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Author Topic: Petition - Railcard for train spotting?  (Read 1620 times)
TaplowGreen
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« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2020, 06:30:12 am »

I think trainspotters are looked upon with affectionate bemusement rather than in a derogatory way.

There's a hierarchy too. Line bashers look down on those who collect loco numbers. Loco spotters look down on carriage spotters. Carriage spotters look down on those who collect freight wagon numbers. And they all look down on bus enthusiasts.

.....that helps to explain the bemusement.
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Phil
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« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2020, 10:47:09 am »

I think a Railcard scheme would be a good idea so that genuine trainspotters could be recognised

I have to say that in my experience, it doesn't require a railcard to recognise a rail enthusiast - and I'd imagine that staff are even more adept at spotting them than I am. I'm fairly sure at Westbury for example (where I spend most of my time getting on or off or just waiting) that most of the regulars are known to the staff there by name.
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Clan Line
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« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2020, 11:36:31 am »

Bad idea !!

Any person has a right to access a station (except in emergency - terror/UXB/accident/etc). A card makes it all to easy for that right to become a paid for "privilege" which any jobsworth on a barrier can remove. The very liberal interpretation of the Penalty Fares system in some locations already seems to point that way.

I have had several meaningful discussions with barrier staff about accessing a platform when not travelling - when I asked for the Duty Manager I was invariably let through !
I would have no objection to purchasing a platform ticket (at 1d ?  Wink) - but I know at least one of my local TOCs (SWT) had told their staff not to sell them. Didn't that break the rules about ticket sales ? Another TOC (FGW) thought I was bonkers when I asked if I could buy a  platform ticket - at an "open" station ! When I explained that I didn't actually want one, I just wanted to know if they would sell me one, they said they could.
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grahame
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« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2020, 11:53:03 am »

Any person has a right to access a station (except in emergency - terror/UXB/accident/etc). ....

Not quite ..."Withdrawal of Implied Permission"

From Byline Times

Quote
Homeless people risk being banned from their local train station under an increasingly used order called a Withdrawal of Implied Permission (WIP).

Data obtained by Byline Times shows that between 2013 and the end of 2017 483 people were banned from train stations under these orders. Although the number issued dropped after the first year they were introduced, it has steadily increased since 2015.

Withdrawal of Implied Permission orders are designed to be used against people engaging in ‘anti-social behaviour’ but there are concerns they could disproportionately target homeless people. Examples of behaviour that could lead to an order being issued have been listed on notices in various train stations. As well as offences such as shoplifting the examples include: begging, loitering, persistent rough sleeping and alcohol related crimes.

In 2016 British Transport Police working at London Victoria station tweeted a picture of such a notice while commenting that “begging in and around the station could result in a 6 month ban” and encouraging people to report “unwanted behaviour”.

I'm not sure of the procedure for issuing these notices, but they do exist and include "loitering" in the list of reasons for their issue which is, after all, what train spotters do in the gaps between services ...
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2020, 12:13:56 pm »

I’m not sure that anyone has a right as such to enter a station because they are on private land.

One clearly has a right to enter a station if you have bought a ticket, because you have then entered into a contract with a company to take you somewhere by rail. In order to access their service, you need then to enter the station. But that is for a specific purpose and not a general right.

You would not expect to be allowed to go airside in an airport to watch planes. You can watch them quite satisfactorily from landside, in exactly the same way as you could watch trains from outside the station.

It is sometimes forgotten that in previous years canal towpaths were just as private as railway land when it came to public access. Those rules tended to be overtaken by events as the canal networks were formally abandoned and became derelict, but they were still technically in place.
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stuving
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« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2020, 12:16:59 pm »

Bad idea !!

Any person has a right to access a station (except in emergency - terror/UXB/accident/etc). A card makes it all to easy for that right to become a paid for "privilege" which any jobsworth on a barrier can remove. The very liberal interpretation of the Penalty Fares system in some locations already seems to point that way.

I have had several meaningful discussions with barrier staff about accessing a platform when not travelling - when I asked for the Duty Manager I was invariably let through !
I would have no objection to purchasing a platform ticket (at 1d ?  Wink) - but I know at least one of my local TOCs (SWT) had told their staff not to sell them. Didn't that break the rules about ticket sales ? Another TOC (FGW) thought I was bonkers when I asked if I could buy a  platform ticket - at an "open" station ! When I explained that I didn't actually want one, I just wanted to know if they would sell me one, they said they could.

A platform ticket is not a ticket - not in the sense used in the RSP TSA, anyway. The definition therein says:
Quote
Ticket means a document which evidences the Purchase of a Fare, an Excess Fare or an Upgrade or certain types of Reservation.

The rules about ticket sales apply to tickets in that sense, conferring a right to travel. A platform ticket would be some kind of barrier pass, a local matter for the station operator (at least in principle).
« Last Edit: July 27, 2020, 01:26:35 pm by stuving » Logged
paul7755
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« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2020, 12:40:57 pm »

Not much of a trainspotter if he doesn’t realise that a “railcard” is the thing you use to get a discount off a fare.   Huh

What he really wants is some sort of “photo”, “ID”, or “membership” card, but please not a railcard...

Paul
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Bmblbzzz
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« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2020, 12:45:59 am »

Choose trains
Choose a ticket
Choose a railcard
Choose a discount
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onthecushions
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« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2020, 02:47:11 pm »

There's always the Ian Allan Loco-spotters club that NR could revive, complete with badge (in six regional colours), membership card and solemn undertaking to obey this rule:

 Members of the club will not in any way interfere with railway working or material, nor be a nuisance or hindrance to their staff, nor, above all, trespass on railway property.

You needed a 1/3d postal order and SAE with 41/2d stamp.

How much have we lost.

OTC

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grahame
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« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2020, 03:00:59 pm »

There's always the Ian Allan Loco-spotters club that NR could revive, complete with badge (in six regional colours), membership card and solemn undertaking to obey this rule:

 Members of the club will not in any way interfere with railway working or material, nor be a nuisance or hindrance to their staff, nor, above all, trespass on railway property.

You needed a 1/3d postal order and SAE with 41/2d stamp.

How much have we lost.

OTC


The Rail Rider's Club - https://www.railriders.club/rail-riders-benefits - is back.  But the point of the rail"card" was / is for train spotters who station themselves at - err - a station and do not ride.   

The new "Rail Riders" is for the John Cleese of this world, where the Ian Allan club was for the Ronnie Barkers.  There's probably a club for the Ronnie Corbetts to stand on the street corner and watch the buses go by.
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stuving
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« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2020, 05:59:51 pm »

How much have we lost.

OTC

Yes - it's called the past. It does that all the time.
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grahame
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« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2020, 09:40:41 am »

A new group just started on FaceBook

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1182062955503754/permalink/1182068055503244/

Quote
RIGHTS FOR RAIL ENTHUSIASTS

I have started this group because of on going issues at Swindon GWR station about being allowed on to the platforms to photo and spot trains (both before COVID19 and after)

For me and other men and a few ladies going to your local station to see the trains is all some of them have to do in their senior years ,for me it is good for my well being and my mental heath plus a social event,

This should be taken into account by the train companies when deciding the rules.

Swindon had a manager who disliked rail enthusiasts;but she has now gone but things have not changed a great deal

Of course the barriers are there to stop fraudulent travel but there are cameras all over if they want to keep an eye on us and if you break the rules you will be banned

GWR Have a heart please !!!
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