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Author Topic: Hayes & Harlington - poor CIS due to Crossrail  (Read 6874 times)
CJB666
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« on: January 06, 2017, 07:44:26 am »

Over the last few years Hillingdon Council, various local business development organisations, the GWR Customer Panel, members of the travelling public, and even the local Hillingdon Gazette have all tried to get the conglomerate of Network Rail, Crossrail and Great Western Railways to improve the customer information systems at Hayes & Harlington. All have failed.

Emails, letters, complaint forms, phone calls - all are ignored.

Over a year ago the main station building on platform 4 was demolished, yet since then nothing has been done to replace it. Rumour has it that the money has simply run out. Certainly the demolition was a tad early, and platforms 5, 4, 3, & 2 still need to be lengthened for even 10-car trains let alone the projected 12.

However the CIS situation is dire. The Crossrail works usually involve switching the use of platforms from 3 & 4 to 1 & 2 especially late at night and early in the morning, and at most weekends. Sometimes ALL platforms are in use at the same time.

BUT THE CIS SYSTEMS DON'T WORK FOR MUCH OF THE TIME.

There is only a SINGLE tv screen indicating which platforms are in use - but this is in the upper foyer soon to be demolished.

There is a hotel in High Point Village near the alternative entrance to platform 4. Many tourists need to find a working CIS display at that entrance detailing the platforms they need to go to. Even local passengers need this information, especially since the platform changes and usage are so many and varied.

Yet whilst there is indeed a second tv screen opposite the temporary ticket office at the entrance to platform 4 - and it is clearly marked that passengers should refer to it - it is 1/ never switched on, 2/ when it was switched on the display couldn't be read due to sun light dimming the display, 3/ to counteract this the contrast was turned up high rendering the display unreadable, and 4/ the glass screen inside was always covered in condensation.

This is a key entrance to the Station for intending passengers from Hayes town and the hotel. There SHOULD be a working CIS display there. Yet the arrogance of Network Rail Crossrail and GWR knows no bounds. Despite numerous complaints over the last few years this tv screen remains u/s.

OK - so the money has run out for the Hayes & Harlington Station rebuild. But what is the cost of a replacement tv screen FGS?

So intending passengers entering via platform 4 have no way of finding out if platform 4 or 2 is being used for London trains. So it has been observed that many simply wait around at the London end of platform 4 hoping for the best. When trains arrive at platform 2 they then have a choice: 1/ wait for the next train, 2/ run for the train over the connecting bridge - but the GWR drivers rarely wait, or 3/ run across the tracks - the quickest way.

BTW Network Rail / GWR switched off one of the two Oyster readers on platform 1 due to the danger of over-crowding. The logic of that completely fails me. Excessive over-crowding takes place because of that reduction from 2 to 1 readers. You couldn't make this stuff up.

And this is how GWR runs its services today. Unprofessional, pathetic and dangerous.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2017, 08:33:24 am »

And this is how GWR runs its services today. Unprofessional, pathetic and dangerous.


How can you say such things, when they are busily  "Building a Greater West"!!!  Roll Eyes
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CJB666
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« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2017, 08:38:01 am »

How can you say such things, when they are busily  "Building a Greater West"!!!  Roll Eyes

For which the entire electrification project has devolved into chaos, and for which the money has run out.
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Thatcham Crossing
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« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2017, 09:41:31 am »

Quote
For which the entire electrification project has devolved into chaos, and for which the money has run out.

Surely your beef re. that needs to be with NR and not GWR!
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Phil
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« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2017, 10:09:14 am »

My understanding is that the feed that supplies CIS with next train arrival & departures information is publicly available if you know who to ask to get the code. Given that's the case, could not the community and/or passengers club together and buy a few screens and a Raspberry Pi or two and provide their own CIS? You're looking at 500 quid max. Perhaps a local business might want to sponsor it.

One thing we've learned here in Wiltshire is that there is no "them" any longer. The organisations we once expected to work for us (civil servants, the health service and previously public bodies such as the Post Office and NR) are financially, and often it seems morally, completely and utterly bankrupt. "They" won't and can't do anything. The only answer is to do it yourself.
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grahame
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« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2017, 10:33:27 am »

My understanding is that the feed that supplies CIS with next train arrival & departures information is publicly available if you know who to ask to get the code.

I have the codes for many stations (including Hayes and Harlington), for the "WebTIS" screens - that's not the LED displays on the platform but the TV monitors.  There's a number of different formats available including the beautifully named "detailed summary" - sample below.   If you get to setting up a screen, it shouldn't be a problem getting the feed (that applies to most but not all other GWR served stations too).

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ChrisB
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« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2017, 11:28:16 am »

I suspect that you're caught between station operators now.

Shortly to become a Crossrail/Elizabethan/TfL station, it is not difficult to understand why GWR don't want to spend capital expenditure there - they won't get their money back.

Suspect you're waiting for the handover to TfL, when, if Sadiq K's promises hold , you'll get his bells & whistles of Staff from first to last trains, full barriers, and decent CIS.

Not long to wait....
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Surrey 455
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« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2017, 09:27:17 am »

My understanding is that the feed that supplies CIS with next train arrival & departures information is publicly available if you know who to ask to get the code.

I have the codes for many stations (including Hayes and Harlington), for the "WebTIS" screens - that's not the LED displays on the platform but the TV monitors.  There's a number of different formats available including the beautifully named "detailed summary" - sample below.   If you get to setting up a screen, it shouldn't be a problem getting the feed (that applies to most but not all other GWR served stations too).

I like that display. I haven't seen any others at stations that show the arrival times for the following stations or the Last Report.
Out of curiosity, how many locations do you know of locally that use this and do you have issues with screen burn? I'm thinking along the lines of the old plasma display boards at Paddington that were replaced with LED displays about 10 years ago.
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stuving
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« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2017, 11:01:15 am »

My understanding is that the feed that supplies CIS with next train arrival & departures information is publicly available if you know who to ask to get the code.

I have the codes for many stations (including Hayes and Harlington), for the "WebTIS" screens - that's not the LED displays on the platform but the TV monitors.  There's a number of different formats available including the beautifully named "detailed summary" - sample below.   If you get to setting up a screen, it shouldn't be a problem getting the feed (that applies to most but not all other GWR served stations too).

I like that display. I haven't seen any others at stations that show the arrival times for the following stations or the Last Report.
Out of curiosity, how many locations do you know of locally that use this and do you have issues with screen burn? I'm thinking along the lines of the old plasma display boards at Paddington that were replaced with LED displays about 10 years ago.

I imagine screen burn - or its equivalent with LEDs - is not a serious issue given the low cost and short amortisation period of these today. It's just a screen with enough computer to run a browser, after all.

You could sign up to Darwin and do your own formatting, though I've no idea how much formatting it takes. There is a single response object called StationBoardWithDetails.

Or try this, from A1 publishing. Maybe that's not a lot more than NRE offer, though. They have a number of other formatted screens, presumably based on Darwin and perhaps other like sources, including TfL ones.

SWT's own screens may not be openly on line like GWR's, of course.
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stuving
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« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2017, 05:09:50 pm »

You could sign up to Darwin and do your own formatting, though I've no idea how much formatting it takes. There is a single response object called StationBoardWithDetails.

Or try this, from A1 publishing. Maybe that's not a lot more than NRE offer, though. They have a number of other formatted screens, presumably based on Darwin and perhaps other like sources, including TfL ones.

SWT's own screens may not be openly on line like GWR's, of course.

Now here's a thing. It looks as if I was getting confused between two different NRE services: Darwin Webservice (Public Version) - all XML, SOAP, and such stuff - and Public CIS (PubCIS). The latter is formatted for a web browser, available from their server (but only if you register - details unknown), and is or was used by SWT.

Google found a formatted page I can look at, with animation, but I suspect it's an example rather than a usable page. That's because it has South West Trains at the top, but shows departures and services from Brighton. So if you can find out how to request the right station, that might be what you were asking for.
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grahame
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« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2017, 05:28:12 pm »

There's a developer's day coming up in about a month on the Network Rail feeds, and the public CIS is available in both HTML (7 formats) and XML. Will follow up with a forum link when on a sure connection tomorrow.
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stuving
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« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2017, 06:00:50 pm »

Well, first thing to try is editing the CRS code in that URL. Which works! Though mine isn't updating automatically (which might be Firefox), and it's only page 1 of 2 (for Brighton).
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SandTEngineer
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« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2017, 06:06:23 pm »

Well, first thing to try is editing the CRS code in that URL. Which works! Though mine isn't updating automatically (which might be Firefox), and it's only page 1 of 2 (for Brighton).

I've just tried for my local station (PLY) and it works!  Interestingly it also shows the last reported point and time.  You can also change departures to arrivals.
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bobm
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« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2017, 06:47:39 pm »

This is the link which provides the screenshot Graham posted earlier.

http://iris2.rail.co.uk/tiger/

It is on Google - so not private.
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grahame
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« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2017, 08:14:55 pm »

Google found a formatted page I can look at, with animation, but I suspect it's an example rather than a usable page.

The services look real ... lots of buses rather than trains this evening ;-)
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