Great Western Coffee Shop

With winter fast approaching, and depending on which forecast you chose to believe possibly a bad one, i thought it may be good to set up a thread for people to share past travel experiences/questions ... and for any budding forecasters predictions?

There will be no improvement in the TOCs abilities to run trains at the first fall of snow

Two reasons - drivers & guards, like commuters, don't live close to their depot anymore. But they have to drive usually.

Secondly, peolple have forgotten or never learned properly, how to drive on snow-covered roads...so they can't get very far.

Although if we start getting snow annually, the second reason should disappear as peole do work out its a diffrent way in the snow.

couldn't agree more on the standard of driving! i have to admit i have had more practice than most in my previous job

(http://www.flickr.com/photos/relex109/5280054846/in/photostream)
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5169/5280054846_c2dd34fe66_b.jpg)

(and before nailsea comments for some reason im a very good snow and ice driver  ;D)

i found that around here the efforts to treat the roads were frankly quite pitiful ! we were parked up when a gritter/plough passed by and hardly any grit was deposited... infact it was mixed with sand and not much of that! and all the plough did was turn it into an ski slope!

that being said im not looking forward to braving it in my rear wheel drive automatic car this year !

the main problems tend to be staff and passengers getting to the stations then?

In quite a few automatics these days you can at least force it to a specific gear.

you can in mine... i guess the last few years i had the added bonus of knowing that if i damaged the van it wasnt mine  ;D

RWD and snow dont go together regardless of gear box. I've a 3 series and last winter i tried and ended up sliding out at the first corner i tried. I then ended up driving everywhere in the mrs's vectra. I'm bidding on a Vitara on Ebay at the minute, MOT till March next year, so will do the winter, not much more than scrap value at the moment neither!!!

I agree that it's a big issue, but in the last couple of heavy snowfalls that have practically paralysed the network, at a few FGW depots drivers/guards were available, and more trains could have operated had the track conditions been better.  Nowhere near as many trains need to run, as there's far less passengers, so efforts by NR to keep more routes open (particularly on the Southern network) could lead to at least a partial improvement in my opinion.

Anyway, I think it's quite possible we'll have a run of milder winters and everyone will forget about how bad it was the last couple of years.

I know from personal experience that FGW makes huge efforts to keep running in winter weather. Stations are primed to keep car parks open and platforms and walkways safe. Since last year, company vans at stations have been replaced by 4WDs, so staff can get out to unmanned stations.

Yes, staff will struggle to get in, but many do, and far more pro rata than passengers!

Don't expect the unreasonable - it takes time to clear/treat all stations. But I have no doubt the will (and the means) is there to make it happen.

I tend to agree with Industry Insider that we may be due for a milder winter.

Usually when we get a long term forecast of severe winters or blazing hot summers they seem to be wrong.

Wasn't some of the trouble last year that the snow came before Christmas and wasn't forecast much time before hand.

But I do agree a lot of the problems with the railways in snow is that, as has been said, a large number of train and station staff drive relatively long distances to work.

I was on the Southrn in 1963 and I seem to recall that once the intial fall had been cleared the railway ran reasonably well although It was rumoured that when they dug up the reserve coal stocks at Nine Elms and Feltham they were mostly half house bricks, but the Merchants still steamed.

We also needed 28 COR (7 4CORs or Nelsons) on Haslemere bank to clear the conductor rails.

FGW did indeed cope better with last winters bad weather than many other TOCs.
Probably because most of their trains are old and/or diesel.

Electric trains are vulnerable to bad weather, conductor rail powered trains more vulnerable still, and generally the newer the train, the worse it performs in snow.

I am old enough to remember the slam door third rail EMUs, these coped fairly well in snowy weather, and in really bad conditions could be assisted by a steam or diesel locomotive.

Then came class 455s for Waterloo suburban services, these seemed less reliable and frequently suffered from frozen sliding door mechanisms.

Some years later, slam door units on Blackfriars suburban services were replaced by class 319s, theses were so bad in snow that services were withdrawn if snow was even forecast, with customers advised not to travel.

We then suffered another modernisation in south east London when the networkers came into use, and performed very poorly in snow or ice, with customers again advised against travel. (last winter, just to make certain that no one could get to work, they stopped all the buses as well !)

I cant imagine FGW or their replacement, coping very well in snow when 40 year old HSTs are replaced by modern EMUs.

Without wishing to bang any drums, FGW staff, perhaps having benefited from the PCF Customer Service Programme, also displayed a much more visible 'can do' attitude last winter.  I travelled home from the 'frozen north' via a number of other TOC services and although naturally biased, I found that FGW came out way ahead.

I've seen photographic evidence of your handiwork in reconfiguring the bodywork of various Ford vans, mind!  ;) :D ;D

ahh the ford wasnt my fault! ... its vauxhalls i tend to trash  ;D

Excellent blog by the Met office in response to some of the stupid 'artic weather is coming' stories that have appeared in the media recently about the forthcoming winter:
http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2011/10/12/met-office-in-the-media-there-is-no-need-for-alarmism/

Why is councils stocking up on grit such a story? That is what they are expected to do before the start of winter and be more prepared if they have learned lessons from the previous winter by getting in extra stocks if it was felt there wasn't enough to cope with a major snowfall. It's got nothing to do with them having inside information on the forthcoming winter being a severe one. Let's be honest, who really knows?

pftt after last year im not trusting the met office !

got snowed in the yard because the snow would turn to rain past plymouth !.... apparently

Weather has never been the same since the Met Office moved from Bracknell to Exeter.... ;D

my thoughts exactly.... haha

must be something in the water down here

i blame devon for my rapid deterioration in linguistic skills since moving here

From The Book of Heroic Failures. Stephen Pile ISBN 0-7088-1908-7.


 ;D

I remember reading once about the highest windspeed recorded in the UK.  It ended with a footnote saying "it might have been higher but the wind gauge blew away".  Can't find a reference to it at the moment though.

Sure thing the met office get it wrong. My main reason for posting a link to their recent blog was trying to bring some reason to some of the silly winter weather related stories that have been doing the rounds lately. Gosh who would have thought snow on the hills of Scotland and night time frosts with the temperature 'plummeting down' to -1 in October? It's called Autumn!

PS For what it's worth, I do think we will see some snow in the South again this winter, when? I have no idea. Somewhere between December and March. How's that for a winter forecast? Not much more accurate than some of the domesday weather articles that have been appearing in some newspapers of late.

Can I just say that the thermometer I saw on the side of Roys of Wroxham (http://www.roys.co.uk/storefinder-wroxham.html) on Sat 01/10/2011 was registering 29.8^C.

Scorchio!

i can put out me own forecast but word it slightly differently, it will snow somewhere in the uk this winter, it will be cold somewhere in the uk this winter, at least one gritter will be depleted of its stock probably due to cut backs

Well I witnessed my first grit of the season at AML tonight - saw man in orange suit spreading white salty grit on the platforms/overbridge as I came in from Paddington.

Perhaps a little over cautious? we're only set to dip to around 4C tonight but with clear skies according to Met Office - no snow or icy patches have been witnessed thus far here in London this season, though it might be a tad frosty in the morning.

I don't know who sent him out to grit, but IMO it seemed a little wasteful.

Better safe than sorry!

Indeed - essential safety preparation for the winter: make sure the salt bin opens; make sure the shovel works ...  ;)

Returning home tonight I was greeted by an iced up windscreen and not just a little frost thick ice and doors were iced shut... I say again... Good old met office!

Al least this winter relex, there should be less chance of you having various meetings with roadside ditches.  :P ;) ;D

Actually I was thinking of heading up exmoor for some winter photography

Should we forewarn the AA or RAC?  ;) ;D

I think it will be minehead garage again .... They have me on speed dial lol

Snow may be on the way for much of FGW land tomorrow morning...

Great just when we have enough problems in south wales thanks to that lightening strike yesterday.

I normally love it when we have snow I just hope we can get the signallng equipment between Bridgend & Cardiff back online within the next couple of hours.

I do know the weather  north of Merthyr Tydfil is supposed to be terrible tommorow morning.

Looks like i'm a bit stuffed whichever route I choose tomorrow, between Southampton and Bristol.

The other day when that map was posted a typed a message saying its from the met so I doubt it's accurate... Then decided not to post it......