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Author Topic: Barton on Humber - plan to 'temporarily scrap all trains'  (Read 208 times)
grahame
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« on: January 25, 2021, 02:17:13 pm »

From Planet Radio

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The MP for Cleethorpes has hit out at Northern Rail over plans to temporarily scrap all trains on the Barton Cleethorpes line.

The Governments asked operators to reduce their amount of services as passenger numbers remain low due to the pandemic.

Martin Vickers says he hopes there?ll be a rethink ?

Northern Rail says a replacement bus service will be put in place.
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2021, 02:28:35 pm »

I'm generally in favour of reducing services at the moment on many routes, but not cutting them completely.  Though a bus replacement is better than nothing of course.

More locally from today, for example, services through Oxford have been reduced from twice hourly to hourly between Oxford and Didcot, Oxford and Paddington and Oxford and Marylebone.  That also happened last Spring, but this time around services on other routes haven't been wiped out completely - there's still a decent service between Oxford and Banbury, and still a daily train (though earlier) serving the halts along the Cotswolds.

Last spring the country virtually shut down,  But now, with additional journeys such as people heading out on the train to get vaccinated, and more people needing/wanting to travel on essential journeys to and from work, I think it's important to retain at least some semblance of a service on all routes.
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grahame
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« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2021, 04:40:17 pm »

From a suggestion / input being worked on elsewhere (which, sadly in my view, was not unopposed there) I give you guidelines for temporary service reductions - taking a basket of services in my home area, this allowed for a 55% reduction in train diagrams.  The opposite view was that the community should do nothing to support, facilitate or advise any service reduction even on a temporary basis.
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? - Local and regional journeys not to drop below hourly
? - Long distance journeys not to drop below every 2 hours 
? - Stations with local flows to have minimum hourly service
? - Low use stations with local flows to have minimum 2 hourly service 
? - Longer distance journeys can be rescheduled to serve extra intermediate stations 
? - Connections need to be maintained
? - Tickets to be accepted on alternative public transport
Ironically, the thinned out service connected where the timetabled that should be running didn't / doesn't and there would have been a very real risk that some journeys would be significantly improved.

The above makes common sense (IMHO) and I don't see very much happening around here than goes against it.

Sitting, dangerously, in my armchair in the bottom left corner of England and looking towards the upper right, I have taken a look at the timetable as it 'should' be for Barton on Humber.  Looks like 2 train sets, with a total of 4 crews needed on Monday to Friday, 1 train set of Saturdays, and line closed on Sundays.   Basically it's 2 hourly with an odd extra (odd enough to have me wonder "why?").

One train set, Monday to Friday ... two crews ... and you loose that odd extra and one middle of the day train. Without an answer to that "why" I have or other local knowledge, and not knowing whether there are factors like high signal / crossing staff costs, I wonder at the total "temporary" annihilation and wonder what definition the authorities would care to put on 'temporary'.
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ChrisB
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« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2021, 04:44:43 pm »

You miss any consideration for staff availability (both train & NR)
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grahame
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« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2021, 04:57:02 pm »

You miss any consideration for staff availability (both train & NR)

How inconsiderate of me - (not).

Four crews per day down to 2 crews per day as stated.  Gap available by middle of day changes for personal needs breaks. As stated though, no data on signalling nor (but I did not comment / do not know) track and train maintenance  and servicing teams.
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« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2021, 05:05:13 pm »

Freight is very much king in that neck of the woods, so I don't think NR staffing would be an issue (if we're still talking Cleethorpes to Barton?)
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ChrisB
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« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2021, 05:11:59 pm »

Why on earth not? They are human, so affected by the virus, just the same as you & me.
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2021, 08:43:11 pm »

The section affected is the single line between Haboough and Barton. There is still semaphore signalling on the line and two level crossings at Ulceby and Thornton Abbey plus some occupation rossings. There is at least one manual box that I observed when I was up there is 2018, suggesting some furloughed NR staff as a result of the closure.

The rail connection to Immingham Docks leads off this line at Ulceby. I dont know how much use the line gets for freight these days but nothing is appearing on RTT for today.
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grahame
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« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2021, 09:07:40 pm »

The section affected is the single line between Haboough and Barton. There is still semaphore signalling on the line and two level crossings at Ulceby and Thornton Abbey plus some occupation rossings. There is at least one manual box that I observed when I was up there is 2018, suggesting some furloughed NR staff as a result of the closure.

The rail connection to Immingham Docks leads off this line at Ulceby. I dont know how much use the line gets for freight these days but nothing is appearing on RTT for today.

No sure of the line layout in the area or where trains get logged, but Ulceby itself looks like the Clapham Junction of Lincolnshire (or is that Humberside?) to me!

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grahame
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« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2021, 09:29:24 pm »

Catching up on this ... https://media.northernrailway.co.uk/news/northern-explains-barton-line-timetable-decision



There are times I feel that 1984 double speak is here ... "timetable changes" indeed - Zeroed out!
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TonyN
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2021, 09:35:48 pm »

A Bus service might be a Improvement if it continued over the bridge to Hessle or Hull. When I travelled that way the connection was missed and I ended up paying for a taxi.
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Robin Summerhill
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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2021, 09:55:53 pm »

The section affected is the single line between Haboough and Barton. There is still semaphore signalling on the line and two level crossings at Ulceby and Thornton Abbey plus some occupation rossings. There is at least one manual box that I observed when I was up there is 2018, suggesting some furloughed NR staff as a result of the closure.

The rail connection to Immingham Docks leads off this line at Ulceby. I dont know how much use the line gets for freight these days but nothing is appearing on RTT for today.

No sure of the line layout in the area or where trains get logged, but Ulceby itself looks like the Clapham Junction of Lincolnshire (or is that Humberside?) to me!


Theres a technical term for this. Its called a cock-up in my part

I looked up RTT for Barton on Humber when I thought I had loked up Ulceby...

Why isnt there an "Ill Get Me Coat" smilie on this forum Embarrassed

Edit - by grahame - don't worry, Robin - we all do things like that at times.  Yeah - perhaps we could do with other emotions on here such as ... no, subject for elsewhere!
« Last Edit: January 25, 2021, 10:21:07 pm by grahame » Logged
grahame
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2021, 10:18:54 pm »

Looking wider, it would appear that Brigg and Kirton Lindsey aren't doing very well either ... not sure if the "amendment" there in 1993 which removed Monday to Friday services was supposed to be "temporary" but I suspect we have one or two members who know.    Saturday service now appears to have disappeared too and the ticket engine tells you it's a bad query to ask:



Very interestingly, you should NEVER get a 400 from a mistyped URL or broken link ... it indicates a web site problem and not a page that cannot be found - that should be a 404.

We know "Essential Journeys Only" at present.  I do recall when I was on this line (one Saturday 18 months ago) that in amongst the day trippers there were a number of people headed out to shops - that they could only shop on a Saturday and how vital that train was ... memorable trip on the second most jammed train I was on all week.
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