Signalling & Services Between Paddington & Reading Not Fit For Purpose

[whole diary]

[SandTEngineer]

Interesting to note that when complete there will be four separate depots at Old Oak Common; GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway), Heathrow Express, Crossrail and IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) and that three of them get wiped out when HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) comes along

Which one will remain after HS2?  Crossrail or North Pole?

From the preliminary plans I have seen only North Pole IEP depot will remain.

[paul7575]

Doesn't "a state-of-the-art train control system", (as mentioned in the NR^» (Network Rail - home page) release) include the ETCS^▸ (European Train Control System) overlay then?   Isn't that part of the requirement for Crossrail on the mainline, as well as to overcome the lack of TPWS^▸ (Train Protection and Warning System) into Heathrow?

Paul

[SandTEngineer]

Doesn't "a state-of-the-art train control system", (as mentioned in the NR^» (Network Rail - home page) release) include the ETCS^▸ (European Train Control System) overlay then?   Isn't that part of the requirement for Crossrail on the mainline, as well as to overcome the lack of TPWS^▸ (Train Protection and Warning System) into Heathrow?

Paul

As far as I am aware no ETCS is being installed at this stage.  That's why the Crossrail (sorry, Elizabeth Line) tunnels are being fitted with enhanced TPWS in the interim.  I think that (personal opinion) ETCS is a loooooong way from being implemented in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom)

[ellendune]

From the preliminary plans I have seen only North Pole IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) depot will remain.

Isn't that a bit short sighted given that they are only just building the cross rail depot?

[SandTEngineer]

From the preliminary plans I have seen only North Pole IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) depot will remain.

Isn't that a bit short sighted given that they are only just building the cross rail depot?

Yes, but this is the Modern Day Railway we are talking about.........

[SandTEngineer]

The next two major signalling commissionings are scheduled for Xmas/New Year 2016/2017 (Stage K) and Xmas/New Year 2017/2018 (Stage M).

[Electric train]

The Crossrail (or should we say the Elizabeth linen )depot remains post HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) it has been shifted slightly north to allow foe HS2, the reason the original Crossrail depot at Romford could not be built hence OOC^▸ (Old Oak Common (depot)) is the major depot with something like 80% of the stock berthing / being maintained there every night.

The GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) depot HST^▸ (High Speed Train) shed will demise as the Hitachi trains come in, HEX is destined for Langley under HS2 plans or the old Eurostar heavy maintenance shed in North Pole.

The other part of the Signalling works announced was awarded to Amey for signalling power, reading the press releases it would seem it is to upgrade the current single end radial feeds to  dual end feed with an auto reconfig system.  I am on a training course soon for one of the suppliers of auto reconfig ............. its all very "beam me up Scottie"   

[TaplowGreen]

The next two major signalling commissionings are scheduled for Xmas/New Year 2016/2017 (Stage K) and Xmas/New Year 2017/2018 (Stage M).

......I take it that means yet more Christmases with huge disruption then?

[ellendune]

The next two major signalling commissionings are scheduled for Xmas/New Year 2016/2017 (Stage K) and Xmas/New Year 2017/2018 (Stage M).

......I take it that means yet more Christmases with huge disruption then?

Would you prefer
- disruption to be at a time when even more people would be inconvenienced? or
- they do not do the work so we still have signalling that is not fit for purpose and no capacity for improved services

[SandTEngineer]

The Crossrail (or should we say the Elizabeth linen )depot remains post HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s))

......mmm.  Not on the plans I have seen

[IndustryInsider]

......I take it that means yet more Christmases with huge disruption then?

Yes, and most Bank Holidays as well until the early 2020s I should imagine.  There's quite a lot of work going on...

[TaplowGreen]

The next two major signalling commissionings are scheduled for Xmas/New Year 2016/2017 (Stage K) and Xmas/New Year 2017/2018 (Stage M).

......I take it that means yet more Christmases with huge disruption then?

Would you prefer
- disruption to be at a time when even more people would be inconvenienced? or
- they do not do the work so we still have signalling that is not fit for purpose and no capacity for improved services

Obviously not...........although I do wonder when "Manana, manana" on signalling, electrification, capacity, delays etc etc is going to end (if ever).

I remember reading a suggestion on another thread that maybe it would be better to pick a week in August when traffic tends to be a lot quieter due to hols and closing down/doing the work then - giving 6 months notice -most peoples holidays are a movable feast so they can work around it, Christmas is not.............I can appreciate GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) may be reluctant for this to happen (it'd involve giving up fare income, whereas work taking place on Christmas Day/Boxing Day costs them nothing), and I'm sure it would be far from universally popular, but 7 days/nights without interruption would give an opportunity for huge amounts of work to be done in one "hit"?

Any thoughts?

[IndustryInsider]

There have been and will be several week long blockades during the quieter times whilst the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) electrification takes place, along with other works.  The Banbury/Hinksey blockades this summer are upcoming examples. 

I would imagine the main reason that week long blockades are not chosen for these Crossrail works is the fact that the London end of the network is extremely busy even during the summer holidays.  It would prove very unpopular - even if you were to persuade (or 'force' as the press would no doubt describe it) a hefty percentage of commuters to take their holidays on a given week.  Added to that, the weekend tourism traffic would be badly hit, and bus replacements would be required in huge amounts.

Another reason is that these works are staged very carefully.  During the Christmas blockades, infrastructure that is commissioned has had months of enabling works that couldn't be completed in, say, a week blockade anyway.  So, in other words, I'm not sure that much more extra work could take place in many examples.  Sure, other works take place during that window of opportunity, but the big reason for the blockade is often pretty much completed during the year and then commissioned during the two day break when no trains run - an extra few days would make little difference.

[grahame]

I remember reading a suggestion on another thread that maybe it would be better to pick a week in August when traffic tends to be a lot quieter due to hols and closing down/doing the work then - giving 6 months notice -most peoples holidays are a movable feast so they can work around it, Christmas is not.............I can appreciate GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) may be reluctant for this to happen (it'd involve giving up fare income, whereas work taking place on Christmas Day/Boxing Day costs them nothing), and I'm sure it would be far from universally popular, but 7 days/nights without interruption would give an opportunity for huge amounts of work to be done in one "hit"?

Any thoughts?

What's interesting is that this is exactly what they did last summer - Chippenham to Bath was closed for six weeks (Trowbridge to Bath for 4 of those weeks too).  Bath to Bristol was shut for 10 days earlier this month, the Severn Tunnel shuts for a number of weeks in September / October, and it's not unusual for Devon / Cornwall branches to be closed for a week (or even 2) for major works.   However, I wonder at the resources (people, equipment, logistical capacity) to handle a sustained closure for a week of London - Reading.

Yesterday was GWR's stakeholder conference - that's where Great Western update the local authorities, LEPs^» (Local Enterprise Partnership - about), etc on where they are and where they're going.  Mark Langham, Network Rail Western Route MD was showing how performance slipped last summer / early autumn - mainly due to London - Reading issues; on his arrival at that point, an extra budget was put in place to keep the current system running properly / customers looked after during the upgrades.  The supporting graphs showed a dramatic improvement after that date.

One of the questions from the audience asked about the reliance on this single line from Reading into London, and about the provision of a second route.  Answers related how additional robustness is planned from the current works, with steps being taken giving an increased capacity, including looking forward to the digital railway.  Late in the answer, comment was made telling the audience of a future potential (for engineering / emergency only from the tone of the answer) via the west curve at Didcot and Oxford Parkway - into Paddington via the Chiltern line.

[paul7575]

Reading to Waterloo is also always available in extremis, and of course it is getting gauge cleared for IEPs^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.)...

Paul