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Author Topic: Patterns of returning passengers?  (Read 35949 times)
stuving
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« Reply #45 on: August 27, 2021, 17:41:26 »

I read this in today's Metro, but the report I found is from th Guardian:
Quote
Bank holiday weekend travel warning as fine weather forecast for UK (United Kingdom)

Holidaymakers in England, Wales and Northern Ireland look to take advantage of late summer sun
Ticket sales for trains to seaside destinations over the bank holiday weekend have surpassed pre-pandemic levels, according to the industry body the Rail Delivery Group (RDG(resolve)). Demand is more than double compared with last year’s August bank holiday, and up 17% on the same weekend in 2019.

Travellers are keen to take advantage of warm, dry and sunny weather across most of the UK this weekend, with the highest temperatures and most sunshine in the west, according to Met Office predictions.
...
The consultancy WPI Economics said trains were especially popular among young people, with 1.03m journeys per week made using the 16-25 railcard, an increase of 49,000 since the beginning of June.

WPI estimated that passengers travelling to seaside destinations for leisure spend on average £116 per trip. This includes £40 on food and drink, £31 on accommodation, £23 on shopping, £13 on other travel and £10 on entertainment and culture.

However, commuting and business trips by rail are still well below pre-coronavirus levels, with the result that rail industry revenue is at 59% of what it was at this point in 2019.

Most of the article is about roads. One thing not being said is that people who are working (or "working") at home today may be able to spread their travel times across more of the day than used to be the case. Is there any evidence of that?

Talking about the seaside, there was a recent report about Frinton-on-Sea quoting the deputy mayor of Walton and Frinton as saying "Frinton is not a seaside resort...".
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froome
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« Reply #46 on: August 27, 2021, 18:20:05 »

Frinton isn't a seaside resort. It is a retirement home next to the coast.  Shocked
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eightonedee
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« Reply #47 on: August 27, 2021, 18:41:43 »

Quote
Frinton isn't a seaside resort. It is a retirement home next to the coast

Giving rise to the famous graffiti applied to a "Harwich for the Continent" poster, namely

"and Frinton for the incontinent" Grin
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johnneyw
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« Reply #48 on: August 27, 2021, 22:57:10 »

Quote
Frinton isn't a seaside resort. It is a retirement home next to the coast

Giving rise to the famous graffiti applied to a "Harwich for the Continent" poster, namely

"and Frinton for the incontinent" Grin

During my very early years living on the edge of London, an older colleague of my mother retired with her husband to Frinton-on-Sea.  I recall visiting once and I don't remember it giving me the impression of somewhere to go for a day by the sea like Southend on Sea did....this was in the 1960s I should add.
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eightonedee
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« Reply #49 on: September 08, 2021, 22:22:05 »

I did my first Goring to Guildford journey since March 2020 - not a commute, but to attend a social event at work in the early evening (4pm to 6pm).

The station car parks at Goring and Pangbourne are definitely fuller - 50% plus, and the return journey at about the time I used to commute back was not as busy on the first (Guildford-Reading) leg, but neither was it deserted. The Reading - Goring leg was almost back to passenger levels of old.

I think my earlier posting about Friday travel may not have been a good guide, as Friday seems to be a day that many under new (or evolving) work patterns are not attending offices. My firm is moving towards some days when everyone (or all members of a team) will be expected to attend in the absence of booked holiday or genuine work related appointment out of the office. It looks like Tuesdays and Thursdays for most.

It will be interesting to see if a consistent pattern emerges across the commuting classes with some days of the
week being regularly much busier than others - a challenge for those setting timetables and allocating resources perhaps?
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stuving
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« Reply #50 on: September 08, 2021, 22:56:38 »

It will be interesting to see if a consistent pattern emerges across the commuting classes with some days of the week being regularly much busier than others - a challenge for those setting timetables and allocating resources perhaps?

Well, what pattern can you see in the last few weeks' numbers added in the latest upadate?

Number of cars in the Wokingham Station car parks, capacity 531 (SWR» (South Western Railway - about)) or 424 (Ringo), seen at some time during 10 am-5 pm (most often 14:30-16:30).

W/S      Mon  Tue  Wed  Thu  Fri    Notes
21/9 29 42~ 42~ 40 35 "stay at home" advice from Thursday
28/9 23 40 40 53~  -
  5/10 23  - 43 45 37
12/10 3129 39 46 41
19/10 37 29  - 36 26
26/10 17 22 30 37 45 Half term
  2/11 23 39 27 19 18 "Lockdown 2" from Thursday
  9/11 17 18 19 27 15
16/11 27 26 28 27 21
23/11 15 16 15 17 19
30/11 19 19 18  - 23
7/12 19 29 41 43 21
14/12 26 24 25 - 27
21/12 17 - 7 3 - didn't look Xmas week
4/1/21 14 8 7 - - "Lockdown 3" from Tuesday
11/1 7 8 8 - -
18/1 11 11 - 10 15
25/1 12 14 16 12 12
  1/2 13 14 14 19 12
8/2 - - - - - too cold all week!
15/2 10 16 - 16 12
22/2 15 11 12 16 9
1/3 1413* 9*14* 9* *not counting Tighe's vans, but maybe a few workers' cars
8/317*21*21*17*19*   back-to-school week
15/315*12* 9*11* 18
22/3 15~ 15 15 15 13 not counting "waiters" for schoolkids
29/3 16 16 16 12 6* first notch of relaxation
5/4 * 12 - 15 20 * Easter
12/4 18 32 32 30 21
19/4 21 28 31 32 25 schools back
26/4 31 42 50 29 27
3/5 -* 28 37 32 28 *Mayday BH; some use visibly for part days now
10/5 37 30 - 28 28 Sat 28
17/5 30 42 64 48 39 "step 3 easements" from Monday
24/5 39 38 41 - 49~ Sat 58, Sun 38
31/5 27* 37 42 49 37 * BH
7/6 - - - - -
14/6 42 56 62 57 - Sat 40. Ascot week (test event)
21/6 - - 62 61 46 Sat 74
28/6 - 47 64 69~ 36 Sat 42
5/7 - - 60 75 49 Sat 71
12/7 50 64 74 62 31 32
19/7 51* 72 79 57 46 *"Freedom day!"
26/7 38 57 60 63 -
2/8 45 52 69 63 50
9/8 56 - 88 87 59
16/8 54 70 86 66 54
23/8 65 84 63 82 92 Sat 34
30/8 34* 47 107 - 72 Sat 85 *Bank holiday Monday

~ approx.
updated 8/9/21

The slow drift back to going to work continues, but it is very slow - remember there are over 500 spaces!

Next update is here, and is from July 2021 only.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2021, 13:23:33 by stuving » Logged
Mark A
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« Reply #51 on: September 08, 2021, 23:04:45 »

Up to London on the 8:13 Bath - Chippenham - Paddington yesterday. Fair few alighting at Bath and just a few on. Two in 1st up to London, and standard class, after Chippenham, perhaps 1/5 full (a 5 car set).

Back on the 16:20 from Waterloo: very busy from Waterloo. Later, on the Bristol portion from Salisbury, nine standard class passengers and two in first class in one of the three carriages, the others were not counted.

Northern line southbound from Highgate to Bank / DLR (Docklands Light Railway) full and standing during this evening's peak. About 70% masked.
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« Reply #52 on: September 09, 2021, 17:49:05 »

The "Business" section in today's Daily Telegraph has a photo captioned "Back in the old routine" showing packed platforms at Clapham Junction - "a hive of activity".

I haven't liked the stance on Covid adopted by the Telegraphand cynically wondered whether it was a pre-Covid photo. Perhaps 80 commuters packed together: OK, some had their backs to the camera, but I couldn't see any masks. A friend sporting brand new bifocals spotted one.

I retain a cautious approach (but not completely risk-free), and I did wince.
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« Reply #53 on: September 09, 2021, 22:32:06 »

We're starting our phased return of teams to offices. It's still masks in buildings and social distancing which has been raised by some staff in stark contrast to their being in packed trains with no rules.

A significant number have raised concerns about having to return at this point because of travel. Outside of London I suspect more people will drive if its an option but it doesn't really work in central London.

We've also had HSE (Health and Safety Executive) inspections about Covid safety which I didn't really understand considering the Government's laisse faire approach elsewhere.
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MVR S&T
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« Reply #54 on: September 09, 2021, 23:51:52 »

I am surprised that some firms still don't get it, case rates are still very high, the vaccine is wearing off, flu season is near, we need to embrace the new normal, my knee is playing up, will I have to wait 15 years for a replacement, just because some middle managers wanted their team back to justify their jobs....
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grahame
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« Reply #55 on: September 10, 2021, 06:14:13 »

I am surprised that some firms still don't get it, case rates are still very high, the vaccine is wearing off, flu season is near, we need to embrace the new normal, my knee is playing up, will I have to wait 15 years for a replacement, just because some middle managers wanted their team back to justify their jobs....

I would query elements of that ...

I would suggest that it's top rather than middle managers for the most part who want their teams back in the office; middle managers (and it depends on the definition) probably don't have the authority for such a far-reaching decision.

I would also suggest that for training and bringing on a new generation of staff to do a "coalface" job, the office environment is a very great help (to put it mildly).  Putting it another way, companies have been able to carry on with home working, and have been able to do so for a year or two, but there's a need to keep a fresh flow of new blood coming in to teams and the home work approach in some roles stunts that growth - there is a need to get more back to  meeting in real life and sitting alongside your peers.
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grahame
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« Reply #56 on: September 10, 2021, 06:31:37 »

From the BBC» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page)

Quote
Quote
Rail industry urges workers not to spurn the train

Unless workers start taking the train again, there could be long-term adverse effects on city centres and High Streets, the rail industry has warned.

Train commuting is still just 33% of its pre-Covid rate, while car journeys have reached pre-pandemic levels, said the Rail Delivery Group (RDG(resolve)).

The article goes on to talk about the various side-effects of reduced (rail) commuting - pollution and traffic jams if people transfer to the roads, and the spending by train passengers on "food and drink, shopping, entertainment and culture".   It suggests

Quote
The RDG said rail journeys to and from work were expected to increase during September, but could take years to return to numbers seen in 2019.
 
...

Andy Bagnall, director general of the Rail Delivery Group, said that for many commuters, the future would undoubtedly involve a mix of home and office working.

"Commuting" is a much overused word and I'm unclear what was measured in their 33% ... does it mean people who travel from home to a single place of work multiple times per week? Does it mean all rail travellers - considering that I would "commute" to Weymouth for the day a a weekend if I risked all 4 trains I needed to take actually running?  And on that latter, is one of the keys to railway passenger numbers recovering going to be the rail industry reaching  or getting close to previous targets and achievements in terms of reliability, frequency and capacity?
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« Reply #57 on: September 10, 2021, 06:54:23 »

I suspect that a lot of potential rail passengers in GWR (Great Western Railway) land still think that the message is "avoid train travel" whether due to covid, cracks or staff shortage.

And of those who DID» (Didcot Parkway - next trains) try the train again, some may have decided that driving is the better option, due to the levels of cancellations and short formations.

If we are serious about reducing local air pollution, traffic congestion, and global warming, then "the railway" in general and the GWR bit in particular really need to up their game.

No amount of clever (or silly?) advertising compensates for trains that don't turn up or are overcrowded.

"Five took the train, and vowed never again"
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
TaplowGreen
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« Reply #58 on: September 10, 2021, 08:40:03 »

Up to London on the 8:13 Bath - Chippenham - Paddington yesterday. Fair few alighting at Bath and just a few on. Two in 1st up to London, and standard class, after Chippenham, perhaps 1/5 full (a 5 car set).

Back on the 16:20 from Waterloo: very busy from Waterloo. Later, on the Bristol portion from Salisbury, nine standard class passengers and two in first class in one of the three carriages, the others were not counted.

Northern line southbound from Highgate to Bank / DLR (Docklands Light Railway) full and standing during this evening's peak. About 70% masked.

Plymouth to Taplow (via Reading) on the 1514 yesterday - very quiet...........left Plymouth on time but about 25 mins late into Reading, similarly quiet TfL» (Transport for London - about) connection to Taplow.

Masks about 50% from what I could see

One more thing - don't try the avocado wrap - I was offered that or the all day breakfast sandwich - with several weeks of excess behind me I chose the former - never again, it was pretty dreadful although no doubt virtuous!
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Sixty3Closure
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« Reply #59 on: September 10, 2021, 18:13:20 »

I am surprised that some firms still don't get it, case rates are still very high, the vaccine is wearing off, flu season is near, we need to embrace the new normal, my knee is playing up, will I have to wait 15 years for a replacement, just because some middle managers wanted their team back to justify their jobs....

I wouldn't underestimate the number of younger staff who are desperate to come back into the office as well. Apart from the lack of spare rooms to work in they want to build up their network in the organisation and that's much harder to do over Zoom. I've been working with some new joiners who haven't yet met anyone in the organisation face to face and that must be incredibly tough when all of your assumptions and relationships are based on instant messaging and video conferencing in meetings.

Also in my case we've been treading water in terms of what projects we can deliver and not sure it can go on indefinitely.
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