WiFi on trains - vital to customers, or just a "nice to have"?

[whole diary]

[grahame]

WiFi on trains has sprung up on my news feed again today - this from the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) article about

Rail users could lose access to wi-fi on trains in England as part of cost cuts after the government said it was a low priority for passengers.

The Department for Transport says cost pressures mean it will review whether the current wi-fi service "delivers the best possible value for money".

But one rail expert criticised the move and said trains could lose custom as a result.

Most operators currently offer free wi-fi as standard on their services.

Transport officials cited a report from independent passenger watchdog Transport Focus, which they said showed passengers were more concerned about value for money, reliability and punctuality than access to wi-fi.

"Our railways are currently not financially sustainable, and it is unfair to continue asking taxpayers to foot the bill, which is why reform of all aspects of the railways is essential," the Department for Transport (DfT^» (Department for Transport - about)) said.

"Passenger surveys consistently show that on-train wi-fi is low on their list of priorities, so it is only right we work with operators to review whether the current service delivers the best possible value for money."

On-train wi-fi equipment installed in 2015 is now in need of replacing and the government said many people on short journeys did not connect to the on-train wi-fi, and used their mobile phone network instead.

[Worcester_Passenger]

My experience is that the Wi-fi on trains is best described as so slow as to be useless. I always use my laptop on the train, but I connect to the outside world using the 'mobile hotspot' facilities on my phone.

Last September, we were travelling from Budapest to Munich on the day of the Queen's funeral, on a super-whizzo Austrian RailJet.  Tried connecting the laptop via the train's Wi-fi. Tested the speed - less than 1Mb/s. Ended up watching the funeral on the mobile.

[eXPassenger]

I haven't been on a train since before covid, but I would prefer to use my phone with it's hotspot rather than the train WiFi.  My experience was always that the WiFi was slow and dropped out.

From an IT perspective I would rather n people used their mobiles which will communicate with base stations from multiple carriers, than have n people consolidating into the bottleneck of a single radio connection.

[Electric train]

WiFi on trains has sprung up on my news feed again today - this from the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) article about

Rail users could lose access to wi-fi on trains in England as part of cost cuts after the government said it was a low priority for passengers.

The Department for Transport says cost pressures mean it will review whether the current wi-fi service "delivers the best possible value for money".

But one rail expert criticised the move and said trains could lose custom as a result.

Most operators currently offer free wi-fi as standard on their services.

Transport officials cited a report from independent passenger watchdog Transport Focus, which they said showed passengers were more concerned about value for money, reliability and punctuality than access to wi-fi.

"Our railways are currently not financially sustainable, and it is unfair to continue asking taxpayers to foot the bill, which is why reform of all aspects of the railways is essential," the Department for Transport (DfT^» (Department for Transport - about)) said.

"Passenger surveys consistently show that on-train wi-fi is low on their list of priorities, so it is only right we work with operators to review whether the current service delivers the best possible value for money."

On-train wi-fi equipment installed in 2015 is now in need of replacing and the government said many people on short journeys did not connect to the on-train wi-fi, and used their mobile phone network instead.

I would say its penny pinching, not so long ago the DfT were chastising TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)'s who did not provide WiFi

[ChrisB]

As others, I no longer use train wifi as it is dreadfully slow - as the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) recognises in that article quote.

There would be a significant cost in upgrading the tech on the trains - both to work with either 5G and/or satellite if speeds were to be improved - meaning new routers as well. Persuading suppliers to 5G the rural areas between stations would also be a challenge seeing as 5G aerials are needed much closer together than 'conventional' current masts.

Quicker & easier & cheaper to let travellers tether the data on their mobile frankly

[Hafren]

Some sort of internet access is fairly "essential" on our culture these days, but phones often cover that. Those on PAYG^▸ (Pay as you go) or who run close to their limits probably benefit most from services provided on board. Otherwise it's much the same as the service my phone provides - while the exact areas of good & bad coverage may differ from my own network's range, the overall amount of good & bad coverage is similar, and the speed is slightly better when it's good, but often very much comparable.

Some rely on the service provided to get work done, especially in the new era of not doing all work in the office – perhaps working on the train allows shorter office hours and better work-life balance for some. However, I wouldn't say the current provision is reliable enough that someone could guarantee being able to get work done on the train. Personally I'd be wary of doing some types of work on a busy train – checking messages might be fine, but I'd only be comfortable doing more in-depth work if I don't have someone next to me, for example, so how busy the train is could be as much a factor in being able to get work done as the gamble of how good the service quality is.

Not that work is the only reason for wanting a good connection. For some in the modern world, being able to catch up with other things online means the hours spent travelling are more valuable. So not having the provision could make the difference in terms of whether or not a regular long commute is worth it. For some it might be no different from using one's own data connection, but for those who perhaps can only afford a lower data allowance, perhaps free WiFi is a significant perk.

On the other hand, in these times when first class and season tickets need to be replaced with other income streams, while increasing fares isn't the greatest idea, perhaps charging a small amount for a better WiFi service is the way to go - whether better is because it allows more to be invested in the infrastructure, or just because fewer people are using up the bandwidth.

[TonyN]

Do not forget that some trains especialy Voyagers on cross country and Meridians on East Midland have mesh in the windows to block mobile signal.

Also slightly off topic but at Birmingham new street the mobile networks are so overloaded that a full strength 5G signal gives almost no data. The station free wifi is no better so slow that the data use agreement does not load.

[Worcester_Passenger]

One thing that has to be praised about the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) on-train Wi-Fi is the accuracy of its GPS.

The attached screenshot has the latitude and longitude to 12 places of decimals. Doing the conversions, I think that means it's accurate to 0.0001 millimetres, though I may be out by a few orders of magnitude.

Alas, there's no indication as to whether this is the location of the router within the carriage or the laptop on the table.

[CyclingSid]

Now is that accuracy or precision?

[GBM]

I like to have RTT^» (Real Time Trains - website) and OpenTrainTimes running on two tabs.
Then glancing at the news, etc whilst travelling.
Always found the train WiFi too slow, but don't always get a good mobile signal either.

[Red Squirrel]

Now is that accuracy or precision?

I suspect neither - unless Worcester_Passenger’s train was in a field near the railway, as the map suggests.

[Witham Bobby]

4G (or 5G) coverage in the countryside is a bit patchy, but that's what I use.  It's better than the slowcoach WiFi on the train, every single time I've tried to use it

Isn't the train WiFi reliant on a 4G or 5G connection anyway?

[grahame]

80% of you use on-train WiFi, with the majority of you feeling it's pretty important to you.   Would be a shame to loose it but, frankly I don't see may people switching away from rail journeys if it's not there.   Good poll response too - suggests it's a topic of great interest.