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Author Topic: What might have been - 1975 suggestions /  (Read 3697 times)
grahame
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« on: March 25, 2021, 11:37:55 »

Map and accompanying text sets the scene well.  Not sure how officials the map is, but the format is familiar with other official ones from around the time.


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Witham Bobby
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« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2021, 12:36:34 »

I remember these ideas being widely discussed on BR (British Rail(ways)) when I worked for the outfit.  The degree of support within some sections of the management for retrenchment was a huge shock to me.

In the Westbury Area, where we were working hard every day to shift the Mendips towards London and elsewhere, and keep a fairly comprhensive service of fasts and local trains going, this was all so demoralising.  Thank goodness these ideas, and those of the Serpell Report, which came later but had as one of it's options virtually what this map shows, (with some exceptions), were not taken forward
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RichardB
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« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2021, 12:47:23 »

The map is an adaptation of the maps in the Beeching Report.
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2021, 12:56:35 »

The map is an adaptation of the maps in the Beeching Report.

Interesting to see how things might change if a similar level of closures were required now.  In terms of staying open, I bet Oxford to Birmingham and Manchester to Sheffield would get preference over Chester to Holyhead.
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« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2021, 21:26:04 »

One does wonder to what extent Holyhead was a political inclusion.
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Lee
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« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2021, 21:40:25 »

One does wonder to what extent Holyhead was a political inclusion.

Doubly ironic when you consider the political position it finds itself today, at the gates of the rail industry's "new dawn"
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« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2021, 21:43:59 »

The map is an adaptation of the maps in the Beeching Report.

Interesting to see how things might change if a similar level of closures were required now.  In terms of staying open, I bet Oxford to Birmingham and Manchester to Sheffield would get preference over Chester to Holyhead.

Don't forget that this map was put together by a campaigning group.  It had no status.  Very few closures after 75, thankfully.  Long may that remain the case.
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ellendune
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« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2021, 22:36:11 »

Don't forget that this map was put together by a campaigning group.  It had no status.  Very few closures after 75, thankfully.  Long may that remain the case.

Yes but it has remarkable similarity to the Serpel Report Map.

Some notable ones closed after 1975 though like March Spalding. And there were plenty of near misses like Settle and Carlisle! Also much rationalisation (removal of capacity - single tracking and 'simplified' junctions). 
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Lee
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« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2021, 23:15:03 »

The map is an adaptation of the maps in the Beeching Report.

Interesting to see how things might change if a similar level of closures were required now.  In terms of staying open, I bet Oxford to Birmingham and Manchester to Sheffield would get preference over Chester to Holyhead.

Don't forget that this map was put together by a campaigning group.  It had no status.  Very few closures after 75, thankfully.  Long may that remain the case.

Whilst I appreciate RichardB's view, and agree with the overall sentiment, speaking as a veteran now of several closure battles, I have worked with some of the most wonderful, talented, knowledgeable and committed people I have ever met on them, and their efforts in both stopping the closures and securing the future by subsequent building up the passenger numbers have had a huge impact on keeping the map as full as it has been. I would certainly include Richard himself in that with his sterling continuing efforts on the Devon and Cornwall routes.

In that respect, the rail network is fortunate that it has always known who its true friends are, and has been able to count on them to stick by it through thick and thin.

If only we were all so lucky in our day to day lives.
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RichardB
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« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2021, 10:52:08 »

Don't forget that this map was put together by a campaigning group.  It had no status.  Very few closures after 75, thankfully.  Long may that remain the case.

Yes but it has remarkable similarity to the Serpel Report Map.

Some notable ones closed after 1975 though like March Spalding. And there were plenty of near misses like Settle and Carlisle! Also much rationalisation (removal of capacity - single tracking and 'simplified' junctions). 

Don't get me wrong, there certainly was a constituency for big rail cuts as we saw a few years later with the Serpell Report.  Thankfully it was largely fought off in the 70s and Sir Peter Parker and the BRB(resolve) saw off Serpell.  Settle/Carlisle was indeed a very close run thing.  Not an awful lot else though if you look back.  Rationalisation - another story entirely.  Thankfully much has been put back in more recent times.
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RichardB
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« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2021, 11:01:20 »

I thoroughly recommend Chris Austin and Richard Faulkner's book on the battle to save lines in the 70s and 80s.  "Holding the Line" - both Chris and Richard (now Lord Faulkner of course) were closely involved in BR (British Rail(ways)).  Their other book, on rail policy, "Disconnected" is really worth reading too.

https://www.bluebell-railway.com/product/holding-the-line-how-britains-railways-were-saved/
https://rail-books.co.uk/products/holding-the-line-how-britains-railways-were-saved-9780860936473
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/9780860936640/Disconnected-Broken-Links-Britains-Rail-0860936643/plp

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grahame
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« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2021, 11:05:29 »

Interesing to see closure of all lines and the stations at places like Yeovil, Ely, Shrewsbury, Worcester and, yes, Westbury. Swansea and Plymouth both become the terminii of branches from the Bristol area, and Oxford the terminus of a branch from Didcot. Bournemouth and Salisbury also become branch terminii of lines from Basingstoke.  On the east coast, Darlington and Newcastle become just intermediate stations, as (on the west coast) do Preston and Carlisle. But Tunbridge Wells to Eridge is retained.

On rationalisation - like Beeching closures - some especially around terminus stations and facilities probably made sense with trains able to arrive and depart frequently from less (or one!) platform.  Perhaps less so all the singling and changes at junction stations which accountants may have thought made sense, overlooking the necessary destruction of all round connections as train  move from calling in parallel to in series.
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« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2021, 11:33:34 »

Terry Gourvish produced two volumes on the history of British Railways. The first covers British Railways 1948-73, the second British Rail from 1974 to 1997. They were official histories with access to original documents. Very detailed but give a fascinating account of the changes.
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