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Author Topic: ScotRail's plans for their HSTs.  (Read 9748 times)
bobm
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« Reply #30 on: August 22, 2017, 08:56:20 pm »

Friday 1st September might be a problem with regards to availability but the following week the high summer timetable finishes. The daytime HST will no longer run to Newquay and the 10:47 ex Penzance reverts to being a unit to Plymouth. 

Looks like no catering vehicles are going in the initial batch but then don't GWR own a lot of them?
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grahame
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« Reply #31 on: August 22, 2017, 10:08:59 pm »

Probably likely to short form whatever's left over as they are doing with  a lot of the remaining Turbo services on LTV?

Aren't there some HST diagrams which are purely LTV services?  So part of the juggling that GWR will be doing could be replacement of such diagram(s) by 16x based services - which however would be detrimental on cascades westwards, those needed because on 150/1 units headed off to Northern.
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #32 on: August 22, 2017, 11:02:55 pm »

There are certainly possibilities in that regard.  One diagram does the 06:34 DID-PAD, 08:09 PAD-RDG and 09:12 RDG-PAD, which could easily be Turbos, though as you say Turbo availability is also stretched until the new year!
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To view my cab run over the new Reading Viaduct as well as a relief line cab ride at Reading just after Platforms 12-15 opened and my 'before and after' video comparison of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/1
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« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2017, 10:11:14 am »

There's one that comes down to Newbury (on weekdays) for about 0915, then turns around and goes back to PAD.

Whenever I've caught this from Thatcham at 0930, it is always lightly loaded, as opposed to the 0905 Turbo (first off-peak to PAD) which is usually rammed.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #34 on: August 23, 2017, 05:53:06 pm »

Just a thought-perhaps the focus should be on how the service can be improved, rather than the best way to make it worse?

Radical concept for the railways I know.
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #35 on: August 23, 2017, 08:16:54 pm »

That might be part of the current problems - too much need to focus on future improvements, rather than shorter term issues such as this one.
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To view my cab run over the new Reading Viaduct as well as a relief line cab ride at Reading just after Platforms 12-15 opened and my 'before and after' video comparison of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/1
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« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2017, 11:03:28 pm »

Power car 43132 hauled its final passenger service for GWR this evening, 23rd August 2017. 1C91 1733 London Paddington - Paignton.

Exam at Laira before moving to St Phillips Marsh and marshalled with the other rolling stock coming of lease and heading to Scotland.
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chrisr_75
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« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2017, 12:20:20 am »

Power car 43132 hauled its final passenger service for GWR this evening, 23rd August 2017. 1C91 1733 London Paddington - Paignton.

Exam at Laira before moving to St Phillips Marsh and marshalled with the other rolling stock coming of lease and heading to Scotland.

Ummm, so when are the IEPs (or whatever they're called now) actually entering revenue service? Strikes me as a half witted way of doing things...start sending the HST's off before the replacements have entered service...
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bignosemac
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« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2017, 12:26:48 am »

IEPs are scheduled to enter revenue earning service with GWR in October.
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grahame
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« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2017, 03:40:35 am »

Ummm, so when are the IEPs (or whatever they're called now) actually entering revenue service? Strikes me as a half witted way of doing things...start sending the HST's off before the replacements have entered service...

IEPs are scheduled to enter revenue earning service with GWR in October.

I'm not sure that GWR were given any recent choice about sending off HSTs.  More they're being pulled out by the people to whom they were promised (and contracted from around now) in the heady days that expected electric trains to be running to Cardiff this year ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-12606470 ).   The Scots have a contract for their hire from this autumn, GWR do not.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #40 on: August 24, 2017, 06:49:17 am »

Ummm, so when are the IEPs (or whatever they're called now) actually entering revenue service? Strikes me as a half witted way of doing things...start sending the HST's off before the replacements have entered service...

IEPs are scheduled to enter revenue earning service with GWR in October.

I'm not sure that GWR were given any recent choice about sending off HSTs.  More they're being pulled out by the people to whom they were promised (and contracted from around now) in the heady days that expected electric trains to be running to Cardiff this year ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-12606470 ).   The Scots have a contract for their hire from this autumn, GWR do not.


..............so in the sure and certain knowledge, held for some time that electric trains would not be running to Cardiff this year, what did GWR do to mitigate the problem of knowing that they would have to give up old trains before new trains were available? (......or am I again making the unjustified assumption that GWR understand or indulge in the strange concept of "contingency planning"?)
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Timmer
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« Reply #41 on: August 24, 2017, 07:53:14 am »

..............so in the sure and certain knowledge, held for some time that electric trains would not be running to Cardiff this year, what did GWR do to mitigate the problem of knowing that they would have to give up old trains before new trains were available? (......or am I again making the unjustified assumption that GWR understand or indulge in the strange concept of "contingency planning"?)
GWR are just the puppet for their masters at Dft when it comes to rolling stock who micro manage as to who gets what. There's a discussion on another rail based forum about a handful of units that are due to leave GWR for Northern but GWR can't give them up as the Thames Valley Turbos haven't been released yet to release the units to head up North because electrification is running behind schedule! And so it goes on, one franchise promised another franchise's knackered old rolling stock.
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ellendune
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« Reply #42 on: August 24, 2017, 07:55:20 am »

I'm not sure that GWR were given any recent choice about sending off HSTs.  More they're being pulled out by the people to whom they were promised (and contracted from around now) in the heady days that expected electric trains to be running to Cardiff this year ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-12606470 ).   The Scots have a contract for their hire from this autumn, GWR do not.
..............so in the sure and certain knowledge, held for some time that electric trains would not be running to Cardiff this year, what did GWR do to mitigate the problem of knowing that they would have to give up old trains before new trains were available? (......or am I again making the unjustified assumption that GWR understand or indulge in the strange concept of "contingency planning"?)

GWR are just the puppet for their masters at Dft who micro manage who gets what. There's a discussion on another rail based forum about a handful of units that are due to leave GWR for Northern but GWR can't give them up as the Thames Valley Turbos haven't been released yet to release the units to head up North because electrification is running behind schedule! And so it goes on, one franchise promised another franchise's knackered old rolling stock.

Agree with Timmer (you got in first) What realistically could GWR do? They seem to me only to have three options:

a) Wave a magic wand and find some 125mph trains to hie hire in from somewhere.
b) Axe some trains from the timetable
c) Try the best they can with what they have got.

The late delivery to the iEPs (rather than electrification) is not down to GWR.  

Don't forget that the franchise extension was due to DfT expecting a lack of interest due to all the disruption and problems during this period.  
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bobm
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« Reply #43 on: August 24, 2017, 08:03:15 am »

As I understand it, GWR were able to slow the exodus of HSTs to Scotland in that only one set is going this month. The original plan was for more to go at this early stage.
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grahame
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« Reply #44 on: August 24, 2017, 08:03:52 am »

..............so in the sure and certain knowledge, held for some time that electric trains would not be running to Cardiff this year, what did GWR do to mitigate the problem of knowing that they would have to give up old trains before new trains were available? (......or am I again making the unjustified assumption that GWR understand or indulge in the strange concept of "contingency planning"?)

Extended leases on all their class 143 and class 153 because they were not committed to any future contract.  Pulled back on promises (delayed pals) to lengthen trains that are overcrowded.  There may be more things which I have overlooked (don't have my notes to hand this morning). These may not be direct replacements for HSTs, but they allow turbos as they are released to take over certain diagrams.    What's available to GWR is to a very great extent decided by the DfT - though this ability to point to the DfT may also encourage the operator to inflict a bit of pain and say "not us, guv" where they could perhaps be hiring locomotive hauled coaching stock for some services.   I don't know the finances and practicality on that last suggestion / comment I have made though. "OOz gonna pay for it?".

Contingency planning does require some knowledge of what contingency you're planning for ... and there have been so many variables here, not least trying to second guess DfT decisions on rolling stock, that any contingency plans had to be at the broadest level only.
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