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Author Topic: Tarka Line Overcrowding Problem To Be Solved  (Read 6817 times)
Lee
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« on: January 22, 2019, 03:29:52 pm »

Tarka Line article with quotes from our very own RichardB, kindly verified to the moderation team by the man himself - https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/overcrowded-devon-train-problem-solved-2452676
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« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2019, 04:00:52 pm »

It says that the "new" trains have 20% more capacity. If the trains are as badly overcrowded as the article says, is that likely to be enough?  Especially if more people start using them once marketing starts again. Also I noticed that the article quoted passenger figures to 2016. If people have been put off travelling, maybe 2017 and 2018 have shown no growth or even a fall?

Mind you, at least the extra seats are genuine, rather than being by squeezing 5 across which is what is happening in the Bristol and Cardiff area. It still seems absurd to me that the Barnstaple branch gets Class 158s, but the longer distance Cardiff Portsmouth line gets 5 abreast turbos.
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2019, 05:56:59 pm »


Mind you, at least the extra seats are genuine, rather than being by squeezing 5 across which is what is happening in the Bristol and Cardiff area. It still seems absurd to me that the Barnstaple branch gets Class 158s, but the longer distance Cardiff Portsmouth line gets 5 abreast turbos.


I really cannot believe that someone thought a Turbo, designed for inner suburban use, was suitable for journeys of 3 hours +
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PhilWakely
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« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2019, 06:38:00 pm »

Forgive me as this comment should really go in the 'inappropriate use of stock photographs' thread, but I cannot find it.

Tarka Line article with quotes from our very own RichardB, kindly verified to the moderation team by the man himself - https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/overcrowded-devon-train-problem-solved-2452676
Note the use of a photograph of an 8 coach HST in an article about overcrowded 2 coach services. Good old Devon Live!
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grahame
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« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2019, 06:52:45 pm »

I really cannot believe that someone thought a Turbo, designed for inner suburban use, was suitable for journeys of 3 hours +

Sorry - has anyone even thought that 2+3 seating is suitable for a 3 hour journey.  Some people decided they are usable (a far far lower hurdle) for the three hour journeys ... and especially so as most of the users of the service are making much shouter journeys, for which the trains aren't so bad.  Also noting that the Cardiff - Portsmouth service does NOT serve London, nor does it serve GWR's HQ.
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« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2019, 07:12:15 pm »

There should be a decent proportion of longer distance traffic given the size of the cities. But it's hardly a surprise if there isn't given the quality of trains used.  Turbos will probably drive more longer distance passengers onto the road, especially as the journey time end to end is much slower by train. So then that will be used to justify even more tailoring to short term journeys. No toilets and side on seating next?
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broadgage
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« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2019, 08:33:00 pm »

For years we were told that the introduction of the IETS, and the new EMUs for the Thames valley services would greatly reduce overcrowding, not only on the routes thus served, but also by freeing up cascaded stock for use elsewhere.

Not much seems to have happened.

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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
grahame
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« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2019, 08:53:09 pm »

Quote
The Tarka Line is so overcrowded that the Devon and Cornwall Rail Partnership have stopped advertising train journeys on the line in North Devon - but new trains are on the way.

The line between Exeter and Barnstaple is one a number of branch lines that the partnership promotes as research shows that people often think trains are twice as expensive and run half as frequently as they actually do.


But Richard Burningham, manager of Devon and Cornwall Rail Partnership, told the Devon and Exeter Rail Project Working Party at their meeting on Friday afternoon that they have stopped promoting the line in North Devon as it the rolling stock cannot cope with the passenger numbers.

158s strike me as a good choice for the Exeter to Barnstaple service, with most passengers being end to end.  And provided there is enough capacity on them - i.e. they're arranged into trains with enough carriages.

TransWilts also hit the capacity limit and we reduced marketing; with longer trains now, it's on the grow again; MRUG tomorrow night should give us an idea of their 2019 plans.
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RichardB
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« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2019, 09:43:32 pm »


158s strike me as a good choice for the Exeter to Barnstaple service, with most passengers being end to end.  And provided there is enough capacity on them - i.e. they're arranged into trains with enough carriages.


Me too, Graham.  It also helps that there will be extra trains in the timetable from, hopefully, December providing a full hourly service through the day and removing two 90 minute gaps there at the moment.
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grahame
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« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2019, 09:48:49 pm »


158s strike me as a good choice for the Exeter to Barnstaple service, with most passengers being end to end.  And provided there is enough capacity on them - i.e. they're arranged into trains with enough carriages.


Me too, Graham.  It also helps that there will be extra trains in the timetable from, hopefully, December providing a full hourly service through the day and removing two 90 minute gaps there at the moment.

With the 90 minute gaps removed, is that going to mean that some of your customers base will have there trains at a 30 minute offset from what they are at the moment?   And if so ... advantage, disadvantage, short term 'hit' of long term build?
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« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2019, 10:26:09 pm »

There should be a decent proportion of longer distance traffic given the size of the cities. But it's hardly a surprise if there isn't given the quality of trains used.  Turbos will probably drive more longer distance passengers onto the road, especially as the journey time end to end is much slower by train. So then that will be used to justify even more tailoring to short term journeys. No toilets and side on seating next?

Well, as mentioned before Turbos have been working along the Cotswold Line daily since the early 1990s (and for a large part of that they formed the majority of the trains on the route), on journeys of 2-3 hours without seemingly that much fuss made of the lack of quality.  And that was before such luxuries as proper disabled spaces, universal access toilets, better air conditioning (though still not perfect) and free Wi-fi and plug/USB sockets were fitted. 

Perhaps when a proper franchise is let the new operator will be able to invest in new, better quality stock as TPE, Northern and Greater Anglia have done, and the Turbos will provide a much needed boost in capacity for only a few years before a more suitable replacement comes along?
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TonyK
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« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2019, 10:55:04 pm »

Tarka Line article with quotes from our very own RichardB, kindly verified to the moderation team by the man himself - https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/overcrowded-devon-train-problem-solved-2452676

Not RichardB's fault, but do they not have even sub-editors any more?

i like the Tarka line, and welcome the additional capacity. I look forward to trains from Okehampton.
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RichardB
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« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2019, 11:12:52 pm »


158s strike me as a good choice for the Exeter to Barnstaple service, with most passengers being end to end.  And provided there is enough capacity on them - i.e. they're arranged into trains with enough carriages.


Me too, Graham.  It also helps that there will be extra trains in the timetable from, hopefully, December providing a full hourly service through the day and removing two 90 minute gaps there at the moment.

With the 90 minute gaps removed, is that going to mean that some of your customers base will have there trains at a 30 minute offset from what they are at the moment?   And if so ... advantage, disadvantage, short term 'hit' of long term build?

The gaps are at unfortunate times (06 58 to 08 43 ex Barnstaple and 15 28 to 16 57 ex Exeter St D) so there is a big advantage in going to the hourly service.  Extra seats in the morning heading south and back in the afternoon will be a big help too.  We'll see but I hope (and cautiously expect - if that is not bold) people to be pleased.  Promotion will need to be very carefully done until we all see how things pan out in terms of capacity being there to meet the demand. 
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Andy
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« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2019, 11:58:09 am »

Tarka Line article with quotes from our very own RichardB, kindly verified to the moderation team by the man himself - https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-news/overcrowded-devon-train-problem-solved-2452676

Not RichardB's fault, but do they not have even sub-editors any more?

i like the Tarka line, and welcome the additional capacity. I look forward to trains from Okehampton.

Me, too. An Okehampton service would also help alleviate some overcrowding, hopefully.
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« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2019, 09:58:23 am »


158s strike me as a good choice for the Exeter to Barnstaple service, with most passengers being end to end.  And provided there is enough capacity on them - i.e. they're arranged into trains with enough carriages.


Me too, Graham.  It also helps that there will be extra trains in the timetable from, hopefully, December providing a full hourly service through the day and removing two 90 minute gaps there at the moment.

Hello,

I am a frequent user of the Tarka Line as Barnstaple is my local station and yes it does get very overcrowded on particular journeys atm. Do we know when the 158s will be appearing on the Tarka line, or has that yet to be declared?

Thanks in advance Smiley
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