Train Graphic
Great Western Passengers' Forum Great Western Coffee Shop - [home] and [about]
Read about the forum [here].
Register and contribute [here] - it's free.
article index - [here]
 27/04/2019 - TransWilts AGM
27/04/2019 - Melksham to Swanage trip
28/04/2019 - Melksham to Seaton trip
30/04/2019 - SERUG talk - Sidmouth
02/05/2019 - WWRUG - Trowbridge
15/05/2019 - Community Rail in the City
Random Image
Train Running @GWR Twitter Acronyms/Abbreviations Station Comparator Rail news GWR co. site Site Style 1 2 3 4 Chat on off
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
April 24, 2019, 04:49:51 am *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most liked recent subjects
[70] "Nationalise to end chaos" - Diane Abbot MP (Sunday ...
[65] Martson Vale Line receives first of new Class 230 stock
[61] Williams Rail Review
[56] Climate change protests to target overground?
[38] Great Western Main Line electrification - ongoing discussion
[36] 'Bath is ready to have things done'
News: A forum for passengers ... with input from rail professionals welcomed too
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Poll
Question: Should this group adopt the interim constitution for the period to the initial AGM?  (Voting closed: March 17, 2019, 06:48:50 am)
Yes, I am in favour of adopting the interim constitution - 67 (95.7%)
No, I am not in favour of adopting the interim constitution - 3 (4.3%)
Total Voters: 70

Linked Events
  • Constitution poll ends 6 a.m.: March 17, 2019
  • Coffee Shop AGM (provisional): June 08, 2019
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
Author Topic: Constitution and look ahead for the Coffee Shop - initial adoption vote  (Read 995 times)
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« on: March 13, 2019, 06:48:51 am »

The Coffee Shop Forum is now a decade old. We (the admin and moderator team) propose to adopt a formal structure and constitution to help clarify, protect and develop the forum for the next decade. The contents of the constitution and our foward planning has been under discussion for some time, and we now have a draft constitution which has been prepared by the admin and moderator team and fine tuned based on Frequent Poster board input.

The following posts on this thread comprises the interim/draft constitution and a look forward. We propose to hold a first AGM under this constitution on Saturday 1st June 2019 (or a date close to that), and that AGM will include a motion to adopt it as the permanent constitution subject to any changes incorporated prior to the meeting being called.

If you have any questions, please ask them (Frequent Poster thread http://www.passenger.chat/21184 or personal message to the author of this thread) prior to voting.

My thanks to everyone who has helped consider, write and tune this constitution, which I commend to you.


Edit to add - the draft constitution you're voting on makes several references to the forum agreement that members accept when they join the forum.    This is (always has been) available in a sticky topic ah http://www.passenger.chat/1761 together with code of conduct notes.  I have added a further copy of the forum agreement onto the end of this thread as it's pertinent to the constitution and sensible to have it all in the one place.  Note that the forum agreement includes agreement by the moderators in how they will treat you and your data - it's a two way thing.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2019, 10:51:46 am by grahame » Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2019, 06:50:38 am »

Constitution

* Constitutions have been around a long time, and tend to be written around groups / organisations which physically meet at their core.  We don't, so some parallels have been drawn (to help traditional-minded readers) and abstraction and changes to modernise are necessary.

* There is a tendency for some of the constitutions we have read to get very detailed, and that is something we're looking to avoid.

Identity

The name of the Group is the Great Western Coffee Shop Forum

The operating name of the internet forum shall be Great Western Coffee Shop as of the date of adoption of this constitution. This may be changed by a vote of a simple majority of the moderators, described in paragraphs following, in (for example) the light of changes in the operation or name of the Great Western Railway.

Objectives

The purposes of the Group are:
* providing a voice for the community
* promoting sustainable, healthy and accessible travel
* bringing communities together, supporting diversity & inclusion
* supporting social and economic development

To work towards these aims, the Group will operate an internet forum for discussion of matters relating to the Great Western Railway primarily, railways and public transport generally and connected topics.
The forum works on a partnership ethos and aims to fulfil its aims through the pillars of community rail as laid down by organisations such as the Department for Transport and ACoRP.

The Forum plans to be a permanent contributor to its aims, updating as appropriate through other avenues of technology.  It may also arrange and join events that may be of interest to current and potential members and publish information about relevant events arranged by third parties.

Membership

Organisations typically have members, committee and officers, and often a mailing list of interested parties that goes beyond members, and welcome guests to their meetings. For the Coffee Shop:

Guests are welcome to read any public pages, all of which contain links to allow them to email the administrators, and to the registration page if they want to move on to the next stage.

Members are people who've agreed to the forum agreement and who's registration has been accepted by an admin - checked with the moderator team if in doubt.

Voting Members are members who have posted at least 10 times or are otherwise in frequent posters. To be a voting member you are required to have logged in at least once in the last 12 months, and still have the ability to log in (so if you're banned, you're not a voting member)

This threshold of 10 posts ensures that we have active and confirmed genuine people taking part in any votes outlined in the constitution.  The forum has some members who, whilst logged on and reading (sometimes with many days of presence to their credit) haven't even introduced themselves and without physical meetings, phone calls, email exchanges, we really don't know them; the "10 posts" rule closes what could be a loophole in our ongoing purpose and security. 

You may wonder about "or otherwise in frequent posters". On one occasion I can think over in the 10 years since Frequent Posters was set up, we have promoted someone we knew very well into a moderator role just shy of the 10 posts - and an excellent decision it was too. We also have a technical admin who we can ask for help in an emergency; never had the emergency, but that person should have a vote.

Moderators are members who have been invited to, and agreed, to take on a watching brief when they're on the forum - to greet and assist.  And on the rare occasions where something's seriously needing attention in a more negative way to help deal with that.

Administrators are the handful of members who are deeply involved with daily operations of the forum.  The Webmaster is a technical administrator with admin authority and the ability to take backups, upgrade software, reconfigure server parameters, etc as appropriate for the continued running of the forum.

For the purpose of these rules, all administrators are also moderators and all moderators are also voting members.

A comparison to a regular group may be useful but does not form part of the constitution
ForumPhysical Group
GuestGuest
MemberOn Mailing list
Voting MemberPaid Up Member
ModeratorCommittee Member
AdministratorOfficer

The moderators shall be responsible for the overall operation of the Group, including but not limited to:
* raising funds, including receiving grants and donations
* procurement of technology services to facilitate operation of the internet forum
* preparation maintenance and application of the forum agreement and a code of conduct for members
* admission of members to the group, maintenance of a membership list, and reviewing membership
* protection of membersí data in accordance with legislation.

Membership is open to any individual who agrees to the forum agreement and demonstrates adherence to it and the code of conduct through their activities. The forum was set up by passengers, for passengers, but welcomes members from the rail industry and local and central government too. Employees of the rail industry or local and central government which relate to the topics discussed on the Coffee Shop will not normally be considered for appointment as moderators or administrators.

New moderators and administrators are appointed by the current administrators based on a discussion and a vote there if the outcome of these discussions is not clear, requiring a two thirds majority of those voting in a poll that's open for at least 7 days to be carried.  The process of appointing a new moderator or administrator can be instigated at any time by any existing administrator or moderator. The agreement of the proposed new moderator or administrator much be obtained before their appointment and before any vote is taken or before any change of status is applied.

Membership may be withdrawn from any person who does not adhere to the forum agreement and code of conduct. The decision shall be confirmed by a simple majority of the moderators. The member shall have the right to submit a statement to the Committee before a final or permanent decision is made, and shall be informed of the reason for any such decision. The nature of the forum is such that a withdrawal of membership as described here will normally be as a last resort.

Moderator or admin rights may be withdrawn from a moderator or admin following the same guidelines as withdrawal of membership.

Annual General Meeting

An Annual General Meeting shall be held to which all voting members will be invited at least 21 days before the meeting takes place. The meeting will take place between 31st March and 31st October and will be held at a location within the geographic area covered by the forum and accessible by public transport.  The meeting will be free of charge to members, but it will be up to individual members wishing to attend to meet their own costs of getting to the meeting unless prior agreement from the moderators.

Notice of meetings will be sent to the registered email address of voting members. Members will not be considered to be a voting member if it comes to the attention of the moderator team that an email sent from the forum to the member's registered address has not reached that member, and the moderator team will not be responsible for taking further steps to try to deliver the email. A public post will also be made on the forum to alert all readers to the meeting. Those two steps will be deemed sufficient notice of meeting.

The purpose of the AGM will be to receive reports from the webmaster, the treasurer, and others and to consider any changes to the constitution which have been proposed.  Such proposals must be notified to the admin team at least 14 days prior to the meeting, and indicate the support of at least 5 voting members.

The meeting will also confirm the appointment of the moderator and admin team 'en block', with a two thirds majority of those present and at least 30 votes required to block the confirmation.  In the event of the re-appointment failing, an extraordinary general meeting will be called within three months; procedures will be agreed on the forum under such circumstances, or if procedures cannot be agreed the webmaster(s) has/have the final say on outcome.

The AGM will be minuted and the minutes circulated via the forum, with a vote to approve them as being an accurate record within 4 weeks of the meeting.

As well as formal business, the AGM will be an opportunity for furthering the aims of the forum via networking sessions and speakers.

Financial and operational

To date (financial year 2018/19) the Coffee Shop has been funded by the webmaster / founder with all activities undertaken the members (at all levels) on an unpaid voluntary basis. From the acceptance of this constitution, the forum will move to a financial and operational model which is designed to be sustainable and scaleable in the future.

Income streams may include (but not be limited to) corporate members, advertising revenue, marketing and sales of promotional and other products, donations and grants applied for. Income streams will only be accepted where they are in line with the objectives set out in this constitution. Membership at the levels set out in the constitution is and will remain free of charge and this can only change by resolution at an Annual General or extraordinary general meeting.

Expenditure may include (but not be limited to) web hosting and domains, software licenses and specialist programming and support services, marketing and advertising, insurance and covering voting member's reasonable expenses incurred for activities undertaken on behalf of the forum. It shall also the cost of the AGM and any EGMs.

The forum shall insure its members and volunteers against risks incurred in their duties undertaken for the forum. Volunteers will be required to consider safety and risk in their activate for the forum

A Treasurer shall be appointed from amongst the moderator and admin team who shall look after the finances and operations and work on authorisations voted on or otherwise agreed "Behind the Counter". The treasurer shall be appointed for a period of one year.  The treasurer is also authorised to operate a bank account on behalf of the forum with transactions confirmed by another moderator.  The treasurer may hold other roles within the admin and moderator team and will be appointed by that team and from within it.

A set of unaudited accounts and a budget / forecast for the following year and years shall be produced by the treasurer. It will be the responsibility of the whole moderator and admin team to ensure that the forum's financial position is secure.

Winding up

Should the Coffee Shop forum vote at an AGM or EGM to disband (by a majority of two thirds of those present and at least 30 votes), the remaining team will undertake as orderly wind down as practical. The remaining team will distribute any residuary funds amongst community organisations with the geographic area which have similar aims to the forum as they see fit.

Should the number of voting members be less than 45, a simple majority of those attending the AGM or EGM will suffice for a decision.

AK/GE - 2019-03-10, updates 2019-03-12
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2019, 06:53:10 am »

Planning Ahead

Objectives

You may think that the wording we've chosen for our objectives is correct, but with an interesting slant. That's because the meeting in February, and other feedback and discussions, have shouted "Community Rail Partnership" at us.  The objectives are taken from the Department for Transport / Association of Community Rail Partnership's update of direction which come into effect next month - their four pillars.

The Coffee Shop has moved from being a protest group a decade ago to a candid friend to public transport in this decade.  The "Candid" bit lets us be honest where we feel (or our members have views) which are critical of how things are done, but where it's practical we make those candid comments constructive. We look to come up with things that will work for everyone, just like the line or service based CRPs. We also note that line and service based CRPs manage to square the difficult circle of accepting some operation and funding support from the Train Operators, whilst at the same time being that candid friend.

Let's wait and see what ACoRP membership / joining criteria brings in coming months.  Under the old designated / line / service regime I was left scratching my head as to how and if a virtual CRP covering a much wider area (whole franchise) would fit, but initial contacts have been made to look towards how this might be in the future under the updated direction and accreditation scheme. It certainly seems logical to build on the success of ACoRP "bringing life to local lines" as they move on to "Engaging communities in their railways" and we are a substantial community with the interest to reach out further. Excellent job done on local lines - how about engaging communities on secondary main lines such as Reading to Taunton and Cardiff to Portsmouth, and even main lines and London commuters.

ACoRP membership for the Coffee Shop CRP may be a "nice to have" - it was for TransWilts once we sorted out a couple of issues that made TransWilts a special case that didn't easily fit. But membership itself if not key - the ethos is.

I could write more on "objectives" - will do so later - but just to stress here that they'e concerned with appropriate positive encouragement of rail (and other public transport) use, and the benefits that brings to everyone.  It will include people who are enthusiastic, but we are not an enthusiasts club!

Feedback

This forum has been read by a surprising number of GWR staff over the years, including senior staff who are in a position to pick up comments and act upon them.   It's been very much an informal process over the years and we've not even known about it - "what a co-incidence - xyz was fixed" or a message received to answer a question that happened to have popped up.

I'm delighted to report that we're working with GWR (admin and / or mod team representatives to meet them later this month) to set up a channel for passing through public, moderator and admin issues and to receive briefings and feedback too.  There is a massive amount that could "go in" here - much has been hinted at before, but I prefer to wait for the first of the meetings before re-igniting discussions on those elements (I can list 8 straight off!).   Excellent news is that our initial key contact has responsibility right across the GWR patch, which takes well into consideration our area; Regional Manager <-> CRP is logical for line or area based.  I'm really looking forward to this link.

One work of caution - I'm disinclined to formally take up individual personal cases. Happy to advise forum members who to get in touch with (whether GWR or some other organisation) and point members at previous threads, web sites, etc that are likely to help them.

Funding

Multiple "thank you"s due here.  GWR have offered us an annual grant which they describe as "small" but I would describe as very significant indeed for us - and also significant in being annual (revenue) rather than one off (capital).  Ts & Cs such that we acknowledge their help but absolutely retain editorial control; very much joint interest in much/most stuff anyway.

CCIF bid confirmations for the 2019/20 year - where we asked for a one-off sum to get very serious upgrade and promotion work done - are not yet confirmed.  A cynic (who is involved with other bids but not a forum member) suggested that bids will only be confirmed at the very tail of this month, and he is fearful of scalings back even though he knows he's been put forward. However, I understand that the forum's modest bid is funded fully and very quickly.

The dash for the constitution - originally planned for May time - is in the most part to allow the admin / moderator team to set up the financial director role and bank account so we can get things under way.

On the funding front, a further big "thank you" - this time to Leah. I "cut my forum teeth" on her UK-Yankee board, and I could tell more than a story or three of past times.  Registered there in 2002. UK-Yankee makes us look puny - total members: 15255, total posts: 1008432, total topics: 68107 (4 to 6 times our numbers).  Leah has helped provide very useful information and guidance on what might otherwise be commercially sensitive stuff concerning advertising revenue and methods / options.   It's also reassuring, isn't it, to see the later version of the SMF software which is what we're using coping well with a five fold traffic increase. Which leads me on to ...

Software plans

Move forward to SMF 2.0.15 or similar (read back to last paragraph in previous section for background). Although we're using SMF already, we are SO out of date that it's no easy task - in fact others have been defeated as they move their databases.  We also have a lot of issues with "specials" that I have put in over the years.   However, reasonably confident it can be done and it must be done as the version of PHP we use is w-a-y out of date and the modern version is not 100% compatible.  By jumping back into the mainstream we'll sort out issues like search, board order, nice look and feel on all devices, and be ready to add all sorts of new things such as geotracking.

Industry data feeds to the likes or recent time trains, open train times and real time trains progress, as do bus feeds and map feeds. Once we're up to date and with device responsive pages, a lid is lifted... I'm not going to promise more than research at the moment

Community Rail in the City

At last - within the last few days - Network Rail at Reading have confirmed that they have space to host two Community Rail booths on 15th May 2019.  One's us, and the other's another GWR CRP who we know well, and who have decided to switch from Bristol Temple Meads to Reading.  Our objective on the day is to inform passengers passing by - especially commuters - of information (such as is available on the Coffee Shop) and opportunities that are available by public transport across the GWR area and wider.  Two meetings already set up on this - ACoRP and GWR and I'm confident of doing a good, purposed stand.

AGM and other real life events

Well - our constitution is written / proposed to have an AGM, and there will be other diary dates too.

I suspect GWR will have a Community Conference in Bristol on 13th / 14th June. We may find ourselves in Telford for ACoRP's annual party on 3rd October. And there's TWSW on 20th March and probably 5th October. RailFuture branch and promotion day is 26th October.  GWR has a stockholder's conference in the autumn too. These are opportunities to be evaluated to promote the Coffee Shop within and to other groups, and to learn to help feed data and allow whoever goes to update our members.

Less specifically dated, feeds of data on timetable changes, fare issues, engineering, etc, may also involve real life meetings, and I suspect that the team would be happy to accept appropriate invited to group and station events to talk and to tell people how great public transport and the Coffee Shop are.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2019, 09:57:02 am »

A couple of typos in the constitution have been brought to my attention.  They're 'obviously' the wrong word for another similar word (i.e. my correspondent correctly told me what the right word should be  Grin Grin) .   As voting is well under way, these typos have been noted and will be corrected in the final constitution to be voted on at the AGM should this current poll vote in that direction;  we won't be changing the text on which you're voting.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2019, 05:17:37 pm »

There are several references to the forum agreement made in the constitution (above in this thread).  That forum agreement is a two way street - it's what you agree to when you sign up, and it also talks about what the staff and owners of the forum (a.k.a. moderator / admin team) agree in return in - for example - how they handle your data.

Quote
You agree, through your use of this forum, that you will not post any material which is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, adult material, or otherwise in violation of any International or United States Federal law. You also agree not to post any copyrighted material unless you own the copyright or you have written consent from the owner of the copyrighted material. Spam, flooding, advertisements, chain letters, pyramid schemes, and solicitations are also forbidden on this forum. This agreement extends to personal communication with other members (via personal message, email, or in any other way) where such communication is not acceptable to the recipient.

Note that it is impossible for the staff or the owners of this forum to confirm the validity of posts. Please remember that we do not actively monitor the posted messages, and as such, are not responsible for the content contained within. We do not warrant the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of any information presented. The posted messages express the views of the author, and not necessarily the views of this forum, its staff, its subsidiaries, or this forum's owner. Anyone who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to notify an administrator or moderator of this forum immediately. The staff and the owner of this forum reserve the right to remove objectionable content, within a reasonable time frame, if they determine that removal is necessary. This is a manual process, however, please realize that they may not be able to remove or edit particular messages immediately. This policy applies to member profile information as well.

You remain solely responsible for the content of your posted messages. Furthermore, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless the owners of this forum, any related websites to this forum, its staff, and its subsidiaries. The owners of this forum also reserve the right to reveal your identity (or any other related information collected on this service) in the event of a formal complaint or legal action arising from any situation caused by your use of this forum.

You have the ability, as you register, to choose your username. We advise that you keep the name appropriate. With this user account you are about to register, you agree to never give your password out to another person except an administrator, for your protection and for validity reasons. You also agree to NEVER use another person's account for any reason, and not to register for a second account if you already have one, even if you are unable to access it for any reason.  We also HIGHLY recommend you use a complex and unique password for your account, to prevent account theft.

After you register and login to this forum, you will be able to fill out a detailed profile. It is your responsibility to present clean and accurate information. Any information the forum owner or staff determines to be inaccurate or vulgar in nature will be removed, with or without prior notice. Appropriate sanctions may be applicable.

Please note that with each post, your IP address is recorded, in the event that you need to be banned from this forum or your ISP contacted. This will only happen in the event of a major violation of this agreement.

A "vexatious person" is one who posts / acts in such as way as to increase the workload and stress on the web site operator, and the web site team supporting that operator. The site operation and support team (including owner, programmers, administrators and moderators) will declare that a member or other party or group is a vexatious person in exceptional circumstances, and the team's decision as to what's exceptional will be final. Any sanctions which the team feels appropriate to safeguard the site and its aims, or to reduce the support work overhead that such a vexatious interacter may generate, may be taken without the application of our standard rules, methods, courtesies or policies. Vexatious persons who wish to make a formal approach to the web site owners may do so in a letter sent via the Royal Mail, postage prepaid, to the address at which the domain is registered, and will be answered if appropriate within four weeks of the receipt of the letter.

When you log in, this software will place a cookie in your browser, allowing us to keep you logged in and identify you on each screen (i.e. keeps you logged in). This data is then returned each time you link to a new page or submit a form, and is use to link your posts together.  It's also used to ensure privacy and protection of personal messages, and to track which posts you have read so that you can make use of facilities such as "view unread posts".  We also use Google Analystics which places some cookies in your browser, and if you select to change the colour scheme a further cookie is placed which tells our server to use a non-default style with each subsequent request. By accepting this forum agreement, you are agreeing to us placing these cookies in your browser.

As you sign(ed) up, that is followed by a box you must tick - "I agree" it says alongside it. By default the box is unticked,  so a deliberate action is needed o join.

There is a pinned copy of this in a thread at the top of "Introductions and Chat" - http://www.passenger.chat/1761 which also contains code of conduct stuff.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
welshman
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 258


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2019, 04:28:24 pm »

I've voted against for technical reasons.  I'm not sure that you can adopt a constitution before you adopt it.

As for the content:-

1.  It does not specify what officers are to exist.

2.  Is there to be a limit to the membership of the committee?

3.  Are the officers to be members of the committee?

4. What constitutes a quorum at an AGM or EGM?

5. No procedure for the nomination of new officers.

6.  Don't understand or like the 30 votes needed to block a confirmation.  That's a recipe for perpetual renewal.

7.  Surely the better provision is simply to say that "The officers (or whatever) shall be elected annually.  Retiring officers shall be automatically nominated for re-election."  That way, unless someone new throws his hat into the ring, everyone gets re-elected "on the nod". 
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2019, 05:10:30 pm »

I've voted against for technical reasons.  I'm not sure that you can adopt a constitution before you adopt it.

Neither am I.  Grin Grin . We have found ourselves in a right "chicken and egg" - the draft / interim is to get most of the structure in place and we can fine tune based on suggestions for the AGM.

Quote
As for the content:-
1. It does not specify what officers are to exist.
2. Is there to be a limit to the membership of the committee?
3. Are the officers to be members of the committee?
4. What constitutes a quorum at an AGM or EGM?
5. No procedure for the nomination of new officers.
6. Don't understand or like the 30 votes needed to block a confirmation.  That's a recipe for perpetual renewal.
7. Surely the better provision is simply to say that "The officers (or whatever) shall be elected annually.  Retiring officers shall be automatically nominated for re-election."  That way, unless someone new throws his hat into the ring, everyone gets re-elected "on the nod". 

If you read "moderators" for "committee" and "administrators" for "officers", some (but I would agree not all of those become clearer, and in some cases the answers are not in a single neat sentence but in the combination of several.   Some of the election concerns are commented on at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=21184.msg260151#msg260151 ... there's something of. compromise in there, and a desire to reflect the different metrics of an online 'social media' type group with a more traditional group where decision timescales always allow reference back rather than immediate single member action.   Do take a look at the backup thread on bans too (and note just how rare this is!) - http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=21191.0

Got to dash out - but all inputs such as this will be looked at / we shouldn't change what we're voting on here but certainly a discussion of what's to be tune will be done before the version that's put to the AGM.   Let's see how this poll goes.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
welshman
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 258


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2019, 06:17:46 pm »

Not trying to knock the building down.  Just offering comments based on some experience of dealing with this sort of stuff.
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2019, 07:13:01 pm »

Not trying to knock the building down.  Just offering comments based on some experience of dealing with this sort of stuff.

I came across far far 'crisper' than I intended - sorry.  There are days when everything lines up .. and there are other days that are just the opposite. I have had one of those latter todaand will be getting out of bed on the other side tomorrow!

Yes - we want to tune to take care of these things - must be aware ... and on most I / we are. Whether it's explain, clarify or change ... not today, please.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2019, 07:01:53 am »

Poll result

The question asked was "Should this group adopt the interim constitution for the period to the initial AGM?".
67 votes were cast "Yes, I am in favour of adopting the interim constitution"
3 votes were cast "No, I am not in favour of adopting the interim constitution"
That's 95.7% (typo corrected) in favour and 4.3% against and I declare the vote carried

During the period the voting was open, 193 registered members who were eligible to vote logged in, of whom 158 have posted sufficient times (over 9) to be members of our "Frequent Poster's Club" which now forms the core voting membership for AGM and other official purposes.  (Numbers in this paragraph from our databases)

In addition to the registered members, an estimated 850 guests visited the Coffee Shop over this 4 day voting period, 600 of whom were visiting for the first time. 94% of (all) visitors were from the UK; top 10 cities reported are London Bristol Reading Exeter Oxford Bath Trowbridge Cardiff Plymouth Birmingham and Torquay. (Numbers in this paragraph from Google Analytics)

Thank You to everyone who voted. Thank you also to anyone who took time to read the supporting documents but decided to abstain on the vote. Especial thanks to all of those who assisted and passed comment during the preparation of the draft constitution in the moderators's area (dozens of messages) and in "frequent posters" (32 message thread) in recent weeks. Thanks also to those members who made suggestions during the voting process; I'm sure you'll appreciate we could not change the interim constitution at that point, but we do now have several months to plan ahead, consider and implement positive tuning suggestions prior to the AGM in late spring / early summer.

With an interim constitution in place, and implementation plans laid out in the supporting data, it's time to press some green buttons. Much background work has been done already, but no assumptions made prior to the vote - so plans picked up, meetings this week and next.  You will see little change short term - odd bits of wording such as at the forum page base here and there, and indeed medium term too the main changes will be cosmetic ones and content feed modernisation and improvement as we take 10 years of experience (and wear and tear) and prepare for the next decade.



Quote
As someone who [snip]. I'm flattered to be asked to vote but I'd rather assumed that those running this forum could pretty much make up their own rules. In a sense my continued presence shows that I agree with the way it is run [snip]. I should say that I'm grateful to be offered the chance to contribute. Thanks for an informative forum.

That's a much reduced / anonymised quote - Frequent Posters will be able to follow this link and see the full context. It gives me an excellent hook onto which to hang the following comments

Running this forum has  been and is my and our pleasure.  Although I've not gone around and asked all the moderators and admins to confirm that is has been a pleasure for them, I feel pretty safe making that statement for them as the whole thing has been done on a volunteer basis, and little or no pressure or strong cajoling has been required.   

You're right in suggesting that the handful of us who initially set the forum up did make up our own rules. We also had (if you like to call them this) rules about rules - guiding principles - which while looking to strongly represent the passenger and wannabe passenger also looked for open and positive campaigning, and full co-operative involvement of everyone with an interest in a well provided, well used, inclusive, sustainable public transport network. For individual guests who visit just once or twice looking for an answer, those principles fit but feel distant. For members at the heart of the project, they feel very much closer when they're thought about, even though they may have been little stated until recently.

Whilst some things don't change, others have done.  When Lee and I founded the forum in 2007, I don't think we expected it to last and grow as it has done.  5 members who joined in the first few weeks - over 12 years ago, when the total number of posts was less than 500 - have been logged in within the last 4 days. Their loyalty (even if we don't always share every view) is really appreciated. And indeed 60 members who have been here in those recent days have been members for over 10 years. The forum has become very much everyone's baby and not just Lee's and mine. I may have posted a lot and so have some others, but I still account overall for less than 10% of content and as much as a half of that is pointers at news feeds / resources / data, or "news and assistance" or other admin and running.  Data is the value these days, so the Coffee Shop has turned into a community resource of some value, or which I happen to have become the (webmaster) custodian; not a position / responsibility I feel entirely comfortable with - and as such generating the need to provide a solid safeguard route into the future - for the next decade.  Able to make our own rules?  Yes - we have been, and while we're around and stable we're looking for a more formal structure that says "steady as she goes", provides a described and re-assuring standard for people and organisations we work with, and looks to the continued provision potentially far into the future.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2019, 08:47:10 am by grahame » Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 4195


The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2019, 08:39:54 am »

I've voted against for technical reasons.  I'm not sure that you can adopt a constitution before you adopt it.

Neither am I.  Grin Grin . We have found ourselves in a right "chicken and egg" - the draft / interim is to get most of the structure in place and we can fine tune based on suggestions for the AGM.
[/quote]
Perfectly in order for a number of initial members to adopt the constitution prior to a general meeting.
I got up too late this morning, but am in favour.
Logged

Now, please!
Adelante_CCT
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 1230



View Profile
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2019, 08:43:47 am »

Quote
That's 97.5% in favour and 4.3% against


And thats from the 101.8% of people that voted  Grin
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2019, 08:45:15 am »

Quote
That's 97.5% in favour and 4.3% against


And thats from the 101.8% of people that voted  Grin


Transposition error.  97.5 v 95.7.   Will go back and correct.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 4195


The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2019, 09:50:27 am »

I blame the schools. 56% of children can't read and write properly, and the other 67.2% can't add up.
Logged

Now, please!
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 24703



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2019, 10:58:44 am »

I have moved the provisional AGM date that was set in this thread from 1st to 8th June 2019 in order to avoid a clash with the final full length HST charity special.

Although we are primarily a passenger forum rather than an enthusiaist's club, there is likely to be some considerable overlap between people looking to attend our AGM and people wanting to travel on or see the special train ...
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Member of Melksham Rail User Group, on the board of TravelWatch SouthWest and some more things besides
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules (email link). Forum hosted by Well House Consultants