 90 minutes? Just hpw long will they sit at Basingstoke?

FGW services are restricted to the slow lines all the way because there are something like 25 bridges that would require strengthening for a HST power car to go over them on the fast lines.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 05, 2010, 13:59:20
FGW services are restricted to the slow lines all the way because there are something like 25 bridges that would require strengthening for a HST power car to go over them on the fast lines.

In fact the oppposite is probably true.

If you read the NR document I linked to a while ago (15th Sept) it reports that:

"Around twenty minutes pathing time exists in both up and down Waterloo paths giving robust headroom, including for any speed restriction that may be necessary at the one remaining bridge under gauging assessment between Basingstoke and Byfleet Junction."

It also says that:

"No additional speed restrictions through gauging are expected except between Basingstoke and Byfleet Junction where routing via the slow lines will result in slow speed over two underbridges, however trains are timetabled over the fast lines where no restriction applies.

That first paragraph alone answers most of the last few comments about the slack timings...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 05, 2010, 14:03:05
Thanks - that answers my question - there could be up to 20 minutes hanging around at Basingstoke. Time plenty for a smoke then....:-)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: readytostart on October 05, 2010, 14:13:49
Thanks - that answers my question - there could be up to 20 minutes hanging around at Basingstoke. Time plenty for a smoke then....:-)

Just remember it's pick up / set down only at BSK, if you get off coming in from the West Country they might not let you back on!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 05, 2010, 14:27:39
good point!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on October 07, 2010, 20:16:20
I've noticed work taking place on bridges both the East and the West of the station. To the East, over Vastern Rd what look to me like preparatory work for a new bridge next to the Waterloo lines has been done, which I'd assumed was for the extended platforms and third platform there. To the West, over Caversham Rd, two old sections of bridge have been taken away on the northern side of the tracks.

Now, I'd got the impression from Rail that during the Christmas possession one of these bridges, Caversham Rd I think, is to be completely replaced, which I'd assumed to mean the whole width, including lines still in use. But I don't see why this would be needed for the Caversham Rd bridge, as the old sections of bridge have already been demolished, so I'm unclear why the rest of the bridge would have to go? And when will the new Waterloo line bridge be installed?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 07, 2010, 23:21:05
The moral of the story?  Don't necessarily rely on 'Rail' for accuracy. AFAICS Network Rail explain it is only the northern two spans that are to be replaced:

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAIL-BRIDGE-REMOVAL-PREPARES-GROUND-FOR-CHRISTMAS-WORKS-1576/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAIL-BRIDGE-REMOVAL-PREPARES-GROUND-FOR-CHRISTMAS-WORKS-1576/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx)

I reckon what they are doing is putting in a much wider span at the north side only, so that they can relay the relief lines further north in due course.  Then they'll have room to do more changes to the track layout on the remaining spans.  A sketch I have indicates that there will be 11 tracks over the bridge, there are 8 at the moment.

PS...   Comparing that right hand picture on NR's press release with Google Maps, it looks as though they have filled in that small space at the east side of Caversham Rd, ie between the road and end of the old viaduct shown being used as a carpark - perhaps about a 20ft square space?  That'll give quite a bit of extra width (from the rail perspective)...

Paul

(BTW - isn't it odd that this was in NR's London and Southeast, not the Wales and West area of the media section...)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 07, 2010, 23:32:35
(BTW - isn't it odd that this was in NR's London and Southeast, not the Wales and West area of the media section...)

Thanks, Paul - that would perhaps help to explain why I didn't pick that up, in my regular trawl for news items relating to the FGW area ... ???


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 07, 2010, 23:49:33
Quote
(BTW - isn't it odd that this was in NR's London and Southeast, not the Wales and West area of the media section...)

Just the way that the NR press offices operation is organised. London and Southeast covers roughly the old BR Network South East area. Wales and West is everything west of Didcot. There is some crossover, eg Cotswold Line is normally an L&SE route in news terms but redoubling project news is handled by Wales and West, as the project team and the Wales and West press officer are based in Swindon.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 08, 2010, 09:59:17
The moral of the story?  Don't necessarily rely on 'Rail' for accuracy.

Or Modern Railways.....at last, others are realising what I worked out a while ago - that they are trawling these & other boards and Newsgroups for their editorial, and running stories without checking with press offices.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 08, 2010, 17:18:34
Had a look at the concrete work at the north end of the Caversham Road bridge this morning.
The 'block in the corner' I mentioned earlier seems to add about 25ft to that side's abutment (along the line of the road), and on the west side of the road between the fire station and the railway there is reinforced concrete piling in place to form the foundations for another new abutment, probably about 15-20 ft wide as well, so I guess the S&C for the track 'fan out' to the eventual platforms 14 and 15 will start some way to the west of the bridge.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on October 08, 2010, 20:20:48
...
I reckon what they are doing is putting in a much wider span at the north side only, so that they can relay the relief lines further north in due course.  Then they'll have room to do more changes to the track layout on the remaining spans.  A sketch I have indicates that there will be 11 tracks over the bridge, there are 8 at the moment.

PS...   Comparing that right hand picture on NR's press release with Google Maps, it looks as though they have filled in that small space at the east side of Caversham Rd, ie between the road and end of the old viaduct shown being used as a carpark - perhaps about a 20ft square space?  That'll give quite a bit of extra width (from the rail perspective)...

Paul
...

That certainly seems likely, though the Google picture also shows quite a big gap between the fast and relief lines over the bridge, so I wonder if they plan to fill that as well, if you think there's 3 more tracks to go in?

Does anyone know more about what is planned on the Vastern Rd bridge, where the extra Waterloo platform is going in?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 08, 2010, 21:30:56
I'll try and describe what it ends up like, as I haven't a detailed linkable drawing to hand.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6341.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6341.aspx)  gives an idea but it's important to note it doesn't show all the tracks.  (If someone has a better drawing link please put it up, thanks.)

At the moment you have the three fast lines between P4 and P5, but there will eventually be just two tracks there, a 'down Newbury' through P7, (the current P4 built out), and a down fast P8 (current P5) and a second down fast P9, being roughly where the current P8 is.   A second island allows for two up fast lines through P10/11.

There will also be four relief line platforms and tracks, another two islands.

So ignoring the four southern most tracks as seen on Google for a moment, then you've basically got seven more lines south to north across the site, one in hte rough position of the current P8, (down relief) then three more islands with six tracks.

I'm assuming that the bridge they're about to install at Christmas will definitely carry at least two tracks towards the up relief island, possibly a third for the P13 down relief.  I also assume that the southern four tracks will be in roughly the same position as now, so the remaining current spans will need to carry four or five tracks.

However what would be really useful to see is a scale drawing of the completed station, but all I've ever seen are schematics, which don't really give you the relative positions of the four finished island platforms, although I have heard that the current P10 will be remodelled and extended west to form the new P11, if that makes sense. 

It wouldn't surprise me if a few more bridge spans get repositioned slightly, even if they aren't replaced, and of course there'll have to be a number of transitional layouts, for instance the two new island platforms will be built first, P12/13 and P14/15.  Once they are in use they'll have a huge amount of working space between the mains and reliefs to play with.

All I know about Vastern Rd is that there will be two tracks splitting into three platform lines somewhere east of the bridge, the platforms cross the bridge, and it is all very tight between the existing railway boundary and the various buildings...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on October 08, 2010, 22:03:57
Thanks Paul,

I've seen the Network Rail diagram, but as you say it is only schematic and it is hard to relate it to what is going on there at the moment. Indeed, looking from trains when passing through it is very hard to see how  another two island platforms will fit on the other side of the current p9/10!

I've been watching the work going on on the eastern side of Vastern Rd from my train as I commute to Wokingham. As you say, it is very squeezed, particularly now that large new office block has been constructed. It looks like they've started to build a retaining wall from where the new section of bridge will end, back to the current trackbed, presumably this will then be filled in to create the new trackbed. The new concrete abutment that has been built is currently at the same level as the footpath at the top of that bank, well below the level of the track, so I'm assuming the new bridge will have quite a high support structure on top of the concrete base.

Yesterday it looked like the traffic has now been moved away from the western side of the road, presumably so that piling can start on the other side.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 09, 2010, 11:04:48
Indeed, looking from trains when passing through it is very hard to see how  another two island platforms will fit on the other side of the current p9/10!

It is going to be a bit of a squeeze, but don't forget that the brick buildings which house the current panel box and equipment will all be demolished along with parking spaces, so there's just enough room.  The extension to 4A/B and the third 'southern' platform will be an incredibly tight fit.

It's worth looking at a close-up in Google Earth, as there's an 8-car train in Platform 4b which gives you a very good idea how far the 12-car length platforms will be, extending all the way over Vastern Road.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 09, 2010, 12:12:08
Although perhaps not given a much publicity as the new mainline platforms and flyovers the third "Southern" Platform will be a big improvement for pasengers on the Waterloo and North Downs services. Giving as it does a 3rd platform and more importantly eliminating the single track bottleneck over Vastern Road bridge.

Sometime back they (NSE?) managed to derail a train on the bridge. Total chaos for the electric services.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on October 09, 2010, 12:16:22
................. and its all being built Crossrail "friendly"


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 09, 2010, 12:26:47
................. and its all being built Crossrail "friendly"

Let's hope that in the spending review Crossrail isn't given the go ahead to Maidenhead and GWML electrification is posponed.

Which means they will spend millions on the turnback sidings at Maidenhead which will be totally unecessary once the wires reach Reading. One option I've heard (unsubstantiated) is that Crossrail's Central  London Tunnel and the Eastern links will go ahead, but the wires will only be extended to West Drayton which is currently a designated turnback point.

This actually makes a lot of sense as it causes less damage to the Reading to Ealing Broadway local services than splitting at Maidenhead.

You can have a mixed semifast/stopping  servce Reading Hayes Ealing Padd (as today) and an all stations West Drayton Shenfied/Abbey Wood. However, they'd probably have to cut down to 20tph through the tunnel.
 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on October 09, 2010, 16:00:57
There is NO reduction in the planned Crossrail stations, the significant change is on the Abbey Wood branch where third rail is going to be used on the surface and the Connaught tunnel (form North Woolwich line).

Even if Crossrail reaches Reading and the GWML is electrified as far as Oxford it could still make sense terminating local stoppers at Maidenhead with a similar service pattern used before the Heathrow Connect days with the terminating at Slough.  Currently the XX:42 is caught up by the XX:57 at Maidenhead likewise the XX:12 is caught by the XX:27 at Maidenhead.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 09, 2010, 20:58:46
There is NO reduction in the planned Crossrail stations, the significant change is on the Abbey Wood branch where third rail is going to be used on the surface and the Connaught tunnel (form North Woolwich line).

There's been so many mainstream media 'what ifs' about Crossrail it was difficult to keep track - IIRC one fairly respected newspaper mentioned doing away with 'one or two of the western branches' which sounded odd at the time because both of the branches are already built, ie the Heathrow branch, and the existing GWML reliefs. Not sure how that removal would have worked.   ???

But anyway, having an AC/DC changeover, possibly during the Custom House stop, makes some sense. AIUI much of the refurbishment planned for the Connaught tunnel was to do with increasing clearance for overhead electrification by lowering the track bed.  A decision to go back to third rail through there puts some more flesh on the bones of recent stories about 'reusing existing infrastructure in Docklands'...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 09, 2010, 23:36:07
Sorry to disagree with you electric train but stopping Crossrail short at Maidenhead completely disrupts large passenger flows from Reading to intermeadiate stations.

There is a very counterflow from East of Maidenhead into Reading and equally there is a heavy flow from Reading (and West thereof) and Twyford (plus Henley) to stations East of Maidenhead in particualr Slough Hayes and Ealing Broadway. All these passengers who currently enjoy athrough train will have to change.

For instance currently with one change at Reading you can to an aweful lot of places from Taplow. To add a change one stop down the line doesn't make rail tavel attractive especialy as many will be leisure journies with luggage.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 10, 2010, 10:33:30
If anyone wants to get a feel for the areas being talked about at Reading station, there are quite a few pictures in this forum thread on pages three and four.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 10, 2010, 20:32:54
A very good map - the most detailed I've seen is on page 4, too.  I'm intending to do a series of pictures showing the transformation at Reading over the coming years (at roughly 6 monthly intervals) , in a similar style to ones I have done at Bicester North.  I will share them on here of course.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 11, 2010, 09:59:17
Where are the Bicester North ones?....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 11, 2010, 10:54:11
You can find them here, Chris.

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=7250.30 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=7250.30)

I'll add a third picture in a couple of months when all is finished at Bicester North.  For Reading I plan to visit the same ten or so spots every six months to record the changes over the next five years or so until the scheme is complete and slowly produce a mosaic and slideshow of the changes.  Some of the locations (such as the overbridge) will become inaccessible after a couple of years, but others, such as the multi-storey car park and the current platform 4 should be available throughout.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 11, 2010, 13:14:25
A very good map - the most detailed I've seen is on page 4, too. 


I have an earlier small combined version of that 'phase 1 and phase 2 diagram', unfortunately I printed it (without ever saving) straight from a masssive online report that I've never been able to find since - it was labelled up as a 'Corus Rail' drawing! 

Thanks to 'Skyscraper city' then, as that version is now safely stored on my PC, it's possibly the most detailed source I've seen anywhere.  Will still keep a lookout for a geographically correct drawing, one will probably surface eventually...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on October 13, 2010, 20:45:49
Although perhaps not given a much publicity as the new mainline platforms and flyovers the third "Southern" Platform will be a big improvement for pasengers on the Waterloo and North Downs services. Giving as it does a 3rd platform and more importantly eliminating the single track bottleneck over Vastern Road bridge.

My information from our Network Rail Liaison Manager some 4-5 weeks ago is that the 3rd Platform is likely to be shelved due to the cuts.  However, all the preparation work is to go ahead so it can be installed if there is a change of heart subsequently.  Pretty much all the rest of the station development is secure.  However, there are likely to be cuts to the development of the new depot.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 13, 2010, 20:52:02
To be honest, the third southern platform is a bit of a luxury, so if anything was to be cut from the scheme then I would agree it should be that.  Provided that the single feed into the platforms is doubled, the platforms are extended to 12-car, and the fly-under is reopened allowing grade separated access to the new high numbered platforms, there should be plenty of capacity.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 13, 2010, 23:27:36
Also, if the oft-rumoured joining of some Gatwick and 'west of Reading' services via the new relief platforms ever happened, two platforms for SWT would remain perfectly adequate.  As long as the Vastern Rd overbridge is made wide enough for the 3rd paltform and track the rest of the job will presumably be straightforward - although it has been repeatedly said that access to teh site is pretty constrained so it makes practical sense to do the whole job at once.  Maybe the half way house is to do the civils only, and leave the platform structure til later?

Of course in the future they might even be able to shift the responsibility and get BAA to pay for it from their Airtrack budget...

(BTW, and to save a new thread, the extra platform at Gatwick was given the go ahead today (on NR's London and SE press release page). The relevance to FGW is that it potentially makes paths available for the Reading Gatwick service at the other end...)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 14, 2010, 09:32:45
Oxford - Gatwick trains are very much part of the equation for after the upgrade.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 14, 2010, 12:24:59
Interestingly, the Sussex RUS analysis is that a second Reading - Gatwick service per hour doesn't currently have an adequate BCR. 

It may be that an extended service would be expected to bring in just enough additional through passengers from Oxford to tip the analysis positive - of course the extra Redhill - Gatwick leg would also tie up another Turbo all day - where would they get it?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on October 14, 2010, 19:38:17
Also, if the oft-rumoured joining of some Gatwick and 'west of Reading' services via the new relief platforms ever happened, two platforms for SWT would remain perfectly adequate.  As long as the Vastern Rd overbridge is made wide enough for the 3rd paltform and track the rest of the job will presumably be straightforward - although it has been repeatedly said that access to teh site is pretty constrained so it makes practical sense to do the whole job at once.  Maybe the half way house is to do the civils only, and leave the platform structure til later?

....
Yes, I wondered about that. Given all the expensive and disruptive work needed to install the additional bridge over Vastern Rd, how much money is really saved by not adding the new platform, and how much more expensive and disruptive will it be to come back and add it in the future?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 15, 2010, 14:12:54
There is NO reduction in the planned Crossrail stations, the significant change is on the Abbey Wood branch where third rail is going to be used on the surface and the Connaught tunnel (form North Woolwich line).

NR have announced a design contract award today for the Abbey Wood area surface works:
Quote
Network Rail has awarded a major design contract for Crossrail works to Balfour Beatty Rail. The contract covers the design phase for works on the two-mile stretch from Plumstead to Abbey Wood in south east London, including the design for the new Abbey Wood station, which is the terminus station on the south east section of the Crossrail route.

The station work will provide two new Crossrail platforms and improved access. In addition, a four-track railway will be created requiring Network Rail to improve five bridges and build two new overhead electrified railway lines between Plumstead portal (where the central tunnel section emerges) and Abbey Wood.


But that might just mean the press office aren't completely up to speed, which wouldn't be unusual...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 15, 2010, 14:15:54
Network Rail (London and SE) press release confirming that Reading BC have cleared the station plans...

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/ACTION-STATIONS-FOR-READING-AS-COUNCIL-GIVES-GREEN-LIGHT-TO-REDEVELOPMENT-PLANS-15ab/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/ACTION-STATIONS-FOR-READING-AS-COUNCIL-GIVES-GREEN-LIGHT-TO-REDEVELOPMENT-PLANS-15ab/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx)

Quote
^The fact that consent has been granted so quickly is thanks to the hard work that has gone on behind the scenes so that our plans are right for Reading, and we appreciate the strong support we^ve had from the council in developing this scheme.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 15, 2010, 22:46:49
Quote
But that might just mean the press office aren't completely up to speed, which wouldn't be unusual...

Or that they are intending to go ahead with overhead wiring to Abbey Wood. And since the press office is the official mouthpiece of the company they are conveying the official position.

Given that the Gravesend extension is still only an aspiration, it would seem something of an absurdity to fit third-rail gear to the trains, which would only be used for a short section of a short branch. And the cost of fitting the trains with DC gear would probably wipe out any saving achieved by not improving clearances in the Docklands tunnel.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 16, 2010, 12:14:26
Don't let the Maidonians hear there might be shoe gear on the trains, they'll be demanding third rail on the river bridge to avoid despoiling Brunel's structure!

Recent units such a 377 and 378 seem to have been churned out in both third rail and dual versions (and presumably if required a pure AC version) but not sure of the cost differential.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: XPT on October 18, 2010, 20:43:32
Booking is now available up untill 30th December.   Though dissapointingly it seems only a limited number of services offer the ^10 single fares.    For instance in the morning of the 27th Dec, only the 1130 service from Bristol Temple Meads has a ^10 single fare available.  The rest are all ^24, ^28, and ^31 single.   Similarly coming back from London Waterloo-Westbury, the fares are all ^28 single! Except for a ^10 single with South West Trains on the 1920 service!

Do you think all the cheap advance singles have not yet been loaded onto the database?   Or is it likely that FGW are only offering the cheap advance tickets on a limited number of services only?

I suppose given the novelty value of these services, ^38 return isn't too bad.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: inspector_blakey on October 18, 2010, 21:04:47
Just a guess, but if service levels are somewhat reduced compared to normal the FGW may be a little cautious about flooding the trains with cheap advance fares, to avoid potentially overcrowding them more than necessary.

As far as I'm aware, the advance fares for trains are made available all at once in a block, so I don't think there's much chance that only some of the advance tickets have been released.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 18, 2010, 21:18:24
Recent units such a 377 and 378 seem to have been churned out in both third rail and dual versions (and presumably if required a pure AC version) but not sure of the cost differential.

All 'post privatisation' EMUs are dual voltage capable, by the very nature of the traction equipment. They all have a pantograph well, even SWT's Desiros, although numbered in the 400 series (DC units) are convertible.  If you look at the rear panel on the SWT Desiro secondmans side you can see the pantograph up/down controls.  The as new costs vary depending on whether the AC 'front end' gear (the pantograph, breaker and combined transformer/rectifier/inverter) is fitted or not, but there is always space for it, and the internal wiring is fitted.  On the opposite side of the equation, LM 350/2s are capable of having shoe gear fitted.  Apparently it was a 'future proofing' requirement initiated by DfT.

AIUI the cost of the AC or DC specific extras, or both, is relatively insignificant in terms of the overall cost of a unit, as (ignoring shoe gear for a moment) it is only one carriage that is different, so 75% of the typical four car train costs the same, and the majority of the fourth car is the same no matter which power supply is used.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 18, 2010, 21:28:28
On the fares front, SWT have announced on their Christmas alterations pages that they are reducing their Bristol service for the week, so that they can strengthen the Exeter trains.
Quote
A reduced South West Trains service will run between London Waterloo and Bristol during the closure of Reading station. This is so we can provide more carriages for the expected extra passengers on our main London Waterloo to Exeter route.  Bristol passengers should use the altered First Great Western service.

I was wondering if 'route Salisbury' fares are therefore usable on FGW services even though trains aren't stopping there. Does that open a can of worms?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Surrey 455 on October 18, 2010, 22:35:44
From the SWT website www.southwesttrains.co.uk/Xmas2010.aspx
Quote
A limited First Great Western service will run to and from London Waterloo via Westbury and Salisbury during the closure of Reading station. Please see special publicity for details.

SWT seem to think trains are stopping there.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: inspector_blakey on October 18, 2010, 22:57:57
I was wondering if 'route Salisbury' fares are therefore usable on FGW services even though trains aren't stopping there. Does that open a can of worms?

Interesting question, that. As a general rule under normal circumstances your train doesn't need to stop at any routeing point printed on the ticket, just needs to pass through it (e.g. Bristol to London advance tickets may be routed "AP Slough" to force the GW route rather than the SWT route, but you certainly don't have to catch a train that calls Slough. Likewise some Reading to Gatwick fares are route "Gomshall" to preclude travelling via London, but the train doesn't actually have to call there - you get the picture).

BUT there are certain get-out clauses when trains are diverted due to engineering work. However, in this case given that the timetable is so comprehensively altered and squashed around, with SWT not running their normal service on the route, it would seem reasonable for FGW to accept tickets routed "Salisbury". Whether they will or not however I don't know - presumably the FGW ORCATS share of a Bristol - London, route Salisbury ticket is fairly small under normal circumstances. I don't know if that means (a) FGW therefore won't accept the tickets, (b) FGW just sucks up the loss of revenue and does accept the ticket, possibly with some sort of Network Rail compensation? or (c) someone does a bit of fiddling with ORCATS to re-allocate revenues for the blockade period.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 18, 2010, 23:20:45
From the SWT website www.southwesttrains.co.uk/Xmas2010.aspx
Quote
A limited First Great Western service will run to and from London Waterloo via Westbury and Salisbury during the closure of Reading station. Please see special publicity for details.

SWT seem to think trains are stopping there.

Not necessarily, they may just be describing the route. We know from the journey planners they aren't calling at Salisbury, and the Basingstoke call is set down only towards London and pick up only on return.

Paul



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: XPT on October 18, 2010, 23:21:54
I was wondering if 'route Salisbury' fares are therefore usable on FGW services even though trains aren't stopping there. Does that open a can of worms?

Well I tried putting in a Westbury-London Waterloo return journey, and it lets you get a ^29.90 Super Off Peak Day Return. Which lets you travel on any of the FGW services on that route.

Obviously though us rail buffs will want to get a journey on both of the diverted routes on the same day.  

There seems to be a good amount of ^10 single fares from Paddington, but hardly any less than ^28 from Waterloo.

^47.90(incl a ^8.90 single from Westbury-Bristol) for a day return to London is somewhat more than I would usually be willing to pay.   But as this is a special and possibly once in life time return journey, then it's not too bad a price I suppose.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 18, 2010, 23:46:18
I've tried the Shirehampton - Waterloo (Route: Salisbury) Off Peak Day Return for 27th Dec on the East Coast JP which offers up the option of a change at Westbury onto a Waterloo bound HST. So the Route: Salisbury fares appear to be valid on the diverted HSTs.

The JP did suggest, however, changing again at Basingstoke as that will get you to Waterloo sooner. Think I'll stay on board the HST, thanks. ^17.90 (with my railcard) for some rare HST mileage is not to be missed!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 19, 2010, 10:12:13
I'll be bashing the route out from Padd via Banbury and return to Waterloo....just got to choose my preferred date.

On the fares front, SWT have announced on their Christmas alterations pages that they are reducing their Bristol service for the week, so that they can strengthen the Exeter trains.
Quote
A reduced South West Trains service will run between London Waterloo and Bristol during the closure of Reading station. This is so we can provide more carriages for the expected extra passengers on our main London Waterloo to Exeter route.  Bristol passengers should use the altered First Great Western service.

I was wondering if 'route Salisbury' fares are therefore usable on FGW services even though trains aren't stopping there. Does that open a can of worms?

I';ve asked the question of FGWs Fares department.....I'll post up the response when I get it.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 19, 2010, 10:42:39
On the fares front, SWT have announced on their Christmas alterations pages that they are reducing their Bristol service for the week, so that they can strengthen the Exeter trains.
Quote
A reduced South West Trains service will run between London Waterloo and Bristol during the closure of Reading station. This is so we can provide more carriages for the expected extra passengers on our main London Waterloo to Exeter route.  Bristol passengers should use the altered First Great Western service.

I was wondering if 'route Salisbury' fares are therefore usable on FGW services even though trains aren't stopping there. Does that open a can of worms?

Here's your definitive answer, from FGW Fares Management....

thank you for your e-mail.  To confirm FGW Bristol to London services will operate via Swindon, Oxford, Banbury/Aynho and High Wycombe and thus route 'Salisbury' tickets will not be valid on these trains.  Customers wishing to use route 'Salisbury' tickets may continue to do so by travelling from Bristol to Salisbury and changing trains for London Waterloo services, as per the majority of journey opportunities on a normal weekday.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: rogerw on October 19, 2010, 19:00:50
It doesn't answer the question in terms of fares from Westbury although journey planners show it as valid.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 19, 2010, 19:17:12
As I said up thread JP's do allow one to use the Waterloo bound HSTs from Westbury on a journey from Bristol and its environs.

I've also checked using National Rail Enquiries online and I can also summon up Route: Salisbury fares including HSTs from WSB - WAT. Takes a bit of jiggery-pokery though. I had to put in via Trowbridge & Salisbury and avoid Taunton. Then also select First Great Western services only!

After all that it offers up the ^27.10 Off Peak Day Return (valid anytime between Xmas and New Year) for Shirehampton to Waterloo.

This is the fare I'd suggest any cash concious Bristol based bashers buy (try saying that quickly after a couple glasses of wine!) - it's cheaper than the BRI-WAT Super Off Peak Day Return.

Here's your definitive answer, from FGW Fares Management....

thank you for your e-mail.  To confirm FGW Bristol to London services will operate via Swindon, Oxford, Banbury/Aynho and High Wycombe and thus route 'Salisbury' tickets will not be valid on these trains.  Customers wishing to use route 'Salisbury' tickets may continue to do so by travelling from Bristol to Salisbury and changing trains for London Waterloo services, as per the majority of journey opportunities on a normal weekday.

Hardly definitive, when it misses paul7755's initial point regarding fares via Salisbury. Someone should tell FGW Fares Management that there is an alternative route and fares from Bristol to London. Paddington is not the centre of the universe!!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 19, 2010, 22:21:20
But Paul raised the point in the context of SWT's clear advice to Bristol passengers, which was to use FGW's services from Bristol during the period affected, ie, don't bother trying to travel route Salisbury from the Bristol area at this time.

I shouldn't think the ticketing needs of those wanting to clock up some rare track/rolling stock miles was top of the list of priorities at the planning meetings.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 19, 2010, 22:56:12
I totally agree, willc. Just offering up the advice for those of us, in the Bristol area, who do want to take a HST into Waterloo.  ;) ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 20, 2010, 09:22:36
But Paul raised the point in the context of SWT's clear advice to Bristol passengers, which was to use FGW's services from Bristol during the period affected, ie, don't bother trying to travel route Salisbury from the Bristol area at this time.

This business of fares is getting way out of hand. Here we have a major junction closed for period and they can't even work out a sensible fare structure to get people to/from London and Bristol/Wales/West.

It seems to me that should be a special set of fares from all FGW stations West of Reading to London  valid on any train or combination of trains that takes you to/from a London terminus.

They should be considerably cheaper than present anytime fares to compensate for the longer journey times and extra changes.

This should also apply to other thread re Chiltern diverting via Didcot.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 20, 2010, 10:29:20
It might sound like a nice idea but you do say "a sensible fare structure" then suggest something that would only add further complication. Don't forget that in the middle of it all, the line through Reading does reopen for New Year's Eve, so would you then revert to normal fares for the day?

And Chiltern need to find the money from somewhere to pay FGW for the use of its trains during closures (it's their project, not Network Rail's). Not that there is any consistent pattern to those closures, so a sensible fare structure is the last thing you would end up with. The following scenarios can all apply, with all sorts of journey times, depending on the circumstances. Chiltern trains divert to Oxford or Didcot from Banbury, passengers are advised to use XC to get to Oxford, trains serving Oxfordshire and the West Midlands are diverted via Aylesbury with a reverse at Princes Risborough, plus all sort of bus/train routings, depending on which parts of the line are closed.

In all this, by far the most important thing is to keep people on trains, whatever the route or journey time or fare, rather than putting them into buses, which surveys consistently show is something people dislike. And FGW and Chiltern seem to be doing their level best to achieve that (assisted by SWT in the case of the Waterloo diversions).


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 20, 2010, 17:33:11
It might sound like a nice idea but you do say "a sensible fare structure" then suggest something that would only add further complication. Don't forget that in the middle of it all, the line through Reading does reopen for New Year's Eve, so would you then revert to normal fares for the day.

What I should have said is one fare somewhere between the Advanced and Offpeak should be offered for any applicable journey for the whole of the disruption no matter what route or time of day. It would apply on New Year's Eve, with it being free after midnight.

And Chiltern need to find the money from somewhere to pay FGW for the use of its trains during closures (it's their project, not Network Rail's).  

That's just bean counting, due to stupid way railways are organised and  funded.

Not that there is any consistent pattern to those closures, so a sensible fare structure is the last thing you would end up with.  

To my mind it doesn't matter what the pattern of closures are if the effect is that you cannot make a journey you would normally be able to make without being diverted, extra changes, longer journey times  or worse still put on buses then the same cheaper fare can apply for all such disrupted journeys.

In all this, by far the most important thing is to keep people on trains, whatever the route or journey time or fare, rather than putting them into buses, which surveys consistently show is something people dislike. And FGW and Chiltern seem to be doing their level best to achieve that (assisted by SWT in the case of the Waterloo diversions).

Couldn't agree more so why not let them travel cheaply to compensate them for their loyalty.



Edited to remove response from quoted post. bignosemac


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 20, 2010, 18:40:08
So when the operators' costs are substantially increased through extra mileage, hire of buses, etc, you think they should cut the revenue they are generating? Never mind that the disruption is likely to put off some potential custom anyway? It all has to be paid for somehow and I don't think the Government is going to be offering to help just now.

The majority of this work is taking place at times when travel is on off-peak (I am using the term generally, in the way it used to be understood by sane and sensible people, not the dubious way the rail industry now employs it) or advance fares anyway.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: XPT on October 24, 2010, 15:12:03
I'm still trying to work out what to do for my trip to London and back especially for these diverstions.   Shame about there being only a limited number of services which offer the cheap advance fares.   

If I get the 1130 from Bristol Temple Meads, I can get a ^10 single.   Scheduled to arrive in London Paddington 1437.  I could then possibly get the 1526(albeit at a cost of ^28 single) from London Waterloo to Westbury, but I think this could be cutting it fine a bit whether I'll be able to get there in time.  Getting the 1626 may be a safer option.  But the thing is then it will be practically dark at that time and with the HST ultra bright carriage lighting as it is nowadays, I won't be able to see a thing of the diverted route the train is taking!

Alternatively I could take the journey the other way around, Bristol-Westbury, Westbury-London Waterloo-Paddington-Bristol.  And be able to get a ^10 single on one of the afternoon services from London Paddington.  Thing is though if I get on at Westbury, these services will originate from either Plymouth or Penzance.  So I might not get the convenience of having a window seat and facing the direction of travel, as there'll be plenty of people allready on those trains! I see though there is a good value fare of just ^9.50 on the 0718 service from Westbury.   Though this would involve a walk of about an hour and 20 minutes to Temple Meads that morning.  To get the 0605 service to Westbury, arriving there at 0641.  But if that service gets cancelled that would ruin that plan.  The next train is at 0640 and scheduled to arrive Westbury at 0716, just TWO minutes before the 0718 to London Waterloo which is cutting it fine a little!

Is there likely to be many people travelling between the West Country/Bristol and London on the 27th and 28th December?



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 24, 2010, 20:28:17
Yes, but not that early!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 24, 2010, 20:38:06
Me? I think I'm going to start at Oxford to Padd, Waterloo to Westbury to Bristol TM to Oxford....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: XPT on October 24, 2010, 23:06:07
Finally decided what I'm going to do, and just about to book up.  On Tuesday 28th, I will get the 0601 service from Bristol Parkway-London Paddington. Fare just ^10 single. This will be a service from Swansea, but even then I shoudn't think there'd be too many passengers onboard at that early hour on a Bank Holiday!  So should easily get a window seat. At that time it will be pitch black outside, but at around 7:30ish, just around the time the train reaches Banbury daylight will start breaking allowing me to see the diverted route we're taking.  The 1 hour 50 minute non-stop journey after Oxford will be particularly interesting.

Upon arrival in London at 0907, I'll then just have a bit of a ride somewhere in the London area.  Maybe just a trip up to Harrow & Wealdestone and back on the Bakerloo line 1972 stock.  Then to Waterloo for the 1233 service to Westbury.  Upon arrival in Westbury there will be a short wait for my onward train back to Bristol.  Fare ^24.50.

That's ^34.50 for the total return fare to London with FGW.  I certainly see that as not too bad atall, especially as it's two special *possibly*
once in a lifetime journeys.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 24, 2010, 23:09:09
Good luck with that, XPT - and please do post some pictures here!  ;)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on October 24, 2010, 23:36:48
I'm hoping to do Taunton to Waterloo on the 27th then back to Bristol via Banbury. 27th being the day I can escape from the family after Christmas!

Not making too many confirmed plans until nearer the time as life at the moment seems to be getting in the way of 'messing about on trains'.  :-\


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 26, 2010, 12:13:38
Meanwhile, there's still absolutely no sign of any physical works at Banbury connected with this turnback provision for platforms 1 and 2.  Only five months to go, so I would expect things to start happening imminently, or it'll be a rush job!

Two shiny signal posts have now appeared at the south end of platforms one and two.  Covered up, but from the counter-weights already fitted it looks like they're going to be semaphore signals - I wonder how many brand new semaphore signals get installed these days!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 26, 2010, 12:15:06
Definitely semaphore, debate rages as to which type though!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: inspector_blakey on October 26, 2010, 15:08:10
*fingers crossed, hoping for upper quadrants to upset the Brunel posse*

;)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 26, 2010, 15:48:40
Apparently there is rule as to whether a new semaphore is upper or lower quadrant. It is apparently  determined by counting the number of existing signals of each type and providing the type in the majority.



 

 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 26, 2010, 17:35:59
From memory there's one (possibly two) upper quadrant ones at Banbury, the rest being lower quadrant.  Oh, and some colour light ones to throw into the mix as well!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 26, 2010, 19:00:18
Are you sure they don't just count the preferences of the individuals hanging around platform ends?  ::)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 26, 2010, 21:58:59
Are you sure they don't just count the preferences of the individuals hanging around platform ends?  ::)

Paul

Probably so that's why it will be lower quadrant.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 26, 2010, 22:04:21
For an in-depth look at Banbury's rag-tag selection of signals, see Adrian the Rock's signalling site. Links to pages about the south and north ends of the station from this page http://www.roscalen.com/signals/Banbury/index.htm

The south end is GWR lower quadrant country when it comes to semaphores, though the main line has colour lights.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on October 26, 2010, 22:33:51
*fingers crossed, hoping for upper quadrants to upset the Brunel posse*


Even lower quadrants were a bit new-fangled for Mr Brunel. How about disc and crossbar instead?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Didcot_disc_and_crossbar_signal.jpg

Pity early loco drivers, who had to cope with this selection of weird and often not very wonderful devices.

http://www.railsigns.co.uk/sect1page4/sect1page4.html


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 27, 2010, 00:54:57
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-11631380):

Quote
Reading station's ^15m road revamp plan 'approved'

A ^15m roads project as part of the Reading train station revamp has been given conditional approval.

Reading council was set for ^15m from the government to upgrade the road network, but the funding was put on hold as part of the Spending Review.

The Department for Transport (DfT) said it wanted to see savings, but was set to give the green light in January.

The station is being remodelled by 2013 to include five more platforms and two additional entrances.

A DfT spokesperson said: "The department will look carefully at the costs and scope of the scheme and explore possibilities to reduce costs and increase local contributions.

"We hope to agree a way forward on funding by January."

Reading West Conservative MP Alok Sharma said: "It is not full approval but it is certainly progress and a good sign. I am confident the council can take it forward and get full agreement."

The ^850m revamp of the rail station was confirmed last week during a visit by transport minister Theresa Villiers.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on October 28, 2010, 08:56:13
Great Western pattern lower quadrant semaphores!

Quote from latest MDRS news letter!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 28, 2010, 09:21:56
There are actually TWO semaphore posts gone in at the south end of Plat 1/2 at Banbury.....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BBM on October 28, 2010, 11:16:26
Two shiny signal posts have now appeared at the south end of platforms one and two.  Covered up, but from the counter-weights already fitted it looks like they're going to be semaphore signals - I wonder how many brand new semaphore signals get installed these days!

A new semaphore signal was installed earlier this year on Platform 3 at Shrewsbury, however I think it's upper quadrant. There's a picture of it about three-quarters of the way down this webpage in the section headed "New signal at Shrewsbury":

http://www.nwrail.org.uk/nw1007c.htm


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 28, 2010, 13:11:44
There are actually TWO semaphore posts gone in at the south end of Plat 1/2 at Banbury.....

That's what I said.  :-\


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on November 01, 2010, 12:45:41
Are we still on "Reading Station Improvements"?  This thread is going to take some wading through by 2016 when the improvements are supposedly completed unless it is unravelled soon!  ???


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 01, 2010, 12:51:30
Well, the Banbury signalling changes are part of the Reading Remodelling in so much as they wouldn't have happened had this Xmas block not been required!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on November 02, 2010, 12:41:10
Apparently the reason they are lower quadrant is that are replacing two ground discs. Thus the signal wire run, levers and interlocking are unchanged they just hook up the new arms to the old wires.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: super tm on November 02, 2010, 15:50:02
Apparently the reason they are lower quadrant is that are replacing two ground discs. Thus the signal wire run, levers and interlocking are unchanged they just hook up the new arms to the old wires.

I doubt that.  Upper or lower quadrant would not make any difference to the wire run, levers etc.  More likely they had a couple spare from the recently abolished boxes on the Stratford on Avon area.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 05, 2010, 01:43:52
The new signals at Banbury will be commissioned and brought into use this coming Sunday.  As well as the signals themselves, a few ground semaphore signals they are replacing will be recovered and TPWS grids will be installed and 'Off' indicators will be provided on the platforms.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on November 05, 2010, 08:55:22
Quote
More likely they had a couple spare from the recently abolished boxes on the Stratford on Avon area.

Unlikely, as the London midland region converted the area to upper quadrant years ago. I think there was just one lower quadrant at Bearley Junction which had survived the cull.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on November 11, 2010, 23:56:24
Couple of pictures of the new Banbury lower-quadrants, which both look brand spanking new, here

http://www.upmain.fotopic.net/p68078022.html
http://www.upmain.fotopic.net/p68078005.html


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on November 12, 2010, 09:38:46
Installed last Sunday....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on November 17, 2010, 13:59:54
Timetables for services for services London-Bristol-South Wales and London-West of England during the Reading improvement works over Christmas/New Year now online:
http://firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=4888


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on November 18, 2010, 18:32:05
London & Thames Valley services timetables added:
http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=4888


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: gwr2006 on November 21, 2010, 12:49:40
Apparently the reason they are lower quadrant is that are replacing two ground discs. Thus the signal wire run, levers and interlocking are unchanged they just hook up the new arms to the old wires.

I doubt that.  Upper or lower quadrant would not make any difference to the wire run, levers etc.  More likely they had a couple spare from the recently abolished boxes on the Stratford on Avon area.

According to Network Rail the two new semaphores at Banbury were manufactured specifically for the job and were not redundant from any other signalling scheme.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 21, 2010, 17:30:38
Timetables for Reading Closure are on FGWs website:

http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=4888

Although I think there is a mistake in them, recently the journey time between London and Swindon during the diversions has increased by 15 minutes according to Journey Planner, whether this a problem with journey planner, I dont know. Anyone have any answers?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on November 21, 2010, 18:04:19
They've increased the journey time via Banbury


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 21, 2010, 18:41:25
They've increased the journey time via Banbury

I hope they publish new timetables on their website showing these changes.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on November 21, 2010, 18:49:46
I doubt it, as they've gone to press.....

I'll check, as it may be an error.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 21, 2010, 18:50:27
I doubt it, as they've gone to press.....

I'll check, as it may be an error.

If they have already gone to press, Oh dear indeed, oh dear!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on November 21, 2010, 18:52:33
Were meant to be available at Padd next week.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on November 23, 2010, 10:38:45
The new Caversham Road bridge is complete, ready for installation at Christmas, see http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-BRIDGE-NEARS-COMPLETION-AHEAD-OF-XMAS-RAIL-IMPROVEMENT-WORK-15f2/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 23, 2010, 13:34:19
Interesting news in that NR press release that touches on the discussion about track layout and bridge positions a few weeks ago.

They describe removing two further bridges over the period, so that must be the two that the reliefs currently use?  So that is a much more significant work package than simply craning a wide span in for the tracks into the two completely new platform islands, which wouldn't really impact on the operational railway. 

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 23, 2010, 16:47:30
On a different part of the scheme, passing through today I noticed a lot of work now taking place along the line of the dive-under that is to be re-opened. This work seemed to be over quite an extended site, going beyond the railway bridge the track will go under and towards the Thames. I was wondering what this is, is it new drainage, or will there be new sidings down at that level?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 23, 2010, 17:29:42
I don't know for sure, but I think that's going to be a storage compound used for materials that are going to be used in the project and also facilities for the engineering staff involved in the project.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 23, 2010, 17:36:26
I don't know for sure, but I think that's going to be a storage compound used for materials that are going to be used in the project and also facilities for the engineering staff involved in the project.

Now that would make sense: some of the construction looked like it could easily have been for something as mundane as bases for Portakabins etc.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 23, 2010, 17:43:42
A kind of PS: the construction of a new embankment on the other side of Vastern Rd for the extended Waterloo platforms is well under way. And it looks like piling will start soon on the station side of the road, beyond platform 4b. Earlier someone said they thought the proposed third platform has now been dropped, anyone have any further info on this? I'm still unclear how this would save much money, given the amount of earthworks and bridge construction needed anyway.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: hornbeam on November 24, 2010, 10:07:00
I know on caversham Road they have been re painting some of the decks, but that new bridge deck looks much bigger than the gap its going in!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on November 24, 2010, 10:39:12
Better that, than being smaller than the gap it's intended to fill!  ;) ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 24, 2010, 20:14:59
Timings on journey planner have return to the same as the timetable on the FGW website. Must of been a blip with the journey planner system.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 25, 2010, 09:59:24
Something else I've noticed: a crane and what looks like a piling machine (for want of the correct term) near  the northern side of the Vastern Rd bridge, i.e. the other side of the tracks from the Waterloo lines. Is further bridge widening planned here?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 25, 2010, 10:35:38
I suspect there will have to be a piled retaining wall up to a certain height parallel to and along the line of the railway, as the available site isn't wide enough for a normal sloping embankment.  Similar to the wall immediately south of the existing platform 4A/B.

I think from one of the phots linked to earlier the piling for the actual bridge abutments is done already?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 25, 2010, 11:51:29
To clarify, I'm not refering to work associated with the Waterloo platform extentions and proposed third platform, for which embankment work and a new retaining wall are well progressed. What I noticed this morning was piling equipment on the northern side of the main tracks, i.e. somewhere between Vastern Rd and the start of the ramp down to the dive-under that is to be re-opened. Maybe they need a retaining wall on that side for the new track to the dive-under?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 25, 2010, 12:32:41
Ah yes I see.  :-[

Maybe the gradient or curvature of the ramp down to the dive under will be different?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on November 25, 2010, 12:55:01
Earlier someone said they thought the proposed third platform has now been dropped, anyone have any further info on this?

The original 3rd platform had been dropped to save money, but 10 days ago we heard it had been reinstated into the works.  As far as the station is concerned, all the original proposals are now going ahead.   :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 25, 2010, 13:28:07
Earlier someone said they thought the proposed third platform has now been dropped, anyone have any further info on this?

The original 3rd platform had been dropped to save money, but 10 days ago we heard it had been reinstated into the works.  As far as the station is concerned, all the original proposals are now going ahead.   :)

That's goood- it seems like something that wouldn't really have saved that much money to leave out but would have been extremely expensive to add afterwards.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 25, 2010, 14:29:36
Probably exactly the sort of responsible 'what if' options that have been going on for the last 6 months to convince the new Govt. that the sums do add up.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 26, 2010, 13:45:03
Something else I've noticed: a crane and what looks like a piling machine (for want of the correct term) near  the northern side of the Vastern Rd bridge, i.e. the other side of the tracks from the Waterloo lines. Is further bridge widening planned here?

Had a closer look this morning. It does indeed look like piling is taking place at either end of the Vastern Rd railway bridge, on the northern side, as if in preparation for the bridge to be widened to take an additional track on that side, as well on the Waterloo lines side.  Will be interesting to see if that is what is actually being done. There does also appear to be some further shoring up with steel sheets along the ramp down to the dive under.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on November 26, 2010, 15:52:35
According to the aerial schematic on the Network Rail site:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6341.aspx

  • Vastern Road bridge will have extra tracks to both the North and the South so I'd expect to see the bridge widened on both sides.
  • The Dive-Under to the east will eventually have new tracks running through it so that trains can access the line to Wokingham line from the Northern platforms.

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on December 09, 2010, 11:48:58
A good article here about the improvements (including best time to watch the bridge being put into place!) at Reading during New Year.  Also mentions the signalling changes and work at Goring.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2083641_station_revamp_launch_pad

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on December 11, 2010, 20:31:13
Maybe they need a retaining wall on that side for the new track to the dive-under?

Yes, a retaining wall IS being built on the North side.

After Christmas, work on the 3 Guineas and heritage buildings will commence which will have more visibility to passengers.  Then the visible works start in earnest, beginning with the building of the new platform 4 (i.e. next to 4A and B).  Earthworks and the retaining wall will continue to progress to the north of the station.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 13, 2010, 00:29:44
Will the three guineas remain during the works

:( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

If not


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2010, 16:26:38
Will the three guineas remain during the works

It will either remain open or remain closed, I guess.   ;D

But seriously, it ought to be unaffected, as it's the listed building they can't touch?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Fish on December 14, 2010, 17:02:09
The 3 Guineas is remaining open, and yes as its listed not much is being done to it, but I believe it is taking on extra accommodation.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 14, 2010, 17:15:29
According to the aerial schematic on the Network Rail site:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6341.aspx

  • Vastern Road bridge will have extra tracks to both the North and the South so I'd expect to see the bridge widened on both sides.
  • The Dive-Under to the east will eventually have new tracks running through it so that trains can access the line to Wokingham line from the Northern platforms.

Boppy.

On the map from Boppy's link, the new yellow line  from the up Berks and Hants to the new platforms to the north of the present station is shown as a "new Freight line".  But surely it will be used for up B&H passenger trains as well (and probably many more of them than freight trains heading towards London)? I asked this question at one of the exhibitions at Reading Civic Center a while ago, but the person I asked clearly didn't know much about pattern of operations at Reading and could not give a sensible answer.

It would seem to be illogical for up B&H passeneger services (including Bedwyn stoppers) to use other than the new "yellow" line, else they will conflict with down services towards Didcot.  So why call it a "new Freight track" ?



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2010, 18:45:18
It would seem to be illogical for up B&H passeneger services (including Bedwyn stoppers) to use other than the new "yellow" line, else they will conflict with down services towards Didcot.  So why call it a "new Freight track" ?

It's because that map has been simplified too much. On the more detailed drawings you'd see it actually represents two bidirectional lines, one which provides a dive under for B&H services, and one which links to the relief lines, for the freight flows.

If you follow the link to the Skyscraper City forum in an earlier post (the first Oct 10th post on page 9 by 'willc') the diagram on page 4 of that linked thread makes far more sense.

Edit: added as an attachment to this post. (Cropped and compressed)

Paul
 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 15, 2010, 14:36:30
Thanks Paul, I'd never seen that schematic before and it makes much more sense.  Makes you wonder why NR produced such a useless "plan" as that on their website.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 21, 2010, 21:44:18
From the Network Rail press release (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/CHRISTMAS-LAUNCH-PAD-FOR-MASSIVE-IMPROVEMENTS-TO-READING-S-RAILWAY-162c/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx):

Quote
CHRISTMAS LAUNCH PAD FOR MASSIVE IMPROVEMENTS TO READING'S RAILWAY

With five days to go until Christmas, 250 Network Rail engineers and contractors are preparing to deliver the first phase of a six-year project to upgrade Reading^s railway.

Between Christmas Day and 3 January, Network Rail will complete the resignaling of 100 miles of railway around Reading, and lift a 1,000 tonne railway bridge into place over Caversham Road. The work will require 16,000 man hours, take ten days to complete, and is the biggest engineering upgrade Network Rail is undertaking anywhere on Britain^s railway this Christmas.

Bill Henry, project director for Network Rail in Reading said: ^The work we^re doing this Christmas is the launch pad for our project to improve Reading^s station and railway. The bridge we^re setting in place over Caversham Road will provide space for track to serve new platforms at the station; and the state of the art signalling technology we^re installing will allow us to make huge changes to the track layout to increase capacity and cut delays. This work will benefit passengers along the entire Western route, from south Wales and the south west to London.

^We^ve been planning and preparing for this work for well over a year now. We^re right ready to go and I^m excited to get started.^

The work over the Christmas period will mean substantial changes to train services through Reading, affecting the entire Western route. No trains will be able to run through Reading from 27-30 December, with an amended timetable in place until 4 January (the first working day of the New Year). Passengers will still be able to reach their destinations, with diversionary routes in place wherever possible to reduce the need for replacement bus services. Passengers should check the details of their journeys before they travel to see how they^re affected (www.nationalrail.co.uk).

Work to replace the rail bridge over Caversham Road will require the closure of Caversham Road between Tudor Road (Station Hill) and Caversham Road roundabout from 8pm on 30 December 2010 to 6am on 3 January 2011. Members of the public will be able to view the bridge lift from Caversham Road (the Caversham side of the railway tracks). The main lift is scheduled to take place on the morning of New Year^s Day.

Notes to Editors:

Improving Reading^s railway, key facts:

The project:

^ 730 trains per day serve Reading station. It^s the second busiest station in the UK outside London (only Birmingham New Street is busier)

^ 14m passengers currently use Reading station every year. This is predicted to double by 2030

^ Journey time to London when Reading Station opened: 1hr 5mins. Journey time to London now: 30mins.

This Christmas

^ Working 24/7 for ten days

^ Over 250 Network Rail employees and contractors working over the Christmas period

^ Over 16,000 man hours

Caversham Road bridge

^ 1,000 tonne bridge deck

^ Moved by a self propelled modular transporter with 72 axels. Each axel can be turned independently to allow for very precise movements

^ 25cm ^ the amount of clearance between the new bridge and the corner of our offices on its route to Caversham Road. We^re removing part of the facia from our building to provide an extra metre^s clearance.

Signalling

^ The whole project will transfer control for over 100 miles of railway from Reading to Didcot

^ There are seven stages of recontrol. Stages 1-3 (between Woodborough and Theale on the Berks and Hants line, and from Goring to Cholsey on the Great Western Mainline) are complete

^ Stages 4-7 (between Ruscombe and Pangbourne on the Great Western Mainline, to Theale on the Berks and Hants line, and to Wokingham on the Southern lines) will be completed between 25 ^ 30 December


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on December 21, 2010, 22:03:46
The forecourt of Maidenhead Station would seem to have acquired some portacabins and marque type things obviously in readyness for the busitution west


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on December 31, 2010, 16:12:14
So it looks as though Reading Station is open

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-12020729 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-12020729)
Quote
Reading railway station has reopened to passengers after it was closed for the first step of a ^850m overhaul.

Network Rail has started its remodelling of the station, which will include five more platforms, two additional entrances and a new viaduct.

Major re-signalling works have meant no trains have run through the station since Monday.

A bank holiday timetable will operate throughout New Year's Eve with the station due to fully reopen on Tuesday.

The lifting into place of a new 1,000-tonne railway bridge will also reduce services over the new year weekend, with full closures at certain times.

The main bridge lift is likely to start from 2100 GMT.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on December 31, 2010, 17:39:04
So it looks as though Reading Station is open

Yes..as planned.. :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2010, 18:28:51
And well done to the project managers and engineers concerned.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: autotank on January 01, 2011, 06:01:37
Hear hear - well done to all the guys working unsocial hours to get this vital work done.

I passed the Caversham Road Roundabout last night and could see the bridge being rolled out - looked very impressive. Shame I'm working today and can't go and have a closer look.

I enjoyed my trip on the diverted HST last week - surprised how many semaphores there still are around Greenford just a few miles out of Paddingotn. It's the kind of trip you only really want to do a handful of times though - it was a bit annoyingly slow and time consuming! Well done to FGW though for going the extra (several) miles and going for diversions instead of buses though.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 01, 2011, 10:07:13
Did a little day trip Reading to Weston-super-mare yesterday (excellent fish and chips at the end of the new pier by the way).  Reading station operating smoothly with Platforms 8 and 9 closed, and all through trains including Pad - Didcot stoppers using 4 and 5.  So well done to the operating people for this. As mentioned above, the new Caversham Road Bridge was in the road ready for its move into place to-day.  So well done to the engineers as well.

BUT what isn't as good is customer information.  Pangbourne and Tilehurst stations (there may be others) had very large signs outside stating "Station Closed" despite the fact there were trains every 30 minutes.  But what surely takes the biscuit is the little "Diversionary routes" postcards which have been distributed widely. It's full of errors (eg 1 TPH Reading-Theale, a bus from Reading West going nowhere, etc), appallingly presented, and of little practical use to anyone.  FGW's Customer Service people should first of all check what they produce against the facts, and then test it on focus groups before rushing into production. 

It's such a shame when the operators and engineers plan meticulously, then Customer Services fail to do their job properly by ensuring that information is accurate and clear.

Oh, and Happy New Year by the way.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Lee on January 01, 2011, 13:01:27
From the BBC: (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-12102741)

Quote from: BBC
Reading rail station bridge lifted into place

A new 1,000-tonne railway bridge has been lifted into place at Reading station.

The bridge is part of a ^850m overhaul which will include five more platforms, two new entrances and a viaduct.

Engineers used specialist equipment to slide the bridge into place over Caversham Road during the early hours and work was completed to plan.

Network Rail said it was "confident" services would be back to normal on Tuesday following recent disruptions.

A bank holiday service has been scheduled over the weekend and on Monday.
 
Improvement works, which will remove a major bottleneck in the rail network, saw the station and the Caversham Road closed over the Christmas period.

The bridge will eventually carry rail track to new platforms.

Work to reorganise traffic flows and road layouts around Reading town centre ahead of the project began in June.

David Wilson, from Network Rail, said passengers would feel the benefit when the project was completed in 2016.

He said: "The main benefits from it will come later in that it will transport the new track which will serve the new platforms. Passengers won't see much difference but behind the scenes a massive amount has changed."


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on January 04, 2011, 00:26:58
Pictures of some of the diverted HSTs at Banbury and on the South Western main line here, http://www.hondawanderer.com/Recent_Additions.htm


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on January 04, 2011, 02:53:32
Thanks for the link to those pics, willc.

Best of the bunch, IMHO, is:

http://www.hondawanderer.com/43197_Banbury_2011.htm


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 04, 2011, 10:58:17
Everything seems to have gone very smoothly- all on time for my Didcot to Wokingham journey this morning. Clearly a well planned and implemented job by all involved, and the weather didn't mess things up.

The new bridge seems to have filled all the spaces that used to be between the old bridges, so that is a lot more track space, in addition to the widening northwards that others have commented on here.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on January 04, 2011, 11:00:15
Pictures of bridge being put into place...

http://www.reading-forum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=105&t=5766

I'm impressed by that bridge transporter vehicle!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2011, 15:17:56
Here's an article together with the time-lapse video of the whole process.  It makes fascinating viewing (seriously!) - you can even see the progress made before and after the New Year's Eve re-opening as the trains whizz past on the mains, before stopping again as the main structure slides into place.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2084877_caversham_road_opens_ahead_of_schedule (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2084877_caversham_road_opens_ahead_of_schedule)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on January 04, 2011, 16:01:34
That's fantastic.

When the new bridge suddenly comes into view half way through I LOL'd.  It's size!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: devon_metro on January 04, 2011, 16:09:34
Here's an article together with the time-lapse video of the whole process.  It makes fascinating viewing (seriously!) - you can even see the progress made before and after the New Year's Eve re-opening as the trains whizz past on the mains, before stopping again as the main structure slides into place.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2084877_caversham_road_opens_ahead_of_schedule (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2084877_caversham_road_opens_ahead_of_schedule)

Agreed, marvelous. Didn't quite realise it was such a large structure!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 04, 2011, 17:30:13
The new bridge seems to have filled all the spaces that used to be between the old bridges, so that is a lot more track space, in addition to the widening northwards that others have commented on here.

Yes - as we were predicting a few months back, and now that I've seen it, I'd expect the eventual up fast pair of tracks and maybe even the platform 9 down track will all use the new bridge.  I walked under it this morning and although not too surprising, it covers the entire width from the new abutments to the bridge that had been left. 

A massive lump of prefabricated work, and 'very well done' to all those who did the job.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on January 04, 2011, 23:55:34
Some more diverted HSTs on the Chiltern line towards the bottom of the page here http://geoff-plumb.fotopic.net/c900316.html along with pictures of Chiltern's Class 67+Mk3 workings.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Adrian the Rock on January 05, 2011, 19:59:24
A short video of some of the diversions at Banbury on Dec 30th:

http://www.roscalen.com/signals/Banbury/South.htm#Videos (http://www.roscalen.com/signals/Banbury/South.htm#Videos)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 05, 2011, 20:19:55
I haven't got any footage, but there were also a couple of HST's/Turbos turned round at Aynho Junction when things got a bit congested at Banbury.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Brucey on January 09, 2011, 18:55:01
This video provides an excellent summary of the diverted Waterloo - Westbury journey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFGrkGST3Ss

I was quite surprised at the number of passengers waiting at Basingstoke.  Presumably all from Waterloo on an earlier SWT service.

Poor person filming must have been frozen on arrival at Westbury!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 24, 2011, 19:36:40
I've noticed over the last few days that they seem to be digging up part of the newly laid embankment that has been built where the new Vastern Road bridge will join the Waterloo lines. Is anyone aware of a significant problem there?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on January 28, 2011, 13:14:32
Went to presentatation to the Institute of Civil Engineers at Reading Town Hall on Tuesday. OVer 150 people.

Very good saw, timelapse video, fascinating.

One question I forgot to ask, is whether the East tunnel (old goods link) will have enough clearance for OLE and where the change over to third rail will be?

The problem is that it used to realtively easy, take Farringdon for instance trains raise and lower pans in teh station many time a day. However, the new arangements at Highbury and Islington whereby teh old power suppy has to be switched off and then the new switch on, seems to be unnecessarily complicated and not conjucive to a regular service.

Although they regularly swith the O/H in Aachen station from DC to AC on a regular basis depending on whether a DB or NS train but the train stays native.

O/H to Redhill? with dual through to Wokingham and Ash to Shalford Jn.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on January 28, 2011, 18:11:49
One question I forgot to ask, is whether the East tunnel (old goods link) will have enough clearance for OLE and where the change over to third rail will be?
The problem is that it used to realtively easy, take Farringdon for instance trains raise and lower pans in teh station many time a day. However, the new arangements at Highbury and Islington whereby teh old power suppy has to be switched off and then the new switch on, seems to be unnecessarily complicated and not conjucive to a regular service.
Although they regularly swith the O/H in Aachen station from DC to AC on a regular basis depending on whether a DB or NS train but the train stays native.
O/H to Redhill? with dual through to Wokingham and Ash to Shalford Jn.
Not sure where the equipment will be located, the change over more than likely will be in platforms, not point in having a change over on the move as it is likely all trains will stop at Reading.

There is a number of ac dc interface systems, the most common is 25/25kV isolation transformers and a sectioned dc conrail, running rails have insulted block joints (IBJ's) in both rails with voltage limiting devices across them.  Thameslink at Blackfriers uses a contactor change over system with a large number of rectifiers (at Ludgate Cellars S/S there is 8 2MW units and associates switchgear although only 4 are needed for service they have built in 100% redundancy)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 28, 2011, 18:18:20
Quote
... running rails have insulted block joints (IBJ's) in both rails ...

Sorry, Electric train, but you're beginning to lose me on the technicalities now ...  ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on January 28, 2011, 18:27:36
Quote
... running rails have insulted block joints (IBJ's) in both rails ...

Sorry, Electric train, but you're beginning to lose me on the technicalities now ...  ;D ;D ;D

Electrification is soooooooooo complex esp ac/dc  :o  S & T hate us we keep blowing their stuff up  ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 28, 2011, 20:38:15
One question I forgot to ask, is whether the East tunnel (old goods link) will have enough clearance for OLE and where the change over to third rail will be?

The problem is that it used to realtively easy, take Farringdon for instance trains raise and lower pans in teh station many time a day. However, the new arangements at Highbury and Islington whereby the old power suppy has to be switched off and then the new switch on, seems to be unnecessarily complicated and not conjucive to a regular service.


Will they bother with electrifcation through the underpass initially though?  Surely no electric trains off the 'Southern' will need access to the reliefs, they'll have their three lengthened platforms to play with - and those are supposed to provide enough capacity for Airtrack too.  If there's a need to run trains through the underpass routinely to find platform capacity, wouldn't they be the Gatwick DMUs?

Regarding Highbury, AIUI there is no intention to run any through passenger services between the ELL and the NLL , the prospective use is only to allow dual voltage units to gain access to the depot at New Cross Gate when necessary.  So stopping on the transfer track while changeing over will not be a delay - indeed the OHLE doesn't make it past the footbridge into the platform IIRC, so a platformed changeover cannot happen.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 28, 2011, 20:44:24
After all the discussion a while ago about the new station layout, the latest (Feb) Modern Railways has a 6 page article about the Reading project, and at last it includes a reasonable scale map of the area, including the surrounding streets and buildings, which gives a pretty good indication of the relative positions of the new through platforms.  The three Southern platfoms seem very long, going well past Vastern Rd as you'd expect.

Also repeats that track plan showing all the flyovers and stuff to the west, so may be worth a browse in Mr Smith's library even if you don't normally buy it... ;D

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on January 29, 2011, 08:45:59
There is I believe "passive" allowance for ac/dc change over at Reading, which basically means that what is built must allow space for future equipment.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 29, 2011, 11:13:39
There is I believe "passive" allowance for ac/dc change over at Reading, which basically means that what is built must allow space for future equipment.

That makes sense - and I suggest that economics will come into it, as it may be better to accept a change on a single track section than fit out four separate platform lines?  Although I also think that the Gatwick trains would probably be on DC all the way on the Southern, indeed I'm pretty sure the electrification strategy recommended DC infill on the route, ie Wokingham to Ash and Shalford to Reigate.

OT stuff now...   Am I right in thinking that the Thameslink changeover will be about as complex as it gets, I've read (in the rolling stock ITT stuff) that they want an option of the changeover to be automatic under the control of ATO. I also believe (from something linked to online a while ago) that the contactor system effectively changes the return current set up as the trains progress through the various signal sections between Farringdon and City Thameslink.  The AC/DC changeover positions are normally to be Farringdon southbound, and City T/L northbound, but various fallback options will also be possible to deal with changeover failure on the train, ie to continue to the next station in either direction and reverse, while remaining on AC or DC as appropriate.

Simple it aint...   :(

Further OT stuff.  One of the main issues with dual electrifcation schemes seems to be track circuit intereference (for anyone still reading this is  because the DC Area generally uses AC track circuits, and the AC area DC track circuits).   Presumably this issue goes away (or is reduced) if axle counters are adopted, especially in an area which is being resignalled anyway?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on January 29, 2011, 11:46:13
Paul thanks for the reference to Modern Railways I get a copy through RSA membership.

It doesn't mention the Eastern tunnel connection specifically certainly not whether it will have clearance for O/H wire. I would imagine that everyone would want condutor rails confined to new SW platforms and not have it in the main station, hence my query as to where the changeover might be.

Going back to Modern Railways there is an intersting sub article on Reading and Crossrail. Which implies that after the enlargement and wirng to Oxford and teh new depot that Crossrail could get to Reading and be cheaper overall because things like the turnback sidings at Maidenhead would not be required.

Especialy as there is another article which says tunnelling won't be finished until 2018 because of new way of doing the central portion. It's to do with making the staions boxes from below via the TBM bored running tunnels rather than down to meet them. Not sure I've expalined that correctly, but it probably means the wires might well be at Reading by then.

Maybe Networkrail have learnt the old BR trick of doing things down the line and then linking them up eg starting West Coast electrification in Manchester and Liverpool and working South and trialing 25Kv between Colchester and Clacton and then linking to Shenfield and converting the DC to 6.25/25Kv.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on January 29, 2011, 19:48:53
Maybe Networkrail have learnt the old BR trick of doing things down the line and then linking them up .........
Not so much learning old trick NR have employed many of the BR electrification engineers that were about in 95, the office has many old friends in it


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on February 03, 2011, 11:17:32
On my way to the station this morning I saw that new scaffolding has gone up on the South side of the East bridge.

I take it this is the beginning of the new structure for the bridge widening for the extended Waterloo line platforms?

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on February 03, 2011, 12:04:57
As I mentioned earlier, they seem to be digging up the recently laid new embankment on the Eastern side of Vastern Rd, where the new bridge span will join the Waterloo lines. It looks like they've even removed the new retaining wall that separates the pedestrian route and the new embankment. I suspect a problem has been found, perhaps the ground under the new embankment isn't stable enough and needs to be underpinned with further concrete piling?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on February 14, 2011, 13:26:34
As I mentioned earlier, they seem to be digging up the recently laid new embankment on the Eastern side of Vastern Rd, where the new bridge span will join the Waterloo lines. It looks like they've even removed the new retaining wall that separates the pedestrian route and the new embankment. I suspect a problem has been found, perhaps the ground under the new embankment isn't stable enough and needs to be underpinned with further concrete piling?

Looking this morning it appears that even more of the recent work is having to be re-done! The new embankment has been completely dug up for several metres back from Vastern Rd, I can't believe this is all going according to plan. Anyone else seen it?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 14, 2011, 13:40:51
Can't say that I've noticed too much - I don't think the embankments had ever been fully built up to the new rail level (even accounting for ballast), so perhaps it's more a case of minor surgery than anything more calamitous?

Meanwhile, work on the other side of the tracks with supports and embankments for the re-instated underpass leading to the southern lines, is proceeding at quite a pace with soil dropped and compacted and much work going on underneath the GWML bridge.  The materials and offices area to the east of this underpass is also being quickly developed with more cabins and facilities cropping up all the time.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on February 14, 2011, 13:45:42
Can't say that I've noticed too much - I don't think the embankments had ever been fully built up to the new rail level (even accounting for ballast), so perhaps it's more a case of minor surgery than anything more calamitous?

Meanwhile, work on the other side of the tracks with supports and embankments for the re-instated underpass leading to the southern lines, is proceeding at quite a pace with soil dropped and compacted and much work going on underneath the GWML bridge.  The materials and offices area to the east of this underpass is also being quickly developed with more cabins and facilities cropping up all the time.

Well they did have a new block-built retaining wall between the footway on Vastern Rd and the end of the new embankment, and the infill had got very close up to the level of the existing tracks before the recent work started. This new wall does now appear to have been knocked down, and the carefully compacted aggregate dug out for several metres back, the digging out apparently following what looked like an attempt to put in some concrete piles.  I'd guess it is a bit more than minor surgery!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on February 14, 2011, 15:41:31
and the infill had got very close up to the level of the existing tracks before the recent work started. This new wall does now appear to have been knocked down, and the carefully compacted aggregate dug out for several metres back, the digging out apparently following what looked like an attempt to put in some concrete piles.  I'd guess it is a bit more than minor surgery!

Possibly, I'll take a wander down there on foot sometime to see the extent of the work/dismantling - though the infill had only got anywhere near it's final height for only a very short section when compared to the overall length of embankment that will be required.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 21, 2011, 09:40:30
Did you find out any more about this? Since my previous post on this there has been further excavation of the new embankment, right back down to the original ground level, with what looks like another concrete base being poured close to the point where the tracks to the new bridge will join the existing track.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 21, 2011, 10:40:06
The explanation I got (from a chap in orange walking past who may or not have known what he was on about) was this. 

It was all planned, because the piling machine needs a level base for it to operate from, so they build up the level as required and then drill the cores down through the compacted material. The steel tubes that go down with the auger, are then withdrawn as the concrete is pumped in, and the reinforced concrete sets into place in the hole.  Removing the made ground afterwards leaves the piles at an extended height out the ground, and if necessary they are then trimmed back to the required height.

Or something like that...   ???

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 21, 2011, 14:32:17
Interesting- thanks. I suppose that would explain it, though I still think it is a bit strange for them to build what looked like a permanant block wall only to knock down bits of it and presumably then rebuild, instead of using something temporary. Maybe it was simpler this way.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 22, 2011, 10:56:38
Meanwhile work is progressing well on the north side of the east end with the ramp down to the reinstalled southern underpass pretty much complete and ready for ballast and a track.  Tangible signs of work about to start in earnest on the support embankment for the new southern platform, i.e. the station side of Vastern Road as well.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 22, 2011, 13:20:44
Just surmising here, but it's quite possible that the underpass might be a fairly early requirement, because if the track works for the new Southern platforms are staged over a few weeks or months, only one platform face might be available on the current P4.  A temporary solution might then be to divert the FGW Gatwicks into the main station - the current platform 10 bay could be a likely destination?

PS - I just saw in Today's Railways mag that they expect the three 12 car 'Southern' platforms to be in use by this December - does that fit with previous understanding of the timescales?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 22, 2011, 16:07:41
Network Rail have reported that advance utilities work starts on one of the Cow Lane underbridges this weekend:

http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/COW-LANE-IMPROVEMENTS-TO-BENEFIT-ROAD-AND-RAIL-USERS-IN-READING-16eb/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx

Paul



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 22, 2011, 21:04:51
I just saw in Today's Railways mag that they expect the three 12 car 'Southern' platforms to be in use by this December - does that fit with previous understanding of the timescales?

Yes, I think by 2011 has been the stated date for that (and the underpass I believe?). Certainly that's what NR have been saying on their timeline: http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/9126.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/9126.aspx)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 26, 2011, 13:58:41
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-12869989):

Quote
Reading rail bridges widening closes Cow Lane

Motorists have been warned to expect delays when a road is closed as part of a revamp to Reading's railway station.

Cow Lane will be shut from 1900 GMT until 1100 GMT on Sunday while work to widen two rail bridges starts.

The project will see the bridges expanded to fit two lanes for motorists, a cycle path and pavements to help ease a traffic bottleneck.

The work is part of a ^850m revamp of Reading station by Network Rail which is due to be completed in 2016.

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/51851000/jpg/_51851739_51851738.jpg)

Cow Lane will again be closed in May, this time for for up to three weeks, as part of the widening scheme which will also allow space for a new track layout to boost capacity for rail users.

Bill Henry, Network Rail's project director for Reading, said: "Our work in Reading isn't just about improving the performance of the railway and building a better station. The changes we're making to Cow Lane will bring big benefits for cyclists, pedestrians and motorists, cutting congestion and making the road safer. This is a big engineering project and we're making every effort to minimise its impact on residents and businesses in the Cow Lane area."


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 31, 2011, 20:08:01
I've noticed that ongoing construction work is taking place slightly to the west of the new Caversham Rd bridge. This bridge extended further to the north than the width of the existing embankment, and a new concrete platform was built on the eastern side to connect to it. So I'm wondering whether there is going to be widening of a significant length of the embankment to the west of the bridge, as it looks like there is a gap which if filled would provide a wider embankment all the way to Cow Lane. 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 31, 2011, 21:36:12
If I'm understanding you correctly, then I think there will be a short widening of the embankment immediately west of Caversham Road so that the tracks for the five additional platforms, especially the furthest north (Platform 15) can use all of the space afforded by the bridge deck that was replaced.

According to the map on page 15 of this thread, the remaining space between Caversham Road and Cow Lane is set aside for the proposed IEP sidings which could probably fit in the existing space once the many redundant railway buildings have been removed or relocated - indeed some of these have already been demolished.  Then, west of Cow Lane, the new Turbo (or Class 319 as it will probably be by then) depot and sidings will be built.

I'm not sure whether this will involve the widening of Cow Lane for rail tracks with a new deck as happened at Caversham Road, but there is certainly a lot of work going to take place there during the next twelve months.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 31, 2011, 21:50:16
Yes, that was what I meant. Looking at Google, there is a short section west of Caversham Rd where the embankment is a bit narrower than the rest, up to a group of buildings. Hopefully visible here (a grassy strip is visible between the embankment and the road running parallel to it):

ttp://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Reading&aq=0&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.783636,28.256836&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Reading,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.460217,-0.977665&spn=0.001771,0.003449&t=h&z=18 (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Reading&aq=0&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.783636,28.256836&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Reading,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.460217,-0.977665&spn=0.001771,0.003449&t=h&z=18)

I say 'short', but it is still a few hundred metres, so still a lot of civil engineering if they build up the full length. What method do you think they will use?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 01, 2011, 10:45:01
If you look at the end of the video of the bridge slide you'll see that the north side of the bridge is at a somewhat acute angle to the line of the relaid relief lines. 

The more accurate plan in the February Modern Railways shows the two lines from the new platforms 14 and 15 (up reliefs)  combining at roughly the western side of the Caversham Bridge, so the northmost track is not parallel to the edge of the bridge.  So what I'm thinking is that the dimensions of the bridge are governed by the track position on the east side, but there's some spare space on the west side.   

In the case of the two tracks from the down relief platforms, they're not combined into one until further along - about half way along that 'strip of greenery' on the aerial view, and just after that there's another junction from the up relief fanning out to the north for the new depot. 

It does look (from MR's drawing) as though the area at track level could be 'squared off' in line with the side of the new bridge, but there's no track shown in the space provided. 

Paul   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 01, 2011, 14:58:13
Here's a few more details about the new Maintenance, sorry Train Care Depot to be built between Cow Lane bridge and Scours Lane Junction (taken from an internal NR release):

*  Depot to be passed to FGW on or before August 2013.

*  Relocate FGW (plant, labour materials) 6-8 weeks.

*  From Aug 2013 to 2015 there will be a staging issue in the west end, the depot run round road will be 3m from the Mainline Up Goods until viaduct completed.

*  Depot will run with 2 connections until 2015 when connection at Wigmore Lane will be installed.

*  Overhead Line Equipment:  All bases, steelwork and wiring planned to be installed before depot is handed over, except for the west end.  The Up Goods Line is on the line of the OLE bases.  Planned for daytime possessions to install the works in the east end of the depot post 2015.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2011, 20:12:19
A few new pictures here that may be of interest, first ones I've seen of the eastern underpass so far, also shows good progress on the new approach ramp to the underpass:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=75473887&postcount=99

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on April 15, 2011, 10:10:09
Work now appears to have started on construction of the new Vastern Rd bridge for the Waterloo platforms. I was interested to see that the bridge is being built in situ, rather than being assembled elsewhere and carried into place in one piece, as was done at Caversham Rd.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on April 15, 2011, 10:14:54
Hi,

Regarding the new Vastern Road bridge I am intrigued to see that the bridge extension is using the same design.  I take it that all the original design plans were available for new parts to be replicated or did carrying on the same design involve investigating how the old design was done?

I'd assumed that the widening would just involve two new bridges (with a different design) either side.  What they're doing is much more impressive!

Cheers,

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 15, 2011, 10:56:34
Hi,

Regarding the new Vastern Road bridge I am intrigued to see that the bridge extension is using the same design.  I take it that all the original design plans were available for new parts to be replicated or did carrying on the same design involve investigating how the old design was done?

I'd assumed that the widening would just involve two new bridges (with a different design) either side.  What they're doing is much more impressive!

Cheers,

Boppy.

Nuttalls built the existing bridge when the road was widened in the seventies - they should have kept the plans, but if they hadn't, NR would have done.  Matching existing was a planning requirement:

http://www.bamnuttall.co.uk/PDFfiles/ReadingStationRedevelopment.pdf

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on April 15, 2011, 12:16:13
Thanks for the info Paul!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 21, 2011, 16:55:39
Another good set of pictures put up on the skyscraper city thread, showing the new Vastern Rd bridge spans, as dicussed above:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=76319069&postcount=107

Hope this is of some interest to those who don't get to Reading often.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 21, 2011, 23:26:02
Thanks, Paul.  I only noticed today that the bridge supports across the Vastern Road had started to be installed.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 12, 2011, 22:22:30
Another public exhibition of the plans has been announced for 19-21st May at Reading Town Hall.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2092553_railway_plans_go_on_display (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2092553_railway_plans_go_on_display)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 18, 2011, 14:09:49
The project is set to be complete a year early, in 2015.  Amalgamation of works during Easter 2013 has led to this improvement.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-13437508 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-13437508)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 18, 2011, 14:46:58
The Platforms get renumbered this Xmas, together with some signalling & bridge work - and one additional platform, I understand.

A 5-day Oxford - Didcot blockade is also being scheduled this Xmas (possibly for other work)

Then Easter 2013 is the next major blockade.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on May 18, 2011, 14:50:30
Then Easter 2013 is the next major blockade.

Do you know what scale of disruption this will cause to services through reading, and any idea whats being done?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 18, 2011, 14:51:39
BIG - same scale as before with no trains through Reading.

Not sure yet just how many days closure there is....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 19, 2011, 17:40:00
Had a look at the exhibition this morning - it gives little or no new information really.

The key point I took away is that the newly compressed timescale (saving a year) is mainly to do with the western grade separated junctions. There is little or no change to the previously published timeline for the station works - it may complete a couple of months earlier, but not much.

Regarding the Southern (Waterloo) platforms, the plan is that in Jan 2012 they'll start using the new platform (P4 in the renumbered scheme), and the existing pair (future 5 and 6) will then be taken out of use one at a time and lengthened and straightened, by summer 2012.  The new track layout, ie the two track approach and various crossovers, will be complete in Jan 2012 though - which will overcome the limitation of the current single track over the bridge.  New info (at least for me) was confirmation that the three platforms will be dead straight and parallel - ie the current curvature to tuck in behind P4 will be removed.

(Recent PR seemed to suggest this area would all be finished next Jan, but this seems to have been an oversimplification.)

The key date of Easter 2013 is when the four new relief line platforms will be brought intom use with a big bang, having been built in green zone conditions, ie outside the blue fencing which denotes the operational railway boundary.

The following info, mostly discussed before was reconfirmed: 

Current P7 bay will close this December, as the space is needed for the new transfer deck.
Current P5 and P8, the down main island, retains its current shape, but all the buildings will be removed - this will be done behind hoardings with the platform faces remaining in use.
Current P4 will be closed some time (late in the sequence) to be straightened somewhat, the middle of the platform will be extended out by a couple of metres as there will only be two tracks rather than the three current.
Current P9 will be extended southwards over approximately one track width, to widen what will be the up main island, and the P10 bay will be filled in.  The buildings will all be demolished, again this will be done behind hoardings with the platform in use.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 19, 2011, 17:44:24
Thanks, Paul.  That all pretty much makes sense.  Do you know when the southern underpass at the eastern end is scheduled to open?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on May 19, 2011, 17:48:28
Are any of the on platform buildings being retained or replaced?  Or will we go back to buying food and drinks on trains again?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 19, 2011, 17:48:55
Regarding the Southern (Waterloo) platforms, the plan is that in Jan 2011 they'll start using the new platform (P4 in the renumbered scheme), and the existing pair (future 5 and 6) will then be taken out of use one at a time and lengthened and straightened, by summer 2012.  The new track layout, ie the two track approach and various crossovers, will be complete in Jan 2011 though - which will overcome the current single track over the bridge.  New info (at least for me) was confirmation that the three platforms will be dead straight and parallel - ie the current curvature to tuck in behind P4 will be removed.

(Recent PR seemed to suggest this area would all be finished next Jan, but this seems to have been an oversimplification.)

Errrrr......next Jan IS Jan 2012.....Jan 11 having passed a few months ago!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 19, 2011, 17:50:23
Are any of the on platform buildings being retained or replaced?  Or will we go back to buying food and drinks on trains again?

It would cost a lot of money NOT to replace any demolished buildings, surely?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 19, 2011, 17:52:42
Thanks, Paul.  That all pretty much makes sense.  Do you know when the southern underpass at the eastern end is scheduled to open?

Forgot to ask that - sorry.  Perhaps someone else could check that out.

Are any of the on platform buildings being retained or replaced?  Or will we go back to buying food and drinks on trains again?

All four island platforms, will have full facilities to include waiting rooms, catering, toilets etc etc.  No facilities will be lost, they'll be re-provided to modern standards.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 19, 2011, 17:53:55
Regarding the Southern (Waterloo) platforms, the plan is that in Jan 2011 they'll start using the new platform (P4 in the renumbered scheme), and the existing pair (future 5 and 6) will then be taken out of use one at a time and lengthened and straightened, by summer 2012.  The new track layout, ie the two track approach and various crossovers, will be complete in Jan 2011 though - which will overcome the current single track over the bridge.  New info (at least for me) was confirmation that the three platforms will be dead straight and parallel - ie the current curvature to tuck in behind P4 will be removed.

(Recent PR seemed to suggest this area would all be finished next Jan, but this seems to have been an oversimplification.)

Errrrr......next Jan IS Jan 2012.....Jan 11 having passed a few months ago!

Ta, I'll edit my post to avoid confusing everyone.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on May 20, 2011, 10:57:45
I picked up one of the leaflets they were handing out.

I'd say the plan of the new platforms and track layout has improved over last time but it's still full of inconsistencies and in one place I'm sure clear error.

  • The main lines are clearly represented by 4 tracks out to the East towards London and the West towards Bristol and then the individual tracks are shown next to each platform.  But towards Reading West it shows that only a single track exists rather than two.  Also the 3 new platforms 4, 5 & 6 towards Wokingham will merge into just a single track rather than two.
  • The diagram states that the lines out to the West (Bristol/Oxford) will not be able to use platforms 1, 2 or 3?!?!

I know proper schematics of the layout exist but surely it wouldn't have taken much more to fix this diagram up more accurately?

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2011, 11:01:00
  • The diagram states that the lines out to the West (Bristol/Oxford) will not be able to use platforms 1, 2 or 3?!?!

I know proper schematics of the layout exist but surely it wouldn't have taken much more to fix this diagram up more accurately?

The vast majority of customers don't care what the layout is like & would be perfectly happy with schematics.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Zoe on May 20, 2011, 11:11:30
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN2OEXQr4RI

An interesting new type of signal appears at 5 - 10 seconds in this Network Rail video.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 20, 2011, 11:12:17
hmmm.......


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 20, 2011, 11:27:27
  • The diagram states that the lines out to the West (Bristol/Oxford) will not be able to use platforms 1, 2 or 3?!?!


The current SR Quail only shows P3 with access to the down main, as does the new layout. 

So they're mostly or 2/3 right...   ;D

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on May 20, 2011, 11:31:42
Ah sorry!  I would have though that having those bays linked up would have been handy - but if one is enough so be it!

Thanks for correcting me!  :)

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 20, 2011, 13:00:18
Ah sorry!  I would have though that having those bays linked up would have been handy - but if one is enough so be it!

Thanks for correcting me!  :)

Boppy.

Actually, for what it's worth I was somewhat surprised by the track layout there.  I suspect though that it's partly because of the existing FGW 'western bay' service patterns all being towards the Newbury or Basingstoke directions. However P3 will get a lot more use shortly when P7 closes for the works to the main island. All those XC services that sit for half an between services will also have to use P3, I can't see any another option.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on May 20, 2011, 13:38:31
I'm curious about how the new lines to the Waterloo platforms will connect with the existing ones. I had assumed that the junction would be squeezed into the narrow space between the end of the new platforms and the start of where the line descends to the bottom of the embankment. However, work appears to be taking place alongside the line at the bottom of the slope, as if preparing space for additional track, so I'm now wondering if the junction will be there, with the new tracks climbing up to the bridge on a new ramp parallel to the existing one...? The newly widened embankment includes a ramp in that direction, but I had assumed it was only for construction vehicle access.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 20, 2011, 14:13:04
The platforms are all extended by at least enough to allow 12 cars - but the current platforms are only barely long enough for 8,  so I expect the rebuild will include a much greater marigin at the buffer end as well, if rebuilt to current standards.  So I'd estimate the platform ends will be at least 100m away from the present ramp. 

The various track diagrams suggest a set of points combining the new platform 4 and 5 lines, then a pair of facing and trailing crossovers (ie not a diamond crossing) to allow entry and exit from the station, so I'd suggest another quite significant length there - getting well towards the underpass.  Would they normally build an S&C layout on a ramp if they had an alternative?  Not really sure on that.

On the Modern Railways scale drawing (that I mentioned a few pages back) the junctions and crossovers are off the page to the right, but the platform ends reach as far as that large octagonal building that Google satellite view shows on the far side of Vastern Rd.   

PS - looking at Google's satellite view it loooks like a typical simple crossover between two tracks takes around 60m of track length - so the points and crossings could easily take up around 150m anyway...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on May 20, 2011, 14:29:08
Thanks, just taken a look on Google maps and I see what you mean. The track will have to ramp up much earlier than I'd appreciated, so there's a lot more earthworks and embankment building still to be done.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 24, 2011, 14:59:57
An interesting video showing a computer generated impression of the new station forecourt, underpass, and northern entrance with taxi rank and altered RailAir loading point.  It looks pretty smart I must say, though the camera never quite shows whether the rusting shell of Western Tower will still blight the view!  No details of the actual track, platforms or concourse.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2093181_video_shows_new_look_for_reading_railway_station (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2093181_video_shows_new_look_for_reading_railway_station)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 25, 2011, 11:47:03
That lower level plus the walkway through to the North look like skateboard city to me!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on May 26, 2011, 10:56:00
Just seen some info re the platform renumbering -

The passenger subway will close in July this year.

All platform numbering changes take effect on resumption of service on 27 December. Current pLatform 7 closes permanently on that date. (Strictly speaking, I guess it really closes on December 24 close of service).

Also on that date, signal TR253 at the London end of current platform 5 is being moved approx 10 metres further west (back down platform), to enable other signalling equipment to be installed. THe HST stopping point may move too)

Current platform 10 is being widened to a temporary (until Easter 2013) new track alignment to provide space on the platform for a Transfer Deck support.

The new platform 4 and renumbered platform 6 (old 4a) in use from that date. In March 2012, it'll be new Platform 4 along with renumnbered platform 5 (old 4b) until July 2012 when all three will be opened.

The other new platforms only open after the major Easter blockade in 2013 (new platforms 12 - 15), along with the Transfer Deck.

Also at Easter 2013, current platform 10 (new 11) changes to a through platform (from current London Bay) and current platform 6 (new 16) closes permanently.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 26, 2011, 16:00:29
Useful info, Chris.  Thanks.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: The SprinterMeister on May 26, 2011, 16:42:07
Also on that date, signal TR253 at the London end of current platform 5 is being moved approx 10 metres further west (back down platform), to enable other signalling equipment to be installed. THe HST stopping point may move too.
Don't think you'll get an HST to stand in rear of TR253. That's the signal that protects the exit from the current East end facing bay platform 6....

TR53 is the LED signal on the London end of platform 5.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on May 26, 2011, 18:49:20
and current platform 6 (new 16) closes permanently.
Must be one of the shortest lived platforms .. platform 16


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on May 26, 2011, 19:14:49
Workington North anyone?  (but I know what you mean  ;D)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on May 29, 2011, 15:11:30
Traveled through Reading for the first time in months; the new MDU (Maintenance Delivery Unit) UP side on the London end of the station looks to be open, the old panel box has a lot of it operating floor ripped out can not be ong before the big wreckers move in.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: SandTEngineer on May 29, 2011, 18:51:49
RIP http://photos.signallingnotices.org.uk/photo.php?pc=245&p=IMG_3898.JPG  :'( :'(


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on May 29, 2011, 20:02:33
Traveled through Reading for the first time in months; the new MDU (Maintenance Delivery Unit) UP side on the London end of the station looks to be open, the old panel box has a lot of it operating floor ripped out can not be ong before the big wreckers move in.

Is that at mainline track level - or is that what that large concrete floored compound at a lower level down by the roadside is? 

(On the way along towards Tescos at Kings Meadow - I'm not sure of the road name...)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on May 29, 2011, 20:35:35
Traveled through Reading for the first time in months; the new MDU (Maintenance Delivery Unit) UP side on the London end of the station looks to be open, the old panel box has a lot of it operating floor ripped out can not be ong before the big wreckers move in.

Is that at mainline track level - or is that what that large concrete floored compound at a lower level down by the roadside is? 

(On the way along towards Tescos at Kings Meadow - I'm not sure of the road name...)

Paul
On the way to Tescos the old "Cattle Pens" Depot has gone although the modern modular building look inhabited and still has a sign on it


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on June 02, 2011, 17:57:18
OMG - a news update on the FGW website!  Dated 27th May -  it says  (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/NewsItem.aspx?id=687)the work at Christmas went well.

Quote
Network Rail and First Great Western have welcomed a report by Passenger Focus, which singles out the engineering works in Reading over Christmas 2010 and the associated passenger communication as best practice.
Network Rail Project director Bill Henry said: ^Close partnerships with train operators including First Great Western were key to our success over Christmas. The Reading job was a huge engineering challenge, but just as important for all of us was minimising the impact of our work on passengers.

^Before Christmas, we made big upgrades to the railway so that trains could be diverted around Reading, reducing the need for replacement buses. We also worked with train operators to run the largest joint communications campaign we^ve ever delivered to support engineering works, making sure people knew the facts before they planned their journeys.

^This Christmas was the launch pad for a five year programme of upgrade work that will transform Reading^s railway. We^ll continue to work with train operators to plan our work efficiently, keeping the railway running and getting passengers where they need to go.^
More on the link above.

Also includes a link to  Passenger Focus  (http://passengerfocus.org.uk/news-and-publications/press-release.asp?dsid=5161) for the full report.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on June 03, 2011, 17:40:24
Traveled through Reading for the first time in months; the new MDU (Maintenance Delivery Unit) UP side on the London end of the station looks to be open, the old panel box has a lot of it operating floor ripped out can not be ong before the big wreckers move in.

Is that at mainline track level - or is that what that large concrete floored compound at a lower level down by the roadside is? 

(On the way along towards Tescos at Kings Meadow - I'm not sure of the road name...)

Paul

The old panel box was by the North side of the goods lines which ran behind platform 9. I assumme that's what Electrictrain was refering to. Don't think the concrete base you are refering to is on railway land, although it may have been in the past pre closure of goods yard and signal works.   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on June 03, 2011, 19:07:24
Traveled through Reading for the first time in months; the new MDU (Maintenance Delivery Unit) UP side on the London end of the station looks to be open, the old panel box has a lot of it operating floor ripped out can not be ong before the big wreckers move in.

Is that at mainline track level - or is that what that large concrete floored compound at a lower level down by the roadside is? 

(On the way along towards Tescos at Kings Meadow - I'm not sure of the road name...)

Paul

The old panel box was by the North side of the goods lines which ran behind platform 9. I assumme that's what Electrictrain was refering to. Don't think the concrete base you are refering to is on railway land, although it may have been in the past pre closure of goods yard and signal works.   
The concrete base Paul is referring to is at the low level East of the station on the North side used to be part of the Gas Works sidings


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Timmer on June 05, 2011, 10:55:15
OMG - a news update on the FGW website!  Dated 27th May -  it says  (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/NewsItem.aspx?id=687)the work at Christmas went well.
Whilst everyone should be pleased that in general arrangements for covering services around the time of the Reading blockade went well, it was disappointing that a number of services, particularly on December 27th and January 1st, ended or started short of Paddington/Waterloo at Oxford and Basingstoke respectively because of a lack of pilots to cover the diverted routes. This seems to have been missed in reports/articles that I have read about the Reading works over Christmas/New Year.

If I had been a passenger on these trains I would have been none too pleased particularly if had been travelling to London and only getting as far as Oxford. Basingstoke not so bad as SWT were running a normal service to Waterloo and you may have actually found yourself arriving into London earlier because the FGW HSTs had to go via Staines.

I hope lessons have been learned from this even if they have not been made public with a view to ensuring less trains end up terminating/starting short of London when the next blockade takes place.

On the whole I thought the communication of these works was excellent and should be used as an example for future major rail engineering projects.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: willc on June 09, 2011, 20:17:35
Contractor chosen for the station rebuilding. From Network rail press release:

Quote
A Costain/Hochteif joint venture has been named preferred contractor for Network Rail^s rebuild of Reading station.

The contract will see five new platforms constructed at Reading, relieving congestion on the Great Western Main Line and spelling an end to the familiar experience of waiting outside the station for a platform.

The contract, worth approximately ^80m, is one of the biggest that will be awarded as part of Network Rail^s ^850m project to transform Reading^s railway.

Full release here: http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/NETWORK-RAIL-ANNOUNCES-PREFERRED-CONTRACTOR-FOR-READING-STATION-UPGRADE-179e/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on June 15, 2011, 22:30:49
Big chunks being taken out of the old 'signal box' this afternoon while I was waiting for my train on P8.

I had a walk round for a look at the new Vastern Rd bridge from the roadside - what seemed noticeable (to me) is that the three new spans that are now in position on the north side (for the new line down to the underpass) are at a different spacing to the rest of the bridge, including the new stuff on the south side.

The only explanation I can think of is that the 'pitch' of the original spans didn't quite fit a single track width IYSWIM, ie two wouldn't have been enough, and three at teh normal spacing would have been unnecessarily wide?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on June 16, 2011, 12:12:45
...and some updated pictures taken yesterday:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=79677666&postcount=117

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on June 16, 2011, 22:13:34
...and some updated pictures taken yesterday:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=79677666&postcount=117

Paul

The old telephone exchange flattened also the single story buildings that I once had a desk in flattened ............ oh well progress


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on June 16, 2011, 22:19:34
Wonder where that skylight's from, sitting to the left of the pile of rubble in the penultimate photo? 

Wonder if someone's claimed it for re-use somewhere...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on June 27, 2011, 19:16:49
I went through Reading on Friday.  The old panel box has now gone. 

The new building on Napier Road (Kings Meadow) neaar Tescos has a Network Rail logo on it.  Is this a permenant replaceemnt for the temporary Reading Delivery unit building which is still standing lonely to the west of the Caversham Road bridge. 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on June 27, 2011, 19:21:10
I'm sure someone will be along presently to answer that query, ellen.

In the meantime, a very warm welcome to the Coffee Shop!  :D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on July 14, 2011, 23:01:29
More photographs of the work have been posted on

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=6 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=6)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 19, 2011, 15:31:41
Thanks for the link to those updated pictures, ellendune.

In addition, the crossings for the link to the reinstated eastern underpass line have now started to be installed on the Down and Up Southern lines, along with some additional/revised signalling, clipped out of use until commisioning this December.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on July 20, 2011, 20:11:20
Yes, there is a lot of activity there at the moment. It is now becoming clearer where the widened ramp up to the Southern platforms will start, with a new retaining wall now built just behind the new signal equipment box at the bottom of the ramp and a lot more aggregate being added along its length. It looks to me as if a single track's width is being added at the lower end of the ramp, widening to two tracks width at a new piled concrete retaining wall structure that has been built at around the point where the ramp levels off.

It looks like the concrete base for the new bridge  is now, complete, and retaining walls to link the bridge to the start of the existing retaining wall the other side of platform 2b have been completed. Space between the existing platform 4b tracks and the retaining wall has been cleared as if in preparation for having ballast added for the third track. I'm curious to know how the platform will be added to the old retaining wall- will this be raised and a platform added to the top, overhanging the existing wall? Also, a huge pile of large white blocks has been unloaded at the site, anyone know what they are for?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on July 20, 2011, 21:25:32
Also, a huge pile of large white blocks has been unloaded at the site, anyone know what they are for?
Polystyrene used as fill between shuttering when concrete is case when remove leaves a void is my guess


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 20, 2011, 23:07:29
I had a look from the footbridge a few weeks ago and tried to estimate the overall width required.  It would be highly unusual for the back of the new platform to overhang the Vastern Rd bridge's parapet, and it has to be 2.5 metres deep (although that could be given a concession at the far end).  My gut feeling is that the concrete formwork you can see in the third of the latest photos is the alignment of the back of the platform structure, and therefore there will be a space of about a metre between it and the existing concrete wall.  On the station side of the bridge adjacent to that formwork there is a massive concrete block with no apparent purpose (yet!) - I'd be interested to know what that is all about, it doesn't seem to have an equivalent on the other side of the bridge.   ??? 

I suppose once the new platform structure starts appearing everything will suddenly become clearer;  however I also suspect that the track into the new platform won't be laid until Christmas.  My reasoning here is that the track alongside the existing island will have to be removed before the new can be laid. I know from the NR Q&A session a couple of months back that the project includes straightening the existing platforms so that they will be parallel with the new one, ie the existing curvature (away from the main lines) near the buffer stops gets removed.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on July 21, 2011, 09:00:24
Also, a huge pile of large white blocks has been unloaded at the site, anyone know what they are for?
Polystyrene used as fill between shuttering when concrete is case when remove leaves a void is my guess

They do indeed look like these polystyrene blocks used in construction:
http://www.sundolitt.co.uk/default.asp?menu=8683

Looks like they are going to use them to build up the gap that still remains between the newly cast concrete bridge abutment and the start of the existing retaining wall next to platform 4b. However, there is a large pile of them, so maybe they are also going to use them to build the new platform as well?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on July 21, 2011, 20:59:22
Using polystyerene would reduce any increase in load on the existing retaining wall.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Not from Brighton on July 21, 2011, 23:36:44
They do indeed look like these polystyrene blocks used in construction:
http://www.sundolitt.co.uk/default.asp?menu=8683
Polystyrene you could park a car on, there's something I'd never imagined.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on July 25, 2011, 17:36:47
I took a couple of photos with the phone this lunchtime, the 'new' concrete retaining wall is basically in line with the nearest parts of the existing wall alongside Apex Plaza.  What I suggested earlier about it being nearer than the wall must have been an illusion as seen from the platform. The big lump of concrete I noted is consistent with the parapet height as well...

Uploaded the pics as attachments hereunder so not brilliant quality.

Interestingly, one of the Nuttall workmen told me that their contracted work is planned to be handed over to Network Rail this weekend, with the platform works contractor starting immediately afterwards.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on July 29, 2011, 00:46:43
Here's a telephoto shot (light fading) showing the connections now installed on the Southern Lines east of Reading station.  The short length of new single track will dive under the GWML and emerge up the embankment on the north side of the formation reinstating a link removed (I think) in the 60's.

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6020/5986226914_9858b29b2c_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on August 03, 2011, 20:25:00
The line of the platform is now apparent over Vastern Rd bridge, there's a concrete foundation strip appeared, by eye I'd say it's possibly a couple of metres from, and parallel to, the bridge parapet.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 03, 2011, 20:28:16
Two more switch ends have been installed between the one in my photo above and the station.  Bagged over new/realigned signal heads are now installed in a few places too.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on August 03, 2011, 20:48:00
It's all quite encouraging isn't it - and they ought to be able to progress the first new platform pretty quickly as well, as they are in green zone conditions.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: anthony215 on August 03, 2011, 21:46:41
I have to say the work at Reading is progressing very well, i look forward to wandering around the station when work is complete.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on August 05, 2011, 09:36:07
I'm curious about what is planned for the station end of the new platform, where space is constrained by the adjacent delivery ramp for the station and there are a couple of concrete structures in the ground next to the existing platform 4b track. Someone I was recently idly chatting to while watching the construction work  said that the trains would stop further back than the existing buffers, and that the ends of the curent bays would be filled in to provide more passenger circulation space. I can see that this would also help provide access to the new platform given the space constraints there.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on August 05, 2011, 11:14:33
I think the circulation space will nearly all be gained from the removal of the lift, escalators and stairs to the current footbridge - all of which will be gone. 

The trains will probably have to stop further back anyway because current standards for bays/buffers will have to apply to the new work, but there'll then be a larger gap between the buffers and the 'cross platform' (the section joining the platforms together).

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on August 12, 2011, 21:52:23
Note that the final London and South East RUS http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browseDirectory.aspx?dir=\RUS%20Documents\Route%20Utilisation%20Strategies\RUS%20Generation%202\London%20and%20South%20East (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browseDirectory.aspx?dir=\RUS%20Documents\Route%20Utilisation%20Strategies\RUS%20Generation%202\London%20and%20South%20East) recomends an early decision to extend Crossrail to Reading to save ^31M is savings at Maidenhead and to provide additional capacity to releave overcrowding on Paddington to Reading.  Decision required in the next few months. 

This is part of a big section on resolving capacity issues on GWML.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on August 15, 2011, 14:41:23
Piece on the remodelling of platforms 4A and 4B  in the Reading Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2098000_railway_project_on_track) complete with Video.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on August 15, 2011, 18:06:53
...recomends an early decision to extend Crossrail to Reading to save ^31M is savings at Maidenhead and to provide additional capacity to relieve overcrowding on Paddington to Reading.  Decision required in the next few months. 

Hopefully common sense will prevail and Crossrail extended to Reading and the turnback sidings at Maidenhead dropped.

Although how Maidonians will take not having their own exclusive terminal for Crossrail will be interesting to see. The insulters of Brunel were already up in  arms about wires across the bridge, despite the fact that if Brunel had had 25KV overhead electrification we would have had 200 mph plus broad gauge trains across the bridge for 175 years. No doubt the catenery supports would have been quite decorative with scroll work etc.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on August 24, 2011, 18:59:41
Next phase starts next week with the closure of the subway -  FGW Website. (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=5297)

Quote
30 August marks the start of a period of major construction and improvements to Reading Station that will result in a modernised station with increased capacity to meet growing customer demand.

This major remodelling at one of First Great Western^s busiest stations is one of the most significant railway upgrade schemes currently being undertaken anywhere in the country.

From the early hours of Tuesday 30 August, Network Rail^s contractor will start construction work at Reading Station and the subway will be permanently closed to all staff and passengers. Alternative access to and from all platforms will be via the over bridge.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on August 24, 2011, 20:43:07
That'll extend the mad dash between P8 and P3, that typically occurs when XC are re-platformed at very short notice...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on August 24, 2011, 23:18:30
I went through Reading today. 

Alot of activity putting drainage in by the festival site just west of cow lane (new train maintenance facility) and widening the embankment there.

Vastern Road Bridge widening looks nearly complete on both sides.  The approach to the new Waterloo platforms also looks nearly complete. 

 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 28, 2011, 10:52:41
That'll extend the mad dash between P8 and P3, that typically occurs when XC are re-platformed at very short notice...

Indeed it will.  But FGW have done a good job at advertisng the subway closure, with lots of posters and staff handing out leaflets.  Yesterday evening I was accosted by a very nice CS Team member on P9 who handed me a leaflet (the second on my trip from P4 via the subway) and explained that I would need to allow more time to get off P9 for connections etc.  In response to my moan about the narrow staircase off P9 to the footbridge, he pointed out that an additional temporay staircase has been built up to the footbridge to increase capacity and separate up and down passenger movements.

So well done FGW and NR.


PS I can never get the Quotes to work - please would some nice moderator fix it for me.


Moderator note: Done!  ;D bignosemac


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on August 28, 2011, 11:18:42
I also just noticed that the planned Saturday evening and Sunday closure between Wokingham and Reading P4a/b has been cancelled for the next two weekends, might that suggest they have made better progress than planned originally?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 30, 2011, 13:18:33
Work in earnest on the new southern platform and track bed is now beginning.  The large concrete slab at the station end is getting broken up and removed with Vortok blue protective fencing panels in place.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on August 31, 2011, 11:30:36
Here's the latest staff newsletter regarding the Reading rebuild.  I've got permission to use this and future editions on the forum (with minor editing), so will post them as and when I can.  Hopefully you'll find the information useful.


(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6078/6099149973_ed70f4184e_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6181/6099150439_6a7370c873_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: smokey on August 31, 2011, 11:40:23
Best Improvement Reading Station can have is When the First Great Western Signage disappears to be replaced by A. N. OTHER operator.  ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on August 31, 2011, 11:42:24
Having travelled over 2,000 miles with them in the last 10 days there's a lot FGW do get right.  However as with life in general you remember the bad times better than the good.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on August 31, 2011, 12:36:27
Vortec fencing 'protecting' the workforce?...that's a joke isn't it? From what? Anything moving at under 1mph would get through that. Highl;ighting that there's work going on, maybe....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on August 31, 2011, 13:34:02
Make me chuckle when people refer to the "Old Royal Mail Depot" the then new Royal Mail depot was built on the old Reading Signal Works so at last some of the site is "coming home" to railway use


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: TheLastMinute on August 31, 2011, 16:48:56
Vortec fencing 'protecting' the workforce?...that's a joke isn't it? From what? Anything moving at under 1mph would get through that. Highl;ighting that there's work going on, maybe....

Protecting as in it effectively prevents workers inadvertently stepping on to a live running track. Without any fencing, it's surprisingly easy to do after you've been on site for a few hours and your focus is maybe on a certain aspect of the task in hand.

TLM


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on August 31, 2011, 16:54:56
Oh, ok, workling in that direction, I understand.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on August 31, 2011, 18:08:52
Vortec fencing 'protecting' the workforce?...that's a joke isn't it? From what? Anything moving at under 1mph would get through that. Highl;ighting that there's work going on, maybe....
It there to set up a "Fenced Green Zone" meaning there is no requirement for Lookouts or Site Wardens.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 03, 2011, 09:35:39
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6073/6108560214_28f5b8b294_z.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6204/6108560324_3f91bcf7ee_z.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on September 05, 2011, 13:55:19
Thanks for posting these!  :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: anthony215 on September 05, 2011, 14:41:29
As others have said thanks for posting these


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on September 05, 2011, 19:25:35
Yes fascinating reading (pardon the pun).  I remember that hairdressers/barbers in the subway.  When the station was last rebuilt the subway at the northern end was curtailed following the closure of the bus station.  Now its gone altogether...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 12, 2011, 10:37:45
No problem.  Here's the latest edition:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6083/6139383283_2f44971e3c_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on September 12, 2011, 10:44:59
Is simply wrapping the new posts for the hoarding in hazard tape sufficiernt? Shouldn't they be cordoned off so visually impaired / blind don't walk into them, but meet the cordon tape first?....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: super tm on September 12, 2011, 11:09:34
I often wondered why it is necessary to paint the wooden boards for the hording.  Apart from looking nice it seems an unnecessary expense.  Unless someone can enlighten me  :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 15, 2011, 16:51:54
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6151/6150495770_d9e8c0f4e1_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on September 17, 2011, 18:37:05
Some more photos have come up on http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=7 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=7)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on September 24, 2011, 10:35:17
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6160/6177566332_244e7448e4_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: centralman on September 25, 2011, 22:16:01
Thats some good info.. I guess you work at Reading. Do you know who will be doing the voices on the new PA system and is Phil staying?

Edited to remove quoted image - the comment above had got a little lost! i_b


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 12, 2011, 06:42:21
Thanks for all the info in this thread -  at the moment I travel through RDG every day and am often curious to know what is happening "behind the hoardings"!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 13, 2011, 08:46:51
New platform 4 is making steady progress, front and rear walls of the platform structure look pretty much complete beyond the Vastern Rd bridge, progressing towards the station as shown in the attached snapshot below.  It seems a very substantial build, with fairly massive concrete footings, and you can see all the vertical rebar that will presumably be embedding within the walls...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on October 16, 2011, 23:48:03
Just as an aside the renumbered platforms are now showing on the National Rail Journey planner for services after Christmas.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 17, 2011, 15:09:06
I don't think this has been mentioned, but DfT have just confirmed the funding for Reading BC's works outside the station - last heard these were awaiting final approval...

Quote
The improvements include:
 ^direct access to the new northern and south-western station entrances.
 ^ safe, secure and step-free pedestrian access
 ^ new and improved walking and cycling routes
 ^ significantly increased secure cycle parking provision
 ^ a new junction providing access to the new northern entrance.

http://www.dft.gov.uk/news/press-releases/dft-press-20111004 (http://www.dft.gov.uk/news/press-releases/dft-press-20111004)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 20, 2011, 11:15:26
Just as an aside the renumbered platforms are now showing on the National Rail Journey planner for services after Christmas.

For those who hadn't realised already the current platform 6 is going to be temporarily renumbered to 16 (while it remains in use), as number 6 is transferred to what is currently 4A.   All other platform number changes are there as expected, ie 4 to 7, 5 to 8, 8/9/10 to 9/10/11.

Nearly all the XC services that previously used the closed bay platform 7 will use platform 3 instead - this is currently used mainly by the 2 hourly Southampton bound extended services, the slight problem is that there isn't a huge amount of waiting space as it is back to back with the main down platform.  Passenger info systems are pretty sparse down that end as they only display on the up facing side...

Paul



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 20, 2011, 11:36:26
I predict a lot of confused staff who've got used to the old number system for so long.  In the future, I myself will find it very hard not to say 4a or 4b for Waterloo when asked!  Overall though, it's going to be a better system in the long run.

I'm not sure the link was posted on here when it was released, but there's a relatively new NR video of the Reading remodelling, which gives the best impression yet of the new overbridge and platform layouts:  http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx)  - note that you need to click on the right-hand video (which looks like it links to the older video for last Xmas' bridge replacement), as they've got them the wrong way round on the site!

Nearly all the XC services that previously used the closed bay platform 7 will use platform 3 instead - this is currently used mainly by the 2 hourly Southampton bound extended services, the slight problem is that there isn't a huge amount of waiting space as it is back to back with the main down platform.  Passenger info systems are pretty sparse down that end as they only display on the up facing side...

The same can be said about the info systems on Platform 7 though.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 20, 2011, 12:04:16

For those who hadn't realised already the current platform 6 is going to be temporarily renumbered to 16 (while it remains in use), as number 6 is transferred to what is currently 4A.   All other platform number changes are there as expected, ie 4 to 7, 5 to 8, 8/9/10 to 9/10/11.


Paul


So when I resume my daily commute from THA to REI changing at RDG I must remember that when the CIS says platform 6 it has moved! Sounds obvious in the cold light of day but when I arrive at RDG at 615am I'm not sure it will be that clear!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: SandTEngineer on October 22, 2011, 17:33:12
...and of course details of the Christmas platform alterations are here http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=5297


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 24, 2011, 10:18:11
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6219/6276101610_69108571b6_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2011, 11:14:14
That picture of the new P4 etc seems to show a shelter over some steps at the London end of P5/6.  Is that an emergency exit perhaps?  Don't think I've seen that before.   

However I did previously hear that there is a new box section subway being driven right under the railway at about that point...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 24, 2011, 16:05:36
Well spotted, Paul.  I'd just thought it was a waiting shelter but you can see what appear to be steps on closer inspection.  The rules on emergency exits are much stricter these days, though I hope it is suitably blocked off in normal situations so the local oiks don't abuse it and get out of the station scott free.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2011, 20:46:46
On second thoughts the most secure set up might be an emergency route between the two platforms, ie 4 and 5/6.  I did see some detailed plans recently of what they are going to build at London Bridge, and there are escape routes shown at the ends of all the island and bay platforms there - but they connect them together rather than directly to the 'outside world'...

I do find it odd that there have been no drawings surfaced on Reading BC's website, although most of the work is permitted development, there is still normally a rubber stamping approval process involving the planning department.

See later post  ???

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on October 24, 2011, 21:34:40
...and of course details of the Christmas platform alterations are here http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=5297

It says

Quote
31 December 2011 - The new platform 5 (existing platform 4b) will cease to be in use. Train services which currently use platform 4b will use platform 6

I assume this means the new platform 6 (existing platform 4a) rather than the existing platform 6 (which used to be used for the North Downs line trains many years ago). It does not say when 4a is to be renumbered I assume at the same time as 4b though.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ChrisB on October 24, 2011, 21:40:21
That is correct.

Those sw platforms don't all come into use for a while after Xmas...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 25, 2011, 09:35:55
Yes, Platforms 4a, 4b and the new southern platform will be renumbered 4, 5, & 6 although 5 will closed to be lengthened and straightened out, followed by 6, so all three southern platforms won't be in use until late next year (if I remember correctly).

The current Platform 6, will be temporarily numbered Platform 16, before closing permanently in the future when the four new platforms 12/13/14/15 open in 2013.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on October 25, 2011, 10:28:05
Some pictures I took this morning (with my phone hence the not great quality) to show the latest work removing the canopy from Platform 4 (first attachment) and platform 9 (second attachment).

Boppy.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2011, 12:33:22
Having suggested in my post yesterday evening that there were still no drawings available, I double checked this morning in case anything has changed, and it has.   ::)

The planning application number for the station rebuild is 10/01269/FUL, and every time I've looked before it wasn't there. 
Planning sites don't usually allow direct links to individual files - they tend to time out so I'll just link to the application search page:

http://planninghome.reading.gov.uk/online-applications/search.do?action=advanced&searchType=Application

From the application summary click 'documents', then the link 'view associated documents'.  Of the 48 docs listed,  the 'proposed plans' give a layer by layer plan of the platforms, except the tail end of P4/5/6.  The 300 page 35 MB Design and Access Statement (DAS) is interesting because it shows a number of proposals that were eventually decided against.

Getting back to my suggestion yesterday about escape routes, the answer is that each of the new platform ends, (so that's 4,5/6, and both ends of 12/13,14/15) has an emergency fire escape route to meet current design standards.  Except for P4 these all include subway sections.   The existing platforms including islands for 8/9 and 10/11 are mostly reworked existing so don't get escape provision as it is not retrospective. This info appears at the very end of the DAS. In extremis I expect the lines would be blocked and escape across the tracks to adjacent 'new' platforms would be the solution.

Hope the linked info gives plenty of detailed answers to how it will all look eventually.

I've attached a snip of one of the useful plans as a taster...

Paul





Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2011, 12:42:53
Yes, Platforms 4a, 4b and the new southern platform will be renumbered 4, 5, & 6 although 5 will closed to be lengthened and straightened out, followed by 6, so all three southern platforms won't be in use until late next year (if I remember correctly).

July 2012 from various dates suggested/quoted previously - which seems very much achievable on current progress.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on October 25, 2011, 13:41:51
Hope the linked info gives plenty of detailed answers to how it will all look eventually.

Very useful.  Thanks very much for searching for the links.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2011, 16:28:39
Another old question answered... 

Reading BC planning case 10/01329/FUL concerns the reopened eastern underpass.  In that application those curious girder arrangements added to the overbridge are explained as strengthening works to the bridge parapets and steeelwork webs. To be carried out on the outside face of the existing parapets to avoid closing the main lines.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on October 31, 2011, 10:54:31
<Bing Bong>

The new information screens and announcements system now appears up and running at Reading!

Changes I've noticed so far:

- As shown in the staff update the platform information tv screens are now blue rather than "Great Western" green.
- The platform indicators now show "Arrived" - I don't think I've seen them do this before.  It's a shame they say it before the train has actually arrived though!
- The announcers are different (I'm sure others can say who they now are).  They sound much more awkward though:  "Platform 5 for the <pause> 08 <pause> 52 <pause> service to London Paddington..." compared to the old announcements.
- And "Bing Bong"!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on October 31, 2011, 13:21:00
There's been a lot of visible progress at 4a/4b over the last week, the new canopy has started to be put up on the new platform.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 01, 2011, 04:21:21
The announcers are different (I'm sure others can say who they now are).  They sound much more awkward though:  "Platform 5 for the <pause> 08 <pause> 52 <pause> service to London Paddington..." compared to the old announcements.

Yes, it's the fella who does the recorded announcements for engineering works.  Used (along with the female voice) on many new PA installations in the recent system replacements.  He has a good voice, but sadly his recordings for this system aren't very good - speaking slightly too slowly with unnatural sounding pauses.  Compare that with the female voice on the same system which is fine and it's a bit of a shame.

Perhaps the unnecessary pauses can be removed with a bit of jiggery-pokery to the sound files recorded?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 01, 2011, 16:19:49
<Bing Bong>

The new information screens and announcements system now appears up and running at Reading!

Changes I've noticed so far:

- The platform indicators now show "Arrived" - I don't think I've seen them do this before.  It's a shame they say it before the train has actually arrived though!
-

I caught the 1045 hrs off P5 yesterday and when the "Arrived" announcement came up a number of passengers (presumably non-regulars) waiting for it were visibly unsettled, eg scanning the other platforms to see if the train had arrived somewhere else.  Looking down the line the 1045 was still a speck in the distance well west of Cow Lane!

But I would like to say I noticed lots of helpful FGW staff around on all the platforms, which deserves to be commended.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 01, 2011, 16:33:01
I caught the 1045 hrs off P5 yesterday and when the "Arrived" announcement came up a number of passengers (presumably non-regulars) waiting for it were visibly unsettled, eg scanning the other platforms to see if the train had arrived somewhere else.  Looking down the line the 1045 was still a speck in the distance well west of Cow Lane!

The screens show "Arrived" when the train passes the signal before the platform, and because of the junctions at Reading and the obviously reduced speed limit, it can seem like it is miles away! The new screens should not do this however!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 01, 2011, 16:52:27
Wouldn't be better if the "Arrived" indication came up when the train entered the track circuit for the platform starting signal?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 01, 2011, 17:35:22
Wouldn't be better if the "Arrived" indication came up when the train entered the track circuit for the platform starting signal?

Unfortunately that isn't possible, as the track circuit isn't used at all when it comes to tracking trains, it all to do with the train description which is available at every main aspect signal, and not every track circuit.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 01, 2011, 19:05:54
Fair enough, I'm no S&T expert and obviously if there was a simple solution the S&T would have found it.  Maybe no more need to be said here on this little topic, so my homework this evening is to research why a platform starter signal is not a main aspect signal.....


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 03, 2011, 16:32:43
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6228/6309159993_3a575d7648_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 03, 2011, 17:20:54
The "new" temporary staircase off the overbridge to P10 is still closed, I think the plan was that this would be open by the time the subway was closed to relieve pressure on the existing narrow staircase to P9.  Does anyone know why this is?



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 03, 2011, 17:29:59
I think it's opened at peak times only isn't it?  I remember seeing it in use a week or two back around 8:30am.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 03, 2011, 18:10:30
Ah, that could be the case, I hadn't thought of that and I hadn't realised that was the plan. It's just occurred to me that the temporay stairway needs a ticket examiner on duty, so I can see the logic in closing it when P9 is less busy.

I saw the gates at the bottom of the stairs closed at about 1045 am. 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Ollie on November 03, 2011, 23:17:27
As per II it is peak only stairs and has staff checking tickets.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 08, 2011, 12:13:10
A new set of pics by reading general on skyscraper city:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=85485929&postcount=125

I was through the station yesterday, no phots taken but it's getting quite easy to visualise the new platform 6 - and I guess the steelwork details they've put up so far will be similar to the main through platform canopies.  At least it would be odd if they did something completely different on P4-P6...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on November 08, 2011, 15:55:12
Changing at Reading the other day we went up the wrong stairs from Platform 10 and found ourselves on the way out side of the footbridge. So had to go down and throught he barriers to get to Platform 4.

There were two guys standing at the bottom of the stairs but they didn't check our tickets.

It got me thinking about platform renumbering. I knew I wanted 4 in all probability. when 4 is renumbered to ? when I look at the departure board I won't know which platform is which for a while.

Has any thiught been given to putting the old platform number in brackets after the onew. So you'have say N (4)  At least for while?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 08, 2011, 16:44:08
How the platform renumbering works...
1,2,3 stay the same
new 'Southern' platform will be 4
4B becomes 5
4A becomes 6
4 becomes 7
5 becomes 8
6 becomes 16 (until it finally closes)
7 closes
8 becomes 9
9 becomes 10
10 becomes 11
12,13,14,15 will be the new reliefs.

I expect there'll be loads of notices, but I don't think they'll put any 'formerly X' signs up - and of course the PIS listing displays will all be using the new numbers, I don't think there'll be a huge problem - nearly everything (except some XC and some Waterloo/Redhills) will be operating from the same physical platform after all...

Paul



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 14, 2011, 13:34:36
The contract to build the new train depot has been let to VolkerFitzpatrick:

http://www.theconstructionindex.co.uk/news/contract-news/volkerfitzpatrick-undercuts-competition-to-take-reading-rail-work (http://www.theconstructionindex.co.uk/news/contract-news/volkerfitzpatrick-undercuts-competition-to-take-reading-rail-work)

Worth ^36.2m (less than half the budget price of ^72m), works starts in January and is due to be complete by August 2013.  Looks like there'll will be an awkward transitional phase between closure of the old Turbo depot and the arrival of cascaded/new electric traction following the GWML electrification.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 14, 2011, 18:04:55
The new Turbo depot planning reference is 10/01380/FUL if anyone wishes to look at the details - and as usual there are enough details to keep you browsing for quite a while...

As you'd expect, although the planning application is for a replacement 'Turbo Depot' the drawings show all the facilites are designed to fit four car units with OHLE structures and gantries almost everywhere you look...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Surrey 455 on November 14, 2011, 21:27:40
In the above jpeg of the Reading Station staff update it quotes the URL http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/reading is the place to be!

I've given it a try and I get a 404 error. Tried removing the spaces, removing the exclamation mark but to no avail. Is there really a dedicated website?

EDIT....

Had a rethink and found it is just http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/reading


Title: Reading Station Temporary Exit next Platform 1
Post by: chineseJohn on November 15, 2011, 11:51:18
Last night a chap with a loud hailer was informing people they can exit at a door next to Platform 1 ( i assume this is to ease exit congestion on Platform 4), he was checking tickets if people wanted to use that exit.


Title: Re: Reading Station Temporary Exit next Platform 1
Post by: paul7575 on November 15, 2011, 13:03:54
The reason for this new access is explained in the staff brief shown in post #371 in this thread:

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.360

Mods - Please could this and the previous post be transferred into the main Reading Stn thread to avoid an unneccesary offshoot starting?

Paul


Edit note: Done. CfN  :-X


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 15, 2011, 13:14:46
The new Turbo depot planning reference is 10/01380/FUL if anyone wishes to look at the details - and as usual there are enough details to keep you browsing for quite a while...

Thanks for providing the link, Paul.

First time I've seen them in such detail, although I was aware of the basic layout.  From the plans it looks as if stabling/maintenance capacity will be provided as follows:

West End Stabling Sidings:  6 sidings with a total capacity for around 80 vehicles
Maintenance Depot:  4 maintenance roads with a total capacity of around 28 vehicles, plus room for 8 vehicles on a siding alongside the maintenance shed, as well as a unit in the 'Underframe Cleaning Facility' with up to two of its vehicles actually in the facility.
IEP Depot: 7 track facility with a total capacity for 17 5-car Bi-mode IEP sets or a maximum of 6 10 car Electric IEP sets and 5 Bi-Mode sets.

The operation in the West End Stabling Sidings especially will have to be very slick given the fact that one of the sidings can stack up to 17 vehicles ending in stop blocks, so the need to make sure the units are in the right order to come out next morning will be much more important than it is now in Reading Upper Depot with its 17 separate sidings!  Mind you, the lack of a need to manage fuel loads on the electric sets will mean there's a little more flexibility in that respect.

I believe a signalling system is to be installed in the depot, similar to that at the former Eurostar depot at North Pole, as with such a long operational length, handsignalling is not deemed appropriate.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 18, 2011, 21:06:13
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6232/6359681735_cfb6f91f75_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 18, 2011, 21:13:34
With many thanks for your latest summary, IndustryInsider, I've also just 'un-linked' this topic from our calendar entry - and without deleting the whole thing, thank goodness! ::)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 18, 2011, 21:18:12
Wouldn't be better if the "Arrived" indication came up when the train entered the track circuit for the platform starting signal?

If it said "Arriving" rather than "Arrived" then there wouldn't be confusion, a simple fix surely?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 19, 2011, 11:37:48
Wouldn't be better if the "Arrived" indication came up when the train entered the track circuit for the platform starting signal?

If it said "Arriving" rather than "Arrived" then there wouldn't be confusion, a simple fix surely?

Then people would complain that it showed arriving when the train had arrived? It can be fixed with a software timer I expect, it will be a similar problem to that which arises at certain stations when the 'passing train' warning is too early, or the 'this train terminates here - all change' happens too early.

Gordon's possibility mentioned above is not quite how it works, because the aspect of a platform starter isn't (in general) controlled by the approaching train, the track circuits on the approach side of a signal are usually being used to control the signal behind the train, ie where it has come from...

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 19, 2011, 16:41:51
Does anyone know the dates that Cow Lane will be closed as Network Rail work on the bridges please? Currently, their website says:
Quote
A further road closure will be required in December.

II, thanks for posting the development updates for staff, I've been looking everywhere for updates and signing up to FGWs ~/reading page seems to have sent me nothing about the station updates, but plenty of offers, places to go etc.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on November 19, 2011, 17:26:53
Does anyone know the dates that Cow Lane will be closed as Network Rail work on the bridges please? Currently, their website says:
Quote
A further road closure will be required in December.

II, thanks for posting the development updates for staff, I've been looking everywhere for updates and signing up to FGWs ~/reading page seems to have sent me nothing about the station updates, but plenty of offers, places to go etc.

19th December for 5 weeks according to this article

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 19, 2011, 17:54:49

19th December for 5 weeks according to this article

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/)
Thank-you.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on November 20, 2011, 11:24:40
My wife went through Reading yesterday, reported she couuldn't see how to get to the Three Guineas. Is it shut?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on November 20, 2011, 11:30:58
As noted on another thread, HSTs calling at Platform 4 are now stopped right down the far western end of the platform. I think this is to do with managing the pedestrian flows, though I can't see any benefit apart from maybe getting more alighting passengers to use the temporary exit near Platform 1. It does mean that lots of passengers wanting to board trains are now having to fight their way along a crowded platform 4 to reach the standard class coaches, and no doubt lots of people boarding via first class to avoid missing their train. Does anyone know if this arrangement is intended to last throughout the rebuilding? Any chance of it being reviewed?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 20, 2011, 11:39:55
As noted on another thread, HSTs calling at Platform 4 are now stopped right down the far western end of the platform. I think this is to do with managing the pedestrian flows, though I can't see any benefit apart from maybe getting more alighting passengers to use the temporary exit near Platform 1. It does mean that lots of passengers wanting to board trains are now having to fight their way along a crowded platform 4 to reach the standard class coaches, and no doubt lots of people boarding via first class to avoid missing their train. Does anyone know if this arrangement is intended to last throughout the rebuilding? Any chance of it being reviewed?

My understanding is that this was done because of the reduced width between the hoardings on P4 and the platform edge. In the morning when I travel from Thatcham and have to change at Reading for the Gatwick train P4 is almost empty so this isn't a problem but on the return journey at 5.30 P4 is understandably very busy and space on the platform is limited so this change makes sense to me. Congestion on P4 isn't helped by Cyclists riding their bikes along the platform and passengers who dawdle because they havent got a clue where they should be (despite announcesments advising them to move right down the platform.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 20, 2011, 11:47:59
As BerkshireBugsy says, it's due to the narrow width of the platforms where the hoardings are currently erected.  I think it is under constant review, but I can't see anything changing until the hoardings come down.  Similarly, 3-Car Turbos now stop some 15 metres back in the other direction which means anyone waiting in the centre of the platform also has to get walking fast to get on the train.  Perhaps better use of signs and announcements could be made though?

There will inevitably be a few years of inconvenience at different areas of the station for months at a time due to the massive rebuilding programme - platform 9 is a good example at the moment as with no canopy there's precious little shelter from the elements.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 20, 2011, 19:58:03
My wife went through Reading yesterday, reported she couuldn't see how to get to the Three Guineas. Is it shut?
No, it's still open. The entrance is still the same too.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on November 22, 2011, 23:21:01
Some more photographs now on:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=7 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=7)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 24, 2011, 04:53:39
19th December for 5 weeks according to this article

http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2011/11/19/55405-huge-project-could-face-weather-hurdle/)
I received a lovely email (with horrendous grammar and spelling) from Network Rail today telling me they would update their website as it was "falling short [on] this occasion".

They also confirmed the road closures affecting through traffic from 19th Dec to 30th January.

On top of that, they emailed me a newsletter about works and affected train services that will be "distributed starting next week" - so I'll post it on Monday (though many members of the site have probably already seen it!)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 24, 2011, 06:27:12
Although I travel through reading every working day it is dark at both ends of my journey so I don't get to see the progress on the new platform (4?) Which is being built next to platform 4b so am pleased to see the updates coming out vie this forum.


Am I dreaming or is it supposed to be ready for use when they change the platform numbers over the Xmas break?


Once again thanks for the updates and newsletter - much appreciated


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 24, 2011, 06:47:41
Although I travel through reading every working day it is dark at both ends of my journey so I don't get to see the progress on the new platform (4?) Which is being built next to platform 4b so am pleased to see the updates coming out vie this forum.


Am I dreaming or is it supposed to be ready for use when they change the platform numbers over the Xmas break?


Once again thanks for the updates and newsletter - much appreciated
Platform 4 or the future number 7 will open on 27th December "at approximately 1400"
Platform 9 or the future number 10 will open on 28th December
The new platform 4 will open on 31 December.

That's all I have dates for new platforms, I think the platforms are meant to all be done when the station "reopens" at Easter 2013

Edit: All platforms will be renumbered (not necessarily complete  on 27 December)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Worcester_Passenger on November 24, 2011, 10:02:22
I'm not a regular user of Reading - most of the time it's just that place where you get delayed going to and from London.

But I had to change there on Monday to get to Gatwick. And I really hadn't appreciated how much work is going on.

Thanks for posting the Staff Newsletter. I'll certainly be following this thread with much more interest in the future.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 24, 2011, 10:24:17
IIRC the main reason for the extended closure of the 'Southern' platforms for a few days during the Christmas week is that there isn't quite enough room to fit a pair of operational tracks between the new P4 and the new P5 (current P4B) - this is due to the slight curvature of the existing platform, which has to be trimmed back slightly in places so it's parallel to the new platform.

I'd assume (but no guarantees!) that the track laying alongside the new P4 (or at least the first 8 car length) probably won't start until the in use track and all its top and bottom ballast is removed - which will allow them the space to do a thorough job over the whole width.

As far as the new platform structure is concerned though, I think progress has moved up a few gears over the last 10 days or so, and it ought to be structurally complete quite soon.  It also looks as though the canopy will only extend as far as the bridge - which still covers two thirds of the overall length, so should be quite adequate for a 12 car platform.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 24, 2011, 10:33:52
As far as the new platform structure is concerned though, I think progress has moved up a few gears over the last 10 days or so, and it ought to be structurally complete quite soon.  It also looks as though the canopy will only extend as far as the bridge - which still covers two thirds of the overall length, so should be quite adequate for a 12 car platform.

I'm sure progress is moving on but when it is raining and dark it isn't always to see what is happening. Certainly over the last few weeks  have noticed work on the canopy etc progressing quickly - at what point will they lay the track up to the platform?

Out of curiosity when will the track get laid in the eastern underpass? I notice the points are there on the southern side - will this wait until more work has been completed on the northern side?



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 24, 2011, 11:09:08
...at what point will they lay the track up to the platform?

I just explained that in the post you are replying to?   However if you mean the track beyond,  and the section over Vastern Rd bridge, then they could do that before hand as it doesn't interfere with the existing route into 4B.

Quote
Out of curiosity when will the track get laid in the eastern underpass? I notice the points are there on the southern side - will this wait until more work has been completed on the northern side?

I expect as it joins the track leading towards platforms 14 and 15 it will probably only be done once the platforms are built, so just prior to May 2013.

Paul



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 25, 2011, 13:20:16
It also looks as though the canopy will only extend as far as the bridge - which still covers two thirds of the overall length, so should be quite adequate for a 12 car platform.

Especially when you consider the current canopy on 4A/B only provides shelter for just over two carriage lengths, about 30%, of the platform.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Pedros on November 25, 2011, 15:22:22
Yesterday evening, during the delays to services arriving at Reading Station, the arrival screens were especially confusing.  They were actually showing two trains as 'Arrived' at the same time! The Hereford train, which was on platform 4 with doors still open but about to leave, and the Swansea train which was still outside the station, both displayed 'Arrived'.  You can imagine the confusion with passengers who were already heavily delayed scrambling on and off trains.  Very poor if you ask me.

Some passengers were even saying that stating that the train had 'arrived' long before it actually did was a way to mask some of the punctuality performance. It raised a wry smile from me.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 25, 2011, 15:27:30
Yesterday evening, during the delays to services arriving at Reading Station, the arrival screens were especially confusing.  They were actually showing two trains as 'Arrived' at the same time! The Hereford train, which was on platform 4 with doors still open but about to leave, and the Swansea train which was still outside the station, both displayed 'Arrived'.  You can imagine the confusion with passengers who were already heavily delayed scrambling on and off trains.  Very poor if you ask me.
I think what makes matters worse is the fact that due to the limited width on P4 the HSTs pull much further down - which has been discussed elsewhere. So you had the situation where Pax walked all the way down to P4 only to find the service they were waiting for was re-platformed to arrive at P5/P8/P9 etc.

Hopefully tonight will be better :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on November 25, 2011, 16:55:20
Yesterday evening, during the delays to services arriving at Reading Station, the arrival screens were especially confusing.  They were actually showing two trains as 'Arrived' at the same time! The Hereford train, which was on platform 4 with doors still open but about to leave, and the Swansea train which was still outside the station, both displayed 'Arrived'.  You can imagine the confusion with passengers who were already heavily delayed scrambling on and off trains.  Very poor if you ask me.

You would think it would be fairly simple to make the "trigger" point for the "Arrived" to be displayed after Signal TR36 - the one just outside the station.  "The train now arriving at Platform 4..." is triggered as the train passes the signal - would make sense for both to be in parallel.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on November 27, 2011, 18:41:31
Here is Issue 1 of Reading Station News. (https://docs.google.com/open?id=0ByDs20XdYEFaZjViYzU5YjQtYTkwNy00NTJlLTgxNjEtZmU2YjQ4Y2ZiYjdh)

Distributed starting tomorrow.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 27, 2011, 20:06:17
Here is Issue 1 of Reading Station News. (https://docs.google.com/open?id=0ByDs20XdYEFaZjViYzU5YjQtYTkwNy00NTJlLTgxNjEtZmU2YjQ4Y2ZiYjdh)

Distributed starting tomorrow.

Very informative and well presented. Thanks!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on November 28, 2011, 11:11:58
Indeed good first edition.

Top of page 3 though seems to have a photograph of a different station though?  It's certainly not the barriers at Reading.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on November 28, 2011, 13:57:39
You're right Boppy. That's the gateline at Oxford!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: hornbeam on November 30, 2011, 14:17:20
Anyone know why there has been a change to the infomation screens to show 'arrived'? seems a bit pointless as often it says it quite a while before the service shows up.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 30, 2011, 14:19:21
Anyone know why there has been a change to the infomation screens to show 'arrived'? seems a bit pointless as often it says it quite a while before the service shows up.

And I believe it sometimes appears before it has actually arrived at the platform.

Premature Announcments....a common problem :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on November 30, 2011, 14:41:39
New starting signals for the southern platforms have been installed, blanked out pending commissioning over Christmas.  Standalone signal masts to replace the overhead gantry that currently houses their equivalents.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: lordgoata on November 30, 2011, 15:22:57
Anyone know why there has been a change to the infomation screens to show 'arrived'? seems a bit pointless as often it says it quite a while before the service shows up.


They are just being consistent with the "On time" display that is shown for trains that are running up to 3 minutes late ;)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 30, 2011, 16:25:00
Anyone know why there has been a change to the infomation screens to show 'arrived'? seems a bit pointless as often it says it quite a while before the service shows up.

Your question has already arrived - back in October on page 26 of this thread...   ;D

The ensuing discussions tried to work out what triggered the early arrival of the arrived indication.   ???

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on November 30, 2011, 16:38:33
The arrival indication is triggered by the passing of the signal outside of the platform, the reason for its early appearance will be because of how far out of the station this signal is.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 30, 2011, 16:42:37
On arrival on platform 4b last night (Tuesday 29th Nov) it *appeared* as if the trackways on the new platform 4 were being cleared ready for track laying- is this the case or was I imagining it ? It was very dark outside!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on November 30, 2011, 18:51:27
They were using one of those laser controlled 'road rail' bulldozers to level the formation on Monday afternoon - I asked a passing 'orange person with a NR label' if that meant track laying was reasonably imminent, and he didn't say no!

Which just goes to show that what I was told at the information display outside the station a few months back might have been duff gen.  (I mentioned the other day that the tracks in new P4 couldn't be laid because they might interfere with those in new P5 - of course it may just turn out that they can be physically installed, but not actually used by trains as the full 'six foot' gap isn't there.)

They're definitely at a stage where a lot can happen in a week, I noticed that beyond Vastern Rd bridge the platform copings were in position,  and immediately on the station side of the bridge a stockpile of copings and tactile pavers was in position - they can be put in place pretty quickly I expect.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 30, 2011, 19:29:33
Thanks Paul I am genuinely impressed with the progress made in the last two daya


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements plat 4a/b
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 01, 2011, 06:25:45
I noticed this morning (Thursday 1st dec) 3 new upright supports just past the covered area on the above platforms - out of curiosity does anyone know what these are for? They would be about the right for support a roof extension but would be suprised if that is what they are for.

You can tell I have too much time on my hands when changing trains at reading!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on December 02, 2011, 11:44:36
Some pictures I took this morning of the work on Platform 9.

Most of the buildings appear to have been knocked down with the spoil heaps out to the west.

What interests me next which, hasn't been discussed much as far as I'm aware, is the track work about to happen on platform 9.  I see that pieces of spare track have been laid down next to the existing track and there are bags of ballast sat at one end.

As I understand it the plan is for the existing platform 9 to be extended southward (to make room to the north for the new platforms)  So I'm assuming the first step is to re-lay the track for platform 9 to make space for the platform to be extended southwards?

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 02, 2011, 12:30:42
Platform 9 (10 in the new scheme) definitely does get widened to the south over its full length,  there will only be two tracks between the two existing islands - the eventual up and down mains as it happens. 

However what surprises me is the possibility that it is happening over the Christmas and New Year partial closure of the station.  Unless they are using some sort of very high speed installation method with prefabricated sections it seems a very ambitious timescale...

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 02, 2011, 12:34:57
On my way in to Reading this morning (from Reading West) I notice two yellow Network Rail sets parked up in the area next to the GWML.Does anyone know if these are here in relation to any local acitvities (such as track laying changes to Reading Station)?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements plat 4a/b
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 02, 2011, 14:59:22
I noticed this morning (Thursday 1st dec) 3 new upright supports just past the covered area on the above platforms - out of curiosity does anyone know what these are for? They would be about the right for support a roof extension but would be suprised if that is what they are for.

I would guess they're supports for a barrier that will separate platforms 4A/B whilst work to lengthen them takes place one at a time.

What interests me next which, hasn't been discussed much as far as I'm aware, is the track work about to happen on platform 9.  I see that pieces of spare track have been laid down next to the existing track and there are bags of ballast sat at one end.

As I understand it the plan is for the existing platform 9 to be extended southward (to make room to the north for the new platforms)

I think that track will be laid in the gap very soon and some temporary platform sections will be required whilst a proper platform eventually takes shape a few metres south of the current one.  I think that sections of yellow coloured temporary platform are being installed down the slope to the eastern underpass - they certainly look like temporary sections of platform, and possibly the prefabricated sections that Paul was hinting at.  I'm sure the 'Station News' will tell us shortly.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: coachflyer on December 02, 2011, 15:57:35
Was told this week that over the Christmas period platform 9 (new 10) is being widened from the didcot end up to the over bridge with a 25mph speed through it.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 02, 2011, 16:24:00
I think that track will be laid in the gap very soon and some temporary platform sections will be required whilst a proper platform eventually takes shape a few metres south of the current one.  I think that sections of yellow coloured temporary platform are being installed down the slope to the eastern underpass - they certainly look like temporary sections of platform, and possibly the prefabricated sections that Paul was hinting at.  I'm sure the 'Station News' will tell us shortly.

That's the sort of method I was thinking of.  Presumably once you have something (anything) that allows passengers to reach the newly aligned track, you can replace it with the permanent structure gradually.  I once had an idea that you could build a mobile temporary deck that ran on the redundant rails for such a project - but I expect H&S experts wouldn't allow something that could set off down the line if its brakes failed...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 03, 2011, 07:23:52
Last night I noticed on the CIS displays at Guildford showed that buses were replacing train services between Wokingham and Reading (Sunday only I think) so I wonder what is being done. I wish it was light when I travel in and out Reading so I could see what was going on!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 03, 2011, 10:46:07
Might just be the normal extended overnight closure for track work on the approaches to the Southern platforms.  Most weekends are affected (even if only for a few hours) until mid-Jan, just like back in late summer - but according to SWT's engineering work page some closures extend as far as Bracknell, so it could include normal maintainance as well...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 03, 2011, 14:10:58
Here's the latest 'Station News', which answers a few questions posed on this thread recently.

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7014/6446668183_87afe5f8c0_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 03, 2011, 16:07:47
I noticed the comment in the update sheet about "will it be ready on time?" If you had asked me a week ago I would have thought "no" but it has come on so quickly. I am back there early Monday morning and am hoping the 634 for Gatwick leaves from 4b as you can get a better view of what is happening.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jonathan H on December 04, 2011, 12:05:59
Plenty of work underway on the new platform today with 4A/4B under possession. There is a 66-hauled engineers train with ballast and sleepers in platform 4B which would appear to suggest that the track will be in place along the platform tomorrow morning.

Gatwick trains departing from platform 6 today - pick up only at Wokingham - buses for South West Trains passengers.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 04, 2011, 12:07:49
Plenty of work underway on the new platform today with 4A/4B under possession. There is a 66-hauled engineers train with ballast and sleepers in platform 4B which would appear to suggest that the track will be in place along the platform tomorrow morning.

Gatwick trains departing from platform 6 today - pick up only at Wokingham - buses for South West Trains passengers.

Wow - it certainly is all happening!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements monday 5th december 2011
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 05, 2011, 06:30:09
Difficult to see detail from the window of the parked SWT service on platform 4b this morning but the new track is laid next to t he new p4 so it looks like it has been a busy weekend here. Also looks like more cable ducting has been installed on the existing 4a/b platforms .

I notice the new p4 rails only appear to be 2 rail which suprised me as I thought this platform was going to be used by SWT services (but then it is very two out there)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 05, 2011, 09:59:00
From what I've seen on previous new installations the third rail is usually fitted during a follow up visit, the insulators probably wouldn't be fitted to the as delivered sleepers anyway.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 05, 2011, 10:24:30
From what I've seen on previous new installations the third rail is usually fitted during a follow up visit, the insulators probably wouldn't be fitted to the as delivered sleepers anyway.

Paul 

You are probably right Paul. Would I be right in assuming the third rail will be farthest away from the edge of the new P4?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 05, 2011, 16:58:34
Yes, normal practice would definitely be to fit the third rail on the side away from a platform.  The only exceptions would be those comparatively rare situations where there's a platform both sides, such as at Ascot or Guildford.  Another rare situation is where there's points or a crossover alongside a platform - that might theoretically lead to a short section of third rail being required, but I can't think of any immediate examples of that.  Where you have points very close to the end of a platform the third rail might well start just alongside the ramp though.

Paul
   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 05, 2011, 18:25:14
From the Reading Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2104530_passengers_to_learn_about_christmas_rail_works):

Quote
Passengers to learn about Christmas rail works

Passengers will have a chance to find out more about the planned changes to Reading railway station at a public exhibition tomorrow.

Staff from Network Rail, First Great Western and Reading Borough Council will be on hand between 8am and 7pm to answer questions about the next phase of the ^850 million redevelopment project.

Network Rail project director Bill Henry said: "A host of changes will be rung over the festive period which the public should be aware of, including a change to platform numbers at the station, as a new platform is being added, and a temporary diversion at Cow Lane while a new bridge is constructed."


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on December 05, 2011, 19:17:12
Seems the National Rail iPhone app has the new booked platforms at Reading from the timetable change rather than December 27th.  Look out for lost souls heading for the west country at platform 7 from next weekend..... ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements monday 5th december 2011
Post by: Electric train on December 05, 2011, 19:20:26
I notice the new p4 rails only appear to be 2 rail which suprised me as I thought this platform was going to be used by SWT services (but then it is very two out there)
The Conrail is generally last to be installed for a couple of reasons; there is no need for Conrail permits and strapping out, it is easier to tamp align etc the line without the Conrail being in place likewise for the S & T it is easier to work without the Conrail, the insulators run the risk of damage while the track is being installed, the Conrail leveling and hight is easier one the line is tamped.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 05, 2011, 20:11:57
Seems the National Rail iPhone app has the new booked platforms at Reading from the timetable change rather than December 27th.  Look out for lost souls heading for the west country at platform 7 from next weekend..... ;D

They probably won't hang about too long once they notice the track's been lifted though...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on December 06, 2011, 20:17:54
More photos have popped up on:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=86377545&postcount=138 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=86377545&postcount=138)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements monday 5th december 2011
Post by: onthecushions on December 07, 2011, 19:45:44
Difficult to see detail from the window of the parked SWT service on platform 4b this morning but the new track is laid next to t he new p4 so it looks like it has been a busy weekend here. Also looks like more cable ducting has been installed on the existing 4a/b platforms .

I notice the new p4 rails only appear to be 2 rail which suprised me as I thought this platform was going to be used by SWT services (but then it is very two out there)

If you can see the sleeper ends clearly, you should see the four foundation plugs cast into the concrete sleeper ready for the bracket for the insulator pot.

Oddly enough you'll see these at the most unlikely sites for 3rd rail electrics.


OTC


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on December 12, 2011, 14:29:33
New track is now between the existing track for platforms 9 and 8.  At the moment the ends need attaching to the existing track.  At each end there are curves pointing towards the platform 9 track.

One thing I've noticed is that the new straight part of track won't be long enough to accommodate an HST within it so I'm assuming that the new temporary platform 9 will either be curved at each end to allow HSTs to use it or will turbos only serve the temporary platform 9?

Boppy.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 12, 2011, 17:34:52
I think that newly laid middle track for the widened P9 (future P10) will probably be extended further east during the Christmas closure, but there'll be some signal equipment resiting needed to allow for it, in fact I'd be surprised if the east end crossover between the relief lines isn't relocated east as well - isn't the signal at the London end of the current P8 supposed to be moving?

I noticed today the top ballast has now been laid in the new P4, and some conductor rail has now been delivered - it has a slightly different cross-section to running rail, the thicker base web gives it away.  I don't think I've seen quite so many workers together on the new P4 as today - they must be trying to meet some deadline or other, one of the briefing notes posted earlier suggested staff would be learning about new P4 this week - but obviously not today!

There are notices up everywhere announcing P7 is now closed with XC using P3 in lieu - but it still got used a couple of times at short notice this afternoon as there were a few signalling issues just east of the station, with most down trains using the current P4 for a while.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 13, 2011, 10:10:51
I remember seeing a diagram where there was a distinct kink in the eastern end of the new platform 10 after Xmas and a 25mph speed limit imposed on the Up Relief line during that stage of the works.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on December 14, 2011, 17:03:10
I experienced the double "Arrived" train situation myself today.

3-car turbo to Paddington on Platform 8.  Then a platform alteration announcement that the train to Gatwick will now leave from Platform 8.  Everybody rushes to board with the signs doing anything but helping.

Thankfully the platform staff were there to stop people incorrectly boarding the train.

Regardless of the problem of what triggers the point at which a train is "Arrived" the software could surely be updated to check that the sign should only say "Arrived" if the train is number 1 in the list.  Numbers 2 (or 3) in the list could say "Due next" or something.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Louis94 on December 15, 2011, 17:03:29
I experienced the double "Arrived" train situation myself today.

3-car turbo to Paddington on Platform 8.  Then a platform alteration announcement that the train to Gatwick will now leave from Platform 8.  Everybody rushes to board with the signs doing anything but helping.

Thankfully the platform staff were there to stop people incorrectly boarding the train.

Regardless of the problem of what triggers the point at which a train is "Arrived" the software could surely be updated to check that the sign should only say "Arrived" if the train is number 1 in the list.  Numbers 2 (or 3) in the list could say "Due next" or something.

Oh dear, that is just terrible! This is all because of the transfer to the new system at Reading with old hardware, soon as the new screens are installed, they will cease to say "Arrived" and will instead just say the same as everywhere else.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 16, 2011, 06:33:18
I'm going to be genuinely impressed if the new p4 is open as scheduled. There still seems a lot to do and I guess Fgw staff can't have familiariastion training whilst it is still technically a construction site.

But there are still quite a few calendar days left before the 27th so there is still a chance.

Am I right in thinking the platform re-numbering will happen even if the new p4 is not ready?  I can't imagine that being done at any other time.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jonathan H on December 16, 2011, 07:05:53
The new Southern platforms do not open until 31 December - a bus substitution applies between Reading and Wokingham for the period 27-30 December so there's a bit more time to get things finished. After Christmas, it appears to be 4A and the new platform in use (as 6 and 4 respectively.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 16, 2011, 09:03:33
The new Southern platforms do not open until 31 December - a bus substitution applies between Reading and Wokingham for the period 27-30 December so there's a bit more time to get things finished. After Christmas, it appears to be 4A and the new platform in use (as 6 and 4 respectively.

THanks but I am getting confused here. I can understand buses replacing trains between Reading and Wokingham for SWT services but does this also apply for FGW?

The TM on my RDG to Reigate service this morning lead me to believe the FGW trains were running as normal between xmas and new year. The phrase Replacement Bus Services" has the same affect on me as reading the sentence "batteries not included"


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: adc82140 on December 16, 2011, 10:42:02
I guess the Gatwicks will be using the main part of the station during this time? Is it usual practice to bustitute the SWT's to prevent overcrowding on the Gatwicks at times like this?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 16, 2011, 10:45:55
I guess the Gatwicks will be using the main part of the station during this time? Is it usual practice to bustitute the SWT's to prevent overcrowding on the Gatwicks at times like this?

Certainly has been the practice in the past, and Wokingham has always been declared pick up only ex Reading, and set down only ex Gatwick, to try to stop Waterloo passengers hitching a ride to Wokingham with FGW, and overwhelming their trains.

Edit: I wrote the above before I'd checked the journey planner, so I guess the previous poster was mistakenly thinking FGW were running normally...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 16, 2011, 10:55:19
I guess the Gatwicks will be using the main part of the station during this time?

Erm, there's no trains at all from 27th-30th between Reading and Wokingham!  There's a whole load of signals and points to commission, including some signals on the spur line linking the main platforms with the southern lines.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 16, 2011, 10:58:18
I guess the Gatwicks will be using the main part of the station during this time?

Erm, there's no trains at all from 27th-30th between Reading and Wokingham!  There's a whole load of signals and points to commission, including some signals on the spur line linking the main platforms with the southern lines.

That makes sense. When they put the buses on to Wokingham do they leave RDG at the scheduled departure time of a FGW Gatwick/Redhill service or do they just leave at regular intervals? If the former is true do they revise the departure times from Wokingham?

I'm just trying to work out if it would be easier to drive from Thatcham to Reigate during that period.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 16, 2011, 11:08:48
That makes sense. When they put the buses on to Wokingham do they leave RDG at the scheduled departure time of a FGW Gatwick/Redhill service or do they just leave at regular intervals? If the former is true do they revise the departure times from Wokingham?


What they'd normally do is run the trains at the right time (as normal timetable) from Wokingham, and a theoretical connecting bus would leave Reading earlier than normal - and the journey planner does give bus departure times. I'd expect there'll be different buses for SWT and FGW though, the former being all stations to Wokingham. 

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 16, 2011, 11:09:06
Regular intervals.  Check the National Rail Enquiries website - all the details are on there...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 16, 2011, 11:16:46
What they'd normally do is run the trains at the right time (as normal timetable) from Wokingham, and a theoretical connecting bus would leave Reading earlier than normal - and the journey planner does give bus departure times. I'd expect there'll be different buses for SWT and FGW though, the former being all stations to Wokingham. 

Paul 

THanks Paul and II - sadly it's not possible to travel by train and arrive in Reigate at my normalish time (Before 8) so car it is but thanks for your help

Dave


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on December 16, 2011, 19:05:13
I'm going to be genuinely impressed if the new p4 is open as scheduled. There still seems a lot to do and I guess Fgw staff can't have familiariastion training whilst it is still technically a construction site.

But there are still quite a few calendar days left before the 27th so there is still a chance.

...

I'm sure they can get it all finished in time, but like you I'm also quite surprised at how much is being done so close to the deadline. Have there been delays? It seems a bit hair raising if it was planned this way from the start. They were still pouring concrete for the platform base in late november, not much margin for delay...


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 16, 2011, 19:22:56
I'm sure they can get it all finished in time, but like you I'm also quite surprised at how much is being done so close to the deadline. Have there been delays? It seems a bit hair raising if it was planned this way from the start. They were still pouring concrete for the platform base in late november, not much margin for delay...

IIRC there were some delays to the area immediately adjacent to the buffer stop end, they had to dig out a massive lump of concrete and then do a load of concrete grouting to reinforce the underlying earth before digging out for the footings.

I also think they'll make the overall deadline easily now though.   

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 17, 2011, 11:06:26
I also think they'll make the overall deadline easily now though.   

There really isn't that much to do, and don't forget that even if things did get tight there's no actual need for the far end to open on time as the longest trains will still only be 8-car length, so as long as that much is finished, the bit under the canopy, there will be no operational problems.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on December 17, 2011, 14:23:30
Latest rumour, largely  unsubstantiated, is that the project is on time and may even be slightly ahead.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 17, 2011, 15:28:12
A lot of activity around the new p4 today (Saturday) - the 3rd rail pillars are in place and part of the 3rd rail itself has been laid.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: SandTEngineer on December 19, 2011, 20:40:04
A lot of activity around the new p4 today (Saturday) - the 3rd rail pillars are in place and part of the 3rd rail itself has been laid.

The are pots not pillars ::)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 19, 2011, 21:12:57
Pots, or posts?  ??? :P


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 20, 2011, 06:23:43
My description of the equipment required to hold the power rail in poaccsition may not have been technically accurate but it was close enough for others to know what I am talking about:)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 20, 2011, 09:27:21
Pots was the nickname given when they were generally white ceramic devices. 

'Adjustable height insulators' are the modern equivalent you'd see on a new build or renewal...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 21, 2011, 15:40:44
Where are all the Freightliners etc going whilst the Cow Lane Bridge on Reading West curve is being replaced?  When I was waiting at Pangbourne yesterday for the 0947 to Rdg a FL came through on the UR (with the 0947 4L behind it - but that's another story) so I presume the rail closure is shorter than the road closure. 

I presume they wouldn't be reversed in Reading, so are they going via Kensington, or Westbury, or what?



Edited for typos


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 21, 2011, 20:17:50
Cow Lane bridge is only closed to rail traffic for just over two days, from 5 pm on the 24th, 25th and 26th. 

I don't think there'll be much freight moving around the country on either day, but presumably it will be the Didcot - Oxford closure, which lasts longer, that will have a significant effect on freight routeings?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 22, 2011, 06:27:48
Some things I noticed on wednesday 21st December

On the old p4 there is now a big diagram about halfway down the hoardings showing the new platform and track layouts

On the new p4 the signage is up in the NR blue colours . There also seem to be some new signs signs opposite the excess fares office.

It looks like it is all coming together.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on December 22, 2011, 09:13:57
It looks like it is all coming together.
I am sure there is a P3e plan behind it mapped into Oracel to cost it all of which has had an ARM QRSA and QRA which is all, to me a humble Project Engineer, Project Manager gobbledygook for Can we build this ............. yes we can    ;D  ;D

There will be a very detailed plan for the whole of Reading with all the mile stones, key dependencies, contingencies, risks etc mapped into it this will not only have taken just Reading into account but the wider Western route and the wider impact that this station has Nationally


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 23, 2011, 12:00:33
Latest bumper edition of the station newsletter:

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7153/6558771691_2704504abb_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on December 23, 2011, 13:37:30
Interesting, thanks for these updates.

I'm curious about the process for lengthening 4a/4b, as I would assume that the whole island would be extended in one go rather than two narrow strips one after the other. So once 4b is re-opened in March, and 4a closed, what further work will be required on 4a, apart from canopies etc?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 23, 2011, 13:59:30
I'm sure that it would have been very desirable to alter both platforms at the same time, but there needs to be two southern platforms available for use at all times.  With both platforms getting straightened out (especially 4b) to fit into the new track layout, which of course has to be altered to allow their length to be extended to 12 carriages, that would not be possible to do all at once without closure of both platforms for a considerable amount of time.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 23, 2011, 14:43:21
I've an idea that much of the extension of what will become platform 5 and 6 may well be done while the first of the two platforms is out of use, ie when platform 5 reopens it might include the furthest 4 car length of platform 6 as well, because the significant section over the Vastern Rd bridge will presumably be prefabricated like the section of new platform 4 already completed.

What I'm thinking. IYSWIM, is that the eventual P6 closure might not take as long as the P5 closure...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on December 26, 2011, 15:49:33
Cow Lane Bridge Work Delayed


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-16142664 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-16142664)

The BBC is reporting that the installation of the new bridge is delayed untill 18:00 because of water in the foundation holes.  Is that a full 10 hour delay or less?  Will it be possible to recover this time by Wednesday morning?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on December 27, 2011, 04:07:40

The BBC is reporting that the installation of the new bridge is delayed untill 18:00 because of water in the foundation holes.  Is that a full 10 hour delay or less?  Will it be possible to recover this time by Wednesday morning?

I was there between 0030 and 0100 and the bridge was still being moved into place. I then went to do some work (that's what I am being paid for). When I left 35 minutes ago it was finished. I was very pleasantly surprised at the number of people who were watching given the time.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 27, 2011, 19:43:14
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-16338949):

Quote
Reading Cow Lane bridge lifted into place after delay

A new 1,600-tonne bridge has been installed in Reading.

One of two bridges in Cow Lane was demolished on Christmas Day but the installation of its replacement was delayed because of water in the foundations.

It was finally manoeuvred into place with a 66-axle vehicle on Tuesday morning. Crowds of people turned out to watch the seven-hour operation.

Cow Lane will be closed until 30 January and diversions are in place.

Trains are due to start running over the new bridge, made of concrete and steel, later this week once the tracks are replaced.

The work will allow for two lanes of traffic, a cycle lane and a pavement under the new bridge.

It will mean double-decker buses can use the road.

Network Rail project director Bill Henry said the bridges were a "notorious bottleneck".

The new bridge structure has been built at a nearby site and is part of the ^850m Reading Station redevelopment.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on December 27, 2011, 20:02:18
The Live departure board at Reading seems very confused at the moment:

The 19:56 Paddington to Weston Super Mare is shown as Platform 4 (Has to be the old number 4)

The 20:06 Paddington to Plymouth is shown as Platform 7 (Has to be the new number 7)

So thats two successive trains leaving from the same platform (old 4 becomes new 7), but the departure board give two different numbers!

No wonder they need extra staff to direct passengers!

PS Not just a one off - P4 seems to crop up regularly and at least one p5. 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on December 30, 2011, 22:52:27
Time lapse footage of Cow Lane's bridge being replaced has been released.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-16367565


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on December 30, 2011, 23:33:00
Time lapse footage of Cow Lane's bridge being replaced has been released.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-16367565

Thanks for that.

Not clear where the delay occured though. Also not sure why it is under Hampshire.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on December 31, 2011, 02:26:15
It doesn't appear in the Hampshire part of the website, I'd imagine it was just human error.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2011, 11:50:05
A couple of photos of the new layout at Reading station.

Firstly the realigned platform 10 (old platform 8 ) with the temporary platform sections and a dramatic kink in the old track layout at the western end mean a 25mph speed restriction is now in force whilst the platform is rebuilt into island platforms 10 and 11.  Platform 11, the old platform 10, will then be converted from a bay to through platform.

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7153/6606019077_4df4e7fa7a_b.jpg)



And here's the new shiny platform 4 ready for business and looking very nice I have to say.  Track for platform 5 has also been re-laid ready for platform 5 to be rebuilt in a straighter formation over the coming months.  Note the position of the buffer stops, now a good coach length away from the physical end of the platform.  Modern safety standards I expect, though how many thousands of people will just miss their train over the coming years with that extra distance to go I wouldn't like to guess!
 
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7017/6606017083_74fed660f4_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jonathan H on December 31, 2011, 15:16:49
I rode to Wokingham from the new platform 4 (1234 Reading to Redhill) and back into platform 6 (1134 Redhill to Reading) to have a daytime ride over the new formation.  I was a little suprised at how far down into the dip the new junctions are.  Traversing the new junctions is however a lot smoother than before and should save a few seconds in the future.

From the car park, you can see clearly that trains in platform 4 stop almost a whole class 458 carriage length (20 metres) further east than in platforms 5 and 6.

Is any further trackwork planned or is the final formation now in place?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on December 31, 2011, 16:46:08
Firstly the realigned platform 10 (old platform 8 ) with the temporary platform sections and a dramatic kink in the old track layout at the western end mean a 25mph speed restriction is now in force whilst the platform is rebuilt into island platforms 10 and 11.  Platform 11, the old platform 10, will then be converted from a bay to through platform.
Am I wrong? the photo is the old 9 taken from the old 8 at the old 6 (new 16) end, so is the old 9 the new 10?

Boy I thought KX was complex with its plat 0 and 9 3/4   ::) ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2011, 16:51:47
Yep, sorry, I should have said 'realigned platform 10 (old platform 9)'


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 31, 2011, 17:18:09
I rode to Wokingham from the new platform 4 (1234 Reading to Redhill) and back into platform 6 (1134 Redhill to Reading) to have a daytime ride over the new formation.  I was a little suprised at how far down into the dip the new junctions are.  Traversing the new junctions is however a lot smoother than before and should save a few seconds in the future.

...Is any further trackwork planned or is the final formation now in place?

The new junctions are significantly longer, to allow for various parallel moves in and out of the new platforms (ie at the same time), but without using any 'diamond' crossovers at all, as per current standards.  So an up train from new P4 has to weave across to the up line in two stages, rather than using a crossover straightover the down line.   

It is also seems current best practice is to avoid S&C components on any sort of gradient - so that also extends the whole layout.

From what I've seen previously I think the track layout is probably now complete.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2011, 18:31:12
It is also seems current best practice is to avoid S&C components on any sort of gradient - so that also extends the whole layout.

Some of the new crossovers are very much on a gradient!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on December 31, 2011, 18:35:50
It is also seems current best practice is to avoid S&C components on any sort of gradient - so that also extends the whole layout.

Some of the new crossovers are very much on a gradient!

Another bit of 'duff gen' from someone at one of those NR public displays then...   ::)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 01, 2012, 17:18:20
Time lapse footage of Cow Lane's bridge being replaced has been released.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-16367565
Not clear where the delay occured though.

Here's a possible theory, purely from the video though. 

Looking at the procedure shown, the foundation pads (or footings) seem to have been built integrally with the bridge sides, prior to it moving. See at 1m 18s.  I think this means they would have to excavate wide trenches to very exact dimensions with very accurate depths and more importantly accurate flatness and compaction.  It may just be that heavy rainfall slowed down the digging and levelling.

Normally footing concrete would be poured into the ground, then it would self-level to an extent, and be allowed a decent time to set hard, the method seen here seems to be designed specifically for speed - but can be slowed by rain.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 01, 2012, 21:26:19
Another bit of 'duff gen' at one of those NR public displays then...   ::)

I'm sure it's just a question of space constraints.  Ideally, on the level is best, but when you haven't got the room.  Bear in mind the distance between Spur Junction and the buffer stops is less than a mile and in that space you have to fit all the extra crossovers for the three platforms and the crossovers to the route that will eventually be reinstated under the GWML to the north side of the station.

I'd have thought that as long as any gradient remains constant, then it shouldn't make too much difference.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 02, 2012, 15:54:49
Another bit of 'duff gen' at one of those NR public displays then...   ::)

I'm sure it's just a question of space constraints.  Ideally, on the level is best, but when you haven't got the room.  Bear in mind the distance between Spur Junction and the buffer stops is less than a mile and in that space you have to fit all the extra crossovers for the three platforms and the crossovers to the route that will eventually be reinstated under the GWML to the north side of the station.

I'd have thought that as long as any gradient remains constant, then it shouldn't make too much difference.

In hindsight, I wonder if they were trying (without much success) to explain that the additional S&C couldn't be fitted on a constant slope of the same length of the original gradient,  so as well as the move to allow for longer platforms the sloping section had to be lengthened overall so that it could be fitted?  Does that makes sense...   ???

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: FellowTraveller on January 02, 2012, 21:59:11
More photos have popped up on:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=7


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on January 02, 2012, 22:22:20
It also has a link to a better time lapse video of Cow Lane and some You Tube Video of Platform 4.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on January 04, 2012, 18:30:42
Old habits die hard.  I was on Reading Station last week and because of signalling problems east of Reading they were doing a lot of manual annoucements.  The person doing them kept getting his platform 7s confused with his platform 4s causing much amusement among the despatch staff on the new platform 7.  It obviously got back to him as he was trying to avoid a fit of the giggles.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 04, 2012, 18:42:48
That was happening tonight - staff getting p4 and p7 mixed up resulting in much confusion !


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: onthecushions on January 05, 2012, 20:25:09

I wonder whether it would be better to rename platforms as A, B, C, etc., when numbers must change. That way staff and customers would have to think in terms of the new titles. When everything had settled down, the platforms could revert to their final numbers.

Glad to see that the Windsor Lines have kept number 4 - beautiful job the new work is.

OTC


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 05, 2012, 21:22:36
....  Note the position of the buffer stops, now a good coach length away from the physical end of the platform.  Modern safety standards I expect, though how many thousands of people will just miss their train over the coming years with that extra distance to go I wouldn't like to guess!
 

I was very surprised at how far down the new platform the buffer stop now is. Is this really justifiable, in cost-benefit terms, given TPWS, the crash-worthiness of modern rolling stock etc? I'd be interested to know the impact on the cost of the scheme- that's a fair length of additional platform constructed and, given the constraints on space at the other end, must have had an effect on the work necessary to accommodate the new junction.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 06, 2012, 11:17:31
It is because the new devices are not actually traditional fixed 'buffer stops', but 'friction arresters'.  If you look closely you'll see that there are fitted clamps allowing the structure to slide along the rail head, and as it moves backwards it gradually impacts on more rail clamps, and these increase the friction progressively, thereby slowing the train gradually.  Friction arresters are the new standard, they are being fitted all over LU as well.  Unless you can fit the sort of hydraulic buffers (the big pistons) seen at Waterloo, the arrester is a modern way of giving a gradual stop rather than a slow speed collision.

You have to consider also that TPWS etc will not stop a train sliding under worst case railhead conditions, whether caused by ice or leaf fall.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 06, 2012, 14:28:16
Paul,

I realise how they work, and that this is now the current standard, but what I'd like to know is whether the additional cost involved, if the new platform had to be made longer than would otherwise have been the case, is justified by the reduction in risk achieved. Clearly the risks of the older style buffers weren't considered unacceptable, otherwise thousands of trains wouldn't still be allowed to stop at them every day across the country.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on January 06, 2012, 19:33:56
Will they be fitted to platforms 5 & 6 when the work is completed on them?



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 06, 2012, 19:50:43
I assume they would have to be as both platforms are being significantly rebuilt so would have to comply with the latest standards. One has already been placed at the end of P5, although it doesn't look as if it is fitted in its final position yet.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on January 06, 2012, 21:55:59
Network Rail now have their time lapse footage of Cow Lane on their website:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/Custom/Templates/NetworkRailNewsArchiveSummary.aspx?id=30064779385 (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/Custom/Templates/NetworkRailNewsArchiveSummary.aspx?id=30064779385)

Still have not updated the Reading page though so it still says it will happen.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Tim on January 07, 2012, 14:57:26
Paul,

I realise how they work, and that this is now the current standard, but what I'd like to know is whether the additional cost involved, if the new platform had to be made longer than would otherwise have been the case, is justified by the reduction in risk achieved. Clearly the risks of the older style buffers weren't considered unacceptable, otherwise thousands of trains wouldn't still be allowed to stop at them every day across the country.

I have mixed feelings about things like this.  It is good that new kit is safer than old kit and sensible for things gradually to improve.

The problem however, is that you can go too far and make the railway so expensive that people are priced off onto the more dangerous roads.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on January 07, 2012, 16:36:50
A few years ago I was on duty at Reading when a voyager slid into the blocks on Platform 3. These were new, friction blocks and they were pushed back about a foot or so. The train was very busy, with lots of people stood up, ready to get off. Amazingly, no one was hurt, or even aware, that there had been an impact. Even the TM was unaware - he thought it had just been a rather sudden stop.

Whilst this was clearly a low speed impact, its not difficult to imagine that things could have been much worse had the blocks been of the fixed variety. A sudden jolt would have sent a lot of people and luggage flying.

I would think the financial case for friction blocks is easily made!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 07, 2012, 17:15:17
Is it possible P3 at Reading might reflect an interim design, as there is nothing like the same distance behind the arrester, although (at least to my eye) it looks exactly the same type?

On the other hand, perhaps the distance behind the device is related to maximum train length, or weight?

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Tim on January 09, 2012, 09:30:51

I would think the financial case for friction blocks is easily made!

That absolutely fine then.  Thanks for the info


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 09, 2012, 22:25:30
A few years ago I was on duty at Reading when a voyager slid into the blocks on Platform 3. These were new, friction blocks and they were pushed back about a foot or so. The train was very busy, with lots of people stood up, ready to get off. Amazingly, no one was hurt, or even aware, that there had been an impact. Even the TM was unaware - he thought it had just been a rather sudden stop.

And when you compare that to the (fairly) recent crash at Cannon Street in 1991.  Two people died and 524 were injured in a collision with buffer stops at only 10 miles an hour!  True, it was a very full train, and formed of very old rolling stock, but the type of buffer stop in use was also commented on in the inquiry.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on January 12, 2012, 21:31:33
Work seems to have started on the site of the former Platform 7 today. When I went through this morning there was some sort of briefing going on and by this afternoon on the way back there were signs of work in progress with an excavator visible.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 12, 2012, 22:44:40
There were markings painted on the platforms either side of the old P7 bay when I was there early last week, suggesting that a hoarding will be put up round the site that would take quite a big chunk off the width of platforms 8 and 9 (new numbers).

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 16, 2012, 15:27:26
Over the weekend Platform 5 (formerly 4b) has now disappeared behind hoardings, and a temporary canopy has gone up over P6. Last week a section of P5 had been cut away at the far end of the island, presumably this will now continue further down as it is realigned to the new track position. In the space where the island platform is to be extended a pile boring machine and various other plant is being prepared. Sections of the track to P5 has been covered with hardboard, presumably to protect it while the works are underway.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 16, 2012, 15:32:12
Over the weekend Platform 5 (formerly 4b) has now disappeared behind hoardings, and a temporary canopy has gone up over P6. Last week a section of P5 had been cut away at the far end of the island, presumably this will now continue further down as it is realigned to the new track position. In the space where the island platform is to be extended a pile boring machine and various other plant is being prepared. Sections of the track to P5 has been covered with hardboard, presumably to protect it while the works are underway.

One of the "downsides" of the new P4/5/6 arrangement is that if I am catching the 634am from Reading to Gatwick and it is freezing cold and/or pouring down with rain I cant wait on the SWT service which used to be parked across the platform. Most mornings the SWT is waiting on the new P4 and the RDG>Gatwick service pulls in on the new P6


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on January 17, 2012, 18:16:38
There is also another snag.  Some trains are obviously in the system to use Platform 5 - ie the 18:52 Reading to Ascot.  It appears on the main screens around the station as platform 5 but of course there is currently no departure screen for the closed platform 5 so it effectively disappears.  It is only when, just before the stock arrives to form the service, that you get "This is a Platform alteration...the 18:52 South West Trains service etc etc" and it is switched to platform 4.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 17, 2012, 18:35:13
There is also another snag.  Some trains are obviously in the system to use Platform 5 - ie the 18:52 Reading to Ascot.  It appears on the main screens around the station as platform 5 but of course there is currently no departure screen for the closed platform 5 so it effectively disappears.  It is only when, just before the stock arrives to form the service, that you get "This is a Platform alteration...the 18:52 South West Trains service etc etc" and it is switched to platform 4.

This also happens to my morning service from reading to gatwick. On the CIS system the 634 shows up on the display for P4 leaving AFTER the 70x service to waterloo .

Then a few minutes later there is a "platform alteration" pa and the CIS shows correctly.

Not a big issue for regular travellers but I have seen a few gatwick bound pax scratching their heads.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: adc82140 on January 17, 2012, 22:53:04
I wonder if this is what's completely screwing up the departure boards further away on the North Downs Line? The 18:24, 19:36 and 19:55 departures off Guildford to Reading have completely disappeared from National Rail Enquiries, Live Departure Boards, the CIS at all stations on the line and whatever system FGW customer service use. It was only when I asked the customer service people on the phone to check TRUST that they admitted these services exist. The platform staff at Guildford are tearing their hair out, as apparently it's very difficult to add them manually to their CIS. They told me it was the same yesterday.

I have asked FGW Customer Service to look in to it.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: EBrown on January 20, 2012, 16:27:08
I just found some (better) time lapse footage of Cow Lane Bridge. This video includes the construction of the bridge and a little more after the bridge was moved into place. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4ca9xVYJqk


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on January 20, 2012, 19:15:22
Sad news regarding the death of a contractor linked with the project:

http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2106588_police_investigate_lorry_death (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2106588_police_investigate_lorry_death)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on January 20, 2012, 23:13:57
Of little comfort to his family I know, but nice to read - if the article is accurate - that the company employs 69 year olds and doesn't send them packing at whatever age the retirement limit is this week.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: John R on January 20, 2012, 23:40:19
There isn't one. Since October employers cannot terminate employment solely because of age (unless they are in one of a small group of occupations where safety is deemed a paramount consideration). 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on January 21, 2012, 08:23:41
Of little comfort to his family I know, but nice to read - if the article is accurate - that the company employs 69 year olds and doesn't send them packing at whatever age the retirement limit is this week.
There isn't one. Since October employers cannot terminate employment solely because of age (unless they are in one of a small group of occupations where safety is deemed a paramount consideration). 
Also he could have been self employed which is quite common in both the haulage and construction industries. 

Sad news, as all deaths are, on what has so far been a project with a very good safety record


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on January 24, 2012, 13:24:45
Took this quick photo as I was boarding train today.

Last view of the old platform 7 before it gets fully boarded up.

The gap where the tracks were has been filled in already.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on January 24, 2012, 14:58:35
Does anyone know if the new layout at Reading will cure the problem of a train being trapped on the approach to platform 7 (formerly platform 4) if a train fails or is otherwise delayed while at the platform?  It happened again today.  A three car unit came in the platform out of service at about 12:20.  I assume it had failed somewhere as it had a red tail lamp perched on the driver's desk in the rear cab.  It then sat there for 15 minutes before being moved.  In the meantime the 12:27 to Bristol Temple Meads and the 12:33 to Penzance were queuing outside the station with no where to go.  I assume the Penzance service could have been moved to another platform as it was before a crossover, but the 12:27 could only gain another platform by reversing which would have been very time consuming.  As a result it left 12 minutes late and only just ahead of the following Cardiff service which had been diverted to Platform 8.  It does seem a weakness that the final signal before the platform is effectively a dead end - there is only one way to go if/when it clears.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: SandTEngineer on January 24, 2012, 17:30:05
Some you Win some you Lose ::)

The signal on the approach to P7 was installed over ten years ago and allows a shorter platform reoccupation time under normal working.  Unfortunately an HST stood at this signal has its tail end over the points leading from the Down Main to Up Main and so a train stood at the signal near the Gas Works will be caught as well.  This then blocks back to other trains on the Down Main which have no way out.  With five minute peak headways things can very quickly escalate when it goes wrong. The only way out then is to turn trains Down Main to Down Relief at Ruscombe Junction near Twyford.>:(

The new Reading layout will be completly different (see earlier posts in this thread).


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 29, 2012, 19:21:15
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-16779856):

Quote
Reading Cow Lane bridge opens to road traffic

A commuter route in Reading is due to reopen following the installation of a new 1,600-tonne bridge.

Cow Lane has been closed since early December for Network Rail to remove and replace one of two bridges and lay a new road under the structure.

The southern bridge was demolished on Christmas Day but work was held up because of water in the foundations.

Trains have already started using the bridge and Cow Lane is scheduled to reopen to traffic on Monday.

The concrete and steel structure was manoeuvred into place with a 66-axle vehicle on 27 December. Crowds of people turned out to watch the seven-hour operation.

The work has allowed for two lanes of traffic, a cycle lane and pavement under the new bridge and means double-decker buses can use the road.

Network Rail project director Bill Henry said the bridges were a "notorious bottleneck".

"We're very thankful to the patience of local residents and commuters who bore with us while we finished off this very important phase of our works," he said.

The work is part of the ^850m Reading Station redevelopment with work on the northern Cow Lane bridge due to finish in 2015.

That BBC article includes two and a half minutes of time lapse footage, showing how the 1,600-tonne bridge was installed: I found it absolutely fascinating, but slightly headache inducing (flash lighting effect).  ::)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on January 29, 2012, 20:16:15
Linked to already back in December, in post # 524. 

However, I think post # 537 includes a longer better version.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 29, 2012, 20:22:21
Sorry: I did think some of it seemed rather familiar.  :-[

However, their 'latest' item is described by the BBC as posted "29 January 2012 Last updated at 10:50".

The perils of believing the BBC, I suppose.  ::)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on January 29, 2012, 20:35:50
The BBC story is new in that it is reporting the re-opening of the road, which took a few more weeks  work to complete after the railway bridge was installed. In doing so they linked to a newer version of the time lapse film than the one they had originally referenced.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - a downside for the time being
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on February 03, 2012, 09:18:37
I know that alot of Reading Station is a building site at the moment but one definate downside as far as I can see is there is no-where to "hide" from the cold weather like we have had this week. At the moment my travels only involve platforms 1-7 so I don't know if this is any different across the other sides of the station

When I am doing my normal commute there isn't much time to be affected by the bad  weather but last night I had the pleasure of sepnding nearly an hour at the station with very little respite from the cold - even on the main concourse through the barriers.

I know in projects like this sometimes things have to get worse before they get better but I do miss the waiting room, toilets and coffee shop on the old P4 !

Dave (hoping for a heatwave!)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on February 03, 2012, 19:34:03
Its not just the UK, I remember a similar wait on Rotterdam Central Station a couple of years ago.  That is undergoing a similalrly radical rebuild.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on February 03, 2012, 23:51:16
There is always the Three Guineas - it has departure screens in there and a view of the platforms!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on February 04, 2012, 18:51:30
There is always the Three Guineas - it has departure screens in there and a view of the platforms!


................. and beer  ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on February 04, 2012, 22:39:53
Usually some quite interesting ones!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on February 10, 2012, 13:04:45
Old platform 7 canopy is no more...



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 11, 2012, 15:50:52
I spent a while at Reading station yesterday (in the cold!) waiting to meet someone.  It struck me how much capacity is lost because of the normal operating practice of not closing the doors on departing trains until the starting signal clears. I saw several trains that were loaded up and ready to go, and just waiting for the signal to clear after a previous train.  Then when the signal cleared there was blowing of whistles and the door closure routine starts - maybe 20-30 seconds elapses from the signal clearing to HST's actually departing, but of course much longer for Voyagers with their drawn-out door closing process. 

It seems to me that this is an old railway practice which goes back to slam door stock, when of course passengers could and would join the train if it was in the platform and stationary.  With modern stock with lockable doors, why cannot trains close their doors at train time and draw up to the starting signal, so they are ready to go as soon as it clears?  This would improve punctuality and improve throughput at busy junctions like Reading


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on February 11, 2012, 22:18:56
Intersting idea but I can't see elfandsafety being too happy with a train starting to move and then stopping again. People would be trying to board thinking it was stopping to pick them up.

With ERTMS and enough baliases(? spelling) a train could in theory be given the start signal sooner but only at 5 mph say, the train would then get successive higher speeds until it was following the train ahead at line speed.

Watch Docklands to get an idea of what I mean where trains creep up to around 50 yards behind a stopped train, enter the platform as the previous train leaves and then follow it out quite closely. You can see the block sections if you are in the front as they are where the control wire loops and there is numberplate. it's very precise especialy station stops which are spot on the stop plate everytime.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on February 12, 2012, 14:05:09
If you try and find a map of Reading Station on the FGW website you are directed to national rail (not a problem) .  However this map has not been updated and still has the old platform numbers on it.

[Note The Paddington map will also need changing now they ahve moved the Taxi Rank.]


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on February 12, 2012, 15:41:18
I've recently read on Twitter that NRE are aware of the issue regarding the online map of Reading and the incorrect platform numbers. Brought to their attention by an FGW staffer who is also a member of this forum. Well done Ollie!

National Rail Enquiries are, however, painfully slow in updating incorrect information on their website.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on February 12, 2012, 18:24:08
I suspect that they used a specialist contractor to produce all the drawings and photos for the whole network as part of that 'stations made easy' scheme, but then didn't set up a system to deal with future changes as and when they happen.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: eightf48544 on February 13, 2012, 11:50:50
Heard from a very reliable source that the TV Signalling Centre is finding it very hard to work Reading without the old platform 7. They've nowhwere to park an out of course Voyager terminator without blocking a through platform if 3 is occupied.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 13, 2012, 16:34:07
Yes 8F, I can see the XC Reading terminators (only every 2 hours now of course) must be a bit of a headache even if they are on time.  They arrive at xx07 and depart at xx41, so presumably block P9 or P10 for 34 minutes.  Else they're put across to P3 with all the extra conflicting moves, and squeezed in after the xx11 northbound XC departure and effectively blocking P3 for the xx46 southbound XC.  Unless they shunt them out of the station for the layover time?

I'll check the Reading departures this evening and see where the 1741 Newcastle goes from (although the inward wrorking is 22 late from Oxford so it will need less platform time at Reading than usual)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on February 13, 2012, 16:48:59
Yes 8F, I can see the XC Reading terminators (only every 2 hours now of course) must be a bit of a headache even if they are on time.  They arrive at xx07 and depart at xx41, so presumably block P9 or P10 for 34 minutes.  Else they're put across to P3 with all the extra conflicting moves, and squeezed in after the xx11 northbound XC departure and effectively blocking P3 for the xx46 southbound XC.  Unless they shunt them out of the station for the layover time?

I'll check the Reading departures this evening and see where the 1741 Newcastle goes from (although the inward wrorking is 22 late from Oxford so it will need less platform time at Reading than usual)

I can tell you that the 1741 Xcode to Newcastle is normally parked at p3 as it is there when I catch the 1736 service to thatcham


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 13, 2012, 17:15:31
. as it is this evening.  Just looking at the Reading departures on the FGW website to see where the 1711 XC to Manchester is leaving from (in 1 minute's time!) but no platform is showing yet.  So presumably it doesn't normally goes off P3!  Just hope the punters at Reading can see a platform number!

So maybe they keep P3 for the XC Reading terminators, and use P7-P10 for XC's when P3 is so occupied.

1711 XC to Newcastle has now left Reading, platform not known.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on February 13, 2012, 17:26:21
1711 is to Manchester Piccadilly.

But as you rightly say, Live Departures showed no platform number.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on February 13, 2012, 17:30:59
Yes 8F, I can see the XC Reading terminators (only every 2 hours now of course) must be a bit of a headache even if they are on time.  They arrive at xx07 and depart at xx41, so presumably block P9 or P10 for 34 minutes.  Else they're put across to P3...)

All the XC terminators are diagrammed to layover in P3. This was shown in route planners from about last November onwards, and displayed on posters around the station back in December when P7 notionally closed, although until Christmas P7 was still used on occasions.

The through services on the SOU/RDG/NCL route nearly all use P3 as well - 1640 northbound from Southampton and 1815 southbound to Eastleigh are about the only through services that don't use P3;  platform allocations checked with opentraintimes.com for tomorrow - avoiding any late changes!

PS - a similar check suggests nearly all Bourrnemouth/Man Picc trains use the through platforms, either 8 or 9, but I did also find a 1646 to Bournemouth in P10

PPS here's a link (for tomorrow):  http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG/2012/2/14/0700

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on February 13, 2012, 17:43:22
. as it is this evening.  Just looking at the Reading departures on the FGW website to see where the 1711 XC to Manchester is leaving from (in 1 minute's time!) but no platform is showing yet.  So presumably it doesn't normally goes off P3!  Just hope the punters at Reading can see a platform number!

So maybe they keep P3 for the XC Reading terminators, and use P7-P10 for XC's when P3 is so occupied.

1711 XC to Newcastle has now left Reading, platform not known.

1741 is now sitting at p3 wtg departure


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 13, 2012, 17:49:01
Sorry, 1711 to Manchester not Newcastle as you say BNM.  But obviously the closure of the old P7, whilst necessary for the station modernisation, adds to congestion etc. in the short term and presumably more instances of late platform changes and passengers rushing about to and from P3.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on February 20, 2012, 23:19:17
More recent photos posted on

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=88717140&postcount=142 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=88717140&postcount=142)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Boppy on February 21, 2012, 14:12:18
Took this photo this morning standing between platforms 8 & 9 looking east.

I believe this was the building that housed the goods lift and store cupboards.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on February 27, 2012, 13:34:57
The concrete footings for the extended platform 5/6 are now being built. Something that has struck me about them is that they appear to be closer to the track serving platform 5 (currenly closed) than 6. They also look asymmetric in appearance. So it looks like there will be a larger overhang on the P6 side, or is some of the existing platform on that side to be cut back and the track shifted towards the platform?

At the end of where the extended platform will be there is an excavation going on, which I think is to provide an emergency exit, via a subway under the tracks. Is this correct? I'm assuming that the  strange concrete structure that was built while the embankment was being widened last year was in fact the liner for the subway, so no further tunnelling or undercutting will be needed?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on February 27, 2012, 16:48:47
I can answer this, as I asked someone on site about it around ten days ago!

The concrete foundations between the two tracks are about 2/3 of their finished length, there is a load of reinforcing bar (rebar) poking out through the concrete on the 'north' ends of the various strips, which will connect to the remaining lengths of the foundations, and a row of piles, when they are eventually cast, which will be once P5 is re opened and P6 is closed.

The reasons for doing it this way are twofold.  They don't have to excavate so near the operational track yet, and it also allows for the public area of P5 to be an adequate width with a hoarding supported just past the centre line in due course.

And yes the excavation in line with P5/P6 is the second emergency escape route - drawing attached below from the design and access statement.

PS to the above - now that the majority of the 'cast in situ' concrete crossbeams are in position you can see more easily a further outcrop of rebar extending towards the P6 track...



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Lee on March 15, 2012, 20:10:45
From getreading: (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2110150_green_light_for_next_stage_of_reading_rail_scheme)

Quote from: getreading
Green light for next stage of Reading rail scheme

Town hall planners called on Network Rail to ensure it takes measures to prevent graffiti as they gave the go-ahead for the next stage of the multi-million Reading Station redevelopment.
 
Reading Borough Council^s planning committee has given approval to proposals for viaducts and box junctions which will create a raised railway along a stretch of the Great Western mainline.
 
The changes will allow mainline passenger services to travel over the top of the mainline to avoid freight trains up to a mile long coming up from the South and crossing over it, causing delays.
 
Overall, councillors were in favour of the proposal, but voiced concerns about graffiti while others suggested more could be done by Network Rail to let the public know about the scheme.
 
Councillor Richard Willis said: ^We have all seen the applying of graffiti around the network.
 
^We should get feedback from Network Rail that they consider that and something be done to minimise graffiti in advance.^
 
Cllr Chris Maskell added: ^I have no problem with the application and it just demonstrates how important Reading is to the nation^s rail network and, more than that, why we should become a city.
 
^The scale of the development taking place here is enormous, but I think Network Rail aren^t doing the best job they can in PR work in telling people what is going through.^
 
Cllr Tony Page earlier welcomed the latest development to the scheme at the meeting held at the council^s Civic Offices on Wednesday last week. He said: ^Clearly, this is a very important application in the staging of the Reading station area development.
 
^There is no getting away from the fact the viaducts will be seen and that is stated in the report but we cannot have the benefits accruing from this scheme without the construction of them and the supporting junction.^
 
The committee unanimously approved the application.
 
After the meeting, Bill Henry, director of Network Rail^s improvement scheme at Reading said in a statement: ^We^re delighted that Reading Borough Council has given the green light for the development of the viaduct.
 
^The council staff and members ^ especially Tony Page, lead councillor for planning and transport ^ have been hugely supportive.
 
^As passengers will be well aware, there is a problem with a bottleneck on the railway at Reading and the viaduct is the main part of the solution in fixing this.
 
^It will stop slow freight trains from delaying faster, mainline services which will use the viaduct, while the freight trains will pass underneath the structure.
 
^When the viaduct is finished in 2015 it will also allow Network Rail to replace Cow Lane bridge north, bringing another wider, safer bridge with two lanes of traffic, a footpath and cycle lane.
 
^We^ve already engaged with local residents and businesses about the viaduct but will be contacting them again before construction work begins in January 2013 so they know what to expect.^


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 16, 2012, 10:34:02
The first signs of a building in the new maintenance depot has sprung up this week, in a location which matches where the train care shed will be built.  I'm hesitant to say it is the new train care shed in case it's a temporary structure, but if it is part of the new depot then it's great to see it taking shape.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 16, 2012, 12:32:41
There is also a new tall structure appearing to the North of the station, which I assume will provide support for the northern end of the new pedestrian bridge...?

I'm curious to know how the station will operate during the interval between the new platforms opening and the completion of the grade separation, given the significant changes in track layout when the flyover is open, in particular whether trains on the Newbury/Basingstoke line will able to reach 11 to 15. Also, I think that some of the existing platforms are to be built out (7?) so will trains be diverted to the new platforms while this work is done?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 16, 2012, 15:19:50
I had a look through the 2013 NR engineering access statement, (Part 7.0 possesions register - Western) which shows next years probable engineering work closures, week by week:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/Rules%20Of%20The%20Route/MAINMENU.pdf

Going by that (which is subject to change of course) it suggests that once the new relief side islands open, it will be platforms P10 and P11 that close to get sorted out first, so that would leave 7, 8 and 9 still available for the fast lines. 

If I was a betting man, I reckon that up fasts will probably then transfer to P10/11 when it is complete and P7/8/9 will be taken out of service in sequence, P7 last of all.   My reasoning is that the P10/11 island isn't really wide enough to deal with crowds of passengers heading in both directions, so it would be best to leave it as an up platforms only?

Criticism welcome though, as that's mainly guesswork...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on March 16, 2012, 19:41:54
The massive building site to the North of the station (where the new Northern entrance will be) is not visible from the platforms, but you get a very good view from the overbridge to the car park. A massive retaining wall has been built to separate the elevated track level side from the road side, which is at a considerably lower level. The wall has been built up in one place to the height of the new overbridge - impressive engineeering. The concrete base for the new buildings appears to be complete now, and looks very extensive. A concrete tower has also been built, which I assume is a lift shaft.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jason on March 19, 2012, 12:43:20
The steel superstructure surrounding (though mainly to the north of) the concrete wall has been rapidly rising over the past week. There is also additional concrete structure being added between the wall and platform 10.

Judging by the new line of metal girders now on platform 10 I imagine it is going to be narrowed in the not too distant future.

(Apologies for the v. quick snap taken at dawn. My first time posting here)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: johoare on March 19, 2012, 21:59:22
Thanks for the picture Nosaj.. And welcome to the forum  ;D


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 20, 2012, 18:41:08
While waiting for a connection today, I took a couple of shots from the carpark roof.  Those blocks the crane is positioning (more on the back of the trailer) are the lift shaft sections for the group of passenger lifts up to the transfer deck.  All factory made for accuracy, shouldn't take more than a day or two and they'll all be in position...

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Electric train on March 20, 2012, 20:20:26
  All factory made for accuracy, shouldn't take more than a day or two and they'll all be in position...

Paul 
And speed


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 23, 2012, 09:04:03
The first signs of a building in the new maintenance depot has sprung up this week, in a location which matches where the train care shed will be built.  I'm hesitant to say it is the new train care shed in case it's a temporary structure, but if it is part of the new depot then it's great to see it taking shape.

This has shot up over the last week, must be a permanent structure. It is good to see visible progress like this, the scale of the new passenger bridge / deck is becoming apparent now, hadn't really appreciated before how much wider it will be than the existing bridge. Also, concrete panels are starting to be laid for the deck of the extended platform 5/6. Does anyone know the current timescale for completion of the extended platform and when work will switch to platform 6?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 23, 2012, 09:58:09
Platform 5 was supposed to be all finished by the end of March with work on Platform 6 starting immediately and taking longer as it will involve demolition of the existing platform.  Scheduled completion by July.  They'll have to go some to complete Platform 5 in just over a week though!

The building on the maintenance depot is indeed a permanent structure as has become apparent now with the size of the thing!

Finally, in terms of the electrification time-scale, work is supposed to start ahead of the GWML project this September and be finished by November 2015.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 23, 2012, 10:11:50
Thanks. It will be a rush then! Assuming it isn't delayed. Why does Platform 6 need to be demolished? Indeed, isn't it part of the same structure as Platform 5?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 23, 2012, 10:23:28
Platform 5 is delayed by a few weeks I believe, because they have decided following inspection to replace the concrete deck over its entire length.  The previously intended method was to just reduce the thickness of the deck slightly, to allow for a new top surface and coping slabs, (this section had been cast 'in situ' originally, with an asphalt skim), and this is why they have only recently started using machinery to demolish the whole of the length of the deck - there were visible signs of the abandoned 'surface reduction' on some of the deck sections.  I assume that they'll need a load more prefabricated panel sections for that change of plan - lets hope the factory can deliver them on time.

What I did get confirmed on my last visit was that the canopy support steelwork for P5/P6 will be fitted during the P6 closure, working behind the line of the hoardings which will be 'reversed' once the P6 deck is finished.

P6 and P5 are not part of the same structure, they were built nearly 10 years apart, the old 4A replaced the Southern station on its own in 1965, 4B arrived significantly later in the 70s when more capacity was needed.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jason on March 23, 2012, 12:25:48
Those lift shaft sections are indeed very quick to assemble, this one appeared over the course of a single day.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 23, 2012, 17:57:17
Your latest picture clearly shows the thickening of the supporting concrete wall that will support the north end of the transfer deck - it's 30m wide according to the plans.  (Or nearly 100 ft for us old folk.)

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on March 23, 2012, 20:28:30
More photographs available on...

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=89730646&postcount=143 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=89730646&postcount=143)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on March 24, 2012, 12:28:45
The latest Reading Station Staff Update popped in a rather timely fashion into my inbox this morning.  Lots more detail to confirm what has been said...

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7127/7010764137_afe9e83a3a_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 24, 2012, 12:31:53
Just wanted to say "thanks" to the posters who add content that alot of us cant - or dont have time - to see on our journeys through RDG....keep up the good work!



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on March 25, 2012, 23:00:53
New edition of Reading News already available on line.

http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/About-Us/Rail-improvements/~/media/PDF/Press%20Releases/Reading%20NewsFINAL.pdf (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/About-Us/Rail-improvements/~/media/PDF/Press%20Releases/Reading%20NewsFINAL.pdf)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 25, 2012, 23:19:18
The 'Reading News' just might have gone to print before the decision to re-work platform 5 was made.   

I don't really think it will be ready by next weekend  :o as stated in the text...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on March 28, 2012, 01:25:53
Will the new platforms 4,5 & 6 still have the signalling to accomodate two trains as happened occasionally on the old 4a and 4b or with the new capacity is that now deemed unnecessary?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2012, 11:46:31
I'd expect they will have permissive working, as even if they didn't need to routinely operate more than one service from a platform, it would allow for splitting and joining of units - which would be useful for SWT anyway.

It should be easy to check anyway, if someone who regularly travels on the Southern route (BerkshireBugsy maybe?) looks out for the presence of subsidiary signals [1] when on the approach towards Reading

[1] Subsidiary or 'calling on' indications are the two small white lights at 45 degrees (normally not illuminated), usually mounted below the main aspects.

Paul

   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 28, 2012, 12:32:43
I shall have a look this evening!

Had a quick look at Platform 5 now that the old deck has been removed. You can now see clearly that Platforms 5 and 6 are separate structures underneath the deck, as you explained before.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 28, 2012, 12:34:43
I shall have a look this evening!

Had a quick look at Platform 5 now that the old deck has been removed. You can now see clearly that Platforms 5 and 6 are separate structures underneath the deck, as you explained before.

I am guenuinely impreessed with how far P5 has come in the last week. Last Wednesday when I came though they were still demolishing the old deck and on Monday they had some of the replacement structure down.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on March 28, 2012, 12:37:16
I noticed that the new deck has started to appear on the newly extended platform, but wasn't able to see from a quick glance whether any of the old deck has been replaced. I got the impression from an earlier post that the replacement would be cast in situ, whereas the deck for the new section seems to be pre-cast slabs. Will try to have a better look this evening.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2012, 14:11:12
Interesting article summarising the state of play of the Reading area improvements in this month's Rail Engineer online version:

http://www.therailengineer.com/print-archive/

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on March 28, 2012, 14:24:16
Fascinating article.  Does the plan really extend from Sonning to Pangbourne or is that journalistic licence?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2012, 16:58:29
I wondered about that too.  It's possible that with the station area capacity expanding the way it is, signalling and track alterations actually start a long way either side, I think because with high speed running it is important to keep the four aspect signalling at standard distances?  I'm thinking of the stuff such as main to relief ladder crossovers for instance - if they move a crossover position by half a mile or so, that would change which signals are automatic and which are controlled. A signalling sighting alteration or interlocking change at Pangbourne wouldn't necessarily be highly visible, but it's still a part of the overall project.  With the depot and stabling extending so far to the west, it's likely a lot of operational functionality has to be relocated. I've seen references to a new 'Kennet Junction' - I'd assume that's somewhere in the vicinity of the river - so that would take the area of interest more to the east as well?

Paul   



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jason on April 03, 2012, 12:26:45
Things progress apace.
Platform 10 is now narrowed again and structural works are taking place so close to the hoardings that they overhang it and are cladded.
There was a nice view down into the subway section through one of the viewing holes on the platform.
Sorry for the poor lighting, it's was rather dull first thing.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 03, 2012, 12:48:18
It should be easy to check anyway, if someone who regularly travels on the Southern route (BerkshireBugsy maybe?) looks out for the presence of subsidiary signals [1] when on the approach towards Reading

[1] Subsidiary or 'calling on' indications are the two small white lights at 45 degrees (normally not illuminated), usually mounted below the main aspects.


Sorry - missed this - if it hasn't been answered I will try and look on my way back this afternoon. Is this likely to be attached to the same signal which has the desitnation platform number on it (E.g., currently 4 or 6)?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 03, 2012, 14:16:15
It should be easy to check anyway, if someone who regularly travels on the Southern route (BerkshireBugsy maybe?) looks out for the presence of subsidiary signals [1] when on the approach towards Reading

[1] Subsidiary or 'calling on' indications are the two small white lights at 45 degrees (normally not illuminated), usually mounted below the main aspects.


Sorry - missed this - if it hasn't been answered I will try and look on my way back this afternoon. Is this likely to be attached to the same signal which has the desitnation platform number on it (E.g., currently 4 or 6)?

Yes, that would be the normal position, as that would be the appropriate signal for a 2nd train to be brought to a halt at.  The setup is that once the train is stopped by the red signal, the signaller will then clear the subsidiary signal. The second train into a platform cannot run in at normal line speed that way.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 03, 2012, 14:22:38

Yes, that would be the normal position, as that would be the appropriate signal for a 2nd train to be brought to a halt at.  The setup is that once the train is stopped by the red signal, the signaller will then clear the subsidiary signal. The second train into a platform cannot run in at normal line speed that way.

Paul

We were held at that signal coming into P6 yesterday afternoon which suprised me as there was no service on the platform waiting to depart (or a service waiting to depart from P4 which would cross our path). Having said that we pulled in at P6 last night and then (I believe  the train was then taken out of service)

Dave


 Will see if I can see the signal this afternoon.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 05, 2012, 11:28:03
Just to confirm that the signal protecting platforms 4, 5, and 6 is fitted with a position light signal and so those platforms can be used permissively with more than one train at once.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on April 06, 2012, 23:01:42
New Network Rail Video of North entrance

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Surrey 455 on April 07, 2012, 22:50:48
New Network Rail Video of North entrance

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6339.aspx)

Couldn't get that video to work. Only the third video on that page would play but the picture kept freezing whilst the progress bar carried on.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 11, 2012, 13:43:23
The Carriage Wash facility superstructure is now taking shape in the new depot following works on the underground piping and concrete foundations.  It can be seen a 150 metres or so west of the new Train Care Shed.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 12, 2012, 11:14:53
I see two fairly massive masts have appeared, one at the London end of the future P10/P11 island, and one alongside it to the north presumably in the middle of the future P12/P13 island's location.

I wonder if they are for electrification?  Or signalling?

Paul   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 12, 2012, 12:53:19
Or signalling?

That's what I'd guess as there's a lot of metal cable tidies being attached to them.  Also a large signal gantry appeared a few weeks ago by New Junction, so they clearly are at a physical work stage with them.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements quick update on p5
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 17, 2012, 06:43:16
Work on p5 seems to be progressing at quite a rate now - I did take a picture earlier today which I ay post layer if I get the chance. It looks like most of the platform is now in place

Also noted ref p5 is the installation of a CIS display to the right of the one which is currently in use for p6.i am guessing that at some point the new one will be associated with p6 whilst the older one will revert to p5

I also notice two supports have appeared etween the p4 and p7 tracks which I m guessing are for the erection of a gantry - possibly for I galling ?

Someone who knows what they are talking about will be better qualified to confirm this !


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - picture of P5 taken 17/4/2012
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 17, 2012, 09:08:30
Showing platform progress and new CIS screen



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 17, 2012, 17:28:51
I had a walk along P6 at lunchtime, I reckon if they make good progress for the rest of this week P5 could possibly be in use next Monday, otherwise I should think the end of the month won't be a problem, which would put them about 4 weeks behind the original schedule, following the decision to rebuild the decks as we discussed a little while ago. 

There's about 10 carriage lengths of edge slabs already in position, backed by the tactile slabs all the way along, and the new hoarding supports seem to be nearly all in place as well.

I don't envy those blokes putting in over 250m of block paving though...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on April 19, 2012, 12:41:18
Rapid progress on P5 in the last couple of days. On current progress I'd agree with Paul that it could be ready this weekend. The new hoarding is going up, lights are installed, and paving now installed on most of the length. Metal posts are being installed between the concrete piers that support the platform deck, I assume these are so the space underneath can be fenced off. The hoarding posts don't extend for the full length, so I assume they will block access to the far end, beyond the length of current trains, allowing easier construction worker access to the emergency exit subway which is still incomplete.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: coachflyer on April 19, 2012, 16:37:22
Platform 5 to be in use from Monday morning but as an 8 car platform only.

Platform 6 to be taken out of use to be rebuilt.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 19, 2012, 16:39:10
Platform 5 to be in use from Monday morning but as an 8 car platform only.

Platform 6 to be taken out of use to be rebuilt.

In which case I guess both CIS screens at the end of P5/P6 will be active then. I didn't go on the north downs line today but will have a look tomorrow.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on April 21, 2012, 12:41:40
Passed thru Reading (on foot) this morning and very pleased to see so much work going on on a Saturday.

Lots of finishing work on the new platform 5. The third rail is in place and the barrier between the tracks has been removed (although there were still men working on the platform 5 track whilst platform 4 was in use).

To the North of the station, the first decking sections of the new transfer deck had arrived on three large lorries and preparations for the first lift were ongoing - a very large crane was in place. All of the piers for the transfer deck from the new station building to platorm 10 are complete, so the decking should go up quickly.

The signal gantries for the posts that have been erected at the West end of platform 10 had arrived and were being made ready to be lifted in place.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 21, 2012, 12:44:25
Passed thru Reading (on foot) this morning and very pleased to see so much work going on on a Saturday.

Lots of finishing work on the new platform 5. The third rail is in place and the barrier between the tracks has been removed (although there were still men working on the platform 5 track whilst platform 4 was in use).


If the new P5 is open on Monday am there is a 50/50 chance I may be one of the first to use it when I catch the 0634 to Reigate!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 21, 2012, 14:35:54
To the North of the station, the first decking sections of the new transfer deck had arrived on three large lorries and preparations for the first lift were ongoing - a very large crane was in place. All of the piers for the transfer deck from the new station building to platorm 10 are complete, so the decking should go up quickly.

That very large crane, if it's the one I've been told about, will be in situ for around the next six months to lift all sections of the transfer deck into place.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 23, 2012, 09:33:55
On my journey through Reading this morning, platform 5 was now in use and platform 6 blocked off ready for work.

It also seems the new signal gantry at the east end of p7/8 has been put in place.

It's all happening :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: lordgoata on April 26, 2012, 10:05:07
Noticed this morning that a lot of new track has been laid along by the new depot area, and across the new bridge over Cow Lane. Progressing at quite a pace now!


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: mjones on April 27, 2012, 09:31:34
Platform 6 work moving ahead quickly, it has been demolished already. Just piles of rubble left. Looks like they have demolished the concrete footings as well as the platform deck. Does anyone know why it needed to be completely demolished, is it being re-aligned?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 27, 2012, 09:46:45
It might just go back to the different ages and conditions of the two halves of the 4A and 4B islands.  AIUI the northern side was built about ten years before the other side, and it looked like two different types of construction were used along its length as well.

Might just be a good opportunity to bring the whole thing up to a decent standard.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Oxman on April 28, 2012, 22:52:11
Couple of pics taken yesterday on my phone:

First is the new platforms 4 and 5, with the now demolished platorm 6. Note the new gantry above the HST.

Second is taken form the footbridge looking west across the area where the new north side platform will be. The piers and firts sections of the transfer deck are just behind the crane and the new north station building is on the right, behind the retaining wall.



Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 29, 2012, 09:24:56
Couple of pics taken yesterday on my phone:

First is the new platforms 4 and 5, with the now demolished platorm 6. Note the new gantry above the HST.

Second is taken form the footbridge looking west across the area where the new north side platform will be. The piers and firts sections of the transfer deck are just behind the crane and the new north station building is on the right, behind the retaining wall.



THanks for the pics Oxman.

Does anyone know if when p6 is finished there will be a wall/seperation between that and p5? at the moment it gets very congested with passengers (mainly on the Gatwick servers) as passengers getting off an on the services trying and do battle with their suitcases in tow :)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2012, 11:04:33
I'd be surprised if there was any division, it is quite unusual to see it on a pair of terminating platforms.  What there was back when it was P4A/4B didn't seem to help much at all as people used both sides of the platform anyway.

Perhaps when it all settles down they might dedicate services to platforms, eg all the Waterloos on P5/P6 and all the Gatwick/Redhills on P4? Another idea might be to make sure the Waterloo trains leave immediately before the next one arrives.   

There'll also be much more circulating space once the footbridge, lift and escalators are removed, so people shouldn't be clashing at that corner by the lift at least...

Paul   


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 29, 2012, 11:09:37
I'd be surprised if there was any division, it is quite unusual to see it on a pair of terminating platforms.  What there was back when it was P4A/4B didn't seem to help much at all as people used both sides of the platform anyway.

Perhaps when it all settles down they might dedicate services to platforms, eg all the Waterloos on P5/P6 and all the Gatwick/Redhills on P4?  There'll also be much more circulating space once the footbridge, lift and escalators are removed, so people shouldn't be clashing at that corner by the lift at least...

Paul   

Good points Paul. I think part of the problem on P4 is that sometime passengers, who are strangers to the station, don't know which way to exit once they disembark the train. THere are some signs on the wall but maybe it could do with some more. IIRC at one point there was an annoucement on the train as it pulled into Reading "Please exit to the right when leaving the train" but I may be dreaming it.

Dave


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 29, 2012, 11:50:47
How is the multi-story car park going to be linked to the station once the existing footbridge is demolished? Will there be a high level link off the new transit deck - although I didn't see any evidence of new piers last time I looked. 

I did try a search before posting this question without success - so sorry if it's been answered before.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2012, 11:57:16
How is the multi-story car park going to be linked to the station once the existing footbridge is demolished?

It isn't going to be linked at all, it will involve a ground level walk. 

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 29, 2012, 12:13:21
Thanks Paul, with the horrible weather outside there seem to be lots of us in the Coffee Shop to-day!

Just hope the ground level walk is enclosed (ie not just covered), else it wouldn't be very pleasant on a day like to-day.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on April 29, 2012, 13:23:38
Perhaps when it all settles down they might dedicate services to platforms, eg all the Waterloos on P5/P6 and all the Gatwick/Redhills on P4? Another idea might be to make sure the Waterloo trains leave immediately before the next one arrives.   

I though the idea was that the Gatwicks would use the underpass and use the North side of the station.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2012, 13:24:09
I think the problem is that the obvious route (from carpark to new northern entrance) crosses the road.  Although there's no through access to road traffic at the moment,  it is difficult to tell from the station planning drawings I have if that access is to be reinstated or not.  

I did read a while back that they intend to run the Heathrow coach link from a new location on the north side - it is quite possible that would have to approach the station between the car park and new northern entrance, although other possibilities exist.

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2012, 13:34:54
Perhaps when it all settles down they might dedicate services to platforms, eg all the Waterloos on P5/P6 and all the Gatwick/Redhills on P4? Another idea might be to make sure the Waterloo trains leave immediately before the next one arrives.   

I though the idea was that the Gatwicks would use the underpass and use the North side of the station.

That is a much discussed possibility, but I always read it as 'might use' rather than 'will use'.  It would only really be beneficial in conjunction with linking services 'across Reading',  ie there's little point in blocking relief side platforms with terminating trains just because you can, especially as P4 - P6 still have the capacity.  Some of the original options that were published predate the cancellation of the Airtrack scheme as well.

My personal view is that linking services might no longer be as likely as it was (at least for a few years), bearing in mind that the electrification policy has changed the stock type to be used on the suitable services west of Reading, and there is still a signifiicant electrical supply gap in the North Downs route.  Having said that there are other options for linking services, such as East West Rail but that's in what I would consider the medium term...

Paul


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: ellendune on April 29, 2012, 13:39:01
I think the problem is that the obvious route crosses the road.  Although there's no through access to road traffic at the moment,  it is difficult to tell from the station planning drawings I have if that access is to be reinstated or not.  

I did read a while back that they intend to run the Heathrow coach link from a new location on the north side - it is quite possible that would have to approach the station between the car park and new northern entrance, although other possibilities exist.

If a new pedestrian exit from the car park is made in the South West corner then it would be only a very short crossing of any road to the new North entrance.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: bobm on April 29, 2012, 13:56:01
Is it just a figment of my mind but weren't there the occasional through trains from Oxford to Gatwick about 10 years ago?


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2012, 14:05:04
I think the problem is that the obvious route crosses the road.  Although there's no through access to road traffic at the moment,  it is difficult to tell from the station planning drawings I have if that access is to be reinstated or not.  

I did read a while back that they intend to run the Heathrow coach link from a new location on the north side - it is quite possible that would have to approach the station between the car park and new northern entrance, although other possibilities exist.

If a new pedestrian exit from the car park is made in the South West corner then it would be only a very short crossing of any road to the new North entrance.

Yes, I was thinking more of the proposal that it should be fully enclosed, which would be no problem as far as either side of the road crossing, but would be unlikely to include the road.  The sort of set up they have at Southampton Airport, between station and concourse as it happens.

Paul 


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on April 29, 2012, 14:23:28
Is it just a figment of my mind but weren't there the occasional through trains from Oxford to Gatwick about 10 years ago?

There were - early morning to Gatwick and late evening back again.  Didn't really serve much of a market though as they were stoppers from Oxford.

I agree with Paul's comments regarding the potential use of the underpass.  It will also come in useful for the ECS Turbo movements between the Depot and Platforms 4/5/6, but under normal running I would expect that the only time Gatwick services will use anything other than 4/5/6 will be early morning and late evening as they do now.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: Jason on May 03, 2012, 22:01:30
Wherever you look at the moment things are happening:
Track is being laid west of the station, to the north of the main line.
The foundations for the new platform 6 are almost all excavated.
The steel core for the first of the supporting pylons on platform 8/9 is up
To the north, the main girders for the new deck are rapidly going in.
The northern entrance is rapidly taking shape, I took a couple of pics earlier this evening
http://i1147.photobucket.com/albums/o558/ticktock1232/0503a.jpg (http://i1147.photobucket.com/albums/o558/ticktock1232/0503a.jpg)
http://i1147.photobucket.com/albums/o558/ticktock1232/0503b.jpg (http://i1147.photobucket.com/albums/o558/ticktock1232/0503b.jpg)


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: JayMac on May 03, 2012, 22:09:56
And all being done around one of the busiest stations on the network.

Impressive.


Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
Post by: IndustryInsider on May 03, 2012, 22:41:30
    Here's a summary of next Easter's major engineering work whilst the new platforms are brought into use:

    Good Friday 29th March (00:30) to Tuesday 2nd April (04:00)

    • Heathrow Airport Junction <> Slough all lines closed
    • Maidenhead <> Didcot all lines closed
    • Reading - no trains apart from Platforms 4/5/6 and also Platform 2 (for Pilotman operated B&H/Basingstoke services only).

    HST are being diverted as they were Xmas 2010, i.e. and hourly Paddington to Swansea service via Chiltern Line and Oxford and an hourly Paddington to Bristol service via the same route.  West of England services running hourly from Waterloo via Basingstoke though should be 30-45 minutes quicker than in 2010 thanks to running on the main lines.

    Also Cheltenham's and Worcester's mostly starting at Didcot. Hourly from Reading to Bedwyn and Basingstoke (though the latter could be a XC service running though to Bournemouth).

    LTV services and HEx services forming a 15-minute interval service between Paddington and Hayes.  A 30-minute interval Turbo between Slough and Maidenhead and Windsor/Marlow/Henley service as normal.

    Waterloo<>Reading service ramped up to every 15-minutes all day as this will be the only Reading to Paddington train service.

    Buses covering all other routes as appropriate.


    Tuesday 2nd April (04:00) to Saturday 6th April (23:00)

    • Main Lines closed between Ruscombe and Tilehurst.
    • Reading Platform 2 open as in first possession.
    • New platform 12/13/14 and 15 also open (but all others closed).

    HSS services from Paddington to Bristol/Swansea largely unchanged though Cardiff off-peak services withdrawn.  West of England services diverted via Swindon and Westbury after Reading. Cheltenham's start/terminate at Swindon.

    LTV services between Reading and London thinned a little and other services thinned a little as well.


    Saturday 6th April (23:00) to Tuesday 9th April (04:00)

    • Maidenhead<>Didcot all lines closed
    • Reading<>Southcote Juntion all lines closed

    HSS services largely operating as per first possession (i.e. via Chilterns/Waterloo), and Cheltenham/Cotswold Line services starting at Didcot.

    Paddington to Maidenhead Turbo services and Bedwyn's running between Bedwyn/Westbury and Theale only.  Windsor/Henley/Marlow open as normal, but buses as appropriate on other routes between Maidenhead and Didcot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on May 03, 2012, 22:49:08
    Excellent summary of the situation next Easter, II. Thanks.  ;)

    From a purely selfish point of view, these engineering possessions won't affect me unduly, but I'm looking forward to bashing some unusual HST mileage again.  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 03, 2012, 22:51:36
    Roger Ford in Modern Railways suggested that the FGW franchise may be extended by a couple of weeks to cover the period of the Reading closure. I'm fairly sure new franchises normally start around the start of April and it perhaps isn't a good idea to have a change of management team half way through the blockade.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on May 03, 2012, 23:00:02
    Thanks for all the information, very helpful.

    (for Pilotman operated B&H/Basingstoke services only)
    Sorry, I don't understand what that means? Could you explain it please?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 03, 2012, 23:13:23
    A pilotman is the authority for a train movement to take place over a line which is usually operated only in one direction but is being used as a bi-directional line, but lacks the normal bi-directional signalling necessary for such movements. I presume at Reading only one track is available from Southcote Junction, on to the Basingstoke line to Reading. Trains will only be allowed to run along that section when the pilotman, a member of Network Rail staff wearing a pilotman armband I believe is on board the train. It's a similar principle to tokens on single tracks, where movements are only authorised when the driver has the token, a lump of wood or metal I believe, which will be released by the signalman at a signalbox. Several tokens can exist, for example at signalboxes at either end of a single line section but the interlocking will prevent more than one being released at one time, preventing more than one movement over a single line section.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 04, 2012, 10:35:35
    Not a bad summary of working by pilotmen by 'Southern Stag' there.  If anyone fancies some bedtime reading here's the full procedure:

    http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Rule_Book/Forms/Live_Documents.aspx?RootFolder=/Rule_Book/Rule%20Book%20Modules/P%20-%20Working%20by%20Pilotman&FolderCTID=0x01200060B274261602B94B84F5B3E1E95DE5C8 (http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Rule_Book/Forms/Live_Documents.aspx?RootFolder=/Rule_Book/Rule%20Book%20Modules/P%20-%20Working%20by%20Pilotman&FolderCTID=0x01200060B274261602B94B84F5B3E1E95DE5C8)

    And, yes, the franchise is being extended to cover until the end of the blockade.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 04, 2012, 12:01:06
    The steel core for the first of the supporting pylons on platform 8/9 is up
    To the north, the main girders for the new deck are rapidly going in.

    At one of the Network Rail briefings they mentioned that the transfer deck will be built in sections and then slid across the operational part of the station, ie what you see being assembled at the moment is not in its final position.  I'm fairly sure that the rusty looking steel girder sections visible on the sides of the support columns at various angles are 'temporary works' associated with the bridge slide.  I'd expect them to add weight at the north end of the deck and then extend it out over the tracks during a weekend closure of the lines some time over the summer. 

    I expect once the P8/P9 in situ castings are completed to match those on the other three islands, progress will be quite rapid - of course there is substantial work to be done to support the P7 end of the transfer deck, not much seems to get mentioned about progress behind the P7 hoardings...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 04, 2012, 12:08:13
    Waterloo<>Reading service ramped up to every 15-minutes all day as this will be the only Reading to Paddington train service.

    Reading to London perhaps?

    I wonder if this could see SWT running a few 12 car trains to make better use of the new platforms?  Using 450s (as they'd be in addition to the normal 458 operated service) would mean that Reading - Waterloo passengers could fill the rear unit on departure from Reading?

    Also, as they'd be running additional to the normal timetable, there'd be little need for any intermediate stops anyway.  Lack of overtaking opportunities would prevent a decent speed, but they could shift a lot of through passengers (ie end to end) that way.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 04, 2012, 12:52:22
    Waterloo<>Reading service ramped up to every 15-minutes all day as this will be the only Reading to Paddington train service.
    Reading to London perhaps?

    Indeed.  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: The SprinterMeister on May 04, 2012, 13:47:57
    I expect once the P8/P9 in situ castings are completed to match those on the other three islands, progress will be quite rapid - of course there is substantial work to be done to support the P7 end of the transfer deck, not much seems to get mentioned about progress behind the P7 hoardings...Paul

    Which is where the new booking office and entrance will be when its all completed. As I remember the grand plan, only the 'Three Guineas' / clock tower will be the only visible link with the past.

    At some point the up through line finishes and P7 moves across so that its face is up against where the through line currently is, not sure when that takes place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 04, 2012, 14:19:29
    A pilotman is the authority for a train movement to take place over a line which is usually operated only in one direction but is being used as a bi-directional line, but lacks the normal bi-directional signalling necessary for such movements. I presume at Reading only one track is available from Southcote Junction, on to the Basingstoke line to Reading.

    Ive just found this (late, I know) and it reminded me of an incident last year (I think!) where the 1736 Reading to Bradford OA (and then Temple Meads) suffered a failure in one of the emergency control systems (I think ATP kept applying the breaks incorrectly) at Reading West - literally next to the station.

    From memory the TM told us that she was in dialogue with Swindon trying to get approval to reverse run back to the station. I don't think this ever happened. From memory what did happen was an engineer from Reading West depot was ferried by Taxi to Reading West station where he was able to fix the issue and allow slow running west bound

    SOrry Mods - just realised this may not be relevant to this thread so feel happy to delete it if you think appropriate.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 04, 2012, 16:28:50

    Which is where the new booking office and entrance will be when its all completed. As I remember the grand plan, only the 'Three Guineas' / clock tower will be the only visible link with the past.

    I'm aware of what is happening, I just meant that there hasn't mean much discussion about what if any progress has been made so far behind the hoardings in that area, since the demolition was done.  A few of us seem to have been concentrating on the details of the Southern platforms, and the work in the vicinity of the Northern entance is also much discussed and photographed...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on May 04, 2012, 16:43:23
    I have a peek through the windows in the p7 hoarding from time to time, but all I can see at the moment is a very deep hole in the ground, which I think includes the remnants of the subway; and the new crane that has been installed there.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Btline on May 04, 2012, 17:46:36
    Are the Bristol trains running via Banbury? :o

    Shame Evergreen 3 isn't open! :'(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 04, 2012, 17:48:12
    Same as at Christmas 2010, booked to operate via Banbury and reverse there but when they are running late reversing at Aynho Junction will be possible.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Devon Big Bird on May 04, 2012, 21:45:54
    Is it just a figment of my mind but weren't there the occasional through trains from Oxford to Gatwick about 10 years ago?

    And of course the old (Table 50 for those who remember them) Inter-Regionals, through OXF to Brighton, Newhaven etc!



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 05, 2012, 10:35:19
    I remember catching a timetabled service (Saturdays only) from Reaing to Dover West Docks (I think, may have been Folkestone Harbour).  Third rail all the way - went via Staines, Latchmere no 3 Junction, Longhedge Junction, Wandsworth Road etc.  Obviously before the tunnel opened.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 05, 2012, 10:48:37
    A link to some more photos has appeared on:

    http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=91008804&postcount=145 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=91008804&postcount=145)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 05, 2012, 13:31:42
    Crikey :-\ In my 42 years in the S&T industry I must say that this is one of the most over the top signal gantries I have ever seen http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7130297711/in/set-72157629572744340/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 05, 2012, 14:25:16
    Crikey :-\ In my 42 years in the S&T industry I must say that this is one of the most over the top signal gantries I have ever seen http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7130297711/in/set-72157629572744340/

    There's quite a few built on a masssive scale like that on the WCML, but I can't think of any offhand that span such a width of platforms and tracks.  I wonder if the one at Reading east end will actually extend further north towards the car park once the ground level is raised to its final height?

    At some WCML locations the signal heads appear to be mounted within individual 'cages' that presumably allow safe access for maintenance purposes without taking the OHL power off?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: anthony215 on May 08, 2012, 18:58:36
    I am due to have a job interview with FGW at Newbury this Friday traveling there from south wales changing trains at Reading so I will be very interested in seing what the station looks like when I am there in person rather than just looking at pics on the internet.


    This may be slightly off topic but I have a question for the regular users of Reading but how easy is it chnaging trains particulary changing from the high speed services to the local services to Newbury?

    I'm asking as I have not used Reading for at least 2 years now and I have 12 minutes to change trains there on Friday morning (maybe less if there are delays on my hst which is due to arrive into Reading at 07:00)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 08, 2012, 19:14:07
    It's not great at the moment because the platforms are very narrow because of the hoarding up, 12 minutes should still be enough though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on May 08, 2012, 19:16:22
    Should be able to do it in 5 mins - the service from Swansea is booked into platform 8 and the 0712 to Newbury from platform 1.  Up the escalator/lift at the London end of 8 - over the footbridge.  Battle your way down the hoards on platform 7  ;D and Platform 1 is at the country end.  Getting out of coach E or F should save you a little on getting off platform 8.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: anthony215 on May 08, 2012, 19:17:06
    It's not great at the moment because the platforms are very narrow because of the hoarding up, 12 minutes should still be enough though.

    Ok thank you for the warning hopefully I will be able to find my way to get the 07:12 departure to Newbury otheriwse I will get the next one.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on May 08, 2012, 19:23:21
    I got totally caught out by the changes at Reading today.. I was changing on to the stopping Service back to Maidenhead and I'm sure I always used to get on on the right hand side platform as there is a platform both sides of that particular. Platform 16 however is to the left of the train now.. I made myself look a bit silly I think as I walked quite a way up the train before trying the door button and then realising the doors were open on the other side.. I must remember to pay attention in future.. Hopefully it made some of the other passengers chuckle though..::) ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on May 08, 2012, 19:30:59
    I was lucky the other Sunday - my train from Swindon came in on platform 7 - making it the shortest of walks to the Waterloo line services!  Saved me a half hour wait too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 08, 2012, 21:29:18
    I got totally caught out by the changes at Reading today.. I was changing on to the stopping Service back to Maidenhead and I'm sure I always used to get on on the right hand side platform as there is a platform both sides of that particular. Platform 16 however is to the left of the train now...

    Possibly clutching at straws here, I think!   ;D  Wasn't the operational side of P6 always on the north side for the last few years?  Which makes perfect sense for DMU dispatch, because the driver is on the left of the train? IIRC the former P7 was also opened on the left side (from the perspective of a departing train)?

    However you'd be right for P11, the old P10, on the north side of the up relief platform...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on May 08, 2012, 23:27:54
    Was always left hand side, as long as I can remember!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on May 08, 2012, 23:35:40
    Platform 16 (Old Platform 6) - has had doors released on the old Platform 8 side (now Platform 9) for as long as I can remember.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on May 09, 2012, 00:46:30
    Possibly clutching at straws here, I think!   ;D  Wasn't the operational side of P6 always on the north side for the last few years?  Which makes perfect sense for DMU dispatch, because the driver is on the left of the train?
    Also the platform edge the other side doesn't run the full length like the left hand side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on May 09, 2012, 06:45:46
    I got totally caught out by the changes at Reading today.. I was changing on to the stopping Service back to Maidenhead and I'm sure I always used to get on on the right hand side platform as there is a platform both sides of that particular. Platform 16 however is to the left of the train now.. I made myself look a bit silly I think as I walked quite a way up the train before trying the door button and then realising the doors were open on the other side.. I must remember to pay attention in future.. Hopefully it made some of the other passengers chuckle though..::) ::)
    Was always left hand side, as long as I can remember!

    If I recall correctly the north side only was introduced just before Turboisation around about 1990, there had been attempts before that on both on 6 and on 7 to limit board to the northside only but it was impossible with slam door stock when passenger wanted to disembark from the south side on arrival


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 09, 2012, 11:45:58
    It's a shame that for arrivals both sides of the doors can't be opened to speed up the flow of passengers a little.  What happens now is that whenever a full train arrives on Platform 16 everybody getting off bunches up by the narrow part of the platform alongside the escalator steps on Platform 9.  Any train then coming in behind from the London direction onto Platform 9 then has to face people jostling for position right to the edge of the platform - a clear safety risk.  Still, with Platform 16 not long for this world the problem will solve itself soon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 09, 2012, 15:20:39
    I am due to have a job interview with FGW at Newbury this Friday traveling there from south wales changing trains at Reading so I will be very interested in seing what the station looks like when I am there in person rather than just looking at pics on the internet.

    Antony215 - first of all good luck with the interview.

    If you havent been to Reading station for two years I am guessing you havent been there since the subway has been closed. So if you are coming up from the West you will need to go over the cross bridge at the Eastern end of the station and then make your way to the relevant platform which would be either P7 or P1 (but can be others).

    I reckon 12 minutes would be more than enough but as others have said space is limited on P7 and I would think about moving up towards the first class coaches as your service approaches Reading. That way you will be nearer the stairs for crossing over to P7/p1 etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on May 09, 2012, 17:24:37
    Platform 16 (Old Platform 6) - has had doors released on the old Platform 8 side (now Platform 9) for as long as I can remember.

    Yeah.. I wonder if it's a different platform I was thinking of as I was embarrassing myself yesterday... oh well... I didn't make the same mistake today  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: anthony215 on May 09, 2012, 20:19:35

    Antony215 - first of all good luck with the interview.

    If you havent been to Reading station for two years I am guessing you havent been there since the subway has been closed. So if you are coming up from the West you will need to go over the cross bridge at the Eastern end of the station and then make your way to the relevant platform which would be either P7 or P1 (but can be others).

    I reckon 12 minutes would be more than enough but as others have said space is limited on P7 and I would think about moving up towards the first class coaches as your service approaches Reading. That way you will be nearer the stairs for crossing over to P7/p1 etc.
    [/quote]

    Funny enough I never used the subway least time I was there when it was still open I am planning on getting the carriage next to the buffet car.
     I did originally plan on getting to Newbury by going via Westbury but the number of changes put me off especially since it would only take one of those connections to be late etc and my plans would be blown out of the water.

    Thank you for the best wishes as well and I hope my luck is with me on friday especially since this would be my 1st job in the railway industry and not something I had originally planned on doing.

    Hopefully all going well I should be in Newbury for 07:45 before getting a taxi to the Hilton Newbury centre,  where FGW are carrying out the interviews that said if I can get a bus  to somewhere close to the centre rather than a taxi I will do so. Does  anyone know the area?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 11, 2012, 11:33:10
    I've attached a couple of pictures snapped with the phone yesterday.

    One is taken through the hoarding on P8/P9 looking west, showing the London end concrete pedestal for the transfer deck.  As far as I can work out the footings must be at the side of the old subway?  I'm also assuming the section immediately in the foreground is the future well for the escalator machinery, which will need to be a couple of metres below platform surface level.

    The second shot is of the transfer deck steelwork, and shows the various steel brackets associated with sliding it into place across the station as i mentioned a few posts back.  You'll notice (much easier on the real thing of course!) that the support pads above the concrete 'arms' don't actually match up with the steelwork - this is also seen above the concrete block in the middle, which forms the lift shafts.

    Also noticeable between the tracks is a concrete section which was put in over Christmas/New Year, which forms part of the rebuilt subway roof.  It is effectively a short section of slab track, with the rail chairs cast into the deck.  Was this done in order to gain headroom below?

    Hope this is of interest.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 16, 2012, 15:26:37
    What looks like the realigned 'relief lines' west of the station are now being laid, presumably so that access to the new platforms 11-15 can be provided by next April and then the current relief lines can be lifted to allow room for the tracks and flyunder towards Southcote Junction.  I'd imagine there will be some temporary track arrangements at either end given the complex staged nature of the remodelling.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on May 16, 2012, 20:03:26
    Will be very interested to see how the phased opening works. Will all the platforms, new and upgraded existing ones, be brought into use before the flyover opens?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 16, 2012, 20:12:49
    That is still the plan, yes.  I think all the main platform work except P11 is supposed to finish before the western junctions work starts.

    There's an amended timetable on page 83 of the CP4 enhancements plan update for March 2012, the third file on this page:

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/publications/deliveryplan/Control-Period-4/Delivery-Plan-update-2012/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on May 16, 2012, 20:20:52
    Thanks, that's useful.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 18, 2012, 13:57:02
    Here's the latest edition of the staff news:

    (http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5238/7221156704_f233d8067a_b.jpg)


    (http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5448/7221157224_3392919de3_b.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 18, 2012, 14:58:29
    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.  Updated every 15 minutes throughout the working day you can view crystal clear sharp images from any date since the project began right up to the latest shot, or view all images in a time-lapse style which will no doubt feature on the NR website in time.

    There's a total of nine cameras based on three main worksites.  Go to www.lobstervision.tv and enter one of the following in the 'username' and 'password' box:

    For the new northern entrance and transfer deck:  nrreading01
    For the new western gateline by the Three Guineas: nrreading02
    For the new maintenance depot and associated buildings:  nrreading03

    Navigation to the individual cameras and still image or time-lapse options is on the page that will be displayed.  Up-to-the minute pictures for all of us.  Brilliant stuff!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 18, 2012, 16:04:25
    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.  Updated every 15 minutes throughout the working day you can view crystal clear sharp images from any date since the project began right up to the latest shot, or view all images in a time-lapse style which will no doubt feature on the NR website in time.

    There's a total of nine cameras based on three main worksites.  Go to www.lobstervision.tv and enter one of the following in the 'username' and 'password' box:

    For the new northern entrance and transfer deck:  nrreading01
    For the new western gateline by the Three Guineas: nrreading02
    For the new maintenance depot and associated buildings:  nrreading03

    Navigation to the individual cameras and still image or time-lapse options is on the page that will be displayed.  Up-to-the minute pictures for all of us.  Brilliant stuff!

    many thanks for this - I don't get to travel on the main line west out of Reading so it was good to watch.

    Thanks again


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 18, 2012, 19:56:46
    For those who don't know.  PTFE referred to in the newsletter is better known by the registered trade name Teflon (hope this does not offend the trade mark holder since I have acknowldged that it is a registered trade mark)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on May 18, 2012, 23:59:06
    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.

    Awesome news, I love watching time lapse stuff! Please pass on our thanks to whoever gave permission :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 21, 2012, 17:01:02
    Looks like today (viewing the lobstervision cam), that the first of the overhead catenary masts are being installed in the new depot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 25, 2012, 16:28:43
    New canopy of platforms 5 and 6 seemed to be coming along well today, unsurprisingly it looks identical to platform 4's canopy. The structure of the new transfer deck really does loom large above the station now as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 30, 2012, 06:41:42
    New canopy of platforms 5 and 6 seemed to be coming along well today, unsurprisingly it looks identical to platform 4's canopy. The structure of the new transfer deck really does loom large above the station now as well.

    Indeed SS this morning (Wednesday) even more canopy had been added and the supports for p6 "floor" seem to be coming along well. It will be good to have p6 open as p5 can become very congested.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 30, 2012, 19:00:21
    I saw this today as well.  It seemed to me that the canopy columns need to be installed before the decking can be installed on the bases.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 14, 2012, 12:03:46
    There's an exhibition of the project taking place at the station today and tomorrow:

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAILWAY-UPGRADES-GET-STATION-SHOWCASE-1ad2/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAILWAY-UPGRADES-GET-STATION-SHOWCASE-1ad2/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on June 14, 2012, 16:12:29
    There's an exhibition of the project taking place at the station today and tomorrow:

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAILWAY-UPGRADES-GET-STATION-SHOWCASE-1ad2/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-RAILWAY-UPGRADES-GET-STATION-SHOWCASE-1ad2/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx)

    Thanks for posting this. Sadly I will miss it as I am not travelling through Reading again until next week. It will be interesting to see how the decking on p6 has advanced by then - I suspect quite alot as they appeared to be starting it when I came through Wednesday PM.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on June 14, 2012, 16:17:12

    Thanks for posting this. Sadly I will miss it as I am not travelling through Reading again until next week. It will be interesting to see how the decking on p6 has advanced by then - I suspect quite alot as they appeared to be starting it when I came through Wednesday PM.

    Most of the precast base slabs seemed to be in place this morning, and the entrance to the emergency exit at the far end of the platforms is nearly complete. The latter is a very solid cast concrete structure considering it only has to provide shelter for the steps down to the subway, looks strong enough to be part of an air raid shelter!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on June 14, 2012, 16:23:18

    Most of the precast base slabs seemed to be in place this morning, and the entrance to the emergency exit at the far end of the platforms is nearly complete. The latter is a very solid cast concrete structure considering it only has to provide shelter for the steps down to the subway, looks strong enough to be part of an air raid shelter!

    Yes, I had noticed the "Solid" construction of the emergency exit when pulling into P5. Speaking as a frequent user of those platforms it will be nice to get some space back on P5/P6 as it gets cramped on P5 quite easily. Having said the FGW have done their best to hold back the "new" passengers until dis-embarking pax have left the platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on June 15, 2012, 23:09:55

    Good to have first class scheme and publicity. Usually it's one or the other.

    As an aside does anyone know why NR didn't opt for a simple modern overall roof or train shed, like at Leeds City?

    The platform canopies and escalator covers look very complicated

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 16, 2012, 21:19:14
    There is a new Reading Station Newsletter on Network Rail's site

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=30064781722 (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=30064781722)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 20, 2012, 21:45:05
    More photos on:

    http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=92550641&postcount=168 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=92550641&postcount=168)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 20, 2012, 21:50:22
    Also an article:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2115567_reading_station_development_reaches_crucial_phase (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2115567_reading_station_development_reaches_crucial_phase)


    Title: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on June 21, 2012, 21:48:46
    Those photographs are a bit out of date based on what I saw today.... :o


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 21, 2012, 21:53:30
    Just in case anyone missed this post earlier in the thread:


    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.  Updated every 15 minutes throughout the working day you can view crystal clear sharp images from any date since the project began right up to the latest shot, or view all images in a time-lapse style which will no doubt feature on the NR website in time.

    There's a total of nine cameras based on three main worksites.  Go to www.lobstervision.tv and enter one of the following in the 'username' and 'password' box:

    For the new northern entrance and transfer deck:  nrreading01
    For the new western gateline by the Three Guineas: nrreading02
    For the new maintenance depot and associated buildings:  nrreading03

    Navigation to the individual cameras and still image or time-lapse options is on the page that will be displayed.  Up-to-the minute pictures for all of us.  Brilliant stuff!


    Title: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on June 21, 2012, 22:20:25
    Here is a photograph of the Platform No.6 works taken at 1415 today 21 June 2012:

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1335815694/IMG_0386.JPG)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pbc2520 on June 27, 2012, 02:02:49
    Just in case anyone missed this post earlier in the thread:


    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.  Updated every 15 minutes throughout the working day you can view crystal clear sharp images from any date since the project began right up to the latest shot, or view all images in a time-lapse style which will no doubt feature on the NR website in time.

    There's a total of nine cameras based on three main worksites.  Go to www.lobstervision.tv and enter one of the following in the 'username' and 'password' box:

    For the new northern entrance and transfer deck:  nrreading01
    For the new western gateline by the Three Guineas: nrreading02
    For the new maintenance depot and associated buildings:  nrreading03

    Navigation to the individual cameras and still image or time-lapse options is on the page that will be displayed.  Up-to-the minute pictures for all of us.  Brilliant stuff!

    And there's now nrreading04 for some views inside and outside the new shed!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on June 27, 2012, 06:27:54
    Come on fellow FGW'ers...you are missing the major improvement to Reading station over the last 7 days...

    New washers/hand dryers in the gents on the main concourse!

    (Sorry Ladies, you will just have to take my word for this!)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Surrey 455 on June 27, 2012, 09:50:29
    New washers/hand dryers in the gents on the main concourse!
    They must have been put in on Mon/Tues as most of the previous ones were out of order on Sunday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 27, 2012, 10:14:09
    And there's now nrreading04 for some views inside and outside the new shed!

    Well spotted, sir!  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on June 27, 2012, 15:59:31
    I noticed this morning that the automatic ticket gates were out of action whilst "enhancement" work takes place. It seems that the manual wide gates are being replaced with automatic versions. Passengers were being funnelled through a few gates where cursory manual checks were being made.

    This will no doubt allow a further reduction in staffing levels. A few years ago the gates were well staffed with a permanent supervisor, who also monitored use of the lifts between the platforms and the unprotected side of the footbridge. In recent years, there has been little or no supervision and ticket checking on the manual gates is cursory at best.

    I guess that usage of this gateline will decrease dramatically when the new entrances open.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on June 27, 2012, 16:02:46
    I noticed this morning that the automatic ticket gates were out of action whilst "enhancement" work takes place. It seems that the manual wide gates are being replaced with automatic versions. Passengers were being funnelled through a few gates where cursory manual checks were being made.

    I think the word "cursory" is key here and I noted you repeated it again later in your post. In my experience there are certain gateline operatives who do the checks more thoroughly than others. I often get the feeling I could wave last weeks ticket at them and still be allowed through.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on June 27, 2012, 21:39:23
    I often get the feeling I could wave last weeks ticket at them and still be allowed through.

    I did that the other week at Maidenhead, the gate kept saying "Seek assistance" (as it does 9 times out of 10), I was on the phone at the time effing and blinding about it, waved it at the member of staff, he opened the gate and I went through. When I got to the platform to sort myself out and put the ticket away, I realised it was the old season ticket and I had pulled the wrong one out in my haste!

    I apologised to the gate machine for shouting at it, the next evening ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on June 27, 2012, 21:50:18
    I apologised to the gate machine for shouting at it, the next evening ;D

    Apologising to an inanimate object? I like it!

    I once walked into a lamppost whilst busy texting. I apologised immediately thinking I'd bumped into somebody, much to the amusement of the friend walking next to me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Btline on June 27, 2012, 22:11:19
    Wow - good to know the staff checked your ticket thoroughly! ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: devon_metro on June 27, 2012, 22:55:44
    Wow - good to know the staff checked your ticket thoroughly! ::)

    Presumably the commuter was shocked/stunned/aghast...etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on June 28, 2012, 06:47:11
    I apologised to the gate machine for shouting at it, the next evening ;D

    Apologising to an inanimate object? I like it!

    I once walked into a lamppost whilst busy texting. I apologised immediately thinking I'd bumped into somebody, much to the amusement of the friend walking next to me.

    I once apologised to a shop dummy I had bumped into in M&S........


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 02, 2012, 13:23:04
    More photos on:

    http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=92550641&postcount=168 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=92550641&postcount=168)

    I can answer the final question in that skyscrapercity post - the shape of the embankment east of the existing footbridge is temporary, it is to do with the way in which they build the retaining wall which will be tied back into the earthworks at various levels.  A similar technique was used east of the Vastern Rd bridge on the south side.  Basically the land within the retaining wall will be built up gradually in compacted layers, around the reinforcement supports behind the wall.

    (From one of the contractors doing that part of the civils work.)

    PS - I've attached a quick phone pic from this afternoon - you can see the idea, the black mesh reinforcement is run from between every few courses of blocks right across the fill material, which will be compacted over it.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 03, 2012, 18:00:49
    I was assured this afternoon that the transfer deck steelwork is supposed to start moving across the station during a possession tonight...

    (Also, the post above is updated to include a picture of the wall building procedure.)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 04, 2012, 15:36:11

    And there's now nrreading04 for some views inside and outside the new shed!


    ...and also now nrreading05 (only a camera 2 so far) for a view inline with the transfer deck from the south...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 04, 2012, 21:09:17
    More photos on http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=9 (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501601&page=9) (scroll down to the bottom)

    There is also now group on Flicker

    http://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/with/7390066106/#photo_7390066106 (http://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/with/7390066106/#photo_7390066106)

    Can anyone tell me whether the tunnel shown on this photo (from http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7390066106/in/pool-1945836@N21 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7390066106/in/pool-1945836@N21)) will be used?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pbc2520 on July 04, 2012, 21:46:43

    And there's now nrreading04 for some views inside and outside the new shed!


    ...and also now nrreading05 (only a camera 2 so far) for a view inline with the transfer deck from the south...

    Paul

    Excellent.. cameras are sprouting up everywhere!  Good view of an office ceiling from camera 1 :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 05, 2012, 07:57:09
    The transfer deck seems to have moved about 3 metres last night from what I couldee from the train on platform 8.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 05, 2012, 11:31:39

    Can anyone tell me whether the tunnel shown on this photo (from http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7390066106/in/pool-1945836@N21 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/7390066106/in/pool-1945836@N21)) will be used?


    I'd suggest not, because there is nowhere I can think of for the other end to appear, especially not on the south side.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 05, 2012, 11:43:30
    The transfer deck seems to have moved about 3 metres last night from what I couldee from the train on platform 8.

    Confirmed with the webcams too - the northern end of the structure is sitting just about in line with the concrete supports on P14/P15, so it has moved a quite significant distance.  The time lapse photos suggest it moved in about 90 minutes as far as I can work out.

    From what I heard on Tuesday there will be a period with it in an interim position with the south end somewhere over P8/P9 while more length is added to the north end, then the slide will be completed.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 05, 2012, 20:02:46
    ...and also now nrreading05 (only a camera 2 so far) for a view inline with the transfer deck from the south...

    Excellent.. cameras are sprouting up everywhere!  Good view of an office ceiling from camera 1 :)

    Progress!  Camera 1 on page 5 is now providing a useful view westward along the line of P10 - will show the transfer deck slide progress very clearly ...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 06, 2012, 07:47:57
    It moved again last night. The south end of the transfer deck is now centred over the supports on platforms 8/9. Is this as far as it will go for a while?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 06, 2012, 07:52:27
    I noticed that this morning on my way though. Ok, I wil admit this is a stupid question (and I havent yet had time to watch the stomo  video) but is it moving or bits added on the southern end? Logic tells me the latter given the sheer mass of it!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 06, 2012, 08:53:28
    Definately moving


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 06, 2012, 10:58:43
    I noticed that this morning on my way though. Ok, I wil admit this is a stupid question (and I havent yet had time to watch the stomo  video) but is it moving or bits added on the southern end? Logic tells me the latter given the sheer mass of it!

    Most definitely a 'bridge slide'.  The mechanics of how it all works (strand jacking) were described in detail in post #681 in this thread, back on page 46...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 06, 2012, 11:00:57
    Thanks Paul...must make time to read this in more detail (not easy on a mobile!) but IMHO it is certainly an impressive operation!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 06, 2012, 11:10:19
    It moved again last night. The south end of the transfer deck is now centred over the supports on platforms 8/9. Is this as far as it will go for a while?

    The post I just referred back to confirms that it will be held above P8/P9 for a while, the initial move was explained to be 28.5 metres.  The gap between the P8/P9 piers and the P7 abutment is rather longer than the distance they've just covered, so I assume they need more weight on the north end now to balance that out.

    In fact, having now looked at the webcam pictures, I'd estimate that the next gap is a bit longer than half the length of the existing structure - so it will have to be made longer for the procedure to work again, IYSWIM...

    I think this could also be done by adding significantly more temporary weight to the north end as a counterbalance, but it probably makes much more sense to spend a little more time adding the normal structural steel, as that only has to be done once.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 07, 2012, 14:41:49
    I noticed it moved a bit more last night!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 08, 2012, 12:40:28
    It also move again on saturday night another metre I think


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on July 08, 2012, 16:27:03
    BBC showed a video report of the bridge being moved yesterday. An NR spokesman said that the new footbridge would be completed earlier than planned as things had been progressing so well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 08, 2012, 18:37:00
    BBC internet report:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-18762712

    "Work on Reading rail bridge is completed"

    Er, don't they understand about phases of work?  If a BBC reporter had actually visited the site would he really write that?

    Paul

    PS Had reported my criticism last night via BBC website comments page - and give them their due thay have amended the article slightly to refer to a 'section'.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 08, 2012, 23:59:18
    Meanwhile Platform 6 is nearing completion and is scheduled to open on Thursday 12th July, when platform 5 will also be open along its full 12-car length of 268 metres.  So that'll be 3 12-car length platforms (for 20 metre carriages) with 3rd rail and permissive working to increase operational flexibility in time for the Olympics.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 09, 2012, 05:16:59
    Meanwhile Platform 6 is nearing completion and is scheduled to open on Thursday 12th July, when platform 5 will also be open along its full 12-car length of 268 metres.  So that'll be 3 12-car length platforms (for 20 metre carriages) with 3rd rail and permissive working to increase operational flexibility in time for the Olympics.

    That will be very welcome news to me! Hopefully when my homeward bound service pulls in a P4/P5 the "human" congestion will be alot less!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 09, 2012, 10:32:13
    Meanwhile Platform 6 is nearing completion and is scheduled to open on Thursday 12th July, when platform 5 will also be open along its full 12-car length of 268 metres. 

    Does that mean that the tubular steel fencing bolted down along P5 (beyond the 8 car length) has only been temporary during the works?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 09, 2012, 17:43:15
    Network Rail timelapse video of the transfer deck slide:

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-BRIDGE-GETS-THE-PUSH-1b03/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on July 09, 2012, 20:23:49
    Network Rail timelapse video of the transfer deck slide:

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/Press-Releases/READING-BRIDGE-GETS-THE-PUSH-1b03/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx

    Paul

    Now that is how to build a station


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 10, 2012, 07:57:07
    See below picture of transfer deck over p8 takeng this morning (10/7/2012)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - and a question
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 10, 2012, 20:53:10
    This evening on my journey home I noticed the cover was on the emergency exit at the east end of P6/p5. It's certainly all happening!

    Now there will soon be 3 platforms servicing the north downs/waterloo lines, will the trains be scheduled to make best use of platform space? E.g.,  Using P4 and P6 at the same time rather than p5/p6? Of course this does assume there will only ever be two trains platformed at anyone time which is probably not a true assumption.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on July 11, 2012, 11:03:40
    ....and the new Platform No.6 taken at 1515 yesterday 10 July 2012....

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1335815694/IMG_0044.JPG)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - and a question
    Post by: paul7575 on July 11, 2012, 18:54:13

    Now there will soon be 3 platforms servicing the north downs/waterloo lines, will the trains be scheduled to make best use of platform space? E.g.,  Using P4 and P6 at the same time rather than p5/p6? Of course this does assume there will only ever be two trains platformed at anyone time which is probably not a true assumption.

    I think the logical approach from a 'passenger standardisation' viewpoint (pending any unlikely new services such as Airtrack etc ::) ) might be to use P5/P6 for SWT, and P4 for FGW.

    Having said that signallers everywhere do seem to like injecting random changes to keep everyone, including passengers and staff, on their toes...

    This afternoon there was lots of NR brass about, jotting down in notebooks what still had to be done for tomorrow morning's reopening - should be OK though because P4 looked in a similar state the day before didn't it?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on July 11, 2012, 19:21:03
    On the top deck of a passing bus today and saw that what appears to be a brick tunnel near to the Vastern Road bridge is actually just an "alcove" about 10ft deep so no question of it going under the tracks. Looks like an old GWR storage bay.

    A secret passageway into Apex Plaza did seem quite exciting!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - and a question
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 11, 2012, 19:40:53
    I think the logical approach from a 'passenger standardisation' viewpoint (pending any unlikely new services such as Airtrack etc ::) ) might be to use P5/P6 for SWT, and P4 for FGW.

    Having said that signallers everywhere do seem to like injecting random changes to keep everyone, including passengers and staff, on their toes...

    This afternoon there was lots of NR brass about, jotting down in notebooks what still had to be done for tomorrow morning's reopening - should be OK though because P4 looked in a similar state the day before didn't it?

    Paul

    Thanks Paul for your reply. To a layman like me, where is the decision made as to which platform an incoming train will use when it comes up from Wokingham? Is it made at Reading or where ever (swindon?)?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on July 11, 2012, 19:49:46

    Thanks Paul for your reply. To a layman like me, where is the decision made as to which platform an incoming train will use when it comes up from Wokingham? Is it made at Reading or where ever (swindon?)?

    It will normally be the ARS (Automatic Route Setting) at Didcot (TV Siganlling Centre) that will route the train to the platform. The signalman will only intervene if there is out of course running etc.

    So any one train should in theory always use the same platform. How the platforms are used will depend on whoever programmes the ARSs.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 11, 2012, 19:59:20

    Thanks Paul for your reply. To a layman like me, where is the decision made as to which platform an incoming train will use when it comes up from Wokingham? Is it made at Reading or where ever (swindon?)?

    It will normally be the ARS (Automatic Route Setting) at Didcot (TV Siganlling Centre) that will route the train to the platform. The signalman will only intervene if there is out of course running etc.

    So any one train should in theory always use the same platform. How the platforms are used will depend on whoever programmes the ARSs.

    Thanks 8F - so how often are the routes reprogrammed - for example if there exactly the same services at the same times on two consectutive days would the routes need to be re-programmed?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 11, 2012, 21:24:15
    I was in Reading today and despite all the work going on it was pleasing to see that the station continues to function normally. Train despatch in this afternoon's peak was particularly good. My 1626 to Bristol TM was wheels turning dead on 16:26:00.

    The regular, as well as the additional, and very visible, FGW staff are doing an excellent job in somewhat difficult conditions. To make things worse today the scrolling displays were out of action, with a not very useful 'Welcome to Reading' being displayed. I people watched for a good 20 minutes before I caught my train home. Station staff were noticeably proactive in helping passengers - not always waiting to be asked - but rather, doing the asking themselves. One FGW chap near me on P7 was approaching passengers and asking about their destination, ensuring that they knew which was the right westbound service to catch by telling them, "It'll be the 1st/2nd/3rd service on this platform." He was also busy hustling people along the platform and telling them roughly where Standard Class or the coach with their booked seat would be. He was even helping people with their luggage.* All done with an engaging smile and courtesy. I made a note of this chap's name and will be emailing FGW with some praise.


    *I briefly worked for FGW through an employment agency in the booking hall area of Bristol Temple Meads in 2004, employed to assist passengers with information about their trains and to help prevent a large build up of folk in front of the screens near the gateline. I would also help folk with their luggage if asked and I occasionally offered. That is until one of the permanent staff told me to stop doing it. Apparently I wasn't insured to carry luggage or even just lift it onto a trolley and push said trolley. This guy told me that the RMT had decreed that such work was outside of a Customer Service Assistant's contract terms and until FGW paid extra and insured their platform and gateline staff to do 'portering' duties then such assistance should not be offered. Despite protests from one or two of the old guard (worried, I assume, that if I did the odd bit of portering, passenger would come to expect all staff to do it) I continued to help when asked. The tips were often quite generous!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 11, 2012, 21:53:59
    I think one of the things which "i am not partial to" at Reading is the continual announcments to members of the public on P7 asking them to "keep behind the yellow line, please".   My dislike is not about the fact FGW staff are making these announcments but I guess they are being made by someone on the platform through a radio mike to the PA system and uncomfortable levels of feedback are not unusual

    I must stress I totally understand the need for these annoucements at the moment space is limited on P7.

    To back up what BNM said, I also found the way the traffic flow from p5 was managed this afternoon was exceptionally good. on this occasion it wasn't down to one person but a team working as a - err- team!

    I won't be on my normal route tomorrow (Thursday) when P6 reopens but look forward to seeing the difference on Friday morning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 11, 2012, 22:09:06
    Thanks 8F - so how often are the routes reprogrammed - for example if there exactly the same services at the same times on two consectutive days would the routes need to be re-programmed?

    The theory is that between timetable change dates the base platforming information isn't altered - (apart from differences between weekday, Sat and Sun).  Clearly they have to stick a preferred platform in the database to make certain that the timetable works.  If you interrogate a site such as open train times, you'll find that your 'hhmm to where ever' shows the same platform every weekday - and if there are no perturbations to the daily operations, that is what ought to happen.

    If you try links like these (that will go stale eventually) you can wind the date/time on by amending the link where it shows the date or time, and you'll see the same cycle appears - although there are minor differences:

    http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG?day=11&month=7&time=1200&year=2012
    http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG?day=12&month=7&time=1200&year=2012
    http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG?day=13&month=7&time=1200&year=2012

    (At the time of writing P6 isn't shown at all, but that will change...)

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 12, 2012, 12:33:15
    Does that mean that the tubular steel fencing bolted down along P5 (beyond the 8 car length) has only been temporary during the works?

    Paul 

    That's answered, the tubular fencing has gone now.

    Call me picky ;D but I'm quite surprised they've used both a different style of station name boards to those on P4, and fitted them in a different position. Looks poor in comparison.

    I also think there's something cheap and nasty looking about the way all the P5 and P6 signs have just been clamped round the uprights.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on July 12, 2012, 12:57:01
    Platforms 4, 5 and 6 from a departing train at around 07:30 this morning:

    (http://www.wellho.net/pix/readytogo.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 13, 2012, 11:53:32
    The new platforms 12/13 and 14/15 along with what will be the new through platform 11 are now starting to take shape.  Also the roof covering of the lower section of the transfer deck is now being installed.  Best viewed on the lobstervision site's camera two on nrreading01.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on July 14, 2012, 22:00:21
    On the top deck of a passing bus today and saw that what appears to be a brick tunnel near to the Vastern Road bridge is actually just an "alcove" about 10ft deep so no question of it going under the tracks. Looks like an old GWR storage bay.

    A secret passageway into Apex Plaza did seem quite exciting!!

    With apologies for our apparent oversight, Jonty, may I now offer you a very warm welcome to the Coffee Shop forum? Chris ::) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 16, 2012, 07:54:31
    I know P6 has been handed back but is actually used at the moment? I know it's only been a week but I haven't yet seen a service pull in on it.

    Just to update my own post I did a check on open train times (see below) and no departures were listed from P6 on this enquiry. I am aware that platform alterations on p4/5/6 can happen at the last minute so this is not conclusive.

    http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG (http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: autotank on July 16, 2012, 09:43:54
    I saw a train using PLatform 6 on Saturday and have a photo to prove it!

    https://twitter.com/thebunkline/status/224138666707132416/photo/1

    Looks very impressive - well done all involved.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 16, 2012, 09:52:44
    I know P6 has been handed back but is actually used at the moment? I know it's only been a week but I haven't yet seen a service pull in on it.

    Just to update my own post I did a check on open train times (see below) and no departures were listed from P6 on this enquiry. I am aware that platform alterations on p4/5/6 can happen at the last minute so this is not conclusive.

    http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG (http://www.opentraintimes.com/location/RDG)

    I've been checking live departure boards (LDBs) and often no outgoing platform numbers are shown, whereas the corresponding arrivals do show where they are terminating.  I have a theory that this indicates that they are not sticking to the long term platforming (such as shown in 'opentraintimes' (which isn't a live feed BTW)).

    I've seen quite a few arrivals shown in LDBs as P6 over the weekend, but can't vouch for what actually happened to the actual services...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 16, 2012, 10:02:09
    Thanks for both of you for clearing this up

    Dave


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 16, 2012, 18:14:48
    Arrived at Reading tonight (From Reigate) on P5 with no train on P6...and there is so much space to exit the train and leave the platform now!

    Definate improvement!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on July 16, 2012, 20:08:49
    I agree, it is such a relief after months of overcrowding!

    But P6 looks like it hasn't had any trains all day- the CIS was just displaying "Welcome to Reading Station" this morning and this evening. Does anyone know if there is some track or signal problem preventing its use? Or are the unions demanding  a bonus before staff will use it?  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 16, 2012, 20:33:37
    Webcam Reading01 Camera 2 is showing the big mobile crane is back and large sections of steel for the next transfer deck section are going up...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Visoflex on July 17, 2012, 11:01:25
    The extra Southern platform (4) was built partly in anticipation of Heathrow Airtrack. With that project's cancellation in its original form, could it now be the case that there is too much platform capacity at least for the time being?  However, as you don't rebuild stations to cope with the current business, rather than for the future, then this capacity will be used up eventually,.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 17, 2012, 11:36:50
    I'm fairly sure that, if they felt only 2 platforms were to be routinely used, the track layout on the approach is such that the maximum flexibility would be gained by using 5 and 6, with 4 as the spare. 

    Of course there are plans to run more SWT services in the peaks in the 2014 timetable # which may result partly from the additional platform capacity gained.

    (# That would be after the available stock increases following the 10 car conversions of the 458s for the Windsor lines.)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 17, 2012, 18:45:08
    Photo of activity tonight at Reading station (taken about 17:30)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 18, 2012, 23:06:52
    Some timelapse on the FGW Reading Station Site

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/About-Us/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/About-Us/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on July 24, 2012, 10:07:40
    There seem to have been some further work being done on platform 6 over the last couple of days, some of the paving looks like it is being re-done. This might explain why the platform is still not in regular use.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 24, 2012, 10:11:11
    One thing I have noticed about the p5/p6 combination is that no matter how much space there is, passengers leaving services still manage to take up alot of space (and manage to get in my way!)

    But I guess that is just human nature :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Pedros on July 24, 2012, 10:37:40
    There also appears to be a few oddities with regards to the platform allocation with some trains too.  For example, I get the train into Reading from Guildford, which arrives at 17.54.  We're always held outside Reading waiting for a Waterloo bound train to leave the station (timetabled at 17.56)  We wait for it to pass and then trundle in to platform 5

    It seems odd that you have 3 platforms, yet trains are still being held outside the station. I should also say that there are no other trains in the platform when we arrive, so it can't be because of platform congestion.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on July 24, 2012, 10:40:58
    Yes, I am often on the same train, and was quite surprised to find we are still waiting outside the station at the same time and place as was the case in the days when there were only two platforms and a single track approach over the bridge!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on July 24, 2012, 10:43:47
    There also appears to be a few oddities with regards to the platform allocation with some trains too.  For example, I get the train into Reading from Guildford, which arrives at 17.54.  We're always held outside Reading waiting for a Waterloo bound train to leave the station (timetabled at 17.56)  We wait for it to pass and then trundle in to platform 5

    It seems odd that you have 3 platforms, yet trains are still being held outside the station. I should also say that there are no other trains in the platform when we arrive, so it can't be because of platform congestion.

    The Waterloo service is booked out at 1753


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 24, 2012, 10:46:57
    There also appears to be a few oddities with regards to the platform allocation with some trains too.  For example, I get the train into Reading from Guildford, which arrives at 17.54.  We're always held outside Reading waiting for a Waterloo bound train to leave the station (timetabled at 17.56)  We wait for it to pass and then trundle in to platform 5

    It seems odd that you have 3 platforms, yet trains are still being held outside the station. I should also say that there are no other trains in the platform when we arrive, so it can't be because of platform congestion.

    In the morning the 634 Reading to Gatwick seems to be scheduled for P4 by default but on a couple of occasions it has been switched from P4 to P5/P6 at the last minute so pax seem to have got into the habit of waiting at the end of P4/P5 until the train can be seen on the horizon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 24, 2012, 11:00:29
    Yes, I am often on the same train, and was quite surprised to find we are still waiting outside the station at the same time and place as was the case in the days when there were only two platforms and a single track approach over the bridge!

    To allow an arriving train into P4 while a departing train leaves P5 would require an additional length of 'third track' and at least two more sets of points. As installed, P4 is a simple branch to the left off the straight route into P5 but this is beyond the crossovers between up and down lines. 

    AFAICS the move you expect is going to be available in the opposite half hour, but only assuming the Waterloo train is leaving P6 directly onto the up line.

    Maybe the timetable will be altered in future to optimise the capabilities of the three platforms?

    The other point I've just remembered is that all the time P6 was out of use, the available track layout was effectively the same as the old set up prior to the alterations startimng, so any time in the last week that P6 was temporarily out of use it would also have had the same effect?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on July 24, 2012, 11:13:34
    Ah, of course. I was naively assuming that approaching trains go straight into P4 so wouldn't conflict with departures from P5.  Hopefully with P6 fully functional this will give a bit more flexibility, as presumably a P6 departure can take place simulaneously with a P4/5 arrival, assuming platforms are available?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 24, 2012, 11:24:10
    As far as I can work out yes - P6 departures are independent of both possible arrivals. 

    Track layouts at a multi-platform terminus (ie more than two) on a two track railway can get quite complicated - but without adding flyovers or underpasses there will always be certain moves that cause conflicts across the whole approach layout, either on arrival or departure.

    Paul     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 24, 2012, 12:12:08
    Here's an improvement at Reading station that Network Rail have kept very quiet - TGVs!! According to a street sign on a road near the station:

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/tgvreading.jpg)

    http://goo.gl/maps/nOol

     ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 24, 2012, 12:22:45
    Webcam nrreading01 (cameras 1 and 2) showing steelwork for canopy support have been put in on both the P12/13 and P14/15 islands overnight...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 24, 2012, 12:32:47
    Here's an improvement at Reading station that Network Rail have kept very quiet - TGVs!! According to a street sign on a road near the station:

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/tgvreading.jpg)

    http://goo.gl/maps/nOol

     ;D

    @BNM that is how rumours start!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 24, 2012, 18:27:29
    Will we see any suitable passenger facilities such as seating on Platforms 4/5/6 I wonder?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on July 24, 2012, 19:43:50
    Webcam nrreading01 (cameras 1 and 2) showing steelwork for canopy support have been put in on both the P12/13 and P14/15 islands overnight...

    Paul


    Why did it have to be done in the middle of the night?  Surely a possession is not required for the crane to work there?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 25, 2012, 10:24:42
    Perhaps it was considered safer as there would have been fewer workers on site, fewer lorries delivering stuff and so on?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 25, 2012, 11:08:49
    From a few random checks on the webcams I think there is normally a significant night shift activity Mon - Fri anyway, it's not likely to be associated with possession requirements.

    By the way, there's some canopy 'internal structure' appeared now on P14/15, and again it was being progressed in the small hours.  Might just be normal construction site working practices, spread everything out over 24 hours?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on July 30, 2012, 11:38:40
    Platform 6 still seems to be out of use. No visible work going on at the moment, though last week there seemed to be some repairs to uneven paving being done.  Is there some more fundamental problem? Given the previously discussed conflicts that occur when accessing 4 and 5 it seems odd to leave it with that pair being the ones that get used.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 30, 2012, 11:46:10
    Platform 6 still seems to be out of use. No visible work going on at the moment, though last week there seemed to be some repairs to uneven paving being done.  Is there some more fundamental problem? Given the previously discussed conflicts that occur when accessing 4 and 5 it seems odd to leave it with that pair being the ones that get used.

    I don't think it is true to say P6 is out of use as the North Downs trains I used on a frequent basis have pulled in there a couple of time but it certainly seems to be the case that it is not the "platform of preference". Certainly around about 615am there is normally an SWT service on P5 and the 634 Gatwick service is advertised as P4...and then sometimes get moved to P6 at the last minute.

    Due to overrunning engineering works at Theale last Friday I had to work from home but this morning I noticed the "2012 Olympic" destination signs were up. Did these go up on Friday?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 30, 2012, 12:34:51
    I asked a chap from the contractors on Friday, and he said the platform was definitely operationally available, but because they were still dealing with the snagging list the signallers were not routinely using it.  I don't think there's a fundamental problem.

    Live departure boards (arrivals option) showed it in use over the weekend though not this morning - which makes sense if the contractors aren't about on Sat afternoon and all day Sun?

    PS - webcam2 showing steelwork frame for the stairs at the P7 side of the transfer deck now.  Gives a good idea of the scale of the whole thing, the escalators will be between the stairs and the concrete wall that's soon to be cast...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 30, 2012, 13:49:26
    I've just been watching the various time-lapse from the lobstertv cams at Reading. It's quite amusing to see the pauses in work, which are obviously weekends, when cranes, trucks, diggers and mixers all appear to suddenly stop and the orange clad army of workers disappear. Rather like everything is catching its breath. Noting though that the purple flashes of FGW rolling stock continues without missing a beat!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 08, 2012, 13:37:34
    Here's a close-up of the progress on the new platforms 12/13 at Reading.  With platforms 14/15 in the background.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8423/7739430196_3c7934e988_c.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on August 08, 2012, 13:53:08
    it would be good if someone in the know could get some pictures of the existing reading west depot , inside and out,before it strikes the dust (Whenever that will be)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 16, 2012, 15:01:56
    Web Cam 1 (option 3) reveals the 'strand-jacking' equipment is being re-fitted to the new transfer deck side beams - so I expect the final phase of the slide across to platform 7 must be happening soon;  maybe at the weekend, or within the next week or so?

    Web Cam 2 (option 1) is also now showing some fairly major roof support steelwork has appeared in the vicinity of the new southern gateline, ie between the foot of the new transfer deck's staircase and the 'Three Guineas'.  There's a few large sections lying on the ground (next to the portakabins in the foreground) - I guess they're something to do with the overall curve of the roof in the area of what will effectively become the main entrance?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 20, 2012, 20:41:22
    There is activity around the bridge both (Cam 1 option3 & Cam 2 option 2) sides this evening with extra temporary lighting being installed.  Perhaps a slide tonight.

    Edit: Yes the bridge is now lit up and there is more activity.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: coachflyer on August 20, 2012, 23:53:01
    Just spoken to a couple of the workers and it is on the move.

    Due to move 12.5 m tonight with the rest tomorrow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on August 21, 2012, 08:25:53
    Just spoken to a couple of the workers and it is on the move.

    Due to move 12.5 m tonight with the rest tomorrow.

    Does that mean the southen end of the transfer deck will be in it's final placement by the end of today (Tuesday)?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 21, 2012, 10:44:18
    Just spoken to a couple of the workers and it is on the move.

    Due to move 12.5 m tonight with the rest tomorrow.

    Does that mean the southen end of the transfer deck will be in it's final placement by the end of today (Tuesday)?

    I expect 'tonight' in the above context meant overnight Mon/Tue, and the final few feet will be overnight Tue/Wed, so by tomorrow morning it should be in the final position.

    While I'm no expert, I'd imagine there are final support fittings and bearings to precisely align on the matching surfaces of the piers and the underside of the deck - it would make sense for there to be a final round of detailed adjustments at this stage. For a deck that size there'll have to be some fairly complex expansion joints, not just at the ends but where the stairs and escalators are mounted?

    Having succesfully predicted the move, my prediction for the next week is that fairly significant lengths of the platform side walls will be built at the east ends of P12/13 and P14/15.  There's been a general tidy up in that area, and the footings for the walls are being poured in sections.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on August 21, 2012, 14:25:57
    Yep it looks like the slide happened last night and the transfer deck now spans Platforms 7 & 8 as well.  To my untrained eye it looks like one further slide of a few metres may still be necessary?  I could well be wrong as it may be the case that some steelwork is simply missing and can now go up to bridge the gap.

    Thinking about what is yet to come:  I'm certainly enjoying seeing the new platforms come into shape.  I guess once they are completed and the rack laid we'll move on to the next stage of using the new platforms whilst the old platforms get closed for renovation.

    One question I do have is concerning the work around the east bridge.  The roads have been reduced to one lane so I'm taking it that there is soon to be some serious work going on in and around the bridge.  I take it it's connected with the new retaining wall to the north of the station and how that connects to the bridge?  Or is there some other bridge work required?

    Thanks,

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 21, 2012, 17:08:38
    Yep it looks like the slide happened last night and the transfer deck now spans Platforms 7 & 8 as well.  To my untrained eye it looks like one further slide of a few metres may still be necessary?  I could well be wrong as it may be the case that some steelwork is simply missing and can now go up to bridge the gap.

    The deck definitely has to slide a few metres yet, about 2 or 3 at the most.  You can see this on the webcam views by the way the gaps in the transfer deck framework that line up with the stairs and escalators aren't centralised over the relevant concrete piers yet.

    Regarding the east bridge, I assume you mean Vastern Rd bridge? 

    I thought the work to the bridge itself was reported complete last year, but there are fairly serious changes to the road markings and layout associated with the bus lanes for the new Northern entrance.  So could it be to do the changes shown in the diagram linked at the bottom of this web page, "New northern and southwest interchanges":

    http://www.reading.gov.uk/residents/parking-road-and-travel/reading-station-upgrade-town-centre-roadworks/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on August 21, 2012, 17:49:32
    Ah thanks for the link Paul - yep it looks like the road layout is going to change quite a bit.

    Cheers,

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on August 21, 2012, 23:54:08
    The signs that warned of the roadworks said delays for the next nine months and, looking at the plans, I can see why!

    Vastern road is now down to one lane in each direction and there are lane restrictions under the "east" bridge. It looks as though Reading road users are certainly going to suffer for the cause. Some of those road users are, of course, rail users on their way to and from the multi storey car park.

    It will be interesting to see how successful the new North side facilities are in attracting custom away from the South side. Its obvious that RBC are keen to see it succeed, and I hope it works.

    The new station will probably cost a great deal more to operate - more platforms, two major entrances, each with their own gateline and ticket office, I presume. And I do feel for the local station management - after years of coping with inadequate facilities, run down infrastructure and operational restrictions, come the new franchise, the new station will be managed by Network Rail. "Thanks a bunch!"

    That will also mean more staff - two sets of management - NR and the principle TOC will both have a station manager and duty managers, if it is anything like Paddington. Unless of course a deep alliance is put in place?

    Discuss.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 22, 2012, 08:43:38
    Transfer deck final movement took place either side of midnight last night, all done by about 0100 (from the web cams).

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 22, 2012, 10:15:10
    Obviously a lot's being going on, I'lll be at Reading station on Friday so must have a good look round.

    Where will the taxi rank be?  Will there be taxi ranks on both north and south side? The "new Northern and Southwest Interchanges" plan that Paul linked to doesn't appear to show any taxi ranks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: animationmilo on August 22, 2012, 10:30:44
    Is there any full block of the line like back in Christmas December 2010 again?

    Max


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 22, 2012, 10:38:43
    Yes, there is.  Next Easter and, I think, again in 2015.

    Easter 2013's alterations are summarised earlier in the thread:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.630 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.630)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 22, 2012, 12:04:15
    Obviously a lot's being going on, I'lll be at Reading station on Friday so must have a good look round.

    Where will the taxi rank be?  Will there be taxi ranks on both north and south side? The "new Northern and Southwest Interchanges" plan that Paul linked to doesn't appear to show any taxi ranks.

    If you view the plan at 100% various taxi rank, bus stop and 'drop off' road markings are shown both north and south - I thought it was reasonably self explanatory?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 22, 2012, 14:12:41
    Paul, thanks, I thought I'd carefully checked the (very informative) Drawing you lniked to, but now I've opened it at 125% I can see the taxi ranks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 24, 2012, 16:18:36
    Had a good look round to-day.  Platform 6 was in regular use - I saw 2 trains arrive & depart.  I walked under Vastern Road bridge and the lane restrictions referred to by others are almost all cleared.  Lots of activity on the new retaining wall and (very attractive) facing bricks on the north side against the access road for the multi-story car park.  Platforms 12/13 is progressing on the London side of the existing footbridge.  Trackwork is in place on the west side of the station for P's 12/13 and 14/15. A large crane was lifting metalwork for the new footbridge.

    From a contractor's point of view it must be a nice site to work on.  Plenty of space so many activities can happen in parallel, unlike, for example some of the sites along Oxford Street in London.

    And of course the station was heaving with Rock Festival people.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 25, 2012, 18:33:12
    I see from the cameras that the bridge was sat on its bearings last night.  If you look at Camera 2 option 1, zoom in on the end of the bridge and do a comparison with 24 hours previously it has quite clearly dropped down.

    They should now be able to finish the remaining gap, but also start fitting out the completed part (e.g. concrete on the floor, glazing the sides etc.)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 29, 2012, 17:45:51
    I wonder how they'll deal with the Padd-Rdg terminators after reconstruction when the east-facing bays are gone.  Up to now they've needed both 16 and 11 (though I think it's now closed or about to be)because of the long layover pattern - surely they wouldn't wish to tie up 2 of the new through platforms for 30 minutes in every hour in the future.

    Maybe they'll arrive in 12 or 13, drop off passengers, then go off (in the same direction) to the depot sidings, then come back into 14 or 15 for the trip back to Padd.   

    And maybe if/when Crossrail gets to Rdg they'll operate in the same way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on August 29, 2012, 18:27:29
    I wonder how they'll deal with the Padd-Rdg terminators after reconstruction when the east-facing bays are gone.  Up to now they've needed both 16 and 11 (though I think it's now closed or about to be)because of the long layover pattern - surely they wouldn't wish to tie up 2 of the new through platforms for 30 minutes in every hour in the future.

    Well I'd hope they'd extend them to Didcot or somewhere! Give somewhere an improved service, hopefully they'll gain enough stock to allow that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2012, 19:53:28
    I wonder how they'll deal with the Padd-Rdg terminators after reconstruction when the east-facing bays are gone.  Up to now they've needed both 16 and 11 (though I think it's now closed or about to be)because of the long layover pattern - surely they wouldn't wish to tie up 2 of the new through platforms for 30 minutes in every hour in the future.

    Maybe they'll arrive in 12 or 13, drop off passengers, then go off (in the same direction) to the depot sidings, then come back into 14 or 15 for the trip back to Padd.   

    And maybe if/when Crossrail gets to Rdg they'll operate in the same way.

    They could sit in the platform - all four relief platforms will be bi-directional, and signalled to allow permissive working.  So there's no fundamental reason why a terminator couldn't layover at one end of say P13 or P14, with a reversing XC service using the other end of the platform.  (At least until there's any serious train lengthening beyond the current lengths.)  I'm also assuming that if the same number of services as now are terminating initially, then the optimum use of the relief side is for P12 to be the down through, and P15 to be the normal up through - which is a bit like the way the Southampton layout works if you know it at all, albeit there's only four platforms there in total.

    This is why I've always been a bit suspicious of claims of massive increases in capacity across the board - clearly having 5 platforms for the main line side is much better, but if the relief side is seen as a straight replacement for the current P9, P10, P11 and P16, (and the closed west end bay previously P7) then it isn't vastly different.  The idea of trains running through the station to a siding could work as well though - as long as it doesn't introduce any other conflicts. The optimum would have been a reversing siding between the up and down lines - the sort of thing the underground tends to have.

    My research in the 'Engineering Access statement a few months ago had P11 remaining open until well after the 4 new platforms open, about August next year, so its eventual closure for conversion into a through platform (which will be on the up main line) shouldn't be an issue.  I believe P16 will last some while yet too.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 30, 2012, 15:11:27
    Paul, I agree with you regarding claimed capaciity increase on the reliefs, and your comparsion with Southampton.  Difference is though at Southampton there are plenty of terminators from both directions, so the centre platform capacity is well used.  At Reading FGW terminators come from Padd only, and the detailed colour coded track layout seems to show XC's using P's 3 and 7.  So relief line capacity is not efficiently used if Padd-Rdg terminators are sitting in a through platform on their own for 30 minutes.

    And don't forget that some freights used to go round the back of P10, so you could argue that the relief side has been reduced from 5 to 4 lines towards Padd. 

    I think perhaps that Padd-Rdg terminators will arrive in P13, then go to sidings before leaving from 14 or 15.

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on August 30, 2012, 15:48:08
    Time to introduce some Ban/Oxford to Reading shuttles, then they can sit the next to the Padd-Reading terminators and not waste the blocked platform ;)

    <rant>That way, next time there is a problem and we get dumped at Reading by the Oxford/Banbury stopper so that it can run empty non-stop to Oxford/Banbury to make up that oh-so precious time, us dumpees might be able to get home this side of Christmas.</rant>

    On a serious note, is there any reason such a service doesn't already exist (between Reading and Oxford/Banbury) ? I have always found it curious there is a service between Paddington and Reading, but not the other side, as it were.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 30, 2012, 16:15:21
    At Reading FGW terminators come from Padd only ...

    and from Newbury, and from Basingstoke, and from Gatwick, and from Redhill and from Shalford ...

    Granted, they come in at the sides of the fan at the moment, by with some flyovers they may come right into the middle


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on August 30, 2012, 16:49:53
    At Reading FGW terminators come from Padd only ...

    and from Newbury, and from Basingstoke, and from Gatwick, and from Redhill and from Shalford ...

    Granted, they come in at the sides of the fan at the moment, by with some flyovers they may come right into the middle

    Wasn't there talk that services from Gatwick and Redhill will use the relief line platforms using the underpass? Could these not interlink with the Reading to London services to reduce the length of time that the platform is blocked? I can see going to/from the depot frequently causing a pathing headache.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on August 30, 2012, 17:47:57
    Before Reading rebuild started I recall Mark telling CLPG that there could be an Oxford direct to Gatwick service using the Reading underpass when reopened.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on August 30, 2012, 21:10:18
    On a serious note, is there any reason such a service doesn't already exist (between Reading and Oxford/Banbury) ? I have always found it curious there is a service between Paddington and Reading, but not the other side, as it were.
    Just demand I presume. London-Reading there is a demand for 4tph but Reading-Oxford there is only the demand for 2 tph, so two London-Reading stoppers continue to Oxford, two turn around at Reading. If more Reading-Oxford services were introduced the logical thing would simply to extend the 2tph that currently terminate at Reading, so 4 stopping tph London-Oxford.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 31, 2012, 11:15:35
    ...and the detailed colour coded track layout seems to show XC's using P's 3 and 7. 

    I was at one of the public information sessions and the chap advised that the colour coding shouldn't be interpreted that way.  What it was meant to show was the majority service on that route, but not the only route a particular flow will use.  That diagram you refer to shows P7 in purple - which means 'Newburys' in the key, but obviously the light blue line towards it, and towards P8, also means XC can use it.  Then P3 is also marked in light blue suggesting use only by XC - which matches today's usage. 

    However if you look in particular at the XC services that terminate at Reading, they always used to layover in the old P7 west end bay, because that was the best place to be for arrival and departure using the relief side.  It is those terminating trains that will probably use a relief side platform, and the 'light blue' routes will be for the Bournemouth and Southampton services, which pass through...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 31, 2012, 19:06:35
    Perhaps the XC's terminating at Rdg used the old P7 because it was there and available, and thus it made sense for them to run RL to/from Didcot.  Maybe the new layout will provide an opportunity to run them ML and thus they would naturally stable in P3 or (the new) P7. 

    Presumably the new track layout was designed with an operating plan in mind - it would be ineteresting to see it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on August 31, 2012, 19:28:13
    Perhaps the XC's terminating at Rdg used the old P7 because it was there and available, and thus it made sense for them to run RL to/from Didcot.  Maybe the new layout will provide an opportunity to run them ML and thus they would naturally stable in P3 or (the new) P7. 

    Presumably the new track layout was designed with an operating plan in mind - it would be ineteresting to see it.

    I understand the new layout will have a fly under for XC services to get to the RL lines from P3 and P7, it makes sense for them to use the RLs to reduce conflicts at Didcot East Junction. Not to sure P7 would be used to terminate XC services I can see them being kept as now using P3, given P7 will be used by all services bound for the Reading West direction coming from the East.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 31, 2012, 20:28:53
    It's all a bit 'chicken and egg' anyway.  Clearly there are aspects of the existing timetable that were designed around the pre-rebuild layout. 

    So there's a risk of it being a waste of time us repeatedly trying to fit the existing timetable onto the new station layout, it may well be that the eventual timetable changes in all sorts of subtle ways (as 'Gordon' hints at above) - starting with the May 2013 version...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 31, 2012, 21:04:41
    Perhaps the XC's terminating at Rdg used the old P7 because it was there and available, and thus it made sense for them to run RL to/from Didcot.  Maybe the new layout will provide an opportunity to run them ML and thus they would naturally stable in P3 or (the new) P7. 

    Presumably the new track layout was designed with an operating plan in mind - it would be ineteresting to see it.

    I understand the new layout will have a fly under for XC services to get to the RL lines from P3 and P7, it makes sense for them to use the RLs to reduce conflicts at Didcot East Junction. Not to sure P7 would be used to terminate XC services I can see them being kept as now using P3, given P7 will be used by all services bound for the Reading West direction coming from the East. 

    The connecting line will be known as the 'Reading Festival Line' ;D

    It will allow connection from the West End Relief lines to Platforms 3,7 and 8 by diving under the Up and Down Main lines near the present Reading West Junction and also from the West End Main Lines by means of a flat junction. The new Reading West curve will also connect to the West End Relief lines by means of the same dive-under (which will thus carry three tracks).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 01, 2012, 09:16:25
    Perhaps the XC's terminating at Rdg used the old P7 because it was there and available, and thus it made sense for them to run RL to/from Didcot.  Maybe the new layout will provide an opportunity to run them ML and thus they would naturally stable in P3 or (the new) P7. 

    Presumably the new track layout was designed with an operating plan in mind - it would be ineteresting to see it.

    I understand the new layout will have a fly under for XC services to get to the RL lines from P3 and P7, it makes sense for them to use the RLs to reduce conflicts at Didcot East Junction. Not to sure P7 would be used to terminate XC services I can see them being kept as now using P3, given P7 will be used by all services bound for the Reading West direction coming from the East.
    I take your point re terminators not using P7 - more logical that terminators use P3 and through XC's (in both directions) using P7. 

    The point about XC's using RLs to avoid conflicts at Didcot East could equally be applied to fast Padd-Oxfords/Costwold line.  It is not a good use of the RL line capacity to have the XC's using them, as their journey time Rdg - Didcot East is so much less than the stoppers.  For example, the xx41 XC from Rdg-Birm etc is right behind the previous xx23 Rdg-Oxford stopper by Didcot East, which severely limits the pathing opportunities for northbound Freighliners etc (ie none can set off from Rdg between the xx23 and xx41).  To maximise total line capacity (ML and RL) between Rdg and Didcot it's far better to put the the fast trains on ML and slow trains on RL.  If you can visualise the old train planning graphs, lots of parallel lines is good, unparallel lines are bad, if you're trying to maximise line capacity.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on September 01, 2012, 10:04:13
    The point about XC's using RLs to avoid conflicts at Didcot East could equally be applied to fast Padd-Oxfords/Costwold line.  It is not a good use of the RL line capacity to have the XC's using them, as their journey time Rdg - Didcot East is so much less than the stoppers.  For example, the xx41 XC from Rdg-Birm etc is right behind the previous xx23 Rdg-Oxford stopper by Didcot East, which severely limits the pathing opportunities for northbound Freighliners etc (ie none can set off from Rdg between the xx23 and xx41).  To maximise total line capacity (ML and RL) between Rdg and Didcot it's far better to put the the fast trains on ML and slow trains on RL.  If you can visualise the old train planning graphs, lots of parallel lines is good, unparallel lines are bad, if you're trying to maximise line capacity.

    Those services do come from London though, so it makes sense to keep them on the fast lines, especially as they already fit into the First Great Western timetable on the MLs.

    Its worth noting that near enough all of XC services on a weekday depart at the same time as a service to Swansea/Cardiff, which use the MLs at xx11 and xx41, so when these operate XC have no choice but to use the SLs. On a saturday when the xx41 is not every hour, but every 2 hours to Cheltenham, XC do sometimes use the MLs to Didcot East.

    With the increase in services after the introduction of new trains on the MLs to/from Swindon at Didcot East, I can see that XC services being kept on the SLs throughout the week to keep conflict to a minimum at Didcot East, I'd imagine FGW will have priority at using the capacity for crossing over to go to Oxford there given they are the main service operator and services will generally already have a path on the FLs all the way from/to London.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 02, 2012, 16:21:01
    Worth mentioning that the HLOS stated an upgrade of the relief line speed from 100mph to 125mph between Reading and Didcot, so the disparity of running times between stoppers/freight and expresses will become even bigger.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 02, 2012, 18:58:38

    Its worth noting that near enough all of XC services on a weekday depart at the same time as a service to Swansea/Cardiff, which use the MLs at xx11 and xx41, so when these operate XC have no choice but to use the SLs. On a saturday when the xx41 is not every hour, but every 2 hours to Cheltenham, XC do sometimes use the MLs to Didcot East.

    With the increase in services after the introduction of new trains on the MLs to/from Swindon at Didcot East, I can see that XC services being kept on the SLs throughout the week to keep conflict to a minimum at Didcot East, I'd imagine FGW will have priority at using the capacity for crossing over to go to Oxford there given they are the main service operator and services will generally already have a path on the FLs all the way from/to London.

    Louis, the strategic decision as to whether to run the XC's on ML or RL between Reading and Didcot will be taken in the context of all the demands for paths, including the increasing freight flows from/to Southampton etc. which will need capacity on the RL's. The timings will follow that decison, not vice versa.

    And I don't know on what basis you assert that FGW get prioriity at Didcot East as they are the "main service operator".  Network Rail does not operate the network that way: if it did, XC would get a pretty raw deal as their trains trundle around the country.





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 02, 2012, 20:59:33
    Worth mentioning that the HLOS stated an upgrade of the relief line speed from 100mph to 125mph between Reading and Didcot, so the disparity of running times between stoppers/freight and expresses will become even bigger.

    Makes you wonder why they are upgrading RL's to 125 mph.  With Oxford stoppers currently at 2 per hour (and possibly increasing), and all the freights mainly at 75 mph, a 125mph path will really kill RL capacity.   Even with electrification Oxford stoppers will still need maybe 23 minutes from Reading to Didcot East.  Reading West J to Didoct East J is about 16 miles: with the new layout (75 mph) freights may do it in say 15 minutes.  At 125 mph you're looking at 7-8 minutes.  So every 125 mph path will take (at the very least) 2 freight paths and 3-4 stopper paths.

    So I can't believe they'll ever time (on a regular basis) a 125 mph path on the RLs.

    .... (as an afterthought) if the stoppers increased to 3 per hour ie every 20 minutes, you couldn't get a robust 125 mph path in between them unless you relied on very tight margins at one or both ends.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 16, 2012, 13:23:14
    There seems to be a large carne in use demolishing the covering for the steps down onto platform 10.  Are they replacing these with temporary steps so that they can finish the new platform 11? Or are they going to use the existing temporary steps on the other side?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 17, 2012, 12:10:30
    There seems to be a large carne in use demolishing the covering for the steps down onto platform 10

    As of this morning the covering had been replaced by the same temporary corrugated metal in use elsewhere in the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2012, 13:13:45
    Here's some more details of what to expect from the track layout after the Easter 2013 blockade.

    Five maps, showing the new layout running from west to east, complete with signal locations and routings

    The first one shows the layout at the Tilehurst end, and shows the temporary Whitehouse Junction which is where the current formation is slewed northwards, so that the main lines run roughly where the relief lines currently lie and the relief lines roughly where the old goods lines used to lie.  This will enable work to begin on the west end viaduct and other grade separation works.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8304/7999400283_7a7b574acb_b.jpg)





    The second one shows where the middle entrance to the new traincare depot will be located.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8038/7999401274_cfafb62a41_b.jpg)





    The third one is where things start to get interesting.  The new west end of the station with new crossovers and the new platforms 12/13/14 and 15.  Several things to note here:

    1) Platforms 1 and 2 remain unchanged.
    2) Platform 3 closes (temporarily?). 
    3) Platform 7 will take up its new role as the usual platform for services from London heading down the Berks & Hants to Bedwyn and the West Country (though platforms 8/9/10 could also see trains heading in that direction).
    4) Platform 8 changes from the current up main platform to the down main loop platform usually handling express trains heading for the west, and acting as a reserve platform, as well as quite possibly for some of the reversing XC services from/to the South Coast.
    5) Platform 9 becomes the down main platform which will be used for the majority of express services heading towards the Didcot direction.
    6) Platform 10 becomes the up main platform, with the trains that currently use platform 8.
    7) Platform 11 will close as a bay platform and then be reconstructed as a through platform after Easter 2013.  When it reopens it will become the up main loop platform.  Until that time, I should imagine that platform 9 will act as the 'reserve' up main platform, with the new relief platforms also used, but this is the only real temporary weakness in the new layout that I can see.
    8 ) Platform 12 opens and becomes the down relief platform
    9) Platform 13 opens and becomes the down relief loop platform.
    10) Platform 14 opens and becomes the up relief loop platform.
    11) Platform 15 opens and becomes the new up relief platform.
    12) I should imagine that platforms 12 and 15 will handle most of the through relief line services, with platforms 13 and 14 dealing with the London to Reading terminators and reversing XC services.
    13) This map also shows the new east end connection to the new depot.
    14) All through platforms are bi-directionally signalled, and you can deduct from the junction indicators that there is a lot of flexibility built into the system, with more to follow when platforms 3 and 11 reopen.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8300/7999400082_0bda0c45c6_b.jpg)





    Map 4 shows the east end of the station.  Again much to note:

    1) The underpass to the southern lines opens and is known (provisionally) as the 'up and down low level' line.  Trains can be routed from/to platforms 13/14 or 15 from this line.  Trains from/to the southern lines can also be routed from/to platforms 7/8 and 9 (and platform 10 at a later date) by using the current spur line as now, as well of course using the dedicated platforms 4/5 or 6.
    2) Trains from the down main and down relief can access any of the through platforms either by using the crossovers at Kennet Bridge Junction (where work to reconfigure has just started), or from signals located on 'Gantry 1' at the east end of the station.
    3) Future track, crossings and signal routings can be seen, including a less conflicting routing from platform 9 (in the up direction) to the up main.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8443/7999398770_a92eaa5833_b.jpg)





    The final map doesn't show much to be honest, though the junction indicators on the signals in the down direction show how all platforms can be accessed.

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8447/7999397514_7d03c7140d_b.jpg)


    All in all this just confirms what we'd been told would happen, but it demonstrates just how it will happen.  The amount of work that has gone in to produce such a flexible layout is commendable, not to mention the fact that it is and will be constructed whilst this station remains fully open.  So far, so good!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on September 18, 2012, 13:23:34
    It certainly looks very flexible and gets rid of the problem caused when a train is delayed or fails while standing at Platform 7 and the following train is being held at the signal just outside the station with nowhere to go.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2012, 13:38:45
    Yes, initially access will be available from the final signal on the down main to platforms 8 and 9, and eventually platform 10 as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on September 18, 2012, 15:20:15
    Thanks II - very interesting indeed. Two comments:

    I can't see any access from the relief platforms to the Westbury lines, so can't see how reversing XCs can use the reliefs. That would mean approaching on the up main and probably using platform 8. Services could cross to the relief lines at either Reading West or Didcot East junctions.

    Whilst services on the down main benefit from the extra platforms, its not so good on the up main. At present, up services regularly use 8, 9 and 10. I can't see 8 and 9 in the new layout being used much for up services - they would have to traverse a long section of the down main before reaching the crossovers at Kennet bridge, which would seriously impact on down services. So I reckon most will use platform 10, including up Westburys, for the same reason. This would suggest that Up main trains from Didcot will regularly be switched to the up relief at Tilehurst East junction, as this is the only way of accessing the relief platforms.

    Still good stuff though!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2012, 15:46:32
    Thanks II - very interesting indeed. Two comments:

    I can't see any access from the relief platforms to the Westbury lines, so can't see how reversing XCs can use the reliefs. That would mean approaching on the up main and probably using platform 8. Services could cross to the relief lines at either Reading West or Didcot East junctions.

    Whilst services on the down main benefit from the extra platforms, its not so good on the up main. At present, up services regularly use 8, 9 and 10. I can't see 8 and 9 in the new layout being used much for up services - they would have to traverse a long section of the down main before reaching the crossovers at Kennet bridge, which would seriously impact on down services. So I reckon most will use platform 10, including up Westburys, for the same reason. This would suggest that Up main trains from Didcot will regularly be switched to the up relief at Tilehurst East junction, as this is the only way of accessing the relief platforms.

    Yes, that's a very good point (or lack of points!) regarding the relief platforms being used for XC services.  There will presumably be that option after the final alterations have taken place, but until then it looks like XC's are most likely to use platform 8 - which in itself will block the up Westbury line, so that's another (temporary) restriction.

    And, yes, I can see the new relief line platforms also being used for some of the up main line services, much in the way that platforms 9 and 10 are currently used for the same purpose when 8 is occupied.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on September 18, 2012, 16:31:43
    Presumably up Westbury-London fast trains aren't actually going to use platform 8 much for now. Doing so would require them to go up the down main past the signal gantry, preventing any fast down services accessing platforms 7, 8 or 9.  For now I'd imagine where possible they'll cross to the up main at the west end of the station, using platform 10. That would leave platform 8 pretty much free for XC, down London-Westbury fast services can use 7 and down London-Didcot fast services can use 9.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on September 18, 2012, 17:15:48
    Not forgetting the Westbury - London stone trains and empty returns, of course. Routing options for these are much more restricted - they will have to use the main lines between Westbury Line Junction and Kennet Bridge. A wise old signaller in Reading panel once told me that they would always try to give the heavily loaded up trains a clear run through the area, even if it meant delaying Class 1s, because the time penalty for stopping and restarting was so huge - it would inevitably cause even greater delays.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on September 18, 2012, 17:42:16
    Wasn't it also a case that the length of them meant if they were stopped at one particular signal they brought the whole station area to a stand.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: old original on September 18, 2012, 17:52:05
    for info.. apparently the next big engineering works which will severely affect train services at Reading are next Easter -  Maunday Thursday to the following Tuesday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 18, 2012, 19:07:21
    II, thank you for posting these plans. Very interesting and a lot to absorb.

    The Goods lines between Tilehurst East Junction and Reading West Junction are shown as being taken out as from Easter 2013, which is not good for us who use Oxford stoppers. Once an up Freightliner etc leaves Didcot East, it's got nowhere to be looped until after Reading West Junction, so if it has to wait for a path across the ML's at Reading West Junction it'll be sitting on the URL with my Turbo behind it.

    Is Reading West Curve long enough to hold the longest Freights clear of Reading West J and Oxford Road J?  If not, regulation gets even more challenging.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: coachflyer on September 18, 2012, 20:00:33
    Just noticed that the Kennet Bridge loop will be made reversible.

    Could be where xc services with a layover are sent to free up space in the station??


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2012, 11:59:24
    for info.. apparently the next big engineering works which will severely affect train services at Reading are next Easter -  Maunday Thursday to the following Tuesday.

    Was posted earlier, (in #641) on page 43 of this thread:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.630

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2012, 12:46:17
    ... but until then it looks like XC's are most likely to use platform 8 - which in itself will block the up Westbury line, so that's another (temporary) restriction.

    The 2013 Engineering Access Statement (formerly RotR) shows a couple of months late next year (Sept to November) with P7 closed (that'll be for building it out towards P8 as there'll be only the two tracks there eventually); this seems to further reduce the platforming options for XC through services to/from the south coast. I suppose though that having P9 as the only down main available towards both Didcot and Newbury (ie while P8 is blocked by a reversing 'through' XC service) is effectively no worse than the current situation where P7 is effectively the only down main platform?

    AFAICS in the current timetable there are Southampton to Newcastle departures and Manchester to Bournemouth arrivals moving in the station area simultaneously - maybe their timetables will need tweaking a bit to separate them? 

    The P7 closure is immediately followed by P8 being reduced to a 5 car length temporarily, I'd assume this is while the P8 platform edging is upgraded?

    Paul   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 19, 2012, 13:21:32
    The 2013 Engineering Access Statement (formerly RotR) shows a couple of months late next year (Sept to November) with P7 closed (that'll be for building it out towards P8 as there'll be only the two tracks there eventually); this seems to further reduce the platforming options for XC through services to/from the south coast. I suppose though that having P9 as the only down main available towards both Didcot and Newbury (ie while P8 is blocked by a reversing 'through' XC service) is effectively no worse than the current situation where P7 is effectively the only down main platform?

    Could the temporary closure of P7 coincide with the re-opening of P11?  That could then be used for XC services (as well as other trains as the situation demands), and would give four platforms to cope with HSS/B&H and reversing XC services.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2012, 14:25:56
    The 2013 Engineering Access Statement (formerly RotR) shows a couple of months late next year (Sept to November) with P7 closed (that'll be for building it out towards P8 as there'll be only the two tracks there eventually); this seems to further reduce the platforming options for XC through services to/from the south coast. I suppose though that having P9 as the only down main available towards both Didcot and Newbury (ie while P8 is blocked by a reversing 'through' XC service) is effectively no worse than the current situation where P7 is effectively the only down main platform?

    Could the temporary closure of P7 coincide with the re-opening of P11?  That could then be used for XC services (as well as other trains as the situation demands), and would give four platforms to cope with HSS/B&H and reversing XC services.

    Ah yes, the 2013 EAS does have P11 back into use by the end of August (26th) so that would provide a further solution but I've just noticed that P10 closes immediately after P11 re-opens, so that won't help after all... 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 19, 2012, 14:44:35
    Darn!  Don't suppose you could provide a link to the 2013 EAS?  I can only find the 2012 one the NR website.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2012, 14:56:53
    Darn!  Don't suppose you could provide a link to the 2013 EAS?  I can only find the 2012 one the NR website.

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/Rules%20Of%20The%20Route/EASyearYY/70wrYY.pdf


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on September 20, 2012, 09:15:22
    Anyone know any more about what is happening with Platform 6? It continues to languish largely unused, except for a few peak services, but I've not seen any work taking place on or near it for some time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on September 20, 2012, 10:05:47
    Anyone know any more about what is happening with Platform 6? It continues to languish largely unused, except for a few peak services, but I've not seen any work taking place on or near it for some time.

    Certainly my experience regarding P6 (as a daily user) is it is rarely used not because it is undergoing work but because (in my mind) if P4 is in use then the logical place to park a second diagram is P5 and vice verca. I am guessing it is "simpler" in terms of routing to place an incoming service on p5 if p4 is busy but I don't have enough knowledge to understand if the incoming train routing to these platforms (at a local level) is manual or automatic.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on September 20, 2012, 10:43:04
    Maybe, though from previous discussions on this P4 and P5 share an approach track (just like the old 4a/4b used to), whereas a train could depart from P6 at the same time as one arrives at either of P4 or P5. I'm not sure what the benefit has been of the extra platform- other than a longer walk to P4 and more missed connections!

    Also, P4 gets rather crowded, which is more of a problem for North Downs trains, which arrive and then leave very quickly, so passengers wanting to board conflict with passengers alighting, than for Waterloo trains which lay over for half an hour so passenger flows are one way.  One approach would be to put Waterloo trains on P4 and P6, with North Downs on P5, benefiting from the greater space available on P5/P6.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 20, 2012, 11:39:58
    Darn!  Don't suppose you could provide a link to the 2013 EAS?  I can only find the 2012 one the NR website.

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/Rules%20Of%20The%20Route/EASyearYY/70wrYY.pdf

    Thanks, Paul.

    Maybe, though from previous discussions on this P4 and P5 share an approach track (just like the old 4a/4b used to), whereas a train could depart from P6 at the same time as one arrives at either of P4 or P5. I'm not sure what the benefit has been of the extra platform- other than a longer walk to P4 and more missed connections!

    The benefit will be that future timetables will be able to make use of the flexibility of the three platforms (the current timetable is configured around two platforms, because that's all there there was when it was introduced in May), and there will also be room for more and longer trains in the future.  There is also more scope to limit the delay damage of a failed train.  Platform 6 is used several times a day, but Platforms 4 and 5 cope with most of the current trains with no risk to the PPM figures.   If you have any comments about passenger crowding on Platform 4, then suggest your alternative workings to FGW, though as a passenger I would be far more annoyed at the lack of any seating on the new southern platforms!

    It is good news that the rebuild is giving more capacity than is currently needed, so that in the future Reading is able to cope.  I expect you'll find that when all the other platforms open there will be long periods off-peak when there is no train using, say, Platform 14, but that is far better than having to knock the whole lot down and rebuild it again in 15 years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on September 20, 2012, 12:25:07
    Also, P4 gets rather crowded, which is more of a problem for North Downs trains, which arrive and then leave very quickly, so passengers wanting to board conflict with passengers alighting, than for Waterloo trains which lay over for half an hour so passenger flows are one way.  One approach would be to put Waterloo trains on P4 and P6, with North Downs on P5, benefiting from the greater space available on P5/P6.
    I totally agree.

    The situation on the platforms which serves the North Downs line is not helped by the fact that passengers waiting to board the services will not give passengers leaving the service much space. Although this is a problem on most platforms it is made worse on p4/5/6 by the number of passengers with suitcases.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: danners on September 20, 2012, 18:13:11
    I drew those diagrams! :-D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on September 20, 2012, 18:57:16
    Excellent work, danners - and a warm welcome to the Coffee Shop forum!  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on September 20, 2012, 22:20:42
    Looking at timetables from December it appears that in the off-peak periods FGW services will use Platform 4, and SWT services 5 and 6.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on September 21, 2012, 17:30:07
    Tonight (Friday) I notice some blue markings have appeared on the west end of p7 they say "prop base" - anyone know what is about to happen? And they going to be temporary or new roof supports? It's certainly alll happening !


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Super Guard on September 22, 2012, 15:42:46
    A notice has gone up that says the stopping position for HSTs on Platform 8 will be bought further back due to the demolition of the roof canopy in due course.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on September 22, 2012, 20:27:00
    I do not use Reading as part of my normal travels, this morning I was heading West from plat 7 (the old 4) it was very congested with many waiting for a West Country train and others making their way to Plat 3 (the old 3  ;D ) for a Bournmouth I would hate to use it in the week day peaks


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 24, 2012, 11:57:05
    Tonight (Friday) I notice some blue markings have appeared on the west end of p7 they say "prop base" - anyone know what is about to happen? And they going to be temporary or new roof supports? It's certainly alll happening !

    In terms of timing I'd expect the canopy between current P7 and P3 to be removed as advance work some time before next Easter, as that is when P3 goes out of use and work starts to rebuild it.  At that time you'd probably expect P3 to be behind hoardings of a similar style to those elsewhere on the station, in which case the vertical supports are secured by large concrete blocks behind the hoardings.  Perhaps 'prop base' defines where these blocks are positioned?

    Alternatively, when they were demolishing the canopies alongside the old P7 west end bay (ie between the current P8 and P9), which were of similar construction, they surrounded the uprights with additional scaffolding support. AFAICT this was probably to reinforce the uprights if the roof load became unbalanced during demolition, but don't quote me.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on September 24, 2012, 12:01:09
    Many thanks Paul...your logic seems sound:)

    Those old platform numbers seem so long ago now!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 24, 2012, 13:10:34
    Tonight (Friday) I notice some blue markings have appeared on the west end of p7 they say "prop base" - anyone know what is about to happen? And they going to be temporary or new roof supports? It's certainly alll happening !

    As of this morning there were a number of upright girders sunk into the platform 1/2 concourse with the usual plastic safety surround. So it looks like the canopy there is about to go.

    In other news, major steelwork has been going up on the western side of the new transfer deck on platforms 8/9 and 10/11, presumably for the escalator housing.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 24, 2012, 20:15:59
    Are they looking to do the new canopy on 1/2 soon then?  If so is a closure likely or will they be doing it at night?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 26, 2012, 10:46:15
    Are they looking to do the new canopy on 1/2 soon then?  If so is a closure likely or will they be doing it at night?


    Comparison with the other end, (the old P4A/4B Southern platforms) would suggest that the old canopy removal can be done overnight, with no train cancellations.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 26, 2012, 10:59:20
    A couple of interesting milestones gleaned yesterday by quizzing one of the project management, (who made the mistake of standing still on the footbridge).   ;D

    There is a mid-October deadline for the 'civils' contractors to be off the new P12/13 and P14/15 islands east of the transfer deck, as that is when the east end track layout starts being installed by the trackwork contractor (Carillion).

    In February the section of the existing footbridge north of the P10/11 island will be taken out of use and removed.  Access to the station from the car-park and the north of the station area will be via the new public subway, which will open then.  (BTW I don't think it's been mentioned yet that at some time over the last few weeks the support girders under that footbridge section have been modified as they were in the way of the P14/15 construction.)

    A second tower crane will be installed in due course west of the new transfer deck, that will reduce the need for mobile crane movements on the site because access space will reduce when the platform islands start being built west of the transfer deck. 

    Paul   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 06, 2012, 20:09:10
    Soem information from Costain

    http://www.costain.com/news/news-releases/2012/10/4/bridge-move-at-reading-station.aspx (http://www.costain.com/news/news-releases/2012/10/4/bridge-move-at-reading-station.aspx)

    Quote
    4 October 2012

    The final stage of work on a new transfer deck at Reading Station is now underway, after what is believed to have been Great Western rail region^s first jacking into position of such a structure over a live railway.

    The transfer deck, part of Network Rail^s ^80million upgrade of the busy Berkshire station, will replace the existing passenger bridge across the tracks, providing considerably enhanced capacity and escalators down to the platforms.

    The second section of the bridge was constructed beside the station then moved into position over five nights in the period between the Olympic and Paralympic Games. The first section was launched before the Olympics got underway.

    Leading the team of around 30 personnel behind the bridge slide was Site Agent, Dave Forbes, who revealed that it took two nights to slide the second bridge section 18 metres over the tracks^then a further three nights to lower it just 100mm into its final position.

    The 1100-tonne section was lowered 25mm at a time in a series of steps to ensure it fitted exactly onto its bearings.

    ^A lot of surveying was necessary, together with a lot of work to get the bearings into the right position and get the section exactly level,^ he said.

    ^There were no real problems during the slide. This was a Great Western ^first^ in that it was carried out  over an operational railway and wasn^t done in possession [when rail services are suspended]. This demonstrated both Network Rail and First Great Western^s confidence in the team after the earlier bridge slide,^ commented Dave.

    Stage three of the deck is now being built in situ, between the two sections. ^From a structural point of view, we^re working towards completion at the end of October,^ said Dave. ^For fit-out and completion, we^re looking at early February 2013, with the bridge commissioned and open to the public by late March.^



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 08, 2012, 09:54:54
    Web cam 01/1 showing some of the first visible platform edge copings and tactile strips to be installed, along the P13 face - note the blue temporary fencing, I assume because the earlier safety fence stanchions bolted to the blockwork will have been removed.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 08, 2012, 16:55:47
    More and more overhead power cable supports are appearing in the new depot as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on October 08, 2012, 20:48:35
    There appears to be work going on south of the main line to mark out, board-off and clear a strip of land from the current depot to the other side of Cow lane. I assume this to be preparatory work for the main flyover...?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 08, 2012, 23:02:09
    There appears to be work going on south of the main line to mark out, board-off and clear a strip of land from the current depot to the other side of Cow lane. I assume this to be preparatory work for the main flyover...?

    Yup.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 09, 2012, 16:33:35
    Also not on webcam - all of the canopies east of the existing footbridge have been removed.
    One was feeling a little exposed this morning on platform 8


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 09, 2012, 19:29:37
    The tower crane on the south side has also gone today. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 10, 2012, 09:13:39
    Also not on webcam - all of the canopies east of the existing footbridge have been removed

    And there are signs at the end of platform 1/2 stating that the canopies there will be removed over the next month and refreshed over the next 12 months.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on October 15, 2012, 08:07:19
    Getting of the train on Platform 2 this morning I noticed that lights have now been placed on the temporary scaffolding. So I am expecting that the canopy removal on Platforms 1 & 2 is going to happen very soon.

    Also the new signal gantry at the end of the new platforms on the London side of the existing passenger bridge does not look as though it is wide enough to cover what will become Platform 15. Is the gantry going to be extended at a later date or is the signal for this platform be somewhere else?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 15, 2012, 08:32:08
    This morning I also noticed that roofing had been added to the stairs/escalators ramps down onto p8 etc. didn't have time to see if they had been added to p10 and associated platforms


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 15, 2012, 09:34:46
    Also the new signal gantry at the end of the new platforms on the London side of the existing passenger bridge does not look as though it is wide enough to cover what will become Platform 15. Is the gantry going to be extended at a later date or is the signal for this platform be somewhere else?

    Welcome to the forum.  If you look at the maps on page 55 of this thread, it looks as if the platform starting signals for Platforms 14 and 15 are not going to be fitted to the gantry, along with a couple of others in that vicinity.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 15, 2012, 17:12:35

    Welcome to the forum.  If you look at the maps on page 55 of this thread, it looks as if the platform starting signals for Platforms 14 and 15 are not going to be fitted to the gantry, along with a couple of others in that vicinity.

    Conventionally, the P15 up starting signal should be somewhere to the left of the tracks as seen by the driver, so 'over the wall' as it were.  That might be part of the reason why the gantry isn't being used, at least for P15.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on October 17, 2012, 09:24:20
    Looks like there is track being installed in the eastern fly-under. Only had a fleeting glimpse as I went by, will look more closely on my way back this evening.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on October 17, 2012, 09:27:40
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 17, 2012, 09:32:47
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?

    Well, once finished it will provide a second, less conflicting, route from the main Reading station to the Southern lines.  So in that respect I suppose it does.  Due to be commissioned next Easter along with the new platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 17, 2012, 13:10:42
    Looks like there is track being installed in the eastern fly-under. Only had a fleeting glimpse as I went by, will look more closely on my way back this evening.
    There is also a retaining structure being built on the ramp up on the north side, presumably as part of the transition from heavy plant access to track.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 17, 2012, 17:13:36
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?

    Highly unlikely IMHO, especially now that the relevant section of the GW is being electrified, but the North Downs line isn't. 

    We've discussed this point before, so I'll keep it short, but I think the Oxford - Gatwick idea was never actually likely anyway, because there are basically no Oxford - Reading services suitable for through working with the Reading - Gatwicks.  I don't think anyone was ever going to accept a reduction in Oxford - Paddington services just to provide rolling stock or paths for such a new route.

    I suggest that the typical use of the diveunder will be at start and end of service to get the stock to/from the depot across the layout without conflicting with the main lines.  Oh, and maybe that daily XC Guildford train...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on October 17, 2012, 18:10:19
    There was at least one Oxford to Gatwick service a few years back.  I think it left Oxford about 04:00 which probably filled two functions, getting stock onto the line and providing an early morning link to the airport.  However I think Paul7755 is right that in the current climate that is unlikely to return particularly as the first Gatwick service of the day is often started late and/or curtailed short because of engineering work.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on October 17, 2012, 18:55:42
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?

    Highly unlikely IMHO, especially now that the relevant section of the GW is being electrified, but the North Downs line isn't. 

    We've discussed this point before, so I'll keep it short, but I think the Oxford - Gatwick idea was never actually likely anyway, because there are basically no Oxford - Reading services suitable for through working with the Reading - Gatwicks.  I don't think anyone was ever going to accept a reduction in Oxford - Paddington services just to provide rolling stock or paths for such a new route.

    I suggest that the typical use of the diveunder will be at start and end of service to get the stock to/from the depot across the layout without conflicting with the main lines.  Oh, and maybe that daily XC Guildford train...

    Paul

    Especially as the Depot will be on the North side.

    It would allow for the Gatwick services to use the relief platforms thereby making cross platform connections easier


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on October 18, 2012, 10:06:16
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?


    From the vantage point that I have from looking out of my office window I can confirm that some track has been put down underneath the bridge.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 18, 2012, 10:21:51
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?


    From the vantage point that I have from looking out of my office window I can confirm that some track has been put down underneath the bridge.

    When I came into reading yesterday I thought the spur to the underpass had got longer - will try to have a look this pm


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 18, 2012, 19:56:52
    "track being installed in the eastern fly-under" Does this bring the propect of direct trains from Oxfordshire to Gatwick any closer?


    From the vantage point that I have from looking out of my office window I can confirm that some track has been put down underneath the bridge.

    When I came into reading yesterday I thought the spur to the underpass had got longer - will try to have a look this pm

    Get his afternoon it looks like the spur track from the north downs line now extends the length of the underpass (but it is difficult to tell for sure)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 18, 2012, 21:48:08
    There was at least one Oxford to Gatwick service a few years back.  I think it left Oxford about 04:00 which probably filled two functions, getting stock onto the line and providing an early morning link to the airport.

    It was at just gone 5am from Oxford with a return at roughly 10:30pm from Gatwick.  On Saturdays there were two trains with the 4am also going to Gatwick,instead of London, as it does (and did) in the week.

    Get his afternoon it looks like the spur track from the north downs line now extends the length of the underpass (but it is difficult to tell for sure)

    From what I can tell it goes to a point just under the bridge, with the ramp up to the station still being used for materials transfer.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 18, 2012, 22:22:30
    There is a new edition of Reading Station News (No 4) on the Network Rail website http://www.networkrail.co.uk/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=30064783758 (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=30064783758)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 19, 2012, 10:22:37
    From what I can tell it goes to a point just under the bridge, with the ramp up to the station still being used for materials transfer.

    AIUI from the conversation I mentioned earlier (in post #853 on page 57), the only deliveries from the east end now are all track related.  All station construction deliveries are now from the west end,  in fact I have an idea that there was a fairly large pile of ballast obstructing the route between Vastern Rd bridge and the rest of the worksite when I last looked?

    I see the new 'Reading News' mentioned above also confirms the date the old footbridge will start being demolished as the end of Feb.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on October 19, 2012, 10:24:40
    Yes, I could see a very large pile of ballast there yesterday evening.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 19, 2012, 11:12:27
    Just noticed on webcam 01/2 that a 'laser dozer' has appeared on the up relief trackbed alongside the new P15. 
    Update at 1300 geotextile fabric has been laid.
    Update at 1600 some ballast has also been put down.

    First signs I've seen of the track laying contractor in this area - although my aforementioned contact did say this would be happening about now.

    (Be good if they had a webcam looking towards London now, I reckon!)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on October 19, 2012, 12:20:58
    I noticed the underpass track protruding out from the north side of the underpass on my way in this morning.

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on October 19, 2012, 12:41:21
    I haven't a clue which direction is North or South in relation to where the underpass is, but this morning just after 8am there was sections of track piled up at the entrance of the underpass on the Tesco side :D I couldn't see if it was actually laid in the underpass itself though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on October 19, 2012, 13:35:42
    I haven't a clue which direction is North or South in relation to where the underpass is, but this morning just after 8am there was sections of track piled up at the entrance of the underpass on the Tesco side :D I couldn't see if it was actually laid in the underpass itself though.

    Tesco side is the North side or in railway speak the up side


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on October 22, 2012, 12:48:15
    Ah ha :) Many thanks Electric train!

    I couldn't see what progress had been made this morning, will try and have a peek tonight though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on October 23, 2012, 16:37:05
    Noticed today that the first lengths of the new canopy are in place on Platforms 8/9, around the footbridge. Feels a little less exposed now, but the London end of the platform is certainly a bit bare now all the canopies have gone.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on October 23, 2012, 19:48:52
    GetReading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2122708_neighbours_kept_awake_by_railway_works)
    Quote
    Neighbours kept awake by railway works

    Tenants in flats nearest to the site of all-night railway engineering works are furious they were not warned in advance.

    Neighbours in Luscinia View, Napier Road, Reading, say the constant blast of horns and steel-cutting through the night has made their lives a misery.

    Network Rail has apologised for failing to inform residents of the work, but warned there is more to come with late-night pile driving for the installation of overhead power lines.

    Eight tenants from the King^s Meadow flats made their views clear at a fractious meeting with Network Rail on Tuesday.

    They were furious about works which started overnight on Saturday, September 15, and continued until the early hours of Monday.

    The same pattern of works are due to continue every weekend until Christmas with unloading and compacting ballast, earthwork excavation, laying tracks, deliveries, plant movement and piling.

    One resident said: ^If you live next to it and your kids are crying because they can^t sleep, it^s very disturbing.

    ^When the siren goes off it^s a terrible noise like a fire alarm in the flats. I couldn^t work on Monday because of the noise overnight.^

    Another said: ^What we don^t get is that everybody else was notified of this work ^ the flats on the other side and in Kennet Walk ^ but we are closest to it and we didn^t get a letter through until September 29.^

    Ward councillor Tony Page, who attended the meeting, said: ^It^s most regrettable the original letter sent by Network Rail only went to a handful of people in the flats and it^s a cock-up that could have been avoided if Network Rail had contacted me before sending them.^

    Works on the tracks, as part of the ^850 million upgrade of the local rail network and Reading station, will take place until December 27 although Network Rail said there would be no noisy work carried out over Christmas.

    Eimear Fitzpatrick, Network Rail spokesman, said: ^Owing to a change in our programme, we were late informing the residents in Luscinia View of the work to upgrade the track, for which we apologise.^

    Network Rail has also promised to consult with residents over the timing of the piling works.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2012, 14:59:59
    Back around pages 54/55 or so we were discussing how the XC services would be platformed in the future, and in the interim 2013 layout.

    Seems this has occured to FGW as well, and I found a whole load of queries and NR responses on the NR 'Network Change' web pages.  Anyway, this is the plan for XC services in the 2013 interim layout:

    Quote
    FGW:
    Paragraph 4: Platform 3 out: Need to know where Cross Country goes;

    NR:
    The proposals are, subject to specific timetable requirements, as follows;
    Manchester ^ Bournemouth reverse in platform 8.
    Newcastle ^ Southampton use platform 10 and then 11 when open.
    Southampton ^ Newcastle use platform 9.
    Terminating services from Newcastle will use platform 13 or 14.
     

    This latter point is what I suggested a while back - will be interesting to see if it does turn out to be the normal practice in the completed layout...

    The whole letter is here, it has answers to various other FGW questions that may be of interest to someone:

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/nc%20g1%20rsar%20002/train%20operator%20replies/first%20great%20western/reply%20to%20fgw%20stage%20f%20ncn%2003102012.pdf (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/nc%20g1%20rsar%20002/train%20operator%20replies/first%20great%20western/reply%20to%20fgw%20stage%20f%20ncn%2003102012.pdf)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on October 24, 2012, 15:30:37
    I notice in the letter linked above Signal prefixs are shown as simply T and not TR - is it the plan that all signals will be redesignated?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2012, 15:45:04
    Going by those layout plans provided earlier (around page 55) it looks fairly systematic, in that TR seems to apply to all the re-controlled existing signals, and T to the brand new signals.  No doubt someone else can confirm what is planned, but it is quite possible that TR is an interim designation specifically to deal with the Christmas 2010 re-control.

    What might tend to confirm this theory is that the approaches to the three Southern platforms (which were resignalled already) also have 'T' designations...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on October 24, 2012, 18:30:30
    Back around pages 54/55 or so we were discussing how the XC services would be platformed in the future, and in the interim 2013 layout.

    Seems this has occured to FGW as well, and I found a whole load of queries and NR responses on the NR 'Network Change' web pages.  Anyway, this is the plan for XC services in the 2013 interim layout:

    Quote
    FGW:
    Paragraph 4: Platform 3 out: Need to know where Cross Country goes;

    NR:
    The proposals are, subject to specific timetable requirements, as follows;
    Manchester ^ Bournemouth reverse in platform 8.
    Newcastle ^ Southampton use platform 10 and then 11 when open.
    Southampton ^ Newcastle use platform 9.
    Terminating services from Newcastle will use platform 13 or 14.
     

    This latter point is what I suggested a while back - will be interesting to see if it does turn out to be the normal practice in the completed layout...

    The whole letter is here, it has answers to various other FGW questions that may be of interest to someone:

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/nc%20g1%20rsar%20002/train%20operator%20replies/first%20great%20western/reply%20to%20fgw%20stage%20f%20ncn%2003102012.pdf (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/nc%20g1%20rsar%20002/train%20operator%20replies/first%20great%20western/reply%20to%20fgw%20stage%20f%20ncn%2003102012.pdf)

    Paul

    Thanks Paul, very interesting, and I've read the letter too. I'm surprised there are so many issues from FGW re layout at this late stage in the Project.

    Incidentally, I hope they haven't forgotten to think about where Bournemouth- Manchester XC's go - though it could be their wording is a bit loose and they will be in P8 also.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on October 24, 2012, 19:25:17
    Apologies if this has already been dealt with but it's a real shame they have got rid of the old bay platform 7.

    This was/should be perfect for the XC trains and surely there is enough room to have kept it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2012, 19:41:39
    It wouldn't be well positioned in the new layout even if physically possible, because the platforms either side (new P8 and new P9) will both be down main platforms. 

    But the real reason it has been lost,  is that it was in the way of the stairs and escalators on the rebuilt island.  Don't forget the whole centre of gravity of the station including platform facilities such as waiting rooms, shops etc, has moved well to the west, there just isn't room for bays as well, as the transfer deck is roughly above where the old P7 buffer stops were...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on October 24, 2012, 20:17:25
    Thanks Paul.

    If new 7,8 and 9 are all down platforms doesn't that mean that the smaller platforms 10 and 11 will serve the up traffic to Paddington- seems a tad strange seeing as it's the busiest single route...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 24, 2012, 22:55:10
    If new 7,8 and 9 are all down platforms doesn't that mean that the smaller platforms 10 and 11 will serve the up traffic to Paddington- seems a tad strange seeing as it's the busiest single route...

    There's far less waiting time for passengers travelling to London who rarely find themselves on the platform for more than 10 minutes.  Sometime grannies heading for the West Country are in position hours in advance, so extra circulating space might not be a bad idea!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Not from Brighton on October 24, 2012, 23:14:05
    Despite not being a granny, I shall somehow miss loitering on (the old) platform 4 trying to guess which of my fellow loiterers were waiting for the same train as me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on October 25, 2012, 09:09:52
    Just heard more blockades around Easter FGW running Swindon Banbury (reverse) Padd via Foxhall

    West of England Westbury Salisbury Waterloo via Mainline swing link problem with HST solved!

    Might get a Padd Swindon return I've never done Foxhall


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 25, 2012, 10:09:04
    Just heard more blockades around Easter FGW running Swindon Banbury (reverse) Padd via Foxhall

    West of England Westbury Salisbury Waterloo via Mainline swing link problem with HST solved!

    More details of which were given earlier in this thread:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.630 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.630)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2012, 10:49:28
    West of England Westbury Salisbury Waterloo via Mainline swing link problem with HST solved!

    The 'swing link problem' is not solved, LSL bogies are still not allowed on the DC network.  The issue of running up the mainlines into Waterloo was a basic matter of gauging limitations through stations such as Wimbledon and Clapham Junction, and the suitability of the platforms on the main side at Waterloo.  Primarily, HST power cars were not allowed into any of the platforms on the main line side, so there was no point in sending the HSTs up that side of the route.  The crossovers in the Vauxhall area that allow moves from the up main into platforms 17-19 (the platforms used last time) cause too many conflicts with other services so are rarely used in the weekday timetable.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2012, 11:02:44
    Thanks Paul.

    If new 7,8 and 9 are all down platforms doesn't that mean that the smaller platforms 10 and 11 will serve the up traffic to Paddington- seems a tad strange seeing as it's the busiest single route...

    I think another way of looking at it is simply that the P8/P9 island is much wider than it needs to be.  Clearly there was no point in reducing its width if there was no essential requirement to, but that doesn't mean P10/P11 is necessarily too narrow.   The up main island is normally going to be dealing with a similar number of trains as the old P5 did on only one platform face, but now spread evenly over two faces, with access from the new footbridge (aka transfer deck) designed to fill the platform from both ends, rather than everyone standing around together.  Also, with trains towards London probably alternating from either side, there's much more space for people to wait in the middle of the platform, once away from the escalators, stairs and platform facilities.     

    I expect it will be fine.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on October 25, 2012, 20:04:09
    Understand that Paul - just seems odd that the 3 main platforms will all deal with down traffic. Would have been better IMHO for 8/9 to be split.

    Won't there also be conflicts for the fast up trains getting back onto the fast up line or are they also remodelling all the lines east of the station?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on October 25, 2012, 21:29:47
    Understand that Paul - just seems odd that the 3 main platforms will all deal with down traffic.
    When the station has been rebuilt Platforms 7/8/9 won't be the only main platforms any more. The main platform will probably be 8/9/10/11. 8 and 9 will handle the bulk of the fast services from London and 10 and 11 the bulk of the fast services to London, so they'll be the new main platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 26, 2012, 11:48:25
    Understand that Paul - just seems odd that the 3 main platforms will all deal with down traffic. Would have been better IMHO for 8/9 to be split.

    Won't there also be conflicts for the fast up trains getting back onto the fast up line or are they also remodelling all the lines east of the station?

    As the last post has explained, there won't be just 3 main platforms.  The overall track layout changes mean that there will be 4 platforms on the mains, with P7 also a down platform but basically dedicated to down trains from Paddington heading towards Newbury/Westbury. 

    So by next April the down fast will run through P9 and the up fast through P10.  P8 will be a loop off the down fast, and P11 a loop off the up fast; and yes, the position of all the lines east of the station will have to be seriously altered, because the fast line alignment will need to be a smooth curve approaching the gap between P9 and P10.  I expect the track slew will have to start somewhere around Kennet Bridge, or further east, and of course the reliefs will also have to move right over to the north of the formation as well, because they have to line up with P12-P15.

    Probably a good idea to have a look at the drawings on page 55 of this thread if you haven't already, they basically cover most of the east end changes, but bear in mind the west end changes that take place in 2013-15 will be even more complex and are not yet shown.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Zoe on October 26, 2012, 15:52:01
    The 'swing link problem' is not solved, LSL bogies are still not allowed on the DC network.  The issue of running up the mainlines into Waterloo was a basic matter of gauging limitations through stations such as Wimbledon and Clapham Junction, and the suitability of the platforms on the main side at Waterloo.  Primarily, HST power cars were not allowed into any of the platforms on the main line side, so there was no point in sending the HSTs up that side of the route.  The crossovers in the Vauxhall area that allow moves from the up main into platforms 17-19 (the platforms used last time) cause too many conflicts with other services so are rarely used in the weekday timetable.
    So has anything actually changed since 2010 or will the HSTs still be leaving the main line at Byfleet Junction?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 26, 2012, 16:38:53
    The 'swing link problem' is not solved, LSL bogies are still not allowed on the DC network.  The issue of running up the mainlines into Waterloo was a basic matter of gauging limitations through stations such as Wimbledon and Clapham Junction, and the suitability of the platforms on the main side at Waterloo.  Primarily, HST power cars were not allowed into any of the platforms on the main line side, so there was no point in sending the HSTs up that side of the route.  The crossovers in the Vauxhall area that allow moves from the up main into platforms 17-19 (the platforms used last time) cause too many conflicts with other services so are rarely used in the weekday timetable.
    So has anything actually changed since 2010 or will the HSTs still be leaving the main line at Byfleet Junction?

    All we have to go on is what was said by Industry Insider in post #639.  What I was emphasising is that the previous (2010) routeing via Byfleet, Virginia Water and the Windsor lines was not due to the type of swing links on the bogies, the presence of long swing link (LSL) bogies still bars a Mk3 coach set from the entire DC electrified area.
     
    Once you have your HST set made up of short swing link (SSL) bogied vehicles, it can then go on the DC network - but it is still subject to normal gauging restrictions.  This is believed to be a power car specific problem,  caused by equipment such as the crew access ladders.  Many platforms in the area, especially at Waterloo's main line side, have vertical faces with much reduced clearance below the copings, hence the speed restrictions through certain stations last time.

    I've had a look on NR's public website and there is no mention there of any recent route clearance for HSTs on the direct route to Waterloo - which of course doesn't mean nothing has happened.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Zoe on October 26, 2012, 16:59:29
    On the subject of Reading, is there any plan to grade separate Westbury Line Junction to allow trains from the Up Westbury to avoid conflicting with the Down Main?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 26, 2012, 17:15:19
    On the subject of Reading, is there any plan to grade separate Westbury Line Junction to allow trains from the Up Westbury to avoid conflicting with the Down Main?

    Yes - it is shown on the attachment to my earlier post #216 way back when.  Trains from the B&H will be able to reach P10 or P11 via the new underpass (the leftmost line shown in purple).  The west end grade separation does a lot more than just the western curve freight route.
     
    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 29, 2012, 17:28:33
    Tower crane being assembled west of the transfer deck this afternoon, difficult to see where exactly but it looks as though it is located on the site of the P12/P13 island?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on October 30, 2012, 07:58:12
    IIRC the canopy for Platforms 1 & 2 was supposed to be removed by the end of October. As there does not seem to be any evidence of this work starting yet it does not look as though this is going to be completed by the end of the month which is of course is tomorrow. So does anyone know when this is actually going to start?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 30, 2012, 10:41:18
    IIRC the canopy for Platforms 1 & 2 was supposed to be removed by the end of October. As there does not seem to be any evidence of this work starting yet it does not look as though this is going to be completed by the end of the month which is of course is tomorrow. So does anyone know when this is actually going to start?

    Some associated work has started I think - all those additional bracing supports on the P3/P7 side put in recently are there so that the P1/P2 canopy can be removed without the other canopy collapsing - you'll notice they are joined over the P2/P3 tracks?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 31, 2012, 11:32:57
    Tower crane being assembled west of the transfer deck this afternoon, difficult to see where exactly but it looks as though it is located on the site of the P12/P13 island?

    I saw a bit of blurb about this crane.  You have the location correct and it will have the ability to reach all the way over to Platform 1 with an 80m jib.  It will be in situ until March 2013.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 02, 2012, 11:28:52
    Blanked off signals have now started to be attached to 'Gantry 1' - the furthest east of the new gantries.  Also, it's nice to see that some seating has now been provided on Platforms 4/5/6.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 02, 2012, 11:39:27
    Ballast is being levelled between new platforms 13 and 14 at the moment.

    They seem to be making reasonable progress with the block paving on the P12/13 island now.  Yesterday afternoon they spent a good few hours 'repositioning by a couple of inches' what they'd already laid in the middle section between the canopy and the escape stairs.  This can be seen on the relevant webcam over the afternoon period.

    Measure twice cut once is the old saying...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pbc2520 on November 02, 2012, 22:08:38
    They seem to be making reasonable progress with the block paving on the P12/13 island now.  Yesterday afternoon they spent a good few hours 'repositioning by a couple of inches' what they'd already laid in the middle section between the canopy and the escape stairs.  This can be seen on the relevant webcam over the afternoon period.

    Measure twice cut once is the old saying...
    Whilst stuck at home with a cold, I noticed that little episode.  Glad to see there's some quality control.  Part of me wondered whether that was intentional - get the bricks down quickly to make sure they don't sink, then shuffle into position.

    Well, what an exciting day that was... :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 04, 2012, 13:39:16
    Those of you who use platforms 1 and 2 may wish to take an umbrella in future.  Parts of the canopy roof are now missing!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 04, 2012, 14:29:47
    I notice a lot of activity (even on Sundays) to finish the facade of the new South West entrance building.  Does this have to be handed over to another contractor soon to work on the road? Otherwise when the subway reopens people will need a ladder to get out!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on November 04, 2012, 22:24:40
    Hoping to see the changes at Reading on Saturday, but in the meantime, can someone post the links to the webcams please, done several seaches to no avail. Thanks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on November 04, 2012, 22:25:49
    Welcome to the forum Justdarkbeer... And.. hopefully someone will be able to easily post the links that you ask for :-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 04, 2012, 22:35:08
    The up to date cameras are:

    nrreading01
    nrreading02
    nrreading04

    Hope this helps

    I'm delighted to say I've got permission to share with you all the official time-lapse photographs of the remodelling which are absolutely fantastic.  Updated every 15 minutes throughout the working day you can view crystal clear sharp images from any date since the project began right up to the latest shot, or view all images in a time-lapse style which will no doubt feature on the NR website in time.

    There's a total of nine cameras based on three main worksites.  Go to www.lobstervision.tv and enter one of the following in the 'username' and 'password' box:

    For the new northern entrance and transfer deck:  nrreading01
    For the new western gateline by the Three Guineas: nrreading02
    For the new maintenance depot and associated buildings:  nrreading03

    Navigation to the individual cameras and still image or time-lapse options is on the page that will be displayed.  Up-to-the minute pictures for all of us.  Brilliant stuff!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on November 05, 2012, 08:08:10
    Those of you who use platforms 1 and 2 may wish to take an umbrella in future.  Parts of the canopy roof are now missing!

    Indeed they have. Got off the train on Platform 2 this morning thinking that nothing had been done again. But then looked up and saw that they have started to take the canopy off. So I expecting that next Monday the rest of it will have been removed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 05, 2012, 16:52:52
    Blanked off signals have now started to be attached to 'Gantry 1' - the furthest east of the new gantries.  Also, it's nice to see that some seating has now been provided on Platforms 4/5/6.

    A few signals have also appeared on gantry 2, at the London end of the station.  I think (from the diagram on page 55) they are probably T1682 and T1686, both suspended from the gantry, and T1692, which seems unusually to be positioned on the gantry supports, inline with the end of the future P12?

    PS Added a couple of phone pics below.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 06, 2012, 13:36:13
    I notice a lot of activity (even on Sundays) to finish the facade of the new South West entrance building.  Does this have to be handed over to another contractor soon to work on the road? Otherwise when the subway reopens people will need a ladder to get out!

    That could be the case, as the Reading BC controlled area has started to be cleared now, they are presently demolishing the concrete base that the tower crane was standing on. 

    I wonder how far into the ground those sort of crane foundation pads go - never thought of it before, but presumably it isn't just 'sat there'?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on November 06, 2012, 13:41:15
    I'm pretty sure it sat on concrete piles that were bored at the same time as the other piling was going on for the new entrance and bridge supports. Presumably  piles for the relocated crane on the P12/13 island were bored at the same time as the other piling previously done there, in readiness for its current use?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 06, 2012, 14:03:35
    That would be the obvious solution - so that pad would have been cast around the top of a load of piles, and they'll just have to be either dug out or left in the ground, depending on the finished level in that area. 

    The drawing showing the road layout outside the station (that I posted a link to a few weeks ago in #788) suggests there will be various ramps and steps in that area to get down to the subway floor level, which I believe is approximately true 'ground level' as seen from Caversham Rd.  The station forecourt is probably about 3-4m higher than the subway?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on November 07, 2012, 10:36:53
    This morning on departure from Reading towards London I looked at the work being done on the ramp up from the underpass tunnel on the north side and there are now sleepers which are yet to be positioned correctly and track laying on top to be attached.

    I guess once that is done the rest of the track will start to be laid for the east side of the new platforms?

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on November 08, 2012, 11:59:18
    I see that glazing elements are now being fitted to the transfer deck. At present these are only over platform 8 on the west side.
    They are just about visible on cam 02, tab 2


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 08, 2012, 16:06:22
    Rather surprised to see signal T1682, at the London end of P7, is hanging by a strut off Gantry 2  with no lateral bracing (although it has a longitudinal brace behind it).  So it will be susceptible to lateral movement from wind etc. and consequential risk of fatigue failure. I hope a bracing strut arrives soon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 08, 2012, 17:05:54
    It does look a bit of a work in progress.  But I also think that it might be a temporary job, because the platform 7 track will not remain in that position.  I expect we won't see the full 'cage' built around that signal, because it is likely to be moved before the OHLE is put up, unlike the example further over above the P10 running line?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 08, 2012, 17:29:24
    Maybe temporary indeed, but even so...   Perhaps the existing P7 up starter has to be moved in the short term, so sticking it on the gantry seems a logical move.  But I still want to see a bracing strut!

    It's diiifcult to visualise the final positions of the platform faces for P7 - P10 looking down from the footbridge, but I think they may all be moving.  So maybe the signal above P10 may need to be moved if/when P10 gets realigned, and the wires go up. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 08, 2012, 18:15:03
    Noticed today whilst passing through a distinct line of OHLE uprights to the west of the station on the north side of the tracks...looked like almost a complete row going west towards the new train shed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 09, 2012, 09:39:36
    It's diiifcult to visualise the final positions of the platform faces for P7 - P10 looking down from the footbridge, but I think they may all be moving.  So maybe the signal above P10 may need to be moved if/when P10 gets realigned, and the wires go up. 

    Yes, when I mentioned the P10 line I neglected to include the point that the new signal seems to be positioned above and to the left of the future position of the P10 track, which wll be slewed out at the east end of the station, ie extended in line with the current temporary platform.  You can see the blockwork beyond the country end of the platform which denotes the eventual alignment.

    In the case of the P8 and P9 island though, there is no fundamental change to the future position in terms of north/south alignment on the site.  Firstly I was told at one of the very early briefing sessions that they would only be having their surfaces and edge copings updated in situ, but this is also confirmed for all practical purposes by the existence of the new canopies sitting vertically above the existing platform edges.  The operational lengths of the platforms may shift slightly though, meaning that there may be areas out of use at the London end, because it is intended that the HST (and presumably IEP) stopping position will be equalised either side of the new 'transfer deck'.  Will be interesting to see if the London end of the island's surface is overhauled to the same standard as the rest - in fact might it be slightly shortened?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on November 09, 2012, 13:23:26
    .... and stood on Platform No.8 under the new transfer deck yesterday morning it suddenly hit me what a huge station its going to be when its all finished :o


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on November 12, 2012, 18:06:36
    Track now properly laid up the ramp to the east of the station on the north side.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on November 13, 2012, 13:53:59
    Various sections of the P1/P2 canopy 'selectively removed' leaving the cross struts to P3/P7 in place still.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 14, 2012, 12:40:10
    Thinking back to last weeks discussion about the road area outside the new southern concourse, webcam 2/2 is showing this morning (13th about 10-12 am) that they've broken through into the void space below the existing road surface.  We'll probably get an idea over the next few days how it will look when fully removed and lowered to ground level, as they probably won't take long to get rid of the waste...

    Track now properly laid up the ramp to the east of the station on the north side.

    ...and a Kirov rail crane practically alongside the multi story carpark just now - visible in background of above webcam. 

    All be over by Christmas...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 15, 2012, 15:17:29
    I was looking down on the new islands and it does seem the canopied areas are very short.  Vast tracts of  the London ends are uncovered.  You come down the escalator, theres's a short canopy, then nothing. The block paving has left no spaces for any columns for canopies that haven't appeared yet.

    Even, as Paul says, the stopping position for trains is centred under the new footbridge, there seems to me that there will be quite a bit of a long turbo, an HST or IEP out in the open.  Does FGW expect its 1st class passengers to wait in the rain, or to huddle under the canopy and make a run for it when the train arrives? (not very good for H&S).

    Hopefully I'm wrong, and that the canopies will be extended once the existing footbridge is demolished.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on November 15, 2012, 18:32:07
    The videos on the Network Rail project giving artists impressions' of the finished project have shorter canopies on the new relief line platforms but full length canopies on the main line platforms. Whether this actually happens remains to be seen as none of the main line platforms have their new canopies yet.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 15, 2012, 19:02:44
    The canopies seem as per the planning application drawings, on the reliefs they are about 150m on a 250m platform.  They extend west about the same distance as the P8/9 and P10/11 canopies.  They do appear short relative to the east end perhaps because the existing islands are somewhat longer than them, and maybe also look short because of the end on view - the sloping roof over the escalators (yet to be fitted) accounts for a significant proportion of the length as far as I can work out.

    I'd also point out that it is very unusual for full length canopies to be provided, taking rail the network as a whole...

    I've attached the platform canopy level planning drawing below...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 15, 2012, 19:09:33
    The videos on the Network Rail project giving artists impressions' of the finished project have shorter canopies on the new relief line platforms but full length canopies on the main line platforms. Whether this actually happens remains to be seen as none of the main line platforms have their new canopies yet.

    The west end canopy of P8/9 is at its full length already, the steelwork 'corners' are both in place.  As per my other post, that roughly marks the west end limit of all four of the main canopies (except P1/2/3/7, which surprisingly are shown slightly shorter)...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 15, 2012, 19:29:21
    Does anyone know whether there will be a First Class Lounge at the new station?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on November 15, 2012, 19:56:10
    That would probably depend on who the next Greater Western franchisee is.

    I think it unlikely if First Group retain the franchise, having closed the lounge at Bristol Temple Meads and only reluctantly continued to nominally operate (through RailGourmet) the lounge at Cardiff Central. Stagecoach have opened new lounges on their East Midlands Trains franchise so they may consider it for other stations on Greater Western should they win the franchise. National Express seemed committed to providing First Class Lounges when they briefly ran the InterCity East Coast franchise so they may be a possible. As for Arriva, anybody's guess.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 16, 2012, 10:53:08
    I've attached the platform canopy level planning drawing below...

    Thanks.  That also answers a question I had about the provision and location of escalators, stairs and lifts.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 16, 2012, 13:18:55
    As Graham has allowed a slightly larger file size for attachments, here's the platform level drawing.  Should allow hours of fun as people try and find a location for a first class lounge, as well...   ;D

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 16, 2012, 20:26:55
    Thanks, Paul.  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 17, 2012, 16:40:15
    The canopies seem as per the planning application drawings, on the reliefs they are about 150m on a 250m platform.  They extend west about the same distance as the P8/9 and P10/11 canopies.  They do appear short relative to the east end perhaps because the existing islands are somewhat longer than them, and maybe also look short because of the end on view - the sloping roof over the escalators (yet to be fitted) accounts for a significant proportion of the length as far as I can work out.

    I'd also point out that it is very unusual for full length canopies to be provided, taking rail the network as a whole...

    I've attached the platform canopy level planning drawing below...

    Paul

    Pual, thanks again for being the provider of hard information.  My point remains that platforms without canopies reflects an assumption that it's OK for people to get on and off trains in the wet.  And that insufficient attention has been given to the H&S and station dwell time issues associated with people congregating in an area shorter than the train they intend boarding. 

    I accept some canopies at some stations (eg Pangbourne) have been shortened over the years because of maintenance issues, but I can't see any excuses for installing short canopies on new-build platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on November 17, 2012, 17:02:26
    Removed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 17, 2012, 17:12:43
    I suppose that unless they've done something that absolutely prevents them being lengthened, it could be done later? 

    It seems to me that initially, any typical sized through services using the relief lines will be able to stop fully alongside the canopies anyway, and the normal platforming will presumably see most HSTs using the mains.  Of course HST's aren't that much longer than the relief platform canopies anyway?

    In the case of the terminating trains, I suppose it will all come down to whether or not they have to sit between arriving and leaving at the London end of the platform away from the canopy, to allow for the country end to be used simultaneously, eg for XC reversals (as discussed at length previously).  If not they'll be able to sit alongside a canopy as well...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 17, 2012, 17:21:58
    The canopies seem as per the planning application drawings, on the reliefs they are about 150m on a 250m platform.  They extend west about the same distance as the P8/9 and P10/11 canopies.  They do appear short relative to the east end perhaps because the existing islands are somewhat longer than them, and maybe also look short because of the end on view - the sloping roof over the escalators (yet to be fitted) accounts for a significant proportion of the length as far as I can work out.

    Pual, thanks again for being the provider of hard information.  My point remains that platforms without canopies reflects an assumption that it's OK for people to get on and off trains in the wet.  And that insufficient attention has been given to the H&S and station dwell time issues associated with people congregating in an area shorter than the train they intend boarding. 

    I accept some canopies at some stations (eg Pangbourne) have been shortened over the years because of maintenance issues, but I can't see any excuses for installing short canopies on new-build platforms.

    Remember these are the relief line platforms and that 150m is more than enough for 6 car 165 and I think it would get all the passenger doors of an unlengthened HST set under the canopy.  I therefore do not see what the problem is.  

    If they start running longer trains or using the platforms for two long trains at once then they can, as Paul says, still be lengthened.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on November 17, 2012, 18:52:45
    As a side point, why is it not OK to get off a train in the rain?

    It is not the end of the world but in the context of the huge Reading scheme it would be good to provide shelter not only for those exiting a train but also those waiting to board.  As has been pointed out, in times of wet weather people will tend to wait in the covered area before moving down the platform when the train arrives and possibly delay its departure.  Wet surfaces are also prone to freezing which does have H&S considerations.

    Agreed it is not the biggest issue in the Reading project, but still valid to raise it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on November 17, 2012, 20:46:03

    Rather large stations such as SFA and STP do not have an issue with this. The passenger flow during the Olympics was worse, and surprise surprise, no one was injured.

    Please get off your health and safety horse unless you have evidence that:
    a) It hasn't been risk assessed (hint, SFA has been, so you'll probably find that RDG has too)
    b) There is actually a danger posed (hint no one was injured at SFA during the Olympics in this way)
    c) You have a serious amount of knowledge in this specific area, perhaps a relevant qualification in health and safety and a damn good reason why you haven't spoken to network rail about it.


    Seems a bit of a harsh response. I wouldn't expect someone to have to raise an issue with Network Rail before giving an opinion on the Coffee Shop.

    And as for SFA and STP, IIRC, there was very little rain during the Games, so any experience there is irrelevant. (Though it seems a bit of a red herring.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 17, 2012, 20:54:55
    Seems silly not to do a "proper" job first time and provide canopies for the whole platform.

    Plat 3 seems esp Exposed if the XC trains will still use it ( as I bet they will)...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 17, 2012, 22:46:41
    As a side point, why is it not OK to get off a train in the rain?

    It is not the end of the world but in the context of the huge Reading scheme it would be good to provide shelter not only for those exiting a train but also those waiting to board.  As has been pointed out, in times of wet weather people will tend to wait in the covered area before moving down the platform when the train arrives and possibly delay its departure.  Wet surfaces are also prone to freezing which does have H&S considerations.

    Agreed it is not the biggest issue in the Reading project, but still valid to raise it.

    But I do not believe anyone needs to be waiting for or getting out of the train in the wet.  http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg120548# (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg120548#)
     
    Plat 3 seems esp Exposed if the XC trains will still use it ( as I bet they will)...

    But the first diagram of services prodced early on (http://richardwillisuk.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/building-a-new-21st-century-reading-station/ (http://richardwillisuk.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/building-a-new-21st-century-reading-station/)) shows the XC services using the mainline platforms. The short canopy should be adequate for a 3 car 165.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on November 17, 2012, 22:50:38
    I expect that a canopy's role is more to shelter waiting customers than those alighting.

    It's a pity that a modern overall roof couldn't be provided for some part of the platforms, near the concourse. Leeds City has this, giving a much improved passenger experience.

    It's marvellous to see, anyway. Well done NR.

    OTC



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 18, 2012, 12:10:07
    Good heavens, some people are getting theselves in a state about canopies.  BTW, EBrown, I hold a NEBOSH Diploma, though I don't think any one needs to be barred from posting on an issue just because they may not have a relevant qualification.   

    If there's a platform then it's fair to assume a train will stop alongside it at some point. We did discuss a few pages back whether the RL platforms would operate like the island at Southampton, ie terminating trains from both directions occupying the platform at the same time - if this is the case there will certainly be trains or parts of trains outside the canopies. 

    Thank you to those who acknowledge that this is a fair point to make.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on November 18, 2012, 12:50:37
    ... and there is a Network Rail Guide to Station design at http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/6368.aspx which includes, on page 37, the comments: 

    Inclusion of noise mitigation techniques and design of effective climate protection through platform canopies and covered pedestrian routes will ensure that station users are protected from unpleasant experiences and provide a positive ambience and journey experience for all.

    Mitigate risks arising from climatic conditions (e.g. the impact of summer sun or water on floor surfaces) for reasons of safety and ease of use.

    But I'll say no more on canopies.  I agree with those who say that the new station looks great.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 18, 2012, 18:40:49
    Just because XC trains are not immediately slated to use Plat 3 doesn't mean that they, or indeed other trains which do not even know about, in 10,20,and 30 years won't.

    Surely it is reasonable to 'future-proof' as much as possible, as adding canopies on an ad-hoc basis later will be hugely more expensive than building one now...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 18, 2012, 19:23:40
    Just because XC trains are not immediately slated to use Plat 3 doesn't mean that they, or indeed other trains which do not even know about, in 10,20,and 30 years won't.

    Surely it is reasonable to 'future-proof' as much as possible, as adding canopies on an ad-hoc basis later will be hugely more expensive than building one now...

    More expensive - yes, but I do not think hugely more expensive.  The way economists value expenditure made now, that will not be needed until some time in the future would show it to be far cheaper to wait even if there was certainty that it would be used by XC. 

    Please remember this is a time when the railway is under extreme pressure to reduce costs and putting canopies on bits of platform that the brief says will only be infrequently used by trains that would need them would not be a priority.  Only by credible control of costs will the railway be trusted to receive further investment.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Not from Brighton on November 18, 2012, 22:44:58
    It would take more than a canopy to protect me from all the "unpleasant experiences" I've suffered on a station platform over the years!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on November 19, 2012, 07:59:28
    Was expecting to get off the train on Platform 2 this morning to find that the rest of the roof had been removed. But that was not the case. So it looks as though users of Platforms 1 & 2 will have another week when they have partial shelter when waiting for trains.

    On a different note does anyone know if the existing platforms are going to be refurbished in anyway (besides getting a new canopy of course)?

    I also spotted that some of Platform 7 has been dug up and cemented over again near the newsagent. Something tells me that more of this may happen if the green spray paint writing is anything to go by.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on November 19, 2012, 08:18:46
    Whilst in a perfect world all platforms would be under shelter, in todays economic climate I can think of more important uses for the money.
    Including buying an extra train ! and yes even one more could make a difference, not by any extra timetabled services but by reducing cancellations and short formations "due to lack of rolling stock"


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on November 19, 2012, 14:01:47
    Travellers arriving and departing on an HST at Penzance can have a very long walk in the rain as I have discpovered in a torrential downpour but I did not think it a cause for complaint. Afterall you can walk along the train in the dry until you reach a coach under the canopy but that might be difficult at Reading if the train only stops a few minutes.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 19, 2012, 17:01:45
    I've attached three 'phone pics' of the progress with the track laying at the east end.

    They seem to have put the crossover for the P13/P14 lines in position, and in the distance you can see that the junction where the P15 and P14 lines merge is sited on Vastern Rd Bridge, so presumably the junction towards the 'Southern' underpass must be beyond the bridge, and anyone who travels in that direction can possibly confirm that is the case.

    Hope these are of interest - they give a good idea of how far away from their existing position the relief lines will be.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 19, 2012, 18:02:47
    Anyone know why there is access to emergency subway only  for platforms 12/13 and 14/15?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 19, 2012, 18:19:49
    It is a recently altered design standard requirement for a new build platform, or for a major alteration, but the requirement is not retrospective for existing platforms that are only being improved in situ.

    Hence 4-6 and 12-15 all get escape routes, but not the others.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 19, 2012, 18:41:03
    Cheers Paul, watching the them being built and the huge effort involved must have added greatly to the cost.

    Arguably 10/11 is as much an alteration as 5/6?

    But difficult to see why they are truly needed - seems to be H&S gone mad...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 19, 2012, 19:36:17
    They seem to have put the crossover for the P13/P14 lines in position, and in the distance you can see that the junction where the P15 and P14 lines merge is sited on Vastern Rd Bridge, so presumably the junction towards the 'Southern' underpass must be beyond the bridge, and anyone who travels in that direction can possibly confirm that is the case.

    I think you can see the start of it just beyond where the P14/15 lines merge, just before the big gang of track workers by the BMW sign.  According to the labels on the track diagrams I posted the two crossovers are much closer together than they look on the schematic, with one finishing at 61 chains and the other starting at 62 chains.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on November 20, 2012, 08:38:06
    Cheers Paul, watching the them being built and the huge effort involved must have added greatly to the cost.

    Arguably 10/11 is as much an alteration as 5/6?

    But difficult to see why they are truly needed - seems to be H&S gone mad...

    Agreed.
    Most railway platforms are very low risk enviroments as regards needing means of escape. They built of substantialy non combustible materials, with few sources of ignition.

    In the most unlikely event of say a terrorist bomb explosion, evacuation to a tunnel or overhead walkway might not be the best option due to the risks of a second bomb.


    In the event of fire or other emergency in the ticket office or on the concourse, it is often best to close the station to arriving passengers, but to evacuate those on the platforms by train.
    And as a last resort, there is always evacuation to track level after stopping the trains.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 20, 2012, 12:34:33
    I suppose 'buildability' comes into it as well.  As they were working away from the operational railway, those new subways were relatively straightforward to build from the surface, but equivalents for P8-P11 would have needed tunnelling under the live railway, presumably a different set of costs entirely.   

    Having said that, the emergency access to the extended 'Southern' P5/P6 must have been done from beneath, but of course there was only one track to cross when they started, rather than four tracks in two locations over in the area being discussed.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on November 20, 2012, 13:43:12
    ...
    Having said that, the emergency access to the extended 'Southern' P5/P6 must have been done from beneath, but of course there was only one track to cross when they started, rather than four tracks in two locations over in the area being discussed.

    Paul

    From memory, watching the work being done at the time, I'm pretty sure that the P5/P6 subway is mostly under the newly constructed embankment, so didn't require any tunneling. When they started work on extending P5/P6 they excavated straight down to the (buried) P5 end of the subway 'tube', and built the entrance  steps down to it, but didn't need to do any digging from below, or sideways underneath any existing structure.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 22, 2012, 17:45:45
    Back in posts 921-923 I asked about the supports for the tower crane that was removed from the new entrance, I see that the piles have been uncovered this afternoon, and are being nibbled away down to new ground level as we thought. 

    (As showing on webcam 2 around about 1500.)

    The entrance to the future public subway is also now almost fully visible.  They also appear (from what I have seen on the webcams over the last couple of days) to have demolished another subway like structure immediately in front of the new - did the previous subway extend far out under the road surface although unused?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 22, 2012, 18:47:13
    The road was raised on a concrete structure rather than filling.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on November 22, 2012, 20:04:44
    Paul - in the days when the old subway was 'open', as was the station, it had 2 exits at ground level - firstly by the old taxi rank, and then across the far side of the road  near the entrance to the old Foster Wheeler tower.

    Off the subway there were also a few exit routes into the subterranean car-parks 'under' station hill road....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on November 22, 2012, 20:51:49
    Paul - in the days when the old subway was 'open', as was the station, it had 2 exits at ground level - firstly by the old taxi rank, and then across the far side of the road  near the entrance to the old Foster Wheeler tower.

    Off the subway there were also a few exit routes into the subterranean car-parks 'under' station hill road....

    And one route used to continue right through to the old bus station!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 23, 2012, 12:38:20
    Thanks chaps - back in the day I never left the station at all, only used it for interchange when passing through on what is now the XC route...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 23, 2012, 13:15:09
    Meanwhile in the new depot building fitting out work has now progressed to a stage where rails have now been laid within the building.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 26, 2012, 07:29:37
    Anyone here know what was going on over this last weekend 24/25 November) to prevent access to p1,2&3 from the main concourse? This may be frequent occurrence but it is very rare I actually leave the station completely at reading.

    I didn't notice any major changes on my way through this morning.

    Dave


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 26, 2012, 09:05:59
    I travelled Reading - Thatcham early on Sat evening (24th) from Plat. 2 and didn't notice anything different re. access to that area (along Plat.7) than it's been for some months now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 26, 2012, 09:08:23
    I travelled Reading - Thatcham early on Sat evening (24th) from Plat. 2 and didn't notice anything different re. access to that area (along Plat.7) than it's been for some months now.

    I believe the restriction was in place Sun am until 5am today (Monday)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 26, 2012, 09:56:32
    On the previous weekend they were digging in the platform around about WH Smith's but it was all filled in again with a temporary surface by Monday.  Once the Monday morning hordes are milling around over the site you probably wouldn't notice anything had happened.

    They went through a phase of overnight excavations on P8 at once stage, I think it was locating utilities and electrical cables, leaving the surface a bit of a patchwork.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on November 26, 2012, 12:35:22
    The far end of the country end of P8 had been dug up this morning, quite a lot of pipes, services revealed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 26, 2012, 16:15:42
    Quite a bit going on now at that end of the P8/9 island isn't there. 

    I'd originally thought that mightn't happen until they had the chance to close the platforms off completely, one side at a time, but I suppose as long as they are beyond the length actually needed for an HST they can crack on with the renewal of the section beyond the working area...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 03, 2012, 12:15:37
    The far end of the country end of P8 had been dug up this morning, quite a lot of pipes, services revealed.

    The end of platform 8 has pretty much disappeared altogether now.
    P7 was closed again yesterday (Sunday) for more delvings. It's quite a hike to P3 via the temporary side entrance.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 03, 2012, 19:10:33
    So where was the temporary side entrance to P3?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 03, 2012, 20:39:35
    So where was the temporary side entrance to P3?

    I didn't go through reading station today but I am guessing the reference may have meant to p1/2/3 rather than just 3. If this is the case then it is the same as the weekend before where access to p1-3 was from outside the station. So if, for example , you wanted to go from p8 to p1 etc you had to leave the station the the gate line and then walk west for a 100 yards r so and then almost turn back on yourself to walk up te path the the aforementioned platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on December 03, 2012, 23:46:59
    The side entrance (to 1-2-3) is behind the RSAR Site offices - where bus number 5/6 used to depart from.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 08, 2012, 13:10:12
    Apologies if this has been mentioned in this thread before but I noticed this week there seem to be new waiting rooms appearing at the western ends of the platforms that have got the new roofing - such as p8-9,10-11,12-13 etc. So this is is a welcome addition for those who use those platforms. 

    I am guessing the "waiting area" for p1-7 will be the main southern entrance and concourse - but that is only a guess.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 08, 2012, 14:52:51
    I am guessing the "waiting area" for p1-7 will be the main southern entrance and concourse - but that is only a guess.

    If you refer to Paul's attachment on page 63 of this thread, then there is mention on that of a 'Customer Lounge' at the western end of Platform 7 (with direct access to Platforms 1/2/3).  Similar in size to the old facilities by the looks of it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 08, 2012, 16:21:23
    Would that be in the area just to the West of the new bridge in the area at the east end of platforms 1, 2 & 3? The area is visible in Lobster Vision nrreading02 camera 2, just between the large grey box (signalling equipment?) and the platform.  Incidentally why is the grey box part in the building and part out? Is it going to be moved or will the building be larger?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 08, 2012, 17:37:32
    I am guessing the "waiting area" for p1-7 will be the main southern entrance and concourse - but that is only a guess.

    If you refer to Paul's attachment on page 63 of this thread, then there is mention on that of a 'Customer Lounge' at the western end of Platform 7 (with direct access to Platforms 1/2/3).  Similar in size to the old facilities by the looks of it.

    Many thanks II - I'd forgotten about that plan...thanks for reminding me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 08, 2012, 19:23:17
    Ah I see from your plan - it is that room under the bridge where they built a plywood wall the other day. And the building is being extended to cover the grey box.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 08, 2012, 19:43:54
    Looked at the plan for the north and south entrances again.  There's an awful lot of work to be done on the south side before the subway can be used.  When were they going to need it was it end of February?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 09, 2012, 10:39:08
    ...Incidentally why is the grey box part in the building and part out? Is it going to be moved or will the building be larger?

    Oddly enough, as these boxes are known as 'relocatable equipment buildings' (REBs), I'd have initially thought relocation was an option. IIRC this one is labelled 'Station REB.  But on second thoughts it is likely that the idea of the REB is simply to build and test the contained signalling equipment at the factory, and deliver as a 'job lot' and connect to local cabling when in its designed position. So I'm tending towards the fact that it is easier to build round/over it than disturb all the relevant cabling.  However this could possibly happen later at a future major alteration to the signalling? 

    You'll see similar boxes at either end of the station, including in line with the new platforms, and of course they are all over the existing railway.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 09, 2012, 13:12:02
    ...Incidentally why is the grey box part in the building and part out? Is it going to be moved or will the building be larger?

    Oddly enough, as these boxes are known as 'relocatable equipment buildings' (REBs), I'd have initially thought relocation was an option. IIRC this one is labelled 'Station REB.  But on second thoughts it is likely that the idea of the REB is simply to build and test the contained signalling equipment at the factory, and deliver as a 'job lot' and connect to local cabling when in its designed position. So I'm tending towards the fact that it is easier to build round/over it than disturb all the relevant cabling.  However this could possibly happen later at a future major alteration to the signalling? 

    You'll see similar boxes at either end of the station, including in line with the new platforms, and of course they are all over the existing railway.

    Paul 

    Thanks Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on December 09, 2012, 13:44:20
    Anyone know whether the new office block nearly finished off Richfield avenue by the new maintenance sheds are temporary or permanent?

    They seem to be built in a modular/temporary way, but also seem so extensive that suggests that they are unlikely to be temporary.

    But if permanent why not just incorporate the offices into the shed buildings, rather than building them apart from them...?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 09, 2012, 16:55:31
    Anyone know whether the new office block nearly finished off Richfield avenue by the new maintenance sheds are temporary or permanent?

    They seem to be built in a modular/temporary way, but also seem so extensive that suggests that they are unlikely to be temporary.

    But if permanent why not just incorporate the offices into the shed buildings, rather than building them apart from them...?

    Marked on the plans as 'Depot Staff Accommodation Building'.  Permanent, but modular in appearance I would guess as that's a nice cheap way to build things these days - many modern housing developments use similar building practices.

    There will be some offices in the shed buildings as well, but why they weren't all incorporated into one building I don't know.  Either space constraints, or ease of access - that building is likely to be in an non-HV vest area for office staff for example - are possible reasons.  The offices in the current upper depot are separate from the main train shed (but not the lower depot!).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 09, 2012, 20:21:36
    Anyone know whether the new office block nearly finished off Richfield avenue by the new maintenance sheds are temporary or permanent?

    They seem to be built in a modular/temporary way, but also seem so extensive that suggests that they are unlikely to be temporary.

    But if permanent why not just incorporate the offices into the shed buildings, rather than building them apart from them...?

    Marked on the plans as 'Depot Staff Accommodation Building'.  Permanent, but modular in appearance I would guess as that's a nice cheap way to build things these days - many modern housing developments use similar building practices.

    There will be some offices in the shed buildings as well, but why they weren't all incorporated into one building I don't know.  Either space constraints, or ease of access - that building is likely to be in an non-HV vest area for office staff for example - are possible reasons.  The offices in the current upper depot are separate from the main train shed (but not the lower depot!).

    Could be the "depot staff building" is for the in service train fault team.

    Modular build is not always a cheap build often the modular buildings are more expensive than the insitu built ones where the savings are made is the on site time especially if possessions are required.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 09, 2012, 21:07:02
    Anyone know whether the new office block nearly finished off Richfield avenue by the new maintenance sheds are temporary or permanent?

    They seem to be built in a modular/temporary way, but also seem so extensive that suggests that they are unlikely to be temporary.

    But if permanent why not just incorporate the offices into the shed buildings, rather than building them apart from them...?

    Marked on the plans as 'Depot Staff Accommodation Building'.  Permanent, but modular in appearance I would guess as that's a nice cheap way to build things these days - many modern housing developments use similar building practices.

    There will be some offices in the shed buildings as well, but why they weren't all incorporated into one building I don't know.  Either space constraints, or ease of access - that building is likely to be in an non-HV vest area for office staff for example - are possible reasons.  The offices in the current upper depot are separate from the main train shed (but not the lower depot!).

    Could be the "depot staff building" is for the in service train fault team.

    Modular build is not always a cheap build often the modular buildings are more expensive than the insitu built ones where the savings are made is the on site time especially if possessions are required.

    If modular buildings are being widely presented as the way forward to save costs.  On the continent they are widely used in preference to insitu build as they have been proven to reduce costs.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 09, 2012, 21:24:52
    Anyone know whether the new office block nearly finished off Richfield avenue by the new maintenance sheds are temporary or permanent?

    They seem to be built in a modular/temporary way, but also seem so extensive that suggests that they are unlikely to be temporary.

    But if permanent why not just incorporate the offices into the shed buildings, rather than building them apart from them...?

    Marked on the plans as 'Depot Staff Accommodation Building'.  Permanent, but modular in appearance I would guess as that's a nice cheap way to build things these days - many modern housing developments use similar building practices.

    There will be some offices in the shed buildings as well, but why they weren't all incorporated into one building I don't know.  Either space constraints, or ease of access - that building is likely to be in an non-HV vest area for office staff for example - are possible reasons.  The offices in the current upper depot are separate from the main train shed (but not the lower depot!).

    Could be the "depot staff building" is for the in service train fault team.

    Modular build is not always a cheap build often the modular buildings are more expensive than the insitu built ones where the savings are made is the on site time especially if possessions are required.

    If modular buildings are being widely presented as the way forward to save costs.  On the continent they are widely used in preference to insitu build as they have been proven to reduce costs.

    I did not say they are not a reduction in costs, I did say they are not a cheap option. 

    There is not a lot in the costs in fact (I know I am involved in procuring fixed traction equipment) modular have higher cost in manufacture, transport and delivery to site (eg very large cranes and possessions) traditional brick and mortar have higher on site costs due to the length of time to build and fit out.  Modular has advantage of factory built easier to do acceptance tests on site commissioning is less, modular disadvantage is the building life span is often less than the equipment inside it (an example are the 1980's dc traction substations through Kent the electrical kit has another 10 plus years life the modular buildings are shot.

    Don't get me wrong I am a great believer in modular equipment enclosures they are not always the best answer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 09, 2012, 21:47:51

    I did not say they are not a reduction in costs, I did say they are not a cheap option. 

    There is not a lot in the costs in fact (I know I am involved in procuring fixed traction equipment) modular have higher cost in manufacture, transport and delivery to site (eg very large cranes and possessions) traditional brick and mortar have higher on site costs due to the length of time to build and fit out.  Modular has advantage of factory built easier to do acceptance tests on site commissioning is less, modular disadvantage is the building life span is often less than the equipment inside it (an example are the 1980's dc traction substations through Kent the electrical kit has another 10 plus years life the modular buildings are shot.

    Don't get me wrong I am a great believer in modular equipment enclosures they are not always the best answer

    The big advantage when you get to site work is that you reduce the risks associated with weather. This can be a major cost in the construction industry. In big civils jobs however there is a cut-off size where the increased crane costs balance out the savings, but in modular building where you are building up from components this is less so. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 12, 2012, 14:40:30
    I thought I'd give a quick summary of where we are and where we'll be in the next year of so of the Reading project (as I understand it):

    Completed:  New Platform 4 and extension to Platforms 5 and 6.
    28th Feb 2013:  New Subway opens.
    1st Mar 2013:  Existing overbridge between the multi-storey car park and the station closes (those from that car park and others usually entering station from north side temporarily need to use new subway).
    29th Mar 2013:  Transfer deck opens along with new northern and western entrances and gate lines, and new northern ticket office.
    2-4th Apr 2013:  New Platforms 12-15 open after Easter blockade, with revised track layout including the new southern lines underpass.  Platform 16 (and Platform 3?) closes.
    May/June 2013:  New maintenance depot and east and west sidings are phased into use with the current Reading TMD (lower depot) closing.
    July/August 2013:  Current Reading fuel point (upper depot) closes and all FGW stabling and maintenance transfers to the new maintenance depot and east/west end sidings.

    Work will also start next year in earnest to the remaining station works and the western underpass, and as I understand it, the east end sidings and maintenance shed, along with the new platforms will have all overhead cables in place.  The west end sidings won't be wired up until the western underpass is completed.  Not sure when the rest of the station will be wired up.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 12, 2012, 17:31:18
    Thanks for the update II, I think 2-4 April (not March) for P12-P15 opening [now corrected by II].  Car park users won't be happy with the permanent loss of a short walk to an HST for London on 1st March, but you can't please all the people all of the time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on December 12, 2012, 18:35:57
    I don't suppose there is any chance that any of you who have the ability to take the odd snapshot could post one now and then for the benefit of we who are remote from proceedings, please?

    Of course I appreciate that you hard-working people probably only pass through in the dark.   :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on December 12, 2012, 18:38:47
    Here are some pics I took a few months ago.

    http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10152074737535459.899624.566580458&type=3


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on December 12, 2012, 19:02:01
    Not saying for a minute that great progress hasn't been made, but looking at the transfer deck when I was passing through today I would say getting that open by 29/3/13 looks like a tall order to me!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 12, 2012, 20:02:37
    Not saying for a minute that great progress hasn't been made, but looking at the transfer deck when I was passing through today I would say getting that open by 29/3/13 looks like a tall order to me!

    I thought the same about p4-6 when they were working on it but it was amazing the progress they made towards the end


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 13, 2012, 11:06:16
    I would expect that a lot of the internal detailed fit-out would be planned to be done somewhat nearer to the final opening anyway.  There's little point in laying final surfaces and putting up wall claddings and the like, until the transfer deck is no longer doubling up as access to the building site. 

    The access ramps and steps to the south end of the subway should also happen fairly quickly now, a lot of foundation concrete is being poured at the moment, and it is the sort of structure that can be built rapidly.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 13, 2012, 11:57:41
    Thanks for the update II, I think 2-4 April (not March) for P12-P15 opening. 

    Of course.  My mistake.  Now corrected.

    I don't suppose there is any chance that any of you who have the ability to take the odd snapshot could post one now and then for the benefit of we who are remote from proceedings, please?

    Here's a few I took last Sunday:

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8066/8268655977_430a6d40f5_b.jpg)

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8071/8269723236_5c70bd3b21_b.jpg)

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8345/8268654893_74588fd676_b.jpg)

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8216/8269721822_087e2d1297_b.jpg)

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8073/8269733070_5bcce7f8fd_b.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 13, 2012, 12:00:02
    Great pics II thanks for posting


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on December 13, 2012, 13:09:14
    II, thank you very much.  We've come a long way since I used to haul boxes of freight accounting paperwork up to the station from the Reading computer bureau in the Signal Works (1969 -ish) at some unearthly hour of the morning.
     >:(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 13, 2012, 13:30:52
    Interesting pictures, thanks II.  The first three pictures show no sign of escalators down to the platforms despite the fact that they're planned to be installed and in use by 29th March.  Tube users know how long it can take to replace escalators (sometimes years!).

    Howvere, the last picture shows a mysterious package, marked Kone,  being transported across the ML's.  Kone make escalators, so it looks like the first bit of escalator is being moved across to the new platforms. 

    Interesting way of getting them across to where they're being installed


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 13, 2012, 14:38:35
    Interesting way of getting them across to where they're being installed

    That's what I thought - hence the photo opportunity.  As you say, that's probably equipment for the new escalators then.  There were several such movements taking place during the day requiring some pretty deft handling of those yellow transportation vehicles as there's not much turning space on Platform 7/8.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 13, 2012, 18:46:12
    Interesting pictures, thanks II.  The first three pictures show no sign of escalators down to the platforms despite the fact that they're planned to be installed and in use by 29th March.  Tube users know how long it can take to replace escalators (sometimes years!).

    Howvere, the last picture shows a mysterious package, marked Kone,  being transported across the ML's.  Kone make escalators, so it looks like the first bit of escalator is being moved across to the new platforms. 

    Interesting way of getting them across to where they're being installed

    Escalators come prefabricated, site fit out is to fit the treads, side panels and some wiring and then set them up.  The ones fitted at Waterloo mezzanine recently were installed fitted out and tested in less than 2 weeks (each) the problem the Tube has is access and working on them while the station is open to the public   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2012, 09:59:15
    I think the main point is that escalator fitting and routine maintenance in normal circumstances (ie not on the deep tube lines) is nothing like as difficult or time consuming.  I suspect that there were some sort of fundamental design errors made in the early days on the tube, regarding long term access for both maintenance and replacement mostly to do with those inclined shafts, and perhaps nearly every escalator there is uniquely sized to the location. 

    The Reading equipment is probably relatively standard equipment.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 14, 2012, 12:17:28
    I take the point that installing new escalators in a purpose designed "enclosure" will be much simpler than replacing very old escalators on the Tube netweork.

    But even so, I wonder if the escalators were late being delivered, as the first enclosures have been ready for some time and they have 16 (I'm assuming 4 per island) to install by 29th March.  And I would be surprised if the Project Plan was based on them being trundled across all the running lines as shown in II's picture.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 14, 2012, 12:21:05
    I take the point that installing new escalators in a purpose designed "enclosure" will be much simpler than replacing very old escalators on the Tube netweork.

    But even so, I wonder if the escalators were late being delivered, as the first enclosures have been ready for some time and they have 16 (I'm assuming 4 per island) to install by 29th March.  And I would be surprised if the Project Plan was based on them being trundled across all the running lines as shown in II's picture.

    I was under the impression there were two per island and stairs but may be wrong


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2012, 14:04:26
    It varies - P8/9 has 4 escalators, with a staircase alongside each pair, but the other 3 narrower islands have 3 escalators, 2 on the London side and a single one (with a parallel stair) on the other side.

    Trundling heavy stuff over the running lines during an overnight block is a standard practice - those polystyrene blocks in the picture are man-portable and can be laid very quickly between the platforms, I've seen them in use on many projects in the south, eg to get plant over onto island platforms during SWT's current platform lengthening work. 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on December 14, 2012, 15:17:32
    Here are some pics I took a few months ago.

    http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10152074737535459.899624.566580458&type=3


    Ollie I forgot to thank you as well, pardon.  (And those captions??)   :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on December 14, 2012, 19:29:27
    Webcam 3 of nrreading01 showed two lorry loads of Kone equipment, including four very large items, being craned onto the site today (using the tower crane). I guess these are destined for the new platforms, which might suggest its only the equipment for platforms 7/8 which needs to be brought in over the tracks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on December 14, 2012, 20:58:49
    Here are some pics I took a few months ago.

    http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10152074737535459.899624.566580458&type=3


    Ollie I forgot to thank you as well, pardon.  (And those captions??)   :D

    You're welcome. I will do those soon... or I might remove the bit about me doing captions ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 15, 2012, 11:41:39
    Webcam 3 of nrreading01 showed two lorry loads of Kone equipment, including four very large items, being craned onto the site today (using the tower crane). I guess these are destined for the new platforms, which might suggest its only the equipment for platforms 7/8 which needs to be brought in over the tracks.

    That figures, because the weight capability of the tower crane will be much reduced at the radius needed for P8 and P9. 

    (Which is presumably what you meant, because for P7 they'll be able to use the main entrance.)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on December 15, 2012, 16:26:02
    Those photos cetainly give the impression of a 21st century rail station. I wonder what the old GWR entheusiasts think about it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 15, 2012, 18:39:51
    Those photos cetainly give the impression of a 21st century rail station. I wonder what the old GWR entheusiasts think about it.

    They could go here http://www.broadwaystation.co.uk/ (http://www.broadwaystation.co.uk/) where they are building a new GWR station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on December 16, 2012, 07:12:02
    Saw this on Journeycheck

    Quote
    Reading Facilities: Lifts out of order At Reading station.
    The lifts will be out of order between Platform 10 and Overbridge from 15/12/2012 08:04 until further notice.
    Message Received :15/12/2012 08:05

    Is this a breakdown, I wonder, or part of the station redevelopment work.  If it is the latter it could be problematic for those who can't use the stairs, particularly as Platform 10 is the main London bound platform on Sundays and between Christmas and New Year.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 18, 2012, 10:20:02
    However, the last picture shows a mysterious package, marked Kone,  being transported across the ML's.  Kone make escalators, so it looks like the first bit of escalator is being moved across to the new platforms. 

    As of yesterday evening, a large pre-fabbed escalator is sat in one of the wells on the east side of P8.
    It's not in final position yet, it's at more of a reclined angle.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on December 18, 2012, 14:54:33
    Yesterday the normal stairs and the lift between the overbridge and platform 10 were both taped off and passengers were being directed to use the temporary stairs on the east side of the overbridge to access platform 10. Altogether not a very good arrangement - not a lot of signage and not the most customer friendly access. I don't know how long this will persist, or if it is permanent? Has to be some issues re access for the disabled to/from Platform 10.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 18, 2012, 15:17:48
    A couple of other things to note:

    We now have track partly laid by platforms 13/14/15.  Ballast is down but still waiting sleepers by the looks of it though! 

    Also if you look on Camera 4 of nrreading01's webcams you can see a door in the side of the transfer deck leading to the walking route to the new depot and sidings.  I understand that this walking route won't require staff to be PTS (Personal Track Safety) trained and won't involve walking over the viaduct with a lighting system to tell you it's safe to keep walking.  Much safer!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 18, 2012, 16:35:29
    Perhaps they'll use the Balfour Beatty 'new track construction machine' to lay the sleepers and clip the track, within a few days from now?  Dropping the rails in roughly the right position, cutting them to length and temporarily joining them takes place before the machine appears, I found a YouTube video here that shows the machine in operation:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhVu7jQZXy0

    A photo of the current situation alongside P14/15 attached below, and also a picture of a gantry that's appeared at the west end of the new platforms some time over the last fortnight or so...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 18, 2012, 16:43:42
    Cheers, Paul.  Anybody else got neck ache though?   ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 18, 2012, 17:02:58
    Cheers, Paul.  Anybody else got neck ache though?   ;)

    Sorry about that - thanks to using an iphone to take the photo, and a mac to upload it, unfortunately Apple's software
    hid the fact I had the phone upside down.   ::)

    I think it might be OK to look again now...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on December 18, 2012, 21:07:35
    I'm intrigued by the heavyweight looking gantry. I thought NR was installing much lighter constructions now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stebbo on December 18, 2012, 21:55:54
    With reference to Electric Train's comment, go to Winchcombe on the GWR where there's a working station albeit much of it transported from Monmouth. But I think station design has evolved - like airports we need to have more retail outlets so you can buy your dinner, a new suit, tie, bra, knickers, mobile phone etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on December 18, 2012, 22:42:43
    And in the case of the Severn Valley Railway, there are some rather controversial plans to "update" Bridgnorth with new visitor attractions and a new footbridge with lift access, which many members don't think will be in keeping with the historic ambience of the station. Maybe they could go the whole hog and put a gateline in as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 19, 2012, 16:18:23
    I'm intrigued by the heavyweight looking gantry. I thought NR was installing much lighter constructions now.

    Thinking about this, although there definitely are lighter varieties of lineside signals that have been recently fitted, (e.g. on the Salisbury - Exeter route), I suspect there's much more complexity about Reading, especially in the station area.  If that gantry has to carry the 'full monty' for 4 platforms, and in both directions, ie two heads for the four main aspects, and any necessary feathers or theatre box route indicators, and calling on lights (for two train working), and CD/RA indicators [1], then it all gets significantly heavier and on top of all that you have to add OHLE safety cages to allow for maintenance staff to get to the signalling equipment while the juice is on.  They may also be fitting various aids such as shades and back boards to improve signal sighting.

    [1] Close doors and 'right away' indications for one person operation - which if Basingstoke is any precedent, could be fitted even if they are not normally ever used...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on December 19, 2012, 16:27:14
    [1] Close doors and 'right away' indications for one person operation - which if Basingstoke is any precedent, could be fitted even if they are not normally ever used...

    Are the existing CD/RA ever used at Reading these days?  I have not seen them used in many a long year.

    There's a small handbill going round giving pre-warning of the Easter blockade.  It mentions a total of 100 new information screens being installed.  Seems a lot but spread across 15 platforms and entrances/exits and walkways I suppose it soon mounts up.  Details of the revised service over Easter will be published next month according to the leaflet.  I fancy a trip via Banbury - missed out when the Christmas block was on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 19, 2012, 17:24:00
    Are the existing CD/RA ever used at Reading these days?  I have not seen them used in many a long year.

    They are used on all DOO services that depart from Platforms 11 and 16, and on all platforms if Driver<>Guard equipment isn't working.  Next Easter would be an ideal time to try to standardise all the method of working on all DOO services so that CD/RA is always used.  We'll see if that opportunity is grasped.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: inspector_blakey on December 19, 2012, 19:21:36
    Would be nice to think that the RA indicators could be used for driver/guard working as well, since they are interlocked with the signalling and won't allow a "ding ding and away" SPAD. There are certainly precedents elsewhere, Birmingham New Street for example where all trains are despatched with an RA despite driver-guard operation.

    Or are the CD/RA indicators in the Thames Valley a different design that means they're not suitable for driver-guard working? Clearly the CD serves no purpose if the guard is closing/locking the doors rather than the driver: does the interlocking mean that CD has to be displayed before RA will pop up?

    Those photos cetainly give the impression of a 21st century rail station. I wonder what the old GWR entheusiasts think about it.

    They could do a lot worse than visit Birmingham Moor Street, where a superb job has been done of providing a busy station with excellent, modern facilities at the same time as retaining a very heritage, GWR feel.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on December 19, 2012, 19:25:02
    Presumably the sleeper is despatched at Reading using RA indicators because of the lack of driver-guard communication, the CD indicators wouldn't be needed then either.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 19, 2012, 19:28:08
    Or are the CD/RA indicators in the Thames Valley a different design that means they're not suitable for driver-guard working? Clearly the CD serves no purpose if the guard is closing/locking the doors rather than the driver: does the interlocking mean that CD has to be displayed before RA will pop up?

    No, direct to RA is possible - and occasionally used in the case of faulty Driver<>Guard comms on HSTs or 180s.  Personally I think on non-DOO trains the Guard giving two on the buzzer is a better system than using a RA indicator as it doesn't rely on the driver continually observing the RA box, they just wait for buzz-buzz and go.  Delays can occur when using the RA if the driver isn't on the ball all the time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: inspector_blakey on December 19, 2012, 23:04:01
    Presumably the sleeper is despatched at Reading using RA indicators because of the lack of driver-guard communication, the CD indicators wouldn't be needed then either.

    Never seen the sleeper despatched at Reading so I'm not sure, but the RA indicators would make sense as I don't *think* there's a driver-guard buzzer on that stock. However it's also possible that it's despatched in the time-honoured way with the guard giving the driver a green flag (or green light, during darkness, fog or falling snow...). That is still the fallback method of despatch in the event of a buzzer/RA indicator failure, and all guards (should...) carry flags and a handlamp in case of need.

    No, direct to RA is possible - and occasionally used in the case of faulty Driver<>Guard comms on HSTs or 180s.  

    Thanks, had often wondered about that! I ended up travelling on one of Chilterns 67-hauled sets the other day which *seemed* to have a weird method of despatch going on. The guard had a two-way radio and from the tit-bits I overheard it sounded as if she was in radio contact with the driver and despatching that way: common enough in the US but I'm not aware of it being used in the UK ever. Not even entirely sure if it's covered by the rule book. The disclaimer is that it's entirely possible that I misinterpreted what was going on though!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on December 19, 2012, 23:10:34
    Presumably the sleeper is despatched at Reading using RA indicators because of the lack of driver-guard communication, the CD indicators wouldn't be needed then either.

    Never seen the sleeper despatched at Reading so I'm not sure, but the RA indicators would make sense as I don't *think* there's a driver-guard buzzer on that stock. However it's also possible that it's despatched in the time-honoured way with the guard giving the driver a green flag (or green light, during darkness, fog or falling snow...). That is still the fallback method of despatch in the event of a buzzer/RA indicator failure, and all guards (should...) carry flags and a handlamp in case of need.

    Definitely no driver-guard on the MK3s or the 57s. Despatched using green flag, or green light in the winter, throughout Cornwall. Not sure if the RA indicators are used where installed at the bigger stations though. They use RA indicators at Redruth in the up direction because the 57 is stopped in the tunnel and it wouldn't be particularly easy for the driver to see a flag or light.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 19, 2012, 23:32:14
    Meanwhile back with the track laying, as I write this the webcams show the Balfour Beatty new track machine is sitting in P13, and there's a ballast train in P15, so as I thought might happen, progress has been swift...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on December 20, 2012, 12:19:57
    I've been dying to ask this.  Is the kink in the main down platform to go?   Has it gone?

    It's a wonder it was not listed, being Brunel's bright idea (?) to send trains in and out of two halves of a single platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on December 20, 2012, 14:05:23
    The dispatch process for sleepers at Reading is:

    Dispatcher gives the first tip to guard, who then locks the doors.
    Dispatcher gives second tip to guard to show all doors locked safely.
    Guard gives green light to dispatcher.
    Dispatcher gives RA to driver.

    All done without a single whistle - wouldn't want to wake the passengers!

    By the way, the lift and stairs from platform 10 to the overbridge are back in use. Apparently, the lift has been suffering significant rain water ingress since the canopy was cut back. A temporary fix has been made to the canopy to rectify the problem.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 20, 2012, 14:12:01
    When I walked through Reading from P4 to P1 last night I was suprised with the amount of rain water that was coming through the round holes in the bottom of the overbridge. This suprised me because (a) I though the roof was on the overbridge and (b) I thought the round holes were for lights!

    Lets hope I am wrong on both counts!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 20, 2012, 14:15:26
    I've been dying to ask this.  Is the kink in the main down platform to go?   Has it gone?

    Platform 7 is to be built out from the middle of its length by about one track width towards P8.  It will have a completely new platform edge, and be significantly straighter than it is now, so I expect there'll be little or no evidence of any original details.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on December 30, 2012, 20:11:34
    The first schedules for the diverted trains this Easter have started to appear online. Some links for the 29th March for anybody who is interested:
    London Paddington: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=London+Paddington&date=29%2F03%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=1&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1
    Exeter St Davids: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=wat&date=29%2F03%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=1&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1

    Service is broadly similar to Christmas 2010. 1tph London Paddington-Swansea and 1tph London Paddington-Bristol Temple Meads via the Chiltern Line, Banbury and Oxford. 1tph London Waterloo-Plymouth/Penzance via Westbury. This time the services to London Waterloo are running along the main lines from Basingstoke-London Waterloo. The result is quicker journey times, only roughly 1 hour longer than normal journey times to Paddington. Reading has the standard service in to the Southern platforms (4/5/6) and out of platform 2 there is 1tph to Basingstoke and 1tph to Bedywn, with every other train extended to Westbury. This will mean a very rare visit of Turbos to Westbury station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on December 30, 2012, 20:25:56
    Thanks SS. I'm travelling back from Gatwick on the 30th March, but notice that services from London still appear to be via Reading. Do I assume that they have not yet reloaded the amended services yet?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on December 30, 2012, 20:32:16
    Indeed, I'd expect the rest to be uploaded over the next couple of days.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: anthony215 on December 30, 2012, 22:09:10
    Well I will be at Reading to get some pics of the class 165/166's at Westbury since its not something we see usually although after 2016 I think it will be more regular providing they can be cleared to work services from Bristol to Weymouth once they are displaced from the Thames Valley region


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on December 30, 2012, 22:28:19
    Just to clean up those links a little and make it a tad easier to read by removing other TOCs (Only GW displays)
    Services from:
    • London Paddington (http://goo.gl/wzlFp)
    • London Waterloo (http://goo.gl/dWj8o)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 31, 2012, 00:26:10
    SWT's engineering work pages suggest that they have changes yet to be made as well, because they state that the normal Weybridge via Staines services are being cancelled for the period to provide extra stock and paths for a strengthened Reading service: 
    Quote
    On the Friday, Saturday and Monday a revised train service will run on routes from London Waterloo to Reading and to Windsor & Eton Riverside. This is to provide extra trains between London and Reading as the First Great Western route will be closed.

    On the Friday, Saturday and Monday there will be no train service for much of the day (about 0700 to 1930) between London Waterloo and Weybridge via Staines, as the trains are required for the above special service. During this time, replacement bus services will run between Virginia Water and Weybridge, calling at Chertsey and Addlestone.  Other stations on this route will be served by some of the altered Reading and Windsor trains.

    http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/MarEng2013.aspx#112618

    I expect a few things will become clearer over the next couple of weeks...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2012, 20:49:57
    Not quite in view from any of the lobstervision.tv webcams, but the new connection at the western end of the station from Platform 8 (what will be the 'Down Main Loop') to the Down Main was also installed over the Christmas shutdown.  It looks like a fairly slow turnout of 25mph to me (compared with everything else installed so far which looks like 40mph) and cuts across what was the extreme end of Platform 8 and, prior to 2012, the connection into the old Platform 7 bay platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 31, 2012, 21:29:52
    According to the Signalling Scheme Plan (final layout) its 50mph along the Down Main Loop and back to the Down Main (back up to 60mph) with a 40mph turnout to the Up Westbury.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2012, 21:49:54
    According to the Signalling Scheme Plan (final layout) its 50mph along the Down Main Loop and back to the Down Main (back up to 60mph) with a 40mph turnout to the Up Westbury.

    Well, there's no way on earth that it'll be 50mph - I'll try and get a picture to demonstrate how sharp it is.  I suspect it's a temporary crossover pending further remodelling and a higher linespeed when all the bits of the jigsaw at the western end of the station are in place?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 31, 2012, 21:54:10
    According to the Signalling Scheme Plan (final layout) its 50mph along the Down Main Loop and back to the Down Main (back up to 60mph) with a 40mph turnout to the Up Westbury.

    Well, there's no way on earth that it'll be 50mph - I'll try and get a picture to demonstrate how sharp it is.  I suspect it's a temporary crossover pending further remodelling and a higher linespeed when all the bits of the jigsaw at the western end of the station are in place?
    Does the turnout start over Caversham Road underbridge directly parallel with the existing turnout between Platforms No.1 and No.2?  That is where the final turnout will be located.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 31, 2012, 22:45:53
    No, it starts before the western end of Platform 8 (a small section of which has been demolished if you see what I mean), then arcs over to the current Down Relief line joining it before (I think) the Caversham Road bridge, in a similar position to where the old Platform 7 line converged with the Down Relief.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 31, 2012, 23:30:33
    ......so that looks like the temporary turnout (as numbered 5c and 10c) on the Easter 2013 track diagrams provided by your good self in a previous post.  Quite likely it is going to be used by all the Cross Country reversers (but not terminators):

    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8300/7999400082_0bda0c45c6_b.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 01, 2013, 15:25:19
    ......so that looks like the temporary turnout (as numbered 5c and 10c) on the Easter 2013 track diagrams provided by your good self in a previous post.  Quite likely it is going to be used by all the Cross Country reversers (but not terminators):

    Indeed it does, with the 05c and 10c being the distance in chains from MP36.  Took another look at it today and if anything it looks like 15mph not 25mph!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 02, 2013, 14:34:42
    Quite likely then that the turnout from Platform 8 is going to connect with the old (existing Down Relief) to old Platform 7 turnout which was 15mph.  I won't be going through Reading for a few weeks yet so a photograph of that end would be nice to see (there seem to be lots of photographs on the www of the work at the London end but not much at the Country end).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 02, 2013, 16:34:57
    The routing via Oxford from Bristol gives me an option I didn't know I would ever see - all very interesting! I'm struggling with an acronym or abbreviation or two, though. I can see WTT in the list, but not VAR or STP. Nor HX or HC, although I figured those out for myself.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 02, 2013, 17:00:17
    I think this might approximate to what happens:
    LTP 'is long term planning' - which is the normal timetable process that produces the WTT.
    STP is 'short term planning' - which is adjusting the former for those planned eventualities such as engineering work diversions. The short term deadline I believe is 12 weeks.
    VAR is minor 'variations' to the WTT e.g. anything that causes a slight adjustment to the WTT on a particular day, eg a planned re-platforming but calling at the same time as normal, and I think it also comes up for any emergencies on the day that stop that day's timetable from working;  so for example that would be your diversion via Westbury following a sudden landslip at Swindon.

    (The 12 week STP deadline is also closely related to why Advance fares are only available up until 12 weeks, by the way.)

    Corrections welcomed as always.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 02, 2013, 17:16:07
    Corrections welcomed as always.

    Sounds like a spot-on assessment to me.  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 02, 2013, 17:24:10
    Thanks, it makes sense. Doubtless one of our excellent mods will make any necessary addition to the acronyms page.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on January 02, 2013, 18:56:22
    I think this might approximate to what happens:
    LTP 'is long term planning' - which is the normal timetable process that produces the WTT.
    STP is 'short term planning' - which is adjusting the former for those planned eventualities such as engineering work diversions. The short term deadline I believe is 12 weeks.
    VAR is minor 'variations' to the WTT e.g. anything that causes a slight adjustment to the WTT on a particular day, eg a planned re-platforming but calling at the same time as normal, and I think it also comes up for any emergencies on the day that stop that day's timetable from working;  so for example that would be your diversion via Westbury following a sudden landslip at Swindon.

    (The 12 week STP deadline is also closely related to why Advance fares are only available up until 12 weeks, by the way.)

    Corrections welcomed as always.

    Paul

    Paul, that is most interesting.  We have booked our Easyjet tickets for next May (Lisbon),  Late July (Bordeaux) and Split (September).  We chose Bristol a starting point because of the convenience of the car, and not being able to book a rail ticket (plus bus to Airport) if we wanted to.  This really belongs on the fares thread (sorry mods) but can you all see that whole tranches of revenue are being lost from we baby-boomer young retired people because The ATOC people can't book advance tickets?  If they could, we might have gone from Gatwick (Cardiff even) and saved the parking fee, etc.  One cannot compete with private car using unknown timetables and thus un-bookable mystery fares.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on January 02, 2013, 19:24:38
    VAR is minor 'variations' to the WTT e.g. anything that causes a slight adjustment to the WTT on a particular day, eg a planned re-platforming but calling at the same time as normal, and I think it also comes up for any emergencies on the day that stop that day's timetable from working;  so for example that would be your diversion via Westbury following a sudden landslip at Swindon.
    Use of VAR paths does vary with different TOCs. FGW use VAR paths for some quite major changes such as Penzance-London services being diverted via Bristol. You also have VSTP paths, Very Short Term, which are generally input on the day for short notice alterations.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Super Guard on January 02, 2013, 21:02:51
    Presumably the sleeper is despatched at Reading using RA indicators because of the lack of driver-guard communication, the CD indicators wouldn't be needed then either.

    Never seen the sleeper despatched at Reading so I'm not sure, but the RA indicators would make sense as I don't *think* there's a driver-guard buzzer on that stock. However it's also possible that it's despatched in the time-honoured way with the guard giving the driver a green flag (or green light, during darkness, fog or falling snow...). That is still the fallback method of despatch in the event of a buzzer/RA indicator failure, and all guards (should...) carry flags and a handlamp in case of need.

    Definitely no driver-guard on the MK3s or the 57s. Despatched using green flag, or green light in the winter, throughout Cornwall. Not sure if the RA indicators are used where installed at the bigger stations though. They use RA indicators at Redruth in the up direction because the 57 is stopped in the tunnel and it wouldn't be particularly easy for the driver to see a flag or light.

    I believe the rule is that RA equipment must be used where provided re: sleeper dispatch.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 03, 2013, 15:12:49
    Colas Rail tamper working on the P14 track at the moment.

    A few weeks ago I suggested that progress with the ramps and steps outside the new Southern entrance might be quite rapid, and it seems that this afternoon they are starting to stand prefabricated concrete wall sections up that align with the rebar extending from the foundation slabs. (As seen on webcam 2/2)

    (By the way have any web cam watchers noticed that today seems to be the first day back for most of the workforce after an extended Christmas & New Year break?  That would suggest they are making acceptable overall progress...)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on January 03, 2013, 21:16:14
    For anyone interested in how platform arrangements are going to work at Reading come the opening of the new platforms it's now possible to view them. Have a look at this link. (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=rdg&date=11%2F04%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=1&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1) New platforms 13 and 14 are divided in to A and B parts with Cross Country services terminating at Reading using B ends, and FGW services terminating from London using A ends. Fast country bound services will depart from Platforms 7, 8 and 9. Quite a change from everything using 7 as is the current situation.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on January 03, 2013, 21:33:41
    Interesting. So, this appears to confirm that finishing p11 will be the first job. Will p10 then close to get the island completed?

    Also interesting to see North Downs services seem to be focused on p5, a pattern that seems to be in place now. Which I think is good, reducing passenger crowding that occurs at p4 with the quick turn around of these services.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 03, 2013, 22:47:35
    For anyone interested in how platform arrangements are going to work at Reading come the opening of the new platforms it's now possible to view them. Have a look at this link. (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=rdg&date=11%2F04%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=1&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1) New platforms 13 and 14 are divided in to A and B parts with Cross Country services terminating at Reading using B ends, and FGW services terminating from London using A ends. Fast country bound services will depart from Platforms 7, 8 and 9. Quite a change from everything using 7 as is the current situation.

    I've posted about XC trains terminating in P13 and sharing with GW stoppers at the other end before, it was clearly stated in a NR Network Change notice a few months ago which I linked to, however this now seems to add confirmation that the platforms will be marked as A and B ends.  (Just like the way they use the island at Southampton for terminators, as came up in discussion before...)

    Edit:
    Remarkably, I just looked through the linked times for the whole day, filtered for XC only, and there seems to be an ECS, 5V82 from Eastleigh depot arriving at 0737, that reaches P13B by running through P8, then via New, Spur and Southern Junctions.  Am I right in thinking that means it would use the eastern underpass?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 03, 2013, 22:54:15
    Interesting. So, this appears to confirm that finishing p11 will be the first job. Will p10 then close to get the island completed?

    Yes. This has been the expected plan for some while now, the date for P11 reopening is the end of August and P10 closes for upgrade about a week later. The exact dates are somewhere a few months back in this thread, page #56, although they were in the engineering access statement for 2013 when it first appeared back in 2011...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 11:59:28
    (By the way have any web cam watchers noticed that today seems to be the first day back for most of the workforce after an extended Christmas & New Year break?  That would suggest they are making acceptable overall progress...)

    I took a look on Boxing Day and thought to myself that if I see workers there then they're in trouble!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 12:05:57
    Remarkably, I just looked through the linked times for the whole day, filtered for XC only, and there seems to be an ECS, 5V82 from Eastleigh depot arriving at 0737, that reaches P13B by running through P8, then via New, Spur and Southern Junctions.  Am I right in thinking that means it would use the eastern underpass?

    Looks like it.  Also several ECS moves from FGW planned to go that way.  A total of 11 trains a day according to the link - only one of which is a passenger train, the 06:08 Reading to Shalford.  An early start for the track bashers!  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2013, 12:08:35
    For anyone interested in how platform arrangements are going to work at Reading come the opening of the new platforms it's now possible to view them. Have a look at this link. (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=rdg&date=11%2F04%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=1&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1) New platforms 13 and 14 are divided in to A and B parts with Cross Country services terminating at Reading using B ends, and FGW services terminating from London using A ends. Fast country bound services will depart from Platforms 7, 8 and 9. Quite a change from everything using 7 as is the current situation.

    I've posted about XC trains terminating in P13 and sharing with GW stoppers at the other end before, it was clearly stated in a NR Network Change notice a few months ago which I linked to, however this now seems to add confirmation that the platforms will be marked as A and B ends.  (Just like the way they use the island at Southampton for terminators, as came up in discussion before...)

    Paul

    Yes, we discussed before how Padd- Rdng locals would be dealt with and whether any of the RL platforms would operate like the Southampton island platform.  I note from the track diagram posted a while back that there are no intermediate signals along P13 or P14 - I wonder how Drivers are supposed to know where they should stop? (ie in the middle of the platform under the canopy, or at the near or far end from where they are entering).

    And talking of canopies (sorry I know I've gone on before about this), the short canopied areas do not sit well with maybe a 5 car XC at one end, a 5 car Turbo at the other, and a canopied gap in the middle.  Still, sod the passengers, they can all get wet at Britain's newest station. 

    More seriously, most passenger injuries occur getting on and off trains, and these are more likely to occur on patforms open to the weather. 

    So I wonder if the A and B arrangement is just temporary.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 12:19:47
    Yes, we discussed before how Padd- Rdng locals would be dealt with and whether any of the RL platforms would operate like the Southampton island platform.  I note from the track diagram posted a while back that there are no intermediate signals along P13 or P14 - I wonder how Drivers are supposed to know where they should stop? (ie in the middle of the platform under the canopy, or at the near or far end from where they are entering).

    All signals controlling moves into 12/13/14 and 15 from either end are fitted with a position light signal (i.e. the two white lights), so I'm guessing that if you get a main aspect you stop in the centre of the platform and if you get a red and then two white lights then you stop at the relevant 'A' or 'B' end (short of any obstruction).  There have been murmurings of discontent with this system amongst drivers and driver managers.  I'll let you know more when I know more...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2013, 12:37:26
    So how are the platforms divided up for Track Circuits?  How will the signaller know where the first train in to the platform has stopped, and whether there is room for the second train?

    a liitle later...  And how common is it for trains carrying passengers to be signalled under calling on signals, unless they're coupling up?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 12:39:37
    I don't know, but if and when I find out I'll post the details.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2013, 12:43:11
    Thanks II, I'd be interested to know. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on January 04, 2013, 13:31:39
    a liitle later...  And how common is it for trains carrying passengers to be signalled under calling on signals, unless they're coupling up?

    Isn't this similar to the situation at Temple Meads, where trains frequently occupy the two sides of the same platform face? Though I don't know whether calling on signals are used, as the route indicators tell the driver which platform to stop at.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 04, 2013, 14:04:39
    Only Platforms 12 to 15 will have divided train detection sections (the division being under the London End of the new link bridge).  There are strict rules on Calling On movements and the signalling controls can be quite complex.  Basically the entry signal should not be more than 800m from the point of obstruction.  In the new station layout there will be entry signals at the immediate ends of the platforms (back to back with the exit signals) and you can see this in the track layout diagrams posted above (I think that some of the new signals are erected already).  Thats not the end of it though as all such movements need to be risk assessed at the time of design to ensure the risks are ALARP (an example of this is the risk is increased if the platform is curved and the obstruction point cannot then been seen until late in the movement).  Generally these days the ORR is very strict about approving such controls but they must have approved these ones ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 04, 2013, 14:09:58
    a liitle later...  And how common is it for trains carrying passengers to be signalled under calling on signals, unless they're coupling up?

    Isn't this similar to the situation at Temple Meads, where trains frequently occupy the two sides of the same platform face? Though I don't know whether calling on signals are used, as the route indicators tell the driver which platform to stop at.
    At BTM there are X signs to tell drivers where to stop.  You are correct that the main entry signals display the correct platform number (the X sign indicating the split point) and the display of a platform number beyond the X sign in the direction of travel is the drivers authority to pass the X sign (otherwise go to jail :P).  The Call On movements are controlled by a subsidiary aspect (two white lights at 45 degrees) on the entry signal and this gives authority to enter an occupied platform up to the X sign and, with the correct platform number displayed, beyond the X sign.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 04, 2013, 14:38:42
    That letter about the Network Change for the new platforms coming into use (that I've linked to a couple of times now, eg post #887) mentions that the 12-15 roads will have 'closing up' signals.  Not a term in regular use as I recall, so are these different to what are normally described as calling on signals - or is it just a local term for the same, or indeed are these what SandTEngineer referred to as 'entry signals'?

    Regarding passenger moves through 'calling on' signals without coupling, I think this is fairly common isn't it?  As well as Southampton as previously discussed, I can think of it happening normally in the bays at Portsmouth and Southsea, and at Portsmouth Harbour too.  Familiarly known as 'top train working', an example is the FGW Cardiff service which at certain times of the day gets a SN train following it into the station and using the London end of the platform.   Mostly this seems to work without the sort of additional signs like they have at Bristol TM.

    Am I right in thinking trains always come to a stop at a Red before getting the calling on indication, so presumably that is the primary safety feature?

    Getting back to Southampton, as far as I can see trains entering platforms 2 and 3 in the down direction stop at the relevant stop marker to position them in the A end by default, but the signal indications seen by drivers of trains such as the terminating XC look the same as far as I can tell - I can only assume they run all the way through because that is what their diagram requires?
     
    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CLPGMS on January 04, 2013, 14:59:44
    The practice of allowing a second train into an already occupied platform was fairly common at Oxford, until, some years ago, when a Thames Trains' Turbo coming from the sidings, ran into the rear of a FGW HST.  Then the practice appeared to cease, except for Turbo coupling movements.  However, on occasions, it is still used, as it was on Friday 28th December, when the 1331 Turbo to Paddington was delayed in the platform while flooding ahead was being investigated.  The following CrossCountry Voyager was allowed to enter the platform behind the Turbo, so that its passengers could alight/board, rather than keeping it at the signal outside the station.  I think that a lot may depend on the combined length of the two trains compared with that of the platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 04, 2013, 15:01:55
    'closing up' signals this i believe was a term in use on LT particularly on the Inner Rail at Victoria Circle Line. Whereby there were a series of signals close together on the approach to the station.

    If there was train already in the station then the following train would be slowed at each signal which would clear just in front of it. Thus in theory the following train kept rolling whilst the previous train departed and the platform was clear. If the platform wasn't clear the next train would stop just in the tunnel a few yards from the platform.

    i believe the system was removed some time ago.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 04, 2013, 15:18:07
    Calling on at Oxford was reinstated for passenger movements about three years ago following a new risk assessment (the rules had changed since the accident - the starter signal now has to be at danger for call on to be allowed). It is used mostly during times of perturbation, as described by CLPGMS.

    The X signs at Bristol (known as St Andrew's Cross) are signals, not signs! When not illuminated, they are a stop signal, just like a red light, and passing them at danger counts as a Spad. The platform indicators on the approach signals are just that - indicators. They do not give authority to proceed past the St Andrew's Cross.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 04, 2013, 15:30:34
    Calling on at Oxford was reinstated for passenger movements about three years ago following a new risk assessment (the rules had changed since the accident - the starter signal now has to be at danger for call on to be allowed). It is used mostly during times of perturbation, as described by CLPGMS.

    The X signs at Bristol (known as St Andrew's Cross) are signals, not signs! When not illuminated, they are a stop signal, just like a red light, and passing them at danger counts as a Spad. The platform indicators on the approach signals are just that - indicators. They do not give authority to proceed past the St Andrew's Cross.

    I think you may have misunderstood my wording (which I tried to keep simple for non-signalling posters on here).  The route indicator on the entry signal will either display the platform number on approach to the X sign (they are not signals and they are not lamp proved and therefore not proved alight in the entry signal controls) or that beyond it.  If the route indicator displays the latter then it is giving authority to pass the X Sign and I have travelled on many trains that do just that.  The Calling On aspect on the entry signal works exactly the same but tells the driver there is an obstruction in the relevant platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 04, 2013, 15:38:37
    That letter about the Network Change for the new platforms coming into use (that I've linked to a couple of times now, eg post #887) mentions that the 12-15 roads will have 'closing up' signals.  Not a term in regular use as I recall, so are these different to what are normally described as calling on signals - or is it just a local term for the same, or indeed are these what SandTEngineer referred to as 'entry signals'?
    You are correct.  As I said before the controls are quite complex.  When the platform is obstructed then the signalling controls will hold the entry signal (the Inner Signal) at danger.  Because the obstruction is also occupying the overlap of the entry signal the next signal back on approach (the outer signal) will also be held at danger.  As the approaching trains reaches the outer signal it will clear to a single yellow.  This is known as the 'Warning Arrangement'.  When the approaching train reaches the entry signal and is proved to be under control the entry signal will clear with the Calling On (two white lights at 45 degrees) aspect giving authority for the train to proceed to the point of obstruction.  The entry signal once used to be described as the 'Closing Up Signal' as that is exactly what it allows.  I used the term 'Entry Signal' in an attempt to KISS for non-signalling forum members on here ::).

    Modern Calling On controls do not allow the exit signal to be cleared at the same time as the entry Calling On signal.  This is because when the train is moving up to the obstruction there have been instances in the past where the exiting train suddenly came to a halt and the following train thought it could carry on moving and then misjuged its braking and ran into the rear of it. :'(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 15:42:04
    I think you may have misunderstood my wording (which I tried to keep simple for non-signalling posters on here).  The route indicator on the entry signal will either dispay the platform number on approach to the X sign (they are not signals and they are not lamp proved and therefore not proved alight in the entry signal controls) or that beyond it.  If the route indicator displays the latter then it is giving authority to pass the X Sign and I have travelled on many trains that do just that.  The Calling On aspect on the entry signal works exactly the same but tells the driver there is an obstruction in the relevant platform.

    That's right, number wise at the entry signal we were always told back in the old days that it was 'odd for the Oxford end' of the platform and 'even for the Exeter end' of the platform if arriving from the eastern direction.  The St. Andrews cross only acts as a sign to indicate where the two separate platforms are located.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2013, 16:02:28
    So, at Reading, are there Platform Indicators on the entry signals to P12-P15 to tell the Driver where to stop if the platform is clear and he/she gets a green or yellow? If there are, do they say just A or B, or is there an option for "middle" ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 04, 2013, 16:29:36
    Its a few years now since I did my dispatch and guards training, but I clearly recall that the St Andrews Cross at Bristol was a signal, and not just a marker to split the platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 04, 2013, 16:34:27
    So, at Reading, are there Platform Indicators on the entry signals to P12-P15 to tell the Driver where to stop if the platform is clear and he/she gets a green or yellow? If there are, do they say just A or B, or is there an option for "middle" ?

    No route indicators so drivers have to use their judgment and crawl in very slowly ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 04, 2013, 16:52:19
    Its a few years now since I did my dispatch and guards training, but I clearly recall that the St Andrews Cross at Bristol was a signal, and not just a marker to split the platforms.

    Although it is a signal, in the same way a painted red stop board in a depot is a signal, it is effectively just a marker point because the authority to pass it is given by the route indication at the entry signal as described in the posts above.  It is a very unusual method of working, unique perhaps?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 08, 2013, 04:00:17
    Interesting to see Reading station develop. Pre Christmas I would have thought things were looking good for Easter - but I am less sure now.

    Concrete forms for step/escalator access to western side of 14/15 are not complete.
    Metal structure for canapies missing on all new platform (some struts have gone in this week)
    At least 16 escalators need to be installed
    Finishing of platform buildings and canopy

    To me, that's ALOT of work.

    Also, has anyone else noted the additional line laid between the up and down reliefs? It starts by the cow lane bridge, off the Up RL, running half the length of the maintainence shed being built. I thought it was a turnback for terminating trains but the three lines are too close together for a walkway to be built for allowing a driver to change cabs.

    It is hinted at on the first diagram on post 55 - you can see the RLs are apart but the middle line is not showing.

    What is this line for (no connection at western end BTW) ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 08, 2013, 10:15:47

    Also, has anyone else noted the additional line laid between the up and down reliefs? It starts by the cow lane bridge, off the Up RL, running half the length of the maintainence shed being built. I thought it was a turnback for terminating trains but the three lines are too close together for a walkway to be built for allowing a driver to change cabs.

    It is hinted at on the first diagram on post 55 - you can see the RLs are apart but the middle line is not showing.

    I don't think anyone has welcomed lbraine to the forum yet, so I will.

    I'm sure the station work is still on schedule.  There's no way they would have had a ten day shutdown over the Christmas and New Year period otherwise.  The optimists amongst us have discussed stuff like the escalators only a few pages ago...

    Edited to add:  Webcam 1 view 3 shows the concrete panels for the 14/15 escalators growing by the day, and what looks like the final prefabricated sections have been delivered to site.  That'll take a few days to fit together.

    The west end track layout is very much in transition, because in the interim they have to leave space for four tracks (two mains and two reliefs) in the space between the flyover worksite and the depot.  So effectively the reliefs are roughly about two tracks north of their final location all the way along past the sidings until the four tracks slew back across onto the normal layout (as suggested by the first track drawing you refer to.  Once the flyover is built the mains will move southwards onto the flyover, and one of the temporary reliefs becomes an up direction good loop, and IIRC there is a parallel track that is primarily for depot and sidings access.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 08, 2013, 10:22:04
    As a layman, but a frequent traveller through Reading, I am often suprised at how things look like they may be ready on time and then everything slots into place.

    On a smaller scale, I seem to remember similar discussions about (the new) P4 and then P5 and P6 which from memory were completed and brought into service on time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 08, 2013, 22:43:50
    I was concerned that there was a lot of work to do on the south side before the new underpass could be used, which I assume needs to be by 1st March?

    The use of precast modular construction for the ramps is certainly fast and I am sure these will be done in time now, but the plan shows steps from the entrance of the underpass up towards the station building. These seem to be under the blue site huts.  Do we know when these will be moved?

    There still seems a lot of work to do before 1st March if this entrance is to be in use by then.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 09, 2013, 10:44:55
    I'm with Paul on this one.  An extended Xmas break for the workers suggests all is well within hand.  I'm sure there'll be the odd snagging works to do here and there after opening, but Easter is still a fair way away - eleven weeks should be plenty of time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on January 09, 2013, 18:36:02
    To an outsider looking in to a project it can often seem illogical why things are done in the order they are and can seem madness that something is not happening on part of the site that seems dormant.  There will be very detailed plans in place there are a number of activities that done mix and have to be kept separated, also contract strategy comes into play don't want lots of staff sitting around doing nowt. 

    All large projects have to go through a risk review at 11 weeks to go the Reading project teams will have had a 12 week go no-go assessment, there are a number of other assessments the next key one will be 6 weeks, this not held at 6 weeks but a week or so before.  After 6 weeks there is a 4 week and the 2 week at which stage they can go to daily.

    There   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johngreg on January 10, 2013, 12:50:46
    I was lucky to go on a site visit of the Reading station works in late November (purely as a "tourist") The introduction presentations, and the site itself underline the scale of the job and emphasised to me the last posting about the projects, within projects and all the timetabled checks. The number of different contractors on site during my time there and the obvious co-ordination of them was very impressive.

    Thank-you to the FGW staff that arranged the visit.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 10, 2013, 12:52:20
    Another point is that the definition of 'finished' is fairly flexible.  Some of the detailed finishing touches might not be made by early April - I suppose the opposite sort of thing to removing the roofs from original platforms while they were still open, for example.

    As long as the new parts of the station are safe for passenger use, there's no need for them to be at absolute 100% completion, 99% might be good though!

    Similarly outside the station south side, are the alterations to the old bus station area by Reading BC included in 'completed', or by early March (when the car park link closes) will NR and others only have to provide a safe route through a building site controlled by those others?  Potentially passengers affected might have to turn right and walk to the end of the ramps, then double back towards the station.  (By the way the first prefabricated step sections are going in this afternoon...)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 10, 2013, 13:57:30
    As long as the new parts of the station are safe for passenger use, there's no need for them to be at absolute 100% completion, 99% might be good though!

    Hence my comment on snagging works.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 10, 2013, 22:01:01
    Similarly outside the station south side, are the alterations to the old bus station area by Reading BC included in 'completed', or by early March (when the car park link closes) will NR and others only have to provide a safe route through a building site controlled by those others?  Potentially passengers affected might have to turn right and walk to the end of the ramps, then double back towards the station. 

    A diagram of the walking route is now shown on the FGW website (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/Reading%20Station%20access.ashx)

    Looks very direct, but then it is only a diagram.

    Also lists what services will use each platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 11, 2013, 00:43:19
    Makes you wonder who the leaflet is aimed at when it mentions Up and Down trains - to say nothing of freight trains on platforms 12 and 15!   ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 11, 2013, 00:54:07
    Seems a lot simpler than what the online train times sites are showing...

    Eg XC are down for 8,9,10,13 & 14 at various times. Nothing about 13/14 being split either...

    Suggesting the Paddington stoppers all go from P13 will be quite amusing for people stood there watching the next one leave from P14...  ???

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on January 11, 2013, 00:56:04
    Yes I agree Bobm, perhaps if up and down were defined somewhere or were maybe something slightly more common sense like North/South East/West London/Penzance etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 11, 2013, 12:00:22
    Two comments on that web page:

    1) Up to 15 minutes extra - that's an extraordinary amount of time to allow for that walk, even if you are at the top of the multi-storey and want to board a train at the extreme end of Platform 4! Hopefully the actual difference in practice will be less than 5 minutes. 
    2) It seems to hint that only part of the transfer deck will be opening after Easter with access to Platforms 1-7 still via the subway.  Or am I reading that incorrectly?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on January 11, 2013, 12:13:54
    Yes I agree Bobm, perhaps if up and down were defined somewhere or were maybe something slightly more common sense like North/South East/West London/Penzance etc.

    Perhaps with all this recent publicity (NR 2014 - 2109 plans, tube 150, floods, etc) they think we are all rail buffs now. 

    Could be.  In Reading we always said 'up to London' when we lived there, as we have wherever we lived in the West Country.

    I see FGW apparently thinks the WoE is west of Castle Cary whereas in Bath, Weston, Thornbury (and to a much, much, lesser extent College Green) they think it's the greater Bristol area.  By the way I had to look up where the pulsating centre of South Glos was to find out it was the vibrant metropolis of Thornbury (shortly to be rail connected it must be acknowledged).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 11, 2013, 12:21:05
    Two comments on that web page:
     
    2) It seems to hint that only part of the transfer deck will be opening after Easter with access to Platforms 1-7 still via the subway.  Or am I reading that incorrectly?

    I agree it looks odd the way they've written that bit.  It implies an absolutely massive problem for interchanging if they are correct.  Perhaps they are basing it on starting from the north side it will be slightly quicker to go that way rather than all the way up and over the transfer deck, and then down to ground level again?   ???

    An alternative possibility - perhaps it really only applies to the period between Tuesday 2nd and Monday 8th April, when the entire service is being run through P12-15, and P8-11 will all be closed?  After all the second diagram is captioned 'fully operational from 8th April' at the top...

    Daftest aspect of the first drawing (that I think we've failed to mention so far) is that they've probably started with an existing sketch and adapted the Vastern Rd bridge to become the existing footbridge. Hence it being shown passing over the far ends of the Southern platforms and the new junctions?   

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on January 11, 2013, 12:37:17
    Makes you wonder who the leaflet is aimed at when it mentions Up and Down trains - to say nothing of freight trains on platforms 12 and 15!   ;D

    I think it's reasonably explicit in stating "from Didcot direction" or similar, in addition to the use of up or down. Though maybe wouldn't get the crystal mark for plain English. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: animationmilo on January 13, 2013, 02:14:00
    Are they still diverting trains via Banbury on weekend 5th to 8th April?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 13, 2013, 11:30:15
    Are they still diverting trains via Banbury on weekend 5th to 8th April?

    Yes,

    The trouble is that for closset track bashers like me who have still not done the Foxhall curve, livng East of Reading  means you have to get to Padd, which I not sure you can do from Slough this Easter, and then go right through to Swindon.

    I've also still  got to do Yeovil Pen Mill - Yeovil Jn. The railtour that was meant to do it missed it out through lack of pilotman. It was Charing Cross to Weymouth and back to Waterloo, all the way along the coast.

    On the lighter side how many reversals. But they were easy 33's and TC's.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 13, 2013, 11:42:04
    The FGW document states "..........will be able to follow a specially-marshalled walking route.....".  Does this mean that it will be guided walk through what will still be a building worksite (looks likely from the webcams).  This could add to the time as there may have to be single line working with one staff member taking people through in groups ;D :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 13, 2013, 12:05:54
    The trouble is that for closset track bashers like me who have still not done the Foxhall curve, livng East of Reading  means you have to get to Padd, which I not sure you can do from Slough this Easter, and then go right through to Swindon.

    Now I know why I moved to Swindon!   ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: adc82140 on January 13, 2013, 12:34:27
    Having read the document I reckon they're just covering their backsides by stating 15 minutes extra, so no-one tries to claim compensation if they miss their train. They also have to consider a worst case scenario- someone trying to get access with a bike, pushchair and a double bass  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 13, 2013, 12:36:25
    It is surprising and depressing that FGW should produce such a poorly designed document as that on access routes from 28th February.  It's full of errors, omissions and inconsistencies, some of which have been mentioned on these pages.  Before publication it should have been tested on a sample of Jo Publics - this would have ensured that errors etc could have been revealed and corrected first.

    According to the second diagram, if I arrive on P7 on a fast from Padd after 29th March and want to get my stopper to Pangbourne, I'm supposed to leave the station by the western entrance, use the subway, re-enter the station by the northen entrance, and then go down to P12.  It may be this is only a temporary arrangment until 8th April, but I can't tell from the diagrams.  

    Of course it may be that the existing footbridge has got "forgotten" in the second diagram.  Common sense would seem to point to the existing footbridge (albeit with the link to the car park cut off) staying open until the new footbridge is complelety open.





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on January 13, 2013, 13:25:01
    Are they still diverting trains via Banbury on weekend 5th to 8th April?

    Only on Sunday 7th and Monday 8th.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 13, 2013, 16:14:06
    The new (temporary) Whitehouse Junction is being installed over this and next Sunday.  Whitehouse Junction is at the very western end of the new depot and will (from Easter) mean that the main lines close, the relief lines become the 'new' main lines and the goods line become the 'new' relief lines.  The map on page #55 of this thread explains that much better than I just have!

    As a result both this and next Sunday passenger trains are using the goods loops - thought I'd mention that just in case there's any track bashers out there!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 13, 2013, 16:19:45
    Another strange paragraph here:

    Quote
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/About-Us/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements

    "Reading Station will be open for South West Trains services (Platforms 4&5), and FGW North Downs services (Platform 2) ^ closed Sunday 07 April"

    Have they probably accidentally chopped a bit out of the draft information, surely it's Newbury and Basingstoke stoppers that are using P2, and North Downs will use P4/5 as normal?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 14, 2013, 14:10:32
    ...According to the second diagram, if I arrive on P7 on a fast from Padd after 29th March and want to get my stopper to Pangbourne, I'm supposed to leave the station by the western entrance, use the subway, re-enter the station by the northen entrance, and then go down to P12.  It may be this is only a temporary arrangment until 8th April, but I can't tell from the diagrams. 

    That's another part of the problem - they've provided info about how to get to P7 unnecessarily, as a check of the timetable for the whole 10 day period shows that P7 is out of use throughout (as are P8/9/10/11) and your hypothetical connection will not be a problem, as all down trains will be using the new island.   

    It's fair to say they've let a lot of poor information out into the wild without thoroughly checking it...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 14, 2013, 16:41:54
    That's a fair point, Paul, so it looks to be OK if your arriving at Reading from Padd.  But for passengers arriving on P1-P6 (which are open over Easter) how will they get to P12-P15 for an onward connection?  Is the existing footbridge open or not?

    ..later  ie use old foot bridge to P8/9 or P10/11 then walk down platform to use new footbridge to P12-P15.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 14, 2013, 18:49:03

    It's fair to say they've let a lot of poor information out into the wild without thoroughly checking it...

    Paul

    Will the person/people responsible get a "Please Explain.." memo like a Driver would get?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on January 15, 2013, 00:15:52
    www.therailengineer.com/2013/01/08/reading-remodelling-takes-shape

    Interesting article (but a few details wrong...)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 15, 2013, 14:29:09
    They seem to be really flying along with the access ramps by the south end of the station subway today, a whole load of additional pre-fabricated sections have been placed this morning.  They are also backfilling behind the inner 'wall' against the building foundations.  So, given fair weather, I predict that'll be ready for the finishing trades by this time next week... 

    Likewise the last few bits of the P14/15 stair and escalator walls have appeared over the last couple of days. 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on January 18, 2013, 10:54:59
    So, given fair weather...

    ;) Indeed - the webcams look most impressive at the moment.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 18, 2013, 11:19:16
    So, given fair weather...

    ;) Indeed - the webcams look most impressive at the moment.

    Ah, you didn't know the bit out the front is to be the start of the new Bobsleigh course then?   ;D

    I'm somewhat surprised to see there's concrete being pumped in at the moment though, they seem to have been doing the roof over the subway extension, and the top of the steps.  Seems to have started snowing as they were getting towards the end of the job, but I wonder if they should have even started given the forecast.   

    Any concrete boffins out there?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on January 18, 2013, 11:36:41
    Concrete cures more slowly at low temperatures, and does not cure at all at very low temperatures.
    Large masses are often OK since the curing process produces a certain amount of heat. Small masses of concrete such as thin floor slabs laid onto a frosty subsurface may fail to cure properly or at all.
    Conditions at Reading at present though snowy are probably not that cold, maybe just below freezing.

    To a certain extent, matters may be improved by storing the materials in a warm building and by use of warm water to mix the concrete.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 18, 2013, 21:55:15
    I saw this picture on twitter. I assume the tweeter wants it published to the entire universe, and that he / it /she holds the copyright, because I have not received an answer to my question re the same. Viewer advisory is discretionary, and let me know if you don't want it posted here.

    So busy with the legals, I forgot where I was. Here's a picture from Reading:

    (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/Boyamijealous_7108a707/Reading_zpsfd4054ac.jpeg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on January 18, 2013, 22:38:35
    I'm sure Mark won't mind. I retweeted on both my account and the FGW account and it got several retweets from that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 19, 2013, 11:15:11
    Must get down to Reading soon there's a lot going on which I need to catch up with.

    Can couple it with a visit to the Hobgoblin and the Pie Shop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 19, 2013, 11:34:29
    the Pie Shop.

    Are you referring to Sweeney & Todds in Castle Street?  Excellent tucker there.  Meanwhile the Hobgoblin is now known as the Alehouse.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on January 19, 2013, 15:45:56
    I'm sure Mark won't mind. I retweeted on both my account and the FGW account and it got several retweets from that.

    Ollie, when i wrote here to you about your photos, as a newbie, I had no idea you were an employee, so just to say how grateful I was for the captions, and thank you for taking all this trouble to keep us informed. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 22, 2013, 22:50:03
    I'm not sure if we've discussed it, and I personally only spotted it when the physical signal was installed the other week, but there is a turnback signal being installed on the down relief at Tilehurst station (TR1760).  An interesting addition to the signalling flexibility - I'm guessing it is to facilitate the easy reversal of services to allow trains via Southcote Junction that want to call at Reading, to do so at weekends whilst the dive under and track layout is altered over the coming years?  Can't think of any other purpose to it (though it might be useful when things are not going to plan!).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on January 22, 2013, 23:38:39
    There's four service a day reversing at Tilehurst from the 2nd-5th April, the week when only the new Relief line platforms are open at Reading. Will these perhaps use it? Service btw are:
    1K71 0520 Bristol Temple Meads-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00266/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1A72 0604 Frome-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00041/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1C91 1703 London Paddington-Paignton (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00158/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1C94 1800 London Paddington-Exeter St Davids (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00162/2013/04/02/advanced)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on January 23, 2013, 02:25:02
    I'm sure Mark won't mind. I retweeted on both my account and the FGW account and it got several retweets from that.

    Ollie, when i wrote here to you about your photos, as a newbie, I had no idea you were an employee, so just to say how grateful I was for the captions, and thank you for taking all this trouble to keep us informed. 

    No problem. I know I still haven't fully captioned them, one thing after another gets in the way. Hope you liked the photos though :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on January 23, 2013, 06:41:59
    1K71 0520 Bristol Temple Meads-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00266/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1A72 0604 Frome-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00041/2013/04/02/advanced)

    Taking over an hour each, I note, from Reading West to Paddington, with just one intermediate public stop at Reading [General].


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 23, 2013, 10:56:40
    There's four service a day reversing at Tilehurst from the 2nd-5th April, the week when only the new Relief line platforms are open at Reading. Will these perhaps use it? Service btw are:
    1K71 0520 Bristol Temple Meads-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00266/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1A72 0604 Frome-London Paddington (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00041/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1C91 1703 London Paddington-Paignton (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00158/2013/04/02/advanced)
    1C94 1800 London Paddington-Exeter St Davids (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P00162/2013/04/02/advanced)

    Yes, I'm sure they will.  Thanks for providing those details.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 24, 2013, 15:14:14
    February issue of Modern Railways has just arrived and in it there is an excellent article on the Reading redevelopment.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 27, 2013, 06:52:52
    The new platforms yesterday. No escalators in situ yet (note the lack of stair access to the new platforms.

    Platform 11 edge profile half completed, due to current lift shaft working being in the way (does any one know how the is going to be resolved ? You can't complete P 11 without access to P 10 being removed. In fact track at London end of P12 cannot be laid as current P 11 terminating bay is too close to P12 alignment. Given P10/11 are the main lines platforms to London (eventually) these works do look like the potential bottleneck.

    Platform 12 surface not completed. No light fittings on any of the new platform fittings or structures.

    It's going to be a race over the next half a dozen weeks to complete this work!! And the remaining lack of escalators (8 for sure, 12 including P10/11) and the required commissioning time....

    My bet will be that platforms open with just one side being open with escalators


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 27, 2013, 09:21:12
    Platform 11 isn't opening at Easter so no problem with it not being completed.  The old bay Platform 11 closes at the start of the blockade so (with the footbridge span going four weeks before) that gives time to demolish the existing Platform 10/11 access and lay the new track through Platform 12.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 27, 2013, 10:45:36
    FGW have made a few changes to their walking route plan we discussed a few pages back.  It's now showing the new footbridge fully open from 29 March with all platforms accessible from both entrances - before it appeared to show no access across the footbridge between P7 and P8.  And it would be clearer if the text block on the 29 March onwards Drawing stating "New west entrance with access to all platforms" was below P1/2 and not next to the subway entrance.

    Still, it's better than it was before.  I now know how I get from P6 (which seems to have its tracks removed) to P12 over Easter.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 27, 2013, 13:15:00
    The new platforms yesterday. No escalators in situ yet (note the lack of stair access to the new platforms.

    If you look on the webcams on the other side the escalator for Platforms 14/15 was lifted in last night. The others are also just visible on that side.


    Platform 11 isn't opening at Easter so no problem with it not being completed.  The old bay Platform 11 closes at the start of the blockade so (with the footbridge span going four weeks before) that gives time to demolish the existing Platform 10/11 access and lay the new track through Platform 12.

    But surely access is still needed to Platform 10 from the new bridge transfer deck.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 27, 2013, 15:30:04
    The part of the platform 11 surface under the transfer deck is completed though - and that's where the access to platform 10 will have to be. There has been far more progress behind the hoardings at the west end of the P10/11 island - it's clearly the main reason P10 was built out temporarily in the first place.

    Regarding the perceived lack of stair access though, mentioned earlier by lbraine, islands 10/11, 12/13 and 14/15 only get a single staircase on the west (country) side of the transfer deck, (each island except 8/9 having 3 escalators of which 2 are on the London side), and all these stairs are in position already - P14/15 was only installed recently but the other two were much earlier.  So even in the unlikely event of all the escalators not being ready, they'll have stairs available - and although we have no idea how they are doing with the lifts either, why is there so much doubt that they can get the escalators installed anyway?  As we discussed a few months back, just because London Underground take months (if not years) to replace escalators has no relevance to a clean installation of a new escalator...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 27, 2013, 21:50:29
    Thanks for the information about the escalators.

    I was not aware that only the London side of the transfer deck was getting escalators. My concern was based on the observation that to get 2 escalators in place on the London side of P8/9 has taken nearly 4 weeks - and I extrapolated that metric for all the others.

    I wasn't try to voice a concern - just an observation.

    I did notice that the width of the opening for P8/9 was wider than P10/11. I thought it was strange that the platforms handling the bulk of the fast trains to London seemed to have no more (or less) capacity to move people up and down to the transfer lines than the new relief platforms.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on January 27, 2013, 21:51:48
    Had a look in to the boarded up bits in 8/9 on Thursday and engineers were busy installing the escalator treads on the eastern side of the deck.

    On an unrelated subject does anyone know why the embankment wall on the Northern side of the lines, just before the Vastern Road Bridge, 'juts' out.

    Previously the old wall ran straight until it reached the old pumping(?) building, which of course has now been demolished.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 27, 2013, 21:55:01
    Thanks for the information about the escalators.

    I was not aware that only the London side of the transfer deck was getting escalators. My concern was based on the observation that to get 2 escalators in place on the London side of P8/9 has taken nearly 4 weeks - and I extrapolated that metric for all the others.

    I wasn't try to voice a concern - just an observation.

    I did notice that the width of the opening for P8/9 was wider than P10/11. I thought it was strange that the platforms handling the bulk of the fast trains to London seemed to have no more (or less) capacity to move people up and down to the transfer lines than the new relief platforms.

    I think you may have misunderstood.

    On the London side there will be two escalators
    On the country side there will one escalator (presumably up) and one set of stairs

    On the Country side where the roof has not previously been fitted the escalator has been dropped in in what looks like a single unit before the roof was put on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 27, 2013, 23:04:59
    I did notice that the width of the opening for P8/9 was wider than P10/11. I thought it was strange that the platforms handling the bulk of the fast trains to London seemed to have no more (or less) capacity to move people up and down to the transfer lines than the new relief platforms.

    ellendune has reiterated what I posted that there are three escalators on the three islands, thanks.

    P8/P9 is effectively larger than needed by accident, because it was sized to include the two bays, the old 6&7.  But that doesn't necessarily mean P10/11 is too narrow.  In any case the maximum flow on a platform will be that following a westbound arrival - and P8/9 will be able to deal with trains emptying out on both sides at once.  People arriving at the station to get on an up departure on P10/11 do not arrive in whole trainloads, but at random intervals.  That is probably the reason why P8/9 is getting four escalators and two stairs.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 27, 2013, 23:10:07
    On an unrelated subject does anyone know why the embankment wall on the Northern side of the lines, just before the Vastern Road Bridge, 'juts' out.

    Previously the old wall ran straight until it reached the old pumping(?) building, which of course has now been demolished.

    I don't think everything was demolished - the last time I looked (before it became hidden) I'm fairly sure that some of the brickwork that formed various accesses under the embankment was still in place.  I assumed they left it because they didn't want to excavate under the operational railway, but that's just thinking aloud really...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 28, 2013, 20:28:50
    Lights on at country end of new platform gantry.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 30, 2013, 12:39:06
    A number of posts over the recent weeks have suggested that the track through P12 under the existing footbridge cannot be installed until the first weekend of the blockade, but I now have some doubt about whether this is correct, as sleepers are being laid today through the space between the existing P10 lift shaft brickwork, and the face of P12.

    (I did think earlier that as viewed from the end of P11 there doesn't seem much of a width problem.  What is known to be a conflict is the old footbridge's mid point supporting legs - these have to go in order to complete the platform surface.)

    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading01#   webcam 1/1

    By the way that link should take you straight to the webcam site without having to enter the double password, I don't know if anyone else has discovered this?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 30, 2013, 12:42:40
    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading01#   webcam 1/1

    By the way that link should take you straight to the webcam site without having to enter the double password, I don't know if anyone else has discovered this?

    I have now! Thanks.  And, I agree with your comments regarding P12.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 31, 2013, 10:59:36
    Rails installed overnight alongside P12, at least west of the existing footbridge - be interesting to hear how far towards the London end they go if anyone is passing through the station later?

    Another webcam observation (from cam 01/3) is that there appears to be metalwork being fastened to the bare concrete face of the west side stairs and escalator housing on P14/15.  Likewise around the lift shafts under the transfer deck.  Hopefully this means there'll be some sort of architectural cladding over the bare concrete, which I hadn't expected before now. Should improve the finished product though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on January 31, 2013, 13:21:54
    There was a large amount of digging going on at the far western end of P8/P9 yesterday evening, quite why I could not tell.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 31, 2013, 18:58:33
    Cladding rails are certainly present on lift shafts on P8/7 and new platforms. Not 10/11 due to lack of space.

    Some bricks for new platform surface laid by new escalator shaft on P8/9

    Some platform roof frames now started on country end of P10/11


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Timmer on February 02, 2013, 07:38:42
    Timetables for the Easter period are now available on the FGW website Reading Station Improvements page:
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 02, 2013, 11:22:37
    Rails installed overnight alongside P12, at least west of the existing footbridge - be interesting to hear how far towards the London end they go if anyone is passing through the station later?

    I changed trains there yesterday morning and did have time for a quick look. As far as I could see (it was raining hard at the time) it is connected in at the London end.

    Another webcam observation (from cam 01/3) is that there appears to be metalwork being fastened to the bare concrete face of the west side stairs and escalator housing on P14/15.  Likewise around the lift shafts under the transfer deck.  Hopefully this means there'll be some sort of architectural cladding over the bare concrete, which I hadn't expected before now. Should improve the finished product though...

    Saw at close quarters - the metalwork is indeed fixings for some sort of cladding.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 02, 2013, 12:17:13
    Timetables for the Easter period are now available on the FGW website Reading Station Improvements page:
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements

    Well thats a good start.  Page 4 in the West of England timetable is blank >:( ::) :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 02, 2013, 12:42:21
    Timetables for the Easter period are now available on the FGW website Reading Station Improvements page:
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements

    Thanks - booked my Good Friday trip from Swindon to Westbury via Banbury and Waterloo!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 04, 2013, 16:40:40
    Rails installed overnight alongside P12, at least west of the existing footbridge - be interesting to hear how far towards the London end they go if anyone is passing through the station later?

    I changed trains there yesterday morning and did have time for a quick look. As far as I could see (it was raining hard at the time) it is connected in at the London end.


    Thanks for checking.   :)

    I also had a look today from the footbridge, and I've attached a quick phone picture, which also shows how well the future down relief 'lines up' with P12.  In my (totally unqualified) opinion, the P11 track does seem to get quite close to it - I doubt a train would be allowed through P12 yet.  Having said that, it was also a rumour about the new P4 and P5 at one stage during that construction, but it turned out not to be the case.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on February 05, 2013, 22:42:45
    There's been a lot of talk about the escalators on the new footbridge on here so I got a quick photo from 8/9 yesterday of the new escalators in place, looks like two escalators and stairs on this side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 06, 2013, 12:15:55
    That's right, as per the plans P8/P9 is the only island with four escalators and two staircases.

    What I thought when on P8/P9, is that with the views available at the moment behind the hoardings you really do start to get an idea of how much circulating space there is?

    The open space along the length of the platform, both in the two areas between the foot of the escalators and the platform buildings, and under the transfer deck around the lift shafts, will be huge.  It also occurred to me that when P9/P10 is complete it too will have more than enough space for waiting passengers.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 06, 2013, 17:56:22
    I do agree: I too was at Reading yesterday afternoon having come non-stop on an HST from Bristol Parkway (but that's another story).  Whatever I've said about the uncanopied areas (which I stand by), there are indeed large and spacious canopied areas on P12/13 and P14/15 under the new footbridge and adjacent to the escalators and stair wells. 

    Just hope that trains stopping outside the canopied areas are the exception rather than the rule. 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 07, 2013, 08:34:48
    Observed this AM: the new lines laid across the new Cow Lane bridge by the new depot have been removed. Includes ballast and membranes laid. Bare concrete of tunnel roof once again visible.

    Anyone know why ?

    Signalling on London side looks energised, including North South link.

    Platform roofing panels going up both side of escalator/stairs on P10/11 are advanced, P12/13 has started country end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on February 07, 2013, 12:47:55
    Picked up printed timetable at Taplow for Easter and following weekend.

    If you travelling locally East of Westbury or Didcot you will basically be on a bus for part or even all of the journey.

    We are  marroned in both directions at Taplow with just a shuttle train  with buses West of Maidenhead and East of Slough over Easter.

    The following weekend we can't get West of Maidenhead


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 08, 2013, 10:23:34
    There was quite a major change to the roofing progress last night, a significant section of the sloping roof over the P12/13 country side staircase and escalator has been installed, and many of the gaps in the P10/11 roof cladding are nearly all closed as well.

    I wonder if the rest of the roof will start appearing quickly now - there's also more of the main steelwork support structure appeared recently on the London side of the same areas.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 08, 2013, 10:44:57
    Observed this AM: the new lines laid across the new Cow Lane bridge by the new depot have been removed. Includes ballast and membranes laid. Bare concrete of tunnel roof once again visible.

    Anyone know why ?

    I noticed that, too.  Not sure why.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 09, 2013, 14:28:27
    A very large crane has appeared and large escalators for the London side of platforms 10/11, 12/13 or 14/5. Could they deliver and lift all in in one session?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 09, 2013, 17:10:07
    I think that might be a reasonable assumption - I doubt they'd want to hire a crane like that too often if at all possible.  When I saw it at first I wondered if it would be to take down the tower crane - that will need a mobile eventually I imagine.

    I still expect that one of these weeks there'll be a sudden surge in activity! As I noted in that earlier post ^^ the roof sections can go on quite quickly once the frame is complete...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on February 09, 2013, 17:12:42
    I have decided to take leave the week after Easter but I imagine I will see quite a difference when I restart my daily journey through Reading the week after!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 09, 2013, 18:14:16
    I think that might be a reasonable assumption - I doubt they'd want to hire a crane like that too often if at all possible.  When I saw it at first I wondered if it would be to take down the tower crane - that will need a mobile eventually I imagine.

    I still expect that one of these weeks there'll be a sudden surge in activity! As I noted in that earlier post ^^ the roof sections can go on quite quickly once the frame is complete...

    Paul

    I expect they wanted to lift all the escalators in on the London side before they started doing the roof sections, so once they have done that they could get on quite quickly.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 10, 2013, 12:38:46
    Looking at the scene just now, it looks like only the P14/15 escalators can be lifted whole, further lifts seem to be of sections of escalator.  That would imply the next island is still out of reach for that mobile crane once the greater load of a whole machine needs lifting.

    Presumably every ground level delivery or crane lift is given its own cost analysis dependent on distance etc - I remember it being pointed out that some of the escalator sections for P8/9 were delivered across the tracks from the south entrance during overnight line closures.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 10, 2013, 13:23:12
    Looks like that crane won't reach P10/11 so they will have to be lifted in the same way they did P8/9


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 10, 2013, 14:09:52
    There's an escalator fit progressing in the P10/11 housing just now, (seen on webcam 1/2 about 1400 on 10th) and working back through the webcam history it looks like it was delivered in bits yesterday, using tracked lifting devices moving along the P11 trackbed.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 10, 2013, 17:33:11
    Escalator going into P14/15 London side today


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 10, 2013, 17:34:12
    Nearly done...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 10, 2013, 19:25:40
    Distinct lack of progress this afternoon.  They put one piece of the P12/13 escalator, lifted the next piece up, then left it hanging there for a long time before putting it down and have done nothing with the crane since.

    If they had finished with the crane I am sure they would have taken it away, so I guess something is not going to plan.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 10, 2013, 20:10:39
    Weather problems?  Might just be the wind speed, especially if they are trying to accurately position stuff?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 10, 2013, 20:30:28
    No much wind here, but am 45 miles to the west.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 10, 2013, 20:55:44
    Seem to have started lifting again now (with another truck load of gear) as at 2050...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 10, 2013, 21:02:56
    Yes do now seem to be off loading the truck that has been waiting there since lunchtime. I am sure the driver is most relieved. There is another one queued up on camera 3 though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on February 10, 2013, 21:40:06
    Could they have exceed their time under the Control of Pollution Act 1974 Section 61


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 10, 2013, 22:46:01
    Or might just have run out of drivers hours. Perhaps not - still unloading trucks at 23:20.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 11, 2013, 14:22:51
    Having watched them on the webcam history craneing bits of escalator onto P12/13 this morning, I think my supposition last night about windspeeds being a problem may have been reasonable.  The escalators for this island appear to be being lifted in three parts, and joined together in situ while hanging off the crane.  With workers in close proximity (presumably doing up nuts and bolts) they wouldn't want any unexpected movements at all.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 11, 2013, 18:54:39
    Having watched them on the webcam history craneing bits of escalator onto P12/13 this morning, I think my supposition last night about windspeeds being a problem may have been reasonable.  The escalators for this island appear to be being lifted in three parts, and joined together in situ while hanging off the crane.  With workers in close proximity (presumably doing up nuts and bolts) they wouldn't want any unexpected movements at all.

    Paul

    You may be right I was not aware that was any wind but it may be local.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 11, 2013, 23:35:21
    Changing the subject slightly, but just to clear up a couple of points that we've discussed in the past which have now become clearer:

    1) Method of working for Platforms 12-15
    They all have 'Closing In' signals at either end of the platform and are split into an 'A' and 'B' end.  Trains of up to 5 carriages in length that are terminating and heading back out in the same direction will stop at a 'Rear Clear' stop board located approximately mid-way along the platform in either direction ('A' end is London, 'B' end is the Country End).  That will then allow the signaller to route another train (again of up to 5 carriages) into the other part of the platform using permissive working arrangements at the Closing In signal (i.e. a red aspect with two white lights).

    Trains of more than 5 carriages will stop at the relevant stop car marker further down the platform, as will through trains of any length.  Regarding concerns over canopy lengths, the canopies are long enough to shelter a train of roughly 6 carriages long, but any train that has stopped at the Rear Clear marker at the 'A' end of the Platform will have most of its length out in the open.

    2) Cross Country trains
    We've covered the lack of flexibility for through Cross Country services in the past and apparently it's also a concern for NR and XC.  As we suspected, their through reversing services will generally use Platform 8, though they could also use Platforms 9 or 10.  Should a problem develop with the critical set of points at Westbury Line junction (or indeed the route on the Up/Down Main to or from those platforms) then that will leave no simple option, but there are still three options available to the signaller to keep those trains running.
    • A train could use platforms 12/13/14 or 15 and be sent out of the east end of the station into what is now Kennet Bridge Goods Loop.  That loop is being upgraded to passenger status, so, for example, a train from Manchester to Bournemouth could be routed into Platform 14 at Reading, depart from there and be signalled into Kennet Bridge Loop, before reversing and then being routed through Reading's Platform 7 and on towards Basingstoke.
    • As above a train could be signalled into 12-15 and then be sent back to Tilehurst station's new reversing signal before being sent via the West Curve through to Oxford Road Junction
    • As has happened in the past, trains could just miss out on the stop at Reading and be routed via the West Curve stopping at Reading West.

    If anyone has any other questions, now is the time to ask!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on February 12, 2013, 13:13:45
    Operationally I would go for the last option - but -  unless Reading West is updated, it has poor access and step free only on the up side.  Other facilities are pretty miserable too.  Good bus service to town centre outside. A free shuttle to General (or whatever it is now called) would be helpful (unless local buses now go there anyway - it's 44 years since I lived there   ;D ).

    Perhaps it could be suitably updated with lifts and decent waiting facilities.  It's a good station for the west side of Reading and  no mistake.  How many pax from (say) Oxford or Eastleigh want to change at Reading General who could not have taken an alternative service to get there?   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 12, 2013, 13:33:20
    swrural - it was 44 years ago that I used to abandon the bus and use the 4d my mother gave for the fare to buy a penny sweet and the 3d child single fare from Reading General to Reading West on the way to school!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 12, 2013, 14:32:23
    Changing the subject slightly, but just to clear up a couple of points that we've discussed in the past which have now become clearer:

    1) Method of working for Platforms 12-15
    They all have 'Closing In' signals at either end of the platform and are split into an 'A' and 'B' end.  Trains of up to 5 carriages in length that are terminating and heading back out in the same direction will stop at a 'Rear Clear' stop board located approximately mid-way along the platform in either direction ('A' end is London, 'B' end is the Country End).  That will then allow the signaller to route another train (again of up to 5 carriages) into the other part of the platform using permissive working arrangements at the Closing In signal (i.e. a red aspect with two white lights).

    Trains of more than 5 carriages will stop at the relevant stop car marker further down the platform, as will through trains of any length.  Regarding concerns over canopy lengths, the canopies are long enough to shelter a train of roughly 6 carriages long, but any train that has stopped at the Rear Clear marker at the 'A' end of the Platform will have most of its length out in the open.

    If anyone has any other questions, now is the time to ask!

    Will the "Rear Clear" stop boards (not a term I've come across before) on each platform have any space beween them - will there be any kind of overlap distance between the board facing London at the A end and the board facing Bristol at the B end?

    And are Drivers and Driver Managers now happy with this arrangement - you indicated before that there was a bit of a problem with this.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on February 12, 2013, 15:39:22
    swrural - it was 44 years ago that I used to abandon the bus and use the 4d my mother gave for the fare to buy a penny sweet and the 3d child single fare from Reading General to Reading West on the way to school!

    Lovely.  Of course when I lived there (just behind the RBH) we had trolley buses still going across town, IIRC from one end to the other, down Oxford Road past Reading West, beautifully quiet and smooth.  The buses were painted an attractive purple.

    We seem to be turning the clock back with local and long distance transport and I shall be interested how many people agree with II on his third option, it needs local knowledge probably.

    Stapleton Road for the Cardiff to Brightons, anyone?   :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 12, 2013, 15:44:55
    Another route for through XC services in the event of problems with Westbury Line Jn is to run through one of P13/14/15 and then via the Southern underpass, and reverse beyond Spur Jn to reach the down main.  The route used by that early morning XC ECS move I found a couple of weeks back, but in the opposite direction.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 12, 2013, 21:40:21
    Will the "Rear Clear" stop boards (not a term I've come across before) on each platform have any space beween them - will there be any kind of overlap distance between the board facing London at the A end and the board facing Bristol at the B end?

    And are Drivers and Driver Managers now happy with this arrangement - you indicated before that there was a bit of a problem with this.

    Yes, there will be space as they are specifically there to facilitate two trains at each end of the platform.  The platform lengths are suitable for 12 carriages of 23m length I believe, but the overlap needed with these 'Rear Clear' boards means that two 6-car trains can't be accommodated at the same time.  That's a shame as it means that a 6-car Turbo can't share a platform with a 6-car Voyager (should they be lengthened).

    This also means possible confusion for a driver arriving with a terminating service which heads back out the same direction as the stopping point with up to 5-cars is the 'Rear Clear' marker with the  6-car stop much further down the platform.  It remains to be seen as to whether there are any incidents as a result of this non-standardised method of working.

    'Rear Clear' marker boards will also be appearing on platforms 7, 8 and 9, with the only through platform not getting them (for the time being) is 10 as trains from London won't be able to be signalled into that platform until a later date.

    Concern has also been raised about the 'Closing In' signals, as not only is it very rare to get a red signal so close to the end of the platform, but in the case of empty trains leaving the depot from the east end connection, a single yellow aspect can be displayed at the departure signal complete with a platform number, despite the fact that the train isn't actually signalled into that platform but only as far as the 'Closing In' signal.  In my mind, that is asking for trouble.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 12, 2013, 21:54:00
    Another route for through XC services in the event of problems with Westbury Line Jn is to run through one of P13/14/15 and then via the Southern underpass, and reverse beyond Spur Jn to reach the down main.  The route used by that early morning XC ECS move I found a couple of weeks back, but in the opposite direction.

    That would only be possible with an ECS service, not with passengers still on the train as per the other three options.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 13, 2013, 01:02:48
    Is that because of a lack of signals?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 13, 2013, 09:14:50
    Will the "Rear Clear" stop boards (not a term I've come across before) on each platform have any space beween them - will there be any kind of overlap distance between the board facing London at the A end and the board facing Bristol at the B end?

    And are Drivers and Driver Managers now happy with this arrangement - you indicated before that there was a bit of a problem with this.

    Yes, there will be space as they are specifically there to facilitate two trains at each end of the platform.  The platform lengths are suitable for 12 carriages of 23m length I believe, but the overlap needed with these 'Rear Clear' boards means that two 6-car trains can't be accommodated at the same time.  That's a shame as it means that a 6-car Turbo can't share a platform with a 6-car Voyager (should they be lengthened).

    This also means possible confusion for a driver arriving with a terminating service which heads back out the same direction as the stopping point with up to 5-cars is the 'Rear Clear' marker with the  6-car stop much further down the platform.  It remains to be seen as to whether there are any incidents as a result of this non-standardised method of working.

    'Rear Clear' marker boards will also be appearing on platforms 7, 8 and 9, with the only through platform not getting them (for the time being) is 10 as trains from London won't be able to be signalled into that platform until a later date.

    Concern has also been raised about the 'Closing In' signals, as not only is it very rare to get a red signal so close to the end of the platform, but in the case of empty trains leaving the depot from the west end connection, a single yellow aspect can be displayed at the departure signal complete with a platform number, despite the fact that the train isn't actually signalled into that platform but only as far as the 'Closing In' signal.  In my mind, that is asking for trouble.

    Are these arrangements (ie A and B platforms) only temporay until the completion of all the layout changes?  It would be surprising if they were permanent.  It's a long time since I did a "Safe working of trains" course, but intuitively they don't seem right.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 13, 2013, 10:14:17
    Are these arrangements (ie A and B platforms) only temporay until the completion of all the layout changes?  It would be surprising if they were permanent.  It's a long time since I did a "Safe working of trains" course, but intuitively they don't seem right.

    I'm sure they'll be permanent.  Not doing so loses the capacity increase over the old set up (on the relief side - as P13/14 would effectively become just the replacements for the London facing bays).  And as I've mentioned in previous posts, the basic method of double ended divided working has been in place at (for example) Southampton for many years - and safely as far as I am aware.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 13, 2013, 12:00:26
    Is that because of a lack of signals?

    In a way, yes.  Shunts via Spur Junction involve ground position signals not main aspect signals, so can't be used under normal circumstances with passenger trains.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 13, 2013, 14:58:50
    Are these arrangements (ie A and B platforms) only temporay until the completion of all the layout changes?  It would be surprising if they were permanent.  It's a long time since I did a "Safe working of trains" course, but intuitively they don't seem right.

    I'm sure they'll be permanent.  Not doing so loses the capacity increase over the old set up (on the relief side - as P13/14 would effectively become just the replacements for the London facing bays).  And as I've mentioned in previous posts, the basic method of double ended divided working has been in place at (for example) Southampton for many years - and safely as far as I am aware.

    Paul

    Take a look at Railway Group Standard GKRT0044 (you can just Google it).  The Group Standard (which does not apply retrospectively to stations such as Bristol and Southampton etc, so they should not be quoted as a precedent for Reading) refers to platform sharing and the signalling of trains on to occupied lines.  It specifically states (4.2.2)  that new platform sharing arangements should only be considered if it is not reasonably practicable to use mid platform signals, or any other measure to avoid it (eg timetabling)

    I'm surprised that NR got away with not providing mid-platform signals as clearly it would have been straightforward to incorporate them into the initial design.   So was there a specification error for the signalling? Was the manner in which the station would need to operate fully understood when the signalling system was specified?

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 13, 2013, 15:37:06
    Understood.

    NR do cross refer to that standard in the NCN about the station operations, as follows:

    Quote
    Standard GK/RT0044 Controls for signalling a train onto an occupied line mandates a number of conditions to be considered when reviewing the need for permissive working and its safe application. Whilst the signalling has functionality to allow for permissive moves to be signalled into the platforms as outlined in the Network Change the usage and availability is determined on operational risk and the need to use. A risk workshop chaired by an external provider was held and FGW representatives were in attendance. The level of Permissive Working agreed was an output of that risk workshop and took into account a number of factors including distance of signal to platform, speed of approach, signalling controls, approach view of train stationary in platform, whether services are planned to be used permissively etc. The new Platforms 12-15 have close up signals which allow permissive moves to be controlled far more effectively than Platforms 7-11 hence the variance in permissive working allowed. The level of permissive working agreed is more favourable than the current situation and the standard places a requirement on operators to try and eliminate/mitigate the use of permissive working and satisfactorily control the risks.

    Not sure what that all means though...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 13, 2013, 16:00:10
    Not sure what that all means though...

    I think it means that "we'll use a lot of waffle to try and convince everyone that it will be an acceptable method of working under the group standard regulations."  It may well be - we'll see.  Most of the concern seems to be about the SPAD risk of giving a driver a signal with a platform number indicator (either a 15, 14, or 13) when they aren't actually signalled into that platform (that's the east end depot signal I referred to earlier - T1708).

    By the way, to answer a question I posed a few weeks ago, the temporary connection from Platform 8 (which will become the Down Main Loop) to and from the Down Main Line will be restricted to 20mph.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on February 14, 2013, 11:27:48
    We do seem to be getting into a muddle with signalling.

    In semaphore days there were three types of indication you could get on a subsiduary signals (short arm two two parralel red stripes) under a stop arm. Depeding on use they could show S for Shunt Ahead into the section, W Warning: Line clear junction blocked and C Calling: On into an occupied section. A W  signal was used regularly between Tulse Hill and Gypsy Hill for Crystal Palace bound trains. Calling on signals were used at places like Staines every half hour to join Windosr and Weybridge portions. Early colur light position signals could show S or C when coupled with a stop signal. W becomes redundant because you'd get  single yellow on the main aspect.

    I'm not sure I like the implications of II's point above.

    "Most of the concern seems to be about the SPAD risk of giving a driver a signal with a platform number indicator (either a 15, 14, or 13) when they aren't actually signalled into that platform (that's the east end depot signal I referred to earlier - T1708)."

    Not sure I understand as I'm still getting used to modern drawings. 1708 seems to be two headed signal 1708 on left  and 1708 CA on right (facing). 1708 seems to be four aspect signal with three aspects in bottom light and a single yellow above, with a square box above that with a 3, whereas 1708CA is reversed with the 3 aspect at the top and single yellow at the bottom.

    Are points 8446 ad 8446B a double slip if so trains from the depot only have access to 15.14 and 13 platforms? Plus there are  stop signals 1706, 1704 and 1702 protecting platforms 15.14.13 between 1708 and the platforms. Perhaps to be clear 1708 should show DRL (13) URL (14) and UR (15) being the running lines the train is routed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 14, 2013, 13:04:25
    Are points 8446 ad 8446B a double slip if so trains from the depot only have access to 15.14 and 13 platforms? Plus there are  stop signals 1706, 1704 and 1702 protecting platforms 15.14.13 between 1708 and the platforms. Perhaps to be clear 1708 should show DRL (13) URL (14) and UR (15) being the running lines the train is routed.

    Yup, that's correct and yup that's what I would have thought would be more sensible.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on February 14, 2013, 17:01:44
    Just discovered 1708CA is Co-acting signal in the 6' which apprently have the red aspect at the top.

    With two signals it would be an very incompetant driver who SPADed them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on February 14, 2013, 17:29:32

    With two signals it would be an very incompetant driver who SPADed them.
    No train driver deliberately sets out to have a SPAD. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 15, 2013, 10:29:57
    Just discovered 1708CA is Co-acting signal in the 6' which apprently have the red aspect at the top.

    With two signals it would be an very incompetant driver who SPADed them.

    T1708 has a co-acting signal due to the restricted view of the main aspect when departing from the sidings on the left hand side of the depot exit.  Though the SPAD risk I referred to is receiving a single yellow aspect and platform number at T1708 and then SPAD'ing the following closing up signals T1702/4/6.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 15, 2013, 15:07:11
    Looking through some signalling bumph I've just found I think a similar set up of a theatre indicator on a signal (indicating the platform number) followed by a set of four 'closing up signals', one at the entry to each platform, is in use on the way into Portsmouth Harbour.  In this case the only approach is from the down main line rather than the depot exit, but the theatre indicator coming just before the platform signal seems to be the same...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 17, 2013, 15:30:54
    Does anyone know if the Vastern Road/Post Office site has been victim of crime recently. I notice that (on camera 1/3) that the police CCTV van is parked there most of the time.

    I originally thought it was just being used as a parking space, but it hasn't moved from that one space in about a week (as far as I can tell).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 17, 2013, 18:48:34
    I see the big mobile crane has been use again today, (with an extension jib), positioning a few roof sections adjacent to the London side escalators on the P10/11 island this time. 

    Just to round up the activities last week, (presumably, and as discussed earlier, due to crane load limits), as far as I can see all the escalators are now in position.  There's a couple of short sections of main steelwork yet to be fitted next to the stair/escalator on the country side of the P14/15 island, but other than that I think there's every likelihood that the bulk of the sloping roof sections will be fitted this week.

    I'd also suggest that on P10/11 the rest of the London end roof (and platform buildings) will probably be delayed until some time later because the building's 'footprint' involves the wider waiting area at the foot of the existing stairs?

    Meanwhile, at the south end of the subway I'm quite surprised the portable buildings are still there, as they really need to start on the Reading Council area of the worksite soon - unless the initial route for subway users really is going to require a diversion to the west end of the access ramps and stairs?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 17, 2013, 19:33:36
    I see the big mobile crane has been use again today, (with an extension jib), positioning a few roof sections adjacent to the London side escalators on the P10/11 island this time. 

    Just to round up the activities last week, (presumably, and as discussed earlier, due to crane load limits), as far as I can see all the escalators are now in position.  There's a couple of short sections of main steelwork yet to be fitted next to the stair/escalator on the country side of the P14/15 island, but other than that I think there's every likelihood that the bulk of the sloping roof sections will be fitted this week.

    This crane only appears to be used to lift heavy objects that are at the furthest reach of the tower crane.  All the other roof sections have been lifted in with the tower crane on the country side were lifted in with the tower crane except those which were so close to the foot of the tower it presumably could not reach.

    On the London side the big crane last weekend did the lower sections of the roof after the escalators were lifted in. However the rest of the P12/13 roof sections were then lifted in during the week with the tower crane. 

    For the escalators the load was obviously an issue as the P14/15 escalators were lifted in with the big crane in as whole units, then the P12/13 were lifted in with the same crane but in three parts.  Alternative means had to be used to install the escalators on P10/11 as even the big crane could not lift that much at such a reach.

    I'd also suggest that on P10/11 the rest of the London end roof (and platform buildings) will probably be delayed until some time later because the building's 'footprint' involves the wider waiting area at the foot of the existing stairs?

    Looks very likely

    Meanwhile, at the south end of the subway I'm quite surprised the portable buildings are still there, as they really need to start on the Reading Council area of the worksite soon - unless the initial route for subway users really is going to require a diversion to the west end of the access ramps and stairs?

    Given that they only have 2 weeks left before the subway is due to be opened I have assumed they will divert people round to the west end of the ramp/stairs.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 17, 2013, 20:29:06
    For the escalators the load was obviously an issue as the P14/15 escalators were lifted in with the big crane in as whole units, then the P12/13 were lifted in with the same crane but in three parts.  Alternative means had to be used to install the escalators on P10/11 as even the big crane could not lift that much at such a reach.

    Er... this is a repeat!  You and I covered this topic last weekend as well...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 17, 2013, 21:06:05
    The tower crane is lifting the other roof sections for the London end escalators as I write.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 17, 2013, 21:29:34
    The tower crane is lifting the other roof sections for the London end escalators as I write.

    Just a thought, once all these roof sections go on there'll not be much to see at all!   :(

    I always thought it was a bit of a shame that they didn't have a view of the track work at either end of the station area...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 18, 2013, 16:57:40
    Just gone up at TLH, on the same poster outlining the Easter works at Reading:

    The footbridge at Tilehurst is going to be renewed while the line is closed.

    Anyone have any details or even knowledge of the plan.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 18, 2013, 21:45:54
    Found a small amount of detail on Planning Consent website of Reading Council.

    The work will be to replace the existing footbridge.

    I did wonder if it was going to be moved to the London end as over the last few weeks there has been a drilling machine just alongside P1 and current mid island P2/3 at London end.

    But the planning consent was for replacement of existing footbridge.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 19, 2013, 00:21:02
    I did wonder if it was going to be moved to the London end as over the last few weeks there has been a drilling machine just alongside P1 and current mid island P2/3 at London end.

    Possibly foundations for a temporary footbridge whilst the permanent one is replaced?  That's what often happens - for example Radley, Iver and Bicester North have had similar temporary structures in recent years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 19, 2013, 11:51:48
    Remember the point made earlier about a 'marshalled walking route' to the north side subway entrance - ie to get across the building site from the end of February?  They seem to have cleared a space parallel to the front of the northern station building as far as the right hand side of the subway entrance over the last few days, and then installed new taller support posts presumably for another line of hoardings.

    On P14/15 the remaining heavy duty steel work has been installed between the stairs and the country end platform roof, AFAICT that is the last section that prevented the sloping roof sections being fitted there.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 19, 2013, 13:44:21
    Meanwhile, at the south end of the subway I'm quite surprised the portable buildings are still there, as they really need to start on the Reading Council area of the worksite soon - unless the initial route for subway users really is going to require a diversion to the west end of the access ramps and stairs?

    Given that they only have 2 weeks left before the subway is due to be opened I have assumed they will divert people round to the west end of the ramp/stairs.


    Posts suitable for a hoardings are now being put in parallel to, and alongside the southern ramp structure, that look as if they will hide the elevated road structure, so now looks very much like the route will include the double back via the west end.  There are also some newly repositioned posts alongside the blue portakabins - perhaps they will also be something to do with the intended pedestrian route?  What I'm thinking here is that having come up the ramps/stairs and over the subway, pedestrians will then have to turn immediately sharp right and go over towards the south side of Station Hill - in other words to cut across the worksite with barriers both right and left?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 19, 2013, 19:48:18
    The tower crane is lifting the other roof sections for the London end escalators as I write.

    Just a thought, once all these roof sections go on there'll not be much to see at all!   :(

    I always thought it was a bit of a shame that they didn't have a view of the track work at either end of the station area...

    Paul

    If you look on number 1 there is a new camera 5 - only the test card so far but...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on February 21, 2013, 00:01:11
    Travelled through Reading this evening....

    Mildly surprised to see an up fast HST service to Paddington pull in on Platform 7. I've not really followed all the ins and outs of what is going on at Reading, but I'm curious to know since when the old Platform 4 (now 7) became bi-di.

    Never seen an up service pull in on this platform before. Lots of shouting from the platform staff saying 'this train is heading to Paddington.... please stand back. The next service on this platform is for Worcester, calling at Didcot, Swindon and all stations to Cheltenham Spa.'


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 21, 2013, 00:13:03
    It has been for a few years. I've got off the up sleeper there before now. I think it used to be routed there as the only connection off it was for Gatwick off the old platform 4A! 

    Admittedly it is a pretty rare event.  The only other time I've seen it was recently when only 7 and 8 were open for through trains because of the improvements and two up trains arrived close together.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on February 21, 2013, 00:15:04
    Platform 7 (the old platform 4) has always been bi di, well at least since Reading was last resignalled in the 60s! Actually, I think Brunel first made it bi di!

    It was only used for up services at times of perturbation, which usually produced the reaction you described.

    Also used occasionally for up services to the North Downs, particularly if a set swap was needed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on February 21, 2013, 00:19:48
    That was the case this evening. Two up fasts arrived almost simultaneously on P7 and P8. The one that came in on 7, possibly 1L91 from Cheltenham Spa, was given the road ahead of the service that pulled in on 8.

    Incidentally, this up train that surprised me on P7 was a 2+7 HST. It was missing a coach G.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on February 21, 2013, 00:40:59
    Platform 7 is most often used for up services off the B&H, so you can get a simultaneous arrival with an up service from Didcot on Platform 8. The Platform 7 service gets priority to clear the platform for down services. And the number of passengers boarding on platform 7 is usually quite low!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 22, 2013, 13:28:49
    What I'm thinking here is that having come up the ramps/stairs and over the subway, pedestrians will then have to turn immediately sharp right and go over towards the south side of Station Hill - in other words to cut across the worksite with barriers both right and left?

    From the way things are currently shaping up it looks like your prediction is spot on !


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 22, 2013, 15:57:00
    What I'm thinking here is that having come up the ramps/stairs and over the subway, pedestrians will then have to turn immediately sharp right and go over towards the south side of Station Hill - in other words to cut across the worksite with barriers both right and left?

    From the way things are currently shaping up it looks like your prediction is spot on !

    Scary isn't it!  Perhaps I should try the national lottery now...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 22, 2013, 16:39:47
    Platform 7 (the old platform 4) has always been bi di, well at least since Reading was last resignalled in the 60s! Actually, I think Brunel first made it bi di!

    It was only used for up services at times of perturbation, which usually produced the reaction you described.

    Also used occasionally for up services to the North Downs, particularly if a set swap was needed.

    I'm just wondering if P7 (old P4) has always been bi di for passenger trains, even if it has been for ECS etc.  I've got a vague recollection that the signal at the London end of this platform, with a new feather and a signalled route across to the UM, was installed more recently, maybe within the last 20 years.   

    I agree it is not uncommon now for it to be used for Up passenger services.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on February 22, 2013, 17:54:16
    Platform 7 (the old platform 4) has always been bi di, well at least since Reading was last resignalled in the 60s! Actually, I think Brunel first made it bi di!

    It was only used for up services at times of perturbation, which usually produced the reaction you described.

    Also used occasionally for up services to the North Downs, particularly if a set swap was needed.

    I'm just wondering if P7 (old P4) has always been bi di for passenger trains, even if it has been for ECS etc.  I've got a vague recollection that the signal at the London end of this platform, with a new feather and a signalled route across to the UM, was installed more recently, maybe within the last 20 years.   

    I agree it is not uncommon now for it to be used for Up passenger services.
    The signal may have been repositioned for sighting reasons when the passenger over bridge was installed


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 22, 2013, 20:41:48
    I am sure I have a photo somewhere but I think the signal at the London end of platform 7 has a theatre box rather than feather(s).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 23, 2013, 01:26:01
    From the Reading Chronicle (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/roundup/articles/2013/02/21/86912-buses-set-for-a-boost-from-new-look-railway-station-/?#):

    Quote
    Buses set for a boost from new look railway station

    (http://www.clydeandforthpress.co.uk/img/2011/03/10/1299773579487.jpg)

    The completion of the multi-million pound transport interchange on the northern side of the new-look Reading Station will make a "huge difference" to the town's bus services.

    The new bus, taxi, and cycle hub - one of two new interchanges being developed as part of the ^850m Reading Station upgrade - is taking shape off Vastern Road.

    Reading Borough Council won ^9.6m from the Department of Transport towards the ^13.2m cost of creating the Vastern Road entrance area and another on the southern side of the station.

    Reading Buses chief executive James Freeman said it will greatly benefit passengers travelling to and from the north of the town when buses begin using it in July and he added: "It will make a huge difference to passengers in Caversham, Peppard and Emmer Green, who have had a raw deal previously as buses have had to approach from the south side of the station. This will make it much quicker, meaning people can get straight to the platform. It will be fantastic railway serving the people of Reading and shows this is a place where you can get about without a car."

    The company has already increased the number of buses on some of its routes in anticipation of the changes, including the Pink 22 and 24 running every 20 minutes from Caversham Heights from 5.30-7.15am and 5.25-7am respectively, the equivalent of a bus every 10 minutes from Caversham Library.

    The company also launches a public consultation on Friday, March 1, canvassing views on what they think of the services so far and what improvements could be made.

    Mr Freeman said: "It's always useful for people to give their impressions of how changes affect their journeys and they can pick up things we haven't always thought of."

    Passengers will be able to respond online at www.reading-buses.co.uk or by completing paper forms available from its offices in Great Knollys Street.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on February 23, 2013, 13:11:58
    Euurgh!  I know one other FGWCS correspondent who mourns the passing of the purple trolleys eh, BobM?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on February 23, 2013, 13:54:21
    One thing I do like about Reading Buses is the colour coding of their routes and buses. Makes for quick identification of your bus when more than one is at a stand, terminus or stop.

    That pink one currently matches the polo top I'm wearing!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 23, 2013, 13:57:59
    One of my prized possessions is a destination blind from a Reading bus before they got all those new fangled electronic ones.  Best livery in Reading is the 20/21 - the claret is the closest they have to the old maroon livery of my youth.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 23, 2013, 16:01:11
    Getting back to the matter in hand - the very large crane has turned up again this afternoon with all the extension pieces. Any idea what it is going to do this time?

    Its in the same place as last week so looks to be something on the London side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 23, 2013, 20:33:38
    I am sure I have a photo somewhere but I think the signal at the London end of platform 7 has a theatre box rather than feather(s).

    Correct.  Signal R49 (now TR49) was commissioned in November 1979.  Platform No.7 (previously Platform No.4) was only reversibily signalled from that date.  From the commissioning of Reading panel on 24-26 April 1965 until November 1979 there was a shunt signal R563 at this position.  The current signal has a Route Indicator for the Up Main or Reading Spur lines.  In five weeks time it is being replaced by new signal T1682 temporarily on the new signal gantry that can be seen here (its on this temporary post as it will be replaced with a proper caged signal in a new position once Platform No.7 is rebuilt against the present Up Main line): http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/8416219893/in/pool-1945836@N21/lightbox/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/8416219893/in/pool-1945836@N21/lightbox/)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 23, 2013, 21:19:17
    Thanks for that info, I was guessing that that signal was in a temporary position in a discussion with 'GBTE' back in November, around post# 927!

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Angle42 on February 23, 2013, 21:22:55
    Getting back to the matter in hand - the very large crane has turned up again this afternoon with all the extension pieces. Any idea what it is going to do this time?

    Its in the same place as last week so looks to be something on the London side.

    It may be the removal of the footbridge to the carpark.

    The Network Rail announcement in December said that the footbridge would be removed by the end of February and they have almost finished the tunnel under the station - probably a day's worth of work left.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 23, 2013, 21:43:35
    Not so.  The footbridge between the car park and Platfom 11 goes next weekend (its shut from 01 March 2013): http://firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements

    The crane is positioned too far from the footbridge as well.

    Welcome to the forum by the way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on February 23, 2013, 22:18:47
    Welcome to the Forum from me too Angle42.. Hope you find it useful..


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 23, 2013, 22:39:37
    Ah ha ... Large bits of metal have appeared. How about the canopy on the London end of platforms 10/11


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 23, 2013, 22:47:17
    Agreed.  Exciting isn't it......... ::) ::) :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 24, 2013, 12:35:23
    Seen this morning:

    Tilehust East junction is being relaid. Up and down relief lines being relaid to connect to new lines/freight line with what looked like connection for fast line - although these were not being connected.

    Track over Cow Lane bridge has been relaid - but not yet reballested.

    Additional signalling/RA indicators being fixed in situ along P12/13.

    Channel being dug under country end of P8/9 and relief lines - but not obvious what the purpose was for.

    Could not see what the large mobile crane was lifting. Fixed crane very busy bustling equipment around the site



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 24, 2013, 13:20:46
    P10/11 roof supports and roof sections turns out to have been the answer as 'ellendune' supposed - and they've installed almost enough so far to match the length of the P12/13 canopy, although eventually P10/11 will go much further along, as far as the present lift and stairs at least.

    This is the bit I thought recently might be left for a while, but in hindsight they might have needed a line block lifting all that stuff over the new platforms once they became live, so it will make more sense to do the maximum possible now...

    PS Regarding the Cow Lane bridge works, I wonder if for some reason they have had to replace what looked like waterproofing sheets? Backtracking through the webcam day by day suggests that might be what was done...

    PPS - there's a structure appeared on the roof of the country end of the P14/15 canopy that looks as though it is part of an electrification gantry...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 24, 2013, 14:26:22

    PPS - there's a structure appeared on the roof of the country end of the P14/15 canopy that looks as though it is part of an electrification gantry...

    Paul

    No way.  Surely thats a chimmny pot for the new waiting room fire........... :D :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 24, 2013, 14:47:53
    Definitely got an odd angle to it though?

    I've been wondering how well they'll integrate the OHLE equipment with the overall 'look' of the station - perhaps they'll use cantilevers from the platform centrelines rather than heavyweight gantries stretching right across all the tracks and platforms?

    We'll probably find out shortly...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 24, 2013, 14:58:05
    Thanks for that info, I was guessing that that signal was in a temporary position in a discussion with 'GBTE' back in November, around post# 927!

    Paul
    I am sure I have a photo somewhere but I think the signal at the London end of platform 7 has a theatre box rather than feather(s).

    Correct.  Signal R49 (now TR49) was commissioned in November 1979.  Platform No.7 (previously Platform No.4) was only reversibily signalled from that date.  From the commissioning of Reading panel on 24-26 April 1965 until November 1979 there was a shunt signal R563 at this position.  The current signal has a Route Indicator for the Up Main or Reading Spur lines.  In five weeks time it is being replaced by new signal T1682 temporarily on the new signal gantry that can be seen here (its on this temporary post as it will be replaced with a proper caged signal in a new position once Platform No.7 is rebuilt against the present Up Main line): http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/8416219893/in/pool-1945836@N21/lightbox/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/8416219893/in/pool-1945836@N21/lightbox/)

    S&T Engineer, thanks for confirming my vague recollections re this signal (ie R49), and that bi-di running for passenger trains through old P4 wasn't in operation before 1979.  OK it's a theatre and not a feather route indicator.

    And it was clear to me that the signal hanging from a pole on the gantry must only be temporary as it wouldn't have met CDM requirements for maintainability.

    Finally, was the trailing slip between DM and UM just east of old P4 put in from November 1979 as well?  And did the shunt signal R653 allow ECS wrong line on the DM UM down to New Junction?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on February 24, 2013, 15:25:02
    Definitely got an odd angle to it though?

    I've been wondering how well they'll integrate the OHLE equipment with the overall 'look' of the station - perhaps they'll use cantilevers from the platform centrelines rather than heavyweight gantries stretching right across all the tracks and platforms?

    We'll probably find out shortly...

    Paul

    Can't see how a cantilever from the centre would look any better than a gantry suspended between the centres.  A gentry would allow the span to be lighter weight.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on February 24, 2013, 15:36:29
    A gentry would allow the span to be lighter weight.

    You can't rely on the gentry to help out these days, what with the school fees and the possible mansion tax...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 24, 2013, 18:12:34
    Finally, was the trailing slip between DM and UM just east of old P4 put in from November 1979 as well?  And did the shunt signal R653 allow ECS wrong line on the DM UM down to New Junction?

    R563 read four ways:  Up Relief; Down Relief Limit of Shunt; Up Main to R575 (facing shunt); Down Main to R577 shunt (reading to the Down Spur).

    Not quite sure what you mean by the 'slip point'.  The connection to the east of Platform No.7 has always been a standard trailing crossover between the Up and Down Mains (since the 1965 resignalling anyway).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 24, 2013, 19:59:22
    Finally, was the trailing slip between DM and UM just east of old P4 put in from November 1979 as well?  And did the shunt signal R653 allow ECS wrong line on the DM UM down to New Junction?

    R563 read four ways:  Up Relief; Down Relief Limit of Shunt; Up Main to R575 (facing shunt); Down Main to R577 shunt (reading to the Down Spur).

    Not quite sure what you mean by the 'slip point'.  The connection to the east of Platform No.7 has always been a standard trailing crossover between the Up and Down Mains (since the 1965 resignalling anyway).

    Thanks again S&TE, I meant "trailing crossover" when said "trailing slip" (i didn't mention "slip point", else we could be in a whole new discussion about slip coaches!).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 25, 2013, 13:38:30
    BBC Berkshire (http://goo.gl/Y4Knq) have put some photos up on their section of the BBC website. Most of them will look familiar as pictures from LobsterVision cameras. There are however a couple of internal ones.


    Quote
    Inside the new passenger footbridge looking down the 33m (108ft) long escalator to the new northern end entrance and ticket hall. New entrances are being built to the north and south of the station.
    (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/65983000/jpg/_65983901_reading012.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 25, 2013, 21:49:19
    Seen this morning:

    Tilehust East junction is being relaid. Up and down relief lines being relaid to connect to new lines/freight line with what looked like connection for fast line - although these were not being connected.

    Just for accuracy's sake, Tilehurst East Junction wasn't being relaid, but continuing work to install the crossovers required for the new Whitehouse Junction next to it, was - in readiness for the post-Easter blockade track layout.  Whitehouse Junction is basically at the location of the current Scours Lane Junction, so quite why it was deemed necessary to rename it is beyond me?  Perhaps a Mr. Whitehouse is involved in the project and fancied a bit of glory?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on February 26, 2013, 11:01:02
    Seen this morning:

    Tilehust East junction is being relaid. Up and down relief lines being relaid to connect to new lines/freight line with what looked like connection for fast line - although these were not being connected.

    Just for accuracy's sake, Tilehurst East Junction wasn't being relaid, but continuing work to install the crossovers required for the new Whitehouse Junction next to it, was - in readiness for the post-Easter blockade track layout.  Whitehouse Junction is basically at the location of the current Scours Lane Junction, so quite why it was deemed necessary to rename it is beyond me?  Perhaps a Mr. Whitehouse is involved in the project and fancied a bit of glory?

    Treading carefully here II, I had a look with GE and it appears there is actually no junction at Scours Lane; the one to Reading West would be perhaps better named Loverock Road?  Using SV, I could not see any white house there either though, just industrial buildings,  - but please put me right on Scours Lane.  Is that was where the signal box was possibly, I have a few old GWR photos (can we mention the old company here?) and the photographer Maurice Earley took many photos there. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 26, 2013, 12:14:04
    I'd thought the same as you initially, swrural, but if you look at page 119 of the excellent Platform 5 Track Atlas you will see that Scours Lane is marked where the Goods lines join the UR line between Tilehurst East Junction and Reading West Junction.

    OK it doesn't say "Jn" after "Scours Lane", but then it doesn't after "Tilehurst East" on page 18 either. 

    I'm just trying to recall if there is a name sign by the Scours Lane junction - maybe someone is passing by later?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 26, 2013, 12:37:41
    There certainly used to be sign as there is for Tilehurst East but I think it has faded somewhat in recent years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 26, 2013, 16:00:27
    Treading carefully here II, I had a look with GE and it appears there is actually no junction at Scours Lane; the one to Reading West would be perhaps better named Loverock Road?  Using SV, I could not see any white house there either though, just industrial buildings,  - but please put me right on Scours Lane.  Is that was where the signal box was possibly, I have a few old GWR photos (can we mention the old company here?) and the photographer Maurice Earley took many photos there. 

    Not sure of signal boxes but Scours Lane does (at least did) have a name plate identifying it.  There is no white house that I know of either, hence my suggestion that a Mr. Whitehouse might be involved in the project (it is marked as Whitehouse rather than White House).

    Anyway, it looks as if the wiring teams are about to get going as two gangs were busy installing brackets where the wires will attach onto the gantry posts installed in the east end sidings of the new depot today.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 26, 2013, 16:38:11
    According to http://www.greatwestern.org.uk/sig1.htm (http://www.greatwestern.org.uk/sig1.htm) there was a 'box at Scours Lane Junction with 57 levers.

    It closed on 25 April 1965 according to another reference I have in a book.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 26, 2013, 17:33:25
    This is just thinking aloud, but the first schematic drawing back on page 55 highlights that Scours Lane Jn is being 'clipped and padlocked in reverse'.  So is it possible that the Whitehouse Jn (described as temporary) has to have a different name just to avoid confusion with anything to do with the existing junction, which presumably remains present and complete in the signalling system even if fully out of use?

    As I say, just thinking aloud though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 26, 2013, 19:03:31
    Does anyone know at what time on Friday 1st March the link between the footbridge and the car park is closing?  Common sense would dictate (as Friday is a working day and car park will be busy) it will be late ie after the last train, but the friendly chap at FGW customer services (after a referral to someone else) told me it wil be closed all day.  Mrs GTBE asked some of the station staff at Rdg this evening at what time on Friday it will close, but got conflicting answers.  Someone said it will be after the last train.

    We're meeting someone at Rdg in our car on Friday and need to know.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 27, 2013, 14:57:28
    Looks like later today will see a sort of major milestone in that the final roof sections will almost certainly be connected up above the west side escalator/stair on P14/15.  The relevant sections are currently sitting on a trailer below, ready to go...

    Allowing for there still presumably being quite a gap on P12/13 where the tower crane is (that can't be seen from the webcam views), if today's work proceeds OK it ought to give a 'nearly finished' look to the overall roof...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 27, 2013, 15:15:38
    Camera 1, tab 1 went offline @ 03:00 today. A precursor to the bridge removal ? [ I'd assumed the camera was on it ? ]


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 27, 2013, 15:28:11
    Camera 1, tab 1 went offline @ 03:00 today. A precursor to the bridge removal ? [ I'd assumed the camera was on it ? ]

    That's quite possible, although they do sometimes go off for periods of a few hours or days anyway. 

    That camera is (was) normally plainly visible when crossing the bridge, it's mounted high up on the inside of the window glass with a suction cup device.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 27, 2013, 17:01:48
    ... it's mounted high up on the inside of the window glass with a suction cup device.

    State of the art technology, then.  ::) :o ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 27, 2013, 17:12:40
    ... it's mounted high up on the inside of the window glass with a suction cup device.

    State of the art technology, then.  ::) :o ;D

    I possibly could have described it better - more like a couple of those 'industrial sized' devices used for lifting large sheets of glass - connected together with a few bits and bobs from the old meccano set...  ;D

    PS All change as of 1730, Webcam 1/1 has now gone missing, with the three remaining now renumbered downwards by one.  Cam 1/4 is now the 'test card'...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 28, 2013, 01:00:53
    According to GetReading (http://goo.gl/wYPbG), the footbridge is closed.

    I think this is more a failure to publish the article on the correct day...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 28, 2013, 10:46:12
    Webcam 1/1 has now gone missing
    Lost property ? ;)

    with the three remaining now renumbered downwards by one.  Cam 1/4 is now the 'test card'...

    *sniff* I was so looking forwards to saying "Number 5 is alive!" :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 28, 2013, 10:48:36
    According to GetReading (http://goo.gl/wYPbG), the footbridge is closed.

    I see one of the comments posted on Wednesday states:
    "At least its not forecast to rain on Friday (the old bridge closes at midnight tomorrow night)."

    I wonder how well-informed that is ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 28, 2013, 14:29:47
    Categorically, from Network Rail & FGW.

    The existing footbridge will close at 2359 tonight (28 Feb 2013). The 'subway' will be in use tomorrow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 28, 2013, 15:32:31
    That'll be the 'subway' tomorrow...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 28, 2013, 15:34:01
    Corrected. Oopsies, I knew what I meant! :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on February 28, 2013, 16:34:55
    There was an army of staff out today when I passed through Reading today informing passengers of the footbridge closure, as well as plenty of signs and announcements.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on February 28, 2013, 17:55:19
    There was an army of staff out today when I passed through Reading today informing passengers of the footbridge closure, as well as plenty of signs and announcements.
    There certainly was not at 12.20 today. Maybe peak only.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 28, 2013, 18:59:11
    I note on webcam 1/2 that late today (28 February 2013) the first OHLE portal structure has been errected over the Platform 14 and 15 lines.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on February 28, 2013, 19:10:28
    There was an army of staff out today when I passed through Reading today informing passengers of the footbridge closure, as well as plenty of signs and announcements.
    There certainly was not at 12.20 today. Maybe peak only.
    I passed through around then. I saw staff in the concourse and on the footbridge handing out leaflets and telling passengers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 01, 2013, 08:31:56
    As of Friday morning a wooden wall has been erected on the ticketed side of the gateline between platform 10 and the now-closed section of footbridge.
    In a useful move the barrier separating ticketed/unticketed traffic across the bridge has been completely removed. It felt rather spacious for the first time in years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 01, 2013, 09:53:45
    In a useful move the barrier separating ticketed/unticketed traffic across the bridge has been completely removed. It felt rather spacious for the first time in years.

    That's good to see - removing that barrier (if only for a few weeks) had crossed my mind a few months back - it should allow the lifts to operate without delays as well.

    I wonder how many delayed passengers there were this morning, who would then obviously claim not to have known anything about the changes...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 01, 2013, 10:58:44
    I note on webcam 1/2 that late today (28 February 2013) the first OHLE portal structure has been errected over the Platform 14 and 15 lines.

    Have you any idea what that odd looking triangular frame is?  It looks like it (and another that's out of shot) were assembled onto the main structure just before it was craned into position, and they seem to be set up along the line of the tracks.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 01, 2013, 11:55:35
    I've just completed 2 transits of the new subway from the short stay on the north side to meet someone off a train.  It's bright, well lit, smartly decorated etc.  And plenty of FGW staff around to help people, so full marks to FGW. 

    There's a lot of walking on stairs and ramps at the south end open to the elements, but of course this is only temporary.  Quite interesting seeing the side of the excavations at the south end, I can remember when the old subway went on southwards under Station Hill and came out in the car park.

    And the 2 escalators on the London side of the new footbridge on P8/9 were running, presumably they are at testing and commissioning phase.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: EBrown on March 01, 2013, 17:04:42
    In a useful move the barrier separating ticketed/unticketed traffic across the bridge has been completely removed. It felt rather spacious for the first time in years.
    Indeed, the contracting company (I think Carilion) were busy taking it out and filling the holes with concrete when I passed through. I took this at 2245 last night.
    (https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-MWeRWengQIA/UTAQ9EZtY9I/AAAAAAAAFXg/vd4gHsOSJhg/s777/1362089695066.jpg)

    I had quite a productive time actually, had a chat with Jim Holden, a bunch of (on-board) revenue staff who would be on the midnight shift telling people about the closed footbridge. Then there was a points failure and ^240 taxi, but that's in the past.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 01, 2013, 23:11:54
    A video update from January from Grimshaws http://vimeo.com/58926497 (http://vimeo.com/58926497)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 02, 2013, 00:12:17
    Visited the station today and took a "few" pics:

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5008_opt.jpg)
    This is the entrance to the walking route from the South side. FGW worker on hand to offer assistance.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5009_opt.jpg)
    Turn left and the stairs and ramps down to the subway open up. First impression is that the quality of finish is excellent. For example, the top of the walls are capped with a timber cladding - looks really superb.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5010_opt.jpg)
    View down the ramp nearest the new south side building. Again, the quality of finish is excellent. The brick wall and stainless steel finishes are striking. Just hope they have applied a coat of grafitti resistant stuff!

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5012_opt.jpg)
    Entrance to the subway on the south side. It is very well lit and the brick/tile work is of a high standard. Also noticed lots of CCTV cameras.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5013_opt.jpg)
    Inside the subway. Its very long! Lights are continuous at a high level along the the left hand side. Plenty of CCTV.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5016_opt.jpg)
    On the north side the walking route passes though the construction yard. There is a manned crossing point for works vehicles.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5018_opt.jpg)
    View from the Car Park across the north side construction site, with the walking route cutting though it. I timed the walk from the bottom of the lifts to the station entrance on the south side and, at my leisurely pace, it took about six mins. So suggesting an allowance of 15mins is reasonably conservative. I met four FGW staff acting as marshalls.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5020_opt.jpg)
    View from the car park to the now closed section of the bridge. Demolition signs up and men at work inside.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5021_opt.jpg)
    Level 9 of the car park, showing the boarded off entrance to the footbridge. No one will miss this!

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5022_opt.jpg)
    Back to the main station now and the staircase from the concourse to the overbridge, which has been closed off.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5023_opt.jpg)
    View of the overbridge with the partition removed. Huge improvement!

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5024_opt.jpg)
    The north end of the footbridge where the "Vastern Road" gateline used to be, now boarded off. Closure of the walking route across the bridge has done wonders for revenue protection. So many of the loopholes have been closed. The only way out of the station is through the main gateline. I saw half a dozen revenue protection staff having an absolute field day at the gateline!

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5025_opt.jpg)
    And finally, a view of the first electrification gantry to be erected over the new platforms. The metalwork at both ends is to stop silly people from climbing up on to the canopy roof and out along the gantry, where they might kill themselves. Shame!

    Overall impression is of a job well done. If the rest of the build is to the same standard, it will be a magnificent station.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 02, 2013, 00:38:31
    Does the bridge closure mean XC catering supplies have to go round via the subway and ramps?  I think they were operating from portakabins down at ground level by the car park for the duration of the work so far?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 02, 2013, 00:39:48
    Does the bridge closure mean XC catering supplies have to go round via the subway and ramps?  I think they were operating from portakabins down at ground level by the car park for the duration of the work so far?

    Paul

    It appeared so - saw some going that way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 02, 2013, 08:44:40
    The screens are there to allow roof maintenance with taking an isolation of the OLE and not as an anti climbing guard that can be done with a chevaux de frise (which is what the spikes are around the edge of the screens.  Rule for working near to OLE without an isolation is 2.75m (9ft rule) or where there is screening 600mm (2ft rule).

    This is a good piece of forward thinking design work to be CDM obligations.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on March 02, 2013, 11:04:11
    ...that can be done with a chevaux de frise ...

    ... or whatever they call them in France.

    Excellent set of pictures, Oxman! I know what to expect now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 02, 2013, 11:41:14
    Does anyone know when the footbridge is actually being removed?

    I assume there is some work to be done inside first - not least disconnecting the electricity, but how long will this take?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 02, 2013, 11:46:18
    Does anyone know when the footbridge is actually being removed?

    I assume there is some work to be done inside first - not least disconnecting the electricity, but how long will this take?


    The reporter on BBC last night said it would be gone in about a week's time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 02, 2013, 12:38:25
    As the Country End (West) of the station works doesn't seem to feature much I took these photographs yesterday (01 March 2013) during a quick 10 min interchange between trains:

    The new turnout between Platform No.8 and the new Down Main (existing Down Relief) line.  No signal just yet :o
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0055.JPG)

    ...and the station works (you wouldn't know the old bay Platform No.7 ever existed)
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0064.JPG)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 02, 2013, 13:06:39
    These are especially interesting now that we have lost the first web cam (not that it covered this end anyway).  Most grateful, thanks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 02, 2013, 16:58:40
    ...that can be done with a chevaux de frise ...

    ... or whatever they call them in France.


    Chevaux de frise a medieval defensive obstacle as such would have been words recognised a 1000 years ago in England  ;D

    It also looks like they have used the station roof columns to support the OHLE structures

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 02, 2013, 18:15:24
    It also looks like they have used the station roof columns to support the OHLE structures

    Yes, we'll have to wait until more structures are fitted, but it appears, from the one example we have so far, to be a very neat and unobtrusive solution.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 02, 2013, 21:19:31
    Many thanks to everyone for posting this recent set of pics. I didn't travel on Friday but it looks like I will notice some difference when I resume my commute on Monday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on March 03, 2013, 11:55:00
    Unless there are more than one, it would be a cheval de frise.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 03, 2013, 17:19:13
    Taken from platform 9 country end. First signage on new transfer deck in place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 03, 2013, 17:32:14
    Notice alot of the scaffolding has gone from the Country End today


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 04, 2013, 17:13:21
    Here's another forecast guess about future happenings then...  ;D

    By Friday last week, the 'Station Hill' site compound alongside the new ramps (ie west of the temporary access route) was completely empty of all contractor equipment.  Late this afternoon, a few blokes have been re-arranging the hoarding, but the clue is that they aren't wearing NR style full orange clothing.   Could this possibly be a different contractor about to start work on an area that Reading Borough Council are responsible for, e.g. demolition of the roadway down to ground level?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 04, 2013, 19:02:23
    Here's another forecast guess about future happenings then...  ;D

    By Friday last week, the 'Station Hill' site compound alongside the new ramps (ie west of the temporary access route) was completely empty of all contractor equipment.  Late this afternoon, a few blokes have been re-arranging the hoarding, but the clue is that they aren't wearing NR style full orange clothing.   Could this possibly be a different contractor about to start work on an area that Reading Borough Council are responsible for, e.g. demolition of the roadway down to ground level?

    Paul

    Sound very plausible to me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 04, 2013, 19:23:44
    When I came through reading tonight they seemed to be hanging cross cables across one of the gantries near the country end of the station. This surprised me - I didn't think they would start that so soon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 04, 2013, 20:21:06
    Passed through Reading today, first time in a while, good to see they are installing light weight LED signals along the route.

    The only thing I cannot work out are the OLE structure numbering although only laminated paper at the moment the structures seemed to have "RW" where the GWML should be "J" might just be temporary construction numbers



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on March 04, 2013, 20:47:51
    Passed through Reading today, first time in a while, good to see they are installing light weight LED signals along the route.

    The only thing I cannot work out are the OLE structure numbering although only laminated paper at the moment the structures seemed to have "RW" where the GWML should be "J" might just be temporary construction numbers


    Do you know that for certain?

    The current OHLE on the GWML is controlled by the Romford ECR, but I don't think the new wiring is going to be, is it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 04, 2013, 22:11:18
    Passed through Reading today, first time in a while, good to see they are installing light weight LED signals along the route.

    The only thing I cannot work out are the OLE structure numbering although only laminated paper at the moment the structures seemed to have "RW" where the GWML should be "J" might just be temporary construction numbers


    Do you know that for certain?

    The current OHLE on the GWML is controlled by the Romford ECR, but I don't think the new wiring is going to be, is it?

    The current OLE on the GWML was controlled from Slough IECC when it was commissioned.  The ECR has no bearing on the structure numbers, I was involved in the project that closed Hornsey and Doncaster ECR and the opening of York the ECML remained E for the primary route and the MML remained as F.

    It is not unusual to use temporary construction numbers for structures.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 05, 2013, 12:48:11
    Could this possibly be a different contractor about to start work on an area that Reading Borough Council are responsible for, e.g. demolition of the roadway down to ground level?

    That looks rather likely - there are various pieces of machinery laying into the former road surface this morning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 05, 2013, 14:06:32
    An interesting discussion has developed on the Reading Forums regarding the nature of Station Hill and the subway.
    It starts somewhere around about here:

    http://www.reading-forum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=1383&start=280 (http://www.reading-forum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=1383&start=280)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 05, 2013, 21:31:39
    Wires are starting to be strung between the overhead line structures installed in the east sidings of the new depot.  Meanwhile it looks as if the new platforms won't be wired up in time for their opening after the Easter blockade, though the structures will be in place for them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 06, 2013, 12:01:44
    I don't quite see the practical benefit of fully wiring the station area yet.  Yes there are a few possessions avoided if the portals and gantries over the platforms and canopies are installed now, but in the overall scheme of things is it actually useful to have the catenary and contact wire doing nothing much for a few years?

    The situation is slightly different in the depot area, because if as I suspect they'll be using a simpler headspan construction, it is probably more difficult to install those once the depot is in full use 24/7...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 06, 2013, 18:36:39
    The difference between the depot and the station is the station is (or will be) part of the operational railway as such when the track becomes operational after a possession the OLE comes under rules of "The Green Book" (the green book is rule book for OLE) as such the OLE needs to be declared "LIVE" even though it is not this generates the need for an awful lot of form filling and trained staff, no one can work within 9' (2.75m) of it without a "Form C" (permit to work on or near OLE) it also make it difficult for machines to work under the wires; the depot is a construction site the OLE comes under the control of the PWC (Principle Works Contractor) for the depot until handed over therefore they can happily leave the wires without status.


    Apart form that the "main line" possible is not ready for wire runs yet, track needs to be in its final position the wire is set to track and not the other way round.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on March 06, 2013, 19:01:44
    Electric Train,

    That is a very clear explanation - thank you. It makes perfect sense to finish the job in the depot, which won't be needed for a while, and then the wires in the station to the very last minute. Presumably, if the art of any job is the preparation, electrification is the perfect example. The actual fitting and connecting of the cables looks straightforward compared to the rest.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 06, 2013, 21:28:38
    Electric Train,

    Presumably, if the art of any job is the preparation, electrification is the perfect example. The actual fitting and connecting of the cables looks straightforward compared to the rest.

    You need all the structures in place, with all the rakes applied to them, all the small part steels fitted and insulators.  The wire runs are done in a sequence the planning of the sequence is the art.  Once the wire is run its hight and stagger (the zig zag) is set to the track geometry (rail position and cant has to have been done before the heights and staggers), then a check pan is run through is done.

    Then system test, electrical section proving to prove that the right switch livens up the only the correct piece of wire.   Short circuit and steady current test are likely to be done to prove immunisation of Telecoms and signalling all these tests have to be done under full possession with only those involved in the test out an about on the track.

    Spent many a long night doing short and steady current tests ............. a lot of setting and up waiting around and the flash all done in less than 200 mili seconds in reality 3 tests are done.  Section proving involves a lot of walking around removing and placing earths and applying live line testers usually rains when I'm involved  :-\


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 06, 2013, 22:26:00
    Thanks for that explanation, Electric Train.  Just out of interest, how many of the stages described in your previous post will be able to be done in one hit with the electrification train that's due to be delivered any time now?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 06, 2013, 22:37:21
    Thanks for that explanation, Electric Train.  Just out of interest, how many of the stages described in your previous post will be able to be done in one hit with the electrification train that's due to be delivered any time now?

    That is an interesting question, the OLE engineers I work with will be watching, from a distance, how it performs.  I believe the concept is the foundations where piled are done the structure (mast) is erected the small parts fitted (cast concrete foundations will be done ahead of the train).  The original plan was also run the wire as well the risk identified was a foundation failure its not easy to unrun the wire, so now the wire will be run separate with the highs and staggers done as part of that.

    There is also all the bonding to be done, all of that has to be verified before the system tests are done

    System test are done at the very end once the results are verified it is declared operational.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on March 07, 2013, 00:01:26
    According to this article, (http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/single-view/view/windhoff-to-build-network-rails-electrification-factory-train.html) the marvelous example of the Four Sprung Duck Technique that is the High Output Plant will do the full monty, and leave the track behind it ready for action.

    Quote
    The train will complete foundations and stanchions and install and test the overhead line equipment as it moves. It is expected to be able to electrify an average of 1^6 km of track per night, a 'significantly higher rate' than previously achievable, while allowing adjacent tracks to remain open. NR expects this to reduce construction times, disruption and cost.

    German is not my first language.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 07, 2013, 09:31:18
    I took a look at the old bridge as I was leaving Reading this morning. Sections of the side have been removed adjacent to the carpark and also halfway along the closed section over one of the supports. There was a lot of debris laying on the floor, presumably pulled down from the roofspace.

    On platform 7 yesterday evening I noticed a couple of the temporary roof support style girders (wrapped around with the standard issue black corrugated plastic tubing) that I don't recall seeing before and certainly not doing anything useful yet. One was at the extreme eastern end, the other roughly in line with the end of platform 6.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 07, 2013, 13:27:26
    I took a look at the old bridge as I was leaving Reading this morning. Sections of the side have been removed adjacent to the carpark and also halfway along the closed section over one of the supports. There was a lot of debris laying on the floor, presumably pulled down from the roofspace.


    Some sections of the London side were removed some months ago when they fitted the temporary support leg.  That was why there was a wooden hoarding within the bridge on that side.  I think what will happen over the next few days is that anything that can lighten the weight/size of the overall structure will be removed before any 'big lift' starts.  This might include the exterior cladding, the glazing units, flooring etc.  Once they are down to the steel framework sections (and split them at the joins) they'll still be pretty large for road transport removal, perhaps they'll be cut up further in situ.

    It's not as if they'd have a secondhand use on a preserved railway after all...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 07, 2013, 14:06:22
    Once they are down to the steel framework sections (and split them at the joins) they'll still be pretty large for road transport removal, perhaps they'll be cut up further in situ

    Yes, I was wondering if they'd do a big lift n' shift having exposed the framwork at both ends


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 07, 2013, 14:32:53
    Another possibility is that there are separate sections that align with the position of the original support legs, so maybe a relatively short section immediately abutting the car park will be removable in one piece?  (Which is where the crane is working as I write this.)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 07, 2013, 16:16:42
    (Which is where the crane is working as I write this.)

    So it is, various red flashes from presumably a metal cutter and a few roof sections gone as of 4pm visible on Cam 1, tab 3


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 07, 2013, 19:45:39
    Looks like the car park connecting span has gone at 1945ish...........


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 08, 2013, 11:46:06
    ...and a much bigger mobile crane has arrived this morning.  Rest gone by Monday as someone else predicted?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 08, 2013, 16:13:20
    ...second span looks as though its ready to go about 1630ish......


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 08, 2013, 16:33:33
    When is that ghastly office block to go -I worked there once (1965-ish) - real cheap and nasty dump it was.   :(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 08, 2013, 18:40:18
    So up goes the first of the (two?) big spans just before 1830;

    ...and at 1840 the view is completely different!

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 08, 2013, 19:06:37
    I can remember being involved in some of the work when that bridge was built


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 08, 2013, 19:08:40
    ...second span looks as though its ready to go about 1630ish......

    Changed trains there at about 3:30 and it didn't look like much was about to happen.  Must have all happened quickly


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 08, 2013, 22:06:53
    On a rather sombre note, from the Reading Evening Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2130240_inquest_told_of_fight_to_save_colleagues_life?):

    Quote
    Inquest told of fight to save colleague's life

    A 35-year-old construction manager working on the new Network Rail depot collapsed and died while on the phone to a colleague.

    The father died just two days before Christmas last year, an inquest heard on Tuesday.

    Wayne Forster had been working on the Cow Lane construction site for 11 months and was talking on the phone to friend and colleague Darren Lapping when he said: ^I think I^m tripping out here.^

    In a statement, Mr Lapping on another part of the site said he could hear a ^strange breathing noise from the phone^ and called colleague Steve Williams, who has first aid experience.

    Mr Williams went to where Mr Forster had collapsed in his van and started CPR and was soon joined by Mr Lapping who also helped.

    Coroner Peter Bedford read the statement from Mr Lapping ^ who was at the inquest ^ which said Mr Forster had seemed ^his normal self^ but had complained of a rectal bleed that day. Mr Forster^s fianc^e Karen O^Toole had told police she had spoken to him on the phone earlier that day and he had mentioned ^flu-like symptoms^ and the bleeding.

    Pathologist at Royal Berkshire Hospital Dr Colin McCormick told the inquest a post mortem examination revealed a frothy fluid in the lungs which indicated cardiac arrest. Exhaustive tests for various causes of death all came back negative so he gave the cause of death as ^unascertained^.

    However he said the cause of death was almost certainly cardiac arrest, explaining heart damage only showed if the patient lived for some time after the heart stops.

    ^If the patient died immediately there would be no sign of damage.

    He said it was possible to have heart arrhythmia without knowing it and even be put on a heart monitor for 24 hours without it showing up.

    Dr McCormick said: ^It is well recorded that an individual can co-exist with such an arrhythmia and it is not symptomatic until the fatal event when the heart stops beating for just too long.^

    Ms O^Toole told the doctor she and Mr Forster, from Stannington in Northumberland, had a son and asked if it was hereditary.

    He said he had looked for the obvious hereditary heart conditions which were not present, but suggested Mr Forster^s father who was at the inquest should have tests.

    The coroner recorded a verdict of natural causes and praised Mr Forsters^ colleagues for their attempts to save his life.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 09, 2013, 06:26:18
    I was reviewing the artists/architects pictures of the new station and comparing them against the emerging reality.

    One thing I have noticed is that on these pictures there are glass panels running the length of the escalator/stairs wells - presumably to provide cover against weather. I did think some time back that the escalators seemed exposed - and as the new awning rises to the new deck roof, it's even more so.

    Are these panels going to be fitted ?

    I only raise it because with most of the work done squeezing / lifting large glass panels into place would seem to perhaps have been easier earlier on in the works.

    Or perhaps this feature has been dropped ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 09, 2013, 12:45:31
    Some latest(ish) photographs here: http://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/with/8528453394/#photo_8528453394

    Not sure about the fancy new tiling in the subway (plenty of places to prop cigarette ends etc ;D)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 09, 2013, 13:49:47
    Are these panels going to be fitted ?

    I only raise it because with most of the work done squeezing / lifting large glass panels into place would seem to perhaps have been easier earlier on in the works.

    I think it's probably a question of 'wait and see'.  They seem to have had scaffolding rigged under the sloping roofs for some time, presumably to work on the ceiling cladding, which logically wouldn't be fitted until the outside was made watertight.  It doesn't look like there are any suitable fixing points to extend upwards from the sides of the 'staircases', so by default any side glazing would have to hang from the underside of the roofs.  So they might have been planned to be fitted later all along.  (As we discusssed earlier in the thread they are also the sort of areas that are non-essential in terms of getting the new platforms into use, and could feasibly be progressed later.)

    By the way, and on a vaguely similar point, has anyone else noticed that, (as far as the webcams appear to show), the main north and south glazed walls of the new entrances do not continue all the way to the underside of the roof?

    Also, the 'inside' glazed wall above P7 cannot be fitted yet as another roof section is still to be fitted.  This would be above the running line until the platform is widened later in the year, so that will explain the temporary white sheeting on the present north facing side of the southern stairs area.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 09, 2013, 14:06:43
    I was a Reading this morning to see Tornado come through.

    I spotted the gap in the glazing on the new ticket hall and wondered what that was all about.

    The new subway is very functional. If not a little dull. For some reason I thought it would be wider. Seem to recall something saying it would a third wider that old subway as the dividing wall splitting the length of the old tunnel was being taken down.

    Maybe it is wider - just didn't see it.

    And Yes - plenty of dented roof tiles in the subway already :(

    I didn't check the canopies over the escalators/stairs to see if any thing could be hung - but certainly there are no fastening on the concrete to hook on a huge sheet, of what I can imagine is, very heavy glass.

    I suppose its a wait and see to see if they appear later on in some final fix stage.
    Going to be a tad draughty up on the deck with out some kind of windbreak.

    Tornado was awesome BTW.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 09, 2013, 14:31:55
    The new subway is very functional. If not a little dull. For some reason I thought it would be wider. Seem to recall something saying it would a third wider that old subway as the dividing wall splitting the length of the old tunnel was being taken down.

    Maybe it is wider - just didn't see it.

    The old subway was split roughly 50/50 public and staff side, the new layout is supposed to have increased this ratio to about 75/25 in favour of the public side according to the planning drawings, as there is still a resited dividing wall for a smaller building services corridor (for 'private' access to electrical services rooms under the platforms) along the west side - aren't there various doors along that side as well?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 09, 2013, 18:33:25
    By the way, and on a vaguely similar point, has anyone else noticed that, (as far as the webcams appear to show), the main north and south glazed walls of the new entrances do not continue all the way to the underside of the roof?

    I had not realised it was like that both sides.  Tabs seem to have been fitted and I assumed that something  was due to be fixed to them to block the hole.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 10, 2013, 16:32:01
    ...and a much bigger mobile crane has arrived this morning.  Rest gone by Monday as someone else predicted?

    Paul

    Lack of apparent activity yesterday and today lead me to think that you might be wrong there, but sudden activity with crane started at 15:20 (camera 1 tab 3) seems to suggest you and they might be bang on!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 10, 2013, 18:09:27
    I think the relief side has routinely been blocked to trains on Sundays recently, so not planning anything on the Saturday may have been predictable in hindsight.  Edited to add:  Another point I just thought of is that if 'part 1' is still sat on the floor being cut up in situ there's nowhere to put part 2?

    Looking back through the webcam images (as of 1750) the lifting wires seem to have been in position and 'taut' for the last  hour or so, I suppose they get everything set up and take the strain on the crane wires, and then spend quite a time undoing bolts and/or cutting the steelwork.  That's roughly what seemed to happen on Friday, when it appeared 'about to go' for a couple of hours...

    PS, while I was writing this the 1800 update now shows the bridge section moving away at the station end...

    PPS, then not much happened all evening - just keeps going up and down a couple of feet now and again.   ???

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 10, 2013, 21:01:25
    ....well the caption to this photograph states that the lift will not take place until 0215 Monday morning 11/03/2013.....http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/8544070125/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    ....but its on the move at 2120..... ::)

    ....and I hope its not as windy at Reading as it is in the far South West at the moment......think there will be few trees down tonight..... >:(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 10, 2013, 21:22:29
    21:20 Camera 1 Tab 3 - Bridge is mid air at the moment.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 11, 2013, 12:10:29
    From what I can make out on the webcam the crane stuck around long enough to remove the visible supporting structures too.
    I'll be passing through this evening for a closer look.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 11, 2013, 12:29:48
    Just noticed the new western entrance had its ticket barriers installed over the weekend.

    Something else that I noticed for the first time is that the far west end of the 'wall' on that side, (the section that was scaffolded beside the furthest steps for most of last week) includes the word Reading (vertically) as an architectural feature in the brickwork. 

    I thought they were just a few odd dirty marks at first, back in mid February when they hadn't extended the section to full height...   ::)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 11, 2013, 13:07:13
    Something else that I noticed for the first time is that the far west end of the 'wall' on that side, (the section that was scaffolded beside the furthest steps for most of last week) includes the word Reading (vertically) as an architectural feature in the brickwork. 

    I thought they were just a few odd dirty marks at first, back in mid February when they hadn't extended the section to full height...   ::)

    Well spotted!  I certainly hadn't noticed that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 13, 2013, 10:13:59
    On platform 7 yesterday evening I noticed a couple of the temporary roof support style girders (wrapped around with the standard issue black corrugated plastic tubing) that I don't recall seeing before and certainly not doing anything useful yet.

    These now have framework attached at the top and some cabling hanging off the most easterly one. Is this prep work for the rest of the old bridge being removed in the coming months, I wonder.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Angle42 on March 13, 2013, 12:37:05
    I see that the external views (ouside the new maintenance sheds) on Camera set 4 have gone.

    Two internal views left - one the same as before but the other one has changed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 13, 2013, 13:01:09
    These now have framework attached at the top and some cabling hanging off the most easterly one. Is this prep work for the rest of the old bridge being removed in the coming months, I wonder.

    I'd expect removal of the main bridge will be done completely differently to the car park link-spans, intuitively it seems unlikely that they'll just crane it away in big chunks, as there appears to be no-where to position a huge mobile crane, especially to reach the P8/9 island. It's also a much wider and higher 'box section' than the sections already gone. I'd be thinking more about a safety deck built under and around it and then dismantling in situ.

    Can anyone remember how they got it into position back in the 80s?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 13, 2013, 14:08:50
    I see that the external views (ouside the new maintenance sheds) on Camera set 4 have gone.

    Two internal views left - one the same as before but the other one has changed.

    Can someone help here please/  The link i have been following has only three camera positions 9was 40 and doesn't shew the images you are describing at all.

    This is my link

    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading01#

    Is there another then?  Also this 'READING' down a wall is also a mystery to me?  ???


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on March 13, 2013, 14:25:39
    Just change the nrreading01 to nrreading02, then all the way up to 4 to get 4 different sets of cameras.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 13, 2013, 15:47:48
    Brilliant SS, thanks.  I've been deprived all this time!   :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 14, 2013, 16:28:58
    Tubular steel piling going in (almost certainly for OHLE) on the P12/13 and P14/15 islands, about halfway between the canopy and the escape stairs.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 15, 2013, 09:43:19
    There has been a lot of work going on out of sight of camera 2, stripping off the upper layers of the road surface on station hill. You can just see part of the mounds of rubble on the left of tab #1


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 15, 2013, 15:32:50
    That's reassuring because a few days ago I thought they seemed to be working in 'slow motion' alongside the new pedestrian ramps.  But I think they were using concrete saws so as to leave a straight edge when the deck is lifted off.  So if they are digging it out from west to east that does make sense, as they'd have to do that while easy access was still available.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on March 15, 2013, 18:42:29
    The previous stuff from RBC suggested that the Station Hill arcade would be demolished pdq.

    However, seeing the cutting etc. of the old road it looks like the arcade and pavement will be kept for the moment, with just the built-up road surface and associated stilts being removed.

    It's going to be a pretty crazy/weird multi-level environment until they finally bite the bullet and demolish the whole hideous 1960's monstrosity of Station Hill/Gt Western Tower...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 16, 2013, 08:50:23
    Very large mobile crane now in shot at Camera 1 Tab 2, just next to the tower crane. Is the tower crane to go today (it surely must go in the next couple of weeks) or is there something else heavy to move?

    Update: Definitely taking down the tower crane.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on March 16, 2013, 12:23:58
    Does anyone know if the gatelines in the new concourses will be smartcard enabled?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 16, 2013, 18:34:28
    It's going to be a pretty crazy/weird multi-level environment until they finally bite the bullet and demolish the whole hideous 1960's monstrosity of Station Hill/Gt Western Tower...

    Yep, it might take some time to get back to this :)

    http://readingimages.epixtech.co.uk/loc/1224663.PDF (http://readingimages.epixtech.co.uk/loc/1224663.PDF)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 16, 2013, 23:04:57
    Does anyone know if the gatelines in the new concourses will be smartcard enabled?

    I believe DfT have mandated that all ticket barrier installations must allow for ITSO readers as well as magstripe readers, but that alone doesnt mean the current FGW franchise has to use them, or accept anyone else's smartcards.

    The external 'target' feature is just a circular flat area, which an appropriate colour vinyl label is stuck on, the internal electronics and aerials can be tailored to whatever system is needed, be it Oyster, ITSO, or the new EMV format that debits ordinary credit or debit cards.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 17, 2013, 08:57:42
    We now have an electrification mast on the London end of platform 14/15 in Camera 2 Camera 1 Tab 1

    Apologies Correction Made


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 17, 2013, 09:52:43
    We now have an electrification mast on the London end of platform 14/15 in Camera 2 Tab 1

    Camera 2 is of the south side of the station (both tabs).  Have you designated the right one here?  I can see a mast of sorts on Camera 1 tab 1.   ???  Is that it? 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 17, 2013, 15:16:39
    The tower crane has now gone!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 18, 2013, 14:12:11
    Hello folks,

    I'm a brand-new member, though I've been enjoying reading all of your posts for some months now - what knowledgeable and civilised people you are!

    I live in Reading and for some 10-15 years was involved in some of its re-development/renaissance (though not station-related) and so have a dual interest in watching the amazing things that NR, RBC and others are doing with the station and associated areas. All of the posts on this particular thread have therefore been fascinating, and it's been really enjoyable reading your analyses and informed conjectures about why certain things have been designed in certain ways, and whether the scheme will include X or Y, and also about how the design/construction team are going to resolve outstanding issues X, Y and Z. And then with a soft "d'oh!" it finally struck me that most if not all of these issues will already have been aired and resolved in the public domain, as they'll all have had to have had Planning Consent. And so yesterday I set off with my friend Professor Google to see what I could find...and we quickly hit the motherlode. So, in the hope that I'm not repeating what somebody else may have already posted years/months ago, would you be interested in, amongst others, the Planning Applications for the viaducts west of Reading and the Station re-development itself?

    Unfortunately, for some reason my browser has recently stopped letting me copy/paste URLs, so I can't just put direct links to documents here; instead, I've typed out a step-by-step guide which will take you to them. I'm sorry it's so laborious, and again I apologise if you've already seen/discussed the Planning Applications, but nevertheless here goes:

    1.   Go to  www.planning.reading.gov.uk (http://www.planning.reading.gov.uk) (I've typed in that URL as it's a short one)
    2.   Select Enter PublicAccess for Planning
    3a.   In the Search box, enter 11/01885/FUL
       This opens the Planning Application Summary for the west of Reading viaduct works
                Click on the Documents tab
       Click View associated documents
       This opens up a Results window, giving access to 5 pages of documents
       
                For me, the best stuff is on pages 2, 3 and 4, ie elevations and section drawings

    3b.   Back at the Search box, enter 10/01269/FUL
               This opens the Planning Application Summary for the Station re-development
                Again click on the Documents tab
       Again click ^View associated documents^
       This again opens up a Results window, giving access to 2 pages of docs
       
                I recommend you go to p.2 and click on Design and Access Statement (parts 1 and 2). For me, this answers loads  of      questions
     
    I should add that perhaps you shouldn^t embark on this if you have deadines to meet/children to feed/trains to catch ^ you should prepare to write-off several hours of your life, albeit very enjoyably.
           


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 18, 2013, 15:08:53
    Hi Jeff, and welcome to the forum.

    We have previously mentioned a few planning applications, in fact I first saw the one for the western viaducts only a couple of weeks back, but didn't link to it as it didn't really provide any significant new information.

    In the case of the main station works, the application took quite a time to appear on the website for some reason, by the time it was available online IIRC it was all happening anyway...

    It's possibly worth pointing out for anyone using the RBC planning portal for the first time that any links you generate seem to be session based and go stale anyway, so there's no mileage in copying and pasting them.  (This seems to vary between different local authorities as well, some do allow linking direct to documents...)

    Here's one for the depot by the way:

    The new Turbo depot planning reference is 10/01380/FUL if anyone wishes to look at the details - and as usual there are enough details to keep you browsing for quite a while...

    As you'd expect, although the planning application is for a replacement 'Turbo Depot' the drawings show all the facilites are designed to fit four car units with OHLE structures and gantries almost everywhere you look...


    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 18, 2013, 15:35:54
    I answered my own question about camera numbers.  the web site nrreading01 is in fact camera 2 when you get to it and vice versa, so nrreading 02 is camera 1.   >:( >:(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 18, 2013, 15:47:53
    Ah thanks Paul, evidently I was teaching you all to suck eggs re suggesting Planning Applications as source material - I note your post of [cough] Nov 2011 re the Depot application.

    I'll get me coat.

    Jeff


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on March 18, 2013, 16:40:28
    Ah thanks Paul, evidently I was teaching you all to suck eggs ....

    Jeff, you may have been teaching a few, but certainly not all  ;)

    Those of us who've been on this forum for a long time (I can claim to be one of the longest standing!) and post frequently are very much in a minority.   And it's all too easy to forget the majority of the people who read as guests, or who are members who only post occasionally.   For one, I'm very grateful for your detailed post as it helps provide an ongoing resource for guest and new members (and old once who only come by occasionally, or forget ...) - please carry on in that vein.  I actually do something similar in terms of providing technical resource on my own blog - for sure these things have been written about before, but it's really nice to refresh them, put them all together in one place, and perhaps add a new slant.

    In writing this answer, I looked at some of our stats.
    * We have around 150 members who have posted more that 100 time.  Probably "experts"
    * We have a further 1,000+ registered members who have posted less.
    * In the last month, over 13,000 unique visitors have come to the site - that's a lot of guests

    When I'm logged in as an admin, I can numbers of people and roughly where they are, and I frequently notice guests looking at this thread.  And typically there are many more guests than logged in users - a few minutes ago I took a peke and it was 21 to 9 [24 to 5 a few minutes later].  3 or 4 may be spiders indexing us for search engines, but most are from UK IP addresses.  In fact, the 13,000 unique visitors between them made a total of about 31,000 visits in the last month, on average stopping by 5 pages.  And over 29,000 of those 31,000 visits were from the UK.

    I probably don't say "thank you" often enough to all the contributors here - especially those who post from a strong knowledge or educational background.  I hope the figures quoted here give you some idea of just how much you're read and appreciated - all of you!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 18, 2013, 18:02:05
    Thanks Grahame, that's very kind of you.

    Funnily enough, I'd actually just had a look at the number of posts on this thread and though "sheesh, that's a lotta posts!". Very impressive, and also clearly a very nice community here. Coat off and back on peg.

    I'm not sure whether there's been any discussion in the past about some of the interesting issues within the Design and Access Statement within the Planning Application for the Station, but here's something which caught my eye:

    • the Transfer Deck was originally conceived as having a 40m width but then reduced to 30m, with the rationale being that the impacts on walking and queueing times would be within acceptable tolerances
    • the "dwell time" (ie queueing and information-searching) modelled for the Transfer Deck was an average of 2 mins, within the range 1-5 mins
    • there's to be no seating provision on the Deck, as I understand it, with all customer lounges to be on the platforms themselves
    All very interesting, and whilst I do have genuine respect for all of the professionals involved in this extremely impressive project, I do wonder about those three points when taken together; instinctively, I feel that when the icy rain is slanting across the platforms during Nov-April, people may be tempted to "dwell" for considerably longer on the Deck than 1-5 mins.

    What do people think?

    Jeff.
     

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 18, 2013, 18:33:20
    Yes, I can certainly see people staying up on the transfer deck, given the facilities on the platforms don't look that extensive.  And it'll be a good vantage point for those that just like watching the trains.  Do we know if there will be any retail outlets on the deck, or are they being kept to the platforms?  It remains to be seen whether some discrete seating may be provided over time - I guess there will be an element of 'let's see how it goes' with regard to how the deck is used.  The good old general public (even with sophisticated modelling tools on computers) are very hard to predict!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 18, 2013, 18:57:15
    Interesting question about retail facilities on the transfer deck.  In the recent Modern Railways article about the improvements, the author stated that the reason the deck was to be so wide was to allow for retail outlets to be up there.  But I think he was making quite a wrong assumption, perhaps clouded by what's been going on at other NR run places such as Kings Cross and Waterloo; but the difference is that those retail areas are not part of the main circulation spaces.

    The planning stuff (the design and access statement) includes a heck of a lot of detailed info about passenger circulation routes, and the various diagrams suggested to me no catering facilities up there at all, secondly the main layout plans (that I've referred to before now) also show the only permanent items on the deck are the lift shafts.

    None of that means that the sort of pre-fabricated catering stand that they used to have on the existing footbridge cannot be used, but I think there's some evidence that it will just be an open space...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 18, 2013, 19:23:33
    I'm just trying to paste an image-grab of the proposed Transfer Deck interior from the Design & Access Statement into a Word doc, but my pedal-driven laptop is struggling. If/when it consents to me scaling down the image and centring it in the middle of the page, I'll post it here.

    Jeff.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on March 18, 2013, 19:28:19
    If the Word .doc is less than 256KB it can be attached to a post rather than converted to an image and embedded.

    Click on 'Additional Options' below the text entry box when composing a reply and you'll see an 'Attach' facility.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on March 18, 2013, 19:31:01
    A comparable would be the transfer deck/bridge at Clapham.

    Much narrower than the new Reading deck but stuffed to the gunnels in the middle bits with retail outlets including some en-suite seating.

    If NR/GWR can make money out of it they will...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 18, 2013, 19:50:48
    FGW runs the station at the moment so it gets the revenue from retail outlets. Given that this is one of the few income streams it can actively develop, FGW has always been keen to get as much in as possible, in some cases to the detriment of the ambience of the station. At Reading for example, the "Stewpot" outlet on the forecourt immediately outside the main doors is, in my opinion, a dreadful eyesore.

    However, I recall that NR is to manage Reading in future. Although NR is also keen to increase revenue from retail outlets, it appears to take a more holistic view, rather than cramming anything everywhere.

    Whoever does it, there will be a need for coffee outlets, etc, either on the platforms or the bridge. All those commuters making their way each morning from the car park to the train will demand it!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 18, 2013, 20:09:03
    Thanks BNM but unfortunately the doc was over 2mb and when I tried to post it there was a flash and a bang and smoke came out of the top of my monitor and I thought I'd broken the internet. Fortunately I then got an automatic message from your site saying that max file size was 500-some kb. Oh well.

    Instead let me quote the first sentence from the text next to an image of the proposed Transfer Deck interior in the D&A Statement:

    "The transfer deck interior is designed to be as open as possible allowing clear views to all platforms".

    The image shows no retail units.

    For anyone wanting to see the image and the rest of the text, it's in Part 2 of the D&A Statement at Section 5.2 on p.20 in the PDF reader (p.186 of the original Grimshaw document).    


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 18, 2013, 20:37:00
    I picked up the March 2013 edition of the Reading Station News today, at the station. Can't find it on a web site yet.

    Contains some detail about what to expect:

    The new southern entrance will have gateline and three TVMs. The Northern entrance will have gateline, three TVMs, two manned ticket windows, and an excess fare facility.

    FGW providing two mobile help desks, each equipped with PC and printer for journey planning.

    It introduces the idea of the new platforms having A and B ends, with trains sharing platforms.

    It says, by the way, that the new entrances and bridge will be opened on Good Friday, 29th March, although the only train services from the station over Easter will be to Basingstoke, Newbury, Gatwick and Waterloo, The new platforms open on 2 Tuesday 2nd April.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 18, 2013, 20:43:47
    FGW providing two mobile help desks, each equipped with PC and printer for journey planning.

    Putting them out on the transfer deck might be a good idea - during disruption they could easily check where everyone was stood ranting and raving, and move somewhere else...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 18, 2013, 20:46:57
    I picked up the March 2013 edition of the Reading Station News today, at the station. Can't find it on a web site yet.

    Its on the Network Rail site www.networkrail.co.uk/reading (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/reading)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Angle42 on March 19, 2013, 11:06:12
    One thing that keeps escaping me, and the diagram in the March Newsletter does not help...

    Where do you buy a ticket so that you can pass through the gateline on the south side of the station? The gate line seems to be at the entrance to the new section and from the Web cams I can see no evidence of ticket machines, or a ticket office.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 19, 2013, 11:42:12

    Where do you buy a ticket so that you can pass through the gateline on the south side of the station? The gate line seems to be at the entrance to the new section and from the Web cams I can see no evidence of ticket machines, or a ticket office.

    Three TVMs are to be placed there, otherwise you use the existing ticket office.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on March 19, 2013, 11:50:09
    One thing that keeps escaping me, and the diagram in the March Newsletter does not help...

    Where do you buy a ticket so that you can pass through the gateline on the south side of the station? The gate line seems to be at the entrance to the new section and from the Web cams I can see no evidence of ticket machines, or a ticket office.
    It IS shown on one of the maps - image 17 (click here) (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/assets/0/72/4294967297/30064771426/30064771894/30064771897/890592bf-e953-4ba9-9746-1287877c77be.jpg) shows a Northern side ticket office near the multi-story car park on the right of the map. The Southern side ticket office is located next to the arcade, again on the right hand side of the map.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 19, 2013, 12:21:32
    Took some pics yesterday:

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5027.JPG)
    This is the gateline of the new North entrance, taken though glass, so please forgive the reflections. Ticket windows in the background and lots of advertising banners for NR and construction companys. Also some hoardins hiding part of the building - possibly for installation of retail outlets?

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5030.JPG)
    View of the East end of the new platforms. Shows one of the signals that give entry to the platforms, as discussed earlier in the thread.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5031.JPG)
    Another of the East end, OHLE stanchions in place.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5033.JPG)
    The signal gantry at the East end.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5034.JPG)
    The end of the old bridge! And a pile of timber, presumably to be used during the Easter block?

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5038.JPG)
    Shot of the Western stairs/escalators from platforms 10/11 to bridge. The walls are being capped with a substantial bit of metal, presumably the base for the glass screens discussed earlier. There is gap visible between the ceiling of the bridge and the flying canopy. It doesn't look as though these are to be filled in - they have a mesh grill in them, presumably to keep pigeons out. It will be interesting to see how well the bridge is protected from the elements.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5039.JPG)
    Stairs and escalators from platforms 8/9 to bridge.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5040.JPG)
    Lots of work going on at the Western approaches to the new platforms, and OHLE visible in the new depot.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oxman/100_5043.JPG)
    The knitting going up in the eastern depot sidings.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 19, 2013, 12:36:09
    The first of Oxman's pictures shows that the ticket gates do have the circular area (behind which the smart card electronics can be fitted) - as discussed a couple of days ago...

    Based on the latest basement level plan on RBC's website, that NR banner is over a recess where some TVMs will be fitted.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 19, 2013, 12:36:56
    In the second photo, the old office block looks like a hollow shell with no glass in the window spaces - is that right?  I wonder when it will come down?
    Thanks very much for these images; actually better than the web cams for detail.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 19, 2013, 12:49:07

    Where do you buy a ticket so that you can pass through the gateline on the south side of the station? The gate line seems to be at the entrance to the new section and from the Web cams I can see no evidence of ticket machines, or a ticket office.

    Three TVMs are to be placed there, otherwise you use the existing ticket office.

    Again, there's been some disinformation knocking around about the entrance use.  One of the articles I read a few weeks ago stated fairly categorically that the 'old entrance' was going to be for P7 and the Southern (SWT) platforms only - but the same interchange along P7 will still be there - and anyone coming from the ticket desk will be able to use either route.

    There might have been a time when the new entrance was to get a manned ticket office, but it'd been removed by the time of the planning application for what's actually being built.   Earlier development plans did give the new entrance all the facilities, and reduce the Brunel Arcade's status, but that was too expensive IIRC.

    (It's always possible that temporary closures of P7 will occur, perhaps over weekends while it is being widened of course.)


    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 19, 2013, 13:12:58
    But isn't that the north entrance?  Webcam 2/1 suggests the south entrance barrier line is not that complete yet.  If I'm right, then based on the latest basement level plan on RBC's website, that NR banner is over a recess where some TVMs will be fitted.

    Paul

    Apologies, yes it is the North entrance. Edited to correct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 19, 2013, 13:44:08
    There has been a lot of work going on out of sight of camera 2, stripping off the upper layers of the road surface on station hill. You can just see part of the mounds of rubble on the left of tab #1

    A large section of this had been demolished as of yesterday evening, in a line running across most of the road width on Station Hill. You can see how far out this extends in the very lower section of camera #2, 2


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 19, 2013, 16:54:56
    A large section of this had been demolished as of yesterday evening, in a line running across most of the road width on Station Hill. You can see how far out this extends in the very lower section of camera #2, 2

    Significant progress being made this afternoon, as of 1645 they are level with the end of the new ramps - the space under the road looks about 2 or even 3 metres in height?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 19, 2013, 17:03:52
    A large section of this had been demolished as of yesterday evening, in a line running across most of the road width on Station Hill. You can see how far out this extends in the very lower section of camera #2, 2

    Significant progress being made this afternoon, as of 1645 they are level with the end of the new ramps - the space under the road looks about 2 or even 3 metres in height?

    Paul

    It was an underground car park I believe. There was a door from the old subway that lead through to it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 19, 2013, 19:57:01
    Cameras 4/1 and 4/4 at the new depot reactivated in a slightly different position at 1645 today (19 March 2013).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 19, 2013, 22:09:32
    Ended up coming back from Reading rather than London on the train today.  Used the underpass for the first time.  Much activity.  Saw much of the stuff shown on Oxman's photographs.

    Noticed that on the country end canopies, the mountings for the supports for the overhead wires has been fitted to exted the gantry that already spans from 12/13 to 14/15.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 20, 2013, 13:46:28
    Camera 1 on nrreading04 shows a piledriver and crane at work in the yard on the south side of the tracks. First physical activity on the west end flyovers etc?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 20, 2013, 14:34:20
    Thanks Oxman, these were 'new to me' (camera 1 and 4 as previously I had only seen the two inside the depot).

    Looking at the panorama, it's a good job that, somehow, the old goods railway land in that area was not sold of by the property board, isn't it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 20, 2013, 18:14:38
    The glass 'screens' have appeared.

    The look at little cosmetic rather than functional ?
    The hole is looking mighty draughty !


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 20, 2013, 18:32:37
    I agree - there is certainly plenty of ventilation on the footbridge! I wonder how draughty it will be and whether the wind will howl down it or across it - is this the kind of thing architects can model?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 21, 2013, 15:53:47
    I wonder if there's ever been any realistic likelihood the stairs/escalators would be fully screened, (notwithstanding how they have been shown in various planning sketches)?  It isn't as if the existing setup on P8/9 is windproof after all.

    With just over a week to go there are station name signs, notice boards, seats etc starting to appear on the new platforms, although as usual there's also more block paving removal going on!

    The removal of the road deck alongside the ramps (outside the southern entrance) is now proceeding reasonably quickly.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 22, 2013, 14:40:58
    Another prediction, based on what I saw from the steps over the subway, is that they are about to divert the pedestrian route past the southern gateline entrance.  The hoarding has been removed a couple of days ago, but they are now placing those concrete blocks as if to support a new hoarding line, parallel to the gateline opening and extending towards the Three Guineas, so you'd have to assume some (or all) of the portakabins are about to be removed.  Perhaps they'll do that over this weekend?

    That would then allow the Reading BC demolition contractor to get access to where their new steps will be that will provide the more direct route from the subway opening, i.e. bearing left on exit towards the station forecourt and the town centre...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 22, 2013, 20:38:25
    Another prediction, based on what I saw from the steps over the subway, is that they are about to divert the pedestrian route past the southern gateline entrance.  The hoarding has been removed a couple of days ago, but they are now placing those concrete blocks as if to support a new hoarding line, parallel to the gateline opening and extending towards the Three Guineas, so you'd have to assume some (or all) of the portakabins are about to be removed.  Perhaps they'll do that over this weekend?

    That would then allow the Reading BC demolition contractor to get access to where their new steps will be that will provide the more direct route from the subway opening, i.e. bearing left on exit towards the station forecourt and the town centre...

    Paul

    Surely they will have to move the grey portacabins that are in front of the Three Guineas otherwise you cannot get through to the existing station entrance.

    I presume the portacabins are temporary offices and storage that will transfer to the office space in the new North Entrance building and will go over Easter.

    Alternatively this is in readiness for 2nd April and gives access to new entrance and old one (once portacabins have been removed).  The hoarding then, as you suggest would protect the Reading BC Works.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 23, 2013, 01:34:48
    Remember that the new station bits open on Good Friday, just six days away. I think there may be room for a walking route to the new south side entrance between the portacabins and the Three Guineas. It certainly looks, as Paul said, that there is hoarding being erected to divert the walking route from the subway across the front of the new entrance.

    Relocating the station offices from the portacabins to the new offices on the North side will not be trivial. There will be a new station control office in the north side building, replacing the one in the portacabins, but with a huge increase in functionality. Lots of computers and comms  to be configured. I don't know when this will be implemented, but the portacabins can't go until it is!

    I would be surprised if this can be done before Good Friday. It might happen over the Easter weekend. Either way, there is a lot going on in the next two weeks!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 23, 2013, 09:10:45
    I think there may be room for a walking route to the new south side entrance between the portacabins and the Three Guineas.

    On closer inspection I think you might be right.  I did not see that gap.  It looks like part of the section under the roof is outside the doors. So it might be large enough.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 23, 2013, 11:12:34
    I know from an internal briefing that the Network Rail Chairman, CEO and ex board visited Reading station during the week to ensure everything was in place for the Easter works and the new parts that will be opened for public use will be safe to do so


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 23, 2013, 13:06:17
    I often wonder (from the outside) whether visits from top brass help or hinder.  Pats on the back and thank you noises are perhaps more helpful. 

    I notice that on the new passageway on the south side, there are staff positioned, in the rush hour at least.  I wondered if they were giving out leaflets about the coming arrangements? 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 23, 2013, 13:23:44
    I often wonder (from the outside) whether visits from top brass help or hinder.  Pats on the back and thank you noises are perhaps more helpful. 

    Looking at it another way. If it all went wrong, the board would carry the can. So visiting to find out whether it is genuinely ready might seem like a good idea to the board, given the amount that is at risk here.

    I notice that on the new passageway on the south side, there are staff positioned, in the rush hour at least.  I wondered if they were giving out leaflets about the coming arrangements? 

    Yes they are. At least when I went through on Tuesday afternoon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 23, 2013, 17:50:40
    Thanks ED.  I just wondered what Board members could establish there that they could not establish with a phone call?  Unless they thought the contractors were lying.  Even we have the webcams.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 23, 2013, 19:39:15
    I often wonder (from the outside) whether visits from top brass help or hinder.  Pats on the back and thank you noises are perhaps more helpful. 
    Their visits are a pain in the !!! however they are an essential part of a project especially something as high profile as Reading anything goes wrong its the CEO that will be in front of the Transport Select Committee or even worse John Humphries.  Their visit will highlight things that the project team miss due to being so close to it.


    Thanks ED.  I just wondered what Board members could establish there that they could not establish with a phone call?  Unless they thought the contractors were lying.  Even we have the webcams.
    There is nothing like getting the real feel for it, imagine the flack they would get if they answered questions on the project just based on third party information and webcam images.

    I would be more concerned if they did not visit


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: coachflyer on March 23, 2013, 22:46:03
    Camera shows that there has been some gauging tests on the depot today and there is a turbo stabled in the new shed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on March 24, 2013, 11:40:39
    It's called MBWA (Management by Walking About) as advocated by Tom Peters and Nacy Austin in A Passion for Excellence,

    Maybe if more company bosses and politcians did it then things might be considerably better. Lord Adonis when transport minister was a good example.

    Gerry Fiennes tells the story of a Divisonal Manger at Doncaster on the pre war LNER who gradually raised his Divison up the table for punctuality. When asked how he'd done it "personal supervison sir". Apparently what was not said was that "personal supervison" consisted of standing at the door of the buffet on Doncaster station with a pint in hand!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 24, 2013, 15:23:55
    It's called MBWA (Management by Walking About) as advocated by Tom Peters and Nacy Austin in A Passion for Excellence,

    That must be a new PC version - on my management course the acronym used was still 'GOYA'.

    ...as in Get Off Your A***.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 24, 2013, 15:44:50
    Attached is a poor picture showing a local Turbo *in* the bounds of the new train depot. I presume doing some firm of track circuit proving.

    It was sitting alongside the country most shed - on the line connecting the country end stabling sidings with the main depot shed.

    To its left were the freight lines - soon to be new relief lines.

    Also ground clearance for new viaduct seems advanced - a few drill in situ just to the west of the line to Reading West. They did not seem to line up with the existing 'gap' that is P7/8 - which were further north in alignment, so they must be related to some if the dive under build activity I concluded.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 24, 2013, 16:56:34
    Camera shows that there has been some gauging tests on the depot today and there is a turbo stabled in the new shed.

    Yes.  You can see it in the new shed at 1530 on Saturday 23 March 2013 on Camera 4 Tab 3.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 25, 2013, 13:19:32

    Also ground clearance for new viaduct seems advanced - a few drill in situ just to the west of the line to Reading West. They did not seem to line up with the existing 'gap' that is P7/8 - which were further north in alignment, so they must be related to some if the dive under build activity I concluded.

    I think where those piling machines are operating (visible in webcam 04/1 in long shot) is roughly where the new 'south to east' freight chord will be heading round to pass under the viaduct - the concrete box section where the lines cross will not necessarily match the obvious line of the flyover route because the freight chord will pass under on a skewed angle.

    When it comes to the main flyover construction, the east end ramp will have to line up roughly with the present 'gap' through P9/P10 anyway, with a gradual move over to line up with the existing mains well beyond the west junction somewhere.  However the east end of the flyover also carries a third line (is that the route to be known as the 'Festival line'?) to enable XC services to get over the freight chord and then dive under the main line pair to reach the reliefs, so the eastern part of the viaduct will have to be wide enough for three tracks, with the southern track lining up with P8.

    What would be handy is a nice straightforward before and after plan, something I haven't quite found yet when searching the planning application linked a few pages ago...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 25, 2013, 16:17:24
    Took this pic at Reading this morning.

    It was taken from the stairs to platform 10 looking west along platform 11. The reason for the shot is the black triangle in the white circle.

    Its clearly a sign for drivers - its mounted on a substantial bracket so as to be clearly visible to drivers. I could see what were probably the same signs on other platforms, and there was probably another one of these facing west on platform 11, about 20m beyond the one which is visible.

    My guess is that they are markers to show stopping points for trains that are intended to use only half the platform - a sort of Reading "St Andrew's Cross"?

    Unless of course, you know differently?

    By the way, looked at the work to open the new south side concourse, and it look to me as though passengers will be channelled through the walkway that was built for the opening of the subway, at least until the FGW portacabins are removed.
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 25, 2013, 16:46:03
    The triangles for P15 and P13 are easily visible on webcam 01/1 as well. 

    I don't really see what the potential problem is with normal 'X car stop' markers like they use on the A and B split platforms at Southampton though. I suppose there's some sort of rationale for every area having its own way of doing the same thing, but I can't think what it might be...

    In separate news, they've now positioned the OHLE mast (and gantry) on the P12/13 island that seemed to be dragging on for a few days.  Over the weekend it looked like they were doing something very time-consuming in the excavation on the platform, they did the steel piling a week or so back...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on March 25, 2013, 19:20:31
    It's called MBWA (Management by Walking About) as advocated by Tom Peters and Nacy Austin in A Passion for Excellence,

    Maybe if more company bosses and politcians did it then things might be considerably better. Lord Adonis when transport minister was a good example.

    Gerry Fiennes tells the story of a Divisonal Manger at Doncaster on the pre war LNER who gradually raised his Divison up the table for punctuality. When asked how he'd done it "personal supervison sir". Apparently what was not said was that "personal supervison" consisted of standing at the door of the buffet on Doncaster station with a pint in hand!

    At sea it was called "Captain's Rounds", consisting of him (!) visiting every compartment to see the sailors on watch directly. In hospitals it was called "Matron's Rounds", again to maintain standards by professional leadership. Many modern disasters are traceable to ceasing this practice.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on March 25, 2013, 20:52:05
    Took this pic at Reading this morning.

    It was taken from the stairs to platform 10 looking west along platform 11. The reason for the shot is the black triangle in the white circle.

    Its clearly a sign for drivers - its mounted on a substantial bracket so as to be clearly visible to drivers. I could see what were probably the same signs on other platforms, and there was probably another one of these facing west on platform 11, about 20m beyond the one which is visible.

    My guess is that they are markers to show stopping points for trains that are intended to use only half the platform - a sort of Reading "St Andrew's Cross"?

    Unless of course, you know differently?

    It looks like a 'Rear Clear' sign - see here for an explanation [25.23]: http://www.railsigns.co.uk/sect25page2/sect25page2.html (http://www.railsigns.co.uk/sect25page2/sect25page2.html)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 25, 2013, 21:06:09
    Correct.  As defined in Railway Group Standard GI/RT7033 Sign AK205z.  However, if it is to be a marker as to where the second train into the platform would have to stop then it should really be Sign AK105 as shown here: http://www.railsigns.co.uk/pics/pic_midplat/pic_midplat.html and here: http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Control%20Command%20and%20Signalling/Railway%20Group%20Standards/GIRT7033%20Iss%202.pdf

    Personally I think the rear clear markers are being incorrectly used to indicate to the driver when the first train is berthed into the platform without the rear end sticking out as a guide as to where to stop to allow the second train to berth from the opposite direction ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 25, 2013, 21:09:19
    Yup, that's where any train of 5-cars or less, that is returning back in the direction from whence it came, will stop, as of the opening of the new platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 25, 2013, 23:19:57
    That's interesting re the black-triangle-on-white-disc sign; I'd seen those on the webcams and, as a lay-person, had just thought that they signalled to alighting passengers "here's where you go UP in order to go out/change platforms", as they're sited adjacent to the stairs/lifts/escalators. Evidently, they have a specific operational purpose, but it's a nice happy accident that they also have value to the first-time arrivee at Reading.     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 25, 2013, 23:26:12
    I can see how this works for a max train length of 5 cars,  but why introduce a scheme that could easily be overtaken by events within a few years, for instance if after electrification they end up using typical 4 or 8 car EMUs in multiple.

    Jeff's suggestion only applies to the London end, because the platform length is not centred around the transfer deck.  Hopefully not too many people will interpret them that way, and they will use the normal way out signs to find the exits...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 26, 2013, 03:47:46
    I can see how this works for a max train length of 5 cars,  but why introduce a scheme that could easily be overtaken by events within a few years, for instance if after electrification they end up using typical 4 or 8 car EMUs in multiple.

    If the trains are 4-car then that'll still work well with this 'rear clear' system, i.e. a 4-car EMU could quite happily share the same platform with a 5-car Voyager.  Anything as long as an 8-car (even with 20m vehicles) and you would always struggle to fit another train in the same platform given the platform lengths we have - I'm guessing that they are the maximum length that space constraints would practically allow?  Hopefully, come the end of the decade there will be a dedicated platform (or two) used solely for a 10-car Crossrail train operating at a 4tph frequency - that should be possible (and in my opinion sensible) given the extra capacity afforded by the extra platforms.  Use of the 'rear clear' system would then be more limited.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 26, 2013, 08:47:54
    A couple of things I noticed this morning:

    The lifts on platform 7 have been installed and it looked like some initial proving was taking place.
    The temporary stairs down to platform 10/16 are gone.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 26, 2013, 09:25:45
    Jeff's suggestion only applies to the London end, because the platform length is not centred around the transfer deck.  Hopefully not too many people will interpret them that way, and they will use the normal way out signs to find the exits...

    Paul


    Ha ha elegantly done, Paul! Yes, I do have admit that my layperson's interpretation was rather simplistic. Thanks for gently putting me right. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 26, 2013, 11:49:06
    Ha ha elegantly done, Paul! Yes, I do have admit that my layperson's interpretation was rather simplistic. Thanks for gently putting me right. 

    What made me realise the signs were probably offset towards the London side of the transfer deck, was that Oxman's picture which is alongside an escalator box, seems to show the back of a similar sized round plate for the other direction just a few feet away... 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 26, 2013, 19:03:14
    Lights on tonight on the new platforms.

    Seems on the southern side of the lift shafts a row of passenger information displays is going to be resident.

    Signs up on waiting rooms at country end say toilets are at the other (London) end of the platform

    Does any one know if the closure will be used as an opportunity to clear away the remainder of the old buildings on platform 8/9 and 10.
    I think it was discussed that the lift shaft on P10 will go to allow track laying for P11 - but what about the rest ?

    Also - I presume old P16 closes during the blockade?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 26, 2013, 23:21:22
    I'd be somewhat surprised if the demolition of the remaining buildings, escalators and lift shafts etc was to be done over the coming week.  The planned work sequence that is already known has the current platform 11 out of use until mid August - so there's no obvious urgency there, and when new P11 opens P10 then closes for a few months.  There are also various sequential closures of P7/8/9 with a completion deadline of spring 2014.

    What I would expect to happen during the 10 days of this closure is removal of the remaining sections of the old footbridge, but only because that would otherwise involve work above the tracks, so doing it now avoids an extra closure of the main line.

    P16 closure is a given - the track diagrams posted a while ago no longer show it after this blockade.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 26, 2013, 23:52:45
    Demolition of buildings is not that straightforward these days. The buildings must be stripped out carefully particularly to remove any hazardous materials (e.g. asbestos) before the bulldozers can move in.  The might not be a problem with the bridge pier on P11 (as it was built after asbestos was banned I think), but the station buildings will need careful stripping out over a couple of weeks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on March 27, 2013, 22:19:09
    Thought you may want to see this piece of news about the station - it has some views from the new platforms which makes the station looking like it was reported from a wrong station! (As in it doesnt feel like its Reading station)

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-21962629


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 27, 2013, 22:26:47
    Quote From the BBC Report: No trains will run from the south's busiest station from 23:45 GMT on Thursday until 04:00 BST on Tuesday as engineers get to work.

    There will be trains to/from the station throughout the blockade.  Haven't they read the Blockade Timetables ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 27, 2013, 22:27:05
    Hmmm.. got a lot of respect for Paul Clifton but it isn't true no trains will use Reading over Easter.  Waterloo and North Downs trains will use the bays to the east of the station and trains from the B&H and Basingstoke will be using the west bays. Wouldn't have been too hard to check that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 28, 2013, 00:13:36
    Meanwhile, thanks for posting that link, CheekyPaul - and a warm welcome to the Coffee Shop forum!  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 28, 2013, 11:05:42
    The wrappings were very much coming off this morning. The wooden hoardings along P7, 8, 9 were replaced by metal fences and various waiting rooms and lifts were in evidence. A large arrivals and departures screen was operational in the south entrance opposite the stairs.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2013, 13:51:39
    I noticed one odd aspect to the new signage.  Above the lift doors at platform level, the relevant platform numbers are prominently displayed. (As an example, webcam 01/3 shows these above the lift doors on the P14/15 island as 15B and 14B.

    Surely when standing looking at a lift it should be labelled with where it is going to, not where someone is coming from?  Or am I reading too much into this?

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2013, 14:23:37
    Also just noticed there's a giant sized Ainscough crane present again, positioned by the car park. 

    So how about this for a theory? 

    Build a temporary working surface over the tracks and new platforms, using all that timber and polystyrene blocks that have already been delivered, and then use the massive crane to lift a normal mobile crane up there, and/or other suitable machinery, that will then be used to dismantle the old footbridge...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on March 28, 2013, 21:08:18
    I was wondering if anyone knows what will happen to the 1989 Brunel station building long term once the new development is completed?

    Only its gonna be looking weird to have a 2014 building standing next to the 1860 & 1989 buildings, all in three different designs. The 1860 building is grade listed and cannot be redesigned etc but at least if the Brunel station is going to stay, wouldn't it be good to have the exterior re-clad etc so that it actually matches the 2014 station designs and have the older building looking grand between the two older buildings in matching designs?

    I'll personally would rather they get rid of the 1989 building, and replace it with something to cater those railway passengers, such as more cafes, shops etc, as in better design, more space etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 29, 2013, 11:54:32
    I'll personally would rather they get rid of the 1989 building, and replace it with something to cater those railway passengers, such as more cafes, shops etc, as in better design, more space etc.

    There's an interesting question about how much the station concourse will be used after the new transfer deck opens.  I predict it will be a much quieter place, and the existing cafes and shops might find it difficult to survive.  The usual rush hour crowds will, in the majority of cases, filter out of the station through the new south gateline at the base of the transfer deck, with only passengers arriving on platforms 4, 5, 6, and the London end of platform 7 likely to filter through the concourse as everyone has had to previously do.  I also wonder how many passengers will choose to wait for their train in an area which will become quite far removed from where they have to go to get a connecting train?  I have a feeling the existing concourse will become a bit of a ghost town comparative to how it is now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on March 29, 2013, 13:44:43
    One of the non-chain firms has already complained, I can't remember their name but they make their own ice cream.  Apparently they have been frozen out of a pitch on the 'new' side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 29, 2013, 13:52:55
    Over 100000 views of this thread and 1424 posts - still a way to go before it overtakes the Cotswold Line Redoubling thread which has managed 156060 views and 1623 posts, but I reckon it'll get there sooner rather than later...!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 29, 2013, 17:55:04
    Over 100000 views of this thread and 1424 posts - still a way to go before it overtakes the Cotswold Line Redoubling thread which has managed 156060 views and 1623 posts, but I reckon it'll get there sooner rather than later...!

    Spooky...I was just wondering what the stats were!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 29, 2013, 21:34:29
    I was wondering if anyone knows what will happen to the 1989 Brunel station building long term once the new development is completed?

    I know the 1980s monstrosity is labelled the 'Brunel Arcade', but referring to it as the 'Brunel station building' didn't half confuse me for a minute or so...   ???

    I think the bottom line is that altering the Brunel Arcade and the possibility of re-siting the manned ticket office was looked at during the design and planning application stages but was found to have significant costs that would impart no operational advantage.  What they decided to do was put the money they had into passenger circulation facilities.

    Nonetheless if I'd been designing it I think I'd have turfed the pub out of the 'heritage building' and resited it into the arcade.  I'd have had the manned ticket office where the pub now is with internal exits to the left and right into the new and existing gateline areas, which IMHO would have given the advantage of a more obvious and central ticket office for 'strangers' to the station, with parallel routes either side directly to the new gatelines for those who already had tickets.

    I had a good look round the transfer deck this afternoon, and as far as it goes so far I'm thinking 'WOW'.  It is absolutely massive - and following the discussion a few days ago, once you get used to the scale of it you can see a number of corners which could safely contain catering facilities without impacting on the circulation routes at all.  Difficult to explain but anyone who has a look round over the next few days will immediately realise this.

    The north side ticket office was up and running, as were the two new gatelines - makes a lot of sense for the staff to have a 'soft start' over the weekend, I suppose with various shift changes it should ensure that many of the staff are already completely familiar with the layout before the Tuesday morning peak starts.

    Photos available on flickr here, not mine:  http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on March 29, 2013, 23:49:34
    Can you still ask for a 'platform' ticket nowadays, or will I need to buy a single to Reading West to have a gander?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 29, 2013, 23:52:18
    Camera 1 Tab 1 annoyingly shows activity of a large excavator next to Platform 11 and the old footbridge, but it is mainly off the field of vision. Its a Gilpin's machine and seems to be producing a lot of spoil. Is is demolishing the stairs at the end of the footbridge. This sort of activity is blocking platform 12 so would need to be done this weekend to allow work on the new platform 11 to continue without closing platform 12.

    Anyone know what is going on?

    UPDATE:  Some more photos just gone up on Flickr - Yes it is! (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/8601234896/in/pool-1945836@N21)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 29, 2013, 23:58:22
    Can you still ask for a 'platform' ticket nowadays, or will I need to buy a single to Reading West to have a gander?

    Wouldn't you need to buy a return - so you can get back out again, through the barriers?  :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on March 30, 2013, 00:05:00
    Ah, good,point!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 30, 2013, 08:45:35
    A close look at Camera 2 Tab 2 shows that at least the top of the northern (P9/10) span of the old footbridge has gone!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 30, 2013, 11:38:23
    A close look at Camera 2 Tab 2 shows that at least the top of the northern (P9/10) span of the old footbridge has gone!

    Good Spot ! There are 3:15am today - gone at 3:30.

    Looks like the opportunity to get rid of the old while they can is too precious a one to pass up.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 30, 2013, 14:09:25
    The roof of the stairwell from the old footbridge down to P8/9 disappeared between 12:15 and 12:30 today Camera 2 Tab 2.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on March 30, 2013, 15:18:17
    Hmmmm....

    I'm trying to be really positive here, and I haven't been to the station yet and have only seen the interior pics on flickr, but does anybody else feel that the signage is just...nowhere near good enough? I've had serious reservations about it over the past few weeks when looking at it on the webcams but was hoping that that was largely because those views were less than ideal, but having seen Mark & Naomi Iliff's and Dave C's pics on flickr (thankyou to all three of you) I have to say that my heart sank. In short, I think the signage is too small, is too "busy", and is too "late", especially on the Transfer Deck. I'm sure you know what I mean by "busy", ie small signs trying to convey too much information, but what I mean by "late" is that it looks as though one has to actually go to the signs to get key strategic directions (ie, on how to get to platform Xa or Yb, or to the exit), rather than have them convey that information from a distance. For example, the Transfer Deck is 100m long, but if I was a first-time emergee from the escalators at either end (as thousands of people will be on Tues) I would be faced with a very large, undifferentiated space stretching off into the distance, with no clear instinctive or signalled sense of where I should be aiming for. I would have to walk towards the central lift pods in order to read directional information, in what looks to be quite a small font. So that means that I wouldn't get that information until very "late" in my journey towards my desired platform. What I'd like to see instead would be very very large and prominent platform numbers on those pods, so large that they'd be visible from the other end of the Deck. I'm therefore hoping that those large blank panels on the pods are reserved for such large numerals. I also hope for large numerals immediately above/adjacent to the opening of the stair/escalators themselves. 

    And my other concern is about the signage for people emerging from the lifts on the Deck; as I see it, one would alight from the train on platform Xa, enter a lift (which, as someone pointed out the other day, are themselves confusingly signed/numbered at platform level), and then emerge onto the Deck...facing straight back towards the stairs/escalators going to/from the platform that I'd just left. I think that will confuse people and so they'll spend valuable seconds trying to work out what has just happened and whether they'd actually selected the wrong lift, and I think that additionally they still also won't know instinctively/immediately which way to go next for the platform/exit that they did want. I think this designs-in congestion in front of the lift doors on the Deck, and that this might be further exacerbated by the people I described in the para above themselves gravitating towards the pods in order to get their own directional information.

    Architects are trained to ensure that people's navigation of large and unfamiliar spaces, especially against the time-constraint of a train departure, should be largely intuitive, and that the design of those spaces should both facilitate that and also minimise reliance on signage. I really do hate to carp, but it seems to me that these spaces and pedestrian-flows are not intuitive, and furthermore that not only does there seem to be a corresponding over-reliance on signage but that that signage does not actually do its job very well.   

    Or is it just me?

    I should add that I'm not an architect, and nor am I moaner, I'm just an ordinary punter puzzled by why what seems to be some unnecessary complications in how to use this brand-new station.             


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 30, 2013, 18:04:31
    I didn't get the impression that the signage is too small when seeing it for real - I think the pictures might be making it look small because the surrounds are so big. 

    I think you have to allow for a certain amount of common sense, people ascending towards a station footbridge would surely expect to leave at one side or the other - and the mainly glass ends through which you can see the surrounding streetscape seem to immediately tell you which way is the town centre and which way isn't, even if you ignore the signage.

    I'm no expert, but I suspect that safety comes into the orientation of lift doors so that on exit from a lift you'd normally be heading along the platform, rather than towards the platform edge.  Obviously you can go to the expense of having lifts with doors on differnt sides, eg 90 degrees apart, but I'd think that most people would be familiar with turning round to face where they've come from when exiting a lift.  So intuitively if you enter a lift at platform level knowing that Reading town centre is on your left, you'd then assume on exiting that it would be on your right.

    Lastly platform numbers - again intuitively you'd expect them to appear in numerical order, so if heading to (say) P12 you'd expect it to be further away from whatever first number you see, whether that is P8 if coming from the south, or P15 coming from the north.  There are pretty obvious platform numbers at the top of each bank of escalators/stairs, however read on to my next point.

    What might be an issue is something you didn't mention, but all the signs have A or B suffixes.  I know only too well happens at Southampton, where all 4 platforms are subdivided and labelled with A and B suffixes.  What happens is that long trains are shown on the PIS with a number only, so for instance heading for a 12 car train on P2, strangers look for signs for P2.  As they don't realise that P2 actually means P2A and P2B together, and coming out the lift there are no obvious directions to P2!  IMHO in this case it would be better for long trains to show on the PIS as P2A/B.   

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on March 30, 2013, 18:07:37
    What might be an issue is something you didn't mention, but all the signs have A or B suffixes.  I know only to well happens at Southampton, where all 4 platforms are subdivided and labelled with A and B suffixes.  What happens is that long trains are shown on the PIS with a number only, so for instance heading for a 12 car train on P2, strangers look for signs for P2.  As they don't realise that P2 actually means P2A and P2B together, and coming out the lift there are no obvious directions to P2!  IMHO in this case it would be better for long trains to show on the PIS as P2A/B.   

    Paul
    I'm with you on this Paul-Birmingham New Street is another example.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 30, 2013, 18:43:56
    Especially as it was not all that long ago that Reading had Platforms 4A and 4B - where were not the same as Platform 4.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 30, 2013, 19:02:18
    Network rail have posted these images on twitter

    pic.twitter.com/44z6DBUYKG (http://pic.twitter.com/44z6DBUYKG)

    pic.twitter.com/nqQ5kUVHlX (http://pic.twitter.com/nqQ5kUVHlX)

    Sorry never worked out how to do images


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 30, 2013, 22:36:30
    Good set of pictures here showing how they are chomping up the old footbridge in situ, using JCBs etc lifted into position by the big crane...

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/8603177757/in/photostream/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 31, 2013, 14:36:17
    A photograph of the new Reading workstation at TVSC has been posted here: http://www.signalbox.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2478


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 31, 2013, 14:54:23
    Are those display screens scrollable?  The platforms seem to divide across the monitors bit like fold on a map - just the place you want to look!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 31, 2013, 15:19:28
    Are those display screens scrollable?  The platforms seem to divide across the monitors bit like fold on a map - just the place you want to look!

    No.  The screens are only switchable between views or to show an enlarged area in more detail.  The split is just where you need it as the signals and S&C at each end on the approach to the platforms appears on one screen only.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 31, 2013, 18:51:32
    S&TE, are there separate Track Circuits for the A and B ends on P10-15?  I was going to look when I'm there on Tuesday, but you probably know.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 31, 2013, 20:19:53
    I'd be somewhat surprised if the demolition of the remaining buildings, escalators and lift shafts etc was to be done over the coming week. 

    Failed with that prediction then...   >:(

    The demolition contractor seems to be adopting a 'scorched earth policy' on the P8/9 island after all, including removal of the last of the old platform buildings.  Discussions at the station this afternoon suggest that the last section of the old footbridge will be left for a while, possibly until next weekend, because the route through P7 is still needed by engineering trains.

    Other points of note this afternoon:

    From my viewpoint it looked very much like the new relief lines were physically complete east of the station.  Does anyone know if modern practice will require proper test trains to run tomorrow some time?

    The up bay platform 16 (old P6) has just about been filled in over it's whole length. 

    Cutting back the platform edges of the London end of both P11 and P9 are well in hand.  P11 re-alignment has always appeared likely, but  now that you can visualise the alignment of the new down main line (as seen from the transfer deck) it also seems that the P9 side of the other island will also have to be trimmed back a little as well.

    It definitely looks like the P8/9 island is getting shortened at the London end as well.

    The east end of the old up main through road (between the P7 and P8 tracks) has been cut back to about the position of the old footbridge, but as of this afternoon it was still being used to hold engineers trains.

    Paul 

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on March 31, 2013, 21:51:06
    From the Reading Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2131380_uncertain_future_for_railway_caf?):

    Quote
    Uncertain future for railway caf^

    A popular independent caf^ at Reading station is facing an uncertain future in the face of massive changes at the railway.

    (http://m.gmgrd.co.uk/sbres/12.$plit/C_67_article_2131380_body_articleblock_0_bodyimage.jpg?25%2F03%2F2013%2008%3A03%3A16%3A113)
    Concern: Jane Stockley at Tutti Frutti

    The owners of Tutti Frutti, in the Brunel Arcade, say big name retailers are getting prime position in new parts of the station while they are being overlooked. And they are facing further instability with the ownership of the train station being up in the air while renewal of their lease is pending.

    Loyal customers and Reading East MP Rob Wilson are rallying to support the small family firm.

    Tutti Frutti owner Jane Stockley, whose neighbours include Costa Coffee, M&S and West Cornwall Pasty Company, said: ^These places are all run by franchisees and some of them have been guaranteed units and kiosks in the new parts of the station and some people who don^t exist here at the moment have been granted units. We^ve not been given a thing and we don^t understand why because there^s been no application or tendering process.^

    Mrs Stockley, who runs the business with husband Paul, fears trade will drop dramatically when the new pedestrian bridge opens next month as far fewer passengers will use the existing station entrance. On top of this, the ownership of Reading station is unclear since the Government halted the competition for the Great Western franchise following the debacle of the West Coast Mainline contract bid.

    Mrs Stockley said: ^This is currently held by First Great Western for another six months so our lease ends then and we don^t know what^s going to happen after that.^

    The couple, who previously owned courier firm Post Haste, have been running Tutti Frutti for about two years and it is currently ranked number one out of 290 restaurants in Reading on the Tripadvisor website.

    Mrs Stockley said: ^We are a Reading business, we offer delicious produce, all hand made. The ice cream is made here, there^s great coffee and it^s a fun place to be, it^s a jolly shop.^ She added: ^If this doesn^t work out we^ll go to a unit in town but it will be a shame because we could keep our core customers but we^ll lose a lot of our commuter customers who we have built up over the last two years.^

    Reading East MP Rob Wilson, who visited Mrs Stockley at her cafe, said: ^m not very happy with First Great Western in that they seem to be making excuses and not give reasons why they can^t negotiate with Tutti Frutti. There are uncertainties about how long their franchise will last but that shouldn^t stop them from negotiating a deal.^

    A statement from Eimear Fitzpatrick, of Network Rail, and agreed by First Great Western said an announcement is due in the spring about the future management of Reading station. She added: ^The new retail units that have been allocated beyond the gate line, in the new parts of the station, have been given to businesses whose units were taken away as part of the work at the station. Network Rail made commercial agreements with these businesses a number of years ago. We haven^t done any work on the concourse area outside the ticket gate on the south side, so these shops were not impacted.^


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 31, 2013, 21:54:17
    S&TE, are there separate Track Circuits for the A and B ends on P10-15?  I was going to look when I'm there on Tuesday, but you probably know.

    Correct.  The Track Circuit split (They are not axle counters in the Relief platforms) should be just under the London Side of the new access bridge (are we allowed to call it a footbridge?).  This only applies to the Relief lines.  The Main lines will not have the split.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 31, 2013, 22:03:33
    Quote
    Does anyone know if modern practice will require proper test trains to run tomorrow some time?

    Considering the scale of the changes it is normal practice to prove the new signalling with a test train (loco or unit).  This also gets the rust off the rails ready for the first proper trains ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 31, 2013, 22:29:02
    Demolition of buildings is not that straightforward these days. The buildings must be stripped out carefully particularly to remove any hazardous materials (e.g. asbestos) before the bulldozers can move in.  The might not be a problem with the bridge pier on P11 (as it was built after asbestos was banned I think), but the station buildings will need careful stripping out over a couple of weeks.

    Another prediction I got wrong! (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/with/8603177757/#photo_8603177757)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 01, 2013, 06:19:38
    I had a brief look round the new transfer deck and entrances yesterday, and wow! They certainly are impressive, the transfer deck is massive. I guess part of that was down to there being very few people up there because of the lack of trains. As people have being predicting on here, it certainly was rather cold up there, the staff on the gateline had a tiny electric heater but I'm not sure that was doing much.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 01, 2013, 08:31:18
    Great shot of the track diagrams - once I had made them out!

    Looking at the new P 7,8 and 9 layout it does striker that themist efficient use if the platforms will be a 'round-robin, 7-8-9-7-8-9- etc.

    Or at least 7-8/9-7-8/9-

    Looking at the current timetable this is not a pattern easily supported  - apart from top 14 mins if the hour which looks similar.

    Do you think we will get a timetable recast to maximise the new layout benefits thus Winter, or will it be left until the final job is done in 2015?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Brucey on April 01, 2013, 09:06:57
    From the Reading Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2131380_uncertain_future_for_railway_caf?):

    Quote
    Uncertain future for railway caf^
    Is it not Network Rail who are responsible for leasing retail units anyway?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 01, 2013, 13:23:02
    Great shot of the track diagrams - once I had made them out!

    Looking at the new P 7,8 and 9 layout it does striker that themist efficient use if the platforms will be a 'round-robin, 7-8-9-7-8-9- etc.

    Or at least 7-8/9-7-8/9-

    Looking at the current timetable this is not a pattern easily supported  - apart from top 14 mins if the hour which looks similar.

    Do you think we will get a timetable recast to maximise the new layout benefits thus Winter, or will it be left until the final job is done in 2015?

    I think the GWML RUS implies that any major timetable recast to make full use of the remodelled layout will coincide with Crossrail, electrification and IEP introduction.  By this December's timetable change they will still be using interim layouts anyway, it isn't until next May that all the station platforms become fully available,  during the year up until next spring they still have to rebuild all of platforms 3 and 7-11, in a sequence yet to be fully confirmed but starting with P11 until August.

    However until the western viaduct and new underpasses are complete in 2015 they still can't remove all the flat crossing conflicts.

    What may happen over the next two timetable changes is that very minor changes will be made to remove certain obvious conflicts, but not so much that it would be considered a major recast.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 01, 2013, 15:20:02
    S&TE, are there separate Track Circuits for the A and B ends on P10-15?  I was going to look when I'm there on Tuesday, but you probably know.

    Correct.  The Track Circuit split (They are not axle counters in the Relief platforms) should be just under the London Side of the new access bridge (are we allowed to call it a footbridge?).  This only applies to the Relief lines.  The Main lines will not have the split.

    So the Track Circuit splits are between the "Rear Clear" boards (where else would they be?), which certainly mitigates to some degree the inherent risks of platform sharing (dare I mention Group Standrad GKRT0044 again?).  At least the signallers at Didcot will know when and where trains arriving in P10-15 have stopped - they may well get some surprises as they don't always know how long some trains actually are (whatever the train plan says).  I believe it is not uncommon for signallers to contact Drivers to ask how many coaches they are. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 01, 2013, 16:00:05
    From the Reading Post (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/s/2131380_uncertain_future_for_railway_caf?):

    Quote
    Uncertain future for railway caf^
    Is it not Network Rail who are responsible for leasing retail units anyway?

    Depends who is running the station.  At the moment FGW run it, but I understand that it is the intention that Network Rail will run it directly in future as a "Major Station" . So I guess they are in limbo at the moment.

    ...during the year up until next spring they still have to rebuild all of platforms 3 and 7-11, in a sequence yet to be fully confirmed but starting with P11 until August.

    What happens about P1-2.  The canopy has been demolished and the surface looks distinctly ropey in a number of places.  Surely they will have to be rebuilt as well?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 01, 2013, 16:15:49
    There seem to be no changes to the basic footprints of P1 and P2, and AIUI from the EAS (engineering access statement) there are no planned long term closures of those two, so I have assumed that any resurfacing and canopy renewal will take place during normal overnight or weekend closure opportunities.

    Even Platform 3 doesn't actually get physically altered as far as I know, although again it will presumably be resurfaced during the P7 alterations.  Although it is out of use for the immediate future this is because it is not possible to use it for its intended purpose, (reversing XC services) because of limitations of the interim layout while the western viaduct is built.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: autotank on April 02, 2013, 06:21:48
    Oh dear looks like things have over run at Reading - not the start to the new station we were hoping. Anybody got more details?

    Over running engineering works at Reading
    Delays of up to one hour on First Great Western between Bristol Temple Meads and London Paddington, between Oxford and London Paddington and between Westbury and London Paddington
    Following major engineering works over the Easter Weekend. The line is back in operation but all routes through Reading affected. There is no estimate for normal service. Also affecting Crosscountry services.
    Source: Train Operating Company


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 02, 2013, 06:34:38
    Nothing running on P 7/8/9/10

    Seeing plenty of activity on the new platforms 12-15.

    P12 is acting as the main from London
    P14-15 are main and relief to London

    Broken down train at Goring is not helping....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on April 02, 2013, 07:25:58
    ........oh what a surprise, (or perhaps not) utter chaos.  >:(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 02, 2013, 07:56:29
    To be fair - we have seen worse.

    London bound are delayed 3 to 20
    Country bound are delayed 20 to 30

    But NOT every train.

    Given the Easter break I think majority of commuters will be unaffected


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on April 02, 2013, 08:00:49
    .....ah of course that makes it perfectly acceptable then, just a few tens of thousands inconvenienced!!!  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 02, 2013, 08:24:31
    To be fair - we have seen worse.

    London bound are delayed 3 to 20
    Country bound are delayed 20 to 30

    But NOT every train.

    Given the Easter break I think majority of commuters will be unaffected

    The 06:44 from Twyford to Paddington disappeared from the screens without trace but the following 06:53 (the 06:20 from Didcot) was only 3 minutes late - however it was only 3 cars instead of 6 so it was jammed full from Twyford and quite a crowd was left behind at Maidenhead (where it looked like the following 07:08 service was running about 40 minutes late).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 02, 2013, 08:32:49
    Nothing running on P 7/8/9/10

    Seeing plenty of activity on the new platforms 12-15.

    P12 is acting as the main from London
    P14-15 are main and relief to London

    Broken down train at Goring is not helping....

    There was not supposed to be anything running on P 7/8/9/10/11 all week so no surprise there. P 8/9/10 not due to reopen until next week. P11 out until August and I think P 3 & 7 out for a period as well. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 02, 2013, 09:37:16
    To be fair - we have seen worse.

    London bound are delayed 3 to 20
    Country bound are delayed 20 to 30

    But NOT every train.

    Given the Easter break I think majority of commuters will be unaffected

    The 06:44 from Twyford to Paddington disappeared from the screens without trace but the following 06:53 (the 06:20 from Didcot) was only 3 minutes late - however it was only 3 cars instead of 6 so it was jammed full from Twyford and quite a crowd was left behind at Maidenhead (where it looked like the following 07:08 service was running about 40 minutes late).

    Anyone know where the three carriages went? Today, where there are less trains running than usual, really isn't the day to remove carriages from the trains that are running


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: FellowTraveller on April 02, 2013, 10:10:15
    It would be great if our friends at Lobstervision TV had some cameras directed at the station activity around platforms 7-11 as well as the new track layout East of the station. And whilst I'm compiling a wish list, it would also be good to see what is happening where the piling is taking place to the West too!

    Really enjoyed being able to see the developments of the station and depot with the current set of cameras, but less to see these days as they are pointed at things that are pretty much complete or  nearly so.

    Thanks go to the Flickr group who have contributed a lot of great shots over the Easter weekend that really brought the changes to life.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on April 02, 2013, 10:12:36
    Anyone know where the three carriages went? Today, where there are less trains running than usual, really isn't the day to remove carriages from the trains that are running

    The Twitter feed was earlier blaming displaced carriages on the overrunning engineering works.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on April 02, 2013, 10:22:09
    Anyone know where the three carriages went? Today, where there are less trains running than usual, really isn't the day to remove carriages from the trains that are running
    During the Reading blockade, quite a few trains in the Turbo fleet were kept at Old Oak Common instead of Reading depot. It is quite possible that if work over-ran this morning that they wouldn't have been able to get to Reading in time for the start of service.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on April 02, 2013, 14:00:11
    Hi,

    I arrived at Reading this morning around 8.15 for my normal commute in and here are my initial impressions:

    1)  The signage for people arriving at the Bus Station from the south informs people to go a long route via the "usual" Brunel Arcade entrance even though the new Southern Entrance is open.  I won't be taking that needless detour along Platform 7 tomorrow!

    2)  The new Southern Entrance and Transfer Deck are very spacious and light and overall I was impressed.  The views are fantastic.  Screens and signage all good for me.  One issue was the the interior lights on the Eastern side of the Transfer Deck are all flickering and clearly still need fixing.

    3)  Platforms feel spacious (I think that is more due to there being no hoardings any more to stand near by).  The "A" and "B" ends are clearly indicated.  Good to see one HST bound for London coming in on 14 whilst one was already sat on 15.

    4)  The only let down for me is the Waiting Rooms at the Western end of the platforms.  The design to me appears a throw back to ugly BR buildings from 60s/70s and reminded me of Coventry station.

    (I'm ignoring the long delays due to the broken down train in my impressions).

    Looking forward to my commute home!

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on April 02, 2013, 15:45:03
    S&TE, are there separate Track Circuits for the A and B ends on P10-15?  I was going to look when I'm there on Tuesday, but you probably know.

    Correct.  The Track Circuit split (They are not axle counters in the Relief platforms) should be just under the London Side of the new access bridge (are we allowed to call it a footbridge?).  This only applies to the Relief lines.  The Main lines will not have the split.

    So the Track Circuit splits are between the "Rear Clear" boards (where else would they be?), which certainly mitigates to some degree the inherent risks of platform sharing (dare I mention Group Standrad GKRT0044 again?).  At least the signallers at Didcot will know when and where trains arriving in P10-15 have stopped - they may well get some surprises as they don't always know how long some trains actually are (whatever the train plan says).  I believe it is not uncommon for signallers to contact Drivers to ask how many coaches they are. 


    My understanding is that all Plats through the station are axle counters. You can actually see the little yellow boxes where the wires from the axle counter heads go to in the middle of the platform. It is also what has been briefed to all drivers (so a driver tells me).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on April 02, 2013, 16:03:18
     :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

    Just asked a friend to confirm and have ended up with a bonus!!!!!!

    This webiste gives you a complete guide to all new routes, signals and layout. It is the driver brief for the remodel.

    (Link removed - Chris from Nailsea)

    Password: (Password removed - Chris from Nailsea)


    ENJOY!!!!!


    Edit note: At the request of gioconda.co.uk, I have removed this link and password, as they are intended to be 'industry confidential' and should not be used as posted here.  Chris from Nailsea.  :-X


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 02, 2013, 17:40:10
    I had a trip up to Twyford today, from Eastleigh, and unfortunately I have to say that the Basingstoke and Bedwyn/Westbury services had all but collapsed by mid afternoon.  There seemed to be major problems, caused by displacement of traincrew, resulting in it being pretty much impossible to run trains in and out of P2.   The pilotman isn't much use without a driver, and a train in P2 with no driver stops the other route's inbound service at Reading West.

    I ended up walking to Reading West - a brisk 15 mins - in order to pick up the XC at 1548, having been on the platform in bags of time for the 1405 originally, and then the 1505, both of which were cancelled.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 02, 2013, 17:41:32
    S&TE, are there separate Track Circuits for the A and B ends on P10-15?  I was going to look when I'm there on Tuesday, but you probably know.

    Correct.  The Track Circuit split (They are not axle counters in the Relief platforms) should be just under the London Side of the new access bridge (are we allowed to call it a footbridge?).  This only applies to the Relief lines.  The Main lines will not have the split.

    So the Track Circuit splits are between the "Rear Clear" boards (where else would they be?), which certainly mitigates to some degree the inherent risks of platform sharing (dare I mention Group Standrad GKRT0044 again?).  At least the signallers at Didcot will know when and where trains arriving in P10-15 have stopped - they may well get some surprises as they don't always know how long some trains actually are (whatever the train plan says).  I believe it is not uncommon for signallers to contact Drivers to ask how many coaches they are. 


    My understanding is that all Plats through the station are axle counters. You can actually see the little yellow boxes where the wires from the axle counter heads go to in the middle of the platform. It is also what has been briefed to all drivers (so a driver tells me).

    Yes, I was at Reading watching the chaos waiting for the 1632 to Pangbourne (30 late).  There are definitely no track circuit insulated joints between the A and B Rear Clear boards on P12-15.  There are yellow AWS magnets (or whatever they are called nowadays) and axle counters, though a different design to what I've seen before.

    Incidentally, 1632 was shown onn the CIS as P12, but in fact drew right down to the the 5 car stop board which is quite close to the starter signal on 12B.  So why not show it (and similar trains) as 12B and not just 12?

    Does strike me that with only 2 lines open the train service they are trying to run is a bit ambitious.
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on April 02, 2013, 17:59:34
    It's all very well eulogising about how pretty it looks but if it don't work, it's ugly.Today has been an unmitigated disaster for FGW - having just been incredibly lucky to catch a stopper back from Reading I have witnessed people literally weeping on the platforms having been waiting ridiculous lengths of time in the freezing cold for a train - and I speak as a commuter in both directions of 14 years vintage.....the platform staff were quite clear - things were never going to be ready today and it was simply daft to try to run such a comprehensive service.....far better to have run a much more drastically reduced service for a few days and manage expectations rather than today's farce.

    Poor old Isambard will be turning in his grave,but I very much doubt anyone from FGW will have the cojones to carry the can....usual cut and paste apologies I expect.

    Overruns of an hour or two are one thing but this simply a case of poor planning and execution.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 02, 2013, 18:16:14

    Incidentally, 1632 was shown onn the CIS as P12, but in fact drew right down to the the 5 car stop board which is quite close to the starter signal on 12B.  So why not show it (and similar trains) as 12B and not just 12?

    Fairly predictable bad design of the PIS as far as I can tell.  The 'listing' type of displays really need to show A or B for a short train, and the 'single platform' displays on the transfer deck at the top of the stairs and escalators also need to be showing different info depending on which end the train is on.

    What they were doing today, eg displaying the 1340 XC to Newcastle on both 14A and 14B will catch people out once it becomes more common to have trains in both ends at once.

    Quote

    Does strike me that with only 2 lines open the train service they are trying to run is a bit ambitious.
     

    One of the managers pointed out to a couple of us interested bystanders that they weren't really being helped by more random train failures than usual.  The webcam 1 tab 2 shows a prime example, the same HST sat down in P15 for over 75 mins around lunchtime...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on April 02, 2013, 18:24:48
    Seeing 33 cancellations showing up at the moment, I'm glad I'm sitting on a platform waiting to head to Manchester at the moment.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 02, 2013, 19:11:59
    If there is only a single track circuit for each platform, how does the signaller know where an incoming train has actually stopped (as opposed to where he thinks it should stop)? I don't think an axle counter between A and B will help him with this.  So when the first train has arrived eg a terminator from Padd how can he be certain it's stopped behind the Rear Stop board on A before he signals eg a XC into B?

    Another twist I saw this evening.  A terminator from Padd arrived in 14A. It was all set to go back to Padd eg tail lights on (I think it was the 1648) but then it got cancelled. The red lights turned to white and the train headed off west past the Rear Stop board on A and up to the starter on 14B which was red and remained red for a few minutes until the road was clear.

    My question is... how does the signaller give permission for the driver to pass the Rear Stop board on A, especially when the starter on B is red? And if the answer is by radio then that is not the way to run a safe railway.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 02, 2013, 19:24:27
    I can't answer any of that as I am not technical.  What I have noticed today is that trains are doing well on timekeeping until within a few miles of Reading - either side.  So whatever the problems were with staff, etc, the remaining services would have been OK it seems, were it not for some reason having to crawl into Reading from either side.

    Just an eyeball view of the Realtime Trains site.   This is the link if this is a new site to you.

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=Reading&date=02%2F04%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=3&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 02, 2013, 19:42:01
    It seems plans are afoot to thin the service out through Reading a bit further for the rest of the week. It mainly affects Oxford services and some through trains to/from Cheltenham. Journey planners will be updated overnight. Hopefully there will also be something on the FGW website.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 02, 2013, 20:21:46
    It's all very well eulogising about how pretty it looks but if it don't work, it's ugly.Today has been an unmitigated disaster for FGW - having just been incredibly lucky to catch a stopper back from Reading I have witnessed people literally weeping on the platforms having been waiting ridiculous lengths of time in the freezing cold for a train - and I speak as a commuter in both directions of 14 years vintage.....the platform staff were quite clear - things were never going to be ready today and it was simply daft to try to run such a comprehensive service.....far better to have run a much more drastically reduced service for a few days and manage expectations rather than today's farce.

    I think, from my observations, there was a bit of bad luck (the train that failed near Goring first thing), another bit of bad luck in that a key signal was causing problems first thing, a bit of bad planning (in hindsight) in that too many services were in the plan (I think it would have been better to run most of the RDG-PAD stoppers only between MAI or SLO-PAD) and key to many of the delays was expecting too much of the turnback facility at Tilehurst which seemed to be adding unduly to the delays.  And a bit of bad company structure in that (as usual) as soon as the service starts to disintegrate there aren't enough resourcing staff to adequately deal with sorting out a plan in advance - those that are there are constantly trying to maintain some kind of service at the time, rather than having the freedom to step back and work out an adequate plan for services several hours in advance.

    I await with interest what happens tomorrow, as things are very much in the balance with capacity and it will only take one problem to risk sending the service into a downward spiral again like today.  It's incredibly difficult to manage upgrades to an aged railway system like this without the odd 'unmitigated disaster' though as, even with the best planning in the world, there are an awful lot of things that can go wrong on the day that can't be planned for - for example any kind of train failure or signal failure at any point between Tilehurst and Twyford will cause huge disruption as there is no way of routing other trains around them.  How can you plan in advance for that given the need to shut 2 of the 4 lines and the need of commuters to have some kind of service after the Easter break?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 02, 2013, 20:31:09
    This webiste gives you a complete guide to all new routes, signals and layout. It is the driver brief for the remodel.

    (Link removed - Chris from Nailsea)

    Password: (Password removed - Chris from Nailsea)


    Edit note: At the request of gioconda.co.uk, I have removed this link and password, as they are intended to be 'industry confidential' and should not be used as posted here.  Chris from Nailsea.  :-X

    Please note my edit above, and do not mis-use that website. That is an official request from gioconda.co.uk. Thanks, Chris.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 02, 2013, 20:41:18
    I notice that Gilpins have left their plant on the end of P 8/9 to continue their demolition work later in the week I presume.  It was said in an earlier post that the Engineering trains were using the P7/8 tracks and the through road.  I notice that work to the east of the station over the last couple of days has been concentrating on the up main line and the approach to P 10/11. I presume when they shift over to the down main line they will use P10 for engineering trains and then Gilpins can finish their work. They may also need to do it at night as it will be quite near to the pedestrian route to P 4/5/6.

    Is they layout to the East of the Station to be the final layout? Or will that be altered when the flyover is connected as well?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on April 02, 2013, 20:55:52
    It's all very well eulogising about how pretty it looks but if it don't work, it's ugly.Today has been an unmitigated disaster for FGW - having just been incredibly lucky to catch a stopper back from Reading I have witnessed people literally weeping on the platforms having been waiting ridiculous lengths of time in the freezing cold for a train - and I speak as a commuter in both directions of 14 years vintage.....the platform staff were quite clear - things were never going to be ready today and it was simply daft to try to run such a comprehensive service.....far better to have run a much more drastically reduced service for a few days and manage expectations rather than today's farce.

    I think, from my observations, there was a bit of bad luck (the train that failed near Goring first thing), another bit of bad luck in that a key signal was causing problems first thing, a bit of bad planning (in hindsight) in that too many services were in the plan (I think it would have been better to run most of the RDG-PAD stoppers only between MAI or SLO-PAD) and key to many of the delays was expecting too much of the turnback facility at Tilehurst which seemed to be adding unduly to the delays.  And a bit of bad company structure in that (as usual) as soon as the service starts to disintegrate there aren't enough resourcing staff to adequately deal with sorting out a plan in advance - those that are there are constantly trying to maintain some kind of service at the time, rather than having the freedom to step back and work out an adequate plan for services several hours in advance.

    I await with interest what happens tomorrow, as things are very much in the balance with capacity and it will only take one problem to risk sending the service into a downward spiral again like today.  It's incredibly difficult to manage upgrades to an aged railway system like this without the odd 'unmitigated disaster' though as, even with the best planning in the world, there are an awful lot of things that can go wrong on the day that can't be planned for - for example any kind of train failure or signal failure at any point between Tilehurst and Twyford will cause huge disruption as there is no way of routing other trains around them.  How can you plan in advance for that given the need to shut 2 of the 4 lines and the need of commuters to have some kind of service after the Easter break?

    Absolutely, over this Easter major open heart surgery was carried out on one busiest and most complex piece railway out side London.  The project team would have been involved in detailed planning over many months with NR Ops and all the TOCs and FOCs; all these "stake holders" would have had an input and have been very confident in the plan being deliverable, they would have spent a lot time and effort running risk analysis to manage them out in the planning, what can never be taken into account is anything more complex than N-1 which I believe was the case today, singly they would have been planned for -
    Engineering over run
    Failed train
    Points failure (at Didcot)

    What was sadly lacking was communication at platform level this morning this continued through to this afternoon which by this time the managers should have had a grip on things.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: inspector_blakey on April 02, 2013, 21:21:01
    If there is only a single track circuit for each platform, how does the signaller know where an incoming train has actually stopped (as opposed to where he thinks it should stop)? I don't think an axle counter between A and B will help him with this.  So when the first train has arrived eg a terminator from Padd how can he be certain it's stopped behind the Rear Stop board on A before he signals eg a XC into B?

    <snip>

    My question is... how does the signaller give permission for the driver to pass the Rear Stop board on A, especially when the starter on B is red? And if the answer is by radio then that is not the way to run a safe railway.

    There's a disclaimer here in that I'm not at all familiar with the new signalling arrangements at Reading, although I have a few colleagues who will know them inside out.

    However, in terms of permissive working in platforms (that is, allowing one train into a long platform that's already occupied either to get two different services in there or to couple one to the other) there doesn't necessarily need to be divided track circuits or axle counters. The driver of an incoming service would see a red main aspect, with two white lights at 45 degrees as a subsidiary indication: the white lights give the driver permission to proceed past the red aspect as far as the line is clear, being prepared to stop short of any obstruction. Their diagram will tell them whether they are to couple up to the unit that's already occupying the platform or not. This method of working is used routinely up and down the country and is perfectly safe. All the signaller will see on their panel or screen is an occupied platform track circuit, not the specific location at which the first train has stopped.

    As I said, I don't know any of the specific arrangements with the new Reading signalling, but I'd be surprised if they relied on radio communications between signaller and driver because of the extra workload this would have the potential to be create. Happy to be corrected by anyone who knows more than me though.

    There is incidentally, an unusual variation on this method of working at Bristol Temple Meads where each long platform face has two numbers and it's important the train stops in the right place. Firstly, at the last signal before the station, the driver will see a route indicator with the platform number at which they should stop. Secondly, the platforms are separated by the black-on-white "St Andrew's cross" signs: I *think* that when these are unlit they count as a signal at danger, and when lit can be passed (may have that the wrong way round) allowing access to the far end of the platform face. Again though, I'm not fantastically well acquainted with these arrangements so remain open to correction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Timmer on April 02, 2013, 21:50:52
    It seems plans are afoot to thin the service out through Reading a bit further for the rest of the week. It mainly affects Oxford services and some through trains to/from Cheltenham. Journey planners will be updated overnight. Hopefully there will also be something on the FGW website.
    Indeed FGW have put the following up on their website:
    Quote
    Tuesday 2 April 2013 - Update: 19:40

    First Great Western would like to apologise for the delays to some services in the Thames Valley which were compounded by the very limited capacity at Reading Station.

    Having re-evaluated our plans for the remainder of the week with Network Rail and other Train Operating Companies, a revised timetable will be in operation. Please check JourneyCheck for the latest updates and revised timetable for your journey before travelling.

    Our normal timetable will resume once Network Rail has completed their work on 8 April.

    Please follow us on Twitter @FGW for real time updates and your questions answered.

    Sad for everyone really that things just haven't worked out as planned and that services will need to be further thinned out to try and run a better service for the rest of the week.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 02, 2013, 21:54:03
    But fair play for trying to address the problem and not just take the easy option and say "Well, we've only got three more days to get through..."


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 02, 2013, 22:10:17
    Anyone know where the three carriages went? Today, where there are less trains running than usual, really isn't the day to remove carriages from the trains that are running
    During the Reading blockade, quite a few trains in the Turbo fleet were kept at Old Oak Common instead of Reading depot. It is quite possible that if work over-ran this morning that they wouldn't have been able to get to Reading in time for the start of service.

    Or in fact for the rest of the day it seems? I was on the 11.47 to Paddington.. 3 carriages still.. we left people behind at Hayes and Southall...

    I came home on the 20.45 as far as Slough.. Firstly it showed as delayed for a good 15 minutes.. No announcements whatsoever during that time about all the delayed trains (!!).. They were kind enough to announce that the toilets on platform 1 were now closed but that the ones on platform 12 were open all night (which a) told me that there was someone around who could have made announcements and b) made us wonder if that was a secret way of telling us we were going to be there a long time)

    Finally it was announced as the front of platform 13 (even though most platforms were empty).. We went straight away and  hurried (not ran) to get there but the guy was still blowing the whistle as we arrived on platform 13.. I imagine some of the people who were slower didn't make the train. oh and still 3 carriages...sigh

    Hopefully they will make some longer trains tomorrow though fortunately I don't have to travel FGW the rest of this week...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 02, 2013, 22:36:06
    FGW have posted an apology and full breakdown of the amended amended changes for the rest of this week.

    I expect they had anticipated teething problems, but not quite to the scale that happened this morning.

    From FGW on Facebook:

    Quote
    "Delays to some train services in the Thames Valley this morning were related to a number of problems in the region. These problems were compounded by the very limited capacity at Reading station, while improvement work continues, which had a greater affect on our ability to recover quickly from otherwise relatively small delays than originally thought.

    "We worked hard with Network Rail to minimise the delays, but it quickly became clear that the number of trains we were trying to operate through the area was affecting our ability to get our services back on track, and our customers to where they needed to go, as quickly as we would have liked.

    "Having re-looked at our plans with Network Rail and other train operating companies this afternoon, we've revised our special timetable for the remainder of the week. This will reduce the chance of congestion in the area and make sure our services are as robust as possible while Network Rail continues its important improvement work.

    "While we know this decision may cause difficulties for some customers, we are confident this will deliver a more reliable service for the vast majority of customers. We will, of course, be making every effort to let people know about the changes being made, and we would like to take this opportunity to apologise for the inconvenience caused today.

    "Our normal timetable will resume once Network Rail has completed their work on 8 April."

    The following is a summary of planned changes to First Great Western services on Wednesday 3 April. Please see http://bit.ly/WJK6eP for more detailed information.

    Oxford services
    Fast Services between Oxford and London will generally be reduced from half-hourly to hourly in each direction. Stopping services between Oxford and London are not affected by this change and will run as planned

    Reading services
    The 06:35, 06:57 and 06:59 Reading-Paddington services will be cancelled. Customers are advised to catch the 0714 service instead.

    Bristol Services
    The 05:20 Bristol Temple Meads-Paddington service will not run.
    The 16:57 Paddington-Bristol Temple Meads service will not run.

    Worcester Services
    The 05:21 Worcester Shrub Hill-Paddington service will terminate at Swindon, where customers are advised to catch a connecting service to London Paddington and intermediate stations.

    Cheltenham Services
    The 06:31 Cheltenham-Paddington service will terminate at Swindon, where customers are advised to catch a connecting service to London Paddington and intermediate stations.

    The 15:45 Paddington-Cheltenham service will start at Swindon instead of Paddington. Customers wishing to travel to Cheltenham are advised to catch the retimed 15:42 Paddington-Swansea service to Swindon for the onward connection, which will now leave Paddington at 15:45.

    The 17:45 Paddington-Cheltenham service will start at Swindon instead of Paddington. Customers wishing to travel to Cheltenham are advised to catch the retimed 17:42 Paddington-Swansea service for the onward connection, which will now leave Paddington at 17:45


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 02, 2013, 22:40:58
    Hopefully they will make some longer trains tomorrow though fortunately I don't have to travel FGW the rest of this week...

    Yes, there did seem to be a lot of 2-car trains running around today.   ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 02, 2013, 22:45:29
    Thanks bignosemac..I saw that FGW post too..

    It isn't terribly specific though.. For example if I were commuting into London from Maidenhead for the rest of this week I wouldn't know how that affected me.. And I can't quite work out if the NR website has been updated or not since this is a quite last minute change..


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 02, 2013, 23:51:41
    It's worth noting that whilst FGW have issued the amendments to the amended timetable, this information has not filtered down to National Rail Enquiries' journey planner or booking engines.

    For instance I can still select the 0520 from Bristol TM to Paddington and the 1657 return for 3/4/2013, if I so wish, from FGW's booking engine.

    Internally, FGW are saying these amendments will also be in place for Thursday and Friday. Yet the booking engines are still allowing reservations on cancelled services.  ::)

    Is it too difficult to remove cancelled services from both the operational timetable and the journey planners/booking engines?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 03, 2013, 00:38:44
    Well today was rather chaotic. I spent most the day in the Reading area attempting to use a Kennet Day Ranger, but a lot of the services I could use, those from Reading-Basingstoke and Westbury were cancelled. The problems did seem to be more down to the timetable than anything else as by the afternoon there weren't many other problems, but services were just getting delayed through the heavily congested Reading. The main victims did appear to be the LTV services, with numerous cancellation to the London-Reading stoppers and the services from Platform 2. I spent a bit of time at Reading West and the staff there were excellent. There were only 2 of them, but lots of rather confused passengers. The CIS was pretty much useless so the staff had a lot to do to keep everyone informed. Using Reading West as an interchange for XC really fell down today because so many of the Reading-Reading West services were cancelled, XC passengers were turning up at Reading West with no service due for Reading for long periods, or turning up from Reading having missed there service. Hopefully tomorrow can get off to a better start without any AM disruption so the rest of the day stands a better chance. I agree that turning round the London-Reading stoppers before Reading would be useful, and probably the XC services at Oxford or Didcot too. Terminating trains were really eating up capacity today.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on April 03, 2013, 02:32:22
    It's worth noting that whilst FGW have issued the amendments to the amended timetable, this information has not filtered down to National Rail Enquiries' journey planner or booking engines.

    For instance I can still select the 0520 from Bristol TM to Paddington and the 1657 return for 3/4/2013, if I so wish, from FGW's booking engine.

    Internally, FGW are saying these amendments will also be in place for Thursday and Friday. Yet the booking engines are still allowing reservations on cancelled services.  ::)

    Is it too difficult to remove cancelled services from both the operational timetable and the journey planners/booking engines?


    Journey Planners update overnight. Unfortunately not just a case of taking it out.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 03, 2013, 02:48:27
    Thanks Ollie. Today's amendments are now in the journey planners, but not those for Thursday and Friday. Can only one day be updated at a time?

    Booking engines still showing today's cancelled trains though as, at 0245. I am kinda interested as I was planning on using the 0520 from Temple Meads this morning. I'm now travelling on the 0447. Arriving far too early in London for my appointment, but hey-ho at least it's not me paying for the ticket. However, if I'd known earlier, I could have bought the Super Off Peak which is valid on the 0447 but not the 0520.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 03, 2013, 08:38:43
    If there is only a single track circuit for each platform, how does the signaller know where an incoming train has actually stopped (as opposed to where he thinks it should stop)? I don't think an axle counter between A and B will help him with this.  So when the first train has arrived eg a terminator from Padd how can he be certain it's stopped behind the Rear Stop board on A before he signals eg a XC into B?


    I think I can answer my own question (which I'm glad to do before someone else comes on and tells me I'd got it wrong).  There are of course no track circuits: there are axle counters at both ends of P11-15 as well as the middle between the rear clear boards, so trains can be counted in and out of A and B separately so the signaller knows where they are.  So I think this issue is resolved.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 03, 2013, 08:42:31
    Hopefully they will make some longer trains tomorrow though fortunately I don't have to travel FGW the rest of this week...

    Yes, there did seem to be a lot of 2-car trains running around today.   ::)

    And again this morning - the 06:53 from Twyford was just 2 cars instead of 6, one less even than yesterday. Someone must have informed the Maidenhead passengers as it appeared that most people there had gone over to Platform 2 to sit it out for the delayed 07:08.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 03, 2013, 10:33:45
    Seems to be holding together much better today so far.  A few too many 2-cars still running around on peak services for my liking, such as BBM's one quoted above, but at least most of the off-peak LTV services seem to be using at least 3-cars with several 5-cars running about out there.  Punctuality wise, delays on both LTV and HSS services seem to be in the order of 5-10 minutes typically, which is rather better than the 25-50 minutes we were seeing for most of yesterday.  The 180s have (surprise, surprise) been pulled from service though.   ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 03, 2013, 11:58:58
    In the case of the services into platform 2, from the Newbury direction of from Basingstoke, in hindsight might it have been a good idea to dedicate a pool of train crew to those routes all day?   I wonder if that's part of today's solution?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 03, 2013, 12:03:13
    In the case of the services into platform 2, from the Newbury direction of from Basingstoke, in hindsight might it have been a good idea to dedicate a pool of train crew to those routes all day?   I wonder if that's part of today's solution?

    Paul

    Good point Paul. Does anyone know if there is anything in the rule book which prevents a driver operating the same route (or alternating between the same routes) all day ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 03, 2013, 12:07:33
    In the case of the services into platform 2, from the Newbury direction of from Basingstoke, in hindsight might it have been a good idea to dedicate a pool of train crew to those routes all day?   I wonder if that's part of today's solution?

    Paul

    Good point Paul. Does anyone know if there is anything in the rule book which prevents a driver operating the same route (or alternating between the same routes) all day ?

    They do it on the Isle of Wight quite happily!  I'd have thought interworking the two routes would be fine - a few round trips shared between both would be heading towards a full shift, with the Basingstoke only being hourly there was a lengthy layover at Basingstoke as well.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 03, 2013, 12:18:59
    Is they layout to the East of the Station to be the final layout? Or will that be altered when the flyover is connected as well?

    I reckon it's just about finished, especially on the reliefs side.  There are still some additional crossovers to add, it seems to me that the line towards P10 will need straightening when that platform is rebuilt in the autumn, and although the line through Platform 11 is not being installed yet, I'd be surprised if the relevant points outside the station and at least some of the the track towards it were not installed and placed out of use.

    The track layout diagrams posted back on page 55 do show the finished layout (with some greyed out crossovers and P11 line as I mentioned) and it looks like there will be nothing else significant to do east of the station.

    Future changes at the west end to re-align the up and down main over onto the viaduct, and add the freight/Newbury/XC lines through the various underpasses should have no effect on the east end layout as far as I can see.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 03, 2013, 16:22:33
    Congratulations paul7755. You posted the 1500th reply in this thread!

    I was kinda hoping I'd be home in time to be the one to post the 1500th reply, as I took a butchers around Reading today. 1501st will have to do.  ;)

    That transfer deck. It's a gert biggun innit? As we sez down Brizzle/Zummerset way.  ;D

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_1702_zps96a7725c.jpg)

    A word of thanks also to all who have contributed, and continue to contribute, to this thread. It's become an excellent record of the changes that Reading station has gone through over the past three years.

    Jeep posting though. There's still more work to be done!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 03, 2013, 16:30:06
    In the case of the services into platform 2, from the Newbury direction of from Basingstoke, in hindsight might it have been a good idea to dedicate a pool of train crew to those routes all day?   I wonder if that's part of today's solution?

    Paul

    Good point Paul. Does anyone know if there is anything in the rule book which prevents a driver operating the same route (or alternating between the same routes) all day ?
    Usually there are local agreements on the maximum number of trips that can be done over one line in a shift.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 03, 2013, 16:31:09
    The 180s have (surprise, surprise) been pulled from service though.   ::)
    I was very surprised to see any in use yesterday, one at Reading about 10:50 and again about 21:30.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 03, 2013, 20:25:55
    Had time to have a nose around the new look Reading today and it certainly is a lighter, brighter place.

    Arrived on the new platform 15 and the first impression was of the space there seems to be now.  I can see now why the new transfer deck is so called - it is certainly much more than a footbridge or overbridge.  It also offers views of some of the work outside the station not visible before.

    The first thing I saw was the new arrangement whereby two trains can share a platform

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/plat13.jpg)

    Moving onto the transfer deck it was possible to see the work going on the currently closed platforms 7 and 8 - and all that remains of the old footbridge.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/oldfoot.jpg)

    Meanwhile down below platform 7 is strangely quiet

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/plat7.jpg)

    ..as was the new southern gateline...

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/sthgate.jpg)

    Finally it is now possible to see the work going on outside on Station Hill.  The old drivers cafe frequented by generations of taxi and bus drivers is no more.  I think the GWR Staff Association building was there too.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/stnhill1.jpg)

    and looking at the row of shops opposite with the subway which used to lead to the old bus station now visible underneath.  The road structure looks rather fragile after the subterranean passages are exposed but it had taken the weight of buses and the like for many years.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/stnhill2.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 03, 2013, 20:44:36
    ...I think the GWR Staff Association building was there too.

    The GWR SA building is still there, it's the hip-roofed building just to the right of the two portakabins in the background, beyond where the station wall starts to curve round.  I think it's possibly past its sell by date though, and just because it is old doesn't necessarily mean it has any architectural or historical merit. 

    While in that general area, has anyone seen any details of how that part of the site will be finished off - at the moment you have an odd sort of concrete piled 'step' outside the station wall but above ground level. (In other words the route taken by the temporary pedestrian access to P1-3.) With the council's project apparently removing everything down to true ground level, isn't that going to be a bit of an awkward area to finish off?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: inspector_blakey on April 03, 2013, 22:19:37
    After changing trains twice at Reading today I'm in two minds about the new station: the new southern gateline, transfer deck and platforms have a superb spacious, clean, modern feel which area  genuine transformation from the Reading of old. However, the wind doesn't half whistle through the place, making it bleak and inhospitable despite the quality of the space. It's not entirely clear to me if what is there represents the complete, finished product but it does strike me as unpleasantly exposed on a cold day.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 03, 2013, 22:33:21
    One thing I did notice today which looked a bit off was this CIS display on the transfer bridge

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cis.jpg)

    What is supposed to go on the right hand side where the wood block is - or did someone just cut the hole too big!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 03, 2013, 22:57:29
    I'd like to just say what a good (if not fun I imagine) job Ollie and Jo have done on facebook the last couple of days coping with all the queries (I'm sure they have done the same on Twitter but I still can't work out how to use it properly so I don't)

    Just one question to either of them though (didn't want to post it on FGW on facebook due to the Trolls on there that like to be rude to people from time to time).. But Ollie replied to someone's query that the turbos were shorter than normal this week due to crewing issues?

    I can only guess this is a shortage of people to link units together? I imagine drivers can drive a 2/3/5/6 car turbo with no extra training between any of them?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 03, 2013, 23:00:25
    One thing I did notice today which looked a bit off was this CIS display on the transfer bridge

    What is supposed to go on the right hand side where the wood block is - or did someone just cut the hole too big!  ;D

    Hopefully more screens will go there - if that photo is taken where I think it is then there is room for another five or more screens next to it.  There's practically no point in just having five screens next to each other at a busy station like Reading given the number of departures.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 03, 2013, 23:05:01
    One thing I did notice today which looked a bit off was this CIS display on the transfer bridge

    What is supposed to go on the right hand side where the wood block is - or did someone just cut the hole too big!  ;D

    Hopefully more screens will go there - if that photo is taken where I think it is then there is room for another five or more screens next to it.  There's practically no point in just having five screens next to each other at a busy station like Reading given the number of departures.

    Trying to remember!  I think it was at the top of the escalators from platform 14/15.....

    (I'm sure they have done the same on Twitter but I still can't work out how to use it properly so I don't)

    Don't worry - I've just about worked out Twitter but haven't a clue about Facebook!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 03, 2013, 23:16:31
    ...a few blinkers on here me thinks....http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/News-Releases/7417/Easter-weekend-work-marks-end-of-the-beginning-for-Reading-station-upgrade (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/News-Releases/7417/Easter-weekend-work-marks-end-of-the-beginning-for-Reading-station-upgrade)

    Why can't NR ever be honest when it comes to these things and admit that it didn't all go sweetly to plan >:(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 03, 2013, 23:21:05
    One thing I did notice today which looked a bit off was this CIS display on the transfer bridge

    What is supposed to go on the right hand side where the wood block is - or did someone just cut the hole too big!  ;D

    Hopefully more screens will go there - if that photo is taken where I think it is then there is room for another five or more screens next to it.  There's practically no point in just having five screens next to each other at a busy station like Reading given the number of departures.
    There's a couple of locations on the transfer deck with just 5 screens and it did seem like too few. Especially yesterday when when a couple of the screens at a time were just showing cancelled services.

    When I passed through Reading today around 10:00 the staff had just sorted out the A/B issue with Turbos. They'd altered services formed of Turbos booked to depart from the whole platform just to depart from the A/B end as appropriate. The CIS did go a bit crazy announcing them all, nobody really needed to know about a platform alteration five hours away!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 03, 2013, 23:23:55
    ...a few blinkers on here me thinks....http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/News-Releases/7417/Easter-weekend-work-marks-end-of-the-beginning-for-Reading-station-upgrade (http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/News-Releases/7417/Easter-weekend-work-marks-end-of-the-beginning-for-Reading-station-upgrade)

    Why can't NR ever be honest when it comes to these things and admit that it didn't all go sweetly to plan >:(

    That is more than a little bit naughty of them.. Glad that "the people we've had through already seem very pleased with the results.".. I guess that was before they saw how few trains there were ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 03, 2013, 23:25:47

    Don't worry - I've just about worked out Twitter but haven't a clue about Facebook!

    Oh dear.. Try Facebook.. I think it's easier.. I've never worked out how to see whole "conversations" or whatever they are called in twitter.. It's not user friendly (to me)  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 03, 2013, 23:36:21
    Probably not high on the list of priorities at Reading at the moment but the toilets in the Brunel Arcade could do with a refurb.

    In the Gents today, three cubicles were covered in black and yellow tape with 'Out of Order' signs and of the remaining ones the one I chose had an interesting lock. Novel use of a copy of 'Reading Station News'. Perhaps the person who did this was making critical comment on the problems on Tuesday:

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_1698_zps66215101.jpg)

     :o


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Plymboi on April 03, 2013, 23:46:02
    So this a/b is so that each through platform can act as two bay platforms when required. Very interesting concept.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 03, 2013, 23:52:22
    Toilets are another thing I was going to mention, the facilities on 12/13 and 14/15 did seem a bit lacking to me. I've been in to the Gents on both and they both only had one cubicle and one urinal. Seemed a bit small to me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2013, 00:45:05
    So this a/b is so that each through platform can act as two bay platforms when required. Very interesting concept.

    Not at all unusual though?

    Then of course some stations achieve the same effect slightly differently by giving the ends different numbers, such as Bristol TM, or Newcastle Central. 

    Birmingham New St also uses A and B I think, as does Southampton Central.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on April 04, 2013, 02:20:45
    I'd like to just say what a good (if not fun I imagine) job Ollie and Jo have done on facebook the last couple of days coping with all the queries (I'm sure they have done the same on Twitter but I still can't work out how to use it properly so I don't)

    Just one question to either of them though (didn't want to post it on FGW on facebook due to the Trolls on there that like to be rude to people from time to time).. But Ollie replied to someone's query that the turbos were shorter than normal this week due to crewing issues?

    I can only guess this is a shortage of people to link units together? I imagine drivers can drive a 2/3/5/6 car turbo with no extra training between any of them?

    Thanks Jo.

    The crewing issues I refer to is what caused a lot of disruption on Tuesday. Because of these crewing issues the 180s are not in use. To cover the 180s Turbos are being used instead which has meant some diagrams are now short formed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 04, 2013, 08:22:07
    I'd like to just say what a good (if not fun I imagine) job Ollie and Jo have done on facebook the last couple of days coping with all the queries (I'm sure they have done the same on Twitter but I still can't work out how to use it properly so I don't)

    Just one question to either of them though (didn't want to post it on FGW on facebook due to the Trolls on there that like to be rude to people from time to time).. But Ollie replied to someone's query that the turbos were shorter than normal this week due to crewing issues?

    I can only guess this is a shortage of people to link units together? I imagine drivers can drive a 2/3/5/6 car turbo with no extra training between any of them?

    Thanks Jo.

    The crewing issues I refer to is what caused a lot of disruption on Tuesday. Because of these crewing issues the 180s are not in use. To cover the 180s Turbos are being used instead which has meant some diagrams are now short formed.

    My thanks too to all the FGW Twitter people for keeping things going every day! Regarding the short-forming, again today the 06:53 from Twyford was only 3 cars, and with the preceding 06:44 again disappearing without trace (and the 06:40 stopper cancelled), the train was very badly crush-loaded after Maidenhead. While the people there were squeezing on board I did see a 180 go past towards Reading.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: NickB on April 04, 2013, 08:47:28
    My thanks too to all the FGW Twitter people for keeping things going every day! Regarding the short-forming, again today the 06:53 from Twyford was only 3 cars, and with the preceding 06:44 again disappearing without trace (and the 06:40 stopper cancelled), the train was very badly crush-loaded after Maidenhead. While the people there were squeezing on board I did see a 180 go past towards Reading.

    The 7.03 from Maidenhead mentioned above left approx 100 people on the platform, who then had to squeeze on to the (short formed HST) 7.08.  The 7.08 is taking all the strain at the moment as the 7.18 (5 carriage Turbo) is cancelled.  Its not much fun at the moment : (

    Paddington-->Maidenhead on Tuesday was the worst, with the 8(?) carriage 18.16 reduced to 2 carriages.  In the crush to get on I witnessed a young boy get pushed between the platform and the train and it was only the speedy reaction of the guy beside him that prevented him going completely under.  I recognise that things are difficult this week, but I wonder sometimes if incidents like this are an unfortunate byproduct of short formed trains on an already overcrowded network.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 04, 2013, 08:59:33
    I've just seen this on the FGW website:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/compticket/ (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/compticket/)

    Quote
    Reading Redevelopment

    You might be entitled to receive one complimentary weekend open return ticket with First Great Western (Standard or First Class, depending on your existing Season Ticket held). Please register your details online by midnight 14th April 2013. If you qualify we will send your PIN details to your registered email address by 28th April 2013. The complimentary ticket needs to be purchased by 6th July 2013 and used for travel by 29th September 2013.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 04, 2013, 09:53:37
    After changing trains twice at Reading today I'm in two minds about the new station: the new southern gateline, transfer deck and platforms have a superb spacious, clean, modern feel which area  genuine transformation from the Reading of old. However, the wind doesn't half whistle through the place, making it bleak and inhospitable despite the quality of the space. It's not entirely clear to me if what is there represents the complete, finished product but it does strike me as unpleasantly exposed on a cold day.

    My views were similar to yours IB when I was there last Tuesday.  Bit like an airport terminal with no heating.  With the large open spaces for the escalators and the open top vents there is always going to be a significant ariflow through the transfer deck.  I'm hoping that some retail units will appear in due course to give it some character and interest: but I think for now I'd be happy, as IB, to give it the benefit of the doubt and see what the finished product is like.

    Incidenatlly, some of the escalators were a bit noisy.  I hope they'll be OK when they get rain and snow on (and in) them, which they will given the fact they are not enclosed and protected from the weather.


     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Western Enterprise on April 04, 2013, 09:57:46

    Paddington-->Maidenhead on Tuesday was the worst, with the 8(?) carriage 18.16 reduced to 2 carriages. 

    I noticed that the 18.16 on P10 yesterday was rammed, as was the Turbo in P11 next to it.
    Gave up in the end and waited for a local stopper. That got rammed too. Some altercations developed at Ealing Broadway as nobody could get on.
    Brave Staff had to intervene to let the train go on her way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Western Enterprise on April 04, 2013, 10:02:25
    So this a/b is so that each through platform can act as two bay platforms when required. Very interesting concept.

    Not at all unusual though?

    Then of course some stations achieve the same effect slightly differently by giving the ends different numbers, such as Bristol TM, or Newcastle Central. 

    Birmingham New St also uses A and B I think, as does Southampton Central.

    Paul
    You're right, Birmingham Snow Hill used to use A and B platforms, that was many many years ago. Half way along there were pairs of crossovers to enable departure / arrivals with the other half already occupied.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2013, 10:07:44
    You're right, Birmingham Snow Hill used to use A and B platforms, that was many many years ago. Half way along there were pairs of crossovers to enable departure / arrivals with the other half already occupied.

    Well yes, but split platforms with central crossovers is really another level up in complexity from what we are discussing. 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2013, 10:16:13
    My views were similar to yours IB when I was there last Tuesday.  Bit like an airport terminal with no heating.  With the large open spaces for the escalators and the open top vents there is always going to be a significant ariflow through the transfer deck.  I'm hoping that some retail units will appear in due course to give it some character and interest: but I think for now I'd be happy, as IB, to give it the benefit of the doubt and see what the finished product is like.

    I suppose a lot depends on whether it is seen by the architects as a properly sized (and therefore future proofed) access route to the platforms, or as a large waiting room?  In the overall scheme of things I'm assuming their idea is that you wait on the platforms - which is where they've provided the small waiting rooms and seating areas etc.

    At the design stage of these things, presumably when it comes to decisions on heating and ventilation they start off from an assumption that everyone is arriving appropriately dressed for ambient weather conditions?   (Possibly a mistake nowadays...)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 04, 2013, 10:39:38
    So this a/b is so that each through platform can act as two bay platforms when required. Very interesting concept.

    Not at all unusual though?

    Then of course some stations achieve the same effect slightly differently by giving the ends different numbers, such as Bristol TM, or Newcastle Central. 

    Birmingham New St also uses A and B I think, as does Southampton Central.

    Paul
    You're right, Birmingham Snow Hill used to use A and B platforms, that was many many years ago. Half way along there were pairs of crossovers to enable departure / arrivals with the other half already occupied.

    Interestingly Bristol TM never went in for this A and B lark, even though it long had that facility.  See Wikipedia article, where the old and new numbering is discussed (under History about half way down).

    It would have been better IMO, if that system was maintained (see earlier remarks about confusion with trains that cover both 'platforms' on PIS).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 04, 2013, 11:05:15
    NickB.. I edited your post above to sort out the quotes (just in case you wondered what I had done)

    I am quite concerned that the trains aren't going to be back to normal next week now.. I guess it will just be a case of wait and see on Monday morning?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2013, 11:47:26

    I am quite concerned that the trains aren't going to be back to normal next week now.. I guess it will just be a case of wait and see on Monday morning?

    The currently uploaded timetable suggests they should be very near to normal on Monday morning, but with a full blockade on Sunday getting the rolling stock to the normal 'start positions' on Monday morning is the key. 

    If you look at this:  www.realtimetrains.co.uk (http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=Reading&date=08%2F04%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=3&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1)

    ...it shows up mostly in red in the middle of the night, which is because everything is changed to sort out the stock following the blockade on Sunday.  But it is back to black by around the time normal people get up!

    Well that's the theory anyway...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 04, 2013, 13:50:15
    From the NR disruption page:

    "There is currently no firm estimate for when a normal service will resume. It is anticipated that this disruption will continue until at least 8 April" (bold added by me)..

    I'm quite concerned about Monday now.. And the trouble is.. No one will know for sure until they get to the station and find it's either ok (hopefully) or chaos (most likely)

    And my season ticket needs renewing.. It's almost worth not doing it incase it's not possible to actually get on a train in the peak..


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 04, 2013, 14:54:47
    You can always have look before leaving home on Maidenehad Live departures
    http://www.livedepartureboards.co.uk/fgw/summary.aspx?T=MAI&x=27&y=9 (http://www.livedepartureboards.co.uk/fgw/summary.aspx?T=MAI&x=27&y=9)

    You at least get a feel for how things are going, but it won't tell you how crowded the trains are though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: NickB on April 04, 2013, 15:03:48
    From the NR disruption page:

    "There is currently no firm estimate for when a normal service will resume. It is anticipated that this disruption will continue until at least 8 April" (bold added by me)..

    I'm quite concerned about Monday now.. And the trouble is.. No one will know for sure until they get to the station and find it's either ok (hopefully) or chaos (most likely)


    On Tuesday I gave up and went home again   :(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 04, 2013, 15:33:56
    If I was a Maidenhead commuter I'd be tempted to use that realtimes trains site in advanced mode, because as I suggested earlier the key issue is the ECS moves before the passenger service starts.  National Rail's LDBs obviously won't display ECS, or indeed any backdated info on earlier passenger services.

    But I'd be cautiously optimistic, because as seen from the station it looks like the mainline side track works to/from P7/8/9/10 are rapidly approaching physical completion, with over three days left. As I understand from posts elsewhere the main aim of Sunday's closure is to demolish the remaining part of the footbridge, so if they've any sensible sort of overall plan the trackwork should be proven beforehand.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on April 04, 2013, 17:26:56
    The very disrupted service this morning was caused by a failed train on Reading Depot at around 0100-0200 which prevented the last 3 or 4 trains arriving on time, they were all around 60 mins late.

    This in turn delayed morning departures, with only the back exit from the depot in use, with 2 reversals (one at Reading West and other at Tilehurst) chaos and big delays were all over the place. I believe some departures were nearly 90 mins late.

    The current depot is not designed for the large number of trains (and formations) to enter/exit via the West, This is because where the trains are stabled (roads 6-22), you have to shunt 1 unit at a time towards a neck then shunt back towards the West end, then go and get the other unit and repeat then couple them. Only one train can be formed at a time, and this takes time. Bearing in mind that every set of points have to be pulled by a person........Oh if only there was a new depot with more capacity and power points????? (8 weeks to go I believe?)

    I think a similar startup may reoccur tonight / tomorrow, but hopefully not quite as late!! (Too many trains not enough tracks)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 04, 2013, 17:31:11
    You can always have look before leaving home on Maidenehad Live departures
    http://www.livedepartureboards.co.uk/fgw/summary.aspx?T=MAI&x=27&y=9 (http://www.livedepartureboards.co.uk/fgw/summary.aspx?T=MAI&x=27&y=9)

    You at least get a feel for how things are going, but it won't tell you how crowded the trains are though.

    I always do..every day..and JourneyCheck. You'd be amazed at how things can change during the 25 minute walk.. or how sometimes Journeycheck is wrong..

    Still doesn't help my dilemma re renewing my season ticket. If I go an do that Sunday I feel I'm going to be jinxing the Monday service.. but I imagine the ticket queues on Monday will be very long if there are trains..


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 04, 2013, 17:33:32
    From the NR disruption page:

    "There is currently no firm estimate for when a normal service will resume. It is anticipated that this disruption will continue until at least 8 April" (bold added by me)..

    I'm quite concerned about Monday now.. And the trouble is.. No one will know for sure until they get to the station and find it's either ok (hopefully) or chaos (most likely)

    On Tuesday I gave up and went home again   :(


    it's good that they take (lots of our money) for our Season tickets but I bet you won't get a refund even though you couldn't travel...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 04, 2013, 22:44:59
    The crewing issues I refer to is what caused a lot of disruption on Tuesday. Because of these crewing issues the 180s are not in use. To cover the 180s Turbos are being used instead which has meant some diagrams are now short formed.

    Sadly the decision to take the 180s out yesterday backfired somewhat on the Cotswold Line in the afternoon, as after the 12:21 PAD-GMV departed (formed with a 2-car Turbo vice 180), the following train, the 13:21 PAD-MIM was cancelled and the train after the 14:21 PAD-WOF (also formed of a 2-car Turbo) only got as far as Oxford after those in charge realised, after it had arrived at Oxford, that the HSS Train Manager rostered to take it forward didn't sign Turbos - nobody had thought to check in advance!   

    Then fate dealt another dud card (as it often does) as the following train, 15:51 PAD-WOS, activated a hot axle box detector near Didcot and limped into Oxford to terminate.  A 3-car Turbo was summoned from the yard and left (totally crammed) at around 17:20 and was closely followed by the halts train.  That meant that only one 2-car Turbo left Oxford towards the Cotswolds in five hours!

    Presumably the 14:21 PAD-WOF was only a 2-car due to its call at Shipton on the return journey, and if so presents another staggering example of the needs of the few outweighing the needs of the many.  How full that, and the 12:21ex Paddington, were when they left London I dread to think!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 04, 2013, 23:12:52
    If I was a Maidenhead commuter I'd be tempted to use that realtimes trains site in advanced mode, because as I suggested earlier the key issue is the ECS moves before the passenger service starts.  National Rail's LDBs obviously won't display ECS, or indeed any backdated info on earlier passenger services.

    But I'd be cautiously optimistic, because as seen from the station it looks like the mainline side track works to/from P7/8/9/10 are rapidly approaching physical completion, with over three days left. As I understand from posts elsewhere the main aim of Sunday's closure is to demolish the remaining part of the footbridge, so if they've any sensible sort of overall plan the trackwork should be proven beforehand.

    Paul

    Thanks paul7755.. That link does look very useful... I've saved it as a favourite.. Not sure I will totally understand all the trains on it but should give me some idea in advance if Monday morning is going to be good or bad


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 05, 2013, 08:24:50
    The crewing issues I refer to is what caused a lot of disruption on Tuesday. Because of these crewing issues the 180s are not in use. To cover the 180s Turbos are being used instead which has meant some diagrams are now short formed.

    I saw another 180 heading west this morning, I'm guessing it was the 06:48 Paddington-Great Malvern? The 06:53 from Twyford was again indicated as having only 3 cars but I didn't get it this morning as it ran about 13 minutes late and the 06:44 did actually turn up for the first time this week, albeit 18 minutes late but just ahead of the 06:53 and with plenty of room inside.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on April 05, 2013, 09:59:20
    A 180 was leaving Goring at 17:47ish last night as well, just in the interests of completeness :-)

    FGW seem to have improved as the weeks gone by - on Wednesday the 0731 8-car HST from Goring stopped at Reading, Twyford and Maidenhead, and was crammed when it left. On Thursday and Friday it was set down only at Reading (looked like another HST was due at Reading around the same time, so I assume that was why), so when it arrived at Twyford and Maidenhead there was plenty of space for all the passengers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on April 05, 2013, 11:07:33
    Things were quite slow again this morning @ 06:50. There was something of a procession of trains all waiting for P15 towards Paddington and running around 10-15 minutes late.

    I had a look around whilst I waited for a fast service - the transfer deck does feel nice and airy and has great potential. It does feel cold and very exposed near the platform exits as previously noted.

    There always seems to be one of the escalators in the south entrance out of action.

    I wasn't overly impressed with the summary train displays - only a single screen the size of my TV on each pier. It would be nice to have larger and more displays available. With many departures having a subtext line (eg, calls at Slough) there isn't much room for that many services to be shown, even when it is flipping over two pages.

    There are the 5 groups of screens at the NW and SE sides of the deck but I had to look at them a while to work out whether they were related to a single platform(s) or all the upcoming departures.

    What looks like a Starbucks booth (judging by the logo half hidden under cladding) was being erected in the centre.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 05, 2013, 12:47:50

    But I'd be cautiously optimistic, because as seen from the station it looks like the mainline side track works to/from P7/8/9/10 are rapidly approaching physical completion, with over three days left. As I understand from posts elsewhere the main aim of Sunday's closure is to demolish the remaining part of the footbridge, so if they've any sensible sort of overall plan the trackwork should be proven beforehand.

    Paul

    They may be making progress on the east side of the station, but I think they've some way to go at "Whitehouse Junction"  (ie Scours Lane East).  When I went past on Tuesday it looked like some track slewing was still to be done, and some crossovers to put in place.  Maybe that's planned for Sunday as well, if it hasn't been done since Tuesday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 05, 2013, 13:21:49

    But I'd be cautiously optimistic, because as seen from the station it looks like the mainline side track works to/from P7/8/9/10 are rapidly approaching physical completion, with over three days left. As I understand from posts elsewhere the main aim of Sunday's closure is to demolish the remaining part of the footbridge, so if they've any sensible sort of overall plan the trackwork should be proven beforehand.

    Paul

    They may be making progress on the east side of the station, but I think they've some way to go at "Whitehouse Junction"  (ie Scours Lane East).  When I went past on Tuesday it looked like some track slewing was still to be done, and some crossovers to put in place.  Maybe that's planned for Sunday as well, if it hasn't been done since Tuesday.

    That's a fair point - that area is definitely a bit 'out of sight and out of mind', and presumably there may also be changes at Reading West Jn?  However the complexity can't be any greater than what's going on at the east end, so in terms of overall timescales should be just as achievable before Monday.  There's no station buildings and footbridge demolition going on in parallel after all...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 05, 2013, 13:55:26
    Mrs GTBE complained to me that there are no down esclators on 12/13B (and presumably 14/15B as well), so when she arrived for the train to Pangbourne (shown as 12B) she had to walk down a million steps.  I told her she could have gone down the escalator on the A side and walked down the platform (OK it may have added about 100 yards to her journey to the train).  I won't repeat Mrs GTBE's reply.

    So with platform sharing we will have all westbound turbos and XCs shown on the B platform.  The passengers go to the exit from the transfer deck labelled xxB and are confronted by no down escalator and steps. Now us regulars know you can go down the A esclators or get a lift, but how many will.  I envisage lots of people with luggage struggling down the stairs to their XC on 12B, muttering how silly it is not to have a down escalator, not to mention hoards of westbound commuters every evening who haven't got the time or inclination to take the scenic route to their train home.

    PLEASE will someone in the know reassure me that platform sharing is only a temporay arrangement!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 05, 2013, 14:01:31
    The large crane has reappeared this morning, which I guess is the preparation for work to start on the rest of the old footbridge. I assume they will be making a start overnight tonight.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 05, 2013, 16:56:10

    PLEASE will someone in the know reassure me that platform sharing is only a temporay arrangement!


    Is that a serious question?  You seem to be very much against platform sharing, and I don't see why this is, the 'problem' with one way escalators is trivial - and anyway I've seen the B end escalators running downwards.  How did people manage with the old platform 10 with luggage?

    I suggest the reason they've fitted all the axle counter sections, and all the signage etc is that it is permanent - at least until short DMUs are no longer used on the route at all.  The NR Network Change notice I quoted way back makes no mention of it being temporary.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on April 05, 2013, 20:23:06

    I paid my first visit to the new South (West) entrance/gateline today, not train-travelling till Monday.

    I was amazed to find the gateline barely 3m inside the doors, no concourse, ticket office, coffee shops, WHSmiths etc, being directed by the friendly CSM on the line to the old (1991) concourse.

    The transfer bridge is wonderfully airy and spacious and reminds one of European Gares and Bahnhofs - but is it just a posh footbridge?

    Can anyone explain it to me?

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on April 05, 2013, 20:24:34
    Mrs GTBE complained to me that there are no down esclators on 12/13B (and presumably 14/15B as well), so when she arrived for the train to Pangbourne (shown as 12B) she had to walk down a million steps. 

    She exaggerates. I have told her a million times.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 06, 2013, 08:01:25
    As far as I can see from Camera 2 Tab 2, demolition of the rest of the footbridge started around midnight last night. This morning the top is no longer visible.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 06, 2013, 11:49:17
    Yes, It's a pity the camera that was on an east building that pointed west disappeared.  Perhaps it was on the footbridge! ;D

    Actually I had assumed it was on an office building near the southern station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adrian the Rock on April 06, 2013, 14:04:43
    Slightly tongue-in-cheek video of last weekend's HST diversions via Banbury:

    http://youtu.be/XF1HVDDKJz0 (http://youtu.be/XF1HVDDKJz0)

    Enjoy!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 06, 2013, 18:06:27
    Slightly tongue-in-cheek video of last weekend's HST diversions via Banbury:

    http://youtu.be/XF1HVDDKJz0 (http://youtu.be/XF1HVDDKJz0)

    Enjoy!

    many thanks for sharing. Having spent many years living in the Banbury area it was good to be reminded of the lovely design of the station!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 18:16:34
    As far as I can see from Camera 2 Tab 2, demolition of the rest of the footbridge started around midnight last night. This morning the top is no longer visible.

    Here's a couple of pictures (attachments below) taken early this afternoon.  I'd be expecting now that the lift, escalators and stairs will be dealt with gradually.  As discussed earlier there's no real urgency for those bits is there - although we could be surprised again.  All the bits of footbridge were piled on the P8/9 island, which makes me think they'll be craned off starting later tonight once normal services have ceased.


    Perhaps it was on the footbridge! ;D


    Yes it was definitely on the footbridge, only a few feet onto the first linkspan from the station end, the camera housing was on the inside of the glass attached by heavy duty suction cups.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 18:44:53

    I paid my first visit to the new South (West) entrance/gateline today, not train-travelling till Monday.

    I was amazed to find the gateline barely 3m inside the doors, no concourse, ticket office, coffee shops, WHSmiths etc, being directed by the friendly CSM on the line to the old (1991) concourse.

    OTC

    In the design and access statement (which records the alternative options and design decisions as a part of the planning application), it is basically described as an additional entrance, and is not intended to replace the existing 'main entrance'.  There was a plan to reduce the older entrance to what would have effectively been a dedicated entrance for the 'Southern' lines, but this was discounted. 

    I also recall (without looking this up) that Reading BC actually wanted a massive 'grand design' type entrance from the transfer deck with the escalators and stairs aligned towards the town, including the ticket office, but this wasn't possible in the constraints of the site, unless the properties on the other side of station hill disappeared. They go into great lengths about the areas required at top and bottom of the escalators for what is called 'run off',  these are safety features to prevent accidents on both escalators and staircases - hence all the staircases have so many intermediate landings.  (This is also why the northern stair is so convoluted - the building isn't long enough to stretch out the stair case with that amount of 'rise'.

    To cut a long story short though, I think that moving the ticket office was abandoned as it would have been an unnecessary cost, for no operational benefit.  The layout they've ended up with might even have advantages in separating those with tickets already from those without, and of course on the paid side of the barriers the two main line island platforms will still have coffee shops etc, as will P7 as it is now...

    As I've suggested in an earlier post, I think the Three Guineas 'heritage building' should have been turned back into a central ticket office with routes through to it's left and right.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 06, 2013, 18:45:37
    The old footbridge has been completely destroyed then? Not dismantled piece by piece?

    Surely such a wonderful example of late 1980s design and architecture should have been preserved for the nation. Wasn't there any interest from a heritage railway in relocating it?  :P ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 06, 2013, 19:02:46
    One thing I've noticed is that there's a tendency for people arriving at the top of the escalators to clash as they round the corner with those coming the other way.  Possibly solved with some strategic barriers?

    I've also noticed that the stairs are eerily quiet most of the time as us lazy citizens cram on the escalators - which, incidentally, are fitted with an energy saving 'slow mode' when they detect nobody is on them. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 19:18:21

    I've also noticed that the stairs are eerily quiet most of the time as us lazy citizens cram on the escalators - which, incidentally, are fitted with an energy saving 'slow mode' when they detect nobody is on them. 

    I wonder if the sets of four (such as on the south side) reduce to just two overnight as well, and that accounts for some of the supposed faults?  Obviously if there are barriers up that's a definite snag, but perhaps they also stop sometimes if not actually needed?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 19:22:51
    Surely such a wonderful example of late 1980s design and architecture should have been preserved for the nation. Wasn't there any interest from a heritage railway in relocating it?  :P ;)

    I think that 'joke' counts as a repeat - too like mine at #1309...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 19:36:30
    They may be making progress on the east side of the station, but I think they've some way to go at "Whitehouse Junction"  (ie Scours Lane East).  When I went past on Tuesday it looked like some track slewing was still to be done, and some crossovers to put in place.  Maybe that's planned for Sunday as well, if it hasn't been done since Tuesday.

    Went out to Tilehurst and back this morning, and there's no work whatsoever going on at the west end of the layout at all now, however the new connections (as shown in the first of the diagrams posted on page 55) are all in operation.  XC trains to/from Basingstoke and freight services are running up and down what will now be the interim 'mains' (ie the old reliefs) as far as Reading West Jn, the block (stop lights) on this pair of tracks was further east, nearly at Cow Lane I think?

    One point about the track layout I hadn't realised so far is that the running junction at Tilehurst East is only a single ladder, so parallel moves by up and down trains between the reliefs and the mains aren't possible - presumably exactly why that area became the main bottleneck...

    PS - since posting that I thought I'd see if webcam 04 tab 4 showed these tracks in use, and although there isn't much to see, I did find a couple of freightliners at 1130 and 1345 today.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 06, 2013, 20:14:23
    Surely such a wonderful example of late 1980s design and architecture should have been preserved for the nation. Wasn't there any interest from a heritage railway in relocating it?  :P ;)
    I think that 'joke' counts as a repeat - too like mine at #1309 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg128184#msg128184)...   ;D

    Great minds eh?  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on April 06, 2013, 20:28:04
    Paul7755,

    Thank you for your kind and lucid explanation.

    I can see that the great gain will be in access and quality space. I used to complain that it was a crowded 500m+ from my seat (!) in quiet coach A to the No 5 bus stop, also about short notice platform changes via the sub-way (old 5 to 9 then back to 4!). I also admired B'ham International with its deck above platforms and visible tracks.

    I imagine that the 1991 concourse will soon look jaded and the poor, uneconomic site-ratio of the present building may prompt rebuilding.

    I'm now looking forward to Monday!

    Thanks,

    OTC



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 20:51:42
    Another theory might be that Network Rail are hoping the council will chip in with a sufficiently large contribution to make a difference.  I can think of a few situations where the local authority has helped out, Southampton Central's new south entrance being a typical joint effort.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 06, 2013, 21:11:33
    Quote
    One point about the track layout I hadn't realised so far is that the running junction at Tilehurst East is only a single ladder, so parallel moves by up and down trains between the reliefs and the mains aren't possible - presumably exactly why that area became the main bottleneck...

    PS - since posting that I thought I'd see if webcam 04 tab 4 showed these tracks in use, and although there isn't much to see, I did find a couple of freightliners at 1130 and 1345 today.
    Paul

    There is an existing double junction between the new Relief lines (the old Goods Lines) via the new Main lines (old Relief lines) and across the out of use old Main lines (gosh hope that makes sense :P) to Reading West curve (see the previous track layout drawings).  I don't think that the main lines themselves between Tilehurst Reading West Junction and Twyford are commissioned until tomorrow tonight (Sun 07/Mon 08 April 2013).  I suspect the old double junctions will be de-commissioned when the new flyover lines come into operation.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 06, 2013, 21:51:21

    There is an existing double junction between the new Relief lines (the old Goods Lines) via the new Main lines (old Relief lines) and across the out of use old Main lines (gosh hope that makes sense :P) to Reading West curve (see the previous track layout drawings).  I don't think that the main lines themselves between Tilehurst and Twyford are commissioned until tomorrow tonight (Sun 07/Mon 08 April 2013). 

    When I wrote that the new main lines were already in use, I was only referring to the stretch from Tilehurst as far as Reading West, but I'm sure I'm right on this because as I left Tilehurst towards Reading, at about 1330, there was a Freightliner service bombing along in parallel, having stayed on the up main whilst my 165 made its station call at Tilehurst. 

    Realtimetrains has the Turbo (2P52) at Reading West Jn at 1344 on 'RL' and the Freightliner at same timing point at 1344 on 'M'.  All the timings seem about right from what I recall, although I wasn't writing anything down...

    I remember thinking that train's still moving pretty fast, and ah now it's passed that signal, so it can't be crossing over to the relief side where I am...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 06, 2013, 22:13:12
    Paul, quite possible then that last weekend they connected up the Main lines to the old Relief lines at Tilehurst.  Its a shame that there don't appear to be any photographs of the work at that end :(

    I have edited my post above to reflect your recollection.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 07, 2013, 00:01:37
    All the bits of footbridge were piled on the P8/9 island, which makes me think they'll be craned off starting later tonight once normal services have ceased.

    Crane started working at about 22:30 tonight


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 07, 2013, 11:46:12
    All the bits of footbridge were piled on the P8/9 island, which makes me think they'll be craned off starting later tonight once normal services have ceased.

    Crane started working at about 22:30 tonight

    ...and they seem to be in the tidying up phase now, around 1130, as the crane is removing the heavy machinery and the baulks of timber used to protect the platform surfaces.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 07, 2013, 14:22:16
    You know that bit in the movies, where they're waiting for it to kick off, and someone says it all seems a bit too quiet?   ;D

    Just looked at the long shot of the east end track works (available by zooming in on webcam 02/2), and there doesn't seem to be anything going on...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 07, 2013, 17:24:43
    I have just renewed my monthly season ticket so apologies to everyone should I now have jinxed the service being good tomorrow morning  ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 07, 2013, 20:20:55
    Erm ... thanks for that, Jo.  :P ::) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 07, 2013, 20:23:27
    Erm ... thanks for that, Jo.  :P ::) ;D

    I know!..It was a difficult choice though.. Had I not done it today.. and the trains were ok (as I am sure they will be) in the morning.. the queues for tickets would have been very long tomorrow.. Hopefully all will be ok though...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 08, 2013, 11:33:08
    Will not blame Jo for this (!) but I notice that the reduced platform availability is causing major delays (5 to 10 minutes) on trains passing through Reading, both ways.  These are doubtless chargeable by FGW (mainly) to NR.

    Those of you in the know, I have a question.  Given that the temporary timetable must have been drawn up in anticipation of this reduced capacity, who is really to blame?  Is it right that NR should be coughing up, as at the moment, apart from annoying customers, it seems a nice little earner for FGW?

    Put me right someone please, especially if you are 'in the know'.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 08, 2013, 11:41:37
    But they haven't got reduced platforms this week have they?  I though they were all open apart from Platform 11 and possibly 3 - which means they have more platforms available than ever before.

    Will find out for certain when I pass through there in a couple of hours.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 08, 2013, 11:53:08
    Yes, all platforms (bar 3, 16 and 11) are now open.  A few delays this morning, but nothing too bad, and importantly pretty much everything did run even if it was a little late.  It'll take a little time for drivers, signallers and despatch staff to adjust to the new capacity and make best use of it, but in a few days delays the added flexibility will come in useful and cut delays that have been occurring for years due to too many trains and not enough platforms.  The situation will then improve still further when all the platforms are reopened and the west end of the station has been remodelled with the two dive unders.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 08, 2013, 12:07:05
    16 - previously 6 is history though now isn't it?  That will not be re-opening will it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on April 08, 2013, 12:19:23
    I was talking to a driver yesterday about the new layout. He told me that the training they had received was a one day classroom briefing, supported by simulation DVDs and, in his opinion, that had been not been enough. He would have have liked to have been conducted through the new layout before driving in passenger service.

    Clearly, this was not possible. Every driver and guard of every TOC/FOC that goes through Reading would have had to have been briefed on the new layout, and the idea of giving each one experience of the layout before using it for real is totally impractical. As it is, the job of briefing hundreds of drivers and guards must have been a major exercise.

    One of the results of this approach, he said, was that drivers were going slowly through the area - "15mph from Tilehurst to Kennet loop" - so that they had plenty of time to pick the signals and the stopboards. This must have had a big impact on timekeeping last week, and presumably something similar is happening today for the newly opened routes through the station. The effect will diminish over time, but there will still be drivers coming fresh to the situation over the next few weeks, and its better to drive carefully at 15mph than risk a SPAD.

    He also commented that the number of stopboards etc on the new platforms, with the use of A and B ends as discussed earlier in this thread, was overly complex. Trains had to be stopped within 5 yards of the stopboard to avoid tripping the next set of axle counters. Bound to be a few issues with this until familiarity increases.

    One last, and slightly worrying comment, visibility of the Led signals (pariculary the feathers) was difficult in some light conditions. In particular, in darkness, the intensity of light from the platforms made some signals difficult to read.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 08, 2013, 12:41:53
    Thanks for follow-ups.  Was i right about who picks up the tab?  I mean, if Oxman is correct, it should be the TOC.

    I wonder if they agreed a 'share the pain' until all is bedded down?

    Yes BobM, I thought it was all open today too, which is why I was surprised at the delays.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on April 08, 2013, 12:52:43
    Thanks for follow-ups.  Was i right about who picks up the tab?  I mean, if Oxman is correct, it should be the TOC.

    I wonder if they agreed a 'share the pain' until all is bedded down?

    Yes BobM, I thought it was all open today too, which is why I was surprised at the delays.

    The sillyness is that a little bit or pre-publicity on the engineering signs "from Monday onwards, we'll be operating a new layout and there may be delays of up to ten minutes as we bed in" would have been understood by commuters, and should have obviated the need for blame assignment, fines, etc which all end up being paid for by the customer or taxpayer anyway!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on April 08, 2013, 16:34:49
    It was rather Manic at Maidenhead this morning.. I arrived at 7.45 to find the 7.08 HST just departing (it was only about 10 minutes late when I left home so had lost quite a lot of time somewhere meanwhile)...

    The 7.45 and 7.49 stopping trains to Paddington came in the wrong way around (unless you believed the Maidenhead station announcer but anyway).. the 7.49 which arrived first got there at about 7.54 but sat in the platform for at least 5 minutes, doors open, green signal, for reasons that we weren't told about (but obviously then delayed subsequent trains)..

    The 7.45 then came in gone 8am.. Just before that the announcer told us that fast trains to Paddington would be arriving at platform 4 and 2 simultaneously.. Which was half true.. The delayed 7.45 stopper arrived at the same time as the non-stop 8.04am.. Hopefully no one got on the 7.45 thinking it was non-stop by mistake.. As also whilst the 7.45 was in the platform the indicator board was still just showing it as "delayed" and that 8am departure was timed at 8.03 (which was the time it was then)..

    Very confusing.. Not sure why the information system couldn't keep up this morning...



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 08, 2013, 16:40:00
    One of the results of this approach, he said, was that drivers were going slowly through the area - "15mph from Tilehurst to Kennet loop" - so that they had plenty of time to pick the signals and the stopboards. This must have had a big impact on timekeeping last week, and presumably something similar is happening today for the newly opened routes through the station. The effect will diminish over time, but there will still be drivers coming fresh to the situation over the next few weeks, and its better to drive carefully at 15mph than risk a SPAD.

    That's probably a little excessive - most drivers won't be going quite that slow over that whole distance, but it's very true that they will be treading carefully for a while until the new routes all bed in.  For example, a new signal on the 'Up Relief' near the maintenance depot (T1732) can show six different routes into platforms 12-15 all with different speeds.  And (temporarily at least) the last signal on the 'Down Main' before Reading now has four different routings (it used to just have one) and if you're heading towards Didcot you can't get there from Platform 7 any more, so a driver needs to know that they can't accept a Junction Indicator 2 at that signal.  And then there's all the closing-up signals and rear-clear markers...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 08, 2013, 16:46:32
    As also whilst the 7.45 was in the platform the indicator board was still just showing it as "delayed" and that 8am departure was timed at 8.03 (which was the time it was then)..

    Very confusing.. Not sure why the information system couldn't keep up this morning...

    I was just about to post something similar to the last part of your post having just got back from Reading.  I was waiting on platform 9 for the 15:44 to Cardiff.  It became pretty evident that it wouldn't be using that platform as there was a XC service to Bournemouth at the west end of the platform and that was not due to depart until 15:46.

    After much waiting around the Cardiff service was duly swapped to Platform 8 where it arrived at 15:50.  By this time the CIS was showing "Delayed" and remained doing so I as boarded.  It had been showing an estimated time until the train actually arrived.

    I also noticed today that when a train runs past the platform non stop there is still the verbal announcement to keep clear but the CIS no longer changes to ** PLEASE STAND CLEAR ** as it used to.

    Meanwhile a Starbucks kiosk was in the process of being installed on the transfer deck towards the northern end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 17:26:08
    ...I notice that the reduced platform availability is causing major delays (5 to 10 minutes) on trains passing through Reading, both ways. 

    Buzzz!   Exaggeration  ;D  as we know, many FGW trains delayed by up to 10 minutes at destination will still be counted as on time in the stats.  These cannot reasonably be considered major delays surely? 

    But as others have already mentioned, there is no intentional reduced platform availability this week - although I overheard there was a defective set of points affecting the country end crossover from P8 to the down main.  Now that might have caused a reduction in usable platform capacity for a time while it was fixed?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 08, 2013, 17:46:17
    Delays can't have been too bad today or else we would have had Mr Happy from Taplow on here... ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 18:00:38
    A snippet of info I gleaned 'interrogating' NR employees this afternoon - as you do!  :D

    The crossover at the end of P8 towards the new down main is definitely a temporary alignment, and will be relaid at a 'shallower angle' later in the stage work.  (I think we discussed this before?) Therefore the corresponding 'step' in the platform 8/9 island is also confirmed as temporary stage works, despite the finished look of the guardrails and those newly fitted steps down onto the ballast, all that will be repositioned to the true platform end sometime within the next year - dates to be decided.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 08, 2013, 18:34:05
    I must admit I did think it was a pretty steep double bend out of platform 8 when I saw it this afternoon.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/plat8.jpg)

    Apologies for the quality of the photo - had to use my phone after taking my camera complete with charged battery...but no memory card!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 08, 2013, 19:02:50
    Does anyone know what happened to tab 1 and 4 of camera 04?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 19:38:11
    Does anyone know what happened to tab 1 and 4 of camera 04?

    Happens now and again, sometimes they do go off for a few hours, days or overnight.  But if they go permanently off the tab usually goes as well.

    However tab 4 is showing OK up till 1900 tonight (8th Apr), one of the quirks of the system is that if the first view you get to is 'stale', and you change to a different tab, you then need to click on the calendar to update that tab again, IYSWIM...

    HTH

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on April 08, 2013, 19:41:10
    I must admit I did think it was a pretty steep double bend out of platform 8 when I saw it this afternoon.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/plat8.jpg)

    Apologies for the quality of the photo - had to use my phone after taking my camera complete with charged battery...but no memory card!

    Am I seeing it correctly, have the small part of the rails of the middle line been cut out, just to the left of the "20" speed limit sign? If so, I take the line is not being used till the existing platforms are being re-done or what?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 08, 2013, 19:43:42
    The middle line (actually was the Up Main) is now history and will not be replaced.  The line to the left (Platform No.7) will move closer to the position of the redundant track thus allowing the platform to be (much) wider when its rebuilt later this year.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 19:54:08
    Am I seeing it correctly, have the small part of the rails of the middle line been cut out, just to the left of the "20" speed limit sign? If so, I take the line is not being used till the existing platforms are being re-done or what?

    That line is permanently out of use pending removal as S&T points out above.  However as there was no urgency to remove it, in terms of the overall phasing of the work, it was just cut through where it got in the way of any new kit.  There's that signal post as well (not just the 20 mph sign) , and there's also a 'yellow mushroom' (connection box for axle counters) roughly under the new footbridge.  The line now stops short at about the London end of P7, I was told today it'll be gone within a few weeks. Lifting the track is the sort of job they can do overnight at a weekend without a major closure.

    As mentioned the line through platform 7 is to be moved further out when that platform is rebuilt later this year - not all the way as far as the middle line because it will still have to align smoothly with the Caversham Rd bridge spans you can see in the distance under the gantry.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Super Guard on April 08, 2013, 20:04:16
    As mentioned the line through platform 7 is to be moved further out when that platform is rebuilt later this year - not all the way as far as the middle line because it will still have to align smoothly with the Caversham Rd bridge spans you can see in the distance under the gantry.

    Paul

    Which also explains why HSTs arriving on 7 from London have quite a big bend at present from the last signal out.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on April 08, 2013, 20:12:45
    I take it the 'big bend' at present is to stay once the redevelopment is completed?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 20:39:01
    I take it the 'big bend' at present is to stay once the redevelopment is completed?

    Yes, because the highest speed route will be the new 'down main' through platform 9, hence the platform 8 line diverges off that line, and then the platform 7 line diverges away from the P8 line.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 08, 2013, 21:41:16
    ...cough.  Gentlemen they are CURVES not BENDS.... ::) ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 08, 2013, 22:27:52
    ...cough.  Gentlemen they are CURVES not BENDS.... ::) ::)

    I tried to steer round that issue. Or is that a different thread?  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 08, 2013, 22:28:45
    This shows the bend curve and the old through road which now is no longer connected at either end.  You can also see the last part of the old footbridge on the right hand side next to the original station building.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/plat70804.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 09, 2013, 06:11:30
    First trip through the new station yesterday. Some observations:

    In the AM (travelling to London) everything was running 5-10 mins late, but not too horrible. From Scours Lane to Twyford we did see to take things slow/tentatively - which may have been down to drivers taking matters safely.

    Transfered onto the Fast service on P10. Couple of country end escalators not working- causing a lot of people to back peddle to alternative set at Londonend rather than use stairs.

    P10 is cramped. The hoardings blocking off P11 cut down the available space quite a lot.

    Coming back in th PM I had 20 mins on the deck. It's is cold and windy - and I noted that where the platform canopy rises across the deck to flow down the otherwise - there is no glazing in the 1 ft gap! Just a wire grill to deter pidgeons!

    There was a solid queue of London bound train lights along the main line at this time (6pm). The root cause was the single use of P10 for London bound fasts. The new platforms were empty! I did note the lack of connections between Fast and Relief lines around Kennet Bridge end on way into station - which restricts the use of the new platforms for the fasts (not sure where the next crossovers are past Kennet? Too far along to prevent delays I assume)

    A couple of CC trains transferring from the main through the forementioned tight crossover from Oxford to use P8 as a reverser brought main movements to a stop.

    To ease the pressure what is needed:

    [1] accelerate the finishing work of P11. Without this P10 is now the bottleneck - for trains and passengers
    [2] determine a way for more London bound mains to use the new platforms to relieve pressure on P10

    CIS was OK, IMHO, just.

    For example the 18:20 stopper to Oxford was leaving P12B and was shown/displayed at escalator CIS at 18:05. But on P13B the 19:27 stopper was also displayed - a full 80 minutes before departure ! Will unfamiliar travellers see P13B first and think that was the next stopper service.....

    The CIS displays in the centre of the deck need another screen. I dislike the rolling page approach - and with a busy station like Reading seem only able to show 10 mins in advance. So people walk up and down the deck looking for their platform.

    I think the CIS will need some tweaking



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 09, 2013, 11:17:35
    ...[1] accelerate the finishing work of P11. Without this P10 is now the bottleneck - for trains and passengers
    [2] determine a way for more London bound mains to use the new platforms to relieve pressure on P10

    Once P11 is opened (planned for August bank holiday but even if it was speeded up) clearly P10 will then have to close for quite a long period of time to be rebuilt in its final position.  So there'll still be a bit of a bottleneck until both platforms are available together. 

    However they already do have a method of running High Speed services round an obstructing service in P10, they'll cross to the up relief at Tilehurst and use P15; then back over to the up main at Kennet Bridge Jn.  This can be seen happening in the realtimetrains advanced service listings, and I also saw it yesterday during the afternoon when a XC Newcastle - Southampton service was reversing in P10.

    BTW the interim layout Industry Insider posted (on page55) shows all movements possible at Kennet Bridge Jn - but it's well out of sight of the station...

    Today's timetable shows a number of Bristol - Paddington trains using P15, and early on there were trains that originated in Hereford and Cheltenham that used P15 - presumably they'd be HSTs too?

    Quote
    ...For example the 18:20 stopper to Oxford was leaving P12B and was shown/displayed at escalator CIS at 18:05. But on P13B the 19:27 stopper was also displayed - a full 80 minutes before departure ! Will unfamiliar travellers see P13B first and think that was the next stopper service....

    The chap on the mobile information desk noted this down for me on his comments sheet, and I've also sent them a feedback form about this, but based on similar observations about the XC Newcastle service.  In this case the 1340 was waiting in 14B, and the 1540 was also showing on the 'escalator display' of 13B.  They just need to suppress the later display until the previous train has left.   This is really only a disadvantage of the additional 'escalator display' because of course displaying trains in a few hours time was fairly common on the old  '3 line displays' hanging above the platforms, but in that case the later trains come up in the third line of three and are quite obviously in the future.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 09, 2013, 16:40:09
    The chap on the mobile information desk noted this down for me on his comments sheet, and I've also sent them a feedback form about this, but based on similar observations about the XC Newcastle service.  In this case the 1340 was waiting in 14B, and the 1540 was also showing on the 'escalator display' of 13B.  They just need to suppress the later display until the previous train has left.   This is really only a disadvantage of the additional 'escalator display' because of course displaying trains in a few hours time was fairly common on the old  '3 line displays' hanging above the platforms, but in that case the later trains come up in the third line of three and are quite obviously in the future.

    Even with the old station layout, this sort of thing was a common problem, usually involving stopping trains to London and Platforms 11 and 16 which would list the next departure from that platform which would often be several trains after the next actual departure to, for example, Maidenhead.  Even when a departure wasn't listed on the screens, the very presence of a train sat in the platform seemed to attract people to go and sit on it, even if it wasn't moving for hours!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 09, 2013, 16:57:08
    Yes, that's true and it's not really a specific problem to Reading anyway, but I think the entry displays at the top of the stairs do sort of exaggerate the problem.

    What they could also probably do with is a couple of sets of those alphabetic 'next fastest train to' listing displays, with almost all the through destinations shown.  Even straightforward Winchester has got those...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 09, 2013, 17:57:06
    I am pretty sure I saw of those "next fastest train to" displays by the new southern gateline.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 09, 2013, 18:29:37
    Ah,  I hadn't noticed one on my last visit, but then I spent most of the time on the transfer deck or the new platforms.  I suppose given the size of the place having such displays on the transfer deck as well as at the entrances would probably be a good idea. Once interchanging passengers realise where their expected service is likely to run from they too may not venture far from the middle of the transfer deck...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on April 09, 2013, 18:31:32
    ...cough.  Gentlemen they are CURVES not BENDS.... ::) ::)

    I know, I know. It drives me round the curve.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: NickB on April 10, 2013, 08:28:59
    I've just seen this on the FGW website:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/compticket/ (http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/compticket/)

    Quote
    Reading Redevelopment

    You might be entitled to receive one complimentary weekend open return ticket with First Great Western (Standard or First Class, depending on your existing Season Ticket held). Please register your details online by midnight 14th April 2013. If you qualify we will send your PIN details to your registered email address by 28th April 2013. The complimentary ticket needs to be purchased by 6th July 2013 and used for travel by 29th September 2013.



    As a follow up to this post I've noticed that FGW have changed the submission template.  Last week when I tried it asked me for my photocard ID, but rejected anything that contained alphanumeric characters - which prevents you from entering your photocard ID.  Skills.  I've just been back to reenter my details and you no longer need to enter this data.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 10, 2013, 14:41:04
    Noticed some track recovery going on this morning, the western double track approach route down to the lower level of the depot (where it crosses the separate Cow Lane steel bridge) appeared to be disappearing pretty fast.   I guess that bridge isn't going to last much longer...

    The relevant area can also be seen on webcam 04 tab 1.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on April 10, 2013, 17:22:34
    ...cough.  Gentlemen they are CURVES not BENDS.... ::) ::)

    I know, I know. It drives me round the curve.
    You can get around it quickly with a little cant  :o  :D  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on April 10, 2013, 19:34:35
    ...cough.  Gentlemen they are CURVES not BENDS.... ::) ::)

    I know, I know. It drives me round the curve.
    You can get around it quickly with a little cant  :o  :D  ;D

    ...unless you suffer from cant deficiency.....


    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 10, 2013, 20:34:29
    I  don't think this discussion is turning out well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 10, 2013, 20:37:13
    I  don't think this discussion is turning out well.

    I agree - I think it's going off at a tangent (be fair mods, as least we have moved on from the bovine and urine puns)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 10, 2013, 21:32:27
    It's raining hard in Reading tonight - with a stiff breeze.
    I have just caught the local stopper to Oxford.

    The gap at the top of the transfer deck, where the platform canopy, goes up and over was letting the rain in. Lines of water where visible on the floor and the little yellow slip hazard signs were appearing as I descended to the platform

    Crazy ! A peice of cheapo Perspex would do more to keep out the weather - the wire grills are ridiculous !



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 10, 2013, 21:35:30
    Crazy ! A peice of cheapo Perspex would do more to keep out the weather - the wire grills are ridiculous !

    Yes, I wouldn't be surprised if those grills are replaced with something more substantial, as whenever it rains and the wind is blowing water comes through and creates slipping hazards, as well as being uncomfortable.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 10, 2013, 23:16:26
    This was the scene this evening with the wind blowing the rain onto the London side of the transfer deck.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rain2.jpg)
    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rain.jpg)

    Several Network Rail staff were making frequent visits armed with mops.

    I am pretty sure I saw of those "next fastest train to" displays by the new southern gateline.

    I was right - there are two on each side of the southern gateline

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/atozdep.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 11, 2013, 10:14:45
    Ah right, I was thinking of a different format display, which has significantly more stations listed by time and allocated platform, but in alphabetical order.  At Basingstoke it has 3 columns of at least 20 stations.

    I wish I could find a picture of the 'orange LED' type online, but I found a similar (slightly older) device at East Croydon - the difference with this one is that the destinations are permanently attached, with only time and platform info changing.  But the key thing is they show 175 separate destinations there:

    http://www.datadisplayuk.com/croydon-led-departure-boards

    PS I did a bit more digging and found this on the manufacturer's website:

    http://www.infotec.co.uk/uploads/news/id5/south-west-trains.jpg

    Paul




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on April 11, 2013, 10:22:40
    Yes, I wouldn't be surprised if those grills are replaced with something more substantial, as whenever it rains and the wind is blowing water comes through and creates slipping hazards, as well as being uncomfortable.

    Its not just the transfer deck itself, the uncovered stairs and escalators will end up in a right state after a winter (or summer judging by the year so far!) of abuse. Why on earth they are not enclosed at the sides is beyond me.

    They did exactly the same at Twyford when they installed the new footbridge, the stairs were exposed... for a couple of weeks before the old (new) railings were replaced with solid panels and windows all the way up.

    Still, at least it looks nice.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CLPGMS on April 11, 2013, 10:28:04
    When I was at Reading station on Thursday 4th April, light snow was blowing onto the steps and escalators on platforms 14/15.  Surely the lack of protection from the elements of these steps and escalators could cause problems when the weather is more severe.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 11, 2013, 10:43:31

    Why on earth they are not enclosed at the sides is beyond me.


    I'd venture a guess that it's all part of some 'green' idea that they'll just use entirely natural ventilation.  If those grilles were made more watertight then they'd probably have to add fans or something...

    I wonder if the design statement mentions it at all? 

    Later...  Although I found a simple reference to 'natural ventilation', I found no detailed analysis so far; but it's a safe bet it's somewhere in the overall planning documentation - no doubt some architect or other thinks it's a brilliant idea.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on April 11, 2013, 11:40:47

    The reason for the grilles is of course for natural ventilation, needed partly for breathing but mostly to control odour and thermal gains. In the summer with air temperatures at c28C, with the sun falling on the glass and all those internal heat gains from people and gizmos....the transfer deck would be really cozy. Also, in winter the area would be classed as open and therefore unheated. Grilles should have rain screens (not NASA technology) but the proper solution is to provide more shelter through an overhanging roof. This also cuts out direct sun, the cause of discomfort, the diffuse component being adequate for daylighting.

    What it means is that the station should have had more of an overall roof - a train shed - covering the escalators and perhaps a car length either side.

    The new Leeds City Station is an example of what should have been done.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 11, 2013, 12:00:02

    Why on earth they are not enclosed at the sides is beyond me.


    I'd venture a guess that it's all part of some 'green' idea that you they'll just use entirely natural ventilation.  If those grilles were made more watertight then they'd probably have to add fans or something...

    I wonder if the design statement mentions it at all?

    Paul

    Yes, the D&A statement does explicitly refer to natural ventilation. That's obviously got to be a good idea, in terms of minimising CO2 production by obviating the need for more electricity generation, but the actual implementation of that fine principle has been woeful - surely, the primary requirement of any building, whether it's ventilated naturally or mechanically, is that it has to be weatherproof. Entirely predictably, the Transfer Deck is not.

    I did have grave misgivings about the design when I saw it in the plans/elevations submitted for Planning but decided not to whinge about it here as that would just seem negative, though I did express my concerns recently about the apparently poor  navigability of the Deck and the total inadequacy of the signage. However, I think Grimshaw (the architects) and Network Rail (the clients) have really embarrassed themselves by producing a building whose functionality and fitness-for-purpose simply do not look like they have been properly thought through at all. I remember seeing in the Environmental Statement (I think) that the design-decisions about local wind conditions were based on readings taken at the Met Office weather station in Bracknell! Unbelieveable! This station was a long, long time in the planning - surely someone could have said at some point: "hang on, this section of the GWML is oriented exactly East-West, in a country with prevailing westerly/sou'westerly winds, and the existing station already suffers from having those winds howling directly through it; before designing the new station, perhaps we should therefore install anemometers on the existing building for a few years and take site-specific wind-readings to help inform our decision-making".

    The idea of good architecture is to anticipate and design-out really basic problems such as potential weather ingress before one gets to Planning and certainly before getting to detailled design-drawing stage; dealing with them retrospectively in the way that NR are now having to, ie with mops/buckets/slip-hazard signs, is just appalling, and makes them look amateurish. Which is a terrible shame, because this has otherwise been an incredibly impressive project so far. 

    I have to say that the more I've read on this thread about the RSAR project, the more I've understood that it was west-of-Reading track-led, and that the re-configuration of the station was largely a necessary consequence of that (though I do acknowledge that the anticipated doubling of passenger numbers through Reading in the period to 2030 was also a massive driver); it does, therefore, seem to this layperson that the station re-design was almost an afterthought (I exaggerate, of course, for effect).

    I'm so puzzled by how this weather-ingress situation was allowed to get to this stage, ie allowed to get right through many design iterations, and through the construction process when there was terrible weather, to the point that the building fails within a week of commissioning, and customers are posting photos of puddles and buckets. All the actors here are normally first-class at what they do: Grimshaw, Hotchieff/Costain, Network Rail, all excellent - so how has this been allowed to happen? How did this problem get through their respective (and joined-up) quality-assurance processes?

    We all know that architecture/construction is always a compromise between aspiration and cost, but surely making your building weather-proof must always be on the "must-do" list rather than the "nice-to-do" list?           


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 11, 2013, 12:36:00
    Jeff, very interesting comments. Some of us who were looking at the transfer deck in the first few days commented on how it and the escalators were open to the weather etc.  And I (and Mrs GTBE) agree about the poor quality of the signage and the CIS's.

    I was talking to a retired railway architect (they used to be in house) a few weeks ago who said that they had the knowledge etc to design in the funcitionality of a station which external architects sometimes didn't necessarily have.  There's more to a station than looking pretty.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on April 11, 2013, 12:55:24
    Might the over generous ventilation in fact be a requirement as part of the fire safety case?
    Smoke kills far more people than heat or flames, and it could be argued that having the structure substantialy open to the elements greatly reduces the risk.

    No doubt precautions have been taken to reduce the risks of fire breaking out, but accidents do happen. A smallish fire breaking out in a well enclosed building can cost many lives, to reduce the risk relatively elaborate fire precautions are required in say offices or department stores.

    If fire broke in say a catering stall on the new bridge, then the consequences would hopefully not be serious as the smoke would readily escape rather than killing people.

    If the structure is made more weather tight then I consider it likely that more elaborate fire precautions might be needed at significant expense.

    In todays troubled world one must also consider the risks of terrorists detonating a bomb or releasing toxic chemicals. The large open areas would tend to vent the pressure wave from an explosion and thus reduce the risks to persons and property.

    Any toxic gas or fumes would be much more readily disperesed than in a better enclosed building.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 11, 2013, 16:04:58
    Ah right, I was thinking of a different format display, which has significantly more stations listed by time and allocated platform, but in alphabetical order.  At Basingstoke it has 3 columns of at least 20 stations.

    The screens at Reading does also show the platform number alternating with the time.  Not as good as having both displayed at the same time, but at least all the information is there.

    As for comments on the transfer deck, well let's give them a chance to sort it out before getting too over-critical.  The time constraints in getting it ready for Easter were a real problem, so I don't blame them for concentrating on getting it open rather than ensuring all loose ends were tied up - there's nothing there that a little bit of plastic, glass or perhaps some staff operated windows won't largely solve.  The weather isn't always as bad as it's been the last few weeks where, not only have the temperatures been disappointing, but the average windspeeds must have far exceeded the seasonal average - I bet that breeze will be very refreshing in the summer  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 11, 2013, 16:12:42
    As for comments on the transfer deck, well let's give them a chance to sort it out before getting too over-critical. 

     I agree with you on this. I will be making my first journey through the station since the thursday before Easter so  I look forward to seeing the changes for real.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 11, 2013, 19:35:15
    I started puzzling over the aerodynamic design of the new station right from its opening, and was writing down my conclusions, which now extend to more than two pages. I was wondering whom I might helpfully send it to when I found the topic was being discussed here. Any suggestions? Anyway, her's a few new points:

    The transfer deck is big and sits high up (as footbridges usually do), so the air has to deviate a lot to get round it and so speeds up. It will take a short-cut if there is one through the structure, so wind was always bound to whistle through the unglazed clerestories, and across from one stairway to another. Most big station footbridges I have seen are glazed right along the deck and often down the stairs too. Why, if there's no need?

    Look at old platform canopies - high ridge, wiggly baffles along the eaves, both features there for a purpose. A crosswind is forced to pass well above eaves level, and any eddies that spill into the gap between canopies (i.e. the track) are weak at eaves level and dissipated by the baffles. Now look at Grimshaw's ones - flat top, knife-edge "eaves". So the crosswind can pass close over the top, and when it spreads downwards between them it is deflected by the knife-edge down towards the passengers on the platform.

    The same effect at the overhangs of the main roof means that the gap at the top of the glazing lets in a lot of air, as the pressure is very high there. Have you noticed the gusts of wind you get at the top of the North-side escalators? So far we have only had it a bit breezy. What happens with high winds? Will the gusts hitting people in the back at the top of the escalators be unsafe? Would you like to be waiting on platform 15, and is there a maximum safe gust speed for platforms?

    The clerestories predictably let in snow - and as we now know a surprising amount of rain too. This is going to land on top of the lifts, which are open (a grille) and I very much doubt the installation, electrical and mechanical, is specified for that. The deck itself will be liable to freezing, as it has no heating from the ground below. Will the operators be prepared to clear snow and de-ice the deck, as well as the stairs and escalators?

    Finally, what does this say about the design methodology? Stations used to be designed based on operating experience, so looking at old designs gives you access to that accumulated experience. So there should be a formal stage in the design, of justifying any departure from established designs as due to a change in requirement or environment. For example, "we provide less protection for passengers because the climate is so much milder (like Southern Spain, or warmer) or people are much more tolerant of cold, or safety standards are less strict" ... Somehow I don't think this design would have got past such a process.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on April 11, 2013, 19:47:22
    Welcome to the forum, Stuving .... that's one heck of an impressive opening post!

    I've not yet gotten off a train at the new Reading ... so really can't comment.  But surely designs evolve and one would hope that past experience has been used in the building of this new "Transfer Deck", and it's not just someone's view without looking back.   But having said that, I personally find the new Newport cold, impersonal and less welcoming to the passenger ... but is that one of the key criteria in the design, or is it much more based on cheap to run (fewer staff, easyclean), low maintenance, little opportunity for fare evasion, no corners for antisocial behaviour ... rather than the comfort and enjoyment of you and me?

    I fear you may be too late to make meaningful inputs ... it's virtually there now, isn't it?

    By the way - I'm not against all new stations; King's Cross is lovely, as are many aspects of Paddington


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on April 11, 2013, 21:23:18
    There are a number of features in the station design that might not be apparent in general use, the designers I am sure will have to take into account fire, the transfer deck would be the principle escape route in the fire and evacuation strategy therefore it cannot be allowed to come a smoke trap also potential terrorist bomb threat allowing for pressure release is important.

    I currently involved in fire and evacuation strategy for a project I am working on which involves the potential of two 12 car trains (about 1000 passengers each) the things to be considered certainly opened my eyes.

    As II said there are a number of things that still need to be finished the focus has been to open the station in a usable an safe condition some bits need finishing, possibly not all the gutters are in place yet


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 12, 2013, 10:02:53
    I don't think the cheerleaders for the new station should be so quick to dismiss the comments from posters such as Jeff and Stuving who obviously know what they are talking about.  It seems to me that the problems are more fundamental than can be fixed with bits of plastic or gutters.

    Yes of course emergency egress is important, but architects can and should design structures which are safe for the occupants without requiring them to be wet, cold, or at risk of slipping or being blown away. 

    edited for spelling


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on April 12, 2013, 10:28:09
    This was the scene this evening with the wind blowing the rain onto the London side of the transfer deck.

    It was the turn of the country side this morning with impressive pools near the p8/9 and p10/11 escalators.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 12, 2013, 11:12:07
    Presumably pools of water near escalators would be deemed a safety hazard.

    Therefore, anyone who slipped and fell could probably sue Netwrokrail for providing an unsafe environment.

    I've always thought architecs shuld be made to use any building they design for sixmonths after construction. Would love the architect of Slough Bus station to wait for a bus every January night for an hour!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 12, 2013, 12:34:44
    On the subject of escalators I have seen a couple of people almost knocked off balance when stepping on the stairs while they were in eco-slow mode and then speeded up after detecting someone.  It is a particular problem if you are carrying bags in both hands and cannot hold onto the handrail.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Phil on April 12, 2013, 12:44:35
    I'm going to name my next band Wiggly Baffles. Great first post stuving, and welcome to the forum!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: devon_metro on April 12, 2013, 14:41:59
    On the subject of escalators I have seen a couple of people almost knocked off balance when stepping on the stairs while they were in eco-slow mode and then speeded up after detecting someone.  It is a particular problem if you are carrying bags in both hands and cannot hold onto the handrail.

    I recently travelled on a Spanish metro system where I can only assume they had 'eco' escalators. I often tended to not use them thinking they were broken!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 12, 2013, 18:10:09
    This has me confused.  Surely the only method for eco escalators is that they are still until a person steps within one metre (OK yard if you want) of them?  Then they do not cease moving until the arising human has arisen and thye are free of humans within one yard /metre of the bottom.  I cannot see how anyone would be jolted, once having got on board.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 12, 2013, 18:34:22
    They don't stop from what I saw, they run at a slower speed than normal, but then speed up as someone triggers a beam as they get on.  As far as I can see they either run at about half or full speed, it's not that easy to gauge by eye.

    But it's a fairly common feature nowadays, I'd be surprised if people haven't used them elsewhere without even noticing.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on April 12, 2013, 20:03:57
    They don't stop from what I saw, they run at a slower speed than normal, but then speed up as someone triggers a beam as they get on.  As far as I can see they either run at about half or full speed, it's not that easy to gauge by eye.

    But it's a fairly common feature nowadays, I'd be surprised if people haven't used them elsewhere without even noticing.

    Paul

    Yes, they run at reduced speed if unused for a few minutes. When a person steps on to the escalator it gradually ramps up to full speed and remains at full speed for a few minutes before slowing again, unless someone else gets on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 12, 2013, 20:16:21
    My system seems safer to me.  It may even save more energy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 12, 2013, 20:30:34
    No-one would approach the stopped escalator, they'd just assume it was broken down and go up the stairs.

    In fact you might be on to something here that will save more money...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 12, 2013, 20:32:44
    Stopping and starting escalators will likely use more energy than merely slowing them. The power draw of an electric motor is always highest when it starts up. There's also the wear and tear on the mechanism as well. Much better for longevity of parts to not have them constantly stopping and starting.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 12, 2013, 23:51:27
    Perhaps I don't get out enough - but it is the first time I have come across them.  Agreed it would be counter-proudtive stopping them rather than slowing them down; people would assume they were broken and it would not produce energy savings.  It was one of the escalators up from the southern gateline.  Perhaps it needs adjusting and speeds up a tad too quickly.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 13, 2013, 00:04:02
    I'm going to name my next band Wiggly Baffles.

    Do you need a bass player Phil? I dusted off my old one last month, re-strung it, fixed the pick-ups and started strumming again. Still very much page one, chapter one of learning to play it though. One of those purchases years ago that seemed like a good idea at the time. I can just about manage the bass progression at the end of 'The Chain' by Fleetwod Mac (aka BBC Formula 1 theme). :P ;) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 13, 2013, 00:14:45
    Do the pair of you need an agent?   ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 13, 2013, 12:54:27
    In view of the foregoing discussion the proposed FGWCS supergroup should be called:

    'Rain, Wind and Draught' (with apologies to Turner).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pbc2520 on April 13, 2013, 17:08:30
    In view of the foregoing discussion the proposed FGWCS supergroup should be called:

    'Rain, Wind and Draught'...

    I propose the debut single: 'Soggy Wonderland'.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: adc82140 on April 13, 2013, 23:07:19
    Picked up some friends from the North exit today- it really needs an arrivals board- no way of checking if their train was on time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 15, 2013, 13:00:52
    GTBE, thanks for your comments at replies #1620 and #1627.

    I too thought Stuving's opening post was very insightful and helpful.

    FWIW, I had my first experience of the Transfer Deck yesterday (Sun 14 April), thanks to the kindness of the gateline operators who were happy to indulge my request to "...just have a look around". And I have to say that I was underwhelmed, and also that all of my concerns about the signage, based on my just having seen the pics on Flickr, were confirmed when face-to-face with the reality. I witnessed people drifting around looking utterly puzzled, and then gravitating to the lift pods to try to gain some of understanding of where they were in this huge space and where they needed to go for their train. And interestingly, my companion, acting as a sort of "control group" in this experiment (ie she was coming to the subject absolutely fresh, having never been to Reading Station before and having never read any of the postings on here or seen any of the pics), found the Deck very disorienting and bewildering - and she's a very seasoned and confident solo traveller. One of her spontaneous comments was exactly what I'd said on here a week or so ago, ie that the lift pods need to have huge numerals on them to signpost the way to the relevant platforms, and also that the tops of the stairs/escalators themselves need to signal their platform numbers more clearly. She also added that the CIS screens need to be triple the size.

    I won't continue to bang on here about the Transfer Deck, whether about signage or weather ingress, but personally I really do think that NR need to make some improvements, and soon. I may be completely wrong, and I apologise to any of the involved professionals who may be reading this, but it just feels to me that the voices of the civil engineering and/or QS elements of the design team pre-dominated over those of the architects. In short, the Deck doesn't appear to have been designed to accommodate how people actually behave.

    I have to say that I'm a very reluctant nay-sayer about this, as I was as keen as everybody else on this site to be a cheer-leader for this massive and otherwise extremely impressive project, but I'm just so disappointed that what could have been an absolutely superb Deck has fallen short because of simply poor thinking. Of course, the Deck is an improvement on the narrow footbridge we had before, but surely if you're giving yourself a blank slate on which to work, as NR did here, then you get it absolutely right, first time - instead, I feel that we've ended up with something which falls far short of what could have been provided. And I'm not thinking in terms of absolutely world-class iconic architecture, which obviously comes at a price, I'm just thinking of something which functions properly.   

    EDIT: and I was absolutely astonished to see the mesh-screens, rather than glazing, in the clerestories! What was the thinking there?      


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 15, 2013, 15:39:16
    Good stuff Jeff, but what evidence do we have that anyone from NR reads your and others' postings?

    I have noted that at least one FGW employee reads the blog and I would have thought this company (along with XGC and perhaps SWT to an extent) would be more concerned, as it is their pax who are affected.

    The main complaint is signage and that can be fixed very quickly.  I imagine larger screens are not difficult to source, too.

    The clerestory problem is an NR one clearly, but there again, the pax have little knowledge and even less interest in who owns the thing.

    Perhaps you should forward your posting to NR or just post them with a request to read this thread, may I suggest? 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on April 15, 2013, 16:57:12
    I know from first hand experience that FGW senior management regularly visit this site!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 15, 2013, 18:09:05
    Here's a puzzle for you what are the black triangles on arms at right angles to the  track on the new platforms? More impotantly does anyone know why this design?

    Here's a clue Cross Country drivers don't know!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 15, 2013, 18:17:28
    Here's a puzzle for you what are the black triangles on arms at right angles to the track on the new platforms? More importantly does anyone know why this design?

    Here's a clue Cross Country drivers don't know!

    They are 2-5 car 'rear clear markers' for permissive working.  Effectively just the stop position for a 2-5 car unit if platform sharing and returning where they came from.

    It was discussed at length earlier in this thread (around post #1400, page 94) - my point then was that it made little or no sense to introduce a completely different sign for an otherwise familiar method of working, particularly for XC crews using split platforms at places like Southampton or New St...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 15, 2013, 20:10:42
    Good stuff Jeff, but what evidence do we have that anyone from NR reads your and others' postings?

    Perhaps you should forward your posting to NR or just post them with a request to read this thread, may I suggest? 

    Thanks SWR,

    Yes, I'd already been thinking that the best thing to do would be to direct our concerns to NR, as it's of no help to anyone if I/we just chunter on about them here, but I've been waiting to see whether there were any posters here who are in relevant positions at NR. I'll leave it for a few days to see if anybody picks it up; if not, I'll then call/email NR.

    Alternatively, perhaps the the senior managers at FGW that Oxman refers to may wish to comment and/or direct their NR colleagues' attention to it. If so, I'd direct them to start reading from either p.95 (paul7755's post #1420 about the confusing signage above the lifts at platform level) or my own post #1435 on p.96 (about the signage on the Deck). Thereafter they'll also see other posters' concerns and pics about weather ingress, buckets, slip-hazard signs etc.     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on April 15, 2013, 20:19:16
    Just want to add a quick note about signage.

    The station is far from finished, there is still a while to go until it's done, some of the signage is temporary. I am tolld that there is a review of the current signage on 17th April by the project team.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on April 15, 2013, 20:20:36
    I'm sure some of the senior managers who read this website would want to stay anonymous, for very understandable reasons. All we can do on the forum is comment on issues, hope that people in positions of influence read it, and that the points are noted.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 15, 2013, 20:36:18
    Thanks Ollie and John R,

    Both encouraging responses. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 15, 2013, 21:31:13
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 15, 2013, 21:50:27
    I too visited again for a second time on Saturday. Cleaners with mops in evidence mopping up the water..... but that we have noted before.....

    Couple of operational observations:

    CC train leaving platform 14b using cross over at country end to navigate to country relief. Train terminating at 13a is held at entrance to platform - it cannot enter until CC is out of section.

    Now I know in normal operation clearly standard practise is for a train to be prohibited from entering a section until train before has left , but given the A/B split platforms and presumably signalling on the new platform (platforms which are OK to have trains directly approaching each other from either ends!!) this seemed a very restrictive operation.

    Next - someone should tell the CC drivers about the A and B splitting!! And what the upside down white triangles mean!

    CC train (sorry - think it was for/from Southampton Central) was shown in P10B. But the 10A was showing the next Paddington fast - due 3 or 4 mins after the CC was due to depart.

    Perhaps not an ideal scenario - but now imagine what happened when the CC train pulled into the middle of the platform!

    Passengers at both ends joined the train. Station staff swamped by confused passengers as the train was half in and half out. So sad to see it was funny.

    Someone mentioned that the new Noth Entrance needs a Next Train departure board - so does the transfer deck. This was the question I saw being asked the most of staff located up on the deck.

    Hopefully these are all just teething problems. Now to solve the unweatherproof roof design.......


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 15, 2013, 22:00:35
    I know from first hand experience that FGW senior management regularly visit this site!

    I, too, can assure our readers that senior management at First Great Western do read this forum - as they find it very useful and informative.

    Whether they are able to act immediately on any concerns that we may raise here is of course another matter.  But, to be fair, they do at least take notice of them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on April 15, 2013, 22:15:52
    CC train leaving platform 14b using cross over at country end to navigate to country relief. Train terminating at 13a is held at entrance to platform - it cannot enter until CC is out of section.

    Now I know in normal operation clearly standard practise is for a train to be prohibited from entering a section until train before has left , but given the A/B split platforms and presumably signalling on the new platform (platforms which are OK to have trains directly approaching each other from either ends!!) this seemed a very restrictive operation.
    Where platform sharing is permitted trains cannot be routed into a platform if it is occupied and the route set from the other end of the platform. This was the result of an accident, but I can't recall which one.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: The SprinterMeister on April 15, 2013, 22:18:47
    Next - someone should tell the CC drivers about the A and B splitting!! And what the upside down white triangles mean!

    The AXC drivers will have had the same Gioconda route books, DVD box sets and NR 'Yellow Perils' as the FGW drivers who go through Reading so they should be well aware of the function / meaning of the 'Rear Clear' signs.

    I haven't been on the new platforms yet. We can only get onto platforms 7 - 10 from the Westbury line with HST's as things stand at the moment. Maybe tomorrow as Castle Cary - Cogload Jn is shut.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on April 15, 2013, 22:27:12
    CC train leaving platform 14b using cross over at country end to navigate to country relief. Train terminating at 13a is held at entrance to platform - it cannot enter until CC is out of section.

    Now I know in normal operation clearly standard practise is for a train to be prohibited from entering a section until train before has left , but given the A/B split platforms and presumably signalling on the new platform (platforms which are OK to have trains directly approaching each other from either ends!!) this seemed a very restrictive operation.
    Where platform sharing is permitted trains cannot be routed into a platform if it is occupied and the route set from the other end of the platform. This was the result of an accident, but I can't recall which one.
    Stafford 1990 I think, the driver could see the proceed aspect for the train in front, and accelerate into the rear of the train in front, one of my freinds was there!
    Think the original question relates to the use of P13 and 14, the 'overlap' of the country end starters goes accros the crossovers, so therefore blocks the passage of an approaching train from london direction, if a move is accross the crossovers. Hope that makes some sense.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on April 15, 2013, 22:40:53
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)

    Just for clarity, in case I have given a mistaken impression, I have no connection with the railway, except for 2 hours a day and ^5k a year that is.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 15, 2013, 22:43:54

     ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on April 16, 2013, 02:20:37
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)

    Just for clarity, in case I have given a mistaken impression, I have no connection with the railway, except for 2 hours a day and ^5k a year that is.

    I can't say the same :P

    If someone wants to drop us a message with concerns about signage then I can email it to one of the project managers who can take it into account on 17th when the signage review is done.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 16, 2013, 09:05:17
    CC train leaving platform 14b using cross over at country end to navigate to country relief. Train terminating at 13a is held at entrance to platform - it cannot enter until CC is out of section.

    Now I know in normal operation clearly standard practise is for a train to be prohibited from entering a section until train before has left , but given the A/B split platforms and presumably signalling on the new platform (platforms which are OK to have trains directly approaching each other from either ends!!) this seemed a very restrictive operation.
    Where platform sharing is permitted trains cannot be routed into a platform if it is occupied and the route set from the other end of the platform. This was the result of an accident, but I can't recall which one.
    Stafford 1990 I think, the driver could see the proceed aspect for the train in front, and accelerate into the rear of the train in front, one of my freinds was there!
    Think the original question relates to the use of P13 and 14, the 'overlap' of the country end starters goes accros the crossovers, so therefore blocks the passage of an approaching train from london direction, if a move is accross the crossovers. Hope that makes some sense.

    Yes - that was what I was trying to describe !

    It just seemed off that two trains approaching (under caution) from opposite ends of a platform is permitted.
    But a train entering from one end is held at the entrance to the platform, while a train leaving an adjacent platform, crossing onto the track of the first train (and past the end of platform signal I believe).

    (you will notice I am an amateur here - by the language I am using).

    Maybe it was a one off. Maybe there was something else going on that I could not see from the deck to cause the entering train to be held. Is was 'odd' behaviour - and that's why I noticed it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 16, 2013, 09:26:18
    On a similar note, what are the arrangements for splitting trains at the platform.

    I was going from Reading to Twyford last week and arrived on platform 9 about three minutes before my train was due to leave.  It was shown on the screens as being on platform 9A with an Oxford train on 9B.  The only train on the platform was a Turbo which was more at the 9B end - but confusingly it had its white marker lights switched on at the London end but the signal at the country end was off.

    It turns out it was TWO trains.  The train had come in from Paddington and then split - with one unit going on to Oxford and the other going back to London.

    Is there something in the operating instructions which prevents the trains moving more than a few feet apart after splitting? If the rear portion had proceeded back to the London end - the advertised 9A - the confusion would have been reduced.

    In this particular case the situation wasn't helped by the Turbo only showing "11" in its destination screen on the front - and throughout my journey to Twyford the internal displays claimed it was a Paddington to Oxford service!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 16, 2013, 11:02:25
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)

    Hear hear!  And some of the stories above re XC's and splitting trains and what I mentioned earlier about how Drivers get permission to pass the Rear Clear Boards after they have stopped all go to show that this platform sharing thing is a bit messy (apart from appearing to be non-compliant with Group Standard GK/RT 0044).

    I accept that S&TE and myself are perhaps the only two posters who are concerned about all this. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 16, 2013, 11:12:47
    Quote
    If someone wants to drop us a message with concerns about signage then I can email it to one of the project managers who can take it into account on 17th when the signage review is done.

    Ollie,

    That's an excellent offer, thanks very much - I hope FGW formally acknowledge and appreciate how well you represent them on here, as that would reflect as well on them as it does on you. 

    I'll bash something together today - it'll largely be a bulletised cut'n'paste of the signage-related concerns from here but it should be enough to contribute something useful into your colleagues' thinking tomorrow. Do let us know if there's likely to be an opportunity to feed in any other themed thoughts/concerns about RSAR at any other point.  


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 16, 2013, 12:41:27
    On a similar note, what are the arrangements for splitting trains at the platform.

    Is there something in the operating instructions which prevents the trains moving more than a few feet apart after splitting? If the rear portion had proceeded back to the London end - the advertised 9A - the confusion would have been reduced.

    If the front part of the train is not returning back in the direction it came it will go through to the stop car mark at the far end of the platform.  When uncoupling a Turbo, then operating instructions state the maximum distance to be moved is three feet.  That is to avoid any risks of the train hitting anything else (very unlikely) or unintentionally passing a red signal (more likely - especially with the old layout at Reading).  There would be nothing stopping the driver closing the doors, changing ends and contacting the signaller for permission to move to the other end of the platform, but that is not usually worth doing as it's a fair bit of faffing about.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 16, 2013, 13:06:31
    This thread has now become the most contributed to on the forum. It overtook the Cotswold Line redoubling 2008-2011 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=3602.0) thread on 11/04/2013 with the 1624th post (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg130548#msg130548). Rather nicely, that entry was an impressive first post from stuving.  :)

    Keep up the good work, folks.  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 16, 2013, 15:20:30
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)
    I accept that S&TE and myself are perhaps the only two posters who are concerned about all this. 

    I also share your concerns. Here we have a "Signal?!" with one aspect that can either be passed if you are long train or stopped at if you are a short train.

    They seem to go against all the best railway railway practice which up to now has required both  positive STOP and Proceed aspects. Even permissive stop boards have a positive STOP and something like "Do not proceed without signalman's permission". Ok I know it should be signaller!

    Although I understand that a Temple Meads there are black crossess but there the driver is told whether to run by or stop as the platforms have different numbers.

    I think that they should be positive 3 aspect signals Red Stop, Yellow proceed to end of platform stop at next signal, Green for non stops/Freights. But I suppose that would cost too much.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 16, 2013, 15:48:26
    Ollie,

    I've just emailed you a note about the signage concerns but got an auto-message back saying that your mailbox was full - and it was only a 354kb pdf, honest! Clear down your box and I'll se-send. I've also tried to post it here as an attachment but at 354kb it's above the 256kb size-limit.

    Jeff


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: The SprinterMeister on April 16, 2013, 16:21:30
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)

    Hear hear!  And some of the stories above re XC's and splitting trains and what I mentioned earlier about how Drivers get permission to pass the Rear Clear Boards after they have stopped all go to show that this platform sharing thing is a bit messy (apart from appearing to be non-compliant with Group Standard GK/RT 0044).

    I accept that S&TE and myself are perhaps the only two posters who are concerned about all this. 

    Those 'Rear Clear' signs are going in at various places. There are some for the reversing move at Tilehurst and there are some at Bradford Jn for reversing HST's when Box Tunnel is shut.

    Having read the documents, seen the DVD's etc I understand the meaning of the 'Rear Clear' markers. But then I was bought up with the platform crosses at Bristol TM which are also effectively 'non compliant / non standard' signage as they are only used at the one station. Disobeying the platform crosses was treated as a SPAD in those days.

    Was at Reading for one and a half hours today and all the trains I saw including XC services appeared to be managing to stop in the right places without problem.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Ollie on April 16, 2013, 17:37:24
    Ollie,

    I've just emailed you a note about the signage concerns but got an auto-message back saying that your mailbox was full - and it was only a 354kb pdf, honest! Clear down your box and I'll se-send. I've also tried to post it here as an attachment but at 354kb it's above the 256kb size-limit.

    Jeff

    Sorry Jeff, my fault, my profile on here has an email address I don't check anymore.

    You can send it to ollie@fgwollie.com :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 16, 2013, 18:01:11
    Thanks Ollie. Done.

    Jeff


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 16, 2013, 18:40:52
    Hi Ollie/John R,  Perhaps you could point out to them as well the non-compliant mid-platform (rear clear) signs as well (see my post No.1404 on Page 94 of this thread) ::)

    Hear hear!  And some of the stories above re XC's and splitting trains and what I mentioned earlier about how Drivers get permission to pass the Rear Clear Boards after they have stopped all go to show that this platform sharing thing is a bit messy (apart from appearing to be non-compliant with Group Standard GK/RT 0044).

    I accept that S&TE and myself are perhaps the only two posters who are concerned about all this. 

    Those 'Rear Clear' signs are going in at various places. There are some for the reversing move at Tilehurst and there are some at Bradford Jn for reversing HST's when Box Tunnel is shut.

    Having read the documents, seen the DVD's etc I understand the meaning of the 'Rear Clear' markers. But then I was bought up with the platform crosses at Bristol TM which are also effectively 'non compliant / non standard' signage as they are only used at the one station. Disobeying the platform crosses was treated as a SPAD in those days.

    Was at Reading for one and a half hours today and all the trains I saw including XC services appeared to be managing to stop in the right places without problem.

    I note your comment about the signs going in elsewhere (e.g. Tilehurst).  I would suspect that those sites do not have platform sharing so the Rear Clear sign is the correct one there.  It is not intended for places where the Platforms can be shared (hence my original post showing the Snow Hill example which does it correctly).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 17, 2013, 08:34:33
    You look for 1 triangle ... And then 4 appear at once.

    From country end P3 at TLH


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 17, 2013, 09:37:49
    Totally confusing. Especialy with the signal in the middle!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 17, 2013, 10:21:29
    Totally confusing. Especialy with the signal in the middle!

    Confusing to who exactly?  That signal is not directly affected by these signs, they are to signify being clear of the wrong direction starter signal at the London end of the platform, and drivers will be well aware of their purpose.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 17, 2013, 10:29:28
    Too many signs. Also if they are to be stop markers for trains turning back on the Down Relief at Tilehurst I would suggest that it would be better to resite the signal to the  further marker and hold it red for a tain turning back. Then no confusion the driver stops at the signal.

    Also if longer train approaches Tilehurst ready to turnback and the signal is red where do they stop? Then do they have to wait for the signal to clear draw forward and then reverse?

    KISS Keep It Simple S...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 17, 2013, 11:07:13
    But if you moved that signal (at significant expense), and ran trains right up to it, wouldn't they now be in the wrong position for the next move back to the east?  The point of the different markers is to put the now leading cab at the right place for the up direction signal, with the cab ideally placed for signal sighting, so even if the signal was moved beyond the furthest marker (10 car I assume) would they still want the rear clear signals anyway?

    Seems to me that if they'd simply used ground level 'car stop markers', (like there are alongside the up lines leaving Fareham towards Eastleigh and Southampton for reversing trains back towards the south) no mention would be made.  It's both the visibility and the newness of these signs that is causing concern perhaps?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 17, 2013, 11:50:51
    The 5-car rear clear board is a bit unnecessary, given that Tilehurst platforms already have a 6-car stop board for normal trains stopping at the station which is obviously clear of the reversing signal anyway.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 17, 2013, 17:39:06
    ...crikey.  The standards on signal sighting state that there should be no distraction at the target signal :o  I don't really understand how all of this is getting past the Signal Sighting Committee (EDIT: or come to think of it the Testing Staff).  On projects I'm currently working on if something like this was proposed you would be laughed (or more likely kicked) out of the room :P ::) ;)  The arrangement shown at Tilehurst is positively encouraging a driver to misread and potentially SPAD the signal.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on April 17, 2013, 17:48:12
    Well said S&T, signals should be well sighted and give unambiguous indications.

    A one aspect signal doesn't work unless it's an absolute stop or a fixed distant.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on April 17, 2013, 20:31:31
    On the subject of rear clear boards... whilst they may be a new phenomena to many readers here, this isn't the first instance of them on the network. They have previously existed in the Old Oak Common area to assist with shunting movements. If you look out of the window whilst passing the area you might just make them out.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 17, 2013, 21:22:09
    My first visit to Reading since before Easter.

    Cannot comment on how cold or wet the deck was because the weather was neither cold nor wet. It was however very spacious.

    Arrived on P10 - very interested that all the levels are different between P11 and P10 and there are some temporary ramps. Also the platform faces on P8/9 seem to be temporary surfacing with some levels to be changed.

    Hoardings round stair to old link bridge make accessing P4/5/6 quite cramped. A lone FGW staff member was trying to encourage people of an arrival at P5 to use the new gateline rather than queue to get trough to the old one but he might as well have been talking to himself no one listened.

    Looking at the layout to the East of P 9/10, the turnout for P11 is in place as is the crossover from the Down Main to P10, but the other crossover cannot be installed until the P10 road is realigned. See plan previously posted.


    (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8443/7999398770_a92eaa5833_b.jpg)





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 17, 2013, 22:10:15
    Does anyone know when the remaining escalators and lift leading up to the old bridge are scheduled to  be removed?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 18, 2013, 00:28:02

    Arrived on P10 - very interested that all the levels are different between P11 and P10 and there are some temporary ramps. Also the platform faces on P8/9 seem to be temporary surfacing with some levels to be changed.

    The P10 side is still the pre-fabricated temporary platform built out over the original track, it remains in use until August bank holiday weekend as it is now.

    As far as I recall most of the new parts of P8/9 were behind the hoarding lines over the last year or so, again I don't think the finishing work to the platform edge areas is imminent, and it will be done in phases later.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 20, 2013, 00:37:32
    For those of you that are interested, here's a link to a 'view from the cab' video of the revised layout from Scours Lane to Kennet Bridge Loop, via Reading's new Platform 14.  It's available in 720p HD if you hover over the footage and click the 'quality' tab and then click the 'full screen' icon. 

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xz5ew8_cab-ride-of-new-interim-layout-at-reading-from-scours-lane-to-kennet-bridge-loop_travel#.UXHU9sqp-wM (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xz5ew8_cab-ride-of-new-interim-layout-at-reading-from-scours-lane-to-kennet-bridge-loop_travel#.UXHU9sqp-wM)

    A somewhat leisurely run due to signal checks, but at least that gives you ample time to appreciate the revised track and signalling.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 20, 2013, 00:49:42
    Thanks as ever II for another interesting insight.  It certainly shows why the drivers have been taking it "steady as she goes" since the new routes came in.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 20, 2013, 14:45:32
    Thank you, one and several, for your kind words. I have been trying to catch up on previous postings, but obviously the sheer number of them makes that a daunting piece of homework. So please forgive the inevitable repetition of things already raised or dealt with.

    I have also been looking at the planning application to RBC (11/01885/FUL ) that Jeff cited earlier, which also contains far too much stuff to review thoroughly. It gives an detailed view of what was expected to be the design at that stage, and one of the few big differences from "as built" is the glazing.

    In fact, their are several related RBC planning applications with a lot of similar documents in them:
    09/01003/REG3; June 2009; application from RBC dealing with their responsibilities
    10/01269/FUL; July 2010; main application for station from NR
    11/01885/FUL; December 2011 ; main application for the rail viaducts and bridges, revisions to some other documents including the latest (?) version of the D&AS (but marked June 2010)
    12/00577/FUL; April 2012; minor revision of frontage
    other (entries /LBC are for listed building consent)

    However, we must be careful about the status of this (the Design & Access Statement). Network rail's application letter (listed as "supporting letter", file 00261496.pdf) states plainly but politely that railways can do pretty much what they like without planning permission. While Network rail need to get the local authority's approval for the design of bridges, and the planners can ask for some other things to be reconsidered, there are not really any grounds for refusing planning approval, except:
    "(a) the development (other than the provision of or works carried out to a dam) ought to be and could reasonably be carried out elsewhere on the land; or
    (b) the design or external appearance of any building, bridge, aqueduct, pier or dam would injure the amenity of the neighbourhood and is reasonably capable of modification to avoid such injury."

    Of course RBC is contributing, notably to change the roads around the station, which gives them some leverage - but that should not come via the planning department (it's meant to be independent of the rest of the authority). In practice the whole process involves much more cooperation that the legal minimum, and the documents submitted are much more complete than required by planning law. The D&AS only needs to deal with access outside the station, and its overall design to assess if is "injurious". All the stuff about internal circulation and other design details does not bind NR in any way. The design presented is  pretty much the one we have got, even if some details - notably the glazing - have been altered later. This may have been a design change, or perhaps the detail in this area was not meant to be fully designed until later.

    Whoever did the pictures clearly did expect full glazing of the deck and stairways. The 2010 D&AS (pp 184-186) describes in the text full-height glazing of the deck and light and ventilation via the clerestories, though only glazed openings are pictured. The glazed screens down the stairways are nearly full height, described as enough to prevent diesel fumes being conducted into the deck. That's interesting in the context of fire safety as the main fire risk is trains, and smoke and fumes would also be guided to some extent into the deck by the canopies alone. In the discussion of the choice of the sweeping canopies (p 127), clerestories are shown as glazed to the North and louvred to the South. This is also shown in cross-sections in the latest (2012) amendment applications (at least in some clerestories), and here the glazing of the South wall of the deck is not full height.

    Now the original version looks to me like a reasonable arrangement, especially if the louvres can be closed, and I would rather see even more of the glazing movable. The lack of any mention of control of ventilation openings does suggest that it's aiming to be fully passive. That could explain the subsequent removal of a lot of the glazing - if you try to keep the temperature down on a calm day passively that's what you would get. Unfortunately this passive thermal design idea is being stretched well past its logical limits. Surely controlled ventilation openings, even if motor driven, are so close to being passive they should not be lumped together with full HVAC. Try saying "it is possible to provide a comfortable internal environment, in all conditions of wind, sun,  and temperature, passively using only fixed glazing and permanent openings" and see if you are convinced. I think it's self-evident rubbish.

    Incidentally, the new footbridge for Wokingham (which I guess is a standard Access for All design) is shown in its planning application as fully glazed, though with windows that can be opened.

    A couple of other things I spotted in these documents:
    The name of the inflated plastic bag roofing used in the skylights (access stairways, and on platform 8/9). If you look at the North side of a skylight from the right angle, you can see the inflation pipes. They are ETFE foil cushions, as used in the Eden project, and I gather the new Newport station too - how successful has that been?.

    All of the passenger flow modelling assumes platforms 12-15 are well to the West of their as-built position, almost symmetrical about the deck. The deck being well off-centre means the A/B labelling as used now is not always helpful for passengers. Platforms 7-11 were assumed to be almost as pre-existing, though I think some are to be shortened. I can't find any explanation of this change, nor even a scale diagram showing the full length of the platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Sabre999uk on April 20, 2013, 15:04:45
    Thanks to II for the video from 2nd April, how do I know this? I'm in it along with my Nan & 9 year old nephew at the end of platform 13  ;D I'm the one wearing the beige coat.

    Steve

    Edited to correct platform number


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: GBM on April 20, 2013, 16:59:48
    Also my thanks to II for the great video.  Us rubber wheeled folk don't get to see such good views... (unless you're on a 300 run, of course)  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 21, 2013, 10:55:02
    Incidentally, the new footbridge for Wokingham (which I guess is a standard Access for All design) is shown in its planning application as fully glazed, though with windows that can be opened.

    If there is such a thing as a standard 'access for all' footbridge, there are a large number that are not fully glazed, eg Bracknell, Fareham, Fratton.  They seem to have varying combinations of glass, wire mesh or 'nothing', I don't think there is a hard and fast rule at all, in fact Fareham's bridge is quite wet internally when wind and rain are in the right direction.

    Quote
    All of the passenger flow modelling assumes platforms 12-15 are well to the West of their as-built position, almost symmetrical about the deck. The deck being well off-centre means the A/B labelling as used now is not always helpful for passengers. Platforms 7-11 were assumed to be almost as pre-existing, though I think some are to be shortened. I can't find any explanation of this change, nor even a scale diagram showing the full length of the platforms.

    There are a number of drawings of the platform layout around, which as far as I can see show platforms 12 - 15 roughly as built, but with the 'operational centres' now visibly marked by the pairs of rear clear markers, AWS magnets, and the axle counter heads, I'd suggest the notional midpoint is just under the London side of the 30m wide transfer deck.  So all in all, the mid point is only about 10-15m further towards London than if the platforms were exactly balanced.  So less than a coach length.   (Small point but the operational mid point may not be the physical mid point.)

    I'd assume the P12/15 platform layout was constrained (for East/West position) by how wide they could make the approaches on either side - as we know both Caversham Rd and Vastern Rd bridges were widened to the north to allow for points and crossings etc.  Perhaps the limits were defined by the fire station and the BMW dealership.   Then as discussed in the DAS, the transfer bridge was located to allow sufficient space for escalator and gateline run-off areas at either side.  Another factor I just thought of might have been keeping the foundations for the bridge piers, and the various lift and escalator 'sumps' clear of the subway and existing plant rooms under the platforms?

    In the case of the existing platforms 7-11, we don't really know yet how much of the London end will be 'shortened'.  The P8 and P10 current operational lengths are definitely not in their eventual positions, and all the drawings I've seen show the western ends 'squared off' just beyond the ends of P12-15; ie with P8 extending west as far as current P9, and P10 as far west as currently unopened P11.  It is not clear how much of the London end of the existing structures will be physically removed, but the length beyond the signal gantry will presumably not actually be used. In the case of P7, I think it will be roughly balanced either side of the transfer deck anyway.

    (There are full platform layouts which show the east end of P8-11 over two pages in section 8.3 and 8.4 of the 2010 DAS - most of the individual drawings, such as that attached below, cut off the east end.)

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on April 21, 2013, 19:23:39
    Thanks II - an excellent insight. Nice to see so many gantries in place already.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 21, 2013, 19:37:59
    Indeed, my thanks as well, IndustryInsider. ;)  It's almost as if you had access to the inside ...  :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 22, 2013, 08:19:47
    Over the weekend all the remaining old main track from Scours Lane to Reading West has been lifted.

    Trying to get a view of the order of the works for the new viaduct is pretty difficult.
    The old sidings by the old depot have some pretty large earth works - with a large Yellow Box construction doing something.

    At this point in time it looks like the viaduct will be built first - for the new mains - and then the dive unders will appear later. If not then the current displaced mains are going to have to be moved again - and I think they are sited precisely where the dive unders start/end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 22, 2013, 10:17:25
    The intended sequence is in the Planning Staement within the documentation at 11/01885/FUL on RBC's planning website.

    Quote
    Main Line & Festival Line
    It is envisaged that the Main Line viaduct works will be divided into three sections, with a west to east flow of works:
    West section ^ Wigmore Lane to Reading West Curve;
    Central section ^ Reading West Curve to East Chord ^Box^ (this includes the Festival Line viaduct and approach ramp);
    East section ^ East Chord ^Box^ to end of East Ramp.
    The Wigmore Lane to East Chord ^Box^ sections of the works can commence once the existing Main and Relief lines have been slewed to the north. The remainder (East Chord ^Box^ to end of East Ramp) requires the existing depot to be decommissioned. The staging programme expects the track works to overlap the viaduct works.
    Works at the Reading West Curve will need to be coordinated with slewing of the West Curve tracks, which may necessitate advance/early construction of parts of the West Curve ^Box^. Additional possessions for works close to the West Curve will be required.
    A linear progression of the works is anticipated; the proposed form of construction permits construction to progress at and from several ^fronts^, although this will be subject to access constraints, e.g. Loverock Road, for which significant highway traffic management will be required.

    East Chord
    The new East Chord is currently envisaged being in 3 stages:
    Stage 1 ^ Oxford Road Junction to the existing depot site, which is across the west side of the ^Upper Triangle^, the North Slope and the west end of the ^pond^;
    Stage 2 ^ The depot site to the viaduct;
    Stage 3 ^ The tie in with the viaduct (i.e. works to the north of the Main Line).
    The current Time/Chainage Programme indicates Stages 1 and 2 commencing once the depot area is decommissioned. But stage 1 and works adjacent and across the west end of the ^pond^ are able to commence earlier as long as east/west access for the depot adjacent to the north of the ^pond^ is maintained. Earlier construction of this stage of the East Chord has benefits for the settlement related design aspects of the embankment.

    Previous discussions I've had at the various public displays by NR have always indicated that the up and down mains will effectively only be moved again once, onto the new viaduct.  The east curve (freight to reliefs) is the last to be completed in NR's latest CP4 enhancement milestones, which show the viaduct and everything at Reading West complete Dec 2014, and the eastern 'freight' curve by April 2015.

    This section mentions the physical position of the new route over the viaduct, implying that the viaduct is further south than the old main lines:
    Quote
    From the western tie-in the route also slews to a new alignment along and over the side slopes of the south side of the current embankment and up to the railway boundary. When the route reaches the ^triangle^ area the slew is up to 10m (including the slew of temporary Main Line lines to the north), which allows much of the structure to be constructed with minimal requirements for abnormal possessions (the closure of the railway). Possessions will be required at tie-ins and when building across the RWC junction.

    Although often termed 'diveunders' in discussion, they aren't really - the West and East Curves pass through concrete boxes which when built allow the tracks to remain broadly at present ground level, and from what I can see from the drawings the west box will be built in the triangular site between Reading West Curve and the temporary main lines, with the West Curve tracks being moved into it later.

    The equivalent east end box is not currently part of a rail route so its impact on existing tracks during build should be much less.

    Paul





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 22, 2013, 10:49:09
    Looking out to the West from the station, there's the first part of some points leading off to the left from the track from platform 12, before it joins with platform 13. It's not for the feeder line - that's already there further out. It's on the Easter 2013 plan (page 55), in grey and leading nowhere. but not on any plan of the final layout I have seen.

    Where will it go? The only possibility seems to be a crossover to platform 11, presumably before that splits or joins any other track. I can see that's a low-conflict way of "borrowing" a spare relief platform when there's a queue on the up main, and Voyagers turning in 10 and 8. In fact, wouldn't it have been useful to have that from Easter?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 22, 2013, 17:32:40
    Over the weekend all the remaining old main track from Scours Lane to Reading West has been lifted.

    Yes you can see that (or rather can't see that ::)) on Camera 4, Tab 1.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 22, 2013, 17:38:27
    Looking out to the West from the station, there's the first part of some points leading off to the left from the track from platform 12, before it joins with platform 13. It's not for the feeder line - that's already there further out. It's on the Easter 2013 plan (page 55), in grey and leading nowhere. but not on any plan of the final layout I have seen.

    Where will it go? The only possibility seems to be a crossover to platform 11, presumably before that splits or joins any other track. I can see that's a low-conflict way of "borrowing" a spare relief platform when there's a queue on the up main, and Voyagers turning in 10 and 8. In fact, wouldn't it have been useful to have that from Easter?

    That connection will be to the bi-directional 'Up Reading Feeder Main' which will link Oxford Road Junction to Platforms 10, 11 and 12 via under the new Mains Flyover.

    The principle running lines to the West of the station will be (North to South):
    Up Reading Passenger Loop
    Up Relief #
    Down Relief #
    Down Reading Feeder Relief
    Up Reading Feeder Main
    Up Main #
    Down Main
    Down Reading Festival Line

    All lines bi-directional except those marked #


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on April 22, 2013, 19:48:01
    I'm very impressed by the ambition and scale of what's to be done West of the station, and actually the scale of that has only just struck me with a re-read of the Planning appn and its component plans and elevations. Long-standing and/or technically-qualified posters on here may be very familiar with what's proposed/underway, but for those of you who aren't (like me) I've just posted on the Flickr Reading re-modelling thread the Planning document which shows a plan view of all of the upcoming viaducts, bridges, dive-unders etc, which includes abstracts showing fairly crudely-rendered perspective views of all of them. [Apologies: I can't post the link here because, for some reason, my browser has recently decided to stop letting me copy links].

    Again, you may have already had this discussion here (and apologies if so), but recent new-joiners may be interested to know that:

    • There is to be a main viaduct 1.8km long, and 9m high at its highest (over Cow Lane)...
    • ...and also a viaduct on the new Festival line which, I think, goes under the main viaduct


    Spectacular stuff.

    I'm sure that if I haven't got this right someone will put me straight.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 22, 2013, 21:32:17
    Sorry if this sounds dumb, but what is the new 'festival' line and why is it named so?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 22, 2013, 21:40:31
    Sorry if this sounds dumb, but what is the new 'festival' line and why is it named so?

    Not a dumb question at all.......

    The line concerned will start at the West End of Reading station Platform 7 pass along the south side of the new Down Main line, pass over the Reading Connecting Lines to Oxford Road Junction and then pass under the Up and Down Main line viaduct and connect with the Relief lines opposite the new Reading Depot.  It gets its name from the Reading Festival which is held every (?) year in the field just north of there (see Lobstervision Camera 4, Tab 4 for a view: http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading04# )

    Its main purpose will be to get XC services from the relief side at the Didcot end to Platform 3, 7 or 8 and then to the Basingstoke lines and vice-versa without a flat crossing conflict with the Up and Down Main lines (shame about the flat crossing conflict at Southcote Junction though).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 22, 2013, 22:07:38
    Thanks S&T, makes sense now...

    But would it not be possible for southbound XC trains to stay on the reliefs, use platforms 12-15, and then access the Southampton line via the new underpass under the mainline viaduct, and vice versa?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on April 22, 2013, 22:11:32
    Its main purpose will be to get XC services from the relief side at the Didcot end to Platform 3, 7 or 8 and then to the Basingstoke lines and vice-versa without a flat crossing conflict with the Up and Down Main lines (shame about the flat crossing conflict at Southcote Junction though).

    Can only fix 100 problems at once, the hundred and first gets a bit more challenging  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 22, 2013, 22:22:46
    Its main purpose will be to get XC services from the relief side at the Didcot end to Platform 3, 7 or 8 and then to the Basingstoke lines and vice-versa without a flat crossing conflict with the Up and Down Main lines (shame about the flat crossing conflict at Southcote Junction though).

    Can only fix 100 problems at once, the hundred and first gets a bit more challenging  ;D
    .......102 because I forgot the flat crossing at Oxford Road Junction as well ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 22, 2013, 22:25:42
    Thanks S&T, makes sense now...

    But would it not be possible for southbound XC trains to stay on the reliefs, use platforms 12-15, and then access the Southampton line via the new underpass under the mainline viaduct, and vice versa?

    Yes.  Using the Down Reading Feeder Relief I mentioned above.  However, I believe that most XC through trains will use Platform 3 or 7.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 23, 2013, 09:53:44
    Thanks S&T, makes sense now...

    But would it not be possible for southbound XC trains to stay on the reliefs, use platforms 12-15, and then access the Southampton line via the new underpass under the mainline viaduct, and vice versa?

    Yes.  Using the Down Reading Feeder Relief I mentioned above.  However, I believe that most XC through trains will use Platform 3 or 7.

    We discussed a while back the merits or otherwise of XC's using the ML's rather than RL's between Reading and Didoct East Junction.  Whilst using ML's creates a conflict at Didcot East as Louise pointed out a while back (flat junction, problem 103), it should be remembered that XC's are 125 mph and putting them on the RL's would take up paths that may be needed for stoppers and freights.  The number of paths on the RL's would be significantly reduced if they had to accommodate 2 X 125mph paths (or whatever the line speed is to be raised to) each way every hour.

    So I think that is why the XC's will mostly use P3 and P7 as S&TE says.

    edited for spelling error
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 23, 2013, 19:03:52
    The future layout allows for almost maximum flexibility for XC.  From what I was able to work out last time this was discussed, the only platform XC cannot easily use for through services in the final layout is P9.  So in the event of any perturbations to the normal timetable they can go just about anywhere.

    However I was also told a couple of weeks back (by someone I met at Reading involved in timetable planning) that the XC terminating trains may well stick with P13/14 in the final layout.

    Talking of XC, their upcoming summer timetable has a footnote explaining that through services are calling at Reading West vice Reading on all Saturdays between 14th Sept and 19th October, and on Sundays between 15th September to 1st December.  IIRC from the EAS the dates correspond to 'remodelling Westbury Line Jn'.  Presumably much of that is also to do with removing all that redundant S&C just west of P7 and P8?

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 23, 2013, 23:04:33
    However I was also told a couple of weeks back (by someone I met at Reading involved in timetable planning) that the XC terminating trains may well stick with P13/14 in the final layout.

    If that becomes the reality then that's a very huge waste of the capacity built into the new layout  :P :(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 24, 2013, 12:18:52
    Noticed that some of the hoardings are being removed opposite the main (old) station entrance. The vehicle entrance to the portakabin offices to be specific.  Might this be a sign that FGW staff are relocating into their new offices at the northern entrance?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 24, 2013, 15:29:06
    Does it not mean also a much longer hike for the majority of pax?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 24, 2013, 16:02:29
    Does it not mean also a much longer hike for the majority of pax?

    Not sure what you are getting at here...

    Edited.

    Have now realised you are referring to my post #1708 yesterday rather than post #1710 today...

    Well yes it is further from P14, to P3 or P7.  However that assumes a 'majority' of pax off XC are changing to those routes you mention, but what if they are wanting stoppers towards Ealing Broadway, or the exit towards Caversham?  I don't think it's as black and white as you suggest.

    In any case surely it wasn't a lot different prior to the rebuild starting, when most XC Newcastle/Reading terminating trains sat in the old P7.  Is it really the case that platforming is designed around connections, or is it designed around removing pathing conflicts in the approaches?  Perhaps neither takes priority, I don't know really.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 24, 2013, 18:52:14
    I wrote 'pax' not 'staff'. 

    I meant that the majority of alighting pax don't want to go to platform 14.  They want to go to Newbury or Sunningdale (or The Butts in Reading even  :D  ).

    So either the exit or connecting platforms are a long way away.  (If my contention about where people want to go is incorrect, of course my argument falls down - I just thought a southern platform would be more convenient for most pax).

    Who cares how far the staff have to walk?   ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on April 24, 2013, 19:57:56
    Noticed that some of the hoardings are being removed opposite the main (old) station entrance. The vehicle entrance to the portakabin offices to be specific.  Might this be a sign that FGW staff are relocating into their new offices at the northern entrance?

    Looks to me more like the blue site offices are being moved that the grey ones.  The blue ones are those that are in the way of Reading BC works on the steps.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 24, 2013, 20:59:37
    Deleted. Confused by crossed posts earlier.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 24, 2013, 21:09:40
    Sounds like SWRural has himself taken a slight passenger detour into the 3 G's... ;)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: swrural on April 24, 2013, 22:44:30
    Sounds like SWRural has himself taken a slight passenger detour into the 3 G's... ;)



    Don't get it.  Perhaps tell me via pm, realise I can be thick, perhaps to do with that deleted post?

    Many thanks Jonty.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on April 24, 2013, 23:49:43
    Hi SWRural - sorry, like Paul I thought your comment about the pax having to take a longer  route round was in response to his posting about the temporary buildings being removed outside the 3 G's...

    Whereas you were responding to an earlier posting about where trains were being platformed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 25, 2013, 09:34:54
    Topic : Platform levels.

    Standing at Reading yesterday I was struck by the variations in platform levels - I presume there are 'Standards' that need to be applied - and Law (Disability Access etc.)

    All the new platforms are look 6 to 8 inches higher that the old platforms.
    P10 is lower than P11, and you descend a (temporary?) ramp to descend to the P10 level.

    P8 and P9 are lower than the new platforms - although they look level with the bottom of the escalators - which seems odd if they are to be raised to Standard height.

    And finally, P7 is lower - perhaps it will be built to new height when pushed outwards - but the 'flow' into the other spaces - including the new Southern Entrance - would require a ramp down !



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 25, 2013, 10:46:34
    All the new platforms are look 6 to 8 inches higher that the old platforms.
    P10 is lower than P11, and you descend a (temporary?) ramp to descend to the P10 level.

    P10 is a portable, pre-fabricated and temporary surface, unchanged from when it was first fitted prior to the demolition starting.  So of course the ramps are temporary - if you look beyond the present country end barrier you can see that there is a part built platform face that is already higher than the temporary level.

    In the case of the other original through platforms I'd be tempted to wait and see how they end up.  P8/9 for instance is possibly wide enough to have slight rising gradients towards the platform edge.  P7 might end up with the track lowered once on its new alignment, as the current P7 track is probably canted slightly to reflect that it was the down main?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 25, 2013, 10:54:25
    Topic : Platform levels.
    All the new platforms are look 6 to 8 inches higher that the old platforms.
    There are some cross-sections in the last set of planning documents (12/00577/FUL) that show, at a rather small scale, that platforms 10-15 are all level with each other and with "South grade". Platforms 7-9 are shown at the same level just at the Western edge of the transfer deck, but lower to both sides, unevenly. The track follows its platform. My inference is that the new platforms and 10/11, (which is being substantially rebuilt) are being built level, while the others are just being adjusted for cross-level but not for along-track profile. there is also a new platform standard height in GI/GN7616 (i.e. for new platforms, not a new height) of 915 mm + 0 / - 25 mm, so presumably the tracks will be relaid to meet that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: basset44 on April 26, 2013, 08:26:42
    Hi All,

    I do hope this is not a sign of things to come at Reading

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-22294831


    Basset


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 26, 2013, 09:00:48
    Could I just ask at this point if you do post a link from a newspaper or other source you quote at least part of the article or explain the context of it?  Firstly it makes the flow of the thread easier to follow and secondly external links die - at which point the meaning of your post is lost.  I realise it is not always possible to quote if you are posting from a handheld device but where possible please try.

    In that vain, here is the article referenced above.

    Quote

    (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/48902000/jpg/_48902083_newstation.jpg)

    Newport's railway station was revamped in time for the 2010 Ryder Cup

    A railway station's futuristic roof is being repaired for leaks less than three years after it opened following a ^22m revamp.

    Newport's new station opened in September 2010 ahead of the Ryder Cup golf tournament at nearby Celtic Manor.

    But this month passengers reported dodging puddles on walkways.

    Network Rail said "interface issues" with the roof's construction material were being addressed and contractors said two leaks were remaining.

    The new roof is comprised of 31 air-filled cushions, made from the polymer ethylene tetrafluoroethylene, which give a "bubble-wrap" effect.

    The cushions are created using two layers of film measuring around two to three strands of hair in thickness.

    The panels for the Eden Project in Cornwall are also made of the material.

    Councillor Matthew Evans who was the leader of Newport council when the station revamp was unveiled has described the leaks as "embarrassing".

    Mr Evans said: "You will have snagging problems with any new building but when you've still got problems three years later it doesn't exactly fill you with confidence.

    "I don't have anything against the design - I called it thought-provoking at the time - but it needs to be practical.

    "The roof has had problems for some considerable time. It is embarrassing."

    'Materials used'
     
    When it was unveiled, Network Rail called it a distinctive station "that is cost-effective to build and maintain, eco-friendly and fit for the 21st Century and beyond".

    A Network Rail spokesman said: "We still have verification works to complete before we are happy that the roof is leak free.

    "The station represented a ^20m investment when it was redeveloped in 2009.

    "The station reopened in time for the 2010 Ryder Cup golf competition in Wales.

    "Since then, we became aware of interface issues between some of the materials used in its construction.

    "We agreed a remediation plan with our contractor and we are delighted that the works are now complete."

    A spokesman for contractors Galliford Try said: "We have rectified the readily accessible leaks identified in the roof with the exception of two which require possession of the line.

    "We will attend to these at the first opportunity."

    Arriva Trains Wales said the matter was an issue for Network Rail and its contractor.

    A spokeswoman added: "We're keen to resolve any issues as soon as possible for the benefit of our passengers."

    Ironically the 2010 Ryder Cup was badly affected by rain on the first and third days and ended up going on until Monday evening....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 29, 2013, 12:02:45
    There is a short atricle in the new issue of RAIL magazine (721) regarding the failed Turbo train at Goring on the 2nd April which helped to add to the grief when the station re-opened after the Easter blockade.

    According to FGW the unit hit some ballast which had been laid too high after engineering work and this ripped off part of the braking control system which caused the unit to come to a stand with the brakes locked on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on April 29, 2013, 12:21:56
    There's a 6-page article on the Reading upgrade in the June 2013 issue of the Railway Magazine, for those who're interested!

    Other periodicals are also available.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on April 29, 2013, 19:59:41
    ...with the excellent headline " Reading: Between the lines."


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 29, 2013, 20:24:49
    ...with the excellent headline " Reading: Between the lines."

    Brilliant!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on April 29, 2013, 20:30:08
    ...with the excellent headline " Reading: Between the lines."

    Blimey, I completely missed the pun!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 29, 2013, 22:53:59
    Did anyone notice that in the Alan Williams pages of the May edition of Modern Railways there's a real caption howler?

    A picture of Reading looking east with 'the new overbridge in view'.  Unfortunately it's taken from the new bridge and actually shows that massive signal gantry...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 30, 2013, 10:26:01
    The installation of OLE equipment continues in the depot with contact wire now being installed in the east end sidings and also through one of the roads of the new maintenance shed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 30, 2013, 10:27:51
    The redundant centre road (the old up main) has now been lifted through the station area.  I presume they did that overnight Sat/Sun?

    PS Just noticed on the webcams that a couple of the contractor's portakabins (the upper pair of the dark blue) have recently been removed. 

    PPS The rest of the portakabins including the station management ones are now being removed as of pm 1st May.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 01, 2013, 12:26:00
    Mrs GTBE caught the 0834 from Pangbourne this morning to change at Reading on to an HST for Paddington.  She and many others were not allowed down on to P10 because it was too crowded.  So of course lots of people missed the next train (there is of course lots of waiting space on the footbridge!). 

    Hopefully they can reduce the fenced-off area on P10/P11 soon and give more space for passengers - I think someone previously has referred to the problems caused by the (temporary) narrow platform on P10.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on May 01, 2013, 16:58:44
    A small aside - but Reading related :

    Does anyone know what is going on at Tilehurst wrt the new footbridge.

    There was minimal work over the Easter shutdown - and now nothing for weeks and weeks. Is there a problem ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on May 02, 2013, 16:12:04
    I passed through Reading the other day, Platform 10 does currently seem awfully narrow at the moment, hopefully things will be better when it closes and platform 11 opens?

    I see paul7755 has already mentioned it as a PPS, but the portakabins at the front of the station have now been cleared. One can see them being removed on lobstervision nrreading02, camera 2. It looks as if they've now opened up the direct route from the new station to the Three Guineas pub as a result.

    (I should introduce myself - longtime lurker, I've been travelling through Reading about once a week for the last year, shortly to come to an end)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on May 02, 2013, 17:11:14
    Can you tell me a bit more about lobstervision?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on May 02, 2013, 17:22:26
    Can you tell me a bit more about lobstervision?

    Yes, I should have just provided the link. They have webcams documenting the changes. There are 4 URLs, each url has between 1-4 tabs for different cameras:

    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading01 (http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading01)
    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading02 (http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading02)
    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading03 (http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading03)
    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading04 (http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading04)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on May 02, 2013, 17:28:53
    Coo. Brilliant. Thanks ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 03, 2013, 16:56:31

    I see paul7755 has already mentioned it as a PPS, but the portakabins at the front of the station have now been cleared. One can see them being removed on lobstervision nrreading02, camera 2. It looks as if they've now opened up the direct route from the new station to the Three Guineas pub as a result.


    When I was through the station earlier this afternoon it looked as though they were almost ready to open a route through at the front, but there was a patch of newly laid concrete drying.  So I'd expect that the hoardings will probably be re-arranged over the weekend to allow demolition to continue eastwards on Reading BC's worksite.

    Welcome to the forum BTW aleph_0

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on May 04, 2013, 16:35:47
    Looking at the latest pictures of the new entrance on lobstervision/nrreading02 cam, I was thinking its nice to see some people having a drink outside the pub in what is a gorgeous weather and then it occurred me, wouldn't it be good if they could replace WHSmiths (next to the pub) with some kind of a food venue (ie caf^) so that you can sit outside too, enjoy the space, have a bite before catching a train and it'll give Reading station a new feel to it - a busy station with all sorts of thing happening and to make the most of the public space instead of it becoming a space you walk through to get from A to Z.

    Just something I thought of :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 05, 2013, 15:05:51
    Subject: Signage and weather ingress on the Transfer Deck

    Further to our upthread discussions on these issues, a quick browse on the NR site has thrown up their Guide to Station Planning and Design. It's very good, and I commend it to interested posters on this thread. It's at: www.networkrail.co.uk (http://www.networkrail.co.uk) > Property & Retail > Improvements > Stations (sorry, my browser refuses to let me copy/paste links).

    I've attached here (and on my subsequent 4 posts below) some abstracts I've made of pertinent pages from the Guide. It'll be interesting to read your thoughts on them as they relate to Reading.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 05, 2013, 15:06:53
    Abstract no.2.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 05, 2013, 15:07:35
    Abstract no.3


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 05, 2013, 15:08:12
    Abstract no.4


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 05, 2013, 15:08:39
    Abstract no.5


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 06, 2013, 09:07:29
    I did mention this document in my post 954 back last November, in the context of the short canopies on P12-15.  There was a view here that the canopies were perfectly OK for a 6 coach Turbo - this was of course before we all knew that these platforms would have A and B ends with 5 car trains in each. 

    If you walk around the new station (which of course I accept is not finished yet) and tick off what it provides against what it should provide wrt the NR Guide, how much would you score it out of 10?  About 7?  And how much would that score go down in winter with a cold wind howling through the footbridge?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jeff on May 06, 2013, 12:54:42
    Ah, sorry GTBE, beg pardon. Oh well, perhaps my repeat posting will be of use/interest to recent joiners who haven't worked their way right through the thread. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 06, 2013, 13:07:15
    Jeff, no need to apologise for drawing attention to something that was mentioned a long time ago - I've done it several times as have others. 

    I'm at Reading tomorrow, must check if there any more signs up yet eg a sign at the northern end of the footbridge pointing to the northern exit (how on earth are non-regular passengers supposed to know there is a down escalator to an exit out of sight round the corner?)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 06, 2013, 15:34:08
    Abstract no.5
    I am not so impressed by the "Guide to Station Planning and Design", which I find too keen on motherhood and apple pie. I assume it is meant to tell the public what kind of things are considered relevant, rather than actually to guide designers, still less be a top-level requirement. Even so, it is not much use.

    Looking at "U4.2 Provide effective climate protection, [...]", the main statement is:
    Design of stations should ensure that passengers are protected from extreme weather conditions (wind, rain, snow, sun, and extreme heat and cold).
    To what degree? I certainly expect protection from extremes that threaten life and health, though I accept that I will probably still be uncomfortable. What is more important, I expect to be comfortable within the station when the weather is ordinarily unpleasant outside. Where is that mentioned? I think the current design may meet what the guide says, but not a more realistic requirement.

    Later, we find:
    Mitigate risks arising from climatic conditions (e.g. the impact of summer sun or water on floor surfaces) for reasons of safety and ease of use.

    Another failure, at least for snow getting in (I assume the leaky roof can be cured). Also:
    Consider the need for resilience to climatic change and extreme weather conditions.
    "Resilience" in the current jargon usually refers to coping with the unexpected, or out-of-normal-range event, even with a lot of intervention. In this case it seems a bit unnecessary; none of the (serious) climate change predictions I have seen involves more extreme extremes, it is all about shifts in probability distributions and so medians and means.

    That's poor enough. What is more likely to be damaging is the section on sustainability, here given the title "V2.2 Minimise energy use and explore sustainable energy sources". Most of this is about economising on heating energy use, which I will try to filter out, as my main concern here is the unheated transfer deck. However, we still have:
    Harness and reuse solar, wind, daylight and water power where appropriate combined with: 
    Passive measures such as increasing a building^s insulation should take priority over active or mechanical solutions and:
    Use intelligent control systems to optimise energy use where appropriate.

    Because the emphasis is on the need for heating, followed by cooling, ventilation is not covered except by implication. Thus what this set of statements is taken to mean will depend on the mind-set of the reader. I see it as advocating intelligent control and adaptability, to make best use of "mechanical solutions" (fans and motorised flaps and louvres); others may see it as a blanket ban on anything mechanical. There is evidence of this...

    There is a "Network Rail Sustainability Policy", as well as loads of web pages on the subject, but I can't see any meaningful; content in any of it - it's all guff. (Google for the title; the link in the design guide does not work.) However, in the RBC planning documents there is a "Reading Station Sustainability Strategy" (00229620.pdf, the third "Other documentation..." in 10/01269/FUL). Ignore the "Programme Environment and Sustainability Strategy" (both the first "Other documentation..." in 10/01269/FUL, and the "Sustainability statement" in 11/1-885/FUL) which is really about the construction phase and the surrounding environment, not the design of the building itself.

    I shall quote in extenso the section on ventilation:
    "Ventilation Options"
    Natural ventilation should be always considered where feasible as the most sustainable solution and cost effective from an operation and maintenance perspective.
    Wind-catcher or similar systems shall be considered and assessed.

    Thats yer lot - the rest is about HVAC (heating, ventilation, and air conditioning) systems, understood not to be passive.

    Why this odd selection of possibilities, ignoring all others? Shouldn't this project-specific document be better targeted and more thorough than the more general one? It confuses cheap with cost-effective, a fatal error when purely natural ventilation simply does not work so, however cheap, is not cost effective.

    This comes from section 3, "Building Management", which does say at its start: The objective is to make sure that any Passive measures are designed into the project [in GRIP 4] and also to assess the viability of additional Active measures that could be incorporated cost-effectively (their capitalisations).
    That reflects a more sensible approach, though I still wonder if they know what cost-effective means.
     
    What I can't see in any of this is a stated objective of achieving the required performance, in terms of a comfortable internal environment, whatever the weather outside, and for the lowest cost. That should give a rank ordering of fully passive, controlled passive (motorised vents and windows), fans, and then HVAC. And fully passive is never, on its own, going to be the answer.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on May 06, 2013, 22:15:18
    Abstract no.5
    I am not so impressed by the "Guide to Station Planning and Design", which I find too keen on motherhood and apple pie. I assume it is meant to tell the public what kind of things are considered relevant, rather than actually to guide designers, still less be a top-level requirement. Even so, it is not much use.

    Looking at "U4.2 Provide effective climate protection, [...]", the main statement is:
    Design of stations should ensure that passengers are protected from extreme weather conditions (wind, rain, snow, sun, and extreme heat and cold).
    To what degree? I certainly expect protection from extremes that threaten life and health, though I accept that I will probably still be uncomfortable. What is more important, I expect to be comfortable within the station when the weather is ordinarily unpleasant outside. Where is that mentioned? I think the current design may meet what the guide says, but not a more realistic requirement.

    Later, we find:
    Mitigate risks arising from climatic conditions (e.g. the impact of summer sun or water on floor surfaces) for reasons of safety and ease of use.

    Another failure, at least for snow getting in (I assume the leaky roof can be cured). Also:
    Consider the need for resilience to climatic change and extreme weather conditions.
    "Resilience" in the current jargon usually refers to coping with the unexpected, or out-of-normal-range event, even with a lot of intervention. In this case it seems a bit unnecessary; none of the (serious) climate change predictions I have seen involves more extreme extremes, it is all about shifts in probability distributions and so medians and means.

    That's poor enough. What is more likely to be damaging is the section on sustainability, here given the title "V2.2 Minimise energy use and explore sustainable energy sources". Most of this is about economising on heating energy use, which I will try to filter out, as my main concern here is the unheated transfer deck. However, we still have:
    Harness and reuse solar, wind, daylight and water power where appropriate combined with: 
    Passive measures such as increasing a building^s insulation should take priority over active or mechanical solutions and:
    Use intelligent control systems to optimise energy use where appropriate.

    Because the emphasis is on the need for heating, followed by cooling, ventilation is not covered except by implication. Thus what this set of statements is taken to mean will depend on the mind-set of the reader. I see it as advocating intelligent control and adaptability, to make best use of "mechanical solutions" (fans and motorised flaps and louvres); others may see it as a blanket ban on anything mechanical. There is evidence of this...

    There is a "Network Rail Sustainability Policy", as well as loads of web pages on the subject, but I can't see any meaningful; content in any of it - it's all guff. (Google for the title; the link in the design guide does not work.) However, in the RBC planning documents there is a "Reading Station Sustainability Strategy" (00229620.pdf, the third "Other documentation..." in 10/01269/FUL). Ignore the "Programme Environment and Sustainability Strategy" (both the first "Other documentation..." in 10/01269/FUL, and the "Sustainability statement" in 11/1-885/FUL) which is really about the construction phase and the surrounding environment, not the design of the building itself.

    I shall quote in extenso the section on ventilation:
    "Ventilation Options"
    Natural ventilation should be always considered where feasible as the most sustainable solution and cost effective from an operation and maintenance perspective.
    Wind-catcher or similar systems shall be considered and assessed.

    Thats yer lot - the rest is about HVAC (heating, ventilation, and air conditioning) systems, understood not to be passive.

    Why this odd selection of possibilities, ignoring all others? Shouldn't this project-specific document be better targeted and more thorough than the more general one? It confuses cheap with cost-effective, a fatal error when purely natural ventilation simply does not work so, however cheap, is not cost effective.

    This comes from section 3, "Building Management", which does say at its start: The objective is to make sure that any Passive measures are designed into the project [in GRIP 4] and also to assess the viability of additional Active measures that could be incorporated cost-effectively (their capitalisations).
    That reflects a more sensible approach, though I still wonder if they know what cost-effective means.
     
    What I can't see in any of this is a stated objective of achieving the required performance, in terms of a comfortable internal environment, whatever the weather outside, and for the lowest cost. That should give a rank ordering of fully passive, controlled passive (motorised vents and windows), fans, and then HVAC. And fully passive is never, on its own, going to be the answer.


    Welcome to the fun that is Network Rail Infrastructure Projects, there are many tens if not several hundreds of company standards that sit behind these glossy statements and then there are TSI's (Technical Specification for Interoperability) which are European standards which the NR are endeavouring to incorporate


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 07, 2013, 06:52:16
    I stopped travelling through reading on the Thursday before Easter and today was my first visit since the big change. As I had a few minutes between services I thought I would have a look at the new south entrance and transfer deck. So as a layman on a warm sunny morning here are my thoughts:

    1) space - I love the feeling of space on the transfer deck and abundance on natural light
    2) I am happy with the signage but then having flowed this thread I kind of knew what to expect.
    3) I'm not sure about the lack of shops on the transfer deck - but I haven't explored down onto platforms 8 and above to know what is down there. This personally doesn't affect my travels but may be an issue with passengers changing services

    In fact the only thing I would give a definite down mark down to are the PA announcements as there seems to be a lot of echo.

    I do accept that things are still fluid so this may change. Once again I reckon it has been one hell of a project keeping the station open whilst these changes are going on. I have wondered if the project teams which oversee the changes at reading are in contact with their counterparts at Birmingham new street to offer assistance.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 07, 2013, 07:55:47
    In fact the only thing I would give a definite down mark down to are the PA announcements as there seems to be a lot of echo.
    I thought the same. It would be a predictable drawback of so much glazed wall - I don't think they make transparent acoustic absorbers. In the transfer deck itself, the ceiling has acoustic treatment above the slatted surface. I guess that could perhaps be increased - but only up to a strict limit (100% absorption).

    The northern stairwell is worse, and that already has a pretty large treated wall. It may be hard to alter that, but maybe it is not such a high priority there.

    In the design guide, there are several mentions of the need for announcements, but the only reference to acoustics per se is under "O3.2 Ensure full compliance with all statutory emergency requirements", where we find:
    Design appropriate acoustics to allow passengers to hear public address announcements on platforms and help control excess noise and vibration.
    Why does that only refer to platforms? Even for this restricted purpose of emergency management, that looks wrong.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 07, 2013, 19:47:39
    Noted that the walkway from the South entrance in front of the 3Gs opened at about 1000 this morning (07 May 2013).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on May 07, 2013, 21:46:47
    In fact the only thing I would give a definite down mark down to are the PA announcements as there seems to be a lot of echo.
    I thought the same. It would be a predictable drawback of so much glazed wall - I don't think they make transparent acoustic absorbers. In the transfer deck itself, the ceiling has acoustic treatment above the slatted surface. I guess that could perhaps be increased - but only up to a strict limit (100% absorption).

    The northern stairwell is worse, and that already has a pretty large treated wall. It may be hard to alter that, but maybe it is not such a high priority there.

    In the design guide, there are several mentions of the need for announcements, but the only reference to acoustics per se is under "O3.2 Ensure full compliance with all statutory emergency requirements", where we find:
    Design appropriate acoustics to allow passengers to hear public address announcements on platforms and help control excess noise and vibration.
    Why does that only refer to platforms? Even for this restricted purpose of emergency management, that looks wrong.

    The passenger transfer deck will be regarded in the evacuation strategy as a "Place of Relative Safety" the focus of the evacuation strategy will be worse case a train fire at one of the platforms, the transfer deck will have been designed to with stand a fire directly under it for a duration.

    The PA system I suspect will get balance once the station layout is complete, this can be done by adjusting the volume of individual speakers or operating some in anti-phase (i.e. they cancel each other out)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 08, 2013, 11:02:24
    The passenger transfer deck will be regarded in the evacuation strategy as a "Place of Relative Safety"

    Agreed - until they put retail units up there....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 09, 2013, 16:30:06
    Just noticed to-day that, as well as there being no signage at the ends of the footbridge for the main North and South exits, there are no Fire Exit signs (ie the approved pictograms) anywhere on the footbridge either.   I'm surrpised: obviously it's legal as NR must have complied with Fire evacuation etc regulations, but I'm still surprised.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on May 09, 2013, 19:14:38
    The path at the southern entrance from the station towards town has today been included in the work site (as in, now the only way to access the transfer bridge entrance, and subway, from town is by the path in front of the three guineas).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 09, 2013, 19:32:29
    That'll be so they can demolish it - meaning the path - I think.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 11, 2013, 19:03:02
    Things seem quite quiet at Reading at the moment. If the station is to be finished by February there is still much to do in not so very much time.

    P11 is not due to open until August - that's four months out of service.

    However, P10 presumably needs to close for rebuilding and so does P7. There is also a canopy to put back over P1/2.  Is there something limiting the rate of progress at the moment that will allow the rate to increase later?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on May 11, 2013, 23:33:13
    ellendune, I guess there has been quite a bit of boring tidying up to do and minor jobs that us outsiders won't notice since the big blockade. As observed above, at the front of the station the portacabins have been removed, presumably so the demolition/remodelling of Station Hill will have more activity soon.

    I'd guess the work on Platform 11 is constrained by being surrounded by a functioning railway, so is very much a slowly-but-surely job, rather than something that manpower can be used to fix.

    I believe the Platform 1/2 canopy is planned to fit into normal engineering time. Either way, it makes most sense to worry about this once Platform 7 is done (and if it does require, say, a weekend possession of platform 1/2, this could wait until all of platforms 7-11 are open, at which point you could probably close 1/2 on the weekend without much harm).

    But I am also curious what is/will be happening soon, hopefully someone else will have some deeper insight.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 09:37:30
    .......well I was at Reading yesterday (11 May 2013) and it was quite windy.  The wind was going up one escalator, across the transfer deck and down the opposite escalator and this was the result............ ::)

    Cue one embarrassed station cleaner.....
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0089a.JPG)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on May 12, 2013, 10:56:49
    .......well I was at Reading yesterday (11 May 2013) and it was quite windy.  The wind was going up one escalator, across the transfer deck and down the opposite escalator and this was the result............ ::)

    Cue one embarrassed station cleaner.....
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0089a.JPG)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer
    I bet Railway Eye (http://www.railwayeye.blogspot.co.uk/) would appreciate that picture being submitted!

    They have a photo on there of a crunched escalator at Reading at the moment too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 11:12:55
    ......another couple of observations from my trip through Reading yesterday (11 May 2013):

    The new transfer deck catering department (note the very hi-tech waste bin ::) )......
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0086.JPG)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    .....and the former Up Main Line now recovered.....
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbums/album_1357222339/IMG_0081.JPG)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 11:30:05
    ......and also.  I noted that on the transfer deck that the exit to the South entrance escalators/stairs is around a blind corner. Human beings like to to take the shortest route around corners so cue several human to human body collisions.  I think a few barriers will be required to direct people coming up the escalators/stairs to away from that corner ;D :D

    Also the original station entrance foyer was still as busy as ever.

    Finally I had to suffer a last minute (or two) platform change from the London end of No.8 to No.7.  This took a good three minutes and the train was coming into the platform when I got there :P :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 12, 2013, 11:41:25
    I am interesting in S&Ts pic of the re-worked track past P7 - does that mean that FGW depot traffic to plats 4-6 will now go up through P8?

    Dave


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on May 12, 2013, 11:50:51
    The one currently available lift down from the Transfer Deck on the south side is also not immediately visible. There is a rather confusing sign in front of the doors of the other lift. Advising you to use the lifts, but then blocking access to the one immediately in front of you. You can't see the other one as, like the escalators, it is round a corner.

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_1956_zpsf6c44fab.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 11:51:41
    Hi BB.

    The Reading Upper depot connection on the B&H line can be reached from either Platform 7 or 8 (and Platforms 9 and 10 as well).  The Reading Lower (Triangle) depot can only be reached from Platforms 8, 9 and 10.  The connection from Platforms 8, 9 and 10 doesn't conflict with the Down B&H so will be more likely to be used (personal opinion only).  The Southern Lines can be reached from Platforms 7, 8, 9 or 10 (and, of course, off the Relief Line Platforms 13, 14 and 15 via the new Southern dive-under).

    Have a look at the signalling layout drawings posted further back in this thread (Page No.55, Post No.820).

    B&H = Berks and Hants


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 12, 2013, 12:59:45
    .......well I was at Reading yesterday (11 May 2013) and it was quite windy.  The wind was going up one escalator, across the transfer deck and down the opposite escalator and this was the result............ ::)

    Cue one embarrassed station cleaner.....
    I've been resisting the temptation to say "I told you so"; I was really talking about accidents that injure people. On the other hand, I would not like to end up saying it after someone is seriously hurt. A few points one how likely this is:

    How windy was it? Let's say it was windy, rather than just very breezy. Even so, "very windy" is a quite common occurrence, and even that is not the extreme weather that the design guide says we should be protected from.

    Does it help that the wind has to squeeze through a narrow gap? Just across Station Approach there is a passageway under the buildings (outside the Gulshan restaurant) where there is a pivoted steel barrier. This can be moved out to block the passageway when it is windy, as otherwise when you turn the corner you could be knocked off your feet. I imagine there must have been a nasty accident due to this, though it would have been before I lived here (i.e. over 20 years ago).

    Note that this is not at the top of a two-storey staircase.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 12, 2013, 14:54:30
    There is of course a famous precedent for wind-related accidents at Reading, in the sad tale of Henry West - though I would not suggest it is likely to be repeated. I am sure that many members of this forum are familiar with the story, given their bathymetrically challenging knowledge of the GWR and all its history. For others, I have attached (I hope) a picture of his memorial in St. Lawrence's churchyard (behind the old town hall).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 12, 2013, 15:58:19
    Many thanks for posting that picture, stuving!  :)

    As you suspected, that sad incident has indeed been mentioned on this forum before - at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=4306.msg35986#msg35986  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on May 12, 2013, 16:04:11
    There is of course a famous precedent for wind-related accidents at Reading, in the sad tale of Henry West...

    Currently hidden from view, there is a memorial plaque to Henry West on P7 at Reading affixed to the rear of original station building (The Three Guineas):

    I took a picture of it a couple of years ago before redevelopment work started in earnest. Took some trawling through my photo archives, but I've managed to find the original:


    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/IMG_0097_zpsd935bec2.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 16:20:23
    There is of course a famous precedent for wind-related accidents at Reading, in the sad tale of Henry West - though I would not suggest it is likely to be repeated. I am sure that many members of this forum are familiar with the story, given their bathymetrically challenging knowledge of the GWR and all its history. For others, I have attached (I hope) a picture of his memorial in St. Lawrence's churchyard (behind the old town hall).

    ....but for those that don't http://openplaques.org/plaques/11272 and here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reading_railway_station

    ....and the width of that memorial in the graveyard; why 7ft 0^inches of course ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 12, 2013, 22:27:41
    Things seem quite quiet at Reading at the moment. If the station is to be finished by February there is still much to do in not so very much time.

    P11 is not due to open until August - that's four months out of service.

    However, P10 presumably needs to close for rebuilding and so does P7. There is also a canopy to put back over P1/2.  Is there something limiting the rate of progress at the moment that will allow the rate to increase later?

    As has always been planned, the work on P10 cannot start until P11 is available.  But they seem to be making reasonable progress on one of the most significant areas of P11, the new foundation strips and platform wall at the London end, but they obviously cannot deliver concrete as easily as they did for the new platforms, as they are between operational tracks.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 12, 2013, 22:39:32

    As has always been planned, the work on P10 cannot start until P11 is available.  But they seem to be making reasonable progress on one of the most significant areas of P11, the new foundation strips and platform wall at the London end, but they obviously cannot deliver concrete as easily as they did for the new platforms, as they are between operational tracks.

    Paul

    ...but they managed it this morning around 1200 (Sunday 12 May 2013) as seen on Lobster-vision Camera 1, Tab 1.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 12, 2013, 23:40:00

    As has always been planned, the work on P10 cannot start until P11 is available.  But they seem to be making reasonable progress on one of the most significant areas of P11, the new foundation strips and platform wall at the London end, but they obviously cannot deliver concrete as easily as they did for the new platforms, as they are between operational tracks.

    Paul

    ...but they managed it this morning around 1200 (Sunday 12 May 2013) as seen on Lobster-vision Camera 1, Tab 1.

    Well yes they can obviously do it during a planned block, but previously they were working permanently in green zone conditions and concrete pumps could be used 24/7 if they wanted.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 13, 2013, 10:28:51
    Just noticed to-day that, as well as there being no signage at the ends of the footbridge for the main North and South exits, there are no Fire Exit signs (ie the approved pictograms) anywhere on the footbridge either.   I'm surrpised: obviously it's legal as NR must have complied with Fire evacuation etc regulations, but I'm still surprised.

    Perhaps footbridge exit routes come under 'stating the *$*$ obvious' though.  Likewise I cannot think of another footbridge which has 'fire exit' signs.  It isn't a fully enclosed building after all...

    Can anyone think of a covered footbridge anywhere which has fire exits designated?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 13, 2013, 10:47:40
    THe public subway hasn't got fire exits either....I don't think they're needed as each has two or more exits....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 13, 2013, 10:53:36
    Ah - but all (both) the subway's exits are potential fire exits, and not hard to find. The transfer deck has lots of exits to platforms that are not fire exits at all. And you can see them, but not the station exits - just some small and easy to miss signs.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 13, 2013, 11:10:37
    I think any platform is open enough to act as a evacuation area if needed (I.e. a fire on the bridge) or for the overbridge to act the same way if evactuation need from any platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on May 13, 2013, 17:20:52

    Two new escalators out of use today. Shape of things to come?

    To Oxford today - no escalators - what's happening to the old ones from Reading?

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 13, 2013, 17:58:39
    ...what's happening to the old ones from Reading?

    I don't think those on the island came out intact.  They were in use one day and gone the next, in pieces and put in skips as far as I could see.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on May 13, 2013, 20:37:24
    On a different point, several times now I've been waiting for a Didcot bound train at P9 and seen it waiting for a signal outside the station, even though the platform was empty and I couldn't see any conflicting movements on that side of the station that would have prevented it coming into the platform. This has often resulted in trains arriving a few minutes late, having been waiting outside the station for several minutes. What reasons might there be for this?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 13, 2013, 20:47:33
    On a different point, several times now I've been waiting for a Didcot bound train at P9 and seen it waiting for a signal outside the station, even though the platform was empty and I couldn't see any conflicting movements on that side of the station that would have prevented it coming into the platform. This has often resulted in trains arriving a few minutes late, having been waiting outside the station for several minutes. What reasons might there be for this?

    Could it be caused by what is happening (or not yet happening) in P8, eg if a route is set from P8 onto the down main via the crossovers at the country end it might be in the overlap of the P9 platform starter?  Likewise a reversing XC might be heading up from the Westbury route into P10 or something. 

    I'll await the expert's comments with interest, but I think that might be something like it...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 13, 2013, 20:49:10
    I notice some additional OLE appeared overnight on P12-P15

    OLE= Overhead Line Equipment


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 13, 2013, 21:02:19
    FGW said tonight that passenger accudents at Reading are already up on the old station. Seems to beca dislike of using lifts with luggage & trying the escalators instead.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on May 13, 2013, 21:05:15
    On a different point, several times now I've been waiting for a Didcot bound train at P9 and seen it waiting for a signal outside the station, even though the platform was empty and I couldn't see any conflicting movements on that side of the station that would have prevented it coming into the platform. This has often resulted in trains arriving a few minutes late, having been waiting outside the station for several minutes. What reasons might there be for this?

    Could it be caused by what is happening (or not yet happening) in P8, eg if a route is set from P8 onto the down main via the crossovers at the country end it might be in the overlap of the P9 platform starter?  Likewise a reversing XC might be heading up from the Westbury route into P10 or something. 

    I'll await the expert's comments with interest, but I think that might be something like it...

    Paul

    Very likely- there were XC movements to the west of the station when I've seen this happen, but why should this prevent a train from the east entering and stopping at P9, as there is a signal preventing it from leaving again until the line is clear? Seems an inefficient use of the new platform capacity.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 13, 2013, 21:58:49
    I agree with the probably reasons, and you have to bear in mind that the west end layout is temporary.  XC (and other services from Southcote Junction) will not be using that route in the final layout, and the temporary 25mph crossover from P8 to the Down Main is just that, with the final layout giving a much greater distance from the signals to the next set of points, which should be well outside any overlaps.

    Very likely- there were XC movements to the west of the station when I've seen this happen, but why should this prevent a train from the east entering and stopping at P9, as there is a signal preventing it from leaving again until the line is clear? Seems an inefficient use of the new platform capacity.

    Each signal has an overlap which will prevent the previous signal from being cleared if there is a conflicting move.  In the case of P8 and P9 the signals are quite close to the junction that an incoming XC would use to get to P10, so, as Paul stated, it is likely that the previous signal can't be cleared until the XC service has arrived at P10.  It's basically a safety back-up, (admittedly less important thanks to TPWS), which could potentially avoid a collision should a train be involved in a SPAD.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on May 13, 2013, 23:32:54
    Thanks, as ever, for your ... err, inside information, IndustryInsider.  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on May 15, 2013, 16:14:16
    Visited the station  today. All of the escalators have been stopped, apparently for safety reasons.

    I was told that a six inch piece of metal was ejected by one of them this morning and made its way at high speed across the circulating area. Fortunately, no one was injured.

    I was told that there had been an issue during commissioning that affected all of the escalators, but this was thought to have been rectified. Apparently the problem has returned. Clearly bits of flying metal are not good for safety, so they were all switched off as a precaution.

    Kone engineers were taking one apart, overseen by a very worried looking man in a suit!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 15, 2013, 16:37:17
    Took a mobile shot of the P11 progress this lunchtime, give it a few days and I think the last section of the platform walling should be complete.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: devon_metro on May 15, 2013, 16:57:52
    Visited the station  today. All of the escalators have been stopped, apparently for safety reasons.

    I was told that a six inch piece of metal was ejected by one of them this morning and made its way at high speed across the circulating area. Fortunately, no one was injured.

    I was told that there had been an issue during commissioning that affected all of the escalators, but this was thought to have been rectified. Apparently the problem has returned. Clearly bits of flying metal are not good for safety, so they were all switched off as a precaution.

    Kone engineers were taking one apart, overseen by a very worried looking man in a suit!

    I did read somewhere that the escalators installed at Reading were considered to be "cheap". Apparently they were correct!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 15, 2013, 17:03:46
    Took a mobile shot of the P11 progress this lunchtime, give it a few days and I think the last section of the platform walling should be complete.
    It looks to me as if the far London end of P11, past the gantry, is not being built yet - maybe there is a signal in the way?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 15, 2013, 17:31:21
    I thought the London end (of the wall) is already done beyond the gantry, it's visible from that end of P10.  From what I've seen on various drawings I think that's it.  The P11 starter signal is on the gantry but bagged over, which suggests the last few yards of platform are not for operational use for up direction trains.

    This picture shows the signal I mean, the up starter for P9 is on the right, and I'd put a few quid on the P10 equivalent being added to the gantry (or the supporting leg) in due course:

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/8727787691/in/pool-1945836@N21/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on May 15, 2013, 19:22:28
    Have the cameras been taken out of use?

    http://www.lobstervision.tv/nrreading04


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 15, 2013, 19:47:31
    Looks like number 4 has problems, however various views have gone and re-appeared before. 

    Cams 1 and 2 are OK, and cam 3 is still live, but never showed much anyway.

    I wonder if they considered that the depot and approach track work had reached a stage where there'd be very little change?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on May 15, 2013, 20:19:22
    Given that the OLE now goes through the servicing shed, perhaps they decided to remove the cameras before they "got in the way".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 15, 2013, 22:30:15
    Given that the OLE now goes through the servicing shed, perhaps they decided to remove the cameras before they "got in the way".

    Seems highly relevant doesn't it. The two external cameras were high up as well, so even if not physically obstructing things, I suppose an isolation would be needed just to work at height removing them.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on May 15, 2013, 23:56:50
    Also talked to someone who told me that the 7 minute standard connection time was proving problematical. It was taking much longer to get, say, a passenger in a wheelchair from one side of the station to the other. In fairness, 7 minutes was quite tight for some connections in the old station. I was told that connections are regularly being missed and that this was a particular issue with assisted travel.

    Apparently, the decision has been taken not to increase the standard connection time, so connections may well be an ongoing issue. I can understand the reluctance to do this - it would mean that many journey times would be increased, possibly by up to an hour. Not commercially desirable.

    But does it make sense to have passengers running around the station in order to make such tight connections?

    Two other points: everything was on time today! Noticable that trains from Padd were arriving a full two minutes before they were due to depart - makes a huge difference to timekeeping. Maybe Reading remodelling is starting to work? And, noticed some electrification masts on the Reading West curve - I am beginning to believe it will really happen!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 16, 2013, 11:08:54
    Noticed an intriguing part of the new signalling installation in the area of the new junctions east of the station, alongside the end of P6.

    What they have done is wired up axle counters mounted on short sections of rail - I'm assuming to provide the correct indications in some part of the signalling system before the tracks are actually installed?

    Perhaps one of the S&T experts could confirm this, as I was wondering why they wouldn't just make the necessary temporary changes in a junction box or cabinet somewhere.  Alternatively does it mean that future testing can be shortened as the axle counters are already 'working'?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 16, 2013, 21:22:02
    On the western approach to P15 there is a large black board mounted on what seems to be a OLE mast.  What is it?

    OLE = Overhead line equipment


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 16, 2013, 22:04:28
    On the western approach to P15 there is a large black board mounted on what seems to be a OLE mast.  What is it?

    Its a screen to either prevent extraneous lighting from affecting signal sighting or to prevent cross-reading of an incorrect signal as there is a curve approaching the platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 16, 2013, 22:27:00
    On the western approach to P15 there is a large black board mounted on what seems to be a OLE mast.  What is it?

    Its a screen to either prevent extraneous lighting from affecting signal sighting or to prevent cross-reading of an incorrect signal as there is a curve approaching the platform.

    Thank you


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 17, 2013, 16:23:25
    Webcam 1 tab 1 showing that final section of platform wall is up to the level where the 'oversail' blocks go on.  (The overhanging support for the coping slab.) 

    Carrying on now to the stage where they can fit the platform edge copings all the way along would make it look like major progress...   :D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 17, 2013, 23:21:48
    Webcam 1 tab 1 showing that final section of platform wall is up to the level where the 'oversail' blocks go on. 
    If you look closely (by now) you can see a lot of these "oversail" things in place. You can also see them at the end, which still looks like there is a bit more to be added. It may be just the end wall, but why?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 17, 2013, 23:25:48
    Webcam 1 tab 1 showing that final section of platform wall is up to the level where the 'oversail' blocks go on. 
    If you look closely (by now) you can see a lot of these "oversail" things in place. You can also see them at the end, which still looks like there is a bit more to be added. It may be just the end wall, but why?


    It looks to me like the track on P10 will be realigned when that platform is rebuilt. In which case the end will be wider.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 17, 2013, 23:36:25
    I expect it will, and needs to be as P10/11 really needs the greatest passenger capacity.

    I think it's more a question of whether they want to build just the P11 half of the end wall or not. It may be that, as the kind of fence they are putting on platform ends can only be fitted at full width, they will fence it off initially anyway.

    Come to that, with the starter signal on the gantry, what is the point of building this extra bit of platform now?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 18, 2013, 10:17:03

    It looks to me like the track on P10 will be realigned when that platform is rebuilt. In which case the end will be wider.

    Definitely will, that's what all the drawings show - the up main basically 'parallels' the down main as a pair throughout the station area.  I'm fairly sure that's why certain crossovers between up main and down main east of the platform ends were not provided in the interim (current) layout, because the final position of the P10 track has not been achieved yet.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 18, 2013, 10:30:24
    I expect it will, and needs to be as P10/11 really needs the greatest passenger capacity.

    I think it's more a question of whether they want to build just the P11 half of the end wall or not. It may be that, as the kind of fence they are putting on platform ends can only be fitted at full width, they will fence it off initially anyway.

    Come to that, with the starter signal on the gantry, what is the point of building this extra bit of platform now?


    I think when they did the other new islands, the foundation strip for the end wall was cast in one section across the end, you can see that the side foundation strip finishes under the blockwork.  The staggered blocks shown in your picture are probably to key in the end wall. 

    The reason for the actual position of the platform end may not be directly relevant to the signals above - there could be a designed tolerance, eg to allow for the maximum length train expected plus a bit spare, 10 x 26m IEP maybe?  Or it is to do with down direction train positioning if they stop a little short of the down direction signal?  I don't know for certain - it's possible it is just a convenient position to square off the whole of both main islands that looks neat!

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 18, 2013, 11:40:08
    Well, a train absolutely must stop before the signal, mustn't it?
    I only have Grimshaw's plans to work on which do not have any marked scales (how unprofessional!).

    With a bit of calibration, I get the length of P12-15 to be 280 m. The end-of-platform stop board says "11 car" which, for 23 m each, is only 253 m. The boards are a few m from the ends, but it looks as if there is a significant margin in the length allowance too. I assume all platforms must take all trains, to support the "7-day railway" requirement.

    P10/11 I measured off plan at 342 m, going past P12 by 50 m at the London end and 10 m at the other. As built it is much shorter at both ends.

    The relevant standard (GI/GN7616) suggests a UK-specific minimum of 300 m, though the "Infrastructure Register" may say different (If it exists yet). This is a derogation from the general requirement for lines of category I, II and III to be 400 m long - which I think is to cope with a double-rake TGV, should one happen to turn up

    Of course the ends of the platforms (outwith the canopies), the gantry, etc. might have been seen by NR as their business, that station architect don't need to trouble their fluffy little heads with.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 18, 2013, 12:02:49
    Well, a train absolutely must stop before the signal, mustn't it?

    Yes, of course, but the point is that all platforms are bi-directional.  This is why I mentioned a hypothetical down train on what is normally an up platform, because it will be stopping at a signal at the other end.  So I further supposed that you could allow for a safety margin for the back of the train.

    Does that make sense?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 18, 2013, 12:17:28
    Well, a train absolutely must stop before the signal, mustn't it?

    Yes, of course, but the point is that all platforms are bi-directional.  This is why I mentioned a hypothetical down train on what is normally an up platform, because it will be stopping at a signal at the other end.  So I further supposed that you could allow for a safety margin for the back of the train.

    Does that make sense?

    Paul 

    Well, no, not really. I would want a maximum-length train to stop in the same place in either direction. The signals and train detection would follow from that. I know that there can be peculiarities of the trackwork that sometimes prevent that, but surely there are none here? (except perhaps at the country end and temporarily.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 18, 2013, 12:35:31
    Another perfectly feasible explanation that's just occured to me is that it provides for the safety refuge away from the trains?

    But as I suggested I don't really know the designer's reasoning, all I originally intended to point out is that what we can now see is probably the final length of P11.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on May 18, 2013, 14:03:36
    Another way of looking at it is the platform might as well be built the maximum length possible that doesn't prevent any reasonable future modifications of the trackwork? If it provides flexibility for the future at not much extra cost, then doing the job right once sounds like a good plan.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on May 18, 2013, 17:34:14
    Come to that, with the starter signal on the gantry, what is the point of building this extra bit of platform now?


    In the photo attached to your previous post the lattice mast is an OLE TTC  ???  (Overhead Line Equipment Twin Track Cantilever) 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 18, 2013, 18:11:40
    Come to that, with the starter signal on the gantry, what is the point of building this extra bit of platform now?


    In the photo attached to your previous post the lattice mast is an OLE TTC  ???  (Overhead Line Equipment Twin Track Cantilever) 

    In context, I think stuving was referring to my earlier comment about the P11 starter which is already fitted and covered up on the main signal gantry.  In post #1792.

    Hence all the discussion about why the platform needs to extend beyond the signal in the first place?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 18, 2013, 19:53:40
    Quite so, Paul.

    In GI/GN7616, there is a box that contains (before it goes on to the actual lengths):

    TSI - Conventional Rail Infrastructure (draft)
    4.2.10.1. USABLE LENGTH OF PLATFORMS
    All Categories of Line

    The platform length shall be sufficient to accommodate the longest interoperable train intended to stop at the platform in normal service. When determining the length of trains intended to stop at the platform, consideration shall be given to both the current service requirements and the reasonably foreseeable service requirements at least ten years following the bringing into service of the platform.

    It is permissible to build only the length of platform required for the current service requirement provided passive provision is made for the reasonably foreseeable future service requirements.

    The usable length of a platform shall be declared in the Register of Infrastructure.


    So what is "passive provision"? Not putting a big steel box right next to the platform, as with P12/13 (visible in my picture)? Aligning track so it does not need moving? Is it easier to move the starting signal than to build the platform itself?

    I'm not sure, but then this TSI may not be in force now anyway. The actual standard is I think GI/RT7016, but that has similar wording to the first paragraph of the box quoted above, and no specific lengths.

    One thing that does occur to me is that not building half the end wall now will give safety issues if it has to be done with P11 in use. 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 18, 2013, 20:14:11
    Bar? Do you see a bar? (On P12/13 B.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on May 18, 2013, 22:19:48
    Down near floor level? Skirting round the structure. Perhaps you have to push one of those.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: devon_metro on May 18, 2013, 23:01:32
    Bar? Do you see a bar? (On P12/13 B.)

    Those doors are presumably locked by magnet above the door, released by the keypad or using the green emergency door release. Does seem odd not to have bars though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on May 19, 2013, 10:12:57
    Quite so, Paul.

    In GI/GN7616, there is a box that contains (before it goes on to the actual lengths):

    TSI - Conventional Rail Infrastructure (draft)
    4.2.10.1. USABLE LENGTH OF PLATFORMS
    All Categories of Line

    The platform length shall be sufficient to accommodate the longest interoperable train intended to stop at the platform in normal service. When determining the length of trains intended to stop at the platform, consideration shall be given to both the current service requirements and the reasonably foreseeable service requirements at least ten years following the bringing into service of the platform.

    It is permissible to build only the length of platform required for the current service requirement provided passive provision is made for the reasonably foreseeable future service requirements.

    The usable length of a platform shall be declared in the Register of Infrastructure.


    So what is "passive provision"? Not putting a big steel box right next to the platform, as with P12/13 (visible in my picture)? Aligning track so it does not need moving? Is it easier to move the starting signal than to build the platform itself?

    I'm not sure, but then this TSI may not be in force now anyway. The actual standard is I think GI/RT7016, but that has similar wording to the first paragraph of the box quoted above, and no specific lengths.

    One thing that does occur to me is that not building half the end wall now will give safety issues if it has to be done with P11 in use. 



    The passive provision for the interoperable train foreseeable within ten years could be the removal of the REB (Relocatable equipment building) and the removal of all fixed signals the full interoperable system on the GWML will be ETRMS level 2 (that is no fixed line-side signals) the GWML is currently being resignalled to level 1 which will allow level 2 trains to operate the driver ignoring the level fixed signals when all the traction units that operate over GWML metals are ETRMS level 2 all the fixed signal will be felled.
    This is likely to be the derogation against the TSI that NR will have agreed with the ORR and DfT


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 19, 2013, 11:48:43
    One thing that does occur to me is that not building half the end wall now will give safety issues if it has to be done with P11 in use. 

    If you consider the country ends of P8/9 and P10/11 they are both equally complicated 'works in progress' with only half of the eventual platform end built, on the P9 or P11 sides.  So I think you might be getting unnecessarily concerned about this. 

    When they open P11 for the first time they'll presumably have all the additional length from the country end (beyond the relevant waiting room) that is already built to play with - there shouldn't be any operational necessity to use the final few coach lengths at the London end, where the work to extend the P10 side will still be going on?

    With up trains (HSTs) on P11 they ought to be positioned significantly further back on the platform and bring both sets of escalators/stairs into regular use - which will hopefully spread the passengers along the whole train...  At least that's the theory that we've discussed previously!   

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 19, 2013, 17:18:35
    If you consider the country ends of P8/9 and P10/11 they are both equally complicated 'works in progress' with only half of the eventual platform end built, on the P9 or P11 sides.  So I think you might be getting unnecessarily concerned about this. 
    Fair comment - I'm sure it's all being done in an order that makes sense to the people doing it (or do I mean in charge of doing it?).

    But, as you point out, the other end of P11 does look as if its face is finished to the end and halfway along the return, though missing its steel fence. P9 has a fence, and that will need altering when the nibbled corner of P8 is made good - presumably worth doing that way as the removal of the acrobatic link line from P8 can't be done until after the viaduct is up and running.

    This all started with my puzzling over what the length of main line platforms would be, given that they started off much longer. That is not relevant for the trains and services being planned, but would be if there was ever a need to boost passenger capacity in a hurry. And that's part of the big imponderable topic known now as "resilience".

    There is still something inside the Cabinet Office called the "Civil Contingencies Secretariat", which uses the strapline "How networks and individuals can support the country's emergency planning, response and recovery, and keep systems and services running." Transport is one of the main topics they address, though the little evidence I can see of their work is limited to natural hazards such as flood. It needs little imagination to pick that out, as it has happened. So has a disruption to oil supplies, so I would expect that to be on the list of hazards to plan for as well. The example we have was in distribution, so the effect was very quick, but threats further back in the supply chain could still reach crisis point in a few weeks.

    Last time, in 2000, large numbers of people did switch to trains - or try to - but then it stopped after about a week. That's the point, really: railways have the capability to boost passenger capacity at short notice, but for a big boost you need longer trains and the platforms for them. Obviously you need to relax some of the rules on comfort and even safety. I am not sure whether the reserve of old rolling stock we used to have has physically gone, or is just not accessible via the leasing process, but resilience planning would also consider that. We seem to be drifting into a situation of only building platforms as long as the trains and then buying trains of fixed length that can't be made longer, or even coupled together to suitable length in a lot of cases. So what, if anything, is this bunch of resilience planners doing?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 20, 2013, 12:02:38
    Considering the Reading BC work outside the new southern entrance, I've been wondering why they seem to have been using a piling rig all over the area by the ramps.  Drawings I'd found a few months back suggested that area alongside the ramps was going to be a simple paved open space, with a taxi/car drop off beyond it .

    Is there a possibility that they are doing something else requiring more foundation work?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on May 20, 2013, 16:11:10
    Not sure that it is piling - more like ground stabilisation? Its one of those rigs that bores a hole and then rubble is tipped down the hole.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 20, 2013, 16:36:15
    Ah right. In hindsight I didn't actually see any tubular piles. You can learn a lot about ordinary civil engineering in this thread...   ;D

    Presumably this is the sort of thing they're doing, Keller is the name on that rig:

    http://www.keller.co.uk/services/groundimp.aspx

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on May 21, 2013, 17:33:47
    On my way home they had barriers out at the top of the escalators in the southern concourse....it seems as though somebody has acted upon the suggestion that somebody posted on here a little while ago.

    Also there is some work going on on the platform area between 3 and 7. Not quite sure what they are doing though. taken a couple of pictures but they are too big.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 21, 2013, 18:11:36
    On my way home they had barriers out at the top of the escalators in the southern concourse....it seems as though somebody has acted upon the suggestion that somebody posted on here a little while ago.

    I noticed that, and thought it would probably become permanent.  I didn't think there was much necessity to separate the stairs from the up escalators though - whenever I've been there the usage of the stairs has been insignificant...

    Quote
    Also there is some work going on on the platform area between 3 and 7. Not quite sure what they are doing though. taken a couple of pictures but they are too big.

    All they seem to be doing at the moment is trenching and installing that multi-channel underground conduit for electrical services.  When I looked a few days ago they were then re-installing the same surface materials that had been removed, which was surprising as I'd have thought that new tactile paving would be part of the job.

    I suppose the advantage of block paving is that it can easily be adjusted later on though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on May 21, 2013, 20:22:11
    On my way home they had barriers out at the top of the escalators in the southern concourse....it seems as though somebody has acted upon the suggestion that somebody posted on here a little while ago.

    I noticed that, and thought it would probably become permanent.  I didn't think there was much necessity to separate the stairs from the up escalators though - whenever I've been there the usage of the stairs has been insignificant...

    Quote
    Also there is some work going on on the platform area between 3 and 7. Not quite sure what they are doing though. taken a couple of pictures but they are too big.

    All they seem to be doing at the moment is trenching and installing that multi-channel underground conduit for electrical services.  When I looked a few days ago they were then re-installing the same surface materials that had been removed, which was surprising as I'd have thought that new tactile paving would be part of the job.

    I suppose the advantage of block paving is that it can easily be adjusted later on though...

    Paul

    Managed to resize them...so here is the first picture.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on May 21, 2013, 20:23:34
    On my way home they had barriers out at the top of the escalators in the southern concourse....it seems as though somebody has acted upon the suggestion that somebody posted on here a little while ago.

    I noticed that, and thought it would probably become permanent.  I didn't think there was much necessity to separate the stairs from the up escalators though - whenever I've been there the usage of the stairs has been insignificant...

    Quote
    Also there is some work going on on the platform area between 3 and 7. Not quite sure what they are doing though. taken a couple of pictures but they are too big.

    All they seem to be doing at the moment is trenching and installing that multi-channel underground conduit for electrical services.  When I looked a few days ago they were then re-installing the same surface materials that had been removed, which was surprising as I'd have thought that new tactile paving would be part of the job.

    I suppose the advantage of block paving is that it can easily be adjusted later on though...

    Paul

    Managed to resize them...so here is the first picture.

    and the second


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on May 22, 2013, 10:34:36
    There appears to be some foundation work taking place in the compound behind P1/2/3 as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 22, 2013, 10:54:33
    There appears to be some foundation work taking place in the compound behind P1/2/3 as well.

    That section should be capable of fairly swift completion, as far as the plans suggest it is just a few columns and a similar overall roof over a large open space (with an ETFE skylight as on P8/9).  I assume that waiting room on P7 will have its windows 'unblanked' and it will open out onto that area as well.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 22, 2013, 21:00:52
    Noticed a couple of XC Voyagers in the London end of Platforms 13 and 14 this afternoon.

    Checking 'realtimetrains' shows that since the timetable change a couple of the terminating services from Newcastle (the 1510 and 1707 arrivals) are now diagrammed to run as far as Kennet Bridge loop and back, rather than sitting in the platform for half an hour.

    I wonder if this has been done in response to capacity issues discovered in the few weeks since the new platforms opened?  As far as I can see these are the only trains it applies to - perhaps there's a need to  get them out of the way as the number of trains towards London increases for the evening peak?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on May 22, 2013, 21:11:38
    Noticed a couple of XC Voyagers in the London end of Platforms 13 and 14 this afternoon.

    Checking 'realtimetrains' shows that since the timetable change a couple of the terminating services from Newcastle (the 1510 and 1707 arrivals) are now diagrammed to run as far as Kennet Bridge loop and back, rather than sitting in the platform for half an hour.

    I wonder if this has been done in response to capacity issues discovered in the few weeks since the new platforms opened?  As far as I can see these are the only trains it applies to - perhaps there's a need to  get them out of the way as the number of trains towards London increases for the evening peak?

    Paul
    I suspect that the trip to Kennet Bridge and back is to help retain route knowledge for Cross Country drivers. The benefit of this is that when things do go wrong at Reading, or engineering work means fewer platforms are available, there is somewhere to put their terminating trains without hogging a platform at the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 22, 2013, 22:36:26
    That's what I thought - some kind of test or familiarisation exercise -  because these trains are only away for 10 minutes, and nothing is timetabled to go through the platform during their absence. Quite why there are just these two late afternoon trains  is less clear.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 23, 2013, 21:50:45
    An REB (Relocatable Equipment Building or large grey box thingy) appeared in the yard outside the Northern Entrance on Monday.  It looks like it has been outside as it is dirty. (Camera 1 Tab 3)

    Is it on the way out or on the way in?

    Where has it come from/ going to?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Visoflex on May 24, 2013, 08:47:25
    From New Junction to Tilehurst (I think) eventually


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 25, 2013, 18:44:37
    Does anyone know when the new Train Care Depot will be finished/opening? It must be quite soon now?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 25, 2013, 18:49:30
    Does anyone know when the new Train Care Depot will be finished/opening? It must be quite soon now?

    Final touches now being applied - including surfacing the new walking route to/from the station.

    Friday 21st June is the planned handover date to First Great Western, with a gradual and staged transfer of maintenance and stabling from the old depot leading up to full commissioning on Sunday 14th July.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on May 25, 2013, 19:38:28
    I was there for the first time in a long time on Thursday and I can't believe how different it is, or certain parts of it at least..Some of the platforms look the same obviously.. The new overbridge though is even better and bigger than I thought it would be...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 27, 2013, 14:05:45
    That's what I thought - some kind of test or familiarisation exercise -  because these trains are only away for 10 minutes, and nothing is timetabled to go through the platform during their absence. Quite why there are just these two late afternoon trains  is less clear.

    Test or familiarisation exercises don't go on for a whole WTT period, although driver route retention might. 

    Don't forget though, that within the next few months we have the DMU depot move over to the new premises, so any ECS moves needed for the afternoon/evening peak will be heading through the relief side, rather than going through P7/P8 as now.  So for general flexibility of operations it may be useful to have XC units out of the way.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 30, 2013, 20:06:10
    Well, I guess now we know how far P7 is going to be extended outwards ... though perhaps not yet how long it will be at the London end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 30, 2013, 23:48:49
    I see no evidence on the planning drawings of any increase in length at the London end, and the width increase shown is as previously drawn with a 'taper to zero' at the west end, because the P7 track has to stay lined up with the Caversham Rd bridge section as it is now.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 31, 2013, 22:28:15
    Anyone know if this is a bridge that is already removed or one that is still there?

    I did not think there was a bridge with a long enough span at Reading.

    Great Central Railway to 'bridge' the gap between Leicester and Nottingham within five years (Using Bridge from Reading) (http://www.loughboroughecho.net/news/loughborough-news/2013/05/30/73871-33406710/?)
    Quote
    GREAT Central Railway is hoping to ^bridge^ the gap between the Loughborough heritage line and the Nottingham section to the north with the news a connection is to be built over the Midland Mainline.
    GCR has launched a ^1m Bridge To The Future fund-raising appeal after forming a parnership with Network Rail to build a bridge over the Midland Main Line at Loughborough.
    Design work is underway and the new structure made up of two reclaimed rail bridges from Reading is expected to be in place running over the four tracks of the Midland Mainline by mid-2015 - allowing the demolished 500m link between the two sections, rejoining Leicester to Nottingham via an 18 mile heritage railway.
    GCR managing director Bill Ford said: ^We are delighted to announce this incredible step forward.
    ^Building this bridge unlocks the rest of the re-unification project which will create an attraction with truly international appeal.^
    Following the bridge^s construction, other elements of the overall project include repairing an existing canal bridge, building a new bridge over Railway Terrace Road in Loughborough and replacing a missing embankment.
    The estimated cost for the complete scheme is ^8m, and it is hoped trains will be running within five years.
    Mark Fowler, of Great Central Railway Nottingham, said: ^There is huge interest and excitement amongst both railway enthusiasts and the general public in seeing this project succeed.
    ^It is vitally important to us that the local communities join us in this vision too. It will drive economic benefit during construction and in the longer term too.^
    Phil Verster, route managing director for Network Rail, said: ^Our electrification teams are already making significant changes to the infrastructure in this area so it^s the ideal opportunity to get the bridge in place, with minimal disruption and cost.
    ^Once the full scheme is complete it will bring significant economic benefits to the region as well as reinstating a piece of our railway heritage.^
    Loughborough MP Nicky Morgan has worked to bring about reunification. She said: ^This is an incredibly exciting project for Loughborough, Leicestershire and beyond and I am delighted to give it my whole-hearted support.
    ^We have all seen the bridges lying next to the GCR station in Loughborough. To realise that, with the support of Network Rail and other key parties, their re-use to bring together the two parts of the Great Central Railway is now within sight, is a thrilling prospect.
    ^I am convinced that reunification will bring big benefits to our local economy and I do hope everyone locally will support this important first step.^Nigel Harris, chairman of Great Central Railway Development, said: ^This agreement is the start of the Great Central^s most exciting adventure yet; the delivery of a vision of an intercity heritage railway.
    ^It^s been a very long haul to get to this point, especially over the last 20 years, but what has unlocked the problem has been Network Rail^s willingness to work in partnership with GCR, Charnwood Borough Council, Loughborough MP Nicky Morgan and other stakeholders.
    "The whole community is invited to participate. If you^ve ever wanted to see this happen, now is the time to act!^
    To support the appeal, or for more information about building the bridge and the rest of the reunification project, visit www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify (http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on May 31, 2013, 23:35:48
    Doesn't this, from the article you quote, answer the question?

    Quote

    We have all seen the bridges lying next to the GCR station in Loughborough. To realise that, with the support of Network Rail and other key parties, their re-use to bring together the two parts of the Great Central Railway is now within sight, is a thrilling prospect.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 31, 2013, 23:44:26
    Yes, this refers to a couple of sections of girder bridge removed from the original Caversham Rd set up - before they replaced it with that massive concrete structure there were a number of track spans, some for separate single tracks, in fact I think one or two sections were removed in advance of the Christmas closure?

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 01, 2013, 00:21:35
    Presumably these are the two old relief line spans. They carried one track each, so I think they would need to be used side by side. At roughly 4 m wide by 16 long, they ought to be long enough to span a four-track line.

    The other spans that were removed had carried the goods lines, and had been unused for several years. While I have never seen anything to confirm this, I think they had been condemned as unsafe - you could see daylight through the holes in them as you walked underneath.

    Oh, and the new bridge is most definitely made of steel. Perhaps deck describes it better (orthotropic deck, if you want to be technical).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 01, 2013, 08:05:31
    Oh, and the new bridge is most definitely made of steel. Perhaps deck describes it better (orthotropic deck, if you want to be technical).

    Orthotropic means, if I recall correctly, that it spans in two dimensions both cross and along the bridge deck. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 01, 2013, 08:30:37
    Orthotropic means, if I recall correctly, that it spans in two dimensions both cross and along the bridge deck. 
    The usage of the term is a bit more specific - the deck surface is a plate that forms an essential part of the structure. The lengthwise and crosswise members are then welded to the bottom of this plate. For example, these might be U-sections that form box girders only when joined to the deck plate. This saves a lot of weight compared to a girder bridge with a deck plate loosely fixed on top of it.

    At Reading, I am sure that one of the objectives was to provide an unobstructed deck so that a variety of sweeping curves and trackwork can be installed, rather than being restricted to parallel plain tracks. Obviously a design with no members above the deck, between sides that are very far apart, is ideal.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 01, 2013, 18:47:01
    Orthotropic means, if I recall correctly, that it spans in two dimensions both cross and along the bridge deck. 
    The usage of the term is a bit more specific - the deck surface is a plate that forms an essential part of the structure. The lengthwise and crosswise members are then welded to the bottom of this plate. For example, these might be U-sections that form box girders only when joined to the deck plate. This saves a lot of weight compared to a girder bridge with a deck plate loosely fixed on top of it.

    At Reading, I am sure that one of the objectives was to provide an unobstructed deck so that a variety of sweeping curves and trackwork can be installed, rather than being restricted to parallel plain tracks. Obviously a design with no members above the deck, between sides that are very far apart, is ideal.

    It also allow the deck to be shallower maximising the height under the bridge


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 01, 2013, 20:03:35
    It also allow the deck to be shallower maximising the height under the bridge

    Quite so, in the sense that otherwise the girders or stiffeners omitted from above the deck would have to be replaced by something deeper than the current structure underneath it.

    On the other hand, the new deck is not any shallower than the deck of the old spans still there. In fact, its underside sits level with theirs (you can see this on Street View). I don't have any evidence that shows its height relative to the removed spans.

    This is rated as a low bridge, with signs saying 15'6" (4724 mm). The road is even widened just south of the bridge so that artics can do a U-turn if they need to - and I have seen it happen.
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 01, 2013, 20:19:28
    So I suppose the issue was to not make it any deeper while giving the flexibility that you mentioned.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 02, 2013, 09:00:45
    Anyone know if this is a bridge that is already removed or one that is still there?

    I did not think there was a bridge with a long enough span at Reading.

    Great Central Railway to 'bridge' the gap between Leicester and Nottingham within five years (Using Bridge from Reading) (http://www.loughboroughecho.net/news/loughborough-news/2013/05/30/73871-33406710/?)
    GREAT Central Railway is hoping to ^bridge^ the gap between the Loughborough heritage line and the Nottingham section to the north with the news a connection is to be built over the Midland Mainline.
    GCR has launched a ^1m Bridge To The Future fund-raising appeal after forming a parnership with Network Rail to build a bridge over the Midland Main Line at Loughborough.
    Design work is underway and the new structure made up of two reclaimed rail bridges from Reading is expected to be in place running over the four tracks of the Midland Mainline by mid-2015 - allowing the demolished 500m link between the two sections, rejoining Leicester to Nottingham via an 18 mile heritage railway.
     .......


    After all the discussion on the science of bridges here's a link to GCR http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/2013/05/bridge-to-the-future-fundraising-appeal/ (http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/2013/05/bridge-to-the-future-fundraising-appeal/)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 02, 2013, 15:47:25
    Obviously I did not read the GCR item carefully - my mistake.

    It does say that the bridge will take the rebuilt GCR main line over the NR line. As this is close to Loughborough station, the tracks are spread out over well over 16 m, and the bridge will only carry a single track.

    The picture does not look like the relief line spans, more like the older goods line spans but substantially rebuilt.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 02, 2013, 20:39:05
    Anyone know if this is a bridge that is already removed or one that is still there?

    I did not think there was a bridge with a long enough span at Reading.

    Quote
    Great Central Railway to 'bridge' the gap between Leicester and Nottingham within five years (Using Bridge from Reading) (http://www.loughboroughecho.net/news/loughborough-news/2013/05/30/73871-33406710/?)
    GREAT Central Railway is hoping to ^bridge^ the gap between the Loughborough heritage line and the Nottingham section to the north with the news a connection is to be built over the Midland Mainline.
    GCR has launched a ^1m Bridge To The Future fund-raising appeal after forming a parnership with Network Rail to build a bridge over the Midland Main Line at Loughborough.
    Design work is underway and the new structure made up of two reclaimed rail bridges from Reading is expected to be in place running over the four tracks of the Midland Mainline by mid-2015 - allowing the demolished 500m link between the two sections, rejoining Leicester to Nottingham via an 18 mile heritage railway.
     .......


    After all the discussion on the science of bridges here's a link to GCR http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/2013/05/bridge-to-the-future-fundraising-appeal/ (http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/2013/05/bridge-to-the-future-fundraising-appeal/)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: didcotdean on June 03, 2013, 18:13:30
    Short BBC report from 2011 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-13003379) on the bridge just after it was removed plus one with more detail (http://www.british-heritage-railways.co.uk/blog/network-rail-donates-redundant-steel-bridges-to-great-central-railway/), although it seems they have changed what they are going to do with the donated bridges.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 03, 2013, 18:53:10
    Curiouser and curiouser...

    My initial thought was that this reporter has got mixed between the two bridges taking the GCR over  the A60 and the Midland mainline. However, this report:
    http://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/news/network-rail-gives-massive-boost-to-great-central-bridge-project (http://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/news/network-rail-gives-massive-boost-to-great-central-bridge-project)
    (which is awfully similar to the British Heritage Railways one) ends with this:
    Quote
    Spanning the Midland Main Line is still the major aspect of the project, and this will be accomplished as a single span.

    So it looks as if there are to be two new bridges - the question is whether both use old Reading spans. If they do, you would have thought that was worth mentioning, not least by GCR and GCR(N)!

    The description of the two spans to be used side by side over the A60 as dating from the 1970s must mean they are the relief line ones.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on June 03, 2013, 20:02:01
    Curiouser and curiouser...

    My initial thought was that this reporter has got mixed between the two bridges taking the GCR over  the A60 and the Midland mainline. However, this report:
    http://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/news/network-rail-gives-massive-boost-to-great-central-bridge-project (http://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/news/network-rail-gives-massive-boost-to-great-central-bridge-project)
    (which is awfully similar to the British Heritage Railways one) ends with this:
    Quote
    Spanning the Midland Main Line is still the major aspect of the project, and this will be accomplished as a single span.

    So it looks as if there are to be two new bridges - the question is whether both use old Reading spans. If they do, you would have thought that was worth mentioning, not least by GCR and GCR(N)!

    The description of the two spans to be used side by side over the A60 as dating from the 1970s must mean they are the relief line ones.

    The GCR are clear on this:

    Quote

    The link will be single track to contain costs and will reuse the two bridge decks formerly over Caversham Road in Reading

    (source: http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify/unify-more-information/ (http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify/unify-more-information/)

    There's another issue - the embankment needs to be narrower than the original due to a requirement for an access road, and to allow deviation around the Preci-Spark factory.

    The GCR's website http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify/ (http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify/) illustrates the MML bridge as two spans with a central pier.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 03, 2013, 21:03:55
    Exactly - and two years ago there were clear plans for rebuilding the A60 bridge.

    Looking carefully through the three different GCR articles on this, I can find words that say:"We have to raise one million pounds, to put two previously recovered bridge decks in place by the end of 2015." and " On the northern section of the GCR, the bridge across the A60 also needs upgrading."

    So why not explain - for the benefit of anyone who saw the earlier news - that the reused spans were going to be used on the A60 bridge, but that is now going to be upgraded a different way? If it's because the A60 bridge is on the GCR(N)'s side of the gap, it does make you wonder how well the two groups will co-operate, or even merge, after the link-up.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 05, 2013, 18:12:13
    Exactly - and two years ago there were clear plans for rebuilding the A60 bridge.

    Looking carefully through the three different GCR articles on this, I can find words that say:"We have to raise one million pounds, to put two previously recovered bridge decks in place by the end of 2015." and " On the northern section of the GCR, the bridge across the A60 also needs upgrading."

    So why not explain - for the benefit of anyone who saw the earlier news - that the reused spans were going to be used on the A60 bridge, but that is now going to be upgraded a different way? If it's because the A60 bridge is on the GCR(N)'s side of the gap, it does make you wonder how well the two groups will co-operate, or even merge, after the link-up.
    I think the reason why the bridge over the MML is happening and the A60 is not is due to NR having a project team in place this makes it easier for GCR to bridge that part of the gap to do the A60 I suspect means engaging with a County Council highways and the Highways Agency who are unlikely to have a project team in place


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on June 07, 2013, 10:43:19
    It looks as though preparations are happening for the laying of track into P11 on the London side of the station.
    The ballast has been leveled and the route marked out in blue.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on June 11, 2013, 05:58:31
    Yesterday sleepers had appeared from mainline to end P11 with ballest 1/3 the way along  the platform on the London side. Coping stones at platform 11 edge were still missing.

    Also there was a DEMU in the depot area presumably doing more circuit checking.

    The new depot area looks ready to go - all the minor tidy up jobs are completed, although some OLE is missing country side from the Washing Unit to the buffer stops at Scours Lane.

    Stabilising piling is still going on outside station. Large blue and white wooden barriers mark the path of the new flyover, is is skewed quite away across into the old Network Rail sidings of the old depot - south of the old mainline path. The old mainline area is where the dive under from Reading West will surface.

    Untangling these lines and introducing the new lines is going to be quite a feat. With keeping the railway going. Anyone here want to take a quess at the order or works for the untangling.......


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 11, 2013, 10:16:34
    The new depot area looks ready to go - all the minor tidy up jobs are completed, although some OLE is missing country side from the Washing Unit to the buffer stops at Scours Lane.

    The western end OLE isn't being installed until later in the programme as some of the foundations can't be installed as the temporary main and relief line layouts next to it are in the the way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 11, 2013, 15:22:31
    ... Anyone here want to take a quess at the order or works for the untangling.......

    You asked this before, (in post #1695 page 114), and I answered with the details from the planning application in the next post. That might be a reasonable start...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 14, 2013, 09:47:08
    Steelwork frames are now going up in what will become the circulating area at the head of platforms 1-3.  They extend towards P1, and I'm told that there are foundations (already prepared but hidden under boards) along most of the platform length, so we might see some visible progress there over the next few weeks.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 14, 2013, 19:41:51
    Steelwork frames are now going up in what will become the circulating area at the head of platforms 1-3.  They extend towards P1, and I'm told that there are foundations (already prepared but hidden under boards) along most of the platform length, so we might see some visible progress there over the next few weeks.

    Paul

    If you look in Camera 2 Tab 1 and zoom in you will see that it goes part way along Platform 1 before ramping down. From then on the you cannot see how far it goes because of the temporary lighting support, but you can see four of the new uprights in position particularly if compare with the same view a few days ago.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 15, 2013, 16:01:00
    If you look in Camera 2 Tab 1 and zoom in you will see that it goes part way along Platform 1 before ramping down. From then on the you cannot see how far it goes because of the temporary lighting support, but you can see four of the new uprights in position particularly if compare with the same view a few days ago.

    Ah yes! - I missed those other uprights as there was a train in the platform - I should have changed to an earlier view.  ::)  I guess the 'ramping down' possibly deals with the change in levels between the main roof and that over the P1/2 section?

    I'm assuming though that the platform canopy will be the same sort of height as P4/5/6 - but the main roof over the open space will connect with the bottom of the main transfer deck cladding, you can see the slight angles to the lower edges I think?  The central part will be the same translucent ETFE as used on the P8/9 canopies that are wider than the others.

    Edited to add a screen grab from the planning drawing...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 15, 2013, 20:33:11
    The support rail is complete, and ends level with P8's with a stanchion for the OLE. The small slope down lines up with the invert of the staircase canopy. Here is a picture, with a close-up of the ends as well.

    The slightly higher roof does indeed fill the gap up to the main building, and seems to run straight into it. What I can't see is anything for the electric warp to be tied off to. Presumably there should be a crossbar of some kind?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 15, 2013, 20:39:44
    On another topic, there are some small yellow clamp-like objects that have just appeared on some of the sleepers of the line under the Southern underpass. What are they? (My camera failed to get a photo.) There are at least a dozen of them, on every other sleeper, about a sleeper's width long and maybe 10 cm wide.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 15, 2013, 21:09:42
    On another topic, there are some small yellow clamp-like objects that have just appeared on some of the sleepers of the line under the Southern underpass. What are they? (My camera failed to get a photo.) There are at least a dozen of them, on every other sleeper, about a sleeper's width long and maybe 10 cm wide.

    From your description it sounds as if they are 'lateral resistance plates' (or anchors)?  They add a sort of adjustable 'keel plate' to the sleeper to help prevent it floating about in the ballast, used on curves tighter than a certain radius:

    http://www.yorkareagroup.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/track-001-1024x768.jpg

    Manufacturer's info here: 
    http://www.vossloh-fastening-systems.com/en/produkte_2010/weitere_produkte/schwellenanker_sn/schwellenanker_sn.html

    Earlier versions appeared as a plate secured to the very end of the sleepers, but the current type allow for repositioning of the track while fitted, by slackening the clamp during tamping etc...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 15, 2013, 21:18:13
    [From your description it sounds as if they are 'lateral resistance plates' (or anchors)?  They add a sort of adjustable 'keel plate' to the sleeper to help prevent it floating about in the ballast, used on curves tighter than a certain radius:

    I think they probably are. Mind you, that's not much of a curve, or even none. Maybe there's some other reason to worry about track stability - but surely not the reduced clearance to the scaffolding currently up at the South side of the bridge?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 15, 2013, 21:30:02
    I think they probably are. Mind you, that's not much of a curve, or even none. Maybe there's some other reason to worry about track stability - but surely not the reduced clearance to the scaffolding currently up at the South side of the bridge?

    Educated guessing really, but it's possibly because the track in the underpass is either fixed slab track or is critically positioned with its ballast 'glued', so they won't want the track on the approach to move so much as is normally allowed.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 15, 2013, 21:40:40
    The slightly higher roof does indeed fill the gap up to the main building, and seems to run straight into it. What I can't see is anything for the electric warp to be tied off to. Presumably there should be a crossbar of some kind?

    The warp would need to be tied off between the platforms. That would presumably be part of a structure at 90 degrees to the line we can see which has yet to be erected.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 15, 2013, 21:44:11
    The slightly higher roof does indeed fill the gap up to the main building, and seems to run straight into it. What I can't see is anything for the electric warp to be tied off to. Presumably there should be a crossbar of some kind?

    The warp would need to be tied off between the platforms. That would presumably be part of a structure at 90 degrees to the line we can see which has yet to be erected.

    Exactly - but I had a good look, and there's no sign of any prepared position to bolt something to the support rail, nor to the back wall which seems too far back anyway.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 15, 2013, 22:30:47
    The slightly higher roof does indeed fill the gap up to the main building, and seems to run straight into it. What I can't see is anything for the electric warp to be tied off to. Presumably there should be a crossbar of some kind?

    The warp would need to be tied off between the platforms. That would presumably be part of a structure at 90 degrees to the line we can see which has yet to be erected.

    Exactly - but I had a good look, and there's no sign of any prepared position to bolt something to the support rail, nor to the back wall which seems too far back anyway.

    My experience from looking at photographs of these structures at reading is that prepared positions are not very visible.  I am sure they will not have forgotten the need to tie off the warp.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 16, 2013, 10:59:57
    The massive structures seen at some existing stations when electrification has terminated in bay platforms are often completely over-engineered.  Possibly because they are effectively independent  and free standing and have been added in with minimal change to existing canopies etc.

    In this case I'd expect something more lightweight which could easily be integral with something yet to be fitted, such as the west end girders of the higher overall roof?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 16, 2013, 14:26:43
    The massive structures seen at some existing stations when electrification has terminated in bay platforms are often completely over-engineered.  Possibly because they are effectively independent  and free standing and have been added in with minimal change to existing canopies etc.

    In this case I'd expect something more lightweight which could easily be integral with something yet to be fitted, such as the west end girders of the higher overall roof?

    Paul

    Electrification structures and components are to a standard range of designs from the foundations to the wire, this often results in larger structures than a Civil Engineer would design however it does mean the design process is quicker and simpler. 

    I am not an OLE engineer as a rough idea the "Goal Posts" often seen at bay platforms etc do have a wire terminal load the wire is tensioned typically by balance weights of 0.75 Tonnes through a pulley system of 3:1 so a wire tension of about 2.25 Tonnes there can be radial loading as well given the wire terminating hight there can be quite a lot of turning motion at the base also the terminating structures want to well clear of any over run through stop blocks .............

    Plus us electrification engineers like to make a statement  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 16, 2013, 14:47:41
    If (as I understand it) the lines into P1/2/3 are all effectively 'slow speed short sidings' off the down Westbury, can't they just use a lighter OHLE construction generally in the three bays, a bit like that in the new depot?  (Is it known as trolley wiring or something like that?)

    It seems standardisation might be the enemy of aesthetics...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 16, 2013, 17:17:03
    If you look at the elevations and sections (planning documents 12-00577-FUL), you find that the wiggle in the canopy for platforms 1 & 2 takes it down from the same height as platform 3 (and 7-15) to a metre or so lower. The OLE conductor wire is roughly level with the top of the higher canopies, and the catenary (which is what needs something solid to fix to) is higher still. So the terminating support is going to be above the whole canopy.

    My recollection of these things (which may not be of current British practice) is that they avoid putting weights in stations, and usually fix that end and tension form the other end. How high it has to go I am not sure; there seem to be plenty of solid supports that should mean the catenary does not need to curve up very far. No doubt there is indeed a cunning plan.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 16, 2013, 21:32:52
    If (as I understand it) the lines into P1/2/3 are all effectively 'slow speed short sidings' off the down Westbury, can't they just use a lighter OHLE construction generally in the three bays, a bit like that in the new depot?  (Is it known as trolley wiring or something like that?)

    It seems standardisation might be the enemy of aesthetics...

    Paul

    It all depends on how the wire runs work out, I'm convinced its more art than science.  Even trolley wires are under tension.

    My current project is using conductor beam now that is interesting stuff .............  apparently  ::) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 17, 2013, 08:43:04
    It all depends on how the wire runs work out, I'm convinced its more art than science.  Even trolley wires are under tension.

    My current project is using conductor beam now that is interesting stuff .............  apparently  ::) ;D

    I've just read an article about the beam system Balfour Beatty have used at St Pancras LL and in the Kings Cross tunnels on the Thameslink project.

    In the June edition of the online Rail Engineer magazine here:  http://www.therailengineer.com/print-archive/

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 17, 2013, 22:03:54
    It all depends on how the wire runs work out, I'm convinced its more art than science.  Even trolley wires are under tension.

    My current project is using conductor beam now that is interesting stuff .............  apparently  ::) ;D

    I've just read an article about the beam system Balfour Beatty have used at St Pancras LL and in the Kings Cross tunnels on the Thameslink project.

    In the June edition of the online Rail Engineer magazine here:  http://www.therailengineer.com/print-archive/

    Paul 

    That's the stuff, the inner core area used 80mm beam the project I am involved in, which is part of TLP, will use 115mm beam.

    There is talk of using it in GWML tunnels the only problem is none of the GWML tunnels have slab track which a requirement for 200kph (125 mph)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 18, 2013, 12:05:22
    That's the stuff, the inner core area used 80mm beam the project I am involved in, which is part of TLP, will use 115mm beam.

    Would that possibly be the Canal Tunnels then, given the lack of other obvious or likely candidate areas?

    Hadn't realise that above a certain speed you'd need slab track under a beam conductor in a tunnel, but presumably that's because you can no longer alter the position of the beam easily to follow any slight track movement?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 18, 2013, 15:36:25
    That's the stuff, the inner core area used 80mm beam the project I am involved in, which is part of TLP, will use 115mm beam.

    Would that possibly be the Canal Tunnels then, given the lack of other obvious or likely candidate areas?

    Hadn't realise that above a certain speed you'd need slab track under a beam conductor in a tunnel, but presumably that's because you can no longer alter the position of the beam easily to follow any slight track movement?

    Paul

    Canal Tunnels is the one, the fit out is in full swing and will be substantially complete early next year.

    Conductor beam is very unforgiving, it dose not move (or very little) so the slightest shift in track geometry cause a problem


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 28, 2013, 16:34:31
    Couple of observations today:

    Platform 8/9 west end retail space is now occupied by WH Smith.  Unfortunately, having removed the covering from the windows facing along the platform, all passengers waiting in the area between the escalators and the building can see is the back of all the shelves and stuff. Anyone arriving down the escalators wouldn't even know there was a shop there...   (I appreciate it may be a work in progress.)

    Around 1200 an ECS DMU left platform 13B or 14B, (not quite sure, I was on P7 at the time), and headed into the new stabling sidings.  Realtimetrains and opentraintimes show no details though, so I was wondering if this was some sort of trial?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on June 28, 2013, 21:26:47
    There were three sets on the new depot this evening, in the West end sidings.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 29, 2013, 11:42:33
    Yes, the sidings and depot are now in use - as stated in my post a couple of pages back a staged transfer from old to new is taking place from Friday 21st June up to full commissioning on Sunday 14th July.  This should allow procedures to be fine tuned before drivers start arriving en-masse for their sets in the morning.  Hopefully all will go smoothly, though changing from a depot where most sets are stabled on different sidings, to a depot where there is lots more space but a limited number of sidings will involve changes in the way things work.  I expect there to be the odd problem!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on June 29, 2013, 22:27:11
    That's the stuff, the inner core area used 80mm beam the project I am involved in, which is part of TLP, will use 115mm beam.

    The low Level at Berlin HBF uses beam. Not sure if it's slab track but it's relatively low speed as everything stops. However, they don't seem to go in for defensive driving so appeoches can be quite fast.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on June 30, 2013, 17:31:11
    Hopefully all will go smoothly, though changing from a depot where most sets are stabled on different sidings, to a depot where there is lots more space but a limited number of sidings will involve changes in the way things work.  I expect there to be the odd problem!

    I can help with this one. Our office car park works to a similar constraint.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 05, 2013, 20:34:19
    Cyclists officially banned from Reading Station subway

    From  Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/traffic-regulation-order-bans-cycling-4867313)

    Quote
    (http://i2.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article4867315.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/Station-underpass-4867315.jpg)

    An order banning cycling in the newly renovated Reading Station subway has been passed by Reading Borough Council.

    Eleven people objected to the proposed traffic regulation order, saying the subway would create a safer alternative to cycling on Vastern Road.

    But the council says the subway is too low for cyclists to use.

    The traffic regulation order was discussed at a meeting of the council^s traffic management sub-committee on Thursday, June 13.

    An Earley resident wrote to the council saying: ^If the council prohibits cycling through the subway this would be a lamentable failure to fully grasp this opportunity to enhance the town^s sustainable transport infrastructure.^

    Another objector said: ^I live in Caversham and have to contend with the Vastern roundabout every day.

    ^This is a horrible place to cycle. I want to be able to cycle the one mile to town with my family safely.

    ^I do not want to encounter a cycling dismount sign after millions have been spent on transport redevelopment.^

    However, a report to the sub-committee said the existing subway was the only viable option to re-providing a pedestrian route across the station, following the loss of the old pedestrian bridge, and it was too low for cyclists.

    It said the national standard minimum height for a shared cycle/pedestrian subway was 2.7m and the minimum height of the station subway was only 2.23m.

    The report by traffic officer Cris Butler said: ^There is no deviation from the current standard that will allow cycling through the subway now or at any time in the future.

    ^However, there is nothing to prevent a cyclist from dismounting and pushing a bike through the subway, therefore travelling at the same safe speed as a pedestrian.^

    Councillor Tony Page, chairman of the sub-committee, said: ^The whole environment either side of the tunnel will be pedestrian friendly, which is another reason we should ask the cyclists to dismount and wheel their bikes through the subway.^

    The sub-commitee voted to approve the banning order with no public inquiry.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on July 05, 2013, 20:55:20
    Cyclists officially banned from Reading Station subway

    From  Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/traffic-regulation-order-bans-cycling-4867313)

    Quote
    (http://i2.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article4867315.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/Station-underpass-4867315.jpg)

    An order banning cycling in the newly renovated Reading Station subway has been passed by Reading Borough Council.

    Eleven people objected to the proposed traffic regulation order, saying the subway would create a safer alternative to cycling on Vastern Road.

    But the council says the subway is too low for cyclists to use.

    The traffic regulation order was discussed at a meeting of the council^s traffic management sub-committee on Thursday, June 13.

    An Earley resident wrote to the council saying: ^If the council prohibits cycling through the subway this would be a lamentable failure to fully grasp this opportunity to enhance the town^s sustainable transport infrastructure.^

    Another objector said: ^I live in Caversham and have to contend with the Vastern roundabout every day.

    ^This is a horrible place to cycle. I want to be able to cycle the one mile to town with my family safely.

    ^I do not want to encounter a cycling dismount sign after millions have been spent on transport redevelopment.^

    However, a report to the sub-committee said the existing subway was the only viable option to re-providing a pedestrian route across the station, following the loss of the old pedestrian bridge, and it was too low for cyclists.

    It said the national standard minimum height for a shared cycle/pedestrian subway was 2.7m and the minimum height of the station subway was only 2.23m.

    The report by traffic officer Cris Butler said: ^There is no deviation from the current standard that will allow cycling through the subway now or at any time in the future.

    ^However, there is nothing to prevent a cyclist from dismounting and pushing a bike through the subway, therefore travelling at the same safe speed as a pedestrian.^

    Councillor Tony Page, chairman of the sub-committee, said: ^The whole environment either side of the tunnel will be pedestrian friendly, which is another reason we should ask the cyclists to dismount and wheel their bikes through the subway.^

    The sub-commitee voted to approve the banning order with no public inquiry.
    Good cyclists are after able to get off and walk, they are a danger to pedestrians especially in a subway like this.
    We had a work college hospitalised this week while crossing on "green man" and a speeding cyclist jumped a red light came round a conner and bowled her over; I accept not all cyclists are irresponsible its just I've not come across many that are considerate to pedestrians


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 05, 2013, 21:16:12
    Without taking this thread too far off topic, I'd agree with you Electric Train.  I cycle two miles a day and hardly a day goes by when I am not overtaken by a fellow cyclist intent on jumping the lights.  (I agree I cheat too - I have an electric bike!)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: didcotdean on July 05, 2013, 22:19:25
    There is a pedestrian walkway under the railway in Didcot that has had 'Cyclists Dismount' signs at each end for years. Regrettably I doubt one in five actually does, even though it is barely wide enough for pedestrians to pass each other going in opposite directions.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on July 05, 2013, 22:20:45

    Good cyclists are after able to get off and walk, they are a danger to pedestrians especially in a subway like this.
    We had a work college hospitalised this week while crossing on "green man" and a speeding cyclist jumped a red light came round a conner and bowled her over; I accept not all cyclists are irresponsible its just I've not come across many that are considerate to pedestrians


    Seems a bit absurd to me - I'm pretty tall but I'm sure I don't need 2.7m headroom.

    Looks to me like there's room there for a bicycle lane

    Cyclists disobeying red lights and flattening pedestrians on crossings is a completely separate issue and has no relevance to this, though I agree that there can be problems in badly-designed 'shared' spaces.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 06, 2013, 00:13:13
    And there are plenty of badly designed shared spaces and cycle lanes out there. There's a website dedicated to finding and documenting them, with the latest (July 2013) from Swindon:

    http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pete.meg/wcc/facility-of-the-month/



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 09, 2013, 12:38:51
    Had a wander round the transfer deck yesterday for the first time in a while and noticed that the information screens have changed to show the next fastest train by destination rather than a list of the next few departures and their calling points.  A much better set-up for a station as busy as Reading and with four columns of A-Z listed stations, the most popular 56 can be displayed.  Paddington has a display devoted to itself.  I reckon the vast majority of passengers can now easily see their next train and platform, though there are still some popular stations omitted such as Goring & Streatley, Burnham and Banbury (another column would be useful!).  Here is a (slightly blurred) picture:

    (http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7322/9247961104_10db11a03e_c.jpg)


    Signage is still a little poor, though I'm led to believe that it is recognised that the platform numbers are far too small up on the deck, so we can expect that to change soon.  Rather unprofessional barriers still help with passenger flow to/from the escalators, so hopefully they will be replaced with something a little more permanent looking.

    Oh, and a very pleasant breeze was coming through the open holes in the roof cooling it down a little up there on what was a very hot day, so at least the holes do come in useful - as long as it's not raining, and it remains to be seen how cold it gets in winter!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 09, 2013, 12:42:12
    I noticed those screens yesterday too, but they would be more helpful if they showed the platform as well as the departure time....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 09, 2013, 12:57:10
    I noticed those screens yesterday too, but they would be more helpful if they showed the platform as well as the departure time....

    Yes they could almost do with being in "Landscape mode" rather than "portait mode"

    All in all can't find the signage that bad (at Reading) as I tend to use it in peference to digging my mobile out of my pocket



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 09, 2013, 13:46:14
    I noticed those screens yesterday too, but they would be more helpful if they showed the platform as well as the departure time....

    They do, don't they?  Rotate between showing the time, the expected time, and the platform.  Wider displays would be nice though, so all of that could be displayed at once!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 09, 2013, 14:12:57
    A nice big Solari would do the trick!  :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 09, 2013, 14:15:32
    A nice big Solari would do the trick!  :P

    Blimey I havent seen (or heard,even!) one of those in years!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on July 09, 2013, 14:46:44
    A nice big Solari would do the trick!  :P

    Is that:

    1. A type of ice lolly;
    2. The latest Mobile Death Greenhouse from Vauxhall;
    3. A type of slang popularised in 'Round the Horne'?

    Edit: OK, I googled it. I have a distant memory of being in a London terminus late one night (or rather early one morning), hoping to get home, and watching as the whole board ticked over to black - one of the most dispiriting things I've ever experienced.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 09, 2013, 15:00:35
    Who remembers the liquid crystal ones they used to have at Paddington in the 1980s? They were so proud of them when they were installed but they quickly suffered from failures.  I was reminded of them the other day when they were shown in an episode of Inspector Morse which included shots of Paddington.

    I noticed those screens yesterday too, but they would be more helpful if they showed the platform as well as the departure time....

    They do, don't they?  Rotate between showing the time, the expected time, and the platform.  Wider displays would be nice though, so all of that could be displayed at once!

    Ah perhaps they do - I didn't notice when I looked at them and they weren't visible in the photo I made the mistake of assuming they didn't.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on July 10, 2013, 13:37:23
    The North Exit though is still missing an Arrivals display screen.  It has three screens all dedicated to departures currently.

    This exit is now more busy thanks to the new north exit bus interchange opening.  Additionally, you have the car pick-up zone of people waiting to pick up folk.

    A few Sunday's back I was waiting for my wife to arrive at Reading on the train from Gatwick in the North Exit.  As there was no arrivals info I asked a member of staff who said they assumed it was on time.  I was then left waiting an extra 10 minutes because it had in fact been delayed.

    This seems to me an oversight as I've witnessed other people waiting to meet people arriving at Reading at that exit.

    Boppy.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 10, 2013, 13:43:07
    I agree an arrivals board at the north exit would be useful.  I noticed that buses and taxis had started using the new interchange there - another part of the Reading jigsaw completed!  What bus services are currently using it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 10, 2013, 23:21:31
    This shows the route numbers

    http://www.reading-buses.co.uk/files/maps/8%20July%202013/final%20maps/reading%20town%20centre%20bus%20stops%20July%2013.pdf (http://www.reading-buses.co.uk/files/maps/8%20July%202013/final%20maps/reading%20town%20centre%20bus%20stops%20July%2013.pdf)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on July 11, 2013, 18:40:53
    I went through Reading today on the way to Bracknell.. My train (local stopping service from Paddington to Reading) came in on platform 7 which was a first, although very handy for the South West trains platform. There was only ten minutes before a penzance train was due on that platform so not sure how that would work as it should have been returning to Paddington as a stopping service but they'd have had to move it from that platform quite quickly..

    Whilst coming home I was on platform 10 and noticed a sign advising us not to stand on the "hatching" on platform 10. Obviously I noticed the sign after I'd been stood on it for quite a while and nothing bad happened, but I wonder if anyone knows why we're not supposed to stand there?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 11, 2013, 21:57:45
    I went through Reading today on the way to Bracknell.. My train (local stopping service from Paddington to Reading) came in on platform 7 which was a first, although very handy for the South West trains platform. There was only ten minutes before a penzance train was due on that platform so not sure how that would work as it should have been returning to Paddington as a stopping service but they'd have had to move it from that platform quite quickly..
    The obvious reason is that the unit is going to the depot, whatever its diagram said. Getting from platforms 12-15 to the old depot involves going back to Kennet Bridge and crossing to (usually) P7 anyway.

    Depending on how the transfer to the new depot is being phased, it may be one of the last still based there - or perhaps it's making one last nostalgic visit?
    Quote
    Whilst coming home I was on platform 10 and noticed a sign advising us not to stand on the "hatching" on platform 10. Obviously I noticed the sign after I'd been stood on it for quite a while and nothing bad happened, but I wonder if anyone knows why we're not supposed to stand there?
    Isn't that where the platform has less than the acceptable minimum depth for passengers to stand and move about behind the yellow line?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on July 11, 2013, 22:21:53
    Thanks Stuving. usually the Stoppers go up and down between Paddington and Reading but maybe the 10.04 from Maidenhead is the exception...It's the first time I've seen it though and I do that journey quite often..

    Good point re platform 10.. That didn't occur to me...Thank you  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on July 11, 2013, 22:39:34
    London-Reading stoppers do generally form stoppers back to London but at the start and the end of the peak they often run into the depot as well as services will generally run with less carriages in the off-peak, with the spare units going to the depot between the peaks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on July 11, 2013, 23:56:02
    Thanks Stuving. usually the Stoppers go up and down between Paddington and Reading but maybe the 10.04 from Maidenhead is the exception...It's the first time I've seen it though and I do that journey quite often..

    Good point re platform 10.. That didn't occur to me...Thank you  ;D

    Might you have been on the 0955 from Maidenhead, arriving Reading 1015:
    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P01329/2013/07/11/advanced

    As deduced above, the train went from platform 7 to the old depot. The timetable also shows that from Monday, it will instead be scheduled to arrive at platform 13, before going to the new depot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on July 12, 2013, 09:31:32
    I was at Reading late last night, arriving on a Padd-Oxf service (comprised of 2x2-car 165's stuck together, but pretty busy considering it was around midnight) and noticed a lot of work going on around Platforms 1 and 2.

    My next train, the 0020 to Newbury departed from Plat. 9A as a result.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on July 12, 2013, 19:13:20
    ...but pretty busy considering it was around midnight) and noticed a lot of work going on around Platforms 1 and 2.

    There is infrastructure work going on around p1/p2 most nights it seems . A large 400V power distribution cupboard went in a couple of weeks ago and it looks like underground works are taking place along the platforms, judging by the fresh concrete some mornings.

    I also saw the following piece of genius engineering last week :)

    J.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 16, 2013, 09:18:18
    As deduced above, the train went from platform 7 to the old depot. The timetable also shows that from Monday, it will instead be scheduled to arrive at platform 13, before going to the new depot.

    I see this morning that there are some North Downs line services showing delays "train late from depot", and earlier one (2O27 6:06 Shalford) was cancelled "a problem at the depot (MU)". I wasn't watching yesterday - how did it go (not just for North Downs)?

    I can imagine that the first day, with a transfer plan to manage what train is where, it might be just fine. The first time they have to put trains in one night and get them out the next morning, they find some problems with the schedule that was worked out in advance.

    By the way, I did notice that the last train from Wokingham to Reading (2C79 from Waterloo arrives 1:04) was replaced by a bus last night. No sign of announced works, but it is listed as a WTT variation until Thursday this week. Is there any specific work going on?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on July 17, 2013, 12:07:51
    The removal of the P3/P7 roof has been taking place over the last couple of nights - everyone at that end should be getting a good suntan now ;)
    It can be seen (or rather not!) at the left side of camera 02#02


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 17, 2013, 19:21:56
    Here's a picture of what's left of the canopy as it looked this morning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 17, 2013, 20:14:47
    Yesterday I saw two guys in red rompers carrying a steel sheet pile (shades of "The Plank") off across the deck, down the North escalator, and out through the barrier. Do you think that using this route is part of the construction plan?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 17, 2013, 20:28:19
    I saw today that some concrete sleepers have been laid along what used to the middle road between platforms 7 and 8 today.   I assume this will be the new layout for platform 7.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/read7.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 18, 2013, 21:41:57
    The platform number signs on the transfer deck have now been enlarged as promised.  Maybe not quite the size I was hoping for, but much better than the old tiny ones, and help to avoid confusion with people trying to find a platform 13, but only seeing signs for a 13A and 13B.  They won't stop someone asking where platform 98 is though - as I was asked the other day as someone was catching a train departing from platform 9B.  :D

    (http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3684/9314603943_44c6122895.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 18, 2013, 23:07:05
    I wonder if they intend to remove the massive numbers above the platform level lift doors? 

    I do think they are totally inappropriate - they'd be far more use opposite the lift doors, ie on the escalator/stairs support structure above the bin cupboards etc, that way they'd actually help people arriving by lift...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on July 19, 2013, 18:45:34
    New depot finally opens:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23354169

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23361642 (video)

    Looking very modern compared the old one!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on July 19, 2013, 18:53:35
    Sad to see Cow Lane Depot go spent a good summer there in 1977 when I was an apprentice, was and I certain they still are a great team of fitters, electricians etc, they have always maintained a high level of availability of the units in their care.   

    I wish them well with their new facilities.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 20, 2013, 12:06:49
    New depot finally opens...

    That makes it sound as if it is late, but I'm fairly sure it has been brought into full use significantly earlier than the date originally announced.

    The CP4 milestones still show the depot completion as Key Output 2 due in November 2013...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on July 21, 2013, 17:41:56
    This is not the first recent project to be completed early by National Rail, although by other measurements it is 30 years late.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 22, 2013, 09:04:01
    New depot finally opens:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23354169

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23361642 (video)

    Looking very modern compared the old one!

    ... both the article and video explain that the depot is in the way of the 'new flyover' which is not correct any more, now that the eastern curve (Reading Feeder Line) is remaining on the level and the mainlines are going on the flyover. 

    I feel the BBC are also giving a bit too much weight to the lack of an order for new trains - it is widely understood that the DfT's current plan is to tack the relevant units onto existing orders for Southern, this is underway and should easily meet the target date.  The original plan after all was to use cascaded 319s freed up the Thameslink route, what is happening now ought to be a far better solution, so we shouldnt be too critical...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on July 22, 2013, 09:45:36

    I feel the BBC are also giving a bit too much weight to the lack of an order for new trains - it is widely understood that the DfT's current plan is to tack the relevant units onto existing orders for Southern, this is underway and should easily meet the target date.  The original plan after all was to use cascaded 319s freed up the Thameslink route, what is happening now ought to be a far better solution, so we shouldnt be too critical...


    Oh dear the TV commuters aren't going to like being switched from 377 type units to TFL cattle wagons for Crossrail!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 22, 2013, 10:30:15
    Oh dear the TV commuters aren't going to like being switched from 377 type units to TFL cattle wagons for Crossrail!

    Crossrail 10 car trains have been specced for 450 seats, ie 45 per car on average.  Logically that number has to include significant amounts of 2+2 seating.  I'm assuming by 'TfL cattle wagons' you mean the LO 378s, with their 32 longitudinal seats per carriage?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 22, 2013, 10:40:41
    Bit off topic now (mods to move to the Crossrail thread?), but I think that a sensible seating layout for the Crossrail design would be 2+2 metro style seating (as on the LM/LO Class 172s) for part of the train which works out at about 60 seats per carriage and longitudinal seating for the other part at around 32 seats per carriage.

    If you had the middle four carriages as longitudinal and the three carriages at either end as 2+2 metro then that would give you around 490 seats which is similar to the spec - slight reductions for disabled spaces, bike spaces and toilets might be needed to take that back down to somewhere near the specified 450 seats.

    That would mean those who are travelling longer distances from places like Taplow and Burnham could get relatively comfy seating at either end of the train, with those travelling shorter distances in the core section able to pack into the middle carriages with their ample standing room.  Just an idea...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 22, 2013, 10:57:19
    I feel the BBC are also giving a bit too much weight to the lack of an order for new trains - it is widely understood that the DfT's current plan is to tack the relevant units onto existing orders for Southern, this is underway and should easily meet the target date.  The original plan after all was to use cascaded 319s freed up the Thameslink route, what is happening now ought to be a far better solution, so we shouldnt be too critical...

    The TV report also made a point that the depot was designed for electrics and there won't be any for years - somewhat wide of the mark, given that the depot was rapidly re-designed when electrification was announced (unless this was done from the start as an option).

    I noted last week that the DMUs were spread around both the "IEP" sidings and the D/EMU ones past the depot. As the six "IEP" sidings have access at both ends, that adds the equivalent of 12 extra parallel sidings to the seven (or eight) in the far set (based on the plans published by RBC). So the potential problem of stacking order should be minimal.

    The D/EMU sidings are pretty long, relative to the length of trains. So why isn't there an access track running across them at the far end? There is also scope to extend the track half-way that leads to the shorter three sidings to allow all three long ones to be used as six halves.

    And what are the "IEP sidings" for? I didn't think IEP was going to be used on any services that start or finish at Reading. What have I missed?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 22, 2013, 11:40:20

    And what are the "IEP sidings" for? I didn't think IEP was going to be used on any services that start or finish at Reading. What have I missed?

    Stabling and depot locations aren't always at the end of a route. They just run ECS to a suitable start point as appropriate.  Another point is that services running at start and end of the day don't necessarily have to run over the whole route, some may even start very early from Reading to provide outbound services from Paddington and vice versa at the end of the day.

    The sort of thing I'm thinking of is what XC do at their Eastleigh stabling site, they throw out eight Voyagers every morning, which start variously at Southampton, Reading, Bournemouth and Winchester; but they would be mostly considered to be part of XC's 'Bournemouth' services...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: pfneeves on July 23, 2013, 07:43:44
    Walking over the deck this morning saw that all the rest of the roof on Platform 7 has now been removed and only the framework is left.

    Hopefully now that work has started to remove the roof on this platform means that the work to put the new canopies on this platform and 1& 2 is going to start properly. The work on the canopy on Platform 1 & 2 seems to have come to a grinding halt. They have put the girders up and nothing since that. Although saying that they do seem to have had fun digging up the platform all over the place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on July 23, 2013, 09:48:58
    Hopefully now that work has started to remove the roof on this platform means that the work to put the new canopies on this platform and 1& 2 is going to start properly.

    The surface of P1/2 has been completely redone very subtly, overnight - there is a new drain channel down the centre and all the brickwork has been relaid (except around the bases of the temporary supports, of course) with a nice gradient into the drain. Only the edging stones are unchanged at present.

    All the riser girders are in place along the remaining length of P8/9 too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 23, 2013, 11:18:50
    Hopefully now that work has started to remove the roof on this platform means that the work to put the new canopies on this platform and 1& 2 is going to start properly. The work on the canopy on Platform 1 & 2 seems to have come to a grinding halt. They have put the girders up and nothing since that. Although saying that they do seem to have had fun digging up the platform all over the place.

    But how do you know it isn't happening exactly as planned?   If they want to run the normal services, P1/2 cannot be closed.  As far as I have been told by people on site, going back to the original start of demolition, their schedule has always assumed very limited overnight access, which is why the platform has been covered in removable decking for so long.

    Perhaps they need to be able to bring a mobile crane into the Station Hill worksite to crane in the roof sections - that would seem a feasible approach - but clearly wouldn't be possible at the moment.  Maybe the August bank holiday closure of the route section, with buses between Reading and Reading West, will see the roof go on in one 'big bang'?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 23, 2013, 15:11:29
    BBC report of one less "iconic" neighbour to show up the new station.
    (from http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23410196 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-23410196))

    Quote
    Reading's Thames Tower to be re-clad not demolished
    Developers who said they would replace a derelict building in Reading with a 25-storey skyscraper have scrapped their original plans.


    LaSalle, which owns Thames Tower, planned to demolish the 1974 building and replace it with a "landmark" development.

    It now says the skyscraper is "too risky" and plans to strip the tower back to its structure and reclad it.

    Reading councillor Tony Page said he was "deeply disappointed".

    He said there was "enormous public support" for replacing Thames Tower.

    'Costly building'
    However, he added he was "reassured" that the developer would continue to work towards the regeneration of the Station Hill area.

    The development is next to Reading Station, which is currently undergoing a ^895m revamp.

    LaSalle's European director, Andrew Bull, said he still believed the site was "one of the best office locations outside London".

    "Reading's economy remains buoyant, but the problems in the European and UK economies are continuing for longer than anyone had expected," he said.

    "We do not have confidence that we can fill so much space at the rents required by such a costly building."


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on July 24, 2013, 09:26:30
    Are the short-term plans for Station Hill documented anywhere now that pedestrian access has been diverted elsewhere ?

    I see the shopfronts have all been boarded up and painted an eco compliant green colour but that doesn't exactly draw the eye from the immense gravel pit in the foreground.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 24, 2013, 11:09:05
    There's a planning application available here:  http://planning.reading.gov.uk/fastweb_PL/welcome.asp

    You'll have to search using the application number as links go stale.

    Planning Application Number:   130440

    Site Address:   
    Western Tower Office and 26-58 Station Hill Reading RG1 1NF

    Description:   
    Demolition of Station Hill Retail Parade (including 26 to 58 Station Hill) to create a multipurpose area to be used for holding temporary events. Works of hard and soft landscaping and other incidental works.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 01, 2013, 17:47:47
    Not reported on so far to the best of my knowledge, but I noticed today that the vertical steelwork sections for the P8/9 canopy have been installed, and they reach about as far as the London end of P7, suggesting that (unlike on the relief side) the vast majority of the main line platforms will be undercover.

    I recall there were some concerns a while back about the canopy lengths...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 01, 2013, 19:48:24
    Not reported on so far to the best of my knowledge, but I noticed today that the vertical steelwork sections for the P8/9 canopy have been installed, and they reach about as far as the London end of P7, suggesting that (unlike on the relief side) the vast majority of the main line platforms will be undercover.

    I recall there were some concerns a while back about the canopy lengths...   ;D

    Paul
    The concern was more with the relief platform canopies, given their use as  two halves. The mains are shown about as long in the drawings as you describe; the puzzle there is that those drawings show pre-rebuild platform extents and they are being built shorter.

    I presume P3/7 will soon gets its stanchions too - it had lost all the canopy frame by Monday, and the pillars should be gone this week.

    And actually it was noted a week ago (#1930).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 01, 2013, 22:07:15
    And actually it was noted a week ago (#1930).

    So it was.  I mustn't have reacted to the word 'risers' when scanning through, unfortunately...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 02, 2013, 18:22:27
    A couple of lorry loads of platform roofing sections have been delivered today, they are stacked outside the north side office entrance;  visible on webcam 1/3 (that doesn't normally show much nowadays...

    I reckon they look about the right size for P10/11;  assuming they would deliver P1 and P2 stuff to the south side, once they can get a crane into the vicinity.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 03, 2013, 19:38:00
    Yesterday I found the platform displays of P1-7 all showing the "Welcome to Reading..." message. Today those at the entry to P4-6 were entirely blank. In both cases nothing (other than the usual PA announcements) was done to avoid the untidy heap of baffled passengers in the limited space at the end of P4-6.

    Yesterday one of the dispatchers on P7 was doing extra announcements as loud as he could manage without a loud-hailer. At the entry to P1-2 someone had found a whiteboard, with only static information but that happens to be valid until after 8 pm. Surely the obligatory response to this failure should be a white-board and a dispatcher with a marker pen to update the time and destination for each train as it arrives?

    ( On another type of confusion: the 18:34 to Gatwick left from P14A today (though realtimetrains does not show this or the incoming movement). As it came in, the "this train is not scheduled to stop" announcement was played, which was puzzling as the 18:48 to Paddington was already standing at P14B. )


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 03, 2013, 20:48:49
    Hmm Interesting post stuving.
    Here's an observation from the trusty live train information at Reading for today Saturday 08/08/2013.
    The reason why is that my sister was due to go to Southampton for a day trip, and what i found interesting is that a Arriva Crosscountry train was arriving and departing from platform 10!. I thought only non stop London Paddington trains where due to run through platform 10 but was amazed to see on the live information page that a arriva crosscountry train come in at 1807 and left at 1818, with another train due at 1820. How does that work when one train is heading west and the other is coming head on with the Cross Country?
    My question here, is why was the cross country in platform 10 and not in it's normal platform 13 or 14, or has the train system for layout's at reading changed?
    It would have been a simple change at Reading, but as ever it never works like that


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 03, 2013, 21:11:58
    The reason why is that my sister was due to go to Southampton for a day trip, and what i found interesting is that a Arriva Crosscountry train was arriving and departing from platform 10!.

    XC services must use one of platforms 8, 9 or 10 if reversing to or from the south, there is no route provided from the relief line side of the station towards Reading West.  Hence the majority of XC services on Monday to Saturday (to/from Bournemouth or Southampton) do NOT use P13 or P14, and have not been able to do so since the Easter changes.

    If you check out a site such as realtimetrains for a weekday (link below) you'll see that P8/9/10 are all well used.  P10 is the current  default for all up main trains, whether stopping or not, but it is still available for reversers as well. During the off-peak certain HST operated services run through platform 15 when P10 is occupied by XC, they crossover to the reliefs at Tilehurst and back to the mains at Kennet Bridge junction:

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=Reading&date=9%2F8%2F2013&tocs=XC&timespan=4&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1

    Link should be valid for weekday XC trains until next Friday or so...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 03, 2013, 21:18:30
    ( On another type of confusion: the 18:34 to Gatwick left from P14A today (though realtimetrains does not show this or the incoming movement). As it came in, the "this train is not scheduled to stop" announcement was played, which was puzzling as the 18:48 to Paddington was already standing at P14B. )

    A very common scenario, and not just at Reading.  The PIS is picking up on the fact that is an ECS (Class 5) train, and defaults to the 'non stopping' message.  It might be better to play the 'not in public service' message, to be more relevant to what's actually occurring.     

    Another regular that occurs, is that they play 'not scheduled to stop' for freight trains that are booked to stop for a driver change...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 03, 2013, 21:30:32
    Ah i see, that's cleared that one up then. Regardless of that, Reading Station is looking very impressive. No complaints from me. In fact this is the only piece of railway infrastructure to be built, that is worth the disruption and money.
    Maybe other area's should take this wonderful design idea and put it into action.
    Also once electrification gets going well then i think Reading will then have done enough to satisfy the council and other bodies to make it a City of the Thames Valley, because other times it tried to become a city were turned down on the grounds that the Station of Reading needed bigger platforms and major redevelopment. Well i hope it receives city states as it deserves it. Well done Network Rail, however you still have other work to do so don't fall foul of your duties, because you can achieve great things like you have done here.

    I will watch what happens here, and if all goes well, then maybe it should look at the Didcot Area.
    One idea is to build a flyover so that fast london to oxford services and fast crosscountry services can cross from the main's to the relief's without crossing the other lines, reducing delays further and enhancing extra capacity for the mainlines. What ever idea network rail has, may sure it happens soon, thats my advice.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: laird on August 03, 2013, 22:19:07
    The next challenge in terms of a bottleneck is Reading to Southcote Junction (via Reading West) the Reading design permits for conversion from two to three tracks although a new bridge near Reading West would be required. (Didcot isn't much of a problem because the peak flow is in a consistent direction in Morning and Evening).


    At Reading station what concerns me with the delivered design is the passenger flow which seems abysmal and with little hope of improvement.
    I am always pleased to see the modernity of glass, steel and concrete completed by the addition of the semi-permanent blue barriers at the top of the escalators from the new Southern entrance. :-)

    Something also seems wrong with the proportion of Platforms 8 and 9 in comparison to 10 and 11. While 8 and 9 will eventually handle a similar number of passengers to 10 and 11, 10 and 11 will cope not only with the same transiting number of passengers + the morning commuters waiting for their fast services to Paddington.

    I guess in a while we will be enjoying the winter and as the escalators fail under the strain and contamination from being exposed to the elements the city assessors can arrive to see the boarded up mecca bingo, old bus station and associated buildings ... truly Reading has taken a step forward in its desire to become a city. ;-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: aleph_0 on August 03, 2013, 23:36:05
    Something also seems wrong with the proportion of Platforms 8 and 9 in comparison to 10 and 11. While 8 and 9 will eventually handle a similar number of passengers to 10 and 11, 10 and 11 will cope not only with the same transiting number of passengers + the morning commuters waiting for their fast services to Paddington.

    Whilst I suspect the size of the islands was motivated by practical means, the sizes make sense imo. Passengers using 10/11 shouldn't be waiting on it long before jumping on the train. OTOH, A passenger on platform 8/9 may be waiting some time for their specific train.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 03, 2013, 23:50:32
    As we've discussed before, the fact that 8/9 is relatively large is because they simply retained the full existing island for ease of construction.  It happened to have been sized to allow for the closed bay platforms, but it doesn't therefore follow that the new 10/11 is too narrow.

    As pointed out in the previous reply, passengers using P10/11 should not normally have to wait longer than the next train.  It is also P8/9 which seems to get the better waiting facilities, I suspect because they've realised that people heading west on trains with a much lower relative frequency per destination will tend to turn up earlier and wait longer for their specific train...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 04, 2013, 08:46:09
    Track seems to have been laid in P11 early this morning


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 04, 2013, 12:34:17
    Track seems to have been laid in P11 early this morning

    Looking at web cam 1/1 they made quick progress, with sleepers being delivered at around 0400, and top ballast going in by mid morning. 

    Has anyone noticed if the junctions with the P10 line have been fitted - there was a discussion  a while back somewhere that suggested they'd initially just use plain line and divert the existing route through P11, and leave the S&C until P10 was rebuilt, and its replacement track completed?

    IYSWIM...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 04, 2013, 13:10:19
    Has anyone noticed if the junctions with the P10 line have been fitted - there was a discussion  a while back somewhere that suggested they'd initially just use plain line and divert the existing route through P11, and leave the S&C until P10 was rebuilt, and its replacement track completed?

    I dimly recall that the junction at the London end was laid some time ago.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 04, 2013, 13:23:18
    I dimly recall that the junction at the London end was laid some time ago.
    Yes, because that piece of track is in its final form and position. At the country end, it won't be final until after the embankment is finished and the new main lines are in place on it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 04, 2013, 18:04:50
    You can see the London End connection to Platform No.11 just to the right of the signal cage here (taken on 11 May 2013):
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1375126025/IMG_0102a.JPG?cache=0.8605168561916798)
    Image (c)2013 S&TEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 04, 2013, 18:09:30
    A very common scenario, and not just at Reading.  The PIS is picking up on the fact that is an ECS (Class 5) train, and defaults to the 'non stopping' message.  It might be better to play the 'not in public service' message, to be more relevant to what's actually occurring.     
    Paul

    Hold on - I don't follow. This was incoming ECS to form the next outgoing service. Surely that never ought to trigger either of these warnings.

    Does the system perhaps need to be told explicitly that an ECS working forms a passenger service at a platform? In that case inconsistent information could lead to a warning. In this case realtimetrains never showed the ECS and still shows 1O86 leaving from P5, when it really went from P14A, so presumably the data it feeds on is in some way deficient.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 04, 2013, 18:21:54
    I think what's possibly happening is that for anything that is coming ECS into passenger service in the normal WTT, the automatic generation of the 'not stopping' warning can be, and often is suppressed.  The fact that this move wasn't present in RTT suggests it was an out of course working, and they are more likely to be where no-one has thought or bothered or had enough time to manually intervene. 

    (The author of RTT has explained in another forum that it doesn't capture all alterations that occur on the day, although by colour coding and italics it will show if a WTT movement did not happen as planned.)

    I've seen the announcement error happen frequently at Southampton, where the PIS has generated a perfectly normal 'next train to arrrive at platform 1 is the xx45 XC service to Newcastle, then as the unit comes into sight the screens revert to the 'stand clear the next train is not in passenger service' type message.

    I think one of the 'insiders' has explained why this happens before in another thread, there could be a better description yet to come...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on August 04, 2013, 18:35:43
    The CIS system feeds off Train Describers to play announcements. When a headcode appears in certain TD berths the CIS system will play announcements. For example, if a headcode steps into the TD berth associated with a platform then the CIS might play a 'train now standing' announcement. This relies of the CIS being able to correlate the headcode it sees in the TD berths with what it expects to be there, referencing it to the timetable if you like. If the CIS system picks up on a headcode which it does not expect then it will default to a stand away announcement.

    You can see TD's in action on the Open Train Times maps here: http://www.opentraintimes.com/maps/signalling/R2/1 If you watch for a while you should see headcodes moving along, the little black boxes are all TD berths.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Pb_devon on August 05, 2013, 08:56:01
    STE, in your image in #1951 it would appear the signal on P11 is showing a proceed aspect, even though there's no track!  As the expert, can you explain?  (Or is the long lens deceiving the eye).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DavidBrown on August 05, 2013, 10:14:33
    STE, in your image in #1951 it would appear the signal on P11 is showing a proceed aspect, even though there's no track!  As the expert, can you explain?  (Or is the long lens deceiving the eye).

    I'd have said that signal is for P10, with the out of use overhead signal being for P11.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 05, 2013, 18:34:14
    Yes, and the Red is for P12, which is just as well as the points in advance are set for P13.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 05, 2013, 20:17:08
    I dimly recall that the junction at the London end was laid some time ago.
    Yes, because that piece of track is in its final form and position. At the country end, it won't be final until after the embankment is finished and the new main lines are in place on it.


    I can confirm that the new track is connected to the junction, albeit that it is only held in place by clamped fishplates at the moment.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 05, 2013, 20:18:27
    STE, in your image in #1951 it would appear the signal on P11 is showing a proceed aspect, even though there's no track!  As the expert, can you explain?  (Or is the long lens deceiving the eye).

    The green is for Platform No.10 at which the HST is standing (remember there is currently a 'kink' in the trackwork at the end of that platform and this is hidden from view by the signal structure leg).  PS: I hope this also solves the argument about the eventual width of the London End of Platforms No.10 and 11.

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1375126025/IMG_0104xCopy.JPG?cache=0.7577728750184178)
    Image (c)2013 S&TEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 05, 2013, 20:21:53
    ........and just to add that the last S&C to be installed at the London End will be the missing Trailing Crossover between Platform No.9 and Platform No.10 (just to the platform side of the existing Facing Crossover and below the middle of the HST in the previous photograph).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 05, 2013, 20:37:33
    Deleted, cos S&T added a similar photo ^^^


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 05, 2013, 23:01:54
    A useful article from Get Reading

    Cow Lane bridges improvements explained (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/cow-lane-bridges-improvements-explained-5588783?)

    Quote
    Improvements to one of Reading's most notorious road bottlenecks will simultaneously help improve rail services .

    The Cow Lane bridges have, for decades, added to the time it takes for motorists to reach and to leave Portman Road while freight trains have caused delays to passenger services whose paths cross in the same area.

    Eighteen months ago, one viaduct was replaced.

    And Network Rail is gearing up again for the next major works at Christmas 2014 when a new bridge will replace the northern viaduct leaving traffic to run freely from the Norcot roundabout to Caversham bridge.

    The old archway will be demolished over Christmas Day and Boxing Day 2014 and the tracks removed.

    The new tunnels, which have been built to the north of the old viaduct, will form the new highways ^ due for completion in summer 2015.

    The tunnel which traffic currently uses will be a cycleway and footpath, while the section to the west which is currently boarded off, will provide two lanes and have enough headroom to allow for double decker buses to pass under.

    Then, under the new southern bridge which has a wide pavement on the west side, the road will be altered to have a cycleway and a central crossing island.

    While the current work goes on, Loverock Road has a temporary one-way system and Network Rail hopes to keep disruption to a minimum.

    Spokeswoman Sam Kelly said: ^We understand the current disruption is inconvenient to the businesses along Loverock Road and thank them for their patience during these important works.^

    That work, which will take fast lines over freight and stopping services, is the largest structure construction on Western route.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Pb_devon on August 06, 2013, 09:39:53
    Thanks STE and other posters for the clarification.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 08, 2013, 09:46:33
    I was going to ask if anyone knew what the next step in the Chinese puzzle of platform rebuilds was - the FGW site is warning that from 23rd September some West of England services will use a platform too short for an HST. However, yesterday I found a new issue of the information sheet (Issue 7 - not on the NR site yet, despite appearing some time after its copy cut-off date) which explains this. (There's also a lot about feedback from some customer organisations and about related changes, such as to the CIS.)

    We expected P11 to be in use this month, and that will be from the 27th according the WTT, which shows P10 going out of use at that time. Issue 7 puts that on the timeline at "Summer 2013", while the text says nothing - but does refer to phased work starting on P8 and P9 in August which is on the timeline at "Autumn 2013". The WTT shows P8 and P9 still in use in September, though it looks as if P8 may be for turning XC trains only leaving half being rebuilt. All very confusing.

    Finally, what I had not realised is that a temporary P7 will be built over the track of P6, probably using the East end of P7 too, and that is the short one. That means working on the rest of P7 with trains using its track, which is something that has generally been avoided. I guess the track could be temporarily put a bit further out, but not all the way along, and again that has been avoided in other cases. No doubt there's a cunning plan - we'll have to wait and see!

    I also note that the new main line embankment is still being referred to in Issue 7 as a viaduct, presumably because that is familiar and the distinction is regarded as just a technical detail.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 08, 2013, 11:34:51
    ...The WTT shows P8 and P9 still in use in September, though it looks as if P8 may be for turning XC trains only leaving half being rebuilt. All very confusing.

    That has always been the plan, and at roughly that period, as shown in the earlier engineering access statements when we were originally researching the dates.  The different ends of P8/P9 will have their edge copings and surfaces brought up to standard sequentially while remaining partially open for short trains at the opposite end.  Another point that's become clear is that XC services to/from Bournemouth are non-stopping on some weekends during the autumn, implying there's no room for them in the station on those dates.  This is shown in the current XC timetables.

    Quote
    Finally, what I had not realised is that a temporary P7 will be built over the track of P6, probably using the East end of P7 too, and that is the short one. That means working on the rest of P7 with trains using its track, which is something that has generally been avoided. I guess the track could be temporarily put a bit further out, but not all the way along, and again that has been avoided in other cases. No doubt there's a cunning plan - we'll have to wait and see!

    That has only become clear recently, but it seems essential to do it that way to keep the track operational for the use of the down Westbury route, because as can be seen it is a main route for up direction freights from that direction.  But that doesn't mean they'll necessariy be working alongside the live line, they may just use overnight and weekend possessions.  But the track will be moved out to it's new alignment at the London end at commencement, and that will be its permanent position. (As you have probably seen the new sleepers have been positioned on the final alignment already, where clear of the existing track.)  I don't see why the temporary P7 will conflict with P6 though, unless they wish to build a large circulation space at the London end of the existing P7, and it will be over the P6 buffer stop. 

    Quote
    I also note that the new main line embankment is still being referred to in Issue 7 as a viaduct, presumably because that is familiar and the distinction is regarded as just a technical detail.

    The majority of the new mainline elevated section does run on viaduct - built as a succession of 25m concrete spans.  There are some embankment sections as well, basically at either end of the nearly 2 km run, and concrete boxes where the lines pass underneath, but the planning drawings describe the whole thing as a viaduct.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 08, 2013, 12:04:41
    The majority of the new mainline elevated section does run on viaduct - built as a succession of 25m concrete spans.

    Some of those spans are now taking shape with the foundations in place and the reinforcing steel framework being installed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 08, 2013, 12:33:54
    The majority of the new mainline elevated section does run on viaduct - built as a succession of 25m concrete spans.

    Some of those spans are now taking shape with the foundations in place and the reinforcing steel framework being installed.

    I noticed the progress earlier this week, I reckon a few viaduct piers will start appearing soon, I did see a concrete pump in action at one site.  I took a quick iphone video along the route, but it's pretty poor quality at the speed involved. (I must have a look at how to extract still pictures from it when I have time...)  ::)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 08, 2013, 13:13:16
    That has always been the plan, and at that time, as shown in the earlier engineering access statements when we were originally researching the dates.  The different ends of P8/P9 will have their edge copings and surfaces brought up to standard sequentially while remaining partially open for short trains at the opposite end.  Another point that's become clear is that XC services to/from Bournemouth are non-stopping on some weekends during the autumn, implying there's no room for them in the station on those dates.  This is shown in the current XC timetables.
    I had always expected that the optimum way to upgrade five working platforms was to blitz one at a time. I don't see why it would take more than two months, even to do P11, if you tried. Evidently that's not the thinking here - there will be work on three platforms at once!
    Quote
    That has only become clear recently, but it seems essential to do it that way to keep the track operational for the use of the down Westbury route, because as can be seen it is a main route for up direction freights from that direction.  But that doesn't mean they'll necessariy be working alongside the live line, they may just use overnight and weekend possessions.  But the track will be moved out to it's new alignment at the London end at commencement, and that will be its permanent position. (As you have probably seen the new sleepers have been positioned on the final alignment already, where clear of the existing track.)  I don't see why the temporary P7 will conflict with P6 though, unless they wish to build a large circulation space at the London end of the existing P7, and it will be over the P6 buffer stop. 
    To paraphrase the news sheet: a temporary P7 will be built in September, linked to P6 (which will be closed) by walkways. Once the West end of P7 has been built out it will be removed and work will start on the East end of P7.

    So it sounds as if the temporary P7 will be mostly past the end of the present one. How else will both it and the length of P7 rebuilt in the first step be as long as 6 cars**?

    The line that was painted on the ground, and the plans, show the track at P7 steadily diverging from that at P8 as it goes West - the sleepers can't be on the final alignment for much of their length. However, if the plan is to timeshare between working on the platform and running trains, it can all go to its final position at the start. It just extends the timescale, and surely it increases the scope for mistakes at handover of possession.
    Quote
    The majority of the new mainline elevated section does run on viaduct - built as a succession of 25m concrete spans.  There are some embankment sections as well, basically at either end of the nearly 2 km run, and concrete boxes where the lines pass underneath, but the planning drawings describe the whole thing as a viaduct.
    You are right - I had either never spotted or (more likely) forgotten about the western viaduct. It's not obvious why that is viaduct, based on the design logic as explained - perhaps it helps to squeeze it into the limited width of the site. Arguably the viaducts are still less than 50% of the total length, if you do not count the box tunnels as well, but that's a bit pedantic - and in any case the various lengths given in the planning statement don't add up.

    ** PS: in theory it is, or was, long enough originally - so there must be some other reason.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Sapperton Tunnel on August 08, 2013, 14:18:03
    Lobstervision Camera site 6 appears to have become live on 26th July and shows the Viaduct construction from near Reading West Junction.

    Login is nrreading06 with the same password as per usual.

    Came across it in an idle moment of experimentation

    Sapperton Tunnel


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 08, 2013, 14:42:32
    Well spotted - I only checked up to 3, 4 and 5 earlier this week with nothing found...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 08, 2013, 14:43:41
    Very well spotted that man.  Camera 2 shows the support pillars for the viaduct I mentioned earlier.  Back to my daily Lobstervision visits...  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 08, 2013, 15:03:25
    The line that was painted on the ground, and the plans, show the track at P7 steadily diverging from that at P8 as it goes West - the sleepers can't be on the final alignment for much of their length.

    They are aligned with the yellow line down the middle of the sleepers just about as far as the transfer deck, extending on that alignment towards the Caversham Rd bridge, once the track alongside the platform is lifted, is probably something they can do easily during a weekend possession.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 08, 2013, 15:20:02
    I haven't been to Reading Station in a while, however since I was last there, are they going to cover the opening parts of the roof or do they just stay like they do?
    Apologies if this has already been covered.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 09, 2013, 08:32:56
    They are aligned with the yellow line down the middle of the sleepers just about as far as the transfer deck, extending on that alignment towards the Caversham Rd bridge, once the track alongside the platform is lifted, is probably something they can do easily during a weekend possession.

    Most of the line we are referring to has disappeared - ballast is hardly the most stable medium for painting on. The sleepers that have been set out are aligned to a new blue line along their northern ends. Looking down, the old yellow line does not seem to point to the centre of those - but then there is a break in the curvature under the deck, so it's hard to see. As you say, it should all be sorted out one weekend soon. I'm sure someone will be there who knows where it should go.

    The WTT shows P6 out of use only before this new arrangement comes into use - from 7th September, and by 23rd it's back in use. So I now suspect the temporary extension to P7 will be short: maybe only up to the signal gantry? That's quite a big obstruction for a platform, and avoiding it may be why the temporary one can only take 6 cars. So P6 will then still be more than 8 cars long, and the staging across its station end should be highly "frangible"!

    Another way to see that is from the lengths: the old P4 is a bit less than 300 m, and this short HST (power car + 6 carriages) is about 155 m. So an extension of 20-30 m makes it just possible to do two halves and still have one of the 1st class carriages platformed.

    Looking at the WTT (i.e. in realtimetrains) it seems the timetablers are relying on the services of an illusionist to help them to operate without P6 - this is from 20/9/13:
    Quote
    WTT    1754    Redhill                    5    2V67    GW    Terminates here       
    WTT               Starts here             4      1C52   SW    London Waterloo     1753   
    WTT               Starts here             14A 2P71    GW    London Paddington  1754   
    VAR    1758    London Waterloo     5     2C91   SW    Terminates here   
    WTT    1756    London Paddington 12   1D53    GW    Oxford                    1757   
    WTT    1754    Hereford                11   1P65    GW    London Paddington  1756   
    WTT    1754    London Paddington  9    1C24    GW    Taunton                  1756   
    WTT    1759    London Paddington 13A 2R54    GW    Terminates here       
    WTT    1800    Basingstoke            2    2J52     GW    Terminates here       
    WTT    1800    Swansea                11  1L76     GW    London Paddington  1801   
    VAR    1758    London Paddington   8  1C91     GW    Paignton                 1804   
    WTT                Starts here             5   2O49    GW    Redhill                    1804   
    WTT                Starts here            2     2J55     GW    Basingstoke           1807   
    WTT    1757    Oxford                   15   2P74    GW    London Paddington   1808   
    WTT    1805    Cheltenham Spa    11    1L80     GW    London Paddington  1807   
    WTT    1803    Bournemouth         9      1M66    XC    Manchester Piccadilly 1810   
    WTT                Starts here            1      2K80     GW    Newbury                1812   
    VAR                Starts here            5      2C60     SW    London Waterloo    1812


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 10, 2013, 12:32:20
    Well it would appear that somebody is listening.............
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/9478695498/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 10, 2013, 12:40:24
    Well it would appear that somebody is listening.............
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/9478695498/in/pool-1945836@N21/

    Good - that's much better looking!  Just the water ingress to deal with now then - and possibly some further minor tinkering with the signage, escalators and CIS screens.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 10, 2013, 13:34:36
    You know, since i last visited Reading, the platforms i used to arrive on, seem to be quiet, as i dont hear the HSTS or adelantes breaking which is a nice change from the old. Btw i arrived on platform 14 and departed platform 15 on my return home, before anyone questions it :)
    Also was thinking why crosscountry dont have their known platforms and if trains travel through reading at high speed in the future (as part of the intercity timetable), why arnet they going to be fast tracks that are not near platforms. It makes me think that if trains travel at 140mph will their be a risk of those trains striking a platform?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 10, 2013, 13:58:09
    Platforms 9 and 10 are the only platforms at Reading where anything approaching a high-speed movement might ever take place and even then that would be at a maximum of 100mph - that wouldn't be until the advent of in-cab signalling and until then 50/60mph will be the maximum for the next decade or so, which is rather less than the 75mph that was permitted through the old Platforms 8/9 until the late 90s.

    Places like Didcot, Slough and Maidenhead regularly have trains running alongside the platforms at 125mph.  Special arrangements are needed for speeds over 125mph, which (I feel) might be the biggest hurdle to overcome with regard to 140mph IEP workings over the GWML in the future.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 10, 2013, 14:49:21
    Thank you. Indeed. We will just have to wait and see what happens :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 11, 2013, 09:07:20
    Platforms 2 & 3 had what appeared to be timber supports holding up the platform edges. It appears to me that platforms 1 & 2 appear to have been resurfaced now. Can anyone confirm this and has this timber now been removed from the platform edge?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 11, 2013, 10:27:29
    Platforms 2 & 3 had what appeared to be timber supports holding up the platform edges. It appears to me that platforms 1 & 2 appear to have been resurfaced now. Can anyone confirm this and has this timber now been removed from the platform edge?

    Still there this morning (as seen on the P3 side which is visible on the magnified web cam view).  I was told a few months ago it is a precaution where the existing coping overhangs the support by more than a small amount, in case a heavy impact or load placed right on the edge pivots the back of the slab and loosens it.   There are a few short lengths of the main P8/9 island that had the same precaution taken.

    P1/2 is not fully finished, there is much patching still to do in the block paved areas, but IIRC the tactile strips are continuous along both sides.  It was thought a while ago that the copings themselves were not going to be replaced.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 14, 2013, 16:51:55
    Blue hoarding going up along P11 now, in readiness for the Bank Holiday switch over from P10...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on August 15, 2013, 10:10:56
    Will Reading Staiton be open over the Bank Holiday?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 15, 2013, 11:11:11
    Only various partial closures with reduced through platforms available it seems. The Monday morning looks like 1-6 and 12-15 only, using realtimetrains; but it looks fully open by BH Monday evening.

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced?location=Reading&date=26%2F08%2F2013&tocs=All&timespan=4&show_schedules=11&schedule_type=0&show_wtt=1&show_var=1&show_stp=1

    I wouldn't expect a long closure, there's relatively little involved in re-routing trains from P10 to P11 I think.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 15, 2013, 11:24:39
    I wouldn't expect a long closure, there's relatively little involved in re-routing trains from P10 to P11 I think.

    Not much work at all - should just involve installing the western end connection and commissioning that and the eastern end connection already installed and associated signalling (which is also already installed).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 15, 2013, 11:31:28
    There's a pamphlet on the FGW site:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/TicketsAndTrainTimes/TrainTimes/PlannedChanges/Reading%20Bank%20holiday%20Monday%20leaflet%20V5.ashx

    So not much at all, finished by 1200.

    I might be too optimistic here, but I really can't see any full closures for long periods (ie on a par with the Waterloo and Banbury diversions week/weekend) being needed again, they should always have part of the station available for some services.

    As we know XC through services are using Reading West for some Sat and Sun during the autumn period, but I don't see any massive alterations over and above recent Sundays, where they often run with platform closures with no fanfare... 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 15, 2013, 12:40:26
    I might be too optimistic here, but I really can't see any full closures for long periods (ie on a par with the Waterloo and Banbury diversions week/weekend) being needed again, they should always have part of the station available for some services.

    I might have got a little mixed up, but I thought there was one more lengthy possession involving diversions planned for Easter 2015, when track and signalling for the flyovers/unders are fully commissioned along with the extra western entrance to the depot and realigned relief lines and reinstated goods loop?  Then it's job done.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 15, 2013, 13:05:45
    I hadn't heard of that lot all happening at the same time, but I suppose some details will appear in the 2015 EAS towards the end of the year? 

    What I'm thinking though is that even with all that going on you might still be able to have some trains running to/from the east? 

    What you are describing probably wouldn't take more than a couple of days, I'd have thought.  I've always thought that the predictions of 'endless chaos for years' were a bit of an exaggeration though.  So far I think there's only been the two full blockades, and even then the Caversham Bridge one allowed a small number of through trains during the shortened working week...

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 15, 2013, 13:13:04
    Yes, it was more that I remember being told that there were three blockades which would involve HST diversions via Banbury, only one of which would affect Christmas, and a little bit of me putting two and two together, but that was many years ago so the details may have changed.

    When you check what's in the Engineering Access Statement I'd be interested to know - I'd check myself, but I know you love scanning through that sort of document over supper, Paul.  :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on August 18, 2013, 22:09:09
    Some further posts, which were originally made in this particular topic, on the subject of specific timings of posts, have now been split off to form an interesting discussion of their own, at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=12807.0  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on August 19, 2013, 12:29:12
    There's this on their website -
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements

    which points to this....
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/contents/reading-station-improvements

    Quote
    Monday 23 September to Friday 22 November The following services will not call at Reading:

     0745 London Paddington to Swansea
     1745 London Paddington to Swansea

    Let's hope they DO get communication of this out there!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 19, 2013, 13:10:07
    A couple of lorry loads of platform roofing sections have been delivered today, they are stacked outside the north side office entrance;  visible on webcam 1/3 (that doesn't normally show much nowadays...

    I reckon they look about the right size for P10/11;  assuming they would deliver P1 and P2 stuff to the south side, once they can get a crane into the vicinity.

    Paul

    Three canopy panels delivered to station south entrance. Look like P8/9 size. Placed on wheelable steel frames, one taken through old station entrance and empty frame returned. How are they placed on the supporting structure? Assume rail mounted crane. Cam 01/1 out of action so not able to view.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 19, 2013, 13:35:27
    Three canopy panels delivered to station south entrance. Look like P8/9 size. Placed on wheelable steel frames, one taken through old station entrance and empty frame returned. How are they placed on the supporting structure? Assume rail mounted crane. Cam 01/1 out of action so not able to view.

    The two sections sitting outside can be seen on camera 02/2. Judging by the two little skylights(?) in them, they can only be for P8/9.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 19, 2013, 14:29:54
    Three canopy panels delivered to station south entrance. Look like P8/9 size. Placed on wheelable steel frames, one taken through old station entrance and empty frame returned. How are they placed on the supporting structure? Assume rail mounted crane. Cam 01/1 out of action so not able to view.

    The two sections sitting outside can be seen on camera 02/2. Judging by the two little skylights(?) in them, they can only be for P8/9.

    They definitely look about the right length/cross section for P8/9, (comparing with the end view of the sections already on P8/9 visisble on webcam 1/1 from last week), but I don't think those are skylights showing; they look to me as if sections of the access walkways have been pre-assembled.  There are similar devices attached to the smaller sections (presumed for P10/11) sitting outside the north entrance.  However when I saw one of those through the over-bridge window the other day it looked as though some sections of walkway were fixed in their final position, but others were just lashed on for transit - perhaps to go over the joints IYSWIM?

    Surprising that they are being delivered through the station when it's open, or did this happen yesterday - even though just been posted?

    PS, just backtracked through the webcam pics, the move through the station was in the middle of the night.  One way they could get over to P8/9 is with those large polystyrene blocks that they place in the gap between the platforms, didn't someone report a while back that some escalator sections had been delivered like that?  Then once on the island I think they've got a 'spider crane' over there, that can probably lift that sort of load quite easily.

    For example one of these sort of things:  http://www.ggrrail.com/mini-cranes/urw-094

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on August 19, 2013, 17:06:37
    Meanwhile, may I offer you a very warm welcome to the Coffee Shop forum, ironstone11, and thank you for posting some useful information in your very first contribution to this particular discussion!  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 19, 2013, 18:58:09
    Welcome to from me.  I had assumed that P8/9 were beyond a crane lift from the North side so they would be lifted in from the south over the existing station building. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 19, 2013, 21:03:17


    PS, just backtracked through the webcam pics, the move through the station was in the middle of the night.  One way they could get over to P8/9 is with those large polystyrene blocks that they place in the gap between the platforms, didn't someone report a while back that some escalator sections had been delivered like that?  Then once on the island I think they've got a 'spider crane' over there, that can probably lift that sort of load quite easily.

    For example one of these sort of things:  http://www.ggrrail.com/mini-cranes/urw-094

    Paul

    Very awkward manoevre as they have to be lifted between the two supporting beams and then rotated thru 90 degrees and then lowered into place. We shall see how many sections they manage to install, or at least move from the forecourt, tonight.  I am surprised they have not been craned from the south entrance forecourt. Weight of the big crane is perhaps too much for the hollow forecourt.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 19, 2013, 22:30:11
    Welcome to from me.  I had assumed that P8/9 were beyond a crane lift from the North side so they would be lifted in from the south over the existing station building. 

    I don't recall any use so far of a mobile crane from the south side over the 3 Guineas or main entrance buildings.
    Much of the P8/9 roof work was done either when the north tower crane was still available, or with a long lift from the north side using a mobile with a very long reach jib. 

    If I get time tomorrow I'll have a look back and see whats shown in the webcam history...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 19, 2013, 22:44:13
    I am pretty sure it has not been done before. I do not recall seeing a crane from the north side reach further than P10/11. I think the sections on P8/9 were done when the tower crane was still in place.  Working from the South side may be a shorter reach.

    I would expect the P1/2 and P3/7 sections to be done from the south, but as you say these sections are not the right size for P1/2 and they are not ready yet for P3/7



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 19, 2013, 23:05:47
    Have you spotted that another section has been wheeled into the station already tonight? And where are they going - hasn't anyone been there today and tripped over a spare bit of canopy?
    PS: as of 23:00, make that two more.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 19, 2013, 23:10:30
    So I am wrong.  I also notice that live departure boards have no trains on p7/8/9 at the moment.  So I suppose its the large polystyrene blocks in use again.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 19, 2013, 23:18:57
    So I am wrong.  I also notice that live departure boards have no trains on p7/8/9 at the moment.  So I suppose its the large polystyrene blocks in use again.
    In fact there are still trains on 9 - and were after midnight last night too. Maybe they (the canopy sections, of course) are being raised later on?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 19, 2013, 23:45:02
    They could just be stacking them on the P8/9 island for now?   We need someone to have a look tomorrow...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 20, 2013, 10:57:07
    I am pretty sure it has not been done before. I do not recall seeing a crane from the north side reach further than P10/11. I think the sections on P8/9 were done when the tower crane was still in place.  Working from the South side may be a shorter reach.

    Ah, it turns we both mis-remembered!  The earlier canopy sections on the London side of P8/9 (those that have been in place some time surrounding the ETFE skylights) were installed overnight Sat/Sun 20/21 October, using a mobile crane positioned between platforms 11 and 12, and of course that area was still a building site at that time, accessible to road vehicles such as mobile cranes.

    The island platform 12/13 tower crane was yet to be installed by that stage.

    Also, as you say it was the canopy sections on P10/11 island that were installed using a large Ainscough crane operating from the north side car park, there's an example of this in progress on Sunday 24th Feb around 0800.  That was done when the tower crane was still present, but presumably the loads were too great for it?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on August 20, 2013, 11:18:04
    They could just be stacking them on the P8/9 island for now?   We need someone to have a look tomorrow...

    I'm pretty sure they were installed overnight on P8/P9, my train came in on P12 and blocked my view.
    Camera 01#01 is back online and appears to confirm this compared to 5 days ago.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 20, 2013, 11:28:37


    Also, as you say it was the canopy sections on P10/11 island that were installed using a large Ainscough crane operating from the north side car park, there's an example of this in progress on Sunday 24th Feb around 0800.  That was done when the tower crane was still present, but presumably the loads were too great for it?

    Paul

    Cam 01/1 is now back in action and shows the three new canopy panels in place on P8/9.  They must have been lifted with the spider crane, but surprised it could lift that load at the reach that would be required.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 20, 2013, 11:50:00
    I think when I looked last weekend there was a gap in the horizontal girders about half way along the steelwork, possibly where the platform buildings are going to be.  Difficult to describe in writing, but suppose the sections would be delivered into that gap orientated across the island, then lifted just above girder height, then some mobile device (and you'd really only need a high reach fork-lift) could then move along the centre of the platform and carry them into position.  The way they are manhandled about on those trollies suggests there's not a huge weight to deal with.

    It's a pity the relevant webcam has been down for a few days, perhaps they can afford to keep it going overnight this time.  Time was when it was 24/7 coverage, but so many of them now switch off overnight...   >:(

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 20, 2013, 12:07:31
    The first concrete support for the viaduct at the western end has been completed.  You can't quite see it on the webcam due to the abundance of reinforcing rods for other supports.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 20, 2013, 13:34:52
    The first concrete support for the viaduct at the western end has been completed.  You can't quite see it on the webcam due to the abundance of reinforcing rods for other supports.

    I noticed the other day there seem to be two significantly different sizes of 'concrete slabs' for the piers, and it turns out from the planning drawings that the piers themselves are either 2.0 or 1.2 metres in thickness.  The larger piers are the fixed ends of the 25 metre viaduct sections, alternating with the floating ends, and the larger pier foundation slabs have twice the area, where that increase is all in the length along the viaduct.   For info the section in the webcam 6/2 view will have 14 spans over 350 metres.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 20, 2013, 18:58:09
    Cam 01/1 is now back in action and shows the three new canopy panels in place on P8/9.  They must have been lifted with the spider crane, but surprised it could lift that load at the reach that would be required.

    You spoke too soon it failed again almost as soon as you posted


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 20, 2013, 19:23:16
    Yes, I also noticed that - it must be rigged up for 'edited highlights only'...   ::)

    On a side issue though, has anyone else thought that the progress on the council's work site out the front is amazingly slow?  There's rarely more than a few chaps working, so I'm wondering now if there's some sort of planning delay while they decide what's going on with the demolition of the shops etc.

    Nothing to do with the station really, but it would look a lot better with the eventual access stairs to the subway in use...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 20, 2013, 19:52:10
    I think when I looked last weekend there was a gap in the horizontal girders about half way along the steelwork, possibly where the platform buildings are going to be.  Difficult to describe in writing, but suppose the sections would be delivered into that gap orientated across the island, then lifted just above girder height, then some mobile device (and you'd really only need a high reach fork-lift) could then move along the centre of the platform and carry them into position.  The way they are manhandled about on those trollies suggests there's not a huge weight to deal with.

    Yes, that's basically correct. The dollies must go through what was the public footbridge access, to the right of the gateline. The stairs have gone (though the escalators are still there) but I'm not sure if they go that way - maybe they have to spin round and come round behind the escalators and onto the platform opposite the gap in the canopy support beams. Either way it's a tight fit for these long sections.

    From there they must go across on an expanded polystyrene bridge, and are picked up by the crane and positioned. It's not a spider crane - if you peer closely you can just see the caterpillar tracks. Whether it uses its jib length or keeps that short and carries the sections would I guess depend on their weight and its stability.

    That procedure could put most of the sections there - but what about the ones on top of the missing beams? (I think these beams just bolt in like the rest: the bolts have enough extra length for that.) I think those mysterious rectangles are part of the base of a walkway - which will be continuous when more are attached later; they cross the joins where there is a strip of cladding to be added first.

    PS: These picture come to you courtesy of the TM of the train I dropped my camera on on the way home - he spotted it soon after, and I was able to reclaim it as he came back through Wokingham from Gatwick. Now that is customer service.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 20, 2013, 20:12:26
    On a side issue though, has anyone else thought that the progress on the council's work site out the front is amazingly slow? 

    Yes I have.  I watched them build that manhole and thought how primitive their methods were. especially compared to the speed at which the ramps and steps were built between Christmas and Easter.  It must be costing the contractor an absolute fortune - unless they are paying their (few) workers no more than minimum wage.  Even then the longer you are on site the more the fixed costs mount up. So unless there is a huge amount of activity elsewhere on the site that I cannot see, it would appear that either the contractor is loosing a fortune or Reading BC are being charged over the odds.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 20, 2013, 21:59:09
    Cam 01/1 is now back in action and shows the three new canopy panels in place on P8/9.  They must have been lifted with the spider crane, but surprised it could lift that load at the reach that would be required.

    You spoke too soon it failed again almost as soon as you posted

    Also on Cam 01/1, the safety fence on the edge of P11 has been removed and the station name boards (labels) are up (I think). So ready for business.

    Another three panels delivered this evening between 2100 and 2200 and placed on the stands. Last train on P8 is about 2150 so I suppose they wheel them across after 2200.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 20, 2013, 22:12:26

    On a side issue though, has anyone else thought that the progress on the council's work site out the front is amazingly slow?  There's rarely more than a few chaps working, so I'm wondering now if there's some sort of planning delay while they decide what's going on with the demolition of the shops etc.

    Paul 

    Yes, it's pathetic, they look like a real (small) bunch of amateurs. Suspect tho that the design has not yet been finalised and/or there is no planning approval. On a Reading forum it is suggests that the steps are on a curve, amphitheatre style, but the only plans I can find show the steps as straight. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on August 21, 2013, 22:01:55
    Something struck me, metaphorically, as I was coming into Reading from the Berks & Hants line today. There is a signal (I didn't spot the signal number) with four directional route indicators (feathers). Two of them are covered over by what looks like bin liners.

    Why have they gone to the bother of doing that? If the routes they indicate are out of use presumably the signaller cannot call them so the feathers will never be lit?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 21, 2013, 22:42:00
    Why have they gone to the bother of doing that? If the routes they indicate are out of use presumably the signaller cannot call them so the feathers will never be lit?

    There are several signals which have yet to have all the routes they will eventually be able to route to commissioned, both outside and within the station area.  They will all be available once the final track layout is finished in 2015.  So, in the meantime, they are bagged over.

    Noted that the new northern exit and bus stops were proving very useful today in ferrying the early arrivals for Reading festival onto the shuttle bus service.  Much better separating them from the usual throng of regular passengers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on August 22, 2013, 04:35:24
    Why have they gone to the bother of doing that? If the routes they indicate are out of use presumably the signaller cannot call them so the feathers will never be lit?

    There are several signals which have yet to have all the routes they will eventually be able to route to commissioned, both outside and within the station area.  They will all be available once the final track layout is finished in 2015.  So, in the meantime, they are bagged over.

    I appreciate that, my point was more WHY are they bagged over when presumably the signalling system prevents them being lit until the route they indicate is installed and available.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on August 22, 2013, 09:51:25


    Noted that the new northern exit and bus stops were proving very useful today in ferrying the early arrivals for Reading festival onto the shuttle bus service.  Much better separating them from the usual throng of regular passengers.

    Oddly, when I passed through this morning there were signs on the transfer deck directing Reading Festival goers to the Southern exit and the underpass... I wondered why they would this rather than send them directly via the Northern entrance?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on August 22, 2013, 10:33:20
    Bobm
    I appreciate that, my point was more WHY are they bagged over when presumably the signalling system prevents them being lit until the route they indicate is installed and available.
    [/quote]

    It's belt and braces, by bagging them it makes it fully obvious to the driver that those routes are not yet in use, rather than having to remember from  a special notice. So in the extremely unlikely event one does becomes illuminated the driver should stop and query with the signalman.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on August 22, 2013, 10:37:08
    From the First Great Western press release:

    Quote
    Additional trains to take Reading Festival goers home

    First Great Western is to run three additional trains to help weary Reading Festival goers return home when the music stops on Sunday night [August 25].

    Reading Festival ticket holders are being advised to allow plenty of time for their journey and a queuing system will be in place to help passengers board trains in safety.

    Two additional early morning trains will take passengers to London Paddington and leave Reading at 01.37 (non-stop) and 03.10 (calling at Slough and Ealing Broadway).

    A third service will run from Reading to Redhill at 05.04 (calling at: Wokingham, Blackwater, North Camp, Guildford, Dorking and Reigate).

    Advice for travellers going to Reading Festival:

    ^        Leave Reading Station via the North exit (the exit nearest to the multi-storey car park), which will be signposted

    ^        This takes you to where you can catch the shuttle bus, or a taxi, or walk to the festival site via Vastern and then Caversham Roads

    ^        Please use the pedestrian crossings as advertised

    And when heading home:

    ^        Walk down Richfield Avenue, Caversham Road, then take Vastern Road (the road to the left of TGI Fridays) to the station North entrance

    ^        Shuttle buses take you from Caversham Road to the North entrance

    ^        The old route via Station Hill has been closed

    ^        Please use signage to get to the North entrance where you will be able to enter and catch your train

    ^        All taxis and private hire vehicles have been informed to drop off at the North entrance

    With planned Network Rail engineering work due to take place until midday on the Bank Holiday Monday a replacement bus service will operate on certain routes.

    Monday travel advice:

    ^        Train services to Reading West, Newbury, Basingstoke and Southampton are affected by maintenance works on Monday morning

    ^        Until normal services resume at midday, a rail replacement bus service will collect affected passengers from Reading station and take them to Reading West station festival-goers should join the queuing system which is in place at Reading station and they will be directed to the correct part of the station to board the rail replacement bus service

    ^        Reading Festival goers should allow at least two hours from the festival venue to get their train if they have booked a ticket on a specific service. If they miss their booked train due to arriving too late they may have to purchase a further ticket to board a different service


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on August 22, 2013, 13:31:05
    So it sounds as if the temporary P7 will be mostly past the end of the present one. How else will both it and the length of P7 rebuilt in the first step be as long as 6 cars**?

    I see in the Reading Station Improvement works: Summary of Changes link posted elsewhere:

    Monday 23 September to Thursday 2 January 2014    
    On London Paddington to west of England trains, the rear two First class coaches (G-H) will not be available to board/alight at platform 7, at Reading station . Customers are advised to listen to announcements.

    That could be interesting on busier trains!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on August 22, 2013, 13:54:09
    From the First Great Western press release:

    Quote
    [...

    Advice for travellers going to Reading Festival:

    ^        Leave Reading Station via the North exit (the exit nearest to the multi-storey car park), which will be signposted

    ...

    Which makes it even more strange that the signposts up this morning directed festival goers to the southern entrance!

    Note: edited to fix quotes


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on August 22, 2013, 14:12:12
    So it sounds as if the temporary P7 will be mostly past the end of the present one. How else will both it and the length of P7 rebuilt in the first step be as long as 6 cars**?

    I see in the Reading Station Improvement works: Summary of Changes link posted elsewhere:

    Monday 23 September to Thursday 2 January 2014    
    On London Paddington to west of England trains, the rear two First class coaches (G-H) will not be available to board/alight at platform 7, at Reading station . Customers are advised to listen to announcements.

    That could be interesting on busier trains!

    In theory a lot of the West of England services which use Platform 7 are pick up only at Reading although as we have discussed before how much that is enforced is a matter for debate.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on August 22, 2013, 14:21:17
    In theory a lot of the West of England services which use Platform 7 are pick up only at Reading although as we have discussed before how much that is enforced is a matter for debate.

    At the risk of diverting the thread if (say) a Paddington to Taunton service is pick up only at reading will the stop be advertised on te departure boards at Paddington ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on August 22, 2013, 14:55:19
    nope


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 22, 2013, 15:16:24
    Which makes it even more strange that the signposts up this morning directed festival goers to the southern entrance!
    Don't you suspect it was just someone doing the same as last time? Or some idea that there is more capacity at the South entrance?

    In terms of available space, there is not much to choose, though at peak times I guess there will be more "normal" passengers at the main entrance. There are more escalators on the South side, but then there are two working lifts to the North. The space outside the doors is pretty cramped on both sides. Even on Tuesday you had to thread your way around clusters of HGPs* both there and in the tunnel.

    Incidentally, in the tunnel I passed a man with a floor scrubbing machine, accompanied by four more men watching and discussing said machine - one even walking backwards so he could see the front of it. I can't see why it would take so many to do or decide whatever they had to. Now did that have anything to do with the Festival-goers?

    *Heavy goods pedestrians - some needing "wide load" signs



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 22, 2013, 17:48:21
    I've just been reading the Reading Station News - Summer Edition. Two interesting points so far. First, FGW acknowledge that they need to improve CIS provision and platform signage (a point mentioned several times here, but I don't think anyone has picked up FGW's acknowledgement of this issue)  Second, Jim Weedon, NR's Deputy Project Manager, is quoted as saying there will be a new line "for freight only" in the remodelled western layout.  Is this true?  I can see no possible reason for a freight only line: all the lines would appear to serve a useful purpose for passenger trains as well.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 22, 2013, 18:12:12
    I'm assuming he means the new reversible line that connects Oxford Rd Jn to/from platform 12 which (as far as I can see from earlier layouts and explanations) will be predominantly for freight.  Unless service patterns on the Westbury route change, the up direction through passenger services from the Westbury line will be heading towards P11 on the parallel track.

    I say predominantly with caution, because as has been discussed in previous posts, whatever the primary purpose and directions shown on the colour coded drawings, nearly all lines and platforms are reversible and all are signalled to passenger standards.

    I've attached another copy of the intended track layout, to save searching for it again...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on August 22, 2013, 18:13:28
    The freight only line is currently the relief line to Paddington on the western side.

    Many posts ago when the new relief alignment along side the new depot was being laid it was noticed that there were in fact 3 lines : The southern down line, a middle line that runs out around the wash unit, and the new north up relief line.

    We wondered if the middle line was to be a turn back for the new platforms, negating the need for use of depot lines should such an arrangement be required. But it looked tight for space.

    After a discussion on Reading station with a friendly driver and another FGW employee - it was revealed that the middle line was the up relief, eventually. The northern new line was the freight relief - which starts just past Scours Lane to just before te depot sidings at the western end of the station.

    If you stand on the bridge you can distinctly see the up relief trains 'kinking/joining' the correct up relief alignment off the freight line.

    I did ask why it was laid out this way initially, post the blockade, and was given an informed shrug and one word 'signalling'


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 23, 2013, 08:06:35
    There has been a steady stream of roof panels going in through the ticket barriers (a sight I would really like to have seen) each night.  Yet I note that the pile of panels outside the North entrance has not gone down.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 23, 2013, 08:49:01
    There has been a steady stream of roof panels going in through the ticket barriers (a sight I would really like to have seen) each night.  Yet I note that the pile of panels outside the North entrance has not gone down.

    Surely the work has been planned so that these sections arrive by road direct from the makers as required. They are probably all unique, so sequencing is vital. The real question is why the ones now stacked on the North side were delivered too early.

    By the way, I did have a look at the one left outside on Monday night. The dolly is so high you couldn't see the top - now why would that be? Is it so it can be manoeuvred with its ends passing over the gateline? What you could see is that there are several extra parts of IKEA flat-pack station strapped or clamped on. I think that includes the lengths of topside cladding that cover the joins, though not the blue cladding for the underside.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 23, 2013, 11:29:54
      Yet I note that the pile of panels outside the North entrance has not gone down.

    I suspect these are for P10/11. The support beam has not yet been extended. At the moment it can only take another 2 or 3 canopy sections.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 23, 2013, 12:20:50
    In the overall scheme of things I expect it's the manufacturer of the roof sections that has the 'steady stream' production line, and at the station they are being fitted in anything but a steady stream - (notwithstanding this weeks overnight activity on P8/9).  So eventually they might have to be delivered to 'somewhere' to make room at the factory, even if the station isn't ready to accept them.

    But on the other hand perhaps the P10/11 panels were going to be fitted the weekend after they arrived but something else, such as a mobile crane, was cancelled at the last minute?  Or was the weather forecast wrong, or were the steelwork supports delayed unexpectedly?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grumpysocks on August 23, 2013, 14:51:20
    Platforms 9 and 10 are the only platforms at Reading where anything approaching a high-speed movement might ever take place and even then that would be at a maximum of 100mph - that wouldn't be until the advent of in-cab signalling and until then 50/60mph will be the maximum for the next decade or so, which is rather less than the 75mph that was permitted through the old Platforms 8/9 until the late 90s.

    Places like Didcot, Slough and Maidenhead regularly have trains running alongside the platforms at 125mph.  Special arrangements are needed for speeds over 125mph, which (I feel) might be the biggest hurdle to overcome with regard to 140mph IEP workings over the GWML in the future.

    When you get to that sort of speed, the bypassed platforms really should be on either a loop or some for of platform edge protection doors/barrier need to be fitted. Both expensive, and places like Swindon where the old down loop was ripped out and the formation built on top of for Platform 4 haven't helped.

    Slough (Up/Down Main platforms) is a pretty un-nerving place to be when a HST passes at 125. Perhaps those platforms should be locked out of use until specific stopping trains are inbound.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 23, 2013, 15:36:56
    Slough (Up/Down Main platforms) is a pretty un-nerving place to be when a HST passes at 125. Perhaps those platforms should be locked out of use until specific stopping trains are inbound.

    That would probably have to be the solution if speeds of more than 125mph were introduced, but you'd have to do that at places like Goring, Cholsey, Maidenhead, Langley, West Drayton etc., which is why I wonder whether it'll ever happen apart from Didcot to Swindon and Swindon to Chippenham where there are (currently) no intermediate stations.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 23, 2013, 15:39:54
    I'm assuming he means the new reversible line that connects Oxford Rd Jn to/from platform 12 which (as far as I can see from earlier layouts and explanations) will be predominantly for freight.  Unless service patterns on the Westbury route change, the up direction through passenger services from the Westbury line will be heading towards P11 on the parallel track.

    I say predominantly with caution, because as has been discussed in previous posts, whatever the primary purpose and directions shown on the colour coded drawings, nearly all lines and platforms are reversible and all are signalled to passenger standards.

    Paul

    I think you're right.  Mainly freight but not only freight on the reversible line you describe.  But you can see a not uncommon situation, for example, where they want to start or changeover a Newbury stopper, and the easiest way to get a set to/from the depot is to use P12-15 and the "freight only" reversible.

    I remember at one of the early roadshows in Reading this line was described as "freight only", and I questioned that at the time.  Clearly it will not be freight only.

    The "freight only" line in front of the depot from Scours Lane to the Depot sidings will maybe serve a similar purpose to the old freight lines behind the old P9. Timetabled looped freights, failed HST's etc..

    edit: remove errant "is" before ..."to get a set to/from..."


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 23, 2013, 17:33:44
    Slough (Up/Down Main platforms) is a pretty un-nerving place to be when a HST passes at 125. Perhaps those platforms should be locked out of use until specific stopping trains are inbound.

    Preventing public access is the principle extra requirement for speeds higher than 125 mph, but it's considered safe at 125 mph or below, as it has been since HSTs were first introduced.

    As it currently stands, 125 mph is allowed with the appropriate warning signage in addition to the usual yellow lines. The latter are in fact only required for passenger speeds above 100 mph - it's turbulence from passing freight trains (at greater than 60 mph) that is considered the greater hazard to passengers...

    Current policy is in section 9 of this group standard:

    http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Infrastructure/Railway%20Group%20Standards/GIRT7016%20Iss%203.pdf

    Paul   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 23, 2013, 20:37:50
    I think you're right.  Mainly freight but not only freight on the reversible line you describe.  But you can see a not uncommon situation, for example, where they want to start or changeover a Newbury stopper, and the easiest way to get a set to/from the depot is to use P12-15 and the "freight only" reversible.

    I remember at one of the early roadshows in Reading this line was described as "freight only", and I questioned that at the time.  Clearly it will not be freight only.

    Are you remembering that both feeder lines, despite their names, are now to be connected to the relief lines? There's an extra set on points on the line  to P12, not on the plan Paul posted above, as explained by SandTEngineer here http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg131258#msg131258 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg131258#msg131258).

    I'm not sure what the thinking here is, but it did occur to me that you can't stop and wait on a reversible line - especially for something that's coming the other way on it. The extra connection gives the option of using the two "reversible" lines as a pair. So, not "freight only" and not always bidirectional either?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on August 24, 2013, 09:11:10
    One slight problem I've heard about teh "Freight Line" is due its gradient and curvature it is unlikely even a 59 could restart a heavy stone train if stopped by signals. So freight trains will nee a clear run from Reading West into the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 24, 2013, 12:57:23
    I think you're right.  Mainly freight but not only freight on the reversible line you describe.  But you can see a not uncommon situation, for example, where they want to start or changeover a Newbury stopper, and the easiest way to get a set to/from the depot is to use P12-15 and the "freight only" reversible.

    I remember at one of the early roadshows in Reading this line was described as "freight only", and I questioned that at the time.  Clearly it will not be freight only.

    Are you remembering that both feeder lines, despite their names, are now to be connected to the relief lines? There's an extra set on points on the line  to P12, not on the plan Paul posted above, as explained by SandTEngineer here http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg131258#msg131258 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg131258#msg131258).

    I'm not sure what the thinking here is, but it did occur to me that you can't stop and wait on a reversible line - especially for something that's coming the other way on it. The extra connection gives the option of using the two "reversible" lines as a pair. So, not "freight only" and not always bidirectional either?

    I'd forgotten about you pointing out the apparent extra connection between P12 and the Up feeder line which is not shown on the "old" track diagram which Paul referred to.  Has anyone got access to an updated track diagram for the final layout to the west of the station? Also, details of the points layout around Oxford Road Junction would be interesting, to see what operating flexibility that would offer. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 24, 2013, 13:06:37
    I
    One slight problem I've heard about teh "Freight Line" is due its gradient and curvature it is unlikely even a 59 could restart a heavy stone train if stopped by signals. So freight trains will nee a clear run from Reading West into the station.

    Interesting to compare with the new Acton layout, where the freight lines into the yard will be kept relatively flat, and it's the passenger lines that go up and down.  As well as the gradient and curve on the feeder lines, there may also be railhead condition issues, what with being in Reading town centre and being next to the depot sidings, with maybe idling diesel engines nearby.  Anyone know what the max gradient on the feeder lines will be?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 24, 2013, 15:09:37
    Anyone know what the max gradient on the feeder lines will be?

    According to the signalling plan the main lines rise and fall 1 in 93 over the new flyover with the lines underneath falling and rising approximately 1 in 90.  Note: There is a general falling gradient from Reading station towards Tilehurst.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 24, 2013, 18:26:21
    So the 1 in 90 will become the new ruling gradient for Up stone trains from Westbury - not very clever that this is being installed as part of a route upgrade especially at a location where Red signals can be expected.  I notice that Train 747K (a Whatley - Acton stone train) can load up to 4,800 tonnes.  Up a 1 in 90 this requires a theoretical drawbar pull (not allowing for rolling resistance etc) of some 53 tonnes, or 119,000 lbf, rather more than a Class 59 can deliver even if it can get the adhesion.  And that's before you take account of the effect of the curve and cant on rolling resistance.

    So these stone trains will need Green signals from before Oxford Road Junction so they carry speed and momentum along the feeder line and up into the station, which will not be good for other trains around at the time. 

    Or maybe they'll be put though P7, and avoid the so-called "freight only" feeder line completely.  Now that would be ironic!





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 24, 2013, 19:02:27
    I notice that Train 747K (a Whatley - Acton stone train) can load up to 4,800 tonnes.  Up a 1 in 90 this requires a theoretical drawbar pull (not allowing for rolling resistance etc) of some 53 tonnes, or 119,000 lbf, rather more than a Class 59 can deliver even if it can get the adhesion.  And that's before you take account of the effect of the curve and cant on rolling resistance.

    We seems to have solved the adhesion to pull problem for passenger trains of various length by using powered vehicles along the length of the train which also carry the passengers. Perhaps the next generation of freight train will follow the same solution, thus keeping the pull to weight ratio pretty much the same no matter how long the train is. 

    We went from locomotive hauled trains from Paddington (I'm told - it was before I got involved in these parts) to trains with locomotives at both ends, and we're moving on to units with traction distributed throughout in the case of 10 car trains.    Freight's a bit behind - we've moved from locomotive at the front to locomotive at both ends in many cases, and the next step seems logical, doesn't it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 24, 2013, 20:24:19
    Back to canopies ... I see that having almost filled the space from the existing canopy to the gap in the rail, the next three sections have gone at the far end. To my surprise, I found that the sections were just parked next to each other - some touching, some not quite, but with no bolts holding them together and presumably not fixed to the rails. That's not so bad with two rails, but it would be scary if they do the same with P10/11. That looks rather precarious on its single rail even if you know it is bolted down.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 24, 2013, 21:25:04
    Back to canopies ... I see that having almost filled the space from the existing canopy to the gap in the rail, the next three sections have gone at the far end. To my surprise, I found that the sections were just parked next to each other - some touching, some not quite, but with no bolts holding them together and presumably not fixed to the rails. That's not so bad with two rails, but it would be scary if they do the same with P10/11. That looks rather precarious on its single rail even if you know it is bolted down.

    Another three panels being unloaded this evening!

    If they leave a gap, i.e. don't work from an end, I don't see how they can raise the last ones into position.  Perhaps they haven't thought of that?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 24, 2013, 22:16:22
    I sort of question the fact, why the mainline is a flyover with Freight trains that have to go up a gradient below the mainlines...
    Would have made more sense to design the main line beneath the Freight and Local Passenger Lines, than above it.
    Oh dear does that mean future problems for passenger trains if freight trains get stuck on the gradient, if thats the case what good planning that was hey. As people say good old british engineering  ;D

    Ironstone 11 give them time, i am sure once its done (incorrectly) someone will remark and say, did we do it right?  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 24, 2013, 22:25:41
    If they leave a gap, i.e. don't work from an end, I don't see how they can raise the last ones into position.  Perhaps they haven't thought of that?
    Oh, I'm sure they have - and planned all the moves in minute detail. There's lots of possible ways to do it:
    • bring in a much bigger crane to the forecourt
    • use the crane they have there, or a slightly larger one, but from outside the existing canopy. For example, on or over the track in P7-8, or on P7 (no canopy at the moment)
    • jack them up and put them on stands
    • something else I've not thought of, which is probably what they will do.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 24, 2013, 22:28:20
    Adapting existing infrastructure to meet new requirements is seldom straightforward. The process of design is usually fraught with compromises that you would never make if you were designing the thing from scratch. However, we are where we are (as the saying goes) so we have to make the best of what we have.  

    The vertical alignment is so often dominated by te constrains of getting over or under certain roads or other constraints that a perfect alignment was never going to be possible. In this case we have a gradient that is not ideal for freight. However there is a solution. If that means there is a constraint some freights have to wait until they can be signalled through P12 then that is still better than waiting for a path across the main line which is what we have now.  


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 24, 2013, 22:35:17
    Adapting existing infrastructure to meet new requirements is seldom straightforward. The process of design is usually fraught with compromises that you would never make if you were designing the thing from scratch. However, we are where we are (as the saying goes) so we have to make the best of what we have.  

    The vertical alignment is so often dominated by te constrains of getting over or under certain roads or other constraints that a perfect alignment was never going to be possible. In this case we have a gradient that is not ideal for freight. However there is a solution. If that means there is a constraint some freights have to wait until they can be signalled through P12 then that is still better than waiting for a path across the main line which is what we have now.  

    Now that is a reasonable statement, however it feels that more time should have been spent, on delivering a better project, rather than a rushed job, but as you say its what we have that we have to live for, for the next what 30 40 years or so?
    I wonder what they will construct then, a floating Reading Station, with the below station part filled with water?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on August 24, 2013, 23:15:39
    I notice that Train 747K (a Whatley - Acton stone train) can load up to 4,800 tonnes.  Up a 1 in 90 this requires a theoretical drawbar pull (not allowing for rolling resistance etc) of some 53 tonnes, or 119,000 lbf, rather more than a Class 59 can deliver even if it can get the adhesion.  And that's before you take account of the effect of the curve and cant on rolling resistance.

    We seems to have solved the adhesion to pull problem for passenger trains of various length by using powered vehicles along the length of the train which also carry the passengers. Perhaps the next generation of freight train will follow the same solution, thus keeping the pull to weight ratio pretty much the same no matter how long the train is. 

    We went from locomotive hauled trains from Paddington (I'm told - it was before I got involved in these parts) to trains with locomotives at both ends, and we're moving on to units with traction distributed throughout in the case of 10 car trains.    Freight's a bit behind - we've moved from locomotive at the front to locomotive at both ends in many cases, and the next step seems logical, doesn't it?

    From my layman's-with-an-engineering-background, this sounds like an interesting idea. If a standardised approach could be taken (and there, of course, is the rub) with each wagon containing its own modular power unit (we're talking electric-only here) then the 'locomotive' need consist of little more than a cab, supply pick-up and control module. But why not extend this concept to passenger stock? A complete reversal of the traditional loco-hauled train. Potentially this could also return some of the flexibility that was lost with the wholesale adoption of unit trains. A plug-and-play railway?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 24, 2013, 23:20:33
    There have been suggestions since years back that some urban rail systems could work with small single vehicles that can be routed point to point. I'm not sure how many have got very far. The two problems I know of are efficiency - it would help to join cars into trains for trunking - and safety, i.e. spacing, how to couple them etc. But the basic engineering is all quite doable.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on August 25, 2013, 01:22:31
    I was once told by a signaller in the old Reading panel that, if at all possible, they would give a freight off the B&H a clear run from Southcote Junction through the station to the up relief. The reason being that, if they stopped it, it would take so long to restart that the delays would be far greater than simply giving it a clear road. Thus the reason why so many down main class 1s were held at the old platform 4 whilst an up stone train was allowed across Reading West junction in front of them, and why all of this money is being spent to eliminate such conflicts. Its clear to me that the provision of a flyover/diveunder will make a huge difference, whatever the gradients, and whatever the need to give a clear run. The days of class 1s being held at Reading for an up stone train will be no more! Job done.

    All so worth saying that the discussion on here about how things will be done ("I suppose it will all work out in the end") could not be further from the truth. Every operation will have been planned in the finest detail. In the offices of the former Post Office sorting office on Vastern Road, there is a large, multi-disciplinary team, consisting of engineers and planners from all of the parties (NR, FGW and all of the contractors) that has planned every step in minute detail. Every operation will have been walked though and risk assessed. There is a team of professionals at work here who, so far, have delivered ever stage on time and, according to NR, to budget. To suggest that "they haven't thought of that" or that this is a "rushed job" is, frankly, ridiculous.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 25, 2013, 01:50:02
    I was once told by a signaller in the old Reading panel that, if at all possible, they would give a freight off the B&H a clear run from Southcote Junction through the station to the up relief. The reason being that, if they stopped it, it would take so long to restart that the delays would be far greater than simply giving it a clear road. Thus the reason why so many down main class 1s were held at the old platform 4 whilst an up stone train was allowed across Reading West junction in front of them, and why all of this money is being spent to eliminate such conflicts. Its clear to me that the provision of a flyover/diveunder will make a huge difference, whatever the gradients, and whatever the need to give a clear run. The days of class 1s being held at Reading for an up stone train will be no more! Job done.

    All so worth saying that the discussion on here about how things will be done ("I suppose it will all work out in the end") could not be further from the truth. Every operation will have been planned in the finest detail. In the offices of the former Post Office sorting office on Vastern Road, there is a large, multi-disciplinary team, consisting of engineers and planners from all of the parties (NR, FGW and all of the contractors) that has planned every step in minute detail. Every operation will have been walked though and risk assessed. There is a team of professionals at work here who, so far, have delivered ever stage on time and, according to NR, to budget. To suggest that "they haven't thought of that" or that this is a "rushed job" is, frankly, ridiculous.

    Oxman you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, however what i write is my own opinion and we need to agree on that, if you know what i mean. I am sure, that network rail and officials do a good anaylsis of how the railway around Reading should be built.
    Obviously they know alot more about it than what we know (the non rail workers) however it is wrong if it has been said on this forum that the platform 11/10 or other areas needs to hurry up. It takes time to complete everything, and yes i understand network rail workers are under pressure every day, but people need to understand what is done is done, and theys nothing else in which you can do or say (if your not involved in the actual construction) and thats it. Also i am not suggesting people shouldnt post they opinions as all opinions are good, however some opinions cannot be taken on board, as like i said that part of the construction is or is going to be constructed in the near future..


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 25, 2013, 02:44:05
    Oxman you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, however what i write is my own opinion and we need to agree on that, if you know what i mean. I am sure, that network rail and officials do a good anaylsis of how the railway around Reading should be built.

    James, from my personal (non-railman) experience, I can assure you that the amount of analysis that goes in before any changes / improvements are made is huge.   Where possible, multiple pieces of analysis are done and checked that they all end up pointing in the same direction, and "proof" is requested / required that every aspect of the scheme will work - the ducks will all line up.  That's certainly what I've seen just on the one small rail project to which I've been making a small contribution.

    Quote
    Obviously they know alot more about it than what we know (the non rail workers) ...

    I have been highly impressed, and continue to be, by the professionalism of almost everyone in the rail industry, a number of whom are very much valued members of our Coffee Shop community, and help keep us informed here.  There are a huge number of technicalities and details I don't know about and never will (I would have to give up my day job to have the time to understand even a little of it) but I often find myself reassured that things have indeed been considered when others bring them up and professionals answer.  At times, this consideration and the reasons for decisions may not be immediately obvious to the newcomer though!



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: James on August 25, 2013, 09:28:30
    Oxman you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, however what i write is my own opinion and we need to agree on that, if you know what i mean. I am sure, that network rail and officials do a good anaylsis of how the railway around Reading should be built.

    James, from my personal (non-railman) experience, I can assure you that the amount of analysis that goes in before any changes / improvements are made is huge.   Where possible, multiple pieces of analysis are done and checked that they all end up pointing in the same direction, and "proof" is requested / required that every aspect of the scheme will work - the ducks will all line up.  That's certainly what I've seen just on the one small rail project to which I've been making a small contribution.

    Quote
    Obviously they know alot more about it than what we know (the non rail workers) ...

    I have been highly impressed, and continue to be, by the professionalism of almost everyone in the rail industry, a number of whom are very much valued members of our Coffee Shop community, and help keep us informed here.  There are a huge number of technicalities and details I don't know about and never will (I would have to give up my day job to have the time to understand even a little of it) but I often find myself reassured that things have indeed been considered when others bring them up and professionals answer.  At times, this consideration and the reasons for decisions may not be immediately obvious to the newcomer though!


    Cheers for that Grahame. Thats most interesting and enlighting. This also obviously includes myself, and i have alot to learn as well (as you say time is not always on your side to read all that railway info) but i will try my best to read about projects as throughly as possible and railway workers experiences who build this impressive railway to get an idea of the overall grand scheme of this before posting anything, that is of constructive influence.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 25, 2013, 09:52:03
    Thanks Grahame.  As one of those professionals who posts on here and try's to give some of the answers its quite off putting when all you get back sometimes is criticism ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 25, 2013, 10:13:13
    All so worth saying that the discussion on here about how things will be done ("I suppose it will all work out in the end") could not be further from the truth. Every operation will have been planned in the finest detail. In the offices of the former Post Office sorting office on Vastern Road, there is a large, multi-disciplinary team, consisting of engineers and planners from all of the parties (NR, FGW and all of the contractors) that has planned every step in minute detail. Every operation will have been walked though and risk assessed. There is a team of professionals at work here who, so far, have delivered ever stage on time and, according to NR, to budget. To suggest that "they haven't thought of that" or that this is a "rushed job" is, frankly, ridiculous.

    I too was a professional railwayman for 31 years, and I agree with you that a lot of hard work goes into planning and delivering projects like Reading.  But that isn't to say that everything runs silkily smooth and that things don't get overlooked and that mistakes don't get made - as I've said earlier, FGW now acknowledge mistakes on some aspects of the station design (see the Summer Reading Station News). 

    More significant is the issue of dividing P's 12-15 into A and B.  If this had been the plan at the outset presumably they would have been properly signalled as per the Group Standard.  I therefore suspect that the A and B idea came in after the initial signalling design, which resulted in the rather odd Rear Clear Board arrangements which we've discussed ad nauseam before.

    So I for one am not questioning the hard work going on at ground level, but I wonder whether the right level of experience and expertise has always been available, particularly in the early stages of the project.

    edit:  P12, not P11


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 25, 2013, 13:49:42
    I
    One slight problem I've heard about teh "Freight Line" is due its gradient and curvature it is unlikely even a 59 could restart a heavy stone train if stopped by signals. So freight trains will nee a clear run from Reading West into the station.

    Interesting to compare with the new Acton layout, where the freight lines into the yard will be kept relatively flat, and it's the passenger lines that go up and down. 

    I am puzzled as to why it is assumed that the feeder freight lines will be anything but relatively flat. In the case of the Festival line and the freight feeder they emerge from the north side of their respective viaduct boxes and immediately join the relief lines which must be at the same levels.

    The drawings show the feeder freight line on an embankment, culvert and access bridge, so the intention must have been for it to meet the relief lines at the correct level. I think the only lines with significant gradients are the Festival and Up/Down Main on the viaduct.  So the principle is the same as at Acton with the passenger line going up and down, except that here it's a flyover rather than a diveunder.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on August 25, 2013, 13:54:56
    So I for one am not questioning the hard work going on at ground level, but I wonder whether the right level of experience and expertise has always been available, particularly in the early stages of the project.

    I expect the right experience and expertise were there at the feasibility, AIP (acceptance in principle) for those stages, often its not until a detailed design is worked on and full modelling is done and these are presented to Op's and maintenance they can come up with a "if you could" there are very few people around (if any) that has the ability to see full functionality when something is conceptual in a virtual 3D model


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2013, 14:37:43
    I am puzzled as to why it is assumed that the feeder freight lines will be anything but relatively flat. In the case of the Festival line and the freight feeder they emerge from the north side of their respective viaduct boxes and immediately join the relief lines which must be at the same levels.

    The drawings show the feeder freight line on an embankment, culvert and access bridge, so the intention must have been for it to meet the relief lines at the correct level. I think the only lines with significant gradients are the Festival and Up/Down Main on the viaduct.  So the principle is the same as at Acton with the passenger line going up and down, except that here it's a flyover rather than a diveunder.

    The few drawings that I can find with elevations marked appear to have a datum about 100 m below Ordnance (ODN). I guess that's a site-wide standard, possibly derived from GPS. They show the ground falling a couple of metres from Caversham Road to Little John's Lane, with a few local variations between (but none of this can be called natural).

    In general, the land here is all on the flood plain, so it is pretty flat. The existing railway is on an embankment high enough to pass over the roads, which is too low to pass over a railway. The planning statement says the feeder lines under their box are "virtually at grade", but what grade that means is unclear. On the elevations they are about 2 m above flood plain level. The relief lines will be at existing embankment height, so there will be some 4 m height to gain - though unfortunately the elevations do not extend to Caversham road.

    The statement also describes the height of the new line, but by reference to the existing line - which is confusing, as the existing embankment continues well out to the West. It says the new line is still rising as it goes westward over the feeder lines box and is 9 m above the existing embankment level at its highest, which seems a lot.

    (Corrected reference to statement)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on August 25, 2013, 14:49:24
    If you look at camera 3 of Reading01 on Lobster vision you can see that a queuing system has been set up inside the works compound to handle the returning crowd of festival goers. Should make interesting viewing tomorrow morning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 25, 2013, 15:28:06
    So I for one am not questioning the hard work going on at ground level, but I wonder whether the right level of experience and expertise has always been available, particularly in the early stages of the project.

    I expect the right experience and expertise were there at the feasibility, AIP (acceptance in principle) for those stages, often its not until a detailed design is worked on and full modelling is done and these are presented to Op's and maintenance they can come up with a "if you could" there are very few people around (if any) that has the ability to see full functionality when something is conceptual in a virtual 3D model

    Where I come from the AIP process is a quantitative check by a chartered engineer on the detailed engineering design to make sure that the structure (in this case to pass one pair of running lines over some others) complies with engineering good practice and standards etc and is thus safe for its intended purpose.

    I suppose what I keep going on about is the high level spec for the whole project, which I'm sure did not include the acceptability of heavy freights having to take a "run" at the flyunder to ensure that they didn't run the risk of not being able to restart if they saw a Red light half way through.

    The project may be being delivered on time and to budget, the question is whether the project was defined correctly.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 25, 2013, 15:46:55
    OK here are gradients from Theale to Reading station (extracted from the signalling plan dated November 2010):

    F=Falling Gradient in direction of Travel
    R=Rising Gradient in Direction of Travel
    O/B=Overbridge
    U/B=Underbridge
    m=Metres

    Theale to Reading Station Via Westbury Lines

    Theale Staion to Burghfield Road O/B
    691F Average

    Burghfield Road O/B to Southcote Junction
    323R for 1447m

    Southcote Junction to Bath Road O/B
    323R for 692m

    Bath Road O/B to Reading West Station Platform (Middle)
    307F for 735m

    Reading West Station Platform (Middle) to Reading Station (Via Westbury Lines)

    5822F for 22m to Oxford Road U/B
    671R for 38m Over Oxford Road O/B to Oxford Road Junction Points
    330F for 112m
    194F for 150m
    250F for 472m to Reading Triangle Upper Points
    110F for 42m
    147R for 73m
    304F for 40m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Down Reading Feeder Relief)

    330F for 219m
    90F for 264m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    106R for 287m
    730R for 195m to Westbury Junction (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Up Reading Feeder Main)

    330F for 139m
    112F for 84m
    90F for 260m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    150R for 482m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Health Warning: This data is extracted from a copy of the signalling plan that is 3 years old and may therefore not fully represent the arrangements currently being constructed.  It is therefore listed as a guide only.


    I^ll put the Main Line in a separate post.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2013, 16:32:00

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Down Reading Feeder Relief)

    330F for 219m
    90F for 264m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    106R for 287m
    730R for 195m to Westbury Junction (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Up Reading Feeder Main)

    330F for 139m
    112F for 84m
    90F for 260m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    150R for 482m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms


    Thanks for that, S&TE - I've not quoted it all, obviously.

    So the 1/90 you referred to is the down slope from Oxford Road onto the flood plain, and it's 1/106 up to the relief lines on their embankment. That's steeper than the rise on the other feeder line as it has to join the releif lines further west to access all platforms.

    Now, how long is a 4800 tonne train going to be ... and how much weight would be on the up slope at once?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2013, 17:02:14
    That's steeper than the rise on the other feeder line as it has to join the releif lines further west to access all platforms.
    Having looked at the plan, I'm not sure that's true. Both feeder lines appear to have a West and an East connection onto their respective main line, and at about the same place.  From a quick look at Google earth, I think the 482 m distance would be to the East connection - the rise to the West one would be steeper. That fits with the two-slope profile for the Feeder Relief, but not so obviously for the Feeder Main.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 25, 2013, 19:42:00
    The connection to the Down Relief is 139m West of that to the Up Main (Platforms No.10, 11 and 12).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2013, 19:51:36
    There's been a lot of activity joining up the West end of  P11, visible by zooming into the left-hand edge of the picture from camera 02/2. It's hard to make out, especially with a ballast train on P9, but the rail crane has been there presumably to move the pieces of track.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 25, 2013, 20:03:40
    OK here are gradients from Theale to Reading station (extracted from the signalling plan dated November 2010):

    F=Falling Gradient in direction of Travel
    R=Rising Gradient in Direction of Travel
    O/B=Overbridge
    U/B=Underbridge
    m=Metres


    Reading West Station Platform (Middle) to Reading Station (Via Westbury Lines)

    5822F for 22m to Oxford Road U/B
    671R for 38m Over Oxford Road O/B to Oxford Road Junction Points
    330F for 112m
    194F for 150m
    250F for 472m to Reading Triangle Upper Points
    110F for 42m
    147R for 73m
    304F for 40m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms



    I^ll put the Main Line in a separate post.

    Many thanks for that.

    Analysing the figures I conclude that the Westbury chord descends by 3m in the up direction between Reading West Stn and Reading Stn.

    The freight feeder lines descend from Reading West Stn. by about 3m to the viaduct box and then ascend by approx 3m to Reading Stn.

    If you go down 3 and then up 3 you are not at the same level as just going down 3, so something is wrong with my reasoning.

    This implies that between the freight feeder viaduct box and Reading Stn. the relief lines ascend by 3m. I will have to check the distance, but this seems an unlikely gradient for a Brunel railway.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 25, 2013, 20:11:52
    I sort of question the fact, why the mainline is a flyover with Freight trains that have to go up a gradient below the mainlines...


    The first version of the Reading West plan was to put the mainlines under the others.  The mains on viaduct option was a later decision. The basic reason the mains underpass  didn't happen was that they would have had to close Cow Lane.

    Probably far easier to build the present design.  The design statement on the planning website suggests the height change for the feeder lines from the box towards the station is less than 2 metres, (1850 mm) so one can only hope they know what the freight trains are capable of...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 25, 2013, 20:14:09
    I passed another trailer with three canopy sections about half an hour ago, it was heading north on the Winchester bypass.  I wonder where they are being built?

    PS - A trailer with another 3 sections being reversed outside the main entrance at 2130, possibly those I saw earlier...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 25, 2013, 20:32:51
    There's been a lot of activity joining up the West end of  P11, visible by zooming into the left-hand edge of the picture from camera 02/2. It's hard to make out, especially with a ballast train on P9, but the rail crane has been there presumably to move the pieces of track.

    I notice from Realtime Trains that after 1200 tomorrow (Mon), both P10 & 11 are in use. After that, P10 is used by just one train per day, the 0604 Southampton - Manchester XC service. I guess that means that the western end of the platform is used while work continues on the eastern end. Temporary buffer stops halfway along?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 25, 2013, 20:40:10
    Continued: Here are gradients from Tilehurst to Reading station (extracted from the signalling plan dated November 2010):

    F=Falling Gradient in direction of Travel
    R=Rising Gradient in Direction of Travel
    O/B=Overbridge
    U/B= Underbridge

    Tilehurst Station to Readng West Junction (Main Lines)

    1320F average from Tilehurst Station to Scours Lane Junction
    3614F for 445m
    1760F for 136m
    2682F for 341m
    85R for 621m (Reading West Junction and Mains Flyover Reading West Curve and Reading Festival Lines)

    Readng West Junction to Reading Station (Main Lines)

    730F for 538m
    93F for 536m (Passing over Mains Flyover Up Reading Feeder Main and Down Reading Feeder Relief)
    LEVEL for 256m to Caversham Road U/B
    1463F for 429m to Reading Station Platforms
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Tilehurst Station to Readng West Junction (Relief Lines)

    1320F average from Tilehurst Station to Scours Lane Junction
    3614F for 1579m from Scours Lane Junction to Reading West Junction

    Readng West Junction to Reading Station (Relief Lines)

    3614F for 529m
    420R for 169m
    730R for 402m
    LEVEL to Westbury Line Junction
    LEVEL to Reading Station
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Reading West Junction to Westbury Line Junction (Down Reading Festival Line)

    209R for 177m (passing under the Mains Flyover)
    72R for 384m (Passing over Mains Flyover Up Reading Feeder Main and Down Reading Feeder Relief)
    93F for 506m (Connection to Up Westbury at Westbury Line Junction)

    Health Warning: This data is extracted from a copy of the signalling plan that is 3 years old and may therefore not fully represent the arrangements currently being constructed.  It is therefore listed as a guide only.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 25, 2013, 20:46:06
    I notice from Realtime Trains that after 1200 tomorrow (Mon), both P10 & 11 are in use. After that, P10 is used by just one train per day, the 0604 Southampton - Manchester XC service. I guess that means that the western end of the platform is used while work continues on the eastern end. Temporary buffer stops halfway along?

    I think it's more likely that nothing will be using the platform and that's a typo in the underlying data.  It has happened before, a few XC services were shown using incorrect platforms after the big Easter changes - a number of XC through services were wrongly shown reversing in P7, which was impossible by that stage...

    The listings for the 2nd of September show XC using P10 during most of the day, I'd bet on it not happening.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2013, 21:09:25
    If you go down 3 and then up 3 you are not at the same level as just going down 3, so something is wrong with my reasoning.
     
    I agree that any three routes between A and B should have the same height change, subject of course to the tolerance of these figures. So something (literally) does not add up.

    I can add a piece of data from non-railway sources: the spot heights on an old OS map are 137 ft on Oxford Road, and 126 ft on Caversham Road, both near enough at the bridge. So given that the bridges are similar and hence so is the road to railway offset, you would expect a fall about 3.3 m in each railway route between those points - again plus a suitable tolerance.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on August 25, 2013, 22:57:04
    In the overall scheme of things I expect it's the manufacturer of the roof sections that has the 'steady stream' production line, and at the station they are being fitted in anything but a steady stream - (notwithstanding this weeks overnight activity on P8/9).  So eventually they might have to be delivered to 'somewhere' to make room at the factory, even if the station isn't ready to accept them.

    But on the other hand perhaps the P10/11 panels were going to be fitted the weekend after they arrived but something else, such as a mobile crane, was cancelled at the last minute?  Or was the weather forecast wrong, or were the steelwork supports delayed unexpectedly?

    Paul

    Looking at P10 it appears to me that if any further canopy panels were added they would seriously overhang the track (until the track and platform is realigned in the next few weeks). Would this be a reason why the modules cannot be fitted yet?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 25, 2013, 23:38:08
    If you go down 3 and then up 3 you are not at the same level as just going down 3, so something is wrong with my reasoning.
     
    I agree that any three routes between A and B should have the same height change, subject of course to the tolerance of these figures. So something (literally) does not add up.

    I can add a piece of data from non-railway sources: the spot heights on an old OS map are 137 ft on Oxford Road, and 126 ft on Caversham Road, both near enough at the bridge. So given that the bridges are similar and hence so is the road to railway offset, you would expect a fall about 3.3 m in each railway route between those points - again plus a suitable tolerance.


    Yes thanks, that's useful confirmation that my figures for the Westbury chord are about right.

    The explanation lies in the figures for the relief lines. If I use these:-

    Reading West Junction to Reading Station (Relief Lines)

    3614F for 529m
    420R for 169m
    730R for 402m
    LEVEL to Westbury Line Junction
    LEVEL to Reading Station
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    The relevant ones being 730R for 402m which starts at the freight feeder box.

    This gives a rise to the station of 0.55m and at an upward gradient of 1:730 and within reasonable tolerances, a similar height to the route via the Westbury chord.

    So the answer to the original question is that there is no problem. If a train stops on the freight feeder it is on a downhill slope anyway (towards Reading) and when joining the relief lines encounters a 1:730 upward gradient.

    QED.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 26, 2013, 00:04:12
    The relevant ones being 730R for 402m which starts at the freight feeder box.

    This gives a rise to the station of 0.55m and at an upward gradient of 1:730 and within reasonable tolerances, a similar height to the route via the Westbury chord.

    So the answer to the original question is that there is no problem. If a train stops on the freight feeder it is on a downhill slope anyway (towards Reading) and when joining the relief lines encounters a 1:730 upward gradient.

    QED.

    I don't follow. What I see in the relief line figures is that they run almost level along the embankment, so are only 0.55 m down level with the feeder line box. But the feeder lines are "virtually at grade", i.e. 3 m down at that point.

    The main lines fall 6.5 m from the top of the viaduct, but less than half of this happens from the feeder box - so the feeder lines must be below the relief lines to pass below the main lines on the viaduct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on August 26, 2013, 03:14:10
    There's been a lot of activity joining up the West end of  P11, visible by zooming into the left-hand edge of the picture from camera 02/2. It's hard to make out, especially with a ballast train on P9, but the rail crane has been there presumably to move the pieces of track.

    I notice from Realtime Trains that after 1200 tomorrow (Mon), both P10 & 11 are in use. After that, P10 is used by just one train per day, the 0604 Southampton - Manchester XC service. I guess that means that the western end of the platform is used while work continues on the eastern end. Temporary buffer stops halfway along?


    PLATFORM 10 will be OUT OF USE both starting signals will be covered over, Platform 11 (up main loop) will be in use. Signalling / route availability will be identical to that currently of platform 10.

    To confirm that is.

    Up trains: from Up Westbury or Up Main, permissible working allowed.

    Down trains: No access from Kennett Bridge end, however a train can enter from UM/UW and reverse to DM or DW

    Speed:25mph

    Only minor difference is that platform 11 will be fully A/B working as technically 10 was never split.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 26, 2013, 09:31:08
    Re the Up Down Feeder Relief line gradient issue which I was ratcheting up.

    I'm happy to acknowledge that now we know more about the lengths and extents of the gradients that will be encountered by up stone trains between Oxford Road Junction and the station via the Up Down Feeder, it is probably not a mathematical certainty that such a train, if brought to a stand at the signal on the Up Down Feeder line just before it joins the DR, would not be able to restart.

    However, I think it would be a brave signaller who tried it!  So I think these trains will still if at all possible be given a clear run from Southcote Junction and through the station not just for the reasons Oxman mentioned earlier, but also to avoid the risk of a train being unable to restart - or worse, just managing to move far enough to foul the DR. 

    edit:  "Up Feeder" description corrected to "Down Feeder" as per Stuving below.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 26, 2013, 10:23:04
    Re the Up Feeder line gradient issue which I was ratcheting up.

    I'm happy to acknowledge that now we know more about the lengths and extents of the gradients that will be encountered by up stone trains between Oxford Road Junction and the station via the Up Feeder, it is probably not a mathematical certainty that such a train, if brought to a stand at the signal on the Up Feeder line just before it joins the DR, would not be able to restart.

    However, I think it would be a brave signaller who tried it!  So I think these trains will still if at all possible be given a clear run from Southcote Junction and through the station not just for the reasons Oxman mentioned earlier, but also to avoid the risk of a train being unable to restart - or worse, just managing to move far enough to foul the DR. 

    That raises another point - how would such an issue be dealt with now? After all, this problem of heavy freight trains and gradients isn't new. I guess that in the past it was down to a signaller's local knowledge, but has that now been replaced by something more systematic? After all, it would not be hard to put the trains' vital statistics into the suitable program and find out exactly which routes it can cope with (at some given adhesion). I could probably do it in Excel, given the time.

    That presumably would be based on the worst-case stopping points, since surely in the new capacity-improved conflict-reduced layout more trains should operate as pathed - non-stop from loop to loop?

    Oh, and if you look closer you will see that it is called the Down Reading Feeder Relief line - not Up, despite being on the left of the Up Reading Feeder Main. I presume that's because it branches off the Down Relief. Of course they are both bi-directional.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 26, 2013, 10:38:05
    The relevant ones being 730R for 402m which starts at the freight feeder box.

    This gives a rise to the station of 0.55m and at an upward gradient of 1:730 and within reasonable tolerances, a similar height to the route via the Westbury chord.

    So the answer to the original question is that there is no problem. If a train stops on the freight feeder it is on a downhill slope anyway (towards Reading) and when joining the relief lines encounters a 1:730 upward gradient.

    QED.

    I don't follow. What I see in the relief line figures is that they run almost level along the embankment, so are only 0.55 m down level with the feeder line box. But the feeder lines are "virtually at grade", i.e. 3 m down at that point.

    The main lines fall 6.5 m from the top of the viaduct, but less than half of this happens from the feeder box - so the feeder lines must be below the relief lines to pass below the main lines on the viaduct.

    Yes, you may well have a point.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 26, 2013, 16:28:07
    Discussions yesterday about the possible use of P10 are now academic, as not only are the signals bagged out of use as mentioned earlier, but almost the entire length of the temporary pre-fabricated platform structure has been removed.  Where the temporary surface IS still present, (ie towards the London end where it tapered away to nothing), the track has been removed completely.

    I'll try and upload a few pictures later on once I've reduced their file size a bit...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 26, 2013, 21:01:32
    Back to canopies ... I see that having almost filled the space from the existing canopy to the gap in the rail, the next three sections have gone at the far end. To my surprise, I found that the sections were just parked next to each other - some touching, some not quite, but with no bolts holding them together and presumably not fixed to the rails...

    Reassuringly they are all bolted down to the rails as of today...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on August 26, 2013, 21:49:17
    Anyone would think the Reading project team are making it up as they go along  ???

    I am sure they must at least have a meeting in the cafe on Friday mornings  ;D



    .
    Everything (well almost everything) you see will have been thought through, even the sequence of the deliveries to site.  Railway projects work to a timetable, yes margins are built in because we don't want to over run as we know how important the 05: .......... oh my word is that the time train departure is


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 27, 2013, 21:44:38
    Discussions yesterday about the possible use of P10 are now academic, as not only are the signals bagged out of use as mentioned earlier, but almost the entire length of the temporary pre-fabricated platform structure has been removed.  Where the temporary surface IS still present, (ie towards the London end where it tapered away to nothing), the track has been removed completely.

    I'll try and upload a few pictures later on once I've reduced their file size a bit...

    Paul

    Thanks for the pictures. Makes you realise how much work there is left to do.

    BTW. Another two canopy panels delivered this evening.
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on August 27, 2013, 23:57:26
    Yes, the demolition of old buildings, well other than relocating the signalbox to Didcot, and adding the new platforms is almost 'easy' it will always be converting what is there, becomes fun. While of course keeping the trains running, and any change to track layout requires signing off of track, full testing of all the signaled routes, and I guess the routes that have been taken out of use must be tested to make sure they DONT work.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2013, 01:11:50
    Last night's delivery of canopy stuff seems different, frames are being built up on the forecourt.  Any ideas why that might be?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on August 29, 2013, 07:59:33
    Last night's delivery of canopy stuff seems different, frames are being built up on the forecourt.  Any ideas why that might be?

    Paul
    A couple of thoughts why if I were involved, the whole or large sections can be craned in a oner to reduce or to fit into possession time, the complete sections are to big to deliver in a oner


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 29, 2013, 08:25:38
    Last night's delivery of canopy stuff seems different, frames are being built up on the forecourt.  Any ideas why that might be?

    Paul

    Surely this is the answer to the question " but what about the ones on top of the missing beams?" - as expected, the method used is not one I thought of. As there are four, I suspect they can pile the bare frames on top of each other next to the gap, put in the last two rails, then move the frames into place using stands or similar and finish assembling them. Of course there may be other reasons for not pre-assembling them.

    By the way, had you noticed that you can see the crane putting the sections in place at the London end of P8/9? Look on camera 02/2, above the "heritage" station roof, to the left of the clock (or lantern), after midnight, from 23rd August. It's hard to work out exactly what it's doing, but it looks as it it has its jib extended, kept near vertical, and does move about a lot. I'm still not sure if it moves carrying a section, or puts it down and then moves, if the crane comes across the polystyrene bridge ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on August 29, 2013, 10:38:38
    Now that the temporary P10 surface has been removed I was intrigued to see what was beneath. Where the foundations for the new bridge have been sunk they have cut straight through the sleepers of the original track and removed just half of it.

    In the same area, excavations have begun. Presumably these are footings for the new permanent P10 in line with the new track position.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2013, 11:21:34
    Now that the temporary P10 surface has been removed I was intrigued to see what was beneath. Where the foundations for the new bridge have been sunk they have cut straight through the sleepers of the original track and removed just half of it.

    It wasn't really apparent earlier, but with hindsight they must have had to cut the sleepers.  Presumably because we couldn't see all the way back under the temporary deck, although the original platform track was always visible in certain places, most noticeably at the far west of the temporary P10.  This was subsequently removed when they started the permanent blockwork construction on the final platform alignment beyond the temporary section;   IYSWIM...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on August 29, 2013, 11:48:52
    Last night's delivery of canopy stuff seems different, frames are being built up on the forecourt.  Any ideas why that might be?

    Paul

    By the way, had you noticed that you can see the crane putting the sections in place at the London end of P8/9? Look on camera 02/2, above the "heritage" station roof, to the left of the clock (or lantern), after midnight, from 23rd August. It's hard to work out exactly what it's doing, but it looks as it it has its jib extended, kept near vertical, and does move about a lot. I'm still not sure if it moves carrying a section, or puts it down and then moves, if the crane comes across the polystyrene bridge ...

    Well spotted. The crane can be seen from Aug 19 to Aug 28. A very substantial crane it is too, with telescopic jib, not unlike the Ainscough used to unload the canopy sections. The crane can't surely be on the plaltorm. It must be rail mounted? Anybody spotted a crane in the sidings during the day?

    The delivery last night included quite a lot of hardware in addition to the long beams, so the final canopies (those for the gap in the support beams?) are going to be assembled in place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2013, 12:22:03

    Well spotted. The crane can be seen from Aug 19 to Aug 28. A very substantial crane it is too, with telescopic jib, not unlike the Ainscough used to unload the canopy sections. The crane can't surely be on the plaltorm. It must be rail mounted? Anybody spotted a crane in the sidings during the day?


    I'm 99% sure the crane used is working from the island platform, there was one there on Monday within the hoarded off area. Will have to get a photo in due course...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 29, 2013, 12:32:23
    I'm 99% sure the crane used is working from the island platform, there was one there on Monday within the hoarded off area. Will have to get a photo in due course...

    I think so too - it does look like the small grey tracked crane that is kept there, despite its small base and apparent lack of weight.
    I have this picture from a few days ago; not very clear but it does suggest about 5 extending jib sections.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2013, 12:41:30
    Ah, well done.  Saves me a few minutes.  I suppose the next question is how they recover the crane, but presumably that won't be much different to how they recovered the machines used to tear down the old footbridge.  In that case they drove them across temporary infill structures over the tracks towards the new platforms and used a big crane from the north side...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: coachflyer on August 29, 2013, 12:47:12
    FGW have posted some pics how they have moved the roof sections here.

    http://bit.ly/147OeUd (http://bit.ly/147OeUd)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2013, 13:34:37
    Remarkable.   Confirms nearly all of our accumulated guess work - just a shame no-one noticed the pics a week ago!   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 29, 2013, 13:57:04
    Yes - some kind soul evidently wanted to stop our endless speculations. The one thing I did miss was about the dollies. Having worked out that long legs would allow the panels to be manoeuvred above the gateline, I had not spotted they have no bracing - so they can pass through the gateline. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on August 29, 2013, 16:54:25
    Yes - some kind could evidently wanted to stop our endless speculations. The one thing I did miss was about the dollies. Having worked out that long legs would allow the panels to be manouevred above the gateline, I had not spotted they have no bracing - so they can pass through the gateline. 
    Remarkable.   Confirms nearly all of our accumulated guess work - just a shame no-one noticed the pics a week ago!   ;D

    Paul

    Its all been a bit like the manager of the England football team


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Phil on August 29, 2013, 18:15:00
    Surely allowing long legged dollies through the gateline is discriminatory though? I thought that sort of thing only went on at night-clubs. Tsk.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 29, 2013, 18:27:00
    Surely allowing long legged dollies through the gateline is discriminatory though?

    I thought you said long legged doggies for a moment there, Phil

    (http://www.wellho.net/pix/bmo_01.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 29, 2013, 18:38:49
    Surely allowing long legged dollies through the gateline is discriminatory though? I thought that sort of thing only went on at night-clubs. Tsk.
    Well, it was at night. And in a place the public have to buy a ticket to enter, though it was closed at the time.

    I guess it's in the nature of mechanical engineering to be just stuffed full of double entendres.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on August 29, 2013, 19:20:06

    I guess it's in the nature of mechanical engineering to be just stuffed full of double entendres.

    My secretary asked if I could think of an example of a double entendre, so I gave her one.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 30, 2013, 20:07:51
    The delivery last night included quite a lot of hardware in addition to the long beams, so the final canopies (those for the gap in the support beams?) are going to be assembled in place.
    You will probably have seen that the bare frames (just two spars and two cross-members) of six sections have been assembled, the last two of which are still sitting outside. The other four are in place on their support beams, so I suspect that the reason for fitting them in that form is weight. Being lighter, they can be lifted by the crane over a bigger radius. So, the question is: where is the crane for this lift? I can't work it out from seeing its jib on camera 02/2. It is sill being kept in the middle of P8/9, but then we know it can drive under the support beams.

    It appears that the sections have always been bolted to the beams, but the spars are still not fixed to each other at their tips, and there are gaps of several cm. Maybe there is a sneaky method of shimming them to spread any gaps more evenly when they are finally bolted through the holes provided.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 30, 2013, 22:39:15
    Here's an idea then...  Perhaps once the polystyrene block 'bridge' is in place the crane can operate from on top of it?   That would possibly mean that they'd be lifting the sections 'endways on', rather than 'across' the line of the jib, so the load capacity might be reduced?

    As I say, just a thought.  Unless anyone is daft enough to go down there in the middle of the night I don't suppose we'll find out...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 30, 2013, 23:23:27
    Well, we know the crane drove across the styro-causeway, but that's not the same. The remarkable strength of this soft material depends on its being evenly loaded, so relying on it to stay level when the weight on it tries to tilt would be risky. It would take a lot of effort to calculate its strength, and the consequences of the crane toppling would be so expensive, I doubt it would be worth even thinking about.

    The orientation of the load can't affect the load on the crane - its centre of gravity lies in line with the vertical cable. Its weight dictates the maximum radius.
    Afterthought - being end-on does place the load's centre further out - which maybe you  meant - but that's already true anyway.

    Looking at the pictures again, it looks as if the crane is the far side of P9 - which makes no sense to me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 03, 2013, 16:28:25
    I had a look at the canopy sections from platform level today, and I think the answer might be that the crawler crane could still operate through the gaps between the sections as they came together. In other words, I'm thinking that even with only one section missing there would still be a gap big enough for the crane jib to have been used.  Then it is noticeable that the pair of long 'side members' of what would have effectively been the final section are not yet connected together by 'cross pieces'.  So it is possible that they were either craned in separately, or craned in joined to the sections either side.

    I've attached a phone picture to show where I mean...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 03, 2013, 16:48:21
    Couple of photos here showing work on platform edges.

    First one is the London end of P8.  Coping slabs along this section are being replaced with modern equivalents after building up the existing platform walling to a revised level.  This suggests to me that, if that is the solution all the way round the P8/P9 island, there might not be as much upheaval as sometimes thought.  The engineering access statement suggests that the platforms will have reduced operational length at certain stages, presumably when they do the middle sections?

    The second picture shows the initial stages of building up the concrete foundation strip for the new wall for platform 10,   continuing eastward from the short length of block walling previously built alongside the 'coffee shop'.  I'd assume that some shuttering will appear next.  Still wondering if they'll remove those redundant sleepers visible on the left, or if they'll just be buried...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 03, 2013, 19:37:55
    I had a look at the canopy sections from platform level today, and I think the answer might be that the crawler crane could still operate through the gaps between the sections as they came together. In other words, I'm thinking that even with only one section missing there would still be a gap big enough for the crane jib to have been used.  Then it is noticeable that the pair of long 'side members' of what would have effectively been the final section are not yet connected together by 'cross pieces'.  So it is possible that they were either craned in separately, or craned in joined to the sections either side.

    I've attached a phone picture to show where I mean...

    Paul

    Yes, I did wonder about that. The difficulty would be limited luffing angle, but maybe modern cranes - presumably the latest ones are all digital now - can change their jib extension as well as luff and hoist in a coordinated manouevre. It may even be possible to input some motion limits and the desired load path and have the crane tell you if it is possible, and then just do it.

    Mind you, their chosen method still seems a lot of trouble to go to to do it the easy way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 03, 2013, 19:42:17
    Mind you, their chosen method still seems a lot of trouble to go to to do it the easy way.

    So what would you have said was the easy way?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 06, 2013, 13:23:42
    There is activity taking place at various locations at the moment.

    Clearance of the old depot on the triangle has started, sections of track south of the main shed have disappeared.

    The rest of the temporary P10 has gone, workers were constructing the reinforced steel cages for concreting sections earlier this morning.

    I noticed that the last vestiges of the old canopy at the eastern end of P7 have been removed too along with the shanty town style corrugated iron temporary section.
    Does anyone know what the plans are for what used to be the access to the old bridge. That section of the building has been largely stripped down to a shell and sections of the roof were gone as of yesterday evening.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 06, 2013, 14:34:55
    Does anyone know what the plans are for what used to be the access to the old bridge. That section of the building has been largely stripped down to a shell and sections of the roof were gone as of yesterday evening.

    I was surprised by how long it has taken to remove this part - last time I looked the escalators were still there. As we've not seen them come out on the cameras, presumably they still are there.

    The plans show the whole of this structure being cleared, leaving the shops next to the heritage station building and what I guess we call the ground level concourse much as they are. The gateline will be straighter and closer to the platforms, and the current roof over will be extended and extra bits added to fill the gaps between it and the new canopies.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 06, 2013, 17:11:36
    Mind you, their chosen method still seems a lot of trouble to go to to do it the easy way.
    So what would you have said was the easy way?

    I meant using the crawler crane on P8/9, as Paul suggested, even if it means handling the last few sections differently. However, I guess the same could be said about other ways of getting those in place, such as the ones I suggested. In fact, it often is worth making the extra effort to use whatever is available - even if it is over-capable - and I've done much the same. I just rather thought they would have some simpler ways of raising such loads and sliding them along the support rails.

    How much does one of those spars weigh, anyway? Crude photogrammetry suggests it is roughly 0.25 m deep and 15 m long. A standard 254x114 mm steel I-beam (which I think would be thicker steel) would weight 550 kg, say half a ton. You don't need a crane to handle that kind of weight. Indeed, the last two lengths of support rail, weighing about a ton each, were raised using a hoist - at least there was a small wheeled gantry still sitting over one of them last week.

    A complete canopy section I guess would weigh about ten times one spar - so five tons - or perhaps more. That is a bit more demanding, though a straight lift or slide still look safer than a mobile crane without jacks.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 06, 2013, 17:12:29
    I've attached a couple of snips from the planning drawings, the details may have changed slightly since the original application, but they'll give the general idea.  (The drawing shows the widened platform 7 of course, rather than the current width.)

    I had a look round on Tuesday, the escalators were still there at that time, but they were nibbling away at various parts of the concrete structure above and surrounding them.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 08, 2013, 16:57:12
    Roll up! Roll up! to see the amazing leaping train!
    The operating timetable for tomorrow in Real-time Trains still shows the following sequence of movements in platform 5:

    VAR  0940  0940  London Waterloo  5  2C17  SW  Terminates here    (forms 2C94)
    WTT  0951  0949  Redhill                5  2V54  GW  Terminates here    (forms 2O34)
    VAR                    Starts here          5  2C94  SW  London Waterloo  0956  0956
    WTT                    Starts here          5  2O34  GW  Redhill                1004  1004

    Now that must be worth watching - and the same thing happens several times later in the day, starting at 17:10.

    More seriously, whose job is it to check these platform moves for geometrical feasibility, and when? Note that the trains do not belong to the same TOC.

    The issue arises, of course, because P6 has been taken out of use for two weeks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 09, 2013, 13:07:46
    The issue arises, of course, because P6 has been taken out of use for two weeks.

    Does anyone know why P6 has been taken out of use?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 09, 2013, 13:31:35
    Does anyone know why P6 has been taken out of use?
    Presumably to do with the plan to build a temporary (extension to) P7 - see:
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg137501#msg137501
    et seq.
    (Issue 7 of the Reading Station news is still not on the NR site, so I can't link to it.)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 09, 2013, 13:46:33
    Does anyone know why P6 has been taken out of use?
    Presumably to do with the plan to build a temporary (extension to) P7 -
    I would have thought it would be out of use for much longer if for P7.

    I think this may have been discussed before, but would it not make sense to get P10 back into use and finish P8 & 9 before tackllng P7?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 09, 2013, 15:51:24
    I would have thought it would be out of use for much longer if for P7.

    I think this may have been discussed before, but would it not make sense to get P10 back into use and finish P8 & 9 before tackllng P7?
    We can't really talk about what makes sense without knowing what the sneaky plan of works is on full - so we'll just have to wait and see.

    Here's our  evidence base:-

    This from the FGW site:
    Quote
    Monday 23 September to Thursday 2 January 2014   
    On London Paddington to west of England trains, the rear two First class coaches (G-H) will not be available to board/alight at platform 7, at Reading station . Customers are advised to listen to announcements.

    The bit in Issue 7 of the Reading Station News that says:
    Quote
    A temporary platform 7 will be installed in September to allow customers to continue to  board trains once the west end of the platform is closed for construction. Platform 6 will be closed and linked to platform 7 by walkways. The west end of platform 7 will reopen in December and the temporary platform will be removed.
    Work will then begin on the east end of the platform.

    The WTT in Realtimetrains that shows P6 back in use from 24th - presumably a bit shorter than its current 12-car length.

    The current West of England timetable that implies P7 is out of use on Sundays 15/9 to 1/12 and on Saturdays 14/9 to 19/10.

    I guess the track at P7 will be moved sideways on the weekend of 21/22 September.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 09, 2013, 16:02:19
    I think this may have been discussed before, but would it not make sense to get P10 back into use and finish P8 & 9 before tackllng P7?

    I don't think it really matters much.   Either P10 or P11 on their own provide the same notional capacity as the up main always had,  and P7/8/9 provide far more than the old down main's previous capacity, and can still allow for XC reversals even with half of P8 or P9 closed, as has always been the intention.  Also, as we now know, P7 will effectively remain partially open throughout (ie limited to 6 car train lengths, with SDO used on HSTs).

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 09, 2013, 16:42:43
    I think this may have been discussed before, but would it not make sense to get P10 back into use and finish P8 & 9 before tackllng P7?

    I don't think it really matters much.   Either P10 or P11 on their own provide the same notional capacity as the up main always had,  and P7/8/9 provide far more than the old down main's previous capacity, and can still allow for XC reversals even with half of P8 or P9 closed, as has always been the intention.  Also, as we now know, P7 will effectively remain partially open throughout (ie limited to 6 car train lengths, with SDO used on HSTs).

    Paul

    True, but the old UM P8 (very old P5) couldn't always cope on its own with all UM trains and it was not uncommon for some UM trains to be timetabled or put into the old P9 (very old P8).  Until we get the second UM platform this option doesn't exist.

    However, it seems to me far better to get on with the platform works and complete them quickly, even if it means several platforms being unavailable or limited in capacity at the same time.   And, of course, until all the platforms are available the station is going to be a bit stretched to operate the train service smoothly.  We just have to accept it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 09, 2013, 17:05:09
    I think this may have been discussed before, but would it not make sense to get P10 back into use and finish P8 & 9 before tackllng P7?

    I don't think it really matters much.   Either P10 or P11 on their own provide the same notional capacity as the up main always had,  and P7/8/9 provide far more than the old down main's previous capacity, and can still allow for XC reversals even with half of P8 or P9 closed, as has always been the intention.  Also, as we now know, P7 will effectively remain partially open throughout (ie limited to 6 car train lengths, with SDO used on HSTs).

    Paul

    True, but the old UM P8 (very old P5) couldn't always cope on its own with all UM trains and it was not uncommon for some UM trains to be timetabled or put into the old P9 (very old P8).  Until we get the second UM platform this option doesn't exist.

    It does exist to the extent that trains can and do cross to the reliefs (although further to the west) and then run through P14 or P15 - almost the equivalent of running through the old P9?    I didn't feel the need to add that level of detail though.  Also of course up trains off the Westbury route can still head through any of P7-P9 as well before crossing back to the up main anyway.

    I think we're in agreement that there's no obvious need to delay the P7 work though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 09, 2013, 18:46:29
    Yes, agreed on that Paul.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 10, 2013, 18:16:51
    (Issue 7 of the Reading Station news is still not on the NR site, so I can't link to it.)

    It's been on the FGW site since you first quoted from it a few weeks ago though:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/YourJourney/Rail%20Improvements/Reading%20Station%20Improvements/fgw-reading-station-news-issue-seven.ashx

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on September 10, 2013, 18:37:15
    A couple of comments now that things are up and running on a few platforms:

    1. The entrances to WH Smith on Platforms 8&9 Country End are wrongly positioned. They face the platforms, but when you are coming down the stairs/escalators it isn't very clear that there is a shop there at all. Business was dreadful and I would expect Smiths to push for a new entrance facing the escalators to be built.

    2. The canopies prevent prevent you from looking down the platforms from the over bridge - a little odd...

    3. There appears to be a new coffee booth opened at the Country End of Platforms 10&11, but being invisible from the Overbridge ( see above) and currently also obscured by hoardings/scaffolding I suspect that it's only customers are the station staff/workmen...

    4. The hotch-potch of surfaces on Platforms 8&9 is a right mess.Does anyone know whether they are planning to create a uniform surface using the normal brick herringbone pattern?

    5. As others have pointed out, it is incredibly disappointing that after the feverish activity to get the station opened at Easter, the rest of the works are essentially plodding on at snails pace...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 10, 2013, 19:09:43
    A couple of comments now that things are up and running on a few platforms:
    1. The entrances to WH Smith on Platforms 8&9 Country End are wrongly positioned. They face the platforms, but when you are coming down the stairs/escalators it isn't very clear that there is a shop there at all. Business was dreadful and I would expect Smiths to push for a new entrance facing the escalators to be built.

    I agree - it is surprising the doors open outward towards the tracks.  However it's a bit more obvious than when I first mentioned it when it opened, initially the 'windows' facing the bottom of the escalators were clear glass showing nothing but the backs of the sales racks...

    Quote
    3. There appears to be a new coffee booth opened at the Country End of Platforms 10&11, but being invisible from the Overbridge ( see above) and currently also obscured by hoardings/scaffolding I suspect that it's only customers are the station staff/workmen.

    But it will be fine once the hoardings are down, because this one at least opens towards the waiting area.

    Quote

    4. The hotch-potch of surfaces on Platforms 8&9 is a right mess.Does anyone know whether they are planning to create a uniform surface using the normal brick herringbone pattern?

    Yes they are providing a uniform surface, and correcting the levels of the platform copings. As I posted a few days ago they are starting to do the platform edges at the London end of P8.  So it is happening albeit slowly, but work is already planned to accelerate, because as has been shown in the engineering access statement for a couple of years they are about to shorten P8 to half its length.  The herringbone paviors are already installed in some areas, and there's a significant amount been done under the London end canopy - I expect as the hoardings come down this will all become obvious?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 10, 2013, 19:11:47
    (Issue 7 of the Reading Station news is still not on the NR site, so I can't link to it.)
    It's been on the FGW site since you first quoted from it a few weeks ago though:
    Paul

    So it is - thanks for that; I hadn't realised that page was being kept up to date. Just Network Rail being flat of foot, then.

    Without having been to watch, it appears from Realtimetrains that no acrobatics have so far been needed in platforms 4 and 5, but they are still planning to have another try tomorrow.

    This morning the Redhill train was late so there was no conflict, but it sneaked in and out so quickly it never got its name and number took. Yesterday it was swapped from P5 to P4, which is free - at least if you ignore the ECS movements listed as "activated". These are 5Z41 from Woking via Guildford, 5Z42 to Ascot and back again, and 5Z43 to Guildford direct - all SWT. I can only assume these are imaginary, despite having some recorded real times. At least, for the one transit of Wokingham I observed, I'm sure I saw it not go past.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 10, 2013, 20:37:32
    It's been on the FGW site since you first quoted from it a few weeks ago though:
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/YourJourney/Rail%20Improvements/Reading%20Station%20Improvements/fgw-reading-station-news-issue-seven.ashx
    Paul
    Wow, thanks for that. I had looked at the FGW website and now I understand why I didn't find it!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 10, 2013, 23:30:12
    Re: 5Z41/2/3 - these are route learners for SWT drivers who are about to operate the Wessex area autumn railhead treatment trains, (RHTT) hence they also cover Guildford to Reading via Blackwater. 

    They were reported running in mid August for a few days using the 6 car 159 that usually berths at Basingstoke in the weekday off-peak.

    They only cover areas the intended drivers don't already have route knowledge though, so bear little or no resemblance to the eventual RHTT paths when they start running in earnest with the NR Windhoff MPVs.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 11, 2013, 00:03:11
    Re: 5Z41/2/3 - these are route learners for SWT drivers who are about to operate the Wessex area autumn railhead treatment trains, (RHTT) hence they also cover Guildford to Reading via Blackwater. 
    They were reported running in mid August for a few days using the 6 car 159 that usually berths at Basingstoke in the weekday off-peak.

    Ah - that makes sense, at least, and I think I remember seeing something of the kind coming from Basingstoke. These ones, on closer examination, ran from and to Guildford, and starting before 8:00 are not exactly off-peak. They managed to dodge round the Redhill train at Reading by both being a few minutes early or late - so I may have missed it as it passed here.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 11, 2013, 12:25:27
    Ah - that makes sense, at least, and I think I remember seeing something of the kind coming from Basingstoke. These ones, on closer examination, ran from and to Guildford, and starting before 8:00 are not exactly off-peak. They managed to dodge round the Redhill train at Reading by both being a few minutes early or late - so I may have missed it as it passed here.

    Yes, I used 'offpeak' in the context of this particular 6.159 diagram, because the pair of DMUs normally only does the 0543 from Salisbury to Waterloo arriving 0714, then departs Waterloo empty at 0720, arriving at Basingstoke at 0814 where it berths for the day to form a pair of 3 car trains in the evening peak.  So 'contra peak' might have been a better description.   

    What they do by short term planning (STP) is to run the 6.159 in its normal ECS path (5L89) as far as Woking and then divert it via Guildford onto route learning for a few hours and get it back to Basingstoke later on to do its afternoon peak work...

    You can see here how 5L89 is altered to form 5Z41:  http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/WOK/2013/09/09/0747

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 12, 2013, 09:02:41
    I had a look round on Tuesday, the escalators were still there at that time, but they were nibbling away at various parts of the concrete structure above and surrounding them.

    As of yesterday evening both escalators are gone and the structure is little more than a shell.
    There are lots of markings and filled concrete holes appearing on P7 overnight(s).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 12, 2013, 18:38:25
    A few pictures captured from a 'phone video', taken from a train, showing the 'Central Viaduct' site.

    The first two shots show the two variants of concrete pier, the larger one is where the fixed ends of the steelwork are supported, alternate piers are not so substantial (in terms of thickness), and they carry the floating ends of the steelwork sections.

    If I've got my bearings correctly, the third picture shows the blind spot between the two webcam views, and shows them pouring concrete into the shuttering that forms the 'pile cap' for the north side of the Festival Box slab.   The corresponding views on webcam 6/2 are around 1200 today, 12th Sept.

    Hope these are of interest for anyone who doesn't get through Reading often, even if relatively poor quality...

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 12, 2013, 19:03:38
    Various little steps forward visible today - some expected, some perhaps not...

    There are lots of markings and filled concrete holes appearing on P7 overnight(s).
    Not only that, they line up with the stanchions for the canopy on P1/2.

    It appears that the sections have always been bolted to the beams, but the spars are still not fixed to each other at their tips, and there are gaps of several cm. Maybe there is a sneaky method of shimming them to spread any gaps more evenly when they are finally bolted through the holes provided.
    I'm not sure much was done to straighten out the canopy sections. The ends are bolted together directly where they touched, and shimmed with one or two (never more that I saw) 5 mm-ish plates where gapped.

    What has been done that needed P6 closed? Well, there's some scaffolding appeared (1st pic). Not quite a self-assembly platform kit, as you need a gang of scaffolders to come and build it. This amount only looks enough to cover the near end of P6, and I can't see why that needs to wait until this weekend. The built-out P7 has to go in during the same possession as the track is moved, expected to be 20th-23rd?

    And finally - some little I-beams have been piled in the 6-foot between P9B and P10B (Second pic - there are some more further down, towards and under the deck). I'm not sure what to call them, as they look too short to be called pillars or stanchions. I guess these are the two piling machines that put them there. Maybe that's what the track was left in place for - and it goes on well past the deck, so perhaps some more will appear. Now the question is, what are they for? And why just here, not between other platforms?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 12, 2013, 19:38:34
    Guessing, and mainly based on a drawing posted ages ago (somewhere in this thread), the finished height of the track for P10 is significantly higher than that through P9, and they are possibly going to put some sort of barrier in to deal with the ballast levels being different.

    (I'm thinking here of a cross section across the station perpendicular to the tracks, it showed that the new platforms were all significantly higher than the existing...)

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 12, 2013, 19:47:45
    Guessing, and mainly based on a drawing posted ages ago (somewhere in this thread), the finished height of the track for P10 is significantly higher than that through P9, and they are possibly going to put some sort of barrier in to deal with the ballast levels being different.

    (I'm thinking here of a cross section across the station perpendicular to the tracks, it showed that the new platforms were all significantly higher than the existing...)

    Paul

    I think you're right - and if you look closely at that cross-sectional view, it shows a little retaining wall with its own foundation. The height difference is about the height of track plus sleepers - whatever that is. In that case it must run all the way along, surely.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 12, 2013, 20:52:45
    If I've got my bearings correctly, the third picture shows the blind spot between the two webcam views,
    The cameras are visible in the picture, top right.
    Quote
    and shows them pouring concrete into the shuttering that forms the 'pile cap' for the north side of the Festival Box slab.   The corresponding views on webcam 6/2 are around 1200 today, 12th Sept.
    Paul
    Parts of the concrete pump can be seen very much in the foreground on Cam06/2 at that time.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 12, 2013, 22:03:34

    ...and shows them pouring concrete into the shuttering that forms the 'pile cap' for the north side of the Festival Box slab.   The corresponding views on webcam 6/2 are around 1200 today, 12th Sept.
    Paul
    Parts of the concrete pump can be seen very much in the foreground on Cam06/2 at that time.

     ??? That's what I meant above (in bold)...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 12, 2013, 22:06:07
    What has been done that needed P6 closed? Well, there's some scaffolding appeared (1st pic). Not quite a self-assembly platform kit, as you need a gang of scaffolders to come and build it. This amount only looks enough to cover the near end of P6, and I can't see why that needs to wait until this weekend.
    The third rail power will have to be off during materials delivery and scaffold contruction. Whether that justifies P6 being out of use. According to RTT P6 comes back into use after Sep 23, contrary to the statement in Reading Station News No7.
    What really puzzles me though is how P7 is going to be part re-constructed in as little as 3 months adjacent to a running line. I had thought that perhaps P8 would be used for down Westbury trains, but according to RTT,  (and FGW), P7 remains operational.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 12, 2013, 22:13:24
    I've been thinking that they might do the majority of the work to build the new block wall during overnight or weekend (late Sat/early Sun) possessions, does RTT show P7 being out of use at all on all these weekends later in the autumn (when we know XC are diverting via Reading West curve etc)?  Once the wall is built up and the copings installed they can then work away from the platform edge.

    I haven't looked through RTT in detail over the whole period yet, but for example P7 and P8 are not mentioned on Sun 29th:  http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RDG/2013/09/29/0200-0159?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

    They'd put a warning on the website that SDO will have to be used on weekday servcies that call, but wouldn't necessarily mention if the services were using different platforms on a weekend, that would be considered a normal situation I think...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 13, 2013, 17:28:19
    Found some Network Change details for the 'Stage J' works this Christmas period.  Basically resignalling of the Westbury Route as far as Southcote Jn, and the Reading West Curve, and installation of some crossovers and points associated with the future 'Feeder Lines':

    Quote
    By way of a brief summary the main changes that will take place as part of the Stage J Works are:
    ^  Re-modelling of Oxford Road Junction and installation and renewal of a number of point ends to support the future introduction of the new Up Reading Feeder Main Line and Down Reading Feeder Relief Line.
    ^  Introduction of new signalling between Southcote Junction inclusive and Reading Westbury Line Junction inclusive. To  include:
       o  Thales AzLM axle counters as means of train detection.
       o  Bi-directional signalling on the Down Westbury between Reading Station and Reading West Station.
       o  Provision of two preliminary route indicators on the Up Westbury Line on approach to Reading West Station.
       o  A number of position light signals changing to main aspect signals.
    ^  Introduction of a new Double Junction and associated signal route between the Down and Up Reading West Curves in the vicinity of Oxford Road.
    ^  Changes to Permissible Line Speeds (PSR).

    From this document, which gives greater significantly greater detail:

    http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/reading%20redevelopment/ncn%20g1%202013%20rsar%20003%20stage%20j.pdf

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 13, 2013, 22:03:48
    I've been thinking that they might do the majority of the work to build the new block wall during overnight or weekend (late Sat/early Sun) possessions, does RTT show P7 being out of use at all on all these weekends later in the autumn (when we know XC are diverting via Reading West curve etc)?  Once the wall is built up and the copings installed they can then work away from the platform edge.
    Paul
    Yes, I think that your suggestions for building the platform walls are most likely. RTT shows P7 & 8 out of use for the last two weekends in September and all weekends in October.  I wonder if it is a mistake, but RTT shows P7 & 8 back in use on the first weekend in November - I haven't explored all weekends beyond the start of November. Also P6 comes back into use from Sept 21 onwards, according to RTT.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 13, 2013, 22:42:36
    I got a free, and somewhat unexpected, shower as I alighted from a HST on P7 this evening.

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_2735_zpsbc13d3ad.jpg)

    Now I know that Reading is still very much a work in progress, but I can't quite fathom why this downpipe (and others) off the transfer deck roof aren't draining water away from us passengers below. Surely even temporary drainage could be in place.

    This one above P7 is perfectly placed to shower anyone boarding or alighting coaches D/E on HSTs.  ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 13, 2013, 22:55:51
    The reason it is unfinished is that there is a bit of the ground floor structure missing - to be built once P7 is widened.

    Did you look at the other side of the deck? Last time I looked there was a very improvised-looking wooden box catching the water under the down pipe. That works there because it sits on top of the fence around a work site. This side would take a bit more arranging - but you'd think a bit of guttering glued on the side to drop it on the track would be possible.

    Maybe it wasn't on the master plan - and no-one is allowed to do anything that's not planned?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 13, 2013, 23:26:33
    Maybe it wasn't on the master plan - and no-one is allowed to do anything that's not planned?

    Agreed.... and I'm sure the buckets catching water on the transfer deck weren't part of the master plan either....

    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_2736_zps58884748.jpg)

    One of three examples on the transfer deck this evening. Again, with the caveat that this is a work in progress... but for a new structure to be leaking like this....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 00:53:46
    Hmm ... the transfer deck is very poorly protected against wind, which can drive rain, snow, and - wind through the open clerestories and stairways. You can perhaps recall my views on that subject. But it's not been windy, has it? (Just wait until Sunday/Monday, though.)

    I did think the leaks from just rain on the roof were "normal" flat roof issues, i.e. poor jointing of whatever forms the weathering surface. But that would be quite easy to remedy - even during a summer with relatively little rain to show up the problem. So maybe this is something more fundamental, too?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 14, 2013, 01:23:46
    These leaks that I noted this evening were not on account of rain being driven onto the transfer deck. They were most definitely leaks from the roof....

    Worth pointing out that the trainshed at Paddington was also suffering from numerous leaks today. There though, Network Rail arguably have an excuse - said trainshed is over 150 years old.

    Reading transfer deck hasn't yet reached it's 1st birthday....

    Now, I may be being just a little unfairly critical. However, the transfer deck is a very public advertisement for the new Reading station. Doesn't look good when there are numerous buckets dotted around because of leaks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 08:36:27
    That flat roof is not the easiest thing to observe - the best I can find is camera01/1. You have to hunt around for the best lighting conditions, as the view is from the North and shaded by the flying canopy, so not always in focus.

    It looks as if the roof is very much big and flat, and surrounded by steel members higher than it. This "freeboard" should be enough to prevent the water getting deep enough to spill over the rim, unless all its exits are blocked.

    Obviously the water has to be provided with an exit route that is downhill all the way, and that is the first area to look for defects. If there is a small step up to enter the downpipe (or whatever leads to it) the water will form a pool next to it. You can see several things poking up through the flat roof too, and each of these will need sealing. That just adds to the rest of the edges and joints that have to be sealed. Any pooling of water will make the sealing there critical.

    There's a lot of electrical equipment and wiring up in that roof - best not to soak it too often (though if you have ever had a bath overflow upstairs, you may have observed that pouring water through light fittings doesn't usually make them go bang immediately). But I suspect the PR issue is more likely to push this issue up the project team's things to do list - in fact it's surprising it hasn't done so already. After all, when the problem was first apparent they didn't know it would be a good summer, did they?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 14, 2013, 09:09:27
    Platform 7 right now !


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 14, 2013, 09:26:21
    And P1 and 2 getting their canopy


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 09:51:29
    Platform 7 right now !
    That does seem odd, doesn't it - from RTT this possession of P7/8 ends early on Monday, while next weekend's is longer though only for P7.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 09:53:43
    Did you look at the other side of the deck? Last time I looked there was a very improvised-looking wooden box catching the water under the down pipe. That works there because it sits on top of the fence around a work site.

    If you look at camera 0102/2 you can still see this wooden tray, though not whatever it drains into.

    You can also see onto the roof, just.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on September 14, 2013, 10:09:28

    Worth pointing out that the trainshed at Paddington was also suffering from numerous leaks today. There though, Network Rail arguably have an excuse - said trainshed is over 150 years old.


    The age of a building is no excuse IMHO - it is a lot cheaper to maintain a roof properly than to deal with rust, damp damage and rot that results from failing to do so.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 14, 2013, 11:18:19
    Nice to see the P1/2 canopy being fitted using a mobile crane from the front, as I predicted a few weeks back.  Also, as the canopy sections for this area seem to be another 'just in time' delivery by lorry, that possibly adds a little more confirmation that those outside the north entrance are for P10/11.

    Regarding the current P7 track work, does the team think that by the end of the weekend the new track will be installed on new ballast and sleepers, but still alongside the platform on its existing alignment?   That way all they'll have to do next weekend is bring in the necessary handling gear and slew the whole lot over to the new alignment early in the closure.

    PS - Alternatively, could they build a temporary deck out to the new track alignment,  to be used for only one week?

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 14, 2013, 11:59:55
    The reason it is unfinished is that there is a bit of the ground floor structure missing - to be built once P7 is widened.


    I don't think there is any ground floor structure in that area.  There's another one of those massive roof support girders in parallel with the other three that are already there, but there's just an open space shown at platform level. 

    As it's drawn, that scaffolded 'temporary wall' covered in white sheeting is removed and nothing replaces it, the extra section of the main swooping curvy roof just extends out as far as the repositioned edge of P7, matching the shape of that on the London side of the transfer deck for P8 etc...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 12:23:08
    Having had a bit of fun at the expense of the timetablers and signallers, I ought to say that their Micawberite coping strategy has worked pretty well. That's because the overlap times for the conflicting trains in P4/5 are quite short, so the incoming train only needs to be a few minutes late and the problem does indeed solve itself.

    In this specific case, if 2V54 09:51 from Redhill is over five minutes late, then 2C94 09:96 to Waterloo will have already left P5.
    If not, it goes into P4, which is empty.
    Now the incoming 2C87 from Waterloo is due at 9:55, so only has to be held for about four minutes to allow 2C94 to depart for Waterloo at 9:56.

    Most of the day there is no problem, as Waterloo trains only overlap xx:10 to xx:12 and xx:40 to x:42, while North Downs Line trains dwell xx:23 to xx:34 and xx:54 to xy:04. What's odd about the extra trains that introduce the conflicts is their timings:

    There's 2C90 Reading 07:24 to Waterloo 08:46, which is the only peak reinforcement into London from Reading.
    There are three more from Ascot (or Aldershot through Ascot) arriving 7:59, 8:29, and 9:00.
    Two of these run back out to Reading, arriving at 9:30 and 9:55, before returning to Waterloo.
    That seem too late even for schools - what demand are they meeting?
    (Note - I've linked trains as being addition ones, not as diagrams.)





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 12:28:36
    As it's drawn, that scaffolded 'temporary wall' covered in white sheeting is removed and nothing replaces it, the extra section of the main swooping curvy roof just extends out as far as the repositioned edge of P7, matching the shape of that on the London side of the transfer deck for P8 etc...
    Paul

    Yes - that is what the plan shows: no wall. So why has someone painted the line of a wall and a pair of outward-opening double doors on the platform there?

    More important for rainwater handling, I suspect a new drain has to be constructed in the platform. Plus there may be a little bit of finishing to do round the end of the deck, not done earlier as the temporary wall is in the way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 12:43:51
    Nice to see the P1/2 canopy being fitted using a mobile crane from the front, as I predicted a few weeks back. 
    Paul
    Do we infer this is solid ground?

    Also, did you see that there was another small crane - (mounted on a flatbed lorry) helping to erect three new lampposts along the ramp? They don't look a whole lot different to the ones that are there, which they are right next to. Seems a bit unnecessary, doesn't it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 14, 2013, 12:45:09
    Yes - that is what the plan shows: no wall. So why has someone painted the line of a wall and a pair of outward-opening double doors on the platform there?

    Perhaps they signify temporary hoarding works?  While they are rebuilding P7 there still has to be a public route along to the lifts, and then beyond them to P1-3, while the temporary P7 is in use and a building site along the present line of the tracks?

    Similar markings appeared on the platform surface surrounding the old P7 bay before the work there started.

    PS ...checked this today Sunday, and the yellow line does have the word 'hoarding painted next to it here and there - but in any case one of the contractors confirmed the work site for P7 will be isolated behind hoardings set along the yellow line from next weekend.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 14, 2013, 12:48:16
    Do we infer this is solid ground?


    Probably is adequate now.  A few months ago we were discussing what I initially thought was piling taking place around the whole area, but the explanation that came out of the discussion post #1822-4 was that they were reinforcing the ground.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 19:56:51
    Regarding the current P7 track work, does the team think that by the end of the weekend the new track will be installed on new ballast and sleepers, but still alongside the platform on its existing alignment?   That way all they'll have to do next weekend is bring in the necessary handling gear and slew the whole lot over to the new alignment early in the closure.

    PS - Alternatively, could they build a temporary deck out to the new track alignment,  to be used for only one week?

    Paul

    A small army of yellow machines at work spreading new ballast this afternoon - and later, they have moved on and are digging out the old stuff. It does look as if the new ballast does go right up to P7, so the track could be put in on its old line just as far as where the new line is already in place. So is slewing that length of track - say 150-200m - really so much easier than doing it in one go?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 14, 2013, 20:09:48
    There's other stuff going on this weekend too - not just P1/2 canopy, but boring holes in P7 for canopy pillar foundations, and the end of P6 has been fenced off and holds loads more scaffolding components.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 14, 2013, 22:01:38
    Also, did you see that there was another small crane - (mounted on a flatbed lorry) helping to erect three new lampposts along the ramp? They don't look a whole lot different to the ones that are there, which they are right next to. Seems a bit unnecessary, doesn't it?
    The new ones look taller than the existing ones. It must have been thought that the present lighting was inadequate in some way, intensity or distribution?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 14, 2013, 22:37:22
    there's other stuff going on this weekend too - not just P1/2 canopy, but boring holes in P7 for canopy pillar foundations, and the end of P6 has been fenced off and holds loads more scaffolding components.
    Really useful to have some pictures. Thank you.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 14, 2013, 23:34:10
    A small army of yellow machines at work spreading new ballast this afternoon - and later, they have moved on and are digging out the old stuff. It does look as if the new ballast does go right up to P7, so the track could be put in on its old line just as far as where the new line is already in place. So is slewing that length of track - say 150-200m - really so much easier than doing it in one go?

    I think I'll reserve judgement until we know afterwards how they did it! Probably  tomorrow morning some time?  I suppose under all that fresh ballast they've already altered the track drainage, so the track could go into its final alignment, but it may just be faster all round to move the track next weekend given the right mechanised handling aids...

    ...such as a set of PEMs, as shown in the distance in this pic by sapperton tunnel from the Kemble re-doubling thread:

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/99295362@N07/9496228210/in/photostream/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 15, 2013, 00:20:21
    The new ones look taller than the existing ones. It must have been thought that the present lighting was inadequate in some way, intensity or distribution?

    My point was that the ones that are being replaced were only put up in February. The new ones look as if they are tapered - like the one in the foreground of camera 02/1, and that's been there for ages. So it looks more as if the ones on the ramp were temporary ones. Maybe the Council (assuming the lamps are theirs) couldn't get more matching ones sooner. I hope it's not because they hadn't decided what they wanted.

    Two are taller than their friends, but the one by the station building is if anything shorter. If they are going to match the existing ones on Station Hill, they will get pointy thing on top of them too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 15, 2013, 07:06:03
    Just for the record - with the curve to Reading West closed, local turbos were using the Oxford Rd Curve and reversing at Tilehurst platform 3 all yesterday. The reversing signal installed for last Easters blockade got some use!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 15, 2013, 09:35:27
    Two are taller than their friends, but the one by the station building is if anything shorter. If they are going to match the existing ones on Station Hill, they will get pointy thing on top of them too.
    I hadn't noticed that, but obvious from the pictures of them lying on the ground that one of the three is shorter.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 15, 2013, 10:28:03
    Just for the record - with the curve to Reading West closed, local turbos were using the Oxford Rd Curve and reversing at Tilehurst platform 3 all yesterday. The reversing signal installed for last Easters blockade got some use!

    Yes, I noticed that at Reading yesterday - full of people looking for their trains in unfamiliar places (well, not literally full, obviously - it's too huge for that).

    Also, as I came through Wokingham station I heard the booking clerk explaining that the next Gatwick train had failed, and as they were a platform short at Reading this might delay the next Waterloo train. In fact, it was too late for that to happen. 1V51 had run 8-9 minutes late all the way to Winnersh, then lost 20 minutes before Reading. Where it went then, and the platform of its replacement (14B) are not in RTT, so I can't be more precise.

    Once they have located a spare train it should be quicker to get it to P14 from the new depot than it was before to P4a/4b. However, the time to be allowed for passengers to move themselves across is now much longer. 1O80 was due out at 15:34, but is recorded as leaving for Reigate at 16:17, arriving around 17:23, behind 2O44 which left for Redhill on time at 16:04 and got to Reigate just before it. I didn't hear all the announcements, so I can't say what people were told about these out-of-sequence trains.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 15, 2013, 20:02:14
    Had a look at what was going on this afternoon.  By 1700 or so, the P7 track was re-connected all the way through the station area, but ballast was yet to be dropped at the east end.  A tamper was active alongside P7.

    The situation is best explained by dividing the area into 3 parts.  From the Caversham Rd bridge to the country side of the transfer deck the track and sleepers have been renewed.  There is then a fishplate temporary join with the original P7 track, which looks undisturbed.  Then the track eastward from the signal gantry has been re-ballasted, with new sleepers fitted, again with a temporary join to the remaining original P7 track.

    Then there is still the new section of ballasted track parallel to the original, from the west side of the transfer deck to the signal gantry.  I enquired about the next stage next weekend and basically the two outer sections will be quickly disconnected and simply slewed out to meet the two ends of the new section, which is already in its final position. 

    I also got confirmation that it was done this way for time reasons, it would be too much to do in one weekend closure, as well as building the temporary P7.

    Pictures summarising the situation attached below.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 15, 2013, 22:16:58
    I think you're right - and if you look closely at that cross-sectional view, it shows a little retaining wall with its own foundation. The height difference is about the height of track plus sleepers - whatever that is. In that case it must run all the way along, surely.

    There's a load more of the sections lying alongside the track today, and they aren't just a conventional I-beam section, there's a flat plate attached, presumably to give them more of a hold in the ground/ballast:

    Enough to do a good length anyway, shame about the photo quality...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 17, 2013, 17:27:13
    Something else I noticed today is that they've rigged up a pipe run to deliver the concrete for the footings for the new P10 block wall.  Apparently the pipe will run through the service side of the subway, I've attached a phone picture below that shows they have core-drilled through the concrete to get from the subway to the worksite.

    An attempt has already been made to deliver some concrete, but the pump failed...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on September 18, 2013, 06:28:50
    I saw that too yesterday - wondered whether it was some sort of temporary drainage...

    Are there no specialised 'concrete mixers on railway wheels'...?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 18, 2013, 08:01:06
    The picture also shows a short stretch of retaining wall, which is what presumably the rest will look like when finished.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 18, 2013, 08:22:50
    The picture also shows a short stretch of retaining wall, which is what presumably the rest will look like when finished.

    Possibly, but that section is part of a specific solution to a problem.  It's where they rebuilt a section of subway roof where there was very little headroom, there is a short section of slab track between it and the platform.  It was done during a Christmas closure a while back, and IIRC the 'wall' there was cast as part of the whole slab section.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 18, 2013, 08:25:24
    Some while back, with the installation of the reversing signal on the down P3 at Tilehurst, I posted a picture of the signage at the opposite (country) end if the platform.

    Guess what - there is now more !!

    Little purple stop signs complementing the white and black triangles.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 18, 2013, 09:16:17
    The picture also shows a short stretch of retaining wall, which is what presumably the rest will look like when finished.

    Possibly, but that section is part of a specific solution to a problem.  It's where they rebuilt a section of subway roof where there was very little headroom, there is a short section of slab track between it and the platform.  It was done during a Christmas closure a while back, and IIRC the 'wall' there was cast as part of the whole slab section.

    Paul

    That's what I though it was when it appeared. Of course if a wall is needed, it would have to be built into the bridge not done by piling.

    There's an extra layer of complexity too - looking at the sections, the height offset (and need for the wall) varies along the line. It's shown as almost zero at cut 8.1 - along the western side of the deck - but the wall is present on both sides of that, including at cut 10.1 - through the eastward lift. The subway runs further East, at cut 11.1 (not in the set I'm looking at, though I have a hazy recollection of having seen it somewhere). So there may not be a wall all the way along, but I'd guess there is one at this point.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 18, 2013, 12:58:38
    ...The hotch-potch of surfaces on Platforms 8&9 is a right mess.Does anyone know whether they are planning to create a uniform surface using the normal brick herringbone pattern?

    There is day by day progress with the copings along P8 - they seem to do sections of about 30 foot or so whenever the platform is closed to through traffic, as it was last Sunday afternoon.

    The picture below shows that they have reached about as far as level with the end of the 'heritage' station building, ie about where the east side of the old footbridge was.  I suspect the next part of the plan will be to limit P8 to shorter trains at the west end, such as XC and non HST services (the latter will be able to use temporary P7 or P9), but this will only be for a short period while they reach the mid point of resurfacing, then they'll switch trains to the other end.

    Meanwhile I noticed yesterday that there is a walking route being set up to get to P1 and P2 that is on the south side of the present hoarding line - tracing the yellow line then once past the P7 lifts the route will be next to the new waiting room, and then head straight across towards P2 - allowing P3 and the far end of P7 to be completely isolated from passenger flows...

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on September 18, 2013, 16:59:06
    I saw that too yesterday - wondered whether it was some sort of temporary drainage...

    Are there no specialised 'concrete mixers on railway wheels'...?



    With concrete mixers you need a batching plant, apparently according to the civil engs it not as simple as 3 shovels of sand 1 of cement and add water to taste, it is easier to source the readymix locally.

    The railways did have mixers on wagons for electrification mast foundations years ago.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2013, 22:34:08
    I suspect the next part of the plan will be to limit P8 to shorter trains at the west end, such as XC and non HST services (the latter will be able to use temporary P7 or P9), but this will only be for a short period while they reach the mid point of resurfacing, then they'll switch trains to the other end.

    Spot on!   :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 19, 2013, 10:35:47
    Meanwhile I noticed yesterday that there is a walking route being set up to get to P1 and P2 that is on the south side of the present hoarding line - tracing the yellow line then once past the P7 lifts the route will be next to the new waiting room, and then head straight across towards P2 - allowing P3 and the far end of P7 to be completely isolated from passenger flows...
     

    That could be interesting at peak times. Would that be using the currently closed off door(s) in the waiting room and then opening up what is currently a builders yard at the end of P1/P2 ?

    I noticed the first concrete pour at the western end of P10 had taken place by yesterday evening.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 19, 2013, 16:06:11
    (http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt68/bignosemac/100_2736_zps58884748.jpg)

    One of three examples on the transfer deck this evening. Again, with the caveat that this is a work in progress... but for a new structure to be leaking like this....

    Apologies for quoting myself. I've just learnt of requests from both the BBC and ITV for permission to use my pictures of the leaky transfer deck roof....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2013, 16:56:35

    That could be interesting at peak times. Would that be using the currently closed off door(s) in the waiting room and then opening up what is currently a builders yard at the end of P1/P2 ?


    No, straight along in a westerly direction but behind the present hoarding line, not through the building.  So if you came out the waiting room towards P7, turn left left immediately and go straight ahead...

    A picture is worth a thousand words, though it's only an educated guess.

    PS ... a week on and the public route is now skirting the building, so I've re-annotated the drawing

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 19, 2013, 17:41:44
    ITV Meridian have posted a video news item about the leaky transfer deck and they did include my pictures with the reporter commenting on them. Although I'd slightly disagree that I'd 'taken to social media to complain'. My post here including the pictures was only meant as an observation and mild critique. I did point out that Reading Station is still very much a work in progress.

    http://www.itv.com/news/meridian/story/2013-09-19/850m-station-roof-is-leaking/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2013, 17:51:24
    I see they use the cost of the entire remodelling project to add fuel to the flames, which I suppose is exactly what you'd expect nowadays...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 19, 2013, 18:02:17
    To be fair to ITV, FGW Spokesman Dan Panes said that this was a ^1 billion project in his response. He could have clarified the cost of station work against the total cost of remodelling.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 19, 2013, 18:24:57
    With concrete mixers you need a batching plant, apparently according to the civil engs it not as simple as 3 shovels of sand 1 of cement and add water to taste, it is easier to source the readymix locally.

    Where is the other end of this pipe, anyway? I can't see anywhere near the ends of the service corridor to couple a readymix tanker even if they do have enormous folded delivery pipes. And it must be a very long built-in pipe.

    On Saturday there was a small concrete factory on P7, among the debris of the escalators, with a suspiciously big hose along the platform. I assumed that was just to fill the canopy support foundations that had just been bored. They were really quite small holes, as groundworks go, but it still took a big stack of cement bags - so I can well believe that's not viable for P10, as S&T says.

    That prompts a thought: how do they clean the concrete out of one of these pipes, if you can't take it home on the vehicle? I've always imagined you stuff something up it - a spherical "pig", or maybe an old jumper - and use compressed air. Using water would give you an unmanageable quantity of very runny grout to dispose of. And letting it set ... would give you a big headache.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 19, 2013, 18:46:03

    Where is the other end of this pipe, anyway? I can't see anywhere near the ends of the service corridor to couple a readymix tanker even if they do have enormous folded delivery pipes. And it must be a very long built-in pipe.


    Right in the NW 'internal corner' between the northern building and the main station retaining wall.  Or just by the big external aircon heat exchangers, where the black doors giving entry to the plant rooms, substation and service tunnel are.  If you zoom right in on the left hand side of webcam 1/2 between about 1015 and 1415 today you'll see a few concrete mixers, the concrete pump (white box on wheels), and the pipe right in the corner...

    PS - The same area viewed with webcam 1/3 also shows the pipe crossing the pavement, but the mixer trucks are out of shot...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 19, 2013, 19:31:15
    Ah - there it is. When I first looked, I didn't spot that Lobstervision was showing me August, for some reason. So your "concrete mixers" will be those big trucks with "Hanson" written on them, then?

    You can see there is quite a lengthy clean-up process, taking about two hours. The pictures are too few and lacking in detail to show what's going on, other than that it involves several plastic "bathtubs" on wheels.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 19, 2013, 20:34:46
    That prompts a thought: how do they clean the concrete out of one of these pipes, if you can't take it home on the vehicle? I've always imagined you stuff something up it - a spherical "pig", or maybe an old jumper - and use compressed air. Using water would give you an unmanageable quantity of very runny grout to dispose of. And letting it set ... would give you a big headache.

    Having had a bit of a look, the answer turns out to be "all of the above, including the ones you thought impractical". Both water and air are used, with or without balls or sponges. Handling concrete always generates lots of waste concrete and washing water, and the pipe volume is not that big relatively.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 19, 2013, 20:54:27
    I didn't spot that Lobstervision was showing me August, for some reason.
    nrreading01 defaults to Cam 1, the last shot from which (i.e. when it was last working) was on Aug 29! That date then carries over to the other cameras.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 20, 2013, 08:38:50
    No, straight along in a westerly direction but behind the present hoarding line, not through the building.  So if you came out the waiting room towards P7, turn left left immediately and go straight ahead...

    A picture is worth a thousand words, though it's only an educated guess...

    Thank you, it does indeed. I had a look around last night and there were upright girders (the same as those used for hoarding elsewhere) going in, tracing a fairly tight perimeter around the edge of the current building area at P1/P2.

    P10 pushing ahead, there were already 3 courses of blockwork in place last night atop the concrete poured only a day earlier.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Andrew1939 from West Oxon on September 20, 2013, 08:40:27
    Reading station was featured in yesterday's edition of the Meridian local news starring the buckets laid out over the floor to catch the drips from the leaking roof with interviews with staff and travellers. It may be possible to view that item on the ITV catchup service but I haven't checked that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on September 20, 2013, 08:54:55
    See earlier in this thread:

    ITV Meridian have posted a video news item about the leaky transfer deck and they did include my pictures with the reporter commenting on them. Although I'd slightly disagree that I'd 'taken to social media to complain'. My post here including the pictures was only meant as an observation and mild critique. I did point out that Reading Station is still very much a work in progress.

    http://www.itv.com/news/meridian/story/2013-09-19/850m-station-roof-is-leaking/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on September 20, 2013, 09:40:23
    It seems little has improved since the problem was first reported here five months ago  (same buckets too!)  http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg130496#msg130496 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg130496#msg130496)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 20, 2013, 09:57:57
    It seems little has improved since the problem was first reported here five months ago  (same buckets too!) 

    No doubt that'll be the wrong kind of rain - not wet enough, or too little of it to show the leaks.

    You may have seen the Meridian item said the hot weather had open up the joints - which, if true, means they did fix it but it became unfixed and is likely to become unfixed again in any future decent summer. Of course that may be just the press office's excuse generator at work.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 20, 2013, 19:02:33
    A couple of snaps below, first one showing the arrangement of the temporary platform so far, I was told it will extend about 50m east of the signal gantry, they won't start there until the track has been slewed to the new alignment.

    (By the way, they've already removed the redundant up starter signal for P7, (T1682) the one that always looked as though it was on an incredibly light weight bracket that we discussed way back.  I assume its number will transfer to the one that's covered up eventually, but will they fit another temporary signal at the London end of the temporary P7, and use the number for that as well?)

    Second pic shows the beginnings of the blockwork wall for P10.

    Hope this is of interest...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 20, 2013, 19:49:16
    A couple of snaps below,
    Hope this is of interest...
    Paul
    That's great, thanks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 21, 2013, 12:08:36
    Also, did you see that there was another small crane - (mounted on a flatbed lorry) helping to erect three new lampposts along the ramp?
    Two are taller than their friends, but the one by the station building is if anything shorter. If they are going to match the existing ones on Station Hill, they will get pointy thing on top of them too.

    Wrong again - no pointy things, and quite unlike the lamps on Station Hill, which presumably will now be replaced too.

    The street-lamp fairy, with cherry picker, came and put three lamps on the three new posts yesterday morning. Not one on each, of course, that would have been too obvious. And it happened from 01:00 to 04:00, which perhaps makes sense if they have to accommodate an elf.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 21, 2013, 14:33:14
    The street-lamp fairy, with cherry picker, came and ...
    But missed the middle one, which will presumably be a double.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 21, 2013, 20:34:31
    Down on platform 7, the track at the West end has already done its great leap sideways (Pic 1). Not sure what was used, I suspect nothing too high-tech. You can see a short stretch of new track between the slewed section and what was already in place, getting a bit of gentle persuasion, and needing a bit more done to it (pic 2).

    Up at the East end ...
    [...] I was told it will extend about 50m east of the signal gantry, they won't start there until the track has been slewed to the new alignment.
    ... was this (pic 3) what you had in mind?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 21, 2013, 20:49:03
    A few pictures of mine from a quick visit this afternoon...

    The first picture was taken just as they finished joining the slewed P7 track in its finished position.  In the far distance there was a large amount of work going on, hopefully you'll be able to pick out the new points that will provide access to/from P3.  They are much closer to the platform end than before, and I'm presuming that is to allow for a more direct route from P3 onto the Festival line and the down main?   (We're possibly going to need a new track diagram shortly I think...)

    To answer stuving's point about how they slewed the track, I saw the tail end of the work, and they used a couple of powered machines to lift the rail away out of the sleepers to one side(as shown at the east end), and then used a road rail machine to lift the sleepers out of the way while they regraded the ballast.  After that it was a fairly straight forward re-assembly.
     
    I've now answered my own question about signal T1682, the signal on the gantry is now uncovered, and the ID plate has been transferred to it, so that suggests the UP direction stop position will not allow for a 6 car train to berth alongside the temporary platform...

    ...because since yesterday it has become clearer where the temp platform's west end will be.  As the third picture shows it ends where the wooden steps are, just about level with the small WH Smiths.   That suggests the first portion of the platform to be rebuilt (the west end) is by far the larger of the two phases of the work.

    The fourth picture shows the start of a scaffolding bridge from P6 across to where the temporary platform is yet to be built, and paint markings suggest there will be another bridge a few yards further east on P6, but that remains to be seen.

    Again, I hope that is all of interest.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 21, 2013, 21:11:18
    In the far distance there was a large amount of work going on, hopefully you'll be able to pick out the new points that will provide access to/from P3.  They are much closer to the platform end than before, and I'm presuming that is to allow for a more direct route from P3 onto the Festival line and the down main? 

    I think it also allows Westbury Line Junction to come further East, to clear the start of the gradient up to the viaduct.

    I reckon they will be rebuilding over 200 m of P7, so it should hold a whole HST. I'm not convinced it is strictly not possible to get any access directly to the end of the temporary P7 - with only access across the staging to P6, the passageway by P4 is going to be very congested (unless that can be widened).

    The posters are definite that P6 will stay closed until January, and the WTT now agrees. There are some minor timing changes on SWT services, but there would be some on October 6th anyway (leaves). It looks as if this change is happening a little early this year, though I can't see any announcement of that.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 21, 2013, 21:16:37
    Just to elaborate on the relative lengths of the P7 temporary platform, and the remaining part of platform 7 which will become the worksite, I reckon they'll have left about 240m out of use - based on Google Earth measuring to the ramp end.  

    The significance of that seems to be that the section they'll be working on from next week will easily be long enough for an HST once it's finished, so the second phase of the work shouldn't actually result in any operational limitations?

    In terms of access to the temporary platform, there is a relatively large section alongside the 'old concourse' (where the footbridge was) which appears to give access as I've now marked up below - I wasn't intending to suggest that the scaffold bridge (or bridges) I mentioned earlier would be the only route, it already seemed clear from yesterdays picture it or they are additional.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 21, 2013, 22:45:07
    In terms of access to the temporary platform, there is a relatively large section alongside the 'old concourse' (where the footbridge was) which appears to give access as I've now marked up below - I wasn't intending to suggest that the scaffold bridge (or bridges) I mentioned earlier would be the only route, it already seemed clear from yesterdays picture it or they are additional.
    Paul
    But there looks to be a scaffold 'wall' being built in the gap between P7 and the extension - just where your red access arrow is drawn. If it is really is there, what would its purpose be?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 21, 2013, 23:03:23
    But there looks to be a scaffold 'wall' being built in the gap between P7 and the extension - just where your red access arrow is drawn. If it is really is there, what would its purpose be?
    The temporary platform is quite narrow, with a gap behind most of it. Hence the wall, which I thought was continuous when seen from the deck. Looking again at a picture I took from P8, there is a gap in that wall and the line of lights on it. It's a bit more complete than in Paul's picture - you can clearly see the end wall. So the other accesses are needed I think because it is so narrow, and they don't need to take too much of the traffic.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 22, 2013, 10:38:53
    We both happen to have put up pictures from similar oblique views, (although high and low),  so the foreshortening doesn't really allow you to easily gauge how long it currently is.  In hindsight a straight across view from P8 would have made it much clearer I think.

    Can't help until Monday unfortunately...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on September 22, 2013, 10:47:44
    Apologies if this has been answered before, but could they not have waited to do platform 7 until 8,9 and 10 had been finished and fully re-opened?

    You would'nt need to worry about messing around with a temporary platform as the increased capacity elsewhere could have picked up the over-flow from 7.

    Seems a much cheaper way than what they are currently doing...?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 22, 2013, 10:56:52
    The posters are definite that P6 will stay closed until January, and the WTT now agrees. There are some minor timing changes on SWT services, but there would be some on October 6th anyway (leaves). It looks as if this change is happening a little early this year, though I can't see any announcement of that.

    That's not actually true for the whole period. Platform 6 reappears in the WTT patchily from now to December, starting, oddly, on October 5th.

    On timings, basically the leaf-fall timetable (October 6th to December 7th) removes the conflicts by removing the short overlap needing an extra platform. For the next two weeks, the extra (to two per hour) trains are delayed incoming achieve the same thing.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 22, 2013, 11:14:45
    Also noted on Camera 02/02 that the new passenger access route to Platforms 1 and 2 seems to be ready for opening tomorrow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 22, 2013, 11:33:50
    P7/8/9 sequencing has been mentioned before, but probably deserves another discussion.  The main reason being because I think until only a few months ago no-one was really aware of the temporary platform plan, early references were usually to it just 'closing'...

    I think though, that the existing P7 really has to close to finish its roof and its remaining connecting sections up to the transfer deck - these cannot be built over the existing tracks, and they cannot easily add all the main steelwork with the platform in public use.

    The way they are temporarily 'moving' P7 now therefore allows for it being properly available again from some time after Christmas.  P8 and P9 won't ever fully close, and I have been assured they will always remain at least partly available during the working weeks although there will be periods with one or other's overall length curtailed to about a 6 car length.

    So if P8/9 never actually close, they don't really provide a worthwhile reason not to start P7 now.  Basically, they are doing it now because they can, and any delay would delay the station area part of the overall project.

    PS FGW's website description of the works does include this bit:

    Quote
    Works to upgrade platforms 8 and 9 will take place simultaneously. To ensure minimum disruption to customers, the platforms will remain in use while the phased upgrade works are carried out. Platforms 8&9 are due to complete by late spring 2014. 

    We are also now suggesting that when P7 re-opens it will be almost full length, certainly allowing for HSTs - and that suggests that the final area to be worked on will be just the old gateline area and new overall roof by platforms 4/5/6.

    Another point that's just occurred to me, is that we don't know the full sequencing of the track layout alterations to bring the main viaduct, the 'festival line' (XC underpass) and the 'feeder lines' (Freight and Up Westbury underpass) into use - it's possible that the route through P7 will be more important at some stage in a future transitional period.  I'm sure they'll have a cunning plan.  It isn't inconceivable that they'll eventually need to use P7 for more XC reversals because they can no longer use P9 for those trains, although P9 would probably remain in use for down main trains towards Didcot.

    Meanwhile though, I don't think the timing of the P10 rebuild has a huge impact on the down service at all, so it is possibly of little relevance to your main question.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 22, 2013, 11:42:49
    Also noted on Camera 02/02 that the new passenger access route to Platforms 1 and 2 seems to be ready for opening tomorrow.

    It also now seems that despite my earlier suggestion (#2185), it does skirt round the building leaving the construction site between the concrete pathway and P3/7.  Last weekend there were some signs of a new pathway just behind the 'east/west' hoarding line, there's even a picture on this flickr link, it continued to the corner of the waiting room: http://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/9741281155/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 22, 2013, 17:05:32
    (We're possibly going to need a new track diagram shortly I think...)

    Well they seem to be sticking to the plan:

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/Reading%20Station%20West%20Stage%201%20and%202.JPG?cache=0.06923340307548642)
    Image (c)2013 S&TEngineer

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379865632/Reading%20Staion%20West%20Stage%203%20to%205.JPG?cache=0.5431615205015987)
    Image (c)2013 S&TEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 22, 2013, 17:24:25
    Another point that's just occurred to me, is that we don't know the full sequencing of the track layout alterations to bring the main viaduct, the 'festival line' (XC underpass) and the 'feeder lines' (Freight and Up Westbury underpass) into use - it's possible that the route through P7 will be more important at some stage in a future transitional period.  I'm sure they'll have a cunning plan.  It isn't inconceivable that they'll eventually need to use P7 for more XC reversals because they can no longer use P9 for those trains, although P9 would probably remain in use for down main trains towards Didcot.

    According to the staging plans the new flyover will come into use before the Westbury Line Junction is finally remodelled and until then the only connection to/from the Reading Festival Line will be to Platform No.8 only.

    Just to complicate matters, shortly afterwards the temporary connection from Platform No.8 to the Down Main (Country End of Platform No.9) will be recovered :o

    However, don't panic, as by then the Reading Feeder Main and Reading Feeder Relief from Oxford Road Junction will also be in use giving full access to/from the B&H to the Relief side of the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 23, 2013, 17:43:09
    A few pics of today's progress:

    The full length of the temporary P7 firstly as seen from the transfer deck, and then from P8.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 23, 2013, 17:53:10
    A few pics showing the access to the temporary P7.  Two shots of the area adjacent to the old concourse, and one of the first bridge over to P6, a second was also being completed.   The London end of the temporary platform is roughly level with the middle of the fifth car of one of SWT's trains, so about 80 metres beyond the original P7 ramp...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 24, 2013, 19:20:46
    More on P7, from yesterday.

    I'm sure you will be enormously reassured to see that the gauge clearance of the new temporary platform has been carefully checked by the latest hi-tech instruments. Look closely and you can see the adjustment mechanism - a few scaffolders who dived underneath to loosen some of the clamps, gave the platform a heave, and then retightened the clamps.

    That's a capability you don't get with the masonry ones. Raises all sorts of options, if you add some motors to it ... no more compromises between gauge differences, with gaps to mind, and then there's HS2 with its two sets of trains (compatible and UIC gauge). And new announcements too - "this train will no longer call at Nextown due to a platform failure" - or does that already happen on the Jubilee Line?

    There was a poster about P7 that I perhaps ought to have photographed too. While it was not really clear, I think it was explaining why they bothered with this temporary one rather than just closing it. It said they needed to keep the down West country trains out of the way of the Newbury and Bedwyn trains using P8-11.

    I think what's behind this is that only P7 connects to the Down Westbury, so without it putting all down trains through the Up line adds an extra choke point in addition to the squeeze of platform slots. Of course there's a further assumption: we don't want to add temporary track instead.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 24, 2013, 19:32:18
    The street-lamp fairy, with cherry picker, came and ...
    But missed the middle one, which will presumably be a double.

    This post is pre-drilled for two luminaires, but the lower one looks as if it would have a bit of a negative clearance problem with one of the old luminaires if fitted. That presumably explains why it was left off for now.

    These luminaries are, as you would expect, full of loads of LEDs. It could be that there's a policy in force (not sure whose) that all new street luminaires must be LED ones, which applies to these.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on September 24, 2013, 21:15:45

    These luminaries are, as you would expect, full of loads of LEDs.


    Easy mistake to make, but thanks - it made I larf. I wouldn't wish being filled full of led on even a C-list luminary.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 24, 2013, 22:08:34
    The poster concerning Platform No.7 can be found here: http://firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/contents/ReadingImprovementWorks/platform-7-poster-v3.ashx


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 24, 2013, 22:19:46
    The poster concerning Platform No.7 can be found here: http://firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/contents/ReadingImprovementWorks/platform-7-poster-v3.ashx
    Summarises it quite well.

    They will have to crack on to get it finished by the end of the year. As discussed earlier, the initial work will have to be done during night time possesions.

    BTW there are some Flickr pictures of the weekend work. One shows a track panel being craned in, presumably from Caversham Road. http://www.flickr.com/photos/digitalmck/9904590674/in/pool-1945836@N21


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 24, 2013, 22:24:08
    It could be that there's a policy in force (not sure whose) that all new street luminaires must be LED ones, which applies to these.

    I don't know, but some councils are adopting LEDs for renewals. Longer life, lower energy and WHITE!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 24, 2013, 22:48:29
    The poster concerning Platform No.7 can be found here: http://firstgreatwestern.co.uk/~/media/PDF/contents/ReadingImprovementWorks/platform-7-poster-v3.ashx
    Thanks for finding that - I did look, but the links to it are less than obvious (it's under "upcoming works at Reading station", though the temporary platform has now finished upcoming).

    Reading it properly it is a lot clearer than my recollection, which was hindered by having to read it through a stream of passengers. I'm not sure why it was put up in such awkward places. But it is a surprisingly detailed explanation, compared with most - better than most of the last Reading Station news.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 24, 2013, 22:55:33
    I see (on camera 02/2) that there's a load of activity in the front forecourt compound just now, as during each night since about Thursday. There's also a bright floodlight shining straight at the camera, so you can't see into the entrance. The styrocauseway was being used as well, which would make sense to supply work on P8/9.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 25, 2013, 10:05:51
    Just looking at RealTimeTrains there seems to have been a subtle change to platforming of down direction HST operated services, eg to Bristol and South Wales.   AFAICT there are now none booked through P8.  Last week many Bristol and South Wales HSTs used P8.  If this is actually the case in practice, (because platforming can change at the last minute), is this an indication that P8's 'operational length' has now been reduced as originally proposed in the Engineering Access Statement?

    I remember it being explicitly mentioned in the EAS a couple of editions back, but there's nothing in the current online version.

    By the way, the P8 edge coping replacement was almost at the half way point by Monday, although the platform was still in normal use by HSTs at that time.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 25, 2013, 13:48:01
    I'm pretty sure P8's length was reduced temporarily to 6-car Turbo length at the same time the temporary P7 opened.  HST's can still stop there, but won't do so unless problems with P9 force it to be used.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 25, 2013, 13:57:10
    I'm pretty sure P8's length was reduced temporarily to 6-car Turbo length at the same time the temporary P7 opened.  HST's can still stop there, but won't do so unless problems with P9 force it to be used.

    That would probably explain why they won't have advertised it on any public posters then, as there shouldn't normally be any effect on passengers until such time as they depart from booked workings.  I'd assume passengers on those services will have become used to going from either P8 or P9 pretty much at random over recent months, so they may actually see standardisation on P9 as an improvement anyway...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Tim K on September 26, 2013, 07:15:12
    I was on a HST on Monday night that had to stop at platform 8, we were told that the rear two coaches would not be opening and that anyone in those carriages who wanted to alight at Reading needed to move forwards. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 26, 2013, 10:38:38
    I see the concrete pump is is use again this morning - and a mixer truck has just arrived. Presumably that's for the last 15 m or so of foundation on P10 that was not done last week (pic from Saturday).

    Looking at the long string of detached pipe sections, I was trying to imagine how the discharge point was moved. It is more usual to have an articulated pipe going up and then down, but this straight one can't do that. Do they really start with it full length, and hastily unbolt a section at a time as the trench fills? If so, how do they clean the concrete out of each section (they look pretty clean)?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 26, 2013, 11:16:28
    I wonder if they use a flexible section on the end to allow for more accurate placement of the concrete, (like you see on the lorry mounted equipment), and then reposition it as they reduce the length a few sections at a time.  Seems to me what would be left in the individual pipe sections could just be dropped into the trench, something pushed through on a pole would deal with what little remained inside the pipe.  Then what we might not see is a gang of men cleaning the short sections as they are removed using manual means, that could even be done somewhere else, and what we've seen between times is after they've returned the sections to the worksite.  Earlier in the week the sections of pipe were all lying along the footings, but were not yet joined together.

    On Monday afternoon they were extending the footings trench at the London end, perhaps they'll pour some concrete there as well?

    By the way, did you notice that the 'I girder' piling we discussed now extends over almost the full length of the gap?

    PS, as at 1620, there have been a fair number of concrete mixers arrive and depart over the course of the afternoon, will be interesting to hear how much has been done...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 26, 2013, 23:23:02
    Surprised to see a dumper being driven in through double doors of new southern entrance. Presumably to access P7. Cams 02/1 and 02/2 at 22:45 today.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 27, 2013, 16:29:54
    The main run of the P10 platform wall footing strip is now complete, with another section of blockwork started towards the middle of the London end of the platform.  The 'transom end' strip at the easternmost point had also been poured. 

    The webcam shows the pipe sections being craned onto a truck mid afternoon, 1415 or so...

    Paul   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on September 27, 2013, 20:03:53
    I was on a HST on Monday night that had to stop at platform 8, we were told that the rear two coaches would not be opening and that anyone in those carriages who wanted to alight at Reading needed to move forwards. 

    A very similar message was announced tonight on the 1706 HST from Paddington, the difference being that the train was scheduled to call at Platform 7.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 27, 2013, 20:08:53
    There's no sign of any work yet on widening P7, and maybe there's no hurry. In any case I guess the first step is to take away the old track. When it comes to the foundations here, how far (literally) do you think could you get with a standard truck-mounted pump and long delivery pipe from outside? I'd have thought you could do almost all of the first part, but not the second part where the temporary P7 is now.

    Did you see that the framework of the end of the canopy on P8/9 is now in place (as is that on P1/2)? I think the very end could be assembled in situ from relatively small pieces, but there's a short section before that that may have full-width spars. Did anyone notice when the bits were sneaked in, presumably one night earlier this week?

    The track at P7 has ten rail joints that I can see - there were some quite short pieces used - but why would nine of them be thermite welded and the tenth still held together by fishplates and clamps?.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on September 27, 2013, 20:12:57
    There's no sign of any work yet on widening P7, and maybe there's no hurry. In any case I guess the first step is to take away the old track. When it comes to the foundations here, how far (literally) do you think could you get with a standard truck-mounted pump and long delivery pipe from outside? I'd have thought you could do almost all of the first part, but not the second part where the temporary P7 is now.

    Did you see that the framework of the end of the canopy on P8/9 is now in place (as is that on P1/2)? I think the very end could be assembled in situ from relatively small pieces, but there's a short section before that that may have full-width spars. Did anyone notice when the bits were sneaked in, presumably one night earlier this week?

    The track at P7 has ten rail joints that I can see - there were some quite short pieces used - but why would nine of them be thermite welded and the tenth still held together by fishplates and clamps?.

    Someone ran out of time (or thermite mix) at a guess...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 27, 2013, 21:54:51
    I'd have thought the P7 footings could probably be done with pumped concrete along the ground again, from a few places on the south side, they could easily operate from the temporary entrance at the end of P1, or from the delivery gate beside the end of P4, especially if they do it overnight.  Alternatively perhaps they could use those mini-dumper trucks, (like the one spotted by ironstone11 the other night), delivering it normally in mixers then driving small batches of concrete in through the front door!

    I recall that the canopy end sections on the P12-15 islands were assembled in situ out of parts, rather than being delivered in sections, I saw them being done during the day a good while back. 

    Searches for a while...  Here you are, check out webcam 1/1 on the afternoon of Monday 3rd of Sept 2012.  Amazing to think they were being put up that long ago.  It still involved a crane to lift the actual beams, but there are other ways of lifting small sections - I doubt you'd need a large mobile crane necessarily, but they were readily available anyway at that stage of thee build.

    Agree that the rail welding is something that normally just progresses as time allows.  I've often seen those temporary fishplates a few days after the bulk of the work is done, I guess there's no problem waiting a few days until the next routine possession to do a few more welds.  My expectation would be that there'll be noticeable progress all round the P7 area at the weekends, it looks like P7 and P8 will be closed on Saturday and Sunday again, and the engineering works forecast was that there'd be regular closures for most of October at least...

    The first of stuving's photos shows that the finishing touches have been applied along the P8 platform edge.  A member of the contractor's staff told me this morning that he thought the switch to use the London end of P8 was imminent, although he didn't know the actual intended date.  They've started on the block paving behind the tactile strips now as well, another sign of the gradual progress.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 27, 2013, 22:27:56
    I'd have thought the P7 footings could probably be done with pumped concrete along the ground again, from a few places on the south side, they could easily operate from the temporary entrance at the end of P1, or from the delivery gate beside the end of P4, especially if they do it overnight.  Alternatively perhaps they could use those mini-dumper trucks, (like the one spotted by ironstone11 the other night), delivering it normally in mixers then driving small batches of concrete in through the front door!

    When they were doing the North side there were plenty of examples of pumping concrete much further than they would need to do P7 from outside the south side of the station without any bespoke pipework.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 27, 2013, 22:53:18
    Did you see that the framework of the end of the canopy on P8/9 is now in place (as is that on P1/2)? I think the very end could be assembled in situ from relatively small pieces, but there's a short section before that that may have full-width spars. Did anyone notice when the bits were sneaked in, presumably one night earlier this week?
    Some of the parts were delivered and placed on the last remaining 'long legged' trolley on 18/9/13 @ 22.45 (Cam 2/2) after which the long legged trolley was never seen again, probably dismantled like the other two. More canopy parts arrived on 19/9/13 @ 21:15 - 21:30.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 28, 2013, 00:33:31
    Searches for a while...  Here you are, check out webcam 1/1 on the afternoon of Monday 3rd of Sept 2012. 

    Not sure what you meant by that - camera 1/1 stopped before that. Anyway, you posted a picture on 23rd that showed the end missing.

    Some of the parts were delivered and placed on the last remaining 'long legged' trolley on 18/9/13 @ 22.45 (Cam 2/2) after which the long legged trolley was never seen again, probably dismantled like the other two. More canopy parts arrived on 19/9/13 @ 21:15 - 21:30.

    And the bits were put up a day or two later - and on camera (02/2, just to the left of the clock)!
     
    On the 25th at crane appears at 01:00, and the canopy grows longer by a tiny amount (at this very foreshortening angle). The on the 26th bits of the end frame start to appear at about 01:00 (there's a gap in the recordings) and continue during the day, with what looks like the last bit of the outer frame at about 23:00. The filling-in with other members goes on in between, and during the day.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 28, 2013, 00:41:07
    Agree that the rail welding is something that normally just progresses as time allows.  I've often seen those temporary fishplates a few days after the bulk of the work is done, I guess there's no problem waiting a few days until the next routine possession to do a few more welds. 

    True, though it's not a reassuring thing for passengers to be seeing. I thought it odd because it's been like that since Monday, and at least five of those welds were done after Saturday. There was still Monday night to do the last one - unless they genuinely had burned their way through all the locally-held stock of pyrotechnics.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 28, 2013, 01:56:20

    Not sure what you meant by that - camera 1/1 stopped before that. Anyway, you posted a picture on 23rd that showed the end missing.


    Try reading it again carefully - I was explaining how P12/13 and 14/15 were done in 2012...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 28, 2013, 09:21:26
    Not sure what you meant by that - camera 1/1 stopped before that. Anyway, you posted a picture on 23rd that showed the end missing.
    Try reading it again carefully - I was explaining how P12/13 and 14/15 were done in 2012...
    Paul
    OK - that explains my incomprehension, anyway.

    The corner structures on P8/9 look quite a bit smaller than those on P12/13 (though the angles make it hard to judge by how much). With two support rails the cantilever spans are a lot shorter, the steel members are both shorter and lighter, and maybe they could be raised by a hoist instead of a crane. When the end of P10/11 is done, that will presumably need a crane - it looks to be one of the wide single-rail canopies (like P12/13 both ends and P14/15 West end, but wider than P10/11 West end). 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 29, 2013, 09:02:30
    I noted yesterday (28 September 2013) from the window of a passing diverted West Country HST that the foundations of the East box of the new flyover has the Reading Relief Feeder and Reading Main Feeder lines now installed at the stepped lower levels under the new flyover position (as described in earlier posts).  Unfortunately didn't have my camera with me :(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 29, 2013, 10:19:56
    I was a bit surprised yesterday to see the track to the west of P8 being renewed now. The phasing plans said this would be left until the new mains over the viaduct are ready. It's also aligned rather oddly, assuming it has reached its final location (there is a rail-mounted crane there, just visible at this resolution if you look carefully). Note that trains can still get from P8 to the Westbury lines at the moment, via the link to P9.

    What was planned to happen next was the turns from p7 and P3 to join P1/2 (aka the Down Westbury) being moved eastwards and made less abrupt. The second of the two plans posted two pages ago shows this.

    (Edited to move misplaced reference to posted plan.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 29, 2013, 11:43:46
    I was a bit surprised yesterday to see the track to the west of P8 being renewed now.

    It's possibly just a question of getting an early start (or even tidying up work already started) by removing the back to back redundant sets of points, which were clipped out of use a few months back. (First pic in post #2204, behind the signal head.)  It may be that come Monday morning the overall 'shape' of the track hasn't changed at all, but they are running over plain-lined track rather than the two unnecessary points and crossings.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 29, 2013, 13:01:35
    It's possibly just a question of getting an early start (or even tidying up work already started) by removing the back to back redundant sets of points, which were clipped out of use a few months back. (First pic in post #2204, behind the signal head.)  It may be that come Monday morning the overall 'shape' of the track hasn't changed at all, but they are running over plain-lined track rather than the two unnecessary points and crossings.
    Paul

    Maybe ... but the logic of that poster was that P7 had to be (expensively) kept in use to give direct access to the Down Westbury. The old P8 track goes only to the Up Westbury, but there is another way to reach it, so that link could be removed. The final configuration here has three points in close succession (to Down Main, from P7, to Festival line) before becoming the old "Up" Westbury, no longer used as primarily an Up track. This cannot go in until the "knee" of the old Westubury junction on P7 is taken out.

    So anything put in now has to be temporary, and if that was an option why not connect to the Down Westbury and close P7 to blitz it? OK, we have seen elsewhere that piecemeal work out of hours has been preferred, for whatever reason. Also, the diagram on that poster is misleading - it suggests that shorter-distance trains via the Westbury Line now use P8 and P9 in both directions, rather than P7 and P11.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 29, 2013, 13:37:28
    Maybe ... but the logic of that poster was that P7 had to be (expensively) kept in use to give direct access to the Down Westbury. The old P8 track goes only to the Up Westbury, but there is another way to reach it, so that link could be removed. The final configuration here has three points in close succession (to Down Main, from P7, to Festival line) before becoming the old "Up" Westbury, no longer used as primarily an Up track. This cannot go in until the "knee" of the old Westubury junction on P7 is taken out.

    So anything put in now has to be temporary, and if that was an option why not connect to the Down Westbury and close P7 to blitz it? OK, we have seen elsewhere that piecemeal work out of hours has been preferred, for whatever reason. Also, the diagram on that poster is misleading - it suggests that shorter-distance trains via the Westbury Line now use P8 and P9 in both directions, rather than P7 and P11.

    I think they need all that flexibility to deal with the XC reversals.  In the normal timetable I regularly experience down Westburys and up XCs passing on the east curve, if you only had P8 and P9 in use that would probably force XC into P9 or P11 - perhaps they just want more options, because it isn't unusual to have more than one XC 'reversal' happening at the same time.

    But going back to the point that anything put in has to be temporary, doesn't the final layout have the replacement for the P8 to P9 crossover on the west side of Caversham Rd bridge, so the section you have pictured being replaced to the east of that bridge is possibly permanent - even though the points at the end of P8 will still need plain lining in due course?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 29, 2013, 15:33:17
    Of course there is a capacity issue, but that's not the one highlighted on the poster, with or without a re-write to makes sense of its details. The number of XC trains does make half platforms worth having, so I can see that keeping P8 and P9 open while working on parts of them does make sense.

    The current work does, however, appear to be a change of plan. It is true that the diagrams in these phasing plans are wrong in some areas - how P10 and P11 are shown as coming in and out of service is one, and the absence is the rebuild of P7 is another. However, the reason for changing the track past the west end of P7 (moving the P3-P7 link to before the bridge, stages 1 and 2 in S&TE's post ) is to allow the realignment of the line beyond the bridge (stage 4). This was planned for 2013, any work on the P8 track was planned for 2015.

    I assume not doing this planned realignment means the P8 track can't be on its final alignment, and it looks as if that's so. However the plans are inherently unreliable for proportions at junctions, due to the transverse scale expansion, and our view and pictures are highly foreshortened and partly blocked by a gantry. So I can't be 100% sure of that.

    The key point about this link is that unless it connects to the Down Westbury by points not in the final scheme, it will still channel P8 traffic to a choke point on the Up Westbury. Its value would thus have to be that it by-passes a short stretch of the Down Main, shared with P9. But it exists now, so why replace it, even if it has (for example) a low speed limit?

    Ah well, we'll just have to wait and see (as usual) if some cunning plan reveals itself.

    But going back to the point that anything put in has to be temporary, doesn't the final layout have the replacement for the P8 to P9 crossover on the west side of Caversham Rd bridge, so the section you have pictured being replaced to the east of that bridge is possibly permanent - even though the points at the end of P8 will still need plain lining in due course?
    Paul
    On that specific point - apart from whether the P7 realignment is needed first - the plan shows, if anything, the track turned a little counter-clockwise from its old line. What is being built is turned clockwise (all subject to the caveats noted above). Following the new line eastwards, it would stay closer to the P7 track than the old alignment does. That would at least fit with the way P7 isn't being widened right to the end,  but I can't believe they now intend to widen P8 at this end!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 30, 2013, 18:01:09
    Here's a picture of the current situation.  The track over Caversham Rd bridge appears slightly to the right of previous, hence the weave between the end of P8 and the bridge is not as pronounced as it was before plain-lining;  however the unexpected feature now (almost) visible on the bridge itself is a new set of points leading towards (but not connected to) the present Down Westbury.

    I have a feeling though, that those points will eventually become the route of the Up Westbury, with the normal (straight ahead) route through them becoming the direct route towards the Festival Line.

    Does that make sense, or is there a better explanation?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 30, 2013, 20:18:42
    I have a feeling though, that those points will eventually become the route of the Up Westbury, with the normal (straight ahead) route through them becoming the direct route towards the Festival Line.

    You are correct.  This will be part of Westbury Line Junction Part 2, Stages 6 and 7 remodelling.  There will also be a new parallel facing turnout leading from the Platform No.7 line to the Platform No.3 line (currently disconnected) just to the West of Caversham Road bridge which then be the route of the Down Westbury line via the current Platform No.1 line.  See my post #2215 above.

    I'll post up the stage plan in a few days.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 30, 2013, 20:35:22
    I have a feeling though, that those points will eventually become the route of the Up Westbury, with the normal (straight ahead) route through them becoming the direct route towards the Festival Line.

    You are correct.  This will be part of Westbury Line Junction Part 2, Stages 6 and 7 remodelling.  There will also be a new parallel facing turnout leading from the Platform No.7 line to the Platform No.3 line (currently disconnected) just to the West of Caversham Road bridge which then be the route of the Down Westbury line via the current Platform No.1 line.  See my post #2215 above.

    I'll post up the stage plan in a few days.

    That will be interesting to see - taking what you both say as exact, it would be a change. Originally P8 straight on goes to join P9 as the Down Main, while the turnout goes to join P7 (after its turnout) before dividing onto the Festival Line and the Up Westbury.

    The fact that it looks quite a squeeze to get that all in to fit that new turnout may be just the viewing angle.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements Eastern rail tunnel
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 01, 2013, 11:55:31
    It's been quite a while since I have used the train services through Reading but yesterday a fellow passenger told me that some north downs services leave from platform 15 and use the "new" tunnel to join the north downs line heading towards Wokingham  From a depot movements perspective this makes perfect sense but am curious to know when this entered service.

    I have tried searching, honest !


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 01, 2013, 12:12:35
    The underpass entered service as of the new platforms opening back in April.  More services now use that route after the opening of the new depot, though there's still not too many which are mostly confined to the early morning when they are trains that are formed of sets straight from the depot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 01, 2013, 12:49:07
    Looking at today's timetabled movements, those three start-of-service trains do set of from P14/15, but later in the day I spotted at least one that went through to P5 to start there. I'm sure it's friendlier to passengers to use the normal platforms wherever possible, but most examples later in the day seem to be from P13-15.

    I've been on a couple, which were replacements for late/failed trains. They were late platform changes, so passengers had to move across from P4-6. In terms of time, it's about 10 minutes for a train to do it and about the same for passengers to transfer the other way, especially as they may include elderly passenger with heavy luggage. In such a case there's actually a good reason to prefer taking the train through - but I don't see any sign of it being given priority.

    It's not a very exciting underpass anyway, though it does make a change. Incidentally, does anyone know if there is a gauge restriction on it due to radius, clearance etc?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 01, 2013, 15:49:34
    That will be interesting to see - taking what you both say as exact, it would be a change. Originally P8 straight on goes to join P9 as the Down Main, while the turnout goes to join P7 (after its turnout) before dividing onto the Festival Line and the Up Westbury.

    The fact that it looks quite a squeeze to get that all in to fit that new turnout may be just the viewing angle.

    I'm not so sure of what I posted now, having in the meantime blown up the 'Corus' track layout, it does look like those points (the set I've marked with a red arrow on the attached extract) are still providing a route to both the Up Westbury and the Festival line as you say, and the straight ahead route is still direct to the Down Main (or P9 route) as you thought.   What threw me for a bit is that the down main will have to eventually be slewed significantly further south than it is now, to come into line with the viaduct approach...

    Anyway no doubt it will become clear once SandTEngineer can check his plans.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 01, 2013, 19:10:13
     What threw me for a bit is that the down main will have to eventually be slewed significantly further south than it is now, to come into line with the viaduct approach...

    I don't think that's true. The plans I was looking at show the same as that clip - but with less clutter, worse resolution, and as the end of the phasing sequence. If the superposition of the phases is accurate, the new Down Main, where P8 and P9 join, is almost on top of the old Up Main.

    I've also found a scale drawing of a newer layout that looks like what's going in, though it needs enormous magnification so it too is short of resolution. (It's the "location plan - central viaduct" from the planning application 11-01885-FUL.) While the viaduct is south of the old mains, the new mains touch down well to the north - the new Down Main is even a little north of the old Up Main. However, it still shows the track over the bridge as turned a little anticlockwise when the wiggle is taken out (the remnant of the old turnout off the through line to P5 as as).

    This plan does not distinguish old tracks that are kept unchanged from ones that are taken out. However, it looks as if the track from P3 across the bridge may be removed, rather than joining P1/2 sooner or joining the P7 to Down Westbury link (which is now further east). Maybe.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 02, 2013, 12:14:54
     What threw me for a bit is that the down main will have to eventually be slewed significantly further south than it is now, to come into line with the viaduct approach...

    I don't think that's true. The plans I was looking at show the same as that clip - but with less clutter, worse resolution, and as the end of the phasing sequence. If the superposition of the phases is accurate, the new Down Main, where P8 and P9 join, is almost on top of the old Up Main.


    I was just trying to compare the position of the eventual new Down Main with its 'current and temporary' position though.  What I originally thought was that a straight line projected over the latest position of those points on the Caversham Rd bridge was likely to be leading towards the Festival line, and the route from there to the final Down Main would be tending to bear to the right (as viewed) - implying another set of points further on - but that was obviously mistaken.   

    However, I've found a better drawing this morning, that seems to show that the eventual route from P8 to the point where it joins the 'new Down Main' is basically a straight line.  It's the eighth file on page 1 of the results page on the planning site, I've attempted to post a clip from it below.

    This plan also shows the four separate tracks over that part of the Caversham Rd bridge all retained,  I think it would be necessary for instance if you wanted parallel moves of an up XC service into P7, and then reversing towards the Festival Line, and a simultaneous down departure from P3 towards Basingstoke.  That could be a useful facility.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 02, 2013, 19:17:38
    However, I've found a better drawing this morning, that seems to show that the eventual route from P8 to the point where it joins the 'new Down Main' is basically a straight line.  It's the eighth file on page 1 of the results page on the planning site, I've attempted to post a clip from it below.

    This plan also shows the four separate tracks over that part of the Caversham Rd bridge all retained,  I think it would be necessary for instance if you wanted parallel moves of an up XC service into P7, and then reversing towards the Festival Line, and a simultaneous down departure from P3 towards Basingstoke.  That could be a useful facility.

    Paul

    That plan is a useful find - much easier to follow - but the tracks are not the reason it was included, so need not have been up to date. In fact, there is at least one known change since - the added crossover from the Up Feeder Main into P12.

    I still don't think that track on bridge 4 (from the south) is at the right angle for that nice straight run from P8 onto the Down Main. And the turnout there - it just doesn't look as if there is room for the track over bridges 2 to swing left, then that over bridge 3 to have a crossover to the Down Westbury too. I know, it's very foreshortened, but still...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 04, 2013, 14:13:46
    I was in Waterstones in Reading yesterday, and I found a new book about Reading Station.

    It was published in August, and comes from a very local little publisher so it may not be on sale elsewhere.
    It's a very slim volume - only 100 pages (though the publishers list it as 150!) for ^10 - so not very detailed.
    The author is a local historian not a railway expert, and it is based mostly on local newspapers.
    I found it interesting - but then I'm neither.
    It's largely made up of yearly accounts of the main news stories, plus some 1- or 2-page pieces on tangential topics.

    So, if it's the kind of thing you just can't resist buying, despite the cost per page  ...

    All Change at Reading The railway and the station 1840-2013)
    Adam Sowan, Two River Press.
    ISBN: 978-1-901677-92-8


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on October 04, 2013, 15:02:48
    It is also available on eBay from a number of sellers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on October 04, 2013, 22:46:04
    OK.  Continued from Post #2257 above.  Here is the final track layout over Caversham Road bridge:

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1374009516/Reading%20Extract%201.jpg?cache=0.40694556129164994)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: AMLAG on October 05, 2013, 16:50:34

    Can anyone please advise how long the present temporary unsatisfactorily totally open to the elements platform 7 (constructed on top of the former Down through track) is likely to be in use??
    A recent downpour saw several dozens of passengers waiting for an Express to the South West drenched !
    Possibly the simple provision of a temporary Scaffold structure with a covering to keep people dry was considered...or not ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 05, 2013, 17:38:45
    3 to 4 months.

    Do people have so little initiative that they can't spot the obvious connecting routes and wait over on Platform 6?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on October 06, 2013, 01:25:46
    We are British, a few spots of rain is not going to put us off from our quest to get a seat...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 06, 2013, 16:04:16
    A few bits of work going on at the moment:
    • [Deleted - nonsense due to misread notes.]
    • There are stacks of short (1 m or so) sheet piles on P10, which must be for the retaining wall. They have small holes at one end, and the piles have holes at the top, so presumably they will be tied together only by a wire strung through them.
    • The tracks from P1/2/7 to the Down Westbury have been taken out, for replacement presumably with the points UN and crossover UM-ZG as listed for stages 3-5 on the plan above. No sign of the track out of P3 over bridge 2 going in, but then P3 is out of use for some time yet (this track was not originally scheduled for replacement at all). I guess that was why there was one of Ainscough's cranes down beside Caversham Road. 
    • I reckon there is very little of the structure under the "old" (Brunel Arcade) roof left to nibble away. The plans show this roof is all to be kept, with new canopies around it for P4-7 and some kind of skirts around it to fill in the gaps. Hence they will need to keep all the internal "scaffolding tubes", and something to support this framework. That might be new, but it looks as if taking out the escalator casings and bridge will leave just the concrete pillars. A new (glazed?) end wall is needed above canopy level.

    Access to and from P4-7 is very congested, and it would help a lot if the space under that 1980s roof could be used. Part is being used for concrete/mortar mixing, though that isn't the whole space, and even a small widening of the passageway would help. But somehow I don't expect this to be a priority.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 07, 2013, 12:13:36
    ...There are stacks of short (1 m or so) sheet piles on P10, which must be for the retaining wall. They have small holes at one end, and the piles have holes at the top, so presumably they will be tied together only by a wire strung through them.

    The sheet material fits along its length as shown below:

    A number of the piles have been removed, possibly out of position, and another apparent 'own goal' is that the attachments for the blue safety fence currently prevent about 50% of the sheeting being positioned...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 07, 2013, 12:31:42
    Also around the site I noticed that country end of P7 has been removed over the weekend.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 07, 2013, 12:52:40
    Also around the site I noticed that country end of P7 has been removed over the weekend.

    I guess they'll have to completely remove an initial section coming east ward form the end, but only until such length where the new foundation strip will be entirely outside the existing platform footprint.  40-50 metres maybe?  After that they'll perhaps just cut down the existing wall and bury it behind the new work?

    That's basically what's happening so far at the east end of P10, (picture in above post) the old wall and coping slabs are still there under all that infill material.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 10, 2013, 10:15:32
    I guess they'll have to completely remove an initial section coming east ward form the end

    They've been steadily munching through it overnight. The rubble has been accumulating around p1/2/7, presumably as infill for the new wall when complete.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 10, 2013, 11:48:11
    There are also yellow and blue lines painted along the ballast towards the transfer deck which presumably define the general position of the foundation strip and the wall.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 12, 2013, 23:12:14
    Today, it was onward and ... onward, mostly. But there was a gap in the new foundation trench under the deck, presumably to keep well away from the dangerous yellow mushroom that lurks there. They also seem to have been so scared of it they have abandoned a length of track.

    I do wonder about digging under the track like that. Is the concrete going to fill under there? If not, and it is shuttered, doesn't it all have to be concreted, left to set solid enough, then get backfilled and consolidated before running train on it at 7 a.m Monday?

    Expect concrete deliveries sometime soon - but where? At the front door?
    PS: Perhaps not - there's a big crane popped up over on the North side, visible in camera 02/2 (camera 01 is asleep, of course).



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 12, 2013, 23:28:48
    Out across Caversham Bridge, the next jigsaw piece has gone in - using the DIY crossover kit left next to the track in two heaps two weeks ago. There were at least six pieces to be joined up, so that's lots of welds to do.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 13, 2013, 10:46:11
    Expect concrete deliveries sometime soon - but where? At the front door?
    PS: Perhaps not - there's a big crane popped up over on the North side, visible in camera 02/2 (camera 01 is asleep, of course).

    Well, that crane had done its waving around and gone by dawn. Nothing obvious being hoisted, but it must have been small at that extension. Less than a hopper of concrete, anyway.

    A Hanson mixer truck just (10:30) turned up in the forecourt corral and is offloading into some container(s) on the back of a small flatbed with hoist. Presumably that drives onto platform 7 and uses a chute - that hoist looks too small to move concrete in bulk.

    PS: looking closer, that's a pump on the truck and there is a pipe running into the main entrance, covered by boards on the pavement.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 13, 2013, 11:13:40
    Doesn't the 1030 webcam view show the Hanson lorry backed up next to a concrete pump mounted on another lorry? 

    There seems to be length of barrier and a raised pedestrian ramp outside the main southern gateline, (being installed from around 0330 onwards) with passengers limited to using the left hand doors so far this morning.

    (I must have written that while you were editing...)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 13, 2013, 11:37:03
    I took a few photos yesterday that I won't bother uploading because stuving took a very similar set, but I'll add one below to show some recent progress on the new P10.  About 50% of the new platform wall has its 'oversail blocks' in place, the last level before the coping slabs.  The height difference between P9 and P10 is starting to become quite obvious.

    Another area to report on is the 'missing corner' of P10, at the country end beyond the coffee shop and waiting room.  In this area the foundation strip shuttering and re-bar is in place to make a start on extending it out to the full width to match the length of P11.  The track at that end leading to the up main has been repositioned to make room, definitely looks now as though it has really only been left there for road-rail machine access.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 14, 2013, 16:51:09

    Well, that crane had done its waving around and gone by dawn. Nothing obvious being hoisted, but it must have been small at that extension..


    Platform 10 remaining canopy legs and longitudinal beams (the latter are still lying on the ground - some are stacked behind that red barrier)?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 14, 2013, 17:34:23
    ... But there was a gap in the new foundation trench under the deck, presumably to keep well away from the dangerous yellow mushroom that lurks there.

    I had a think about that today, and I reckon the gap aligns almost exactly with the subway. 

    Now someone had mentioned (quite a while back and possibly in a different forum) that they were going to have to re-waterproof a section of subway roof 'once it became accessible'.  So I wonder if that could be the problem area?  Although it might need a different type of foundation reinforcement anyway, the corresponding section above the subway alongside the new P10 was done differently, albeit only a few days after the sections either side.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 16, 2013, 09:02:14
    There was already some blockwork on the foundations of P7 by this morning, right under the transfer deck.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 16, 2013, 13:00:20
    There was already some blockwork on the foundations of P7 by this morning, right under the transfer deck.

    I think they might progress quite quickly now.  Looks like as we discussed earlier, once the foundation strips are in they'll be able to utilise a few hours of overnight line closures of the P7 route to progress the work right alongside the track. 

    Then this weekend appears to be the last with P7 and P8 closed both Sat and Sun, (possibly for the up Westbury line to be altered I reckon) for future weekends it appears to be Sunday closures only.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 17, 2013, 09:06:05
    There were signs up yesterday on P8 stating that stopping services will be switching to the other end of the platform as of next Monday until approximately the end of November.

    Lots more blockwork on P7 too and some hefty excavations for the new canopy.

    The new canopy on P1/2 is operating under it's own power now. Will there be some kind of cover over the ends of P1/2 ? The slightly higher section closer to the station buildings has what look like connector holes that would bridge over to P7 when that is completed.

    J.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 17, 2013, 09:54:19
    The new canopy on P1/2 is operating under it's own power now. Will there be some kind of cover over the ends of P1/2 ? The slightly higher section closer to the station buildings has what look like connector holes that would bridge over to P7 when that is completed.
    J.

    Yes. There is to be a polybag skylight surrounded by a canopy that slopes down gently all round (matching the curve in the support rail where it joins the P1/2 canopy). However, the plans (for RBC planning) are a bit contradictory, as elsewhere this higher section is at the same height as P7 canopy - and all linear canopies slope upwards, anyway. A recent artist's impression ought to show the 3D form better than those projections that appear to come from different design versions.

    PS: On looking again, if there is a slope all round it's upwards - even where the support rail slopes down ... so it's still, clearly, unclear what shape it is.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 17, 2013, 12:06:12
    It's significantly different to what was shown in the (RBC planning) overhead views of the whole station.   The main change is that the P1/2 roof originally came to a stop at the buffer end, a bit like the roofs on P4/5/6 and was then going to be overlapped by a 'main roof' at a slightly higher level, which included the ETFE skylight. 

    Now the P1/2 roof is continuous with a rising section and then it abuts the transfer deck.

    The original main roof behind the buffers extended further south towards the boundary wall, completely covering that REB container.   I'd anticipate now that the P3/7 roof will be at the higher level all the way along, and also continue up to the transfer deck as well.  That would then leave a gap to be bridged with a section including a slightly narrower ETFE skylight than in the original?

    As a picture is worth a thousand words I've tried to explain what I mean with an original design extract and a very poor quality cut and paste piece of guesswork attached below.  No complaints please if it ends up completely different...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 17, 2013, 18:47:03
    Having realised some drawings were out of date, I had a look at the top of the canopy this afternoon. The picture shows the raised P1/2 canopy is slightly narrower, and has provision to bolt something onto the edge. Presumably this is the skylight frame, and its other side rests on the edge of the P3/7 canopy, which has to be the same height.

    The elevation drawing is presumably right, as it looks like as built. There would not be room for much canopy past the end of the skylight, and there is no sign of mountings for a supporting spar, so presumably there will just be the end of the frame.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 17, 2013, 19:57:57
    All in all they've made it a much simpler construction than that shown in the original design (my first drawing extract).  Agree there seems to be not much space at either end of the ETFE skylight section, looks to be only a couple of metres at each end.

    Odd that there's been no obvious planning application for it, (the one for the re-work of the southern entrance, that replaced the lift with those ramps etc shows the revised elevation), but there's no written background for the change AFAICS.  Would such an alteration be considered only minor, in comparison to the whole project?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on October 18, 2013, 05:57:04
    Does the new canopy design on P1/2 offer the possibility to lengthen P1 to finish close to the transfer deck.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on October 18, 2013, 10:30:30
    Good question. In fact, what's the maximum train length that can currently be accomodated in P1/2?

    Once we have EMU's on Newbury/Basingstoke local services (and Bedwyn, if the wires end up going that far), I understand these will be at least 4-coach units. I'm assuming these can be accomodated as things stand, but probably not if doubled-up.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 18, 2013, 11:29:13
    Good question. In fact, what's the maximum train length that can currently be accomodated in P1/2?

    5-cars.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 18, 2013, 11:36:00
    Does the new canopy design on P1/2 offer the possibility to lengthen P1 to finish close to the transfer deck.
    The very latest standards apparently require something like 20m of free area beyond the buffer stops of a bay platform, so I don't think bringing the buffer stops east is a possibility.  

    (I can't exactly remember where I read it, but station alterations at Newcastle Central have just been changeed because there was insufficient distance between a set of buffers and a proposed platform building.

    P3 was only just long enough for a 5 x 23 m Voyager before the works started, it would be unlikely to be reduced from this, and the plans show the three bay platforms the same length on completion.

    So with any possible extension having to be beyond the various points and over Caversham Rd bridge, operating more than one 4 car EMU from any of the bays is out of the question.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on October 18, 2013, 12:58:12
    Thanks, that confirms what I had worked out in my own mind, ie, that here is no room to extend those platforms further west.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 18, 2013, 15:49:35
    The very latest standards apparently require something like 20m of free area beyond the buffer stops of a bay platform, so I don't think bringing the buffer stops east is a possibility.  

    It's in GI/RT 7016:
    Quote
    6.3 Location of structures at terminal stations
    6.3.1 Location of permanent new structures in relation to terminal tracks
    6.3.1.1 Permanent new structures, including buildings and columns supporting canopies
    shall not be located within a zone extending 20 m behind the face of the buffer
    stop and 5 m either side of the projected centre line of the track approaching the
    buffer stop. This is referred to in sub-sections 6.3.2 and 6.3.3 as the ^overrun risk
    zone^.
    6.3.2 Alterations to existing structures or track layouts
    6.3.2.1 Alterations to an existing structure or track layout shall not:
    a) Cause a structure that is outside the overrun risk zone to come within the
    overrun risk zone (see sub-section 6.3.1).
    b) Cause a structure which is within the overrun risk zone to become closer to
    the centre line of the track and/or closer to the face of the buffer stop.
    6.3.3 Location of temporary structures at terminal stations
    6.3.3.1 Temporary structures shall be located outside the overrun risk zone (see subsection
    6.3.1).

    However, GI/GN 7616 provides some wiggle room:
    Quote
    GN74 The requirements of 6.3 of GI/RT7016 are intended to manage the risk from trains overrunning a buffer stop.
    GN75 When carrying out modifications affecting the overrun risk zone (for example to improve access or facilities) the constraints of the station might mean that it is not feasible to meet the requirements of 6.3 of GI/RT7016.
    ... and gives advice and references for conducting a risk analysis.

    Note that the 20 m runs from the buffer stop itself, so it includes the slide path behind the buffer stop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 19, 2013, 21:49:16
    Crane is in action again tonight Camera 2/02.  Will this be the roof sections on the London end of the canopy for P10/11?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 20, 2013, 08:47:23
    Crane is in action again tonight Camera 2/02.  Will this be the roof sections on the London end of the canopy for P10/11?

    No apparently not they are still in the stack by the North entrance this morning.  Have to wait to see what has appeared on P10/11 this morning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 20, 2013, 10:48:39
    "What have you got there?"
    "It's only 33 tons of concrete."
    "Well, you can't come through the barrier without a ticket. Where are you going?"
    "Platform 7."
    "Sorry, we don't do platform tickets any more."

    The concrete pump's out again - there's a length of trench towards the west end of P7 to fill.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 20, 2013, 12:03:56
    Crane is in action again tonight Camera 2/02.  Will this be the roof sections on the London end of the canopy for P10/11?

    No apparently not they are still in the stack by the North entrance this morning.  Have to wait to see what has appeared on P10/11 this morning.

    It might have just been lifting the longitudinal girders for bolting into position?   I'll have a check tomorrow if no-one reports back in the meantime...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on October 20, 2013, 22:12:10
    Crane is in action again tonight Camera 2/02.  Will this be the roof sections on the London end of the canopy for P10/11?
    Judging by the lift for the installation of the existing canopy panels on P10/11, the very large Ainscough crane will be required. See Cam01/1&3 Feb 24, 2013 at around 11.00am.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 20, 2013, 22:49:48
    Judging by the lift for the installation of the existing canopy panels on P10/11, the very large Ainscough crane will be required. See Cam01/1&3 Feb 24, 2013 at around 11.00am.

    Not just a big one either -  there's a long lattice-work jib extension too. It's out of camera view most of the time, but you can see it being assembled on camera 01/3 the night before, and see part of it in use on camera 02/1.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 21, 2013, 12:02:51
    There were a few parts for the P1/2 canopy in a fenced off area at the country end but I was too busy running this morning to see what else had appeared.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 21, 2013, 16:45:21
    The longitudinal girders are now fitted along the whole remaining length of the P10/11 canopy.  I gatherered the information that they expect the canopy sections themselves to be fitted over about 4 or 5 weekends, given the short period available between end of traffic on Saturday evening and the normal Sunday morning startup.

    The P10/11 platform wall seems complete to the level of the oversail blocks, except for the far country end where the foundations are yet to be poured.

    Over on the P7 side, the gap in the foundation strip under the transfer deck that stuving mentioned has been poured, the block work generally seems to be proceeding quite well.

    There don't seem to have been any significant alterations to the track layout west of Caversham Rd bridge over the weekend, so it may be that nothing more is planned for a while, given that the weekend diversions are relaxed on forthcoming Saturdays...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on October 21, 2013, 17:17:22
    The first longitudinal beams were lifted into place on the viaduct today. Visible on camera 06/2.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 21, 2013, 17:34:19
    The first longitudinal beams were lifted into place on the viaduct today. Visible on camera 06/2.

    Does anyone know for sure how the viaduct sections integrate with the 'fixed piers'?   I'm thinking that the fixed ends of the beams must have reinforcement bars that somehow interlock across the pier with their opposite number, and also interlock with with the rebars visible at the top of those piers, and so there'll probably be a concrete pour to finish off each pier top?

    Then at the free ends, presumably there are steel pad pieces on the pier top to allow the beam to expand and contract, and they'll have to be fixed securely to the pier.  If anyone knows any detail about how that's usually done I'd be interested, because it isn't too clear in the webcams.   Probably not just big 'Rawlplugs'...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 22, 2013, 10:48:05
    Over on the P7 side, the gap in the foundation strip under the transfer deck that stuving mentioned has been poured, the block work generally seems to be proceeding quite well.

    A significant amount of blockwork was laid overnight on the fresh P7 foundations at the country end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 22, 2013, 15:59:01
    The viaduct sections are proceeding well, (webcam 06/2) - there are now ten beams in position as of 1545 today 22/10, seven on the first span started yesterday, and three on the next one towards the station. 

    You can also now see that the outer beams of the set of seven have a different cross section, to give a flat profile to the outside faces.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 22, 2013, 19:32:58
    Does anyone know for sure how the viaduct sections integrate with the 'fixed piers'?   I'm thinking that the fixed ends of the beams must have reinforcement bars that somehow interlock across the pier with their opposite number, and also interlock with with the rebars visible at the top of those piers, and so there'll probably be a concrete pour to finish off each pier top?

    Then at the free ends, presumably there are steel pad pieces on the pier top to allow the beam to expand and contract, and they'll have to be fixed securely to the pier.  If anyone knows any detail about how that's usually done I'd be interested, because it isn't too clear in the webcams.   Probably not just big 'Rawlplugs'...   ;D

    Paul

    No I don't know, but I'm sure the free end of each span sits on a unidirectional bearing, i.e. it provides vertical support and lateral restraint while permitting longitudinal movement. This was the original idea:
    Quote from: Reading Station Area Redevelopment Programme PLANNING STATEMENT
    Each deck is fixed longitudinally at one end (proposed as the east end) and is free to slide longitudinally at other supports; guided bearings are required at the free end. Bearings are envisaged as being proprietary POT type.
    Evidently this was written before these details of the design were worked out - it has been changed to halve the number of expansion joints and fixed pier tops.

    Assuming it still uses a similar merchant bearing, it could be fixed to the beam and pier in several ways: adhesive, grout, or bolts are commonest. If you look at camera 06/2 on October 17th at about 17:00, you can see work on the top of the two nearest free-end piers (i.e. the nearest and the third away). I can't see any bearings as such, but what looks like seven formwork frames on each pier, suggesting something is to be cast or poured into them. My best guess is that the bearing is built into the beam end, and the base goes into the box and gets grouted in place. But that's only a guess.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 22, 2013, 20:14:54
    Assuming it still uses a similar merchant bearing, it could be fixed to the beam and pier in several ways: adhesive, grout, or bolts are commonest. If you look at camera 06/2 on October 17th at about 17:00, you can see work on the top of the two nearest free-end piers (i.e. the nearest and the third away). I can't see any bearings as such, but what looks like seven formwork frames on each pier, suggesting something is to be cast or poured into them. My best guess is that the bearing are built into the beam end, and the base goes into the box and gets grouted in place. But that's only a guess.

    Thanks to your quoted paragraph from the planning docs I googled 'POT bearing' and found more than a few articles that broaden my knowledge of the subject!  It does seem possible that the rectangular cast sections visible on the distant pier tops are more cosmetic than structural. With a bit of luck something will become visible when the covers are removed from the nearest pier...

    Thanks again.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on October 22, 2013, 20:33:33
    Out of curiosity, does anyone know what is the maximum gradient that would be permissible for the ramps?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 22, 2013, 22:25:11
    Out of curiosity, does anyone know what is the maximum gradient that would be permissible for the ramps?
    On what grounds? For running trains, or to make sure the bridge doesn't slide off its piers? Or did you have something else in mind?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 22, 2013, 22:38:17
    The new Up Westbury will be close to the Down, and I wondered if the short section leading towards it would be taken any further now. However, peering into the distance, there's a big height difference to be made up first. Are the Westburies being lifted to match the Mains heading towards the viaduct, which need to be built up starting right next to the Caversham Road bridge? If so, some of the track renewals here will have to include a fair bit of earth-moving.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 22, 2013, 22:41:54
    I don't remember this sign on P7 originally. Have drivers been having trouble remembering the temporary layout?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 22, 2013, 22:51:06
    And finally ... I see they haven't plucked up courage to deal with that yellow mushroom. Do you think it's going to be immured for eternity along with the old track? I hope it's reliable...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on October 23, 2013, 07:17:10
    Out of curiosity, does anyone know what is the maximum gradient that would be permissible for the ramps?
    Om what grounds? For running trains, or to make sure the bridge doesn't slide off its piers? Or did you have something else in mind?
    Thinking about how much space is needed for an up ramp, bridge and down ramp, when considering grade separation elsewhere. The key to this is the gradient.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on October 23, 2013, 07:49:39
    I don't remember this sign on P7 originally. Have drivers been having trouble remembering the temporary layout?

    You don't really need a sign - just look for the mop and bucket on a platform!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 23, 2013, 09:54:08
    Out of curiosity, does anyone know what is the maximum gradient that would be permissible for the ramps?
    Om what grounds? For running trains, or to make sure the bridge doesn't slide off its piers? Or did you have something else in mind?
    Thinking about how much space is needed for an up ramp, bridge and down ramp, when considering grade separation elsewhere. The key to this is the gradient.

    Of course there is a standard ... see GC/RT5021:
    Quote
    2.7.3.1 The normal limiting design value for track gradient on running lines shall be 1 in 80 (12.5 mm/m).
    ... but the standard allows more, or less, depending on detailed calculations. These would reflect actual use, and could result in restrictions on speed and what's allowed on that track.

    The other main factor is of course the vertical offset needed - made up of vehicle gauge height, OLE clearance above and below, bridge deck thickness, and track depth. All of these are variables, but the total is going to be about 8 m "normal minimum" (i.e. can be less but it's getting hard to do). Any gradient of the other line affects this too - and can be either way.

    Finally, there's an allowance for minimum vertical radius - roughly 1 km - times gradient, at each end (ignoring the rise/fall within this distance). On top of that you need a turnout, before the ramp proper.

    I make that 665 m for the ramp itself. For comparison, what are the figures for the ramp down to the "Southern" underpass?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 23, 2013, 10:40:41
    I make that 665 m for the ramp itself. For comparison, what are the figures for the ramp down to the "Southern" underpass?
    To start an answer to that question ... the distance is 370 m. The bridge is steel, so its depth can be less than a concrete one, and I think there are standard ways of reducing the OLE allowance. But what does the gradient end up being?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on October 23, 2013, 11:01:17
    I think most of the ramps ar Reading are less than 1:80 possibly as steep as 1:30/40.

    I do know that the ramp from the Goods avoiding underpass from Reading West to the station is considered too steep for a 59 to restart a loaded aggregate train. Therefore they will have to have a clear road from Aldermaston through  the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 23, 2013, 11:49:39
    From the planning statement for the viaducts, the east ramp is 270m long including earth embankment and concrete sections, and the west ramp 210m.  The latter is stated to have a maximum height of 5.3m, so about 1 in 40 as suggested above.  That 5.3m is nowhere near the eventual west curve and festival box, they are 400m away along a viaduct section, so the height at the top of that ramp isn't required to clear a railway. 

    A figure isn't given in the text for the east ramp height, which does finish near the feeder line box, but the feeder lines are lower by nearly a couple of metres than adjacent ground level, so if we assume something around 6m it will be slightly less of a gradient than the west end.

    I expect there are more accurate figures available by trawling through all the separate drawings...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 23, 2013, 11:52:24
    I don't remember this sign on P7 originally. Have drivers been having trouble remembering the temporary layout?

    I was there as it was being fitted, and a Turbo driver confirmed that the HST drivers had reported the previous 'stop mark' difficult to pick out.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on October 23, 2013, 14:03:45
    From the planning statement for the viaducts, the east ramp is 270m long including earth embankment and concrete sections, and the west ramp 210m.  The latter is stated to have a maximum height of 5.3m, so about 1 in 40 as suggested above.  That 5.3m is nowhere near the eventual west curve and festival box, they are 400m away along a viaduct section, so the height at the top of that ramp isn't required to clear a railway. 

    A figure isn't given in the text for the east ramp height, which does finish near the feeder line box, but the feeder lines are lower by nearly a couple of metres than adjacent ground level, so if we assume something around 6m it will be slightly less of a gradient than the west end.

    I expect there are more accurate figures available by trawling through all the separate drawings...

    Paul

    I feel a bit reticent in butting in to this conversation, but I understood that this debate had essentially been answered by SandTengineer's posts No. 2065 in August last year. He wrote:

    Quote
    OK here are gradients from Theale to Reading station (extracted from the signalling plan dated November 2010):

    F=Falling Gradient in direction of Travel
    R=Rising Gradient in Direction of Travel
    O/B=Overbridge
    U/B=Underbridge
    m=Metres

    Theale to Reading Station Via Westbury Lines

    Theale Staion to Burghfield Road O/B
    691F Average

    Burghfield Road O/B to Southcote Junction
    323R for 1447m

    Southcote Junction to Bath Road O/B
    323R for 692m

    Bath Road O/B to Reading West Station Platform (Middle)
    307F for 735m

    Reading West Station Platform (Middle) to Reading Station (Via Westbury Lines)

    5822F for 22m to Oxford Road U/B
    671R for 38m Over Oxford Road O/B to Oxford Road Junction Points
    330F for 112m
    194F for 150m
    250F for 472m to Reading Triangle Upper Points
    110F for 42m
    147R for 73m
    304F for 40m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Down Reading Feeder Relief)

    330F for 219m
    90F for 264m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    106R for 287m
    730R for 195m to Westbury Junction (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Relief Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Oxford Road Junction to Reading Station (via Up Reading Feeder Main)

    330F for 139m
    112F for 84m
    90F for 260m (Passing under the Mains Flyover)
    150R for 482m to Westbury Junction (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL to Reading Station (Main Line Side)
    LEVEL through Reading Station Platforms

    Health Warning: This data is extracted from a copy of the signalling plan that is 3 years old and may therefore not fully represent the arrangements currently being constructed.  It is therefore listed as a guide only.

    (I hope that I have done the quoting correctly!)

    There was some subsequent discussion about these figures, but my take on it is that they are probably approximately correct - given the passage of time since they were originally drawn up - but it is unlikely that the gradients have changed as much as is suggested.

    If this is the case then there would not seem to any great difficulty in re-starting a 40 wagon train on the gradient up to the Relief lines as some 14 wagons will be on the (approx.) 1 in 100 up grade and the rest on the train will be on the 1 in 90 falling grade giving a shove! There may well be other arguments for not stopping such long trains near the station, but being unable to re-start is probably not one of them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 23, 2013, 14:25:36
    No problem, I remember that as well, but it's all about the gradients on the various curves and was in answer to the perceived problem of freights being caught in the low point of the new curve, the feeder lines.

    I was just roughly working out the ramps at the ends of the main viaduct, which aren't included in that list. 

    ...and I now see SandTengineer added all the mainline stuff in a later post, #2074.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 24, 2013, 00:41:35
    Seen at Reading today - plonked right in the way at the top and bottom of some escalators.
    Given the small print, it caused some congestion as people stopped to work out if they were meant to go past it.
    There are already the big "no luggage on escalators" signs, and today there was a stream of PA announcements as well.

    I imagine this initiative is driven by the corporate liability lawyers, who say that if passenger A lets go of his bike/surfboard/cyclotron and it injures passenger B, the station operator risks being held liable.
    Or has there been any specific accident that has triggered it?

    Anyway, when Elffan sees it he will insist it is removed as a trip hazard, won't he.

    (I appreciate that this is not strictly speaking an improvement.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 24, 2013, 00:51:10
    However: buggies, wheelchairs and tricycles are not prohibited from using the escalators, apparently?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 24, 2013, 00:59:47
    I did wonder about the trolleys - the graphic looks like an old railway porter's trolley, though airports use the same graphic. Either way, there's not a lot of such trolleys around the station.

    Also - there are only two lifts from the south entrance (and often one out of use). If even all really large luggage and these other things have to use them, is that enough at the main entrance?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on October 24, 2013, 01:36:33
    I used to work at Reading as a Duty Manager. The escalators were the single biggest source of accidents on stations in FGW. And that was when there were just four of them! Over the years there have been a number of initiatives directed at reducing the accident rate, Remember the "talking" notice boards with the South African accent? And then staff were stationed at the escalators to direct passengers with luggage, bikes, etc.  towards the lifts. The problem then was that the lifts were hidden from view, so everyone piled onto the escalators. The problem was discussed at the highest executive level within FGW.

    With so many more escalators in the new station, the problem was only ever going to get worse. Its not surprising that efforts are being made to direct passengers with luggage to the lifts. I saw some really nasty injuries as a result of falls on escalators, usually caused by passengers taking large items of luggage onto them and losing control. Every accident has to be recorded and logged. If the injury is such that the customer has to be taken to hospital, then the accident is Riddor reportable and a full investigation is required with a "quick" review taking place within 72 hours. The paperwork is horrendous!

    Certainly there is a tendency to blame someone else for an accident and the compensation culture is rife. There is clear monetary imperative for reducing the number of accidents from an FGW corporate point of view. For the local management, its simply a case of attempting to manage a difficult situation - reducing the number of accidents reduces the bureaucracy and the pressure from above, and makes for happier customers!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 24, 2013, 10:45:11
    I'm sure you are right, and the subject deserved a more serious treatment than I gave it.

    So, being serious, I can't see putting a sign right in the way like that as a good idea. I imagine one of the problems at Reading (commented on before, I think) is that most the lifts are not at all obvious. The ones up onto the deck from the main entrance are especially well hidden at the moment, but I don't think that will change very much when the building is finished.

    A lot of work was done analysing the people flows at the design stage. Did the presence of people with luggage not feature in that work?

    I'll be interested to see how Gatwick has been redesigned, since this issue must be far more important there. I know that one of the issues with moving GEx off platforms 1-2 was that the lifts for the other platforms were very hard to find.

    There is a railway standard, but it dates from 1996 and unsurprisingly is mainly about fire risks. I does contain this, though:
    Quote from: GM/RT1201 "Escalators and Passenger Conveyors on Railway Stations"
    9.5 When specially designed passenger self help trolleys are used on
    escalators and passenger conveyors, notices in a clear and concise form to
    instruct passengers how to use the trolleys on the escalator or passenger
    conveyor shall be provided. These notices shall be at the approaches to the
    escalator or passenger conveyor, but not at the immediate entrances to
    them where congestion could develop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2013, 11:29:25
    The big yellow signs that have been there a couple of weeks really need to lose the statement about using the lift because it is faster.   That is completely illogical, and surely there's a risk that FGW might be counter sued for misleading people.  ;D  If the lifts really were faster, no-one would bother with the escalators...

    Do FGW not realise the horse has bolted on this problem.  What proportion of passengers departing Paddington have come from the underground, where wheeled luggage is routinely taken on the escalators.  That's another system that could not physically cope with everyone switching to lifts...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on October 24, 2013, 13:33:12
    The mysterious wooden block!

    Has anyone else noticed the mysterious wooden block in the Northern Entrance of the station?

    You'll see it two-thirds of the way up the long escalators on the left-hand-side of the upwards escalator.  It's been there since the Northern entrance opened and looks very temporary with 'Oz' scribbled on it in pencil yet after all this time is still in place so I assume is a crucial part of the structure ;-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: didcotdean on October 24, 2013, 16:13:47
    At Heathrow Terminal 5 there is has always been notices about the lifts being quicker than the escalators, and I can believe it there if you were just standing on them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on October 24, 2013, 17:06:39
    An interesting feature of the escalators to the taxi rank from platform 12 at Paddington is that they have solid metal barriers which are just wide enough for someone to walk through, but not for any thing wider.

    The same feature exists at Heathrow Airport on the escalators there to/from the Heathrow Express/Connect platforms.

    I'm surprised this feature wasn't used at Reading. I've also never seen the western most lift between the transfer deck and platform 7 being used, it's always out of action. Has anyone else seen it working?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 24, 2013, 17:18:57
    ...'ve also never seen the western most lift between the transfer deck and platform 7 being used, it's always out of action. Has anyone else seen it working?

    That was always intentional from what I was told by staff.  The lift was operable, but stayed out of use because it is orientated so that people step out at the bottom towards the platform edge.  If it was turned 90 degrees like all the other lifts people would come out at the top too near the main escalators.

    So on the day P7 went out of use for rebuilding into its wider form the lift was brought into use, and once the platform is widened there'll be much more space adjacent to the lower doors...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 24, 2013, 17:29:01
    An interesting feature of the escalators to the taxi rank from platform 12 at Paddington is that they have solid metal barriers which are just wide enough for someone to walk through, but not for any thing wider.

    The same feature exists at Heathrow Airport on the escalators there to/from the Heathrow Express/Connect platforms.

    I'm surprised this feature wasn't used at Reading. I've also never seen the western most lift between the transfer deck and platform 7 being used, it's always out of action. Has anyone else seen it working?

    I'm sure the barriers at Heathrow (and other airports) are there to keep their self-serve trolleys off escalators, and are present within the airport as well. And there are similar trolleys at Paddington, so that's probably why there are barriers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 24, 2013, 23:27:15
    The mysterious wooden block!

    Has anyone else noticed the mysterious wooden block in the Northern Entrance of the station?

    I always though it was to remove some hazard that might catch someone's finger - and would be replaced by something that looks more professional.

    I did once catch my little finger on a bit of surrounding joinery next to a handrail (stairs, not escalator) in John Lewis in Reading. It was very painful, and I feared I might have broken something - though it turned out I hadn't. But it is easy to do, and well worth avoiding.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 25, 2013, 00:10:47
    With a bit of luck something will become visible when the covers are removed from the nearest pier...

    Well, it looks like the same seven wooden box frames with a bit of rubber matting on top of each. But the resolution isn't good enough to identify what's really there.

    I was going to suggest that the bearings under the transfer deck would be a good example to look at. But there isn't anywhere you can get a good view - obviously from inside the deck they are hidden. The best I could do was from the platform - so you can't really see the bearing itself, but you can see how remarkably small they are. My recollection is that the deck was slid on friction pads in the centres of the Y-piers, then would have been jacked up, so they could be removed, and lowered onto the bearings.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 25, 2013, 07:44:42
    Assuming it still uses a similar merchant bearing, it could be fixed to the beam and pier in several ways: adhesive, grout, or bolts are commonest. If you look at camera 06/2 on October 17th at about 17:00, you can see work on the top of the two nearest free-end piers (i.e. the nearest and the third away). I can't see any bearings as such, but what looks like seven formwork frames on each pier, suggesting something is to be cast or poured into them. My best guess is that the bearing are built into the beam end, and the base goes into the box and gets grouted in place. But that's only a guess.

    Thanks to your quoted paragraph from the planning docs I googled 'POT bearing' and found more than a few articles that broaden my knowledge of the subject!  It does seem possible that the rectangular cast sections visible on the distant pier tops are more cosmetic than structural. With a bit of luck something will become visible when the covers are removed from the nearest pier...

    Thanks again.

    Paul

    The covers have now been removed (Camera 6/02).  The (temporary) timber frame round each bearing suggests they have been grouted thought there are likely to be some bots as well.  If you look at the next (fixed) support you can see the exposed reinforcement at the end of the beams and the reinforcement at the top of the pier.  I assume these will interlock and be cast into a block to provide a fixed end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 25, 2013, 11:43:49
    Looking back a couple of weeks on the webcam, e.g. the 11th, the third pier along (i.e. the next intermediate 'free' pier) seems to have spent a time with the concrete feature finished, but without whatever the black parts are, and then the latter are being fitted around the 17th/18th. 

    So in the case of the nearest pier it looks to me as though all the phases of the fitting have been done one after the other.   

    I also just noticed that around the 20th whatever work was going it required a fire extinguisher to be available, so perhaps there has been either cutting or welding taking place, that would probably mean that the lower part of the bearing is connected to the reinforcement within the pier.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 25, 2013, 20:43:21
    Looking back a couple of weeks on the webcam, e.g. the 11th, the third pier along (i.e. the next intermediate 'free' pier) seems to have spent a time with the concrete feature finished, but without whatever the black parts are, and then the latter are being fitted around the 17th/18th. 

    The black parts are the bridge bearings. The concrete part is merely a feature cast into the concrete pier underneath.

    So in the case of the nearest pier it looks to me as though all the phases of the fitting have been done one after the other.   

    I also just noticed that around the 20th whatever work was going it required a fire extinguisher to be available, so perhaps there has been either cutting or welding taking place, that would probably mean that the lower part of the bearing is connected to the reinforcement within the pier.

    Paul

    I have never heard of them being welded to the reinforcement. By then it would not have been accessible anyway as it was covered in concrete. They are normally attached by a grout and by anchor bolts that are grouted in.  It is possible that a resin grout was used which might have had inflammable components.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on October 26, 2013, 08:45:26
    Looking back a couple of weeks on the webcam, e.g. the 11th, the third pier along (i.e. the next intermediate 'free' pier) seems to have spent a time with the concrete feature finished, but without whatever the black parts are, and then the latter are being fitted around the 17th/18th. 

    The black parts are the bridge bearings. The concrete part is merely a feature cast into the concrete pier underneath.

    So in the case of the nearest pier it looks to me as though all the phases of the fitting have been done one after the other.   

    I also just noticed that around the 20th whatever work was going it required a fire extinguisher to be available, so perhaps there has been either cutting or welding taking place, that would probably mean that the lower part of the bearing is connected to the reinforcement within the pier.

    Paul

    I have never heard of them being welded to the reinforcement. By then it would not have been accessible anyway as it was covered in concrete. They are normally attached by a grout and by anchor bolts that are grouted in.  It is possible that a resin grout was used which might have had inflammable components.

    If a disk cutter had / was being used to trim re-bar or other steel components this is regarded as "Hot Working" the risk assessment to allow a permit to "Hot Work" would almost certainly call for a fire extinguisher


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 26, 2013, 08:54:02
    Looking back a couple of weeks on the webcam, e.g. the 11th, the third pier along (i.e. the next intermediate 'free' pier) seems to have spent a time with the concrete feature finished, but without whatever the black parts are, and then the latter are being fitted around the 17th/18th. 

    The black parts are the bridge bearings. The concrete part is merely a feature cast into the concrete pier underneath.

    So in the case of the nearest pier it looks to me as though all the phases of the fitting have been done one after the other.   

    I also just noticed that around the 20th whatever work was going it required a fire extinguisher to be available, so perhaps there has been either cutting or welding taking place, that would probably mean that the lower part of the bearing is connected to the reinforcement within the pier.

    Paul

    I have never heard of them being welded to the reinforcement. By then it would not have been accessible anyway as it was covered in concrete. They are normally attached by a grout and by anchor bolts that are grouted in.  It is possible that a resin grout was used which might have had inflammable components.

    If a disk cutter had / was being used to trim re-bar or other steel components this is regarded as "Hot Working" the risk assessment to allow a permit to "Hot Work" would almost certainly call for a fire extinguisher

    Looking at the design rebar should not be exposed, but cutting something else might be the answer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 26, 2013, 09:04:10
    The more you look ...

    The free-end piers have had seven low platforms formed on them, presumably because the poured concrete could never be flat enough. The black bearings do look more like plain pads of elastomer (neoprene) than anything prefabricated. If they sit on these platforms rather than in a cut-out, wouldn't they need fixing? To some extent that would depend on the loading regime which I would expect to be different from a road bridge (which is the main application you read about).

    In addition to that extinguisher on October 20th, there are some propane cylinders too. Does that mean the bonding method involves heat? that does sound very strange.

    Anyway, the next batch of beams has arrived for hoisting today. I think they are initially supported by the scaffolding around the piers, until after the deck slab, crossheads, and diaphragms have been constructed (as the drawings put it). Constructed I take to mean poured and left to cure for a suitable time. Then we might see if the fixed-end pier design includes bearings that are not there yet (or we might not).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 30, 2013, 13:36:05
    Public meeting over intensive rail works in West Reading

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/public-meeting-over-intensive-rail-6254723 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/public-meeting-over-intensive-rail-6254723)



    Motorists and householders are being warned of disruption and noise while engineers carry out further works on the railway tracks.

    Teams will be carrying out overnight and weekend works in the Oxford Road area right through to early February, including Christmas.

    Overnight closures of part of Cow Lane have also been announced in November.

    Network Rail is holding a public event in the pentahotel today to give neighbours the chance to find out more about the works.

    Letters have been sent to thousands of householders likely to be affected by the intensive work programme over the next three months.

    Eimear Fitzpatrick, communications manager at Network Rail, said: ^Due to the nature of the work, there may be some noise generated at night-time. The work will also have to be illuminated.

    ^We hope you will bear with us while these improvements are being carried out and we apologise for any inconvenience our work may cause.

    ^We will do all we can to minimise any impact it may have.^

    Activity in the area around the Oxford Road railway bridge, near Reading West station, has already started and will continue on Saturday or Sunday mornings through to January 13, 2014.

    Engineers will be working over Christmas from 11pm on Christmas Eve through to 5am on Monday, December 30.

    Follow-up works will then be carried out on Saturday nights, between 11.30pm and 8.30am, between January 18 and February 2, 2014.

    They are part of the ^895 million improvement programme and includes building a new viaduct, near Loverock Road and piling foundations for new signals and to carry overhead lines to enable electric trains to run.

    Householders are being warned the work will include earthwork excavations, laying tracks using trains and cranes, unloading and compacting ballast, deliveries and plant movements and illumination for night working.

    Network Rail says the Cow Lane bridge widening project will require the closure of Cow Lane, between Cardiff Road and Portman Road roundabout, between 11pm and 5am from Sunday, November 10, to Thursday, November 14, and then again between 11pm and 5am from Sunday, November 17, to Thursday, November 21.

    Vehicle and pedestrian access will be maintained from Portman Road to Safestore, as well as the First Great Western depot and a diversion route will be signposted.

    Engineers and project managers will be on hand to discuss the works at the pentahotel, Oxford Road, between 3.30pm and 7.30pm today.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on October 30, 2013, 15:18:32
    Quote
    The work will also have to be illuminated.

    Talking of illumination, does anyone know if that's the reason for that gargantuan fence that's being fitted at the new depot ? Given it was installed after the site was opened, and only appears to be along the section that has residential buildings along side, that they seem to be backing it with black plastic (I assume to keep the light from the lights that are being fitted from bleeding through the gaps), it seemed the most logical reason, but I am curious to know none the less!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on October 30, 2013, 20:47:05
    Presumably they will be demolishing the old FGW depot buildings?

    There will be then lots of land freed up, even after the new underpass line has been built. Anyone know whether there are any plans for that vacant land.

    Housing/flats perchance...?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on October 30, 2013, 21:33:15
    There are rumours floating about that Freightliner might take over the remaining land, although I don't know of anything official.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on October 31, 2013, 10:10:50
    It'll be so contaminated that I doubt decontamination is a viable option....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 31, 2013, 10:50:51
    The upper triangle site is to be re-modelled for use by the NR National Delivery Service, (NDS).  They need to replace the ability to park up on track plant etc, like they did in parts of the lower depot.   AFAICT from plans it means shortened sidings in the area of the old upper depot, an access road for lorries and hardstandings for transfer of material from road to rail.  There's a recent planning application for the road layout changes which include an entrance off Cow Lane and an underpass under the new east chords (Feeder Lines):

    RBC reference: 130763 
    The Triangle Area Of Railway Land To The West Of Reading Station And To The South Of Western Railway Lines
    Alteration to the new railway line through the triangle area to incorporate a new access roadway on the eastern side of the embankment.


    Regarding Freightliner, perhaps they have an eye on one of the buildings, as I think they previously operated out of a couple of portakabins near the entrance to the lower depot site.  But a Freightliner driver depot doesn't necessarily mean locos and trains using the site...

    Another aspect of the plans is that there are parts of the lower site given over to surface water drainage ponds, wetlands and planted areas of trees and shrubs to compensate for wildlife habitats lost elsewhere.

    I doubt there will ever be anything other than railway use, sorry Jonty.  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: sprinterguard on October 31, 2013, 18:27:29
    There is also a FGW training centre there.. it's not been there that long (don't know exactly, but at the very least 2-3 years) and shall remain in situ for the time being.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 31, 2013, 21:52:51
    There is also a FGW training centre there.. it's not been there that long (don't know exactly, but at the very least 2-3 years) and shall remain in situ for the time being.

    Yes, I'd heard that stays too.   

    Now that the planning website is alive again, I've just been looking at some of the site plans, and it seems to me that most of the buildings in the upper triangle site are not actually in the way of the new chord.  I guess it is possible that some might be re-used for other purposes?   So that might be why there seems to be no rush (so far) to flatten everything up there?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on October 31, 2013, 22:06:59
    I can't seem to get a view of camera 6 anymore, showing the flyover construction. Does anyone have a link that works please?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 31, 2013, 22:28:44
    I can't seem to get a view of camera 6 anymore, showing the flyover construction. Does anyone have a link that works please?

    Old link still works, but it gets confused if you open more than one camera at once


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on October 31, 2013, 22:35:28
    I can't seem to get a view of camera 6 anymore, showing the flyover construction. Does anyone have a link that works please?
    Old link still works, but it gets confused if you open more than one camera at once
    It's at https://www.lobstervision.tv with the same login. In my opinion this new version is most unsatisfactory. Seems like change for change's sake. Why? If it's not broke then why mend it? Site 02 is particulary bad for slow update. Anyone else experiencing these problems. It gives the option of using the old version, but there were no new or current pictures available when i tried it yesterday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 31, 2013, 22:38:41
    Anyone else reckon the picture quality when zoomed in is worse than last week?

    Or is that just the light getting worse at this time of year ...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 31, 2013, 22:43:37
    Anyone else reckon the picture quality when zoomed in is worse than last week?

    Or is that just the light getting worse at this time of year ...

    Paul

    I think that is just the light


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on October 31, 2013, 22:44:31
    Anyone else reckon the picture quality when zoomed in is worse than last week?

    Or is that just the light getting worse at this time of year ...
    Paul

    I think it's due to the light getting worse. Pictures in the evening and early morning from 06/01 suggest it's lens or cover glass is badly scratched.


    Title: Reading Station
    Post by: onthecushions on November 01, 2013, 22:08:59


    Using modern building materials and methods it should be possible to devise standard designs for platform canopies and even overall roofs that are cost-effective to build and maintain at busy stations. Much of the old Southern Region and the Great Western nearer Paddington has kept the Victorian originals.

    Perhaps the straw sucking, smock wearing country folk who insist on catching trains outside of Zone 6 are considered to be content to wait in the wind and the rain, like the cattle in the fields.

    It is a disgrace that the new Reading General, after a spend of ^850M will still have most of its platforms wind- and rain-swept, when its trains  will largely be electrically driven.

    Go to Leeds City and see how a Yorkshireman builds a new station!

    OTC
    OTC



    Title: Reading Station
    Post by: stuving on November 01, 2013, 23:39:26


    Using modern building materials and methods it should be possible to devise standard designs for platform canopies and even overall roofs that are cost-effective to build and maintain at busy stations. Much of the old Southern Region and the Great Western nearer Paddington has kept the Victorian originals.

    Perhaps the straw sucking, smock wearing country folk who insist on catching trains outside of Zone 6 are considered to be content to wait in the wind and the rain, like the cattle in the fields.

    It is a disgrace that the new Reading General, after a spend of ^850M will still have most of its platforms wind- and rain-swept, when its trains  will largely be electrically driven.

    Go to Leeds City and see how a Yorkshireman builds a new station!

    OTC

    The canopies at Reading are an exact match to the platform width, so every section is custom-made. I imagine that the smaller ones, that do not reach the platform edge, are made of standard parts. I expect the ones at Wokingham will be like that.

    What these new designs have in common is that they slope upwards, rather than downwards, towards the trains. That lets in more light, and more rain too. And the shape also catches the wind and directs it onto the passengers. Now that does not seem terribly clever, for use in Britain.

    I fear we are seeing the result of the architect's very visual sensibility  - to do with light and space, and why we have glass walls everywhere - overruling past experience. In the past we had what railwaymen and local builders had worked out over the years They were usually also countrymen used to working outside all year and knowing how to protect people - and cattle.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 02, 2013, 09:40:26
    I've been puzzled by last week's activity on camera 06/2: what is all that scaffolding for?

    Assuming this is the east end of the Festival Lines box we're looking at, the drawings* show a solid reinforced concrete box structure continuing the viaduct, then tapering down to form the railway "box". The words of the drawing** for this phase are:
    (v)  CONSTRUCT 900mm WALLS.
    (vi) CONSTRUCT 850mm THK DECK SLAB.
    so I expect to see the reinforcement for the support walls being tied to that extending from the pile caps, then shuttering put round it and the concrete poured, before going on to do the deck. Surely none of that needs full two-level scaffolding?

    (*Drawings RSC1G-ECV-DRG-AKB-540004 and -540006, files 00261467 and 00261469 of planning submission 11/1885/FUL)
    (**Drawing RSC1G-ECV-DRG-AKB-540002, file 00261465 of planning submission 11/1885/FUL)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 02, 2013, 10:59:28
    ...so I expect to see the reinforcement for the support walls being tied to that extending from the pile caps, then shuttering put round it and the concrete poured, before going on to do the deck. Surely none of that needs full two-level scaffolding?

    I noticed (from the train) a couple of weeks back that on the similar construction at the feeder lines box they had the same style of scaffolding, and I wondered if they need the 'middle level' just for the job of securing the formwork in position and dismantling it afterwards, but then realised they still have to build the rebar cage first before they rig the formwork.  I guess there will be many sections with bolted flanges between them?  Does seem a bit OTT, but then again modern construction rules might have a requirement for all or nothing...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Sapperton Tunnel on November 02, 2013, 12:09:23
    ...so I expect to see the reinforcement for the support walls being tied to that extending from the pile caps, then shuttering put round it and the concrete poured, before going on to do the deck. Surely none of that needs full two-level scaffolding?

    I noticed (from the train) a couple of weeks back that on the similar construction at the feeder lines box they had the same style of scaffolding, and I wondered if they need the 'middle level' just for the job of securing the formwork in position and dismantling it afterwards, but then realised they still have to build the rebar cage first before they rig the formwork.  I guess there will be many sections with bolted flanges between them?  Does seem a bit OTT, but then again modern construction rules might have a requirement for all or nothing...

    Paul

    There will be horizontal lengths of rebar to go in so as to make a proper self supporting cage. The purpose of the 'middle level' will be for the steel fixers to stand on when they attach the horizontal bars to the verticals that are attached to the ones coming out of the pile caps. Since you have the scaffolding there it doesn't take much to drop in extra boards for an intermediate walkway. The shuttering carpenters will also use it for bolting together shuttering sections. There are H&S regs on how high you can lift etc etc, plus its also good practice to keep that to a minimum as productivity will be higher. All very much as Paul7755 has said.

    ST   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 02, 2013, 15:16:10
    If you are interested in the vertical profile of the viaduct and tracks under, I suggest looking at the files 00263637-40 of planning submission 11/1885/FUL. File 00263640 has as plan and some sections, and there are full-length elevations in 00263638-39. There are all vector-coded so can be blown up as far as you like (in the right application). Unfortunately, the vertical dimensions lack a common datum, though they should be measurable off a single print. I'm still pondering how to print them - the paper size indicated on the easy-west elevation drawings is "A1+20 594 x 5041"!

    Anyway, I've taken off estimates of the spacings under the viaduct where the three crossings are:

    Line under:   West CurveFestival LineFeeder Lines
    Box width:     14.0  5.8  11.0
    Box height:     5.5  5.2  5.4
    Track-track:     7.3  6.8  7.2
    (The widths will be a bit high as the section is normal to the viaduct and the boxes are skewed.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on November 02, 2013, 16:45:39
    Quote
    The work will also have to be illuminated.

    Talking of illumination, does anyone know if that's the reason for that gargantuan fence that's being fitted at the new depot ? Given it was installed after the site was opened, and only appears to be along the section that has residential buildings along side, that they seem to be backing it with black plastic (I assume to keep the light from the lights that are being fitted from bleeding through the gaps), it seemed the most logical reason, but I am curious to know none the less!

    My understanding (not sure how much truth in it)
    Has been erected due to noise complaints, originally residents were asked about a fence and they declined as they believed it would possibly block out sunlight, however once the depot went live in the summer and they realised how noisy turbos were especially in the morning when drivers use compressor speed up to build air, they changed there minds.

    My source has also stated that when the depot converts to majority emu operation the fence may come back down if residents want it to?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 02, 2013, 18:58:17
    As I came into the station tonight, one of Ainscough's yellow beasties was settling in between the car park and platform 15. Should reach P10 OK, so it could be the canopy that's being taken for a joyride the weekend. I don't think it will reach where the sections are now stacked, though. 


    Title: Reading Station
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on November 02, 2013, 22:14:40


    Using modern building materials and methods it should be possible to devise standard designs for platform canopies and even overall roofs that are cost-effective to build and maintain at busy stations. Much of the old Southern Region and the Great Western nearer Paddington has kept the Victorian originals.

    Perhaps the straw sucking, smock wearing country folk who insist on catching trains outside of Zone 6 are considered to be content to wait in the wind and the rain, like the cattle in the fields.

    It is a disgrace that the new Reading General, after a spend of ^850M will still have most of its platforms wind- and rain-swept, when its trains  will largely be electrically driven.

    Go to Leeds City and see how a Yorkshireman builds a new station!

    OTC

    The canopies at Reading are an exact match to the platform width, so every section is custom-made. I imagine that the smaller ones, that do not reach the platform edge, are made of standard parts. I expect the ones at Wokingham will be like that.

    What these new designs have in common is that they slope upwards, rather than downwards, towards the trains. That lets in more light, and more rain too. And the shape also catches the wind and directs it onto the passengers. Now that does not seem terribly clever, for use in Britain.

    I fear we are seeing the result of the architect's very visual sensibility  - to do with light and space, and why we have glass walls everywhere - overruling past experience. In the past we had what railwaymen and local builders had worked out over the years They were usually also countrymen used to working outside all year and knowing how to protect people - and cattle.

    The main reason that the platform canopies slope upwards at the platform edges is to give electrical clearance for the 25kV overhead electrification when it arrives. The architects have then tried to make the canopy visually appealing. There has to be sufficient clearance between the ends of the pantographs and anything which is earthed under worst case conditions - in days gone by canopies were often cut back so they didn't reach the edge of the platform or simply removed completely.

    Because of effects like these, I sometimes wonder why overhead electrification of railways is seen to be so wonderful...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 03, 2013, 09:29:30
    As I came into the station tonight, one of Ainscough's yellow beasties was settling in between the car park and platform 15. Should reach P10 OK, so it could be the canopy that's being taken for a joyride the weekend. I don't think it will reach where the sections are now stacked, though. 

    Whatever it was doing, it wasn't lifting canopies as they remain in north yard.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 03, 2013, 09:37:07
    I think it would have to be one of their larger models, with the extension pieces, to move those panels.  Alternatively they could give them a platform ticket and they could take the same route as the P8/9 panels - through the ticket barriers.


    Title: Reading Station
    Post by: stuving on November 03, 2013, 15:43:46
    The main reason that the platform canopies slope upwards at the platform edges is to give electrical clearance for the 25kV overhead electrification when it arrives. The architects have then tried to make the canopy visually appealing. There has to be sufficient clearance between the ends of the pantographs and anything which is earthed under worst case conditions - in days gone by canopies were often cut back so they didn't reach the edge of the platform or simply removed completely.

    The picture below is of Reading station design* and shows a sectional view of a train at platform 15. It's an architect's drawing, but the design obviously had to be based on accurate train and OHLE dimensions. The pantograph is shown at operating height, touching the contact wire. So I don't think the clearance from the canopy was an issue in choosing the canopy height.

    Fitting in the OHLE supports and various other bits and pieces is always going to mean a lot of hacking off parts of an existing canopy, and there will be some cases where the edge has to be cut back. So I suspect that explanation has got generalised into a bit of an urban - or railway - myth.

    (*See RBC planning submission 12/0577 - File 267231 "Proposed Elevations Sections 7.1 and 8.1 and 10.1".)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on November 03, 2013, 16:50:12
    The Platform No.7 new supporting wall seems to have progressed very well over the past few weeks:
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/10643597435/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/10643632706/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/10643840093/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/10643839863/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station
    Post by: Electric train on November 03, 2013, 18:41:48
    The main reason that the platform canopies slope upwards at the platform edges is to give electrical clearance for the 25kV overhead electrification when it arrives. The architects have then tried to make the canopy visually appealing. There has to be sufficient clearance between the ends of the pantographs and anything which is earthed under worst case conditions - in days gone by canopies were often cut back so they didn't reach the edge of the platform or simply removed completely.

    The picture below is of Reading station design* and shows a sectional view of a train at platform 15. It's an architect's drawing, but the design obviously had to be based on accurate train and OHLE dimensions. The pantograph is shown at operating height, touching the contact wire. So I don't think the clearance from the canopy was an issue in choosing the canopy height.

    Fitting in the OHLE supports and various other bits and pieces is always going to mean a lot of hacking off parts of an existing canopy, and there will be some cases where the edge has to be cut back. So I suspect that explanation has got generalised into a bit of an urban - or railway - myth.

    (*See RBC planning submission 12/0577 - File 267231 "Proposed Elevations Sections 7.1 and 8.1 and 10.1".)

    Electrical clearances for OLE to structures are actually quite small, the minimum safety distance for staff and public is 2.75 meters which is taken usually from the nearest component that has live parts e.g. the base of an insulator to typical top of head height, where it is unavoidable to have OLE support arms over platforms the parts over the platforms must be earthed that's not live parts over the platform no matter how high they are.

    The normal electrical clearance to structures is 600mm this can in special circumstance go down 200mm and on some very rare occurrences 150mm.

    The clearance is not just from the wire or OLE fittings it is from the edge of the pantograph where the cant of the rail has to be taken into account there is also a difference if the clearance is a passing clearance or a static clearance.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 04, 2013, 14:11:09
    As I came into the station tonight, one of Ainscough's yellow beasties was settling in between the car park and platform 15. Should reach P10 OK, so it could be the canopy that's being taken for a joyride the weekend. I don't think it will reach where the sections are now stacked, though. 

    Whatever it was doing, it wasn't lifting canopies as they remain in north yard.

    I think you may have been incorrect in assuming that the stockpile adjacent to the north entrance was the next batch to be fitted, because 8 canopy sections have appeared on P10/11 over the weekend...

    Edited to add pic of a couple of the new sections, they are not in a continuous length.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 04, 2013, 14:32:02
    And finally ... I see they haven't plucked up courage to deal with that yellow mushroom. Do you think it's going to be immured for eternity along with the old track? I hope it's reliable...

    I think stuving was getting a bit worried about the position of the above mushroom so I'm pleased to report it is safe now...   ;D

    The picture also shows a pretty secure looking fence along the edge of the P7 blockwork, which I suggest allows for work to proceed more normally alongside normal train movements?

    The second picture shows the blockwork progressing at the country end of P10,  with the foundation strip completed up to the existing 'square end' of P11.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on November 04, 2013, 16:06:34
    Talking of illumination, does anyone know if that's the reason for that gargantuan fence that's being fitted at the new depot ?

    My understanding (not sure how much truth in it)
    Has been erected due to noise complaints, originally residents were asked about a fence and they declined as they believed it would possibly block out sunlight, however once the depot went live in the summer and they realised how noisy turbos were especially in the morning when drivers use compressor speed up to build air, they changed there minds.

    My source has also stated that when the depot converts to majority emu operation the fence may come back down if residents want it to?

    Ah! That makes a lot of sense, thanks insider!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on November 04, 2013, 18:17:50
    The picture also shows a pretty secure looking fence along the edge of the P7 blockwork, which I suggest allows for work to proceed more normally alongside normal train movements?
    The fence sets the site up as what is sometimes called "high Street Environment" when in truth its actually a "Fenced Green Zone" either way it is as you have mentioned to allow work to continue while trains operate normally


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 04, 2013, 19:39:46
    As I came into the station tonight, one of Ainscough's yellow beasties was settling in between the car park and platform 15. Should reach P10 OK, so it could be the canopy that's being taken for a joyride the weekend. I don't think it will reach where the sections are now stacked, though. 

    Whatever it was doing, it wasn't lifting canopies as they remain in north yard.

    I think you may have been incorrect in assuming that the stockpile adjacent to the north entrance was the next batch to be fitted, because 8 canopy sections have appeared on P10/11 over the weekend...

    Moreover, if you look at the ones in the pile outside, they are quite a bit smaller and have one less stringer than the ones on P10/11. So, as the platform doesn't narrow much, if at all, they'll have to find somewhere else to put them. The only possibility now would be P7/3, though I'd have thought the taper there would be visible in the stacked sections.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 04, 2013, 21:09:20
    Moreover, if you look at the ones in the pile outside, they are quite a bit smaller and have one less stringer than the ones on P10/11. So, as the platform doesn't narrow much, if at all, they'll have to find somewhere else to put them. The only possibility now would be P7/3, though I'd have thought the taper there would be visible in the stacked sections.

    I agree that's the probable use for them, but at the same time I think the taper of the P7/3 canopy is fairly minimal, and you'd not really see it in the stacked components.  Measuring off one of the original plans I reckon it is only reducing by about 8% over the canopied length alongside P3. (That is, disregarding the end section with the skylight, which as we've previously discussed has been redesigned somewhat.) The main taper of P7/3 only starts becoming apparent west of the end of the canopy, which is comparatively short like that on P1/2. 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on November 05, 2013, 20:07:57
    I note we now have camera 6/3 which shows the old lower depot, I think.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 05, 2013, 20:49:47
    I note we now have camera 6/3 which shows the old lower depot, I think.
    Camera pointing approx. northeast. Possibly mounted close to the intersection of the RWC line and Cow Lane. On the bridge?

    Cam 01/1 is also working, at least today!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 05, 2013, 20:51:46
    I note we now have camera 6/3 which shows the old lower depot, I think.
    Yes, it must be down close to Cow Lane bridge under the west Curve - I think it's on a pole: the bridge is not that high. It's looking over where the feeder lines (aka Eastern Chord) will run and up to the box where they go under the viaduct. There's a lot to pull down first!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 05, 2013, 21:34:01


    Cam 01/1 is also working, at least today!

    Amazing!  I thought that one had been given up on. Now if only they could just swing it round to the left a bit so that we could something interesting that was being worked on...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 06, 2013, 09:24:00
    I note we now have camera 6/3 which shows the old lower depot, I think.
    Yes, it must be down close to Cow Lane bridge under the west Curve - I think it's on a pole: the bridge is not that high. It's looking over where the feeder lines (aka Eastern Chord) will run and up to the box where they go under the viaduct. There's a lot to pull down first!

    I've been trying a bit of triangulation to work out the field of view. The edges are tricky to place, given the amount that's been already taken down for access - and I hadn't realised how much of the industrial estate in the background had been rebuilt since Google's pictures were taken. I've had to assume the lens is geometrically true, and I'm starting to doubt that.

    Anyway, the feeder lines will just about reach the centreline before curving back to the right, into the box. The whole of the viaduct from there eastwards will be in view (the station is visible in the distance). The pier you can see is I think the free-end pier with one pier to its left before Cow Lane near edge of the view (maybe inside or out), and two to the right before the box. Most of the festival line viaduct should be visible. I get the camera pole to be near Cow Lane, and well away from the West Curve - probably a few metres past the closed-off access into the depot.

    Looking the this bit of the plan (e.g. on file 00263640) there is a puzzling feature: a branch off the "!NR access road" that runs north beside Cow Lane, under the two viaducts one span to the east of it, and then splays out to form a junction with ... the relief lines on their embankment? What's all that about?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 06, 2013, 10:29:52
    Cam 01/1 is also working, at least today!

    I also notice that since the site redesign, all the timelapse videos for the two sets of station cameras, '01' from the north side and '02' from the south side, have handily been condensed into two minute long videos and are now downloadable.  Very useful for someone like me who wanted to keep a record of the rebuild (and have taken many photographs of it), but want a short file to show the work at every stage.  Hopefully the depot cameras '03', and '04' will reappear in the same format sometime?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 06, 2013, 11:16:33
    ...
    a branch off the "!NR access road" that runs north beside Cow Lane, under the two viaducts one span to the east of it, and then splays out to form a junction with ... the relief lines on their embankment? What's all that about?

    I think it will be a permanent 'road rail vehicle' (RRV) access point onto the relief lines.   NR are increasing the number of 'properly engineered' heavy duty access points around the network generally. There'll be an infilled section of rail (a bit like at a level crossing) to allow the machines to orientate themselves with the track before lowering the rail wheels.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on November 06, 2013, 16:52:00
    ...
    a branch off the "!NR access road" that runs north beside Cow Lane, under the two viaducts one span to the east of it, and then splays out to form a junction with ... the relief lines on their embankment? What's all that about?

    I think it will be a permanent 'road rail vehicle' (RRV) access point onto the relief lines.   NR are increasing the number of 'properly engineered' heavy duty access points around the network generally. There'll be an infilled section of rail (a bit like at a level crossing) to allow the machines to orientate themselves with the track before lowering the rail wheels.

    Paul

    Yep they are called RRAP and are for RRV  ???  ::)  ??? ........ RRAP - Road Rail Access Point and RRV as Paul stated also MEWPs (Mobile elevated Work Platforms)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 06, 2013, 18:27:07
    Thanks for posting details of those technical terms, Electric train: I've now added them to our 'Acronyms & Abbreviations (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/acronyms.html)' page.  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 06, 2013, 23:19:55
    ...
    a branch off the "!NR access road" that runs north beside Cow Lane, under the two viaducts one span to the east of it, and then splays out to form a junction with ... the relief lines on their embankment? What's all that about?

    I think it will be a permanent 'road rail vehicle' (RRV) access point onto the relief lines.   NR are increasing the number of 'properly engineered' heavy duty access points around the network generally. There'll be an infilled section of rail (a bit like at a level crossing) to allow the machines to orientate themselves with the track before lowering the rail wheels.

    Paul
    In fact, if you look at that enormously long elevation drawing (file 00263637) it shows this "NETWORK RAIL
    ACCESS ROAD" going up the embankment. Not that you'd recognise it, if you didn't know what it was to start with.

    Given that there obviously more call for one now than there will be when it's built, I presume there is a less engineered access for RRVs somewhere in the viaduct site.

    On the latest plan (file 00282939) this access road runs at the foot of an embankment under the main viaduct, and this is labelled "PLATEAU FORMED AT +42.015 FOR FUTURE VIADUCT INSPECTION" (and another under the festival line viaduct at +40.300). That hardly seems a good enough reason for moving so much earth, does it? Unless it's on site anyway, and would otherwise need to be disposed of elsewhere.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on November 07, 2013, 01:20:28
    In fact, if you look at that enormously long elevation drawing

    Do I have to?

    Slightly losing the will to live wading through the technical minutiae of this thread and the ongoing Reading development.  :P

    That's not to put folk off though. What we have is an account of record of the changes to the second busiest station on the Greater Western network. I'm just beginning to wish it was finished.

    I can hear my Grandma saying, "Patience is a virtue...", and, "The best things come to those who wait".  :-\


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on November 07, 2013, 03:40:29
    In fact, if you look at that enormously long elevation drawing

    Do I have to?

    Slightly losing the will to live wading through the technical minutiae of this thread and the ongoing Reading development.  :P

    No, you don't have to. I'm pretty sure (as one of the admin team) that this thread requires no moderator intervention - though I appreciate your commitment (BNM) to read the forum thoroughly in case adverts for off-topic products, copyright breaches, privacy infringements etc are posted. I can't even see any signals to the intelligence services in this thread  ;D

    Quote
    That's not to put folk off though. What we have is an account of record of the changes to the second busiest station on the Greater Western network. I'm just beginning to wish it was finished.

    I'm sure that the folks of certain parts of Reading, and station users there, have a similar wish.

    In all seriousness, Im getting lost at certain of the detail too - but other detail is fascinating food for thought and I am learning a lot from it.  For example, I was fascinated to learn about not only gradients at flying junctions, but also the rate of change of gradients from one slope to another.   I'm sure there will be other places on the FGW main line that flyovers are seriously considered in the future, and the background knowledge / reminder that we can't go from level to 1:50 (2%) without a transition is useful when considering / discussing options, responding to consultations and helping answer questions.  And long may this thread continue, just the way it is!

    But the point that the less technical are drowning in content and minutiae in this thread is well made, and it's not the first time I have heard it. Perhaps an extra thread - Reading Station Changes - update information for users - would be a good idea.   Can I persuade anyone to start such a summary,  perhaps with an overview of what the project's about, what's done and what's to go, where we stand at present for users, and what we're going to see in the next six months, year, two years, and to project finish?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements - detail
    Post by: grahame on November 07, 2013, 09:17:13
    But the point that the less technical are drowning in content and minutiae in this thread is well made, and it's not the first time I have heard it. Perhaps an extra thread - Reading Station Changes - update information for users - would be a good idea.   Can I persuade anyone to start such a summary ...

    I have started it at
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=13159.0
    as a "hook" onto which someone who knows better than I do can post a user's update, thanks  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 08, 2013, 20:54:17
    People keep saying that the station will be finished by February 2014.  I am not sure I believe it, but they have delivered in the past.

    Is there any chance that the contractors on the Reading BC scheme by the South entrance will have made any meaningful progress by then.  From the cameras it just looks as if they are playing around rather than doing anything. 

    Whereas the ramp and steps were put up by Network rail's contractor at amazing speed, RBC's contractor seems to only work about half day a week and then only to dig and fill in the same hole over and over again.

    Does anyone know what is going on?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 08, 2013, 22:51:09
    Is there any chance that the contractors on the Reading BC scheme by the South entrance will have made any meaningful progress by then.  From the cameras it just looks as if they are playing around rather than doing anything. 
    Does anyone know what is going on?
    From my observations they have been working on the drains. That seems to have been an unplanned process which had it been thought through could have been achieved within a few days.

    I suspect there is as yet no approved plan for the steps.

    The taller lamp posts on the steps/ramp were installed ages ago. On Wed Nov 6 0030 the final luminaires were fitted and some wiring done. Since then, with the original lamps still in place, there is now no lighting on the ramps.  So what is going on there?

    PS. Blokes there this evening - watch this space!

    PPS. The originals have been removed. Perhaps the new ones are working, but the the brighness is considerably lower.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 09, 2013, 11:13:57
    Is there any chance that the contractors on the Reading BC scheme by the South entrance will have made any meaningful progress by then.  From the cameras it just looks as if they are playing around rather than doing anything. 

    I also heard a couple of potential issues similar to above but know nothing 'official'.  One was that the drains they were intended to link into were found to be totally inadequate at a late stage, so something or other had to be duplicated.   Secondly, the decision not to demolish 'Thames Tower' (the block outside the station with the mesh cover over it)  meant that the eastern end of the site had to be redesigned and various planning issues became 'stalled'.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 09, 2013, 20:28:56
    That crane is here again! Cam02/2 at 20:15


    Title: Re: Reading Station
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on November 10, 2013, 14:12:40


    Using modern building materials and methods it should be possible to devise standard designs for platform canopies and even overall roofs that are cost-effective to build and maintain at busy stations. Much of the old Southern Region and the Great Western nearer Paddington has kept the Victorian originals.

    Perhaps the straw sucking, smock wearing country folk who insist on catching trains outside of Zone 6 are considered to be content to wait in the wind and the rain, like the cattle in the fields.

    It is a disgrace that the new Reading General, after a spend of ^850M will still have most of its platforms wind- and rain-swept, when its trains  will largely be electrically driven.

    Go to Leeds City and see how a Yorkshireman builds a new station!

    OTC

    The canopies at Reading are an exact match to the platform width, so every section is custom-made. I imagine that the smaller ones, that do not reach the platform edge, are made of standard parts. I expect the ones at Wokingham will be like that.

    What these new designs have in common is that they slope upwards, rather than downwards, towards the trains. That lets in more light, and more rain too. And the shape also catches the wind and directs it onto the passengers. Now that does not seem terribly clever, for use in Britain.

    I fear we are seeing the result of the architect's very visual sensibility  - to do with light and space, and why we have glass walls everywhere - overruling past experience. In the past we had what railwaymen and local builders had worked out over the years They were usually also countrymen used to working outside all year and knowing how to protect people - and cattle.

    Reflecting a little more on the reason platform canopies now slope up at the edges rather than down I think there is more to it than it simply being due to architects' vanities.

    In my memory of the GWR canopies at Reading (and indeed of other major GW stations) the edge of the canopy protruded over the edge of the platform by several inches - I have memories of heavy rain overflowing the gutters and hitting the roofs of carriages at the platforms. If one looks at old photos of GW stations I think one can see this is the case.

    It is clear that to give electrical clearance from all possible static and dynamic positions of the horns of a pantograph (for example a stationary vehicle will lean in to the curve if stopped on canted track) the edge of such a canopy would either have to be cut back or the canopy bodily raised. In either case the protection offered will be reduced - in this sense overhead electrification is a step backwards in passenger comfort. The rest of the design follows from cost considerations: assuming the position of the outer edge is fixed then a design where the roof slopes down to the centre of the platform uses less material in the central supports than would be needed for a pitched roof. The form and detailing of the roof can then be styled as the architect wishes and the client accepts. One of the disadvantages of such a shape is, as you pointed out, is that it can be windy - I suspect that this is die to the 'venturi' shape of the roof underside and platform surface considered together. The easiest way to avoid this is to place buildings and/or screens along the length of the platform to break up the air flow.

    Clearly an overall roof would offer more protection from rain and wind than canopies on overhead electrified railways. However overall roofs are not always the answer to a maiden's prayer - they can be very cold and unpleasant places if the wind comes from certain directions and is funnelled straight through them^


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 10, 2013, 15:45:49
    From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-24888234?):

    Quote
    Reading Cow Lane closes for railway viaduct upgrades

    (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/71024000/jpg/_71024846_cowlaneviaduct.jpg)
    The completed Cow Lane viaduct will see the road widened to two lanes of traffic

    A busy route through Reading will close overnight to allow work to take place on a new railway viaduct. Cow Lane will close between 23:00 and 05:00 GMT each night from Sunday until Thursday. The same closures will also be in force from next Sunday.

    Network Rail has warned there will be some noise and light generated by the work which forms the latest phase of track improvements around Reading. The new viaduct will help remove a bottleneck on the Great Western line. The work is separate to that which saw a second bridge on Cow Lane demolished and rebuilt over Christmas 2011.

    Kevin Brown from Network Rail said: "We've got to demolish the remainder of an old bridge we started taking down earlier this year and start work on a new viaduct. The track layout to the west of Reading station is changing to take one set of track over the top of the other. That will allow more trains to use the station and make use of new platforms, as well as cutting delays as trains arrive from the west."

    Trains are set to run on the new viaduct from January 2015. During the work, Cow Lane will be closed to traffic between Cardiff Road and Portman Road roundabout.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 10, 2013, 19:28:33
    That crane is here again! Cam02/2 at 20:15
    And you can also see a canopy in flight - a greater blue-breasted one, by the look of it - at 02:00 on camera 02/2.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 11, 2013, 19:32:15
    After platform 6 was closed, there was a period when many trains had to wait for a free platform, and the platform displays were often left behind. With SWT's leaf-fall timetable that's less common, but if anything the displays are wrong more often. This evening's example is hard to fathom - the 17:22 Waterloo was sitting at P5, when the displays changed to say the next at P5 was the 17:53, and a platform change to P4 was announced (by the recorded voice). The TM immediately started telling people to ignore it, and announced over the PA that this was still the 17:22. But what triggered it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 14, 2013, 15:39:59
    I've been puzzled by last week's activity on camera 06/2: what is all that scaffolding for?
    ... Surely none of that needs full two-level scaffolding?

    If anyone questions the need for scaffolding, take a look at Cam 06/2 Nov 14 2013, 12:45.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 16, 2013, 19:48:38
    The taller lamp posts on the steps/ramp were installed ages ago. On Wed Nov 6 0030 the final luminaires were fitted and some wiring done. Since then, with the original lamps still in place, there is now no lighting on the ramps.  So what is going on there?

    PS. Blokes there this evening - watch this space!

    PPS. The originals have been removed. Perhaps the new ones are working, but the the brighness is considerably lower.

    The new lights do all work, but they are pretty dim. LEDs can't compete with the old sodium vapour lamps on lumen output, though they can be brighter if they are more directional. These ones, however, have been made to spread their light around which reduces that effect. They are actually dimmer (in lux) than the big sodium lamps over the road (like the one in front of camera 02/1) anywhere at ground level.

    As LEDs are tiny point-like sources, in theory they could give a very sharp beam cut-off in vertical angle below horizontal. That's always been the ideal for luminaire designs. In these ones the LEDS are arranged in four flat blocks tilted at different angles, which puts the lowest LEDs below the edge of the shroud and so prevents that sharp cut-off. That's why you can see some of the LEDs shining from that camera, i.e. from above horizontal, which I find disappointing. It means any potential for reducing "star-theft", however slight that might be, has been thrown away.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 16, 2013, 20:13:55
    The new lights do all work, but they are pretty dim. LEDs can't compete with the old sodium vapour lamps on lumen output, though they can be brighter if they are more directional. These ones, however, have been made to spread their light around which reduces that effect. They are actually dimmer (in lux) than the big sodium lamps over the road (like the one in front of camera 02/1) anywhere at ground level.

    As LEDs are tiny point-like sources, in theory they could give a very sharp beam cut-off in vertical angle below horizontal. That's always been the ideal for luminaire designs. In these ones the LEDS are arranged in four flat blocks tilted at different angles, which puts the lowest LEDs below the edge of the shroud and so prevents that sharp cut-off. That's why you can see some of the LEDs shining from that camera, i.e. from above horizontal, which I find disappointing. It means any potential for reducing "star-theft", however slight that might be, has been thrown away.

    It seems to me that the amount of light is perfectly adequate. If you compare the images for the 5th and 6th November what you will see is a much more even light with less glare.  Whether it is more or less Lux I don't care.  If it does the job that is all that is necessary. If you can see a little bit of direct light - presumably to get an even spread of light from only two lanterns, then I do not regard this as significant when you compare it to the dramatic reduction in reflected glare from the walls.  The overall effect is less light pollution and less energy used, without any difficulty in safety or security. Surely in this everybody wins.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 20, 2013, 09:16:52
    Now showing on camera 06/2 ... a long-boom concrete pump has just arrived on site, to fill the first part of the "box" shuttering that's in its field of view. (The bit to the left was done on Friday.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 20, 2013, 10:10:29
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.

    PS: Would that signal glimpsed at the left side of the image be "Mickey Mouse" (as noted elsewhere on this forum today), by any chance?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 20, 2013, 17:26:10
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.
    Also visible from Camera 02/2. Almost certainly OLE.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 20, 2013, 17:30:39
    From 00:01 Saturday another part of Platform 8 is opened, in addition to the area currently open, meaning that HST's will once again be able to stop with all doors opening as the useable length will then be 220 metres.  The remaining 64 metres at the Bristol end of the platform will then reopen at a later date.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 20, 2013, 17:42:57
    From 00:01 Saturday another part of Platform 8 is opened, in addition to the area currently open, meaning that HST's will once again be able to stop with all doors opening as the useable length will then be 220 metres.  The remaining 64 metres at the Bristol end of the platform will then reopen at a later date.

    When I checked a couple of days ago Realtimetrains had the P8/9 island being generally used the other way around from Monday, i.e. with most HST operated services at P8 and most XC reversals in P9.   So that suggests they'll now renew the P9 face 50% at a time?

    Am I right in thinking that some of the 64 metres that you mention includes the section alongside the points which cannot be built yet, in other words the 220 metres from the east end will be most of the length as far as the WH Smiths, with a few coping slabs missing (as before) on the remaining few metres to allow for gauge clearance as trains head over to the down main?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 20, 2013, 17:50:23
    That's right I think, Paul - regarding the 'missing' length of Platform 8.  No mention of Platform 9 in the notice I saw, but I suspect that'll be the case as well sooner or later.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on November 20, 2013, 20:21:45
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.
    Also visible from Camera 02/2. Almost certainly OLE.

    Definitely OLE.  I suspect that the rather substantial portal structure is for the termination of wire runs of which there would be several to the east of the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on November 21, 2013, 14:18:14
    From 00:01 Saturday another part of Platform 8 is opened, in addition to the area currently open, meaning that HST's will once again be able to stop with all doors opening as the useable length will then be 220 metres.  The remaining 64 metres at the Bristol end of the platform will then reopen at a later date.

    That is some good going. When I last looked it was largely complete except for the section under the transfer deck where the exposed platform edge was all metal. I was guessing that section is over the subway.
    The platform buildings on P8/P9 were starting to see some glazing earlier in the week.

    P10/P11 has most but not all of the canopy in place and the floor was being concreted in sections the other evening. There was a cement mixer running outside the south entrance around 18:00, maybe related ?
    This morning I noticed there are sleepers in place at the London end where the P10 track branches off but little else.

    P7 is quite the building site, the platform wall, edging slabs and tamped backfill is in place all the way from the eastern edge to west of the transfer deck. The rest of it is a bit of a mess with major excavations for steelwork foundations.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on November 21, 2013, 19:54:24
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.
    Also visible from Camera 02/2. Almost certainly OLE.

    Definitely OLE.  I suspect that the rather substantial portal structure is for the termination of wire runs of which there would be several to the east of the station.

    Definitely an OLE "Goal Post" structure as DP said it is terminating wire, lower cross bar for the contact wire the upper for the catenary wire, usually found at terminating platform ends or stop block ends of sidings.

    OLE structures and foundations are all in the main from a standard range called OLEMI which is "Railway Industry open source" this save time and cost of each foundation and structure having to be individually calculated and designed instead the NR Project Engineer can approve the selection for the foundation and structure based on the known Geotech and OLE loadings


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 21, 2013, 21:36:04
    Quite a bit of progress out west on the central viaduct sections today, looks like around ten or more girders have been craned in over the course of the day, there's no longer a big gap half way along anyway...   

    As seen on Webcam 06/02.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 21, 2013, 22:37:45
    Also on camera 06/2 today, there was concrete pump "giraffe" in the background - presumably at the feeder lines box.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on November 22, 2013, 00:24:15
    I hesitate to ask, but what is a concrete pump "giraffe"?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 22, 2013, 07:25:23
    I hesitate to ask, but what is a concrete pump "giraffe"?
    One of them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 22, 2013, 07:57:28
    Quite a bit of progress out west on the central viaduct sections today, looks like around ten or more girders have been craned in over the course of the day, there's no longer a big gap half way along anyway...   

    As seen on Webcam 06/02.

    Paul

    ... and today, the end span closest to camera 06/2 is being done.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 23, 2013, 19:35:09
    ... and today, the end span closest to camera 06/2 is being done.

    Another set of beams appears to have been delivered today, but I can only assume they are parked up for the day and are to go somewhere at the east end which is currently out of sight of the webcam, as there is no longer anywhere obvious to put them in the foreground, at least that I can see.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 24, 2013, 08:16:19
    Another set of beams appears to have been delivered today, but I can only assume they are parked up for the day and are to go somewhere at the east end which is currently out of sight of the webcam, as there is no longer anywhere obvious to put them in the foreground, at least that I can see.

    As I suspected they were installed somewhere over night. Must have been near to a road.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 24, 2013, 11:59:09
    Another set of beams appears to have been delivered today, but I can only assume they are parked up for the day and are to go somewhere at the east end which is currently out of sight of the webcam, as there is no longer anywhere obvious to put them in the foreground, at least that I can see.

    As I suspected they were installed somewhere over night. Must have been near to a road.

    In fact, they went at the far end of the run of spans - just visible on camera. But why that had to be done overnight ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 24, 2013, 12:09:50
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.
    Also visible from Camera 02/2. Almost certainly OLE.

    Definitely OLE.  I suspect that the rather substantial portal structure is for the termination of wire runs of which there would be several to the east of the station.

    Definitely an OLE "Goal Post" structure as DP said it is terminating wire, lower cross bar for the contact wire the upper for the catenary wire, usually found at terminating platform ends or stop block ends of sidings.

    Seen along the track, that looks right, and the upper crossbar is the same height as the other supports. But if the lower crossbar is level with the contact wires, why is it across all four running lines? I can only assume it must be temporary. Why would you do that?

    Maybe the station wiring will be hand-knitted over a long period, during short possessions, and the loose ends need to be tied off to something. Or do you need some kind of equipment - say to set or measure tension - mounted there? Then later on the HOPS train (knitting machine?) will do the line towards Twyford and the ends get joined up. Or maybe vice versa.

    Mind you, I can't envisage how you remove the crossbars and hold all the loose ends before joining them ... but of course there would be a cunning plan for that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 24, 2013, 12:53:58
    There's further OLE work planned over the Christmas Break, so perhaps the wiring at the east end of the station will be largely completed then, and that crossbar will indeed be a temporary thing to be removed when the line towards Airport Junction is done as part of the GWML electrification?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 24, 2013, 13:33:51
    Another set of beams appears to have been delivered today, but I can only assume they are parked up for the day and are to go somewhere at the east end which is currently out of sight of the webcam, as there is no longer anywhere obvious to put them in the foreground, at least that I can see.

    As I suspected they were installed somewhere over night. Must have been near to a road.

    In fact, they went at the far end of the run of spans - just visible on camera. But why that had to be done overnight ...

    If I have counted carefully - difficult at that distance - this is the last span before the one crossing Cow Lane.  If that is the case then the crane at the east end may have had to work from Cow Lane itself.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on November 24, 2013, 19:45:20
    This gantry arrangement has appeared to the East of Reading - close to the Southern underpass. Is it OLE? No-one expects that to be pretty, but this is decidedly clunky.
    Also visible from Camera 02/2. Almost certainly OLE.

    Definitely OLE.  I suspect that the rather substantial portal structure is for the termination of wire runs of which there would be several to the east of the station.

    Definitely an OLE "Goal Post" structure as DP said it is terminating wire, lower cross bar for the contact wire the upper for the catenary wire, usually found at terminating platform ends or stop block ends of sidings.

    Seen along the track, that looks right, and the upper crossbar is the same height as the other supports. But if the lower crossbar is level with the contact wires, why is it across all four running lines? I can only assume it must be temporary. Why would you do that?

    Maybe the station wiring will be hand-knitted over a long period, during short possessions, and the loose ends need to be tied off to something. Or do you need some kind of equipment - say to set or measure tension - mounted there? Then later on the HOPS train (knitting machine?) will do the line towards Twyford and the ends get joined up. Or maybe vice versa.

    Mind you, I can't envisage how you remove the crossbars and hold all the loose ends before joining them ... but of course there would be a cunning plan for that.
    There's further OLE work planned over the Christmas Break, so perhaps the wiring at the east end of the station will be largely completed then, and that crossbar will indeed be a temporary thing to be removed when the line towards Airport Junction is done as part of the GWML electrification?

    Having seen this structure in a photo that places it in better context, its not a terminating goal post neither permanent or temporary, it might be a mid tension length anchor point; the wire will have tensioning weights or tensorex units at the other end of the wire.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 25, 2013, 11:42:18
    If I have counted carefully - difficult at that distance - this is the last span before the one crossing Cow Lane.  If that is the case then the crane at the east end may have had to work from Cow Lane itself.
    This looks like span number eight counting east from the Festival Line box. It looks as though there are two more beams to be added to this span. There is one more span to go before reaching the pier immediately west of Cow Lane.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 25, 2013, 16:17:05
    Passed through the station around lunchtime, and it was immediately noticeable (due to the increased fresh air!) that the temporary white plastic sheeting had been removed from the scaffolding alongside the south side main escalator bank.

    At platform level it looks as if they are about to cast the concrete plinth that will carry the fourth of the main girders that will hold up the rest of the roof.  (Just to the left of the yellow mini-dumper in the first photo below.)

    Second picture shows progress with the block paving, although from ground level you get much more of an idea just how wide this area of the platform will be.

    Hope this is of interest.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 25, 2013, 17:09:17
    Having seen this structure in a photo that places it in better context, its not a terminating goal post neither permanent or temporary, it might be a mid tension length anchor point; the wire will have tensioning weights or tensorex units at the other end of the wire.

    Note the number of portal members on the ground, left of centre, halfway up the picture. Ready for more of the same or are these to be single?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 25, 2013, 19:24:24
    Note the number of portal members on the ground, left of centre, halfway up the picture. Ready for more of the same or are these to be single?

    If you want to see what OLE is being put up at Reading without going there, here's a rundown. This is based on observation, and by "come in pairs" I mean they usually do, though some may not have a pair yet.

    The stanchions you can see, with the ladder bracing, come in pairs and will have a top that's similarly ladder-braced and comes in shorter bits joined together. There's one visible in the second of Paul7755's pictures here: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg142457#msg142457 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg142457#msg142457). The spare pieces on the ground in my picture are probably cross-pieces for these (but you can't see how they are braced).

    In Paul's picture you can see several "twin-track cantilevers", with lattice bracing. These uprights obviously don't come in pairs.

    There are also square-section stanchions, which come in pairs, and I assume are for headspan supports. The peculiar twin crossbars are mounted on these stanchions - see picture below. (These look a bit like the portal crossbars, but have different bracing.)

    I have also seen some I-section stanchions, that do not come in pairs but seem to be in rows along the tracks. I guess they carry a feeder cable or suchlike that needs to run parallel to the track.

    Having seen this structure in a photo that places it in better context, its not a terminating goal post neither permanent or temporary, it might be a mid tension length anchor point; the wire will have tensioning weights or tensorex units at the other end of the wire.

    I take it from Electric train's turn of phrase that this twin crossbar is not a familiar piece of OLE furniture, so we are all having to guess what it might be for. I still think it looks a bit of a lash-up, and cannot see how the lower beam (at roughly contact wire height) is compatible with the contact wire, support structures, etc. We'll have to wait and see.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on November 25, 2013, 21:31:05
    Having seen this structure in a photo that places it in better context, its not a terminating goal post neither permanent or temporary, it might be a mid tension length anchor point; the wire will have tensioning weights or tensorex units at the other end of the wire.

    I take it from Electric train's turn of phrase that this twin crossbar is not a familiar piece of OLE furniture, so we are all having to guess what it might be for. I still think it looks a bit of a lash-up, and cannot see how the lower beam (at roughly contact wire height) is compatible with the contact wire, support structures, etc. We'll have to wait and see.

    I am not an OLE expert, I deal with Distribution, the GWML electrification are using a new series of OLE gone are the days of Mk3d.  The other factor is the use of the Auto Transformer feeding system (which 25kV -0- 25kV) this system has a feeder wire at -25kV which gives 50kV between contact wire and feeder wire, yet again the GWML electrification is using this differently to the WCML.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on November 25, 2013, 21:52:43
    The Great Western always did things differently....  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on November 26, 2013, 10:50:48
    Passed through the station around lunchtime, and it was immediately noticeable (due to the increased fresh air!) that the temporary white plastic sheeting had been removed from the scaffolding alongside the south side main escalator bank.

    The gift wrap is coming off for Christmas ;)
    By this morning the greater part of the scaffolding had been taken down.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 26, 2013, 12:43:28
    More visible steps forward, out to the west.

    On camera 06/3 the demolition of the lower depot has begun. I guess that stripping out has been going in inside for some time without being seen, but now brickwork is being chomped.

    And on camera 06/2 there's more concrete being pumped, this time to make the solid structure on top of a pier. The drawings refer to the cross heads and diaphragms as well as the deck slab, but these need not all be separate.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 26, 2013, 13:05:46
    And on camera 06/2 there's more concrete being pumped, this time to make the solid structure on top of a pier. The drawings refer to the cross heads and diaphragms as well as the deck slab, but these need not all be separate.

    From the trackside view the pier they are working on is an intermediate one, with the beam ends free to move on the bearing pads, so presumably they aren't joining the beams rigidly across the pier?  Do they use some sort of interlocking within/at the beam ends to stop the separate sections becoming misaligned, either side to side or up and down, IYSWIM?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 26, 2013, 13:38:21
    From the trackside view the pier they are working on is an intermediate one, with the beam ends free to move on the bearing pads, so presumably they aren't joining the beams rigidly across the pier?  Do they use some sort of interlocking within/at the beam ends to stop the separate sections becoming misaligned, either side to side or up and down, IYSWIM?

    Paul

    Going by the the drawings, there's a 60 mm movement joint running the full width and depth of the slab. There's also a "diaphragm beam" that runs crosswise, cast round the main beams, and forming the face of this joint between the beams. The deck appears to be cast on top of this and the beams, to form a single solid structure over two spans. There should also be a movement joint at the nearest pier, between the deck/diaphragm and the start of the box "lid".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 26, 2013, 18:28:26
    This looks like span number eight counting east from the Festival Line box. It looks as though there are two more beams to be added to this span. There is one more span to go before reaching the pier immediately west of Cow Lane.
    Looks as though the last two? beams of the eigth span were lifted into place last night.

    Press release from Network Rail:-

    "Reading viaduct reaches key milestone.
    The construction of a new 2km viaduct in Reading has reached a key milestone after the first pre-cast concrete beams, which will form the base that trains will run on, were lifted into place."

    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/News-Releases/Reading-viaduct-reaches-key-milestone-1f1c.aspx


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 26, 2013, 18:51:00
    What an odd explanation of progress.  We know the 'first beams' were installed about 6 weeks ago.  Perhaps they've been keeping it secret from their PR department...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 27, 2013, 19:45:22
    From the trackside view the pier they are working on is an intermediate one, with the beam ends free to move on the bearing pads, so presumably they aren't joining the beams rigidly across the pier?  Do they use some sort of interlocking within/at the beam ends to stop the separate sections becoming misaligned, either side to side or up and down, IYSWIM?

    Going by the the drawings, there's a 60 mm movement joint running the full width and depth of the slab. There's also a "diaphragm beam" that runs crosswise, cast round the main beams, and forming the face of this joint between the beams. The deck appears to be cast on top of this and the beams, to form a single solid structure over two spans. There should also be a movement joint at the nearest pier, between the deck/diaphragm and the start of the box "lid".

    If you look in 06/02 today you will clearly see the reinforcement for the transverse beam that will tie all the longitudinal beams together.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 27, 2013, 19:48:26

    If you look in 06/02 today you will clearly see the reinforcement for the transverse beam that will tie all the longitudinal beams together.   

    Aye.   Definitely looks as if I should pause for 24 hours before going into print with my questions...  ::)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on November 28, 2013, 09:09:17
    Has Lobstervision changed the login usernames and passwords? I can't login with either the nrreading0x username and password or the nrreading0x# on the URL which used to bypass the password challenge.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 28, 2013, 10:43:40
    Has Lobstervision changed the login usernames and passwords? I can't login with either the nrreading0x username and password or the nrreading0x# on the URL which used to bypass the password challenge.

    I made the big mistake yesterday of emailing the NR PR department and quoting the webcams as evidence that his recent news about the viaduct was about 6 weeks late.   The worrying thing is he might have ordered? the webcams to be made private.

    Apologies to all if that's caused the loss the webcams permanently - although not much is going on in the station nowadays the viaduct cams were quite interesting...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 28, 2013, 11:51:48
    I made the big mistake yesterday of emailing the NR PR department.......

    Grrrrrrrr !!!!!!

    Could you not email them again and tell them that by taking the cameras into password use only, they have created a wave of anger on numerous public web forums. Thus damaging NR's public image.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: FellowTraveller on November 28, 2013, 16:05:41
    Yup, I'm "a wave of anger".

    Suspect switching off access to the webcams is a predictable response if the NR PR bod felt they were (effectively) being told that they were an idiot (by pointing out their inaccuracy). Whoops! (I'm sure everyone forgives you Paul.)

    A great shame to lose the viaduct webcams though. Fascinating to see the construction close up.

    Perhaps NR might restore viewing if sufficient people contact them? (How...?)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 28, 2013, 17:32:43

    I made the big mistake yesterday of emailing the NR PR department and quoting the webcams as evidence that his recent news about the viaduct was about 6 weeks late.   The worrying thing is he might have ordered? the webcams to be made private.

    Apologies to all if that's caused the loss the webcams permanently - although not much is going on in the station nowadays the viaduct cams were quite interesting...

    Paul


    Oh dear, that's very unfortunate as they were very interesting.

    Could perhaps be just a coincidence, but as suggested, perhaps we should contact their PR dept. to request a re-instatement.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 28, 2013, 17:46:18
    Perhaps IndustryInsider has an idea what to do about this.  It was he who announced we had permission to view the webcams back in May last year, in post #680 of this thread:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg112179#msg112179

    I hadn't actually thought for one moment we weren't supposed to be viewing the webcams, based on the above.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on November 28, 2013, 18:04:47
    I don't blame NR. If they give an interested user group permission to view the images and are rewarded with a rather snarky and unnecessary email based on the pictures seen then I can fully understand the instant removal of the privilege.

    It's a real shame though. I was following with great interest.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 28, 2013, 18:08:47
    That isn't what happened. 

    I first sent a perfectly civil email suggesting that his press release had a minor error.  He then replied very quickly stating I was wrong, the piers had been installed a couple of months back, but the beams were definitely only just starting.  He could have checked his facts first.

    It was only then that I told him he was very much mistaken; and he has now corrected the press release...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 28, 2013, 18:14:07
    Perhaps IndustryInsider has an idea what to do about this.  It was he who announced we had permission to view the webcams back in May last year, in post #680 of this thread:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg112179#msg112179

    I hadn't actually thought for one moment we weren't supposed to be viewing the webcams, based on the above.

    Paul

    Let's hope that perhaps he can, with a caveat about private use etc. etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 28, 2013, 23:24:29
    Sorry Paul. You must feel like a right chump?

    My "wave of anger" comment was meant to be light hearted, but the sentiment behind it was the thought that what PR people don't like is to find they are inadvertently putting out bad PR. Unfortunately I shouldn't imagine there's enough people bothered about this to make any difference, even they could make their disappointment known to the right people.

    Have you since contacted this person to ask about the webcams?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on November 29, 2013, 09:58:08
    Perhaps IndustryInsider has an idea what to do about this.

    II to the rescue...  :D

    Though in truth I haven't had to do anything, but the old passwords still work if you visit www.lobstervision.tv (http://www.lobstervision.tv), then click on the 'old lobstervision' link.  They seem to have stopped updating recently though, so on second thoughts that might not be much use...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 29, 2013, 12:12:56
    Have you since contacted this person to ask about the webcams?

    I didn't think that would be a good idea...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 29, 2013, 12:36:10
    Perhaps IndustryInsider has an idea what to do about this.

    II to the rescue...  :D

    Though in truth I haven't had to do anything, but the old passwords still work if you visit www.lobstervision.tv (http://www.lobstervision.tv), then click on the 'old lobstervision' link.  They seem to have stopped updating recently though, so on second thoughts that might not be much use...

    Thank you for that. But with that link, I don't get their home page, but straight into the nrreading06 cameras - live. At least they are the most active ones at the moment, and otherwise not observable.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 29, 2013, 13:34:43
    Perhaps IndustryInsider has an idea what to do about this.
    II to the rescue...  :D
    Though in truth I haven't had to do anything, but the old passwords still work if you visit www.lobstervision.tv (http://www.lobstervision.tv), then click on the 'old lobstervision' link.  They seem to have stopped updating recently though, so on second thoughts that might not be much use...
    Thank you for that. But with that link, I don't get their home page, but straight into the nrreading06 cameras - live. At least they are the most active ones at the moment, and otherwise not observable.
    You are indeed most fortunate. I have not had such good luck.
    This may be a quirk of your browser, as a few times when it was working I seemed to be able to view the cameras without having had to log on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: FellowTraveller on November 29, 2013, 14:31:04

    You are indeed most fortunate. I have not had such good luck.
    This may be a quirk of your browser, as a few times when it was working I seemed to be able to view the cameras without having had to log on.


    Bizarrely, I am still able to access the Viaduct set of webcams (in my Safari Browser in Mac OS X 10.9) without logging in as described by Ironstone11.

    This still works when I've closed the window and then reopen later in the day.

    However if I try to login in to lobstervision in Firefox I just get a message saying "incorrect username or password".

    This suggest that some settings are cached. The question is will I lose these cached settings if I quit the browser or restart the iMac! I'll resist either of these situations for as long as possible!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on November 29, 2013, 16:27:20
    You are indeed most fortunate. I have not had such good luck.
    This may be a quirk of your browser, as a few times when it was working I seemed to be able to view the cameras without having had to log on.
    Bizarrely, I am still able to access the Viaduct set of webcams (in my Safari Browser in Mac OS X 10.9) without logging in as described by Ironstone11.
    This still works when I've closed the window and then reopen later in the day.
    However if I try to login in to lobstervision in Firefox I just get a message saying "incorrect username or password".
    This suggest that some settings are cached. The question is will I lose these cached settings if I quit the browser or restart the iMac! I'll resist either of these situations for as long as possible!
    I think this may happen when you don't explicitly log out. The state of login or logout is possibly held in cookies. Unfortunately some cookies expire after a preset time. So it is probably this timeout which will end your ability to view the 06 site. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 29, 2013, 20:31:54
    One point of progress I saw yesterday - the retaining wall between platforms 9 and 10 is finished (at last). Or is there another word for a wall so low you'd struggle to trip over it?

    Anyway, the RRVs have gone, and a bit of new ballast and sleepers are laid, but most of the old track has still to be taken up and replaced. The next time P9 is taken out of service that I can see is over new year - does it get left until then?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 29, 2013, 20:44:59

    Anyway, the RRVs have gone, and a bit of new ballast and sleepers are laid, but most of the old track has still to be taken up and replaced. The next time P9 is taken out of service that I can see is over new year - does it get left until then?

    I think the last estimate for P10 to come into use was end of February, given in the article in the last 'station news', so there is presumably  some time to go before they desperately need to relay the track.  It should be achievable in a couple of days, having now seen the sort of timescales involved with the P7 re-lay, so New Year might be a good time to do it anyway.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 30, 2013, 19:43:30
    I think the last estimate for P10 to come into use was end of February, given in the article in the last 'station news', so there is presumably  some time to go before they desperately need to relay the track.  It should be achievable in a couple of days, having now seen the sort of timescales involved with the P7 re-lay, so New Year might be a good time to do it anyway.

    Now there's two lengths of rail on top of the old track. That seems out of sequence, even the track replacement is to be done little by little e.g. at night.

    Also, an Ainscough crane has come to roost behind the station. Since few if any of us can see the relevant camera, I though I'd show you the semi-permanent perch that's been made for these cranes. Tonight's picture in the dark is pretty rough, but the previous one shows you the heap of timber balks in all its glory. Now I'd have thought that was a bit wobbly for a big crane to sit on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 01, 2013, 12:52:22
    Those longitudinal timber baulks will only protect the surface from the wheels while the crane is manoeuvring into position, when it is working it lifts the wheels off the ground using its main outriggers, which are positioned over their own large support pads, also visible in the pics.

    Meanwhile, I've got a revised theory about the P10 track situation now. When I was at the station yesterday, towards the end of the morning, a group of workers were cleaning the ballast around the tracked section manually with forks, shovels and industrial vacuum cleaners.

    In my usual inquisitive way, I asked what they were doing.  They reckoned that the section with rails still fitted is significant, because this section was put in new in conjunction with the temporary P10 build out, and it is apparently already considered complete and is staying.  East of the 'central section', the track was the original P10 running line, cut and slewed out to meet the then new section - hence it has been completely rebuilt, because it is on a new route - remember that when the temporary arrangement was in use it had a sort of double bend across to the alignment of the old platform at the London end, and then it turned out again to meet the revised up main alignment.

    So the new sections of rail lying in the four foot at the west end might be for the east end, in which case an RRV will just pull them along into position in due course.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on December 02, 2013, 16:40:28
    Has Lobstervision changed the login usernames and passwords? I can't login with either the nrreading0x username and password or the nrreading0x# on the URL which used to bypass the password challenge.

    I used the old site and the _06 login. It gives me full (2 cameras) pictures up to October 27, a month before the e-mail mentioned.

    A big corporate like NR can't afford to be pilloried for running late, even if true.

    We need to be careful about the inside, detailed information that we receive on this forum.

    What a pity,

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 02, 2013, 16:49:05
    But public access to the webcams was implied quite early on - using them to check progress was suggested in one of the early 'Reading Station News' leaflets, published on behalf of NR (amongst others)...

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 02, 2013, 16:55:15
    Meanwhile, I've got a revised theory about the P10 track situation now. When I was at the station yesterday, towards the end of the morning, a group of workers were cleaning the ballast around the tracked section manually with forks, shovels and industrial vacuum cleaners.

    In my usual inquisitive way, I asked what they were doing.  They reckoned that the section with rails still fitted is significant, because this section was put in new in conjunction with the temporary P10 build out, and it is apparently already considered complete and is staying.  East of the 'central section', the track was the original P10 running line, cut and slewed out to meet the then new section - hence it has been completely rebuilt, because it is on a new route - remember that when the temporary arrangement was in use it had a sort of double bend across to the alignment of the old platform at the London end, and then it turned out again to meet the revised up main alignment.

    So the new sections of rail lying in the four foot at the west end might be for the east end, in which case an RRV will just pull them along into position in due course.

    Paul

    Obvious really - it's not long since we were commenting on the old track being buried and (by me anyway) forgotten. The rails have already been dragged along, and are waiting to be clipped. There seems to be a short extra length at the London end too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 02, 2013, 17:11:54
    Those longitudinal timber baulks will only protect the surface from the wheels while the crane is manoeuvring into position, when it is working it lifts the wheels off the ground using its main outriggers, which are positioned over their own large support pads, also visible in the pics.

    Exactly, but ... you need one layer of wood between the steel spreader and the uneven paving. But a stack of loose timbers must introduce extra play, to be magnified by the lever arm of the jib.

    What did it bring? Well, P10/11 canopy now goes right to the end (as a bare frame at least). I think it was missing just the end section before, wasn't it?

    This afternoon another Ainscough's Santa Claus has come - but this one's at the front. Surely this must be for part, at least, of the last "V" roof support. Its plinth is ready, and all the stuff covering where the top end bolts on has been removed.

    So if you really want to see it, you'll have to get your flask (spirits or vacuum to taste) ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 03, 2013, 08:49:07
    Surely this must be for part, at least, of the last "V" roof support. Its plinth is ready, and all the stuff covering where the top end bolts on has been removed.

    Correct, it was in situ this morning.

    I didn't see it mentioned elsewhere, a large section of the P3/P7 supports and canopy went up over the weekend.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 03, 2013, 10:56:56
    I didn't see it mentioned elsewhere, a large section of the P3/P7 supports and canopy went up over the weekend.
    Are these the canopy sections that were stacked on the north side?
    If only we had those cameras!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 03, 2013, 13:47:01
    I didn't see it mentioned elsewhere, a large section of the P3/P7 supports and canopy went up over the weekend.
    Are these the canopy sections that were stacked on the north side?
    If only we had those cameras!

    Obviously I wasn't being very observant yesterday, even with other things to catch the attention (and a train to catch).

    Those waiting sections can only go on P7, as it's the only platform left canopyless. Were there 12 of them? If so, that looks like them. As you say, we now sadly lack the means to check up on how it was done (or even count them).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 03, 2013, 14:17:54
    Those waiting sections can only go on P7, as it's the only platform left canopyless. Were there 12 of them? If so, that looks like them. As you say, we now sadly lack the means to check up on how it was done (or even count them).
    There were nine of them on Oct 27.
    Checked via the old frontend.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 03, 2013, 18:19:08
    ~18:00. Supporting elements of the P7 roof waiting to go up, laying further along the platform.
    Much of the surface is already finished in brick. This view gives an idea of the greatly increased space that will form the new P7


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 03, 2013, 20:11:19
    Given the progress reported earlier on the P3/7 canopy west of the transfer deck; I can see them easily having the bulk of P7 back in use by the New Year at the rate they're going.

    Then the short section currently occupied by the temporary platform will presumably happen much more quickly - and of course there are no platform buildings to fit out on P7, unlike the other two main islands.

    Added a couple of daytime photos of the P3/7 canopy below:

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 04, 2013, 16:00:25
    Obvious really - it's not long since we were commenting on the old track being buried and (by me anyway) forgotten. The rails have already been dragged along, and are waiting to be clipped. There seems to be a short extra length at the London end too.

    Lunchtime today saw the old and new rails about to be joined, they are just about fully clipped up on the section heading in the up direction.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 04, 2013, 18:11:44
    Another picture, from a slightly different viewpoint, of progress on the last main roof girder.

    Mr Ainscough's little crane remains outside the Three Guineas, so I assume there'll be more progress tonight.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 04, 2013, 18:22:19
    Mr Ainscough's little crane remains outside the Three Guineas, so I assume there'll be more progress tonight

    The crane looks most impressive from my vantage point with a pint ;)

    One of the supporting risers also went up last night and yet more bits waiting this evening.

    Ps apologies for my phone's lack of sense of orientation.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 04, 2013, 18:44:09
    Mr Ainscough's little crane remains outside the Three Guineas, so I assume there'll be more progress tonight

    The crane looks most impressive from my vantage point with a pint ;)

    One of the supporting risers also went up last night and yet more bits waiting this evening.

    Ps apologies for my phone's lack of sense of orientation.

    Pint of what though  :o :o :o :o  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 04, 2013, 18:46:07
    Those waiting sections can only go on P7, as it's the only platform left canopyless. Were there 12 of them? If so, that looks like them. As you say, we now sadly lack the means to check up on how it was done (or even count them).
    There were nine of them on Oct 27.
    Checked via the old frontend.
    And there still are nine of them. So we are running out of suitable places to put that many plain sections - most of the rest of P7's canopy abuts something else (the polybag skylight spanning to P3, the "heritage" station, Apex Plaza) or is sharply tapered (up by P6). I imagine the sections installed on P7 (eleven plus the end frame) were put there by a crane just outside, as those on P3 were, but could not see direct evidence of it.

    I know we already have pictures of that roof support, but here's a somewhat clearer one anyway.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 04, 2013, 19:38:43
    Those waiting sections can only go on P7, as it's the only platform left canopyless. Were there 12 of them?
    There were nine of them on Oct 27.
    And there still are nine of them. So we are running out of suitable places ...
    These will be for P7 and could go anywhere on the sloping section between the canopy above the transfer deck and the new supports running the length of the platform. I hadn't noticed before, but an unfinished canopy end is visible above the transfer deck with it's left hand end obscured by some temporary covering. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 04, 2013, 19:46:23
    These will be for P7 and could go anywhere on the sloping section between the canopy above the transfer deck and the new supports running the length of the platform. I hadn't noticed before, but an unfinished canopy end is visible above the transfer deck with it's left hand end obscured by some temporary covering. 

    It's true I'd forgotten that bit - but I expect that to be joined onto the existing sloping concourse roof, as it is over the top of the deck. There's a cross-section drawing of that bit that shows it is not a symmetrical shape like the sections in the stack - in effect it only has one free edge.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on December 05, 2013, 09:40:25
    Is there any possibility that these roof sections are going to be used in the northern forecourt area, hence their positioning?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 05, 2013, 09:56:33
    Is there any possibility that these roof sections are going to be used in the northern forecourt area, hence their positioning?

    Well, only if there is a new or extended platform somewhere there ... and it's not been made public ... so probably not. And, if for some reason they were scheduled to be made and delivered months too early for the build as it has happened, that is a sensible enough place to store them where they do not get in the way.

    My best guess at the moment is that they do go on P3/7 at the station end, and some of the sections below the top in the stack have modified edges to support the polybag skylight spanning to P1's canopy. But then I've guessed wrong before, so we'll just have to wait and see.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 05, 2013, 10:51:49
    My best guess at the moment is that they do go on P3/7 at the station end, and some of the sections below the top in the stack have modified edges to support the polybag skylight spanning to P1's canopy. But then I've guessed wrong before, so we'll just have to wait and see.

    I'd agree - and it is all that is left to do (for sections broadly symmetrical about the centre line) by a process of elimination. 

    I'd say that comparing the overall shape and the number of longitudinals protruding at the end, (that are visible on the roof sections in the stack at the north entrance - available on the old webcams), with the end view in my second photo in post #2462 above suggests they are almost certainly the same basic cross section.

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 05, 2013, 12:33:06
    I'd say that comparing the overall shape and the number of longitudinals protruding at the end, (that are visible on the roof sections in the stack at the north entrance - available on the old webcams), with the end view in my second photo in post #2462 above suggests they are almost certainly the same basic cross section.
    Yes, I agree, that does look like to most likely home for them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 06, 2013, 08:39:50
    Pint of what though  :o :o :o :o  ;D

    It was a very pleasant pale ale from the 3G's :)

    Three pictures to follow
    1. I didn't realise the P7 canopy support was going to kink out of line like that
    2. The remaining P3/P7 canopy supports are in
    3. The first piece of canopy arrived on P7 overnight


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 06, 2013, 08:45:35
    #3


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 06, 2013, 08:56:35
    1. I didn't realise the P7 canopy support was going to kink out of line like that

    Yes, I noticed that they didn't line up, and wondered how that would be dealt with. Several options with sharply curved joining pieces, cross-beams, etc. but I guess that's the simplest - though perhaps not for the fabricators.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 07, 2013, 22:51:47
    My best guess at the moment is that they do go on P3/7 at the station end, and some of the sections below the top in the stack have modified edges to support the polybag skylight spanning to P1's canopy. But then I've guessed wrong before, so we'll just have to wait and see.

    And here's a picture to show that modified edge of some of the stacked sections, to support the skylight. There are 7 such sections on the extension of P2's canopy, so logic suggests there should be 7 on P7's too. My earlier picture showing P1/2 is at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg141475#msg141475 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg141475#msg141475) for comparison.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: FellowTraveller on December 08, 2013, 04:36:56
    You are indeed most fortunate. I have not had such good luck.
    This may be a quirk of your browser, as a few times when it was working I seemed to be able to view the cameras without having had to log on.
    Bizarrely, I am still able to access the Viaduct set of webcams (in my Safari Browser in Mac OS X 10.9) without logging in as described by Ironstone11.
    This still works when I've closed the window and then reopen later in the day.
    However if I try to login in to lobstervision in Firefox I just get a message saying "incorrect username or password".
    This suggest that some settings are cached. The question is will I lose these cached settings if I quit the browser or restart the iMac! I'll resist either of these situations for as long as possible!
    I think this may happen when you don't explicitly log out. The state of login or logout is possibly held in cookies. Unfortunately some cookies expire after a preset time. So it is probably this timeout which will end your ability to view the 06 site. 

    Cookie expired.  >:(

    Can anyone provide an update on the viaduct build progress?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 09, 2013, 19:44:58
    P7 canopy assembly progress at lunchtime today in photo below.  Crane still present outside the Three Guineas.

    Over on P10 the east end rails discussed a few days back are connected up (with temporary fishplates) and clipped, more ballast has been dropped over the sleepers but it is yet to be aligned and tamped.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on December 09, 2013, 21:06:31
    You are indeed most fortunate. I have not had such good luck.
    This may be a quirk of your browser, as a few times when it was working I seemed to be able to view the cameras without having had to log on.
    Bizarrely, I am still able to access the Viaduct set of webcams (in my Safari Browser in Mac OS X 10.9) without logging in as described by Ironstone11.
    This still works when I've closed the window and then reopen later in the day.
    However if I try to login in to lobstervision in Firefox I just get a message saying "incorrect username or password".
    This suggest that some settings are cached. The question is will I lose these cached settings if I quit the browser or restart the iMac! I'll resist either of these situations for as long as possible!
    I think this may happen when you don't explicitly log out. The state of login or logout is possibly held in cookies. Unfortunately some cookies expire after a preset time. So it is probably this timeout which will end your ability to view the 06 site. 

    Cookie expired.  >:(

    Can anyone provide an update on the viaduct build progress?

    To a layman (ie me), there doesn't appear to be any startling progress. That isn't to say that it isn't, just that it's not particularly discernible.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 09, 2013, 21:13:04
    P7 canopy ...   Crane still present outside the Three Guineas.
    Presumably to complete the sloping section and perhaps a bit more on the lower horizontal section.

    I would guess that the remainder of the run towards London will be done from platform, as per P9/10.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 09, 2013, 22:16:52
    P7 canopy ...   Crane still present outside the Three Guineas.
    Presumably to complete the sloping section and perhaps a bit more on the lower horizontal section.

    I would guess that the remainder of the run towards London will be done from platform, as per P9/10.

    It wouldn't surprise me if they left that bit till they had finished the London end of the platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 09, 2013, 22:39:37
    I expect the priority items just now are:
    • Get the new P7 ready to open on 3rd January.
    • Put the main "atrium" roof on, in case it rains.
    As noted, canopies have been put up at night on platforms that are in use, so that isn't such a priority.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 10, 2013, 08:31:58
    From BBC Berkshire (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-25291280)

    Quote
    Reading's Station Hill plan set for green light
    (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/71612000/jpg/_71612608_71612602.jpg)
    The plan would see up to 300 homes built, including affordable housing

    A long-awaited plan to transform a large area near Reading railway station has been recommended for approval.

    Now in its third incarnation, the Station Hill plan would see a number of buildings demolished with shops, offices and up to 300 homes built.

    Versions of the proposal, which now includes a rooftop sports pitch, won approval in 2008 and 2011 but neither got off the ground.

    Councillors will debate the latest outline application on Wednesday.

    The first outline plan was granted in 2008 but it was called in by the Secretary of State.

    Developers Sackville Developments Reading Ltd (SDRL) subsequently withdrew the application to work up a larger scheme with reduced overall density and more public space.

    In 2011, a second outline version of the scheme was also approved but failed to get off the ground due to the economic climate.

    The latest incarnation, a joint version between SDRL, Benson Elliot and Stanhope, attracted four letters of objections and one in support.

    Fears included a lack of parking and worries that proposed skyscrapers could cause stronger winds.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 10, 2013, 09:34:34
    Presumably to complete the sloping section and perhaps a bit more on the lower horizontal section.

    Yep, there was rather more of the sloping section in place this morning. (No time for a pic thanks to the ongoing hideous delays and cancellations on the RDG-BAS line)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 11, 2013, 12:10:54
    The sloping roof section of P7 is now complete and runs smoothly into the service deck.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 11, 2013, 19:38:23
    This isn't a new picture, though not much has changed since it was taken last week.

    In it there are three stanchions on P7 that stick up through the canopy as mounting stubs. The far one lines up with an OLE support spanning right across from P14, and also with a stub on P2. The middle one also lines up with an OLE support spanning right across from P14, but there is no sign of any stub on P2. The nearest one is taller, and pretty close to the end of the tracks. It seems a reasonable guess that it should support a terminating OLE crossbar, since I'm pretty sure all the wires ought to stop before they run under the roof. There is nothing like it on P2, though, which is odd.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 12, 2013, 14:54:51
    The sloping roof section of P7 is now complete and runs smoothly into the service deck.
    Le grand crane has also departed. I wonder if the remaining sections and trimming will all be done from platform level.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 12, 2013, 17:44:52
    Feature on the BBC about the viaduct.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-25335028


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 12, 2013, 19:03:22
    The sloping roof section of P7 is now complete and runs smoothly into the service deck.
    Le grand crane has also departed. I wonder if the remaining sections and trimming will all be done from platform level.

    The most that could be done now would go about half-way along the front of the "heritage" station (earlier picture by Nosaj at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg144071#msg144071 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg144071#msg144071)), and the rest will have to wait until the other half of P7 is built. It would make sense to wait until then, and do the whole of this run in one go - it may need some rather careful handling machinery to put the canopy on so close to the old building.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 12, 2013, 19:10:10
    From BBC Berkshire (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-25344620)

    Quote
    Reading's Station Hill plans approved

    Plans for a ^500m redevelopment in Reading have been given outline planning approval.

    Developers want to build 300 apartments, shops, offices and a sports pitch on the top floor of a car park.

    Outline plans which would see the disused Friars Walk shopping centre demolished were approved by Reading Borough Council on Wednesday.

    One councillor said the development was "critical" to the town following the ^895m redevelopment of Reading Station.

    Councillor Tony Page, of Reading Borough Council, said: "You come out of one of the most modern station's in Europe and you look across at boarded shops and a vista of dereliction."

    Work to knock down existing buildings on the site and the creation of a temporary events space is expected to start in the summer.

    The redevelopment which includes five new buildings is expected to be completed between 2019 and 2024.

    It's only outline planing, but that should be enough to start demolition.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 12, 2013, 23:11:02
    . It seems a reasonable guess that it should support a terminating OLE crossbar, since I'm pretty sure all the wires ought to stop before they run under the roof. There is nothing like it on P2, though, which is odd.

    Of course any end crossbar would need to span the P1 track too, assuming a cantilevered end (like the ones over the P15 track) would not take the cable tension. So perhaps there will be a another support over by the wall.

    There is actually some evidence for this, in that some of the plans submitted for planning show what are labelled as "indicative OLE structures". (See RBC 10/01269/FUL files 00228521 or 00228518: hover the mouse over the live link (date received) to see the file number.) While "indicative" is true - there are some things shown that are obviously wrong - they do presumably give an idea what was intended. And there is something shown across the end of all three western terminating tracks.

    Most of the supports shown run straight across all the tracks, supported at each platform. Oddly, at the other end the supports extend (at a slight angle) across P4-6 too. Now why on earth would that be there? All I can suggest is that the original design, which was done before GWML electrification was decided, had passive provision for OLE on all tracks, and that is what these (far from final)  drawings show.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 13, 2013, 17:43:09
    I had a look at this OHLE stuff today, concentrating on the West end...

    I think the support you suggest might be needed 'over by the wall' of P1 may actually be going to be fitted outside that wall.  I recall some work just outside the temporary entrance gate some months ago, it looked like they were piling for something.   (I'll see if I can find it on the old webcam if it still goes back long enough...)

    Looking at the gantries over the rest of the islands, I noticed for the first time that as installed they aren't actually continuous, (although they do look it at a quick glance), the sections over P12 are also cantilevers, and do not meet (or align exactly with) those over P11.  It also looks to me from the bolted joint arrangements as if the gantries won't be continuous over the middle of the P8/9 island, so across the station there'll potentially be at least 3 or 4 discrete sections.   So north to south just west of the transfer deck they'd be 15-12, 11-9, 8-7, and a 3-1 end beam of some sort on a different alignment, then the next gantry would have the same sections spanning 15-12 and 11-9, then possibly a single 8-1 section - IYSWIM...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 13, 2013, 21:32:31
    Of course any end crossbar would need to span the P1 track too, assuming a cantilevered end (like the ones over the P15 track) would not take the cable tension. So perhaps there will be a another support over by the wall.
    There is actually some evidence for this, in that some of the plans submitted for planning show what are labelled as "indicative OLE structures". (See RBC 10/01269/FUL files 00228521 or 00228518:
    I have been wondering for some time how the ends of the OHLE were going to be terminated. I suspect that the nearest stantion in the picture shown in post #2487 is a support for the terminating portal. This looks a different design to the others with a plate on the top, which a 'normal' one does not have. The next stantion further away in picture is a normal one which I guess will be an end support for the portal above the lines serving P7 and 8.

    My guess would be that the support for the other end of the P1,2 & 3 terminator could be between the P1 track and the wall. I think there is reasonable clearance between the trains and the wall.

    Confirming Paul's observations, I notice that there are stubs through the canopy right at the ends of P1/2, P3/7 and P8/9 just beyond W H Smith. These are nearer to the transfer deck than the planning drawing suggests, but the ones already fitted on P14/15 are also nearer, although difficult to be sure.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on December 14, 2013, 00:06:02
    The canopy roof sections that have been stored outside the north entrance for such a long time, have now gone.
    They were lifted by crane onto low loaders Friday morning (between 9.00 and 10.30) and taken away. Destination unknown?

    Have they been taken round to the south side, or removed from the station site?




         


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2013, 19:58:32
    The canopy roof sections that have been stored outside the north entrance for such a long time, have now gone.
    They were lifted by crane onto low loaders Friday morning (between 9.00 and 10.30) and taken away. Destination unknown?

    Have they been taken round to the south side, or removed from the station site?

    They aren't visible on the south side, but do bear in mind that isn't part of NR's site, so they'd not expect to be able to leave stuff there.  If I were a betting man, given the time they've been sitting in the open I'd think it likely they've been taken into one of the sheds to be given a check over prior to installation.

    Paul


         


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 14, 2013, 22:59:46
    Now I would have thought being able to stand being left out in the rain was a design requirement for a canopy roof ... In this case, I'm not convinced the plan is particularly cunning.

    Anyway, I can see some logic in not extending the OLE support beams over more than two supports. Two supports gives extra rigidity over one, adding a third doesn't add any more - and means they all have to line up. Still, I'm surprised the beams are not bolted to each other over the support for extra rigidity.

    Also, with two supports of P8 and P9 there is no value in a beam between them to support nothing. But from P8 over to P3/7 and P1/2 means three supports are available, and if only two are used together (from P8 to P3/7) how do you do P1/2? Well, it's not such a wide platform, so a double cantilever might be OK. Basically, that comes down to detailed design constraints, which I certainly don't know.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 15, 2013, 17:07:12
    Remaining country end canopy panels being craned into situ today (11am)
    Also, between P1/2 and P3/7 canopy the fittings for the between canopy shroud (?) were being fitted. Could not see the should itself by the crane, which was parked next to P1 on Station Hill.

    Also, the new pedestrian tunnel under the station is closed from 1st December from 11pm to 5am - anyone know why ?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 15, 2013, 18:42:16
    Also, the new pedestrian tunnel under the station is closed from 1st December from 11pm to 5am - anyone know why ?

    That was explained as to do with craning stuff over the ramps and stairs on the south side - there was a Reading Council poster on the hoarding just by the site access door at the far west of the ramps. Possibly the crane being immediately outside the new entrance probably meant no access to the new gateline either - although the station would still be accessible via the old entrance.

    The potential closure dates were not all expected to be used according to the poster though.  Probably coincided with the recent work on the main sloping roof, plus any spare dates planned for over-runs?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 17, 2013, 14:25:51
    Just a small update on the my last post. It seemed this AM that all the metal work to handle the canopy shroud between P1/2 and P7 were in place. Every thing but the plastic covers themselves.

    Also, along P8B (the country end) the concrete pumping pipe sections have appeared again. Running from under the transit deck to (as far as I could see) along side the WHSmith on P8/9.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 17, 2013, 17:04:00
    Please find below this post a couple of pictures of the steelwork mentioned in the previous post, taken about lunchtime today.

    Other observations made today, are that the recently laid P10 track heading towards the east appears to have been aligned properly at some stage over the last few days.

    On P9 the copings and tactile strips progress a few yards each night, (just like on the P8 side of the main island they seem to be able to progress this gradually during the overnight periods while the platform is not in use), as of today they have completed from the west end as far as the first lift, so about a five car length is done already.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on December 17, 2013, 20:32:09
    Apologies if this has been answered before, but does anyone know why it appears that the platform height for 10 will be built up higher than 9...?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 17, 2013, 21:45:40
    I think the quick explanation, based on something I was told in a conversation a while ago now, was that the three 'all new' islands, which includes the fully rebuilt P10/11 as well as the obviously new islands for P12-15, were built to a certain level with respect to the new subway extension, i.e. building up from the upper surface of the subway roof you have a certain minimum ballast depth, then the normal 915 mm rail to platform edge.

    On the other hand, the P7 side and the P8/9 island had to be left just as they were, because they were not going to be rebuilt, just re-surfaced; and the work (as we can now see) has nearly all been done while leaving the platforms in normal use.   Where the P9 track passes over the subway there is a short section of 'slab track' with cast in rail fastenings, I assume because there wasn't enough depth for normal ballasted track.

    I suppose if they had decided to raise P9 to the same overall height as P10, then they'd have had to do the P8 side as well, and then perhaps the timescales for the whole job would have been significantly lengthened.

    It also seems to have been expected in the planning stages, as there are various cross sections online on the RBC planning  website that show the distinct step up from old to new build.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on December 18, 2013, 00:40:05
    Cheers Paul.

    One strange thing though - when I looked yesterday it appeared as though the tracks on 9&10 were now at the same level - previously 10 had looked higher, to match the higher platform.

    Have they added ballast to 9 recently...? Or had I been drinking..?

    I'll look again tomorrow!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 18, 2013, 09:05:54
    One strange thing though - when I looked yesterday it appeared as though the tracks on 9&10 were now at the same level - previously 10 had looked higher, to match the higher platform.

    Have they added ballast to 9 recently...? Or had I been drinking..?

    It was noted before that the height difference varies along the platforms, and is very small at the western edge of the deck (section 8.1 in the drawings).

    Presumably the new platforms are built level along their length, or perhaps with a very slight gradient, while the old ones (now 7-9) had some bigger dips and rises. The inherited P10 was the old P9, and the track there now was laid when it was temporarily built out and follows that old profile. In that case the main re-levelling of track should be to raise P10's track, away from the deck, where the platform itself has been raised.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 18, 2013, 09:12:33
    On P9 the copings and tactile strips progress a few yards each night
    Very subtle, I'd completely missed that.

    P10 is concreted at the country end now. It's impressive to me how they set these things in the current temperatures.

    Scaffolding was going up under the P7 sloping canopy section.

    As an aside there is now a very annoying chicane on the approach to the south entrance escalators. I'm guessing its ongoing enforcement of the 'no suitcases on the escalators' campaign, seemingly at the inconvenience of everyone else.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 18, 2013, 19:28:09
    P10 is concreted at the country end now. It's impressive to me how they set these things in the current temperatures.

    It in fact very mild at the moment. We don't usually worry about concrete until it gets at least below about 3 degrees.  That is when you need to start covering it up to insulate it while it sets (remembering that setting concrete is an exothermic reaction anyway). 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on December 20, 2013, 17:09:53
    Took some pics of the viaduct work today from a train. Not very good quality, but hopefully informative:

    First one shows the East box. Second shows work on the viaduct, And the last is the West Curve work.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 21, 2013, 22:16:45
    Can someone confirm what is happening over the Xmas period ?

    I think the new part of P7 comes into service, and by the looks of things today it looks doable
    P8b should complete - just some coping right at the country end to go
    P10 - that looks like a big ask. The cement base looks in situ, but no topping anywhere
    Temp P7 gets pulled down ?

    Also FGW pamphlet says there is a new junction going in - where ?

    Lastly - the old roofing by the old footbridge escalators looks in a really bad way. Very rusty, some struts had rust holes in them. I wonder if it would not just be wise (in ongoing maintenance costs) to remove it and replace with a new structure (Another bubble dome canopy). Take a look next time you pass through - it's is open to the elements and is not in a good condition


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 22, 2013, 09:28:46
    I think the new part of P7 comes into service, and by the looks of things today it looks doable
    P8b should complete - just some coping right at the country end to go
    P10 - that looks like a big ask. The cement base looks in situ, but no topping anywhere
    Temp P7 gets pulled down ?

    That's all happening as you suggest.  Platform 10 is going to reopen next March.  P6 reopens with the removal of the temporary P7 and a small amount of P8 remains shut, but not enough to affect workings with current train length.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 22, 2013, 10:05:35
    Also FGW pamphlet says there is a new junction going in - where ?

    That will almost certainly be referring to the re-signalling work in the vicinity of Reading West.  The relevant new junctions (and a crossover?) are just north of the existing Oxford Rd Jn, in the West Curve lines, and are to provide the routes to the eventual Feeder Lines when they are built. However those new facilities there won't come into use until much later in the project.

    (A separate thread was started a few weeks ago about this area of work, (despite it being within the station area rebuild project), it has also been mentioned briefly earlier on in this thread.)

    With respect to platform 8B, in addition to the reply above the proximity of the temporary crossover to the down main probably means they cannot install the full edgings anyway, as there'll be a clearance requirement as the line nears the points.  This was the reason for the shorter length of platform edge that was previously cut back beyond WH Smiths, but the currently incomplete area is slightly longer although still allowing for full length HSTs to call.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 22, 2013, 10:52:32
    Also FGW pamphlet says there is a new junction going in - where ?
    That will almost certainly be referring to the re-signalling work in the vicinity of Reading West.  The relevant new junctions (and a crossover?) are just north of the existing Oxford Rd Jn, in the West Curve lines, and are to provide the routes to the eventual Feeder Lines when they are built. However those new facilities there won't come into use until much later in the project.

    (A separate thread was started a few weeks ago about this area of work, (despite it being within the station area rebuild project), it has also been mentioned briefly earlier on in this thread.)

    "New junction" could mean either something not there before, or a renewal of the old one. According to the NCN that Paul gave a link to earlier, it's both:

    Quote
    The current routes towards Westbury Line Junction and Reading West Junction will be retained and the associated points renewed; as well as this a new facing crossover will be installed between the Up and Down Reading West Curves and a turnout on the Up West Curve and the Up Westbury.

    Of course the renewal element has no implications for the resignalling work, other than the continued spread of axle counters.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 22, 2013, 12:33:32
    Not having changed trains at Reading for the past few months I didn't realise how different (and more spacious) the old entrance had become.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/11434149685/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 22, 2013, 12:47:34
    At last, something visible is being built outside the front of the station. Sorry about the reflections in the picture, it was rather gloomy at the time, and the clarity is not great either.

    You can see the pillars than will support the top of the stairs, and what I take to be shuttering for the lower part - or perhaps it's a concrete slope already poured? I'm not sure of that, nor how the steps would be added on top.

    These are the stairs down into the ... what would you call it? It is a "sunken area" , or with a less straight face "the hole", but what is is architecturally? If there was a wall along the middle it would be a ha-ha, and if they've got the drainage wrong it may become a moat. I do think it should have a name, and no doubt the locals will give it one anyway.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 22, 2013, 12:56:26
    Not having changed trains at Reading for the past few months I didn't realise how different (and more spacious) the old entrance had become...

    The planning application drawings show that gateline is to be re-positioned, effectively it would be straightened up and moved slightly further towards P7, the space required being gained by the removal of the excess fares office.  It would be roughly in line with that pillar over by P4 shown in the linked picture.

    I think that's possibly subject to change though, because the same drawing shows the excess fares re-sited to somewhere under the transfer deck in the vicinity of the new P7 lifts - and that facility hasn't appeared yet as far as I can see.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 22, 2013, 21:25:01
    At last, something visible is being built outside the front of the station.
    Looks like a sloping cast concrete ramp.

    Interesting to see the concrete pillars which replace the originals retained after the deck was demolished and then carefully cut back to just above ground level. The remaing stubs presumably have been used as the bases of the new pillars.

    As pointed out, drainage is likely to be a nightmare. The lowest point of the steps has to be level with the entrance to the subway and the ground to the west slopes towards the steps, so if the drains don't work the subway becomes a river!

    Nowhere can I find any  plans, approved or otherwise, for this part of the steps. The current application, which I think is still outline permission, is for the area immediately to the south of the present work area.  So what plans are being used for the current work?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 23, 2013, 14:35:15
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    Weird.  Seemed only a few days ago that they'd aligned the eastern section properly...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 23, 2013, 16:21:07
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    Weird.  Seemed only a few days ago that they'd aligned the eastern section properly...

    Paul

    Track engineers move in mysterious ways  :o ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 23, 2013, 16:48:35
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    Weird.  Seemed only a few days ago that they'd aligned the eastern section properly...

    Paul

    Track engineers move in mysterious ways  :o ;D

    As soon as something looks finished they'll probably tamper with it...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 23, 2013, 17:16:00
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    Weird.  Seemed only a few days ago that they'd aligned the eastern section properly...

    Paul

    I wonder if one of them has dropped a USB stick full of bitcoins in the ballast ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 23, 2013, 19:12:59
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    More seriously, doesn't this track need to be raised to match the new platform height? The amount of lift varies, but IIRC it's 150mm in some places. Is that too much to be done by just adding ballast - could it end up to deep?

    The eastern part of the track and bed is new, but the western part has been in situ since it was in use with the old platform height.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on December 23, 2013, 20:16:03
    Regarding the drainage, I think the bottom of the steps will still be higher than the bottom end of Greyfriars Road, so presumably it will drain in that westerly direction...?

    In the interminable time that RBC spent in preparing the dug-out Station Hill area, they appeared to put a good number of chunky looking drains in...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 23, 2013, 20:22:12
    Regarding the drainage, I think the bottom of the steps will still be higher than the bottom end of Greyfriars Road, so presumably it will drain in that westerly direction...?

    In the interminable time that RBC spent in preparing the dug-out Station Hill area, they appeared to put a good number of chunky looking drains in...

    I assume that will also be the ground floor level for the new Station Hill development.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on December 23, 2013, 21:24:23
    Regarding the drainage, I think the bottom of the steps will still be higher than the bottom end of Greyfriars Road, so presumably it will drain in that westerly direction...?
    Difficult to be sure. Looking at the pictures of the construction of the existing ramp/steps I got the impression that the path may be going uphill in a westerly direction from the mouth of the subway. Those who use the subway may be able to confirm.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 24, 2013, 20:19:19
    Todays's unexpected news is that the track has been lifted through P10 again.  The eastern (newer) section still has the sleepers still in place, the older section under the transfer deck and towards the west end has been removed complete with the sleepers...

    More seriously, doesn't this track need to be raised to match the new platform height? The amount of lift varies, but IIRC it's 150mm in some places. Is that too much to be done by just adding ballast - could it end up to deep?

    The eastern part of the track and bed is new, but the western part has been in situ since it was in use with the old platform height.

    The plot thickens...   

    Just had a look at the 2014 Engineering Access statement (although it's now overtaken by the 'confirmed period possession plan') and it refers to the track through Platform 10 being relaid later on in the year, about April or May.   Now if that was the original plan, and given that the P10 completion is now assumed to have been brought forward to February, (as per the last 'station news', then this would be the obvious time to relay it properly.   A further closure after re-opening would look like bad planning...

    No idea about the maximum lift they can achieve just by using more ballast, but at a guess, might they be replacing the underlay material, is it 'Terex' or something?  Or working on the drainage?   Whatever the reason I suppose it will all become clear in due course, it might even be reinstalled in only a few days time...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 24, 2013, 22:28:03
    ... but at a guess, might they be replacing the underlay material, is it 'Terex' or something? 
    I think you mean TerramTM (other makes of geotextile products are available)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 27, 2013, 15:39:09
    ... but at a guess, might they be replacing the underlay material, is it 'Terex' or something? 
    I think you mean TerramTM (other makes of geotextile products are available)

    Yes, probably.  That's the sort of word you'd get if you memorised Ter(ramgeot)ex wrongly... 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 27, 2013, 15:52:01
    Report at lunchtime today.

    Station operating with P4/5 and P12-15 in use only.

    Majority of work taking place on P7 and P9, with the polystyrene bridges in place for level access from P7 across P8/9 as far as P10/11.

    A couple of photos below, the first one suggests that by next week the whole of the P9 edge coping might be complete. You can see that they are making progress in a few different areas, directly under the transfer deck steel sections are being bolted to the subway girder bridge to carry the new slabs, followed by a section of edging that looks complete.   Then there's a gap where machines are operating demolishing existing stuff, and then a fairly long section complete at the far London end.

    Next to P6 a significant length of the temporary P7 had already been removed completely, you can see in the photo they are working in the vicinity of the remaining 'bridge' over to P6, everything east of there including the other access 'bridge' had already been removed at around 1230.  The deck boards had been removed over the full length, it seemed they were left with the basic scaffold components to remove, so I don't see that taking too long at all now.

    The length of P7 alongside P3 looked pretty clear of materials, electrical installations were ongoing, and I'd anticipate that they'll probably arrange things so that the trains will stop at the far west end, as there is still loads of work to be done under the new 'ski jump' roof in the middle of the platform.

    Hope this is of interest.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 27, 2013, 18:32:44
    Next to P6 a significant length of the temporary P7 had already been removed completely, you can see in the photo they are working in the vicinity of the remaining 'bridge' over to P6, everything east of there including the other access 'bridge' had already been removed at around 1230.  The deck boards had been removed over the full length, it seemed they were left with the basic scaffold components to remove, so I don't see that taking too long at all now.
    This picture is from lunchtime, and later on that second bridge from P6 was gone too. As you can see, the planking was only taken off when they were ready to dismantle the scaffolding. That would give them something to walk on to carry all the bits away.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 27, 2013, 18:47:00
    Look - they're breeding! So, for all that I still think this look a bit of a lash-up, these things are really a major part of the OLE design.

    There are just the two where we had one before, next to Minnie Mouse. However, if you peer into the distance in the second picture, past the skeletal gasholder, there a whole load more of them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 27, 2013, 19:04:43
    Look - they're breeding! So, for all that I still think this look a bit of a lash-up, these things are really a major part of the OLE design.

    There are just the two where we had one before, next to Minnie Mouse. However, if you peer into the distance in the second picture, past the skeletal gasholder, there a whole load more of them.

    I think, and I not an OLE engineer, they are mid-span anchor points and / or fixed anchor points for the wire runs for the crossovers in this area.  On the Mk3 Headspan the mid-span and fixed anchor tail wires are fed through the adjacent roads to a structure (normally) in the cess, each time they fly through an adjacent road they have to have insulation cut in and the piece of wire passing through bonded to the OLE of the road its flying through ............. gets messy and prone to failure and a pain if the wire needs re-running.

    Why 2 portal booms upper one for the catenary wire the lower for the contact wire, between these 2 structures there will be a contact wire over lap


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2013, 17:42:34
    I think, and I not an OLE engineer, they are mid-span anchor points and / or fixed anchor points for the wire runs for the crossovers in this area.  On the Mk3 Headspan the mid-span and fixed anchor tail wires are fed through the adjacent roads to a structure (normally) in the cess, each time they fly through an adjacent road they have to have insulation cut in and the piece of wire passing through bonded to the OLE of the road its flying through ............. gets messy and prone to failure and a pain if the wire needs re-running.

    Why 2 portal booms upper one for the catenary wire the lower for the contact wire, between these 2 structures there will be a contact wire over lap

    In addition to the (now) two on the station side of gantry 1, I counted about nine on the other side. There's a concentration of them near Kennet Bridge, which supports the idea that they are to deal with the extra wires for crossovers.

    There must be a specific reason for having a second rigid mounting, and I can think of a few possibles. One is for simpler mid-point or end anchoring. Another is to allow a sharp change of direction of the tensioned contact wire, to get it out of the way of live stuff, which needs a significant transverse force. The last is to mount a cable tensioner - I believe there are some that go on the gantry, and do not rely on dangly weights. But, as ever, we'll see if we wait.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2013, 17:50:52
    By yesterday (Saturday) afternoon, the temporary P7 was no more. I think the scaffolding over the track at P3 was being taken down, too. At P10, the ballast had been scooped up and taken away. And there was a load of frantic (semi)final fettling on the other closed platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on December 29, 2013, 19:12:47

    In addition to the (now) two on the station side of gantry 1, I counted about nine on the other side. There's a concentration of them near Kennet Bridge, which supports the idea that they are to deal with the extra wires for crossovers.

    There must be a specific reason for having a second rigid mounting, and I can think of a few possibles. One is for simpler mid-point or end anchoring. Another is to allow a sharp change of direction of the tensioned contact wire, to get it out of the way of live stuff, which needs a significant transverse force. The last is to mount a cable tensioner - I believe there are some that go on the gantry, and do not rely on dangly weights. But, as ever, we'll see if we wait.

    I'm no expert on OHLE, but I believe that the system being installed on the GWML is designed by the Swiss company Furrer & Frey in conjunction with Network Rail.  Furrey & Frey are also responsible for the rewiring of the Great Eastern Main Line between Liverpool St and Shenfield where the original 1949 1500V DC catenary (later upgraded to 6.25kV, then 25kV AC) is being replaced. 

    This presentation by a F&F engineer summarises the work involved.  Whilst most of the original portal structures have been adapted for the rewiring some new ones have been installed. The ones pictured at the bottom of slides 18 and 25 bear more than a passing resemblance to the twin-boom portals east of Reading. I think the ones on slide 18 are located between Bethnal Green and Bow and does indeed appear to be for terminating wire runs. The one on slide 25 appears to be a mid-section portal as described earlier by Electric Train.

    http://www.cifi.it/UplDocumenti/torino12/35%20Rico%20Furrer%20%20%20Furrer%20Frey.pdf


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 29, 2013, 19:16:43
    I think, and I not an OLE engineer, they are mid-span anchor points and / or fixed anchor points for the wire runs for the crossovers in this area.  On the Mk3 Headspan the mid-span and fixed anchor tail wires are fed through the adjacent roads to a structure (normally) in the cess, each time they fly through an adjacent road they have to have insulation cut in and the piece of wire passing through bonded to the OLE of the road its flying through ............. gets messy and prone to failure and a pain if the wire needs re-running.

    Why 2 portal booms upper one for the catenary wire the lower for the contact wire, between these 2 structures there will be a contact wire over lap

    In addition to the (now) two on the station side of gantry 1, I counted about nine on the other side. There's a concentration of them near Kennet Bridge, which supports the idea that they are to deal with the extra wires for crossovers.

    There must be a specific reason for having a second rigid mounting, and I can think of a few possibles. One is for simpler mid-point or end anchoring. Another is to allow a sharp change of direction of the tensioned contact wire, to get it out of the way of live stuff, which needs a significant transverse force. The last is to mount a cable tensioner - I believe there are some that go on the gantry, and do not rely on dangly weights. But, as ever, we'll see if we wait.
    You are thinking of the "PFISTERER Tensorex" units


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 30, 2013, 09:07:50
    Two pictures from Reading yesterday on the way through

    First is platform 9 showing the small gap left in the edging before completion

    Second is the new and old temporary P7


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 30, 2013, 10:52:43
    I travelled up on a diverted WC express last Saturday (28 December 2013) and took the following photographs of the Viaduct works:

    West End
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20010.JPG?cache=0.9826582185924053)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    West Curve Box 1
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20013.JPG?cache=0.8852676262613386)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    West Curve Box 2
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20014.JPG?cache=0.6169990168418735)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    Between West and East Box 1
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20017.JPG?cache=0.2693495387211442)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    Between West and East Box 2
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20020.JPG?cache=0.41848780447617173)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    East (Feeder Lines) Box
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20040.JPG?cache=0.8161030118353665)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    East End 1
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20026.JPG?cache=0.12383060296997428)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer

    East End 2
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/29_12_2013%20029.JPG?cache=0.6573132085613906)
    Image (c)2013 SandTEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 30, 2013, 11:05:56
    This presentation by a F&F engineer summarises the work involved.
    http://www.cifi.it/UplDocumenti/torino12/35%20Rico%20Furrer%20%20%20Furrer%20Frey.pdf

    Thanks for posting that.  I just love the photograph on Page 2 of the document................. ::) :P   I'll show it to a few people at work ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 30, 2013, 11:43:23
    This presentation by a F&F engineer summarises the work involved.
    http://www.cifi.it/UplDocumenti/torino12/35%20Rico%20Furrer%20%20%20Furrer%20Frey.pdf

    Thanks for posting that.  I just love the photograph on Page 2 of the document................. ::) :P   I'll show it to a few people at work ;D

    That working practice was still quite common even as recently as the WCML electrification of the 60's even in the early 90's working from ladders installing insulators was common (a ceramic insulator is not a light weight)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on December 30, 2013, 16:19:53
    Such disregard for Elfan ap Safety. Shouldn't that chap be wearing orange?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 30, 2013, 18:04:10
    Two pictures from Reading yesterday on the way through

    First is platform 9 showing the small gap left in the edging before completion

    Second is the new and old temporary P7

    When was that picture taken? It can't be yesterday=Sunday, since the scaffolding was all gone by 15:45 Saturday (as shown).
    The "new" P7 now looks all ready for use, apart from the hoardings.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 30, 2013, 18:44:18
    I wonder if they'll eventually adjust the curvature of the track towards P7, i.e. to a smoother curve?  To me it just looks 'wrong', but I think it might have been aligned specifically to allow for the temporary platform - and the remainder of the 'proper' P7 won't go that far.

    We'll see in due course...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 30, 2013, 19:31:04
    Regarding the drainage, I think the bottom of the steps will still be higher than the bottom end of Greyfriars Road, so presumably it will drain in that westerly direction...?

    In the interminable time that RBC spent in preparing the dug-out Station Hill area, they appeared to put a good number of chunky looking drains in...
    Is that a big enough drain?

    I tried looking at an old (1900) map, but there's no spot height by the station entrance and the only nearby benchmark is on the SER station. But, remember that the railway line is almost level, and Caversham Road goes under it, and is above the river. Mind you, it's not much above the river, as you'll know if you've seen pictures of the 1894 flood.
    I assume that will also be the ground floor level for the new Station Hill development.
    There's no sign of any preparation of the raised level (between the new "hole" and the buildings) so it can be demolished. Quite the reverse, if you look at the new drains underneath it.

    The other picture shows the base of the steps in more detail. Given the lack of any foundations, presumably the upper section of the ramp will be cast onto the pillars.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on December 31, 2013, 16:22:45

    Thanks for posting that.  I just love the photograph on Page 2 of the document................. ::) :P   I'll show it to a few people at work ;D

    The picture is a still from one of the videos in the East Anglian Film Archive.  The first one covers the 1500V DC electrification from Liverpool St to Shenfield - without viewing it again, I think this is where the still came from.  Without spoiling it there's a graphic demonstration of the hazards of working on the OHLE on a steam-worked line. There's also a fascinating bit towards the end where they have to replace a portal structure at Shenfield (it was slipping down the bank) on what looks a "live" railway.

    The second video covers the extension of electrification from Shenfield to Southend. All good stuff.

    You can view both of them here:-

    http://www.eafa.org.uk/search.aspx#&&page=1&navid=&psize=10&text=electrification

    Enjoy  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 31, 2013, 16:57:53

    Thanks for posting that.  I just love the photograph on Page 2 of the document................. ::) :P   I'll show it to a few people at work ;D

    The picture is a still from one of the videos in the East Anglian Film Archive.  The first one covers the 1500V DC electrification from Liverpool St to Shenfield - without viewing it again, I think this is where the still came from.  Without spoiling it there's a graphic demonstration of the hazards of working on the OHLE on a steam-worked line. There's also a fascinating bit towards the end where they have to replace a portal structure at Shenfield (it was slipping down the bank) on what looks a "live" railway.

    The second video covers the extension of electrification from Shenfield to Southend. All good stuff.

    You can view both of them here:-

    http://www.eafa.org.uk/search.aspx#&&page=1&navid=&psize=10&text=electrification

    Enjoy  ;D

    Excellent  ;D Principles are the same just the 'elf n safety is a little different  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 31, 2013, 17:00:57
    Couple of camera snaps of the re-opened P7 taken earlier today.   They've left the scaffolding alongside the P3 platform face in position.   Also seemed to me that the scaffolding area under the main roof has stopped people realising that there's a lot of space further along, including a decent waiting room they could have been using rather than standing in the open!   I dare say temporary signage will be improved over the next few days...

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 02, 2014, 23:48:37
    I'm sure that many of you will be reassured to see the arrangements that have been made to conduct rainwater from both interrupted downpipes over P7 into the drains. This avoids the alternative route via the lining of a passenger's coat.

    You can also see (part of) the scaffolding needed to put the wiring etc. into the canopy/roof as it sweeps upwards. This is the same as was done on the other platforms, but I don't think they were done with passengers on the platform almost underneath. The edge part, which is directly over the passengers, will presumably need to be done out of hours - off cherry-pickers?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 03, 2014, 00:41:09
    I'm sure that many of you will be reassured to see the arrangements that have been made to conduct rainwater from both interrupted downpipes over P7 into the drains. This avoids the alternative route via the lining of a passenger's coat.

    Thanks for that, stuving - it made me splutter into my coffee!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 03, 2014, 18:18:26
    You can also see (part of) the scaffolding needed to put the wiring etc. into the canopy/roof as it sweeps upwards. This is the same as was done on the other platforms, but I don't think they were done with passengers on the platform almost underneath. The edge part, which is directly over the passengers, will presumably need to be done out of hours - off cherry-pickers?

    OK boss - plan B it is. Just as long as you don't want me to go out on that thing with Wally as well - you'll have to find me someone lighter to help on this one. Oh, and the site safety rules don't allow us to work up there with punters walking about underneath, do they?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 03, 2014, 18:26:52
    Regarding the drainage, I think the bottom of the steps will still be higher than the bottom end of Greyfriars Road, so presumably it will drain in that westerly direction...?

    In the interminable time that RBC spent in preparing the dug-out Station Hill area, they appeared to put a good number of chunky looking drains in...
    Is that a big enough drain?

    Now, what was that about drains having to run downhill all the way?

    [OK, I know that in reality it's probably an unfinished chamber that's filled with rainwater, and possibly nothing to do with the drains, but ...]


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 11, 2014, 17:01:13
    Went through Reading on Thursday.  Did not see much evidence of much progress since Christmas.  Is it all gooing on in the background at the moment?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on January 11, 2014, 17:04:42
    Went through Reading on Thursday.  Did not see much evidence of much progress since Christmas.  Is it all gooing on in the background at the moment?



    If the staff worked over Christmas it might be they are having time off


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 11, 2014, 19:46:49
    Went through Reading on Thursday.  Did not see much evidence of much progress since Christmas.  Is it all gooing on in the background at the moment?

    Yes, in the sense that a lot is going on behind barriers on P8/9, P10/11, and P7, and work by the tracks has to be done at weekends and nights. A couple of examples in the pictures:

    The scaffolding for P7 canopy is still growing, out of hours, into something quite monumental. It does look as if they are boarding vertically between the steps so as to be able to work with the platform open, though there are still some chinks of light visible.

    P7 itself has grown a bit, with a foundation trench dug and concreted - maybe last weekend? - and blocks laid. There's no visible concrete plant, so I don't know how that was supplied.

    And with no picture, P10 rebuild is continuing. Also, some ballast has been laid and graded in P10, though is as barely covers the subway more will be needed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 11, 2014, 20:09:41
    Another couple of photos of the P7 platform work, progress of the main wall from the other direction to stuving's pic, showing that the foundation strip has reached as far as the future 'Southern' concourse area.   

    Also a detail shot taken from P6 suggesting that there may be a cut out formed in the London end of the platform to get round the problem of those electrical boxes in the foreground.  Note the way the old track has been cut either side of the trench.

    It's the sort of work which could progress quickly tomorrow if they have another day with P7 and P8 out of use, this is what is currently suggested by the 'realtimetrains' website.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 12, 2014, 08:51:44
    P7 itself has grown a bit, with a foundation trench dug and concreted - maybe last weekend? - and blocks laid. There's no visible concrete plant, so I don't know how that was supplied.

    On past practice a temporary pipeline laid through the southern concourse would be the most likely way.  Unless you were there at the time there would be little evidence of it. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 12, 2014, 10:38:22

    On past practice a temporary pipeline laid through the southern concourse would be the most likely way.  Unless you were there at the time there would be little evidence of it. 

    Now that they've reached that far east they could also easily use the goods delivery ramp and gate alongside P4?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 13, 2014, 17:09:12
    On past practice a temporary pipeline laid through the southern concourse would be the most likely way.  Unless you were there at the time there would be little evidence of it. 

    I wonder. Based on previous examples, I'd expect to see the pipes left there, especially as the final bit was done after just a week. There's loads of space for stuff, an loads of stuff left in it, but there were no pipes.

    One of the things that is parked on P7 is a stack of sacks of dry concrete mix. You don't suppose they've been using the same technique as my neighbour's fencing contractors last year, do you? That's (1) dig hole, (2) fill with dry concrete mix, (3) top up with water, and (4) wait about 20 minutes for it to start to go off.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on January 13, 2014, 17:49:20

    To Oxford this morning from Reading, platform/track 8.

    Noticed that the West end (8B) does not have platform edgings but rather mortar fillets with stanchion bases (little ones for a guard rail) set in.

    Any explanation?

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 13, 2014, 18:09:00

    To Oxford this morning from Reading, platform/track 8.

    Noticed that the West end (8B) does not have platform edgings but rather mortar fillets with stanchion bases (little ones for a guard rail) set in.

    Any explanation?

    OTC

    It's supposedly temporary to allow for additional clearance for any trains taking the crossover to the platform 9 line.  (Temporary as in until next year sometime, when the track layout is finalised, and that crossover moves west of Caversham Rd...)

    The 'unfinished' distance is somewhat longer than before the work to raise the new platform edge started though, previously the bit with the edge copers missing was only next to WH Smith's shop.

    PS - Just had a thought that the extra length might be required for vertical clearance, I was initially thinking it was excessive compared to carriage lengths, but the problem is three dimensional isn't it...    ::)

    PPS - subsequently confirmed - the track through the west end of P8 will eventually be raised to its correct level with respect to the platform.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 14, 2014, 11:58:24
    Has anyone managed to regain access to the Lobster Vision webcams, or had any contact with NR regarding said access?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 14, 2014, 19:27:18
    I contacted NR's community relations team. After a while, I got this reply:

    "I apologise for the belated response to your query.
     
    Network Rail cannot permit public access as the camera feeds are commercially sensitive. We do however issue edits every quarter on www.networkrail.co.uk/reading
    "

    So much for its quest for "transparency"!

    I will leave others to comment. Seems like a missed opportunity to me.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 14, 2014, 22:17:44

    Network Rail cannot permit public access as the camera feeds are commercially sensitive.

    So they weren't before, then? Pah!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on January 14, 2014, 22:26:21
    The public have no right to see these images - if I recall correctly someone in Network Rail made the link available as a goodwill gesture to a group (ie us) interested in the project. I can fully understand why they decided to withdraw that right once someone was a bit too clever by half in criticising NR (albeit with some justification) based on the evidence in the photos.

    Disappointing yes, but maybe a salutary lesson for any of us who rely a bit on the goodwill of railway staff in one way or another.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on January 16, 2014, 08:19:05
    Did not see much evidence of much progress since Christmas.  Is it all gooing on in the background at the moment?

    Pretty much, from what I've seen:
    The London end of P7 is being worked on overnight(s)
    The monster scaffold on the sloping section of P7 appears complete, along with aforementioned tactical drainpipe solution
    The canopy at the country end of P7 is being fitted out - the lights were in but not on the other evening
    A lot of blockwork on the London end of P10 has been completed
    Platform buildings on P8/9 and P9/10 are still mostly framework


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 16, 2014, 12:31:49
    There are some ground investigations going on at the London end of P10/11, because they've found some unexpected voids due to some sort of buried brickwork, possibly an old building's foundations or something.

    I'd say that the platform buildings on P8/9's east end are far more advanced than those on P10/11,  but the very east end of the P8/9 island itself still has much to be done. Of course it is not necessary to enable the full operational length yet, as long as they can get an 8 car HST in position they can leave the very ends till later.

    Incidentally 'realtimetrains' is now suggesting that P10 will be back in use on Monday 10th March.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 16, 2014, 12:56:39
    Incidentally 'realtimetrains' is now suggesting that P10 will be back in use on Monday 10th March.

    Sounds about right, and it'll be a bit jolt in the arm for performance as well having the two platforms to choose from for London bound fast services.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 17, 2014, 23:11:28
    The concrete pipe's in use again this weekend, on P3. There's a bit at the end missing, plus a bit that's had its paving taken up so presumably needs realigning, but not a lot in total. The feed to the pipe is in through the gate in the side wall. I guess the end of the platform is just out of reach of a giraffe at full stretch.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 18, 2014, 20:07:08
    So, Starbucks' current little shack is only temporary - according to this layout plan that's appeared on the transfer deck. (Apologies for the low quality picture.) Those echoing wide open spaces are going to feel quite different.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 18, 2014, 20:20:44
    Incidentally 'realtimetrains' is now suggesting that P10 will be back in use on Monday 10th March.

    And the trackbed's slowly being rebuilt - the membrane's down, and a bit of ballast on it in places, but a lot more to come.

    The concrete pipe's in use again this weekend, on P3.

    That timing is looking less likely, as no-one has even starting digging any holes to put the stuff in.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 19, 2014, 11:11:20
    So, Starbucks' current little shack is only temporary - according to this layout plan that's appeared on the transfer deck. (Apologies for the low quality picture.) Those echoing wide open spaces are going to feel quite different.

    So they'll have to move the rather inadequate information screens on the side of the lift shafts, which hopefully will be an opportunity to provide better screens along the sides of the bridge.  While they're at it maybe they can put some full departure screens at the bottom of the stairs and escalators on each platform to save you having to go up and down to look for platform information.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 19, 2014, 11:19:50
    ... ...While they're at it maybe they can put some full departure screens at the bottom of the stairs and escalators on each platform to save you having to go up and down to look for platform information.

    I think there are some of these already.  There's definitely a large panel facing the bottom of the London side escalators down to P8/9 for instance, but it is on the end of the future waiting room building, in the work site, and is currently covered up out of use.   

    There is definitely a discussion point about how many departures you show on the 'listing screens' on the platforms, (rather than the 1st/2nd/3rd train displays), and whether they should show all services everywhere.  The sort of thing I mean is do you really need to list trains to Basingstoke or Gatwick in the waiting room on P14/15?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 19, 2014, 11:30:44
    The sort of thing I mean is do you really need to list trains to Basingstoke or Gatwick in the waiting room on P14/15?

    The problem is occasionally a Gatwick train will depart from platform 15 and then go via the tunnel.  Rare I agree.  One issue I have noticed is the A and B screens.  If a train is due to call at A - the screen the B end says simply "Welcome to Reading Station".  If you come down the stairs and see that it is not immediately obvious that the train is going to be at the other end of the platform.  It is also disconcerting if you are intending to catch the following train which uses the full length of the platform as there is nothing to indicate you are on the right platform.

    Meanwhile on the subject of escalators there are a number which are making louder and louder scraping noises against the sides.  I was on one the other day and I thought to begin with it was a Class 180 arriving at the platform!



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 19, 2014, 11:56:52
    Meanwhile on the subject of escalators there are a number which are making louder and louder scraping noises against the sides.  I was on one the other day and I thought to begin with it was a Class 180 arriving at the platform!

    There were similar problems when the escalators were put in. The story I heard is that, while Kone is a big, international, Finnish-owned company, its escalators are bought in from China. Not from a single Chinese supplier, either, but different bits from different places - and they don't all use the same dimensions. Hence some bits needed "persuading" to operate together.

    I just hope there isn't a serious failure with one of the two very long ones on the north side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 19, 2014, 13:36:36
    One issue I have noticed is the A and B screens.  If a train is due to call at A - the screen the B end says simply "Welcome to Reading Station". 

    That is nearly sorted out at Southampton, where for instance the P3A '3 line display' will simply state that the first train is to 'wherever' at hhmm, but the words 'This train departs from Platform 3B' replace the calling pattern in the second line of the display.  I see no obvious reason why this couldn't be done at Reading.

    However it can lead to slight problems if/when there are two trains present in a platform.  Firstly, the B end displays at Southampton are not far enough down the platforms, they are too near the front of a 4 car unit present in the A end of the platform.  Another issue is that typically in some off-peak hours you'll have a Poole departure from 3B at xx30, followed by a Brighton from 3A at xx33.  The Brighton train is now the second train from the whole platform so appears in the 2nd train slot on the display - but for people stood at the A end they seem to be confused by the Poole destination that is also appearing as 'first train'...  ISTM that in those circumstances the platform overhead displays are trying to be too clever...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 19, 2014, 15:58:37
    The sort of thing I mean is do you really need to list trains to Basingstoke or Gatwick in the waiting room on P14/15?

    One issue I have noticed is the A and B screens.  If a train is due to call at A - the screen the B end says simply "Welcome to Reading Station".  If you come down the stairs and see that it is not immediately obvious that the train is going to be at the other end of the platform.  It is also disconcerting if you are intending to catch the following train which uses the full length of the platform as there is nothing to indicate you are on the right platform.


    Exactly.  When I and Mrs GTBE went to Weymouth recently we went down the escalator to 8B (below the sign on the footbridge stating the next train was 0946 to Bournemouth) to be confronted by a sign at the bottom stating next train was 1010 to Manchester - cancelled (during the flooding at Kennington).  No mention of the 0946, which was of course way down on 8A. 

    How on earth does FGW expect the average punter to understand where their train is.  You MUST have consistent signing at the top and bottom of each escalator/ stairway.





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on January 20, 2014, 06:36:06
    For infrequent users of the Station the A and B usage must be a nightmare.

    Esp. When a train is shown to depart from a Platform without any lettering. It's not obvious or intuitive that platform 9 is an amalgam of 9a and 9b.

    And don't forget it wasn't so long at Reading that platform 4 was a different platform to 4a and 4b...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on January 21, 2014, 14:04:18
    There is a short piece with pictures of overnight work on the viaduct here:
    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/ethereal-photographs-capture-giant-concrete-6533619 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/ethereal-photographs-capture-giant-concrete-6533619)

    There is also series of pictures of the station from 1967, apologies if this is off topic for this thread:
    http://www.getreading.co.uk/lifestyle/nostalgia/pick-past-station-1967-6505457 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/lifestyle/nostalgia/pick-past-station-1967-6505457)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 21, 2014, 22:04:46
    The concrete pipe's in use again this weekend, on P3.
    That timing is looking less likely, as no-one has even starting digging any holes to put the stuff in.

    Well, the pipe has gone but the newly filled trench seems to be past the end of P7. Maybe more issues below ground here too? The close-up shows - if you peer closely - some filled trench and some exposed rebar loofah, for some reason.

    The main picture also shows a bit of new track. If that's in its final position, there will be no turnout so no track from P3 over the second bridge over Caversham Road.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 22, 2014, 12:46:13
    I've been wondering about that track for a while.  Previously we've seen track layout drawings that do show a route through the second span, but it has always seemed to me that it is a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain, for very little operational benefit.  In any case there has been plenty of new equipment positioned exactly in line with the bridge span conflicting with a possible track - and it's been there a fair while now.

    I think we may have discussed this way back in the thread, but all the extra line seems to do is allow for a train to be leaving P3 onto the down Westbury, at the same time as a train enters P7 from either the up Westbury, or from the Festival line.

    Perhaps they've decided retrospectively that the functionality provided is not essential, especially in the normal timetable?   Be good to hear the reasoning from an insider though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on January 22, 2014, 18:33:17
    I've been wondering about that track for a while.  Previously we've seen track layout drawings that do show a route through the second span, but it has always seemed to me that it is a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain, for very little operational benefit.  In any case there has been plenty of new equipment positioned exactly in line with the bridge span conflicting with a possible track - and it's been there a fair while now.

    I think we may have discussed this way back in the thread, but all the extra line seems to do is allow for a train to be leaving P3 onto the down Westbury, at the same time as a train enters P7 from either the up Westbury, or from the Festival line.

    Perhaps they've decided retrospectively that the functionality provided is not essential, especially in the normal timetable?   Be good to hear the reasoning from an insider though...

    Paul

    I'm not sure that it's a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain - it's only two point ends and about 50 yards of track. The arrangement shown in the earlier track diagrams, as you say, allows parallel operation from the Festival Line and the B&H into Platforms 7 and 3. In view of the lengths that have been taken in the overall design to reduce the number of conflicting movements it would seem perverse to skimp on a pair of turnouts which could reduce delays to not only trains using Platform 3 and 7 but, if anything is waiting on the Oxford Road Junction to Westbury Line Junction chord, it will impede operations into and out of Platforms 1 and 2 as well.

    I hope the turn outs will be installed and not skimped.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 25, 2014, 20:14:51
    J got into Reading at 16:12 this afternoon, just as a squall struck, and as usual it sprayed rain into the transfer deck. At the same time, there was a very loud noise from the roof. It was rather like a pneumatic drill down on a platform, for only a few seconds, and happened three of four times.

    In such an echoey space it's very hard to say where its source was, other than somewhere in the structure, hence hard to pin down its cause. However, as it coincided with the strongest wind gusts, I guess it must be the metal cladding vibrating. If so, it is potentially quite serious, since the forces involved can be far higher than those for which the fixings are normally designed (weight and steady wind loads) and difficult to predict. And having strips of cladding ripped off and flying about is seriously bad news.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 25, 2014, 21:41:35
    Could it have been hail we had the same guest in Taplow and it was very lound on teh windows Radio 4 weather forecast said there had been hail in the gusts


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: johoare on January 25, 2014, 21:52:43
    I was in Bisham Woods earlier and there was lots of hail so I imagine it was all the same thing. I did think I'd checked the forecast earlier too so it was a bit unexpected


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 25, 2014, 22:37:48
    Could it have been hail we had the same guest in Taplow and it was very lound on teh windows Radio 4 weather forecast said there had been hail in the gusts

    I doubt it, because I've heard hail inside tin-roofed buildings before, and it is different in an important way. Hail has no fundamental note - it is essentially white noise, altered by whatever the resonances of the building are. This did have a basic frequency to it, plus the same building resonances.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on January 25, 2014, 22:39:43
    J got into Reading at 16:12 this afternoon, just as a squall struck, and as usual it sprayed rain into the transfer deck. At the same time, there was a very loud noise from the roof. It was rather like a pneumatic drill down on a platform, for only a few seconds, and happened three of four times.

    In such an echoey space it's very hard to say where its source was, other than somewhere in the structure, hence hard to pin down its cause. However, as it coincided with the strongest wind gusts, I guess it must be the metal cladding vibrating. If so, it is potentially quite serious, since the forces involved can be far higher than those for which the fixings are normally designed (weight and steady wind loads) and difficult to predict. And having strips of cladding ripped off and flying about is seriously bad news.



    Did anything fly off? Are all the roof bits still there? Were the plastic skylights punctured?

    Did the bridge act like a junior Tacoma Narrows?

    No? Then probably the calculations were done correctly. Designers do know how to allow for gusts.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 25, 2014, 22:54:46
    Did anything fly off? Are all the roof bits still there? Were the plastic skylights punctured?

    Did the bridge act like a junior Tacoma Narrows?

    No? Then probably the calculations were done correctly. Designers do know how to allow for gusts.

    No, - if anything had been blown off you would have heard about it on the national TV news. And by "steady wind loads" I wasn't meaning to exclude gusts - just the effects of turbulence and eddy-shedding, which are not easy to design for.

    At the SW corner of the deck, the cladding looks a bit like a roller shutter. Some of it is visibly bent and has been since its installation - which gives some idea of just how flimsy it is.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 27, 2014, 16:36:06
    Couple of photos taken about lunchtime today, firstly the overall shape and size of the London end of P7 appears to be complete, with 'oversail blocks' in place along the whole track facing side.

    Over on the P8/9 island, it looks very much as though the London end of the platform will be staggered, with the P8 side relatively longer than the P9 side.   This is definitely NOT as shown in the planning drawings, which have this island the same length either side, with a basic squared off end over the whole width.   So has the design changed, and might this mean that the country end will also remain staggered, even though I've been told by site personnel a few times now that the country end details are temporary.

    About half the sleepers had been relaid alongside P10 today, it looked as though the ballast towards the west end was being checked for level, so I'd expect some progress towards track relaying later this week.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 27, 2014, 16:52:06
    Over on the P8/9 island, it looks very much as though the London end of the platform will be staggered, with the P8 side relatively longer than the P9 side.   This is definitely NOT as shown in the planning drawings, which have this island the same length either side, with a basic squared off end over the whole width.   So has the design changed, and might this mean that the country end will also remain staggered, even though I've been told by site personnel a few times now that the country end details are temporary.
    I'd always assumed that P8 would be left long at this end until the other end was finished, and then chopped back. Since that won't be until the viaduct and all the new trackwork at that end is done, it would be a fairly long-term temporary arrangement.
    Quote



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on January 31, 2014, 08:40:27
    There has been a smaller Ainscough crane in the pit outside the south entrance for the past couple of days. It's been in a retracted state both evenings that I've seen it so no clues what it's up to.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 31, 2014, 09:16:36
    There has been a smaller Ainscough crane in the pit outside the south entrance for the past couple of days. It's been in a retracted state both evenings that I've seen it so no clues what it's up to.

    They have been erecting shuttering for the rest of the steps - though none of the bits looks so very heavy. Pictured yesterday.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 04, 2014, 16:18:14
    Nothing much to see since I last passed through, but the final footprint of the slightly extended P3 is now taking shape, this is where stuving reported a concrete pour going on a couple of weeks back, in post #2578.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 04, 2014, 16:28:29
    The chaps with the yellow spray cans have been out to mark various routes of the final layout at the west end of the station, including such things as the route the track from Platform 9 leading to the down main (over the flyover) will take.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: wabbit on February 04, 2014, 17:38:43
    Lots of concrete pouring going on for bridge piers tonight. And placement of reinforcing bar and shattering for the sidewalls on the bridge spans is advancing well. Bit too dark for photos as I've just gone past.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 06, 2014, 11:46:23
    There was track through P10 this morning and the concrete pipeline was in place again along the platform.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 06, 2014, 17:32:33
    There was track through P10 this morning and the concrete pipeline was in place again along the platform.
    They were filling in most of the interior of the platform, around the upright of the signal gantry. Would that be where the ground was dodgy?
    There are some ground investigations going on at the London end of P10/11, because they've found some unexpected voids due to some sort of buried brickwork, possibly an old building's foundations or something.

    They weren't using the small pump they had before, for some reason ...

    The first picture also shows the track as initially aligned and sitting on top of the base ballast ... plus a wire that has to run over the wall at this point.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 06, 2014, 18:39:38
    The chap who explained to me about the voids under P10/11 just said they were 'right at that end' - which is probably close enough to the gantry position, give or take a few metres...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on February 16, 2014, 12:37:17
    I've been wondering about that track for a while.  Previously we've seen track layout drawings that do show a route through the second span, but it has always seemed to me that it is a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain, for very little operational benefit.  In any case there has been plenty of new equipment positioned exactly in line with the bridge span conflicting with a possible track - and it's been there a fair while now.

    I think we may have discussed this way back in the thread, but all the extra line seems to do is allow for a train to be leaving P3 onto the down Westbury, at the same time as a train enters P7 from either the up Westbury, or from the Festival line.

    Perhaps they've decided retrospectively that the functionality provided is not essential, especially in the normal timetable?   Be good to hear the reasoning from an insider though...

    Paul

    I'm not sure that it's a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain - it's only two point ends and about 50 yards of track. The arrangement shown in the earlier track diagrams, as you say, allows parallel operation from the Festival Line and the B&H into Platforms 7 and 3. In view of the lengths that have been taken in the overall design to reduce the number of conflicting movements it would seem perverse to skimp on a pair of turnouts which could reduce delays to not only trains using Platform 3 and 7 but, if anything is waiting on the Oxford Road Junction to Westbury Line Junction chord, it will impede operations into and out of Platforms 1 and 2 as well.

    I hope the turn outs will be installed and not skimped.

    I'd like to add to my post and suggest that stuving and paul7755 were correct and these turnouts won't be installed.

    I was looking through some old magazines whilst tidying up, as one does and a then a fifteen minute job lasts all morning^, and came across the February 2013 issue of Modern Railways which included an article on the work about to happen at Reading last Easter. On page 66 is the post-rebuild track layout diagram we have see before and which is expanded from top to bottom to show the tracks so it is somewhat distorted. I had assumed this was the same diagram as had been published elsewhere - also I think somewhere earlier in this thread - but it isn't the same version. It has two small changes. One is the addition of the facing turnout in the Down Relief just west of the station to join with the future Up Westbury line which runs into Platform 11. The other change is the deletion of the line crossing the second span of the Caversham Road under bridge to the Down Westbury line meaning that parallel operation from the Festival Line to Platform 7 and from the Up Westbury Line to Platform 3 will not be possible.

    Someone has worked out, I suspect, that the turnouts between the Down Relief and the Up Westbury, by offering the ability to have parallel operation between the Reliefs and the Westbury lines, outweighs the ability to have parallel operation into Platforms 3 and 7. The number of point ends remains the same, which implied the overall cost of the scheme does not change.

    A pity that the money does not stretch to an extra pair of points.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 16, 2014, 14:45:08
    Thanks for your valuable observations on the subject, 4064ReadingAbbey.  :D

    And, going slightly off-topic:

    I was looking through some old magazines whilst tidying up, as one does and then a fifteen minute job lasts all morning ^

    Oh, I do know that feeling ...  :P ::) :o


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 17, 2014, 00:01:57
    I'm not sure that it's a lot of extra S&C to provide and maintain - it's only two point ends and about 50 yards of track. The arrangement shown in the earlier track diagrams, as you say, allows parallel operation from the Festival Line and the B&H into Platforms 7 and 3. In view of the lengths that have been taken in the overall design to reduce the number of conflicting movements it would seem perverse to skimp on a pair of turnouts which could reduce delays to not only trains using Platform 3 and 7 but, if anything is waiting on the Oxford Road Junction to Westbury Line Junction chord, it will impede operations into and out of Platforms 1 and 2 as well.

    I hope the turn outs will be installed and not skimped.
    ...
    Someone has worked out, I suspect, that the turnouts between the Down Relief and the Up Westbury, by offering the ability to have parallel operation between the Reliefs and the Westbury lines, outweighs the ability to have parallel operation into Platforms 3 and 7. The number of point ends remains the same, which implied the overall cost of the scheme does not change.

    A pity that the money does not stretch to an extra pair of points.

    Of course there might be another reason - the span might need some work, for example. But in any case, conflict is not that likely. Up movements from Westbury will not usually go to P7, and if going to P1 or P2 will conflict anyway.So only P3 to Down Westbury would conflict (avoidably) with P7 to or from the Festival Line, I think. However, you may well be right to suspect point-end accountancy.

    Elsewhere, despite the weather they rigged the polybag roof over P2/3. P10 is now mostly paved, apart from the edge where the railing is still fixed. And the track looks ready. P8 and P7 are also progressing similarly.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 20, 2014, 10:11:55
    The scaffold under the sloping section of P7 has been coming down over the past couple of nights. It looks like that entire side will remain exposed to the elements.
    The floor under the P1-3 bubble roof has been marked out with white spray paint.
    As previously mentioned, the semi-permanence of the track arrangement at the country end of P8 is clear. There is a rail instead of platform edging slabs and the platform space is fully open. Some of the hoardings are down on P8/P9 as the platform buildings approach completion making it feel roomier already.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 20, 2014, 11:05:48
    Latest info I had (from discussion with a member of the workforce yesterday) was that the deadline for most 'daytime' platform building work to be complete is in about 3 weeks, with overnight snagging and detailing continuing for some weeks afterwards.

    Meanwhile P10 shows up as being in use (according to realtime trains data) from Monday March 10th.  The previous day, Sunday, P11 is also out off use - so that will potentially be a busy weekend on that island.

    The specific area where I have some doubts over sudden rapid progress occurring is the refurbishment of the existing concourse area at the head of P4-6, and the interface with the new canopy.  Installing the remaining canopy along P7 shouldn't take too long though - and I noticed yesterday they are working on the brickwork of the heritage building on the P7 side, at the height where I think they'll have to insert flashing to join to the new roof.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 24, 2014, 19:53:16
    Meanwhile P10 shows up as being in use (according to realtime trains data) from Monday March 10th.  The previous day, Sunday, P11 is also out off use - so that will potentially be a busy weekend on that island.

    And yesterday both P10 and P11 were out of use, as well as P9, and P8 except to or from the Westburys. So I was expecting something new in the trackwork from P10 and P11 Westwards - but I couldn't see anything.

    Installing the remaining canopy along P7 shouldn't take too long though - and I noticed yesterday they are working on the brickwork of the heritage building on the P7 side, at the height where I think they'll have to insert flashing to join to the new roof.

    Indeed - a canopy support kit has been delivered to P7, presumably not by big crane this time (nor for its erection). And some smaller supports have appeared along the back (or front) of the 3 Guineas.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 24, 2014, 20:10:01
    RBC's contractors have been slowly pouring concrete to form the steps down into the pedestrian pit, and have now got to the top flight. I was wondering how they had formed the smooth top of the steps, and (while it's not in the photo) I now know it's just a lot of scooping up of the surplus by (gloved) hand and then using a plasterer's trowel.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 24, 2014, 20:31:41
    RBC's contractors have been slowly pouring concrete to form the steps down into the pedestrian pit, and have now got to the top flight. I was wondering how they had formed the smooth top of the steps, and (while it's not in the photo) I now know it's just a lot of scooping up of the surplus by (gloved) hand and then using a plasterer's trowel.

    I think that smooth finish they achieve will still be hidden by the eventual surface 'slabs' as used on the already completed section that we use to reach the subway,  which (as I understand it) is actually part of the RBC project but was completed early.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 24, 2014, 22:33:20
    I think that smooth finish they achieve will still be hidden by the eventual surface 'slabs' as used on the already completed section that we use to reach the subway,  which (as I understand it) is actually part of the RBC project but was completed early.

    That's why I was surprised - I'd expected it would be (in some sense) tiled, and so would only need to be screeded level. But the way they were using their hands to shovel concrete from one step to another was really very quaint.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 25, 2014, 16:41:34
    And yesterday both P10 and P11 were out of use, as well as P9, and P8 except to or from the Westburys. So I was expecting something new in the trackwork from P10 and P11 Westwards - but I couldn't see anything.

    Thinking about this though, there have been a number of Sundays with platforms closed for reasons unconnected with track work.  In the case of P11 I'd assume any work to remove the temporary stuff (such as the steel I-beams holding up the blue hoardings) would probably take place with the platform closed to passengers. 

    A recent example I can recall would be the whole of P9 being closed a few weeks back while manhole covers were being fitted in the block paving surface, where the the relevant openings had previously been buried under what was apparently completed block paved surface.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on February 26, 2014, 09:03:21
    Indeed - a canopy support kit has been delivered to P7, presumably not by big crane this time (nor for its erection). And some smaller supports have appeared along the back (or front) of the 3 Guineas.

    Said canopy support kit was mostly in place yesterday evening. The uprights were in situ as far as the aperture into the Brunel Arcade. The horizontal beams as far as the pub.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 26, 2014, 09:47:14
    The specific area where I have some doubts over sudden rapid progress occurring is the refurbishment of the existing concourse area at the head of P4-6, and the interface with the new canopy. 

    Yesterday, as well as the main canopy support spar going up by leaps and bounds (IYSWIM), there was also a guy up a ladder examining the end of the Brunel Plaza structure. I imagine the P7 canopy has to interface here in a similar way to what happens along the G3 frontage (backage?).

    Looking at the size of the vertical members up against the 3 Guineas (which has been cut away slightly in some places), they must be there to provide rigidity not to bear any significant weight. Obviously any watertight seal can only cope with a very small amount of vertical movement, and these broad canopies balanced on a relatively narrow beam will be really quite floppy in high winds. The reinforced concrete frame of the Brunel Plaza, unlike Victorian masonry, may be able to withstand the forces involved and so perhaps take a direct attachment.

    Also last night, P3 was mostly ready, and workers were clearing debris off the rest of the station end. There's still a bit at the far end of both P3 and P7 that looks to need a bit more building work. All in all, a lot of night-shift work underway even before midnight - a sign of deadlines looming?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 28, 2014, 19:47:17
    Here's that P7 canopy beam - there's one more span still to go on the end. On the left, you can also see the steel sections attached to the side of the Brunel Plaza shell. This is supported by steel uprights along the side facing P7. (Sorry - I had a better-framed picture, but it didn't record.)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on February 28, 2014, 22:38:05

    Of course there might be another reason - the span might need some work, for example. But in any case, conflict is not that likely. Up movements from Westbury will not usually go to P7, and if going to P1 or P2 will conflict anyway.So only P3 to Down Westbury would conflict (avoidably) with P7 to or from the Festival Line, I think. However, you may well be right to suspect point-end accountancy.


    Returning to the topic of the 'missing' turnouts at the entrance to Platform 3, in spite of your argument, I still maintain that it is short-sighted not to install them. My reasoning is that Reading is a very busy node and any delays which occur there have knock-on effects which can still be felt many hundreds of miles away and several hours later.

    As I understand the published information concerning platform allocation, Platforms 3 and 7 are to be the platforms of choice for operation of the Cross-Country (XC) services, with 7 also being used for trains from London being routed towards Newbury and the West. If timekeeping is good then there will be no problems, but the layout has to be designed with the capacity to cope with out-of-course running so it must (a) allow flexibility in routing trains to minimise further delays and (b) allow the service to recover as quickly as possible. With the layout as it now is, and assuming out of course running, a XC train arriving from the Didcot direction and scheduled for Platform 7 will hold up another XC train from Bournemouth aiming for Platform 3. So this waits on the curve beside the Top Triangle Yard until it can use the common section of track. In the meantime a Basingstoke stopper is held at Reading West and behind it a mainline train from Plymouth is caught somewhere back towards Southcote Junction until the logjam clears. The new flyunder to the Up Main is now of no immediate help to this train. I'm sure there are other scenarios which will lead to conflicts in this area which could be cleared quicker if these points existed.

    The point I am trying to make is that, for all the talk of removing conflicts, the new layout has limitations in places where it easily could be more flexible. In this case we are talking about 2 turnouts and 50 metres of track and a couple of extra route indicators. In a total spend of some ^900 million I think that's penny pinching.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 28, 2014, 23:26:33
    That may be true, in terms of the cost. On the benefit side, are the services (occupied paths) on those lines so densely packed you couldn't afford any waiting? I'd be surprised if they are.

    If there enough buttons and washers in the kitty to buy a few more point ends, I'd prefer to see them used to help recovery on the Main Lines. When thing get screwed up here - especially if a train dies in a Reading platform - you need to run more trains than the usual service to catch up. A train held up here delays the one right behind, and the one behind that, and ...

    My candidate to help do that would be crossovers from P11 approaches to P12, and maybe from P9 to P10 (if one is missing). The idea is to borrow P12 for main line use, and allow platforming trains to shift up one platform without conflict. As it is, trains have to cross over to the Relief Lines too far out, creating conflicts on the Relief Lines (at least). The design of Reading (and everywhere else) is predicated on there always being spare paths on the Relief Lines - which may be true in general, but would stop being true in such a recovery situation.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 01, 2014, 23:27:27
    Work on the P7 canopy proceeds at a fair old rate. There is now a steel rail right along the face of the Three Guineas and the Brunel Plaza. Now, will that hold the ends of the main canopy sections still, or will there be a bridging strip from those to this rail?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 01, 2014, 23:59:14
    I went along by the viaduct last week, and could see that a lot has now been built. However, you couldn't say that any part of the viaduct, or any of the boxes, is nearly finished yet. Three pictures to illustrate that - sorry about the inevitable window reflections:
    • Some impressive shuttering clamped onto the beams - presumably to form the side walls and cantilevered walkways. The deck may be created at the same time, or as a previous step (as it says in the drawings).
    • More limited shuttering - to from the crossheads and diaphragms that tie the ends of the beams together.
    • At the western end, where the viaduct slopes right down - here the beams have not yet appeared.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 02, 2014, 13:24:23
    As I understand the published information concerning platform allocation, Platforms 3 and 7 are to be the platforms of choice for operation of the Cross-Country (XC) services, with 7 also being used for trains from London being routed towards Newbury and the West.

    That's one interpretation of the drawing.  However, as discussed ages ago, I was told by a NR train planner that the colour coding only denotes the 'main or majority use' of a line or platform, it is not intended to show that XC will only use P3 or P7.   There is no fundamental reason why XC cannot use P8 for routine reversals in either direction, or P11 at least for 'west to south' moves, having arrived from Didcot on the up main, and there is also no reason for the Reading terminators to stop using P13 or 14 as they do now.

    It seems to me that we need to wait and see what they actually do with the future platform allocations.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on March 02, 2014, 18:56:10
    I very carefully wrote 'platform of choice', not that XC will only use these platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 02, 2014, 20:20:19
    I very carefully wrote 'platform of choice', not that XC will only use these platforms.

    Fair enough - but that wording still implies they are the default, and therefore unless not available XC will usually use P3/7 - and I think it might be otherwise.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on March 02, 2014, 22:06:21
    Anyone know what plans there are to stop the new blank canvas they are building (aka the viaduct) from becoming graffiti heaven ? Already looks like some tags have been painted out I noticed the other day. It never ceases to amaze me how much stuff gets tagged so close the the stations, so I doubt the fact the depot is opposite for a large part of it will make any difference :(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 03, 2014, 15:23:38
    Couple of shots showing the detail of how the roof is going up adjacent to P4/5/6.   

    First picture shows how, as expected based on the planning drawings, the higher roof 'overlaps' the P4/5 canopy.

    Then, as stuving has suggested in his earlier post, the roof cassettes are bolted to a steel channel section running along the back.  In this particular area though the channel is secured directly to the old building's concrete framework, rather than being attached to separate upright steelwork, as is the case alongside the Three Guineas. 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 03, 2014, 15:27:30
    Another pic showing the wide open space available at the London end of the P8/P9 island.   Slightly surprising that there's no evidence of any provision for any seating so far, perhaps some might be fitted later - gives them another chance to re-arrange the block paving...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 05, 2014, 09:24:05
    Latest info I had (from discussion with a member of the workforce yesterday) was that the deadline for most 'daytime' platform building work to be complete is in about 3 weeks, with overnight snagging and detailing continuing for some weeks afterwards.

    Meanwhile P10 shows up as being in use (according to realtime trains data) from Monday March 10th.  The previous day, Sunday, P11 is also out off use - so that will potentially be a busy weekend on that island.

    The specific area where I have some doubts over sudden rapid progress occurring is the refurbishment of the existing concourse area at the head of P4-6, and the interface with the new canopy.  Installing the remaining canopy along P7 shouldn't take too long though - and I noticed yesterday they are working on the brickwork of the heritage building on the P7 side, at the height where I think they'll have to insert flashing to join to the new roof.

    Paul

    Did that date (the end of this week) apply to all platforms, or just P10? Well, there are certainly a lot of very busy little Bobs all over the station every night now. Can't you just feel the hot breath of that dead lion on the back of their necks?

    The canopy on P7 sits, as you can see, with its weight on the main support rail, and the smaller rail by the Three Guineas just holding its edge still. And the delivery is via a (not very big) Ainscough crane - though not, if you think about it, straight over the roof. It will have to be slewed round, and lowered into place blind.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 05, 2014, 09:36:48
    The P7 canopy along much of the length of the pub was installed overnight. It's rather more bespoke than the drop in sections that have been installed elsewhere so it's more kit than a modular build.
    [ Too bad they can't also install a few tables and a serving hatch, it would make delays much more tenable ;) ]

    The ground is being scraped out under the P2/3 bubble roof, no doubt for formal surfacing. There is a still a lot of trimming work going on around the roof itself.

    All the hoardings are now down on P8/9 with just 'CLOSED' signs on all the buildings.

    There is still canopy trimming incomplete on P10 and the P11 side remains fenced off making for a continued cosy experience on PAD bound services.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 05, 2014, 12:23:48
    Latest info I had (from discussion with a member of the workforce yesterday) was that the deadline for most 'daytime' platform building work to be complete is in about 3 weeks, with overnight snagging and detailing continuing for some weeks afterwards...
    Did that date (the end of this week) apply to all platforms, or just P10? Well, there are certainly a lot of very busy little Bobs all over the station every night now...

    I assumed in context he meant at least both of the main islands.  Just to emphasise he didn't say they'd be 100% complete, just that there'd be no significant daytime activity.   That suggests to me mostly complete, with all hoardings removed, possibly with certain areas being progressed by a night shift while services run through other platforms.  Thinking back to stuff like the retrospective fitting of manhole covers into block paved areas, where the service accesses had previously been buried - they did a lot of that on P9 during weekend closures of the platform surface at the 'B end' when it was already notionally complete.

    And of course something like 'shop fitting' in the latest buildings on P8/9 and P10 could be taking place behind closed doors, well into next week, or even the end of this month...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on March 05, 2014, 13:58:13
    Anyone know what plans there are to stop the new blank canvas they are building (aka the viaduct) from becoming graffiti heaven ? Already looks like some tags have been painted out I noticed the other day. It never ceases to amaze me how much stuff gets tagged so close the the stations, so I doubt the fact the depot is opposite for a large part of it will make any difference :(
    Passing Hitchin at the weekend I was disappointed to find that the new flyover viaduct there is already looking rather tatty with graffiti having sprung up along it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 07, 2014, 23:40:21
    Another pic showing the wide open space available at the London end of the P8/P9 island.   Slightly surprising that there's no evidence of any provision for any seating so far, perhaps some might be fitted later - gives them another chance to re-arrange the block paving...
    Paul

    They were assembling the tops of seats at the west end of P10/11 today. I didn't see the support pillars being fixed, but it you look at the other seats they are fixed through the block paving. You'll have to guess how - I'd say drill into the concrete underneath, and fix a stud with resin or cement. The blocks presumably need to be cut, or maybe core drilled, not percussion drilled.

    If you look, there are several sets of white marks where seats will go at the west end of P8/9, and some (but not enough) at the east end of P8/9.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 08, 2014, 00:11:49
    The P7 canopy along much of the length of the pub was installed overnight. It's rather more bespoke than the drop in sections that have been installed elsewhere so it's more kit than a modular build.

    And now the framework of the canopy is complete, and the crane has gone. It is now clear it runs along P7 only until it stops to turn a not-quite-right angle to become the canopy fixed to the Brunel Plaza skeleton overlapping the ends of P4-6. The bit on P7 along the Brunel Plaza face is main spars only, so presumably the rest is bolted in by hand. perhaps it was too far for that crane to reach?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 08, 2014, 23:46:06
    If you look, there are several sets of white marks where seats will go at the west end of P8/9, and some (but not enough) at the east end of P8/9.

    Here are those marks on the west end of P8/9, in line with the seats just fitted on P10/11 ...

    and here are those seats, with supports not in line with each other, or vertical come to that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 08, 2014, 23:57:47
    And now the framework of the canopy is complete, and the crane has gone. It is now clear it runs along P7 only until it stops to turn a not-quite-right angle to become the canopy fixed to the Brunel Plaza skeleton overlapping the ends of P4-6. The bit on P7 along the Brunel Plaza face is main spars only, so presumably the rest is bolted in by hand. perhaps it was too far for that crane to reach?

    For canopy-lovers everywhere, this is P7 today - the pictures may be easier to follow than yesterday's words.

    First, the overall view. The first of the hoops for the EFE skylight is in place now, but lots of cladding is still missing.
    Next, the end - presumably short cantilevered sections go on here.
    That orange thing in the compound is the cutest little crane on wheels, though it ought to be able to handle the bits to be assembled in situ. Your six year-old son would love one!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 09, 2014, 19:56:20
    An interesting telephoto lens shot of the viaduct has appeared here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mark_iliff/13034574633/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on March 10, 2014, 03:49:14
    Platform 10 at Reading Station is back in use this morning (10/03/14)!

    Should make an improvement to punctuality, especially in the morning peak


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: mjones on March 10, 2014, 09:34:28
    At last! Straight into platform 10 on time this morning, none of the crawling past the viaduct wondering if I'm going to make my connection!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Boppy on March 10, 2014, 13:33:34
    I agree.  Having 10 open will finally make a difference in regards to the London bound fast trains not having to queue up.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 10, 2014, 19:25:10
    A couple of points about P8:

    The extra length at the London end isn't just being kept as is while the other end is short - it's being finished as permanently about 30 m longer than P9-11.

    Just where some seats will go at London end (in line with some just put in on P10/11), the paving shows signs of being lifted and relaid. I guess that was to make sure it was suitable for fixing them, e.g. replacing rubble fill with concrete.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 10, 2014, 19:33:13
    Now here's a thing. Underneath the back edge of the P7 canopy, where it is fitted round the back of the 3 Guineas, there are some odd-shaped steel sections. Towards P6, they are stepped to follow the profile of the masonry band at first-floor level, so presumably are to do with weatherproofing the join. Further along toward P3, they are shaped with an extra step into the building above each window - but the masonry doesn't do that. That stonework is being cut into in several places, and no doubt that could be done here. But why make it that shape?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 10, 2014, 19:52:19
    Just where some seats will go at London end (in line with some just put in on P10/11), the paving shows signs of being lifted and relaid. I guess that was to make sure it was suitable for fixing them, e.g. replacing rubble fill with concrete.

    Looking at what's happening on the islands I remembered that in the area of P8/9 between the escalators and the new 'London end' buildings, (i.e. within the previously fenced off area), they built some fairly large and deep concrete footings under the block paving - exactly where there are now seat positions marked with white paint.  Presumably the idea is that they run the block paving right over the area to get them fitted properly round the boundaries such as surface water drains, building walls etc etc, and then go back and remove small areas to fix the legs afterwards...

    I also noticed the fairly random cuts and grooves in the 3G building stone work that you've mentioned - and I couldn't really see a pattern to it at all.  Will be interesting to see what happens over the next few weeks.

    Meanwhile, on a slightly different point.  Looking at the work going on in the vicinity of P4-6, I was wondering if the brickwork and concrete blocks in line with the end of the tracks will be retained in the final design.  They look quite a poor detail now - I remember we discussed the requirements for the over-run distance at the end of a bay platform with respect to the other end, P1-3 a while back but I couldn't easily find it again.   Can you remember if those concrete lumps are essential?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 10, 2014, 22:23:23
    Meanwhile, on a slightly different point.  Looking at the work going on in the vicinity of P4-6, I was wondering if the brickwork and concrete blocks in line with the end of the tracks will be retained in the final design.  They look quite a poor detail now - I remember we discussed the requirements for the over-run distance at the end of a bay platform with respect to the other end, P1-3 a while back but I couldn't easily find it again.   Can you remember if those concrete lumps are essential?

    Do you mean the walls at the ends of the platforms? I can see something is needed, because of the restricted space, but it could be a fence. I don't recall seeing any rules on that.

    The previous post was at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg141501#msg141501 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg141501#msg141501) - which gives the document references. I only remember the bit about the distance needed to a new support for overhead structures. The pillars in line with the tracks are not new, but the rules may still apply.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 13, 2014, 11:13:37
    I'm not sure what this is but it's appeared in the corner at the top of the steps overlooking the south entrance.

    To my untrained eye it looks like an unverted U of piping drilled through the floor tiles, a couple of hand valves and maybe an electric pump connected to some kind of electric supply box, also drilled into the floor tiling.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 13, 2014, 11:22:00
    I wonder if it's for the intended catering outlet there?  It will possibly be their water supply - could be a pressure reducer or even a miniature water meter?

    I think the idea is that all the services are available via a sort of 'crawl space' under the floor of the transfer deck, so caf^s could spring up almost anywhere...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 13, 2014, 11:34:09
    I wonder if it's for the intended catering outlet there?

    Good point. So it's not beer pumps then ? ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on March 13, 2014, 12:10:49
    Looks like a water meter to me, I have installed several.

    The grey box is probably an electricity supply and meter, or at least provsion for installing same.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Visoflex on March 14, 2014, 15:02:37
    Yes, they are services.  Starbucks are moving their concession area to the top of the Western gateline escalators, and the large spaces between the lifts will be occupied by new businesses in glass kiosks such as Boots, Upper Crust, Oliver Bonas, etc.  Details of the new concessionaires are on the current white hoarding.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 16, 2014, 10:16:33
    Now here's a thing. Underneath the back edge of the P7 canopy, where it is fitted round the back of the 3 Guineas, there are some odd-shaped steel sections. Towards P6, they are stepped to follow the profile of the masonry band at first-floor level, so presumably are to do with weatherproofing the join. Further along toward P3, they are shaped with an extra step into the building above each window - but the masonry doesn't do that. That stonework is being cut into in several places, and no doubt that could be done here. But why make it that shape?

    See? It does fit ... sort of.

    Looking along the rest of this wall, the idea seems to be to leave a gap of 4-6 inches round each pilaster, following its shape. This gap is narrowed to 1-2 inches for most of the length of each bay. But what has gone wrong with this one? A classic negative clearance problem, I'd call it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 16, 2014, 16:29:40
    Starbucks moved to new position (atop the Southern escalator/stairs) overnight.

    It's right in that corner - so the view over the RBC works outside is now restricted.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 16, 2014, 18:55:13
    Starbucks moved to new position (atop the Southern escalator/stairs) overnight.

    It's right in that corner - so the view over the RBC works outside is now restricted.

    Perhaps Starbucks didn't want to wait until RBC's project is finished - after all rents might be out of their reach in about 5 years time, at present rate of progress on the site...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 17, 2014, 23:54:47
    Starbucks moved to new position (atop the Southern escalator/stairs) overnight.

    It's right in that corner - so the view over the RBC works outside is now restricted.

    Well, so far it hardly affects the view - certainly not compared with the area their seating is shown as spreading into eventually.

    So you can still see that the monsters are feeling hungry again. Two more pillars-worth of of raised roadway are coming down now, ages after the rest. It does look rather like a change of plan, doesn't it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on March 18, 2014, 00:25:42
    It looks as though ground works have started on the North side of the station for the open space outside the new North entrance. NR appears to have handed over the space to another contractor and lots of drainage work going on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 18, 2014, 09:50:51
    So you can still see that the monsters are feeling hungry again. Two more pillars-worth of of raised roadway are coming down now, ages after the rest. It does look rather like a change of plan, doesn't it?

    I can't fathom what they're building apart from a 3/4 width staircase to view some graffiti ridden pillars against a grim backdrop of derelict architecture ;)

    A lot of the area under the bubble roof over P1/2/3 is now accessible though much of P3 is now closed off again whilst the temporary light and power scaffolding is removed and the holes filled in.
    The country end of P3 is still incomplete but overall that space is much nicer now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 18, 2014, 17:13:13
    I assume it is part of the redevelopment of the building.  If they are going to redevelop and reclad the building they will want to do it down to ground level so removing the last of the concrete slab is presumably a  that work. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 18, 2014, 17:29:50
    The complete building in the view above, including the tall block (out of shot above at the south end of it) is being fully demolished AIUI.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on March 18, 2014, 17:47:36
    The complete building in the view above, including the tall block (out of shot above at the south end of it) is being fully demolished AIUI.

    Paul

    My understanding was that they were now proposing to strip it back to the frame and reclad the tower and redevelop the other buildings at the bottom. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jonty on March 18, 2014, 18:50:04
    No, the whole lot is coming down, praise The Lord.

    It's The NCP car park behind that stays, and gets a re-cladding and a  5 a side football pitch on its roof...!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 18, 2014, 22:44:10
    Are these not all just proposals? I don't think anything has been designed yet, let alone gone to planning. And probably nothing is even half-funded either.

    Certainly all the raised roadway and the row of tatty shops will eventually be replaced by something else. However, the change I was talking about is to the interim arrangement, when first opened to the public.  Were were some pictures? I though so, but I can't now find any.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 19, 2014, 10:17:35
    The latest idea for a 'temporary events space' was only approved in January this year, having been submitted April last year:

    Quote
    RBC planning ref:     130440

    Site Address:  Western Tower Office and 26-58 Station Hill Reading RG1 1NF

    Description:   Demolition of Station Hill Retail Parade (including 26 to 58 Station Hill) to create a multipurpose area to be used for holding temporary events. Works of hard and soft landscaping and other incidental works.

    It looks to me as though there will be some sort of temporary wall in line with the far side of the new steps (parallel to the line of the station) until they decide what to build on the site.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 19, 2014, 10:21:15
    My understanding was that they were now proposing to strip it back to the frame and reclad the tower and redevelop the other buildings at the bottom. 

    Ah, I think that is the current plan for the independent 'Thames Tower' which is across the road from the old station entrance.   (The dark brown coloured tower with the nets fastened round it.)  That is a change from the original full demolition of everything.   But the site at the address I just posted (the one in stuving's photo) is just about to come down, and seems to have been proposed for full demolition in all the earlier plans I can find.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 19, 2014, 10:47:37
    It looks to me as though there will be some sort of temporary wall in line with the far side of the new steps (parallel to the line of the station) until they decide what to build on the site.

    You have to look quite hard at that application to work out what level it is at. It says the ground level will be raised slightly after demolition, but I think that just means up to the lower (bottom of the steps) level. There will obviously need to be a wall to separate this low level from the high level towards Thames Tower. Incidentally, this application does still talk about demolishing that (but of course it's a year old now).

    I wasn't sure if this "temporary" plan would get done right away - but it looks as if it is, so in that sense it is a change of plan (from waiting for a decision to having one). Of course it may not be actually finished at the time the steps are opened.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 19, 2014, 11:38:07
    The most recent things I could find referred to outline planning approval as of last December.
    And on the developers website:

    "The first elements of the phased scheme will commence in 2014. A temporary public event space is expected to be delivered by the end of 2014 / early 2015, alongside new landscaping works undertaken by the Council and the demolition of the existing vacant retail buildings opposite Reading Station. A first phase office building will follow shortly thereafter."
    Source: http://www.stanhopeplc.com/news/article?id=1015 (http://www.stanhopeplc.com/news/article?id=1015)

    But the current works don't seem to reflect that at all.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on March 19, 2014, 23:11:27
    I had a few minutes to kill in the station waiting for a connection at about 4pm today, and watched (along with a couple of FGW staff) from the northern end windows of the Transfer Deck as 2 big diggers removed the last of what was left of the pavement outside the Station Hill parade of shops.

    There was quite an audience outside aswell, and a few people taking pictures.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 21, 2014, 08:26:54
    No sign of these voracious beasties attacking the row of shops yet. I guess the point is that they are leaving enough of a gap for the developers to take that down behind a hoarding, after the "dry moat" is in use by the public. Whenever that may happen.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 21, 2014, 08:39:15
    Another bit of my childhood gone.  I used to buy my sweets from the second unit from the left as I changed buses on my way home from school.  Further along there were offices for the local newspaper and a sports shop run by former footballer and broadcaster Maurice Edleston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurice_Edelston).  Sadly in recent years they had become rather rundown, no doubt with the redevelopment plans in mind.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 21, 2014, 09:09:30
    Does anyone know what the criteria are for Reading station to be declared "finished"? That ought to be followed by an opening ceremony.  I imagine the "all public areas complete" is one, but at least one platform end will be only temporarily finished until much later - after the viaduct is in use and the west-end trackwork is relaid.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 21, 2014, 09:37:02
    ...I imagine the "all public areas complete" is one, but at least one platform end will be only temporarily finished until much later - after the viaduct is in use and the west-end trackwork is relaid.

    I was told earlier this week that the 'cut out' at the country end of P8 is not now going to be filled in, following the decision to provide the 'permanent quality' extension at the London end.   All that will happen is that once the track work is relaid to the final layout, and at the correct levels, the temporary fence alongside WH Smiths will be removed and the copings fitted, then down trains will be able to stop much nearer that end of the platform.

    Which is a shame because it just doesn't look right.  Will always be a relatively easy job to fill the area in if trains get longer though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 21, 2014, 09:43:21
    Were you wondering how big a stepladder it takes to change a light bulb on the canopies that sweep up to the transfer deck? (There are quite a few out already in some places.) Or to clean the windows, come to that. 

    The high-tech hire-in-a-man-with-the-right-kit solution appears to be this. But how about the other platforms, I hear you ask? Is there anywhere to store a complete set of expanded polystyrene causeway blocks on a permanent basis?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on March 22, 2014, 18:10:04
    Would the cherry picker fit on an engineers rail wagon ? , if so the intention may be to move it by rail from one platform to another.
    Fairly easily done at night since I presume that every platform can be reached from the new depot.

    I would presume that lamps wont be replaced one by one as they fail, it would make more sense to replace them all at once, either when a certain percentage have failed, or after a certain number of hours.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on March 23, 2014, 00:31:55
    And replace with LED versions, parts of the town already has LED streetlight, and of course all the new signals are. I was intrigued why LEDs were not used when they were putting up the first canopys.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 23, 2014, 08:19:24
    I hope the new lights illuminating the various tracks around the new depot are LEDs - otherwise someone is going to have a fulltime job replacing them given the number of lights there are!  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: broadgage on March 23, 2014, 09:08:25
    And replace with LED versions, parts of the town already has LED streetlight, and of course all the new signals are. I was intrigued why LEDs were not used when they were putting up the first canopys.

    LED technology is improving rapidly and is now a realistic alternative to fluorescent or metal halide lamps. This is however a new development, many LED lighting installations of only a few years ago failed to meet expectations regarding light output and lifetime.
    I suspect that when the plans for the Reading works were drawn up some years ago, that LED lighting was not considered to be sufficiently developed.

    For at least 10 years LEDs have worth while for coloured lighting such a railway or road signals, tail lamps etc.
    For a similar time LEDs have been worth it for numerous small light sources, such as torches, cycle lamps, Christmas decoration lights etc.

    LEDs to illuminate large areas such as streets, railway platforms, or offices with white light at a competitive cost are very much more recent.

    Special qaulity fluorescent lamps are available that should last about 10 years of continual operation, or 20 years of nightime only operation, or perhaps a century of domestic use. That is competitive with the claims made for LEDs.

    Replacing conventional fluorescent or discharge lamps is a simple task easily done quickly by semi skilled labour.
    Failed LEDs are likey to need an expensive specialist.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on March 23, 2014, 12:38:29
    I had a report done last year on the cost benefit of LED over compact fluorescent (cf) lighting.  The savings were very marginal, LED fittings were two to three times the cost all be it they had a 25 to 30 year life expectancy (this was based on the duty cycle where the lights are installed) cf fittings in that time frame would require a new lamp 1.5 times in the same time frame; energy consumption if I recall LED fittings were 36W and cf were 42W so not too much difference.

    We went for LED because that was the preferred option of the maintainer, LED still have to prove themselves there is a lot of data on failure modes based on well over 10 years use of cf lighting.

    Cold lights like LED or very high frequency cf are the future more lumens per Watt and less wasted as heat.

    I agree with Broadgage when the detailed design was signed off for Reading which may have been 5 years ago LED lighting was not quite there even now it has its limitations compared with conventional lights.  Replacement of a failed LED light is likely to be expensive as it is a whole fitting replacement and not just a lamp (bulb)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 23, 2014, 15:57:10
    There's an electrician for you - always a lamp never a bulb!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Tim on March 24, 2014, 09:28:40
    So are they "reading lights" or "Reading lights"?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 25, 2014, 18:54:17
    Were you wondering how big a stepladder it takes to change a light bulb on the canopies that sweep up to the transfer deck? (There are quite a few out already in some places.) Or to clean the windows, come to that. 

    The high-tech hire-in-a-man-with-the-right-kit solution appears to be this. But how about the other platforms, I hear you ask? Is there anywhere to store a complete set of expanded polystyrene causeway blocks on a permanent basis?

    Well, this appears to be at least the first part of the answer to that question - it goes upstairs onto the transfer deck!

    How did it get up there? I don't know, but if I did I would offer prizes for anyone who could guess. If it climbed the stairs on its tracks, that would have been well worth seeing. Or did they hire in a suitable long-reach indoor crane? (I guess that Ainscough don't do indoor ones).

    And is it narrow enough to get down the stairs on the other platforms? Or is it up there for some other purpose, which itself is hardly obvious given that the ceiling of the deck is not that high. Mysteriouser and mysteriouser.
     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 25, 2014, 19:11:08
    How did it get up there? I don't know, but if I did I would offer prizes for anyone who could guess.

    I reckon it used the polystyrene bridge onto P8/9, and then went up the stairs, but I might have cheated:

    http://www.spiderlift.co.uk/q-and-a/

    Scroll down...    ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 25, 2014, 19:22:56
    Some people have all the fun, don't they?

    That's the 'how?' - but the 'why?' remains, plus another one - why cross to P8 rather then just going up from the entrance?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 26, 2014, 10:29:12
    That's the 'how?' - but the 'why?' remains, plus another one - why cross to P8 rather then just going up from the entrance?

    Maybe it was done when the station was partly operational, e.g. P7/8/9 were out of action, but the main stairs and escalators on the south side were in public use.   Or maybe they used it for something on P8/9 first, and the polybridge was a useful shortcut as it was already rigged for something else.   No idea why it might still be on the transfer deck though - perhaps they'll keep one long term and there's storage space for it behind the enclosure in that corner of the 'deck?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 26, 2014, 11:35:43
    Maybe it was done when the station was partly operational, e.g. P7/8/9 were out of action, but the main stairs and escalators on the south side were in public use.   Or maybe they used it for something on P8/9 first, and the polybridge was a useful shortcut as it was already rigged for something else.   No idea why it might still be on the transfer deck though - perhaps they'll keep one long term and there's storage space for it behind the enclosure in that corner of the 'deck?

    Paul

    Judging by what can bee seen of P7's canopy in the video, it was recent - so presumably last weekend.  I suppose there could be a lower load-bearing capacity on or beside the south-side stairs?

    The biggest access problems must be where the canopy sweeps up over the deck, with a stair/escalator structure in the way underneath. The north access is worse than the platforms, as it has no stairs and is higher. So maybe this beastie is there to reach out sideways into that area - its support legs helping to balance it without too much weight. Only a guess, of course.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on March 28, 2014, 14:46:03
    I counted 5 available platforms while waiting for the 14:26 to padd. It got stuck waiting for a cross country to clear the platform, which itself was waiting for a fgw to clear it's path, seemed to get into a bit of a mess, I can't see why the spare platforms couldn't be used .


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2014, 15:23:17
    I counted 5 available platforms while waiting for the 14:26 to padd. It got stuck waiting for a cross country to clear the platform, which itself was waiting for a fgw to clear it's path, seemed to get into a bit of a mess, I can't see why the spare platforms couldn't be used .

    If the incoming train was already visible near the station and heading towards either P10 or P11 it might well have passed the last opportunity to cross over to reach what appears to be a 'spare platform'.  If they want to put an up direction train through the relief side I think the decision has to be made before Tilehurst, but someone will correct me if that's wrong...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Network SouthEast on March 28, 2014, 15:38:32
    If the incoming train was already visible near the station and heading towards either P10 or P11 it might well have passed the last opportunity to cross over to reach what appears to be a 'spare platform'.  If they want to put an up direction train through the relief side I think the decision has to be made before Tilehurst, but someone will correct me if that's wrong...

    Paul
    Indeed.

    If travelling towards Paddington on the Up Main you must be crossed over at Tilehurst East Junction to access platforms 15, 14, 13 and 12 at Reading.

    If travelling towards Paddington on the Up Relief you must be crossed over at Reading West Junction to access platforms 11, 10, 9 and 8 at Reading.

    At the other end of the station...

    If travelling towards Reading from Twyford on the Down Main, you must be crossed over at Kennet Bridge Junction to access platforms 12, 13, 14 and 15 at Reading station. If on the Down Relief, you must also be crossed over at Kennet Bridge Junction to access platforms 7, 8, 9 and 10.

    When changing platforms of trains at the last minute, it should be considered that the time saved by not waiting at a red signal is then lost by the delay whilst a hoard of passengers are transferring platforms and then trickling through to the train on it's reassigned platform.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on March 28, 2014, 17:52:08
    Was it not one of the main objectives of the station improvements to reduce this kind of congestion?

    The train was booked to depart from Reading at 14:26, it eventually departed at at 14:42, considering it was known that it was running late, (shown as 14:33 on displays) along with the 14:16 XC that was booked to use the same platform, I would have thought that there was enough time to plan in a platform change.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 28, 2014, 18:27:13
    Was it not one of the main objectives of the station improvements to reduce this kind of congestion?

    It is one of the main objectives, but the western end of the station still has most of the layout improvements to be made.  After it's all finished there will be a massive increase in flexibility, but for the moment there are still quite a lot of conflicts and restrictions.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 28, 2014, 18:45:19
    A significant current limitation does concern the XC reversals mentioned by tom m, they cannot use P3 yet (no route available so no track installed yet) or P7 (no route available).

    But this is still a planned and expected phase of the stage works - it will go on for another year or more.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 29, 2014, 13:33:36
    The next major track stage will be the slue of the Main Lines onto the viaduct.  This will then create room on the Relief side for the remainder of the remodelling on that side.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 29, 2014, 16:34:34
    Does anyone know when the viaduct is due to open ?

    I seem to remember that the remodelling was due to be complete by Easter 2015 ?

    So it suggests that the viaduct needs to be open by August or Christmas this year ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 29, 2014, 16:45:48
    Does anyone know when the viaduct is due to open ?

    I seem to remember that the remodelling was due to be complete by Easter 2015 ?

    So it suggests that the viaduct needs to be open by August or Christmas this year ?

    Christmas 2014 is the date on the FGW website:

    Quote
    Christmas 2014 will see significant works on the flyover
    By spring 2015, the new flyover will be completed, allowing more room for trains and provide an alternative route for freight services, meaning fewer delays to passenger services entering or leaving Reading
    There are also ongoing track and signalling improvements to promote smoother, more reliable train journeys and to put in place overhead line structures that will carry the new state-of-the-art electric trains, which will eventually serve Reading
    The Reading Station Improvement Project is due to be completed by summer 2015
    http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Your-journey/Rail-improvements/Reading-station-improvements


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 31, 2014, 13:28:21
    So what I could see this AM as my 180 approached Reading from the west :

    [1] Viaduct built from Scours Lane to Reading West junction
    [2] Viaduct built over Reading West junction and over Cow Lane.
    [3] From work still in place (not sure if this id the right term - metal bars and large panel) about where the Festival Line will dive under the viaduct
    [4] Viaduct, with underpass for fright line from Reading West, built.
    [5] Earth works being built up to start of the viaduct.

    What was less obvious (OK - could not been seen at all to tell the truth) was any works on the east side of of Cow Lane. And in fact from the train I was left wondering how this tricky piece of line was going to be constructed.

    Its has to go under the new viaduct and immediately start rising to clear the new freight and cross country lines to the new northern platforms. I think I recall that these lines were going to dive under the viaduct - but as the viaduct is still at peak height at this point - the dive under is more for clearing the festival line, I think.

    I am in reading next weekend - and will try to get to take a look at the east and southern of Cow lane - about where the old depot was - to see if these, I presume, not insignificant earthworks should be in evidence.






    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 31, 2014, 13:55:40

    I am in reading next weekend - and will try to get to take a look at the east and southern of Cow lane - about where the old depot was - to see if these, I presume, not insignificant earthworks should be in evidence.


    My usual route into Reading is via the west curve, and looking over in a sort of north westerly direction towards the main viaduct there is now an obvious concrete structure (parallel to the concrete part of the main eastern ramp) that looks as if it is descending towards the festival line box rather than rising to the main viaduct level.  I'll try and get a photo next time I pass through.

    (By the way, your 'formwork' (a perfectly accurate enough term IMHO) seems to have been spell checked to 'from work', as does freight to fright...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on March 31, 2014, 14:10:26
    What we need now is one of the engineers to walk along the top with a GoPro so we can see whats going on up there :) Mighty impressive just how quick some of that has gone up recently, and how the hell they know what they are doing with all that rebar and criss-crossing concrete is mind boggling!

    Those square panels they are installing, which I assume is the side of the eathworks for the ramp onto the viaduct, seem very piddly (yes, that is a technical description :P ) compared to the rest of the concrete structures, but from what I could see they are attached to long horizontal legs which are being embedded and compacted into the earthworks itself (like an L rotated 90deg anti-clockwise) - so I guess its self strengthening as it goes up, by virtue of the weight on it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 31, 2014, 18:16:56
    Does anyone know when the viaduct is due to open ?

    I seem to remember that the remodelling was due to be complete by Easter 2015 ?

    So it suggests that the viaduct needs to be open by August or Christmas this year ?

    Christmas 2014 is the date on the FGW website:

    And Christmas 2014 is also when the old Cow Lane bridge is to be taken out. The new bridge has been in use for the Relief Lines for some time, but the main lines stay on the old bridge until they can be shifted onto the viaduct. Then the space they occupied gets remodelled for the feeder lines, festival line, etc.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 31, 2014, 18:26:26
    Another thing I just remembered from somewhere, (now confirmed by the link below),  is that they have apparently left themselves about 6 months to install the track work and signalling etc.  So the viaduct ought to look reasonably complete by this summer even though trains won't use it until after Christmas or so...

    PS - there's a recent article about the viaduct here:  http://www.therailengineer.com/2014/03/28/last-piece-jigsaw/

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on March 31, 2014, 18:58:54
    Also, at the London end of the station, a formerly-redundant tunnel has been totally refurbished and new tracks installed ^ thus enabling trains to pass from the north to the south side of the station, without crossing any lines, to link up with the route to Gatwick and beyond. This is dramatically improving the travel experience for passengers travelling from the west to the southeast.

    I may be wrong but I didn't think the underpass was in general use yet, other than a couple of positioning movements, (and maybe the daily XC service?). If so, it feels a bit of an overstatement to describe the travel experience improvement as dramatic.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 31, 2014, 19:02:36
    Also, at the London end of the station, a formerly-redundant tunnel has been totally refurbished and new tracks installed ^ thus enabling trains to pass from the north to the south side of the station, without crossing any lines, to link up with the route to Gatwick and beyond. This is dramatically improving the travel experience for passengers travelling from the west to the southeast.

    I may be wrong but I didn't think the underpass was in general use yet, other than a couple of positioning movements, (and maybe the daily XC service?). If so, it feels a bit of an overstatement to describe the travel experience improvement as dramatic.

    Quite so. There are a few other non-civil-engineering statements in that piece that are wide of the mark too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 31, 2014, 19:25:17
    I may be wrong but I didn't think the underpass was in general use yet, other than a couple of positioning movements, (and maybe the daily XC service?). If so, it feels a bit of an overstatement to describe the travel experience improvement as dramatic.

    It's a non stop service from Oxford to Gatwick, which is why no-one has seen it yet.   ;D

    Journalism based on the oft repeated presumption that the underpass would allow for through services, although as we've discussed before in this forum, electrification actually makes it even less likelier than it ever was...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on March 31, 2014, 19:41:27
    Some months back I was on a Gatwick to Reading service that used the tunnel, we ended up on plat 15 I think. Not sure for the reason and the driver seemed to be quite supprised too, so don't think it's in regular use, but it is available for use.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 31, 2014, 19:49:27
    Some months back I was on a Gatwick to Reading service that used the tunnel, we ended up on plat 15 I think. Not sure for the reason and the driver seemed to be quite supprised too, so don't think it's in regular use, but it is available for use.

    It's definitely planned to be used for the trains coming from the depot at the start of service, but I think most people can avoid them unless they are around at about 0600...

    (and vice versa late at night of course...)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 31, 2014, 19:53:54
    What was less obvious (OK - could not been seen at all to tell the truth) was any works on the east side of of Cow Lane. And in fact from the train I was left wondering how this tricky piece of line was going to be constructed.

    Its has to go under the new viaduct and immediately start rising to clear the new freight and cross country lines to the new northern platforms. I think I recall that these lines were going to dive under the viaduct - but as the viaduct is still at peak height at this point - the dive under is more for clearing the festival line, I think.

    One way to think of the levels involved is to start from the bridge outside the station. The headroom on Caversham Road is less than a double-deck bus, i.e. about 4 m, which is only half what a railway needs. The embankment then runs west falling only very slowly, while the ground level rises even slower (it's flood plain, and the slope down the Thames is tiny).

    So the viaduct (including the Festival Line) needs to rise to twice the old line's height, while the Feeder Lines fall the same amount to ground level to pass underneath. Only then can the Festival Line viaduct drop down to ground level to pass underneath the main viaduct. Cow Lane itself will be dropped by about 1.5 m - enough to fit a double-deck bus under the Relief Lines at their existing height. The Festival Line is a bit higher at this point, and its box is well to the west of Cow Lane - close to the West Curve box. And if when Cow Lane floods, we will be able to say "I see the pumps have failed" - it's roughly at river level.

    There is of course a drawing of the whole viaduct, as you should eventually see it from the north side, which you could try to load as a 1 Mb PDF from http://documents.reading.gov.uk/AniteIM.WebSearch/(S(g5upsk55ewcpb3i41djfulmv))/Download.aspx?ID=263638 (http://documents.reading.gov.uk/AniteIM.WebSearch/(S(g5upsk55ewcpb3i41djfulmv))/Download.aspx?ID=263638).
    Warning - it's very wide, and may not display on a pocket-sized screen, nor be printable on portable paper.

    If it does, you can edit the final two digits to:
    36  Perspective view of Cow Lane
    37  Full-width drawing from south side
    39  Similar drawing of the Feeder Lines crossing the triangle
    40  Plan of viaduct and triangle, with cross-section sketches
    41  Plan of triangle (new revised version)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on April 02, 2014, 09:48:28
    There was a crane and a long loader transferring track in the triangle this morning but I wasn't able to see if it was being loaded or unloaded.
    There was plenty of groundwork activity there too.

    Elsewhere P7 now has it's bubble roof so hopefully will be a bit more watertight :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on April 02, 2014, 14:08:17
    I think there is significant work, or even a total closure of Reading, over the Christmas 2014 and Easter 2015 period.
    I've heard Easter 2015 there is due to be a blockade on to allow commissioning of all the new signalling equipment.  Wether that has changed since we were told several months ago I don't know.  It may be a case it's just a weekend.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 02, 2014, 16:01:42
    I think there is significant work, or even a total closure of Reading, over the Christmas 2014 and Easter 2015 period.
    I've heard Easter 2015 there is due to be a blockade on to allow commissioning of all the new signalling equipment.  Wether that has changed since we were told several months ago I don't know.  It may be a case it's just a weekend.

    Just had a look at the Dec 2014 Engineering Access Statement (i.e. for 2015 timetable year) there's a full closure from the evening of Wed 24th until 0330 Sat 27th.  After that the reliefs become available, but with only P13/14/15 in use.   So P1/2,7-12 all blocked mostly until 4th Jan, with P12 available from 29th December.   Suggest that period will cover the slew of the mains to the flyover and various Westbury Line Jn alterations.   

    No sign of anything affecting P4/5/6 at that stage as you'd expect.

    Closures at Easter and the following weekend then mainly affect work on the reliefs through Reading, but I haven't looked at that in detail, however there are some periods with diversions via Banbury and into Waterloo for the relevant routes.

    Also of course both periods include major blocks elsewhere, especially towards London for Crossrail, resignalling etc etc...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 08, 2014, 14:34:48
    If you've got full PPE, you might be interested in this (http://www.ice.org.uk/ICE_Web_Portal/media/london/Reading-Viaduct-Site-Visit_flyer_2.pdf)

    I know I wish I had!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on April 10, 2014, 07:50:08
    Just passed through Reading and for the first time on the east side of Cow Lane you can see the first pier for the festival line being formed.

    Base of the pier and part of the column in place. Form work for the 'head' is built but not cast.

    The contrast in heights between the two viaducts was marked.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Steevp on April 10, 2014, 14:38:13
    Excuse my ignorance, but I've always wondered - which is the festival line at Reading?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on April 10, 2014, 15:09:04
    Excuse my ignorance, but I've always wondered - which is the festival line at Reading?

    Welcome to the forum Steevp!   :)

    I don't know the answer to your query, but I'm sure one of our knowledgeable membership will be along shortly with the answer.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 10, 2014, 17:50:26
    The 'Festival line' is not yet built, so is not obvious, and even if you find the track diagram way back in this thread I don't think the name is used.

    Basically this will be a single track bidirectional route that will allow for a train to/from the relief lines west of the station to pass under the main lines to/from platforms 3, 7 and 8.   It is predominantly being introduced to allow for XC trains from the west to reach a suitable platform to reverse towards Basingstoke (and vice versa), without conflicts.  (The Festival line will pass under the mains immediately east of where the west curve will also pass under, but the two routes will be in separate concrete box structures.)

    Another way of looking at it is that it will be a bit like the reopened eastern underpass, in terms of burrowing under the mains at least...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Steevp on April 10, 2014, 20:08:14
    Thanks Paul - no wonder I was confused, it ain't built yet. Appreciate the clear explanation

    Cheers


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 17, 2014, 19:48:20
    Work has started on cladding the concrete skeleton of the Brunel Plaza by platform 7 (the glazing has already gone in, but doesn't show up in a picture). It has been carefully chosen to be not quite the same shade of blue as the canopies. This isn't very evident in the picture, as the cladding is vertical and well lit, but the underside of the canopy is shaded and has a strong reflection. Look at the open panel hanging down at the top; that gives a more accurate impression of the colour.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on April 17, 2014, 23:08:40
    A small part of the Orange Army back from their working 'holiday' in Devon perhaps, as its been a bit quiet on this thread recently... ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 21, 2014, 17:38:16
    The answer to how the P1/2/3 overhead wiring will be secured is now revealed.   As we expected there's a fairly heavy duty girder been mounted across and completely clear of the roof of P1/2, supported by the stub girder we saw above the P3 roof, and at the south end it is supported on an upright girder 'outside' the old station wall - (as I thought it might be)...

    The first photo below also shows the style of the new brickwork which forms the facing of the concrete piled outer/lower wall.  I wonder how they'll deal with the flat space above it, that used to be a raised path I think...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 21, 2014, 23:05:38
    When I saw that facing wall, I wondered whether it would stop there or continue upwards, or if there would be a fence. I presume that area will be inside the station perimeter, as it's now the wrong height for external access (though perhaps an emergency exit could be arranged) and why would they want access anyway? The previous footpath - a kind of bypass round the back of the bus shelters - was about two feet above ground level, though that's not very helpful now the ground has been demolished.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 03, 2014, 23:21:00
    The station build is definitely onto the final lap. Today P7 was open to its full length, though not all being used. A temporary stop board is needed because the platform signalling is still not wired up. One other minor thing I noticed is that the CISs for P4-6 are now suspended from the canopy, so you can see them from further away.

    So now all the platforms are built, apart from the now unnecessary west end of P8.  There still a number of minor finishing tasks to be done, such as removing the temporary wire, pipes, and hoarding stanchions. And, of course, there's the viaduct to build, and the final track layout, and eventually the electrification. But for the station itself, we are nearly there.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 04, 2014, 00:57:16
    I went through for the first time today in a while, Platform 7 is certainly looking rather nice now. Still some work to be done in the area platform side of the original barrier lines, the area where the escalators previously were. It's currently still got a very temporary feel, but much more open than before.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 04, 2014, 19:51:53
    The plans presented to RBC show a slightly revised barrier line a few metres further north, and with the excess fares cabin removed, hence allowing for a straight barrier line and making the whole area much more open.

    (However the original plans also show the excess fares office would be under the steps leading up to the transfer deck, near the lifts on P7 - and there's no sign of that happening so far.)

    Will be interesting to see how it turns out.   For my 2 pence worth I'd like to see those brick built blocks at the end of P4/5/6 removed and something better provided in their place.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on May 04, 2014, 20:08:32
    I could certainly see the logic in moving the excess fares cabin. It's rather out the way for most people now, unless you have come in on Platforms 4,5 or 6 you're probably unlikely to use that gateline.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 04, 2014, 21:27:38
    The plans presented to RBC show a slightly revised barrier line a few metres further north, and with the excess fares cabin removed, hence allowing for a straight barrier line and making the whole area much more open.

    (However the original plans also show the excess fares office would be under the steps leading up to the transfer deck, near the lifts on P7 - and there's no sign of that happening so far.)

    Will be interesting to see how it turns out.   For my 2 pence worth I'd like to see those brick built blocks at the end of P4/5/6 removed and something better provided in their place.

    Paul

    I certainly don't wish to question Paul's in depth knowledge but if RBC means Reading Borough Council do they really need to know where (for example) the excess fares office is ?

    Just curious ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 04, 2014, 22:55:51
    I certainly don't wish to question Paul's in depth knowledge but if RBC means Reading Borough Council do they really need to know where (for example) the excess fares office is ?

    Just curious ?
    The standard letter of application from NR says "we can do this under permitted development or railway acts, but we have to submit it to you (the planning authority) for approval". However the grounds for refusal, or requiring changes, are very limited indeed. As the question has come up before, chapter and verse is at here and the next (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=13143.msg142485#msg142485).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 05, 2014, 13:36:28
    I think permitted development rights etc it is well covered by stuving's post above and via the links - but I think in general that although we can glean all sorts of details from the scheme drawings that happen to be used to support Network Rail's overall application - that doesn't necessarily mean that every detail on those drawings is of concern to RBC...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 05, 2014, 14:07:36
    ... if RBC means Reading Borough Council do they really need to know where (for example) the excess fares office is ?

    I guess the real answer to the question as posed is that the grounds for RBC to object/quibble are rather vague, so it would be hard to write a document tailored to cover only that. It is easier to take an existing design report (from the architects for the station, or an engineering one for the viaduct and surroundings) and perhaps take out a few bits you really don't want public. Then you can argue about any objections that you think RBC are not allowed to make if that arises.

    Of course a lot of the information would have been given to RBC anyway, as they are responsible for (and currently rebuilding) the area around the station. So the same document may serve other purposes as well.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 07, 2014, 16:41:55
    A few photo updates from today.

    Firstly, what do you do about redundant car park doors that are about 6 floors up in the air?  Hide them behind a sign...

    Secondly, if you are going to have a new excess fares cabin, stick with the portable building style, and just provide a new smaller one that could go almost anywhere.   What you can't see in the photo is that the side of the 'cabin' hidden against the back of the ticket machines has a couple of windows designed with an opening 'slot' at the bottom to pass tickets and cash through...

    Third, a poor camera photo of the circulating space by platforms 4, 5 and 6.   As mentioned by stuving above, they've hung the PIS displays off the ceiling, but although all three are reasonably visible as you come round the corner from P7, they've scored a major own goal by hanging a pretty massive 'wayfinding' sign in the way of the view for someone entering via the 'old' barrier line.  The reason that sign is so massive is that the other side provides information about the whole station for the benefit of passengers arriving on the 'Southern' platforms.  All in all I think they need to look at this again.  They could probably do with large individual numbers indicating P4, 5 and 6, (like those box style numbers on the transfer deck maybe?) - but I'll reserve judgement as they may be fitted in due course anyway.

    Just to round off an earlier point, the exterior wall is near completion alongside P1, and the gaps in the original station wall have now been filled, so although an emergency exit may have been possible it no longer seems likely.  I wonder if anyone bothered to store away the top coping stones that were removed when the openings were knocked through a couple of years ago...

    Hope this is of interest, Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 07, 2014, 17:21:00
    Thanks, Paul.  I spotted that massive 'P' this morning myself.  Shame it took over a year to cover up the old door, but a pretty good job has been finally done.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on May 07, 2014, 21:18:41
    I haven't seen the big P for real yet, but it looks a bit naff from the photo, like they have just tried to cover up the hole.

    Why couldn't they fill the hole and clad the outside of the building properly.

    With all the ^m's that are being spent, and the massive (and presumably very expensive) attention to detail seen elsewhere around the Station (for example, the intricate metalwork linking the P7 canopy to the old Station building) I can't help thinking a better job could have been done.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 07, 2014, 21:20:22
    Also noted today (7 May 2014) that all of the OLE structures at the East End of the station approaches seem to have been completed and await the fittings, cantilever arms (and of course wires).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 07, 2014, 21:31:27
    Just to round off an earlier point, the exterior wall is near completion alongside P1, and the gaps in the original station wall have now been filled, so although an emergency exit may have been possible it no longer seems likely. 

    Could there be a door/gate between the grey brick wall and the rebuild wall at 90 degrees to the path?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on May 07, 2014, 21:31:54
    Before....

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/rbainfo/13639652185/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    After....

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnryoo83/13930155340/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 07, 2014, 23:22:49

    Could there be a door/gate between the grey brick wall and the rebuild wall at 90 degrees to the path?

    It's all fenced off with steel railings on the inside, around that relocatable equipment building (REB) that contains signalling equipment.  I don't think it would be feasible as space would be very tight alongside the REB.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 11, 2014, 22:58:21
    They tore up all the block paving outside the northern entrance, in part to put new drains underneath. Now they are finishing the groundwork prior to laying whatever the new surface will be. I spotted these newly-planted specimens - obviously rising bollards.

    I don't recall ever seeing a plan of this area, and it's hard to see why there would be controlled access just here (it's not far from the subway entrance) or even which way through it would be inwards.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on May 12, 2014, 07:10:56
    Not sure if it was anything to do with the improvement works but the 7:04 to readhill departed plat 13 this morning and made use of the dive under the main line to get to the north downs line.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on May 12, 2014, 07:48:00
    I think that was connected to problems in the Ash area. The 07:04 is normally formed from the incoming 05:31 from Gatwick Airport but this was running very late so it looks like a spare unit was brought off the depot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 12, 2014, 09:47:18
    I don't recall ever seeing a plan of this area, and it's hard to see why there would be controlled access just here (it's not far from the subway entrance) or even which way through it would be inwards.

    You'd have to go back to post #788 (Aug 2012) for a road layout plan that was on the Reading Council transport website at one time - but the link goes nowhere now.   I kept a copy though, I've added an extract below that shows the idea, steps and ramps etc, with a large ramp in line with the subway.

    The white strips of blocks visible in your photo seem to match the grey vertical lines in the drawing that divide the surface into sections...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on May 14, 2014, 20:03:23
    When I passed through Reading earlier this week (Monday) part of the over bridge was off limits due to be being "fenced off" by blue panels. Anyone know what is/was going on?

    I haven't been through since so it may have gone.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 14, 2014, 22:21:37
    I haven't seen the big P for real yet, but it looks a bit naff from the photo, like they have just tried to cover up the hole.

    It does look nicer in reality in my opinion, especially at night when it's illuminated.

    When I passed through Reading earlier this week (Monday) part of the over bridge was off limits due to be being "fenced off" by blue panels. Anyone know what is/was going on?

    Presumably the march of the uninspiring, but necessary, chain outlets that have been let?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 17, 2014, 23:22:38
    When I passed through Reading earlier this week (Monday) part of the over bridge was off limits due to be being "fenced off" by blue panels. Anyone know what is/was going on?

    I haven't been through since so it may have gone.

    It is, as expected, the first retail unit being built - over P9-10. From what I could see it's pretty big, almost filling the space between lifts. The corral that was there before (over P13-14) has gone.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on May 22, 2014, 18:51:39
    One of escalators down to plat 12 does not look to healthy


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on May 25, 2014, 09:38:13
    Just to add another perspective - here is a signaller's eye view of the current station layout

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rdgsig.jpg)

    Platform 7 is at the bottom of the screen.  Note platforms 4,5 & 6 are controlled from a different desk and thus not shown here.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on June 02, 2014, 20:32:48
    It seems the station is going to be officially opened by the Queen next month:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/queen-officially-open-redeveloped-reading-7203695


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on June 02, 2014, 22:02:28
    It seems the station is going to be officially opened by the Queen next month:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/queen-officially-open-redeveloped-reading-7203695
    Judging by the picture in the article she look so pleased to be going to Reading  ;D

    Jesting aside this is great news for the team that have worked on Reading Station to have HM the Queen open the station


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on June 02, 2014, 22:31:11

    Judging by the picture in the article she look so pleased to be going to Reading  ;D

    Jesting aside this is great news for the team that have worked on Reading Station to have HM the Queen open the station

    Will she be continuing to dress to a bedding theme? And I look forward to hearing the Duke of Edinburgh's views on work. All the orange jackets might just be a little unsettling, though...

    Also jesting aside, it is indeed great news for the team at every level from drawing board to shovel to have their work recognised thus. I think it is also recognition of rail travel's renewed pre-eminence, and of the value of such infrastructure projects to the national good.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 02, 2014, 22:37:53
    How does the work outside the South entrance look now?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 02, 2014, 23:02:46
    How does the work outside the South entrance look now?
    Last week (picture from 28th) they were adding a bit more width to the steps. No sign of any great urgency to finish it ... yet.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on June 02, 2014, 23:46:52
    Er, the Queen's coming, guys. ER! If it doesn't smell of fresh paint, she won't know she is at an opening.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 03, 2014, 07:29:56
    Er, the Queen's coming, guys. ER! If it doesn't smell of fresh paint, she won't know she is at an opening.

    What's the betting she will only use the North entrance?  Is that any better?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on June 03, 2014, 18:06:20
    Had to change at Reading today. I had not been around the station for some time.  I noticed on P8 the platform edge is propped up by some bodged bits of timber in two places either side of the transfer deck.  I hope this is temporary!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 03, 2014, 18:18:06
    I think the propping is only precautionary because that is the place where they usually build the bridge of polystyrene blocks to get equipment on and off the island platform.  If they accidentally put a heavy load right at the edge it could theoretically lift the back of the coping stone, so they leave the wooden struts in place.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on June 19, 2014, 22:51:13
    So the conversion of the transfer deck to a shopping mall is will underway.

    The size, or the width to be exact, of the units has meant that Network Rail have removed the TV screens showing departure and fastest train information from the side of the lift shafts to the platforms.

    There are now two screen back to back suspended over platform 11/12 - one on the country side, one London. Without these transferring passengers have to to one end of the deck to see a screen that shows their connection.

    To be honest they look a little feeble - and some drunken oaf is going to jump and smack them 'for a laugh' and I suspect that will be the end of that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on June 19, 2014, 23:01:16
    Another observation of the work to the west of the station:

    On the site of the old maintainence depot is a dozen or so 5mx3m concrete box sections. I saw these arriving down the Oxford road and they definitely have a 'lip' - suggesting they all interlock to form a tunnel.

    But 5m x 3 m (my estimate) seems tight for a train ?
    So what are they for?

    The main viaduct build is fast being finished out - with only the complex roof across the Reading west lines /Oxford Rd curve remaining. In some sections to the west railings are fitted and the location bolts for the OLE are visible.

    On track for Christmas opening.

    The Festival line viaduct has gone no where from a few months ago - still with just the footings either side of Cow Lane still prepared. No sign of height yet. Hard to see this being open by Christmas.

    I did try to work out if the box sections could be used for the Festival viaduct - but I don't see how.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 19, 2014, 23:07:01
    Another observation of the work to the west of the station:

    On the site of the old maintainence depot is a dozen or so 5mx3m concrete box sections. I saw these arriving down the Oxford road and they definitely have a 'lip' - suggesting they all interlock to form a tunnel.

    But 5m x 3 m (my estimate) seems tight for a train ?
    So what are they for?
    Probably for the culverts under the feeder lines?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on June 19, 2014, 23:13:34
    So the conversion of the transfer deck to a shopping mall is will underway.

    The size, or the width to be exact, of the units has meant that Network Rail have removed the TV screens showing departure and fastest train information from the side of the lift shafts to the platforms.

    There are now two screen back to back suspended over platform 11/12 - one on the country side, one London. Without these transferring passengers have to to one end of the deck to see a screen that shows their connection.

    To be honest they look a little feeble - and some drunken oaf is going to jump and smack them 'for a laugh' and I suspect that will be the end of that.

    I did wonder what they were going to do about that. Presumably the retail units were never part of the original (Grimshaw) design, which included signage and CIS done jointly with NR (though needing some redesign since then). They will have been designed/bought/acquiesced to by a different bit of the organisation, I think - one that's commercial, not technical.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 20, 2014, 08:58:36
    Another observation of the work to the west of the station:

    On the site of the old maintainence depot is a dozen or so 5mx3m concrete box sections. I saw these arriving down the Oxford road and they definitely have a 'lip' - suggesting they all interlock to form a tunnel.

    But 5m x 3 m (my estimate) seems tight for a train ?
    So what are they for?
    Probably for the culverts under the feeder lines?

    Almost certainly.  That size estimate by lbraine is pretty accurate too, as they are described thus in the 'viaducts' planning statement:

    Quote
    ...The embankments across the railway triangle will contain 8 flood relief culverts each 4.9m by 2.5m with invert levels set at 37.2m AOD. These flood relief culverts pipes are part of the flood mitigation works proposed for the Reading Station Area Redevelopment Project as a whole.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on June 20, 2014, 09:30:04
    The new underpass Reading East Main Junction, 8421 points - Reading Southern Junction (Reading Low Level line) (148) WH03 [note: Accessible only to or from Reading platforms 13 or higher] now appears on the PSUL website

    http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2014.htm (http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2014.htm)

    you can even do it on a Voyager!



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on June 20, 2014, 11:26:26

    I did wonder what they were going to do about that. Presumably the retail units were never part of the original (Grimshaw) design, which included signage and CIS done jointly with NR (though needing some redesign since then). They will have been designed/bought/acquiesced to by a different bit of the organisation, I think - one that's commercial, not technical.

    I witnessed first hand the signage issues last night, around 7:30.

    The transfer deck has a continuous flow of well dressed people returning from Ascot. They arrived up the main escalator (South side) which bring them naturally to the B side of the platforms. They walked along the deck looking for an A platform reference - and could not see one.

    And you can't. The new units block the line of sight to the A side escalators. So if you do not know Readings platform layout you are pretty much stuck.

    I directed 2 couples myself to 13A and the Police (in place for the England game pub exodus) were doing a pretty good job at helping to.

    I really do thing someone is going to have to rethink the signage (and passenger flows) with these units in place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on June 20, 2014, 11:58:59
    The new underpass Reading East Main Junction, 8421 points - Reading Southern Junction (Reading Low Level line) (148) WH03 [note: Accessible only to or from Reading platforms 13 or higher] now appears on the PSUL website

    http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2014.htm (http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2014.htm)

    you can even do it on a Voyager!

    Of course, XC to Guildford....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on June 20, 2014, 13:16:03
    To Help Traincrew find their trains, some staff information screens (train describer and staff version of CIS feed) have been installed in some locations, some private but one is in the public area.

    Next time you are on the Western Gateline (the new one adjacent to platform 7 and all the escalators), have a look at the partition behind the ticket machines- opposite the bottom of the stairs, and you can see a live train describer of the station!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on June 21, 2014, 10:33:31
    A new sign has appeared - just as you come up the southern escalators and turn right onto the transfer deck - there is a sign cross the entrance with a big enormous B and arrow pointing to the country end and a big enormous A and arrow pointing to the London end.

    Nothing on the new northern side.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on June 22, 2014, 10:45:34
    Here are two photographs of the 'new' transfer deck layout taken yesterday (21 June 2014).  The new shops are located in the middle between the lifts.  There are three units in total.

    On the 'B' Platform Side looking North
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/Reading%2021_06_2014%2001.JPG?cache=0.3054159041494131)
    Image (c)2014 SandTEngineer

    On the 'A' Platform side looking North
    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/Reading%2021_06_2014%2002.JPG?cache=0.8437337770592421)
    Image (c)2014 SandTEngineer


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 22, 2014, 20:40:21
    A new sign has appeared - just as you come up the southern escalators and turn right onto the transfer deck - there is a sign cross the entrance with a big enormous B and arrow pointing to the country end and a big enormous A and arrow pointing to the London end.

    I'm 99% sure it was there on Wednesday - so before you posted about race goers getting lost...

    In any case, the A end escalators for P8/9 were always visible, as there are no obstructions in line of sight from the entrance to the transfer deck to those.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 27, 2014, 10:08:35
    The Network Change Notice for Stage L (Christmas/New Year 2014) is now available on the NR website, going into some detail about the track works at the various locations.

    New info (to me) is that the crossovers allowing for routes from the up and down main to the Festival Line and onward to P3, (where the viaduct is rising at the east end), will be named 'Reading High Level Jn'.

    Summary section copied here, each section is described in far more detail in the document:

    Quote
    ^ Closure of the tempoary Up and Down Main Lines between Reading Station and Whitehouse Junction (in use since Easter 2013).
    ^ Opening the new Up and Down Main Lines over the elevated railway between Whitehouse Junction and Reading Station.
    ^ Remodelling of Westbury Line Junction.
    ^ Temporary re-alignment of the Up Westbury Line to facilitate Christmas 2014 commissioning.
    ^ Realignment of Whitehouse Junction to provide access to the new Up and Down Main Lines over the elevated railway.
    ^ Re-opening of Platform 3.
    ^ Introduction of Points 8424 and 8420 on the Up and Down Main Lines at Reading East.
    ^ Introduction of a new junction and associated signalled routes between the Down, Up Main and the Down Reading Festival Line referred to as Reading High Level Junction.
    ^ Opening of the eastern section of the Down Reading Festival Line between Westbury Line Junction and a High Level Junction on the elevated railway.
    ^ Introduction of new signalling between Tilehurst East Junction and Reading Station over the Up and Down Main Lines
    ^ Changes to Platform use at Reading Station.
    ^ Changes to Reading West Junction.

    Network Rail NC/G1/2014 RSAR 001 30 April 2014 (http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/network%20code/network%20change/current%20proposals/thames%20valley%20area/stage%20l%20network%20change/rsar%20ncn%202014%20001%20(stage%20l%20network%20change%20proposal).pdf)

    Route tables at the end of the document show all the connections between platforms and lines available in the interim period until the up feeder line becomes available.  In the 6 months or so up trains from the Westbury direction will have to pass through platforms 7 or 8 bidirectionally.  Last but not least P3 will re-open, with routes to and from both up and down mains via the High Level Jn as mentioned earlier.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 27, 2014, 10:43:29
    Thanks for posting those details, Paul.

    A shame the re-opened Platform 3 won't be long enough to accommodate a 5-Car IEP which may have been useful during periods of disruption, but another stride forward at Christmas in providing a massively enhanced operation at Reading which will largely be completed the following Easter.

    Do we know whether there will be Chiltern Line/Waterloo diversions this Christmas as well as next Easter?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 27, 2014, 10:57:12
    Do we know whether there will be Chiltern Line/Waterloo diversions this Christmas as well as next Easter?

    I think I checked this a while ago and found nothing about Waterloo/Banbury in the EAS until Easter:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg151860#msg151860

    The reliefs should be open anyway, so they might get away with the normal sort of reduced Sunday service through P13-15; with diversions via Melksham for the 'via Westbury' services?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 27, 2014, 11:20:21
    Yes, that's what I thought - just next Easter.  A relief to those travelling through Reading at Christmas then!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on June 27, 2014, 12:01:41
    I hear that the sleepers are also coming via Banbury over the Easter closure.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Southern Stag on June 27, 2014, 13:10:13
    That was rumoured last time. It never happened though and we had an overnight HST into Waterloo instead.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 07, 2014, 16:37:58
    A couple of phone pics taken last Friday showing the additional signage attempting to explain the A and B ends.   Both also show additional 'next train' displays hanging from ceiling in the distance.

    Notices had also been put up explaining that the north entrance is to be closed to the public for much of the working day (after 0900) on the 17th for the 'opening'.  Those blokes laying slabs outside the north end of the station probably need to have a bit of a tidy up...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: MVR S&T on July 09, 2014, 22:42:01
    A good way of testing the signage, perhaps, is to get the MD of the project drunk, take away their glasses and give them them a short time to get the right train, at the right end of the right platform, with some large cases perhaps to add to challenge!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on July 10, 2014, 07:43:21
    I spotted a cross country using the north downs line to reverse at reading (plat 8 to 13) as it had come in from the South and was headding north I presume. I seemed an awkward way of doing things, presumably when the improvements to the west of the station are complete this will mean that this move is no longer needed:

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C74160/2014/07/10/advanced


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on July 10, 2014, 09:04:50
    I went through RDG yesterday for the first time since the new signage had been put up and I think it is very effective. I also like the addition of the new shops on the over bridge although I can't see me using any of them. Good work (imho)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 10, 2014, 09:59:52
    I spotted a cross country using the north downs line to reverse at reading (plat 8 to 13) as it had come in from the South and was headding north I presume. I seemed an awkward way of doing things, presumably when the improvements to the west of the station are complete this will mean that this move is no longer needed:

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C74160/2014/07/10/advanced

    It's been happening since the 'Southern' underpass re-opened, and in the transitional period when the old depot in the triangle was still in use by FGW a whole load of their empty stock made the similar moves.   There have also been (and may still be) XC empty stock reversals in the Kennet Bridge loop, which is another way of getting from the main to relief side east of the station.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on July 10, 2014, 19:25:14
    I noticed passing through today a "Lands End Pasty Co." shop being fitted out on the overbridge.

    I love a pasty, but do we need 2 pasty shops at RDG?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on July 10, 2014, 19:54:18
    I love a pasty, but do we need 2 pasty shops at RDG?

    No, but has been explained to me that having two competing businesses of the same type close to each other helps keep the standards up at both of them, and it also helps attract a wider potential customer base as they'll come from further afield to a centre of excellence.   Told to me by the one remaining jeweller in Melksham just after their competition had closed.  Does what applies to Jewellers in Melksham also apply to Pasty shops in Reading?  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on July 10, 2014, 22:58:00
    Apparently it's a well known retail phenonmenon. I've heard as  two ice cream sellers do better if they are both near the centre of the beach rather than at either end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on July 11, 2014, 22:00:27
    I noticed passing through today a "Lands End Pasty Co." shop being fitted out on the overbridge.

    I love a pasty, but do we need 2 pasty shops at RDG?

    You can never have too many pasties.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on July 12, 2014, 00:04:09
    Member broadgage would probably agree ...  :P ::) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 12, 2014, 01:40:37
    Well, I've stopped buying pasties from The Pasty Shop on stations since the prices went up and the BiTE Card discount went down.  ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on July 12, 2014, 09:02:30
    Member broadgage would probably agree ...  :P ::) ;D


    Great minds think alike - there you are you see - who needs Pullmans or Travelling Chefs......FGW should go to Dewdneys or Pilgrims Pasties in Plymouth, load up a trolley with Oggies, and dish them out to weary travellers on their trains........I promise you customer satisfaction will rocket (along with cholestorol!!!)  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on July 15, 2014, 09:50:58
    From Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/queen-officially-open-reading-station-7416103)

    Quote
    The Queen to officially open Reading Station on Thursday
     
    Queen Elizabeth will be visiting Reading on Thursday to officially open the station   

    It is just a few days until the Queen will visit the new pedestrian walkway and name a train when she officially opens the new Reading Railway Station on Thursday.

    Her Majesty will hear about the ^895 million redevelopment of the station while she views the new transfer deck.

    She will also meet members of the station and Network Rail staff who have been involved in the six-year project.

    The Queen will join Network Rail chairman Richard Parry Jones for a plaque unveiling before moving outside the terminal for a group photograph with construction workers.

    Her Majesty will also view a display on the restoration of Dawlish station, in Devon, where the mainline was severely damaged in the winter storms.

    Part of the visit will also include the naming of the new High Output Plant System (HOPS) train which will be used in the electrification the Great Western Mainline.

    The 23-vehicle train is described as a factory on rails and is the first of its kind to be used on Britain's railways.

    The redevelopment of Reading Station has included two new entrances, five additional platforms, a 110-metre long passenger bridge and extended platforms. Work on constructing a viaduct flyover in West Reading, which will result in the widening of Cow Lane, is ongoing and is due to be completed in 2015.

    Thousands turned out to see the Queen and Duke of Edinburgh in April 1989 for the opening of Reading railway station after a ^20 million redevelopment.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Silver on July 15, 2014, 11:20:06
    Let's hope she isn't travelling by train from Windsor as the signals through the Thames valley are not robust enough to ensure that she will arrive on time.....

    It's great having a re-vamped station, just sad that the infrastructure to get passengers there is currently not fit-for-purpose as evidenced by the signalling fiascos on both Monday morning and evening along the mainline into London.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: insider on July 17, 2014, 05:52:04
    Well to host the queen later this morning, from 0900 the B side of the transfer deck will be closed to general public.

    There are loads of things being set up this morning lots of giant TV screens and sound systems....and lots of things being cleaned!!!

    There will be lots of additional staff / security on hand to direct "normal passengers"

    On a separate note Network Rail have installed 4 self service giant touchscreen info points. 2 on transfer deck and 2 on western gateline.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on July 17, 2014, 08:18:20
    There were signs yesterday saying the northern entrance would be closed 9:00 to 14:00. Also that the main public viewing area was there. I don't think it is finished, but it has been made to look pretty, though with a hoarding round it. They also say there will be viewing areas inside the station for those with tickets. Which I may be - depending on exactly when I get back today.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on July 17, 2014, 08:50:21
    If there's a signal failure will they pay for a taxi for Her Maj to get to Reading from Paddington, or will she be told to get the Picadilly Line to Heathrow and catch the bus?  ;D


    Title: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: Busboy W1 on July 17, 2014, 11:18:49
    The Queen is apparently at Reading Stn today to officially open the refurbished station and possibly Reading Depot. The big rumour part is that 166221 the newly refurbished turbo is to be named by The Queen and named Reading Traincare Depot. Can anybody else confirm this or add any light on these possible events ?


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: paul7575 on July 17, 2014, 11:42:38
    She's definitely naming the HOPS train, in one of the platforms.  Not rumour, pics on BBC Reading news site...

    Paul


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: trainer on July 17, 2014, 12:30:45
    If it's on one of the platforms, any pics of her slipping her Golden Ticket going through the barriers?


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: SDS on July 17, 2014, 13:40:03
    Excuse me madam can I see your ticket?
    What do you mean you dont need one?
    Right then, name and address please.

    Elizabeth Windsor, Buckingham Palace? Really? Pull the other one......


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: patch38 on July 17, 2014, 14:16:09
    Revenue Protection v SO14 - I'd pay good money to see that very brief stand-off  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on July 17, 2014, 16:38:23
    Well to host the queen later this morning, from 0900 the B side of the transfer deck will be closed to general public.

    There are loads of things being set up this morning lots of giant TV screens and sound systems....and lots of things being cleaned!!!


    She must think the whole world smells of fresh paint.


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: johoare on July 17, 2014, 17:53:59
    I did wonder why there were so many policemen at Reading station when I passed through about 9.30am


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 17, 2014, 18:52:59
    If you catch the BBC South Today segment about the Queen's visit, on iPlayer or whatever, Paul Clifton does a bit to camera afterwards from the viaduct, showing the progress there over the last few weeks.  I hadn't noticed before that there are quite a few OHLE stanchions already erected along the high level.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on July 17, 2014, 23:38:07
    Thanks to OTC for these pictures

    (http://www.wellho.net/pix/DSC04035e.jpg)

    (http://www.wellho.net/pix/DSC04046e.jpg)

    Nice pics, thanks!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on July 18, 2014, 00:18:28
    Anyone know what band that was playing today? Uniform is slightly confusing me. Not one of the Guards bands as far as I can work out as they are wearing Busby hats rather than Bearskins.



    EDIT: S'okay. Found 'em. It's the Band of the Corps of Royal Engineers. Appropriate I suppose!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on July 18, 2014, 05:56:36
    I think the caption should read

    "Excuse me young man, are any trains running today?" "

    Don't worry Ma'am, you should get back to Paddington OK eventually, the next signal failure isn't scheduled till 4pm, but there's always the bus to Heathrow and the Piccadilly Line if it happens while you're still here!"  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on July 18, 2014, 14:55:40
    I've never seen so many pristine hi-vis overalls!   ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 22, 2014, 12:10:07
    A Network Rail time-lapse video (based on the previously familiar webcams) has appeared on youtube here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weBuFIzZ-PA

    What is interesting in the last section of the video (from about 1m 20s onwards) is the sheer size of that concrete box culvert section that will eventually be buried under the Feeder Line embankment.  Until you see it in real size those cross sectional drawings don't really demonstrate the overall width through the embankment...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on July 22, 2014, 14:44:44
    The 'missing' trailing crossover between the Up and Down Mains was installed, I think, over this last weekend (19th to 20th July) - at least I first noticed it yesterday afternoon. This is located at the London end of Platforms 9 and 10 and when commissioned (the 'feather' still has a white cross over it) will permit Down trains to halt in Platform 9 and then return eastwards on the Up Main. It's twin, the facing crossover, was put in at the same time as the big changes at Easter last year.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: tom m on July 22, 2014, 17:31:31
    Benches for waiting passengers appear to have been installed on the transfer deck recently


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SDS on July 22, 2014, 21:27:40
    I think the caption should read

    "Excuse me young man, are any trains running today?" "

    Don't worry Ma'am, you should get back to Paddington OK eventually, the next signal failure isn't scheduled till 4pm, but there's always the bus to Heathrow and the Piccadilly Line if it happens while you're still here!"  ;D

    And you can use that free Oyster Card TfL gave you with ^50 on it for your Golden Anniversary.


    Title: Re: The Queen at Reading Stn today 17/07/14.
    Post by: bobm on July 25, 2014, 11:12:35
    She's definitely naming the HOPS train, in one of the platforms.  Not rumour, pics on BBC Reading news site...

    Paul

    Managed to get a snap of the nameplate from a passing train

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/hopbru.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on July 31, 2014, 09:59:23
    I went to meet Mrs GTBE off a XC from Birmingham yesterday evening.  Guess what, there are NO Arrivals Boards on the bridge or at either of the new entrances.  So how is the average passenger meeting their granny etc supposed to know on what platform and when (the XC was 28 late) their train is arriving? I asked this question to the extremely helpful gateline staff, one of whom promptly got out his phone and looked at RealTimeTrains and gave me the correct information.

    So its seems anyone meeting someone at Reading has to find a member of staff who will use a phone to use what is basically a freeware programme produced by a student.  I hope FGW pay RTT a fee for the privilege - I don't believe that RTT should be used for commercial purposes.  And there should be Arrivals Boards on the station.

    edit - spelling error


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on July 31, 2014, 10:12:57
    With barriers in operation, I guess you're meant to meet at said barriers?

    If you have to ask to be let through as the traveller is infirm/old/etc, I guess one can ask at the same time?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on July 31, 2014, 11:38:04
    Saw some more badly worded signs yesterday, although some may think I'm being pedantic...   

    At the top of the stairs/escalators at the appropriate side of the transfer deck there have been small signs added indicating the location of the toilets.   

    But they read (for example, and from memory) "Toilets are at the A-side of this platform".   But this seems wrong to me, A and B refer to the respective halves or ends of the platforms, because they are long and thin.   And what is that hyphen about?

    Simple English usage.  It is perfectly OK to refer to the A and B 'sides' of the transfer deck, because of its orientation, but that doesn't follow that the same is true for the platforms.  The sides of the platform islands have numbers, its the ends that have letters...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Steevp on July 31, 2014, 12:14:05
    Saw some more badly worded signs yesterday, although some may think I'm being pedantic...   

    At the top of the stairs/escalators at the appropriate side of the transfer deck there have been small signs added indicating the location of the toilets.   

    But they read (for example, and from memory) "Toilets are at the A-side of this platform".   But this seems wrong to me, A and B refer to the respective halves or ends of the platforms, because they are long and thin.   And what is that hyphen about?

    Simple English usage.  It is perfectly OK to refer to the A and B 'sides' of the transfer deck, because of its orientation, but that doesn't follow that the same is true for the platforms.  The sides of the platform islands have numbers, its the ends that have letters...

    Paul

    I think you are correct Paul - it does matter. If a sign does not impart clear unequivocal information, then it has failed IMHO


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on July 31, 2014, 13:23:37
    Whilst I can see the transfer deck can have an A and B side, don't teh paltforms have two A and B sides?  ???


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on July 31, 2014, 23:51:13
    Whilst I can see the transfer deck can have an A and B side, don't teh paltforms have two A and B sides?  ???

    As do vinyl LP's. Platform areas here mean "ends" not "sides", in this case East ends and West ends.

    The sides are in fact numbered, 1 - 15, happily no longer including  4a, 4b.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on August 11, 2014, 08:04:52
    A few observations while travelling through Reading this morning:

    1. The fast down main has new track panels attached that run up the slope leading to the country-end of the new viaduct proper. Large (Very large) piles of ballest is at the start of the viaduct, ready for laying up it.

    2. The new main viaduct looked prettuch complete. Railings in place, OLE stantions (?) are all there, metal trunking in place for cabling.

    3. The Festival viaduct has all piers there - with one on the country end still having some form work in place - which I think was in the process of being lifted off by a large crane in situ.

    4. The flood relief 'boxes' seem to be complete and soil was evident on top over a lot of them.

    Just a casual observation now : once the main line has been instated across the viaduct and the reliefs slewed back to their original position it does strike me that there is a long stretch of line 'real estate' that will be left empty (old main line).

    I wondered if rather than using it for Buddlia growth if the Reading West line could not continue further westwards - almost as far as Scours Lane - before joining with the reliefs ? Would this not be a better holding point for the long freights using that line - than perhaps, as is often the case now, being held on the curve ?

    It perhaps would mean the lines from Reading West Curve diving under the main lines (name?) would not face being blocked by stationary freights.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 11, 2014, 08:40:02
    I wondered if rather than using it for Buddlia growth if the Reading West line could not continue further westwards - almost as far as Scours Lane - before joining with the reliefs ? Would this not be a better holding point for the long freights using that line - than perhaps, as is often the case now, being held on the curve ?

    The pinch point is at Wigmore Lane, about halfway to Scours Lane. By then the mains are back on their old alignment, and there used to be two reliefs and one goods loop. The new layout has the same goods loop plus the access track for the depot, and the bridge was extended for that but I would imagine no further. So the extra width only goes part-way, and the reliefs will be slewed diagonally across the available space to eliminate the wiggles currently near Scours Lane.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 11, 2014, 09:12:25
    2. The new main viaduct looked prettuch complete. Railings in place, OLE stantions (?) are all there, metal trunking in place for cabling.

    3. The Festival viaduct has all piers there - with one on the country end still having some form work in place - which I think was in the process of being lifted off by a large crane in situ.

    Here's a picture from Saturday of the viaduct as seen from the station - obviously very much foreshortened. No sign of track yet, but with bags of, presumably, ballast sitting there it can't be long. Last week it was full of vehicles, which have now gone.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 11, 2014, 10:46:13
    The pinch point is at Wigmore Lane, about halfway to Scours Lane. By then the mains are back on their old alignment, and there used to be two reliefs and one goods loop. The new layout has the same goods loop plus the access track for the depot, and the bridge was extended for that but I would imagine no further. So the extra width only goes part-way, and the reliefs will be slewed diagonally across the available space to eliminate the wiggles currently near Scours Lane.

    Having looked at the relevant picture (and Google Earth), there were in fact two goods lines on the bridge. Hence it is unclear why the bridge deck needed widening, unless to extend a new deck to replace an old one. Or maybe tracks are now spaced further apart. Anyway, the bridge still sets the width limit in an obvious way at this point - though widening the formation to the west might in fact involve widening the embankment, and observing slope limits would mean a land take...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 11, 2014, 13:06:55
    Widening Wigmore Lane Bridge towards the north seems to have been allowed by a stand alone planning application, made back in 2008.   Available at the usual place under RBC reference 081025.    Looks like they explained on a single sheet of text that (presumably as a prerequisite to the new depot) they needed more room for the depot entry line, a track diagram suggests the points leading towards the depot are west of the bridge, and the extra width of the embankment is about enough for one track, which is shown with a significant gap between it and the then northernmost track of six.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 11, 2014, 13:21:36
    I wondered if rather than using it for Buddlia growth if the Reading West line could not continue further westwards - almost as far as Scours Lane - before joining with the reliefs ? Would this not be a better holding point for the long freights using that line - than perhaps, as is often the case now, being held on the curve ?

    It perhaps would mean the lines from Reading West Curve diving under the main lines (name?) would not face being blocked by stationary freights.

    I think the eventual junction between the west curves and the reliefs will be in the vicinity of the Little Johns Lane bridge, and that gives about 1500 yards of standage round to the junctions of the Feeder Lines and the west curve, which are pretty much as near the existing Oxford Rd Junction as they can be.     That should be ample for NR's planned maximum train length which is about 700m?    Please excuse mixed measurements...   ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 11, 2014, 15:10:40
    I wondered if rather than using it for Buddlia growth if the Reading West line could not continue further westwards - almost as far as Scours Lane - before joining with the reliefs ? Would this not be a better holding point for the long freights using that line - than perhaps, as is often the case now, being held on the curve ?

    It perhaps would mean the lines from Reading West Curve diving under the main lines (name?) would not face being blocked by stationary freights.

    There is another answer to that question - that as no passenger services are foreseen to use the West Curve, no money should be spent on this. All the track layout is designed for intended services only. That does include "7-day-railway" and diversions, though only in a limited way, and diversionary use of the West Curve will be rare.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on August 17, 2014, 01:49:27
    New mainline viaduct is now covered its entire length with nice clean ballest. Track at country end not progressed further AFAICS.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on August 19, 2014, 12:06:28
    Semi off topic but with the festival coming up this weekend, things could get a little congested around the south entrance with only two narrow walkways to get out, one of which only goes to the Brunel Arcade.

    [ Assuming the ongoing works don't suddenly burst into life, which hasn't exactly been the case recently ].


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2014, 12:51:17
    I think the majority of festival goers will be encouraged to head for the north entrance like last year, now with its new public space area.  Obviously the south entrance/exits will be busier than usual, but I doubt it'll be too much of a problem - at least, not when compared with the station pre-rebuilding.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 19, 2014, 13:22:37
    I think the majority of festival goers will be encouraged to head for the north entrance like last year, now with its new public space area.  Obviously the south entrance/exits will be busier than usual, but I doubt it'll be too much of a problem - at least, not when compared with the station pre-rebuilding.
    Well, last year the official advice for the Monday was :
    Quote
    Please use signage to get to the North entrance where you will be able to enter and catch your train
    But on the day everyone was directed to queue through the tunnel and up the ramp and in via the western gateline. Perhaps that was seen as a way to accommodate a long queue outside the station...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 19, 2014, 13:39:21
    Yes, that would indeed be a good way of accommodating a large queue in a relatively quiet area.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on August 20, 2014, 08:35:43
    Failed freight train blocking relief, Newbury and Basingstoke lines. I'm sure the main is affected too as I've not seen a main train in 15 minutes.

    I'm drawn back to a post a few pages back - if a failed freight can have passenger service impact today, and with the expectation that train lengths will only get longer - shouldn't the Reading west line be extended to take a full length freight - to minimise this distruption.





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 20, 2014, 10:20:54
    Failed freight train blocking relief, Newbury and Basingstoke lines. I'm sure the main is affected too as I've not seen a main train in 15 minutes.

    I'm drawn back to a post a few pages back - if a failed freight can have passenger service impact today, and with the expectation that train lengths will only get longer - shouldn't the Reading west line be extended to take a full length freight - to minimise this distruption.

    This looks like a failure at a random position blocking the junction, so the specific answer is no.

    Otherwise, the normal waiting position will be on the West Curve, which is nearly 1 km something like 750 m long. This is not expected to carry scheduled passenger services, so is anything more needed?

    BTW it looks as if the failed train was 422Q Trafford Park F.L.T. - Southampton M.C.T. , 0624^ at Tilehurst and 0856 at Southcote. 468Q Lawley Street F.L.T. - Southampton M.C.T. was timed 0630^ at Tilehurst and if it was pushing would not register further on.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 20, 2014, 10:37:53
    [Otherwise, the normal waiting position will be on the West Curve, which is nearly 1 km something like 750 m long. This is not expected to carry scheduled passenger services, so is anything more needed?
    The new track does run a bit further west before the points, which will be up close to Little John's Lane. So another remeasure gives 1 km for down trains, though less the other way as the Feeder Line joins the West Curve some way north of Oxford Road.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 20, 2014, 10:48:57
    This is not expected to carry scheduled passenger services ...

    Silly question that may have been answered earlier. Isn't there any sort of "parliamentary" service on the line - as I recall Reading used to be avoided by some trains and I wasn't aware of any formal withdrawal.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 20, 2014, 10:52:26
    This is not expected to carry scheduled passenger services ...

    Silly question that may have been answered earlier. Isn't there any sort of "parliamentary" service on the line - as I recall Reading used to be avoided by some trains and I wasn't aware of any formal withdrawal.

    That doesn't affect an argument about whether you can park goods trains there and have them fail without causing chaos.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on August 20, 2014, 11:27:14
    I think the majority of festival goers will be encouraged to head for the north entrance like last year, now with its new public space area

    If there were a number of popup stalls in that area selling lager & cider by the pallet then I imagine the north entrance would become hugely popular ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on August 20, 2014, 22:05:56
    I understand (I think) about the 750m length standard - yet this morning a freight train blocked (from North to South) reliefs, main, reading west curve, Basingstoke and Newbury line !!!

    That has to longer than 750m

    On this forum in the thread about this AMs disruption it is suggested that these freight are longer than the standard (and will get longer).

    While the new flyover would have prevented the mains being blocked - everything else would still have been shot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 20, 2014, 22:59:24
    I understand (I think) about the 750m length standard - yet this morning a freight train blocked (from North to South) reliefs, main, reading west curve, Basingstoke and Newbury line !!!

    That has to longer than 750m

    On this forum in the thread about this AMs disruption it is suggested that these freight are longer than the standard (and will get longer).

    While the new flyover would have prevented the mains being blocked - everything else would still have been shot.

    Well, do we know that train stopped at a signal and failed to start, or might it have failed while moving and didn't run clear of Reading West Jn?

    And how much more length do you want? I said there was less for southbound trains due to the junction with the end of the Feeder Relief Line, but there isn't a very strong reason to leave that clear unless it's going to be used. So there may be the same as for northbound trains, i.e. about 1 km. For reference:

    West Curve as it is to the Main Lines at Reading West: 840 m (nominal, so less clearance for each end of block say 650)
    Reading West to Little John's Lane: 411 m (most to be added to West Curve length - say 350 m)
    Little John's Lane to Wigmore Lane: 460 m
    Wigmore Lane to Scours Lane: 490 m.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on August 20, 2014, 23:20:17

    If there were a number of popup stalls in that area selling lager & cider by the pallet then I imagine the north entrance would become hugely popular ;)

    The only situation in which I am proud to be a Thatcherite!

    I went to a few Reading festivals, most of which  involved camping under water, and chemical alteration to my minsdset, an avenue of pleasure long closed off to me (I last smoked tobacco on 12 May 1991,and two weeks later wondered what pleasure I gained from 20-odd years'  use of the fragrant weed.. Several were compered by (the late) John Peel, They featured (the late) Phil Lynott. Also Manfred Mann's Earth Band, Eddie and the Hotrods, the Sensational (Late) Alex Harvey Band (/late]. I got there late.

    There were many others, and tales I could tell of times I was not necessarily proud of, but at that time, I would not have been able to tell my kids that I had seen Led Zeppelin, Genesis,, the Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd, Etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: patch38 on August 21, 2014, 07:49:38
    Eddie and the Hotrods! That must have been 1977? Fantastic.

    One of my jobs at Reading for several years was to look after the DJ console between the two stages from which Peel and others linked the various acts. I recall one Saturday afternoon when he announced the football results: Liverpool (his team) had beaten someone like Man U and he gleefully announced the fact, taking the opportunity to rubbish the Man U fans. This was the cue for a stream of mud and plastic bottles full of lukewarm urine to rain down on us. "Was that wise John?," I asked him as we hid under the desk. "Probably not," came the reply, "But f*** 'em." Happy times  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 21, 2014, 11:58:42
    And how much more length do you want? I said there was less for southbound trains due to the junction with the end of the Feeder Relief Line, but there isn't a very strong reason to leave that clear unless it's going to be used. So there may be the same as for northbound trains, i.e. about 1 km. For reference:

    West Curve as it is to the Main Lines at Reading West: 840 m (nominal, so less clearance for each end of block say 650)
    Reading West to Little John's Lane: 411 m (most to be added to West Curve length - say 350 m)
    Little John's Lane to Wigmore Lane: 460 m
    Wigmore Lane to Scours Lane: 490 m.

    I have found some more official information on train lengths.

    • Network rail say this:
      Quote
      Freight train loads and lengths
      This data is contained in a series of what are known as Loads Books, which show the maximum sizes of trains which can operate between different points on the network.

      Some of the data is commercially sensitive and cannot be made readily available so if you have specific queries please email our Access Coordinator.
      Commercially sensitive? Really? No, I don't believe that either.
    • The sectional appendix contains this item:
      Quote
      High Output Ballast Cleaner (HOBC) and Track Relaying System (TRS) Trains
      These trains are authorised to transit between their operating bases and engineering possessions in excess of
      the normal route length limits on Western Route provided that a suitable train path has been identified.
      The train identification used and maximum lengths (including locomotives) are as follows:
      HOBC 6Y11 127 SLUs 811 metres 887 yards 2659 feet
      TRS    6Y33 117 SLUs 744 metres 813 yards 2439 feet
    • West Curve is nominally 43 chains long, i.e. 865 m (a chain is a shade over 20 m). I suspect this is measured between point ends.
    • The "standage" on the up curve (southbound) is only 545 m, and down there is 684 m


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 29, 2014, 21:30:46
    This short article in Railway Gazette:

    http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/infrastructure/single-view/view/reading-viaduct-ready-for-tracklaying.html

    reports that the viaduct has been handed over for track laying, which I think we were aware of, but it includes an interesting aerial view of the viaduct from a western viewpoint; this is quite detailed if you magnify it in a browser or whatever:

    (http://www.railwaygazette.com/uploads/pics/tn_gb-reading-viaduct-aerial-view-balfourbeatty.jpg)

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 29, 2014, 21:52:00
    Wot no Festival Line viaduct?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 30, 2014, 00:40:00
    Wot no Festival Line viaduct?
    Not planned to be finished yet AFAICT. The view from the Westbury line suggests that some of the girders are in, but definitely not all of them.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on August 30, 2014, 09:28:33
    Wot no Festival Line viaduct?
    Not planned to be finished yet AFAICT. The view from the Westbury line suggests that some of the girders are in, but definitely not all of them.

    Paul


    Deck beams for the Festival line in place as far as the east side of Cow Lane, when I went past last Wednesday, but not beyond that as the bridge piers on the west side of Cow Lane are still under construction. On the main viaduct some new track was in place on the western approach with the rest ballasted.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 30, 2014, 09:51:05
    Wot no Festival Line viaduct?
    Not planned to be finished yet AFAICT. The view from the Westbury line suggests that some of the girders are in, but definitely not all of them.

    Paul


    At first sight, it looked an odd critical path and can't be quickest to completion. However, on reflection, there are practical limits to how much of one kind of work can be done in parallel - labour, machines, space for deliveries and keeping stuff, just getting each others' way, etc. Allowing for that, doing all the main viaduct first does make sense. It also leaves much more time for photo-ops on it before the trains arrive.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 30, 2014, 13:42:53
    Allowing for that, doing all the main viaduct first does make sense. It also leaves much more time for photo-ops on it before the trains arrive.

    Another reason for doing the main viaduct first is that it's being brought into service over this Christmas.  I'm not sure that the Festival line is scheduled to be brought into use until the (final) blockade next Easter?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 30, 2014, 13:55:37
    Allowing for that, doing all the main viaduct first does make sense. It also leaves much more time for photo-ops on it before the trains arrive.

    Another reason for doing the main viaduct first is that it's being brought into service over this Christmas.  I'm not sure that the Festival line is scheduled to be brought into use until the (final) blockade next Easter?
    I think that's a result of the order chosen, not a reason to not do things simultaneously.

    The order is chosen because the current Main Lines have to be taken out to make space for the Festival and Feeder Lines to go in, following regrading.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 03, 2014, 12:06:21
    ......and here you will find a photograph of the Festival Line 'ski jump' (on the left hand side of the viaduct) ;) :D
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/15060060211/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 03, 2014, 21:30:35
    Great shots. I hadn't appreciated from earlier posted track schematics that the London end of the Main and Festival Lines were so close - almost a single 'throat' into the station.

    EDIT

    Obvious now looking at track diagrams - the 60 mph between the Festival and Main lines must take place on the lower slopes of the joined viaducts


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 08, 2014, 08:28:52
    A couple of observations this AM while going through Reading:

    One complete track now in situ across new main viaduct. Northern main track. End is visable from Reading station

    Festival line viaduct is now in place. Formwork for building walkways in place on Lobdon side. No progress AFAICS on earthworks to connect to country end of Festival line

    Lots of Little Grey Boxes (S&T) appeared under the main viaduct.

    Definite graded earthworks for freight line from Reading West to viaduct dive under. Gentle slope in place across concrete boxes for flooding defense clearly visible.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on September 08, 2014, 11:29:29
    One complete track now in situ across new main viaduct. Northern main track. End is visable from Reading station

    Indeed, there was an Engineers train on this when I departed Reading westwards last night around 1911.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 08, 2014, 19:44:16
    There are photographs of the Festival Line viaduct beams being installed on 04 September 2014 here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/14955069057/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/52834510@N00/15118625696/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 09, 2014, 13:09:16
    One complete track now in situ across new main viaduct. Northern main track. End is visable from Reading station

    Indeed, there was an Engineers train on this when I departed Reading westwards last night around 1911.

    Are you sure?  I went past this morning, and although there appears to be a physical connection of the rails at the west end of the viaduct to the redundant trailing slip into the DM, there were quite a few sleepers missing. However, there is a new transfer ramp for road-rail vehicles at the west end, I wonder whether you perhaps saw one or more road-rail vehicles up on the viaduct?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on September 09, 2014, 13:30:41
    No, there was a loco attached to engineering wagons. Made me check & look again....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 09, 2014, 14:33:21
    Fine, I wasn't sure whether you just had a fleeting glance as you passed etc.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on September 10, 2014, 13:55:46
    I'm putting this here as it's connected with the works....

    From Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/cow-lane-road-scheme-could-7745770)

    Quote
    Cow Lane road scheme could be delayed for an extra year as dispute heads to tribunal
     
    The transformation of the bottleneck at Cow Lane bridges could be held up for a year by one landowner holding out for more cash.

    Reading Borough Council is now preparing to pursue its compulsory purchase order through a public inquiry run by the Lands Tribunal if it cannot resolve the disagreement with the landowner over the level of compensation in the next few weeks.

    There were four objections to the compulsory purchase order process from landowners in the vicinity of the two bridges, but three of have now been resolved by negotiation.

    Only one remains, but Reading Borough Council is not naming the company holding out for a higher compensation sum.

    If the landowner is shown to be making an unreasonable claim, the Lands Tribunal could order the company to pay costs.

    The borough council and Network Rail also face a costly process which could go on as far as the High Court.

    The Lands Tribunal is unlikely to hear the case before next year with a decision no earlier than next June.

    The traffic management sub-committee is due to hear a report about the delay to the works, part of the Reading Station ^895 million redevelopment scheme, at its meeting tomorrow.

    Deputy leader of the council Councillor Tony Page described the present state of negotiations as ^delicate^, one of the reasons why the company in question was not being named.

    He stressed the stumbling block would only delay and not prevent the widening of the road under the two bridges.

    He said the road widening scheme ^ which should have been fully opened by next spring ^ had been ^decoupled^ from the reconstruction of the second Cow Lane bridge because of the glitch over the final parcel of land.

    Cllr Page told the Reading Post: ^We are talking about a very small, but obviously significant strip of land. The date for holding an inquiry is not in our gift, it is in the hands of the Lands Tribunal.^

    He went on: ^Three of the four objections will be resolved, but one outstanding objection is proving more intractable.

    ^Although there is an offer of compensation on the table, this company is not accepting the figure under offer.^

    A report to the committee says: ^Negotiations with the objectors continue and there remains a possibility that if the proposed agreements are approved and the objections are withdrawn, the public inquiry will no longer be required.^

    The road widening when complete will provide two carriageways, safer pedestrian walkways and a cycle lane under the bridge.

    The new bridge will allow Richfield Avenue to become a bus route.

    The bridges have long been the cause of a notorious local bottleneck for traffic travelling between West Reading, Central Reading and Caversham made worse by truck drivers ignoring the height restrictions and getting stuck under the arch of the railway bridge.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on September 10, 2014, 14:41:25
    ^Buy land, they're not making it anymore^

    Mark Twain was right!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 10, 2014, 14:44:48
    In the earlier story on the BBC site, they refer to the 'the road under the Cow Lane bridges' and the local MP also confuses the issue IMHO by referring to the 'completion of the bridges' being delayed:  

    Quote
    Plans to improve the road under the Cow Lane bridges are being held back as Reading Borough Council negotiates with local land owners.
    Deputy leader Tony Page said the talks to purchase land from a number of companies could delay work by up to a year.
    Reading West MP Alok Sharma has now offered to step in to help speed up the negotiations.
    The council needs to take over additional land alongside Richfield Avenue in order to complete the widening works.
    Mr Page said the council could be forced to go down a lengthy legal route to push the move through, if an agreement cannot be reached.
    He said: "If necessary we will have to use the formal legal procedures, as the land is absolutely essential to delivering the full benefits of the bridge widening."
    Mr Sharma said: "It is very worrying and I would be very happy to help and intervene to see if there is anything I can do as a Member of Parliament to assist in this process.
    "We have got a really successful project at the train station, it is below budget, it is opening ahead of time and really it would be fantastic if we could get Cow Lane bridges done on time as well."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-29109904

    I think the photo in the 'GetReading' article shows the new bridge structures are fundamentally complete, it is presumably the follow up road widening outside of the NR site boundary and leading to the bridge that is being delayed, and as the BBC point out the problem is actually with a plot alongside Richfield Way - which rather narrows down the possibilities to somewhere to the north of the site on the west of the road, surely?

    Hence there should be no problem actually bringing the new route through the western of the two structures into use?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on September 10, 2014, 15:53:10
    What's wrong with the council completing the rest of the work, with the strip of land obvious to all concerned. Then put a sign up that explains to passers by why they are having to wait another year to enjoy the benefits of the improvements, and how the other landowners cooperated.  Even if they don't name the party concerned, it won't be too hard to guess.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 10, 2014, 21:51:36
    I saw some plans about the redevelopment of the Cow Lane/Richfield Rd junction.

    One had an expanded roundabout - with Cow Lane widened at the mouth - requiring land on just 2 sides. The second included a slip lane on the roundabout for traffic towards the new bridges. This required more land from Richfield Avenue

    I surprised its 4 land owners involved - but plans may have changed.

    The biggest looser was the removal of most of the Diary Crest site on the railway side of Cow Lane/Richfield Rd. But given the number of vacant warehouses down Richfield Rd I can't imagine relocation / disruption to business would be large - warrenting large compensation !



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Grinder on September 14, 2014, 17:40:28
    Saw a Colas class 70 on the viaduct this morning, looked to have wagons with ballast in tow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on September 14, 2014, 19:52:37
    Thanks for posting that useful update information here, Grinder - and welcome to the Coffee Shop forum!  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 15, 2014, 11:40:14
    Is it possible they've been dropping top ballast on the eventual up main line over the weekend?  Perhaps someone will be past the station and able to check?

    At the end of last week it looked as though they were still at the stage where the sleepers, with track fitted, were lying on the levelled ballast.  But all the same it is good progress given that it isn't expected to be in use for well over three months yet...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 15, 2014, 21:04:00
    I saw the Train on the eastern side of the main viaduct on Sunday at 10am ish.

    The 'bed' of ballast is down - and has been for for a week - on the up and down new main. The new up main has been 'straightened' and looks ready for its top coat of ballast.
    At the moment the aligned sleepers are held in place every 100 yards or so with a 'dab' of top ballast.

    The train only had about 3 yellow Network Rail low side wagons - as far as I could see.

    Also - the double track drive under earthworks from Reading West to under the Festival and a Main are clearly visible now - with a broader span than just two tracks from what I saw.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 15, 2014, 23:23:35
    ...
    Also - the double track drive under earthworks from Reading West to under the Festival and a Main are clearly visible now - with a broader span than just two tracks from what I saw.

    Edited and expanded post follows having checked the planning drawings...

    There's a widening gap between the two tracks of the feeder lines as they go south, looks as though this is to get the right alignment of the junctions.  I think this is because the up main feeder (the eastern line of the pair) connects to the Up Westbury Line rather than the west curve, and is presumably a reasonably high speed junction so it swings away from the down relief feeder line.  (Up and Down directions here refer to the connections in the main station, they will both be bidirectional lines.)

    Then following the original design, a decision was made to use the shortened upper triangle sidings as the local National Delivery Service (NDS) yard, for infrastructure material delivery, and this required road access for HGVs.  An access road was already provided from Cow Lane, going under the feeder lines and into the area that used to be the lower triangle depot site, and this has been adapted by adding another road that turns left and then rises through 270 degrees to the higher level and runs south alongside the feeder lines as well.  This required both the bridge and the culvert sections to be widened significantly.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 16, 2014, 19:49:08
    Paul - can you snapshot the plan as a picture and share ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 16, 2014, 22:38:36
    Paul - can you snapshot the plan as a picture and share ?

    No problem, I'll look it out in the morning:

    From RBC planning application 130763 - "Alteration to the new railway line through the triangle area to incorporate a new access roadway on the eastern side of the embankment. Amendment to 11/01885/FUL".

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 19, 2014, 23:17:31
    Went through today. 

    Looks like work has just started on the second track over the viaduct from the west. Signs of S&T wiring in place fixed to cable trays on the southern parapet.

    On the festival lines all the beams are in on the viaduct section with work on end supports and deck just starting.

    The foundations for the embankment to the west of the festival lines viaduct also being prepared.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on September 20, 2014, 11:14:31
    Went through today. 

    Looks like work has just started on the second track over the viaduct from the west. Signs of S&T wiring in place fixed to cable trays on the southern parapet.

    On the festival lines all the beams are in on the viaduct section with work on end supports and deck just starting.

    The foundations for the embankment to the west of the festival lines viaduct also being prepared.

    Having just browsed back through a few earlier posts, I'd add to your information just to emphasise that there are no viaduct sections on the Festival Line west of the Cow Lane, so building up the embankment seems to be about the only major remaining activity on that particular route.

    (There's a few earlier posts that refer to the 'east side' of the Festival viaduct, or the viaduct supports on the 'west side', as though it continues, IYSWIM).

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 21, 2014, 16:12:03
    Here is the layout sketch as was proposed in 2008 (as with these documents I have posted before this shows the older dive-under proposal for the flyover, but the track layout is approximately the same):

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/Reading%20Xmas%202014.jpg?cache=0.3403356105554849)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 21, 2014, 17:28:57
    Ah - but that plan, keeping all the connections from the Westburies to the Mains, is no longer going to happen. It was still the plan later in 2008, after the viaduct had been chosen - this (very lo-res) picture dates from the bidders' conference. It is for the stage (about two steps further on) when the Festival Line has just been attached to a loose end of an old Main Line.

    In that plan, right at the end after the Feeder Lines had been opened, all the temporary trackwork from P7-9 onto the viaduct had to be replaced with new, moving it southwards. I assume that in the new plan the trackwork that goes in there will be pretty much in its final location, as in the second picture. Remember that the final layout has no connection from P9 to the Westburies. Note also that the station end of the Festival Line (to the High Level Junction) now goes in at the same time, while it was going to be built from the west end first.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 22, 2014, 21:22:32
    Well your Phase 70 seems to match my copy of Stage 10-11 which (in 2008) was programmed for post Xmas 2014.  Its obvious now, that to get the project completed a year early, that a number of planned stages have been welded together ::) :P.

    (http://cbrailways.co.uk/PhotoAlbumsPro/1379866239/Reading%20Stage%2010-11.jpg?cache=0.036211419152095914)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 22, 2014, 21:27:56
    Noticed today that the Down Main track has also now been added over the new viaduct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on September 22, 2014, 21:59:14
    And also today - clear signs of earth being graded up to first pilon (at cow lane) on western end of festival line.

    There has been some drilling going on around there - presumably for pumping concrete to stabilise the ramp to be built


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 04, 2014, 23:13:28
    This rather impressive congregation of cable drums and lineside cabinets has appeared behind Reading station. I presume it is mostly needed for the viaduct and the new Feeder Lines, rather then for electrification.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 04, 2014, 23:19:58
    I don't know storing signalling equipment in what was once GWR's signalling workshops! Whatever next.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on October 05, 2014, 10:49:56
    Obviously the remaining cabinets for the Xmas to Easter works.  The ones with the yellow stripes are signalling power cabinets.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 05, 2014, 12:21:04
    A large gantry, complete with three signals, has appeared on the viaduct towards the eastern end.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on October 08, 2014, 08:01:06
    And I noted today while passing that the 3 signals (mains and festival) on the gantry are all mounted facing the country end - controlling access to Reading station. Suggesting, at least the down main is going to be bi- directional.

    Also two tampers on each new main line at country end this morning, on new viaduct track. The track looked well bedded, with noticeable camber dealing with the, now gentle, curve onto the main alignment

    Earth / spoil piles are appearing along the country end of the festival line - presumably for the grading up to the new Cow Lane bridge/viaduct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 08, 2014, 11:29:07
    And I noted today while passing that the 3 signals (mains and festival) on the gantry are all mounted facing the country end - controlling access to Reading station. Suggesting, at least the down main is going to be bi- directional.

    Yes, presumably bi-directional from the crossover that it supposed to be on the viaduct itself.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on October 08, 2014, 17:13:10
    And I noted today while passing that the 3 signals (mains and festival) on the gantry are all mounted facing the country end - controlling access to Reading station. Suggesting, at least the down main is going to be bi- directional.

    Yes, presumably bi-directional from the crossover that it supposed to be on the viaduct itself.

    You presumme corectly. The crossover will be installed facing Up Main to Down Main more  or less on the crest of the flyover, with a second crossover From Down Main to the  Festival line. This will give Crosscountries two routes to and from Paltform 3. Depending on whether they are routed Mains or Reliefs to and from Didcot. If on Up Main will use crossovers on the flyovers or if on Relief will use the Festival Line. Similarly Down trains can access Down Main on the flyover or Festval Line to Down Felief


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 08, 2014, 17:54:46
    Here's a pic of a tamper working on the Festival Line at the east end of the ramp this morning, thought it might help for those who haven't yet seen the gantry being discussed above...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lordgoata on October 09, 2014, 09:10:33
    A huge flight of stairs has appeared part way along as well now, I assume for emergency exit in case of an issue on the viaduct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 09, 2014, 09:34:44
    A huge flight of stairs has appeared part way along as well now, I assume for emergency exit in case of an issue on the viaduct.
    Yes - there are to be six "steel emergency access stairs", three on each side of the viaduct.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 09, 2014, 22:43:34
    Here's a long shot view of that signal gantry, with three tracks up onto the viaduct - and a crossover too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on October 10, 2014, 22:31:23
    Thanks for that photograph STUVING.  I bet there will be lots of telephoto lens photographs in the January 2015 railway press of trains coming over the top of that 'ski jump' :D ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 11, 2014, 22:12:10
    Is there a diagram available anywhere of the proposed track layout west of Reading Station after January?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on October 11, 2014, 22:44:23
    Is there a diagram available anywhere of the proposed track layout west of Reading Station after January?

    ....err its in post 2850 above... :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on October 11, 2014, 22:58:53
    Is there a diagram available anywhere of the proposed track layout west of Reading Station after January?

    ....err its in post 2850 above... :D

    Sorry the posts around then refer to three diagrams only two of which are the same.  Is the layout after January going to be the temporary one in the 2008 Stage 6 and Phase 70 drawing or the final Phase 76?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 11, 2014, 23:58:21
    Sorry the posts around then refer to three diagrams only two of which are the same.  Is the layout after January going to be the temporary one in the 2008 Stage 6 and Phase 70 drawing or the final Phase 76?
    None of the above. The discussion then was about the new phasing, which is not as shown on any of the plans done beforehand. It's roughly as phase 76 between P8/9 and the viaduct, but otherwise as phase 70. Probably.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 13, 2014, 00:22:35
    Sorry the posts around then refer to three diagrams only two of which are the same.  Is the layout after January going to be the temporary one in the 2008 Stage 6 and Phase 70 drawing or the final Phase 76?
    None of the above. The discussion then was about the new phasing, which is not as shown on any of the plans done beforehand. It's roughly as phase 76 between P8/9 and the viaduct, but otherwise as phase 70. Probably.

    Hopefully these will help:

    (https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3931/15333736760_518f7dd03d_c.jpg)

    (https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5607/15520082132_73078a6665_b.jpg)

    (https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5597/15497292556_15a803b5ec_b.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on October 13, 2014, 10:48:50
    Many thanks for those - very interesting.

    I can see now that a down fast (Main) will be able to cross to the down slow (Relief) grade separated via the Festival Line and Platforms 7 or 8. Didn't spot that before.  Could be useful for the Oxford/Didcot semi-fasts in the evening peak

    There are also hints in the layout that the Westbury lines will become bidirectional all the way to Southcote Junction - it lacks some signals at the moment but there are some indications from others that are present.  This would allow parallel moves to/from Basinstoke and Newbury and could be quite useful for accommodating the stone trains, etc.

    I am still trying to work out the final topology of the Relief Lines and their connections at the country end of Reading Traincare Depot.

    I have downloaded a copy of Signalling Group Standards here (http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Control%20Command%20and%20Signalling/Railway%20Group%20Standards/GKRT0004%20Iss%201.pdf) but I can still not work out what the crossed-feathers on T.1717/19/21 mean.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 13, 2014, 11:04:47
    Many thanks

    I have downloaded a copy of Signalling Group Standards here (http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Control%20Command%20and%20Signalling/Railway%20Group%20Standards/GKRT0004%20Iss%201.pdf) but I can still not work out what the crossed-feathers on T.1717/19/21 mean.

    No problem.  The crossed feathers simply mean that the junction indicators are installed, but not in use until April.  For you stat fans out there it's interesting that the viaduct slope at the western end is slightly steeper at 1/85 than the eastern end at 1/93.  The top of the viaduct isn't quite level either, sloping downwards gently towards London at 1/730!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on October 13, 2014, 11:10:58
    To help drainage perhaps?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 13, 2014, 11:51:36
      For you stat fans out there it's interesting that the viaduct slope at the eastern end is slightly steeper at 1/85 than the western end at 1/93.  The top of the viaduct isn't quite level either, sloping upwards gently towards London at 1/730!

    Are you sure it's that way round? We had some numbers about gradients provided earlier on, during a rather long discussion about the difficulties of starting goods trains. That said the mains from west to east had 85R/730F/93F.

    The reliefs had 361F/420R/730R from a different start point, so the viaduct isn't matching the ground form. I think the main point is that the West Curve is almost at the level of the reliefs as the viaduct goes over it, while the feeder Lines are 3-4 m lower in their box. So the viaduct can fall towards the station, allowing the ramp up out of the station to be less steep. Almost every train attacks that from a standing start, and every little helps...

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 14, 2014, 10:44:01
      For you stat fans out there it's interesting that the viaduct slope at the eastern end is slightly steeper at 1/85 than the western end at 1/93.  The top of the viaduct isn't quite level either, sloping upwards gently towards London at 1/730!
    Are you sure it's that way round? We had some numbers about gradients provided earlier on, during a rather long discussion about the difficulties of starting goods trains. That said the mains from west to east had 85R/730F/93F.

    Yes, my mistake - I was looking at the chart the wrong way round!   ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on October 15, 2014, 13:42:49
    I note from II's (very helpful) track diagrams that the Feeder Lines are now referred to as Main and Relief, with no reference to Up and Down, thus avoiding the confusion (well to me at least) of the Up and Down Feeder Lines appearing to be the wrong way round.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 15, 2014, 17:27:27
    I was having a play with realtimetrains earlier, it now includes dates after the New Year break, so I did a quick check of the XC platforming, because they are one of the significant conflicting factors for the spring timetable period.

    As I'd expect at this stage the terminating trains do still use P13 or P14, with a couple shunting via Kennet Bridge loop as now.

    Otherwise they generally use P3 and P8, with only a handful of trains in P7 over the course of the whole day. 

    As it stands timings seem incredibly tight - there's quite a few instances over the day where the public timings have trains in opposite directions to or from the festival line at the same time or within a minute or two.  Will require excellent time keeping if that stays the same...

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RDG/2015/01/05/0600-2000?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt&toc=XC

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on October 16, 2014, 09:21:53
    Thanks Paul.  1O84 0725 Newcastle - Soton has an interesting routeing through Reading, it's shown as approaching Reading on the UR, passing through P15 without stopping, reversing in Kennet Loop, and then finally stopping in P7 at 1218.  Now that's going to give passengers alighting at Reading a bit of a surprise.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 16, 2014, 11:54:26
    One of the early ECS trains from Eastleigh to Reading does a different 'run through', but in this case it runs through P7, down towards Earley, and then back through the Southern underpass.  Shows the large number of permutations they have available...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 16, 2014, 12:22:30
    Remember that in this period of early 2015 the feeder lines are not yet in place. Alternatives are needed for trains that would use them, and that means Up Westbury trains having to use P7 or P8 "backwards". There is thus an important time saving in XC running through, rather than reversing in, those platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 16, 2014, 12:25:08
    Remember that in this period of early 2015 the feeder lines are not yet in place. Alternatives are needed for trains that would use them, and that means Up Westbury trains having to use P7 or P8 "backwards". There is thus an important time saving in XC running through, rather than reversing in, those platforms.

    The move I mentioned already takes place today though, it isn't actually a new thing next year.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on October 16, 2014, 16:42:41
    I know that every day there are several XC's that reverse in Kennet Loop as ECS either for stabling or getting across the station, but not for a Class 1 passenger train!  I can't think of any similar move anywhere on the railway network.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 16, 2014, 17:31:42
    I'm sure it has already been done at Reading during a particular set of weekend engineering work, last year sometime.

    Once during some random disruption or other I was on a Southern service that left Southampton westwards, i.e. towards Millbrook from platform 3, then we reversed and ran non-stop through platform 1. As you'd expect that confused a few of passengers. 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 19, 2014, 23:27:46
    There has recently been an acceleration of the pace of RBC's work in front of the station. The steps are paved, and the area below the steps, across to the drop-off road access, is at last progressing too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on October 20, 2014, 12:58:52
    Good to see, and when this is finished it will be great news for a mate of mine who now runs "The Greyfriar" Pub, which you can see in the background of the second shot above.

    He has set it up as a proper "beer-drinkers pub" and hopefully the opening-up of that access will really see it come to life.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 20, 2014, 13:03:03
    Good to see, and when this is finished it will be great news for a mate of mine who now runs "The Greyfriar" Pub, which you can see in the background of the second shot above.

    He has set it up as a proper "beer-drinkers pub" and hopefully the opening-up of that access will really see it come to life.


    Yes, that little bit of Reading should be so much nicer and busier after the redevelopment is finished.  Good to see some tangible progress over the last few weeks on a scheme that seems to have take forever!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 20, 2014, 13:05:55
    In the second picture is it looks as though there now is pedestrian access alongside the new wall at the back of platform 1.  There seem to be a few members of the public visible, i.e. not dressed in builder's hi-vis anyway...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on October 20, 2014, 16:23:26
    In the second picture is it looks as though there now is pedestrian access alongside the new wall at the back of platform 1.  There seem to be a few members of the public visible, i.e. not dressed in builder's hi-vis anyway...

    Paul

    That's right you can come out of the new main entrance and turn right down the steps and use the old subway to get to the  North side. The old subway has been refurbished with no visible access to the platforms.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 20, 2014, 16:52:46
    That's right you can come out of the new main entrance and turn right down the steps and use the old subway to get to the  North side.

    As has been the case for well over 18 months though...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 20, 2014, 17:11:50
    In the second picture is it looks as though there now is pedestrian access alongside the new wall at the back of platform 1.  There seem to be a few members of the public visible, i.e. not dressed in builder's hi-vis anyway...

    Paul

    Well spotted - I must admit I've not been down there to look. There does now seem to be access via the stairs from the ramp, as well as at "ground" level, and there's a seat too.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 20, 2014, 17:14:51
    Another point your second photo shows is that they've removed the laminated timber capping from the concrete walls alongside the ramps.   I did hear a while ago that was a temporary solution - wonder what the final design will be?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on October 20, 2014, 18:17:00
    Good to see, and when this is finished it will be great news for a mate of mine who now runs "The Greyfriar" Pub, which you can see in the background of the second shot above.

    He has set it up as a proper "beer-drinkers pub" and hopefully the opening-up of that access will really see it come to life.


    You put forward a formidable case, T-C! What time is the next rain from BRI?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on October 20, 2014, 21:02:45
    Later tonight...it's going to be very wet! :/)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on October 20, 2014, 22:14:44
    Good to see, and when this is finished it will be great news for a mate of mine who now runs "The Greyfriar" Pub, which you can see in the background of the second shot above.

    He has set it up as a proper "beer-drinkers pub" and hopefully the opening-up of that access will really see it come to life.


    You put forward a formidable case, T-C! What time is the next rain from BRI?
    Next event night at The Greyfriar is an evening "Hogs Back Brewery Tap Takeover" on Weds 5th Nov - I may well be there myself ;-)

    To get a general flavour of whats on offer, have a look at "The Greyfriar, Reading" page in FB.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 21, 2014, 15:10:29
    Path definitely open seen looking towards station:


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on October 21, 2014, 16:35:59
    Later tonight...it's going to be very wet! :/)

    Prophetic typo there...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on October 21, 2014, 16:45:34
    no typo....:-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on October 21, 2014, 17:04:57
    no typo....:-)

    Sorry I meant my inadvertent meteorological request.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on October 23, 2014, 14:20:26
    The one remaining unused 'room' at the London end of P8/9 now has 'Delice de France' posters up on the windows.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on October 23, 2014, 14:46:01
    The one remaining unused 'room' at the London end of P8/9 now has 'Delice de France' posters up on the windows.

    Another nice, local, independent offering then.   ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 23, 2014, 16:04:32
    The one remaining unused 'room' at the London end of P8/9 now has 'Delice de France' posters up on the windows.

    Nearly exactly where they were before the upheaval then.  Maybe they've always had reserved rights for that unit...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on October 24, 2014, 01:25:38
    The one remaining unused 'room' at the London end of P8/9 now has 'Delice de France' posters up on the windows.

    Another nice, local, independent offering then.   ::)

    I considered a response in French, but we've had enough of that on the forum in recent days. Besides which, 'Delice de France' is about as French as something not very French. Actually part of a multinational food business with its strongest roots in Ireland.

    Vive la France to be sure.

    Sorry.  :-[


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on October 29, 2014, 18:24:59

    I considered a response in French, but we've had enough of that on the forum in recent days. Besides which, 'Delice de France' is about as French as something not very French. Actually part of a multinational food business with its strongest roots in Ireland.

    Vive la France to be sure.

    Sorry.  :-[

    No need for a soup^on of the old franglais there, BNM - frangturk^e will do. "Delice" is a Turkish word, meaning "Insane". In frangturk^e (or is it turkcais?) Delice de France could be translated as "Those crazy French". G^zel!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on October 31, 2014, 14:58:01
    A couple of photographs taken at the top of the new viaduct can be found on the Marlow and District Railway Society website here:
    http://www.mdrs.org.uk/gallery/2014/mw_rv_2675.jpg
    http://www.mdrs.org.uk/gallery/2014/mw_rv_2676.jpg


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 31, 2014, 15:30:35
    Outside the south western entrance the direct steps down to the subway and the new taxi rank and car drop off point all came into use last night.  About three quarters of the full area outside the Three Guineas is open to the public - it seems quite massive now it's all opened up.    Even the space directly outside the barrier line, (as far as the wall that overlooks the steps), seems much bigger than I anticiapted...

    Also noticed this morning that there's yet another small coffee shop (Caff^ Ritazza for a change...) going in at the west end of the London end building on the P10/11 island - presumably facing the escalators to catch  the Paddington commuters after their mad dash through the station, ignoring all the other coffee outlets.  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 31, 2014, 17:59:15
    Outside the south western entrance the direct steps down to the subway and the new taxi rank and car drop off point all came into use last night.  About three quarters of the full area outside the Three Guineas is open to the public - it seems quite massive now it's all opened up.    Even the space directly outside the barrier line, (as far as the wall that overlooks the steps), seems much bigger than I anticiapted...
    Paul

    Yes, I thought that yesterday, even looking through the mesh fencing panels (which they were starting to unbolt). And the south side is still hoarded off pending demolition works. I wonder what will fill up all this new space? People (I mean traders and local councils in particular) seem unable to see a large open area without filling it with stuff. And other people will presumably want to "perform" (in the most general sense) there.

    Another point your second photo shows is that they've removed the laminated timber capping from the concrete walls alongside the ramps.   I did hear a while ago that was a temporary solution - wonder what the final design will be?

    You may have spotted the new concrete coping, still being fitted. Its striking feature is the slope across it. Now, is that to discourage walking along it, and falling off on the downstairs side? There a biggish drop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on October 31, 2014, 22:29:20
    One other thing I found out is that the lower level newly opened space, ie west of the steps, includes a few built-in pits to allow for some instant mature trees to be installed.
    Or is that planted? Not my specialist subject...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CheekyPaul on November 01, 2014, 09:18:01
    From the local newspaper;

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/new-railway-station-southern-interchange-8012194

    "The pedestrian route along Station Hill will reopen but the council is warning there will still be ongoing works to plant 29 new trees, across both southern and northern interchanges and to install new lighting, signage, bins and seating."


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 01, 2014, 09:19:25
    You may have spotted the new concrete coping, still being fitted. Its striking feature is the slope across it. Now, is that to discourage walking along it, and falling off on the downstairs side? There a biggish drop.

    Is it possibly arranged to divert rainwater to one side - perhaps with the lower height for it to drip to the ground?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 01, 2014, 09:31:00
    You may have spotted the new concrete coping, still being fitted. Its striking feature is the slope across it. Now, is that to discourage walking along it, and falling off on the downstairs side? There a biggish drop.

    Is it possibly arranged to divert rainwater to one side - perhaps with the lower height for it to drip to the ground?

    Paul

    It is indeed if it was to discourage walking it would be that very pointed slope used on bridge parapets over electrified lines. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 02, 2014, 00:20:40
    You may have spotted the new concrete coping, still being fitted. Its striking feature is the slope across it. Now, is that to discourage walking along it, and falling off on the downstairs side? There a biggish drop.

    Is it possibly arranged to divert rainwater to one side - perhaps with the lower height for it to drip to the ground?

    Paul

    It is indeed if it was to discourage walking it would be that very pointed slope used on bridge parapets over electrified lines. 

    Like everything else, there's a lot of technicalities behind it if you look. Apparently keeping water out of the tops of walls is one of many aspects of building where twentieth-century practice is now found wanting. For masonry (including brick) walls you now need a damp-proof course under the coping, as well as a slope to shed the water. For this cast concrete wall there is no sign of a DPC, but I guess you'd still want a waterproof mastic seal between coping units.

    Apparently it is usual for parapet copings to have this slope ("single weathered"), as well as a drip edge ("throating") each side. I can see that for a roof parapet, but I'm sure most times I've leant on a path or terrace parapet, even an old traditional one, it's been almost level. Hence my noting it looked odd in that location, and having leant on it is feels odd too. Maybe modern, uniform, best practice isn't just a return to tradition.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on November 04, 2014, 20:09:59
    Some photographs of the new south-side station approach 'square' can be found here: https://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/

    Looks quite smart now (for Reading anyway :D ) but I do wish they would clean up that graffiti on the old Western Tower building (its been there for years now).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 04, 2014, 21:18:29
    One of the buildings that lets the whole area down is the GW Staff Association.   Wonder who the landlord is...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on November 09, 2014, 22:03:28
    Latest photos on Flickr show that the signalling is now powered on the viaduct. https://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/ (https://www.flickr.com/groups/1945836@N21/pool/)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on November 10, 2014, 09:03:08
    Having just done an article on the Reading Viaduct for my club magazine, it's struck me that Reading is actually becoming a real Hbf!

    There is grade separation at both East and West ends of the  station and 9 through platforms

    Now all we need is grade separation at Southcote Jn and 4 tracks from there to Reading West.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 10, 2014, 09:26:00
    Having just done an article on the Reading Viaduct for my club magazine, it's struck me that Reading is actually becoming a real Hbf!

    There is grade separation at both East and West ends of the  station and 9 through platforms

    Now all we need is grade separation at Southcote Jn and 4 tracks from there to Reading West.

    I'm not sure you could justify running a Reading S-Bahn - even with a station at Green Park.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on November 10, 2014, 14:42:32
    Why not? The A33 is heavily congested at peak times Bramley has expanded with houses on the ammo dump and you could have a station where the line crosses the A33 in North Basingstoke to serve the retail park.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on November 10, 2014, 17:45:17
    An S-Bahn with two routes: Wokingham - Newbury and Henley - Basingstoke...

    You read it here first!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on November 10, 2014, 18:15:43
    With Crossrail Reading will be on the end of rather a long S-Bahn line. Not much use for the town itself though other than for a stopping service to Maidenhead and Slough.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 15, 2014, 16:01:00
    I'm sorry, but I'm not going to trawl back through 195 pages to see if the info is there. So if anyone is able to answer my question i'd be most grateful.

    Q. What are the new platform lengths for Platforms 7 to 15 ?

    Many thanks in anticipation.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 15, 2014, 18:00:20
    I'm sorry, but I'm not going to trawl back through 195 pages to see if the info is there. So if anyone is able to answer my question i'd be most grateful.

    Q. What are the new platform lengths for Platforms 7 to 15 ?

    Many thanks in anticipation.

    7 - 304m
    8 - 307m (not sure if this is temporary, as it is expected it will be lengthened to the west alongside WH Smiths during the Christmas blockade)
    9 - 303m
    10 - 320m
    11 - 306m
    12-15 All 282m

    Those are operational lengths as shown in the (09 Mar 14 update) online GW sectional appendix - as you can see from the P10/11 figures this can/will differ from the physical length of the platform island due to signal positioning etc.

    HTH

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 15, 2014, 22:44:57
    Many thanks for replying Paul.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 27, 2014, 21:21:40
    Only 4 weeks to go, before the blockade over Christmas and New Year.
    Can anyone clarify the extent of all the work due to be completed over this period?

    Apart from connecting up the viaduct lines, how much passive provision is going to be installed for connecting up the remaining phases at a later stage, e.g. the Feeder lines etc?


       


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on November 27, 2014, 22:02:40
    Apart from connecting up the viaduct lines, how much passive provision is going to be installed for connecting up the remaining phases at a later stage, e.g. the Feeder lines etc?

    Post No.2871 in this very thread will answer that question.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 27, 2014, 23:14:31
    Thanks, S&TE.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on November 29, 2014, 15:57:27
    I suppose the next few weeks are the last chance for photos, prior to the new viaduct and its track coming into use?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 10, 2014, 09:55:21
    Yesterday I spotted that new track has started edging its way into P3. It's only just past the far end so far, but it looks as if there are enough panels stacked close by (it's been sat there for months) to complete the job.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on December 11, 2014, 09:00:44
    Yesterday I spotted that new track has started edging its way into P3. It's only just past the far end so far, but it looks as if there are enough panels stacked close by (it's been sat there for months) to complete the job.
    There was a huge amount of activity last weekend west of the station and P7/P8 were out of action on Sunday (at least). My Basingstoke service started from 13a out to Tilehurst and reversed back. The new track through the triangle looked to be mostly complete.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 11, 2014, 12:10:01
    I think they might end up with existing up Westbury properly re-aligned in the vicinity of Caversham Rd bridge to run smoothly into P8 over the coming weekends.  It will give them a bit of a head start before the Christmas & New Year full closure of the main line side.

    I guess the new track through the triangle you mention is for the feeder lines, but AIUI they'll remain disconnected on the other side of the viaduct underpass, and aren't intended to come into use until next Easter.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on December 11, 2014, 21:13:44
    Presumably, the underpass will be the sole means of access to the north side of the viaduct and the work site for preparing and laying the feeder lines on that side?

    Will that involve earthworks to provide a ramp down to the underpass?


     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 11, 2014, 21:56:45
    Presumably, the underpass will be the sole means of access to the north side of the viaduct and the work site for preparing and laying the feeder lines on that side?

    Will that involve earthworks to provide a ramp down to the underpass?

    If you look at the planning drawing I attached to a post a few weeks back:

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg161424#msg161424

    ...the intention is to build a permanent road rail access point just on the east side of the Cow Lane road bridge, that goes under the festival viaduct and the central section of the main viaduct; so I'd anticipate there'll be a temporary means of access (or better) at the same place during the final phase of work to remove the temporary main lines and install the continuation of the feeder lines.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 13, 2014, 15:31:31
    Paul is correct - the access road and tunnel and under the new freight lines to get to the Westbury lines is in situ.

    Coming out of Reading today it struck me that the new line under the main viaduct and festival line has quite a curve and dip on it just as it enters the under rifts !

    P8 lines being worked on today - P7 closed to. A very large diamond crossing (with Spurs) - sorry don't know correct terms - was being lifted into place as I passed at about 100 yards from the start of the viaduct. I think I could see the new alignment for the mains into 8/9 and 9/10 in place - although not actually connected to the mains. That's Christmas!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 13, 2014, 17:05:21
    P8 lines being worked on today - P7 closed to. A very large diamond crossing (with Spurs) - sorry don't know correct terms - was being lifted into place as I passed at about 100 yards from the start of the viaduct. I think I could see the new alignment for the mains into 8/9 and 9/10 in place - although not actually connected to the mains. That's Christmas!

    Interesting - can't see a diamond crossing on the plans http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on December 13, 2014, 17:37:17
    P8 lines being worked on today - P7 closed to. A very large diamond crossing (with Spurs) - sorry don't know correct terms - was being lifted into place as I passed at about 100 yards from the start of the viaduct. I think I could see the new alignment for the mains into 8/9 and 9/10 in place - although not actually connected to the mains. That's Christmas!

    Interesting - can't see a diamond crossing on the plans http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179).
    The diamond crossings in the old Mains were in place - at least until recently. Don't forget what are now the Mains were the Reliefs and the rails of the old Mains were left in situ, but unused. I suspect it was these crossings which were seen by Ibraine which were being lifted out as they lie right in the alignment of the new mains leading to the flyover.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 13, 2014, 20:08:42
    I was through the station yesterday and sort of convinced myself that the route taken by my XC Bournemouth service out of P8 towards the up Westbury was slightly different to previous trips, but I can't really describe why.   

    All a bit academic really though, because I suspect that it will all be different again by Monday, my reasoning being that I've noticed that realtimetrains doesn't have any XC services at all using P8.  (Not quite true there is one reversal in P8 shown, but the whole day is nothing like Friday just gone):

      http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RDG/2014/12/15/0200-0159?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt&toc=XC

    Perhaps there'll be another change next weekend, 20/21 December...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 14, 2014, 06:37:48
    On evidence it could have been the diamond cross was being lifted out - not being put in.

    It was swinging a few feet off the ground on the end of the arm of one of those very large cranes reaching over from Abbottairs Rd.

    I did notice too that the strange kink in the line as you exit P8 country end seemed a little less pronounced. Might be what Paul felt ?!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 14, 2014, 08:22:40
    If you look in this photo https://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/15473608860/in/pool-1945836@N21 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/15473608860/in/pool-1945836@N21) you can see the remains of the old crossovers in the middle distance just before the stack of track and the red barriers.

    If the line from P8 to Westbury had been diverted to use the left hand route through turnout in the foreground I would not be surprised as this would be its future route. 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 14, 2014, 10:09:12
    The announced reason for the work starting this week-end is to clear track out of the way in front of the viaduct. This was explained in the "Proposed G1 Network Change Notice" of March 2014:
    Quote
    5.4 Temporary re-alignment of the Up Westbury Line to facilitate Christmas 2014 commissioning.

    In preparation for the Christmas commissioning there is a need to undertake track formation work in the Westbury Line Junction vicinity. To facilitate this work the section of the Up Westbury Line between 750B Points and 763A Points will be taken out of use on the 14 December 2014 prior to the Christmas blockade. During this period the only affected route will be from Platform 8 towards the Up Westbury and onto Oxford Road Junction which will not be available. Up trains from Oxford Road Junction will still be able to access Platform 8 via TR249 (Down Main) and 763 Points reverse.

    That says that what's being taken out is the old track "straight" (i.e. via that wiggle) out of P8 and then left onto the Westburys, while the further one that goes right across to the current Down main, and is the one with two diamonds in it (the last vestiges of the old Main Lines), is being left in. That looks a little odd as a priority, as I'm sure that the whole area from P8-11 to the viaduct needs lots of big yellow toys to charge across it (sorry- "to be regraded") before the new track (now expected to be in its final position) goes in.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 14, 2014, 13:16:53
    I had thought that a route might have been left in via P8, but if you take the other one out you cannot turn a XC Birmingham to Southampton very easily.  I suppose that clearing the other line out of the way means that the turnout where the line from P8 and the line from the reliefs join can be removed and it is simple task to slew the connection over  when the possession starts.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2014, 16:16:56
    Does anyone know the fundamental reason why a down train from P8 therefore cannot follow the up direction route in reverse to reach the up Westbury (so via the 763 crossovers and the down main as described in stuving's extract from the NCN posted above)?

    I suppose just because the track is there it doesn't mean there is a proper signalled route over it?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 14, 2014, 16:29:06
    "Proposed G1 Network Change Notice" of March 2014:
    Quote
    In preparation for the Christmas commissioning there is a need to undertake track formation work in the Westbury Line Junction vicinity.


    Is the formation work something underneath that kink (see photo I linked to a few posts back). Is there some chamber or other structure under there that needs sorting before they can lay track on it?

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 14, 2014, 17:53:15
    Does anyone know the fundamental reason why a down train from P8 therefore cannot follow the up direction route in reverse to reach the up Westbury (so via the 763 crossovers and the down main as described in stuving's extract from the NCN posted above)?

    I suppose just because the track is there it doesn't mean there is a proper signalled route over it?

    Paul

    Hardly. It's the normal route from P8 to the DM combined with the normal route from P9 to the DW. So even if they are avoiding using P8 to revers XC trains to the south, it must work (and there is at least one Newbury service going that way next week.)

    As to what they are actually doing now, it's not too obvious. There's P3 being built, and much ballast shovelling around P7, and loads of men and machines in evidence - but not much old track has gone. It looks as if they have dragged that link from P8 across to the old end of P7, but I imagine it's only fit for short-term engineering use. It looks as if the space vacated is being populated with sleepers for the new track straight from P9 to the DM on the viaduct. There does seem to be a set of points in there too, but it's hard to see why - the final position of that junction of P8 and P9 is a lot further west.

    (Edit: second picture added)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 14, 2014, 19:54:34
    It looks as if the space vacated is being populated with sleepers for the new track straight from P9 to the DM on the viaduct. There does seem to be a set of points in there too, but it's hard to see why - the final position of that junction of P8 and P9 is a lot further west.

    Thanks for the photos.

    If the points being constructed is for the junction of P8 to the DM (and I cannot see why they should not be) then the layout from P1,2,3,7,8 looks pretty much complete as shown on the drawing posted earlier http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179). Only the points to the festival line and some plain line connections to be added.  I assume the P8 to Up Westbury connection still needs to be made (in plain line) when the connection from P10 to the Westbury is taken out.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 14, 2014, 19:59:06
    Have done some more digging, and found the Gioconda signalling brief for the 2013 layout.  

    Signal TR240 at the country end of P8 only provided for 3 possible routes.  

    Main aspect to Down Westbury via Up Westbury and crossover towards signal TR344.
    Main aspect and position 4 'feather' to the Down Main via the temporary crossover 763 and signal TR44 on the down main.
    Position Light (the two small white lights) towards Up Westbury and exit via TR542 (another position light towards the triangle sidings.)  

    The position light route doesn't count for passenger service, so the signal can only authorise two routes. I think that's the main stumbling block - I expect they cannot just arbitrarily 'join' two signalled routes half way along.

    It's always possible that those few services shown as using P8 towards the Westbury route are errors in the underlying data that RTT is displaying.  This has happened before when significant changes occurred, they showed impossible platforming for a few days until it was corrected.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 14, 2014, 22:50:39
    I had expected that everything north of the current line from P7 to the Down Westbury would have to be replaced this time round, on the grounds it's all old stuff. Topologically it's not going to change so much, and maybe some bits are in fact new (or renewed) and I've forgotten.

    P8 (after the Festival Line splits off) will join P9 about as far past Caversham road as that bridge is beyond the end of P8. So on second thoughts the lines now appearing may be final - that foreshortening again.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 14, 2014, 23:13:27
    I had expected that everything north of the current line from P7 to the Down Westbury would have to be replaced this time round, on the grounds it's all old stuff. Topologically it's not going to change so much, and maybe some bits are in fact new (or renewed) and I've forgotten.

    P8 (after the Festival Line splits off) will join P9 about as far past Caversham road as that bridge is beyond the end of P8. So on second thoughts the lines now appearing may be final - that foreshortening again.

    I think you will find that over various weekend possessions most of it has already been replaced in the last year or so. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 15, 2014, 09:48:58
    Have done some more digging, and found the Gioconda signalling brief for the 2013 layout.  

    Signal TR240 at the country end of P8 only provided for 3 possible routes.  

    Main aspect to Down Westbury via Up Westbury and crossover towards signal TR344.
    Main aspect and position 4 'feather' to the Down Main via the temporary crossover 763 and signal TR44 on the down main.
    Position Light (the two small white lights) towards Up Westbury and exit via TR542 (another position light towards the triangle sidings.)  

    The position light route doesn't count for passenger service, so the signal can only authorise two routes. I think that's the main stumbling block - I expect they cannot just arbitrarily 'join' two signalled routes half way along.

    It's always possible that those few services shown as using P8 towards the Westbury route are errors in the underlying data that RTT is displaying.  This has happened before when significant changes occurred, they showed impossible platforming for a few days until it was corrected.

    Paul

    So far today all the services routed via P8 to Reading west have been switched to P7, and future ones are also being moved over, so maybe that is how it WILL work out. In terms of rules, of course, it's more subtle than that. There were previously two routes to the same destination - direct (ahead at TR240, with no feather) and right and then left later. If I've identified the rules that apply (unlikely, I know, but still ...) they could not be signalled with one common feather as the speed limits are too different. So it's easier to suppress one of them. However, in terms of how many routes can be signalled there is no problem. And now all routes out of P8 must observe the lower speed limit anyway. So I imagine the issue is more one of programming the route-setting function at Didcot, plus all the procedures for checking, re-checking, notifying all, drivers, and sundry etc. Which may well not be worth the effort when P7 is not exactly rushed off its feet and it's only for ten days anyway. And there's always P9 as well.

    An interesting test will come tomorrow, when 2K52 - 12:12 to Newbury is still shown in P8, while P7 is occupied by an extra - 1Z31 - The Cathedrals Express (12:10), steam-hauled from Newington to Bristol (and needing to water at Newbury Racecourse).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 15, 2014, 16:32:48
    As of this morning there is only one route out of P8 (looking towards the west), as there's a baulk of timber strapped to the rails half way along the 'kinked bit'.   From the end of P8 it looks very much like they just need to slew that 'kinked' track by a similar amount to the left of a theoretical straight line and it will line up nicely with the points to join the down main.

    I took a XC service back down to Basingstoke, and tried to photo what's going on the other side of Caversham Rd bridge, but they didn't really help much, later I'll try and get something off the phone video I took going towards Reading...

    The straight ahead route from P8 now has the points in position to reach the down main, with the left route leading to a short stub of line which includes the trailing points coming in from P7, and then just as far as the next facing points that will either route straight ahead to the Festival line or 'bear left' to remain on the up Westbury (in the down direction). There's little more than a few feet beyond that third set of points, then ballast.

    First pic below just shows the timber blocking the route, (below the gantry) and the current view of Westbury Line Jn beyond, so nothing to add to the earlier pics above really.

    Second pic is the furthest points taken from the train window, they're sitting between the finished down Westbury, and the temporary route of the up Westbury towards the P9/10 crossovers etc.  So (if I'm right) from left to right in that view it is down Westbury, future up Westbury, future Festival line.

    Paul


     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 15, 2014, 19:07:40
    An interesting test will come tomorrow, when 2K52 - 12:12 to Newbury is still shown in P8, while P7 is occupied by an extra - 1Z31 - The Cathedrals Express (12:10), steam-hauled from Newington to Bristol (and needing to water at Newbury Racecourse).

    To tidy up that (not entirely serious) observation - what other platforms are available? Well, at the same time of 12:10 (within timing allowances) P9 is occupied by 1L50 Cheltenham-Paddington. And why is that not in P10 or P11? P10 has 1M42 Bournemouth-Manchester Piccadilly, and P11 has 1O84 Newcastle-Southampton Central.

    Which all looks rather odd, given that running from P9 towards Paddington means crossing over at Kennet Bridge, as the crossovers at Reading East Jn are going in over Christmas. P11 (but not P10) has commonly been used for southbound XC services in the past, though how that route gets indicated I'm not sure (no feathers on T1715). I'm sure the signallers will sort something out ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 15, 2014, 19:37:42
    It looks like almost all of the difficult track-laying will be done on the P7/8 routes before Christmas - it will just need joining up with plain track, changing the signalling and commissioning.  That will leave them more time to look at the P9/10/11 which they will have to start from scratch as they have no space to do the preparatory work.  I assume they will recover the temporary connction from P8 to P9 later. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 15, 2014, 19:52:34
    ... P11 (but not P10) has commonly been used for southbound XC services in the past, though how that route gets indicated I'm not sure (no feathers on T1715). I'm sure the signallers will sort something out ...

    T1715 has a small theatre box below the main aspects that shows either M for down Main or W for down Westbury.  When I say small it is much smaller than many I've seen elsewhere, more like one of those CD/RA indicators, i.e. a letter box shape, and not designed for long distance reading.

    I believe the reason there are no 'feathers' is that it is a movement normally made only by reversing trains, so there is less need for advance warning.   It is one of those minor inconsistencies about the whole set up - the vast majority of other signals use feathers as I'm sure you've noticed.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 15, 2014, 20:07:24
    It looks like almost all of the difficult track-laying will be done on the P7/8 routes before Christmas - it will just need joining up with plain track, changing the signalling and commissioning.  That will leave them more time to look at the P9/10/11 which they will have to start from scratch as they have no space to do the preparatory work.  I assume they will recover the temporary connction from P8 to P9 later. 

    There are short sections of track already in situ.  If you can visualise the new crossover that replaces the temporary one at the end of P8/P9 that you've mentioned,  then the points at the other end are there with a length of track that must be the new down main.

    I've marked what appears to be the eventual new down main from P9 on a cropped copy of the earlier photo, it isn't as clear as the in use track as it is practically submerged in the new ballast.

    If you follow the line of that track you'll see a couple of white boxes?   Those are the power units for extending lighting rigs, but coincidentally they are at either end of the points I mentioned.  Unfortunately there's a redundant signal gantry that prevents the direct view, but if anyone is passing on a train they'll act as reference points to where I'm trying to describe!

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 16, 2014, 00:39:33
    To tidy up that (not entirely serious) observation - what other platforms are available? Well, at the same time of 12:10 (within timing allowances) P9 is occupied by 1L50 Cheltenham-Paddington. And why is that not in P10 or P11? P10 has 1M42 Bournemouth-Manchester Piccadilly, and P11 has 1O84 Newcastle-Southampton Central.

    Which all looks rather odd, given that running from P9 towards Paddington means crossing over at Kennet Bridge, as the crossovers at Reading East Jn are going in over Christmas. P11 (but not P10) has commonly been used for southbound XC services in the past, though how that route gets indicated I'm not sure (no feathers on T1715). I'm sure the signallers will sort something out ...

    Thinking about it, wasn't the signal at the country end of P10 (TR.240) taken out when the platform was rebuilt and not replaced? In which case using P10 for an XC reverser implies that the new signal (T.1715) is now in place, and is being used "because it's there".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 16, 2014, 09:30:32

    Thinking about it, wasn't the signal at the country end of P10 (TR.240) taken out when the platform was rebuilt and not replaced? In which case using P10 for an XC reverser implies that the new signal (T.1715) is now in place, and is being used "because it's there".

    P10 country end was TR242 at Easter 2013.   That was the signal that was in situ while the advance work on the foundations at the west end of P10 was built around it,  but hasn't it been replaced by T1713 at the end of the platform by now?   According to the 2013 brief (as TR242) it had the same theatre box indications as those on P11, i.e. M for down Main and W for down Westbury.

    T1715 is the P11 down direction signal, I'd thought in my earlier reply that you referring to how moves from P11 were indicated.

    (For completeness TR240 is the down direction P8 starter, protecting the temporary down loop to down main crossover.)

    Paul     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 16, 2014, 09:48:46
    P10 country end was TR242 at Easter 2013.   That was the signal that was in situ while the advance work on the foundations at the west end of P10 was built around it,  but hasn't it been replaced by T1713 at the end of the platform by now?   According to the 2013 brief (as TR242) it had the same theatre box indications as those on P11, i.e. M for down Main and W for down Westbury.

    Of course it was; my (late night) misreading. I meant that TR.242 was there in 2013, and now should be replaced by T.1713, but in between there may have been no signal at that end of P10. The September 2014 sectional appendix shows P10 as "up only".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 16, 2014, 17:56:03
    I had a look in passing this morning.  Looking at the attached extract from the plans posted previously by II http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg163179#msg163179).

    As far as I can tell, the points marked with the green circles have been in place for a little while.  The two points marked with the red circles were installed this weekend (though the one joining to the new down main is not complete.  Much of the connecting trackwork was installed this weekend.

    The red point nearest Westbury is not connected to the Up Westbury yet (as the existing line from P9 to Up Westbury is currently connected to it) and of course the festival line and the new main is not connected (as the same line from P9 is in the way). 

    Otherwise much of this side is nearly complete.  This will give a good start to the Christmas works. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 16, 2014, 20:45:43
    So what did happen just after midday?

    The steam engines came through P7 bang on time (12:10 departure) - not only unusual, but they had made up 12 minutes from Hanwell.
    The Newbury train did not leave from P8, but nipped into P7 immediately afterwards from its lurking position on the Spur Line (dep 12:15 only 2L).
    The XC Bournemouth-Manchester did use P11, leaving on time at 12:10
    The other two trains swapped over, so the up Cheltenham went from P10 at 12:13 (3L) and the XC Newcastle-Southampton from P9 on time at 12:16.
    Nothing used P8 at that time.
    The same is now programmed (give or take the odd steam train) tomorrow.

    It does look as if the moves originally set up out of P8 and P10 are both impossible this week. Reaching the Down Westbury will become possible from P8 after Christmas, via track that doesn't exist now, but that end of P10 will not lead to anywhere until Easter. The Up Main is not bidirectional, and the route that will eventually be signalled is onto the feeder line.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 17, 2014, 16:16:32
    Took a couple of shots with the zoom lens, managed to find a couple of positions on the transfer deck that allowed me to see past the various overhead gantries and such like.

    Showing the two sets of points marked with a red circle in ellendune's photo posted yesterday evening.  Both pictures clearly show the temporary 'up Westbury' running right through the worksite...

    Hope this is of some interest.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 17, 2014, 20:36:45
    Thank you confirms what I thought I saw briefly from a moving train. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 18, 2014, 12:13:11
    I've now tried to crop a reasonably sized and adequately defined photo that shows the full Westbury Line Junction area, that doesn't result in a silly file size.

    The three lines entering or leaving the shot on the left are (top to bottom) the P1/P2 approach, the down Westbury line from P7, and the up Westbury line (and Festival line) to/from P8.  The various crossovers should be self explanatory, and on the right hand side the newly laid sleepers below the OHLE gantry are aligned with P9 and the future down main.

    Just cutoff on the RH side is the platform starter signal for P10, fully bagged up - hence confirming there are no usable routes (as discussed by stuving above).

    As in earlier photos, that gantry doesn't half spoil the shot! 

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 18, 2014, 22:02:54
    Thanks - so it shouldn't take much work to get the down main connected up.  The Up main might is much more work however. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on December 18, 2014, 23:04:27
    It looks like a roller coaster, although I appreciate that the focus of the camera makes the angles more intense. The incline is much less than it looks.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on December 18, 2014, 23:27:45
    Telephoto does accentuate the gradient of the flyover. I looked at the photo and thought, V1 launch tracks.  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on December 19, 2014, 10:41:46
    Official Name is Reading Viaduct.

    Statistics.

    The whole structure is approximately 1850 yards in length stretching from 36m 22c to 37m 26c.  Im 4 chains so shorter than Doncaster North Chord by 66 chains.
    The gradient at the east end (station) is 1 in 93 to 36m 49c from where it becomes 1 in 730 rising to 36m 75c then falls at 1 in 85 to the west end of the viaduct.

    Awaiting information of length and gradient of the Festival Line


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 19, 2014, 11:30:01

    Awaiting information of length and gradient of the Festival Line

    The gradients were in SandTEngineer's post #2074, but shown from west to east with metric distances, so do we assume they've built what was originally declared?   

    Reversing those figures for comparison with the above they become:

    1 in 93 rising for 25ch/506m (which you'd expect to be the same as the mains of course)
    1 in 73 falling for 19ch/384m (after passing over Feeder line underpass box)
    1 in 209 falling for 9ch/177m (while passing under the Main Flyover)

    from: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6405.msg138536#msg138536



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 20, 2014, 10:37:29
    Passed through Reading this AM.

    Focus was very much on P8 in terms of activity. The line from P8 had been lifted just after the points to connect to the down main. The 'Kink' has been removed.

    As I looked at this a small army of workmen arrived on P8 with sand, cement and platform edging - presumably to remove the temporary railings from the country end of P8 and put proper edging in place.

    This suggests that P8 will be out of use until after Xmas - as I'm sure I remember someone here saying that the platform edging could not be laid because of the clearance needed for the temporay points connecting P8 to the down main ?

    Perhaps these temporary points may disappear when over the weekend.

    Lastly, and to my surprise, I was able to see that double track on the new Westbury curve viaduct line dive under (does this have a proper name ?) is laid and ballested all the way to where the tunnel under the line to the old depot is. About 150 yards of track will have this under the viaduct ready to be connect to the reliefs.

    A couple of photos from my phone attached


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on December 20, 2014, 10:43:00
    Were you leaning out of the left side of a passing blimp, by any chance?  :) ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on December 20, 2014, 13:33:54
    I noticed on RTT that Reading - Berwyn services were diverting via Tilehust (reversing in P. 3) and the Reading West Curve.  I decided that a track bash was in order using the old season ticket. Track has indeed been laid on the Feeder Lines and is being joined up at the Oxford Road Junction end.

    Some piccies hopefully ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 20, 2014, 14:36:44
    This suggests that P8 will be out of use until after Xmas - as I'm sure I remember someone here saying that the platform edging could not be laid because of the clearance needed for the temporay points connecting P8 to the down main ?

    Perhaps these temporary points may disappear when over the weekend.


    Difficult to tell from 'realtimetrains' if P8 will be closed or not.  It may be that they'll plain line the points and realign the platform track as part of the same job.  I was told a while ago that the other factor in the platform copings being left off was that the track was not at the final height either, in other words the clearance issue was three dimensional, rather than just due to the points.

    Alternatively, all the services through P8 might disappear by Monday...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on December 20, 2014, 17:20:41
    This suggests that P8 will be out of use until after Xmas - as I'm sure I remember someone here saying that the platform edging could not be laid because of the clearance needed for the temporay points connecting P8 to the down main ?

    Perhaps these temporary points may disappear when over the weekend.


    Difficult to tell from 'realtimetrains' if P8 will be closed or not.  It may be that they'll plain line the points and realign the platform track as part of the same job.  I was told a while ago that the other factor in the platform copings being left off was that the track was not at the final height either, in other words the clearance issue was three dimensional, rather than just due to the points.

    Alternatively, all the services through P8 might disappear by Monday...

    Paul

    From what I gather there's only 2 through platforms in use over the Christmas Period (28/12/14 - 03/01/15).

    The current 20mph crossover Bristol end of platform 8 will be removed during is time and the barriers will be removed. 

    Once it reopens in the New Year through services arriving from the Newbury direction will only be able to access platform 7 & 8.
    XC to/from the South will have to use the mains via the new high level section and will use the newly opened platform 3. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 20, 2014, 18:13:36
    From what I gather there's only 2 through platforms in use over the Christmas Period (28/12/14 - 03/01/15).

    I think the point lbraine seemed to be making was that if they are working on the outstanding length of P8 edge copings today, that closure might have to be a few days early, i.e. it might include Monday to Wednesday next week as well.

    Another possibility is that they were just taking advantage of this weekend's closure to deliver the materials to the site, which would allow a quick start late on Christmas Eve...

    Quote
    ...XC to/from the South will have to use the mains via the new high level section and will use the newly opened platform 3.

    I think that after Christmas it would be more accurate to say that some XC trains will use P3, because there's a similar number that will reverse in P8 (or occasionally P7).   The (public) timetabled departure and arrival times usually don't allow for all through XC services to use P3, if they stick to the usual timings there're a number of occasions when two trains are in that area of the  station within a minute of each other.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 20, 2014, 19:17:11
    What I take to be the latest EAS says that P1, 2, 7-11 are closed 25th-3rd inclusive, P12 25th-28th, and P13-15 25th&26th only. P3 ought to come into use on 4th, though that's not in the EAS.

    There's the following note for last weekend's possessions:
    FOLLOWING THIS POSSESSION FROM 0430 MON,
    THE UP WESTBURY LINE IS REMOVED BETWEEN
    750B AND 763A; TRAINS USING UP WESTBURY TO
    TRAVEL VIA 750A AND 763B - CAN APPROACH
    PFMS 8/9/10/11 AS BEFORE HOWEVER TRAINS
    ARE NOT ABLE TO DEPART PFM 8 TOWARDS
    OXFORD RD.

    And then for this weekend:
    THE WEEK BEFORE, AND FOLLOWING THIS
    POSSESSION FROM MON0430, THE UP
    WESTBURY LINE IS REMOVED BETWEEN 750B
    AND 763A; TRAINS USING UP WESTBURY TO
    TRAVEL VIA 750A AND 767B - CAN REACH/LEAVE
    ALL OF PFMS 8/9/10/11 AS BEFORE.

    NOTE: PLATFORM3 IS OOU ANYWAY.

    Which isn't quite the same, but can be read to say that leaving P8 for Southcote is still not allowed and leaving P10 that end is not possible yet in any case.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 23, 2014, 11:07:56
    Did anything happen with Platform 8 by Monday, or was it just a delivery of materials as my last proposed option?

    I haven't been through the station since but I see from RTT that P8 is still in use, looks like it is just like last week...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 23, 2014, 19:34:54
    Did anything happen with Platform 8 by Monday, or was it just a delivery of materials as my last proposed option?

    I haven't been through the station since but I see from RTT that P8 is still in use, looks like it is just like last week...

    Paul
    Yes it is - just as the EAS said - and otherwise not a lot of visible progress, though presumably the points etc. already positioned are being completed. You can see that the track in P3 and in line with P8 is barely clamped together and not finally aligned or anything. Incidentally, a week or two ago they took the copers off part of P3 and relaid them - maybe the clearance from the arriving track wasn't quite as it should have been.

    Aligning the track from P8, to finally remove the wiggle, may require that the old signal TR.240 is taken out. New ones for P8 (T.1709) and for P7 (T.1707) are in place, so the old gantry can go too (needed for OHLE).  There is a big crane already lurking down the end of Abattoirs road, and this time it's not one of Ainscough's (Baldwins' instead)! Have they lost the contract, or was it never that exclusive?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on December 23, 2014, 19:47:08
    There is a big crane already lurking down the end of Abattoirs road, and this time it's not one of Ainscough's (Baldwins' instead)! Have they lost the contract, or was it never that exclusive?

    Both are approved suppliers, there are only so many big cranes around

    I have used both and there are other suppliers although these 2 do have most of the large Tonka Toys in the UK to play with   ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 27, 2014, 17:19:27
    Phone camera pic of the progress so far at about 1400 today, 27th Dec 14.

    Down Main track from P9 appears to be connected through to the flyover, temporary crossover removed from the end of P8, but not yet plain lined.  Signal gantry that previously carried the P7 down starting signal now removed.  Formation being levelled ready for Up Main and Up Main Loop to be laid into P10 and P11 respectively. 

    Will try and get some further pictures on Monday with decent camera...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 27, 2014, 18:24:43
    This picture is from a little later today, and further to the right. You can see the Festival Line coming right down to enter P8. The engineering train hides the Down Main, but also proves the track is there underneath it. There is a little bit of Up Main in place, and another slab that seems to be been dumped and not aligned at all. There was a gantry here, which has also gone.

    If you look closely, there are several bits of completed track that still need a good kicking to get them into their correct alignment.

    By the way - that's not the big crane you can see, that's out of shot and having a rest.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2014, 08:59:36
    A good sign - for once?

    It looks as if the first operational milestone of the current major work has been met - P12 handing back this morning. That implies the heavy lifting to put the Up Main into P10/11 has been done, and the rest can be done with traffic in P12. Surprisingly, there isn't a succession of overnight closures of P12, just a complete blockade on Sunday morning. And it's all supposed to be in place for Sunday at 8:00 - so I guess they have almost a day to overrun into before crunch time on Monday 5th.

    Better get this one right lads - the world's hot breath is melting the back of your orange rompers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 29, 2014, 15:51:52
    A few phone pics to summarise the position at lunchtime today.

    As far as I could see all the intended routes are physically complete, (i.e. the rails and pointwork is in situ even if not fully fettled and ballasted) including the crossover from the Down Relief (P12) to the Up Main Feeder.  First and second pics of three show the junctions leading to/from the Up Main and Up Main Loop.

    The Down Main loop beyond P8 is now in and 'straightened', with the platform edge copings  being laid with reference to a gauge mounted on the track.   Track joint 'thermite' welding was progressing - presumably a good sign as this often seems to be deferred until follow up weekends.

    Redundant signals appear to be all removed, new signals powered up and showing reds.   What seems odd is that the P3 starter signal and route indicator appear to be mounted at low level, in fact almost at ground level.   Can anyone think of a reason for this?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on December 29, 2014, 15:55:57
    What seems odd is that the P3 starter signal and route indicator appear to be mounted at low level, in fact almost at ground level.   Can anyone think of a reason for this?

    I think it always used to be, presumably to reduce the chances of it being mistaken for the signal for Platform 7.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 29, 2014, 15:58:42
    What seems odd is that the P3 starter signal and route indicator appear to be mounted at low level, in fact almost at ground level.   Can anyone think of a reason for this?

    I think it always used to be, presumably to reduce the chances of it being mistaken for the signal for Platform 7.

    Thanks, that would make sense, especially if the overall curvature of the station would make it appear just before the P7 signal?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 29, 2014, 16:10:15
    Also took a trip out to Tilehurst and although the sun was causing a bit of a problem grabbed this pic off a phone video.  This is as far as the Main Feeder track goes, but hopefully it gives the idea that the formation is already lower than the Down Relief, and getting significantly lower as you go further west. 

    The temporary main lines (the old relief lines) have been removed at least as far as the Feeder underpass box, and a number of excavators and dump trucks were in action, I'd guess the intention is to remove the old ballast and sub base to the right level during the rest of this closure.

    CCTV99 in post #2931 was asking about this a few weeks ago.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on December 29, 2014, 16:19:39
    Thanks, that would make sense, especially if the overall curvature of the station would make it appear just before the P7 signal?

    Paul

    Indeed, it also maximises the length of the bay platform too.

    In response to your picture, isn't that the (Down) Feeder Relief which then joins the Reading West Curve? The (Up) Feeder Main is the bit from Oxford Road Junction to Platform 11 surely?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 29, 2014, 16:46:09
    I'm 99% sure that is to be the up feeder main, there's another set of points in the down relief for connection to the down feeder relief a fair distance further along, just visible in my video.

    This came up in the thread a while ago, that they'd added a second crossover to allow parallel moves at that end of the feeder lines?  The two sets of points are shown (c&p) in IndustryInsider's posted drawings included with post #2871 on 13th October.

    It's a pity I can't upload the video here to be sure...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2014, 16:54:30
    Here's two views a little after Paul7755's - with those pesky trains out of the way (mostly). In the first one you can see almost all of the layout as expected, plus the Up Feeder Main as far as it goes - not that far, actually. (There's also a rather strange bit of ironmongery just to the left of where it ends.) Yes - the Down Feeder Relief finishes a bit to the west of what can be seen in the second picture, behind the signal head. I don't think that switch is actually in place yet.

    In the second, you can see down the old Relief Line formation (temporarily the Mains) where all the earthmoving is going on. You can also see the surprisingly abrupt cross-link from P10 to P11, providing access from the UFM to P10. That's an addition to the original plan - instead there were to be two connections from the UFM, one into P11 (gently) and one to the Up Main before it split (sharply). I guess they found that it was more useful to make the viaduct as long as possible, and put this extra link in instead.

    They do seem to be in quite a hurry to bash on with this. As they are working with the Down Relief live, it can't be just an access opportunity. So are they aiming to have it all done and ready early? The EAS says it's not to be attached until Easter, but once this end is built the rest doesn't need major possessions.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 29, 2014, 17:20:52
    ...Yes - the Down Feeder Relief finishes a bit to the west of what can be seen in the second picture, behind the signal head. I don't think that switch is actually in place yet.

    The points for both routes were in place in IndustryInsider's cab ride video though...   ;D

    Only the bare minimum of rail was fitted at that time though.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2014, 17:32:23
    ...Yes - the Down Feeder Relief finishes a bit to the west of what can be seen in the second picture, behind the signal head. I don't think that switch is actually in place yet.

    The points for both routes were in place in IndustryInsider's cab ride video though...   ;D

    Only the bare minimum of rail was fitted at that time though.

    Paul

    So it was - but recently it's got hard to see it behind all the new vertical (and horizontal) galvanised junk. To clarify, it's been there right from the start - and is between the two crossovers of the reliefs so should be clearly visible in the first of my pictures above. But it's not - a matter of resolution, angle, lighting, distance etc. Here's one from not long ago that shows exactly what's there.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 29, 2014, 17:38:51
    As in earlier photos, that gantry doesn't half spoil the shot! 

    Yes, it's a real pain: Network Rail should remove it immediately.  ;D

    Thanks for your update pictures despite the obstructions, though.  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 29, 2014, 18:02:16
    As in earlier photos, that gantry doesn't half spoil the shot! 
    Yes, it's a real pain: Network Rail should remove it immediately.  ;D

    As it happens, the signal gantry in that view has just been removed - but since then (August) a nearer one, and other stuff, have been erected.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on December 29, 2014, 19:58:29
    Thanks for posting those updates.  I will have a chance to see it all on Saturday when I next pass through.

    How about starting a competition to see who can post a photograph of the first four trains passing in parallel at the foot of the viaduct?  :D ::) :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 29, 2014, 20:46:15
    The points for both routes were in place in IndustryInsider's cab ride video though...   ;

    Look out for another one of those shortly...  ;)

    Oh, and well done for getting us past the 200 pages for this topic.  Fitting given all the valuable input you've had on it over the years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on December 29, 2014, 21:33:37
    Not quite past yet....:-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on December 29, 2014, 23:02:53
    A very big thank you to all those posting photos and updates on the progress of the works.

     ;) ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on December 30, 2014, 11:13:20
    At Reading this AM

    Above P8 on transit deck is a 15x8 area of display boards showing/ detailing the viaduct work. Network Eail suits and Press in attendance.

    Suggests NR is feeling confident about Monday target being met - and perhaps trying to get some positive news cycles out in light of earlier events over Xmas.

    Will post today's photos shortly


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 30, 2014, 14:11:29
    This event was mentioned on the BBC South News at 1.15pm to-day.  The story was dominated by Mark Carne deciding not to take his bonus, someone demanding that it should be easier for passengers to get refunds, and some completely irrelevant film (I presume library pictures) of some block paving being laid.  Nothing whatever about the huge amount of work being done to remodel Reading, and in particular the fact that many NR and contractor staff have been working over Christmas to get the viaduct into use.

    Not really fair on NR and in particular the Reading Project team.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on December 30, 2014, 14:50:03
    This event was mentioned on the BBC South News at 1.15pm to-day.  The story was dominated by Mark Carne deciding not to take his bonus, someone demanding that it should be easier for passengers to get refunds, and some completely irrelevant film (I presume library pictures) of some block paving being paid.  Nothing whatever about the huge amount of work being done to remodel Reading, and in particular the fact that many NR and contractor staff have been working over Christmas to get the viaduct into use.

    Not really fair on NR and in particular the Reading Project team.   

    I caught an interview with Mark Carne by Dermot Murnahan on Dky TV and although I think the performance level of rail services over the last few months has been less than satisfactory I thought the agresdiveness of the interview was deplorable. In typical media style the interview was not allowed  to comment on any of the other successes of recent times just the problems.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on December 30, 2014, 18:48:45
    FGW are indicating obtaining refunds for Saturday is going to be made very easy. I guess communications will be forthcoming

    Also that NR are currently ahead of schedule at Reading for a timely hand-back


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on January 02, 2015, 22:47:44
    I haven^t been to Reading for several years, but I use to come for regular meetings. I am meaning to come along the line and have a look.

    Firstly can I thank and congratulate the contributors for an interesting and informative thread ^ pity about the webcams though. The project can be compared to ^A surgeon carrying out open heart surgery, while the patient is running a marathon^. My home station is Ealing Broadway, I don^t think will merit a thread when its upgrade commences.
     
    The comments relating to the signage and the position and content of the CIS/PIS screens within the station remind me of last year when I was a Heathrow Terminal 2 volunteer (guinea pig) taking part in the testing trials prior to the opening of Terminal2 in June. The T2 project team wanted feedback on any problems or faults within the terminal, in order that they could be rectified prior to opening.
    Getting back on topic, here are my comments, assumptions and questions.
    As was queried earlier, is it likely that one or both of the feeder lines could be operational before Easter?
    I have got my ruler and pencil out, and on IndustryInsider^s signalling layout plan joined up both ends of the main and relief feeder lines, then added the down-direction crossover between the Main Feeder (MF) and Relief Feeder (RF) at the southern end. I assume that each line will consist of a single signal section, with signal numbers T1726 (MF) and T1728 (RF) at the north end and T2803 (MF) and T2805 (RF) at the south, with associated junction indicators, route indicators and repeaters, where necessary.

    It immediately becomes obvious that the north end of the layout is flexible offering parallel movements onto and off the feeder lines with no conflicts, however at the southern end, parallel moves are not possible. Down direction Main Feeder to Down Westbury routes down Main Feeder, down Relief Feeder, Down Reading West Curve and then Down Westbury, so conflicting with any up direction routeing from the Up Westbury onto the Relief Feeder. An up loaded stone train could block the route for some time. Is it likely that a crossover between the Up Westbury and Down Westbury will be added in the future, in order that the routeing is not via the Relief Feeder?
     
    Is there enough room on the feeder lines to hold a stationery stone train without fouling the junctions at either end? Although the signallers, in practice, currently signal a loaded stone train through the old layout non-stop, will trials be carried out to prove that a stone train can be started anywhere within its new routeing via the feeder lines?
     
    As of Christmas 2013, the Down Westbury has been bi-directional between Westbury Line Junction and Reading West station, the signalling layout plan does not show this clearly as there is a missing UP arrow to the left of signal T2814.

    Finally, what is the revised track layout of the relief lines between Tilehurst East and where it connects to the existing layout by signals T1745 and T1747 just west of Cow Lane? Looking at the signalling layout plan, RBC plans and IndustyInsider^s cab ride video, then deciding what needs to be removed, replaced or added, one can make an attempt to draw it. I assume that from the video, the train is on the current Up Relief, which will become the Up Relief Loop (Up Goods Loop). The western end of the new piece of track within the west end of the depot will be connected to this. The new Up Relief and Down Relief lines will then be created with appropriate crossovers to each other, the Up Relief Loop, Festival Line and Reading West Curve lines.

    That^s it for now!

    Mike


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on January 02, 2015, 23:25:07
    Welcome to the forum W55Railfinder / Mike - and congratulations on the 3000th post (2999th reply) on this thread.

    I'm going to leave others to answer on Reading - I'm overawed by the detail and knowledge shared in this thread - enjoy reading (some of it fascinating like gradients, holding point lengths, etc) and learning.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: JayMac on January 02, 2015, 23:53:49
    I freely admit to being a little lost on occasions by the technical minutiae that this thread has engendered over its near 5 year life, but I too am overawed by the detail and knowledge it contains. I tip my hat to all those that have contributed to what has become a truly thorough history of the re-modelling of one of the most important locations covered by this forum.

    If someone were to write a definitive history of the Reading re-modelling project they could rightly use this thread for much valuable source material.

    My only small claim to fame in this thread were my pictures of the leaking roof of the, then new, transfer deck, picked up by national news media. Seeing a picture you took featured on ITV News was a novel experience.

    I'll echo the welcome to the forum, W5tRailfinder. How many more posts on this thread before we can say, "project complete"?  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 03, 2015, 08:37:41
    Indeed, welcome W5tRailfinder.

    I've got the Easter 2015 maps which should answer many of your questions.  Hopefully I'll have time to upload them on to here this afternoon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 03, 2015, 10:11:07
    As was queried earlier, is it likely that one or both of the feeder lines could be operational before Easter?

    There is a possibility they might be operational (in the sense that they are capable of working), but I doubt whether they would be in operation. I assume the Easter possession is required to commission the signalling changes and this needs to be at the same time as the commissioning of the festival line.

    It immediately becomes obvious that the north end of the layout is flexible offering parallel movements onto and off the feeder lines with no conflicts, however at the southern end, parallel moves are not possible. Down direction Main Feeder to Down Westbury routes down Main Feeder, down Relief Feeder, Down Reading West Curve and then Down Westbury, so conflicting with any up direction routeing from the Up Westbury onto the Relief Feeder. An up loaded stone train could block the route for some time. Is it likely that a crossover between the Up Westbury and Down Westbury will be added in the future, in order that the routeing is not via the Relief Feeder?

    Yes, but there are more platforms on the south side. Through platforms 7, 8, 10 & 11 all have access to the Westbury route either directly or by the feeder lines that's only 9 that does not! That is the same number of through platforms as on the reliefs (Platforms 12 - 15).    In addition Platform 3 (bay) can be used for the XC services that reverse.  Oh and of course there are the bay platforms 1 &2 for local services to Newbury and Basingstoke.   

    Is there enough room on the feeder lines to hold a stationery stone train without fouling the junctions at either end? Although the signallers, in practice, currently signal a loaded stone train through the old layout non-stop, will trials be carried out to prove that a stone train can be started anywhere within its new routeing via the feeder lines?

    I think the answer is yes is was discussed somewhere further up this thread some months ago. 

    Finally, what is the revised track layout of the relief lines between Tilehurst East and where it connects to the existing layout by signals T1745 and T1747 just west of Cow Lane? Looking at the signalling layout plan, RBC plans and IndustyInsider^s cab ride video, then deciding what needs to be removed, replaced or added, one can make an attempt to draw it. I assume that from the video, the train is on the current Up Relief, which will become the Up Relief Loop (Up Goods Loop). The western end of the new piece of track within the west end of the depot will be connected to this. The new Up Relief and Down Relief lines will then be created with appropriate crossovers to each other, the Up Relief Loop, Festival Line and Reading West Curve lines.

    Interesting there has been talk of II cab video in recent days - I seem to have missed this can someone point me to a link?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 03, 2015, 10:27:44
    Interesting there has been talk of II cab video in recent days - I seem to have missed this can someone point me to a link?

    The link is in the bottom line of the footnote in II's posts.

    You might be kicking yourself now...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 03, 2015, 10:39:30
    Interesting there has been talk of II cab video in recent days - I seem to have missed this can someone point me to a link?

    The link is in the bottom line of the footnote in II's posts.

    You might be kicking yourself now...  ;D

    Paul

    Didn't look down there!  :-[


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 03, 2015, 15:14:16
    Here's the Easter 2015 layout as promised.

    I'm not totally sure that everything will be complete and commissioned at the final major blockade, as things like the 'A' End depot connection and a few other minor works might come in after that date, but the physical layout should at least look pretty much as desribed in these maps.  A couple of observations: I'm hoping that the 40mph restriction on the Down Relief line after Reading as far as Scours Lane will either be temporary, or is a mistake on the maps, as that would be disappointing if a PSR - the Up Relief is 80mph until reasonably close the the station.  Good to see the former goods loop is to be a bi-directional passenger loop, which will be useful.  The 60mph over the viaduct and through platforms 9/10 is confirmed.  As before, the maps run from west to east.

    (https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8667/15997349018_31963d9d33_b.jpg)

    (https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8616/16184025912_a158deb202_b.jpg)

    (https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7524/15562417544_9cd2cc185f_b.jpg)

    (https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7469/15997477070_0f2254d09b_b.jpg)

    (https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7583/16182914201_93d2c892bc_b.jpg)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 03, 2015, 17:39:43
    I'm puzzled by the depot connection identifications being A, C and E.

    Originally I thought for some reason there might be eventually 5 connections, to be labelled A-E.   Then somewhere it was suggested the connections were to be west, centre and east, presumably to be labelled W, C and E.

    Is it just possible that A, C and E have been used to allow for future alterations, for example an up direction crossover leading into the eastern sidings off the passenger loop might become D?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 03, 2015, 21:08:35
    Yes, I think I was expecting a 'W' for West.  I'm guessing future connections is the reason, but it's a little confusing and I can't ever see the need for five connections!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on January 04, 2015, 08:13:35
    0800 London Paddington to Penzance, the first passenger carrying train to be booked to travel over the new Reading flyover this morning!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on January 04, 2015, 08:46:44
    Indeed 1C05 to Penzance has passed over the new flyover, followed by 1W15 to Didcot Parkway

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20221/2015/01/04/advanced

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20906/2015/01/04/advanced


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 04, 2015, 08:49:28
    Indeed 1C05 to Penzance has passed over the new flyover, followed by 1W15 to Didcot Parkway

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20221/2015/01/04/advanced

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20906/2015/01/04/advanced

    I wonder how many passengers on these services would have been interested or even noticed this change ? I know I would have that's for sure :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 04, 2015, 08:53:45
    The Daily Mail will have to find another headline story for their paper tomorrow now they do not have a story about late engineering works.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on January 04, 2015, 08:58:18
    Yes, compared to the shambles happening elsewhere, and the late-running electrification programme, the Reading rebuild and remodelling appears to have happened on time - and presumably on budget?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 04, 2015, 09:14:51
    Reading viaduct is open

    Just witnessed a cross country from 8a using it followedby Swansea train


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 04, 2015, 09:48:00
    Forementioned Swansea train departing P9.

    P3 was also open with a Cross Country located in it.


    One thing noted : Cross Crountry departed P8a and joined Festival line before joining Down Main on the Viaduct. While making this path the P9 starter was a Single Yellow - with the Red showing further along the line just before the Viaduct cross over.

    But the Swansea train driver was taking instructions from a couple of FGW Orange jackets who seemed to tell him to wait until the Viaduct was showing green before starting off.

    I presume this is part of a 'slow and steady' route learning approach.

    Also it's that Cow Lane is closed for 4 nights from the 12th Jan - perhaps to demolish the remainder of the old Cow Lane tunnel.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on January 04, 2015, 09:56:28
    One thing noted : Cross Crountry departed P8a and joined Festival line before joining Down Main on the Viaduct. While making this path the P9 starter was a Single Yellow - with the Red showing further along the line just before the Viaduct cross over.

    But the Swansea train driver was taking instructions from a couple of FGW Orange jackets who seemed to tell him to wait until the Viaduct was showing green before starting off.

    I presume this is part of a 'slow and steady' route learning approach.


    Or they're worried about starting an HST from stationary on a steep rising gradient!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on January 04, 2015, 10:39:16
    More likely, I would suggest


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2015, 10:57:13
    I think HST's are OK starting on a 1 in 93, which someone said was the rising gradient going west from Reading station.  After all, HST's start OK at Totnes and Bodmin Road where there are similar gradients.  And it'll complicate the job of train dispatchers on 8/9 have if they to wait for a Green before seeing off trains.  The repeaters (I think!) say only OFF or ON.

    On another point, the layout at Oxford Road junction is a bit odd.  Trains on the Feeder Main heading for the Down Westbury will need to go right at T 2803 and use the Feeder Relief, which thus prevents parallel moves.  Maybe space is a problem, but the crossover where the Up Reading West Curve line crosses the Up Westbury line would be better as a pair of points.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 04, 2015, 11:24:32
    HSTs can start from Reading Westbound and use the viaduct but only if both power cars are working.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 04, 2015, 11:50:01
    From Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/reading-station-picture-first-passenger-8379746)

    Quote
    (http://i3.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article8379726.ece/alternates/s615/B6f5kn0CYAEtM0F.jpg)
    First public train over the new Reading elevated section - from Network Rail
       
    Network Rail tweeted a picture of the first public train over the newly-opened elevated section at Reading Station.

    The train was the 7.45am Bristol to Paddington.

    The ^895 million redevelopment of the station should be completed this year.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2015, 12:28:31
    Looks like a down train - isn't that the Festival line on the right?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 04, 2015, 13:16:32
    Then perhaps it is the 08:00 Padd to Penzance as stated by a-driver


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 04, 2015, 13:27:19
    It immediately becomes obvious that the north end of the layout is flexible offering parallel movements onto and off the feeder lines with no conflicts, however at the southern end, parallel moves are not possible. Down direction Main Feeder to Down Westbury routes down Main Feeder, down Relief Feeder, Down Reading West Curve and then Down Westbury, so conflicting with any up direction routeing from the Up Westbury onto the Relief Feeder. An up loaded stone train could block the route for some time. Is it likely that a crossover between the Up Westbury and Down Westbury will be added in the future, in order that the routeing is not via the Relief Feeder?

    Can I add my welcome to the forum, Mike. "Aha - here's another troublemaker", I thought; you ought to feel at home here, anyway.

    On another point, the layout at Oxford Road junction is a bit odd.  Trains on the Feeder Main heading for the Down Westbury will need to go right at T 2803 and use the Feeder Relief, which thus prevents parallel moves.  Maybe space is a problem, but the crossover where the Up Reading West Curve line crosses the Up Westbury line would be better as a pair of points.

    I think there are very few cases where such parallel moves could occur, and those only in unusual circumstances.

    The original plan had the Reading Feeder Relief Line (then also misleadingly called "Down") only connecting to the Relief Lines and platforms 12-15 (which is still true), and the Reading Feeder Main Line (then also called "Up") only connecting to the Main Lines and platforms 10 and 11. The RFML is there to take trains from the Up Westbury Line into P10 and P11, and almost nothing else. You can't get into it from platforms 1-3 and 7-9, but they (apart from P9) have access to the Down Westbury directly. The RFRL is there for all the trains into and out of P12-15 via the Westbury Lines. However, through passenger trains to and from Paddington are only a minority - most start and terminate in P1 and P2. Freight trains are thus probably more important.

    We have never had an "official" reason for the added connection between the RFML and P12 (note - only P12). But I think it must be this: if an up train is standing on the RFRL (at T.1728), awaiting a platform or path through one, it blocks any move onto the Westbury Line, and there is no alternative other than crossing to the Main Lines back at Kennet Bridge. Since P12 is on the Down Relief (P13 is the Down Relief Loop) it allows a "tie-breaker" move over the RFML; this is never going to be heavily used, but its capacity for up trains would still be lost for a considerable time, including margins. Of course if the RFRL is occupied, no train can be signalled to enter it via Oxford Road Junction, so the parallel move is ruled out anyway.

    You can always find cases of disruption where a particular additional move adds useful flexibility; perhaps the main one here is the loss of the Festival Line, for which the Feeder Lines offer a way to turn XC trains in the Relief Line platforms. But often there are several competing examples of these - here, a crossover between the Mains on the viaduct would be one (and has other merits).

    Current practice does not accord flexibility much priority - not enough to buy much by way of S&C, anyway. Parallel moves only score brownie points where the frequency of trains can't be provided otherwise, and I'm not sure even that applies to "disruption only" service patterns.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Visoflex on January 04, 2015, 13:27:29
    BBC damning with faint praise as usual

    Quote
    Work on a railway viaduct in Reading has been completed.

    The new 2km (1.25 mile)-long flyover on the First Great Western (FGW) mainline, has been built to separate passenger trains from freight trains.

    The train firm said the elevated section would make a "huge difference" to services as fast mainlines will be taken over freight and relief lines.

    The viaduct is expected to stop queues and free up pinch points on the network at Reading.

    The work is one of the final phases of the ^895m redevelopment project at Reading station.

    Passengers faced train cancellations and delays of 40 minutes in Reading while the final phase of the work, which started on Christmas Eve, was carried out.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 04, 2015, 13:54:31
    Some video of the first train from ITV Meridian (http://www.itv.com/news/meridian/story/2015-01-04/45-million-viaduct-to-ease-reading-rail-chaos-opens/)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 04, 2015, 14:03:58
    Then perhaps it is the 08:00 Padd to Penzance as stated by a-driver

    According to RTT, someone sent off to snap the "first public train" would have seen:

    07:49 5Z05 - P9, Down - ECS HST to Swindon (due after 08:30)
    08:22 693T - P9, Down - light loco to Didcot for refuelling
    08:39 1C05 - P9, Down - HST to Penzance via Swindon
    08:47 1W15 - P9, Down - Turbo to Ddicot
    08:58 1A07 - P10, Up - HST from Bristol
    09:12 1M30 - P8, Down - Voyager to Didcot
    09:15 1B15 - P9, Down - HST to Swansea

    So yes, 1C05 was really the first, but someone inclined to forget to take the lens cap off (or its digital equivalent) had other options.

    Incidentally, RTT is labelling the lines on the viaduct at High Level Junction, and in P7, P8 and P9 too, as "DU" and "DD", depending on the train's direction. P10 and P11 are still labelled "UM". So where does that DU/DD come from?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 04, 2015, 14:43:52
    Whatever the original plan for the layout was, the fact is that the new facing connection from P12 to the Feeder Main allows a route to be set up for down freight trains (or down Bedwyns?) from the London direction through P12 to Feeder Main to Down Westbury.  Why else would the connection have been put in?

    If the layout were changed at Oxford Road Junction as I suggested you would then be able to set up a parallel route from Up Westbury to West Curve Down or to P13-15 via the Feeder Relief.  I think this flexibility would be useful bearing in mind the number and type of movements we'll be seeing at Oxford Road Junction.

    Makes you think that they need to rethink (again!) the names of the Feeder Lines.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 04, 2015, 15:47:26
    I wonder how many passengers on these services would have been interested or even noticed this change ? I know I would have that's for sure :)

    I did a down trip on a relatively empty XC to Didcot from P7, (at about 1010 or so, the first that had come through from Southampton), and returned on a full and standing HST into P10 (1044 from Didcot).   I think I can safely say that hardly anyone commented on the route over the viaduct, that's if they even noticed.

    I thought the guards on each train might possibly have mentioned it in passing, but nothing at all was said.

    At about 1115 the next XC service to Didcot was signalled from P7 towards the festival line with a single yellow at the same time as a Swansea service was leaving the station from P9 - so that suggests they would have no issues with a Voyager coming to a stand on the gradient?

    Later I caught the 1153 XC to Basingstoke, initially announced as leaving from P8B, but then platform changed into P3.

    All a bit of an anti-climax really...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on January 04, 2015, 18:17:30
    Went over it a few minutes ago (up from Didcot to Reading).  Would upload some out-the-window pictures but all you'll see is black.  Smooth - I think we slowed down over the new section (perhaps it's bedding in?) and glided nicely into Reading.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on January 04, 2015, 18:56:35
    I did a quick out-and-back TWY-RDG-DID earlier today (as you do on a cold misty Sunday in January ;D). Likewise for me everything was smooth if a little on the slow side. However like grahame I had a nice glide into Reading from the west instead of standing outside the station for a minute or two as has often been my experience in the past. Hopefully that's a sign of a regular improvement for the future.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 04, 2015, 19:15:16
    I got the impression some of the timings today (and indeed on any Sunday) were fairly slack - isn't it the normal thing to allow for a two track railway between Paddington and Reading for patrolling and other 'preventative' engineering work?   A fair number of trains were reversing at Didcot, including the trunxcated XC service of course. 

    Perhaps everything will seem a bit more 'snappy' tomorrow when the majority of the day sees the normal working timetable in use.

    Today's fairly relaxed 'opening day' ought to have been a very worthwhile test.  Hope tomorrow goes well for them too...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 04, 2015, 20:53:06
    I did a quick out-and-back TWY-RDG-DID earlier today (as you do on a cold misty Sunday in January ;D).

    Thanks for undertaking that 'special excursion' on our behalf, BerkshireBugsy - and for reporting back here.  :D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on January 04, 2015, 20:56:44
    I did a quick out-and-back TWY-RDG-DID earlier today (as you do on a cold misty Sunday in January ;D).

    Thanks for undertaking that 'special excursion' on our behalf, BerkshireBugsy - and for reporting back here.  :D

    No problem! (but I'm not BerkshireBugsy...) :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 04, 2015, 21:00:06
    My abject apologies to you both for my momentary confusion.  :-[ ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on January 04, 2015, 21:30:51
    The compulsory purchase orders requested by Reading Borough Council for completing Cow Lane are online at this link :

    http://www.reading.gov.uk/council/public-notices/land-cow-lane-reading/

    The three letters of objection received - from the Safestore business and The Reading Festival ( this one surprised me ) and the owners of the building on the corner of Argyle Road.

    I can find anything to say the dispute over the orders has been resolved one way or other.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on January 05, 2015, 16:56:34
    Thanks for the welcome.

    Thank you Industry Insider for posting the full signalling / track layout for the area, which then sparked a few comments regarding down movements over the Oxford Road / Feeder Main layout.

    Whoops! Posters, including myself, thought the layout was wrong since parallel movements are not possible between the Feeder lines and Westbury lines at Oxford Road, but by reference to the layout plans at RBC Planning, Google Earth and the track (switches and crossings) design standards you can see Network Rail have got it right.

    The signalling layout plan is no more than an unscaled two-dimensional line drawing of the physical layout. The lines being drawn horizontal, vertical or diagonal (45 degrees). It is pointless in attempting to suggest signalling or track alterations without reference to the physical characteristics of the area concerned.

    Here is my over simplified interpretation of the design process for this junction, which is in a rather awkward location.

    After connecting the Feeder Main to the Up Westbury, the junction is about 20 metres to the east of the Up Westbury - Up Reading West Curve crossing, there are 5 possible at-grade layout design options in order for a down train to route Feeder Main to Down Westbury:

    1   Do nothing - Routeing FM to UW, then to UW-DW crossover at the south (left) of Reading West Station. Parallel movements are not possible. This route is available by the signalling plan.
     
    2   Add down direction UW-DW crossover between FM-UW junction and UW-URWC crossing ^ Routeing FM to UW, then crossover to DW. Parallel movements are possible. Rejected due to there being not enough space for the crossover.

    3   Add single slip to UW-URWC crossing permitting down UW to URWC movements - routeing is FM to UW, then the single slip to DW. Parallel movements are possible. Rejected due to single slip not permitted in design standards.

    4   Add down direction FM to down direction FR crossover ^ Routeing FM, FR, URWC to DW. Parallel movements not possible. Implemented.

    5   Add down direction FM to up direction URWC crossover, south of URWC-FR junction ^ Routeing FM to URWC then to DW. Parallel movements possible. Rejected due to there being not enough space for the crossover and curvature of URWC.


    I have simplified the process/decision making, but no doubt Network Rail would have implemented the optimum solution, option 2 rather than 4, if it had been possible.

    I am sure others will have an opinion on this and I have no doubt the inadequacy of the current design will be raised in the future.

    Mike



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on January 05, 2015, 17:07:32
    Watch this

    http://youtu.be/PybspgUevoI


     :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 05, 2015, 17:17:31
    Watch this

    http://youtu.be/PybspgUevoI


     :)

    Thanks, W5tRailfinder - I, who have not been through Reading for quite a few months*, now understand how this all works in a way that diagrams and still photos couldn't quite convey - not with my limited imagination anyway. Nice bit of blue-sky thinking there! (Se what I did? I'll spare you the Yorkshire greeting).

    (*This will no longer be the case by 1.30pm on Sunday coming)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 05, 2015, 17:52:27
    My abject apologies to you both for my momentary confusion.  :-[ ::)

    Apology accepted BBM :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 05, 2015, 18:24:40
    Thanks for the welcome.

    Thank you Industry Insider for posting the full signalling / track layout for the area, which then sparked a few comments regarding down movements over the Oxford Road / Feeder Main layout.

    Whoops! Posters, including myself, thought the layout was wrong since parallel movements are not possible between the Feeder lines and Westbury lines at Oxford Road, but by reference to the layout plans at RBC Planning, Google Earth and the track (switches and crossings) design standards you can see Network Rail have got it right.

    The signalling layout plan is no more than an unscaled two-dimensional line drawing of the physical layout. The lines being drawn horizontal, vertical or diagonal (45 degrees). It is pointless in attempting to suggest signalling or track alterations without reference to the physical characteristics of the area concerned.

    Interesting, thanks.  As you say - and as I suggested in my first post on this issue - space may be a problem at Oxford Road Junction, but NR own the land in the "Vee" where the depot was which may offer opportunities for track realignment etc.  There are no doubt many other site issues which I for one wouldn't know about, eg signalling overlaps, curve radii, gradients and the need for the Feeders to start going downwards asap etc.  I just wouldn't want the current opportunity to remodel Oxford Road Junction to be lost for ever because they start building things or selling land in the "Vee".   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 05, 2015, 18:58:41
    Here's a couple of pictures, as we haven't had too many new ones.

    First - look Mum, no wiggles! Or, almost none.
    Looking at the two new signals, T.1707 and T.1709, despite the intrusive I-beam you can see they are of different designs. Both have two feathers, but T.1707 (on P7) has a lobed backing plate and no hoods. Now why would that be?

    Plus, that cute little signal for P3 (T.1705) - taken as an afterthought, when it was really too dark, but it shows just how tiny it is. The box to the right shows "F" for the festival Line, and presumably "W" for the Down Westbury. Or would it have the Up Westbury as an option too? Perhaps so - I think P7 does, or it would not need two feathers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 05, 2015, 19:12:23
    Here's a couple of pictures, as we haven't had too many new ones.

    First - look Mum, no wiggles! Or, almost none.
    Looking at the two new signals, T.1707 and T.1709, despite the intrusive I-beam you can see they are of different designs. Both have two feathers, but T.1707 (on P7) has a lobed backing plate and no hoods. Now why would that be?

    The one on the platform is one of those modern relatively lightweight hinged type that can be lowered down to the platform for maintenance, (looks like a fibreglass structure?) but the one for P8 is probably still the relatively over engineered original style - the key difference being that eventually it will have to be maintained between the live wires of the future OHLE?  So it has the full set up with an access ladder, maintenance platform behind the heads, and the protective steel mesh cage.

    That doesn't really explain the shape of the housings for the feathers, but it could be that the more modern design is 'just different'.  I think all the way along the whole area of the rebuild there are different styles of signal structure depending if they are between tracks or 'outside' the tracks.

    Paul.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on January 05, 2015, 19:49:49
    Or could it be that the one without the backing plate is in a position where it will never have the rising morning sun low behind it?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on January 06, 2015, 08:36:24
    Do you mean low *setting* sun :-)

    Facing West, aren't we?....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 06, 2015, 08:45:09
    Oh dear. And it went so well Sunday and yesterday.

    Quote
    Cancellations to services at Reading
    Due to signalling problems at Reading fewer trains are able to run on some lines.
    Impact:
    Train services running to and from this station may be cancelled or delayed by up to 25 mins.
    An estimate for the resumption of normal services will be provided as soon as the problem has been fully assessed.
    Last Updated :06/01/2015 08:37

    Seems to affect P7-P9, and means RTT may not report them - but some trains do now seem to be getting through again.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 06, 2015, 10:15:26
    Oh dear. And it went so well Sunday and yesterday.

    Quote
    Cancellations to services at Reading
    Due to signalling problems at Reading fewer trains are able to run on some lines.
    Impact:
    Train services running to and from this station may be cancelled or delayed by up to 25 mins.
    An estimate for the resumption of normal services will be provided as soon as the problem has been fully assessed.
    Last Updated :06/01/2015 08:37

    Seems to affect P7-P9, and means RTT may not report them - but some trains do now seem to be getting through again.

    Well, that seems to have been sorted out with few trains badly affected. There are a few odd RTT listings, which may be real or due to erratic train detection:
    1O02 XC Birmingham New Street to Southampton Central, due in 0741 but shown at 0823 - apparently spent 50 minutes on the Festival Line.
    1O80 XC Birmingham New Street to Southampton Central, due in 0808 but shown as arr 0826 dep 0816^ ... eh?
    2J15 GW Reading to Basingstoke, due to leave 0838, cancelled "due to a points failure (IB)" - looks like a misattribution as it's the only example.

    I did check yesterday that the signallers mimic (train describer) display was up to date, so we know the signallers had been told about the changes ... which is reassuring.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 06, 2015, 11:03:41
    1O80 XC Birmingham New Street to Southampton Central, due in 0808 but shown as arr 0826 dep 0816^ ... eh?

    Note also that it was on Platform 11 on a reverse to the Basingstoke line ?????
    How was that feat achieved then?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 06, 2015, 11:21:04
    1O80 XC Birmingham New Street to Southampton Central, due in 0808 but shown as arr 0826 dep 0816^ ... eh?

    Note also that it was on Platform 11 on a reverse to the Basingstoke line ?????
    How was that feat achieved then?

    Probably for the same reason there were no reports of this train between P11 and Southcote, and it lost 10 minutes on the way (allegedly) - and as we know there were problems with signals/train detection - it did something else, and a bit of the signalling or RTT processing chain has put 2 and 2 together and got 5^.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 06, 2015, 11:34:43
    1O80 XC Birmingham New Street to Southampton Central, due in 0808 but shown as arr 0826 dep 0816^ ... eh?

    Note also that it was on Platform 11 on a reverse to the Basingstoke line ?????
    How was that feat achieved then?

    I think this is common on RTT when a train visits the same station twice in a journey.  It could have gone out and reversed in the Kennet Bridge loop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 06, 2015, 11:46:06
    At least one XC service called at Reading West in place of Reading and then took the curve towards Didcot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 06, 2015, 12:11:42
    At least one XC service called at Reading West in place of Reading and then took the curve towards Didcot.

    Presumably 1M26 Bournemouth to Manchester Piccadilly, due into P3 0803 but "jumped" from Oxford Road Jn to Didcot East Jn.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 06, 2015, 12:21:05
    Probably.  It was about 8am I looked at the XC website.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on January 06, 2015, 14:23:37
    Incidentally, RTT is labelling the lines on the viaduct at High Level Junction, and in P7, P8 and P9 too, as "DU" and "DD", depending on the train's direction. P10 and P11 are still labelled "UM". So where does that DU/DD come from?

    Nothing to do with RTT, thats data from Trust. Any report which has 'TRUST - Smart' and has a line or path indication should be disregarded - this data being well known for not making sense! Just waiting for new data to be transferred and all should be back to TD again - with correct line and paths.

    I think this is common on RTT when a train visits the same station twice in a journey.  It could have gone out and reversed in the Kennet Bridge loop.

    You are correct there, the train went out to Kennet Bridge Loop.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 06, 2015, 22:33:42
    Here's a couple of pictures, as we haven't had too many new ones.

    First - look Mum, no wiggles! Or, almost none.
    Looking at the two new signals, T.1707 and T.1709, despite the intrusive I-beam you can see they are of different designs. Both have two feathers, but T.1707 (on P7) has a lobed backing plate and no hoods. Now why would that be?

    The one on the platform is one of those modern relatively lightweight hinged type that can be lowered down to the platform for maintenance, (looks like a fibreglass structure?) but the one for P8 is probably still the relatively over engineered original style - the key difference being that eventually it will have to be maintained between the live wires of the future OHLE?  So it has the full set up with an access ladder, maintenance platform behind the heads, and the protective steel mesh cage.

    That doesn't really explain the shape of the housings for the feathers, but it could be that the more modern design is 'just different'.  I think all the way along the whole area of the rebuild there are different styles of signal structure depending if they are between tracks or 'outside' the tracks.

    Paul.

    The 'lobed' signal heads (or mickey mouse ear type as we signal engineers like to call them) are of Dorman iLS type and are constructed from GRP: http://www.unipartdorman.co.uk/ProductFiles/Integrated%20Lightweight%20Signal.pdf and T1707 signal is of Type 73 found on Page 29 here: http://www.unipartdorman.co.uk/Product%20Bulletins/Lightweight%20Signalling%20Handbook.pdf

    As these fold down I would suggest that in the case of T1709 that sighting, height and space restrictions did not allow for an iLS signal so a conventional standard structure was used with individual Dorman LED signal heads and junction indicators.  The conventional junction indicator has a sighting board that fills the gap between individual indicators.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 07, 2015, 19:41:15
    Plus, that cute little signal for P3 (T.1705) - taken as an afterthought, when it was really too dark, but it shows just how tiny it is. The box to the right shows "F" for the festival Line, and presumably "W" for the Down Westbury. Or would it have the Up Westbury as an option too? Perhaps so - I think P7 does, or it would not need two feathers.

    The Yellow Peril (Signalling Notice) for Stage L shows T1705 Standard Route Indicator as displaying no route indication for the 'Down Westbury' line, 'W' route indication for Down the 'Up Westbury' line and 'F' route indication for Down the 'Reading Festival' line.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 07, 2015, 21:05:40
    ....and for information (as its been discussed several times before) here is the viaduct gradient profile from the same Yellow Peril:

    (http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m92/cbrailways/ReadingViaductGradientProfile2_zps1ae19082.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on January 07, 2015, 21:50:17

    I wonder what the time penalty would have been for siting the signals on the top of the viaduct rather than on the approach grades.

    Does adhesion (or energy use) come into S&T considerations?

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 07, 2015, 22:11:56

    I wonder what the time penalty would have been for siting the signals on the top of the viaduct rather than on the approach grades.

    Does adhesion (or energy use) come into S&T considerations?

    OTC

    Don't think the flat(ish) bit at the top of the viaduct is long enough to fit the points and signals either side of it - with the appropriate modern safety overlap distances.


    It should be reasonably rare to be stopped at one of them when the festival line fully opens anyway.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 09, 2015, 11:47:15
     
    I wonder what the time penalty would have been for siting the signals on the top of the viaduct rather than on the approach grades.

    Does adhesion (or energy use) come into S&T considerations?

    OTC
    Don't think the flat(ish) bit at the top of the viaduct is long enough to fit the points and signals either side of it - with the appropriate modern safety overlap distances.

    It should be reasonably rare to be stopped at one of them when the festival line fully opens anyway.

    I think it's a bit more basic than that - surely the signals are there to protect the crossover from the Festival Line to the Down Main. That that can't be any further along the viaduct than it is, as that's where the Festival Line separates and it goes downhill from there on.

    As to whether a train would stop there in normal operations, there are two parts to that - will trains go up the Festival line to get to the Down Main, and will the signal be against them.  The second part is about complicated signalling issues, which I don't claim to know about. However, I assume that T.1931 on the Festival Line, but not T.1733 on the Main Line, might be held 'on' as a precaution.

    The first part is down to pathing rules, i.e. which platforms will be used to turn northbound trains and which southbound.  Today it is possible to see the first full day (April 7th) of post-Easter timetable on RTT. Of course the track may not be 100% finished on that date, so the timetable might be affected by some moves being unavailable or best avoided.

    Most of the day, platforms 3 and 8 are used for both directions, with a few morning trains in platform 7. Most of these are not in the WTT, but even those that are show the same pattern. All the trains that terminate and then start northbound about 30 minutes later use P3, obviously the tidiest place to park them. There are a few transubstantiations to be removed later, where P3 is used to turn another train while one of these terminators is parked there.

    While the "Line" shown in RTT may be of questionable validity, it does vary and so implies something about pathing, at least in some cases. Note that there is a timing point at Reading High Level Jn, which covers both crossovers on the viaduct (Festival - Down Main and Up - Down Mains) despite the distance between them, but the next (on the Main Lines) is not until Didcot East Jn. So I don't think you can tell whether a train uses the Festival Line all the way from Reading West, or only the eastern part and the Mains over the western part of the viaduct. (Or not unless not showing the Reading West timing point on the Reliefs means it is pathed on the Main Lines (i.e. on the viaduct)).

    From the "Line" shown, it appears that even northbound trains out of P8 will use the Festival Line, and some southbound trains into P8 do not use the Festival Line at all. Examples:
    P3    1E36    XC    Newcastle    dep 1041 (FVL cross to DM)
    arr 1040        Manchester Piccadilly    P8    1O08 (UM cross to DM(U)) 
    P8    1S52    XC    Edinburgh    dep 1440    (FVL cross to DM)
    arr 1440        Manchester Piccadilly    P3    1O16  (FVL all the way)

    The first pattern can't be avoided in the current timetable for odd hours, as the northbound train starts here from P3, but these are both through trains. Crossing at Reading High Level Jn from the Up Main to the Down Main (Up),  with or without then crossing to the Festival Line, means reverse running on what will be a very busy line: inefficient and surely to be avoided.  The alternative of coming in via the Festival Line would be expected, I think. With different timing there could be a conflict between the moves into P3 and out of P8, as these cross over.

    The second pattern is what I would have expected as "standard", except that reversing the direction of the Festival Line like that looks odd - especially as the Down Main is available to do it conflict-free. There is no explicit allowance for this in the TPR (I think route-setting is meant to find that on its own) but I doubt that timing works in theory, and obvio1usly in operation it will lead to delays generating more delays.

    Of course there are all sorts of "back-up" possibilities - using P12-15 and the Feeder Relief, or P10/11 and the Feeder Main southbound, which can be ignored here.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 09, 2015, 15:43:45
    I did suggest a year or two ago that once the layout was completed all XC^s would run ML between Didcot and Reading and vv to make the best use of route capacity, and this indeed seems to be the case after Easter.  The main reason that XC^s terminating/starting at Reading used the RL^s before was because the old P7 was a convenient place to put them.

    As regards the signalling going west from P3 and P7/8/9 towards the viaduct, I was at Reading one evening last week and watched XC 1E68 ex Southampton leave P3 at 1848 via Festival line and DM for York.  Just afterwards 1B76 left P9 via DM for Swansea.  It left P9 with a yellow at T1709 and ran up towards T1733 which was still on red as 1E68 hadn^t cleared.  This demonstrates that there are sufficient overlaps (as you would expect) for a westbound train to run up to either T 1731 (on the Festival line) or T1733 (on the DM) protecting High Level Junction while a train precedes them from the other line through High Level Junction.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 09, 2015, 16:21:07
    I've seen the similar situation with a XC leaving P3 on a yellow, heading down the Festival line towards the red signal protecting the junction with the down main; at the same time a down HST was leaving P9 with a clear run.   So it seems there are no special procedures in use to ensure a clear path over the flyover for either type of service.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 09, 2015, 16:51:54
    I did suggest a year or two ago that once the layout was completed all XC^s would run ML between Didcot and Reading and vv to make the best use of route capacity, and this indeed seems to be the case after Easter.  The main reason that XC^s terminating/starting at Reading used the RL^s before was because the old P7 was a convenient place to put them.

    If they do, then that puts more pressure on Didcot East Junction, the new GWML pinchpoint now Reading is nearly sorted.   ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 09, 2015, 17:32:15
    Well, at present there are 3 tph (2  X Oxford/Cotswolds,1 X Cross Country) that cross from DM to DR (ie crossing UM) at Didcot East, so we^re talking about 1 more.  There are 4-5 tph ( 2 X  Bristol, 2 X S Wales, .5 X Cheltenham) on the UM.   So that^s 8-9 movements per hour through the short length of the UM they all need to use, which at first sight doesn^t seem to be an unduly onerous level of conflict.  Obviously a grade separated junction would be better for reliability etc but could it be justified with the current (or planned) level of train movements?

    I^ve been trying to think of other junctions with comparable levels of conflict on 100+ mph lines and how many are flat or grade-separated, but haven^t got very far yet.  Are say Hitchin or Stafford or Woking comparable with Didcot East?  Hitchin in particular is worth looking at, as the new viaduct has just been built and the business case  must have been there.

    Sorry if this is straying off topic.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 09, 2015, 18:14:37
    Well, at present there are 3 tph (2  X Oxford/Cotswolds,1 X Cross Country) that cross from DM to DR (ie crossing UM) at Didcot East, so we^re talking about 1 more.  There are 4-5 tph ( 2 X  Bristol, 2 X S Wales, .5 X Cheltenham) on the UM.   So that^s 8-9 movements per hour through the short length of the UM they all need to use, which at first sight doesn^t seem to be an unduly onerous level of conflict.  Obviously a grade separated junction would be better for reliability etc but could it be justified with the current (or planned) level of train movements?

    You certainly can't squeeze much more through there and with one move needed every seven minutes or so that doesn't give much leeway for trying to ensure those up expresses don't have to throw the brakes on from 125mph as something crosses over in front.  And, don't forget, that from the new IEP based timetable that 4-5 trains is probably going to become 7 trains per hour (4x Bristol, 2x South Wales, 1x Cheltenham).

    Also to consider is the Down Relief line being blocked by movements from the Up Relief to Up Main which wouldn't happen if the XC's stayed on the Up Relief.  That potentially blocks the 2tph stoppers and the ever increasing number of freights coming Down Relief, a few of which need to access (very very slowly!) Didcot Yard.

    My hunch is that we'll see grade separation being constructed within CP6, or early CP7.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 09, 2015, 18:59:55
    Hello, new to the forum, I've been keeping up to date with users posts over the past couple of weeks and found many subjects to be an interesting read and hope over time I can contribute to that.

    I've been looking over the RTT for the 7th/8th April and have noticed that no trains at all use the Festival line all the way to RW Jn, yet the whole idea of this section was to segregate XC services from the main lines, wether that be at RDG or at Didcot East Jn.

    I have also noticed that most of the XC services for these days are VAR and are only scheduled until the 10th meaning possibly a minor change thereafter. Maybe most XCs will use the whole Festival line route from the 13th April onwards?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on January 09, 2015, 19:12:05
    Hello, new to the forum, I've been keeping up to date with users posts over the past couple of weeks and found many subjects to be an interesting read and hope over time I can contribute to that.

    I've been looking over the RTT for the 7th/8th April and have noticed that no trains at all use the Festival line all the way to RW Jn, yet the whole idea of this section was to segregate XC services from the main lines, wether that be at RDG or at Didcot East Jn.

    I have also noticed that most of the XC services for these days are VAR and are only scheduled until the 10th meaning possibly a minor change thereafter. Maybe most XCs will use the whole Festival line route from the 13th April onwards?

    Welcome to the forum .... I'm not a Reading expert, but as I understand it only the start of the Festival line is in place yet



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 09, 2015, 19:46:48
    Hello, new to the forum, I've been keeping up to date with users posts over the past couple of weeks and found many subjects to be an interesting read and hope over time I can contribute to that.

    I've been looking over the RTT for the 7th/8th April and have noticed that no trains at all use the Festival line all the way to RW Jn, yet the whole idea of this section was to segregate XC services from the main lines, wether that be at RDG or at Didcot East Jn.

    I have also noticed that most of the XC services for these days are VAR and are only scheduled until the 10th meaning possibly a minor change thereafter. Maybe most XCs will use the whole Festival line route from the 13th April onwards?

    Welcome to the forum from me ... and I think you may be generally right.

    Since I said this in my post -
    So I don't think you can tell whether a train uses the Festival Line all the way from Reading West, or only the eastern part and the Mains over the western part of the viaduct. (Or not unless not showing the Reading West timing point on the Reliefs means it is pathed on the Main Lines (i.e. on the viaduct)).
    I've looked at some other examples in RTT, and it does seem that if a train did move over from the UM to the UR at Tilehurst East Jn, it would show a timing point at Reading West. So even the inbound trains to P3, which I gave the benefit of the doubt, are staying on the UM to Reading High level Jn. But note that this is true for the ones shown as WTT, valid until 15/4/2015, too.

    Why that should be is a puzzle. The note against the relevant possessions in the EAS (2/4/15 to 03330 on 7/4/15)  is this:
    Quote
    Note: when this possession hands-back, the Festival, Feeder and Passenger Loop lines are brought into use.

    As to whether the Festival Line was meant to take all XC trains, both ways, I'm not sure it was. Or, rather, that the importance of doing that depends on the direction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 09, 2015, 20:13:56
    Well, at present there are 3 tph (2  X Oxford/Cotswolds,1 X Cross Country) that cross from DM to DR (ie crossing UM) at Didcot East, so we^re talking about 1 more.  There are 4-5 tph ( 2 X  Bristol, 2 X S Wales, .5 X Cheltenham) on the UM.   So that^s 8-9 movements per hour through the short length of the UM they all need to use, which at first sight doesn^t seem to be an unduly onerous level of conflict.  Obviously a grade separated junction would be better for reliability etc but could it be justified with the current (or planned) level of train movements?

    You certainly can't squeeze much more through there and with one move needed every seven minutes or so that doesn't give much leeway for trying to ensure those up expresses don't have to throw the brakes on from 125mph as something crosses over in front.  And, don't forget, that from the new IEP based timetable that 4-5 trains is probably going to become 7 trains per hour (4x Bristol, 2x South Wales, 1x Cheltenham).

    Also to consider is the Down Relief line being blocked by movements from the Up Relief to Up Main which wouldn't happen if the XC's stayed on the Up Relief.  That potentially blocks the 2tph stoppers and the ever increasing number of freights coming Down Relief, a few of which need to access (very very slowly!) Didcot Yard.

    My hunch is that we'll see grade separation being constructed within CP6, or early CP7.

    I did mention before (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=14520.msg160739#msg160739) that some of the smart money in Network rail is on Didcot as the next big flyover. And it is an option in the Western Route Study, but combined with other capacity increases to and through Oxford. The point of that is that more that half the trains go that way, not along the main line, a lot more when you count freight and East-West rail too.

    It always puzzled me about the RSAR that no effort had been spent on reducing conflict on the Relief Lines, as if there could never be enough traffic to make their capacity an issue. That seems to be a common assumption in planning throughout the network. I think the idea is that no line needs more than 2 tph stoppers, or 4tph in cities for "metro" lines, unless it's a Crossrail-type megametro.

    Reading West to Didcot East (inclusive) looks to me like a counterexample to that principle. So pushing XC trains onto the Reliefs may not be an answer, or not for the longer term.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 09, 2015, 20:46:51
    Hello, new to the forum, I've been keeping up to date with users posts over the past couple of weeks and found many subjects to be an interesting read and hope over time I can contribute to that.

    I've been looking over the RTT for the 7th/8th April and have noticed that no trains at all use the Festival line all the way to RW Jn, yet the whole idea of this section was to segregate XC services from the main lines, wether that be at RDG or at Didcot East Jn.

    I have also noticed that most of the XC services for these days are VAR and are only scheduled until the 10th meaning possibly a minor change thereafter. Maybe most XCs will use the whole Festival line route from the 13th April onwards?

    Welcome to the forum .... I'm not a Reading expert, but as I understand it only the start of the Festival line is in place yet



    Yes, I was referring to the whole line which is due to open in April, just to make sure there's no confusion  :)

    Also I work next to Cow Lane Bridges so know this area very well


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 09, 2015, 23:13:46
    If you stand in exactly the right place on the transfer deck, you can see through a gap* in the obstructions straight down what were the Main Lines until Christmas. With binoculars, I could see reading West Jn quite clearly, so it should be possible to monitor what's being done along there**. The picture is the best my little compact, with its tiny zoom lens, can do - if anyone's got one*** that pokes out further,  that would be useful.

    * Medically, it's called the intergantrical lacuna.
    ** Provided there isn't an outbreak of promiscuous intralacunal polygantria.
    *** Zoom lens, obviously.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 10, 2015, 10:16:34
    The whole question of how XC trains will use the post Easter layout on a regular basis (outside perturbations) boils down to the question, are they main or relief services?

    As they are operated 100% by 125 mph stock, and despite contrary opinions are definitely allowed to do 125 mph on the relevant route section, then surely the default position is to use the mains?   Should we really expect most XC services to chug along the reliefs in between freights and local stoppers?

    So is the Festival Line underpass an essential feature of the layout to be used a few times per hour, or is it there to give flexibility for regulating due to late or early running?  Compare it with the eastern underpass, that gets very little passenger use in the normal timetable.

    I've suggested before that various statements made in documents, and inferences drawn from track diagrams do not always 'read in reverse' - remember the original much discussed 'Corus' diagram where particular lines were shown colour coded with light blue as 'Cross Country'.  I got an explanation at one of the public briefings that should be read as 'mainly for use of'.

    Hence for a given route to be labelled 'mainly for the use of XC trains' is not equivalent to 'XC trains will always (or mainly) use this route'...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 10, 2015, 10:41:46
    The whole question of how XC trains will use the post Easter layout on a regular basis (outside perturbations) boils down to the question, are they main or relief services?
    Paul

    To be answered, I think, in connection with the talk in various topics on capacity and grade separation at Didcot East and all the way up to Oxford North.

    Why do NR think capacity runs out at Oxford North before Didcot East? Hardly just on the number of trains. I suspect it depends on running Reading-Didcot as two two-track railways pre-segregated at Reading rather than a four-track railway separated on speed /stops. But that means you have a mix of fast/slower/stoppers (lots of stops, too)/a lot of freight over two tracks for about 25 miles. that's bound to slow down a lot of long-distance (or long travel time) trains that need every minute they can find.

    It's probably a result of "we can only solve one problem at a time ('cos they won't give us money to do more)" thinking. Next stop the Didcot East flyover ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 10, 2015, 20:00:38
    Yes if there was a Didcot East flyover the they would always use the mains, but the difficulty is getting them across the reliefs to the East curve.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on January 11, 2015, 13:57:37
    Why do NR think capacity runs out at Oxford North before Didcot East? Hardly just on the number of trains. I suspect it depends on running Reading-Didcot as two two-track railways pre-segregated at Reading rather than a four-track railway separated on speed /stops.

    Oxford North is 4-track (two from Didcot & two from the East Curve) joining 2 tracks to/from Oxford.
    Didcot East is 4 tracks to 2 tracks but fewer movements per hour onto the curve. So yes, Oxford North is likely to run out at the former first.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 14, 2015, 12:59:47
    Just looked on RTT for the 13th April, seems to suggest that xx:10 Bournemouth to Manchester will be using the whole festival route/relief line whereas xx:40 from Southampton will use Didcot East to crossover, again southbound some using relief line/whole festival line whilst others using Didcot/mainline.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 15, 2015, 18:02:02
    I noticed today that scaffolding was being erected round Thames Tower (or Thame Tower as its tatty sign now says), opposite the station southern entrance. This would be the work trailed by this item from Construction Enquirer (http://www.constructionenquirer.com/2014/09/16/bk-to-refurb-reading-eyesore-tower/):

    Quote
    B&K to refurb Reading eyesore tower
    Grant Prior | Tue 16th September | 7:15

    Bowmer & Kirkland will start work by the end of the year on a major refurbishment of Thames Tower in Reading.

    The eyesore opposite Reading train station has been empty since 2010.

    Plans to knock the 1970s tower down and replace it with a new 25-storey building were shelved last year.

    But developers Landid and Brockton Capital have now been granted planning consent for a major refurbishment scheme.

    B&K will extend the current building from 12 to 16 storeys  and extend the the existing 147,000 sq ft to approximately 183,000 sq ft of offices and 8,000 sq ft of restaurant/caf^ space.

    Trevor Silver, CEO of Landid, said: ^Thames Tower is going to appeal to modern businesses who want a lively environment that will attract a young and talented workforce.

    ^Working with interior architect Penson, we^ll be able to offer fit-out solutions bespoke to each tenant, using the features of the existing structure such as exposed services and soffits to create a visually interesting environment.^

    Landid and Brockton Capital have appointed Rider Levett Bucknall to project manage the refurbishment, which is expected to begin in the next couple of months.

    (http://www.constructionenquirer.com/wp-content/uploads/thames-tower-e1410817653946-390x468.jpg)

    So maybe the scaffolding is there so they can do the steroid injections. Anyway, it's one more step towards finishing the masterplan for Station Hill, and no respite in the continuous work going on in the area.

    I didn't spot the planning permission for this going through, finally, in October, Its number is 141043, and the D&A statement is stuffed full of pictures. The developers have agreed to pay nearly ^1 million in protection moneys.106 contributions, mostly for "affordable housing", and to finish the surrounding ground to match the council's paving.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on January 15, 2015, 22:18:35
    I was wandering around the station today, as one does - it being my first visit since Christmas, and I noticed that new stop signs have been erected at the London end of Platforms 10 and 11. These give the stopping points for HST 2+9. This isn't an error as about 20 metres in front of them are HST 2+7 and HST 2+8 signs.

    I'l try to post a photograph tomorrow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 15, 2015, 23:17:29
    Yes, they have them on other platforms as well.  Although rare, 2+9's do run occasionally, often with a coach locked out of use as a positioning move, and I guess the 2+8 board might be a bit tight otherwise.

    I'd imagine the IEP 9 and 10 car boards will be located in the same place eventually.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 15, 2015, 23:25:20
    Yes, they have them on other platforms as well.  Although rare, 2+9's do run occasionally, often with a coach locked out of use as a positioning move, and I guess the 2+8 board might be a bit tight otherwise.

    I'd imagine the IEP 9 and 10 car boards will be located in the same place eventually.

    Surely the point is that the stairs are well to the country end - so longer trains are told to stop right up that end too. All of the platforms are long enough for a few more carriages, hence the extra board. I think they've been there for ages, haven't they?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on January 16, 2015, 11:54:08
    I was wandering around the station today, as one does - it being my first visit since Christmas, and I noticed that new stop signs have been erected at the London end of Platforms 10 and 11. These give the stopping points for HST 2+9. This isn't an error as about 20 metres in front of them are HST 2+7 and HST 2+8 signs.

    I'l try to post a photograph tomorrow.

    Thanks for your comments, as I said I hadn't seen them before. The thought that crossed my mind is whether the GWs HSTs might be lengthened at some point. This is sheer speculation but if the new Scottish franchise is going to use shortened HSTs, after some of the Western's are displaced by the Class 800/1, there will be some spare trailers knocking around... :)

    Now to try to post my first photo


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 16, 2015, 16:03:04
    Surely the point is that the stairs are well to the country end - so longer trains are told to stop right up that end too. All of the platforms are long enough for a few more carriages, hence the extra board. I think they've been there for ages, haven't they?

    Yes, there were '2+9' boards on certain platforms around Easter 2013, I've a couple of photos with them on.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: a-driver on January 16, 2015, 16:58:07
    2+9 sets are normally used for positioning moves between depots although during the Summer time you'll find some of the busier services to the West Country especially Newquay will be load 9 with the additional vehicle inserted purely to carry luggage.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 16, 2015, 18:15:42
    Just a point about that "5/10" stop board. I assume it's there not just for future SETs, but for a 5+5 Voyager - which should be possible, though I've only once seen even a 4+4 at Reading. Now obviously you don't want a 5-car train stopping down there, unless it's taking up just the A end. So if it's not, I think it has to be allocated and directed into the B platform and use the Rear Clear signs as a stop board. If that's forgotten and it's sent to a full platform, it's a longer walk (as it was when P8 was not divided).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 16, 2015, 19:48:39
    I've finally got round to uploading a cab ride over the new Reading Viaduct.  Although there were a couple of videos of the viaduct's opening, including a cab view, this should hopefully give the most realistic 'drivers eye' view available - and it's in full HD if you have quick enough internet.

    It's in the 'up' direction and runs from Tilehurst, over the viaduct, and into Reading's Platform 10.

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2evsst_cab-ride-from-tilehurst-to-reading-over-the-new-reading-viaduct_travel (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2evsst_cab-ride-from-tilehurst-to-reading-over-the-new-reading-viaduct_travel)

    Hope you enjoy watching!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 16, 2015, 20:11:39
    Many thanks for offering us all that latest absolutely brilliant video footage, IndustryInsider!  ;) :D ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on January 16, 2015, 20:27:08
    Yes, thanks for posting II - excellent stuff! 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on January 16, 2015, 20:46:13
    As some who is unlikely to go on this for quite a while thanks for posting - it was great to see.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 17, 2015, 01:41:13
    Thanks for that excellent video II.

    There's clearly lots of work left to do at the western end of viaduct, to the left of the mainlines.


     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 17, 2015, 10:53:16
    Interesting that the down train in P9 must be on a red as the points in advance of the starter signal are reversed, as are the points from the Festival line further in advance at High Level Junction.  Yet we see from the video that the route on the DM from P9 was clear to at least Tilehurst.

    So I wonder why the down train was on a red?  I can^t believe it was waiting time, down HST^s are never early at Reading!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 17, 2015, 14:29:10
    Just a point about that "5/10" stop board. I assume it's there not just for future SETs, but for a 5+5 Voyager - which should be possible, though I've only once seen even a 4+4 at Reading. Now obviously you don't want a 5-car train stopping down there, unless it's taking up just the A end. So if it's not, I think it has to be allocated and directed into the B platform and use the Rear Clear signs as a stop board. If that's forgotten and it's sent to a full platform, it's a longer walk (as it was when P8 was not divided).

    10 car will also work for a pair of 180s if they ever need to run a pair.    The Friday afternoon XC double Voyager to Bournemouth (1246 is it?) that ran into P8 yesterday was a 9 car - wonder which marker they use?

    Sometime after the flyover opened I saw a XC 221 heading for Bournemouth run right through P8, possibly heading for the temporary 5 car stop board which was just past the London end platform buildings while the platform section by WH Smiths was out of use, but presumably as the temp marker had gone he therefore had to run up to the A end 5 car marker.   This left all the waiting passengers behind the train at the B end, and very soon after the auto announcements and displays reported a sudden 'platform alteration'.

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on January 17, 2015, 16:20:52
    Interesting that the down train in P9 must be on a red as the points in advance of the starter signal are reversed, as are the points from the Festival line further in advance at High Level Junction.  Yet we see from the video that the route on the DM from P9 was clear to at least Tilehurst.

    So I wonder why the down train was on a red?  I can^t believe it was waiting time, down HST^s are never early at Reading!


    XC from P3 to go first when up FGW inbound from UW clears junction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 17, 2015, 17:15:30
    Interesting that the down train in P9 must be on a red as the points in advance of the starter signal are reversed, as are the points from the Festival line further in advance at High Level Junction.  Yet we see from the video that the route on the DM from P9 was clear to at least Tilehurst.

    So I wonder why the down train was on a red?  I can^t believe it was waiting time, down HST^s are never early at Reading!


    XC from P3 to go first when up FGW inbound from UW clears junction.

    I'm not convinced the points outside the station really are 'reverse', I've looked at it a few times and can't be sure.  But surely that train that you mention coming into P8 would mean that the crossover leading from P8 to the down main would be held in the normal position.  The points at either end of such a crossover will always act together, surely?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 17, 2015, 17:57:40
    Yes, W5tRailfinder, you^re probably right.  Detective work reveals that:
    1   the cab ride train arrives in P10 at 1055 hrs, and Daily Motion says that video was taken a few days after the viaduct opened
    2   the only northbound XC that could be waiting to leave from P3 is a late-running 1E36 1040 departure to Newcastle
    3   Recent Train Times shows that 1E36 runs pretty reliably, but on Thursday 8 Jan 1E36 was late and left at 1056, which ties in with it waiting for that HST from UW to clear and then to precede the HST in P9.  So I think II^s video was taken on that day.

    Paul, on my monitor with the video in HD it^s clear the points are reversed.  I would think that the signalling and overlaps etc allows for a down train to leave P8 while a down train runs into P9 and vv, else you would lose a lot of flexibility.  So the points can be either position as a down train runs into P8 or P9 with a red at the end of the platform, and there^s no reason why they should co-act with any other points.


    Edit: "down" inserted in second para for clarity


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 17, 2015, 18:24:16
    But surely that train that you mention coming into P9 would mean that the crossover leading from P9 to the down main would be held in the normal position.  The points at either end of such a crossover will always act together, surely?
    But P9 is the Down Main, and P8 the DM Loop. You can pair off the points and call them crossovers, but it's a bit arbitrary to do so. When you do that, going "straight on" from P8 gets you to the Up Westbury into P3, and while that's going to be a common enough routeing it probably isn't "straight on".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 17, 2015, 22:17:28
    I can confirm that the signalling interlocking allows simultaneous movements to be made in the Down direction into/out of both P8 and P9 as well as in the Up direction into both P10 and P11, the overlaps of the platform exit signals being clear of the (merging) trailing points in both cases.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 18, 2015, 00:15:27
    But P9 is the Down Main, and P8 the DM Loop. You can pair off the points and call them crossovers, but it's a bit arbitrary to do so. When you do that, going "straight on" from P8 gets you to the Up Westbury into P3, and while that's going to be a common enough routeing it probably isn't "straight on".
    I've altered my earlier post because I should have referred to P8 on both occasions.  The points allowing the move from P8 to the down main nearest the station must operate together surely?  How are they numbered?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 18, 2015, 14:16:49
    OK.  This is going to get a bit technical :D ;)

    Here is a simplified extract of the Reading station west end signalling plan (as it stood in November 2010).  Points are shown numbered in the 8xxx series.

    A solid line through the points indicates the NORMAL position of the points with the broken line being the REVERSE position of the points (The NORMAL position is usually allocated by the designer to be the highest speed or straightest route or safest route (e.g. to direct a train away from a potential collision with another train; trap points in sidings being an example).  This is decided at time of initial production of the signalling plan, but can be altered later during any risk assessment of the layout.

    If a point end has an A or B suffix then both ends (A and B) are operated together otherwise each point end is independent.  However, the interlocking can demand certain points not in the direct line of a signalled route to be set to protect that route and divert a train away from conflict.  This is called Flank Protection.

    Note that after use points do not automatically return to the NORMAL position (with some exceptions in special cases) and will therefore remain in the position last set after the route has be traversed by a train.

    Hope that makes sense but if not then please ask away ;D

    (http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m92/cbrailways/ReadingStationCountryEnd2_zpsc1e005ee.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 19, 2015, 10:37:39
    From above:

    "Note that after use points do not automatically return to the NORMAL position (with some exceptions in special cases) and will therefore remain in the position last set after the route has be traversed by a train."

    And herein lies the danger that in not returning Normal then there may not be Flank Protection, from a SPAD on another route.

    Ladboke Grove and Colwich being examples where Flank Protection could have been provided.

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on January 19, 2015, 11:27:46
    I think S&TE covered that in his previous paragraph ...
    Quote
    If a point end has an A or B suffix then both ends (A and B) are operated together otherwise each point end is independent.  However, the interlocking can demand certain points not in the direct line of a signalled route to be set to protect that route and divert a train away from conflict.  This is called Flank Protection.

    I have looked at the report for Colwich and can see that Points 21A reversed could have provided the necesary protection were they not designed to be co-acting with 21B - a relic of the original LNWR mechanical installation I would think.

    Ladbroke Grove was subtly different in that the lie of the points taken by the Thames Trains local, having SPADed the infamous SN109 was designed into the system.  Shortly after that incident, it became apparent from people involved in the original design that it was implemented with full ATP as part of the overall signal control on this part of the GWML.  Full ATP was subsequently removed from the programme but the point's normal lie was not changed.  'ATP-lite' or TPWS was one of the outcomes of this disaster IIRC.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 19, 2015, 11:33:57
    Here is a simplified extract of the Reading station west end signalling plan (as it stood in November 2010).  Points are shown numbered in the 8xxx series.
    Thanks - that establishes what the plan is (or was).

    Evidently the feeder line (RUFM) is the normal route into P11, and 5445A/B are a crossover from the Up Main. However, the merged festival Line and Up Westbury is not the normal route into (or should that be out of?) P8.

    I suspect that's less arbitrary than it looks. Two main line split/join here, so the UM and RUFM are both Up Mains that merge east of the platforms, and the label "Up Main Loop" on p11 gets ignored.

    On the other side, the old Up Westbury is no longer an Up Main, at least it won't be when the work is finished. Up trains use it to access P1-P3, P7 & P8 only to terminate or reverse. It also gives Down access from P8. The festival line is also to be used both ways, though it is more essential for Up movements into P3, 7, 8. Of these, P8 also functions, as labelled, as Down Main Loop - most reversals should be in P3 and P7. So the normal route from P8 is back onto the Down Main, and no other dominant usage overrules that.

    So while the alternative of pairing 5451 and 5439, proposed by Paul7755, has its merits, I imagine it lost out 30:70 in the vote.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 19, 2015, 12:09:20
    The main reason I was wondering about the state of play shown in the video though, is why the points 8451 are already set reverse towards the passing train coming into P8.   To make a useful route through those points you need 8439 normal as well - so is the video showing a partial stage in an eventual route being set, in other words 8439 will move to normal as soon as the up train has entered the platform and is beyond points 8439.

    Hypothetical example here, the next train to approach could be a XC train into P8 that is coming along the down main in the up direction having crossed over at the high level junction.

    My intuition would have been that the signaller demands the route on his VDU and the points required all move at once, so maybe  SandTEngineer can confirms it doesn't actually work like that...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 19, 2015, 12:16:36
    On the other side, the old Up Westbury is no longer an Up Main, at least it won't be when the work is finished. Up trains use it to access P1-P3, P7 & P8 only to terminate or reverse...

    That leads to an obvious question, for the final layout, would it not make sense to swap the line names, i.e. the direct route from Reading West towards P11 should become the Up Westbury, with the existing line being renamed the Feeder Main.

    I imagine it becomes too expensive as it's a cost with not much benefit except to clarify how it all works normally...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 19, 2015, 23:11:06
    Just seen confirmation that Reading's Depot Connection 'A' will be brought into use a little later than the rest of the Easter upgrades, in May.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 20, 2015, 17:51:32
    Interesting that the down train in P9 must be on a red as the points in advance of the starter signal are reversed, as are the points from the Festival line further in advance at High Level Junction.  Yet we see from the video that the route on the DM from P9 was clear to at least Tilehurst.

    So I wonder why the down train was on a red?  I can^t believe it was waiting time, down HST^s are never early at Reading!


    XC from P3 to go first when up FGW inbound from UW clears junction.

    Without wishing to flog this little issue to death, the down HST in 9 could of course have a route set as far as High level Junction, so the platform starter would show yellow.

    Edit...

    I^ve just realised the above could be read in different ways.  What I meant to say is that although a route was not set up for the HST at P9 (as evidenced by the reversed points in advance of the platform starter signal), it would have been possible for the signaller to set up a route as far as High Level Junction.  If he/she had done this the P9 starter would be showing a yellow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on January 21, 2015, 09:18:26
    I will get around to responding to some very good points ( :D) made in the posts above but please also remember that all of the main signals are fitted with TPWS and GW ATP which is designed to stop trains before reaching a point of conflict (usually, but not always, within the signal overlap length).

    You might also note the content of my signature in the footer of this message.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 22, 2015, 00:31:29
    Amongst all the discussion about the technical bits, its probably worth asking the question: "Well, is it working?".

    In other words, with the viaduct now open, what effect is it and the other alterations having on timekeeping and operations.

    I was once a Duty Manager at Reading, and did a few shifts as lead dispatch on the old platform 4 in the afternoons and on 5/8 in the morning peak, so have a measure of experience. Having spent a modicum of time watching what now goes on from the transfer deck, my first impression is that the new layout is already making a huge difference.

    I spent 40 minutes there this evening in the early peak. It was good to see the departure screens showing everything on time. I noticed several fast services arriving early - for example, a down Cotswold service was 4 early into platform 9, and it was great to see up services sweeping down off the viaduct and actually waiting time at platforms 10/11. I watched a down Bristol service pulling into platform 12 and, before it had stopped, the Penzance service was entering platform 7, two minutes early. Unfortunately, the Penzance service was held for two minutes whilst waiting for a Cross Country from the South to enter platform 3!

    Saw a smart bit of operating when the 16.10 XC service to the North from P8 was given a single yellow onto the DM, as an on time XC arrival from the North took the crossovers on the viaduct to the festival line en route to platform 3. This service cleared the cross overs and the northbound service was given a clear road well before it got near the signal protecting the crossovers. The 1612 down Swansea service had arrived early in P9 and waited for the 16.10 XC to clear the section - its starting signal cleared a few seconds before 1612 and the service was on the move 40 seconds later. All in all, nice work.

    One issue I have noticed is that most (?) down Bristol trains are routed through platform 12, meaning they cross from the mains to the reliefs at Kennet and back to the mains at Tilehurst. They often lose a few minutes on the approach to Reading. I think the reason for the routing is to avoid a clash with services off the up Westbury, routed through P8, and along the down main before crossing to the up main at Kennet.

    My impression is that the new layout has already made a huge difference to operations, and that the introduction of the feeders and the full festival lines at Easter will eliminate some of the obvious problems that still remain. The Bristol services will presumably then be routed through P8/9, so eliminating another source of delay.

    Two observations about performance in general:

    First, I have noticed up trains losing time between Swindon and Didcot - is there a problem there?

    Second, (touch wood), FGW seems to have had a pretty good run, performance wise, in January. No doubt Taplow Green can correct me!!!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on January 22, 2015, 06:22:46

    First, I have noticed up trains losing time between Swindon and Didcot - is there a problem there?


    There has been a 20mph emergency speed restriction at Wantage Road on the up for the last few days.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 22, 2015, 09:36:19
    Amongst all the discussion about the technical bits, its probably worth asking the question: "Well, is it working?".


    Saw a smart bit of operating when the 16.10 XC service to the North from P8 was given a single yellow onto the DM, as an on time XC arrival from the North took the crossovers on the viaduct to the festival line en route to platform 3. This service cleared the cross overs and the northbound service was given a clear road well before it got near the signal protecting the crossovers. The 1612 down Swansea service had arrived early in P9 and waited for the 16.10 XC to clear the section - its starting signal cleared a few seconds before 1612 and the service was on the move 40 seconds later. All in all, nice work.


    Oxman, I was on the footbridge as well yesterday between P9/P10 and observed this move - I saw someone behind me also watching which may very well have been yourself! As you say, it illustrates how well the new layout works with the XC's etc.  And because the conflicting moves are now further down the line from the platforms, it's easier for the signallers to set up routes away from platforms (even if it's only a yellow) so it's less likely dispatchers will have to wait for a signal to clear before giving the RA.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 22, 2015, 19:07:30
    Amongst all the discussion about the technical bits, its probably worth asking the question: "Well, is it working?".


    Couldn't agree more, for years more often than not in the mornings I would see an HST or southbound XC stopped at or slowly approaching signal 47 over the top of Cow Lane at around 07:30 and since xmas all trains at this time have been simply gliding straight into the station, and as Oxman says, things should improve further after Easter with the other diveunders open.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxman on January 22, 2015, 20:15:22
    Thanks for that, Bobm, That explains why the up service I caught from Didcot was showing as on time and then turned up 5 mins late.

    Just going back to dispatching from Reading, I was chatting to a DM there a few days ago and he was quick to acknowledge that they had to be much sharper now. In the bad old days, many small platform delays were masked by the regular "WLC" (waiting line clear), something which happens only infrequently now.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 26, 2015, 10:22:52
    I'm curious about this move on Saturday 24th Jan.

    An Up, London direction (Acton?) bound stone train from Westbury.
    Passing through Reading Station on the Down Relief through platform 12 ???

    This train clearly couldn't have come via the Westbury line.
    Is it possible that it routed via Swindon?
    Is that a normal routing?

    If it has arrived from the west on the Up Relief, is it typical to have switched to the Down Relief lines to pass through Reading, presumably due to platform occupation?
    (I do appreciate that all platforms a Bi-Directional.)

    Video here....  https://www.flickr.com/photos/danwarman1/16354666161/


    CCTV99


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 26, 2015, 10:26:05
    I'm curious about this move, possibly on Saturday 24th Jan. as stated the caption.

    An Up, London direction (Acton?) bound stone train, stated to have come from Westbury.
    Passing through Reading Station on the Down Relief through platform 12 ???

    This train clearly couldn't have come via the Westbury line.
    Is it possible that it routed via Swindon?
    Is that a normal routing?

    Of course the caption could be wrong and the train originated elsewhere?

    If it has arrived from the west on the Up Relief, is it typical to have switched to the Down Relief lines to pass through Reading, presumably due to platform occupation?
    (I do appreciate that all platforms a Bi-Directional.)

    Video here....  https://www.flickr.com/photos/danwarman1/16354666161/


    CCTV99


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: DidcotPunter on January 26, 2015, 11:53:19
    Routed via Westbury, Melksham, Chippenham and Swindon? I think a number of stone trains are routed that way. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable can confirm but I've definitely seen them in the loop at Challow.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 26, 2015, 12:42:34
    I'm curious about this move, possibly on Saturday 24th Jan. as stated the caption.

    An Up, London direction (Acton?) bound stone train, stated to have come from Westbury.
    Passing through Reading Station on the Down Relief through platform 12 ???

    There were two trains on Saturday (in RTT) that did this - Westbury-Chippenham-Swindon-Reading-Southall, turn in P1 (Down Main) and back on the Reliefs to Kennet Bridge, swap to the DM and vanish. The explanation is the usual one - it enters a possession, in this case from Reading to Moreton Cutting, and the odd manoeuvres are presumably to enter at the right end the right way round, travelling only on operational signalled lines.  There were other Main Line possesions further in, so presumably P1 at Southall was spare.

    As to why it used P12, not P14 which was free at the time - I guess it was routed that way as the timetable had made a gap for it and terminating/turning services are usually timetabled to use P13-15.

    I'm not sure about 6W05, though - the two I can find in RTT are 652Y and 651Z. Oddly, their transits of P12 show in their train pages but not on the RDG station page.

    PS: In fact, loads of HC/HX are shown as going through Southall P1, including at least one while 651Z was there. So I imagine it sneaked off into the yard - I wonder if it needed to pick up  a second loco?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on January 26, 2015, 13:26:42
    I was at Reading on Saturday, and by coincidence saw one of these stone trains pass through (would have been at about 1530).

    I came in on a service from Pangbourne, and it looked like there was track replacement work in progress on at least one of the mains to the west of the viaduct, which was closed.

    I then proceeded to Thatcham via the normal route (east side of Reading West triangle), but noticed an XC Voyager taking the west side of the triangle west-bound, which I thought was unusual as other XC's seemed to reversing at Reading as normal.

    Apologies for the slightly non-technical observations!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 26, 2015, 13:39:48
    I was at Reading on Saturday, and by coincidence saw one of these stone trains pass through (would have been at about 1530).

    I came in on a service from Pangbourne, and it looked like there was track replacement work in progress on at least one of the mains to the west of the viaduct, which was closed.

    I then proceeded to Thatcham via the normal route (east side of Reading West triangle), but noticed an XC Voyager taking the west side of the triangle west-bound, which I thought was unusual as other XC's seemed to reversing at Reading as normal.

    Apologies for the slightly non-technical observations!

    The possession had taken out the viaduct and P9-11, leaving P7&8 for West Country trains both ways. XC were terminating and starting to the north only; through trains were accessed by bus to Reading West.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 26, 2015, 13:41:10
    I came in on a service from Pangbourne, and it looked like there was track replacement work in progress on at least one of the mains to the west of the viaduct, which was closed.

    I then proceeded to Thatcham via the normal route (east side of Reading West triangle), but noticed an XC Voyager taking the west side of the triangle west-bound, which I thought was unusual as other XC's seemed to reversing at Reading as normal.

    I believe the 'track replacement' was more to do with removal of the temporary running junction (Whitehouse Jn?) that was put in to transfer the mains to the original reliefs, and the reliefs to the temporary reliefs, while the flyover was being built.  Logically the return of the main lines to the normal condition will have to be over the current few weekends before the reliefs are then realigned to normal over the next few months.

    On Saturday the hourly XC south coast services were calling at Reading West all day and using the west curve to/from the reliefs, the XC trains seen in the station would be the Reading - Newcastle terminators, running hourly with the alternate Southampton extensions abandoned.  

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on January 26, 2015, 22:10:28
    Thanks both above. I also noticed that the Basingstoke and Newbury/Bedwyn stoppers were using Platforms 1, 2 and 3, presumably as XC's were not able to use the latter.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 28, 2015, 18:50:29
    So the 1 in 90 will become the new ruling gradient for Up stone trains from Westbury - not very clever that this is being installed as part of a route upgrade especially at a location where Red signals can be expected.  I notice that Train 747K (a Whatley - Acton stone train) can load up to 4,800 tonnes.  Up a 1 in 90 this requires a theoretical drawbar pull (not allowing for rolling resistance etc) of some 53 tonnes, or 119,000 lbf, rather more than a Class 59 can deliver even if it can get the adhesion.  And that's before you take account of the effect of the curve and cant on rolling resistance.

    So these stone trains will need Green signals from before Oxford Road Junction so they carry speed and momentum along the feeder line and up into the station, which will not be good for other trains around at the time. 

    Or maybe they'll be put though P7, and avoid the so-called "freight only" feeder line completely.  Now that would be ironic!

    Looking at RTT for late April, we see most if not all passenger trains heading from Up Westbury (UW) towards London use the Festival Lines Feeder Lines into P10 or P11 at Reading which is perfectly logical.

    And the heavy freights from UW towards London for which the ^freight only^ (according to FGW/NR publicity a couple of years ago) Festival Lines Feeder Lines were supposedly provided to avoid a flat crossing over the UM, DM and DR east of Reading?  Well, most if not all are routed via P7 and cross the DM, UM and DR on the flat at Kennett Bridge!

    Someone please tell me this is only temporary.  Or was I right about the gradients?

    Edit: Festival Lines corrected to Feeder Lines as pointed out by CCTV99   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 28, 2015, 19:31:57
    Looking at RTT for late April, we see most if not all passenger trains heading from Up Westbury (UW) towards London use the Festival Lines into P10 or P11 at Reading which is perfectly logical.

    And the heavy freights from UW towards London for which the ^freight only^ (according to FGW/NR publicity a couple of years ago) Festival Lines were supposedly provided to avoid a flat crossing over the UM, DM and DR east of Reading?  Well, most if not all are routed via P7 and cross the DM, UM and DR on the flat at Kennett Bridge!

    Someone please tell me this is only temporary.  Or was I right about the gradients?.   


    Festival Lines?
    Don't you mean Feeder Lines?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 28, 2015, 20:21:35
    Someone please tell me this is only temporary.  Or was I right about the gradients?.   
    There are some notes about timing freights over the Feeder Relief Line in the Timetable Planning Rules, so draw your own conclusions.

    It is planned that freights will normally use the Feeder Relief Line  (But note, here these lines are still labelled UFM and DFR.):
    Quote
    Reading Signal T1728 DFR:
    Up Trains on the Down Feeder Relief of less than 4400t to be timed to stop here where it would otherwise be necessary to add pathing time approaching Reading.
    But, just in case:
    Quote
    Reading Signal T1726 UFM:
    Up Trains on the Up Feeder Main of less than 4400t to be timed to stop here where it would otherwise be necessary to add pathing time approaching Reading.

    Those two signals are on the slope up into the station, so clearly the gradient is no problem for most trains - better to stop there than to hang about further south, getting in the way. For the heaviest ones it's different. Under "Reading: Adjustment to Sectional Running Time (to be shown approaching this location)" is says:

    Quote
    No additional allowance is to be added to freight schedules over 4400t approaching Reading coming from Oxford Road Jn on the Feeder Relief Line. This is due to the curvature and incline. All additional time to be added as pathing approaching Southcote Jn or Oxford Road Jn or to be added as a dwell in Reading Station.

    So evidently they are going to take this route, but not wait at that point. I don't think there is any suggestion they might not start again, just that it would have to be done so slowly it is worth avoiding.  The curve, I take it, places a limit on the tractive effort that can safely be applied, and how well force gets distributed along the train. I can't find the posts now, but I'm sure we established that the rise from the feeder box is quite small, and the slope so short, that the average gradient felt by a long train is not that adverse. 

    The EAS did say for the Easter blockade that the Feeder Lines would open after it. However, there are still a lot of possessions labelled  "RSAR" after that, so maybe something down Westbury way will not be properly finished until a bit later.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on January 28, 2015, 22:05:48
    And the heavy freights from UW towards London for which the ^freight only^ Feeder Lines were supposedly provided to avoid a flat crossing over the UM, DM and DR east of Reading? 
    Well, most if not all are routed via P7 and cross the DM, UM and DR on the flat at Kennett Bridge!

    It's not most or all.
    As an example, on Thursday 24th April.....
    There are 4 Up stone trains in excess of 4000 tonnes that route via platform 7 (other days some are via platform 8 ).
    However there are 5 others (4000 tonnes plus) which route via the Feeder Lines and via platforms 13 & 15.

    The 2 heaviest (4800 tonnes) route via platform 7, but one of those passes at 0300.
    The other passes through platform 7 at 1039 when the relief platforms are either occupied or about to be.

    Those 5 Up trains routing via the Feeder Lines, are listed as 4400 & 4200 tonnes, the same as the other 2 passing through platform 7.

    Also note, that there are lighter Up freights (2000 tonnes or less) routing from the Westbury Line, that also route via platforms 7 & 8 and cross over to the reliefs at Kennet Bridge, in addition to other similarly loaded freights that will use the Feeder Lines.
    This might suggest that there are pathing reasons for using this routing, rather than using the Feeder Lines at those particular times.

    ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on January 29, 2015, 15:06:47
    Its not only the UPs that are routing via platform 7, the down empties are also routing that way as well.

    By the way, whats happening on the ground? Not had anything since the new year. Obviously what work that is going on now is only visible from trains or with binoculars from the station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on January 29, 2015, 20:06:06
    My cousin reported an interesting working on a Cross Country from Birmingham to Southampton. The guard annouced "Don't be alarmed we will stop at Reading but not this time."

    And apparently they went through the platform (high number) and stopped at Kennet bridge and reversed to 7 or 8 for the station stop. He asked the guard if this was usual and was told yes up until April. Presumably it's when a through train runs Up Relief from Didcot.





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 29, 2015, 23:18:05
    This is the standard route for the southbound Southampton service that leaves Reading on weekdays around 1220. Normally 1215 in the standard timings presumably the 5 mins extra allows for the greater distance covered, and the driver changing ends.

    This was happening every hour last Sunday with the Bournemouth services, with the flyover shut for engineering works, however on the Saturday the solution involved Bournemouth trains using the west curve to bypass the station. (Mentioned earlier this week.)

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on January 30, 2015, 09:13:26
    Thanks Paul.  1O84 0725 Newcastle - Soton has an interesting routeing through Reading, it's shown as approaching Reading on the UR, passing through P15 without stopping, reversing in Kennet Loop, and then finally stopping in P7 at 1218.  Now that's going to give passengers alighting at Reading a bit of a surprise.

    Yes, we discussed this move earlier.  I think the conclusion was that a "run through, reverse and stop" move is not unusual at times of disruption or over a weekend etc of engineering work, but you don't normally get them for 4 months!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 30, 2015, 12:55:18
    Yes, we discussed this move earlier.  I think the conclusion was that a "run through, reverse and stop" move is not unusual at times of disruption or over a weekend etc of engineering work, but you don't normally get them for 4 months!

    I thought we'd mentioned it but I didn't search that far back  ;D  so that must have been when we were discussing the Jan timetable well in advance, and now in the last few pages we're discussing stuff that happens in May...

    Situation normal then...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 03, 2015, 12:50:46
    Sunday 1st March 1Z61 08:58 Pad to Cardiff, 09:56 off RDG. At the moment RTT has it down as P9 then RW Junc though a: this is not possible and b: no trains are using P12-P15 nor the relief lines all the way up to and including Didcot (XCs and Oxfords are reversing at Foxhall) therefore RTT will change, but I'm assuming this will be the first steam over the flyover.

    Note: on UKSteam it has "diesel at rear ?" Presumably this may be needed to help push from Reading.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on February 03, 2015, 13:16:14
    Note: on UKSteam it has "diesel at rear ?" Presumably this may be needed to help push from Reading.

    Don't they always have diesel at the rear as required by NR as insurance against failure?




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 03, 2015, 14:13:33
    With all this extra freight from Southampton heading through Reading to reach the WCML, and the latest news that the Harbury cutting failure will last for "several weeks" - I was wondering, if they increased resources at Reading, if they could get at least the Relief Feeder line opened somewhat earlier than planned?

    Paul

     


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 03, 2015, 14:43:12
    With all this extra freight from Southampton heading through Reading to reach the WCML, and the latest news that the Harbury cutting failure will last for "several weeks" - I was wondering, if they increased resources at Reading, if they could get at least the Relief Feeder line opened somewhat earlier than planned?

    I had a look down the ex-mains alignment with binoculars yesterday. All I could see was big heaps of stuff and yellow machines to push them around. So no, it doesn't look at all close to laying track - not without a very special effort, at least.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 03, 2015, 14:53:01
    I expect there's a lot to do, but if they've about 8 weeks to go you might expect the track to be down in a month's time or so.   Might still help with capacity for a few weeks even if we're getting into March.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 03, 2015, 15:01:09
    How long would it take the lawyers to sort out the implications for the current contracts?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on February 03, 2015, 20:50:11
    How long would it take the lawyers to sort out the implications for the current contracts?

    The first week would be spent sorting out the contracts for the lawyers who will sort out the said implications.

    The second week belongs to the accountants...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 05, 2015, 11:25:01
    I think construction of the Feeder Lines is progressing quite well: http://www.flickr.com/photos/danwarman1/16389884782/in/pool-1945836@N21


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 09, 2015, 07:55:52
    Small update from a visit on up train this morning :

    Realignment work at the weekend has seen a new connection between the Reading West line and Reliefs just after Scours Lane.

    Orginally (from memory) the turnout from the relief to the Reading West lines are a fairly sharp turnout, almost at the 'throat' of the lines. This remained the case even with the new viaduct underpass in place.

    The connection has been moved (approx) 100 yards westwards - giving a dedicated straight section before rejoining the relief lines.

    In fact the rejoin looks temporary - a fairly significant slew can be seen on the up Reading West line (if up is the right term here). The down line is much smoother and connects 'gracefully' on the old down relief line.




    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 10, 2015, 14:39:38
    I'm hoping that the 40mph restriction on the Down Relief line after Reading as far as Scours Lane will either be temporary, or is a mistake on the maps, as that would be disappointing if a PSR - the Up Relief is 80mph until reasonably close the the station.  Good to see the former goods loop is to be a bi-directional passenger loop, which will be useful.  The 60mph over the viaduct and through platforms 9/10 is confirmed. 

    Just had confirmation that both the 40mph restriction on the Down Relief until Scours Lane, and the 60mph restriction on the mains from Scours Lane over the viaduct and through Platforms 9/10 to Reading New Junction, are planned to be raised later in the year at probably in September at 'Stage Q' of the scheme.

    The Down Relief Line is to be raised to 80mph and rumours that the main lines over the viaduct will be 100mph - though I'll believe that when I see the signs go up!  ;)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 10, 2015, 14:48:02
    Realignment work at the weekend has seen a new connection between the Reading West line and Reliefs just after Scours Lane.

    Orginally (from memory) the turnout from the relief to the Reading West lines are a fairly sharp turnout, almost at the 'throat' of the lines. This remained the case even with the new viaduct underpass in place.

    The connection has been moved (approx) 100 yards westwards - giving a dedicated straight section before rejoining the relief lines.

    In fact the rejoin looks temporary - a fairly significant slew can be seen on the up Reading West line (if up is the right term here). The down line is much smoother and connects 'gracefully' on the old down relief line.

    I think Reading West Junction's final position will be some 250 metres nearer to Tilehurst than it currently is to allow a 775m long train to stand clear of other lines on the Down Reading West Curve and Up Reading West Curve in the up direction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 10, 2015, 15:31:16
    I think Reading West Junction's final position will be some 250 metres nearer to Tilehurst than it currently is to allow a 775m long train to stand clear of other lines on the Down Reading West Curve and Up Reading West Curve in the up direction.

    Ah, this is quite important: we've discussed before whether the longest freight trains could be accommodated on the West Curve lines clear of Oxford Road Junction at the south end and Reading West Junction at the west end - it is reassuring to us Pangbourne etc. passengers that northbound freights COULD be held at Reading West Junction clear of the Westbury lines to allow a passenger train on the DR through Reading West J first.  Though will this ever happen eg will 1735 Padd - Oxford (1820 ex Reading) continue to be routinely held at Reading West Junction to allow some metal boxes to precede towards Tilehurst, and thus run late for the rest of its journey (though with a 12 minute allowance Radley to Oxford it probably manages to tick an "train arrived on time" box).



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 10, 2015, 15:59:11
    I think Reading West Junction's final position will be some 250 metres nearer to Tilehurst than it currently is to allow a 775m long train to stand clear of other lines on the Down Reading West Curve and Up Reading West Curve in the up direction.

    From the scale drawings, the curve runs beside the reliefs for some way before joining. With the Festival Line joining close to the existing junction, and the Down Reading West Curve joining almost at Little John's Lane, it's all rather spread out.

    However, that's not really the point, as the crossover from the Up Relief for the Festival Line alone will not now be built. Obviously you couldn't use that and the crossover for the Up Reading West Curve together (though parallel up and down moves via the curve and/or festival Line should still be OK). Of course that modification means other changes could have been made since those drawings, too.

    There was a figure revealed by NR of 961 m for standage on the Down Reading West Curve, but that is too long to be the real design driver either. As the Up Reading West Curve is shorter at both ends, given where the Feeder Relief Line diverges, that looks like the main reason for the shape of the new junction. By eye the down looks about 150-200 m shorter, so 775 m would still fit.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on February 10, 2015, 17:57:37
    ....rumours that the main lines over the viaduct will be 100mph - though I'll believe that when I see the signs go up!  ;)

    Better than Blackpool's big dipper!

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 10, 2015, 18:07:26
    Ah, this is quite important: we've discussed before whether the longest freight trains could be accommodated on the West Curve lines clear of Oxford Road Junction at the south end and Reading West Junction at the west end - it is reassuring to us Pangbourne etc. passengers that northbound freights COULD be held at Reading West Junction clear of the Westbury lines to allow a passenger train on the DR through Reading West J first.  Though will this ever happen eg will 1735 Padd - Oxford (1820 ex Reading) continue to be routinely held at Reading West Junction to allow some metal boxes to precede towards Tilehurst, and thus run late for the rest of its journey (though with a 12 minute allowance Radley to Oxford it probably manages to tick an "train arrived on time" box).

    Yes, as I understand it they could hold a freight on the curve.  They could also have a freight onto the Down Relief and route a passenger train from P12-15 via the Up Passenger Loop in the down direction with that passenger train rejoining the down relief ahead of it at Tilehurst East Junction.  Also worth pointing out is that freight trains will traverse the Reading West Curve lines quicker than they currently do, as instead of being 25mph throughout, the linespeed is 40mph over Reading West Curve before dropping to 30mph at the Oxford Road Junction end. 

    The whole layout is massively more flexible.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on February 11, 2015, 15:29:42
    What is the standage for Up trains on Up Relief and Up Passenger Loop for trains waiting to cross to the Festival Line and West Curve? Is there space for a stationery train to be overtaken?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 11, 2015, 23:13:26
    Quick question.  I know last year there was no route from Platform 7 to Didcot, only Berks & Hants. Is that still the case?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 11, 2015, 23:24:09
    Quick question.  I know last year there was no route from Platform 7 to Didcot, only Berks & Hants. Is that still the case?
    No.
    7 & 3 can access the festival Line, it's just 1 & 2 that can only serve the Westbury Line. And that stays true after Easter.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on February 12, 2015, 07:37:21
    Quick question.  I know last year there was no route from Platform 7 to Didcot, only Berks & Hants. Is that still the case?
    No.
    7 & 3 can access the festival Line, it's just 1 & 2 that can only serve the Westbury Line. And that stays true after Easter.

    Yesterday (11th feb ) there was no route from platform 7 (and 8 I believe) to the Berks and Hants line due to signalling problems at Reading but these were fairly quickly resolved. Whilst the problem existed some journeys had to be split at Reading. For example paddington to Bedwyn services came in on p7 and then you had to catch an onbound service from p1-3. Services to the south west of England that would have normally go via newbury were sent via Swindon.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on February 12, 2015, 09:53:50
    Yes, as I understand it they could hold a freight on the curve.  They could also have a freight onto the Down Relief and route a passenger train from P12-15 via the Up Passenger Loop in the down direction with that passenger train rejoining the down relief ahead of it at Tilehurst East Junction.  Also worth pointing out is that freight trains will traverse the Reading West Curve lines quicker than they currently do, as instead of being 25mph throughout, the linespeed is 40mph over Reading West Curve before dropping to 30mph at the Oxford Road Junction end. 

    The whole layout is massively more flexible.

    Yes, agreed re flexibility (apart from layout at Oxford Road Junction as discussed earlier!) and I hadn^t thought of the use of the Up Passenger Loop for down trains. 

    I^m assuming ^ and this I think answers W5tRailfider ^ that the distances are such that if the longest southbound freight is held on the UR at T1744 at Reading West Junction waiting a route across the DR and on to the West Curve, then a following passenger train on the UR can use the Up Passenger Loop to pass it and get into Reading station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 12, 2015, 09:58:34
    Quick question.  I know last year there was no route from Platform 7 to Didcot, only Berks & Hants. Is that still the case?
    No.
    7 & 3 can access the festival Line, it's just 1 & 2 that can only serve the Westbury Line. And that stays true after Easter.

    And you also can't (and won't) be able to head towards Didcot from platforms 10/11 - though after Easter you'll be able to head towards the Berks & Hants via the Feeder Main or Feeder Relief.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 16, 2015, 22:15:21
    A check of the signalling plans shows that the standage for Down freight trains on the Down Reading West Curve is 874m clear of Oxford Road Junction point connections and 778m clear of Oxford Road Junction Down Reading Feeder Relief point connections.  The standage for Down freight trains on the Up Reading West Curve is 775m clear of Oxford Road Junction point connections and 725m clear of Oxford Road Junction Up Relief Feeder point connections.  The standage for Up freight trains on the Up Reading West Curve is 791m clear of the Down Relief point connections.

    The dimensions are based upon the axle counter head positions to the relevant signals but allowances need to be made for defensive driving (i.e. a train will not draw exactly up to a signal).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 17, 2015, 11:54:48
    Is there a 'modern standard' for maximum length of freight trains - which effectively means container trains?   

    I seem to remember a discussion somewhere that referred to 775m loops being the new standard, but it seemed to be an open question as to whether this meant a loop slightly longer than that, i.e. suitable for a 775m train, or designed for whatever trains could be safely 'positioned' within a physical 775m loop, hence the standard train would be a bit shorter.

    I've checked in various NR sources such as enhancement plans and RUSs and it doesn't actually seem to be explicitly defined; this extract from the CP5 enhancements plans uses 775m in both contexts as you can see:

    Quote
    The purpose of the Southampton to West Coast Main Line train lengthening programme is to
    allow 775m train lengths for intermodal services
    from the Port of Southampton to the West
    Midlands and West Coast Main Line. The remaining scope to be delivered in CP5
    comprises:
    Location Scope to deliver the output
    Southampton Western Docks Extend Up / Down docks branch
    Southampton Maritime - Redbridge Extend depot reception sidings
    Eastleigh Provide 775m Up Loop
    Fenny Compton Increase speed of entry / exit to 40mph
    Hatton Increase of loop entry

    In practice, the Eastleigh loop is much longer, and is now referred to as the up slow line.   But the figures for Reading West curve area seem to be spread either side of 775m, which possibly makes it a pinch point for certain route or direction options, IYSWIM?

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on February 17, 2015, 22:13:47
    There is a good photograph of construction progress with the Feeder Lines to be found here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/danwarman1/16561265991/in/pool-1945836@N21/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on February 18, 2015, 16:30:48
    Questions from a relative layman, who is however fairly up-to-speed with the Reading work.

    As a relatively frequent traveller into London from Thatcham, I am assuming that post Easter when the feeder lines open, if I am on a through train THA-PAD it will take the up feeder from Reading West and run up through Platforms 10/11?

    If I am on an up Reading terminator, I assume it will take the current route (up the east side of the Reading West triangle) and into Platforms 1-3?

    Just be good to understand what to expect. If proceeding down on the same routes, I assume roughly the same in reverse?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 18, 2015, 17:41:43
    A random day's worth (0600-0800) of up through trains Bedwyn to Paddington after Easter:

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RDG/from/BDW/to/PAD/2015/04/15/0600-2000?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

    ...and down through trains:

    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/advanced/RDG/from/PAD/to/BDW/2015/04/15/0600-2000?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

    suggests that through trains will usually use P11 up and P7 down, the latter being same as now.  That's basically what I would have expected, because those are the preferential through platforms to use.

    I'd also expect most Reading terminators to use the existing bays, but with a few, at start or end of service, possibly using the relief side platforms - similar to what has been done with the Redhill/Gatwick services since the eastern underpass opened.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on February 18, 2015, 18:36:29
    Thanks Paul,

    I looked at the 0715 and 0903 ex-Thatcham, which are regular transports for me (the former an HST, the latter a Turbo).

    I assume that the route "UFM" refers to the Up Feeder?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on February 18, 2015, 19:47:42
    Quote from: Thatcham Crossing link=topic=6405.msg171415#msg171415

    I assume that the route "UFM" refers to the Up Feeder?

    Yes, Up Feeder Main.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 19, 2015, 23:42:23
    The scaffolding around Thame(s) Tower never got very far up it. Now the great eyesore next to it has been scaffolded and the scaffolding sheeted - or at least part of it has. I presume they are going to strip it out, including removing all the glazing, before subjecting the shell to irrecoverable hydraulic nibbling. I'm less sure whether the scaffolding could still be in place for that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 21, 2015, 10:33:10
    Just flicking through new timetables from May and notice that XCs are having up to 12 minutes to reverse (both north and south bound) with the latter leaving anywhere between xx:46 (before Bedwyn service(xx:48)) and xx:52 (after Bedwyn service)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on February 21, 2015, 13:01:17
    Just flicking through new timetables from May and notice that XCs are having up to 12 minutes to reverse (both north and south bound) with the latter leaving anywhere between xx:46 (before Bedwyn service(xx:48)) and xx:52 (after Bedwyn service)

    I think there's a certain amount of padding in the present run from Reading to Basingstoke, it isn't unusual to get to Basingstoke a good few minutes before being able to cross to platform 1 there.  Maybe they are taking advantage of increased flexibility in the Reading area to hold trains there if they don't really need to leave yet?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 21, 2015, 13:30:08
    Just flicking through new timetables from May and notice that XCs are having up to 12 minutes to reverse (both north and south bound) with the latter leaving anywhere between xx:46 (before Bedwyn service(xx:48)) and xx:52 (after Bedwyn service)

    I think there's a certain amount of padding in the present run from Reading to Basingstoke, it isn't unusual to get to Basingstoke a good few minutes before being able to cross to platform 1 there.  Maybe they are taking advantage of increased flexibility in the Reading area to hold trains there if they don't really need to leave yet?

    Paul

    Comparing the same train after the May timetable change against one before:
    Southbound, 1O087:27 MAN-BMH, minutes later:
    Reading High Level Jn:    0
    Reading P7 or P8:     1
    Depart Reading:    6
    Oxford Road Jn:    7
    Southcote Jn:    6
    Bramley:    1
    Basingstoke P1: 0

    Northbound, 1M38 9:45 BMH-MAN, minutes later:
    Basingstoke P1: 1
    Bramley:    1
    Southcote Jn:    1
    Oxford Road Jn:    3
    Reading P7 or P8:     3
    Depart Reading:    5
    Reading High Level Jn:    6
    Didcot East Jn:    5
    Oxford:    6
    Banbury:    3
    Leamington Spa:    3
    Coventry:    1 (0 on departure)

    Make what you will of that. Some of it (and there are other minor en-route timing adjustments on 1M38) may be known changes in operations or engineering, some experience of how times tend to work out in practice. 1O08 is shown on RTT on the relief Line from Didcot-Reading, while 1M38 is shown on the Main Line.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on February 22, 2015, 19:34:10
    There is a good photograph of construction progress with the Feeder Lines to be found here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/danwarman1/16561265991/in/pool-1945836@N21/
    You can sort-of see the two feeder lines now extend under the viaduct and up the slope to join the relevant lines into the platforms. The stuff in the way doesn't help, but the Feeder Main is on the left and joins P11 and P12, while the Feeder Relief on the right joins the Down Relief just behind the very top of the signal. (The camera's above P9.)

    Now I know it's an awkward shallow camera angle, but don't you think the gradient profile of the Feeder Main is very odd (and the Feeder Relief too, though less so)?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 01, 2015, 10:54:45
    Note: on UKSteam it has "diesel at rear ?" Presumably this may be needed to help push from Reading.

    Don't they always have diesel at the rear as required by NR as insurance against failure?


    Evidently not, here is a video of today's train Mayflower which I believe to be the first steam over the flyover, (sorry about the sound quality, it was super windy)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nlpjqmsm0VQ


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 01, 2015, 12:47:32
    The boys and girls in orange are busy putting in the connections (as far as they can before the Easter possession) for the 'new and improved' Reading West Junction this weekend.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 10, 2015, 18:28:49
    I may be repeating observations- but :

    Feeder lines are now all connected. Looks like a final 'top coat' of ballets is required but otherwise in situ.

    The Festival Line is in situ - again waiting a top coat of ballest
    The Festival Line connects to new point work on what I can assume is the new relief line alignment after Easter (which seems to be pretty much where the old mains are).
    It's a very gentle turn out from the relief to the Festival Line suggesting this can be taken at some speed.

    The Reading West line connection to the reliefs is actually further West than the current slew (say be another 100 yards) - almost level with the buffer stops of the west end of the new depot.

    Thanks to a slow proceeding Turbo for this update


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on March 10, 2015, 20:41:53
    Were the orange army performing Swan Lake then? :-)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 17, 2015, 17:31:14
    We discussed the new closing-up signals at Reading in both directions for platforms 12-15 and whether we thought they posed an extra SPAD risk a few years ago.  Well, yesterday a FGW service did have a SPAD at one of these signals, so it took just under two years for it to happen.  That's not too bad compared with the number of SPAD's in the new depot (4 already I think!), but still not what designers of the layout were hoping for I'm sure.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 17, 2015, 18:35:21
    Which signal number was it II?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 17, 2015, 21:07:46
    Does anyone know when Network Rail will take down the remaining parts of the Cow Lane road tunnel?

    I know there is a hold up on the council side getting permission for the new road layout itself - but I can't see why this would hold up NR from clearing the remainder of the underpass and 'finishing' their part of the job.

    Does anyone know ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 18, 2015, 12:00:56
    Does anyone know when Network Rail will take down the remaining parts of the Cow Lane road tunnel?

    The council side of things should hopefully be resolved soon:
    "The Secretary of State for Transport has approved the compulsory purchase of the final pocket land at Cow Lane."
    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/cow-lane-bridges-transport-secretary-8819656 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/cow-lane-bridges-transport-secretary-8819656)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 18, 2015, 12:03:33
    We discussed the new closing-up signals at Reading in both directions for platforms 12-15 and whether we thought they posed an extra SPAD risk a few years ago.  Well, yesterday a FGW service did have a SPAD at one of these signals, so it took just under two years for it to happen.  That's not too bad compared with the number of SPAD's in the new depot (4 already I think!), but still not what designers of the layout were hoping for I'm sure.

    Yes, one or two of us expressed concern about the occupation of one platform by 2 trains without mid-platform signals, which appeared to be (choosing my words carefully) non-compliant with the relevant Group Standard.

    I though a XC had done similar a year or two ago, so this FGW one isn^t the first.   

    I^d always assumed that once the layout is finished (and terminating XC^s can use P3) this arrangement would stop, and the Padd-Rdg stoppers would run into and out of the depot carriage sidings instead of sitting in P13 or P14 for 30 minutes. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 18, 2015, 12:20:01
    I^d always assumed that once the layout is finished (and terminating XC^s can use P3) this arrangement would stop, and the Padd-Rdg stoppers would run into and out of the depot carriage sidings instead of sitting in P13 or P14 for 30 minutes. 

    I don't think that will be the case as all the platforms now have rear clear markers (even if they don't have closing up signals), so all will continue to be used permissively.  Though the advent of Crossrail and longer electric trains will probably make their use less frequent.  Sending things into the depot just makes it less productive with drivers as they either have to sit down there with the set, or walk back up with another walking back down.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 18, 2015, 15:56:07
    I^d always assumed that once the layout is finished (and terminating XC^s can use P3) this arrangement would stop, and the Padd-Rdg stoppers would run into and out of the depot carriage sidings instead of sitting in P13 or P14 for 30 minutes. 


    The XC terminators continue using either P13 or P14 B end even with the new layout -assuming the info in RTT is correct.

    Paul



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on March 18, 2015, 16:15:32
    Which signal number was it II?

    It was T1695 on the approach to platform 13A in the down direction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 20, 2015, 08:52:27
    I^d always assumed that once the layout is finished (and terminating XC^s can use P3) this arrangement would stop, and the Padd-Rdg stoppers would run into and out of the depot carriage sidings instead of sitting in P13 or P14 for 30 minutes. 

    The XC terminators continue using either P13 or P14 B end even with the new layout -assuming the info in RTT is correct.

    Paul

    Maybe with so many freight trains that could be using the Feeder lines after Easter still continuing to use P7/8 that they want to minimise conflicting moves with XC^s in P3/7/8, so the terminators will be kept in P13/14. 

    Less flippantly, it^ll be interesting to see if there any changes at the December timetable change.  Continuing to block P13/14 with Padd-Rdg stoppers restricts pathing opportunities between the Relief Feeder line and the RL^s, which may be contributing to the continued use of P7/8 for freights to/from Westbury lines (as well as the Feeder Line gradient issue for the heavy freights).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 20, 2015, 09:40:29
    By making all Down Westbury direction freights use the Feeder Line will of course only result in moving the conflict point to Reading West so not much advantage in that :P

    What is needed next is a third reversible line on the Up side between Reading West and Southcote Junction with or without a possible flyover at the latter ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 20, 2015, 09:41:10
    Which signal number was it II?

    It was T1695 on the approach to platform 13A in the down direction.
    Thanks II.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on March 20, 2015, 10:37:33
    What is needed next is a third reversible line on the Up side between Reading West and Southcote Junction with or without a possible flyover at the latter ::)

    That's quite heavy engineering through a built up area, isn't it?   Would an alternative capacity increase for freight to Westbury from Reading be to provide a second track from Thingley Junction to Bradford Junction, where there's already a trackbed as that line was double until 1967 (actually double broad gauge in the 1800s!)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 20, 2015, 13:21:40
    What is needed next is a third reversible line on the Up side between Reading West and Southcote Junction with or without a possible flyover at the latter ::)

    That's quite heavy engineering through a built up area, isn't it?   

    Not really.  There is plenty of space for a third track on the Up side between Reading West station and Southcote Junction with all of the over bridges having a 'spare' arch that could be used.  The boundary fence is quite a way back from the existing track.  The most difficult bit would be the bridge over the A4 at Reading West (McDonalds and Lidl would have to go....... :P).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on March 20, 2015, 14:13:14
    I had the great pleasure to travel into PAD from THA a few times this week.

    On Tuesday morning I arrived at RDG on the 0800 stopper from THA, looked for the first HST into town, and discovered it was an up service from PLY which picked me up on Platform 7.

    I'd not seen an up service do that, so expressed some surprise to a despatcher who told me that it's a temporary measure until after Easter.

    I know this is because of the lack of a route currently from the Westbury's to Platforms's 9, 10, 11 etc, but was surprised that an up service didn't go into Platform 8 (which was vacant as far as I recall).

    Anecdotally, since the Christmas work, there seems to be a lot less "holding" at signals outside the Station, especially when proceeding up between Reading West and Reading (which was previously very frequent during busy periods). I guess this will get better still after Easter.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on March 20, 2015, 14:13:28
    .....Continuing to block P13/14 with Padd-Rdg stoppers restricts pathing opportunities between the Relief Feeder line and the RL^s, which may be contributing to the continued use of P7/8 for freights to/from Westbury lines (as well as the Feeder Line gradient issue for the heavy freights).


    RTT appears to show fewer freights using P7/8 in June, than in the first month after Easter.

    Heavy stone trains (over 4000 tonnes) are booked to use the Feeder lines, with most of those given as 4200 & 4400 tonnes passing through P12-15.
    Only the 4800 tonne trains (only one or two booked a day) seem to be limited to P7.


      


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 20, 2015, 17:33:35
    Quote
    Not really.  There is plenty of space for a third track on the Up side between Reading West station and Southcote Junction with all of the over bridges having a 'spare' arch that could be used.  The boundary fence is quite a way back from the existing track.  The most difficult bit would be the bridge over the A4 at Reading West (McDonalds and Lidl would have to go....... :P).

    The road past Mcds/Lidl is the A329 Oxford Road (Hence Oxford Rd Junc) not the A4.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 20, 2015, 18:22:57
    By making all Down Westbury direction freights use the Feeder Line will of course only result in moving the conflict point to Reading West so not much advantage in that :P

    What is needed next is a third reversible line on the Up side between Reading West and Southcote Junction with or without a possible flyover at the latter ::)

    I think the UM ad DM east of Reading station are together a bit busier than the Up Westbury at Reading West (ignoring freights going round the West Curve of course), so best to have conflict point at the latter I would have thought.   



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 20, 2015, 21:13:29
    Gather someone tried to put an engineering train into platform 3 on Thursday morning only to discover it wouldn't fit and fouled the lines to and from Reading West.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 20, 2015, 23:49:19
    What is needed next is a third reversible line on the Up side between Reading West and Southcote Junction with or without a possible flyover at the latter ::)

    That's quite heavy engineering through a built up area, isn't it?   Would an alternative capacity increase for freight to Westbury from Reading be to provide a second track from Thingley Junction to Bradford Junction, where there's already a trackbed as that line was double until 1967 (actually double broad gauge in the 1800s!)

    For just a few trains maybe ... but (if you believe the Western Route Study - which is not compulsory) the twin track from Swindon to Thingley overloads before Southcote Junction. Plus, of course, those trains don't want to go just between Reading and Westbury. If they are taking aggregate from the Mendips to London, they would need to go through Didcot East which also overloads early. By 2019 its grade separation will likely be at GRIP 3, at most. If they are taking containers of goodies from Southampton to past Birmingham,  they have to get across to Westbury, which is a longer route (though part is identified for possible electrification in CP6 as a diversion for the Electric Spine up to Basingstoke).

    The Route Study considers the third track from Oxford Road to Southcote, along with grade separation at Southcote (option C4). The third track is a bit more expensive (^35M - ^75M), and includes relocating Reading West station - where to, I wonder. That north part of the formation is between rather short back gardens, so I suspect the idea is to use the width occupied by the platforms so as to avoid any land take.

    Part of the analysis of the two parts of option C4 says this (p137):
    Quote
    Either choice would increase capacity and reduce performance risks along the Route Section. However it is anticipated that the delivery of these choices would still be insufficient to deliver the full 2043 ITSS without compromise to the journey time improvements anticipated in 2019 due to key constrained areas on other Route Sections such as London Paddington to Reading where capacity utilisation is high. The implementation of both choices together is expected to mitigate this with the combined intervention allowing efficiencies to be realised which would reduce the overall cost.

    I think that says that either the grade separation or the third track alone would not deliver the hoped-for reliable journey time improvements as the line from London to Reading is so heavily loaded. But doing both would mitigate this. How? Any timing improvements over this short section can't possibly be enough to cancel out the kind of delays that could be produced by a small initial disruption on a fully-loaded 20-minute-plus run out to Reading.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 20, 2015, 23:59:00
    I had the great pleasure to travel into PAD from THA a few times this week.

    On Tuesday morning I arrived at RDG on the 0800 stopper from THA, looked for the first HST into town, and discovered it was an up service from PLY which picked me up on Platform 7.

    I'd not seen an up service do that, so expressed some surprise to a despatcher who told me that it's a temporary measure until after Easter.

    I know this is because of the lack of a route currently from the Westbury's to Platforms's 9, 10, 11 etc, but was surprised that an up service didn't go into Platform 8 (which was vacant as far as I recall).
    One way of looking it is to note that P8, like P7, is a down platform.

    Or, if you look at path conflicts, at the London end it's the same as P7 and P8 join and then the up path has to use the Down Main until it can cross over. at the other end there is one conflict with the path of a down train to the Westbury Lines, or with an XC reverser, whichever platform it uses. However, if the down train is heading toward Didcot, there is no conflict here if it uses P8 and the up train P7, but there is one if they are swapped over.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 26, 2015, 12:36:58
    Somewhat tangential to the station works - visible progress of the demolition of the station hill buildings is now underway.
    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/station-hill-development-work-finally-8920810 (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/station-hill-development-work-finally-8920810)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on March 26, 2015, 23:38:55
    Noticed what I think was a tamper at work on one of the feeder lines (near to the old FGW office building at the southern end of the triangle) when I passed by yesterday.

    I guess that building is staying as it looks like the area at the front of it has been tidied up/resurfaced. Is the old train shed (adjacent to the up/down Westbury's) staying or going?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 27, 2015, 10:12:04
    Noticed what I think was a tamper at work on one of the feeder lines (near to the old FGW office building at the southern end of the triangle) when I passed by yesterday.

    I guess that building is staying as it looks like the area at the front of it has been tidied up/resurfaced. Is the old train shed (adjacent to the up/down Westbury's) staying or going?

    I think the upper triangle is definitely becoming sidings for yellow plant, such as tampers; and a delivery site for equipment that come by road.  So it might be that they are keeping the old DMU shed and offices as a maintenance facility for the plant.

    Isn't the remaining FGW building the driver training school, where the simulators and so on are fitted?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 30, 2015, 21:29:45
    Network Rail staff were out in force at Paddington today handing out leaflets about the Easter engineering work.

    In particular they were drawing people's attention to the last trains on Thursday 2nd April as the Reading blockade gets underway.

    Without listing them all, as a general rule the last trains for most destinations for Reading and beyond are no later than 23:00.

    A notable exception is the 23:46 to Oxford which operates via Banbury.

    Full list here https://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/-/media/PDF/contents/travel-advice/easter-2015/Easter%20Last%20Train%20Home.pdf (https://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/-/media/PDF/contents/travel-advice/easter-2015/Easter%20Last%20Train%20Home.pdf)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 05, 2015, 14:16:52
    I don't wish to put a jinx onto it but currently the Reading Easter works seem to be to be running to plan ::):  https://mobile.twitter.com/networkrailgwrm


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on April 05, 2015, 14:43:02
    I have been keeping an eye on this.

    Yesterday (Easter Saturday) looking at the pictures, it looked as though the track laying of the relief lines was complete. In the previous weekend possessions was the Scours Lane Junction point replaced (Up Relief to Up Reading Passenger Loop) or has this still to be done?

    I cannot work out from the pictures provided what is happening on the URPL. I can see the trailing connection into the Up Relief from it (no track though).

    For those interested in OpenTrainTimes, they now have a Paddington map and a Southall to Stockley Bridge / Heathrow map.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on April 05, 2015, 15:04:01
    I hope all is done by Tuesday pm. I'm heading for Gatwick.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CCTV99 on April 05, 2015, 15:13:14
    I don't wish to put a jinx onto it but currently the Reading Easter works seem to be to be running to plan ::):  https://mobile.twitter.com/networkrailgwrm

    Thanks for the link.
    Lots of photos there.
    Is there a publicly viewable link to the time-lapse cameras mentioned?





    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 05, 2015, 16:15:55
    I hope all is done by Tuesday pm. I'm heading for Gatwick.

    Gatwicks are running anyway....as are SWT to Waterloo.

    Just need to be able to get to Reading from the West...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on April 05, 2015, 19:47:42

    Gatwicks are running anyway....as are SWT to Waterloo.

    Just need to be able to get to Reading from the West...

    My major fear is bustitution.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 05, 2015, 21:12:31
    NR reported project on time at the 10am checkpoint meeting today


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 13, 2015, 17:35:17
    For those of you who couldn't get to Reading today to see the trains having fun scampering in and out of their new rabbit holes, here's a picture of 1A81 coming up the Down Feeder MainRelief to enter P12. This is the second of the two trains from Penzance that arrive almost together, and the other (1A16) which set off an hour earlier but came via Swindon, is visible in P10.

    1A81 was due into P11 at 13:16, and shown as such on the train describer mimic screen at 13:11. By the time I had got upstairs it was being announced as a platform change to P12, and switched from the UFM to the DFR, which seems unnecessary. Is there some problem with having these two trains across a platform from each other - do they squabble?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on April 13, 2015, 17:59:18
    For those of you who couldn't get to Reading today to see the trains having fun scampering in and out of their new rabbit holes, here's a picture of 1A81 coming up the Down Feeder Main to enter P12. This is the second of the two trains from Penzance that arrive almost together, and the other (1A16) which set off an hour earlier but came via Swindon, is visible in P10.

    1A81 was due into P11 at 13:16, and shown as such on the train describer mimic screen at 13:11. By the time I had got upstairs it was being announced as a platform change to P12, and switched from the UFM to the DFR, which seems unnecessary. Is there some problem with having these two trains across a platform from each other - do they squabble?

    In the picture it is on the Down Feeder Relief, the Up Feeder Main is on the left. Don't know what you mean by it switched from the UFM to DFR, there is no way of doing this - you either go to one or the other from Oxford Road Junction.

    Some trains have not used the Feeder lines today, these instead using Platform 7/8. Maybe someone with knowledge of the interlocking can advise whether trains can arrive into Platform 11 with a route set from Platform 10? Sounds like a flaw in the system if you can't!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 13, 2015, 18:26:45
    In the picture it is on the Down Feeder Relief, the Up Feeder Main is on the left. Don't know what you mean by it switched from the UFM to DFR, there is no way of doing this - you either go to one or the other from Oxford Road Junction.

    Sorry - my mistake in typing. I meant its route was switched at Oxford Road Junction, which must have been at the last minute.

    Some trains have not used the Feeder lines today, these instead using Platform 7/8. Maybe someone with knowledge of the interlocking can advise whether trains can arrive into Platform 11 with a route set from Platform 10? Sounds like a flaw in the system if you can't!

    I'm sure they can - or maybe that should be will; might there be a short-term restriction on this? I can believe that there is still some further fettling to do.

    I did see there was train to Penzance (1C86 at 15:39) that went through P12 - which seems pretty odd too. 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on April 13, 2015, 18:34:04
    Set off this morning and saw the first trains round the new curves, a couple of freight trains which were using the Feeder Main heading towards Westbury, can we say that this is already an unusual move on the first day of running? Also saw the first passenger service (05:15 Newbury) and also managed to get a video of the first train using the Festival line (06:10 Manchester)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuuPtxKNM-8

    Popped into work for a couple of hours and then set off on a days travelling, firstly doing the east diveunder which I'd already done before on the 10:21 from Shalford, then onto the 11:44 from Newbury and 12:12 back using Feeder relief. On upto Oxford and catching the 13:43 back going via the Festival line, then down to Theale and back to traverse the Feeder Main, all in all a reasonably successful day.

    As previously mentioned in this thread I'd noticed that HSTs from Westbury direction were not using Feeder Main after 09:00 this morning however all the Bedwyn turbos were, I'm assuming there is a problem with the HSTs using the Feeder Main (Too tight of a curve perhaps?) Perhaps someone on the inside could enlighten us to this problem.

    (Edit: I don't see it being a problem with interlocking as the bedwyns were arriving P11 whilst other services were in P10)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on April 13, 2015, 18:54:37
    I did see there was train to Penzance (1C86 at 15:39) that went through P12 - which seems pretty odd too. 

    I assume this is to do with the failed 14:45 PAD to SWA.
    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20172/2015/04/13/advanced
    All trains after this have used relief line from Slough onwards. The 15:39 and other WestCountry services after it have just stayed on the relief, used P12 and then crossed under, makes sense to me than blocking the up Main east of Reading by crossing over.

    (Edit: It finally made it into Reading, just the 205mins Late)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 13, 2015, 20:21:12
    Well, finally another HST managed to sneak into P11 - 1A92 at 20:10.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on April 13, 2015, 20:45:12
    I did see there was train to Penzance (1C86 at 15:39) that went through P12 - which seems pretty odd too. 

    I assume this is to do with the failed 14:45 PAD to SWA.
    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C20172/2015/04/13/advanced
    All trains after this have used relief line from Slough onwards. The 15:39 and other WestCountry services after it have just stayed on the relief, used P12 and then crossed under, makes sense to me than blocking the up Main east of Reading by crossing over.

    (Edit: It finally made it into Reading, just the 205mins Late)

    Apparently the 1730 Pad to Taunton stopped alongside to allow a fitter to board. Does beg the question why it should take nearly 3 hrs for that to happen so close to OOC.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on April 13, 2015, 20:52:49
    Well, finally another HST managed to sneak into P11 - 1A92 at 20:10.

    1A94 has now followed it, I wonder why the change?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on April 13, 2015, 21:23:42
    Reminder to everyone.

    Looking at reply no #3006, the track and signalling diagrams that Industry Insider provided the proper names for the feeder lines are: Reading Feeder Main and Reading Feeder  Relief, no Up or Down.

    With all this commissioned over the weekend, what is left to do? Is it just tidying up? Has all the temporary  Whitehouse junction point work been removed? 

    I did notice in one of network rail's Easter photos, the laying of the points in the Up Reading Passenger Loop for the depot connection 'A', has this actually been connected to the depot?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on April 13, 2015, 21:29:24
    Reminder to everyone.

    Looking at reply no #3006, the track and signalling diagrams that Industry Insider provided the proper names for the feeder lines are: Reading Feeder Main and Reading Feeder  Relief, no Up or Down.

    The diagram may show it like that (not saying its wrong of course), but train planning information does refer to them as 'DFR' and 'UFM', suggesting Up and Down directions. I guess you could say the railway is full of inconsistencies!

    Another example of inconsistency is that the Reading Festival line on the diagram is called DOWN Reading Festival, where as train planning information refers to it as FVL, suggesting Festival Reversal. (RVL being what is used for reversible normally)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Timmer on April 13, 2015, 22:22:19
    Well, finally another HST managed to sneak into P11 - 1A92 at 20:10.
    I know, I was on it. Most impressed as we went under the flyover and smoothly glided into the northern side of the station.

    At the time I thought it's a shame that more isn't being made of what an incredible job has been done at Reading station and on the approaches that allows trains to come in and out of the station without conflict and queuing of trains waiting for a platform. But of course it's a good news story so not worth reporting.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 14, 2015, 09:29:28
    With all this commissioned over the weekend, what is left to do? Is it just tidying up? Has all the temporary  Whitehouse junction point work been removed? 

    Not sure about that - but FGW drivers/TMs were talking to Banbury staff about being back there again at Christmas.....I thought there weren't any more Banbury trips planned?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 14, 2015, 09:59:49
    Not sure about that - but FGW drivers/TMs were talking to Banbury staff about being back there again at Christmas.....I thought there weren't any more Banbury trips planned?

    There are possessions planned for at least a couple of days following Christmas - there's still loads to be done! There's Paddington station, Electrification and Crossrail continue, and work starts on re-doing Oxford. Whether that means diversions or just buses isn't clear. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 14, 2015, 11:02:40
    Yes, no more diversions due to the Reading programme, but possibly some in the future due to Crossrail/Electrification/WRAtH etc.?  Mostly just tidying up work to do at Reading now, including line speed increases on both main and relief lines when flashing yellow aspects are commissioned later in the year, and I'm not sure whether Depot Connection 'A' has been commissioned yet?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 14, 2015, 11:37:34
    The diagram may show it like that (not saying its wrong of course), but train planning information does refer to them as 'DFR' and 'UFM', suggesting Up and Down directions. I guess you could say the railway is full of inconsistencies!

    Is there still a strange feature in RTT that changes the line name abbreviations for services as they happen, because a quick check of trains into P11 from the Westbury direction has them marked 'UFM' if they are yet to run, but 'DM' if they are in the past.

    However, I think 'DM' in this context is not referring to the Down Main?

    IIRC someone posted a while back that these odd abbreviations for lines are a known issue with the current data RTT uses?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: rower40 on April 14, 2015, 12:12:07
    Reminder to everyone.

    Looking at reply no #3006, the track and signalling diagrams that Industry Insider provided the proper names for the feeder lines are: Reading Feeder Main and Reading Feeder  Relief, no Up or Down.

    The diagram may show it like that (not saying its wrong of course), but train planning information does refer to them as 'DFR' and 'UFM', suggesting Up and Down directions. I guess you could say the railway is full of inconsistencies!

    The decision to remove the designation "Up" from the Feeder Main line, and "Down" from the Feeder Relief line, came after the 3-letter line codes at Reading and Oxford Road Junction had already been chosen and specified in various Train Planning systems.  Similarly, "FVL" is just a line code for the Festival Line, applicable at the previous timing point - Reading station in the down direction, and Reading West Junction or Reading High Level Junction in the up direction.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 14, 2015, 17:32:00
    And today ... pretty well all the trains coming up from Reading West have used P11 - including when P10 is occupied. So that does all work. And one (1A85) came into P10 at 15:49 while P11 was occupied - just showing off that that works too, I guess.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on April 14, 2015, 17:39:32
    I quite often come into Reading on 1A85 (12:56 from PLY to PAD) and in the past it has made good progress up the Berks & Hants only to be held at Reading West (or worse Southcote Junction) and arrived late.  Now more often than not, since the works at Christmas and Easter, it has gone in unchecked.

    Notice today that despite the on time arrival it did then depart 5 late...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on April 18, 2015, 18:15:20
    NR has published some aerial views of the post Easter 2015 work here: https://mobile.twitter.com/networkrailgwrm


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on April 30, 2015, 09:01:57
    Back on an old hobby horse, sorry.

    It will come as no surprise to Tilehurst/Pangbourne/Goring/Cholsey commuters that the completion of the new layout west of Reading has made little difference to the congestion on the RL^s between Reading and Didcot.  Yesterday I caught 2N30, 1153 Reading ^ Pangbourne.  We left on time and then stopped at a Red at Reading West J.  The Driver made the familiar announcement that a freight train was being crossed over in front of us.  We were 5L at Pangbourne.

    The offending freight was 444V from Hams Hall ^ Soton.  It had left 100 minutes late.  Now I would have thought that in a situation like this it should have been held until the next available Q path, but I^ve noticed that freights, whether running early or late, just seem to ^blag^ it.  So my point is that freights should run to a proper path, or else signallers get put in impossible situations re regulation and punctuality suffers.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: rower40 on April 30, 2015, 10:03:59
    Back on an old hobby horse, sorry.

    It will come as no surprise to Tilehurst/Pangbourne/Goring/Cholsey commuters that the completion of the new layout west of Reading has made little difference to the congestion on the RL^s between Reading and Didcot. 

    There's one noticeable improvement.  Train 'A' is allowed into Tilehurst Platform 4 (Up Relief) at the same time as train 'B' is being routed from Up Main to Up Relief over Tilehurst East Junction.  Previously, the overlap of the signal at the end of platform 4 extended over the points on the junction, so if an Up Main to Up Relief train (an HST, say, that needed to use a high-numbered platform at Reading) was late, then the Up stopper would have to wait outside Tilehurst station.

    If a train is going to be delayed, then it might as well be in a platform!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 30, 2015, 11:00:41
    Now I would have thought that in a situation like this it should have been held until the next available Q path, but I^ve noticed that freights, whether running early or late, just seem to ^blag^ it.  So my point is that freights should run to a proper path, or else signallers get put in impossible situations re regulation and punctuality suffers.

    Of course that shouldn't have happened, ;D because as announced by NR in their farcical Easter Monday press releases, freight trains through Reading had just had 'new tracks installed', and are now 'completely separated' from passenger trains:

    Quote
    At Reading new freight lines were installed that will completely separate passenger and freight services for the first time, removing the delays that were previously experienced when some passenger services had to wait for slower freight trains to pass through before commencing their journeys.
    http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk/news/better-rail-journeys-for-thousands-of-passengers-each-year-after-major-improvement-work-on-the-western-route-is-completed-on-time

    NR PR are completely disconnected from reality - producing dumbed down information for the benefit of the dumbed down press that just repeats it without question...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on April 30, 2015, 13:44:25
    Network Rail have just re-released their timelapse video of the Easter work at Reading.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZjCpv5JT6A&list=PL7FD65AF6C9A22BE4

    As anybody with half a brain can see that this is the relaying of the relief lines and the re-modelling of Reading West Junction.

    In a recent blog on the Open Train Times website, Peter Hicks the developer has announced that he is just about to start work on the Reading map. He has just released the Banbury to Didcot Parkway map on the Cotswold menu.

    http://www.opentraintimes.com/maps



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on April 30, 2015, 13:52:46
    Network Rail have just re-released their timelapse video of the Easter work at Reading.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZjCpv5JT6A&list=PL7FD65AF6C9A22BE4

    As anybody with half a brain can see that this is the relaying of the relief lines and the re-modelling of Reading West Junction.

    A sneaky way of getting rid of the valid comment from someone (not me though) on the first version that explained how the title and description were misleading.

    I can't be bothered to sign up just to leave a comment unfortunately...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on May 01, 2015, 19:36:13
    The diagram may show it like that (not saying its wrong of course), but train planning information does refer to them as 'DFR' and 'UFM', suggesting Up and Down directions. I guess you could say the railway is full of inconsistencies!

    Is there still a strange feature in RTT that changes the line name abbreviations for services as they happen, because a quick check of trains into P11 from the Westbury direction has them marked 'UFM' if they are yet to run, but 'DM' if they are in the past.

    However, I think 'DM' in this context is not referring to the Down Main?

    IIRC someone posted a while back that these odd abbreviations for lines are a known issue with the current data RTT uses?

    Paul

    Sorry didn't see this, the 'UFM' you refer to, if the train is still to pass through Reading, is the booked line. The 'DM' you are referring to is what happens when a Trust report is used instead of a Train Describer triggered report - Trust is known to be far from accurate with regards to line and path indications.

    If you hover over the time in question you can identify if it is a TD or Trust triggered report.

    Train Describer data to translate the movements to meaningful arrival and departure times is not available for the Reading area at the present time because of the recent re-signalling - it is waiting for someone to go to the area to record time of trains arriving and departing the station in various scenarios - oh and that will most likely be me at some point!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 02, 2015, 09:48:10
    Sorry didn't see this, the 'UFM' you refer to, if the train is still to pass through Reading, is the booked line. The 'DM' you are referring to is what happens when a Trust report is used instead of a Train Describer triggered report - Trust is known to be far from accurate with regards to line and path indications.

    Thanks for taking the trouble to follow up.  So it seems to be a temporary issue that is known about which is what I thought I'd heard before.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Louis94 on May 05, 2015, 00:09:51
    Sorry didn't see this, the 'UFM' you refer to, if the train is still to pass through Reading, is the booked line. The 'DM' you are referring to is what happens when a Trust report is used instead of a Train Describer triggered report - Trust is known to be far from accurate with regards to line and path indications.

    Thanks for taking the trouble to follow up.  So it seems to be a temporary issue that is known about which is what I thought I'd heard before.

    Paul

    Indeed, I am going to be going to the area to collect data next weekend. However when that data reaches the public eye on RTT I am not sure about - it will be released with the next version of RTT, which I hope will be released by the summer, although this isn't entirely within my control!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on May 11, 2015, 18:24:12
    Just had confirmation that both the 40mph restriction on the Down Relief until Scours Lane, and the 60mph restriction on the mains from Scours Lane over the viaduct and through Platforms 9/10 to Reading New Junction, are planned to be raised later in the year at probably in September at 'Stage Q' of the scheme.

    The Down Relief Line is to be raised to 80mph and rumours that the main lines over the viaduct will be 100mph - though I'll believe that when I see the signs go up!  ;)

    According to this article http://www.railtechnologymagazine.com/rail-news/piecing-together-the-reading-puzzle
    it claims the lines over the viaduct will be 125mph with P9/10 being 100mph.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: jane s on May 15, 2015, 20:53:11
    Back on an old hobby horse, sorry.

    It will come as no surprise to Tilehurst/Pangbourne/Goring/Cholsey commuters that the completion of the new layout west of Reading has made little difference to the congestion on the RL^s between Reading and Didcot.  Yesterday I caught 2N30, 1153 Reading ^ Pangbourne.  We left on time and then stopped at a Red at Reading West J.  The Driver made the familiar announcement that a freight train was being crossed over in front of us.  We were 5L at Pangbourne.

    The offending freight was 444V from Hams Hall ^ Soton.  It had left 100 minutes late.  Now I would have thought that in a situation like this it should have been held until the next available Q path, but I^ve noticed that freights, whether running early or late, just seem to ^blag^ it.  So my point is that freights should run to a proper path, or else signallers get put in impossible situations re regulation and punctuality suffers.


    Yes this is one of my hobby horses too! In particular the 19:19 from Reading to Tilehurst is nearly always delayed by a freight train. Since the 19:27 is generally right behind it, surely no freight train should EVER be allowed to hold this first train up? It would make much more sense for the freight train to be made to wait until the 19:19 has left and therefore widen this already ridiculously small gap, instead of almost completely closing it?

    I too had thought that the new track layout would have solved this problem, but it hasn't changed a thing. :-(


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on May 16, 2015, 09:34:16
    Looking for a 100% solution of every bottleneck/conflict is not realistic, I would suggest.

    From my own experience, mainly travelling through Reading from THA to PAD and back on a fairly regular basis, I've not been on a train that's been held once at Southcote Junction, or between there and Reading West once since Easter. That happened regularly before.

    In the down direction, I've not been on a single train that's been held east of RDG since Easter either.

    So, for me, a noticeable improvement.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 16, 2015, 11:43:56
    Looking for a 100% solution of every bottleneck/conflict is not realistic, I would suggest.

    Junctions potentially cause conflicts, but the way to avoid conflicts is to have a timetable that works and stick to it.  There are too many northbound freights which have very tight margins in front of the down stoppers from Reading on the DR at Reading West Junction.  As I^ve said before, these freights should have more realistic timings so they don^t delay the down stoppers.

    And there are still too many freights swanning around 30 early or 100 late etc which are bound to cause regulation problems.  A little more discipline in train running would be good. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 16, 2015, 12:23:35
    I've noticed a huge improvement, but there will still be the odd train that gets regularly knocked back a few minutes. 

    One change from the new timetable on Monday is the removal of the dwell times on many of these Oxford stoppers at Didcot, which up until now has usually been about 5 minutes, and resulted in delays caused by freights not affecting the PPM figure much as that dwell absorbed most delays.  That recovery time will no longer be there so it might sharpen minds to the problem a little?

    A benefit of that change is that journeys from Didcot (and Swindon) to north of Oxford now have much better connections at Oxford.  For example, Didcot to Banbury in under 40 minutes rather than an hour.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on May 16, 2015, 13:07:20
    I hadn^t noticed the removal of the dwell times for many down stoppers at Didcot.  They^ll now get to Oxford just in front of northbound XC^s, so they^ll have to be quick getting the ECS into the sidings.  Unless they are going to resurrect the permissive use of P2 and have the stoppers terminate right up at the north end of P2?

    Agreed re sharpening minds ^ cue reminiscences from those of us who used to work on the Southern, the only people who knew how to operate a busy railway etc^


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 16, 2015, 19:39:06
    Oxford? Speedy at getting stoppers away to sidings? Was that a pig just flew by?!!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 16, 2015, 20:31:29
    Oxford? Speedy at getting stoppers away to sidings? Was that a pig just flew by?!!

    Yes I remember waiting for a delay XC train there a few months back.  A stopper came in ahead and waited until it was timed to go into the sidings. By waited I mean that the train crew were talking idly with the station staff for several minutes.  Meanwhile a XC train was sat just outside the station in full view of the exasperated passengers many of whom - like me were going to miss their connection. 

    I suppose it was not affecting a FGW train so it did not matter! well it did to me!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on May 16, 2015, 20:38:47
    I too had thought that the new track layout would have solved this problem, but it hasn't changed a thing. :-(

    Did you possibly take too much notice of NR's press releases?

    I've worked out what they did wrong, they just forgot to include the word 'main line' in their analysis of the improvements; as in "freight trains are now completely separated from the passenger trains that run on the main line flyover".   ::)

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: 4064ReadingAbbey on May 16, 2015, 21:39:08
    When the initial semi-diagrammatic drawings of the new track layout were published just after the Reading rebuild was announced all those years ago it appeared to me that three opportunities had been missed. One was a grade separated junction at Southcote, the other a grade separated junction for the West Curve into the Reliefs at Reading West Junction and the third a grade separated junction for the Feeder Relief line into the Reliefs.

    In order to make the grade separated junctions with the Relief lines, the Down Relief would have to have its own flyover starting at the western end of the Relief line platforms and probably linking with the new Main Line flyover. As the flyover for the Mains cost some ^50 million adding the extra ramp and widening the ramp at the western end to accommodate the Down Relief would probably have added some ^15 or ^20 million to the cost of the project and complicated the physical work considerably. This assumes that space was available for the ramp, the gradients could have been made to work, the curvature of the Main and Relief Feeder lines were acceptable and access to the re-located maintenance depot could be maintained.

    So I am not surprised it was not done. It would have been a lot of money and as many of the constraints have been removed by the current design the marginal improvements would have been hard to justify. In any event the flat junctions at Didcot and the restricted capacity from there north through Oxford are now probably more of a hindrance than the flat West Junction.

    I suspect many of the remaining issues can be eased by tweaking the timetable, after which there remains Southcote... :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 17, 2015, 12:29:34
    Oxford? Speedy at getting stoppers away to sidings? Was that a pig just flew by?!!

    Yes I remember waiting for a delay XC train there a few months back.  A stopper came in ahead and waited until it was timed to go into the sidings. By waited I mean that the train crew were talking idly with the station staff for several minutes.  Meanwhile a XC train was sat just outside the station in full view of the exasperated passengers many of whom - like me were going to miss their connection. 

    I suppose it was not affecting a FGW train so it did not matter! well it did to me!

    Did the terminating train have a the signal?  And if it did was the train checked empty, doors locked and ready to go?  It certainly would matter to FGW as delay minutes would all be attributed to them, and if it's an XC service then those can soon rack up substantially given that any train further up the line that delayed XC caused would also be added.

    A memo has gone out to all staff regarding quick dispatch of those terminating trains.  I hope that permissive working isn't used as it rarely saves any time at all and is inconvenient and confusing for the passengers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 17, 2015, 12:32:15
    Would need more than a memo. Sometimes, it seems as if a union meeting happens....and yes, train all cleared & ready to proceed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 17, 2015, 12:51:22
    You witnessed the same train ellendune did?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on May 17, 2015, 12:56:15
    The trains I witness while waiting for those XCs....lets see if the new TT helps


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on May 17, 2015, 13:05:30
    Did the terminating train have a the signal? 

    Yes

    And if it did was the train checked empty, doors locked and ready to go?

    No because they chose to have their long conversation before they started checking the train.

    It certainly would matter to FGW as delay minutes would all be attributed to them, and if it's an XC service then those can soon rack up substantially given that any train further up the line that delayed XC caused would also be added.

    I suspect not because although the train was delaying the XC.  The FGW Turbo had actually arrived  several minutes early, but then waited until its booked time before leaving for the sidings!

    A memo has gone out to all staff regarding quick dispatch of those terminating trains.  I hope that permissive working isn't used as it rarely saves any time at all and is inconvenient and confusing for the passengers.

    Good


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on May 17, 2015, 13:26:21
    Fair enough, I didn't realise from your post that the XC service was running late, and in that instance the delay minutes would not pass on to FGW.

    Most of the time I see staff chatting is when there's either no service behind, a relief driver is being sought, somebody else is still checking the train is empty, or (most commonly) the signal at the end of the platform is red.  That's not to say that is the always the case though or that the operation could be more slick.

    I'm hopeful the memo will have an impact, or if not the delay minutes attributed to the station dispatch team as a result of delays will do.  Ultimately though, the new platform(s) we are promised should mean it doesn't matter as much.  Currently Oxford's restrictive and slightly bizarre layout is the biggest issue!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on June 03, 2015, 22:11:58
    Watching the operation of the layout on Open Train Times, I see that the exit signal berth (T1783) at Connection 'A' from the depot no longer shows 'OOU - Out of Use', has the connection now been brought into use?
    A question regarding this connection, are trains able to reverse into the depot from the Up Passenger Loop ? The  track and signalling layout diagram for Easter does not show a Shunt/position signal, has one since been installed?

    Open Train Times show how flexible the layout is, especially during possessions to the east and west, Realtime Trains cannot be relied upon for route and platform allocations.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 04, 2015, 11:29:40
    Yes, the depot connection was opened in the early hours of 1st June.  The signal that controls movements into it is on the up relief line at Scours Lane (just before the loop starts) with a Junction Indicator 3 for siding W1 and JI2 for the West Run Round Loop.  The normal procedure will be to send trains that need to reverse to the fixed red signal at Tilehurst on the up relief line.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on June 04, 2015, 12:05:52
    That fixed red on the Up Relief at Tilehurst has a signal post telephone in rear of it. I can't work out what it could be used for.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: rower40 on June 04, 2015, 14:43:31
    That fixed red on the Up Relief at Tilehurst has a signal post telephone in rear of it. I can't work out what it could be used for.
    Pilotman working, so that the signaller can tell the Pilotman to tell the driver to pass the fixed-red at, erm... red.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on June 04, 2015, 14:55:56
    Why the need for a pilotman? surely the drivers heading for that depot know the route?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 04, 2015, 16:37:49
    Engineering work, or a severely degraded situation could mean that the up line is worked wrong direction.  I did it myself once between Reading and Didcot many moons ago.  That's the point at which a pilotman would board and travel with the driver, or give the driver a single line working 'ticket' -  either way, they would potentially use that telephone to get instructions from the signaller.  It certainly won't be used much though!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Tim on June 04, 2015, 17:55:12
    Engineering work, or a severely degraded situation could mean that the up line is worked wrong direction.  I did it myself once between Reading and Didcot many moons ago.  That's the point at which a pilotman would board and travel with the driver, or give the driver a single line working 'ticket' -  either way, they would potentially use that telephone to get instructions from the signaller.  It certainly won't be used much though!

    Is there really still a need to install a fixed telephone to contact a signaller these days?  I would have imagined that the cab radio was up to the job and required less cable to be nicked?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on June 04, 2015, 19:02:51
    It certainly won't be used much though!

    It will probably be used more than a telephone I saw - some twenty years ago - in the international arrivals hall at Edinburgh Airport which invited you to use it if you had anything to declare!

    Thanks for the answers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on June 04, 2015, 22:48:04
    Is there really still a need to install a fixed telephone to contact a signaller these days?  I would have imagined that the cab radio was up to the job and required less cable to be nicked?

    There probably isn't much need, no.  But I expect the requirement is hidden away in one of the Railway Group Standards, and it can take years for that sort of thing to get changed.  My reckoning is that SPT's will only go when the signals themselves go!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Visoflex on June 05, 2015, 09:26:35
    But I expect the requirement is hidden away in one of the Railway Group Standards, and it can take years for that sort of thing to get changed.  My reckoning is that SPT's will only go when the signals themselves go!

    Absolutely!  As you say, this could only really come by way of a national edict, and I wouldn't lay money on them all being recovered when the "sticks" go either.  Thinking nationally, these phones are also used by track workers, particularly in areas where mobile phone reception is patchy.  There is also the advantage that calls to signallers via SPT's are recorded - useful when in possessions.

    It is also the back-stop until GSM-R can prove itself to be beyond reproach.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on June 05, 2015, 15:49:19
    Guidance note for provision of SPTs with GSM/R becoming available: http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Traffic%20Operation%20and%20Management/Guidance%20Notes/GOGN3677%20Iss%201.pdf

    Group Standard for positioning of SPTs: http://www.rgsonline.co.uk/Railway_Group_Standards/Control%20Command%20and%20Signalling/Railway%20Group%20Standards/GERT8048%20Iss%202.pdf

    May be of interest.   There's no absolute statement either way, it's all still about risk assessments - but the gist of it I'm picking up is that the overall number of telephones at a complex location may reduce to a safe minimum.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: W5tRailfinder on June 05, 2015, 16:59:13
    Thanks for the info.

    I guess reversals at Connection'A' will not be too common, on this basis. How long will it block the Up Relief? I'll keep a look out for one though.

    Here's some examples of what I have noticed. The more interesting movements taking place during possessions in the evening or weekends, when the signallers can have a limited number of platforms/routes available.

    1. Two westbound freights on the Reading West Curves, both left almost simultaneously, one to the Down relief and the other, crossed over to the Up Reading Passenger Loop, before continuing west.

    2. Two Oxford bound services departed Reading together, a fast from Platform 12 took the Down Relief  and a slow from platform 14 took the Up Reading Passenger Loop.

    3. A down HST fom Paddington, due to route Down Westbury: scheduled to take Platform 7 (RTT), but it was occupied; I expected it to take platform 8, but it went into platform 10 and then took the Feeder Main.

    4. If the Down Main, to the west of Reading is closed, Platform 9 is not operationally flexible like the other through platforms, and doesn't get used. It could only be used for Paddington - Reading services, in this instance.

    5. An ECS move from Platform 7 to RTC, via platform 13: instead of reversing in Kennet Bridge Loop (as per RTT), took the Spur Line to the southern lines and then reversed, going back  through the eastern dive under. RTT did not show the actual route taken.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 11, 2015, 17:52:50
    Here's the maps for Stage Q of the project which should be completed by September and is basically the final layout with the final linespeeds.

    The speeds are pretty impressive.  Much better than I hoped for.

    Down Main Line:  Whoever suggested that 125mph might be the maximum speed on the viaduct is correct, although no train will ever reach that speed!  Coming in from London the current 80/HST95 speed continues past where the current 60mph starts all the way through Platform 9 up to where the 125mph board commences just before the top of the viaduct.

    Up Main Line:  It's 125mph until an 85/HST95 board at the top of the viaduct which continues through Platform 10 with the 125mph resuming again by Reading New Junction.

    Down Relief Line:  40pmh through Platform 12 as now, rising to 80mph just west of the station, then 100mph from Reading West Junction.

    Up Relief Line:  100mph to Tilehurst, then 80/MU100 as far as Reading West Junction where it's 80mph until the 40mph which starts level with where the feeder lines come under the main lines.  Then 60/MU90mph as now.

    Expect plenty of announcements when something is about to roar through 9/10 at 95mph!

    (https://farm1.staticflickr.com/514/20304333949_90d0b9a764_b.jpg)

    (https://farm1.staticflickr.com/400/20304333609_ab02922764_b.jpg)

    (https://farm1.staticflickr.com/429/20482216762_cd2f6af6ed_b.jpg)
    (https://farm1.staticflickr.com/429/20302907380_c684e10c50_b.jpg)
    (https://farm1.staticflickr.com/413/20464772336_27e2493752_b.jpg)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 11, 2015, 23:08:58
    Thanks for posting these II, very interesting


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on August 12, 2015, 08:38:06
    I am surprised that there is no route indication on signal T2810 on the Up Reading from Basingstoke (left-hand part of the diagram) that ^ as far as I can tell ^ is the only route to both signal T2806 on the Up Westbury and signal T2804 on the Down Westbury. The stopping distances to each signal are considerably different, plus it is an area of poor rail adhesion on both roads.  Is it just an oversight on the diagram?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 12, 2015, 09:52:40
    T2810 just has one route - to T2806.  The Down Westbury isn't bi-directional until T2804 on the Down Westbury.  T2804, and the subsequent T2800, are basically just reversing signals to assist with moves to/from the Up/Down Westbury, Feeder and West Curve lines and as such won't be in regular use - especially for passenger trains.  However, it does allow for bi-di signalling to be installed at a later date if needed and if that happens I would expect an intermediate signal would be installed level with T2806.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on August 12, 2015, 14:27:19
    Thanks for that info II.

    I do remain surprised that the flexibility for true bidirectional running wasn't implemented with this resignalling as it would appear to give one more potential up path for a Basingstoke stopper or XC at the same time as a west country up fast or stone train.  No doubt there is a good reason.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 12, 2015, 18:46:19
    I have to say that, having done a few hours on Adelante^s Reading signalling simulator, the layout in the Oxford Road Junction area works fine.  I^d commented earlier that it looks a bit odd and operationally limiting, but movements on the Feeder Main are usually in the Up direction so the lack of a parallel crossover for Down trains off the Feeder Main to the Down Westbury is no big deal.

    Movements through P1 ^ P11 are relatively straightforward - it^s movements through P12-P15 that need the most concentration, especially if there are moves to/from the depot.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 13, 2015, 10:32:35
    There are adverts in the local press for engineering and project management posts with Spencer, working on the "extension and upgrade" of the Reading Train Care Depot. Which seems very odd, given it was only finished two years ago.

    It's not for SET, though Spencer did do the fitting-out of all the SET stabling sites with Hitachi's support equipment (e.g. refuelling with metered Adblue). This is another contract they got afterwards.

    Now there have been changes since RSAR was committed, notably Crossrail coming to Reading.  But why would that call for more than a little stabling? And electrification was far enough back for the depot design to reflect it, so switching from DMUs to EMUs is a pre-planned development. In any case wouldn't that be more a case of shipping diesel-specific kit out west following the trains?

    So what's to upgrade - and where can it expand to?



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 13, 2015, 11:13:42
    It's not for SET, though Spencer did do the fitting-out of all the SET stabling sites with Hitachi's support equipment (e.g. refuelling with metered Adblue). This is another contract they got afterwards.

    Having re-read this from Railway strategies (http://www.railwaystrategies.co.uk/article-page.php?contentid=22475&issueid=657), Spencer's SET contract was only for East Coast. So this new contract might include that element, though as the GWML needs its SET depots earlier the timing seems odd.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 13, 2015, 11:40:10

    So what's to upgrade - and where can it expand to?


    It could be a simple matter of extending the maintenance sheds or tanking/CET  facilities by a short distance to allow for a different length of the typical trains, or multiple trains, now that the EMU fleet is known to be based around 4 x 20m units.  Other possibilities, perhaps they need to have more clear distance to allow a 12 car train through the wash plant, or maybe they need a longer space beyond the wheel lathe building?

    I too cannot see much needing to be added due to Crossrail, if they were to need stabling at Reading overnight, it wouldn't be more than a couple of units, but perhaps they need minor alterations to make economical use of the sidings, as Crossrail are somewhere just over 200m long, I've seen 205 m quoted.

    Perhaps there'll be another planning application online - shall have a look.

    Paul   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 13, 2015, 13:44:54
    I have seen an early plan that shows a number of IEP sidings in the Reading depot area.  I'll see if I can dig it out.......... ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on August 13, 2015, 14:41:15
    I have seen an early plan that shows a number of IEP sidings in the Reading depot area.  I'll see if I can dig it out.......... ::)

    Found it.  Health Warning: This is a very old concept drawing for the Reading Remodelling Project and should not be taken as gospel  ::) :P

    (http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m92/cbrailways/IEP1_zps6jhd66nu.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 13, 2015, 15:21:42
    I have seen an early plan that shows a number of IEP sidings in the Reading depot area.  I'll see if I can dig it out.......... ::)

    Found it.  Health Warning: This is a very old concept drawing for the Reading Remodelling Project and should not be taken as gospel  ::) :P

    That just confirms that this use was known when the depot/sidings area was designed. The long sidings hold 15 26m carriages, which is either suitable or impossible to change. I understood this to be just some extra parking space as there's not enough close to Paddington - does it need more "depot" built for that?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 25, 2015, 00:53:22
    For those friends of Reading Station who were wondering how the neighbours were doing, here's a belated update.

    First, Thames Tower. You may recall it was going to be gutted, reclad, and heightened by a few storeys, and this is well under way. You can't see a lot, as they started by scaffolding it, then wrapped the scaffolding, and have now partly scaffolded the wrapped scaffolding. The picture below is not recent; now there is a lift up its side and a friendly tower crane is gazing fondly down on it.

    Further down Station Hill the bus station has gone, and the demolition of Western Tower above that has just begun in earnest. Again it has been scaffolded and wrapped, and a tower crane erected. I expected that the plan would be to crane something like a JCB with a hydraulic breaker onto the roof, to knock a hole in it. Then the crane can drop an elevator/loader and the breaker vehicle through the hole and so on.

    However, last week I could hear something much lighter - handheld pneumatic breakers - and see lengths of concrete beam being craned to the ground. So it was interesting to see the set of pictures getReading have just put on line (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/station-hill-latest-pictures-western-9913435), showing something rather heavier on its way up and, here, on the job.
    (http://i3.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article9913449.ece/ALTERNATES/s1227b/11873487_10153514568141070_2949811842246013286_n.jpg)

    In between the two towers the shops have all gone, and if the plan is still to create an interim public space there's not much in the way of that.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on September 01, 2015, 19:41:22
    I would guess that once it is down to 8 storeys or so, the big  nipper, such as was used at Bristol's New Bridewell police HQ, will finish the job off.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 05, 2015, 11:25:30
    Looks like the electrification team have pretty much finished wiring the western end of the depot.  The eastern end was completed a couple of years ago, but the western end couldn't be finished until the final track layout was installed.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on September 11, 2015, 19:26:26
    Ooh, look! The OHLE fairies have been back to Reading again!

    When the portals were put up (last spring), some were quite visibly out of true. Then in the autumn they were all adjusted to vertical, and the two-barred ones (for line termination) got one stay each (apart from those closest to the station).

    Now I don't know whether the stays are for strength, rigidity, or both, but one is obviously not much use. Today I see that most of the missing second stays have been fitted. There are still a couple with just one, and one in the station with none, but the others do look ... well, happier, don't they?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on September 11, 2015, 20:41:53
    Now I don't know whether the stays are for strength, rigidity, or both....

    Without changing the verticals altogether of the material it is difficult to have strength without rigidity! So both!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ironstone11 on September 12, 2015, 11:01:22
    Ooh, look! The OHLE fairies have been back to Reading again!

    Now I don't know whether the stays are for strength, rigidity, or both, but one is obviously not much use.

    The stays transfer the catenary tensioning forces to the ground. Thus reducing the bending forces on the uprights.

    In the picture shown, assuming the stays are in compression, the OHL will be coming from the left of the picture to be terminated on the portals.

    Yes, two stays are needed otherwise the structure will twist.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 17, 2015, 01:08:58
    Stage Q has now been implemented in full as per the diagrams on the previous page (post #3251).

    That pretty much finishes the job as far as alterations to the operational infrastructure are concerned, bar the 'knitting' going up.  'Stand back from the edge of the platform' announcements might be wise on platforms 9 and 10 as trains have never roared through Reading at 95mph before!

    I'm sure the thread will rumble on with the remaining work to be done on the station forecourt, but this strikes me as the best moment to offer my congratulations to the whole team who have delivered such a magnificently flexible and enlarged station on time and on budget whislt the station remained open pretty much throughout.

    If anyone's forgotten, the following alterations have happened since the first major work on the ground started in August 2010 when the goods lines were lifted:

    1) Platforms 4a/4b replaced by Platforms 4/5/6 with longer and wider platform faces.
    2) Platforms 4-10 replaced with Platforms 7-15 meaning instead of four through platforms and three bay platforms, there are now nine through platforms.
    3) The overbridge and subway replaced with the massive new transfer deck with lifts/escalator/steps linking all platforms.
    4) A new northern entrance to the station, with bus and taxi ranks.
    5) Reinstatement of the underpass line east of the station.
    6) More flexible signalling and track layout at the eastern end of the station, including a new passenger loop/turnback.
    7) A new maintenance depot with three separate entrances for trains equipped with modern facilities and able to deal with electric trains.
    8 ) Grade separation at the western end of the station with a viaduct reducing hugely the number of conflicting moves.
    9) Two turnback signals at Tilehurst.
    10) Additional passenger loop line at the western end of the station.
    11) General modifications to track and signalling with many more routing options now available and increased linespeeds.

    And the biggest grumbles of the whole project have been that the transfer deck leaks a bit when it's wet and windy and that the canopies could have been longer!

    Perhaps others on the forum can 'like' this post in order to express their own appreciation to those involved?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 17, 2015, 06:35:33
    Yes, certainly an excellent job done on the station and the track layout in the surrounding areas. All done on time and budget as well which seems a rare thing these days.

    Now, I know there have been legal problems and not sure if you could shed any light on this II but..... When on earth are they going to finish the Cow Lane bridge???? There has been no progress made on this so far this year.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on September 17, 2015, 06:50:20
    I'm sure the thread will rumble on with the remaining work to be done on the station forecourt, but this strikes me as the best moment to offer my congratulations to the whole team who have delivered such a magnificently flexible and enlarged station on time and on budget whislt the station remained open pretty much throughout.

    ...

    Perhaps others on the forum can 'like' this post in order to express their own appreciation to those involved?

    I couldn't agree more II - it still amazes me that the station was kept operational (no choice,really) whilst this major work was being undertaken.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on September 17, 2015, 08:01:14
    Agreed, a well executed project.  They just need to sort out Reading West to Southcote Junction now as that has become the remaining bottleneck. Personally I think a third track could be fitted in with some bi-directional working on the middle track :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 17, 2015, 14:33:04
    They just need to sort out Reading West to Southcote Junction now as that has become the remaining bottleneck.

    I think anyone who commutes from Tilehurst, Pangbourne etc would say that the convergence of the Down Relief with Reading West curve at Reading West Junction is a remaining bottleneck. 

    Too often you leave P12 at Reading and then slow to a crawl or stop while a freight precedes or crosses in front of you.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 17, 2015, 16:17:34
    Yes, I guess no matter how much money you spend there would still be weaker links, though the number of times you get held and the length of hold are now less than they were.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 18, 2015, 12:59:43
    Quote
    When on earth are they going to finish the Cow Lane bridge?

    Appears my question has been answered:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/cow-lane-bridges-work-start-10074949


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2015, 13:16:04
    Landowner being awkward by the looks of it then!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on September 18, 2015, 14:04:57
    They just need to sort out Reading West to Southcote Junction now as that has become the remaining bottleneck.

    I think anyone who commutes from Tilehurst, Pangbourne etc would say that the convergence of the Down Relief with Reading West curve at Reading West Junction is a remaining bottleneck. 

    Too often you leave P12 at Reading and then slow to a crawl or stop while a freight precedes or crosses in front of you.

    You also have the new Festival line from the Viaduct coming in just before the junctions with the West Curve so it could be Voyager to and from platforms 3 or 4 that holds you up.   








    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on September 18, 2015, 15:48:07
    Landowner being awkward by the looks of it then!

    That could backfire in terms of costs and money offered.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on September 18, 2015, 16:52:31
    Yes, I guess no matter how much money you spend there would still be weaker links, though the number of times you get held and the length of hold are now less than they were.

    You may be right, not least because (as I think you mentioned before) there are now higher speeds permitted through Reading West Junction.

    The last time I came back from Birmingham on a XC we were checked approaching Oxford while a Freightliner in front of us drew up at the signal on the UM just south of Oxford station (which we then passed as we left Oxford on the Up Loop), and then when I hopped off at Reading and got the stopper to Pangbourne ^ blow me - we were checked by the same Freightliner crossing in front of us at Reading West Junction!

    There^s more work to be done on improving the running of freights to the west of Reading.  I may have mentioned this before ^.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 18, 2015, 17:05:15
    Quote
    You also have the new Festival line from the Viaduct coming in just before the junctions with the West Curve so it could be Voyager to and from platforms 3 or 4 that holds you up.   

    You would mean Platforms 3 or 7 (and 8 ) as going from Oxford to Basingstoke (or vice-versa) via Platform 4 would require one hell of a diversion


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 18, 2015, 19:17:30
    The last time I came back from Birmingham on a XC we were checked approaching Oxford while a Freightliner in front of us drew up at the signal on the UM just south of Oxford station (which we then passed as we left Oxford on the Up Loop)

    Yes, the 'Oxford Corridor' improvement works and preparation for the Chiltern link mean that the up passenger loop from Wolvercote to Oxford North Junction is currently not in use, so with most freights being too long to sit in the through lines at Oxford, quite a few get held south of the station with the passenger trains using the loop line to get round them.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on October 06, 2015, 17:18:08

    Interesting to see the announcement of the re-opening of Manchester Victoria Station (BBC).

    A modern overall roof was included at a cost of only ^20M.

    What a pity such a cheap and useful piece of weather-proofing could not have been included in Reading's ^850M rebuilding.

    There's more to a passenger station than tracks.

    Wet and windswept,

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on October 06, 2015, 17:26:08
    Missed this post first time round

    If anyone's forgotten, the following alterations have happened since the first major work on the ground started in August 2010 when the goods lines were lifted:
     ..snip..
    9) Two turnback signals at Tilehurst.

    Wokingham also got a turnback signal to allow trains from Waterloo to go back to London in service and not run empty to Bracknell.  I think this was provided in the anticipation of the Reading blockades.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 06, 2015, 19:25:30
    Wokingham also got a turnback signal to allow trains from Waterloo to go back to London in service and not run empty to Bracknell.  I think this was provided in the anticipation of the Reading blockades.

    It was really for the series of weekend closures of the "Southern" platforms while they were rebuilt, which you would not call blockades as they are not on through lines. I think these platforms were always in use for the blockades qua blockades.

    I also think it was on a wish list of small improvements, as useful in case of disruption, and could be combined with work to lengthen P2 to take 12-car trains.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 06, 2015, 19:46:20

    ...
    I also think it was on a wish list of small improvements, as useful in case of disruption, and could be combined with work to lengthen P2 to take 12-car trains.

    At the risk of being picky do you mean P2?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on October 06, 2015, 20:19:01
    At the risk of being picky, aren't P2 and P2 the same?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on October 06, 2015, 20:50:58
    At the risk of being picky, aren't P2 and P2 the same?

    You are 100% correct about P2 being the same as P2...I think I have clarified my own confusion ...am I right in thinking you are talking about P2 at Wokingham?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on October 06, 2015, 22:01:20
    You are 100% correct about P2 being the same as P2...I think I have clarified my own confusion ...am I right in thinking you are talking about P2 at Wokingham?
    Of course: the one with the turnback signal in question sitting on it.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 02, 2015, 20:54:43
    I would guess that once it is down to 8 storeys or so, the big  nipper, such as was used at Bristol's New Bridewell police HQ, will finish the job off.

    Apparently not, in this case. It's down to about six storeys and they are still attacking it from its interim roof. Don't you think that baby elevator/loader looks rather fun as a gardening tool?

    A further picture shows they have accumulated a huge heap of hardcore - permissions these days usually insist it is used on site if possible, so I wonder where they have in mind.

    Finally, the space next to it has been rather laboriously surfaced, but with what intent is not clear. It has faint lines at the far end suggestive of car spaces, but they could be for raised beds, seating, or almost anything. I can't now find, let alone remember, what that picture of the proposed temporary pedestrian area looked like.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on November 02, 2015, 20:57:57

    Apparently not, in this case. It's down to about six storeys and they are still attacking it from its interim roof. Don't you think that baby elevator/loader looks rather fun as a gardening tool?

    I agree - it would make short work of my veg patch.

    Quote
    A further picture shows they have accumulated a huge heap of hardcore - permissions these days usually insist it is used on site if possible, so I wonder where they have in mind.

    Danish, in my case, although some German in the interests of diversity.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 06, 2016, 19:21:25
    Accident on escalator on P14/15 at Reading this morning.

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/network-rail-launches-investigation-after-10694737


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Tim on January 07, 2016, 09:35:39
    sounds like it was a broken escalator which people were using as a fixed staircase when it started to move downwards presumably under the load of users and/or following a failure of a brake.  Some people fell over onto other people.  Noone was seriously hurt. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on January 07, 2016, 10:25:12
    But they could easily have done. That's the problem when you don't build fixed stairs into a project - one needs to use broken escalators or a small lift. It'll be interesting to see how they proceed....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on January 07, 2016, 10:57:49
    That's the problem when you don't build fixed stairs into a project - one needs to use broken escalators or a small lift.

    Stairs are available to all platforms, though on 12/13 and 14/15 they are located at the 'B' end of the platform, and if you arrive at the 'A' end of the platform that seems like an awfully long way away.  I'd rather do that than use one of the two lifts if the escalators are out of action and there's a long queue though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on January 07, 2016, 12:15:51
    But they could easily have done. That's the problem when you don't build fixed stairs into a project - one needs to use broken escalators or a small lift. It'll be interesting to see how they proceed....

    There are four main islands, P8/9 has stairs both sides of the transfer deck, the other three narrower platforms only have stairs on the country side.  So five main routes out of eight do have stairs.

    Not forgetting serious amounts of stairs on the north and south end of the transfer deck.   

    Anyone reading the news article might be forgiven for thinking a lift was the only alternative, but surely you are commenting from the position of having been to the station?

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on March 10, 2016, 09:08:50
    This escalator was still out of action yesterday 2 months on from the runaway incident, which means the only access direct to P15A is one escalator which runs downwards (at least in the mornings).  So the many commuters into Reading off Oxford ^ Padd stoppers have to walk all the way back to P15B to get off the platform. Many of these will be changing to an HST for London ^ passengers see their train sail through P15B and past the escalator, and the extra time involved in getting off P15 can mean missing a train.

    I suggested this before, but I^ll suggest it again ^ why can^t trains stop in P15B instead of P15A until the escalator on P15A is fixed? 



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on March 10, 2016, 18:46:41

    "Inspector Sands" called to Brunel concourse at 0850 this Thursday am. Passenger evacuation PA call interrupted in mid sentence.

    ?

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Bmblbzzz on March 10, 2016, 19:33:50
    Surely there have to be fixed stairs to all platforms unless there is level access. You can't have access only by means which are power dependent and escalators are not really suitable to use as stairs; even without the possibility of brake failure, the riser height is usually too high for most people to comfortably walk up and down them. It would be a disaster waiting to happen in the event of a big fire.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 10, 2016, 22:35:09
    Surely there have to be fixed stairs to all platforms unless there is level access. You can't have access only by means which are power dependent and escalators are not really suitable to use as stairs; even without the possibility of brake failure, the riser height is usually too high for most people to comfortably walk up and down them. It would be a disaster waiting to happen in the event of a big fire.

    But there are fixed stairs to all the platforms.  The earlier point about the only alternative being lifts was wrong.

    Additionally, in the event of a fire the completely new platforms have escape stairs at both ends.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 25, 2016, 20:07:38
    Quote
    Cow Lane Bridges final phase work delayed

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/cow-lane-bridges-final-phase-11088551


    Typical.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Noggin on March 25, 2016, 21:47:45
    Quote
    Cow Lane Bridges final phase work delayed

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/cow-lane-bridges-final-phase-11088551


    Typical.

    Yes, but wasn't it established that problem was down to Network Rail assuming that RBC had the land that was needed for the project? And furthermore when it was pointed out that RBC in fact didn't own the land they behaved in a very offhand manner with the landowners (some of whom will be inconvenienced) and dishonest with the public.

    As for a cock-up like the objections being withdrawn but a procedural loophole meaning that it still had to go to the planning inspector suggests that, a) RBC's legal team are *very* unlucky, b) RBC's legal team don't know their ars*es from their elbows, and/or c) they p***ed off a complainant sufficiently for them to go to extremes to stuff RBC.

    Of course my memory could be failing me, but I think there's a lot more to it than Cllr Page is admitting.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 07, 2016, 18:47:53
    A brief discussion had this afternoon about the Tilehurst fatality.  Condolences to friends, family and staff involved.

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=16899.0

    I happened to be at Reading during the line closure that followed the incident, which is the first time I've been at Reading to see how it now copes with major disruption operationally with the new layout.

    I recall many previous occasions when, during similar levels of disruption, the station just collapsed operationally.  There were soon queues of passenger and freight trains unable to move often regardless of destination with the four through platforms occupied by trains.  The only way round it was to turf everyone out of a train and find a siding for it somewhere causing the station to get full very quickly and things become very miserable.

    Contrast that with today.  Hardly any trains had to be de-trained and, sensibly, routes through one, if not two, of the through platforms were kept clear to keep freight and, crucially, most of the passenger trains to and from the Newbury/Basingstoke direction moving.  Two or three HSTs sat in the higher numbered platforms for almost an hour before the down main line reopened.  They couldn't get direct access to that, so had to shunt out via the new Kennet Bridge Loop before coming back through the station, but at least the passengers stayed on board throughout.  Some departures from around noon onwards were held at Paddington as usual to help keep things moving at Reading.

    Regarding staff visibility, I certainly noticed many staff assisting, especially on the transfer deck, including the very proactive Duty Manager.  Something that has been sadly lacking before.

    The trouble with the situation is that there was still a lot of disruption, delays and cancellations, which continued for many hours (as usual Control at Swindon were soon overwhelmed), and many passengers would have had a delayed and uncomfortable journey.  However, had a situation like that occurred with the old layout I can guarantee that there would have been literally hundreds more delay minutes caused.

    Another thumbs-up for the new flexible layout - even if it might not be obvious to Joe Public!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 07, 2016, 19:05:54
    A brief discussion had this afternoon about the Tilehurst fatality.  Condolences to friends, family and staff involved.

    http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=16899.0

    I happened to be at Reading during the line closure that followed the incident, which is the first time I've been at Reading to see how it now copes with major disruption operationally with the new layout.

    I recall many previous occasions when, during similar levels of disruption, the station just collapsed operationally.  There were soon queues of passenger and freight trains unable to move often regardless of destination with the four through platforms occupied by trains.  The only way round it was to turf everyone out of a train and find a siding for it somewhere causing the station to get full very quickly and things become very miserable.

    Contrast that with today.  Hardly any trains had to be de-trained and, sensibly, routes through one, if not two, of the through platforms were kept clear to keep freight and, crucially, most of the passenger trains to and from the Newbury/Basingstoke direction moving.  Two or three HSTs sat in the higher numbered platforms for almost an hour before the down main line reopened.  They couldn't get direct access to that, so had to shunt out via the new Kennet Bridge Loop before coming back through the station, but at least the passengers stayed on board throughout.  Some departures from around noon onwards were held at Paddington as usual to help keep things moving at Reading.

    Regarding staff visibility, I certainly noticed many staff assisting, especially on the transfer deck, including the very proactive Duty Manager.  Something that has been sadly lacking before.

    The trouble with the situation is that there was still a lot of disruption, delays and cancellations, which continued for many hours (as usual Control at Swindon were soon overwhelmed), and many passengers would have had a delayed and uncomfortable journey.  However, had a situation like that occurred with the old layout I can guarantee that there would have been literally hundreds more delay minutes caused.

    Another thumbs-up for the new flexible layout - even if it might not be obvious to Joe Public!

    Thanks for that II - out of interest how do you feel comms between GWR and the travelling public went? This is often the cause for complain - the "not knowing what's going on" issue


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 07, 2016, 20:06:20
    Difficult to say, BB.  Announcements were plentiful and staff in (reasonably) good supply, though I still overheard a few confused conversations between passengers.  The CIS struggled to keep up, with the 'delayed' and 'cancelled' trains dominating the boards leaving little room for the 'on time' departures.  The only really confusing moment I witnessed was when an Oxford fast (I think) was terminated and turned into a London bound stopper - with the driver and passengers on board finding out last of all.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 07, 2016, 20:10:02
    Difficult to say, BB.  Announcements were plentiful and staff in (reasonably) good supply, though I still overheard a few confused conversations between passengers.  The CIS struggled to keep up, with the 'delayed' and 'cancelled' trains dominating the boards leaving little room for the 'on time' departures.  The only really confusing moment I witnessed was when an Oxford fast (I think) was terminated and turned into a London bound stopper - with the driver and passengers on board finding out last of all.

    I'm not surprised about the CIS - I know when overrunning engineering works have happened the CIS just can't cope with all the changes.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on April 07, 2016, 20:13:11
    Quote
    I happened to be at Reading during the line closure that followed the incident, which is the first time I've been at Reading to see how it now copes with major disruption operationally with the new layout.

    I recall many previous occasions when, during similar levels of disruption, the station just collapsed operationally.  There were soon queues of passenger and freight trains unable to move often regardless of destination with the four through platforms occupied by trains.  The only way round it was to turf everyone out of a train and find a siding for it somewhere causing the station to get full very quickly and things become very miserable.

    Contrast that with today.  Hardly any trains had to be de-trained and, sensibly, routes through one, if not two, of the through platforms were kept clear to keep freight and, crucially, most of the passenger trains to and from the Newbury/Basingstoke direction moving.  Two or three HSTs sat in the higher numbered platforms for almost an hour before the down main line reopened.  They couldn't get direct access to that, so had to shunt out via the new Kennet Bridge Loop before coming back through the station, but at least the passengers stayed on board throughout.  Some departures from around noon onwards were held at Paddington as usual to help keep things moving at Reading.

    Regarding staff visibility, I certainly noticed many staff assisting, especially on the transfer deck, including the very proactive Duty Manager.  Something that has been sadly lacking before.

    The trouble with the situation is that there was still a lot of disruption, delays and cancellations, which continued for many hours (as usual Control at Swindon were soon overwhelmed), and many passengers would have had a delayed and uncomfortable journey.  However, had a situation like that occurred with the old layout I can guarantee that there would have been literally hundreds more delay minutes caused.

    Another thumbs-up for the new flexible layout - even if it might not be obvious to Joe Public!

    Agreed, though to be fair they did manage to get the Down Main open within 40 minutes of the incident which would have helped relieve congestion. The other lines opening around 90 or so minutes later. But yes, certainly positives of having a more flexible layout.


    I mentioned on this thread: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=16899.0 about the 12:33 from BRI being diverted via Taunton, sadly for these passengers I see they arrived RDG & PAD 40 minutes AFTER those on the 13:34 from BRI.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 07, 2016, 20:17:01
    Agreed, though to be fair they did manage to get the Down Main open within 40 minutes of the incident which would have helped relieve congestion. The other lines opening around 90 or so minutes later. But yes, certainly positives of having a more flexible layout.

    Yes, a rough average (based on my many experiences over the years) is 60-75 minutes to get at least one of the lines back in use, so in that respect it was an 'easier' incident to deal with.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on April 07, 2016, 21:09:31
    I mentioned on this thread: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=16899.0 about the 12:33 from BRI being diverted via Taunton, sadly for these passengers I see they arrived RDG & PAD 40 minutes AFTER those on the 13:34 from BRI

    Indeed. 1133 from BRI, held at SWI for 50 and then sent via the B&H, arrived RDG at 1514
                1233 from BRI, left 25 late, ran via Taunton, arrived RDG at 1518
                1333 from BRI, ran straight through, arrived RDG at 1443.

    Hindsight is a wonderful thing but having held the 1133 for so long at SWI, there must have been an idea that the line would be open sooner than the 90 minute time penalty that would be incurred by rerouting it.   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 07, 2016, 21:17:44
    In my experience its worth waiting generally....diversions iften take over an hour longer, and as posted earlier, a lot are cleared within 90 minutes.

    That, plus you often arrive after the incident, thus the wait is not often the full length of the disruption anyway


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on April 08, 2016, 10:23:49
    In my experience its worth waiting generally....diversions iften take over an hour longer, and as posted earlier, a lot are cleared within 90 minutes.

    Seconded, especially at Paddington in the evening rush. Diverting via Waterloo is most unpleasant and time consuming compared with heading to the nearest pub for a couple of hours.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on April 08, 2016, 11:19:47
    And thirded, though the problems would often be pretty horrendous at start up again if everyone waited, so it's best to encourage people to use alternative routes, even if on occasions you might not be sure they will save any time over waiting.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 08, 2016, 11:36:55
    In my experience its worth waiting generally....diversions iften take over an hour longer, and as posted earlier, a lot are cleared within 90 minutes.

    Seconded, especially at Paddington in the evening rush. Diverting via Waterloo is most unpleasant and time consuming compared with heading to the nearest pub for a couple of hours.

    A few years ago I arrived at PAD to find that there was no service due to a fatality and announcements were advising everyone to head for Waterloo. Not fancying that diversion I immediately decided to get something from Burger King, find somewhere to sit and pass the time eating. As soon as I took my first bite there was an announcement that the line had reopened and that a fast service to OXF calling at MAI and TWY was at a platform. (I hate people who eat burgers on trains but I was one such person that evening... :-[)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on April 08, 2016, 14:26:59
    ...find someone to sit and pass the time eating.

    Goodness me, I've seen people admit to eccentric behaviour on this forum, but this is the first confession of cannibalism I can remember.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on April 08, 2016, 15:14:59
    ...find someone to sit and pass the time eating.

    Goodness me, I've seen people admit to eccentric behaviour on this forum, but this is the first confession of cannibalism I can remember.

    Duh!  :( I've now corrected my post ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: didcotdean on April 08, 2016, 16:22:54
    Seconded, especially at Paddington in the evening rush. Diverting via Waterloo is most unpleasant and time consuming compared with heading to the nearest pub for a couple of hours.
    The balance may change for some when Marylebone to Oxford is running. Although it wouldn't take many to overwhelm it. (And whether ticket acceptance would be available.)

    Reminds me that Chiltern did some of their cheeky marketing in Oxford recently to attempt to get people to go to Oxford Parkway to avoid Bakerloo closure at Paddington.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on April 08, 2016, 16:26:17
    Oh, Chiltern are very quick to offer ticket acceptance, to the detriment of their regulars!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 30, 2017, 13:01:43
    More waiting for cow lane bridge to finish:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/work-widen-cow-lane-bridges-12520523



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on January 30, 2017, 13:15:01
    More waiting for cow lane bridge to finish:

    http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/work-widen-cow-lane-bridges-12520523

    Quote
    "When eventually complete, the widening and lowering of the bridges will create an important alternative route for HGVs, commercial and other traffic which are just passing through west Reading, resulting in a better and safer local environment for residents and businesses along the Oxford Road.

    If they really do lower the bridges, can you imagine the reaction?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on January 30, 2017, 17:07:14
    Why wait till the last minute to launch the compulsory purchase order, so that any delay due to objections throws the scheme out of sequence? Will this mean another budget busting contract?

    The words "analysis" and "critical path" spring to mind.

    Both NR and RBC share the blame.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: John R on January 30, 2017, 18:18:00
    If I understand it, that all happened a couple of years ago. There shouldn't be any further delay attributable to the CPO.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Noggin on January 30, 2017, 21:17:02
    If I understand it, that all happened a couple of years ago. There shouldn't be any further delay attributable to the CPO.

    That's my recollection too. IIRC there were various issues with CPO's, at least one of which was that RBC assumed that NR had CPO'd land, and then waded in, alienating all concerned.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on January 31, 2017, 07:14:32
    Correct, the CPO thing is over now, nothing to stop them from proceeding. Network rail however aren't too bothered, they've got the railway side of things sorted and not too fussed with the road layout, I'm sure if it was delaying one of the flyovers for a couple of years they would be pulling their fingers out!

    However, even when (if) it does get done, RBC have said they won't initially be doing anything with the mini roundabout at the end of Cow Lane/Portman Road/Beresford Road, for those of you who know the area will know that the little roundabout outside the Milk Dairy place is a very tight 90 degree turn if heading left towards the bridges and even at the moment, a large van can block both lanes, let alone the odd lorry which tries to go that way, (before then reaching the bridge and having to reverse back). Having numerous lorries headed through that way will simply make the roundabout a gridlocked area and whilst solving one problem (the bridges), you are creating another (the roundabout).

    For those who don't know the area the roundabout is surrounded by small grass areas and a larger roundabout or slip lanes could quite easily be accommodated.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on February 01, 2017, 18:37:43
    For those who don't know the area - here is the roundabout in question.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cowrdb.jpg)

    As for the bridge you can see why something needs to be done...

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cow1.jpg)

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cow2.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 02, 2017, 07:11:24
    Thanks for posting these bobm, trip down memory lane, well twice a day every day for the past 12 years, and again in about 20 minutes!

    As you can see the car in pic 1 sticking out not too far from the oncoming lane, when lorries go that way it sticks right out, quite often fully blocking the oncoming lane. For clarification the bridge in pics 2 & 3 will remain as is, but is due to become a cycle/footpath with the new bridge to the left of picture 2.

    Bobm, I work about 50 yards from pic 3, you should have popped in for a cuppa! en-route to the 3 pigs of course  :)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on June 19, 2017, 19:41:52
    Quote
    RBC have said they won't initially be doing anything with the mini roundabout at the end of Cow Lane/Portman Road/Beresford Road

    With RBC seemingly thinking work on the bridges will continue in the Autumn, they have re-iterated the Oxford road corridor study from a few years ago, which does suggest a minor alteration will occur at the roundabout, whether that would be enough only time will tell. (Personally I don't think so)

     Oxford Road Study - Portman Road (http://www.reading.gov.uk/media/7326/Oxford-Road-Study-02---Portman-Road/pdf/Oxford_Road_Study_02_-_Portman_Road.pdf)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 25, 2017, 15:33:52
    Cow lane to be closed over the weekend of 4/5 November and possibly the 11/12 November as well, this is in association with the demolition of the old brick arch tunnel at cow lane.


    Quote
    As part of our Railway Upgrade Plan we will be carrying out work to the highway on Cow Lane. This work involves widening the existing single lane carriageway beneath the Reading West Curve on the Great Western railway line.

    Nice to see Network Rail not even knowing what the correct track is called  :-\


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on August 26, 2017, 14:29:58
    Indeed.  The bridge under “Reading West Curve” was replaced a while ago.  The single lane brick arch bridge in bobm’s pictures used to carry the main & relief lines from Reading to Tilehurst, but I think all lines (which aren't on the flyovers) are now on the new concrete deck bridge which you can see in the pictures adjacent to the original brick arch bridge

    Not for the first time, NR’s PR have got it wrong when explaining the works at Reading.

    Incidentally, as a local I agree with Adelate’s comments in June re the nearby roundabout.  There will also be even more congestion at the Norcot roundabout (ie Oxford Road/Wigmore Lane) when Cow Lane becomes a more attractive route for drivers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 26, 2017, 18:56:09
    Yes, slight improvements to be made at Norcot as well, but still be a busy area

     Oxford Road Study - Norcot Roundabout (http://www.reading.gov.uk/media/7324/Oxford-Road-Study-04---Oxford-Road-1/pdf/Oxford_Road_Study_04_-_Oxford_Road_1.pdf)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on August 30, 2017, 19:38:30
    I see that the West Country HSTs are using a new route (new at least to me!) to avoid Reading during the 16th/17th September blockade.  They will, in the up direction, be calling Swindon and then routeing Didcot West Curve, Oxford, Islip, High Wycombe, South Ruislip, Greenford, OOC and Paddington non-stop from Swindon.  I have done all parts of this route but not in one direct HST.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 30, 2017, 19:51:37
    I see that the West Country HSTs are using a new route (new at least to me!) to avoid Reading during the 16th/17th September blockade.  They will, in the up direction, be calling Swindon and then routeing Didcot West Curve, Oxford, Islip, High Wycombe, South Ruislip, Greenford, OOC and Paddington non-stop from Swindon.  I have done all parts of this route but not in one direct HST.

    That applies to South Wales too - one train each way each route per hour.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on August 30, 2017, 20:51:10
    I understood there's a stop in Oxford to pick up a Chiltern pilot


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 30, 2017, 22:19:13
    More info on this thread (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=18436.0)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 31, 2017, 12:49:48
    I understood there's a stop in Oxford to pick up a Chiltern pilot

    Yes, there will have to be.  Train Manager's will sign the route, but drivers won't.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Bmblbzzz on August 31, 2017, 13:50:05
    I understood there's a stop in Oxford to pick up a Chiltern pilot

    Yes, there will have to be.  Train Manager's will sign the route, but drivers won't.
    What does pilot mean in this case? Like a harbour pilot on a ship, who acts as a guide but someone else still is at the wheel and the captain remains in command (I'm not quite sure how this translates to a train but presumably they would give advance warning to the driver of stations, signals, speed limits, and so on); or someone who will actually drive the train for that section then hand over when they get back to the route the driver knows (presumably OOC) (in which case why isn't this pilot called a driver)?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 31, 2017, 16:20:54
    What does pilot mean in this case? Like a harbour pilot on a ship, who acts as a guide but someone else still is at the wheel and the captain remains in command (I'm not quite sure how this translates to a train but presumably they would give advance warning to the driver of stations, signals, speed limits, and so on); or someone who will actually drive the train for that section then hand over when they get back to the route the driver knows (presumably OOC) (in which case why isn't this pilot called a driver)?

    I thought the usual term used was 'conductor driver'.   Maybe there are historic differences in terminology...

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on August 31, 2017, 19:05:48
    You are 'conducted over the route by a conductor driver' (official terminology) or 'need to be piloted' or something similar (employee slang).

    Procedure is pretty much as Bmnlbzzz described, and usually involves freight company drivers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Surrey 455 on August 31, 2017, 23:42:59
    You are 'conducted over the route by a conductor driver' (official terminology) or 'need to be piloted' or something similar (employee slang).

    Procedure is pretty much as Bmnlbzzz described, and usually involves freight company drivers.

    Does the conductor driver leave the controls occasionally to check tickets?  ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Electric train on September 01, 2017, 08:07:21
    You are 'conducted over the route by a conductor driver' (official terminology) or 'need to be piloted' or something similar (employee slang).

    Procedure is pretty much as Bmnlbzzz described, and usually involves freight company drivers.

    The history of this gets confused in places, this is my little understanding of it

    When the signalling is out of use for any reason could be Absolute Block, Token Block or track circuited MAS trains need to operate over a single line trains could be "Piloted" through the section(s) that was a man posted at a signal or signal box who after seeking authority from the signaller would conduct the train though the section, that is he would ride in the cab with the driver and get off at the end of the effected area, he would then conduct a train back, slow process as there was only one Pilotman. Most of this is dealt with by talking a train through by the use of cab secure radio

    Another Pilot was an locomotive coupled to the head of a train where the driver of the had not signed a route, typically this was where a "foreign" engine was working another companies metals so was piloted through the route.  Today its more practical to place a driver conductor as a pilot in the train to conduct the driver of the train over an unsigned route.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: rower40 on September 04, 2017, 16:01:35
    The history of this gets confused in places, this is my little understanding of it

    When the signalling is out of use for any reason could be Absolute Block, Token Block or track circuited MAS trains need to operate over a single line trains could be "Piloted" through the section(s) that was a man posted at a signal or signal box who after seeking authority from the signaller would conduct the train though the section, that is he would ride in the cab with the driver and get off at the end of the effected area, he would then conduct a train back, slow process as there was only one Pilotman. Most of this is dealt with by talking a train through by the use of cab secure radio

    Another Pilot was an locomotive coupled to the head of a train where the driver of the had not signed a route, typically this was where a "foreign" engine was working another companies metals so was piloted through the route.  Today its more practical to place a driver conductor as a pilot in the train to conduct the driver of the train over an unsigned route.
    A classic case of the same word being used for various different things:
    "Pilot" engine: engine attached to the front of a train, to provide additional power.  The engine already attached to the train is named the "train engine".
    "Pilot"man working: This may be co-incidence, but I understood that, in this case only, "PILOT" is an acronym for "Person In Lieu Of Token".  The man in question wears an armband with "PILOT" written on it, and he liaises with the signaller as to whether to give permission for the train to proceed, and which signals the driver may ignore.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on September 04, 2017, 16:49:35
    ...I understood that, in this case only, "PILOT" is an acronym for "Person In Lieu Of Token".

    A backronym (http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-bac1.htm), or I'm a Dutch squirrel's uncle. There is a clear sense of a pilot as a guide, and that surely is what this is.

    Back in the unenlightened days when this method of working was devised, people hadn't been invented - there were only 'men' (e.g. fireman, signalman etc). So it would have to have been 'Man In Lieu Of Token', or MILOT. This is rather confirmed by the fact that all the armbands I've ever seen say 'PILOT MAN' (with or without the space). And MILOTMAN is tautological as well as a bit silly-sounding.

    So: No.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Red Squirrel on September 04, 2017, 21:11:02
    Found this rather super film about wrong line working. No prizes for working out where Averton Hammer and Boiland are, but see if you can work it out before you get to the end of the film!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJP3l9tSuwo


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: rower40 on September 04, 2017, 21:37:39
    ...I understood that, in this case only, "PILOT" is an acronym for "Person In Lieu Of Token".

    A backronym (http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-bac1.htm), or I'm a Dutch squirrel's uncle. There is a clear sense of a pilot as a guide, and that surely is what this is.

    Back in the unenlightened days when this method of working was devised, people hadn't been invented - there were only 'men' (e.g. fireman, signalman etc). So it would have to have been 'Man In Lieu Of Token', or MILOT. This is rather confirmed by the fact that all the armbands I've ever seen say 'PILOT MAN' (with or without the space). And MILOTMAN is tautological as well as a bit silly-sounding.

    So: No.
    Fairy Nuff.  I'm still going to use the backronym as an aide-memoire for how Pilotman-working is used.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on September 13, 2017, 13:55:01
    With thanks to several members of the Coffee Shop forum for their subsequent posts, I've now moved their more light-hearted discussion to a new topic, at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=18703.0  ;)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on September 13, 2017, 16:45:20
    %0 years ago I piloted a train where the driver hadn't signed the route.

    One winter's Sunday night at Sutton with the line to Victoria via Hackbridge shut with all trains going via West Croydon to Selhurst. As ASM I was doing bus replacement late shift.

    About 21:00 confronted by Station Inspector to say the driver of an up Bognor fast ( 8 COR/Nelson, they were routed via Sutton in those days). doesn't know road and there was no pilotman/conductor available. I offered to take him knowing all the signals, I can still remember them. We trotted round south London at 40 mph and I was dropped at Selhurst on the Up Main platform. Via a piece of track no longer in place. We had all greens except for West Croydon B's distant which they never pulled because it was a long pull round a corner and usually all trains stopped in any case.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightf48544 on September 13, 2017, 16:48:45
    Re routing of trains are the going via Greenford to OOC direct on the single line or round via West Ealing? The Greenford signalman is going to be busy either way.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on September 13, 2017, 18:05:25
    A bit of both I would imagine.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 14, 2017, 11:02:39
    Outbound via Ealing, inbound via Park royal


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on September 20, 2017, 12:44:54
    Exactly - and two years ago there were clear plans for rebuilding the A60 bridge.

    Looking carefully through the three different GCR articles on this, I can find words that say:"We have to raise one million pounds, to put two previously recovered bridge decks in place by the end of 2015." and " On the northern section of the GCR, the bridge across the A60 also needs upgrading."

    So why not explain - for the benefit of anyone who saw the earlier news - that the reused spans were going to be used on the A60 bridge, but that is now going to be upgraded a different way? If it's because the A60 bridge is on the GCR(N)'s side of the gap, it does make you wonder how well the two groups will co-operate, or even merge, after the link-up.
    I think the reason why the bridge over the MML is happening and the A60 is not is due to NR having a project team in place this makes it easier for GCR to bridge that part of the gap to do the A60 I suspect means engaging with a County Council highways and the Highways Agency who are unlikely to have a project team in place

    Apologies if this was covered elsewhere, but this thread on the Reading Forum has a recent update on these bridges:
    https://www.reading-forum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=105&t=7720 (https://www.reading-forum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=105&t=7720)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on November 06, 2017, 04:32:23
    Well they've opened Cow Lane a few hours early, (much to my annoyance as I'd already walked the long way round) though I did have a peek and a walkthrough and the old brick bridge has gone, along with the little pedestrian ramps either side of the road. They have tarmacked those areas and temporarily corderned off the east side (right hand side in photo 1) making it much safer for pedestrians already.

    Sadly no pics as it's a tad dark at the moment so have shamefully borrowed bobm's ones from earlier in the thread for reference :-[

    I did notice on Thursday they had put up a camera (from just behind where bobm was stood for picture 1), I'm assuming that will form some sort of time lapse video which will no doubt be in the media later on today.

    Quote from: bobm
    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cow1.jpg)

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/cow2.jpg)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on November 06, 2017, 16:22:20
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-berkshire-41884023/cow-lane-railway-bridge-in-reading-demolished


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on November 06, 2017, 16:34:09
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-berkshire-41884023/cow-lane-railway-bridge-in-reading-demolished

    Remarkably, the BBC report that it should be finished in August 2018.  Isn't the bulk of the work (ie the bit under the widened railway formation) already complete behind hoardings?

    Allowing 9 months for a straightforward bit of road widening and realignment into a different underpass seems extreme.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on November 06, 2017, 18:10:14
    Sadly the BBC report is correct, Network Rail/Radio Block Centre (RBC) have been saying August 18 for the completion date for some time.

    I don't think they have dug down enough on the new section yet, but still 9 months is extreme


    Edit:VickiS - Clarifying Acronyms


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CyclingSid on November 07, 2017, 09:49:19
    Is it an old wives tale, when they first built the Big Yellow Bridge by Reading Station (Vastern Road), the first double-decker bus got stuck under the bridge?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TonyK on November 07, 2017, 10:12:54
    Is it an old wives tale, when they first built the Big Yellow Bridge by Reading Station (Vastern Road), the first double-decker bus got stuck under the bridge?

    I'll ask her.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 17, 2017, 10:32:36
    From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-42013770):

    Quote
    Reading train depot noise order against GWR and Network Rail
        16 November 2017    From the section Berkshire
    (https://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/904/cpsprodpb/BA16/production/_98783674_readingdepot.jpg)
    Residents complain noise from Reading Train Care Depot has "blighted" their lives Image copyright Geograph/N Chadwick

    Rail bosses have been issued with a noise abatement notice after claims people living near a train depot are enduring "sleepless nights".

    Great Western Railway (GWR) and Network Rail directors face prosecution if they fail to comply with Reading council's legal notice within six months.

    "Prolonged negotiations" had not resolved the problem at the site near Cardiff Road, the council said.

    GWR said new electric trains being introduced will reduce noise levels.

    However, deputy council leader Tony Page said his authority was left with "little option but to proceed to serve the legal notices" after "years of inactivity" by rail operators.

    He said acoustics and others experts had established there was "a statutory nuisance" which was "prejudicial to health".

    "Residents in Cardiff Road continue to suffer from noise disturbance and sleepless nights as a result of the noisy diesel trains," he said.

    "If electrification had been delivered on time, it would have meant by the end of 2017 far fewer diesel trains would have been serviced in Reading.

    "The recent collapse of the electrification programme however, and the lack of any clarity of timescales, means there is no end in sight to the misery for local residents."

    Jonathan Dart, chairman of the Bell Tower Community Association, said the noise was at its worst in the early hours of the morning and late at night.

    "They have to operate the depot in a way that doesn't blight the lives of the people living next to it," he said.

    A GWR spokesman said the company was "disappointed" the notice had been served less than six weeks before quieter electric trains are set to be introduced.

    "We expect this change will significantly alter the noise characteristics of the site," the spokesman said.

    The spokesman added that four independent reports had shown the depot was operating "within safe and agreed limits".

    Network Rail has not responded to an invitation to comment.

    That picture is borderline irrelevant. The depot proper has only businesses for neighbours, even over the road; it must be the carriage sidings that are the problem. And some of those comments really don't make a lot of sense.

    Given that this facility was designed before electrification was announced, how did they (NR/FGW?)  think it was going to operate with houses just over the fence? There will now be fewer Turbos to fire up of a morning, but with 387s (and what else?) as well how much scope is there for shuffling things around to keep the engines and ears further apart?

    I'm not sure about the "recent collapse of the electrification programme", at least as it affects Reading. Though if this order is the result of complaints dating from the opening of the depot, how impressive is it that even with the not-so-recent delay/deferment/deprogramming of some electrification, the council haven't reached this point until now.



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on November 29, 2017, 18:38:08
    I was going to post the good news that the Cow Lane bridge won't be completely finished by August as signs have gone up stating full weekend closures of the road, 2 in July and another in September, however even better news for local road users:

    Cow Lane One Way (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15690964.Traffic_fears_as_Cow_Lane_to_be_made_one_way_only_for_SEVEN_months_for_upgrades/)

    Oh what fun!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: devonexpress on November 30, 2017, 00:47:09
    From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-42013770):

    Quote
    Reading train depot noise order against GWR and Network Rail
        16 November 2017    From the section Berkshire
    (https://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/904/cpsprodpb/BA16/production/_98783674_readingdepot.jpg)
    Residents complain noise from Reading Train Care Depot has "blighted" their lives Image copyright Geograph/N Chadwick

    Rail bosses have been issued with a noise abatement notice after claims people living near a train depot are enduring "sleepless nights".

    Great Western Railway (GWR) and Network Rail directors face prosecution if they fail to comply with Reading council's legal notice within six months.

    "Prolonged negotiations" had not resolved the problem at the site near Cardiff Road, the council said.

    GWR said new electric trains being introduced will reduce noise levels.

    However, deputy council leader Tony Page said his authority was left with "little option but to proceed to serve the legal notices" after "years of inactivity" by rail operators.

    He said acoustics and others experts had established there was "a statutory nuisance" which was "prejudicial to health".

    "Residents in Cardiff Road continue to suffer from noise disturbance and sleepless nights as a result of the noisy diesel trains," he said.

    "If electrification had been delivered on time, it would have meant by the end of 2017 far fewer diesel trains would have been serviced in Reading.

    "The recent collapse of the electrification programme however, and the lack of any clarity of timescales, means there is no end in sight to the misery for local residents."

    Jonathan Dart, chairman of the Bell Tower Community Association, said the noise was at its worst in the early hours of the morning and late at night.

    "They have to operate the depot in a way that doesn't blight the lives of the people living next to it," he said.

    A GWR spokesman said the company was "disappointed" the notice had been served less than six weeks before quieter electric trains are set to be introduced.

    "We expect this change will significantly alter the noise characteristics of the site," the spokesman said.

    The spokesman added that four independent reports had shown the depot was operating "within safe and agreed limits".

    Network Rail has not responded to an invitation to comment.

    That picture is borderline irrelevant. The depot proper has only businesses for neighbours, even over the road; it must be the carriage sidings that are the problem. And some of those comments really don't make a lot of sense.

    Given that this facility was designed before electrification was announced, how did they (NR/FGW?)  think it was going to operate with houses just over the fence? There will now be fewer Turbos to fire up of a morning, but with 387s (and what else?) as well how much scope is there for shuffling things around to keep the engines and ears further apart?

    I'm not sure about the "recent collapse of the electrification programme", at least as it affects Reading. Though if this order is the result of complaints dating from the opening of the depot, how impressive is it that even with the not-so-recent delay/deferment/deprogramming of some electrification, the council haven't reached this point until now.



    Didn't the old depot used to be in the triangle, I'm guessing there is not much space now. Either way its a stupid place to build a busy, loud 24 hour train depot. I'm guessing it will end up with massive compensation payments from Network Rail to the residents to shut them up, and move them away.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 01, 2017, 00:03:34
    Either way its a stupid place to build a busy, loud 24 hour train depot.

    I must disagree. But the depot buildings are well away from any houses and most of the site is surrounded by industrial estates on both sides of the line. I estimate that over 95% of the boundary (including the other side of the main line) is either industrial estates or the Reading Festival Site. There are just a few houses backing onto a small part of the sidings at the Station end.

    I couldn't see where else you could build a Depot in the Reading area that would be anything like as good from the point of view of being away from houses.  If you can't build a depot there then you would either have to build it out in the countryside - but that is in the AONB and so I am almost certain it would not get planning permission - or not at all. 

    There were more houses near to the high level part of the old depot. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on December 01, 2017, 12:09:54
    It wasn't exactly a greenfield site beforehand, wasn't it some sort of freight depot originally, and then saw use as an infrastructure depot.  How close did the old freight bypass lines go.   When were the houses built, in terms of the railway timeline?

    I think the history of the railway use of the site should set some sort of a precedent.  Haven't there been similar noise objections to existing DMU depots in the north Oxford area, from recent new build properties?

    Paul 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 01, 2017, 20:52:53
    It wasn't exactly a greenfield site beforehand, wasn't it some sort of freight depot originally, and then saw use as an infrastructure depot.  How close did the old freight bypass lines go.   When were the houses built, in terms of the railway timeline?

    I think the history of the railway use of the site should set some sort of a precedent.  Haven't there been similar noise objections to existing DMU depots in the north Oxford area, from recent new build properties?

    Paul 

    The railway was there first, of course, though I don't how much of a right that give to be noisy. The houses (and Cardiff Road itself) date from around 1900, by which time there were sidings at the eastern and western end of the current depot area, and also in between, on both sides of Cow Lane. These siding were quite short, and in between at the western half of the current eastern sidings looks like railway land, with a range of small buildings in it, but no identified use. All of those sidings were still there, but no longer used I think, ten years ago.

    The big engine shed was south of the railway, near the Hodsoll Road access into the triangle, where there were still sidings up to RSAR. Next to the sidings behind Cardiff Road the 1900 map says "cattle pens", no doubt connected with the cattle market in Great Knollys Street and guess what in Abattoirs Road (which is immediately south of the railway off Caversham Road).

    The rest of Cardiff Road was and is industrial, but much of it is now half-derelicit at least. The block north of the houses closest to that suspect building was Cox & Wyman, who printed paperbacks there until 2015. That is likely to be redeveloped for housing, but the planning application, promised "soon" in July, has not materialised yet. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 01, 2017, 21:18:17
    The railway was there first, of course, though I don't how much of a right that give to be noisy. The houses (and Cardiff Road itself) date from around 1900, by which time there were sidings at the eastern and western end of the current depot area, and also in between, on both sides of Cow Lane. These siding were quite short, and in between at the western half of the current eastern sidings looks like railway land, with a range of small buildings in it, but no identified use. All of those sidings were still there, but no longer used I think, ten years ago.

    Various stores and equipment buildings remained in at least partial use up until around 2009, but use was very limited in terms of railway vehicles.  Some time before that there was sporadic use for maintenance of wagons, one of the sidings had an inspection pit, and going back even further the resident pilot locomotive was usually to be found lurking in one of the sidings along with a few wagons that seemingly had no other home to go to, but certainly noises would have been far less regular since way back in the 80s.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on December 01, 2017, 21:25:55
    While the railway was there before the houses, only the eastern third of Cardiff Road is residential, the rest, backing onto the railway is light industrial. One of the best car mechanics around, Chiltern Autos, is based there.

    It would have made sense in designing the new depot to locate all the operational buildings at the western end of the site, out of site and earshot of residents and with better road access. The width of the plot is constant so there was no problem. Perhaps recordings of diesel engines running in the early hours should be supplied to Grayling, Maynard etc.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 01, 2017, 21:57:30
    It is the east sidings not the operational/maintenance buildings that are causing the problem.  You could have designed the layout differently but it would have been a sub optimum design if you had the maintenance shed at the eastern end where you want all your trains delivered for service as effectively as possible as the current east sidings do.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 02, 2017, 09:25:42
    It would have made sense in designing the new depot to locate all the operational buildings at the western end of the site, out of site and earshot of residents and with better road access.

    They are - they are all west of Cow Lane!

    Perhaps recordings of diesel engines running in the early hours should be supplied to Grayling, Maynard etc.

    If course if they were electric units there would be no reving of engines, but that project was delivered late, so hopefully come January....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: IndustryInsider on December 02, 2017, 09:46:15
    The situation will become much better in January.  Diesel trains will still be in those sidings, but in far fewer numbers.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on December 02, 2017, 11:59:04
    The situation will become much better in January.  Diesel trains will still be in those sidings, but in far fewer numbers.

    Some earlier pictures labelled the eastern sidings as "maintenance depot for proposed IEP". Obviously that's "maintenance" in the lightest, daily, sense, though that word "proposed" tells you how earlier that was. But won't we reach a point where the Turbos will all fit in the western sidings?

    I did wonder earlier, while describing the geography in words, whether it would have been easier to provide a picture. Several thousand words later, here is one. It can also serve for the other, hypothetically malodorous, current discussion on another thread.

    The picture (dated 25 March 2017) shows the eastern sidings, from Cow Lane to Caversham Road. Cardiff Road to the north has houses only at its east end, where those on its south reach halfway along the sidings. On the north side they extend a little further, but with about half the space occupied by the Cox & Wyman factory. It is just within 50 m of the nearest houses.

    There are a few buildings past the western end of the sidings, of which the slightly skewed one is the "east Controlled Emission Toilet (CET) plant room". The original planning application said this would not be built until a later date "when required for IEP". The west Controlled Emission Toilet (CET) plant room would be built at the start, next to the western sidings - I'm not sure what that implies in terms of what trains sleep where or when in the grand scheme of things (Great Western Railway (GWR) subsection).

    The wide rectangular "balcony" extending the level surface at embankment height, about halfway along the sidings, is where this new "Controlled Emission Toilet" ("CET) waste processing" building is being built.


    Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronyms


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Tim on December 02, 2017, 13:10:53

    The railway was there first, of course, though I don't how much of a right that give to be noisy.

    As I understand it, planning law does not take into account who was built first.  Just because the railway or airport or church bell tower was there before your house was built does not diminish the right of you to object.  However, the principle that homeowners have a right not to be disturbed does take into account the nature of the area.  Those living in an urban area are expected to put up with a certain amount of noise which might be unreasonable in a rural area. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on December 02, 2017, 14:19:47

    The railway was there first, of course, though I don't how much of a right that give to be noisy.

    As I understand it, planning law does not take into account who was built first.  Just because the railway or airport or church bell tower was there before your house was built does not diminish the right of you to object.  However, the principle that homeowners have a right not to be disturbed does take into account the nature of the area.  Those living in an urban area are expected to put up with a certain amount of noise which might be unreasonable in a rural area. 

    The scope of planning law is very limited in this respect.  In planning law an objection can only be made where a planning application is required.

    If you were to substitute the law of nuisance in place of planning law. Then I think you are correct. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 02, 2017, 17:37:43
    Those living in an urban area are expected to put up with a certain amount of noise which might be unreasonable in a rural area. 

    You'd perhaps be surprised.  From the BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-20572854  ::)



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on December 02, 2017, 19:03:15
    Is it an old wives tale, when they first built the Big Yellow Bridge by Reading Station (Vastern Road), the first double-decker bus got stuck under the bridge?

    Could very well be true.   For years there were metal plates in the cabs of several Reading Transport double deckers saying "This vehicle will not pass under Vastern Road Bridge".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on December 02, 2017, 21:27:06
    It would have made sense in designing the new depot to locate all the operational buildings at the western end of the site, out of site and earshot of residents and with better road access.

    They are - they are all west of Cow Lane!


    My point was that the smelly/noisy un-neighbourly activities on the site should be as far from the houses as practicable. It's simple good manners.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Gordon the Blue Engine on December 22, 2017, 16:09:17
    Just seen an interesting move on Open Team Train (OTT) which shows what can be done with the new layout west of Reading.  1E56 1545 Reading – Newcastle was routed out of P14B via the Up Loop to avoid conflict with 2K67 1513 Newbury – Reading which was approaching P13B via the Feeder Relief.

    At Tilehurst East 1E56 then crossed the whole layout and went through Tilehurst on the DM. 

    Hope the XC Driver was tickety-boo on his route knowledge and signal route indications!

    Bit sad to be looking at Open Team Train (OTT) when I probably should be peeling potatoes or generally doing something useful.  Merry Christmas everyone. 



    Edit: VickiS - Clarifying acronyms


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CyclingSid on January 25, 2018, 07:30:22
    After yesterday's rain there was considerable traffic disruption in Reading, partly caused by flooding under the Vastern Road bridge:
    https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/live-updates-as-vastern-road-in-reading-closed/ (https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/live-updates-as-vastern-road-in-reading-closed/)
    in the Reading Chronicle there was an added (olefactory?) extra:
    http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15894010.UPDATED__Vastern_Road_closed_both_ways_due_to_sewage_issue_after_downpour/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15894010.UPDATED__Vastern_Road_closed_both_ways_due_to_sewage_issue_after_downpour/)
    hopefully only Storm, and not Foul drainage.
    Is this a sign of things to come when the have finished digging out under Cow Lane Bridge?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Interceptor on January 25, 2018, 15:42:58
    This is quite interesting. I remember back in 2007 just after I started work at Reading, a massive rain storm caused a similar problem under the then not widened Vastern Road bridge. The pumping station to deal with such events is located in the roundabout on the south side. I was led to believe that for some reasons the pumps did not cut in. However, the man sent to sort it out (presume a Thames Water technician) was stranded in traffic in the area and could not get there quickly so the flood waters deepened.
    Regarding Cow Lane, the design, when I last saw it, did include for a pumping system to deal with any similar occurrence. Proof will be in the future once the works are completed.
    One other little bit of trivia that may be of interest. We undertook a very extensive bore hole survey throughout the area ahead of works commencing. We found (I recall 2008 or 2009) that we were finding ground water about 1 to 2 m below ground level around the multi storey car park on the north side. However, once works kicked off fully mid 2011 onwards, the ground water level was considerably lower. Whilst no one probably appreciated it, the aquifers were quite depleted. The extremely heavy rains of the following winters thus having no ability to "top up" the aquifers slowly resulting in flooding in many areas. I do not know what the situation today is though.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ellendune on January 25, 2018, 21:15:20
    After yesterday's rain there was considerable traffic disruption in Reading, partly caused by flooding under the Vastern Road bridge:
    https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/live-updates-as-vastern-road-in-reading-closed/ (https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/live-updates-as-vastern-road-in-reading-closed/)
    in the Reading Chronicle there was an added (olefactory?) extra:
    http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15894010.UPDATED__Vastern_Road_closed_both_ways_due_to_sewage_issue_after_downpour/ (http://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/15894010.UPDATED__Vastern_Road_closed_both_ways_due_to_sewage_issue_after_downpour/)
    hopefully only Storm, and not Foul drainage.
    Is this a sign of things to come when the have finished digging out under Cow Lane Bridge?

    I am sure it was dealt with promptly as it is within sight of TW's HQ


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on March 13, 2018, 03:25:50
    Anyone know why all the retail units on the Reading over bridge are closed ? It’s been like that for over a week, all displaying a Network Rail notice saying closed and sorry ?whats going on ?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Jason on March 13, 2018, 11:17:05
    I was curious enough to google around and found this on a couple of news sites. It doesn't explain the ongoing impact though.

    The retail units on the transfer bridge at Reading Station have had to be temporarily closed for safety reasons.
    In a tweet on the Network Rail Reading account, staff have confirmed the decision's been made due to the impact of last week's severe weather.

    https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1 (https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: ChrisB on March 13, 2018, 11:34:22
    That'll be costing NR a pretty penny or two in compensation to those units! Their turnover must be substantial....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 13, 2018, 13:12:57
    I was curious enough to google around and found this on a couple of news sites. It doesn't explain the ongoing impact though.

    The retail units on the transfer bridge at Reading Station have had to be temporarily closed for safety reasons.
    In a tweet on the Network Rail Reading account, staff have confirmed the decision's been made due to the impact of last week's severe weather.

    https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1 (https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1)

    The obvious explanation would be that the water supply for sprinklers had frozen and/or burst. I found this from HelmX (http://helmx.co.uk/reading-station/), who installed the shells of the original six units:
    Quote
    The roof structure also had to take the load of a water tank for a fire sprinkler system and air conditioning system, without having any interior supporting columns.

    That's the roof of the units, not the deck. So it looks more like those tanks or the water-filled pipes were damaged, or just had to be drained to prevent that. Why it would take a long time to restore that, and whose liability it ends up as, are both still unclear.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: TaplowGreen on March 13, 2018, 14:36:03
    I was curious enough to google around and found this on a couple of news sites. It doesn't explain the ongoing impact though.

    The retail units on the transfer bridge at Reading Station have had to be temporarily closed for safety reasons.
    In a tweet on the Network Rail Reading account, staff have confirmed the decision's been made due to the impact of last week's severe weather.

    https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1 (https://twitter.com/networkrailRDG/status/971748983952564224/photo/1)

    The obvious explanation would be that the water supply for sprinklers had frozen and/or burst. I found this from HelmX (http://helmx.co.uk/reading-station/), who installed the shells of the original six units:
    Quote
    The roof structure also had to take the load of a water tank for a fire sprinkler system and air conditioning system, without having any interior supporting columns.

    That's the roof of the units, not the deck. So it look more like those tanks or the water-filled pipes were damaged, or just had to be drained to prevent that. Why it would take a long time to restore that, and whose liability it ends up as, are both still unclear.


    More units than usual in for repair?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: didcotdean on March 15, 2018, 19:00:02
    Units are open now, having just gone over the bridge


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on May 14, 2018, 18:36:17
    And yet another delay for the Cow Lane Bridge:

    https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/cow-lane-to-reopen-in-reading-but-project-delayed-by-six-months/


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: martyjon on May 14, 2018, 18:41:40
    And yet another delay for the Cow Lane Bridge:

    https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/cow-lane-to-reopen-in-reading-but-project-delayed-by-six-months/


    Bit like Metrobus then, but we're nearly there, two weeks tomorrow is opening day.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 15, 2018, 09:22:27
    I passed through Reading station last Saturday (12/05/2018) and to say the least I was both supprised and somewhat disgusted about the amount of pigeon poo all over the glass. Looks like the building has been designed without a means of cleaning some quite critical parts (such as over the footbridge escalators/stairs) :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 15, 2018, 09:53:47
    I passed through Reading station last Saturday (12/05/2018) and to say the least I was both supprised and somewhat disgusted about the amount of pigeon poo all over the glass. Looks like the building has been designed without a means of cleaning some quite critical parts (such as over the footbridge escalators/stairs) :P

    All the roof "glazing" is in the form of ETFE ("polythene bag") inflated cushions, which isn't surprising in a Grimshaw design. Its cleaning wasn't covered in the D&A statement (that said "a more detailed review of these strategies will be developed throughout the next design phase"). The experts' experts on this stuff (i.e. Grimshaw use them as contractors for it) are Architen Landrell, and they recommend this in "How to look after your ETFE Cushion Roof":

    Quote
    Unlike traditional fabric structures, ETFE Foil is an extruded material and therefore has a smooth surface. This smoothness reduces the amount of dirt retained on the ETFE foil surface and allows the rain to wash away the majority of bird droppings and dirt. However, it is impossible to say that any material is entirely self-cleaning, and therefore we recommend the following cleaning regime:

    In general terms, we advise that ETFE foil cushions are cleaned externally every 2-3 years if dirt build up becomes a problem. The city environment is dirtier than other locations and therefore may mean that more regular maintenance of the external façade is required.

    The cushions might also need to be dusted on the underside, although far less often – depending on the amount of dirt collected in the internal atmosphere, we would recommend they are cleaned every 5-10 years but many don’t need cleaning on the underside at any point in their lives!

    They don't say how this washing is to be done, but I guess a hose and a soft brush on a long pole is most likely. Giving it a serious scrubbing does not seem like a good idea.

    But maybe it's just the wrong kind of pigeon (or their diet)?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 15, 2018, 10:09:06
    I too noticed a bit of Reading station that's showing its age a bit early. I think the canopy on P5/6 went up in 2012, and like the others that followed its supports came pre-painted in battleship grey. So you'd presume they were factory-treated underneath with something like what they do to car bodies - they now go for twenty years or more without rusting under the paint as they did forty years ago.

    But no, several of the stanchions have been prepared - a bit - apparently for repainting (and so have some seat supports). That doesn't look like rust where the paint was locally damaged during installation does it? (As I remember it, they were bolted down at a flange just below finished surface level).


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on May 15, 2018, 14:27:33
    How do you find these things STUVING? :)

    I don't think it would be possible to reach some of the places I saw, without an OHL isolation and a long reach mobile platform arm...... ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on May 15, 2018, 14:49:31
    I don't think it would be possible to reach some of the places I saw, without an OHL isolation and a long reach mobile platform arm...... ::)

    I did wonder whether your comment was really (or in part) about the wall glazing of the "vertical circulation cores", but could not see those as over the escalators/stairs. The D&A statement did say that the glass wall there could be done by elevating platforms. However, the transfer deck between them is a problem because it's so close to and above the 25kV wires, which rules out most access gantry and similar methods that place staff outside. Their suggestion then was glass that could be turned round and cleaned from inside, but obviously that didn't happen. Since "a more detailed review of these strategies will be developed throughout the next design phase"  applied here too, I wonder what that came up with ... or did Grimshaw never have a bright enough idea before the design had to be frozen and built?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 07, 2018, 20:37:24
    And more problems with Cow Lane bridge

    https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/readings-cow-lane-closed-after-sink-hole-appears/amp/

    Closed late morning and was still closed earlier this evening, I had to take the scenic route home via Scours Lane


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on August 07, 2018, 20:59:07
    ..and as any local will tell you that's hardly scenic... ;D


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 17, 2019, 09:07:03
    It will provide a larger % increase in capacity than Filton Four Track1, has taken just as long to engineer as Crossrail2, and has had as many people working on it as the Great Wall of China3, but we are now only 8 days away from Cow Lane opening for two lanes of traffic for the first time.

    A very long awaited project finally comes to fruition, although the Foot/Cycle Path aspect won't be ready until the summer. For those unaware who are in the area the bridge will be closed for both road users and pedestrians from Friday evening 22nd, until 10am Monday 25th. A strange time to re-open a road but I believe they are waiting until later in the morning so that the media can be all over it and they can do a ribbon opening ceremony, possibly involving the Mayor.


    (1 Potentially around a 250% increase with two lanes of vehicles instead of one lane with traffic lights, of course the bottlenecks will simply move to the roundabouts at either end of the road instead, but that's not something the local press releases will be announcing come next week)
    (2 Both the Reading Station Project which this comes under, and Crossrail both started in 2009)
    (3 Possibly a slight exaggeration)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 25, 2019, 10:40:46
    It's open!!!!


    Obligatory showpiece bus photo

    (https://i.ibb.co/tsqJz44/20190225-101046-crop-776x659.jpg) (https://ibb.co/R03DN99)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CyclingSid on February 25, 2019, 15:21:18
    I've just cycled through it.

    What a mess! If they did some resurfacing over the weekend they didn't stitch it to the original road level very well. The cycle/foot path through the new bridge, when they finish it, is going to require you to then use a pedestrian/cycle crossing to get to the other side of the road to go under the next bridge. Why can RBC never think anything through?

    On the subject of the buses, where are they going to go to and from? On the basis that Reading Buses/Council have always opposed cross town routes, apart from the 17, I can't see any great demand going from Caversham to Tilehurst. I expect a service will run for a year, be gradually downgraded to single then midi bus before it disappears. I will be delighted to be proved wrong.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: lbraine on February 26, 2019, 21:41:22
    Just a couple of comments about Cow Lane -

    1. The north side road surface is incomplete - means there are still some lumps and bumps - but to smooth out access to Reading Depot would have to be closed off, and GWR asked for that not to happen. Unsure at this stage when this work will take place, as the depot is pretty much a 24x7x365 operation, right ?

    2. With regard to cycle way access - Yes you have to cross Cow Lane, presumably at the new crossing provided - but to link the dedicated pedestrian/cycle underpass to the national cycle network (on Portman Rd/Oxford Rd) you have to cross from the town side to country side somewhere ! A bit harsh to blame RBC when they are just connecting up the dots.

    3. The new road and underpass will take a double decker bus - although no routes currently go this way, as has been pointed out. In fact, Reading Buses are looking into reinstating the 16A route from Purly-on-Thames to Reading station. Those with longer memories than I will remember previous peak hour express 16A buses diverted along the Oxford Rd (skipping most of Tilehurst) to provide express services to Reading. But, once past the Norcot roundabout these buses ground to a halt along the eastern section of Oxford Rd (highly built up single lane residential area). The reinstated route will ‘zip’ along Portman’s Rd and Cow Lane to Reading Station, avoid current traffic bottlenecks. Also, the minibus route 42 to Rivermead Lesuire Complex (at the north end of Cow Lane) May also be routed through the new underpass.

    It’s been 8 years coming - let’s not write the new underpasses off quite so early on in their life’s .....


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on February 27, 2019, 11:20:00
    Quote
    Those with longer memories than I will remember previous peak hour express 16A buses diverted along the Oxford Rd (skipping most of Tilehurst) to provide express services to Reading. But, once past the Norcot roundabout these buses ground to a halt along the eastern section of Oxford Rd (highly built up single lane residential area).

    Those with an even longer memory will remember the unique number 19, joint Reading Corporation/Thames Valley route from Long Lane Tilehurst (border of Purley) to the town centre which had a similar calling pattern, and problems with traffic in Oxford Road, not helped when trolley bus poles came adrift form overhead wires!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Reading General on February 27, 2019, 22:28:50
    As someone who has recently worked for Reading Transport I can clarify that it is the company not the council who dislike cross town routes, although the councils poor road planning in the town centre makes some potential cross town routes difficult. Reading Buses find it necessary to attempt to have every route pass near the rail station which just isn't possible without time consuming doubling back on cross town routes. Interchange is great to have, but since the removal of the through route across the front of the rail station and terminal area by RBC, this is no longer possible and space in the town centre for terminating radial route buses is beyond it's peak. The current institution like 17 travelling westbound misses the station and if this route can be the busiest in town missing this I don't see why others can't. So other cross town routes, particularly for the more frequent roads, should still work. If there is one thing I've learnt after nearly two decades driving buses around the town it's that the vast majority of inbound passengers want to go to the town centre and not the rail station.

    Anyhow, I envisage that the council will persuade Reading Transport to run some sort of route along through there, not because it's needed, simply because you can. There is the definite possibility of the contract route from Rivermead being extended, but from there to where i'm not sure. Even if there was a new Purley route via Rivermead from town I can't see it ever requiring double deck buses, the current demand simply isn't there and the Oxford Road is a large traffic generator in itself. For potential passengers travelling between north and west and vice versa any route wouldn't be that useful as it would stop short of Caversham precinct. The only way I could see a route through there working is if it was part of a large circular taking in other parts of west Reading or Tilehurst, crossing Caversham Bridge and back over Reading Bridge, again it wouldn't require double deck vehicles unless it became really popular.
    However, with Cow Lane open, the routes to the west of town should become slightly quicker and more reliable with more regular traffic moving off the Oxford Road and this should be the opportunity to make the corridor free flowing with one or two stops perhaps removed, the distances between stops evened out and allowing for traffic to overtake loading buses again, which, in turn, will help other buses move along the road quicker. I am aware of council plans to change the layout at Norcot Junction with an outbound bus lane and repositioning of the stops out of the traffic flow, whether this will happen or not i'm not sure.

    Cheers


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on March 10, 2019, 09:03:09
    Been away from the forum for a couple of weeks, must have been all the excitement of the bridge opening! I'm lucky enough to not usually have to cycle over the bumpy bit outside the depot as part of the road surface joining with Cardiff Road is smooth, but it is a shame it couldn't be a little neater at least temporarily. I note that Cow Lane is to be closed on the weekend of 13-14th April, so possibly it can be worked on then?

    As has been mentioned about buses, no I do not see a viable route through the bridge and the '17' was just a showpiece to see what could go through the bridge. RB themselves have admitted they have no plans for a route but will see what the future holds. They will soon be building the secondary school on Richfield Avenue and possibly the odd school bus may use it.

    For the record though it was being used by double deck buses yesterday, those running empty to/from the bus depot what with the Oxford Road being closed at Reading West Station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on March 10, 2019, 09:24:12
    In the late 1980s Reading Transport did buy some minibuses specially to work a service linking the Portman Road Industrial estate via Cow Lane to Caversham Road and the Railway Station.

    I can't remember how long it lasted or even the route number now but it didn't run for more than a couple of years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Reading General on March 10, 2019, 20:29:38
    I think it was a number 27, started running from Tilehurst but later turned at Norcot Junction. I think it ran down Beresford Road and through the bus link there. My sister used to catch it to work at Rivermead and she was frequently the only person on it, until it disappeared during a timetable change.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on April 07, 2019, 22:43:33
    Been away from the forum for a couple of weeks, must have been all the excitement of the bridge opening! I'm lucky enough to not usually have to cycle over the bumpy bit outside the depot as part of the road surface joining with Cardiff Road is smooth, but it is a shame it couldn't be a little neater at least temporarily. I note that Cow Lane is to be closed on the weekend of 13-14th April, so possibly it can be worked on then?

    From Railadvent (https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2019/04/new-reading-bridge-upgrade-to-benefit-pedestrians-and-cycle.html):
    Quote
    Network Rail has announced that a new pedestrian and cycle route will open in Reading later this month after two railway bridges were upgraded to create more space for a new cycle path and footpath.

    On Monday 15 April the new route will be opened at Cow Lane following the opening of a wider road, this allows for double decker buses and lorries to use the road for the first time.

    The opening of dedicated new pedestrian and cycle facilities under the new bridges marks the completion of the Cow Lane project. The project, of which, is being completed by Network Rail and Reading Borough Council.

    Before the new facilities can open, a three-day full road closure is required to resurface the new cycle and pedestrian facilities as well as finishing off the resurfacing of the road.

    Cow Lane will be closed to all vehicles, pedestrians and cyclists from 8pm on Friday 12 April until 6am on Monday 15 April. Closure and diversion signs will be in place.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on April 17, 2019, 19:48:07
    From the Reading Chronicle (https://www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/17576986.readings-cow-lane-upgrades-completed-with-pedestrian-and-cycle-routes/)

    Quote
    A NEW pedestrian and cycle route has opened in Reading after two railway bridges were upgraded to create more space.

    On Monday, April 15, the new routes at Cow Lane opened following the creation of the new wider road, which allows for double decker buses and lorries to use the road for the first time, removing one of the town's most notorious bottlenecks.

    The opening of new pedestrian and cycle facilities under the new bridges marks the completion of the Cow Lane project, which is being delivered by Network Rail and Reading Borough Council.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on August 11, 2019, 06:18:47
    Flood warning signs were installed on the approaches to Cow Lane at the beginning of last week

    (https://i.ibb.co/LxZDgyF/20190811-055541.jpg) (https://ibb.co/F5DkY1r)

    Comment from GetReading suggests that there was a foot of water at the bottom during Friday afternoons downpour - unsure of the accuracy of said comment but I passed through an hour or so later and almost no standing water remained, it was certainly a good test for the pumps and appears they passed


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 24, 2019, 10:26:56
    Oops, lots of flooding through Cow Lane Bridge this morning, certainly does not cope with heavy downpours. Cars either not going through, with some risking it failing due to water in the engine.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on September 24, 2019, 11:16:23

    Modern cars can have their air intake ducted from low down at the front, not through a carburettor and air filter above the engine. This means that a mere 12"/305mm of water can drown and write off a car, breaking an engine connecting rod.

    Be warned.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Thatcham Crossing on September 24, 2019, 16:29:42
    Quote
    This means that a mere 12"/305mm of water can drown and write off a car

    Happened to someone I know a few years back. Was proceeding slowly/gingerly through a flood (probably less than 12"). Bow-wave created by large 4x4 coming the other way goes through the front of his car - written off  :o


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on September 24, 2019, 22:48:21
    Quote
    Oops, lots of flooding through Cow Lane Bridge this morning, certainly does not cope with heavy downpours. Cars either not going through, with some risking it failing due to water in the engine.

    How long did this last for? Does anyone know? I thought one of the reasons the work took so long was that they struggled to get the answer to this problem

    Quote
    Posted by: onthecushions
    Insert Quote

    Modern cars can have their air intake ducted from low down at the front, not through a carburettor and air filter above the engine. This means that a mere 12"/305mm of water can drown and write off a car, breaking an engine connecting rod.

    Be warned.

    Yes - even some 4x4 models from manufacturers who do not specialise in such vehicles. "Proper" 4x4s like Land Rovers and Jeeps have their air intakes positioned to give them a much deeper safe wading depth.

    One of our near neighbours discovered this to his cost during the flooding early in 2014. Our combined drive floods in extreme conditions, and we had over a foot across it. He thought it would be fun to charge through in his (company) BMW X3. The inevitable happened - water into intake, compressed in the block, engine wrecked. To make matters worse for his dignity, not only did he have to paddle to get to dry land, but he put the transmission into Park from which it would not budge, so it had the indignity of having to be towed out with all 4 wheels locked by another neighbour's Jeep!   



    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Adelante_CCT on September 25, 2019, 06:19:42
    Quote
    How long did this last for? Does anyone know?

    I passed through at 05:30 and all was fine, by 07:00 the water was extremely high with some avoiding and others taking the risk. Reports suggest that the road was closed from 08:45 until 09:30, by which time the levels were low enough to reopen the road, albeit via a single lane contra flow due to a few cars having broken down either under the bridge or at the top of the hill.

    A customer of mine passed through around 10:15 and said it had all cleared. I went through again at 14:45 and men were still on standby just in case.

    It has been reported that the (new) pumps had failed and that the warning system for such an event had also failed  ::)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: patch38 on September 25, 2019, 10:10:31
    "Proper" 4x4s like Land Rovers and Jeeps have their air intakes positioned to give them a much deeper safe wading depth.


    You still need to know how to drive through standing water though, even in a 4x4. Stopping to assess the flood for depth and obstructions is what most people fail to do and then driving through at a speed high enough to maintain the bow-wave. If you are really serious about wading, a raised air intake (RAI) or 'snorkel' is the order of the day - that way the water will be over your head before it gets into the engine!

    Taking the 'I've got a 4x4' attitude of just turning up and driving blindly into a flood is every bit as likely to end in misery in a Jeep or LR as it is in an 'ordinary' vehicle, as the X3 story above proves.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Reading General on September 25, 2019, 10:21:40
    Driving through a Ford was something my dad insisted I experience when I first learnt  as well as driving in the snow. Off we went to Bucklebury after I had passed my test to find out. That was the early 90’s, I doubt Bucklebury Ford ever gets over a couple of inches anymore.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on September 25, 2019, 10:36:21
    I doubt Bucklebury Ford ever gets over a couple of inches anymore.

    I doubt it does but it does suffer from 4X4s who enter the ford and then turn left or right to follow the stream.  Something which has exercised the Parish Council over the years.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 25, 2019, 13:05:43
    Talking of fords, who else is amused by the road signs which say "Ford: road liable to flooding"? And even better, one I've seen in Warwickshire, "Ford: impassable at all times".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on September 25, 2019, 14:05:39
    Quote
    You still need to know how to drive through standing water though, even in a 4x4. Stopping to assess the flood for depth and obstructions is what most people fail to do and then driving through at a speed high enough to maintain the bow-wave. If you are really serious about wading, a raised air intake (RAI) or 'snorkel' is the order of the day - that way the water will be over your head before it gets into the engine!

    Taking the 'I've got a 4x4' attitude of just turning up and driving blindly into a flood is every bit as likely to end in misery in a Jeep or LR as it is in an 'ordinary' vehicle, as the X3 story above proves.

    Happy to endorse that - there's a picture in our living room of me in my now very elderly Discovery doing just that in the 2003 floods  that featured in the Goring Gap News at the time. For a demonstration of how to do it, see the following-

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypuHsPse9Zc

    in which Adrian Lawson drives his Defender through the floods around the south of Theale Gravel Pits during the 2014 floods.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CyclingSid on September 26, 2019, 07:10:57
    Probably better than on his bike!


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on November 09, 2019, 11:50:00
    Getting this thread back on subject, I am pleased to report (at last) some improvement to the destination/information signage.

    The electronic board by the town entrance was replaced this week with a new one with white lettering, two panels of departures in chronological order that manage together to give nearly an hours worth of train information, and three panels of destination by destination information. Better still, each line of information shows platform number, timetabled departure and estimated time continuously (not alternating), and when a train departs the information whizzes off to the side in a rather fetching manner and the information below moves up without any great blank gaps in the display. A (very poor with the phone which doesn't do it justice) snap attached.

    Now lets roll out signage of this standard throughout the station and finish the job properly!   


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on November 09, 2019, 12:05:25
    Getting this thread back on subject, I am pleased to report (at last) some improvement to the destination/information signage.

    The electronic board by the town entrance was replaced this week with a new one with white lettering, two panels of departures in chronological order that manage together to give nearly an hours worth of train information, and three panels of destination by destination information. Better still, each line of information shows platform number, timetabled departure and estimated time continuously (not alternating), and when a train departs the information whizzes off to the side in a rather fetching manner and the information below moves up without any great blank gaps in the display. A (very poor with the phone which doesn't do it justice) snap attached.

    Now lets roll out signage of this standard throughout the station and finish the job properly!   

    Yesterday afternoon, due to the line closure, each screen was also timesharing with a message about that. This involved each whole screenful whizing off sideways and the message whizzing in for a few seconds. Annoying for one screen, as the cycle time didn't allow long enough to find what you were looking for. With a bank of them doing it, apparently, asynchronously, it's rather distracting.

    I also find these new screens markedly less clear to read, due to the use of a minimal 7x5 matrix instead of the 9x7 (I think) previously. Not too bad for a canopy-dangler, but these ones are higher up and a lot of people will struggle to read them. So more useful information, but at a cost.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on November 10, 2019, 19:04:43
    Quote
    Yesterday afternoon, due to the line closure, each screen was also timesharing with a message about that. This involved each whole screenful whizing off sideways and the message whizzing in for a few seconds. Annoying for one screen, as the cycle time didn't allow long enough to find what you were looking for. With a bank of them doing it, apparently, asynchronously, it's rather distracting.

    I also find these new screens markedly less clear to read, due to the use of a minimal 7x5 matrix instead of the 9x7 (I think) previously. Not too bad for a canopy-dangler, but these ones are higher up and a lot of people will struggle to read them. So more useful information, but at a cost.

    Oh - not so keen on the emergency message system (although I've yet to see it in action, but understand the point you are making). However I recognise that there's a damned if you do, damned if you don't element to this. If there's not prominent notification of major problems there's bound to be complaints. Perhaps confining this to the middle screen might be preferable, but this immediately raises the issue - should those after destinations in the first third of the alphabet lose out when a major incident triggering such a message occurs?

    As to the legibility/pixel issue, I still have reasonably good distant vision, so didn't notice this. Is it a feature of what appears to be a new generation of "white" electronic signs? Stuving - do you also find this with the new platform signs at Wokingham?

    I still rate the new signs at Reading as a step forward, though. 


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Marlburian on January 29, 2020, 21:21:01
    I have various eyesight problems but find the new departures board at Reading Station easier to read.

    One minor grouse is that if I've left it a bit tight to catch a train at Reading and am not completely sure if mine is leaving from the usual platform, the signs on the deck by each set of stairs/escalators often seem to be displaying some sort of routine warning rather than confirming where the train waiting below is going. OK, it's only for a few moments, but when every second counts ...


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: FremlinsMan on March 01, 2020, 22:02:07
    An article in The Beauty of Transport, January 29: "UNBLOCKING THE BOTTLENECK (READING STATION, READING, UK)"
    https://thebeautyoftransport.com/2020/01/29/unblocking-the-bottleneck-reading-station-reading-uk/ (https://thebeautyoftransport.com/2020/01/29/unblocking-the-bottleneck-reading-station-reading-uk/)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on March 02, 2020, 00:06:29
    An article in The Beauty of Transport, January 29: "UNBLOCKING THE BOTTLENECK (READING STATION, READING, UK)"
    https://thebeautyoftransport.com/2020/01/29/unblocking-the-bottleneck-reading-station-reading-uk/ (https://thebeautyoftransport.com/2020/01/29/unblocking-the-bottleneck-reading-station-reading-uk/)

    Quote
    Curving steel columns raise the canopies over the footbridge while sculptural concrete ones support the footbridge itself and provide visual drama at platform level.

    Yes, well, but ... several of those adding comments to that blog have complained about the cold winds through the transfer deck - which is pretty much where I came into this forum. And on Saturday, waiting for a train (actually two of them) down on P10/11, I was thinking more about how cold and gloomy it was - almost as bad as Gatwick - not about "visual drama".


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Marlburian on March 02, 2020, 10:30:25
    I suspect that this may already have been discussed in this very long thread (and, as a newcomer I hope I may be forgiven for not ploughing through it), but was solar paneling every considered for that massive roof?

    I am impressed with the new station, but I too have experienced the cold winds blowing through it. I'm not at all sure how this could have been prevented.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: SandTEngineer on March 02, 2020, 12:05:54
    I am impressed with the new station, but I too have experienced the cold winds blowing through it. I'm not at all sure how this could have been prevented.

    In my over 50 years of using Reading (General) station, I don't think that has ever changed.  It was always a drafty and cold place :P


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Reading General on March 02, 2020, 14:35:29
    Reading (General) station

     ;D
    Can someone change the thread title to the correct station title for the older generation?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on March 02, 2020, 15:38:08
    AIUI the ‘transfer deck’ is reasonably open in order to stop it being treated as an enclosed building with respect to ventilation, fire fighting arrangements, smoke clearance, emergency exits, etc etc.

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on March 02, 2020, 21:39:52
    By coincidence I used Utrecht Station (as a passenger) for the first time last week.

    The last time I was there was in 2004, when I walked under the station using a public subway. I could not see what was above, but could see from the subway that I was passing under a reasonably modern 15 platform station, and thinking to myself "it would be nice if we had something like that in Reading".

    Well, I can confirm that we do now! Utrecht also has a structure over the middle of the station, a little wider than Reading's new overbridge, but the extensive platform ends are as exposed and draughty as Reading's. The escalators are also reminiscent of those at home. Two of those on my journey between trains were out of action, so I missed the connection I was going for. This was not however a problem for me last week as my onward destination was Amsterdam, and there appears to be a train about every 10 minutes between the two.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: CyclingSid on March 03, 2020, 07:15:31
    About the only place draftier than Reading station is the bus stop outside where you catch the bus to the hospital.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on March 03, 2020, 11:42:31
    As 2/3 of our weather traditionally comes from the South West, most main line  GWR stations must be windy. We could have wind breaks on platforms but either wouldn't see our train coming or would walk into the glass. There are plenty of warm spaces to hide from the weather on the main platforms.

    What we shouldn't have is a flooded transfer deck. While it must have ventilation louvres, they should have had droplet eliminators to prevent moisture entrainment.

    It's just a pity there wasn't more roofing particularly over the escalators, and an eastern footbridge; customer amenity wasn't top of the designers agenda.

    I still rather like it.

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 26, 2020, 10:06:21
    Noticed a new sight at Reading yesterday - as a transfer attached to a concrete block I am not sure you can describe it as a heritage sign - but there are a number around the station.

    (http://www.mbob.co.uk/rforum/rdgsign.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on July 26, 2020, 12:46:45
    Pity they couldn't use the right font - gill sans medium.

    Tacky.

    OTC

    https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/totem-br-w-reading-general-h-f-ex-gwr-station-padd-2009nov-0335.html


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: eightonedee on July 26, 2020, 15:29:46
    Agree OTC

    Will they put separate "Reading South 1949-1961, Reading Southern 1961-1965", on a malachite green background on Platforms 4 to 6?


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: bobm on July 26, 2020, 15:32:32
    I was wondering about that - but did not have time to walk down and look.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Marlburian on July 26, 2020, 16:30:37
    I wonder if the signage might confuse some people? Probably not, though back in the 1970s Head Office in London put some overseas visitors with limited English on the train at Paddington and, not being up to date with nomenclature,  told them to get off at Reading General, only for them to see only "Reading" signs. So they stayed on the train and ended up in Bristol. Lots of phone calls, and somehow they got on a train back.

    At much the same period I was building a GWR model railway and wanted to know the typeface for station name-boards and, as a press officer myself, rang a counterpart in, presumably, the British Rail (Western Region) press office. Somewhere I may still have the remnants of the Letraset sheet I used.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: onthecushions on July 26, 2020, 19:58:05
    Agree OTC

    Will they put separate "Reading South 1949-1961, Reading Southern 1961-1965", on a malachite green background on Platforms 4 to 6?

    https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/totem-br-s-ff-reading-southern-from-former-south-e-2019mar-0192.html

    The green totem cost twice the brown one.

    Electrification pays!

    OTC


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Sixty3Closure on July 26, 2020, 23:21:17
    Agree OTC

    Will they put separate "Reading South 1949-1961, Reading Southern 1961-1965", on a malachite green background on Platforms 4 to 6?

    https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/totem-br-s-ff-reading-southern-from-former-south-e-2019mar-0192.html

    The green totem cost twice the brown one.

    Electrification pays!

    OTC

    Interesting site. Has anyone used it? Do they publish estimates on the lots nearer the time? I'm not particularly across railway memorabilia and looking at the previous sales there's obviously a premium for certain objects or themes but I have no idea what the logic behind it is.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: grahame on August 18, 2020, 06:03:40
    I'm curious about the history of the General name. Not just in Reading but everywhere.

    How did it originate? Was it only used by GWR (and subsequent ex-GWR stations)? What was its meaning? Did it signify one station for goods and passengers as opposed to separate facilities? Or was it an equivalent of Central? When was it first and last used? Did it actually add any specific information to the place name?

    I have split this thread - the post above now has a life of its own in its own thread at http://www.passenger.chat/23913


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: paul7575 on August 18, 2020, 11:34:16

    Will they put separate "Reading South 1949-1961, Reading Southern 1961-1965", on a malachite green background on Platforms 4 to 6?

    I hope not, because I think it would be misleading.  As it was a physically separate site, and none of P4-P6 are on the footprint of the former Southern Station.   I reckon the demolished station and platforms were quite a bit further away than people remember.

    Perhaps they should put the label on a bus stop...  ;D

    Paul


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Marlburian on August 18, 2020, 12:17:42
    When I took the train into Reading on Thursday I popped into the new gents at the station (opposite M & S, which is closed at the moment). Quite impressive, with proper hand basins. Those old alcove thingies were always a bit hit-and-miss when it came to getting a splash of hot (?) water, a dollop of soap and a blast of hot air.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: stuving on August 18, 2020, 12:48:52

    Will they put separate "Reading South 1949-1961, Reading Southern 1961-1965", on a malachite green background on Platforms 4 to 6?

    I hope not, because I think it would be misleading.  As it was a physically separate site, and none of P4-P6 are on the footprint of the former Southern Station.   I reckon the demolished station and platforms were quite a bit further away than people remember.

    Perhaps they should put the label on a bus stop...  ;D

    Paul

    Obviously that depends on what you think ... but it was pretty much where Brunel Plaza is. Before platforms 4a and 4b were built there was room for a couple of sidings, then Reading Southern, then a couple more sidings and an embankment down to Blagrave Road (now Forbury Road). The station had to be at about the same height as now, since the bridge over Vastern Road could hardly be much lower than today's.

    Reading Museum has quite a few pictures (http://collections.readingmuseum.org.uk/index.asp?page=resulta&mwsquery=({search}=*{reading%20southern})&filename=REDMG&hitsStart=1); obviously what you get depends on what you search for, somewhat arbitrarily. This example is relevant, and does come up in a search for "Reading Southern", but there are more that don't. Plus there are views in disused-stations (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/r/reading_southern/index2.shtml), and on readingpast (http://readingpast.com/images/reading/Reading%20Railway/Reading_South_Station_1961.jpg).
    (http://collections.readingmuseum.org.uk/images/s1008031.jpg)


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: BBM on August 18, 2020, 16:31:21
    The National Library of Scotland's Online Map Collection includes an Ordnance Survey 6" to the mile map of Reading revised in 1938 and published in 1947 at this link:

    https://maps.nls.uk/view/97792042 (https://maps.nls.uk/view/97792042)

    The map mostly covers the south and east of the town but it's possible to zoon in towards the top left-hand corner and clearly see the location of the former Southern station.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Oxonhutch on August 19, 2020, 08:27:52
    This link (https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17.96333333333333&lat=51.45886&lon=-0.97167&layers=168&b=4) from the same NLS site is georeferenced with today's buildings and road layouts. Simply drag the 'Change Transparency of Overlay' button left or right.


    Title: Re: Reading Station improvements
    Post by: Marlburian on August 25, 2020, 08:07:57
    "Reading station car park could 'collapse' because of small crop of potatoes." (https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/reading-station-car-park-damage-18821041)

    Network Rail certainly has a point about the buddleia . I've noticed quite a few growing of retaining walls on cuttings, bridges etc.



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