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Author Topic: Crossrail - further delay  (Read 8657 times)
Surrey 455
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« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2020, 08:06:15 pm »

The Elizabeth Line is a Metro service, the DfT have determined that metro services do not require toilets, many other services into London do not have toilets on board trains

But SWR are correcting that with their new 701 fleet of trains that should be in service within the next year or two. Or maybe three. It's a rail project so it's bound to take longer than expected for the complete rollout.
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broadgage
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« Reply #61 on: October 07, 2020, 05:22:19 am »

The TfL argument is that toilets will be available within nearly all Crossrail stations and for the others they are facilities nearby (eg for Paddington in the main line station and Bond Street in the shopping centre above). However, some people will be in more urgent need, and outside of emergencies the current low service frequencies makes breaking the journey unattractive.


And will these toilets be reliably available for use, throughout railway operating hours ?
I expect that a lot of them will be closed due to;
Essential maintenance.
Staff shortage.
Vandalism.
Water supply failure.
Security alert.
Some might never actually open, with a promise of toilets gradually turning into a future aspiration that is being "worked towards"

And of course the possibility of station toilets wont help during multi-hour strandings that seem to be an increasing part of modern railway operations.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
Reading General
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« Reply #62 on: October 07, 2020, 09:46:25 am »



The Elizabeth Line is a Metro service, the DfT have determined that metro services do not require toilets, many other services into London do not have toilets on board trains
I guess the DfT have failed to recognise that as well as a service into London it's also a service to London for those beyond the city's outer limits. It's more than a metro service.
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didcotdean
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« Reply #63 on: October 07, 2020, 10:40:58 am »

The previous generation of trains operating the service on the eastern side, ie Liverpool Street to Shenfield didn't have toilets, but they were in effect an inner-suburban configuration even though the journey time end to end can be up to three-quarters of an hour. Indeed the generation before that didn't have toilets either, at least for what would then have been second-class passengers.

The counter-example is the continued provision of toilets on Thameslink, but TfL hasn't got its hands on that.
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #64 on: October 29, 2020, 11:53:02 am »

As a bit of an aside, why do we refer to Crossrail as 'the biggest infrastructure project in Europe' when the EUR38 billion Grand Paris Express, with its 200km of tunnels, is plainly bigger?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjuMcWwMqPk

It'll be interesting to see if they manage to avoid some of the pitfalls of Crossrail...
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broadgage
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« Reply #65 on: October 29, 2020, 02:08:42 pm »

Perhaps the title "biggest infrastructure project in Europe" is to prepare us for when the cost escalates to such a degree that it BECOMES the biggest infrastructure project in Europe, at least in terms of cost.

I expect that the Paris project will also increase in cost, but not as rapidly as Crossrail, so Crossrail could overtake it.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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« Reply #66 on: October 29, 2020, 04:40:03 pm »

As a bit of an aside, why do we refer to Crossrail as 'the biggest infrastructure project in Europe' when the EUR38 billion Grand Paris Express, with its 200km of tunnels, is plainly bigger?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjuMcWwMqPk

It'll be interesting to see if they manage to avoid some of the pitfalls of Crossrail...

It should be remembered that from the UK point of view Europe now consists of only 4 nations, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland  Grin Grin Grin
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Neither a wise man nor a brave man lies down on the tracks of history to wait for the train of the future to run over him.     
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« Reply #67 on: October 29, 2020, 06:06:45 pm »

As a bit of an aside, why do we refer to Crossrail as 'the biggest infrastructure project in Europe' when the EUR38 billion Grand Paris Express, with its 200km of tunnels, is plainly bigger?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjuMcWwMqPk

It'll be interesting to see if they manage to avoid some of the pitfalls of Crossrail...

It should be remembered that from the UK point of view Europe now consists of only 4 nations, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland  Grin Grin Grin

I though it was the other way round - Crossrail can't be the largest anything in Europe, as we're not part of the continent of Europe any more. So I wonder, what are we now - the incontinent of Europe?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 06:58:53 pm by Red Squirrel » Logged
Red Squirrel
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« Reply #68 on: October 29, 2020, 07:05:17 pm »

...we're not part of the continent of Europe any more...

Ah well, if a clod be washed away by the sea and all that.

I note that the Grand Paris Express doesn't claim to be the biggest in Europe. That's because it's the biggest in the world. And its father doesn't smell of elderberries.

Edit: Correction: Mothers don't smell of elderberries.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 11:26:38 pm by Red Squirrel » Logged
TonyK
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« Reply #69 on: October 30, 2020, 09:42:53 am »


It should be remembered that from the UK point of view Europe now consists of only 4 nations, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland  Grin Grin Grin

... at the time of writing.
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« Reply #70 on: October 30, 2020, 03:13:29 pm »


It should be remembered that from the UK point of view Europe now consists of only 4 nations, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland  Grin Grin Grin

... at the time of writing.

More correctly,  the United Kingdom view is that Europe is OVER the Water! Grin Grin
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broadgage
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« Reply #71 on: October 30, 2020, 04:19:46 pm »

"Channel fogbound, ferries and planes at a standstill. Europe isolated" Said to be an old newspaper headline.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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« Reply #72 on: October 30, 2020, 06:27:47 pm »

"Channel fogbound, ferries and planes at a standstill. Europe isolated" Said to be an old newspaper headline.

Except now there is TransManche Link  Grin which is not effected by fog
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TonyK
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« Reply #73 on: October 31, 2020, 04:22:09 pm »


Except now there is TransManche Link  Grin which is not effected by fog

Steady now, ET! I got in trouble for coming over all French. I expected a ?50 fixed penalty.
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Now, please!
grahame
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« Reply #74 on: November 21, 2020, 07:57:05 pm »

From Sky News

Quote
Crossrail, London's long-delayed ?19bn east-to-west rail link, faces being "mothballed" without the release of urgent new government funding, the capital's transport chief has warned ministers.

Sky News has learnt that Andy Byford, the London transport commissioner, wrote to the permanent secretary at the Department for Transport (DfT) this week, seeking ?80m of immediate support to keep the project on track.

Mr Byford, who took on the role in May and has spent much of the last six months battling to secure funds to keep London's bus and Tube network running during the COVID-19 crisis, told Bernadette Kelly that without the additional funding being provided, he could relinquish responsibility for it.

"If agreement is not reached this week, we will have no option but to mothball the project and to seek alternative governance for its eventual completion," the letter said, according to a Whitehall source who had been briefed on it.
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