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  • TWSW - Webinar 6 of 6: February 19, 2021
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Author Topic: TravelWatch Southwest - Webinar 6 of 6 - Friday 19th February 2021  (Read 2523 times)
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« on: January 18, 2021, 11:18:43 am »

TravelWatch Southwest - Webinar 6 3.30 pm - Friday 19th February 2021 - A finale of the series of webinars, with subject to be advises.

From 15:30 for about an hour - Fireside chat, Travelwatch Southwest webinar via Zoom. Sign up via EventBrite - details to follow on this thread.  Please contact TWSW» (TravelWatch SouthWest - website) secretary or myself for further details; all welcome. Each webinar in the series is independent - just attend those which are of interest to you.   This final event in the series is subject "to be advised" ... as we get closer to the date we'll tune the topic based on the interests at previous events, and the developing public transport, use and lockdown situation

This final event is an opportunity for YOUR input - see below in this thread!
« Last Edit: February 17, 2021, 02:27:30 pm by grahame » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2021, 06:59:13 pm »

TravelWatch Southwest - Webinar 6,  3.30 pm - Friday 19th February 2021 - A finale of the series of webinars, with subject to be advises.

...   This final event in the series is subject "to be advised" ... as we get closer to the date we'll tune the topic based on the interests at previous events, and the developing public transport, use and lockdown situation

There's a final back and forth going on for exact wording of invites, but we (that's the TWSW» (TravelWatch SouthWest - website) board) will be encouraging community groups/members to do a "just a minute" type presentation - except it will be "just a couple of minutes" under the headline "what is it that's important for your group in travel and transport terms for your group in the next years".

Outcome will be useful in networking to inform one another, to publish, and to inform TWSW and wider where we should be helping / concentrating in the future.

I will an an Eventbrite signup - probably on Monday or Tuesday; sessions are "all welcome". Priority for the two minute slots  will go to those faithful who have regularly come along, but there should be space for newcomers to speak too.   And indeed one of the issues is encouraging new members and widening the diversity as we do so.

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« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2021, 01:10:18 pm »

Sign up, sign up!!   Your chance to feed in to community groups how you would like to see things improved for the future - listen to what they have to say too, and get the inputs registered and heard - perhaps in some influential places. The input in this session will also strongly inform the board of TravelWatch SouthWest as to what we can do to help you as we all move ahead.

About this Event

This session is for our member groups and others, as we ask member groups to take the floor in the spirit of the traditional TWSW» (TravelWatch SouthWest - website) Meetings when we ask Groups to give us their perspective in a couple of minutes.

Tell us what outcomes you are focussing on and campaigning for locally.

We suggest including the challenges to success and the activities undertaken as your group work to "make it better" going forward?

Use the registration form to let us know whether your Group will be one of those telling us more.

* Key outcomes - what you would like to have delivered and what impact that will have
* Hurdles to getting there and open doors found
* Share your tips on how to learn, consult, input effectively?
* How TravelWatch SouthWest and other community groupings can help

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« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2021, 05:50:11 pm »

This final event is an opportunity for YOUR input - see below in this thread!

My input (slides) at ... other inputs to be written up here in the morning!

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« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2021, 11:09:53 am »

My input (slides) at ... other inputs to be written up here in the morning!

"Just a minute (or two)" - notes from TravelWatch SouthWest Webinar / chat on 19th Feb 2021, as logged by myself.  Please send me a personal message on the forum if there's anything you feel could be clarified within this text, or follow up on the post.  I have done my best, but not the world's best note taker these days!

Chris Irwin (chair). Introduced the meeting thanking everyone for attending the series of session that this one concluded, and for their inputs.   After a break, another series will follow - not too long in the future, but no specific dates yet.  17 (?) people have asked to speak for a minute or two on their own issues, and concerns, and to inform, and importantly this will help inform/confirm to TWSW» (TravelWatch SouthWest - website) as to what is key for our members.

Paul Johnson. (1) Integrating rail and bus information on CIS (Customer Information System) screens is important where rail replacement buses are running.  This has always been put in "too difficult" box by the rail industry when requested, but it's not/no longer just a local issue we have raised here and should be addressed. (2) For your information, we [TransWilts] (shared with Severnside, Worcsestershire, and Gloucstershire CRPs (Community Rail Partnership)) are planning to employ an education officer to promote healthy and sustainable travel via a program. Looking for early youth involvement. Initial funding CRD via CRN(resolve) then from a GWR (Great Western Railway) education fund from which money can be bid from.

Nick Farthing.  Bus / Rail / Ferry ticket to be launched this summer for the Solent area - Salisbury / Winchester / Burlesdon train area, buses in the Southamton area and to Waterside / New Forest, Hythe Ferry and Hythe Pier railway.  I heard "All day" but chat clarified as all day at weekends, off peak on weekdays. Hythe ferry is a return trip on the ticket, rest of service are rover to use multple times if you like

Mike Lambden. We have a big bus archive, but on paper and can't access during Covid. Lessons from the past are to be learned - things that ceased and ideas not taken up may indeed come back now.   It used to be that bus services were widesperead but thin and people made their journeys at the time(s) the bus ran. Now they expect an all day service.  Better mobility has lead to the death of the local centre. Avoid fare systems that are too complex. And people really do NOT like to buy travel ahead of time.

Barclay Davies. Looking after bus users / bus compliance - now laregly online. Challenge (sorry, Barclay - can't read my own note).  No evidence that Covid is / has been transmitted on buses. Need for new headstart / restart (some slight oprimism that there will be promotion help?) . Cashless far from an ideal payment solution - some don't have plastic and don't have access to it. And mobile phones don't always get a rural signal to check your ticket.

Robert / Reading buses - followed this up on chair invite to confirm that although there was some move to cashless journeys which were 50/50 with cash journeys pre-covid, it was only to about 60/40. Privacy of data concerns raised (by other speakers) have not been a problem and "the information is of no interest - we are just looking for payment". But trust might be an issue.

Jacqui from BAVLAP. Look at using school minibuses that are parked up all day for community transport services.  Deliveries have cut emissions. Need government schemes to help. Social and pleasure journeys out at the moment. Also need to look at car sharing. Problems with electic chargers in rural area, people don't have off road parking from where to charge, so perhaps base cars / charge at village and community halls?

David Regdewell. Has been following legal provision for disabled access and ensuring provision does not get overlooked / pulled back during covid times. David also notes the need for govt. funding for at least 18 months for public transport and that farebox will not cover for 2 years. Predicts (educated thought) that things will not go back to commercial services as before.

Tim Dumper. Exmouth, struggling, loss of passengers and challenge is to get them back. In support of electric cargo bikes.  Disappearing and lack of interchanges.

Roma. Now in the North West but learning and informing in both directions. Confirmes that issues in the North West mirror issues in the South West. Lots to learn and share which she is doing working with her old ALRUG area.

Chair asked local govt and rail reps what makes a good user group to work with

Andrew Ardley. A group that listens as well as campaigning. Taking a look at the longer term and working together

David Phillips. Agree with Andrew Ardley and looks at the facts / issues. Look very much at joined up solutions.  Edit - David writes to me: What this should have said (what I intended to say... don't remember what I delivered!) was that I was recalling a stakeholder meeting:
Mark Hopwood said faster trains attracted more passengers (true)
Nina Howe said a more important factor was having reliable trains (also true)
What neither said, but I wished to add, was that for most people, the critical factor was that trains didn't go where they wished to travel.This was, of course, a support for "joined-up solutions" - the thing that we, collectively in UK (United Kingdom), seem to find so hard to do. Original text: David contrasted Mark Hopwood promotion of faster trains v Nina Howe saying people are calling for reliable trains, and how there is an element of contrast between those two positions. (Q: from chair) Have we the right structure. (A:) Boundaries are awkward, and whether or not the structure is right, we don't have the capacity to make full use of all the interfacing and working with opportunities with our neighbours. Especially the case for a landlocked county like Wiltshire with borders on all sides!

Nigel Ewens. 60% have no driveway so electric car charge problem. Suggest village charge point. Only 9 years to end of sales of petrol vehicles. UK needs twice the generation capacity it has. Bus is not profitable and needs political debate. Councils strapped for cash. Village electric bus? Demand responsive? Electric bike surprisingly flexible, joining up. Revitalise village?  Joined up thinking vital.

Dick Daniel. Bristol and Bath trams. Linking system is best. Trams proven to get through traffic where buses do not; people tend to keep out of the way. Overhead may not be needed on all sensitive or awkward sections. Once installed, cheap to run. People like them and will use them.

Colin Divall. Stories / case studies are important to reach people ... lead to a discussion (CI and CD (Capital Delivery)) of someone who was already knowldgable struggling to book a trip from Amsterdam to Florence by train. Then discovered Interrail which was a solution. Story also involved mainland Europe train operators who each run (and protect) their own booking systems and don't open to 3rd parties such as Trainline.

Bryony Chetwode. Post buses were transforming in rural areas for younger people; a freedom for Mum who could see that daughter was with a known operator / person to the main interchange. Also (for Bryony) trigged a youthful enthusiasm / interest in buses. Passenger + mail in one vehicle - stengthens financial case for both.

Andy B. Transport discussion with community group raise a fury in Bristol - mention of WECA» (West of England Combined Authority - about), the Council, Safer Streets and the feedback is that these organisations are seen as working for the white middle class against others.

Mike Reddaway. As RUG» (Rail User Group - about) - frustration with no timetables at stations any longer, though they have been put up for two engineering replaced Sundays. Also issues with alternate train removal which removed trains for long periods at certain stations. GWR responded well and quickly to correct the issue.  Still working to sort out some issues created by the December 2019 timetable change (connections, etc)

James Harkins. Trams - Edinburgh (his background) held up as "shambles" - except that it's carrying 7.5 million passengers a year and now everyone else wants a line and extensions under way. Equate it to childbirth - huge pain and swearing "never again" but yet look at how many people have multiple children.

Graham Ellis.  See summary at - three slided 1. What would we like to see looking forward? 2. Strategy 3. Tactics.  Largely reflext much of the above.

Chair thanks all / meeting closed.  Many thanks for inputs and participation; very useful inputs.

Chat - key comments

Me to Everyone (3:30 pm)
Notes tomorrow at http”//

Kit (Transition Tavistock) to Everyone (3:44 pm)
Mike & others - are there stats about trends in payment mode by age group / location?

Mike Lambden to Everyone (3:52 pm)
Picking up Barclay's point about using PT I was taken about the other day to hear the Shadow Health Secretary state that he thought public transport users should now be using enhanced face masks to travel which would be another barrier.

Kit (Transition Tavistock) to Everyone (3:52 pm)
Re electric cars - with the ranges now available there is no need to charge the car daily. We never expected to refill with petrol within 100yds of home.

Mike Lambden to Everyone (3:54 pm)
TfL» (Transport for London - about) have not taken cash for bus services for several years.

Colin Divall to Everyone (3:55 pm)
The data security/privacy issues get sidelined as well.

James Harkins to Everyone (3:55 pm)
Tallin and other cities have their urban and suburban public transport free in the form of resident cards

david.phillips to Everyone (3:55 pm)
Agree with Colin on data/privacy
I'd prefer to use a card of some form - not to rely totally on one very complex device (mobile phone)

Kit (Transition Tavistock) to Everyone (3:56 pm)
For an good introduction to considerations in using electric cars see

David Redgewell to Everyone (3:57 pm)
the sum.of money to run public transport  system at present is £27.5 a week for buses  £182 million a week for railway£24 .5 million in England
The department for transport funding

Nick Farthing to Everyone (3:58 pm)
Great idea about the cargo bikes - check out Zedify who use cargo bikes - google their name for details

David Redgewell to Everyone (3:58 pm)
coaches get no money  from the department for transport

David Redgewell to Everyone (3:59 pm)
weca mayoral transport authority and North Somerset council are operating 80 bus services under Covid 19 bus operators grant s from the department for transport.

Dick Daniel to Everyone (4:00 pm)
In Bath there is a commercial cargo bike delivery service for businesses called Three Bags Full and the Library of Things use one for delivery's and collections.

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:00 pm)
bus recovery partnership is with  locial authorities is the new way forward

david.phillips to Everyone (4:01 pm)
What Andrew says would apply also to local authorities

Bryony Chetwode to Everyone (4:01 pm)
There is some very positive partnership work being done in Dundee

Nick Farthing to Everyone (4:01 pm)
For cargo bikes check out Pedal and Post Oxford as well

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:02 pm)
The department for transport are issue guidance to the bus and rail operators  and providing the Funds

Nick Hurrell to Everyone (4:02 pm)
Post Covid - it will be more important than ever that User Groups work with Operators. SERUG have re-aligned our objectives to help with passenger recovery

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:04 pm)
The department for transport have again issued instructions via minister to health Authorities clinical commission group on access to vaccinations centre
south west transport board
western gateway transport board

Colin Divall to Everyone (4:04 pm)
Humour - and good (as in inspiring) storytelling as well.

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:04 pm)
we one South west of England Transport board

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:05 pm)
nice if the carry out a public consultation on transport boards and Authorities

Jacqui - BAVLAP Beaminster & Villages Area Partnership to Everyone (4:06 pm)
As I said Village Halls could be ‘Community Hubs”

Bryony Chetwode to Everyone (4:06 pm)
Perhaps we should be encouraged to pay for charging with used Public transport vouchers as the main percentage currency

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:07 pm)
Bristol clean air zone go to cabinet on 25 th February and the Government on the 26th February 2021 starts October 2021
Bath clean air zone start 15 th march 2021 go live

david.phillips to Everyone (4:08 pm)
That is an interesting idea Bryony!

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:09 pm)
25 th online mass transit system wednar by the west of England combined authority and North Somerset council. details eventbrite

Bryony Chetwode to Everyone (4:09 pm)
I expect free buses for the behavioural shift required is not affordable by straightforward reckoning..?

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:09 pm)
mass transit webnar 25th February 2021

Lucy Travis to Everyone (4:10 pm)
Can't seeing hail on demand working for people who commuter or school children as they need reliable bus services at specific times to get them to work or school. Could work for people who have more time on their hands e.g OAP's but then that service would be in essence be community transport.

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:10 pm)
last date for beeching reopening bid 4 th of march 2021  new lines new station s

Lucy Travis to Everyone (4:11 pm)
One of my favourite graphic showing the contrast in terms of road space between cars, buses and other forms of transport.

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:12 pm)
stagecoach south west and user group are opposing the The closure of Torquay fleet street to bus service s
by the town forum traders proposal to the council

GST114288 to Everyone (4:13 pm)
nobody has mentioned a development of postbuses---plus passengers being carried on supermarket delivery vans!

James Harkins to Everyone (4:13 pm)
Manchester Metrolink before pandemic carried 67.6 million passengers with only 120 vehicles. 27% were former car journeys - not expensive if you spread capita over 60 years, four times the life of a bus

Colin Divall to Everyone (4:14 pm)
If you want to get really radical - and I think we have to in the climate emergency  -try John Sutton's ideas about personal rations of mobility miles, which can be traded - in his book Gridlock (2015)  Ticks the social equity box as well as environmental...

David Redgewell to Everyone (4:14 pm)
Department for transport looking at DRt

Kit (Transition Tavistock) to Everyone (4:16 pm)
Didn't Ben Elton also do a novel called Gridlock?

Colin Divall to Everyone (4:16 pm)
He did!

Nick Farthing to Everyone (4:16 pm)
In my experience of "selling" projects to everyone, the best way is to see if those you are "negotiating" with have some benefit from your scheme as well

Dick Daniel to Everyone (4:16 pm)
For lots more information on trams please see

Ian Harrison to Everyone (4:20 pm)
Agree with Nick that projects need to work for all parties if they are going to be successful. For example, services have to generate enough income to meet their costs.

Nigel Ewens to Everyone (4:20 pm)
I lived in Bristol in late 1970's & 17 years ago was invited to advise on rail based proposals as part of transport solution - politics got in the way, the old Midland route Bristol to Bath (with link north) was lost when new Bypass was permitted to be built on part of the trackbed - typical short term thinking.  Today a tram could be put in place using rest of old route + some new route to get around blockage.  Would enable tramway & trailway to exist together --- needs funding & political will

Dick Daniel to Everyone (4:23 pm)
The Manchester Metrolink is a tram system.

Bryony Chetwode to Everyone (4:24 pm)
I will put the papers sent by Andy Burkitt under the Webinar on our Website

Andy Burkitt to Everyone (4:25 pm)
TfGB Papers & Manifesto & next project - I will pass to Bryony & Christopher

Nigel Ewens to Everyone (4:26 pm)
The rail industry -- pre Covid-19 -- uses a 'clearing house' type system to apportion revenues when passenger journeys are across multiple Franchise operators - which can include 'Tube' trips too.  Technology advances should help this concept develop to serve us better

Andy Burkitt to Everyone (4:27 pm)
We also work with James Harkins who has been so helpful.

Edit - correction / clarification from one of the speakers
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 09:23:00 am by grahame » Logged

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