Fines for drivers caught dropping passengers outside designated zones

[whole diary]

[PhilWakely]

These are not fines. Only a court can fine someone.

These are penalty charges for breaching the terms of an implied contract.

I disagree...

https://www.southampton.gov.uk/libraries/library-activities/library-fines-charges.aspx

Again, these are penalty charges, not fines - even though the library describes them as fines.

[Celestial]

The couple of dictionary definitions I've looked at describe a fine as a fee, penalty or punishment for doing something that you shouldn't have or breaking a rule (which may or may not include breaking a law). They certainly don't mention that it has to be a court of law imposing it.

So I think it's perfectly acceptable to say, for example, an imposition of a financial penalty for not returning one's library book on time is a fine, regardless of whether a law has been broken. 

[TaplowGreen]

These are not fines. Only a court can fine someone.

These are penalty charges for breaching the terms of an implied contract.

I disagree...

https://www.southampton.gov.uk/libraries/library-activities/library-fines-charges.aspx

………….they do everything by the book.

[TonyK]

The couple of dictionary definitions I've looked at describe a fine as a fee, penalty or punishment for doing something that you shouldn't have or breaking a rule (which may or may not include breaking a law). They certainly don't mention that it has to be a court of law imposing it.

So I think it's perfectly acceptable to say, for example, an imposition of a financial penalty for not returning one's library book on time is a fine, regardless of whether a law has been broken. 

I spent a lot of time in court when I was younger. In the Magistrates' Court, it was generally referred to as a fine, whereas in Crown Court the term was often "financial penalty". I believe the concept was brought to us by William the Conqueror with the notion of a "finished" payment to end a dispute, from finis, so it could be done without a court case, I suppose. I can't see a library book law, so can't rule out that it is merely a fee for breaching the terms of an agreement that has become a "fine" through common parlance.

………….they do everything by the book.

... which they will throw at you if need be.

[TaplowGreen]

The couple of dictionary definitions I've looked at describe a fine as a fee, penalty or punishment for doing something that you shouldn't have or breaking a rule (which may or may not include breaking a law). They certainly don't mention that it has to be a court of law imposing it.

So I think it's perfectly acceptable to say, for example, an imposition of a financial penalty for not returning one's library book on time is a fine, regardless of whether a law has been broken. 

I spent a lot of time in court when I was younger. In the Magistrates' Court, it was generally referred to as a fine, whereas in Crown Court the term was often "financial penalty". I believe the concept was brought to us by William the Conqueror with the notion of a "finished" payment to end a dispute, from finis, so it could be done without a court case, I suppose. I can't see a library book law, so can't rule out that it is merely a fee for breaching the terms of an agreement that has become a "fine" through common parlance.

………….they do everything by the book.

... which they will throw at you if need be.

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! 

[TonyK]

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! 

A man walks up to the counter and says: "CAN I HAVE HADDOCK AND CHIPS TWICE PLEASE, WITH MUSHY PEAS."
The lady with the tweed skirt and hair in a bun says, indignantly: "Sir! This is the library, you know!"
The man looks surprised, says "Eh? Oh, sorry, so it is. Can I have haddock and chips twice please, with mushy peas."

[Clan Line]

According to The Magistrates Act (1980) a Fine can be imposed after a Conviction. I don't think you are listed as having a Conviction after dropping someone off at the wrong part of Bristol Airport    .

Another good point to argue over in that area: is it a court or a Court ?? Or is it only a Court when combined with such as, Magistrates' or Crown ??

[TonyK]

According to The Magistrates Act (1980) a Fine can be imposed after a Conviction. I don't think you are listed as having a Conviction after dropping someone off at the wrong part of Bristol Airport    .

Another good point to argue over in that area: is it a court or a Court ?? Or is it only a Court when combined with such as, Magistrates' or Crown ??

It's a Court. That saves having to say Magistrates', Crown, or the upper tiers. Penalties written into criminal legislation don't usually make the distinction, referring to "on summary conviction" meaning at a Magistrates' Court, or "on indictment" if it is going to Crown Court.