Train GraphicClick on the map to explore geographics
 
I need help
FAQ
Emergency
About .
Travel & transport from BBC stories as at 08:15 29 Mar 2024
- Bus plunges off South Africa bridge, killing 45
- Easter getaway begins with flood alerts in place
Read about the forum [here].
Register [here] - it's free.
What do I gain from registering? [here]
 02/06/24 - Summer Timetable starts
17/08/24 - Bus to Imber
27/09/25 - 200 years of passenger trains

On this day
29th Mar (1913)
Foundation of National Union or Railwaymen (*)

Train RunningCancelled
07:20 Reading to Gatwick Airport
08:13 Newbury to Bedwyn
08:46 Bedwyn to Newbury
09:00 Gatwick Airport to Reading
09:54 Bedwyn to Newbury
10:22 Newbury to Bedwyn
11:29 Newbury to Bedwyn
11:57 Bedwyn to Newbury
12:52 Bedwyn to Newbury
Short Run
04:54 Plymouth to London Paddington
05:23 Hereford to London Paddington
05:33 Plymouth to London Paddington
05:55 Plymouth to London Paddington
06:37 Plymouth to London Paddington
07:03 London Paddington to Paignton
07:24 Exmouth to Paignton
07:40 Bristol Temple Meads to Westbury
08:35 Plymouth to London Paddington
08:41 Westbury to Bristol Temple Meads
09:45 Bristol Temple Meads to Salisbury
10:35 London Paddington to Exeter St Davids
Delayed
05:03 Penzance to London Paddington
06:05 Penzance to London Paddington
07:10 Penzance to London Paddington
08:03 London Paddington to Penzance
08:15 Penzance to London Paddington
09:04 London Paddington to Plymouth
09:37 London Paddington to Paignton
10:04 London Paddington to Penzance
11:03 London Paddington to Plymouth
PollsOpen and recent polls
Closed 2024-03-25 Easter Escape - to where?
Abbreviation pageAcronymns and abbreviations
Stn ComparatorStation Comparator
Rail newsNews Now - live rail news feed
Site Style 1 2 3 4
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
March 29, 2024, 08:33:44 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most recently liked subjects
[77] would you like your own LIVE train station departure board?
[72] West Wiltshire Bus Changes April 2024
[70] Reversing Beeching - bring heritage and freight lines into the...
[63] Return of the BRUTE?
[56] Infrastructure problems in Thames Valley causing disruption el...
[44] 2024 - Service update and amendment log, Swindon <-> Westbury...
 
News: the Great Western Coffee Shop ... keeping you up to date with travel around the South West
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: Sweden reopens to the Finnish border  (Read 2998 times)
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40691



View Profile WWW Email
« on: April 15, 2021, 07:46:35 »

From Railway Gazette

Quote
SWEDEN: Passenger services have been reinstated on the 159 km route between Boden and Haparanda on the border with Finland.

Regular passenger services on the line had ended in 1992, but have now restarted with Vy Tåg’s Norrtåg subsidiary initially operating two return trains a day from Luleå to Haparanda and a single pair of trains between Umeå and Haparanda, using two-car Bombardier Regina X52 EMUs (Electric Multiple Unit).

The only stop between Haparanda and Boden is at Kalix, where a new station has been built, while the old station at Haparanda has been refurbished.

Looks like joined up thinking.   I find myself asking
- I wonder if this is as expensive per mile as Ashington or Okehampton
- What a contrast to Ireland where Rosslare to Waterford is in danger of being ripped up
- Do Finnish passenger trains run to the border?
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
Lee
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 7519


GBR - The Emperor's New Rail Network


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2021, 10:45:37 »

From Railway Gazette

Quote
SWEDEN: Passenger services have been reinstated on the 159 km route between Boden and Haparanda on the border with Finland.

Regular passenger services on the line had ended in 1992, but have now restarted with Vy Tåg’s Norrtåg subsidiary initially operating two return trains a day from Luleå to Haparanda and a single pair of trains between Umeå and Haparanda, using two-car Bombardier Regina X52 EMUs (Electric Multiple Unit).

The only stop between Haparanda and Boden is at Kalix, where a new station has been built, while the old station at Haparanda has been refurbished.

Looks like joined up thinking.   I find myself asking
- I wonder if this is as expensive per mile as Ashington or Okehampton
- What a contrast to Ireland where Rosslare to Waterford is in danger of being ripped up
- Do Finnish passenger trains run to the border?

The Haparanda Line is quoted above as being 159km, or roughly 99 miles long. The cost of reintroduction of passenger services is quoted as being SKr 50m, or nearly £4.3 million at today's exchange rate, or nearly £43k per mile - see https://www.railjournal.com/regions/europe/new-start-for-passenger-trains-in-the-north/ for more details.

The reopened Ashington line will be around 18 miles long.  The cost of reintroduction of passenger services is quoted as being £166 mliion, or around £9.2 million per mile - see https://www.northumberlandgazette.co.uk/news/politics/council/government-confirms-ps34million-northumberland-line-rail-minister-says-hes-lucky-be-reopening-train-lines-3110263 for more details.

The soon to be reopened Okehampton line is officially quoted as being 14 miles long by Network Rail.  The cost of reintroduction of passenger services is quoted as being £40.5 mliion, or around £2.9 million per mile - see https://www.railjournal.com/passenger/main-line/first-line-to-reopen-under-british-restoration-fund-announced/ for more details.

Proposals to expand Ireland's public transport network never really recovered from the cancellation of the Transport 21 project in May 2011 - see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_21 for more details.

Finnish passenger trains do run to Kolari, on the border with Sweden - see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolari_railway_station for more details.

Hope that helps Grin
Logged

Vous devez être impitoyable, parce que ces gens sont des salauds - https://looka.com/s/78722877
ellendune
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4452


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2021, 20:23:31 »

Well it rather depends on what needs doing to reopen the line. 

One might ask:

  • Is it already open for regular freight?
  • What speed was freight allowed to go and what speed is required for passenger use?
  • How different are the maintenance standards for freight and passenger lines in Sweden?
  • Will there be capacity issues?

Okehampton had not been used much recently and had been somewhat neglected.
I do not know much about the Ashington line





Logged
Lee
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 7519


GBR - The Emperor's New Rail Network


View Profile WWW
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2021, 20:54:43 »

Well it rather depends on what needs doing to reopen the line. 

One might ask:

  • Is it already open for regular freight?
  • What speed was freight allowed to go and what speed is required for passenger use?
  • How different are the maintenance standards for freight and passenger lines in Sweden?
  • Will there be capacity issues?

Okehampton had not been used much recently and had been somewhat neglected.
I do not know much about the Ashington line







All good questions.

I just restricted myself to providing the figures. I assumed grahame had a good reason for asking which I am sure he will reveal in due course  Grin
Logged

Vous devez être impitoyable, parce que ces gens sont des salauds - https://looka.com/s/78722877
stuving
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 7156


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2021, 22:42:36 »

Well it rather depends on what needs doing to reopen the line. 

One might ask:

  • Is it already open for regular freight?
  • What speed was freight allowed to go and what speed is required for passenger use?
  • How different are the maintenance standards for freight and passenger lines in Sweden?
  • Will there be capacity issues?

The line had a major upgrade in 2008-12, including a 40 km long short cut of brand new track, electrification, and ETCS (European Train Control System)/ERTMS (European Rail Traffic Management System.). That was for freight usage, described in the supporting EU» (European Union - about) project as part of TEN-T and being multimodal. No doubt there is some local traffic too, if only trees.

You might think that was done with one eye on passenger services too, but I can't see any sign that was important in justifying the money. Basically there is one thing missing from this part of the world - people.  But I'm sure a couple of passenger trains a day won't be a problem, provided they don't get in the way of the more important trains.
Logged
ellendune
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4452


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2021, 23:42:58 »

The line had a major upgrade in 2008-12, including a 40 km long short cut of brand new track, electrification, and ETCS (European Train Control System)/ERTMS (European Rail Traffic Management System.). That was for freight usage, described in the supporting EU» (European Union - about) project as part of TEN-T and being multimodal.


The Haparanda Line is quoted above as being 159km, or roughly 99 miles long. The cost of reintroduction of passenger services is quoted as being SKr 50m, or nearly £4.3 million at today's exchange rate, or nearly £43k per mile - see https://www.railjournal.com/regions/europe/new-start-for-passenger-trains-in-the-north/ for more details.

So we need to add in another €47,000,000 from that project to the £4.3 mentioned above.  It still suggests it was far from being in the run down state of the Oakhampton line. 
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40691



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2021, 06:40:38 »

I just restricted myself to providing the figures. I assumed grahame had a good reason for asking which I am sure he will reveal in due course  Grin

"Low-level" type question - looking to help fill (me) in on the relative costs of re-openings in the UK (United Kingdom) and elsewhere. It does seem / sound like the Swedish case (in cost per km) was relatively cheap compared to the active schemes in the UK at the moment to bring passenger trains back to lines without any regular passenger trains.

I have learned that there is no special / easy-cheap way that the Swedes are doing it - rather a line than was already virtually up to it.  Ah well - it was worth looking.   Looking for a UK comparison - nothing comes straight to my mind as a long line in fine, modern fettle, though there are some short sections around. 

Around my home area, Westbury North to East curve comes to mind, where a service was tried out a few years ago under "experimental" regulations.  Just one train (initially each way?) per day, it was rather quiet when I caught it and (I believe) it was withdrawn to stop it being reclassified as permanent and requiring a formal closure process if it has stayed but then been withdrawn later.   The alternative (now-ish) running reverses at Westbury rather than taking the curve.

Aside - I am not suggesting that the Westbury experiment was a failure as such; the trains in question provided (and now modified, provide) a Bradford-on-Avon and Trowbridge to Paddington direct round trip for London meetings (far too slow to use on a daily basis) as part of what was running anyway - getting a service that started its day and ended it otherwise at Pewsey to / from the depot.  I was considering for today a trip out from Melksham to either Pewsey of Bedwyn and cycling back, but journey times of 100 minutes to Pewsey on all morning services, and up to 180 minutes to Bedwyn put me off.  Doesn't have to be an obviously-silly journey (Whitby to Scarborough, or Blaenau Ffestiniog to Harlech) to take a silly-long time.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
ellendune
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4452


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2021, 08:59:19 »

The culture of cost cutting by government imposed cuts by BR (British Rail(ways)) has left a huge legacy on our railways.  Top down cuts were imposed and BR therefore became adept at finding ways to reduce costs. It is clear that the underlying assumption that railways were a thing of the past was not only in the mind set of the politicians but many senior managers at BR as well. 

Reducing a double track line to single not only saved the costs of relaying one line and the future day to day maintenance of that track, but also, by slewing the remaining line into the middle allowed then to delay earthworks maintenance. A low speed goods line could be easily neglected as obviously if it was only goods it would be destined for closure soon, was presumably the thinking.

This is essential work that is not obvious to the general public, but its past neglect is haunting Network Rail (NR» (Network Rail - home page)) now, not just on minor good lines. It is obvious if you do not repaint a steel bridge it will deteriorate, but embankments and cuttings are seen as maintenance free, when they are far from being so.  The clay soils that predominate in many parts of the UK (United Kingdom) especially southern England are notorious.  Brunel was delayed in opening the link from Farringdon Road (later Challow station) to Chippenham by 18 month, by the challenge of building embankments with these clays and the Swindon section of the caused major problems in building the Gloucester line.

With some exceptions a goods line in the UK is typically the last leg of a journey with an infrequent service (the intensively used quarry and (previously) coal line were well maintained) poorly were neglected.  I don't know if railway administrations on the continent similarly neglect such routes, but the line in Sweden in the OP (Original Poster / topic starter), was an international freight route that goes through an area with little population so obviously had a future.  I am not sure of the geology but it may have rock embankments rather than clay which can be easier to maintain.

Comparing costs on a benchmark per km basis is a technique used by economists who know little or nothing of engineering to provide ammunition to politicians who are entranced by the idea that "efficiency savings" can allow them to say they are spend more while doing the opposite so they can also cut taxes.  They fail to realise that it is their own policies past and present that have created many of the inefficiencies that therefore cannot be tackled because they are the problem.  Having a steady pipeline of electrification work would cut the costs per km significantly but if you have a new team each time who have to learn on the job you will never do it efficiently. 

Similarly some requirements imposed by DfT» (Department for Transport - about) on HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) to minimise future maintenance have massively increased the cost of construction. I am sure these will be revisited in later stages, but for stage 1 they are now fixed into the project.  Why was no engineer on the project at an early stage empowered to question these requirements or did the design while you construct culture (don't get me on that) that we so like in this country these days blind even them to the implications of that decision. 

Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronym
« Last Edit: April 17, 2021, 19:22:36 by VickiS » Logged
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by customers of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules (email link to report). Forum hosted by Well House Consultants

Jump to top of pageJump to Forum Home Page