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Author Topic: Okehampton-Tavistock. Discussion on reopening and potential use as a diversionary route  (Read 268826 times)
trainbuff
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« Reply #315 on: October 12, 2012, 09:08:18 »

Bit of a shocker after it had been assured the quarry was merely been mothballed.

The Dartmoor Railway have never been great at sharing information, with rumours of rifts and strife posted on other forums. They did recently move some ex-Virgin rolling stock (about 6 coaches?) from the sidings at Yeovil to Meldon, for use on "Polar Express" Christmas specials.

My initial feelings are that it could go either way; a Tavistock-style development that sees passengers service to Exeter reinstated or - heaven forbid - a cycle track, linked to a leisure development.

I hope the former is the case obviously. Mind you, there is part of the Great Western Franchise document that has an option listed for a service from st James park to Okehampton from 2016. I hope that this at least keeps the idiocy of line closure away! I wonder how much is wanted for the quarry and line or even if the line can be purchased seperately?




« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 09:36:27 by bignosemac » Logged

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Andy
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« Reply #316 on: October 12, 2012, 16:57:21 »

The Okehampton news will doubtless be moved to the Okehampton branch thread but to keep all the bits together till then, I'll post here.

Does anyone think there is any chance of the line at least as far as Okehampton being brought back into network ownership, given the murmurings in the franchise debates about some sort of regular service from Exeter - not to mention the old topic of the sea wall route threat?

 
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #317 on: October 12, 2012, 20:03:59 »

The Okehampton news will doubtless be moved to the Okehampton branch thread but to keep all the bits together till then, I'll post here.

A good point - thanks for that gentle hint, Andy!  Now done.  Cheesy
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William Huskisson MP (Member of Parliament) was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830.  Many more have died in the same way since then.  Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.

"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner."  Discuss.
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« Reply #318 on: October 12, 2012, 23:38:46 »

Aggregate Industries own the line from Coleford Junction to Meldon. They lease the line to the railway, which is now owned by British American Railway Services, which was formed by Iowa Pacific Holdings to acquire the railway assets of Ealing Community Transport. Through another subsidiary, Devon and Cornwall Railway, they made an Open Access application for a 4 tpd service from Okehampton to Exeter St James, with an ambition to run one train daily to London. They also wanted to open a freight service. So far as I can tell, none of this is any nearer to happening yet, although the ORR» (Office of Rail and Road formerly Office of Rail Regulation - about) gave it a cautious OK a year ago.

How an American company can cope with the traditional bureaucracy of Britain is not apparent. If they thought it was a simple case of filling in the right forms, they will know better by now. How it would affect or be affected by the priced option in the new franchise is not something I have the faintest idea of. There would be no barrier to them running services in addition to GWR (Great Western Railway), presumably? Or even sub-contracting the service from GWR?
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« Reply #319 on: October 13, 2012, 09:48:08 »

Found this blog:

http://bars-blog.weebly.com/index.html

Up to date info on Devon & Cornwall Railway's fleet of 31's and 56's. Seems they're keeping them busy, however, it also seems that - ironically - they never venture into either Devon or Cornwall.

Good to hear that St James Park - Okehampton is included as an option in the new GW (Great Western) franchise.
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TonyK
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« Reply #320 on: December 01, 2012, 13:16:07 »

Not sure if this is the right place, but This is Devon carries a tory from the Plymouth Herald, where transport expert Neil Mitchell calls for an inland route (are you here, Neil?) avoiding Dawlish.

Quote
Call to build new Plymouth to London train line away from the coast

Saturday, December 01, 2012

Plymouth Herald

By KEITH ROSSITER Political Reporter

A TRANSPORT expert is calling for work to start on Westcountry rail links that were scuppered by Hitler 73 years ago.

After train services to London were twice cut in the past week, Neill Mitchell is urging the Government to look again at plans for a new railway line avoiding Dawlish, which were drawn up before the Second World War.
 ​
"It is simply not acceptable for the 21st century business, freight, tourism and leisure rail service in the peninsula to remain dependent on a solitary 'fair weather railway'," he said.

The rail line between Exeter and Newton Abbot was shut this week after a major landslip at Teignmouth followed by 14 smaller landslips on the route.

But the route's weakest point, and the cause of regular disruption, is the stretch along the sea wall at Dawlish.

Mr Mitchell said the problem was made more pressing now that Plymouth and its hinterland, with a combined population of about 400,000, had lost its direct air link to the capital.

He is calling for the Government to start by "drawing a line on the map" for a line which avoids the sea wall at Dawlish.

Plans for a "Dawlish Avoiding Line" were put forward by the Great Western Railway (GWR (Great Western Railway)) in 1935 at a time when another Conservative-dominated coalition National Government was wrestling with the impact of global economic recession.

Mr Mitchell said GWR had planned a new line from Dawlish Warren to Newton Abbot "in minute detail, down to the level of drainage culverts and pedestrian accesses".

In 1936 Parliament approved a railway almost nine miles long from Newton Abbot, deviating near the rail bridge over the Hackney Canal Channel, and rejoining the main line north of Dawlish Warren station, alongside the River Exe Estuary.

A second Act in 1937 extended the route further northeast, past Kenton and Powderham, to Exminster, adding just over seven miles.

Surveying began early in 1939, and work was intended to be complete by January 1941. But in September 1939 Hitler invaded Poland and war broke out.

Nationalisation of the railways in 1947 was the death knell for the improvements.

Mr Mitchell said that re-routing of the main line away from the Dawlish sea wall would cost considerably less than the present Reading Station re-configuration scheme.

He called for strategic leadership from the new Cornwall and Heart of the South West Local Enterprise Partnerships together with Network Rail, the Department for Transport, the universities and the peninsula's MPs (Member of Parliament).

He said 21st century tunnelling economics and techniques could allow a more direct route, to high-speed rail standards, between Exeter St Thomas and Newton Abbot, via or beneath Haldon.

The existing scenic line along the sea wall should stay open to accommodate weekend engineering work diversions, local shuttle services and for its tourism potential.

Although rail services continued along the former LSWR (London South Western Railway)/Southern main line to Waterloo via Okehampton until 1968, Mr Mitchell said this was not a suitable alternative to the Dawlish line because the bulk of Devon's economically productive population was along the southern route.

But he said it should brought back into use to reconnect West Devon and North Cornwall and to give Plymouth direct access to London Waterloo."

Meanwhile Gary Streeter, the Conservative MP for South West Devon, is calling on Network Rail to make repairs to the Great Western mainline a national priority.

"It's obvious we are not going to get electrification in Devon and Cornwall for many years therefore we must have urgent investment now in making our existing line more resilient and robust," he said.

COUNCIL CALLS FOR RAIL LIFELINE TO BE A PRIORITY

PLYMOUTH^S rail ^lifeline^ should be a national priority, the Government is being told.

After rail services were disrupted by floods in the past week, council leader Tudor Evans is demanding action to keep links to the peninsula open, whatever the weather.

City MP Oliver Colvile has also raised the issue in the House of Commons this week.

And a transport expert has renewed calls for a new line to by-pass storm-hit Dawlish.

Last week^s floods cut the rail link between Exeter and Tiverton and passengers were ferried between stations by bus.

The rail misery continued this week when the line between Newton Abbot and Exeter was closed by 15 landslips.

Now Cllr Evans is co-ordinating a letter from South West leaders to the Transport Minister.

He said the Government was committing huge investment to improve transport in areas of the country that are already very well connected.

^Is it too much to ask for tracks that allow train services to get to a chosen destination without the use of a bus?

^The South West has suffered from severe travel disruption. Not only do we find services suspended, but the replacement bus services themselves were delayed by flooding on the M5.^

Signatories to the letter include Cornwall, Devon and Somerset council leaders, the Mayor of Torbay and the chairs of the Cornwall and Heart of the South West Local Economic Partnerships.

Cllr Evans said: ^I understand we were dealing with extreme weather this time, but this isn^t a new issue and flooding happens all too frequently.

^We know where flooding is likely and we know there is a Government plan to tackle such issues.^

The Government^s 2011 document ^Climate Resilient Infrastructure^ features on its front cover a photo of the line at Dawlish, where services are frequently disrupted by weather.

Cllr Evans said: ^We are striving for economic growth in the region and have some excellent plans in place to create jobs and encourage businesses to the area including the South West Marine Energy Park.

^The Government recognises the economic value of fast, reliable transport links.^

He is calling on the Government to give the South West some priority. ^The DIY approach we are often forced to take just won^t cut it in this situation. We need investment in our travel infrastructure to enable us to deliver growth.

^The South West can no longer be viewed as the sleepy tourist destination of the UK (United Kingdom). We will be asking to meet the Secretary of State for Transport to seek the necessary infrastructure needed.

^Unlike his Transport Minister, who did not travel to Exeter on Thursday, we are prepared to take the long and torturous journey to Westminster to move this agenda forward.

^We^ll be keeping up the pressure on Government so they understand the transport issues that threaten our ambitions for growth in the South West.^

Mr Colvile, the Tory MP for Plymouth Sutton and Devonport, raised the issue at transport questions in the Commons.

He called on Transport Minister Stephen Hammond to make an economic assessment of the impact of that on the Plymouth economy?

Mr Hammond said: ^I recognise that it has been extremely disruptive, but it is too early to undertake an economic assessment.

^The Government^s main priority at present is restoring services to all those affected by flooding.^
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Umberleigh
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« Reply #321 on: December 04, 2012, 12:24:34 »

It would be fantastic to see either the Old GWR (Great Western Railway) proposal built or the Okehampton route reinstated, but surely the real problem is Cowley bridge - Tiverton i.e. the Exe valley? The landslip was secondary to the days of delay caused by flooding.

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TonyK
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« Reply #322 on: December 05, 2012, 23:35:25 »

Certainly Umberleigh, but nothing that couldn't be sorted out by a Great Engineer. It might be easier (and cheaper) in the long run to do away with the embankments and raise both lines on concrete stilts, so letting the mighty Exe flow undisturbed below. Or not. I am a civil servant, not a civil engineer (worse luck), but if other experts agree that the events of the past couple of weeks are a pointer to the future, then I can't see it doing any harm.
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« Reply #323 on: December 06, 2012, 08:43:37 »

It seems to me, Four Track, that the best engineering in our country (and indeed others) was creatively imaginative.  Plenty of other parts of the world have lifted their railways up on stilts to deal with obdurate nature and from the past we have the blessed IKB (Isambard Kingdom Brunel) (Brunel) to thank for many 'ridiculous' engineering projects we still enjoy.  What we don't have is an unquestioning cheap labour force to keep the costs down as did the Victorians - so pleasing progress in that area has an effect on what we can do with our country's budget.
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ellendune
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« Reply #324 on: December 06, 2012, 18:45:18 »

Certainly Umberleigh, but nothing that couldn't be sorted out by a Great Engineer. It might be easier (and cheaper) in the long run to do away with the embankments and raise both lines on concrete stilts, so letting the mighty Exe flow undisturbed below. Or not. I am a civil servant, not a civil engineer (worse luck), but if other experts agree that the events of the past couple of weeks are a pointer to the future, then I can't see it doing any harm.

I am a civil engineer.  But do not know the area well. 

From the video I saw of Cowley Bridge Junction it seemed to me that the railway had become a weir for the flow from the branch river, suggesting that the bridge was not wide enough to take the flow. This then resulted in the flow along the line as well as washing out the embankment. If this is the case, lengthening the span of the bridge, both on the main line and on the branch might alleviate the problem without lifting the line significantly. 

Of course there may be other points on that section of line that were affected that were not shown on the video. 
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Plymboi
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« Reply #325 on: December 12, 2012, 15:53:22 »

Wouldn't the plans for a new station in okehampton hinder any chance left to rest abolish the link between Tavistock and okehampton?
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swrural
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« Reply #326 on: December 13, 2012, 10:25:47 »

I could not understand the meaning of this message Plymboi.  Could you clear up please?
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RichardB
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« Reply #327 on: December 13, 2012, 10:30:06 »

Wouldn't the plans for a new station in okehampton hinder any chance left to rest abolish the link between Tavistock and okehampton?

No, it won't hinder any possibility of one day possibly reestablishing the Tavistock - Okehampton line.  The proposed new station would be a through one.

While on this, I've not heard anything about how the sale of the line is going.
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Plymboi
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« Reply #328 on: December 13, 2012, 13:51:34 »

I could not understand the meaning of this message Plymboi.  Could you clear up please?

It was meant to say ,reestablish the link' stupid iPad autocorrect Sad
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Plymboi
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« Reply #329 on: December 13, 2012, 14:25:38 »

Wouldn't the plans for a new station in okehampton hinder any chance left to rest abolish the link between Tavistock and okehampton?

No, it won't hinder any possibility of one day possibly reestablishing the Tavistock - Okehampton line.  The proposed new station would be a through one.

While on this, I've not heard anything about how the sale of the line is going.

Oh I see I assume it will be built along the existing line? Yeh I wonder what the update is regarding the line sale is, I would love for network rail to buy it Smiley.

EDIT:

I have seen documentation about it. It's being referred to as Okehampton East. Plans are a one platform station. Plans on page 6 of the document.

http://www.devon.gov.uk/loadtrimdocument?url=&filename=EE/12/6.CMR&rn=12/WD403&dg=Public
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 14:40:54 by Plymboi » Logged
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