C7 Restriction Code

[whole diary]

[Fourbee]

There's swathes of contradictions and ambiguities across all the channels where one might expect to see information regarding these restrictions:

-printed material
-nre.co.uk (the truncated URL that appears on tickets with the restriction code)
-individual pages on TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) websites
-NFM^▸ (National Fares Manual)/Avantix^▸ (Ticket Issuing System used on board trains) Traveller
-TOC and third party journey planners/ticketing retailers (including differences between WebTIS/Trainline powered ones)

Frankly, the lack of consistency is ridiculous. If anyone encounters difficulties just remember the following from the Consumer Rights Act:

69Contract terms that may have different meanings

(1)If a term in a consumer contract, or a consumer notice, could have different meanings, the meaning that is most favourable to the consumer is to prevail.

[JayMac]

That is correct, but the wording in the Consumer Rights Act doesn't necessarily allow you to board your chosen, and valid to use, train. If Paddington gateline staff say no, you don't get an immediate court case that would decide in your favour.

What you do get is the hassle of being denied travel, the soul destroying process of explaining your side to the supervisor, then the station manager, then customer services. After all that you still won't get a satisfactory resolution. So you then escalate to the Customer Service Director. He promises staff training, increases the goodwill gesture that you were fobbed of with by his department and says he'll monitor the situation personally.

When it happens to you again, with threats to call BTP^▸ (British Transport Police) when you firmly stand your ground, he meets you personally and says he'll chase up the staff training but won't commit to any disciplinary action for staff who have wilfully denied you travel with a valid ticket. The goodwill is increased to a meal for two on a Pullman service.

When it happens a third time you decide to drastically reduce your leisure journeys through Paddington with GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway). Why keep giving them money in return for hassle?

That's what happened to me. I gave up complaining as it was getting me down. My opinion of GWR is still clouded by those experiences.

[didcotdean]

These cards are produced for many destinations - I have attached to this message the ones for Oxford and Didcot Parkway. They take different approaches; the one to Oxford lists all services, including ones that require a change at Reading/Didcot, where as the one to Didcot lists only 'fast' services and unlisted 'stopping services'. Odd because they are actually on each side of a single card.

They attempt to summarise a complex situation but as already said create issues of their own, from use of jargon, and not covering all ticket types and circumstances, tacetly assuming a ticket just from Paddington. For example on the Didcot one what is a stopping service? The 'fast' services also all stop before Didcot, just not as often.

[stuving]

The leaflet refers to "Off Peak Day". Ticket Restriction C7 is one that is mostly (if not only) applied to Day ticket types.

The leaflet is not suitable information for the trains you can use on Off Peak (period) Returns across the GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) network. It would hinder rather than help.

That's true - obviously it doesn't apply to tickets it doesn't apply to - and in fact the leaflet is Reading-centric (and says so) even if it also applies to longer journeys. That arises naturally in that the not-non-stop trains that are allowed only go to Reading or the next terminating stop (Didcot/Oxford/Bedwyn) - or Frome (but you can't get a day return from there). And the ex-Reading restrictions are designed to stop you changing back onto one of the forbidden trains, even if they are badly miscoded for JPs.

I guess we do still have 57 varieties of off-peak restriction to deal with. But on the basis of a quick look, that list does seem to work generally for off-peak day returns and for off-peak returns from the same stations. So maybe they are not so far from a standard leaflet for CDRs^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day')) - though the category "SVRs from stations also offering CDRs" is hardly a helpful one. But you could say that a first step towards a sane set of rules would be to make them simple enough to go on standard leaflet.

[Fourbee]

That is correct, but the wording in the Consumer Rights Act doesn't necessarily allow you to board your chosen, and valid to use, train. If Paddington gateline staff say no, you don't get an immediate court case that would decide in your favour.

I re-read my last post and it came across as a panacea, whereas it probably is of more use after boarding - notwithstanding any unpleasantness which might occur on the train too.

Is there really nothing in the customer's legal armoury which would ameliorate (I'm thinking financially which is a language most companies understand) the wholly unacceptable situations you experienced?

[JayMac]

It really is limited to a civil contract dispute. There may be some limited legal recourse for prosecuting for harassment, both civil and criminal. But that won't apply for a single incident. Even if there's more than one incident the evidence threshold is quite high.

What's really needed is a regulator with teeth. The Furniture Rail Ombudsman isn't that unfortunately.