Train GraphicClick on the map to explore geographics
 
I need help
FAQ
Emergency
About .
Travel & transport from BBC stories as at 04:55 29 Mar 2024
- Bus plunges off South Africa bridge, killing 45
* Easter getaway begins with flood alerts in place
- Easter travel warning as millions set to hit roads
Read about the forum [here].
Register [here] - it's free.
What do I gain from registering? [here]
 02/06/24 - Summer Timetable starts
17/08/24 - Bus to Imber
27/09/25 - 200 years of passenger trains

On this day
29th Mar (1913)
Foundation of National Union or Railwaymen (*)

Train RunningCancelled
07:00 Bedwyn to Newbury
07:22 Newbury to Bedwyn
08:13 Newbury to Bedwyn
08:46 Bedwyn to Newbury
09:54 Bedwyn to Newbury
10:22 Newbury to Bedwyn
11:29 Newbury to Bedwyn
11:57 Bedwyn to Newbury
12:52 Bedwyn to Newbury
Short Run
04:54 Plymouth to London Paddington
05:12 Reading to Bedwyn
05:33 Plymouth to London Paddington
05:55 Plymouth to London Paddington
06:00 Bedwyn to London Paddington
06:37 Plymouth to London Paddington
07:03 London Paddington to Paignton
08:35 Plymouth to London Paddington
10:35 London Paddington to Exeter St Davids
Delayed
21:45 Penzance to London Paddington
23:45 London Paddington to Penzance
05:03 Penzance to London Paddington
06:05 Penzance to London Paddington
07:10 Penzance to London Paddington
08:03 London Paddington to Penzance
08:15 Penzance to London Paddington
09:04 London Paddington to Plymouth
09:37 London Paddington to Paignton
10:04 London Paddington to Penzance
11:03 London Paddington to Plymouth
PollsOpen and recent polls
Closed 2024-03-25 Easter Escape - to where?
Abbreviation pageAcronymns and abbreviations
Stn ComparatorStation Comparator
Rail newsNews Now - live rail news feed
Site Style 1 2 3 4
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
March 29, 2024, 05:06:43 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most recently liked subjects
[98] West Wiltshire Bus Changes April 2024
[97] would you like your own LIVE train station departure board?
[86] Return of the BRUTE?
[74] Infrastructure problems in Thames Valley causing disruption el...
[53] If not HS2 to Manchester, how will traffic be carried?
[23] Reversing Beeching - bring heritage and freight lines into the...
 
News: the Great Western Coffee Shop ... keeping you up to date with travel around the South West
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
Author Topic: Virgin Trains scraps Friday afternoon peak restrictions from Euston  (Read 3256 times)
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40690



View Profile WWW Email
« on: November 01, 2018, 16:42:14 »

From the Manchester Evening News

Quote
Virgin Trains scraps Friday afternoon peak restrictions from London Euston to Manchester

The huge difference in many peak and off-peak fares previously led to huge demand for the first Friday night off-peak trains

Virgin Trains said congestion has eased since it began a trial to end Friday afternoon peak restrictions in July.

It has now decided to make the change permanent.

The trial resulted in a decrease in average loading - which shows the proportion of passengers to seats - on a number of previously overcrowded services, such as:

    7pm London Euston to Manchester (from 113% to 51%)
    7.03pm London Euston to Birmingham (from 113% to 39%)
    7.10pm from London Euston to Holyhead (from 123% to 85%)

Virgin Trains reported an additional 3,500 journeys were made each Friday during the trial amid an increase in passenger satisfaction.

The firm's commercial director Sarah Copley said: "Rather than everyone waiting for the first off-peak train on Friday evening, people can now travel whenever's convenient for them.

"This change means we've been able to reduce congestion, whilst helping people save money and make an earlier start to their weekends."

Are there any lessons here for Friday evening departures from Paddington?
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
ChrisB
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 12334


View Profile Email
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2018, 16:47:04 »

Basically, it is cancelling the Friday evening peak fares.....must mean a drop in income?
Logged
Timmer
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 6293


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2018, 17:10:36 »

From the Manchester Evening News

Quote
Virgin Trains scraps Friday afternoon peak restrictions from London Euston to Manchester

The huge difference in many peak and off-peak fares previously led to huge demand for the first Friday night off-peak trains

Virgin Trains said congestion has eased since it began a trial to end Friday afternoon peak restrictions in July.

It has now decided to make the change permanent.

The trial resulted in a decrease in average loading - which shows the proportion of passengers to seats - on a number of previously overcrowded services, such as:

    7pm London Euston to Manchester (from 113% to 51%)
    7.03pm London Euston to Birmingham (from 113% to 39%)
    7.10pm from London Euston to Holyhead (from 123% to 85%)

Virgin Trains reported an additional 3,500 journeys were made each Friday during the trial amid an increase in passenger satisfaction.

The firm's commercial director Sarah Copley said: "Rather than everyone waiting for the first off-peak train on Friday evening, people can now travel whenever's convenient for them.

"This change means we've been able to reduce congestion, whilst helping people save money and make an earlier start to their weekends."

Are there any lessons here for Friday evening departures from Paddington?
I think so but I’m sure there will be plenty who will post to say why it wouldn’t work.

For what it’s worth I think it would relieve the chronic overcowding on services just after 7pm you sometimes see on a Friday evening.

Times have changed, many either work from home on a Friday or don’t work at all that day.

Respect to Virgin Trains for making this change. Would be good if GWR (Great Western Railway) would give it a try too.
Logged
JayMac
Data Manager
Hero Member
******
Posts: 18894



View Profile
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2018, 17:11:59 »

I'm sure Virgin have crunched the numbers. They've stated there was no revenue impact during the trial period.

They've essentially given up trying to yield manage Friday afternoon/evening. There may be some increases in price point/reduction in availability of Advance Purchase fares to compensate.

There is a difference between Euston and Paddington though. Virgin only have Off Peak and Anytime. At Paddington there is three steps. Super Off Peak, Off Peak and Anytime. There are also differing restrictions if your Off Peak journey is beyond a certain point. For example an Off Peak ticket to Plymouth is valid after 1801. For Exeter it's 1831.

There is still a problem with overcrowding on long distance services on the first trains after the evening peak at Paddington. Whether GWR (Great Western Railway) will follow Virgin's lead remains to be seen. During this protracted electrication/IET (Intercity Express Train) introduction period I don't think they'll be doing any fares tinkering. I imagine GWR's yield management is all the over the place at the moment.

The time to look at fares changes is when all the IETs are in service, and the new timetables have bedded in. The increase in capacity those changes will bring will inform yield management and pre/post peak period loadings.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 17:52:43 by bignosemac » Logged

"Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for the rest of the day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."

- Sir Terry Pratchett.
IndustryInsider
Data Manager
Hero Member
******
Posts: 10095


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2018, 17:27:04 »

The other big difference is that Virgin out of Euston doesn't really have a 'Reading' with its large commuter demand for season ticket holders.  I don't think Crossrail will have much effect on that, though depending on how the IET (Intercity Express Train) timetable is structured, some trains not stopping at Reading might.
Logged

To view my GWML (Great Western Main Line) Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40690



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2018, 17:29:53 »

Further angle on the story - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46056276
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
TaplowGreen
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 7746



View Profile
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2018, 18:51:17 »

Excellent idea - well done Virgin - possibly the first example of a TOC (Train Operating Company) putting the customer first, but to be fair they are streets ahead of GWR (Great Western Railway) when it comes to customer service.
Logged
old original
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 877


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2018, 19:26:41 »

Bear in mind that for London - Cornwall passengers off peak have been valid on the 1703 on Fridays for some time, but not  Monday - Thursdays
Logged

8 Billion people on a wet rock - of course we're not happy
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40690



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2018, 05:08:33 »

Times and loading balances are changing ... with Friday being what Saturday was 50 years ago, perhaps, and is Thursday becoming the new Friday?   Season ticket sales are down as people aren't travelling all five days but working some from home, etc .... and it makes sense to re-balance fares to ensure best use of seats and best loadings. 

Think I saw a comment about 3,500 extra journeys on Virgin as a result of their change - not sure over what period, but if the change has helped reduce the standing and brought more users to rail, then it's good for the passengers, and actually not such a slows leader for the operators!

I was reminded - but tangential - of the graphic that's now about 10 years old - the DfT» (Department for Transport - about)'s passenger journey start times on a  weekday, superimposed with the then - running TransWilts times of 06:12 and 18:44 from Swindon, and 07:04 and 19:35 from Westbury.

Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
IndustryInsider
Data Manager
Hero Member
******
Posts: 10095


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2018, 06:51:01 »

I think I remember reading, from Stop HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) or similar, that a survey had revealed some long distance departures were only around half full during peak hours from Euston, before the first off-peak ones were swamped.  That certainly isn’t the case for Paddington.
Logged

To view my GWML (Great Western Main Line) Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
TaplowGreen
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 7746



View Profile
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2018, 07:13:55 »

I think I remember reading, from Stop HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) or similar, that a survey had revealed some long distance departures were only around half full during peak hours from Euston, before the first off-peak ones were swamped.  That certainly isn’t the case for Paddington.

…….which would suggest a compelling case for GWR (Great Western Railway) to follow Virgin's example!  Wink
Logged
IndustryInsider
Data Manager
Hero Member
******
Posts: 10095


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2018, 15:11:22 »

The opposite really, as the trains from Paddington are full of season ticket holders (mostly) for Reading already.  Unless you make more trains pick up only at Reading but then you just push Reading commuters onto other already busy trains.
Logged

To view my GWML (Great Western Main Line) Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40690



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2018, 13:44:47 »

The opposite really, as the trains from Paddington are full of season ticket holders (mostly) for Reading already.  Unless you make more trains pick up only at Reading but then you just push Reading commuters onto other already busy trains.

Straying off the "Friday peak fares" topic ... looking at the logic of crammed peak trains to Reading but more seats available thereafter, isn't there logic in replacing one IET (Intercity Express Train) (9 carriage or 10 carriage, effective Cool with a 12 car electric unit shuttling Paddington to Reading every 15 minutes and offering a slightly lower fare on it?   That way, the passenger load of the whole IET's run would be much better balanced, and indeed dwell time at Reading - with lots and lots of people getting off at the ends of carriages before any can get back on - could be reduced.

Paths?  Perhaps the Bedwyns and the Cheltenhams combine as 5+5,  the North Cotswolds and Banburys do the same thing,  one of the Bristols divides at Chippenham offering a Weymouth portion ...
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
ChrisB
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 12334


View Profile Email
« Reply #13 on: November 05, 2018, 11:24:30 »

No point in redeucing fares - most users at that time as mentioned are season ticket holders....
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40690



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2018, 07:19:59 »

Very interesting. Last night (Friday 14th December 2018) I left Paddington on the 18:15 for Swansea - a ten (5+5)  car IET (Intercity Express Train).  Announcements through the train before it left that "this is a peak train", and that only anytime tickets were valid all the way to Swansea, and not off peak or super off peak.    Train was very lightly loaded indeed - in my standard class carriage - in the forward unit ahead of mid-train first - I would estimate that only around 20% of seats were taken.  Frankly, shocked at the lack of crowd.

I happened, yesterday, to be able to use that train with my particular ticketing - but more normally I would catch the 19:00 to Swindon and it would be much, much busier off peak ... or if I missed the 19:00 cram onto the 19:30 all the way to Chippenham, cursing I had missed the last Melksham connection and the fact the 234 bus has gone, but at least being able to put the difference between an off peak and super off peak fare toward the cost of a taxi for the final journey section.

I suspect my experience indicates there could be some benefit in evening out train loading on a Friday evening by amending the peak designations ... whether that would result in an unwelcome financial hit on GWR (Great Western Railway) is, of course, quite another matter!
« Last Edit: December 15, 2018, 07:47:38 by grahame » Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by customers of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules (email link to report). Forum hosted by Well House Consultants

Jump to top of pageJump to Forum Home Page