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Author Topic: Problems with the Night Riviera sleeper - December 2014 onwards  (Read 214110 times)
grahame
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« Reply #795 on: October 17, 2020, 09:14:06 pm »

Why not stick a power car on the front and back of the sleeper stock and be done with it!

Rewiring job.   I understand that class 43 are VHS, but sleeper stock is BetaMax.
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bobm
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« Reply #796 on: October 17, 2020, 10:04:58 pm »

Yes I wouldn?t plug my phone in a USB socket on the sleeper if a class 43 was up front! 
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broadgage
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« Reply #797 on: October 18, 2020, 12:13:45 am »

Why not stick a power car on the front and back of the sleeper stock and be done with it!

Rewiring job.   I understand that class 43 are VHS, but sleeper stock is BetaMax.

Use of HST power cars on the sleeper might be worth considering, despite the need for electrical modifications.
They are readily available and should be cheap if otherwise due to be scrapped.
Commonality with the castle sets for ease of maintenance.
Not perhaps a long term solution due to the age of HSTs, but a quick alternative to the unreliable locomotives used at present.

Presumably the sleeper could proceed at reduced performance on one power car in case of a failure ? Better than blocking the line.

It MIGHT even be possible to uprate the power output of the power cars. The MTU engines are capable of higher power output than the Valentas. One limiting factor is the rectifier. Rectifiers are now much much smaller and cheaper than in years gone by.
Another limiting factor is the traction motor ratings, but hotel power does not add to the loading of the traction motors.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
TaplowGreen
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« Reply #798 on: October 19, 2020, 06:53:25 am »

Why not stick a power car on the front and back of the sleeper stock and be done with it!

Rewiring job.   I understand that class 43 are VHS, but sleeper stock is BetaMax.

Use of HST power cars on the sleeper might be worth considering, despite the need for electrical modifications.
They are readily available and should be cheap if otherwise due to be scrapped.
Commonality with the castle sets for ease of maintenance.
Not perhaps a long term solution due to the age of HSTs, but a quick alternative to the unreliable locomotives used at present.

Presumably the sleeper could proceed at reduced performance on one power car in case of a failure ? Better than blocking the line.

It MIGHT even be possible to uprate the power output of the power cars. The MTU engines are capable of higher power output than the Valentas. One limiting factor is the rectifier. Rectifiers are now much much smaller and cheaper than in years gone by.
Another limiting factor is the traction motor ratings, but hotel power does not add to the loading of the traction motors.

Why not just invest in something newer, and more reliable?
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GBM
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« Reply #799 on: October 19, 2020, 07:35:43 am »

Read on another forum the lead loco failed at Bodmin (last night?) on the up sleeper.
Rear loco pulled back to Lostwithiel, ran around, and then lead the convoy.

Corrected spelling mistook...
« Last Edit: October 19, 2020, 08:13:56 am by GBM » Logged

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bradshaw
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« Reply #800 on: October 19, 2020, 08:38:56 am »

RTT shows 35 late off Penzance, the 183 at Liskeard, thus supporting your post. Diverted via B&H seemingly and arrived 70 down
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broadgage
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« Reply #801 on: October 19, 2020, 03:54:04 pm »



Use of HST power cars on the sleeper might be worth considering, despite the need for electrical modifications.
They are readily available and should be cheap if otherwise due to be scrapped.
Commonality with the castle sets for ease of maintenance.
Not perhaps a long term solution due to the age of HSTs, but a quick alternative to the unreliable locomotives used at present.

Presumably the sleeper could proceed at reduced performance on one power car in case of a failure ? Better than blocking the line.

It MIGHT even be possible to uprate the power output of the power cars. The MTU engines are capable of higher power output than the Valentas. One limiting factor is the rectifier. Rectifiers are now much much smaller and cheaper than in years gone by.
Another limiting factor is the traction motor ratings, but hotel power does not add to the loading of the traction motors.

Why not just invest in something newer, and more reliable?

Two reasons, HST power cars are available now and at modest cost. Something new might take years to design, and then fail to meet expectations regarding reliability.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
grahame
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« Reply #802 on: October 19, 2020, 04:13:08 pm »

Why not just invest in something newer, and more reliable?

Two reasons, HST power cars are available now and at modest cost. Something new might take years to design, and then fail to meet expectations regarding reliability.


May I add a third - "commonality of fleet".  There are perhaps 25 to 30 class 43 power cars in the GW fleet, and adding a handful to that means that there's no need to add holdings of different spare parts and to train up engineers on a new type which - one hopes - only had to be repaired occasionally.

Age (so expected length of life in this new role) is against all the castles, including "Le Chateau de la Belle au Bois Dormant", "Fiona's Castle", "Gournay Court", "Chateau de Chambord ", "Arendelle Castle" etc ... taking the commonality onwards, the logic would be to a next generation IET variant ... which I think I have mentioned before.  Again, commonality of parts, maintenance and driving skills.
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« Reply #803 on: October 20, 2020, 01:49:58 pm »

Commonality of Parts is all well and good, one thing BR never did was put all it's eggs in one basket.

Just how many trains would be cancelled if a serious failure grounded all the Hitachi class 80X fleets under all had been inspected?
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grahame
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« Reply #804 on: October 20, 2020, 01:57:46 pm »

Commonality of Parts is all well and good, one thing BR never did was put all it's eggs in one basket.

Just how many trains would be cancelled if a serious failure grounded all the Hitachi class 80X fleets under all had been inspected?

Indeed ... there is an element of balance needed.  Manufacture of a fleet for - say - 15 years, lifespan 35 to 40 years, and you have a main, well established fleet that's well bedded in, a new fleet going through any teething problems, and a few laggards to keep the enthusiasts interested  Grin .... right across the UK, same fleets giving quantity benefits ...
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grahame
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« Reply #805 on: November 03, 2020, 02:22:08 am »

Quote
21:45 Penzance to London Paddington due 05:03 will be terminated at Reading.
It will no longer call at London Paddington.
This is due to a shortage of train crew.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #806 on: November 03, 2020, 05:58:00 pm »

Is anyone actually using the sleeper at the moment?

Would be interesting if anyone knows the loadings.
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Surrey 455
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« Reply #807 on: November 03, 2020, 08:22:20 pm »

Is anyone actually using the sleeper at the moment?

Would be interesting if anyone knows the loadings.

Will it be running from Thursday night?

If yes, will you be allowed to sleep on it? I am sure nobody actually lives on that train.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #808 on: November 03, 2020, 10:00:05 pm »

Is anyone actually using the sleeper at the moment?

Would be interesting if anyone knows the loadings.

Will it be running from Thursday night?

If yes, will you be allowed to sleep on it? I am sure nobody actually lives on that train.

I suppose theoretically you could be using it to get to work the following day?
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Jamsdad
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« Reply #809 on: November 04, 2020, 10:26:33 am »

There is also a derogation for travelling back to your home base. So yes you can use the sleeper.
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