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Author Topic: Shortage of train crews on Great Western Railway since September 2017 - ongoing discussion  (Read 424377 times)
bradshaw
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« Reply #1455 on: December 16, 2020, 17:17:12 »

Sir Peter Hendy on questioning by the Transport Select Committee indicated that only about 25% of train crew at Plymouth are expected to be available as a result of Covid or isolation nearer to Christmas and it would seem that GWR (Great Western Railway) have closed their booking fir that period and indicating people to book on National Express.

https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/b5b5fb95-311a-4ce3-ae9d-59ccfe4b5060
From about 19:41:00 to 10:46:00
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broadgage
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« Reply #1456 on: December 17, 2020, 05:34:50 »

The present pandemic is clearly an exceptional situation, and therefore one should not be unduly critical of GWR (Great Western Railway) for failing to run the advertised service.
Before "letting them of the hook" entirely, we should remember that they failed pretty miserably to engage sufficient staff to run a full service, long before the pandemic.

I presume that during this pandemic, that the normal "attrition rate" of resignations and retirements continues, and that after the pandemic that the staffing situation will be worse than before.

I can see two means by which the present situation could be slightly improved.
Firstly permit drivers and train managers to postponne or carry forward annual leave as desired, rather than forcing them to take leave by the normaly required date and making a bad situation worse.

Secondly, invite drivers and train managers due for retirement to stay on slightly past retirement age, subject to being medically fit. Todays railway is not a place for the seriously old, but many fit and about to retire workers could stay for another year, or two, perhaps part time.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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« Reply #1457 on: December 17, 2020, 06:51:10 »

Worth noting that although ticket acceptance is in place with SWR» (South Western Railway - about) to use their services between Basingstoke and Exeter, their services are reported to be disrupted today due to staff absence. 
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1458 on: December 17, 2020, 07:11:22 »

Sir Peter Hendy on questioning by the Transport Select Committee indicated that only about 25% of train crew at Plymouth are expected to be available as a result of Covid or isolation nearer to Christmas and it would seem that GWR (Great Western Railway) have closed their booking fir that period and indicating people to book on National Express.

https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/b5b5fb95-311a-4ce3-ae9d-59ccfe4b5060
From about 19:41:00 to 10:46:00

I'm not aware of any other organisation of any scale anywhere in the UK (United Kingdom) that has lost 75% of its staff due to Covid infection or isolation - worth remembering as well that this is geographically one of the lowest affected areas of the UK and that train drivers spend most of their day alone in a sealed cab which is regularly cleaned/disinfected.

You might expect these sort of rates amongst (for example) supermarket staff, teachers, NHS workers but thankfully that hasn't happened.

Has there been a failure of social distancing or perhaps some sort of staff gathering where this exposure could have taken place?
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a-driver
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« Reply #1459 on: December 17, 2020, 08:46:36 »


I'm not aware of any other organisation of any scale anywhere in the UK (United Kingdom) that has lost 75% of its staff due to Covid infection or isolation - worth remembering as well that this is geographically one of the lowest affected areas of the UK and that train drivers spend most of their day alone in a sealed cab which is regularly cleaned/disinfected.

You might expect these sort of rates amongst (for example) supermarket staff, teachers, NHS workers but thankfully that hasn't happened.

Has there been a failure of social distancing or perhaps some sort of staff gathering where this exposure could have taken place?

Train drivers share messroom facilities with customer hosts and train managers.... roles which are customer facing.  Some train drivers also have children and spouses which may work in high risk environments, it only takes one person to unknowingly bring the virus in.
To suggest a staff gathering is quite frankly ridiculous.  To do you really think they?d put the safety of their own families at risk?

Train drivers don?t spend most on their day in a sealed environment and whilst they may be based in the lowest risk area, they do travel to higher risk areas. 

They haven?t lost 75% of their staff.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2020, 09:08:46 by a-driver » Logged
a-driver
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« Reply #1460 on: December 17, 2020, 08:49:11 »


I can see two means by which the present situation could be slightly improved.
Firstly permit drivers and train managers to postponne or carry forward annual leave as desired, rather than forcing them to take leave by the normaly required date and making a bad situation worse.

This causes an issue where next year, you?ll have more drivers unable to use their leave.  The company only guarantees a certain amount off on any given day.

Quote
Secondly, invite drivers and train managers due for retirement to stay on slightly past retirement age, subject to being medically fit. Todays railway is not a place for the seriously old, but many fit and about to retire workers could stay for another year, or two, perhaps part time.

Been done.  I am aware of several who have delayed retirement until the middle of next year
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RA
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« Reply #1461 on: December 17, 2020, 10:11:24 »

I'm not aware of any other organisation of any scale anywhere in the UK (United Kingdom) that has lost 75% of its staff due to Covid infection or isolation - worth remembering as well that this is geographically one of the lowest affected areas of the UK and that train drivers spend most of their day alone in a sealed cab which is regularly cleaned/disinfected.

You might expect these sort of rates amongst (for example) supermarket staff, teachers, NHS workers but thankfully that hasn't happened.

Has there been a failure of social distancing or perhaps some sort of staff gathering where this exposure could have taken place?

It is 75% of one depot, not 75% of the entire organisation. With the best will in the world, it is impossible to fully mitigate against such a local event happening as staff do have lives outside of work that will see them interact with others such as partners and children. The important thing to do is to take sufficient action to prevent it spreading to other locations. Those that follow rugby union may be aware that the professional clubs are following strict protocols such as social distancing, regular testing and player 'bubbles'. This hasn't prevented an outbreak at Exeter Chiefs (in my opinion an extremely professional and well run club) and has seen them have to forfeit their next match owing to the squad self-isolating. Their opponents from last week, Glasgow Warriors, have had to do likewise after being in contact with them. It shows it is not as easy as saying there are measures in place so it won't happen.

Back to railways, I know that Bristol had a lot of staff unavailable for similar reasons earlier this year, however the effects were less noticeable because of the reduced timetable in operation at the time. Large 'urban' depots such as Paddington, Bristol and Plymouth will be more susceptible than smaller 'rural' depots such as Par and Westbury because of the surrounding environs where the staff live and interact with the outside world. It is also unsurprising that these outbreaks have coincided with the colder weather and reduced daylight where staff are more likely to be inside for longer periods than outside. In the summer, there were plenty of staff who would take their break outside in the fresh air. Understandably, this is less appealing at this time of year.

I am of the opinion that reinstating more trains at the recent timetable change wasn't the best move at this time of year and has exacerbated the problem as I am sure that there will be further localised outbreaks at depots this winter.
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a-driver
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« Reply #1462 on: December 17, 2020, 12:12:07 »


It is 75% of one depot, not 75% of the entire organisation.


It is certainly not 75% of one depot!  That would equate to hundreds and would almost certainly see Public Health England launching an investigation!
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broadgage
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« Reply #1463 on: December 17, 2020, 13:07:27 »


I can see two means by which the present situation could be slightly improved.
Firstly permit drivers and train managers to postponne or carry forward annual leave as desired, rather than forcing them to take leave by the normaly required date and making a bad situation worse.

This causes an issue where next year, you?ll have more drivers unable to use their leave.  The company only guarantees a certain amount off on any given day.

Quote
Secondly, invite drivers and train managers due for retirement to stay on slightly past retirement age, subject to being medically fit. Todays railway is not a place for the seriously old, but many fit and about to retire workers could stay for another year, or two, perhaps part time.

Been done.  I am aware of several who have delayed retirement until the middle of next year

Glad to hear that commonsense has prevailed and that some drivers have been able to delay retirement.

As regards annual holidays, I would hope that delays or postponnement would be allowed, WITHOUT ANY LOSS OR REDUCTION in the total holiday entitlement.
I appreciate that this does delay the problem, but hopefully some extra staff will have been engaged and trained by the time these holidays are eventually taken.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
RA
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« Reply #1464 on: December 17, 2020, 16:04:01 »


It is 75% of one depot, not 75% of the entire organisation.


It is certainly not 75% of one depot!  That would equate to hundreds and would almost certainly see Public Health England launching an investigation!

The 75% number was based on the Sir Peter Hendy response yesterday for predicted availability at the depot next week, although I am not sure whether that was just the drivers or all grades. He would appear to be way off then? If so that'll teach me to check his figures before posting. However, that is inclusive of those self-isolating as a precautionary measure. It is probable (although not definite) that a large percentage of the precautionary self-isolating staff will not have caught the virus and therefore would most certainly not see Public Health England launch an investigation. However, if a large proportion of those do subsequently test positive, then you may well be right.
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grahame
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« Reply #1465 on: December 17, 2020, 18:49:25 »

From GWR (Great Western Railway):

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You may be aware that we have been operating a reduced timetable on our Devon and Cornwall services this week.  This is as a result of a number of positive Covid cases, and around 50 other members of staff having to self-isolate under Track and Trace requirements.
 
This has impacted driver availability and we will be operating a reduced timetable on our West of England services through to Devon and Cornwall until at least Sunday 27 December. Details of the long distance service changes through to the 24 December are on our website https://www.gwr.com/travel-updates/live-network-updates.
 
We are working with Network Rail to remove these trains from journey planners as quickly as possible so that customers can see the amended timetable.  Where we have contact details, we will be in touch with customers offering advice on moving their booking to alternative services, or if they prefer, offering a full refund.  Everyone who has booked to travel will be able to do so, though it might mean moving to a different service.
 
We are also monitoring ticket sales on our reservable services and where trains have reached or are close to social distancing capacity, we are no longer taking bookings for those services. 
 
Other train operators continue to provide services, although these are expected to be busy, and customers can also choose to switch to travel by coach. National Express, Megabus and Snap are all putting on extra services during the Christmas travel window.
 
We know how important it is that we get this right and we are doing all we can to reduce inconvenience and to support our customers.  We do however face a significant challenge with so many key staff unable to report for work.
 
Government travel advice remains to only use public transport if necessary having looked at all other options. This will help us support those who have no other option to travel by train to be able to do so. If you are able to help us to spread the message about checking journeys before travelling at gwr.com/check we will be very grateful.
 
I know you will join with me in wishing our crew a speedy recovery and you have my assurance that we are doing all we can to make sure customers are able to complete their journeys.
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« Reply #1466 on: December 17, 2020, 19:23:32 »


I presume that during this pandemic, that the normal "attrition rate" of resignations and retirements continues, and that after the pandemic that the staffing situation will be worse than before.

Retirements are continuing, although this Engineer has deferred his retirement for a year or so

.
Secondly, invite drivers and train managers due for retirement to stay on slightly past retirement age, subject to being medically fit. Todays railway is not a place for the seriously old, but many fit and about to retire workers could stay for another year, or two, perhaps part time.

There is no set retirement age now, so all a member of staff has to do once they are over their pension scheme ag is give notice of resignation and inform the Railway Pension Scheme, a manager can ask someone to reconsider but cannot refuse
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« Reply #1467 on: December 17, 2020, 21:12:35 »


Retirements are continuing, although this Engineer has deferred his retirement for a year or so


The railway will soldier on for a few more years - audible sighs of relief all round!

Greetings

OTC
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« Reply #1468 on: December 17, 2020, 23:18:47 »

Somewhat surprised you can still book berths to Cornwall on 23rd Sleeper at this late stage ! Presume Christmas holidays in Cornwall or visits to Granny in Penzance are greatly reduced this year ?
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1469 on: December 18, 2020, 07:16:06 »

Today's crew shortage cancellation list.............

05:40 Penzance to Exeter St Davids due 08:51
05:49 Plymouth to London Paddington due 08:59
05:55 Reading to Redhill due 07:24
06:46 Reading to Gatwick Airport due 08:22
07:04 London Paddington to Paignton due 10:17
07:06 Truro to Falmouth Docks due 07:32
07:06 Reading to Redhill due 08:37
07:12 London Paddington to Cardiff Central due 09:08
07:13 Paignton to London Paddington due 10:29
07:32 Redhill to Reading due 09:04
07:42 Falmouth Docks to Truro due 08:10
07:42 Truro to Falmouth Docks due 08:06
08:15 Falmouth Docks to Truro due 08:43
08:32 Gatwick Airport to Reading due 09:54
08:35 Plymouth to London Paddington due 12:04
08:45 Truro to Falmouth Docks due 09:09
08:51 Redhill to Reading due 10:45
09:15 Falmouth Docks to Truro due 09:42
09:25 Exeter St Davids to Penzance due 12:40
09:28 London Paddington to Cheltenham Spa due 11:30
09:37 London Paddington to Paignton due 12:49
09:51 Cardiff Central to London Paddington due 11:41
10:10 Par to Newquay due 11:02
10:20 London Paddington to Oxford due 11:13
10:35 London Paddington to Exeter St Davids due 12:59
10:54 Paignton to London Paddington due 14:07
11:12 Newquay to Par due 12:01
11:18 London Paddington to Cardiff Central due 13:17
11:20 Reading to Redhill due 12:52
11:28 London Paddington to Cheltenham Spa due 13:31
11:36 Liskeard to Looe due 12:05
11:50 Penzance to Plymouth due 13:50
11:59 Cheltenham Spa to London Paddington due 13:59
12:01 Reading to Gatwick Airport due 13:25
12:02 Oxford to London Paddington due 12:54
12:08 Looe to Liskeard due 12:33
12:15 Truro to Falmouth Docks due 12:39
12:34 London Paddington to Exeter St Davids due 14:59
12:36 Liskeard to Looe due 13:04
12:45 Falmouth Docks to Truro due 13:13
13:00 Redhill to Reading due 14:33
13:06 Looe to Liskeard due 13:34
13:15 Penzance to Plymouth due 15:09
13:18 London Paddington to Cardiff Central due 15:17
13:20 London Paddington to Oxford due 14:13
13:29 Gatwick Airport to Reading due 14:51
13:36 Liskeard to Looe due 14:05
13:36 Reading to Redhill due 14:47
13:40 Exeter St Davids to London Paddington due 16:14
13:53 Cardiff Central to London Paddington due 15:41
13:59 Cheltenham Spa to London Paddington due 15:59
14:08 Looe to Liskeard due 14:33
14:12 Paignton to London Paddington due 17:09
14:36 Liskeard to Looe due 15:04
14:48 St Erth to St Ives due 14:58
15:02 St Ives to St Erth due 15:14
15:06 Looe to Liskeard due 15:37
15:08 Redhill to Reading due 16:19
15:18 St Erth to St Ives due 15:29
15:33 St Ives to St Erth due 15:44
15:35 Plymouth to Penzance due 17:40
15:38 Exeter St Davids to London Paddington due 18:09
15:40 Liskeard to Looe due 16:13
15:48 St Erth to St Ives due 15:58
15:54 Cardiff Central to London Paddington due 17:43
16:02 London Paddington to Bristol Temple Meads due 17:35
16:03 St Ives to St Erth due 16:16
16:16 Looe to Liskeard due 16:42
16:25 Westbury to Swindon due 17:08
16:37 London Paddington to Plymouth due 20:11
16:44 Liskeard to Looe due 17:12
17:00 Plymouth to Liskeard due 17:35
17:14 Looe to Liskeard due 17:42
17:36 London Paddington to Paignton due 21:16
17:36 Swindon to Westbury due 18:17
17:46 Liskeard to Looe due 18:15
18:17 Looe to Liskeard due 18:43
18:23 Par to Newquay due 19:15
18:37 London Paddington to Plymouth due 22:12
18:39 Westbury to Swindon due 19:21
18:49 Liskeard to Looe due 19:17
19:19 Looe to Liskeard due 19:47
19:20 Reading to Redhill due 21:01
19:22 Newquay to Par due 20:11
19:30 Bristol Temple Meads to London Paddington due 21:08
19:49 Liskeard to Looe due 20:18
20:29 Par to Newquay due 21:21
20:29 Looe to Liskeard due 20:55
20:45 Swindon to Westbury due 21:26
21:26 Newquay to Par due 22:15
21:36 Paignton to Newton Abbot due 21:52
« Last Edit: December 18, 2020, 07:22:00 by TaplowGreen » Logged
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