Full devolution of Wales rail franchise to Welsh Government?

[whole diary]

[anthony215]

Just read this news article on the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) Wales webpage:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-21676260

Seems the DFT^▸ (Department for Transport) officals are in discussions with the welsh government about fully devolving the current wales & borders franchise to the WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about).

[bobg]

And what about 'borders' part of the franchise area?
A lot of my family live in Herefordshire and have no choice at all on the make-up of the Welsh Assembly and would definitely be affected by decisions made.

[TonyK]

And what about 'borders' part of the franchise area?

I'm sure questions about the operation of cross-border trains will form a significant part of negotiations and planning. A fair part of the local rail traffic around Bristol starts life in Wales - like the Cardiff to Portsmouth, which provides several services between Filton Abbey Wood and Temple Meads, as only one example among many. The WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) will be able to dictate service levels within Wales, something I think will be done with great enthusiasm. I'm sure WAG will want to see fast and frequent intercity services too, so it won't be likely to cause us Saeson much problem. So long, that is, as the infrastructure isn't forgotten.

[ellendune]

And what about 'borders' part of the franchise area?

I'm sure questions about the operation of cross-border trains will form a significant part of negotiations and planning. A fair part of the local rail traffic around Bristol starts life in Wales - like the Cardiff to Portsmouth, which provides several services between Filton Abbey Wood and Temple Meads, as only one example among many. The WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) will be able to dictate service levels within Wales, something I think will be done with great enthusiasm. I'm sure WAG will want to see fast and frequent intercity services too, so it won't be likely to cause us Saeson much problem. So long, that is, as the infrastructure isn't forgotten.

But Cardiff Portsmouth is provided by FGW^▸ (First Great Western) not ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) so presumably won't be devolved.  Surely is is the ATW services like Measteg to Cheltenham or Cardiff to Hereford and Shrewsbury that are the issue.

[swrural]

Surely the devolution issue is who picks up the subsidy tab, not who is given the franchise?

[John R]

bobg's point is that passengers in the Borders only have ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)))'s services - say from Hereford to Shrewsbury. It would seem to be an anomaly that control of such a service was completely devolved to the Welsh Assembly without the DaFT^» (Department for Transport - critical sounding abbreviation I discourage - about) retaining some degree of control.

Another good example are the services from mid and north Wales via Shrewsbury to Birmingham International. The WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) could decide to run services no further east than Shrewsbury and use the units elsewhere. Some safeguard would have to exist that committed ATW to provide that service or lose the units.

[TonyK]

Again, I don't think the WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) would ever dream of pulling up the drawbridge. What they would want would be good connections to major areas of interest in England, with connections onwards to the rest of the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) (OK, Scotland) and Europe. At the same time, they would want free rein so far as local services are concerned. The franchise holder would also not be the major issue - that is something up for grabs again soon in any case. The interesting bit will be how franchises are drafted for the cross-border services. If UK government have the final say, WAG could complain the matter has not been devolved. The answer will probably be found with a good old fashioned wasteful duplication of the work by DafT and WafT, or whatever the Welsh equivalent is called.

[anthony215]

I cannot see the services to Birmingham or Manchester being replaced as they are ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)))'s most profitable routes and if they were taken from ATW I suspect subsidies will have to be increased.

If this does happen I would like to see the Weslh Governemnt bring back the Valley lines brand and livery  which I think would help attract more people to use the Cardiff Valley Lines network

[John R]

I'm not saying they would be. All I'm pointing out is that the legal agreements will still have to be watertight to avoid such a situation.