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Author Topic: Portishead Line reopening for passengers - ongoing discussion  (Read 292326 times)
Red Squirrel
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« Reply #870 on: October 21, 2021, 11:18:12 am »

I've just been chatting with Huggy Bear, and the word on the street is that NGET is not the problem. Mr Bear is of the opinion that the delay will be less than 6 months... stand by
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« Reply #871 on: October 21, 2021, 11:32:21 am »

At least their services should be free

As should those of the composer of the theme tune. Someone I know played in a band whose first album was produced by him. I am told that his sole contribution as a producer was to say "That's great - next track please" from the control booth at the back of the studio. When they didn't hear from him after one song, they found him and the engineer asleep. The album did fairly well. The next two, not produced by Mr B, did a lot better, with one reaching no. 5.
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stuving
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« Reply #872 on: October 21, 2021, 12:29:11 pm »

I've just been chatting with Huggy Bear, and the word on the street is that NGET is not the problem. Mr Bear is of the opinion that the delay will be less than 6 months... stand by

They (and WPD and their contractors) are indeed further ahead than I thought. Digging down into the more detailed levels of the project's website, with maps, you find this progress report:
Quote
Overview – Summer 2021

We started the construction work needed to build the new overhead connection, featuring T-pylons, from Sandford to Avonmouth in May 2021. For more information about how we’re building the new pylons, please visit our new dedicated page, which includes a range of videos, maps and FAQs (Frequently Asked Questions).

Our contractor, Murphy, has finished installing the new underground cables between the west end of Nailsea and Portishead substations.

In May we started to remove nine kilometres of overhead line between Nailsea and Portishead. We anticipate completing this work in October 2021.

In April, we started work in Portbury Wharf Nature Reserve to make changes to the Western Power Distribution (WPD) substation and replace pylons to the east of the substation with underground cables.  We’ll be carrying out further work in the nature reserve and in the neighbouring Port Authority land.

So it looks as if they have been able to do this bit, including dismantling the old OHL (Over-Head Line), in time to fit in with the railway works. Putting up the new pylon line should not involve more disruption that anywhere else, where stringing the cables does occasionally close roads and railways.

There is remarkably little to see on Google Earth, only partly becuase their updates have been infrequent. Maybe twenty years ago an underground cable like this would need a trench almost all the way, with very limited tunnelling under major roads etc. Then they started to use horizontal drilling, and now that is used a lot more. So the unlikely diagonal path under the Sheepway bridge represented a drilled section (still some way to the side), and the rest of the trench is along what now looks like a haul road (and may be one).
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #873 on: October 21, 2021, 05:35:56 pm »

There is always a danger of shooting from the hip when things like this announcement happen... I am aware that a veteran local transport campaigner is confidently telling anyone who'll listen that it's the National Trust who've thrown this spanner in the works, though a quick check on the PI portal shows that not to be the case...

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« Reply #874 on: October 21, 2021, 05:56:39 pm »

Digging around, I came upon this - which explains just how unbelievably complex a task it is to build 4km of railway that already exists:

https://www.allaboutlaw.co.uk/commercial-awareness/interviews/one-project-four-regions-how-womble-bond-dickinson-works-collaboratively-to-tackle-complex-cases
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« Reply #875 on: October 21, 2021, 09:51:08 pm »

Digging around, I came upon this - which explains just how unbelievably complex a task it is to build 4km of railway that already exists:

https://www.allaboutlaw.co.uk/commercial-awareness/interviews/one-project-four-regions-how-womble-bond-dickinson-works-collaboratively-to-tackle-complex-cases

Ouch! I know we can't just have any old Tom, Dick or Isambard running around building railways wherever they please, but I wonder how the process of converting 4 km of rotting railway into 4 km of working railway grew to be so complex. Is it because of all the lawyers, building a job, or were we doing it wrong all those years ago?
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #876 on: October 21, 2021, 09:53:27 pm »

Is it because of all the lawyers..?

You may very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.
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« Reply #877 on: October 21, 2021, 10:30:42 pm »

Is it because of all the lawyers..?

You may very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.

They want to be careful, or the whole house of cards may come falling down.
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« Reply #878 on: October 22, 2021, 07:41:06 am »

The view Red Squirrel linked to is looking away from where the overhead lines cross the railway, and must be the temporary haul road built for constructing the new pylon line and/or the underground cable. This appears to have been put in very hurriedly in July, somewhat to NSDC's surprise. But that may be a good thing - if NGET and WPD are willing to get their work in this area done quickly so they can release the sites early for railway construction.

It's hard to cross-reference the HPCC Order or any other documents to sites without the reference map, which I can't find on line (it may only exist at NGET's offices in the Strand). But this letter from the Wombles states the situation at NSDC in response to the SoS's first letter of 26th July; the main bit is this:
Quote
However, on 4 August 2021 NGET served on the Applicant a notice under section 3 of the Compulsory Purchase (Vesting Declarations) Act 1981 of its intention to compulsorily acquire rights and impose restrictions over any of plots 139, 167, 168, 169, 170, 171, 174, 181, 183, 184 and 199 of section F in the HPCC DCO (Driver Controlled Operation). Temporary possession notices were served under Article 29 of the HPCC DCO by NGET in November 2020 and a temporary at-grade crossing has been constructed over the disused railway at plot 02/70. Further, a temporary haul road and improvements to access arrangements off Sheepway have been provided for the construction of all stages of the HPCC DCO works in this area including the dismantling of W-Route OHL (Over-Head Line) (shown as work 4D of the HPCC DCO at Appendix 1 of REP7 – 048). The Applicant understands that the dismantling works are programmed to be undertaken between August and October 2021. As a result of the notification of an intention to vest, as well as the use of temporary notices and the fairly extensive ongoing works, the Applicant's approach to the protective provisions it had sought in the draft DCO at REP7-056 has altered. The Applicant therefore attaches at Annex 3 revised protective provisions which it has proposed to NGET and which in many respects come closer to the protective provisions submitted by NGET at Deadline 4 at REP4-046. The Applicant also attaches at Annex 4 a comparison to NGET's submitted protective provisions. For the avoidance of doubt NGET has not at this stage accepted the Applicant's revised protective provisions.

As I said, you can't easily work out exactly what is what, but the general idea is clear. WPD also banged in a vesting notice on the same day, which I guess is for the underground cable (which is theirs). As to where that goes, who knows? But I would not rely on the crayon line on the project website's map as being accurate.



"I enclose a copy of the July letter together with its enclosures at Annex 1 to this letter and note your
intention to publicise the contents of this letter and it's annexes. "

Shoddy.
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TonyK
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« Reply #879 on: October 22, 2021, 12:08:03 pm »



"I enclose a copy of the July letter together with its enclosures at Annex 1 to this letter and note your
intention to publicise the contents of this letter and it's annexes. "

Shoddy.

You're right. Should of done better.
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stuving
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« Reply #880 on: October 22, 2021, 01:07:05 pm »

Digging around, I came upon this - which explains just how unbelievably complex a task it is to build 4km of railway that already exists:

https://www.allaboutlaw.co.uk/commercial-awareness/interviews/one-project-four-regions-how-womble-bond-dickinson-works-collaboratively-to-tackle-complex-cases

Ouch! I know we can't just have any old Tom, Dick or Isambard running around building railways wherever they please, but I wonder how the process of converting 4 km of rotting railway into 4 km of working railway grew to be so complex. Is it because of all the lawyers, building a job, or were we doing it wrong all those years ago?

The Victorian railway companies were not short of a lawyer or two. In many cases they had spare ones, due to the pressure to merge so as to get a single bill through parliament. The Reading Guildford and Reigate, for example, was forced to promise work to the solicitors of the Reading and Reigate company, but Mr. Rogers of Reading complained that little came his way. In any case, it was the "London work" that brought in the big money, on the bill and dealings with other companies rather than land conveyancing ... sound familiar?

But you are right of course that these companies were building a railway from scratch, and reinstalling one on an existing route should be a whole lot easier to do. Even then they were quicker at it, as we all know - the RGRR started (as what we'd now call a pressure group) in 1845, opened its line in 1849 (by which time the SER had agreed to buy it) and disappeared by its 256th and last scheduled board meeting in 1852.

Progress, no doubt, except in the rate of progress.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2021, 10:50:59 am by stuving » Logged
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« Reply #881 on: October 23, 2021, 08:21:14 am »



"I enclose a copy of the July letter together with its enclosures at Annex 1 to this letter and note your
intention to publicise the contents of this letter and it's annexes. "

Shoddy.

You're right. Should of done better.
Cheesy 
Yes, they should have.
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Red Squirrel
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« Reply #882 on: November 10, 2021, 01:54:49 pm »

This letter has appeared on the Planning Inspectorate website:

Quote
The Secretary of State notes the amendments to chapter 7 of the Environmental Statement references the third, fourth, fifth, and sixth carbon budgets. However, the Secretary of State notes that it only includes an assessment against the sixth carbon budget.

Please could the Applicant provide an assessment of the impact of the scheme against the third, fourth and fifth carbon budgets, or explain why it does not think this is appropriate.

The deadline for any response is 23 November 2021

So:

1. Maybe the National Grid issue was a red herring;
2. Let's see what crops up on the 23rd!
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TonyK
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« Reply #883 on: November 10, 2021, 08:01:48 pm »

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The Secretary of State notes the amendments to chapter 7 of the Environmental Statement references the third, fourth, fifth, and sixth carbon budgets. However, the Secretary of State notes that it only includes an assessment against the sixth carbon budget.

Please could the Applicant provide an assessment of the impact of the scheme against the third, fourth and fifth carbon budgets, or explain why it does not think this is appropriate.

The deadline for any response is 23 November 2021

Double spaced, with carbon copies?
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bradshaw
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« Reply #884 on: November 11, 2021, 09:08:07 am »

This appeared on a Twitter link this morning

Environmental groups accused for Portishead rail delay

https://www.northsomersettimes.co.uk/news/liam-fox-north-somerset-council-portishead-rail-delay-8462044
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