Great Western Coffee Shop

All across the Great Western territory => Buses and other ways to travel => Topic started by: Bob_Blakey on November 09, 2011, 08:05:27 pm



Title: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Bob_Blakey on November 09, 2011, 08:05:27 pm
...it is according to Fly(May)be.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/nov/09/flybe-says-domestic-air-boom-is-over?CMP=twt_fd (http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/nov/09/flybe-says-domestic-air-boom-is-over?CMP=twt_fd)


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: LiskeardRich on November 10, 2011, 02:03:31 am
Although they have opened up new routes from newquay since the demise of air southwestx


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: woody on November 12, 2011, 08:16:30 am
 A group is planning own airline to save Plymouth airport.http://www.thisisplymouth.co.uk/Group-planning-airline-save-Plymouth-airport/story-13828289-detail/story.html
A group set up to fight for the future of Plymouth City Airport is working on plans to set up its own airline and is considering seeking a judicial review of a council decision to allow it to close.
 "Viable" believes the airport can make money and is hoping to re-establish air links between Plymouth and key destinations like London, Glasgow and Manchester by summer 2012.
 Looks like a niche operation for business only to me even if it does succeed.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ChrisB on November 12, 2011, 07:11:53 pm
Be interesting to see if they've got the clout to get CAA approval


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: broadgage on November 17, 2011, 09:24:57 am
Whilst new air routes will no doubt open, I would expect that overall air travell will decline.
It needs a great deal of increasingly expensive oil derived fuel.
Electric trains need no oil fuel, and diesel ones use much less per passenger mile than aircraft.

There is growing evidence that crude oil production has already reached a peak, and is declining. Peak oil=peak air transport.
Even those who do not accept that oil production has peaked, tend to accept that it soon will.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Bob_Blakey on January 11, 2012, 06:55:11 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16490765 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16490765)

'Based on latest sales trends, we believe that challenging market conditions will continue for the rest of the financial year," the company said. These conditions "will force" rationalisation of the European short-haul airline market, something it was well positioned to benefit from, it added.'

Flybe evidently believe that one (or more?) of their competitors is headed for 'Carey Street'.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on November 11, 2013, 09:56:57 pm
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24895428):

Quote
Flybe to cut 500 jobs despite return to profit

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/71036000/jpg/_71036617_71036615.jpg)
FlyBe boss Saad Hammad: "We have excessive costs which we must deal with immediately"

Flybe, the Exeter-based airline, has announced plans to cut 500 jobs across the business, despite reporting a return to profit. Pre-tax profits were ^13.8m for the six months to 30 September, compared with a loss of ^1.6m a year earlier.

The company said its turnaround plan was on track to make ^40m of savings this year and ^45m in 2014-15. But the pilot's union, Balpa, said it was "shocked" by the decision to cut jobs. Flybe employs 2,700 staff.

Flybe has been carrying out cost-cutting measures, but chief executive Saad Hammad, who joined the company in August, said more were now needed. "It was clear to me that the existing Phase 1 and 2 cost savings were necessary but we simply needed to do more and to do it immediately," he said in a statement.

Mr Hammad told the BBC he could not say where the latest job losses would fall at this stage. "We're consulting with unions and our staff," he said.

Flybe cut 490 jobs in 2012-13, with a further 100 going in the first half of 2013-14. As part of the cost-cutting programme some routes could "possibly" go, Mr Hammad said. "These are challenging times," he added.

Group revenues rose to ^351.1m in the six months, up from ^340.8m in the same period last year. The carrier now has 96 aircraft in its fleet, with 28 belonging to Flybe Finland, its joint venture with Finnish Air.

Passenger numbers increased 5.6% to 4.3 million in the first half of the year.

Investors welcomed Flybe's decision to carry out additional cost cuts, sending its shares up by 40.5% to 95.75p.

Quote
Analysis

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/57942000/jpg/_57942487_richardwestcott.jpg)
Richard Westcott
BBC transport correspondent

No airline is finding it easy at the moment. They rarely do. Even the all-conquering Ryanair has announced two profit warnings in two months and pledged to be nicer to its customers.

But Flybe is different to all those big companies. It runs smaller aircraft and doesn't fill them up as much, making it harder to turn a profit. Plus, 74.3% of its flights are domestic, meaning that it often pays two lots of Air Passenger Duty, because you pay every time you take off from a UK airport. A flight abroad only pays once.

John Strickland, director of JLS consulting, told me that Flybe's future relies on making their own regional model work, competing with the trains for example, rather than going head-to-head with the big low-cost airlines. And step one is to start selling more seats on each aeroplane.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 11, 2013, 10:46:34 pm
Regretably, Flybe are in big trouble. The likes of Ryanair and Easyjet can make low-cost operations work because they have massive bases - Easyjet now have over 60 aircraft based at Gatwick and Ryanair over 40 at Stansted (round numbers). With that kind of critical mass, you can make the most of aircraft and pilot resources.

Flybe's problem is that their biggest bases, Southampton, Birmingham and Manchester, are a fraction of this size (eg, 8/9 aircraft at Southampton) and many others a lot smaller with only a handful of aircraft.

With only a few aircraft, flying a few routes at fixed times per day, it's very difficult to get the most utilisation out of the aircraft and their pilots, which means unit costs are high, especially at the smaller bases - Jersey, Guernsey, the Isle of Man, Inverness and Exeter, which is the airline's Head Office are examples of this.

Trying to run those types of services with "low-cost" fares just does not work.

Rumours suggest that they will aim to survive by re-trenching to the main bases and sweating the assets at those locations.

I could go into much more detail, but this is a rail forum!




Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Lee on November 11, 2013, 11:17:48 pm
If John Strickland's track record with the air industry is as good as his track record with boy bands, then Flybe should be safe.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 12, 2013, 08:24:57 am
I do think Flybe will survive, but many of the more marginal regional destinations they serve, some on a very seasonal basis (Newquay being a great example*) may not.

As part of this, bases like Southampton may actually gain routes - an application has already been made to serve Frankfurt from there from next year, for example. There is also talk that they may press their Southampton fleet into nightime service on routes to Spain, Portugal and North Africa - this is what I meant by sweating the assets, which currently sit idle at Southampton between roughly 10pm and 6.30am (when the Airport is closed).

There is also talk that they are looking for another "London" Airport from which to operate the routes they will give up at Gatwick next March. An application to serve Guernsey from Luton has started tongues wagging that they may also consider Newquay from there (they already serve the Isle of Man and Jersey from Luton in Summer).

* for info, in addition to the Gatwick-Newquay "lifeline" service that Flybe will already give up at the end of March '14 (having raised ^20m in cash by selling their Gatwick slots to Easyjet), they currently also operate to Newquay from Manchester (year round, with reduced frequency in Winter), Edinburgh, Newcastle, Norwich and Belfast City - the latter 4 all being July-Sept (Summer hols) services, once a week.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: LiskeardRich on November 12, 2013, 09:12:00 am
I do think Flybe will survive, but many of the more marginal regional destinations they serve, some on a very seasonal basis (Newquay being a great example*) may not.

There is no "may not" about Newquay though. It has already been announced Flybe are ending all flights from Newquay in March 2014.
Unfortunately I don't think Newquay airport has a future, at least as a domestic airport. How long will Cornwall Council continue to plug the 3 million a year loss the airport is generating, whilst making such large cuts elsewhere.
There are a lot of people commenting on local media websites, how they are cutting bus service subsidies, but continue to subsidise Newquay airport so heavily, yet the bus services cuts are having a much more significant impact on Cornish people.
Cornwall council are also going to offer a subsidy to any airline that steps in to take over from Flybe on the London route, on top of the ^3 million a year losses they are plugging already at the airport.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 12, 2013, 10:35:11 am
Quote
There is no "may not" about Newquay though. It has already been announced Flybe are ending all flights from Newquay in March 2014.

Incorrect sir, please read the note at the end of my previous post above.

If you go to the Flybe website and look at the online timetable, you will see that NQY-LGW flights do indeed end at the end of March next year (the end of the winter season in aviation parlance). But, as of now, the others that I mentioned from MAN, EDI, NWI, BHD and NCL (sorry, quicker to use IATA codes!) are still scheduled to operate (and if they are in the timetable, that means they are on sale too)......whether those plans will change is another matter.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on November 12, 2013, 08:14:13 pm
As part of this, bases like Southampton may actually gain routes - an application has already been made to serve Frankfurt from there from next year, for example. There is also talk that they may press their Southampton fleet into nightime service on routes to Spain, Portugal and North Africa - this is what I meant by sweating the assets, which currently sit idle at Southampton between roughly 10pm and 6.30am

Ironically last week I flew from Southampton and on flybe (to Jersey) last week and I highly rate the facilities at the airport and the airline service. For purely selfish reasons I would like to see more services from Southampton as it about 40 minutes drive from me in a thatcham :)



Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 12, 2013, 10:01:33 pm
BB, I've used Flybe at Southampton quite a bit over the years, mostly for domestic and close European business trips, and would recommend it - if the route you need to fly is available from there.

Because of it's size and the closeness of Car Parks, I have been able to be in the car and on the way home (to Thatcham!) 10 minutes after stepping off the aircraft - try achieving that at Heathrow or Gatwick!

As you may have seen, it's good by train aswell, the Parkway Station is right across the access road from the Terminal.

The only other thing to say is that Southampton is *very* reliant on Flybe (who fly probably 90% of it's passengers), so it will live or die depending on the airline's fortunes and what it decides to do with it's ops there.   


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: devon_metro on November 12, 2013, 11:43:35 pm


The only other thing to say is that Southampton is *very* reliant on Flybe (who fly probably 90% of it's passengers), so it will live or die depending on the airline's fortunes and what it decides to do with it's ops there.   

I live close to the flight path for Southampton, not sure i've ever *not* seen a Flybe plane!


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 13, 2013, 08:47:23 am
Currently Eastern Airways (Aberdeen), Aurigny (Alderney) and Blue Islands (Jersey & Guernsey) are also operating daily (reduced at weekends) services, but I think that's it! Everything else is Flybe.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: rogerpatenall on November 13, 2013, 08:50:26 am
"I live close to the flight path for Southampton, not sure i've ever *not* seen a Flybe plane!"

Not even a little yellow Trislander?. . .


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 04, 2013, 11:55:57 pm
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-25221798):

Quote
Flybe cuts Cardiff Airport flights to Paris and Glasgow

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/71535000/jpg/_71535279_018087798-1.jpg)
Flybe recently announced plans to cut 500 UK jobs

Airline Flybe is to axe its flights from Cardiff to Paris and Glasgow.

Services to Paris Charles de Gaulle and Glasgow will be withdrawn from 19 January, and passengers will be offered alternative flights or refunds. However, the airline will still run planned flights to the two destinations for fans travelling to Six Nations rugby matches between 20-24 February.

Cardiff Airport said it was speaking to "a number of airlines" about running the Paris and Glasgow routes.

The announcement came as the company finalised its summer 2014 schedule, and confirmed it will keep three existing Cardiff services to Belfast City, Edinburgh and Jersey.

Paul Simmons, Flybe's chief commercial officer, said: "We have taken a long hard look at all the routes we fly from Cardiff to make sure they are what our customers really want and that they operate at the best possible times for everyone."

Cardiff airport chief executive Jon Horne said it was "unfortunate that the popular Cardiff to Glasgow and Paris routes will drop" from Flybe's schedule. He added: "We are already in discussion with a number of airlines regarding the opportunity to pick up the Glasgow and Paris routes, which currently handle 46,000 and 29,000 passengers respectively per annum. Our focus is on securing an alternative carrier as soon as possible in order to avoid any break in service. We will also continue to work closely with Flybe and explore with them other route opportunities from Cardiff as their restructuring process continues."

In November Flybe said some of its routes could "possibly" be scrapped after it announced plans to cut 500 jobs. Although it operates services from Cardiff, the Exeter-based airline does not have any staff based there.

In October it announced four new direct ski routes from Cardiff Airport to Geneva, Lyon, Chambray and Grenoble. The routes, running from December to April, marked the return of ski destination services at Cardiff after a three-year absence.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on January 03, 2015, 02:04:27 am
From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-30655967):

Quote
Four injured after plane blown off Stornoway runway

Four people have been injured after a plane came off the runway at Stornoway Airport on the Isle of Lewis.

The Loganair service was due to fly to Glasgow at about 08:30. It is thought it may have been caught in strong crosswinds.

Police Scotland said two men were taken to hospital and two women received minor injuries but declined medical assistance.

A full air accident investigation into the incident is under way.

There were 25 passengers and three crew members on board the aircraft.

After leaving the runway the plane came to rest on the grass next to it. The Scottish Fire and Rescue Service sent three appliances to the scene.

One passenger told the BBC it felt as if the tail was caught by a crosswind.

Murdo John MacAskill, who was on board, said: "The plane came down with a bump and we veered far off to the left. I looked out the window and I saw the grass coming up and I knew that there was something wrong so entered the brace position and that's when the plane crashed. We were evacuated from the plane within, I would say, under five minutes. Everyone was standing on the tarmac then and by that stage you had the fire service and the police there."

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80020000/jpg/_80020026_stornoway.jpg)

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80021000/jpg/_80021631_storn5.jpg)

A statement from the airport operators said: "An outbound Saab 340 aircraft operated by Loganair veered off the runway at Stornoway Airport at 8.33am this morning. Efforts to remove the aircraft from the runway are ongoing and investigations into the cause of the incident are under way. It is it our intention to resume normal operations as soon as the aircraft is safely removed from the runway. There are no scheduled arrivals or departures at Stornoway until later this afternoon."

A Police Scotland spokesman said: "As a result of the incident two male passengers received injuries and were taken to Stornoway Hospital for further assessment/medical treatment. Two female passengers received minor injuries and declined medical assistance. A full air accident investigation has now been launched and will be carried out by the AAIB in conjuction with Police Scotland."

A Loganair spokesman added: "All passengers and crew were safely evacuated and returned to the airport's terminal. Two passengers sustained what we understand are minor injuries and have gone to the local hospital. A full investigation is now under way to ascertain the cause of the incident and the Air Accident Investigation Branch has been notified."

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80024000/jpg/_80024173_storn3.jpg)

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/80024000/jpg/_80024174_storn2.jpg)



Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: bignosemac on January 03, 2015, 03:40:27 am
Whilst not wishing to make light of the incident I think this oft said mantra is apposite:

Any landing you can walk away from is a good one.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ChrisB on January 03, 2015, 08:45:13 am
Except that it was taking off in this instance


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: LiskeardRich on January 03, 2015, 09:40:19 am
Although a flybe aircraft it was on charter to Loganair at the time of this incident.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Brucey on January 03, 2015, 09:48:29 am
Although a flybe aircraft it was on charter to Loganair at the time of this incident.
The aircraft (registration G-LGNL) is owned by and operated by Loganair Ltd according the the CAA register.  There is a franchise agreement between Flybe and Loganair permitting Loganair to use Flybe's branding and also for the flights to be sold under the Flybe name.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on January 03, 2015, 10:20:19 am
Quite so, Brucey - and a commonplace arrangement in the airline world. The paint on the aeroplane, the ticket you buy and the Flight No. may be no indicator of the actual owner and/or operator of the aircraft.

Other examples in the UK:

The soon to be extinct Virgin Little Red - their A320's are in Virgin Atlantic colours, but are actually owned, operated and crewed by Aer Lingus (under a sub-contract).

Nearly all BA flights from London City Airport (except the Club Class only flights to New York) are operated by a Company called CityFlyer Express (under a long-standing franchise Agreement).

In other news, the new Flybe Exeter to London City service is to reduce from 3 daily rotations to 2 in February. The airline say they are adjusting the schedule to the demand...for me, any less than 2 rotations a day on a route like this makes it unviable, as the opportunity for day trips is lost.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Umberleigh on January 18, 2015, 11:07:07 am
Judging by Flybe's seat reservations in their online booking form, there are at present 57 passengers booked on tomorrow's early morning Exeter to London City flight, with 43 booked on the afternoon return flight (aircraft have total of 70-odd seats) so there's clearly a demand for a commuter-style service.

It would be very interesting to know where these passengers have travelled from, are people driving from Plymouth for example? And also how many might have used the train if no flights were available?


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Bob_Blakey on April 05, 2016, 09:17:50 am
Haven't seen this posted elsewhere.

As predicted by some contributors to this forum the Flybe Exeter <> London City service has, seemingly very quietly, been reduced to a single early morning EXT > LCY & early evening LCY > EXT schedule making a same day trip from London to Exeter impossible.

What odds on the service being withdrawn completely in the not too distant future?


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ChrisB on April 05, 2016, 11:50:02 am
Unsurprising frankly - why would *anyone* traipse all the way to LCY, go through security etc, fly & get from the airport to city centre when you can get hourly trains from PAD that drop you a hell of a lot closer to where you want to be without any hanging about?


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: BerkshireBugsy on April 05, 2016, 12:08:42 pm
Unsurprising frankly - why would *anyone* traipse all the way to LCY, go through security etc, fly & get from the airport to city centre when you can get hourly trains from PAD that drop you a hell of a lot closer to where you want to be without any hanging about?

I've had to go to central Glasgow a couple of times in the last month.

The first time I went I did the entire journey by train - from Thatcham to Glasgow via Euston. The journey was comfortable and on time but sooo long.

This last time I decided to fly from Gatwick for various reasons.

The train journey to Gatwick was fine but due to plane cancellations and delays I was 7 hours late arriving at Glasgow

So if I have to do this again I don't know which I would choose. I have flown from LCY before but to me there are more facilities at Gatwick and Heathrow is just too expensive.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ChrisB on April 05, 2016, 12:22:01 pm
My post was in relation to the one above referring to going to/from Exeter....


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on April 05, 2016, 12:29:26 pm
Quote
Unsurprising frankly - why would *anyone* traipse all the way to LCY, go through security etc, fly & get from the airport to city centre when you can get hourly trains from PAD that drop you a hell of a lot closer to where you want to be without any hanging about?

I have a work colleague (lives in Exmouth) who quite regularly uses the EXT-LCY for day trips, and it seems to work for him, and is often cheaper than the train. LCY is about 20mins by DLR/foot from our City Office.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ChrisB on April 05, 2016, 12:34:26 pm
For the very few heading that way, yes, it's better - but the OP was referring to London-Exeter return....


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: chrisr_75 on April 05, 2016, 04:15:48 pm
Quote
Unsurprising frankly - why would *anyone* traipse all the way to LCY, go through security etc, fly & get from the airport to city centre when you can get hourly trains from PAD that drop you a hell of a lot closer to where you want to be without any hanging about?

I have a work colleague (lives in Exmouth) who quite regularly uses the EXT-LCY for day trips, and it seems to work for him, and is often cheaper than the train. LCY is about 20mins by DLR/foot from our City Office.

And, of course, the flight guarantees you a seat for the duration of your journey...


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Umberleigh on November 23, 2018, 05:53:52 pm
[Mods - I couldnít find a newer thread...?]

So, Newquay to Gatwick has seen passenger numbers increase by 50% since government intervention several years ago, and will become in 2019 Newquay to Heathrow, with an additional daily flight (now four) and a return to the Dash 8 aircraft, This is being further supported by the Government and is hailed as a major boost to the Cornish economy:

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/heathrow-newquay-flights-flybe-taxpayers-subsidise-cornwall-airport-a8646691.html

This surely has to be making some sort of dent in GWRís passenger revenues from Cornwall?

However, Flybe, the airline which operates these flights, is now up for sale and so I guess the future of these flights is far from assured.

Furthermore, does anyone have any information regarding the future of the Exeter to London City route? Itís defied the naysayers, but hard to imagine it surviving the latest crisis.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: stuving on November 23, 2018, 05:57:57 pm
However, Flybe, the airline which operates these flights, is now up for sale and so I guess the future of these flights is far from assured.

Furthermore, does anyone have any information regarding the future of the Exeter to London City route? Itís defied the naysayers, but hard to imagine it surviving the latest crisis.

Several reports say the buyer will be Virgin (or some bit of it).


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 24, 2018, 09:38:52 am
If Virgin do take the plunge, it's a safe bet that the Flybe brand will disappear.

If they do, their primary interest will be to use them as a regional feed to their major long-haul hubs at Heathrow and Manchester (not so much Gatwick as it's mainly leisure flights on their "beach fleet" from there).

The hubs of Virgin's part-owners Air France/KLM at Paris (CDG) and Amsterdam respectively will also likely be a focus and Flybe already do a bit of this feeding from places like Birmingham, Southampton, Exeter and the main Scottish airports.

Aside from the above, one suspects operations will be paired-back to the high-frequency operations that they run out of their largest bases - Manchester, Birmingham, Southampton, Belfast City (they are the largest operator by a mile at those last 2) and possibly London City, Edinburgh and Glasgow.

Newquay to Gatwick and now Heathrow is a bit of a special case, as it's operated under a PSO (Public Service Obligation) which means government funding is in place should it be needed to sustain it as a route if required. Chatter on the aviation forums suggests it stands on its own two feet financially at the moment.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: TaplowGreen on November 24, 2018, 10:12:55 am

Newquay to Gatwick and now Heathrow is a bit of a special case, as it's operated under a PSO (Public Service Obligation) which means government funding is in place should it be needed to sustain it as a route if required. Chatter on the aviation forums suggests it stands on its own two feet financially at the moment.

It's a great shame that flights from Plymouth to London weren't similarly regarded as a special case.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: ellendune on November 24, 2018, 10:51:40 am
It's a great shame that flights from Plymouth to London weren't similarly regarded as a special case.

An interesting argument.  There is a relatively busy airport just outside Exeter, as well as Newquay.  If every City of that size had to have an airport regardless of its distance from the next one, then none of them would be viable - as - I suspect - was found with Plymouth.

There are arguments for government to subsidise some airport and services, but I think that if I had to choose between Newquay and Plymouth, I would have chosen to subsidise Newquay. 

For what it is worth I would suggest that for very large population centres (say conurbations of 2 million plus) then the volumes might be better served by improved rail services.  Subsidised air services should be reserved for remote locations with lower populations.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: didcotdean on November 24, 2018, 12:23:52 pm
Seen speculations that the real prize are Flybe's slots at Heathrow and the rest would be incidental.

However, Virgin already tried once to run domestic services from Heathrow with these same slots (and some more) obtained after bmi's takeover from BA as Little Red and they loaded poorly.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on November 24, 2018, 04:27:22 pm
Quote
I would have chosen to subsidise Newquay.

Indeed, Newquay is a much more capable airport operationally. Even the Embraer regional jet that currently plies between there and Gatwick would not be able to operate from Plymouth's runway.

Quote
Seen speculations that the real prize are Flybe's slots at Heathrow and the rest would be incidental.

I think you'll find that the slots that Flybe use to fly their current Aberdeen and Edinburgh services from Heathrow are what is known as "remedy slots" (from the BA takeover of bmi) and can only be used to a very small, specific list of destinations. They aren't Flybe's to sell, as I understand it.

Little Red used A320's leased from Aer Lingus, which were too much aircraft to compete with BA on those routes. The 78-seat Q400's that Flybe use are more suited (and only a few minutes slower than a pure jet on sectors of this length).


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: didcotdean on November 24, 2018, 04:59:16 pm

Quote
Seen speculations that the real prize are Flybe's slots at Heathrow and the rest would be incidental.

I think you'll find that the slots that Flybe use to fly their current Aberdeen and Edinburgh services from Heathrow are what is known as "remedy slots" (from the BA takeover of bmi) and can only be used to a very small, specific list of destinations. They aren't Flybe's to sell, as I understand it.

Little Red used A320's leased from Aer Lingus, which were too much aircraft to compete with BA on those routes. The 78-seat Q400's that Flybe use are more suited (and only a few minutes slower than a pure jet on sectors of this length).
Yes this was the point I was making, regarding the slot usage at any rate. The load Virgin Red were getting though were poor as the flight frequency was too low (and at the wrong time) to mop up all of connecting traffic into Virgin proper and not marketed that well either from scratch. Although things might be different now with the closer relationship with Delta, and what BE has already built up.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: RailCornwall on March 31, 2019, 07:25:24 pm
Newquay - Heathrow flights (re)started today.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/cornwall-newquay-airport-heathrow-flights-subsidised-flybe-planes-trains-a8847866.html


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: TaplowGreen on March 31, 2019, 09:51:10 pm
Newquay - Heathrow flights (re)started today.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/cornwall-newquay-airport-heathrow-flights-subsidised-flybe-planes-trains-a8847866.html

Incredibly good news for the region, especially for business.


Title: Re: Flybe (based at Exeter) and domestic air travel - ongoing discussion (merged topic)
Post by: Thatcham Crossing on March 31, 2019, 10:36:30 pm
Quote
Incredibly good news for the region, especially for business.

Indeed it is, but social media also suggests some not happy at loosing connectivity with the huge Easyjet European network and the BA and Virgin "beach fleets" at LGW.

One of those situations where you're not going to please everyone.




This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net