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03:56 Swansea to London Paddington
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17:32 London Paddington to Cheltenham Spa
17:38 Bristol Temple Meads to Worcester Foregate Street
18:17 Taunton to Cardiff Central
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18:59 Cheltenham Spa to London Paddington
19:32 London Paddington to Cheltenham Spa
20:02 Cheltenham Spa to London Paddington
20:10 Weston-Super-Mare to Bristol Temple Meads
20:18 Weymouth to Bristol Temple Meads
21:07 Gloucester to Bristol Temple Meads
21:26 Taunton to Bristol Temple Meads
21:50 Plymouth to Exeter St Davids
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22:47 Cardiff Central to Bristol Temple Meads
23:30 Bristol Temple Meads to Swindon
23:41 Newbury to Bedwyn
03/12/23 06:38 London Paddington to Reading
Short Run
02/12/23 06:40 Penzance to Cardiff Central
02/12/23 07:00 London Paddington to Bristol Temple Meads
02/12/23 07:41 Bristol Temple Meads to Penzance
02/12/23 08:00 Cardiff Central to Penzance
02/12/23 08:30 London Paddington to Taunton
02/12/23 08:50 Penzance to Cardiff Central
09:09 Gloucester to Weymouth
10:30 London Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare
11:30 London Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare
11:32 Taunton to London Paddington
13:00 Cardiff Central to Penzance
13:02 Weston-Super-Mare to London Paddington
13:18 Taunton to Cardiff Central
13:30 Weymouth to Gloucester
13:38 Bristol Temple Meads to Worcester Foregate Street
13:50 Penzance to Cardiff Central
14:02 Weston-Super-Mare to London Paddington
14:02 Westbury to Gloucester
14:30 Cardiff Central to Portsmouth Harbour
15:09 Gloucester to Weymouth
15:30 Weymouth to Gloucester
15:38 Bristol Temple Meads to Worcester Foregate Street
16:00 Cardiff Central to Taunton
16:09 Gloucester to Weymouth
16:18 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
16:23 Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central
16:48 London Paddington to Swansea
16:50 Penzance to Cardiff Central
17:00 Cardiff Central to Taunton
17:28 Swansea to London Paddington
17:41 Bristol Temple Meads to Frome
17:52 Worcester Foregate Street to Bristol Temple Meads
18:00 Cardiff Central to Plymouth
18:23 Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central
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19:10 Taunton to Gloucester
19:50 Worcester Foregate Street to Bristol Temple Meads
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Author Topic: Preserved -> Heritage  (Read 3399 times)
grahame
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« on: May 13, 2020, 06:52:47 pm »

This board has been retitled from "Preserved railway lines, Railtours, other rail based attractions" to "Heritage railway lines, Railtours, other rail based attractions", correcting a long standing goof that has irritated the pedants.

If something is PRESERVED then it is maintained it its original state.  Railway lines running seasonal passenger services for a tourist market are not preserved - many elements are modified to meet modern convenience and safety standards, and extra elements are added to attract business. The term HERITAGE is chosen to indicate they have a facade "times gone by" but man modern element and addition.

The "preserved" v "heritage" argument can be seen, for example, in the original HST (High Speed Train) power car, preserved by the National Railway Museum but then restored for heritage use by the 125 group, with the NRM» (National Railway Museum, at York and Shildon - about) claiming it back at the end of last November (2019), to the disappointment of the group. https://www.125group.org.uk/about-125-group/
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broadgage
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« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2020, 11:45:54 pm »

Agree, "preserved" does imply preserved in substantially original condition. The fitting of replacement parts is often unavoidable, but these should be reasonably close facsimiles of the originals.
Many steam locos can reasonably be regarded as being preserved in substantially original condition.

However considering the West Somerset Railway as an example, the infrastructure is definitely "heritage" and not "preserved"
Electric lights, and concrete sleepers, and other features are appropriate on a working railway even if not original.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
CyclingSid
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« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2020, 07:12:49 am »

Quote
If something is PRESERVED then it is maintained it its original state.
Hardly applies to jam, when you have added a considerable amount of sugar. By the way, if any of the assembled experts can explain the difference between preserve and conserve, in the context of things you spread on bread, I will be educated.
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SandTEngineer
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« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2020, 07:46:53 am »

Agree, "preserved" does imply preserved in substantially original condition. The fitting of replacement parts is often unavoidable, but these should be reasonably close facsimiles of the originals.
Many steam locos can reasonably be regarded as being preserved in substantially original condition.

However considering the West Somerset Railway as an example, the infrastructure is definitely "heritage" and not "preserved"
Electric lights, and concrete sleepers, and other features are appropriate on a working railway even if not original.

Err..... The GWR (Great Western Railway) had electric signal lights, motor points and concrete sleepers in the 1930s, so I think they qualify as 'Preserved'..... Tongue
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bradshaw
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« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2020, 08:10:27 am »

This website explains conserve/preserve etc

https://www.kilnerjar.co.uk/a-guide-to-jams
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broadgage
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« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2020, 07:58:10 pm »

Agree, "preserved" does imply preserved in substantially original condition. The fitting of replacement parts is often unavoidable, but these should be reasonably close facsimiles of the originals.
Many steam locos can reasonably be regarded as being preserved in substantially original condition.

However considering the West Somerset Railway as an example, the infrastructure is definitely "heritage" and not "preserved"
Electric lights, and concrete sleepers, and other features are appropriate on a working railway even if not original.

Err..... The GWR (Great Western Railway) had electric signal lights, motor points and concrete sleepers in the 1930s, so I think they qualify as 'Preserved'..... Tongue

Yes, but I doubt that such modernity was much seen on the Minehead branch.
I have heard that some intermediate stations did not get electricity until a few years before closure.
One station still has a small hand operated winch intended for hoisting a Tilley lamp aloft after filling and lighting at ground level.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2020, 12:14:49 pm »

Plenty of Tilley lamp operations at certain rural locations well into the 1960s and probably beyond. Places like Chetnole and rural S & D stations are examples. This together with gas lighting at more urban locations within a similar period.

For the really rural spots there were examples of trains not calling after dark.
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broadgage
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« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2023, 02:46:05 pm »

The Tilley company actualy made a special lamp for lighting railway platforms. The Challow lantern, this used the same burner as the other Tilley lamps, but had a specialy designed reflector to direct the light along a plarform, with little wasted in other directions.
I used to have one, but sold it to a collecter.

Tilley lamps of various types were widely used by the railway until fairly recently.

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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
Mark A
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« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2023, 02:53:52 pm »

The Tilley company actualy made a special lamp for lighting railway platforms. The Challow lantern, this used the same burner as the other Tilley lamps, but had a specialy designed reflector to direct the light along a plarform, with little wasted in other directions.
I used to have one, but sold it to a collecter.

Tilley lamps of various types were widely used by the railway until fairly recently.



If you'd not said what it was I would have assumed a 'Challow Lantern' was the will o' the wisp occasionally seen by the inhabitants of the Berkshire village on moonless nights during the WW2 blackouts, flickering above the stagnant waters of the canal there.

Mark
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ellendune
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« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2023, 12:49:10 pm »

If you'd not said what it was I would have assumed a 'Challow Lantern' was the will o' the wisp occasionally seen by the inhabitants of the Berkshire village on moonless nights during the WW2 blackouts, flickering above the stagnant waters of the canal there.

Mark

Glad you got the village in the right (historic) county!  There's a reason that Shire Hall is in Abingdon!
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