underground plans for Bristol update.

[whole diary]

[Noggin]

Just a it seemed to me that WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) or more specifically our Metro Mayor had put the whole issue of underground mass transit out of the question, along comes this different take on matters from New Civil Engineer:

https://www.newcivilengineer.com/latest/tunnelling-work-for-planned-bristol-underground-would-be-relatively-easy-22-03-2023/?tkn=1

So, is it back on with WECA or isn't it?  I'm confused (as regulars to the Coffee Shop will likely already know).

Or perhaps it was just horse-trading? WECA pay £13.8m consultants fee to kick the project into the grass long enough for Marv to be out of office. Marv gets to say "I got this transformational idea to the next stage". Marv stops blocking WECA. WECA include in the report scope some stuff they might actually be interested in.

In the scope of the report they include a bunch of stuff 

[TonyK]

Not very exciting at the moment, but maybe it’ll change with time. I presume the ‘4’ refers to the four proposed rapid transit lines, as well as being a homonym of ‘for’.

Four Lines Now? I'm interested...

[johnneyw]

Bristol Live claim to have seen a report by senior WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) transport managers regarding the feasibility of a mass transport system for Bristol.  It doesn't rule out an "underground system" entirely but clearly leans towards most of it being above ground.  Article link below.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/exclusive-report-bristol-underground-says-8756011?int_source=amp_continue_reading&int_medium=amp&int_campaign=continue_reading_button#amp-readmore-target

[johnneyw]

Despite the reports in the previous post regarding mass transit in Bristol, Metro Mayor Dan has once again poured cold water on the "underground" scheme and instead seems here to confirm that he'll tackle the problem with buses. 

That should solve it.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/bristol-underground-plans-ruled-out-8779052

[TonyK]

Bristol Live claim to have seen a report by senior WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) transport managers regarding the feasibility of a mass transport system for Bristol.  It doesn't rule out an "underground system" entirely but clearly leans towards most of it being above ground.  Article link below.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/exclusive-report-bristol-underground-says-8756011?int_source=amp_continue_reading&int_medium=amp&int_campaign=continue_reading_button#amp-readmore-target

In fairness, 55% of London Underground is above ground.

Despite the reports in the previous post regarding mass transit in Bristol, Metro Mayor Dan has once again poured cold water on the "underground" scheme and instead seems here to confirm that he'll tackle the problem with buses. 

That should solve it.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/bristol-underground-plans-ruled-out-8779052

As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly. Planning for more buses will get Bristol nowhere. A mix of heavy rail where it can be done and light rail where it can't is the way forward.

[Red Squirrel]

Indeed. A local rail campaign recently tweeted:

Honest question: Can anyone explain the point of the 'guided busway' sections of the m2 bus route?
The (specially equipped!) bus slows to a crawl, enters the busway, dawdles through it, then speeds
up again when it gets to the end. #bristolrail

So far this has 8413 views and 47 likes. Seems to have struck a bit of a chord.

[simonw]

The fact the Bristol has a mayor (soon to be replaced by committee) that wants an underground, and the West of England has a mayor that wants buses is interesting.

Too much ambition by one and zero by the other.

Whilst not a transport guru, I'd like to see the FOSBR^▸ (Friends of Suburban Bristol Railways) (Bristol Rail Campaign) plan for the West of England come to fruition, with frequent services, local bus hubs and finally an integrated local rail and bus tickets that facilities local travel and not make it impossible by public transport.

[johnneyw]

Interesting though that the Bristol Live report carrying Mayor Dan's reassertion that there wouldn't be an underground was followed by him talking of visiting Coventry shortly to see a transport innovation in the city.  He was presumably talking about the Very Light Rail facility there.

[chuffed]

Given the width of the guidedbusway rails on the m2...I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Marvin ordered some broad gauge trains to replace the buses.....as a parting shot to a certain WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) mayor.

[TonyK]

Given the width of the guidedbusway rails on the m2...I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Marvin ordered some broad gauge trains to replace the buses.....as a parting shot to a certain WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) mayor.

Maybe not broad gauge, but light rail would fit nicely. The skew bridge could be an issue though.

[Red Squirrel]

Given the width of the guidedbusway rails on the m2...I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Marvin ordered some broad gauge trains to replace the buses.....as a parting shot to a certain WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) mayor.

Maybe not broad gauge, but light rail would fit nicely. The skew bridge could be an issue though.

Nice bit of interlaced track would sort that!

[Noggin]

Given the width of the guidedbusway rails on the m2...I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Marvin ordered some broad gauge trains to replace the buses.....as a parting shot to a certain WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) mayor.

Reminds me of the Basque country where they basically build everything to metre gauge, including new tramways and metros, presumably to annoy the rest of Spain, that is apart from the new high-speed line which will be standard gauge, presumably that's OK because it connects to France.

Incidentally, if you think HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) is taking a long time, Google the Basque high-speed lines where there are long lengths of the route with the civils done but no track or overheads because they can't agree how to get the lines into the big cities. 

[simonw]

And today, the Liverpool Region has announced that it plans to copy the Manchester Region in franchising bus services.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/oct/06/liverpool-announces-it-will-bring-buses-back-under-public-control

Hopefully WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) will pick up the challenge and follow!

[TonyK]

And today, the Liverpool Region has announced that it plans to copy the Manchester Region in franchising bus services.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/oct/06/liverpool-announces-it-will-bring-buses-back-under-public-control

Hopefully WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) will pick up the challenge and follow!

A bit of thread drift, I know, but I remember buses under public control in Bristol, around 1977-78 when I first moved there. If they can bring them back as good as that, then Bristol is done for. Qua the late Fred Wedlock, seldom heard and never seen.

[Zoe]

Hopefully WECA^» (West of England Combined Authority - about) will pick up the challenge and follow!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-64965693

That won't be easy though since the WECA lacks the council tax precepting powers which the other combined authorities have.  It would appear that South Gloucestershire Council will not agree to the introduction of such powers.