World Cup of Train Operators

[whole diary]

[Lee]

- Express Routes, with new rolling stock for the longest (4 hour plus) journeys with full buffets.

So that is just London Swansea and beyond and London Penzance.

London Bristol, Cardiff, Worcester, Exeter and Plymouth are all less than 4 hours.  Not going to be a bid order for new trains is it.

Yes, that's a fair point, and there may be scope for some leeway there for slightly shorter journeys on the same or other corridors.

My "4 hour rule" was based on a previous forum debate where that was arrived upon as a fair time beyond which buffets become more desirable. Ive been around the forum long enough to know thats certainly not going to be everyone's view though 

[broadgage]

Indeed, I would consider a buffet desireable on journeys of over two hours rather than over four hours.
For four hour journeys a restuarant should be provided, on selected trains, not just a buffet.
That is not to say that every single two hour route should have a buffet, but it should be the norm.

For the longer distance GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) services, I would favour purpose built proper intercity trains, with buffet and restaurant, padded seats, no underfloor engines, and gangwayed throughout.

If that cant be achieved, then 9 car IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) modified to an intercity specification.
Add a proper full sized hot buffet in the middle of the standard class section. It will thus be within easy reach of any standard class customer (not needed for first as table service provided)
Be prepared to add a vehicle to 9 car sets when passenger numbers justify this. Or even better to add 5 vehicles to existing 5 car sets to make 10 cars.

[grahame]

GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) is still a TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) that's too big and too geographically diverse. That to me is why its negatives outweigh its positives. If we are to keep the franchise system then it should return to its constituent parts.

At the risk of wandering off the original topic, I do think there is something in this specific point.

Thanks for the wander ... and some excellent points.  Ironically, we roundly rejected the suggestion of splitting the franchise into "red" and "blue" areas a few years ago ...

[broadgage]

GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) is still a TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) that's too big and too geographically diverse. That to me is why its negatives outweigh its positives. If we are to keep the franchise system then it should return to its constituent parts.

At the risk of wandering off the original topic, I do think there is something in this specific point.

If it were me managing the reorganisation, I would go as follows:

GWR

- Express Routes, with new rolling stock for the longest (4 hour plus) journeys with full buffets.

- The former Thames Trains/First Great Western Link local routes (minus those already taken over/soon to be taken over by TfL^» (Transport for London - about))

- Potential responsibility for Great Malvern-Worcester-Cheltenham-Gloucester services as a result of Transport for Greater Bristol creation (see below)

- Heart of Wessex line services.

- A new tier of regional routes operated by cascaded IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train) including:

Cardiff-Taunton extended to Exeter, calling at new Wellington and Cullompton stations.

Portsmouth-Cardiff.

Southampton-Salisbury-Westbury-Swindon-Oxford merging existing Romsey/Salisbury 6 and TransWilts services, providing regular 2tph Southampton-Sailsbury-Westbury, and calling at new Wootton Bassett and Wantage Road stations.

Bristol-Swindon-Oxford calling at new Bathampton, Corsham, Wootton Bassett and Wantage Road stations.

TRANSPORT FOR GREATER BRISTOL

- Existing and upcoming local rail services on the Gloucester/Severn Beach-Westbury and Bristol Parkway-Weston corridors.

- Service and infrastructure enhancements, new line and station openings progressively moving towards the "15 minute frequency" aim.

- Rail and Bus services managed by PTE^▸ (Passenger Transport Executive)-style organisation as part of integrated transport system.

DEVON METRO

- Existing and upcoming local rail services on the Exeter-Plymouth, Barnstaple, Exmouth and Paignton corridors, with possible extensions towards Honiton and Axminster.

- Plymouth-Gunnislake local services and future extensions to Tavistock and Okehampton.

- Rail and Bus services managed by PTE-style organisation as part of integrated transport system.

ONE CORNWALL

- Existing and upcoming local rail services on the Plymouth-Penzance corridor and Cornish Branch Lines.

- Rail and Bus services managed by PTE-style organisation as part of integrated transport system.

An interesting post with which I partially agree.
Of particular note IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion), is that a respected and well informed member suggests that IETs are not suited to "express" services, and also suggests that they should be cascaded to secondary routes.

I have always felt that IETs are not proper inter city trains, and are AT BEST an acceptable outer suburban unit.

[Lee]

In response to broadgage's post, my view is more that I think IET^▸ (Intercity Express Train)'s are far more suited to short distance express services than they are to longer distance ones, and that they could be seen by passengers as a significant step change upwards in terms of quality if they were deployed on the regional services that I mentioned.

In response to grahame's post, what's changed since then is that Cornwall has received central government support for groundbreaking schemes such as the "One" and "Superbus" initiatives, and legislation now makes it easier to introduce measures such as Bus Franchising and integration with other modes.

I think that if Cornwall were to actively seek this level of control over their local rail network, then they could find themselves knocking on a largely open door, and I know of several figures with the knowledge, ability and influence to make such an initiative work in the Transport for Greater Bristol and Devon areas as well.

In overall terms though, I wanted to put forward a "horses for courses" approach. Lets have GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) control where GWR control would work best, and lets have local area control where local area control would work best.