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May 28, 2017, 03:41:48 PM *
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Author Topic: launch of national campaign promoting scenic and sustainable tourism by rail  (Read 749 times)
grahame
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« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2017, 02:30:13 PM »

Interesting concept. I agree about suitability of window spacing on current stock plus lineside vegetation.

Do I remember hearing that Mark Iid window pitch was designed to give everyone in first class a window?   

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Remember a trip on the Festiniog a few years back, much of the way the view was obscured by large mature trees next to the line. Unfortunately probably not on their land.

Although I did notice a few years that the West Somerset had done some quite extensive tree clearing  on their land.

Disappointing how poor the view from the train was on the Fawley branch last weekend ...

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Interesting comment from a friend of mine who has just come back from Scotland who remarked that they were surprised how busy Fort William to Mallaig was and that it was only a 2 car unit. A line that probably doesn't need promoting!

Quick arithmetic on passenger numbers and number of services ... each carriage averages just half as busy as the typical TransWilts train ... I would suggest that promotion may need guidance towards less popular trains / seasons.

Interesting that the Purbeck Line says it will run a commuter service from Wareham to Swanage from June 13th. Couldn't find Swanage on the National Rail Enquiries site. Does that mean that it is not 100% definite yet? Or will tickets only be sold through the Swanage Railway?

Final details are awaited; yes - it's running close to the wire, and this has not escaped the notice of the Purbeck line people who were just up-table from TransWilts at Waterloo yesterday!
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Adelante_CCT
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« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2017, 05:52:28 PM »

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Disappointing how poor the view from the train was on the Fawley branch last weekend ..

Hardly worth it for the odd railtour, I don't think the oil wagons are too fussed about having a nice view  Smiley
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eightf48544
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« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2017, 06:31:26 PM »

Do I remember hearing that Mark Iid window pitch was designed to give everyone in first class a window?   

Wikipedia gives

The Mk1 TSO contains eight seating bays, three transverse entrance vestibules, and two toilets arranged either side of a central corridor leading to the gangway at one end. The eight bays are distributed along the coach in two saloons of four bays either side of the almost-central door vestibule (this is slightly offset towards one end by the presence of the toilets at the other end), and the saloon nearest to the toilets is further divided into two saloons of two bays each by a transverse partition. The bay spacing is 6 ft 6 in (1.98 m), this being the standard for Mk1 Third / Second / Standard class, and identical to the compartment spacing in Mk1 side corridor stock.

All with tables!
 
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Western Pathfinder
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« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2017, 06:56:02 PM »

The joys and delights of being able to move when you were seated those were good days indeed. Undecided
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trainer
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« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2017, 10:47:52 PM »

Here is a link to the suggestion about Scotrail proposals.  It may well have been superseded now since I haven't heard anything recently.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/scenic-trains-planned-for-new-scotrail-franchise-1-3194275
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paul7755
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« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2017, 11:27:57 AM »

To confirm Rhydgaled's earlier thoughts, it has definitely turned out Scotrail will just be using 158s on their scenic routes, with some minor modifications to seating alignment, catering and tables.   As always, the original spin was far greater than the actuality...

There are numerous mentions of 'scenic' in their franchise agreement here:  https://www.transport.gov.scot/media/2302/abellio-scotrail-redacted-franchise-agreement-web-version-revised-november-2016.pdf

Paul
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Timmer
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« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2017, 12:33:00 PM »

To confirm Rhydgaled's earlier thoughts, it has definitely turned out Scotrail will just be using 158s on their scenic routes, with some minor modifications to seating alignment, catering and tables.   As always, the original spin was far greater than the actuality...
Wasn't the plan to use 158s on the West Highland line dropped due to gauging issues or something similar?
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grahame
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« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2017, 01:15:06 PM »

Two out of the three postcard pictures not identified earlier from the "Scenic Rail" series are on the lines out of Glasgow via Crainlarich ... so scenery is certainly a key element there. 

Noting the willingness of customers to pay premium rates for a good scenic trip, how about forming up some 2 + 5 HSTs - 2 x first, 1 x buffet, 2 x standard for the summer season.  In winter, run them as 2 + 3 (1 x first and 2 x standard), returning the buffet and extra first carriage to Glasgow and Edinburgh to Perth, Dundee and Aberdeen services - the business trips which are too short to fly, and where the first class travellers probably are thinner on the ground during the summer.  Silly suggestion ... but then ...
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eightf48544
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« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2017, 11:16:32 AM »

Quick arithmetic on passenger numbers and number of services ... each carriage averages just half as busy as the typical TransWilts train ... I would suggest that promotion may need guidance towards less popular trains / seasons.

Grahme would you care to elaborate on this formula, it seems a useful way of comparing services.

Noting the willingness of customers to pay premium rates for a good scenic trip, how about forming up some 2 + 5 HSTs - 2 x first, 1 x buffet, 2 x standard for the summer season.  In winter, run them as 2 + 3 (1 x first and 2 x standard), returning the buffet and extra first carriage to Glasgow and Edinburgh to Perth, Dundee and Aberdeen services - the business trips which are too short to fly, and where the first class travellers probably are thinner on the ground during the summer.  Silly suggestion ... but then ...

Well the pocket rockets are coming to the West Country (2+5) I'm not sure what the seating plans are or whether they will have catering.
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grahame
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« Reply #24 on: May 21, 2017, 11:47:52 AM »

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Quick arithmetic on passenger numbers and number of services ... each carriage averages just half as busy as the typical TransWilts train ... I would suggest that promotion may need guidance towards less popular trains / seasons.

Grahme would you care to elaborate on this formula, it seems a useful way of comparing services.

For the Mallaig line:

>>> 9418+492+1706+478+366+2762+7058+4332+86994
113606
>>> # ticketed journeys east of Fort William
...
>>> 50 * 6 * 4 * 2 * 2
4800
>>> # carriage runs on line (50 weeks, 6 days a week, 4 trains, 2 cars each, 2 ways)
...
>>> 113606 / 4800.0
23.667916666666667
>>> # passengers per carriage
...
>>> 86994 / 4800.0
18.12375
>>> # passengers per carriage in / out of Mallaig

Loading figure of 23.66 will be high due to people making an intermediate journey (i.e. not going to from or through Fort William) are double-counted with this algorithm.


For TransWilts:

>>> 50 * 6 * (18 + 6)
7200
>>> 245000 / 7200.0
34.02777777777778
>>>

245000 is the number of passengers on the Chippenham - Trowbridge section

For both Mallaig and TransWilts, I have taken 50 rather than 51 weeks and there are also some Sunday services not counted in the days.  They're in broad balance for both.

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eightf48544
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« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2017, 09:35:34 AM »

Thanks very interesting calculations. Might try it for Marlow but not sure how reliable passenger figures are as there are no ticket selling facilities there.

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grahame
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« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2017, 09:51:13 AM »

Thanks very interesting calculations. Might try it for Marlow but not sure how reliable passenger figures are as there are no ticket selling facilities there.

Passenger numbers from the ORR are designed to take all ticketed journeys into account, wherever the tickets are bought, and include season ticket and rover data too.   That's why it takes so long from the end of the financial year in April for the data to be published.    Some of the rover and season ticket data has to be estimates, though, and no account is taken of journeys by people who get away without paying.

My method should give you an interesting result for the services into Marlow itself, based on Marlow passenger numbers.  It may be rather more wolly if you calculate for the whole branch, as it double counts intermediate traffic - do people from Cookham use it to of shopping in Marlow, for example.
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