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Author Topic: New 20 miles per hour speed limits - on roads in Bristol, and elsewhere?  (Read 10411 times)
Red Squirrel
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« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2016, 04:53:00 pm »

RPZs should, at least in theory, be revenue-neutral.

Be interesting to see how many people now living in them want them rolled back. Personally I'm disappointed that they won't now be extended into my area - but that's democracy, I suppose!

It'll also be interesting to see how many people ask to have the speed limit raised on their street... or what the reaction would be the first time a pedestrian or cyclist is killed in a street where the speed limit has been raised.

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Bmblbzzz
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« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2016, 05:10:41 pm »

I thought Red Squirrelville was Taunton or Clevedon or somewhere Somerset way? Mind you, I can't recall what led me to think that.

Anyway, RPZs should be revenue neutral: yes, but there are bound to be costs incurred in start up which won't be recouped until they've been running a while. Not that I've any idea how long, mind. After that I wouldn't be surprised if they could become revenue-generating in a minor way. Obviously that's going to depend on what permit prices are set at.
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rower40
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« Reply #17 on: May 12, 2016, 02:52:02 pm »

When I first heard the road safety phrase "20's Plenty", I thought it referred to pints. Cool (hic)
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grahame
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« Reply #18 on: May 12, 2016, 04:54:29 pm »

When I first heard the road safety phrase "20's Plenty", I thought it referred to pints. Cool (hic)

I thought it referred to bicycles on a 153
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #19 on: May 12, 2016, 08:47:55 pm »

I thought Red Squirrelville was Taunton or Clevedon or somewhere Somerset way? Mind you, I can't recall what led me to think that.

Well for the record I live a shortish stroll from MTP - up the steps, not down, else I'd be in the MR RPZ.
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2019, 02:30:49 pm »

Quote
No major changes needed after Bristol's 20mph limit review
Huge public consultation response supported no change to city's 20mph limit

A major review of Bristol’s 20mph speed limit has determined that no significant changes need to be made to the measures introduced throughout the city between 2012 and 2015.

The thorough review – part of a Mayoral mandate to consider whether there should be an increase in speed limits from 20mph to 30 mph, or a decrease from 30mph to 20 mph - identified minor adjustments needed on a small number of roads to support compliance with the limit, which was introduced to improve active travel, street safety and health and well being for citizens.

One of the largest responses to a public consultation in Bristol saw almost 3,500 replies between June and August of last year. When commenting on individual roads, the majority of feedback was for no change and the consultation highlighted significant public and stakeholder support for retaining the limit in residential areas and near schools, with 95% agreeing with 20mph limits by schools, 74% on residential roads and 44% on main roads.

Stakeholders including the police, Bristol Cycling Campaign, First Group, Road Peace and schools also overwhelmingly backed the retention of the 20mph limit.

Cabinet member for Transport, Cllr Kye Dudd, said: “The 20mph review was an essential part of the One City Plan 2040 target of zero people killed or seriously injured due to avoidable incidents on Bristol’s roads.

“The overall outcomes of the project were to ensure reduced speed limits continue to help improve active travel and subsequently health and wellbeing for citizens and make streets safer for all road users as part of our wider approach to transport policy in Bristol.

“The consultation carried out last summer, with councillors playing an active role, received one of the highest levels of response from the public, with officers taking substantial time and care taken to process and analyse the information and data to come out of it.’’

A report into the 20mph review and summary of the consultation report are available now at www.bristol20mph.co.uk/find-out-more/research-and-monitoring/

For details of the UWE BRITE report see http://eprints.uwe.ac.uk/34851/7/BRITE%20Bristol%2020mph%20limit%20evaluation%20report_20July18update.pdf
Source: Bristol City Council
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« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2019, 04:35:50 pm »

I see the City of London is planning to introduce a 15mph limit.
https://news.cityoflondon.gov.uk/city-of-london-is-set-to-become-the-uks-first-15mph-region

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The City of London Corporation’s most senior decision-making body, the Court of Common Council, has voted to make the Square Mile the first area in the UK with a 15mph speed limit, subject to government approval.

The decision follows a public consultation into 54 proposals unveiled by the City Corporation last year, which together sets a 25-year framework for its first long-term Transport Strategy.

The plans have been developed to support the changing working, living and commuting habits across London.

City Corporation monitoring reveals that 90% of all journeys made on the City’s streets are partially or entirely walked. The new Strategy will prioritise the needs of people walking when delivering changes to streets, and make the most efficient use of street space by working to reduce motor traffic by 25% by 2030, and by 50% by 2044.

Data also shows that cycling has increased by 292% since 1999, while the number of vehicles using the Square Mile’s streets has halved in the last 20 years. The Strategy will see the City Corporation enhancing its cycling offer, launching a new cycling network and improving the quality and accessibility of cycle hire facilities.

And as hosts of the London Walking and Cycling Conference, taking place today in partnership with Hackney Council, where the Mayor of London is a keynote speaker - the City Corporation will announce that two operators, Freebike (electric bikes) and Beryl, will begin a six-month trial for dockless cycle hire in the Square Mile.

The new Transport Strategy will also improve air quality by proposing the UK’s first large scale Zero Emission Zone to cover central London, after local zero emission zones are introduced covering the City Cluster and Barbican and Golden Lane.
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martyjon
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« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2019, 05:29:17 pm »

Now let's make Bristol the nations 2nd Congestion Charging Zone City.

 Lips sealed Lips sealed Lips sealed Lips sealed
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2019, 08:29:22 pm »

    This thread has ben dormant for some time and I've never seen i before. However, having now read it, I have a couple of comments to make@

Quote from: Red Squirrel
  • There has been little opposition to 20mph zones because they benefit the people who live in them, to the (very minor) detriment of those who are merely passing through. Some people have double standards here - they're happy to steam through other people's neighbourhoods creating noise, danger and air pollution, but they'd like people to slow down where they live.

Quite. During the course of the Speed Limit Review we had a few years ago, all proposed limit increases were fought tooth and nail, whilst all the decreases generally went through "on the nod."

There is also the issue that people local to an area often get very shirty when caught speeding themselves. Some seem to take the view that the limit is only there for "outsiders" to adhere to. The landlady in a pub I used many years ago was once caught exceeding a 30 limit within a mile of her boozer and told us that when she got "assertive" with the PC and asked "Why aren't you out catching criminals?" she got the reply "I am Madam - that's why I stopped you!" Most annoyed about that, she was...

Quote from: Red Squirrel
  • These limits apply to cyclists as much as they do to other road users. The fact that when travelling at 20mph it is possible for you to be overtaken by a reckless cyclist is not an argument against 20mph limits, and neither is the fact that a reckless motorist may overtake you. 

I am sorry but you are wrong here. Speed limits apply to motorised vehicles only. Anyone without a motor vehicle, be they a cyclist, Olympic sprinter, pedestrian, or someone pushing a really really well-oiled wheelbarrow, can go as fast as they damn well like Smiley


https://www.slatergordon.co.uk/media-centre/blog/2015/06/can-cyclists-break-the-speed-limit-or-does-the-law-only-apply-to-motorists/

https://www.google.co.uk/search?source=hp&ei=J9nuXMjgJ4y0kwW9q7CoBA&q=speed+limits+and+cyclists&oq=speed+limits+and+cy&gs_l=psy-ab.1.0.0i22i30l8.1984.15765..19065...3.0..0.72.1331.23......0....1..gws-wiz.....0..0i131j0j0i10j0i13.qGYV08BuY8M

http://www.astounding.org.uk/ian/cyclelaw/speed_limits.html
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2019, 10:18:53 pm »

Speed limits apply to motorised vehicles only.

I stand corrected! But I note that a cyclist can be prosecuted for 'cycling furiously' if they go too quickly, and exceeding the speed limit (even though it does not specifically apply) would presumably be considered evidence of such an offence. I don't think there is a corresponding offence for wheelbarrow-pushers, though.
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CyclingSid
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« Reply #25 on: May 30, 2019, 07:46:58 am »

15 mph speed limit in City of London probably won't make a lot of difference (except to the blood pressure of a minority) as the average speed is below that.
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #26 on: May 30, 2019, 09:42:09 am »

Quote from: Red Squirrel
Quote from: Robin Summerhill
Speed limits apply to motorised vehicles only.

I stand corrected! But I note that a cyclist can be prosecuted for 'cycling furiously' if they go too quickly, and exceeding the speed limit (even though it does not specifically apply) would presumably be considered evidence of such an offence. I don't think there is a corresponding offence for wheelbarrow-pushers, though.

The offence is actually "wanton and furious driving" and is contained in the Offences Against the Person Act 1861. The terms "wanton" and "furious" may not be understood to mean exactly the same thing in 2019 as they did in 1861, but the summary of the Act (see link below) clearly states that injury needs to be caused to a third party for an offence to have been committed.

The mere act of going faster in miles per hour than a number in a red ring on a pole would not constitute an offence under the Act. It would therefore follow, however, that if you ploughed into someone on your bike and broke their leg when doing 10mph you would be potentially committing an offence, but belting past them at 40mph and not hitting them would not.

If you Google "wanton and furious cycling" you will come across a few (but not many) prosecutions of cyclists under this Act, but in all cases injury was caused to someone.

And yes, it could equally apply to someone "wanton and furiously" pushing a wheelbarrow  Grin

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Vict/24-25/100/section/35
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #27 on: May 30, 2019, 10:50:24 am »

Thinking about this a bit more (whilst buying a stock of Marston's Old Empire" in Morrison's Wink ) I got home and looked up the definition of "wanton." It says: "1. (of a cruel or violent action) deliberate and unprovoked. synonyms: deliberate, wilful, malicious, malevolent, spiteful, vicious, wicked, evil, cruel"

"Furious" in the 1860s would be more likely to refer to a state of mind. The link for that word to include "speed" may have come along rather later in history.

The above may give some insight into what the legislators had in mind when they passed this piece of legislation just after Prince Albert died, and how the words "wanton" and "furious" were interpreted at the time.

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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2019, 11:19:31 am »

I will do my best to digest this new information whilst replenishing my stock of Pukka Blackcurrant Beauty in Scoopaway...
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« Reply #29 on: May 30, 2019, 11:24:44 am »

Around the time the Act was passed, 134 persons had been killed, and 1,827 persons maimed by carriages in the previous 26 months in London alone. Under the prevailing law the maximum punishment was a fine of 40 shillings; the Act increased this to 2 years in prison. The Act was criticised for including the "wanton or furious driving" clause by those who wanted it to apply to all incidents without having to provide evidence as to the actions or motivation of the driver, and that compensation for the victim would still require a separate civil case, which the "poor, or needy, or ignorant" would be unable to do.
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